I have a theory about girls who have “tight like that” best gay boyfriends. These types of girls are very girly (read: flaky and feminine) but their libidos lean towards the masculine. It’s really the perfect combo: A girly girl who unleashes in the bedroom (and the park and the library and the deep end of the pool…). I’m not sure why this is. Maybe the girly in them loves the BGBF attention and the sexpot in them identifies with the robust and promiscuous gay lifestyle. The downside for a straight guy dating a BGBF-loving girl is the higher risk of cheating and drama. These are the girls who will dance on bars as random guys stroke their stockinged inner thighs. To handle a relationship with this girl, you have to be in a “party all the time” mental space.
Interestingly, there is no reverse scenario. There’s no such thing as a lesbian girlfriend for straight men. It would be great to be able to call up a best lesbian girlfriend for a quickie round of golf or Wii bowling, and commiserating over bitches. Even better if she’s a lipstick lesbian and looks good. Unfortunately, lesbians get along with no one but other lesbians.
I would love to have a gay boyfriend — minus the intimacy part — to take along shopping so that I don’t have to waste time figuring out what looks best on me. He would know right away. And I would enjoy my platonic gay boyfriend’s constant flattery boosting my ego major — maybe even two full rating points (10++) so that I would hit the clubs later on cloud nine rejecting women all night for being out of their league.
Some things I’ve learned from a girl I know who has a BGBF:
- Gay boyfriends are fiercely protective of their girlfriends. They have been known to knock out brawny straight guys for disrespecting their “girl”.
- Black gays are the most flaming, followed by whites, then asians who are the hardest to peg as gay from a mere glance. Supposedly, this is because it is a big deal for gay blacks to come out so when they do it’s pedal to the metal.
- There is such a thing as a “gay face”. Hard to describe, but you know it when you see it. Think big bright feminine eyes, full lips, and an all-around glow.
- All gay men are “ass men”. There’s no such thing as a gay “bitch tit man”.
I am much hipper and, yes, a little gayer, for knowing this culturally valuable information.
Postscript:
Do gay men get off looking at their own penises? Do they have to battle a hardon every time they grab hold to take a wizz? Mysteries of the universe…
One thing that I heard about gay men is this conumdrum:
Most gay men are quite feminine, obviously, but they are attracted to “masculine” gay men. So, this is why there is that phenomenon of gay men dressing up as Lumberjacks and firemen and in military garb. They take turns playing the masculine role so that the other can “get off”.
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Interestingly, there is no reverse scenario. There’s no such thing as a lesbian girlfriend for straight men … Unfortunately, lesbians get along with no one but other lesbians.
Steve Sailer wrote a classic essay in the 1990’s pointing out all the differences between lesbians and gay men. It still seems accurate after all these years.
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One other problem with women with gay friend is that often they look to the gay friends for “approval” as to who they should date. Gay men will always steer women towards flashy assholes, never towards anyone decent. Also, if the women are on the pill — which biologically makes them prefer hyper-masculine assholes — you pretty much have to be a date rapist to pass “approval.”
And that Sailer essay was a classic!
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dan savage delivered a lengthy treatise on fag hags
podcasts.thestranger.com/savagelove/archives.php
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First, kudos on seeing a difference between a woman with a gay BF and a fag hag…huge difference.
My main gay is very jealous of the outlying gays in my life. I have seen some gay on gay crime when he thinks a new mo is infringing on his territory. He also hates pretty much everyone I date; no one is good enough. It can be flattering at times, but also tiresome. I have kept certain people a secret from him as I just don’t want to hear it.
As far as the hyper sexual thing, I will say this: I have had some of the most depraved conversations of my life with my Gay BF.
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No, this is not why it is. It’s that black culture, especially the more ghetto the blacks are, is an attention whore culture in general. So is the gay culture. So when you put them together, you get attention whore squared. For example look at a white basketball player and a black basketball player and how they play on average. Blacks put a lot of emphasis on doing that something “extra,” on adding something flamboyant and flashy for the highlight reel. Look at how a black person hooks up a car as opposed to a white person, with the spinning rims, multiple TV’s, gold trim and other gaudy accessories. Look at pimps. Watch a black couple argue vs. a white couple. Look at a group of black girls on the train vs. a group of white girls and how loudly they speak. Blacks in a movie theater. Black guys hanging out with each other versus white guys on average. Now do the same thing with openly gay men versus straight men. You’ll see that gay men on average fiend for attention way more than straight men and act way more flamboyant. Combine black culture with openly gay culture and you get super attention whoring.
Also, white gay people are more likely to be from two-parent homes, so the influence of a straight father figure and other older male adults like uncles and stuff will definitely help rein in queenish behavior. Black gay people on the other hand are more likely to have only older women as role models since illegitimacy is so high. This lack of older male authority figures also causes them to be extra queenish when they come out of the closet.
One of the ironies of black people though is that when they go to the opposite socioeconomic extreme and come from well-to-do, well-off families with a lot of father figures, they are often way more prim, proper and uptight than their white counterparts of similar economic status. When one of these educated “bougee” black types comes out of the closet, they tend to be among the least queenish and most reserved gay people you’ll ever meet.
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asians who are the hardest to peg as gay from a mere glance
Who would have guessed that Mr. Sulu was gay?
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Gay men individually can be OK to hang around with, but if you are a physically attractive man who looks younger than your age you want to stay the hell away from environments with lots of gay men. Particularly if you originally come from a part of the country that triggers their cowboy fantasies. Can you say sexual harrassment?
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Days of Broken Arrows
Also, if the women are on the pill — which biologically makes them prefer hyper-masculine assholes
I thought the pill prevented ovulation and women are most attracted to hyper-masculine assholes when they can become pregnant.
Black gays are the most flaming, followed by whites, then asians who are the hardest to peg as gay from a mere glance.
I’ve noticed this same thing. You can spot a gay black man from across the street. Whites are 50/50 and asians fly under the radar. A good friend of mine recently came out and I had absolutely no idea he was gay beforehand. He is Chinese.
Think big bright feminine eyes, full lips, and an all-around glow.
That describes my best friend. Girls and guys just assume he’s gay all the time. In fact, he’s a womanizing asshole just like me. Although, he is neurotic like a bitch.
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asians who are the hardest to peg as gay from a mere glance
Asian men are already the most feminine men of any race (except for their nerdiness), and there is less sexual dimorphism among asians.
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one of my gay friends recently toldme he would help me come up with a way to get back at this guy i use to see. i really didn’t see the need to do it; he was more into the plot than i was.
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Nailed it… although you forgot one important detail;
– Gay men LOVE boobs and feel it their right; nay, their duty, to fondle them whenever there’s a nice pair around. My girls saw more action during a weekend in West Hollywood…
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“Even better if she’s a lipstick lesbian and looks good. Unfortunately, lesbians get along with no one but other lesbians.”
Goddamn this is true! The lipstick lesbians I’ve met (neighbors), hell I think all lesbians tend to be very suspicious even downright hostile to the opposite sex even if they’re gay. Their cliques look like they are comprised of other lesbians they’ve been in relationships with and they will continue to hang with each other even after splits. Its kinda like watching a sitcom where at some point all the friends sleep with each other, except all the friends are girls.
To add to your gay man identifiers; Gay men seem to have a walk. Unsurprisingly, it looks like they’ve got something stuck up their ass.
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Gay men LOVE boobs and feel it their right; nay, their duty, to fondle them whenever there’s a nice pair around. My girls saw more action during a weekend in West Hollywood…
Hmmm. Might not be a bad idea for a straight dude to pretend he’s gay ….
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Gay magnet:
http://www.glamj.com/collectionDetails.asp?id=csrcd5137&from=search&value=thunderpuss
CD1 is smoking, CD2 sucks.
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The girls you describe as really loving the BGBF sound like bisexuals (girly but wild), so they may also feel an affinity for that reason too.
Think big bright feminine eyes, full lips, and an all-around glow.
Saved by the lack of glow. When I first started paying more attention to what my clothes looked like, I was somewhat worried I’d be mistaken for gay — thin and young-looking, nice clothes, and big eyes / full lips.
In the five years since, it’s happened only once, and by a girl who routinely mistakes gays for straights and vice versa. I think girls can tell just by the look you give them. A gay guy would never try to hold / dominate their eye contact, smirk at them, etc.
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VK, since I don’t subscribe to Showtime I just googled the “the chart” vis a vis the L-word. Holy shit so it is true!? Wikipedia has a nice little section on it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_L_Word
Does this mean that if lesbians we’re capable of reproducing with each other you’d get a bunch of ‘tards? just askin.
VK: “You’re only gay if you’re on the bottom. True story. That is all”
Hahaha! You crack me up.
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Rachael-It’s amazing but true. I have a lot of friends in the restaurant biz, which is chock full of both gay men and loose women. The gay guys basically get to feel up every woman in the place! I used to joke with the head gay waiter that he’s felt more tits in his me, a straight guy.
My town has pretty substantial gay and lesbian populations, and the guys are much more fun to hang out with that the gurlz.
Here in Massachusetts, it’s telling that when gay marriage was instituted, lesbain couples married in far greater numbers than gay men. The boys want to dance to techno, drink and get laid, and the girls want to cuddle on the couch with their cats.
Hey, they’re kinda like straight people!
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Gayguyz and lesbians often don’t like each other one little bit, which makes sense because many lesbians just aren’t that fond of men period. And, exceptions noted, Brutus is onto something: gayguyz like to have extraverted fun (with the occasaional break to sing a sad Sondheim song), while lesbians go into hyper-nesting mode. There’s a widely-noted phenomenon (which I learned about from a lesbian friend) called “LBD” — lesbian bed death. The sex spark vanishes from many lesbian relationships really fast. Evidently it doesn’t hurt to have some testosterone around to set the moment on fire.
A gay friend of mine doesn’t refer to ’em as “gays and lesbians,” he refers to ’em as “gays and glums.”
As Sailer says in his essay, gayguyz and lesbians really don’t have that much in common. It’s funny that for political reasons they’re often thought of as belonging to the same demographic, because left to their own devices (as they are out in, for instance, NY’s Long Island beach towns) they usually don’t have much to do with each other.
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The guyz had Provincetown all to themselves up to a few years ago when a lesbian infestation began, much to the boys’ dismay. Many have since decamped to Ogunquit, Maine, which has become quite the gay hotspot.
The gurlz, on the other hand, have always had Northhampton, MA as theirs. Little surprise that the elte women’s collges (The Seven Sisters) surround the town. Anyone with a (real) penis need not apply…
Hanging out with the aforementioned restaurant people, I’ve gone out with the group to gay clubs, and I have to say that a good time is had by all, if drinking, drugging, dancing, etc. is your idea of a good time.
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Where I live, the only decent dance club within 50 square miles is a gay/lesbian bar. Unfortunately straight men cannot go there without getting their asses grabbed which generally sends them flying out the door unless their girlfriend just HAS to dance one more dance. This happened the last time I went with a straight couple I know. The Calvin Klein underwear runway show was playing on the big screen the whole while which also made him uneasy.
But it’s the only place in this cow town where you can hear electronic music and something besides hip hop (though they have two rooms; one being the hip hop room). Women get hit on too (I did) but the lesbians are a lot more considerate. They will ASK if you’re a lesbian and even if you say no; still want to dance with you. Women are by and large so much more civilized, let’s face it. I have gay friends, my ex husband had gay friends, my daughter has gay & lesbian friends. It’s no big deal any more, thankfully. So yes, friends are good. All types. Go for it, and happy shopping.
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Brutus- I’m from Mass and worked in restaurants there for 5+ years. It was basically an endless game of grabass.
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Funny you should say that, because since I first started reading your blog, you’ve always reminded me of Gale Harold (straight in spite of his name) who played “Brian Kinney” on the TV show Queer as Folk.
What gay men have to offer women, or some of us, as friends and companions is intellectual/artsy interests without the sexual complications that arise from making friends with straight men, and without the emotional complications of female friendships – although the latter can occasionally be an issue with gay male/straight female friendships.
A gay man and a straight woman can be friends in a mind-meets-mind way that is impossible in any other relationship either of them might have.
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DF,
Watch The L Word on Showtime….. you’ll understand after seeing the chart.
You’re only gay if you’re on the bottom. True story. That is all
P.S if you ever go to prison and some guy turns his pocket inside out and asks you to hold it as you walk around the yard…. Trust me…. Don’t do it… He’ll say he wants to just be your friend and protect you but then he’ll start asking you to “do things” for him
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In law school, I had a female classmate who was a little older than most, and her looks were on the unfortunate side of plain (not hideous, but about a 5). She also had a bad case of scoliosis, with an extremely curved spine, and had to walk with canes most of the time. Also, she had the personality of a sea anemone on DNR.
Well, all of a sudden in second year, she announced she was engaged… and when she introduced her fiance to everyone, he turned out to be a hot, yuppie type. It turned out he was employed in the PR department of the local symphony.
I wondered about how this plain, borderline ugly, boring law student with crutches snagged such an attractive guy (about an 8 or 9)… until I heard him talk and looked at his mannerisms. While he didn’t speak with a flaming lisp, the visual and aural clues all said “gay”.
I didn’t want to ask this girl how or where she met him, but since she obviously didn’t get around much, I concluded she had met him on the internet, and that he was a gay guy either masquerading as straight for elaborate personal reasons, or he was playing an elaborate ruse to ensnare a potential future cash cow of a wife.
Still, it infuriated me a bit that such a loser like this chick, with such a dud personality, could somehow score such a good-looking guy. Were really they having sex, I wondered, or was it just a big ruse they were playing on everyone?
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One of the ironies of black people though is that when they go to the opposite socioeconomic extreme and come from well-to-do, well-off families with a lot of father figures, they are often way more prim, proper and uptight than their white counterparts of similar economic status. When one of these educated “bougee” black types comes out of the closet, they tend to be among the least queenish and most reserved gay people you’ll ever meet.
I suspect that it’s an over compensation by the upper class black person to counteract the low class behaviour of his poorer counterparts. It’s an attempt to disprove old stereotypes of black people for personal gain and in some cases, to foster better relations between whites and blacks.
Given how the stereotypes of black people, I certainly sympathize with their so-called bougee attitudes and mannerisms. As an example, I eat KFC in my car with deep tinted windows far away from my neighbourhood, lest some white people find me, and I regularly tip at 25% to fight the old stereotype of poor tipping by black people.
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Yeah, that’s exactly right. It’s an overcompensation.
And I do think, from living in NYC, that Latino gays are probably among the flamingest, if not THE flamingest.
I saw my first guido flamer last month, which had to be the weirdest thing I ever saw.
Another reason why I think blacks may seem to be the most flaming may be because flaming blacks stand out in such stark contrast from your typical ultra-macho black.
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His advice for identifying gay men is only useful for the category of gay men who look gay. Ahem. Elaboration: there are many gay men who do not look gay at all and whom other men are notoriously bad at identifying.
One pointer: any extraordinarily handsome man, good-looking beyond belief, is almost certain to be gay. Whether this is because they are born that way, or because they work harder on their looks, I don’t know, but it is true, and a great sorrow to any woman who appreciates a handsome man.
Another pointer (perhaps only women will pick this up): gay men move with a certain self-consciousness, as if they’re used to being looked at. (“The cameras are turned in” as someone said here once in another context.) Straight men never do this, even if very handsome or vain. A vain straight man may preen in the presence of women or a mirror; a gay man walks as if he’s always aware of eyes on him.
Another pointer that only women can pick up on: until you’re too old to count, straight men always check you out when introduced to you, even if only to dismiss you. Gay men look through you, in an indefinable way that is somehow easy to recognise.
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One pointer: any extraordinarily handsome man, good-looking beyond belief, is almost certain to be gay. Whether this is because they are born that way, or because they work harder on their looks, I don’t know, but it is true, and a great sorrow to any woman who appreciates a handsome man.
This seems to be another instance of alias clio asserting something is “true” without any appeal to evidence; and where the actual evidence, once again, says the exact opposite of her claim.
Gay men are rated as less attractive by women when they are not given personal information on the men. And women will rate heterosexual male faces as more attractive if they are told the men in the pictures are gay!
http://blogs.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-scientific-fundamentalist/200805/all-stereotypes-are-true-exceptv-all-extremely-handsome-me
So the gay man = attractive thing is an illusion that females create solely in their minds for whatever sick reason.
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One thing East Coasters don’t realize is the difference between Central American Latinos and Caribbean or some South American Latinos. The former have inherited more from the Amerindian groups, and these resemble East Asians in many ways; while the latter have inherited more from Africans.
So you’re typical Mexican gay shouldn’t be as flaming as your typical Puerto Rican gay (remember Ricky from My So-Called Life?). Only someone who’s had extensive bi-coastal experience could say for sure. I don’t know.
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“Given how the stereotypes of black people, I certainly sympathize with their so-called bougee attitudes and mannerisms. As an example, I eat KFC in my car with deep tinted windows far away from my neighbourhood, lest some white people find me, and I regularly tip at 25% to fight the old stereotype of poor tipping by black people.”
David A., I have to say that I would never have known about 2/3 of the stereotypes concerning black people if black people had not constantly told me about them. I never knew until you said so, for instance, that black people were supposed to be bad tippers.
p.s. Did you know that Canada’s Governor General is a (very pretty, though no doubt rather old to you fellows) Haitian woman named Michaele Jean? She had dual citizenship but had to give it up when she was appointed GG.
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Rain And, and alias clio:
The most scientifically accepted hypotheses of causative factors behind gayness have to do with either decreased testosterone, or increased estrogen (or both), circulating in the mother’s womb at a critical point in the development of the fetal brain (same supposedly goes for the origin of lesbianism).
Low testosterone or high estrogen might also correlate with a slight feminization of the features, causing many gay men to have slightly more delicate facial features.
I realize this is a generalization and you have a broad, bell-curve of gay males and lesbians with all kinds of features, but there may be a slight preponderance of more delicate features in gay males, which accounts for some women seeing gay males as more attractive, while others think they’re less attractive.
With respect to the Psychology Today article, it depends on what the individual woman considers attractive. After all, it’s been reported that women have an undulating cycle of what kinds of males they respond to, which tracks the menstrual cycle.
At a specific point in the menstrual cycle (I think around ovulation), women prefer men with more exaggerated masculine features and bearing. At all other times, women actually express a preference for less macho looking males. I think this was also reported in Psychology Today and elsewhere.
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Or is it just the fact that I’m female
That must be it!
Or perhaps it’s that your assertions are more likely to be wrong, are more likely to be egregious, are more likely to be routine, and are more likely to be prefaced with words that indicate you’re talking about facts instead of your experiences.
who are by definition very rare and have little impact on the statistical average
If gay men are shown to be less attractive at the average and across the normal spectrum, it is even less likely that they are so amazingly overrepresented at the extremes. There are also good theoretical reasons for doubting it is true. Moreover the subjective evaluations you are relying on here are tainted by confirmation bias, as we’ve already established that women are more likely to upgrade men’s looks when they think they are gay.
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Rain And, you have just bombarded me with stereotypes about how irrational and illogical I must be, which is what predisposed me to suggest that you must be reacting that way because I’m female.
There was absolutely NOTHING in that Psychology Today article (unless I missed something; I read it quickly), that offered any definitive proof that gay men are less likely to be handsome than straight ones are.
Joe T. is trying to offer us a way out by referring to different standards of handsomeness among women (some that are more accepting of slightly effeminate features), but I don’t think that really works either.
If you want an example of what I mean by “gay handsomeness” take a look at what I think was the October 1982 cover of Life magazine, which showed a group of gay San Francisco men suffering from AIDS, the first popular-culture reference to “the gay disease”. I can’t swear that I have the date or name right – I’ve tried to check online but there’s too much coming up – but I remember the photos from that era, one after another, of stunningly handsome men, all gay.
That perception, though it may well be false (I’m not claiming absolute authority here) isn’t exclusively my own. There are many popular culture sources that refer to the exceptional handsomeness of certain gay men.
” There are also good theoretical reasons for doubting it is true.” Oh? What are they?
“Moreover the subjective evaluations you are relying on here are tainted by confirmation bias, as we’ve already established that women are more likely to upgrade men’s looks when they think they are gay.” Established? How? That article wasn’t up to much.
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I know what you mean about black gays being flaming (I was recently approached by one in a straight bar — I know it was a setup by a fat chick whom I rejected before because I saw them talking just before he came to my table…)
But Latino gay guys have to take the cake, no?
I mean, remember Mango from SNL?
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“clio, most hollywood leading men are exceptionally handsome and straight.”
Yeeeeees, but there is another factor to consider. Although most handsome actors are indeed straight, I suspect that you’d find a higher proportion of gay men among handsome actors than in the general population. This could be purely coincidental, since there are aspects of acting that are likely to appeal more to gay than to straight men. But of course it’s hard to be certain about the number of gay men in the upper ranks of the acting profession, since so many feel compelled, even now, to hide their sexual orientation for the sake of their careers.
I wish I could explain what I mean regarding gay handsomeness more clearly – it isn’t “pretty boy” good looks I refer to (like Brad Pitt’s pouty charm) – it’s a certain kind of sensitive-but-masculine handsome face (Dirke Bogarde’s?) that I have hardly ever seen on a straight man. Anyway, it isn’t a thing that can be entirely explained by gym attendance and fastidious grooming.
p.s. If you’ve never seen “Queer as Folk”, you should try it just once, and tell us whether you think the Brian Kinney character is a (gay) version of yourself. I’m curious to know the answer to that question.
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joe, i totally ignored the latino gays didn’t i? i dunno. in popular imagination, yeah, they are the flamingest of the flaming, but in reality i’m not sure they win the flamer sweepstakes. fortunately, i am unable to do the kind of intensive field research necessary to conclude one way or the other.
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Clio, will I find myself agreeing with you more often than not, I can’t see what you’re getting at with the extremely-handsome-guys-are-gay thing. When I think of guys who are indisputably, knock your socks off good looking in the way you describe (and as a straight guy, I can admit to being taken aback occasionally when encountering one of these rare sorts in real life) — Paul Newman, the young Brando, JFK Jr. — they’re all pretty hetero. Dirk Bogard, on the other hand, is just handsome in a very gay way. It seems like you might just be picking out that gay sort of handsomeness (and I agree it’s distinct) and putting it at the top of the hierarchy.
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Speaking of homosexuality and looks, would anyone say there’s a specific, typical lesbian “look”?
For instance, why is it that 90 percent of female women’s college basketball coaches have short, severe haircuts and wear pants suits, but no makeup?
I didn’t say they were necessarily lesbian, but… Connect the dots.
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I think Alias is talking about a man who is not only exceedingly handsome, but preciously so.
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In men, I think it is fastidious grooming that sets gays apart.
I have this gay friend who is quite effeminate, and I’m convinced he waxes and pluacks his eyebrows and applies all kinds of creams and lotions to his face to give it that certain “glow”.
By the way, he was recently back in town and told me he joined a modern dance troupe in Philadelphia.
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Rain And, your entire post is piffle. I don’t “make things up” and I don’t have a “sick mind”, or at least no sicker than the average North American’s. I have no idea what studies may say. I know nothing about the “average” gay man, or gay men in the aggregate. What I do know, in this case, is my own experience: it says, not that gay men are better-looking than average (I never said that at all; I’ve known many very plain or downright ugly gay men), but that extraordinarily handsome men – who are by definition very rare and have little impact on the statistical average – are more likely to be gay.
Why not attack Agnostic, who talk about big bright eyes and full lips as characteristic of gay men? They didn’t offer any evidence either.
Or is it just the fact that I’m female that makes you froth at the mouth in rage when I post something here without five studies to back me up?
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27 David Alexander
“One of the ironies of black people though is that when they go to the opposite socioeconomic extreme and come from well-to-do, well-off families with a lot of father figures, they are often way more prim, proper and uptight than their white counterparts of similar economic status. When one of these educated “bougee” black types comes out of the closet, they tend to be among the least queenish and most reserved gay people you’ll ever meet.”
“I suspect that it’s an over compensation by the upper class black person to counteract the low class behaviour of his poorer counterparts. It’s an attempt to disprove old stereotypes of black people for personal gain and in some cases, to foster better relations between whites and blacks.
Given how the stereotypes of black people, I certainly sympathize with their so-called bougee attitudes and mannerisms. As an example, I eat KFC in my car with deep tinted windows far away from my neighbourhood, lest some white people find me, and I regularly tip at 25% to fight the old stereotype of poor tipping by black people.”
Overcompensation, my ass. As a black man, I just find that stupid. Sure, not all of us are “ghetto,” but “bourgie” can be just as bad. Can’t you just grab the best of both worlds and find a happy medium without getting all extreme about it?
I hope you’re being sarcastic, because the KFC-in-the-car tale is just downright goofy.
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“I hope you’re being sarcastic, because the KFC-in-the-car tale is just downright goofy.”
Downright goofy is David Alexander’s performance art.
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clio, most hollywood leading men are exceptionally handsome and straight. while there may be a faddishly popular conception among women that the hottest men are disproportionately gay, the reality based on box office and female lust for those cinema icons says just the opposite. i suspect a lot of women like to believe that the best looking men are gay to assuage their egos when they aren’t the objects of those men’s affections, your personal anecdotal impressions to the contrary notwithstanding.
that aside, it may very well be that the mean of gay male attractiveness is slightly higher than the mean of straight male attractiveness, owing probably to more fastidious grooming and gym attendance by gays.
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David A., I have to say that I would never have known about 2/3 of the stereotypes
IIRC, from what I’ve barely read from your blog, I know that you’re Canadian, so some of the stereotypes and experiences will vary considerably, especially since the vast majority of the Black Canadian population is Caribbean, like David Alexander. Plus, the black population in Canada just simply makes up a smaller percentage. IIRC, it’s 12% in the US versus 2% in Canada, and they’re virtually unknown outside of Toronto, Montreal, Ottawa, and Halifax.
And yes, I’ve thought about moving to Canada. I’m kicking myself for not going to university there given the generally low tuition of the higher ranking Canadian schools. Mmm, dreams of McGill & Concordia…
Did you know that Canada’s Governor General is a (very pretty, though no doubt rather old to you fellows) Haitian woman named Michaele Jean? She had dual citizenship but had to give it up when she was appointed GG.
I’m well aware of that fact because Madame Jean is a fellow Haitian, and her appointment served as conversation material with my Canadian female friend for several weeks. Interestingly, it wasn’t a big deal in the Haitian community in the states since most Haitians in the US have very little clue as to how Canadian government works or the (symbolic and ceremonial) role of the governor general.
BTW, her dual citizenship issues were due to her husbands’s French citizenry. As my parents and other Haitians have learned first hand, Haiti does not permit dual citizenship.
And, yes, I’ve been to Ottawa. It’s a sleepy, boring town with nothing to do…
I hope you’re being sarcastic, because the KFC-in-the-car tale is just downright goofy.
Admittedly, I won’t eat KFC in front of white people because it does harken to those bad stereotypes of black people and fried chicken. It’s also much easier to eat the meal by hand in the privacy of one’s own car than to put up with the pretense of using a fork and knife in front of others (regardless of race) in the eating area of the restaurant. Besides, who wants to eat alone inside like a loser in an empty KFC under the guise of others entering and returning to their friends and families?
I guess it’s just simply a fear of being pointed out by the greater society as a some member of the black underclass or a loser loner prole.
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Overcompensation, my ass. As a black man, I just find that stupid. Sure, not all of us are “ghetto,” but “bourgie” can be just as bad. Can’t you just grab the best of both worlds and find a happy medium without getting all extreme about it?
Given the propensity for many to presume that any black guy is a member of the stereotypical underclass with all the bad habits and trappings that come with that label, any “bourgie” behaviour that fights those stereotypes and gives us some broader acceptance is certainly welcome, IMHO.
Of course, that’s easy for me to say since I’m comfortable being the so-called Oreo with white friends who listens to Kylie Minogue and clings to the term “Caribbean American”. It certainly may not be so easy for others.
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alias clio I never knew until you said so, for instance, that black people were supposed to be bad tippers.
all the ones with ski masks and guns leave large negative tips, lowering the overall average. ha! another stereotype!
—
what i really want to know is this:
WHERE DOES THE ‘GAY ACCENT’ COME FROM? and why are there NO regional variants of the gay accent? where do they learn it?
it’s not as though they’re surrounded by peers and family speaking with the same affectation, as with southern accents; the stark uniformity* across the queenie population is therefore just plain frightening.
*my scatterbrain is making an analogy to the taillights in a nighttime traffic jam, all of which are exactly the same shade of red.
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I don’t have any gay friends.
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“BTW, her dual citizenship issues were due to her husbands’s French citizenry. As my parents and other Haitians have learned first hand, Haiti does not permit dual citizenship.”
I’d forgotten that part of it. Sorry for the misinformation I almost spread.
As for Ottawa being sleepy and boring, too true, but it seems to suit ultra-athletic types (hikers, cyclists, x-country skiers etc.) very well.
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As a metrosexual young adult male living in the D.C. suburbs, I believe I have experienced more (though not quite disturbingly often) sexual harassment from gay males than from women (my girlfriend thinks it’s funny). About 8 years ago, when I was 16, I worked at this hardware store and some 50+ year old dude who I helped find some good caulk (heh) or something felt the liberty to ask me out for coffee. Funny thing was, he looked exactly like John Kerry. Then about 1.5 or 2 years ago, when I was working at the bank, a 35-ish year old African dude tried to get me to let him buy me lunch at Baja Fresh. You gotta (1) play dumb and try to not act like an ass so he don’t think you’re gonna stab him for hitting on you, and (2) do that thing that hot girls do when they can tell you’re trying to get in their pants, the off-handed “I’m in a relationship already” comment. Eg. “Yea, I don’t think my girlfriend would be too happy about that.” Yea, I don’t think my girlfriend would be too happy if I told her I just took it in the butt from John Kerry or Kunta Kente.
On a side note, I hate lushes and bitches who act like they’re on The Hills.
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“I hope you’re being sarcastic, because the KFC-in-the-car tale is just downright goofy.”
“Admittedly, I won’t eat KFC in front of white people because it does harken to those bad stereotypes of black people and fried chicken. It’s also much easier to eat the meal by hand in the privacy of one’s own car than to put up with the pretense of using a fork and knife in front of others (regardless of race) in the eating area of the restaurant. Besides, who wants to eat alone inside like a loser in an empty KFC under the guise of others entering and returning to their friends and families?
I guess it’s just simply a fear of being pointed out by the greater society as a some member of the black underclass or a loser loner prole.”
Your comments about blacks and chicken would make sense if it were 1949, but now?
And as far as eating alone…it’s only KFC, not a high school cafeteria.
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“Overcompensation, my ass. As a black man, I just find that stupid. Sure, not all of us are “ghetto,” but “bourgie” can be just as bad. Can’t you just grab the best of both worlds and find a happy medium without getting all extreme about it?”
“Given the propensity for many to presume that any black guy is a member of the stereotypical underclass with all the bad habits and trappings that come with that label, any “bourgie” behaviour that fights those stereotypes and gives us some broader acceptance is certainly welcome, IMHO.”
I hang out in white circles myself, and even I think that whole “uptight buppie” thing is bullshit. That can be just as much of a negative trap as anything.
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Wow. I assume this is all a joke, considering all the stereotypes contained within. You are quite articulate, though, and it doesn’t seem that you’d be saying these things seriously. Lesbians getting along with no one but other lesbians is hilarious. Most of my friends are gay men and straight or bisexual women, as well as a few straight men. I know very few other lesbians.
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Words of wisdom. You’re going on mah blogroll.
Check this out:
http://www.stuffwhitedbagslike.wordpress.com
Fun stuff!
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Wow, you definitely hit the nail on the head.
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Muslims are gay bastards.
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Pretty good post. It sure would be nice to have a lesbian to hang out. You could talk girl stuff, but not deal with the drama…I don’t know it just would be great! Anyone lesbians want a straight guy friend who isn’t into lesbian fantasies?
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a straight guy friend who isn’t into lesbian fantasies
Do any such straight guys actually exist?
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Clio, the worst black tipper is better than just about ANY Canadian. You can’t get any service in some parts of this
country if the staff thinks you’re from Snow Mexico.
Speaking of blacks, stereotypes and KFC, I was once at my friend’s restaurant before the Saturday service started. He and one of his sous chefs were out behind the restaurant having a smoke and talking to me and a friend about whatever when a car pulled up with a black couple. The guy asked where the KFC was in my our town. We all looked at each other, and my friend told him that he had to go over to the next town near the highway to find a KFC. The guy answered that he was told it was right off Main Street here, and we said no, there isn’t one around here. He drove away, and we went on with our talk about the Red Sox. The it struck me the the black couple was looking for the K of C, or Knights of Colombus hall, where there was an event that evening! We laughed about that for weeks!
There are benefits from having gay friends. One of my friend’s waiters is one of Clio’s blindingly handsome, well-built guys who could easily pass for stright until he opens his mouth (that “gay” accent). Every girl meeting him for the first time wets her knickers, then, upon finding out he’s gay, says “What a waste!”. But at straight clubs, he attracts the primo women like a light attracts moths on a summer evening. He’s such a good guy and a party animal that they hang around in his group, and all his stright friends have benefitted.
Sorry, guys, but I’m with Clio-gay guys, for whatever reason, are on average better looking than we straights, and I would think it would remain true at the top end. Ponder this-who looked and was aggressively marketed as being the perfect (straight) man more than Rock Hudson?
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39 CH
I just want to commend you on your brilliant comments and post.
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As for Ottawa being sleepy and boring, too true, but it seems to suit ultra-athletic types (hikers, cyclists, x-country skiers etc.) very well.
When one visits Ottawa, it doesn’t come across as a nation’s capital, but more like an unusually large mid-sized secondary city. Maybe I’m biased because I come from New York City which dwarfs nearly every other city in the US and Canada in terms of size and importance. My cousins in Ottawa are only staying because of employment and family, and they have showed a preference for Toronto despite being native Francophones.
Admittedly, I should get off my ass and visit the rest of Canada to get a feel for the rest of the country.
Do any such straight guys actually exist?
Two hot porn stars making out is great. Two average lesbians kissing is a waste of time and energy.
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My best guy friend is gay. He is actually the gayest gay person I know. But in all our interactions, I basically treat him like a girl o.O Sometimes gay guy-straight girl friendship just happen.
—————————
About lesbian people:
I have a friend who happens to be lesbian and she is great! Actually I guess she’s more like bi, but more leaning towards girls? I don’t really understand the bi-ness (just pick one!) but I respect her wishes.
Maybe she’s just not a typical non-straight person, according to you, but she’s one of the best people I know. Having said that, she was reluctant to tell me because she thought I might not be friends with her anymore. Personally, I don’t really care.
I think you should replace with and by association, by association.
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“Interestingly, there is no reverse scenario. There’s no such thing as a lesbian girlfriend for straight men. It would be great to be able to call up a best lesbian girlfriend for a quickie round of golf or Wii bowling, and commiserating over bitches. Even better if she’s a lipstick lesbian and looks good. Unfortunately, lesbians get along with no one but other lesbians.”
I have to disagree with this point. I have a great group of lesbian girlfriends. I also frequent one of their house’s where we play rock band and GTA4 and drink ourselves silly and they are the best pivots, ever. I actually lucked up by being a bouncer at a gay bar and making friends with one of the bartenders. Who introduced me to her friends and the rest is history.
Now I understand that the average guy is not going to be in the very fortunate situation that I was in, but believe me I’ve taken every advantage I can from it. On the plus side these girls are really good friends of mine. Not bail me out of jail kind but the sitting next to me in the cell kind.
On a side note I’ve also developed a personal theory while hanging out with my girls: Just about EVERY LESBIAN HAS A “STRAIGHT” EXCEPTION. I’ve been that exception on several occasions. Now if you say ” Well that means they weren’t totally gay to begin with” I’ll say “UM….So what? Stop hatin.”
if you want to meet my girls, hit me up. I’ve schooled one of them on game. She’s worse then me.
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it killed my last sentence:
Not all lesbians are standoffish. I think you should replace “lesbian” with “man-hater” and by association “heterosexual hater”, by association.
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T. your post is the most racist I have witness in a long time. You assume a lot and you also believe many stereotypes that aren’t true in most cases.
Usually Lurking you are also wrong. If you knew any gay men than you would know that MOST gay men are not very feminine at all. The feminine ones are the ones that you can spot form a mile away. Most gay men that I know, which is a large number because I myself am gay/bi, are masculine. To be honest I know only one feminine gay man. There are a very large number of gay men who are married or not out that no one would ever guess was gay. There are also a lot of gay men who don’t go out to the bars and party because they aren’t happy with the “gay scene”. Gay bars are meat markets and everyone is looking for ass. If you want to see a whole subculture of masculine gay men the google “gay bear” or visit sites like bear411.com
On a final note I am not so much of an ass man (there are gay men who do not engage in anal sex) and I do love breasts. Both male and female. So you can call me a manboob kinda man.
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The funny thing about people claiming my comment about blacks was racist…black people have agreed with the view I put forth for decades. For example look at black comedians and their staple joke: “You ever notice when white people do something, it’s like this, but when black people do it, it’s likethis?!” You know those jokes I’m talking about, where they portray the white people as being more subdued and timid, and the black way of doing something as more boisterous and attention-getting?
When I say that black culture is more of an attention-whore culture than white culture, I wasn’t saying anything that black people haven’t been admitting among themselves for decades now. It’s pretty true, sorry.
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I did not say that a majority of black people did this to their cars. I said that when black people and white people DO choose to add a bunch of ornamental add-ons to their cars, the black add-ons will tend to be way more flashy than the things the average white person would do. (wiggers excepted)
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T, I kind of disagree with you about the attention ho blackculture debate.
I think one of the reasons that flamboyant gay blacks are easy to pick up on is because they contrast with the hyper masculine mandingo or black brute that a lot of Americans think of when they thing of a black male. DL brothers are not easy to pick up on at all.
Asian men fly under the radar because a lot of Americans don’t find them very masculine as has been quoted on this blog a number of times.
I hold a different view of Asian men but I think I have ideas why they are treated the way that they are in Ameican media.
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sorry
I didn’t read before I hit submit.
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Agnostic #19 – I think it’s an energy that is missing when a woman is around a gay male, even a masculine gay male that most of us can pick up on.
It is like they are missing an certain se.xual awareness of women.
Alais clio#23 said
” Gay men look through you, in an indefinable way that is somehow easy to recognise.”
They do this no matter how masculine or feminine they are because they are not attracted to women. Now it bi men who are very diffcult, almost impossible to read.
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@ 69 (T)
Really comedians? So Jeff Foxworthy jokes are a factual representative of white people – that seems odd to me, but to each his own.
I think gay men make the best friends – none of the female/female drama and they give the best blow job advice so basically good times.
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representative s/b representation
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maybe it is the open window to stereotypes about women that CH is so damn good at writing about that makes it easy to trot out, defend and analyze the various characteristics about race, especially the black race.
6. T – wrote “No, this is not why it is. It’s that black culture, especially the more ghetto the blacks are, is an attention whore culture in general. ”
27. Alexander – wrote “I suspect that it’s an over compensation by the upper class black person to counteract the low class behavior of his poorer counterparts. It’s an attempt to disprove old stereotypes of black people for personal gain and in some cases, to foster better relations between whites and blacks.”
A lot of commenters generalizing about general racial behavior makes me cringe. My take is that people are really bad about extracting behavioral norms based on race. People (both blacks and whites) extrapolate from experience without quantifying anything. “Black culture … is an attention whore culture in general” does not leave a lot of room for debate. Neither does trying to explain complex behaviors based on race that people who have significant numbers of cross racial experiences navigate in complex ways based on experience and social context.
So the commenters ask, about overcompensation. Do some blacks overcompensate because they consciously do so or are we applying our own stereotypes for so-called normal behavior when we identify a person as “overcompensating.” The very term conjures up images of some normal level of compensating behavior. Is there some equal behavior that non-black CH engages that tells us how this is being used – perhaps overcompensating alpha maleness to combat his beta-male brothers could be be analagous to overcompensating blacks?
The fact that the “black” readers of this blog have theories that about race and behavior that are as off-the-mark as any clueless “white” in my opinion should teach readers like Clio (and others who are not experienced in the art of racial stereotypes) that racial stereotypes are not just the tools of the racist or casual race conscious person or some societal group norm. Many of the same limiting race-based conceptions that non-blacks spout about black people are remixed and remastered into an entire concept that black people spout about their own group and themselves. Individual truisms turned into nuggets of cultural truth and understanding that are reinforced when we define “black culture.” So I don’t recognize the black culture that is often defined. And on a side note: Gay and Lesbian (or Gay and Glum) culture is also a product of its environment. As Clio notes, there are plenty of gay and lesbian closeted people walking among the straights. Some theorize their numbers exceed those that are out of the closet, e.g. Sen. Larry Craig or the rumored celebrities. What does that mean for labeling the gays and straight by cultural behavior?
I am very fond of the trite saying that goes something like this; “when we are looking out at the world we are really looking in at ourselves.” I think that way about race based statements but I am sure it applies to the world view of a lot topics. The statements about general racial behavior says far more about the person making the statement than about the group it purports to explain. We have a lot of work to do across our racial lines, so we have to talk about the issues of race. I just want us to turn that analysis on our own thoughts even while we share them with others.
What assumptions does one have to make about normal behavior to even lable something as racial overcompensation. What general statements about a racial subgroup do you have to make when you note as commenter 6 does, that you can look at “how a black person hooks up a car as opposed to a white person, with the spinning rims, multiple TV’s, gold trim and other gaudy accessories” or “Look at pimps.” I could point out that far more black people (the very large vast majority) do none of the things that T examines and applies to the group. But why bother. Lets just ask why T and others apply this very small sample to a host of people?
So back to the generalizing and not in a good way. I always chalked my out lesbian friend’s lack of comfort with anything other than other out lesbians to the need for women to comform to their environment. Unlike out-gay men who can tolerate women in their environment, Lesbians feel to much pressure in the mixed settings to conform to group norms and feel lost. One out-lesbian friend confessed that she felt more stigma being out with a mixed crowd of straight men and women than when the same crowd only consisted of women (both gay and straight). It drives them away from men and into subaru outbacks and RAV-4s and yes, softball games. The last bit was my attempt to be more like in preparation for my blog launch.
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a lot of this i don’t think is true and kinda offensive
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76 Aaron
A lot of this is mindless stereotyping.
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White people? Probably not. Rednecks? Sure, to some degree.
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64: there are straight guys who don’t get much out of “lesbian” porn. Not *nothing* since it does have naked women but it’s no better than just naked women.
It seems to work both ways: gay porn also does nothing to me and I have never had any visceral feelings on homosexuality (unlike most men). As a kid I had to spend a lot of time figuring out the “appropriate” homophobic attitudes before I could fit in.
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well there are brosefinas who I guess would count as lesbian friends. Brosefinas being girls who like doing guy things, but either have a boyfriend or hook with whoever when shes liquored up only.
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69 T.
“The funny thing about people claiming my comment about blacks was racist…black people have agreed with the view I put forth for decades. For example look at black comedians and their staple joke: “You ever notice when white people do something, it’s like this, but when black people do it, it’s likethis?!” You know those jokes I’m talking about, where they portray the white people as being more subdued and timid, and the black way of doing something as more boisterous and attention-getting?”
That’s like the biggest comedy cliche going, along with jokes about airport food. You’re the only one who still thinks that is funny.
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My balls itch.
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#74 – wingedfeet: “I think gay men make the best friends – none of the female/female drama and they give the best blow job advice so basically good times.”
You’re a female who actually wants blowjob tips? This is new; I’ve never come across a woman who really cares about pleasing a man…
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Beta Beats Alpha
http://www.dailyreckoning.com/Issues/2008/DR051608.html
homonym…a homosexual nymphomaniac?
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32, 34, etc. — on that Psychology Today article, Kanazawa is a notorious bullshit artist who constantly makes wild “evolutionary psychology” claims with little to no proof. He has no real academic credentials and is an embarassment to the field.
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Also: a lot of lesbians hang out with gay men. In fact, a surprising number of gay men and lesbians have sex with each other.
The one constant is that nobody (gay men or lesbians) really likes straight men (although lesbians are indeed worse on this than gay men). Maybe it’s just because straight men are this culture’s whipping boy, or maybe it’s bad memories of getting bullied in high school.
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CH said “gay men have a ‘look'”
Damn right. I was at a party once and made fleeting eye contact with two different males and I instantly wondered about them. I found out later they both were.
7 Thursday
“Who would have guessed that Mr. Sulu was gay?”
I wouldn’t have guessed from his appearance or mannerisms, but I wondered when I read his (pre-outing) autobiography…no mention whatsoever of dating or mating.
8 Thursday
“Gay men individually can be OK to hang around with, but if you are a physically attractive man who looks younger than your age you want to stay the hell away from environments with lots of gay men.”
Or avoid ALL overt gay men. There’s only one thing that annoys me more than being ogled by a fruitcake, and that is being called a “homophobe” by being annoyed by being ogled/hit on.
Or associated with a queer. Had a boss once (fast food) who seemed efeminate and he wanted me to introduce him to an activity I was involved in that would have been awkward for him to do solo. I thought what the hell, be open-minded (he hadn’t hit on me or anyone, was just efeminate I thought). What a mistake. It resulted in a nasty rumor about me that took years to blow over. After that, to hell with fairness. If a male is the least bit effeminate, I won’t do diddly with him or around him if I can help it. It took me years to get it through my open-minded head that there is NO percentage in being around people who have high potential to cause me trouble. Gays, blacks (excepting exceptionally highly smooth/educated), druggies, ugly people…stay the hell away from me. Yes, I feel sorry for you. Now stay away.
22 Clio
“any extraordinarily handsome man, good-looking beyond belief, is almost certain to be gay.”
“straight men always check you out when introduced to you, even if only to dismiss you.”
Isn’t it something, looking at male models in ads? Jeez, I could never work in that industry (I did have the looks for it).
Re your second point, careful about “always.” I often choose to skillfully ignore a woman, such that I could be pegged as gay based on your logic (though, interestingly, I’ve never gotten the sense that women often thought i was gay…even when I looked through them. Hmm…maybe I’ve been subconciously “looking through” them just below the neck? : )
23 M.Blowhard
“gays and glums”
That is hysterical…and like most good humor, spot-on
25 Racheal
“worked in restaurants there for 5+ years. It was basically an endless game of grabass”
Hmm…if I act like a flamer, I can grab asses with impunity?
27 DA
“As an example, I eat KFC in my car with deep tinted windows far away from my neighbourhood, lest some white people find me”
[Slim Pickens voice] “There’s a nigger eatin’ chicken in his car? Dad gum, we need ta hang that there coon!” :0
42 Joe T.
“why is it that 90 percent of female women’s college basketball coaches have short, severe haircuts and wear pants suits, but no makeup?”
[voice of Butthead saying to Beavvis] Uhhhhhh…cuz they’re, uhhh…LESBIANS?
47 DA
“Admittedly, I won’t eat KFC in front of white people because it does harken to those bad stereotypes of black people and fried chicken.”
I recommend scarfing watermelon with bare hands. Har!
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MQ: Maybe gay men you know don’t like the idea of straight men as a concept, but one of the biggest gay fantasies is to seduce and bed a straight guy. Have you heard of the concept of “trade.” Rich gay guys will pay top dollar for straight a$$.
There was even a LAw and Order episode (or some show) done on this. Zack from Saved by the Bell played a straight guy who needed money for his pregnant wife, so he got gang banged by a bunch of gay guys for top dollar.
There are probably less arduous career options for a straight guy, though. Hahahaha.
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lol… fags
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@2 Peter
“Interestingly, there is no reverse scenario. There’s no such thing as a lesbian girlfriend for straight men”
Once again, I am a statistical freak.
Almost my whole life, my best friends, and closest friends have been lesbians, also my worst enemies. For some reason, they get really really pissed if a male manages to steal their GF’s away from them.
Slashed tires, and other stalker like behavior abound.
I would rather have it out with an angry husband or boyfriend, than a lesbian, because men will get over it a lot *LOT*. I still have some lesbians who go nuts when they see me.
But its funny, some of my lesbian friends wade in and get into mean cat fights, to protect me. Last time this happened, a friend named Dinah, told me. There is no need to for a man to hit a woman, at least when I am around. I will do it for ya, if your cause is just.
wowzah.
Btw, I have a lesbian roomate at the moment.
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T 6.
Totally money post. Insight upon insight.
Kinda partly knew a lot of it, but you made it crystal. I love your ending comments on bourgie blacks too.
I always thought that was heavily tied up with a strict religious thing. Is it similar when neither of the well off parents are at all religious?
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The blacks here have demonstrated that they are clueless and have no sense of humor or self-awareness. They should leave both this website and this country. Soon, we will make them leave this country.
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“Gay face” = Mark Leon Goldberg
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Puerto Rican men have many gay qualities—many dress up as women for many events. That and the extreme emphasis on dancing in P.R. culture probably causes a lot of confusion sexually for them.
And a former slut I was banging told me that the P.R. guys she did loved having things shoved up their ass–fingers, dildos, you name it—all while insisting they’re straight. And preferring anal to regular. Always.
Many black men are in the closet, hence why there is a much higher HIV rate among black females v. non-black females. 4% of blacks have aids v. 1% of non-blacks.
Drug use plays a part, but most blacks don’t use enough needle drugs to cause such a disparity. And, no, straight sex without open sores will not give a straight man HIV in 99.999% of cases; HIV, despite Hollywood’s propaganda efforts, is still largely (71%) transmitted and had by gay sex among men.
Only the most flaming males who can live outside the black community come out, because most blacks still feel an affinity for the black community. The black community’s hostility to homosexuality is causing this AIDS rate to sky rocket.
Many black actors and musicians are gay (mirroring non-black musicians and actors), just will not come out because of hostility; or did you wonder why so many black male celebrities dress like flamboyant pimps, dance so well, and are attention whores?
However, the real problem at this point for blacks is not AIDS, it is inbreeding.
With 3-4 generations now of blacks not knowing who their father is—–and yet being encouraged (by media and liberals) to fuck from a very young age—and blacks not often leaving the black community, or even their own neighborhood for most of their lives—and only certain black men being allowed to breed (alpha drug dealers) with multiple women—-we now almost certainly have situations where half-brothers and sisters are breeding with each other. This does not bode well for the black community in the next 50 years.
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@ Alexander:
“Unless, of course, it involves the sickness and sociopathy of gay “culture”, the idiocy of gay “marriage”, the perversity of a child raised by gay parents, etc.”
Sounds like your idea of a conversation involves spewing forth at somebody about about “sickness, sociopathy, and perversity.” Sure, somebody might not respond well to that. If you come with reasonable arguments and logic, questions asked out of genuine curiosity, et cetera, and avoid insults that would short-circuit a conversation, then you might actually get somewhere.
Common sense.
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How shocking…..when a black comedian makes jokes about some of the common characteristics of various cultures, it’s described by overly p.c. people (or other blacks) as “a running joke; oh but he wasn’t serious.”
When someone from another race points out the same things, here come the “racist racist racist!!” labels.
It’s truly nauseating.
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Certainly a woman can have a hoot, in and out of bed, with a gay guy. Gays are notorious for being unhibited. That helps a lot! Unfortunately, she is certain to end-up frustrated at some point when she realizes her gay guy would rather b—f–k other guys than screw her to get his load off. No matter how wild she gets, she can’t change that!
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Of course, in my previous post, it was gay guys are “uninhibited,” not “unhibited.” I sure wish I would enjoy that kind of psychological freedom, while still remaining hetero. But that’s the way it goes. Can’t have your cake and eat it too.
I am old enough to have had “liberal” female friends who caught their husbands or boyfriends BF men in their own beds. My friends latest meals just did not stick to the bottom of their stomach a minute longer… And we are talking about well experienced women here…
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I confess. I have a bone of contention. I am an attractive man, at least by gay standards. I know that much from facts. My girlfriend fell in love with a gay man, who evidently had strong feelings –desire, jalousie, both, I do not know– for me. What happened next is my girlfriend went out with the guy. I dropped her. Witthin a matter of a couple months, the gay guy stopped paying attention to her. But now, she did it again! I went back with her, and once again the gay guy was green of jalousy! “If I can’t have you good looking man, I will steal your girlfriend!” Almost like a comic opera!
If I disappear again, he will loose interest. He does not crave women for sex. He just likes stealing them to feed his ego. So, why don’t I break the whole triangle thing here. Let these two have each others, until they self-destruct. That’s what they deserve right? The problem is I care for the girl. She is much younger than me. I am protective of her, and I can’t stand the idea of her going through more pain… What should I do?
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