I’ve noticed girls are giving out their phone numbers to guys more frequently than they used to do. They don’t even think twice about it now. Guy asks for number after a 30 second conversation; girl gives it to him. I’ve seen girls give their number to three different guys in one night at the same bar, only to go home with a fourth guy at last call.
What is going on here? Are these girls really interested in all these guys? No. Most of those guys will call once and get voicemail, never to hear from her again. Are they stroking their egos? Maybe, but they can do that without handing over their number. Attention whores survive on instantaneous highs, not the delayed gratification of waiting for a guy to call.
Has the phone number exchange become an easy way to get rid of a guy hitting on her? Girls used to dismiss guys with the standard “I have a boyfriend” line. That was the way things were done, and it was pretty effective. Plus, that tactic had the added benefit of preventing possible weirdos from voicemail-stalking her. Fake numbers also were standard operating procedure for the savvy club girl, but you don’t see that much anymore either.
I suspect the reason for this tactical change on the part of women has to do with the new game guys are bringing to the field. The lessons of the past ten years are beginning to filter down to the masses, and what you see are guys getting more aggressive during the initial pickup, but weaker on the phone tag follow-up. Men are calling their bluff when the girls toss out blowoff lines — “You have a boyfriend? That’s great, so does my girlfriend!” — but are quicker to NEXT the girls when they get voicemail on the follow-up call. The response by girls has been to revert to “number closing” to get a guy off their back knowing that the likelihood he will pester her with multiple voicemail messages is very low.
Women are giving out their numbers more readily because they are no longer concerned guys will stalk them.
My suggestion for guys to defend against this latest counterinsurgency tactic is to make women pay a price for handing their phone numbers over too cavalierly when they have no intention of answering your call. It is time to return to the days of harassing them over the phone. Call three times a week and supplement with rambling text messages. Be persistent, just like in the movies. Except in real life, she won’t find your persistence endearing and eventually succumb to your stubborn charms. But in the future she will think twice about blowing off guys with her phone number.
This is a tongue in cheek, purposely sarcastic suggestion. Right? One never knows around here. If you’re even remotely serious, this is extremely passive-aggressive. Yet, I’m sure you know that. You’re a bright boy. Try it and get back to us with the results.
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Girls have ALWAYS been giving out phone numbers since mobile phones existed because it’s not as intrusive as getting called on a home phone and it’s automatic caller ID.
Guys stroke a girl’s ego by hitting on her, she gives out her number. That’s as far as it goes.
The next day or so as she hangs out with her friends (male and female), her mobile rings off the fucking hook. What better way to stroke her ego and get an instant popularity buzz in front of her friends.
Handing out her number is the closest thing a regular hottie can get to feeling like a celebrity.
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I don’t think it’s the women that create this. Guys think a number close in 30 seconds is as good as a number close after 10-30 minutes or going home with a girl. If you start talking to a girl and your whole intent is to get her number, then congrats. If your intent is to sleep with the girl, or get to know her/date her, then you’re naturally more inclined to spend more time with the chick. Getting a number after 30 seconds doesn’t require any skill nor does it show a woman that you have any real interest in her. That’s the thing most guys forget. They watch the Mystery tv show and think, “Ok I’ll use some witty line, be obnoxious, get a number, she’s now interested in me!!!”
I’m glad women are doing this. It makes my life a lot easier, becuase it shows I have a lot higher value than the guy next to me who’s bragging to his bunch of guys that he got her digits, while she’s spending the majority of her night with me.
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Another great post Roissy.
Reminds me of something that happened to a girl I met back in the day. I used to date this girl who told me about the last guy she met in a nightclub. They guy asked for her number, she gave him a fake. He leaves and comes back a few minutes later and says “This number’s a fake.” The girl, mortified, gives him HER REAL NUMBER. The sheer audacity of calling her on it caught her off guard. He never called, but I always wonder what he would have said if he did.
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this post was 3 out of 5 tongues in cheek.
of course you should not call a girl over and over. but i do think the dynamic i outlined is happening. it’s become less risky for girls to hand out their numbers like candy.
a solid # close needs at least 20 minutes pre-game, on average. if you are getting numbers in 30 seconds don’t expect it to pan out.
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I don’t even get why a guy would even ask for a number after a 30 second interaction. He’s made zero emotional connection, knows next to nothing about her, yet has communicated that within 30 seconds he already knows he wants her number. That just conveys “no challenge” to a girl and puts her on a pedestal too. If one HAS to try to salvage something after a 30 second interaction I think the guy ought to give out HIS number. Since the chances of it working out after a 30 second interaction are slim anyway, he has nothing to lose, and if the girl actually does call there’s no denying her interest.
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I just got out of prison after 15 years. I was only 19 when I went to prison (Charges includes srealing over 1,000,000 worth of gold) I was young and stupid I got 10 to 20 years in jail and got out after 15 on 2/4/2008. now i am 34 and have no idea how to pick up girls/women. If any one is interested in talking with me FEMALES ONLY call me at 412-687-1363. I will be home at 4 pm today (2/11/08/
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First thing I thought was cell phones. Girls value intimacy and the privacy of their own home more than guys do — the world’s more like one big playpen for us.
Think of the difference between physically chasing her down to say Hi, bla bla bla — at work or around her typical haunts, vs. showing up at her door or outside her apt building.
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202/452-7468.
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I personally have never been one for giving out fake numbers, but I definitely think the cell phone era is partially responsibible for the decreasing frequency of this blow off tactic. I have had several guys ask for my number, put it in their phone, and then push “talk” to call me and “give me their number” — even though it’s pretty obvious that they are checking to see if I gave them a fake number.
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Just make sure she doesn’t give you her number as 382-5968.
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The push talk to test method is great right, the blowoff is disapearing and I actually think that women are getting nicer. Instead of just saying I’m not interested, have a BF, etc now they bump up the egos of the 30 second guys with real numbers. I’m interested if a new generation of, “cold calling” Pick Up Artists are going to spring up and advise men to have a list of dead numbers and call them.
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Umm…isn’t it possible they are actually just pushing “talk” to give you the number and not to test you? What the hell do you want people to do, verbally recite the numbers back and forth just to avoid giving the impression of “testing?” That’s ridiculous. If anything that would look MORE insecure.
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I think what Roissy is saying is that it would benefit HIM if guys started doing this, because it allow him to more accurately gauge the amount of time and effort he should invest in turning a number into a notch. As it stands, having the number tells one very little about a girl’s level of interest and how much game will be required going forward.
So while an increase in stalkerish behavior by guys on this board will do nothing to help them, it would be to Roissy’s(and others of his ilk) benefit if everyone else started leaving John Favreau style voicemails on the phone of every number-slut in DC.
On a related topic – I would rather watch all four Saw movies and every other torture porn film made in the past five years in one sitting than watch that scene in Swingers. Ugh.
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Jeff–
I once saw a cartoon version of “that scene in Swingers” featuring Elmer Fudd. I almost choked from laughing so hard.
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Yes that is definitely a possibility, but in these particular circumstances, they all got big smiles on their faces when my bag started ringing and I pulled my phone out, making it pretty clear that they were happy it was a real number.
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i like cell phones for the reasons outlined by paul janka in his pdf for single guys in ny: you are in control of the situation, she cannot use good old “womens intuition” to suss your character and demanour with phrenoligic accuracy as you are not physcially present, and you dont sound like an idiot. … texting is the best thing to happen to guys in a long time.
the art of seduction is assisted greatly by texting, stendhal’s ‘crystallization’ can now be achieved via a mere twiddling of the thumbs, especially with younger girls. it is quite easy to make them fall in love with you well before intimacy. and they all love getting these little romantic messages, its ridiculously simple.
as kierkegaard says of letters (with surprising lucidity (for him)): “On the whole, letters are and will always be an invaluable means for making an impression upon a young girl; often the dead symbol has far greater influence than the living word. A letter is a secret communication,; you are master of the situation, feel no pressure from anyone’s presence, and I think a young girl would really rather be quite alone with her ideal, that is, at particular moments, and precisely when it is influencing her mind most strongly… [the letter’s effect] is that one is invisibly but spiritually present at these sacred moments of consecration, while the idea that the real person is the author of the letter creates a natural and easy transition to reality”
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Okay, when you put it in context like that, yeah…they’re lame.
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Heh. This almost sounds like a “good ole days” kinda entry. And yet, not.
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I do it because if they are creepy it will get them away from you for a minute, and then you can just ignore them later. I say if you want a girl to return you’re call, be more impressive and step up your game. If you’re that good, you won’t even need to ask for her number, she’ll just give it to you.
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17 “the art of seduction” is the art of betrayal. No good will come of it. Slow and steady wins the race, all hormone drives to the contrary. If the game of love is what you’re playing, and not Hollywood Romance. But it hardly sounds from the posts on this site that real love is a goal at all. Dithering and diddling more likely. But make a thousand mistakes, get old, bitter, unhappy, dissatisfied, lonely and generally fucked up and then you’ll take the time to learn not to waste your time on long term failing ‘strategies’. You could be spending your valuable time learning what really works. You won’t get that from “Mystery”, Doc Love, or roissy in DC. One day you’ll wake up, or not as the case may be. Over and out. 🙂
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a solid # close needs at least 20 minutes pre-game.
only true if said game is being run on the nightlife circuit.
if you’re running your game in unconventional places or at unconvential times – like while you’re doing work at a cafe on wednesday afternoon, or during a quick run to the 24-hr drugstore at 2am on a monday** – it actually gets creepy if your pre-number-close lasts more than a minute or two. and these tend to be the best situations: the girl doesn’t have her guard up, and you get at least a glimpse into What She’s Really Like.
**not in the pharmacy aisle, though. have some decency.
—
@ roissy:
i want your opinion on the degree of ‘grade inflation’ that occurs in situations in which you have a shot at a threesome (or even a moresome, if the girls have been hanging out with dr. masters for long enough).
i have a theory that each additional girl over the first adds an additional 50% to each girl’s rating. so a pair of 6’s for a threesome would each become a 9, and if you could snag three 5’s for a foursome, they’d become instant 10’s for the night.
opinion?
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also, roissy, i must say i’m impressed that the quality of your posts hasn’t diminished, even as their frequency has approached an asymptote of 1 per day.
but, whence all the free time? do you roll over and start blogging, instead of lighting up the cig that was once de rigueur?
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Girls give out their number like candy because it’s easier than saying your not interested. It’s lazy. Another example of the pussi-fication of this country. If you aren’t interested, don’t give out the number. I never give a number to a girl I’m not into. I don’t flirt with her either.
Girls just like attention at the bar and to have people see that guys approach them. They flirt and respond to guys they have no interest in just so that they won’t look like they aren’t interesting. Most of the time they aren’t anyway.
I’ve second guessed many numbers that have been given to me and never made the call. Who knows, maybe it could’ve led to something good, but I’m that puppy that got hit with the newspaper. Once it happened, I never trusted that thing again…
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hum… David D. talks about immediatly confronting the girl by asking her if she it one of those flackly types. And reminding her that for you nothing ruins a “friendship” more than someone who flackes.
I’ll run that this weekend.
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meh, women can do whatever pissy, petty bitch move suits them
until
they hit 29
and dry up
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