Several readers emailed me a link to this Camille Paglia article about Hillary Clinton surrounding herself with beta males and how this may be hurting her campaign.
First, a reader wrote to Paglia:
I would like to get your feedback on the subject of those who end up in Hillary’s orbit. Can you conceive of a strong, leader-type male ever working under her? An alpha, if you will. And if the answer is no, then why do you think that is?
The men you always see under her are to a person passive-aggressive, sadistic, mean, little, petty beta-male pieces of work who would not naturally succeed in a common male-type hierarchy. […]
Hillary’s persona is simply not compatible with another strong will, male or female — but definitely male, and that itself is a big red flag.
Paglia’s response in part:
I agree that the male staff who Hillary attracts are slick, geeky weasels or rancid, asexual cream puffs. (One of the latter, the insufferable Mark Penn, just got the heave-ho after he played Hillary for a patsy with the Colombian government.) If I were to hazard a guess, I’d say Hillary is reconstituting the toxic hierarchy of her childhood household, with her on top instead of her drill-sergeant father. All those seething beta males (as you so aptly describe them) are versions of her sad-sack brothers, who got the short end of the Rodham DNA stick.
This sounds right. The Supreme Cunt resents her experiences growing up with a strong-willed, domineering, verbally abusive alpha male father and her history of surrounding herself with wretched lickspittle lapdog beta males who probably had to pay to lose their virginity exemplifies her inward yearning to dominate the most important male figure in her life the way he dominated her. Just take a look at the amorphous, greasy, slimeball sexually neutered beta bitchboys she employs in her inner circle:
It is for this reason — the seething vengeance complex the Cunt On High nurses for all alpha males who remind her of her father — that Hillary cannot be trusted to act as President in the best interest of half the American population. See, for example, the way she LOATHES the military. Her Cunterrific Cuntastic Cuntery ensures that in her world it is always women first, women best, women forever victims and men relegated to an afterthought or natural born criminal perpetrators of Orwellian PC crimes, suitable only for reminding her of her ideological righteousness nurtured for decades during the height of the misandrist revolution in a fetid curdled soup of gender bender feelgood lies.
Bill Clinton, alpha male, gradually learned this, and found love and admiration in the arms of younger women unafraid of their femininity and sex roles. I respect him for that.
Ever notice how most alpha males — the guys who know how to give women what they want — are either indifferent to feminism or, when they’re not in polite company, hostile to it? And how many sniveling beta males lick up the runny shit of feminism and ask for more? Something worth pondering.
“Paglia describes herself as a feminist and as a Democrat who voted for Bill Clinton and Ralph Nader, and even campaigned for John F. Kennedy as an adolescent.”
I adore Paglia’s views, but I didn’t think you’d be one to quote her with such enthusiasm. The enemy of thy enemy is thy friend?
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she says some things i agree with. and she’s at least interesting, which is more than i can say for a dry hump like hillary.
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So, roissy, tell us what you REALLY think of Hillary. . .
(watch this space for further comment)
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I find Paglia to be suffering a cognitive dissonance between her conservative white working class sensibilities and her desire to be seen as a progressive. She’s a great lady, but some of her comments are nonsense.
Interesting point on Hillary: she was an early supporter of barry Goldwater. I don’t see her as ideological; rather, I see her as someone who is more interested in being on the winning side.
One Beta not to be missed: Obama. I’ve read fascinating points by Sailer and Auster on what a mess he is, as revealed by his recent comments and his autobiography. Auster calls him “the opposite of mensch.”
When I hear him speak, I am under the impression that he tries to deepen his voice unnaturally.
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I think you reinvented the word “cunt” maybe 12 times in this post.
Nice
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Feminism is not a girl’s best friend.
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Hillary – who cares?
Why don’t you have the balls to attack the worst admininistration in the history of the U.S.? WTF is with the ass kissing of Bush and Cheney talking points?
Hillary can’t win – so who cares?
Some examples:
They are BORROWING $600. per household to give in a “stimulus package” that we all have to pay back with interest in the form of taxes later – in an election year !
WTF ? – you seem to have some chick skills and then bend over for Cheney and Bush to give it to you-
Why not grow a pair when it comes to assholes who are fucking everything up.
You know they are doing it on purpose – so they can use it as an excuse to get the holy grail – everyones Social Security money. It’s not like they actually believe in God or karma or anything!
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You are so incredibly off base with some of the stuff here, I cannot even begin. You can fucking hate Hillary…I have come to hate her myself…I don’t really care, but as a former member of the Clinton camp, on the inside (not inner circle by any means, but more inside than most), here are a few things…
MP is a prick. An idiot. A tyrant who makes awful political decisions. But a beta? Really Roissy? He is a partner in a highly successful international firm, has a hot piece for a wife, rolls around in piles of cash and can repeatedly fuck up and still be in high demand. This seems highly alpha to me. (And fuck you for making me defend him.)
And then men in “Hillaryland” get more ass than a toilet seat. They use their nerd power to drop the panties. They may not be your cup of tea–they sure were not mine–but a I think rancid, sexual cream puffs is taking it a tad too far.
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When I hear him speak, I am under the impression that he tries to deepen his voice unnaturally.
He does sound oddly unnatural, like a preacher, in his speeches. I think his voice is that deep though, because he seems to talk normally in his interviews.
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*asexual* I cannot type when I am feisty.
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I think a new term should be created to cover the Mark Penn types out there, the people who have managed to make beta traits lucrative and pay off with alpha results. Very alpha and beta at the same time. Politics and entertainment has a lot of these. Power beta? High functioning beta?
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#4 PA:
One Beta not to be missed: Obama. I’ve read fascinating points by Sailer and Auster on what a mess he is, as revealed by his recent comments and his autobiography. Auster calls him “the opposite of mensch.”
Well, I’m convinced. It’s not like Sailer and Auster have an partisan axe to grind or anything.
As for Obama being beta: Women want to fuck him. And it’s likely that he’s going to be the next President. What does the guy have to do to prove he’s not? Nail McCain’s daughter on video?
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Ok, have to admit that this is SUCh a pet peeve of mind. When someone discredits some points simply because the person making them is a partisan. Who else is more likely to criticize someone than a partisan for the other side. That alone is not enough to automatically make the points invalid. I haven’t read Sailer and Auster’s points, and they may indeed be invalid, but I think the points should be invalidated on their merits, not preemptively simply because they were made by partisans. Can you imagine if we only formed opinions of people based on what we heard from people predisposed to like them already?
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Attack the causers of damage
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What T. said.
Plus, I think Obama is one of those peole that is less appealing the more you know him. So long as he emits vague gaseous bromides, some people, including some women who supposedly want to f*ck him, project their fantasy onto him.
But when he’s cornered into speaking with substance, like when he was with the Wright exposure, his messiah-aura bursts like a soap bubble, and all you see is a skinny kid stammering through his unresolved identity issues.
I’d grant that whatever his Alpha appeal, it’s more along the lines of an effeminate, inwardly-tormented poet, not a future commander-in-chief. I’d like him much better if he became a writer, not a politician.
Just contrast him with high-testosterone men like Reagan, Schwartzkopf, Kissinger, or Sharpton. Would any of them have hid behind their granny?
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can i just point out something
passive-aggressive, sadistic, mean, little, petty
slick, geeky weasels
this reminds me of certain behaviors i’ve observed of many newbie PUAs
Ever notice how most alpha males — the guys who know how to give women what they want — are either indifferent to feminism or, when they’re not in polite company, hostile to it?
I know what point you’re trying to make, but it gets lost on me. The language used makes it really hard for me to tell who’s a beta and who is an alpha. Perhaps no such distinction exists, or perhaps you make the rules as you go along.
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Obama beta?! Shiiiiiiit. I’m a Republican and even I can’t say that with certainty. Seriously, I’ve never seen women this worked up over a political candidate. Now that’s alpha you can’t buy with 10,000 hours of Mystery Method tutorial son. Nevertheless, he is the main competition so its about time conservatives started tearing down Obama’s facade of charisma.
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Nice post, but what would be more effective (in my case, anyway) is if you told us how to convincingly lie and say we liked Hillary. Lotta women like her and they take it personally if you don’t.
I’m gonna need to do this for personals reasons and I don’t think I’m up for the challenge. What is there to like? She supports gay rights, I guess.
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Barak Obama is not Beta. When women see him, they get hysterical, start screaming and wet their panties. Adolf Hitler got the same reaction from women by the way when he was Chancelor, there is nothing like Charisma coupled with power to get a woman to wet her panties.
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I’m not convinced Obama’s charisma is for real and I think he’s only appaling from afar.
How about this litmus test: stand him next to a certified Alpha (I dunno who; McCain maybe?) and see if he gains or loses in stature.
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I menat “appealing from afar”
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*Gannon making a Hitler comment… ha ha ha ha ha ha ha !
I thought you were rounded up in the Texas Pedophile bust
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Does Hillary have a Glorious Natural Pelt?
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@Miik:
I don’t live in the US, and I never had sex with a person below age of consent.
By the way, I thought you were hanged in Iran for homosexual activities.
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As for Obama being beta: Women want to fuck him. And it’s likely that he’s going to be the next President. What does the guy have to do to prove he’s not? Nail McCain’s daughter on video?
Probably not a difficult feat to accomplish if you mean his warpiggish adopted daughter from Bangladesh. Though she’s only 15 or 16 years old, guess it would be a job for Gannon.
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Nah, thanks for the offer Peter, but I’ll pass. I prefer the blond older one in this case. But the Bangladeshi one might be a virgin, so that’s always a huge plus, the satisfaction of popping a cherry. Nevertheless, legal restrictions force me to politely decline.
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Probably not a difficult feat to accomplish if you mean his warpiggish adopted daughter from Bangladesh. Though she’s only 15 or 16 years old, guess it would be a job for Gannon.
God damn it, now I’m on a guilt trip for having written something so nasty. About calling her a warpig, that is, not the Gannon part.
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Guilt is for Betas
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#13 T:
I haven’t read Sailer and Auster’s points, and they may indeed be invalid, but I think the points should be invalidated on their merits, not preemptively simply because they were made by partisans.
You know what? You’re right. That was lazy of me. But since political debate on the Internet is as pointless as a fat stripper, I figured I’d save some time.
Point in Obama’s favor for alpha-ness: Obama Girl. Sure, she’s an attention whore, but I don’t doubt she’d jump on the Barack cock with a quickness.
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I think Obama is one of those peole that is less appealing the more you know him. So long as he emits vague gaseous bromides, some people, including some women who supposedly want to f*ck him, project their fantasy onto him.
His ability to have others project their aspirations onto him in itself distinguishes him from other men. He actually never appealed to me on a charismatic level, nor did his speeches ever really interest me. That’s likely because I don’t really watch TV too often or buy into any hype. But I can tell his effects on people peripherally, by watching how other people around him respond to him.
I’m not convinced Obama’s charisma is for real and I think he’s only appaling from afar.
He seems to work best in person rather than on TV, where his racial features and odd pronunciation get in the way. He looks straight at people in the eye and has an “alpha” presence in person, but he doesn’t really ever look straight at the camera. There are men that know how to work the camera/screen presence, and there are men that know how to work other people/a crowd, and he seems to fall into the latter category.
People are easily herded and fall easily to peer pressure, so when they see a crowd around him going hogwild, that is bound to affect their perception of him, even though his charisma is not really shown through the TV screen, it is shown by proxy through the actions of those around him.
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24 Gannon
weak – here you’d be in jail
weak
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Gannon wrote:
Guilt is for Betas
No, Pervert Boy, guilt is for people who have to sense to realize they said/wrote/did something harsh and unfair to an undeserving target.
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@Miik:
Not necesarily, remember that my actual gf is 17 and the relationship became serious when she was 16, that is legal even in most of the US. And advocating for a lower age of consent towards 14 is not a crime.
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Peter – a less long winded David Alexander.
Do you ever post any comments with content other than “Gannon is a child molester” and “I like hairy pussy”?
Even in your apology for pointing out that McCain’s warpig daughter is a warpig you made the post a dig at Gannon.
Gannon can be monomaniacal about the benefits of dating young women but he sticks to topic.
Reggie:
Sailer and Auster aren’t partisans; they don’t shill for republicans (I think Sailer’s criticisms of Bush have been by far the most cogent I’ve read). They’re both motivated by ideology not partisanship. As paleocons, usually they’re closer to republican positions but Sailer at least is completely anti-Bush (I don’t read Auster nearly as often so can’t speak to his positions).
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By a less long winded David Alexander I mean someone who always posts on the same topic and tries to derail discussion in every thread. David tries to get a DA pity party going, Peter tries (and always fails) to get a Gannon two minute hate going.
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Roissy’s propensity to unhinged hysteria, always lurking in the background, gets the better of him here. I can see the spittle flying over the computer screen. Paglia is an eccentric ignoramus who doesn’t know much about politics. Hillary is on Armed Services and has an excellent relationship with the military, has for some time. Wesley Clark is a key advisor of hers.
Besides her generally good relationship with the military, it’s silly to call people like Mark Penn “beta males”. The guy earns millions of dollars a year and is a dominant figure in the highly competitive world of polling and campaign strategizing. Frankly, I can’t stand him, but it’s silly to call him “beta”.
Not to mention her almost 30 years of marriage with Bill Clinton, who is not a “beta male” by any stretch of the imagination.
Roissy naturally fears and dislikes women, but has painstakingly trained himself to overcome his natural tendencies in a bar/pickup environment. But when thinking about an actually powerful woman such as Hillary the old instincts bubble to the surface.
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“Privately, two current military leaders who have testified before the Armed Services committee, and who by custom do not comment publicly on political figures, said they both found Mrs. Clinton conversant about the military and thoughtful in her questions.
Active-duty generals have sought her out, and she has reached out to them. Among those with whom she has built relationships are Gen. David H. Petraeus, the top commander in Iraq, and Adm. William J. Fallon, the new head of Central Command. Recently, too, James T. Conway, the commandant of the Marines, invited her to be his guest of honor at the “Sunset Parade” at the Marine Corps War Memorial in Washington, a high-profile tradition. (She has accepted.)….
The Republican National Committee’s research staff members have already compiled a series of examples that they say show Mrs. Clinton at odds with military interests, including her Iraq war positioning and her opposition to sending additional troops there.
General Keane — whose support for sending more troops to Iraq is at odds with Mrs. Clinton’s view — and other admirers of hers see these skeptical or critical portrayals of her as playing into false stereotypes. He recalled how his own initial impression of her changed after their first meeting: It was supposed to last 15 minutes, but continued for a half hour longer as they talked about West Point and moved onto global hot spots.
John Batiste, a retired major general and former commander of the First Infantry Division, who also consults with Mrs. Clinton, said, “Very, very few politicians have any military experience, and they’re naïve — they don’t understand what it takes to develop a big picture, unified strategy to take a country to war.
“She’s the kind of person who would listen to sound military advice,” General Batiste said, “and not dismiss it or discard it. And I’m a lifelong Republican.“ ”
From NY Times article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/03/27/us/politics/27brass.html?_r=1&hp=&oref=slogin&pagewanted=all
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33 Gannon – you’re very Hitler-like in your observations – hence my laughter earlier! ha ha ha ha ha ha ha !
There are no decent parents that want their daughters to have anything to do with you unless they are retarded.
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I’d grant that whatever his Alpha appeal, it’s more along the lines of an effeminate, inwardly-tormented poet, not a future commander-in-chief.
So when did “effeminate, inwardly-tormented poets” turn into a type of alphas? I’m sure you can get girls that way, but if getting girls is your whole understanding of “alpha”, then it has suffered enough conceptual inflation to be meaninglessness. Pick-up nerds who don’t get it try to stuff every “good” trait into being “alpha”. It’s not about that.
Alphaness/betaness of course means, or is supposed to mean, the order in a pack, so to gauge someone’s alpha/beta tendencies you have to put them in a group of peers and see if they try to get the top position or if they’re immediately willing to accept follower status. Female attention doesn’t make alphas; alphas get extra female attention, but it’s just one way to get attention. In fact, pickup is mostly about impressing females with every other way except your rank among males. If you want to pick up women by “alphaness”, you have to build a lifestyle that puts you in a male hierarchy of some sort and still puts you among women to take notice (so being king of WoW doesn’t get you women), not talk to unknown girls on the street.
Judging from the TV, McCain has much more of a likely-alpha vibe than Obama. (Of course that’s probably completely irrelevant to decision-making ability.)
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My gf’s father likes me a lot, and he teaches Academia and has published academic boks at University levels. He likes me because he prefers a young stable man rather than a stupid teen who could impreganate his daughter and not assume responsibilty.
I don’t think you know much about Hitler, btw. I’m halfgerman, so trying to teach me about Nationalsozialismus is like trying to teach Hope about Chinese history, it´s rather moronic, a term that fits well most of your post.
It’s dangerous to imagine Hitler as a madman. He succeded in Germany because he was very charismatic, very empathic to the needs of other people and a woman’s wet dream. He was deeply machiavelic and inmoral, no doubt about that.
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mq:
Roissy’s propensity to unhinged hysteria, always lurking in the background, gets the better of him here. I can see the spittle flying over the computer screen.
admit it, mq you rascally contrarian, you can’t get enough of my spittle. taste my bitter spittle. lick it up. yum yum. taste the unfathomable spittle of my performance art. that chili is your parents.
Roissy naturally fears and dislikes women, but has painstakingly trained himself to overcome his natural tendencies in a bar/pickup environment.
i dislike them so much i want to make sweet sweet love to them all night long and hold them close in the morning.
But when thinking about an actually powerful woman such as Hillary the old instincts bubble to the surface
i’d vote for a margaret thatcher. waz up wit dat, mq?
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jaakkeli:
Female attention doesn’t make alphas; alphas get extra female attention, but it’s just one way to get attention.
untrue. the love of women is the sine qua non of alphaness. without women in his life, the alpha male is a man without a soul, a duty-bound suit without a paycheck for his efforts. that is why an unemployed street thug who cleans up with the hood rats is more alpha than the well-paid lawyer who fumbles awkwardly when female attention is directed his way.
i wrote about defining the alpha male here:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2007/09/19/defining-the-alpha-male/
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You mention passive aggressive. Which is often a habit formed under disciplinarians. IT cant6 be the fault of this men that they were brought up as such. If they dont know it they wont change it. How do you unlearn the habit of being passive aggresive?
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Hey Reg, O-B girl might jump on his cock, but she didn’t bother to vote for him.
Given the twat he’s marrried to, if he gets elected, he’ll be jumping the dumb intern pussy at a rate that Bubba would be jealous of!
He’s a beta, I don’t care how many moonbats are wetting their knickers over his cocoa ass. The bowling thing is what really brought it home. We’ve been seeing stories about his love of basketball and what a jock he is, and he can’t even make a ball go down an alley. Real alphas can hit a three, cut off a line drive to the gap, rope a drive out to at least 250, and roll a freaking strike at least once in a string!
PA is right on target-real men don’t throw granny under the bus.
Face it, Roissey, the last real man can shut off the light when he leaves the country!
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the love of women is the sine qua non of alphaness. without women in his life, the alpha male is a man without a soul, a duty-bound suit without a paycheck for his efforts. that is why an unemployed street thug who cleans up with the hood rats is more alpha than the well-paid lawyer who fumbles awkwardly when female attention is directed his way.
So how do you define men who have few or no outward Alpha traits yet have great success scoring with women? Men like that are not commonplace but they do exist, especially among artsy types.
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So how do you define men who have few or no outward Alpha traits yet have great success scoring with women?
they are alpha. if women can see this, it doesn’t matter what other men think.
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[Obama’s] a beta, I don’t care how many moonbats are wetting their knickers over his cocoa ass. The bowling thing is what really brought it home. We’ve been seeing stories about his love of basketball and what a jock he is, and he can’t even make a ball go down an alley. Real alphas can hit a three, cut off a line drive to the gap, rope a drive out to at least 250, and roll a freaking strike at least once in a string!
No, I disagree. Bowling is an acquired rather than an inherent skill. A person who hasn’t bowled in many years is going to struggle the first time he tries it.
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Brutus said: “Obama’s] a beta, I don’t care how many moonbats are wetting their knickers over his cocoa ass. The bowling thing is what really brought it home. We’ve been seeing stories about his love of basketball and what a jock he is, and he can’t even make a ball go down an alley.”
Um, the guy can fill a concert stadium with screaming girls and he doesn’t even play rock music to do that. He’s had indefinable star quality since day on in the senate. He’s an Alpha.
I think it’s telling that in America — where sports have a disproportionate significance on men — that someone as Alpha as Obama would be judge a Beta because he can’t…bowl??!
Since when did the Big Lebowski become the standard all US males should apire to? I know a lot of great bowlers but there is only one politician in the US that can fill stadiums with screaming people. I’m not gonna vote for the guy, and don’t really like him, but we need to be honest about what constiitutes Alpha here.
Hey Roissy, if I buy you drinks sometime would you be willing to advise me on how to deal with a situation. See, now that’s a Beta thing!
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I’m with jaakkeli.
There’s the example of my brother. It took him 8 years to finish his degree, a double major in philosophy and film. He really hasn’t had a job in a while, and, like Blanche Dubois, relies on the kindness of others. He’s a tortured filmamaker/screenwriter.
His girlfriend in high school was a Filipina goddess who still, after 15 years, calls him out of the blue to find out how he’s doing, and his current girl is a bodacious blonde who could be Miss Texas and is 9 years his junior!
Women are so fucked up about what they want that you can’t use them to gauge alphaness. It’s what other men think.
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not to sound like Jack Nicholson, but I have neither the time nor the inclination to read all the responses. however, for those of you who might think Mark Penn isn’t beta enough, let me offer you a pristine example of what the gentleman who wrote to Camille Paglia was talking about. I present to you, Mr. Lanny Davis:
’nuff said?
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“Her Cunterrific Cuntastic Cuntery ensures that in her world it is always women first, women best, women forever victims and men relegated to an afterthought or natural born criminal perpetrators of Orwellian PC crimes, suitable only for reminding her of her ideological righteousness nurtured for decades during the height of the misandrist revolution in a fetid curdled soup of gender bender feelgood lies.”
Woah, tiger. Next time you get this upset, call me and we’ll go throw plates or something.
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#49 jaakkeli
Alphaness/betaness of course means, or is supposed to mean, the order in a pack, so to gauge someone’s alpha/beta tendencies you have to put them in a group of peers and see if they try to get the top position or if they’re immediately willing to accept follower status. Female attention doesn’t make alphas; alphas get extra female attention, but it’s just one way to get attention. In fact, pickup is mostly about impressing females with every other way except your rank among males. If you want to pick up women by “alphaness”, you have to build a lifestyle that puts you in a male hierarchy of some sort and still puts you among women to take notice (so being king of WoW doesn’t get you women), not talk to unknown girls on the street.
AMEN.
When Game aficionados try to transform themselves for the express purpose of picking up ladies, they have this idea of the Alpha male in mind as the prototype of who they want to be. But imagine this same male, with the same techniques in a small town where everyone knows him and all the women aren’t random strangers. This same guy cannot get past the actual alpha male, the guy who gets respect from all other men, and the guy who makes all other men whimper. That PUA who got 3 phone numbers at a bar now has to testify to The Man. The man, who usually, with physical strength and social capital can eat this PUA alive.
That’s why the PUA thrives in modern, urban, anonymous environments. He can avoid the domination of other men- the actual alphas, the naturals. When there is no actual social hierarchy to speak of because most people don’t even know their neighbor, there is no real Alpha or Beta. Those terms simply denote a desire to rank oneself above other men by arbitrary rules one decides to make up. If women are the ultimate prize and definition of an alpha, then why does it matter how that man ranks amongst other men? And since it obviously does…then amend your definitions.
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Hey, #52, I’ve been trying to convince Roissy that an alpha has to be more than a man with good “game” and the ability to attract many women, but I never managed anything nearly as convincing as this, and was ready to give in and concede the point. To think he had almost succeeded in changing my mind…
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#49 Brutus:
Women are so fucked up about what they want that you can’t use them to gauge alphaness. It’s what other men think.
…using bowling prowess — one of the least athletic of sports — as your criterion? Do you also use beer-pong as a bellwether of masculinity?
And if that’s the case, what’s so great about putting forth all the effort to dominate other men, get rich, and become an alpha male when men like your brother can get attractive women while not really doing much of anything besides knowing how to interact with them the right way?
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untrue. the love of women is the sine qua non of alphaness.
That’s just your redefinition of alpha. As used in biology, it’s a description of pack behaviour, not laycount. In fact, it’s perfectly possible to be a virgin alpha. Boys exhibit the same hierarchy behaviour at ages when they’re just beginning to get interested in girls. Packs of barely pubescent kids still have identifiable alphas and betas even though not one of them has likely had sex.
without women in his life, the alpha male is a man without a soul,
Blah blah blah. Still, he’s alpha if he’s the head of a pack and not alpha if he’s not. That’s it. Spiritual BS doesn’t matter.
that is why an unemployed street thug who cleans up with the hood rats is more alpha than the well-paid lawyer
No, the reason why a street thug is more likely to end up the alpha is that he’s got the better personality traits for it. For example, he’s likely to care less about whether he gets hurt, killed or in trouble with the authorities, so if you put a thug and a lawyer to interact on an equal basis, the thug can always make the lawyer back down by merely threatening him. That’s why lawyer personalities usually do not like to interact with thug personalities except in surroundings where the thug’s advantage in physical dominance is neutralized. In a scummy bar where a fight is not unusual, the lawyer can’t compete; in a classy place where the rules and the hired security staff neutralize the thug’s advantage on not giving a fuck the lawyer might have the upper hand.
If it’s a short-term interaction, alphaness is all about demonstrating or bluffing power and willingness to use it or actually using it, whether it’s a physical attack or something else. Among all animals, most male dominance fights don’t end up in actual fighting or injury, they end up with the loser gauging that it’s not worth the risk and backing down. Nothing is a better asset in a fight than not caring about what happens to you and a tattooed thug has a much better chance of projecting that than a guy in an expensive suit.
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2007/09/19/defining-the-alpha-male/
You’ve just imagined another meaning for “alphaness”, in the usual fashion common in the pickup industry. It’s the New Age for guys: moralism coated with terminology borrowed from natural science with no regard to what the terminology actually means.
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i agree with j. game is a small aspect of life, and TRUE alphas are REAL leaders of men. laycount means little to alpha status. but the more ‘new agey’ sages pua’s like, such as David Deida, recognise this fact and encourage guys to care more about their careers and life purpose than women. as a result, women are more attracted to them.
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I don’t buy the notion that women want to fuck Obama. I think that to many screaming girls he’s more like an asexual Jesus / Dalai Lama figure.
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they are alpha. if women can see this, it doesn’t matter what other men think.
Roissy, I don’t agree that men’s opinion of another man’s status is irrelevant. It may be so in polite society, where you can choose to ignore other men. But absent the restraints of civilization — like in prison or in Iraq — a man’s very survival depends on his respect among other men.
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In Prison Peter would be everyone’s bitch, a punk.
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” know what point you’re trying to make, but it gets lost on me. The language used makes it really hard for me to tell who’s a beta and who is an alpha. Perhaps no such distinction exists, or perhaps you make the rules as you go along.”
Irina you said it, not me.
jaakkeli -touch down, you made major points with #55.
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As J touched upon, human beings have an INNATE sense of what constitutes an alpha. And that is LEADER OF MEN, not scorer of lots of women. Put Mystery and Donald Trump in the same room full of men – who’s gonna lead? That’s what I thought. For all human history the leader of men got women as a byproduct, but that was all they were – a byproduct. The PUA dons his armour (game), goes straight for the byproduct (women), and declares himself an alpha.
The PUA is a freak of modernity, he couldn’t really exist at any other time. He is essentially cheating the ‘system’, exploiting the quirks and crazy opportunities of modernity – atomisation, endless congregations of beautiful single women in big cities, books telling you what to do etc. To describe a PUA as a true alpha is like me getting on a plane tomorrow morning, flying to India and calling myself a greater explorer than Columbus. Yes I went further, hell I got to where he wanted to go -but only because the modern world let me. Everybody knows I’m not an explorer. A PUA scores lots of women, but only because modernity lets him: humanity will NEVER consider him a true alpha, because the alpha-switch in all human brains will remain leader-of-men.
I love PUA’s. I want to be one, but only for the fun.
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I don’t buy the notion that women want to fuck Obama. I think that to many screaming girls he’s more like an asexual Jesus / Dalai Lama figure.
Huh? Of course women want to fuck Dalai Lama. In fact, I’d have the perfect plan for him, if he ever wants a game coach. It would include nothing except telling any hot woman he meets that the truth about how much he needs to struggle to keep his vow of celibacy in her company, in growingly elaborate language and getting increasingly “unable to resist” a bit of hand-holding, a bit of almost kissing, a bit of…
He’s the fucking Dalai Lama. What kind of a woman wouldn’t want to corrupt him?
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As J touched upon, human beings have an INNATE sense of what constitutes an alpha. And that is LEADER OF MEN, not scorer of lots of women.
Brilliant, brilliant, brilliant post.
I’d like to subscribe to your newsletter.
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#55 jaakkeli, also sheer brilliance. You just described exactly what turns young women on about “bad boys.” It’s alpha behavior that is no longer appropriate in modern civilization, but that had been essential to pack and tribal survival back in the day. Girls who were turned on and bred with such men ensured the survival of their offspring as well as the lives of their clansmen.
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Huh? Of course women want to fuck Dalai Lama.
Hah, true dat. And in what universe do women view Jesus as an “asexual figure”? The image of Jesus is infused with a creepy sexuality. Every image I’ve ever seen of Jesus on the cross, makes him look like some cut Calvin Klein model: perfect abs and pecs, acute orgasm face.
The band Type O Negative even has the perfect song about Christian women and their (sublimated and not) sexually fantasies about their Lord and Host:
http://www.lyricsfreak.com/t/type+o+negative/christian+woman_20141202.html
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I agree that cuchulainn’s #61 post was a great look at Pick Up Artists and why they may not necessarily qualify as Alphas.
Good job. Any luck with that convenience store clerk? Did you try my technique of asking to borrow something — a pen, a quarter. It’s a great ice breaker — women love to help out.
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Alpha != PUA.
Alpha-ness is defined among men. You can take a bunch of men and dump them on an island, Lord of the Flies style, and alpha, beta, and omega males will emerge. The alpha male, sociologically speaking, is the male that other males defer to. It may be out of respect, out of awe, or out of fear, but that’s it.
You don’t even need women to define who is the alpha male.
John McCain is an alpha male. He was thrown into the Hanoi Hilton and men deferred to him, even those of superior rank, due to respect of his moral courage. I have no idea how he does among the ladies, and it doesn’t matter to his alpha-ness.
Similarly, if you drop one man into a party full of girls, some of them will strike out and some of them will leave half of them pregnant. You don’t need other men to determine if a guy is a PUA.
John Lennon was probably a PUA. I don’t know if men would follow him into battle – and it doesn’t matter.
The two are orthogonal – the only thing in common with PUA’s and alphas is confidence.
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Ha, props to Roissy, he can take it. I hate bloggers who take swipes at everyone in their posts but can’t handle it when their commenters criticize.
All this “alpha” stuff is so absurd. The missing ingredient is maturity. This culture is in love with adolescence and would love to continue it as much as possible. In that sense straight culture is becoming a little similar to gay male culture — endless scoring, obsessed with looks, party and stay single forever, etc. (not that all gays do this, but you know what I mean).
The notion that a street punk would have been valued in a tribal culture is silly. If they didn’t calm down and fit themselves into a reasonable role after their youthful acting out, they would have been in trouble. A small group can’t handle someone woofing and acting out all the time, that’s a luxury.
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Of course women want to fuck Dalai Lama. In fact, I’d have the perfect plan for him, if he ever wants a game coach.
I’m guessing this is unlikely.
Although naturally women want to fuck the Dalai Lama. He’s a celebrity!
Women are attracted to anyone who has a unique thing going, is secure and comfortable in it, and attracts the respect of others for it. Also, it helps to be tall and good-looking.
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The notion that a street punk would have been valued in a tribal culture is silly. If they didn’t calm down and fit themselves into a reasonable role after their youthful acting out, they would have been in trouble. A small group can’t handle someone woofing and acting out all the time, that’s a luxury.
Street punks today are not necessarily leaders, nor are men who lead other men generally the thug type. Basically youths who exhibited more “bad boy” behavior such as aggression, disobedience and testing of physical boundaries tend to become de facto leaders among groups of boys. They were more inclined toward leadership whereas others were more inclined to follow.
They were likely whipped into shape by the older leaders who showed them their place in the tribe, but they’re basically going to compete for the leadership position as they get older. In modern society that breaks down, leaving a lot of these types either to join the military, sports, or to turn to street life as they have no real outlet for their desire of physical competition.
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We’re drifting away from the subject. Let’s stay on message, shall we?
Roissy is absolutely right, not only in what he says, but in the words he uses to say it. The fact is, and apparently has to be said over and over again, that men grovel all our lives to get laid, while women (at least ages 15-40–child-bearing years) can do so on demand. Every man knows this, which is why this blog (and Roosh, and VK, et al.) exists. This is known as “dyadic power”, and no feminist will admit it.
Society’s problem stems from women’s push for “structural” (economic and political) power. Men simply gave it all away because we were sold a bill of goods that this would lead to “equality”. Well, needless to say, it really led to female SUPREMACY. Her Supreme CCC and her followers see nothing wrong with a feminist president, house speaker, 100 cunt politics practitioners in the US Senate, etc. etc. etc.
And as I’ve said before, the image of young men’s future when that happens is something like the 1999 movie “Fight Club”. But consider this:
1) A CP legislator in Maine introduced a bill to make a felony violation out of “visual aggression” perpetrated against a child.
2) In Albuquerque, a lesbian couple complained to a local human rights commission about a photographer’s refusal to record their “wedding ceremony”. The HRC (like those initials, eh?) ruled in their favor and ordered the photographer to pay over $6000 in legal bills–all this for an act, the legality of which the State of New Mexico doesn’t even recognize itself!
The fundamental premise of CP as currently advocated by the Democratic party goes far beyond the traditional Dem commitment to a “safety net” to insure that no one will ever starve to death or die from lack of health care. It now holds that life must be all bliss, all the time, that no one’s poor widdle feewings must ever be hurt, and that no one must ever be disappointed by “losing”.
Time for men to take the country back by any means necessary, because if we don’t, the Muslims will.
PS. I know DA is going to give his usual riposte, so let me say to him that numbers do indeed matter–especially when the other side has nuclear toys too (and how do you know they don’t already?)
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mq, in prehistoric times most people would be dead before they ever stopped being youthful. Most of human history has been simply living out the Lord of the Flies.
And you’re missing the point. It isn’t about street thuggery at all. It’s about having some leverage over someone else. It doesn’t even have to be physical. As I mentioned above, an “alpha” can be young enough to not possibly qualify as any sort of a thug. As a kid you have power over others if you simply care less about whether you get in trouble with your mom and your teachers. They put some nerd to do a group assignment with you? You don’t care about the grade, the nerd thinks he’s dead if he doesn’t get a good grade? You have all the power. The nerd needs something from you, you need nothing from him. Little things like this build your long term social rank (depending on how you handle that, you can raise your status, lower the nerd’s status or screw up your own – you can always screw up).
I’m guessing that they have the rank in the old folks’ home, another place where the idea of thugs would be silly, but I can’t come up with an example there, not having had the experience yet.
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Sestamibi, what use is is to be able to “get laid” on demand, when what you want is a man who will love and stay with you? Men and women have different sexual natures, and in ways that can bring both sexes a great deal of unhappiness. To say that women have “won” in present conditions is silly. Any woman, even the prettiest, who doesn’t want to make herself into a kind of sexbot for men’s satisfaction is pretty much forced to drop out of the dating game altogether. The ones who try to go the sexbot route will also have to learn to be tough enough to handle the inevitable rejections when men – who get sexually bored faster than women – want to move on to someone else. Ordinarily she’ll go through a few rounds of this before she finds someone who is ready for an attachment. But if she isn’t lucky, she’ll endure endless cycles of it until she turns into the hard-faced shrew you all despise.
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Ouch, roissy. Devestating, though I suspect somewhat (mostly?) accurate analysis.
Though the sack of shit you see in the pic is probably a spine-less suckup (aka beta), Hillary is certainly not surrounded by betas. In your own words, look at Bill Clinton!
And you have no evidence she “loathes” the military. I’m not a Hillary fan, but when I’m honest with myself, I think it’s more because I don’t like Hillary the person, not because I think she’d be much more inept than the average president. She’s a robotic simulation of a human being, but that doesn’t mean she’d be a significantly worse president than the average one.
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Days of Broken Arrows – no luck, rejection. but that was a while ago. and now i kind of avoid that shop. it really makes sense to learn this stuff in vast, anonymous cities. social circle game, which i think includes areas you frequent, is really stupid, at least at the beginning. i learned the hard way.
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Wanting to do a good job and be successful, perhaps the most successful person in the country, means that Hillary has “a seething vengeance complex?” What exactly did she do that a thousand men haven’t done? (Including her own husband, who’s better at it than she is). You’re transparent in your assumption that a woman in the political arena is somehow agressivley taking away something you seem to think men “deserve.” Sad.
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Do you ever post any comments with content other than “Gannon is a child molester” and “I like hairy pussy”?
Not really, mainly because this is one of the more ridiculous blogs in the blogosphere (and that’s saying a lot!)
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Clio @ 73…I hear what you are saying about even the prettiest girls dropping out of the “sexbot scene”, but, they defintely have options.
As Hope has said many times before, and I can back up (as I am sure you can too), there are a ton of Engineers/Mathematicians/Programmers/etc. that would be happy to be in a long term relationship.
And, nowadays, their social skills have improved greatly (not so much for the new immigrants, though).
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Even nerdy engineers, even “nice” Catholic boys, or most of them, have sexbot expectations of women nowadays. If a woman isn’t ready to sleep with a man after 5 dates maximum, he drops her. If she explains at the outset that she isn’t willing to sleep with him unless they get serious (engagement-level serious), she won’t even get three dates out of him.
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If a woman isn’t ready to sleep with a man after 5 dates maximum, he drops her. If she explains at the outset that she isn’t willing to sleep with him unless they get serious (engagement-level serious), she won’t even get three dates out of him.
Unless the man has similar views. True, the only-after-engagement policy is surely more common among women than among men, but that doesn’t mean that no men think that way.
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Peter/Days-“..on the playing-fields of Eton”, boys. Of course, that probably means NOTHING to a generation that believes everyone gets a trophy at the end of the season, lest their delicate psyches are damaged.
Reg-if you’re alpha, there’s really no extra energy expended to dominate other men; it’s a natural outcome of your alphaness. Women, seeing the deference of other men, flock to your banner. And bowling, as an athletic endeavor, hits the tape at the same time as golf (cart golf, not walking 18). As for the bro, his philosophy studies stand up pretty well for him; he always sounds so sensitive and caring to women. Not that many people on this blog care, but note that I only described his women physically, not intellectually or emotionally. I think his life is so seat-of-the-pants that the beautiful drama queens he draws in are perfect-lovely and temporary.
I didn’t start the concept of Obambi as some sort of stud jock, his campaign did. He even went on HBO’s Real Sports to talk about it! ! For him to be so pathetic at bowling gives lie to his natural athletic prowess, as opposed to one who practices the same thing interminably to instill muscle memory.
I was at a corporate outing last year held by my girlfriend’s company. The evening’s entertainment took place at one of these hip club/bowling alleys where one can bowl and sip Bombay Sapphire martinis. The girlfriend had never done tenpin bowling (up here in the Northeast we have a version called candlepin, with much smaller balls and pins). She bowled 2 strings and drank 2 Cosmos, and averaged 110, about a triple Obama. That’s because she IS an athlete!
All of which proves nothing to the doubters, so GO READ HIS BOOKS!!! They’re full of lines like the one where his grandma made the comment he villified her for being “like a punch in the stomach”.
What a weenie…
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She bowled 2 strings and drank 2 Cosmos, and averaged 110, about a triple Obama. That’s because she IS an athlete!
That’s not exactly demonstrative of athletic prowess. Even I got a ton of strikes when I went bowling, and that was before my days of actually running and exercising. Did bowling well really express my athleticism or was it just my ability to guide a ball in a straight line? I also seem to kick ass at table pool, maybe because I have some manual precision and visual geometry voodoo.
natural athletic prowess
Being athletic does not necessarily make an alpha in the political arena, nor does being a leader necessarily require one to perform well in sports. I don’t know why his campaign even claimed that he’s athletic, as most politicians don’t care to flaunt that aspect of themselves. In any case this hardly proves that he’s a weakling.
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Hope, you obviously have hand/eye coordination and a certain amount of muscle control to guide a bowling ball. I’ll leave it to you to decide if that makes you “athletic”. My girl, on the other hand, swam the butterfly for her college team, shoots in the 90’s from the men’s tees when we golf, and suffers no palpitations when it’s time to buy a new bikini, even at the age of 46 (though, being a woman, she’s always doing extra cardio because she’s “feeling fat”-at 5’9″ 125 lbs!). Her bona fides are established. If memory serves, she scored way better in the second game, so there was a learning curve.
The playing fields were usually the places where the cream rose, alphawise (see Wellington’s line about Eton). Kids don’t play schoolyard ball much anymore, which is where the pecking order is first established. Because there can be no winners or losers anymore, in addition to the fact that many kids have opted for the joys of digital athletic competition instead of physical, the top end of the athletic pool has privatized to year-round AAU programs, leaving the rest in your local Little League to scuffle around the field in a pathetic display of futility when compared to young athletes from 25 years ago. There’s no alpha dog because they’re ALL betas. The cruel payoff comes a few years down the road when he tries out for the high school team; the alphas are back on board and our boy is found wanting, betrayed by the system into thinking (without the reinforcement of the schoolyard) he had actual talent. He then turns on his formerly-favorite pasttime, judging it a waste of time and effort.
In our new, feminized America, you are absolutely correct that today’s politicians don’t flaunt any athletic background, which is mostly because fewer and fewer have any. Bush Senior was captain and 1st baseman for the Yale varsity (the Wikipedia shot of him in his baseball uniform makes him look eerily like Tom Brady’s scouting combine photo). Reagan was a lifeguard and a jock in college. Carter was a basketball star in high school. Ford was a football star in college (U of Michigan retired his number). I don’t have to list JFK’s athletic exploits-the Camelot myth machine pushed that enough (and I would submit his name as the King of Alphas).
Bubba and Dubya-nada. Bush played baseball in high school, and Clinton played the sax.
Again, read his books and form your own opinion about just what Obama is.
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#73 alias, you clearly didn’t read anything in my post #71 beyond the second paragraph. The reality of dyadic power is biologically based, immutable, and totally incidental to what I said.
My main point is that we have never experienced a society with complete “chicks in charge” control, and when that happens, life will be dramatically different from that to which we’ve become accustomed.
The cuntification of America is based on the principle that the truth is whatever I believe it to be. That explains everything, from global warming hysteria at the macro level to the examples I gave in my previous post.
The cunt Katharine MacKinnon has written about “feminist jurisprudence”, which is a completely new paradigm that inverts all our assumptions about civil and criminal justice (and just for the record, I’m not a lawyer). First of those to go is the presumption of innocence in a criminal trial. Another cunt, Wendy Murphy, a former sex crimes prosecutor in Massachusetts, has come right out and challenged this outright insofar as it “assumes” that women making sex crime accusations are always lying.
Let me add another case to those I cited in my earlier post: a politically-active woman in Carpentersville, IL, an Obama delegate no less, was dropped from the slate because of a reference she made about some black kids raising hell near her house as “monkeys”. OK, that’s a political decision and I have no problem with that.
What I do have a problem with is that she was cited for disorderly conduct as under a local ordinance such behavior includes saying anything that might be “disturbing” to someone. Her penalty was a $75 fine.
My point is that a major goal of the cunt agenda is the criminalization of behavior that does no harm other than hurt the most sensitive individual’s poor widdle feewings. And under such rule, the most sensitive individual holds all the cards and the power. This has nothing to do with who can get laid on demand.
Bottom line is that the concept of “equality” peddled by 70’s feminists turned out to be a carload of horseshit. It’s time western men recognized that only one group can be in control. I prefer that it be men, because otherwise we will have a society that first starts out like “Fight Club”, will then turn into one with greater levels of violence against women, and then ultimately into a very intensely patriarchal one in which women’s choices are severely circumscribed.
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Sestamibi, I did read the rest of your post, and I thought that it was so angry/bitter that it was better not to try to tackle it. I loathe what feminism has sought to accomplish in recent years; I’m hoping it will be possible to put a stop to it; but to suggest that all women embrace it equally is mistaken, and to suggest that it was feminists alone who made the situation possible is to ignore the huge political pressure since WWII that brought about the expansion of the public sector.
The 1970s feminists were all schooled in the radicalism of their era and could see no reason not to push for an ever greater expansion of government and an end to the concept of privacy (except as it pertained to the right to have abortions). But there were many other groups, less radical than they, who were part and parcel of the Big Push. The expansion of government suited the politicians – all politicians – very well, because it gave them the opportunity to bribe their voters with other people’s money. That’s why the juggernaut has been so difficult to stop.
If you care to read my blog (I’ve linked the address to my name, above; but it’s also on Roissy’s blogroll as The Other World, so you know that it can’t be all that pro-feminist), and you’ll see that – minus the fury – many of my concerns aren’t that different from yours. Not all my posts deal with politics or sexual politics, but there are a number that do.
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Clio I like your blog, I didn’t know you were an actual academic, I thought you were another hobbyist like the rest of us. lol
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I’m not an actual academic, in the sense of being employed by a university. I got a doctorate in history, and did a little teaching, but that’s all.
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Alias, if I am angy/bitter, I have good reason to be. And if you think I’m virulent, try checking out some of the more miltant men’s rights website: Outcast Superstar, Uzem & Luzem, M is for Malevolent, Eternal Bachelor, etc.
About fifteen years ago I was accused of sexual harrassment by a cunt I hardly knew at my place of employment. I almost lost my job for no other reason than that she was “uncomfortable” in my presence. That was it! In the HR inquest that followed, she even admitted that I never touched her, made no gestures that could be misinterpreted, or threatened her in any way (not that I could do that anyway–she was not even in my department or in the same reporting chain).
If sanity is to be restored in this country, there will need to be a pushback. It is not enough for conservatives to wax nostalgic about “First Amendment rights” in the face of the PC Gestapo. What needs to be done is apply equal and opposite force: “No, WE’LL tell YOU what you can say!”
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Equal and opposite force to whom, sestamibi? To all women anywhere who annoy you, or who make allegations you don’t happen to believe, or to feminists in general, even those who might – it does happen – be making a legitimate claim in a particular instance? Will it mean never giving any woman the benefit of the doubt if she claims injury by a man? (I mean, in private life; the law is the law and should remain impartial when judghing competing claims.)
I’m not taunting; I’m genuinely curious to know what you might mean by pushback, especially when you say something like “WE’LL tell YOU what you can say!” Again, whom will you tell, and what? Forgive me if I find such comments a little alarming. I trust it’s hyperbole.
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You just don’t get it, do you? We’re talking about people being silenced at the whim of feminists and I’m saying that the only way to restore balance is to push back and use the same methods. Making nice and talking about constitutional pieties just ain’t gonna work. The Left/Feminism has made all its gains through intimidation and violence, and I have no problem with using the same methods to resist its suppression of freedom of speech and thought.
Compare what I said to someone like Ellen Goodman, who thinks anyone who doesn’t believe in the religion of global warming should be regarded in the same way as Nazis.
“Will it mean never giving any woman the benefit of the doubt if she claims injury by a man? (I mean, in private life; the law is the law and should remain impartial when judghing competing claims.)”
What the hell does that mean? And what the hell does “private life” refer to? Where does “private life” end and justiciable action begin? And should her word always be taken as gospel?
If we are living in a society where a man can be imprisoned for “visual aggression” simply on the word of a child or woman, then watch what happens when Islam takes over.
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I’m not saying anything very obscure, sestamibi, and I suspect it’s only your anger that makes it seem so to you. Of course I don’t think a woman’s word should always be taken as gospel; that’s why I mentioned the law, which is supposed to be impartial when a victim or plaintiff goes up against an alleged perpetrator. I meant, if you have a female friend or acquaintance, and she tells you a story about how her boss is harrassing her, are you going to automatically jump to the conclusion that she’s lying, or that she is somehow to blame for what happened to her?
I once went through a very bad experience of harrassment by a fellow tenant when I “rejected” him (there was no real rejection because there was no relationship), complete with physical violence – he attacked my door with a hammer – and death threats. and I could not get the police to take it seriously. They just told me to move. Part of the problem was with the law itself, which isn’t equipped, where I live, to handle tenant-to-tenant harrassment, but still – there was something ludicrous about the situation. This happened at the height of the anti-harrassment crusade by feminists, in the early 1990s! And it hasn’t made me bitter against men or the law, just cautious.
Ellen Goodman can think that those of us who aren’t convinced by the global warming hypothesis are equivalent to nazis, but she hasn’t the power to have us arrested yet, has she?
And I ask you once again, what do you mean by “pushing back”? Do you mean having the Ellen Goodman types arrested and charged with hate speech for their asinine bloviating? A nice society you’ll have then. It seems to me that calm, patient, contemptuous rebuttal is the only solution to the problem.
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Sestamibi: thanks for the sites! I am adding them to my bookmarks.
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Oh, and as for alpha meaning power versus success with women, they’re obviously correlated but not identical. Where do you put the Pope? 😉
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SFG- The pope has neither. People haven’t listened to him in centuries, and no one wants to do Darth Sidious.
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with regards to hillary’s pelt, i have just one word: merkin (xl)
given that hillary is nominally a female and nominally a lawyer, her clit must be prodigous (i notice bill tends to back out of a room, when leaving)
sestamibi and sfg sound like they caught the wrong end of a strap-on, at one time or another. there must be a better term than “omega” for such complete losers.
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Alias, I’m sorry for what you went through, but in your case an objective crime was committed and the police were derelict in their responsibilities.
“Ellen Goodman can think that those of us who aren’t convinced by the global warming hypothesis are equivalent to nazis, but she hasn’t the power to have us arrested yet, has she?”
That doesn’t mean that side doesn’t crave that power. Just wait until HRC or BO are elected.
“Do you mean having the Ellen Goodman types arrested and charged with hate speech for their asinine bloviating? A nice society you’ll have then.”
And how is this different from what we already have now??! If that is what it takes, then YES I DO WANT THEM CHARGED WITH HATE SPEECH. Maybe then they’ll get it and both sides can back off.
Let me pose it to you this way, and don’t weasel a response if you care to have the last word:
1) You are a city council member in Carpentersville, IL. Will you propose to amend the disorderly conduct ordinance to drop the provision about “disturbing speech”? Yes or no answer only.
2) You are a member of the Maine state legislature. The bill to make “visual aggression” a felony comes to the floor for a vote? Your vote, Sen. Alias? Yes or no and not chickening out and voting “present” like state senator Barack Obama did all too many times during his tenure in the Illinois legislature.
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Well, let me first make it clear that I’m not an American; I’m Canadian, and I’m actually trying to fight “hate speech” legislation at this very moment.
But if I were an American? My answer would be yes, drop the provision about “disturbing speech”; and no, do not make “visual aggression” a felony.
The only speech I’m interested in banning is the kind that “incites” – i.e. a speaker at a gathering who says, “go out and burn the houses of those —- [whatever group you hate]”. But the law already has provisions against that sort of thing; hate speech legislation isn’t required.
As for visual aggression – well, I would support community bylaws that say “you must not parade naked through the streets”, or “you must not put up posters of violent or sexual acts that the community finds disturbing”. But I would not make this sort of thing a felony; just a nuisance.
Are you satisfied, sestamibi, old chap? I’m pleased that I can give unequivocal answers to both your questions.
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OK, alias, I’ll leave it at that, but just so you should know, this is just in from YOUR Canada!
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/subscriber/columnists/top3/story/4159616p-4746452c.html
Gawd, I’m glad I live in the USA!!
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she hasn’t the power to have us arrested yet, has she?”
That doesn’t mean that side doesn’t crave that power. Just wait until HRC or BO are elected.
You don’t have to wait. Americans are already being watched and arrested for being “terrorists” and engaging in “terrorist activities.” Tyranny comes in many forms, and the inability to tell a girl at work that she’s hot is just scratching the surface.
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“Gawd, I’m glad I live in the USA!!”
Yes, sestamibi, that’s sort of what I was trying to tell you.
Hope, I think your government’s powers under anti-terrorism legislation are too broad, from what I understand of them. But laws made under a perceived external threat are different from those that are understood or comprehended in a nation’s constitution; for one thing, they can be more easily changed, when cooler heads prevail and the threat is reassessed. In any case, such laws are – sometimes – justified.
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Feminism has harmed out society in many ways in the last 40 years. Most men have basically been in the dark until now. Most men don’t realize how much society is fucking them over even now. I predict an uprising at some point, if men finally organize and get their act together. There must be enough angry beta males tired of watching all the hot women mate with the same few guys…
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Yikes, jaakkeli wins the thread! Well said, 55, and true.
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@HOPE, you have to see that assuring survival of the offspring doesn’t always mean fucking the bad boy. sure, women get horny for them, but it is due to their primitive brain function, hunter-gatherer alogical impulses. but if they think a little, what if he gets arrested, or can’t get a decent job to hold the house up? or gets killed by forcing physical limits beyond his intelligence to judge them?
assuring the survival of the offspring is not a 100% sexual decision in our world. we got really sophisticated.
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