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Chateau Heartiste

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Kicking Pussy Off The Pedestal

June 5, 2008 by CH

When I was a naive, idealistic lad first sprouting peach fuzz on my gagoots I used to fantasize about the girls I had crushes on. Strolling arm in arm on the beach, naming constellations while lying on the warm summer grass under a starry sky, saving her from a mugger and returning her stolen purse like a hero, kissing her for hours and hours of fully clothed foreplay (wouldn’t want to sully her with sex)… you know, the usual beautiful beta dreaming. In real life, I stared at these girls from across the classroom and doodled their faces in my notebook.

Putting women on a pedestal was my art. And I was good.

Then reality hit me. In the cleansing fires of rejection (and indifference) I learned that women were not pure creatures of light and virtue. I realized instead they were animals, just like men, but operating under a different set of parameters. In my effort to crack the cooch code I watched and mimicked guys who were good with women. I adopted mentors. I experimented. I grew a thick skin.

But before I could stop putting women on a pedestal I had to first kick them off. So I had an asshole phase. I think every man who was not born with his dick in a girl’s mouth needs to go through an asshole phase in order to seduce women in a healthy way. It’s important to experience for oneself what the power of assholery can do to a girl’s attraction buttons — press them like an epileptic on coke and E playing whack-a-mole.

It’s also important to stay in touch with your asshole side in case you ever find yourself slipping into bad beta habits. This way you can play the asshole card when the moment calls for it. Believe me, it’s much more efficient than groveling your way back into her good graces with expensive dinners, flattery, and engagement rings.

Have you ever said “Fuck you” in anger to a girl you were seeing? Have you ever told a girl “Enough of your shit”? Have you ever let a girl argue for 20 minutes then look her in the eye and say “You done?” and walk off? If you haven’t done any of these things you don’t know just how much is possible in your dealings with women.

It’s easy to dismantle the pedestal when you read this:

Scott Peterson, the man who was convicted of murdering his wife and unborn child, had been on Death Row barely an hour when the first proposal arrived from a woman who wants to be the new Mrs. Scott Peterson.

Three dozen phone calls came in to the warden’s office on Peterson’s first day at his new home in San Quentin State Prison — women were pleading for his mailing address, and one smitten 18-year-old said she wanted to marry him.

18 years old. Scott Peterson was twice her age. So much for the theory that chicks get creeped out by older murderers men. Heh.

So think about that the next time you find yourself romanticizing the woman of your dreams. There are women who would take their chances with a sociopathic death row inmate over law-abiding nonmurderous free men they know.

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Posted in Beta, The Id Monster | 124 Comments

124 Responses

  1. on June 5, 2008 at 5:05 pm Tell me why

    Roissy, in your own mind, where did these early idealistic fantasies originate? I think many men started out this way. I had them too, until I learned the truth.

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  2. on June 5, 2008 at 5:14 pm Jay Gatsby

    Such idealistic fantasies originated where else…with a woman called “mom”. Mothers are dominant authority figures in the lives of children, and teach young boys that they should respect women because they are women. Indeed, with the rise of absentee fathers, far too many men have grown up with the idea that women are “sugar and spice and everything nice.”

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  3. on June 5, 2008 at 5:19 pm Reggie

    Somehow, I doubt the women proposing marriage to Scott Peterson were cracking the 30th percentile of attractiveness. Maybe they generated these marriage fantasies precisely because they were too unattractive (or crazy, which seems obvious) to attract a normal man.

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  4. on June 5, 2008 at 5:20 pm DF

    tmw, speak for yourself. I grew up in a wealthy machista household so women weren’t put on pedestals, they were the pedestal. holla.

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  5. on June 5, 2008 at 5:21 pm Michael Katcher

    Jay – Is that why the African American urban community is known for their beta treatment of women?

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  6. on June 5, 2008 at 5:23 pm sara

    This sounds suspiciously like classic narcissistic overvaluation and devaluation.

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  7. on June 5, 2008 at 5:41 pm T.

    Roissy, in your own mind, where did these early idealistic fantasies originate? I think many men started out this way. I had them too, until I learned the truth.

    The answer is awesome…our mothers. Boys grow up with their mother as the first woman we know and think all women care about us and want to nurture us the same way our mothers did. Plus mothers tell their sons to treat all women with respect, be chivalrous, etc, etc.

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  8. on June 5, 2008 at 5:41 pm Patrick Bateman

    A technique I started using early on was thinking to myself “Bitches want to fuck me everywhere I go”

    Once I didn’t need that level of cocky assholeness I started using
    “Women want to fuck me everywhere I go”

    Now I just walk around with confidence without having to use these. Not giving a shit about women helps a lot too. My perspective is that she’s lucky I even fucking talk to her, so I don’t get approach anxiety or negative feelings of rejection. I still have trouble thinking of good original openers. Of course, I’m sensitive enough to their signals now that I only open girls who are already attracted to me and “Hey” works fine with those girls.

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  9. on June 5, 2008 at 5:41 pm T.

    I meant the answer is obvious, not awesome.

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  10. on June 5, 2008 at 5:43 pm finefantastic

    http://www.hour.ca/columns/messybedroom.aspx?iIDArticle=8622

    paul bernardo is canada’s most notorious sex killer and he has a bevy of groupies. unfortunately for him, he’s not getting out anytime soon.

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  11. on June 5, 2008 at 5:44 pm Peter

    Have you ever said “Fuck you” in anger to a girl you were seeing? Have you ever told a girl “Enough of your shit”? Have you ever let a girl argue for 20 minutes then look her in the eye and say “You done?” and walk off? If you haven’t done any of these things you don’t know just how much is possible in your dealings with women.

    All of these are potentially risky moves. Sure, at least 90% of the time the girl will end up forgiving you, in most cases pretty quickly. You’ll be a better man for having stood up for yourself and for not having groveled. The problem is, every so often the girl will call your bluff, so to speak, and will dump you. Should that happen your dignity will be intact … and you’ll also be out of a relationship.

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  12. on June 5, 2008 at 5:52 pm Dracian

    “The problem is, every so often the girl will call your bluff, so to speak, and will dump you. Should that happen your dignity will be intact … and you’ll also be out of a relationship.”

    Fuck it. It’s worth the price.

    NO woman is worth your dignity and self-respect…
    I’d rather go home and jack it like David Alexander than play that losing game.

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  13. on June 5, 2008 at 5:57 pm Hope

    Most girls had those exact same romantic day dreams, about kissing for hours, watching the stars together, and walking hand in hand through parks. Most average, plane jane girls, who aren’t the objects of male fantasies, yearn after the same few boys the way most average, non-aggressive guys yearn after the same few girls.

    It’s obviously though that girls get sexual power earlier and lose it earlier, whereas guys get sexual power later and lose it later. People place on pedestals things that are “hard to obtain” or “out of your reach.” Don’t guys want women to be the sexual “gatekeepers” and tell them to keep it guarded? But then they don’t want that because it makes it too difficult to access. They can’t have it both ways.

    Here’s one of my favorite Bad Religion songs:

    Millions and millions chase the wild goose tonight
    To conquer loneliness they’ll chase it all their lives
    And when they find it they can just lay down and die
    It seems the game is mostly pointless in the presence of the prize.

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  14. on June 5, 2008 at 6:03 pm Thursday

    Somewhat off topic, but never, ever neg someone with a reference to a their weight. Not even a 10. A buddy of mine got kicked out of a club for saying, “Hey, haven’t you put on a pound or two,” to one of the hired guns.

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  15. on June 5, 2008 at 6:04 pm Usually Lurking

    The problem is, every so often the girl will call your bluff, so to speak, and will dump you. Should that happen your dignity will be intact … and you’ll also be out of a relationship.

    Fair enough, but, we are talking about a girl who is testing you. We are, presumably, talking about a serious relationship here. Not some bar skank.

    If she feels comfortable testing you to the point where you honestly want to say, “Fuck Off” or “You done?”, then, having her break up with you is not the worst possible result.

    Now, if you are telling some sweet young thing to Fuck Off simply because you are stretching your muscles, then, that is a different thing entirely.

    ——————————————–

    Reggie, I got $5 that say the the girls that are calling and writing Scott Peterson weigh less than the average American girl. Whether or not they have amazing bone structure is another thing.

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  16. on June 5, 2008 at 6:06 pm cz

    The John Cusack character in the movie “High Fidelity” says something about all the love songs we’ve listened too. Something like, listening to people singing about broken hearts wrecks you for anything as bland as contentment. http://www.robertchristgau.com/xg/rock/hornby-95.php

    Add to that all the TV shows (Love Boat anyone?) and other media, including public school. Media might have more to do with it than mother.

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  17. on June 5, 2008 at 6:09 pm sara

    Putting “women” on a pedestal is just as stupid as putting “men” on a pedestal. Don’t you call women who do that retarded bimbos? So then when it turns out “men” are not all Prince Charmings they’re justified in turning against the entire gender? LOL Roissy you seem to have the complete inability to put yourself in the other person’s shoes so to speak. A person is supposed to outgrow that, not react to the ego shattering “reality” by turning on the opposite gender like a venomous snake. A person is supposed to mature into the ability to have a mature real love, sans the sappy, nauseating, love sick puppy love they fantasized about as a prepubescent teens.

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  18. on June 5, 2008 at 6:12 pm Usually Lurking

    Don’t guys want women to be the sexual “gatekeepers” and tell them to keep it guarded? But then they don’t want that because it makes it too difficult to access.

    Hope, these are two different things, which is why you can’t have both.

    For the first thing, women being sexual gate-keepers, well, it would resemble, to some degree, the Victorian Age. In this scenario most guys got sex from only two sources: prostitutes or virtuous wives.

    The average PUA would be pretty pissed if we returned to that, but, I think that most men would fall right in line.

    The second scenario is one where some men find it difficult to access. And those men complain. To sum up all of the points surrounding that case I will quote a recent commenter here:

    “Why is it that you never here some asshole say, ‘Why is it that the Nice Guys get all the girls?'”.

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  19. on June 5, 2008 at 6:17 pm Usually Lurking

    Michael Katcher is right. Black children are the most likely to grow up in a fatherless household and, by my count, are the least likely to have these “Girls are as pure as snow” fantasies. Also, Hispanic children are second in this category and they are usually seen as being full of “machismo”.

    Also, I would love to know how many kids who grew up in the post-MTV-Spring-Break era put pussy on a pedestal.

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  20. on June 5, 2008 at 6:50 pm T.

    I actually think Michael Katcher is right. Black and hispanic men I think adopt their “bitches ain’t shit” hip-hop stance as a reactionary defense mechanism precisely to overcompensate for their beta tendencies. Black men are big on buying affection, “flossing” to impress women, kissing butt, putting women on a pedestal for being hot. Look at the hip-hop videos and the sheer amount of beautiful women in them. They worship women. Also check out some of the recent R&B songs you hear…”Buy You a Drink” and “I’m in Love With A Stripper” by T-Pain, “I Like To Trick” by Ray J, Keith Sweat’s beggin ass songs….A great show to see this in action is Tariq Nasheed’s Mack Lessons podcasts, which can be found at macklessons.mypodcast.com. He is a guru focusing on natural game, but mostly works with the black hip-hop community fanbase, and when you hear all the thug sounding guys calling up with the most beta problems you can imagine you really realize how much of it is a macho front.

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  21. on June 5, 2008 at 6:51 pm Sebastian Flyte

    So true man. And here’s an even worse example: JOSEF FRITZL HAS RECEIVED OVER 200 LOVE LETTERS IN PRISON.

    “The lonely hearts told the depraved beast he is misunderstood and “good at heart”.

    They accepted his claims that he kept his daughter Elisabeth in a cellar for 24 years to prevent her from straying and to keep her safe from drugs and booze.

    They also believe Fritzl, who fathered seven children through Elisabeth, wanted to teach her about the “joys of motherhood”. “

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  22. on June 5, 2008 at 6:52 pm T.

    Sorry, meant Michael Katcher is wrong. I’m a mess today.

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  23. on June 5, 2008 at 6:57 pm Michael Katcher

    T. – I hear what you’re saying but I still think I’m right. I think that black men have a strong respect for strong women and a strong distaste for weak women. But it’s all speculation really, given that I’m pretty sure no one here grew up in that culture.

    It’s weird to see your name written out in full like that.

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  24. on June 5, 2008 at 7:08 pm sara

    Roissy the truth is you’re attracted to women who bring out the worst in you. Negativity has higher attracting power. You are a pawn in their game, but because you are the “asshole” you feel powerful and in control. They are more in control than you are. Do you like yourself, truly, as “asshole”? No? Well, then you have to have a stronger intention than they do. Only women who are asking for abuse will apologize to men who treat them like shit. So, why be the one to provide the abuse? Unless you can tolerate never having anything better than average to unhealthy women to have sex with.

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  25. on June 5, 2008 at 7:22 pm T.

    But it’s all speculation really, given that I’m pretty sure no one here grew up in that culture.

    Actually I’m black and grew up in the black hip-hop community.

    You’re sort of right, ghetto black men DO disdain weak women, but much of it has to do with self-hate and low self-esteem. It’s that whole “I don’t want to be part of any club that would have me as a member.” Most “nice guys” of any race are the same way, they can be mean-spirited to ugly girls that don’t interest them, but suddenly turn beta and worshipful when dealing with a girl they find hot and unattainable, and black men are no different. But trust me, a lot of the machismo of the black community is an overcompensating parody of manliness that comes from not having a father figure. Underneath the gruff exterior, there is a lot of sensitivity, betaness and pedestal placing going on, and like any guy that puts women on pedestals for too long, they end up getting burned a lot and eventually develop a bitterness toward women (explains why so many hip-hop songs and videos are dedicated to objectifying women once they get rich, it’s sort of a revenge fantasy). There’s even a word for it in the black community, a “simp:”

    http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=SIMP

    or “tricking.”

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  26. on June 5, 2008 at 7:30 pm Virgle Kent

    T.

    You know I’m all about pouring champagne on bia in da club…. As soon as make enough money to afford that champagne.

    Invest it?!? Put it away and let it grow… FUCK YOU, Champagne, bia, pour… in that fucking order!

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  27. on June 5, 2008 at 7:30 pm Michael Katcher

    T – Whoops, sorry about that. Hope I didn’t offend.

    That would actually make sense. I think a lot of people would assume that the black urban community is very anti-beta based on popular hip-hop objectifying women, but that makes sense that it would be a backlash to the feelings of insecurity that poverty and the lack of female success brings.

    Back then hoes didn’t want me / Now I’m hot hoes all on me

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  28. on June 5, 2008 at 7:34 pm Michael Katcher

    How do you do the big quotes? i thought it was the word quote in the arrow-brackets.

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  29. on June 5, 2008 at 7:35 pm T.

    You know I’m all about pouring champagne on bia in da club…. As soon as make enough money to afford that champagne.

    I prefer to make it rain on dem hoes.

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  30. on June 5, 2008 at 7:36 pm agnostic

    Treating your female friends like they’re nothing special is good practice too — hell, most of the time, they deserve it, as female shit-testing doesn’t only happen when you’re fucking them. They do it to their guy friends too, maybe more so since they seek to turn them into asexual supportive boyfriends.

    I kicked one of my close female friends to the curb a month ago for turning into a bitch (as a mutual friend agreed), and it looks like I’m in the process of shutting out another one right now. Hey, no big deal — when fall semester starts, there will be thousands of freshmen to make new friends with, as well as people I met going out four nights a week. There is always an abundance, and you never have to settle.

    Re: loving killers, in the Yanamamo, a South American hunter-gatherer tribe, males who had higher rates of killing other males were more likely to sire children. “Shawty want a thug” is nothing new.

    And young guys aren’t overly beta due to pop culture — has been that way before TV, radio, etc. Also not due to mothers — the way your parents raise you has no lasting effect on your personality (Judith Rich Harris reviews this in *The Nurture Assumption*). It’s just their genes that influence you.

    Here are two more plausible explanations:

    1) Young guys aren’t going to get laid an awful lot anyway, so natural selection hasn’t weeded out those who gush beta behavior. Natural selection cares more about what guys do in their 20s and beyond.

    2) Gushy beta behavior at a young age is a feature, not a bug. If more cocky, assholey behavior is better, you could be born that way — but you’d risk getting the shit beaten out of you when young and both weak and lacking powerful allies. But if you’re designed to be overly beta when young, you both avoid getting into conflict when you’re more vulnerable, plus you learn what doesn’t work / overreact and become more cocky and assholey in your 20s when it pays to act that way.

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  31. on June 5, 2008 at 7:37 pm T.

    Whoops, sorry about that. Hope I didn’t offend.

    Haha, don’t sweat it, I stopped being chronically offended when I turned in my liberal card years ago.

    Put the word “blockquote” in arrow brackets at the beginning and “/blockquote” with that backslash in front of it in arrow brackets at the end to make the big quote.

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  32. on June 5, 2008 at 7:39 pm kay gee

    When she knows her man has real tangible value, options and life beyond her, gets regular rim jobs, and gives you lots of head, you need not pretend to be an asshole or someone else you’re not. You’ll have a healthy giggly drama-free girlie that you can appreciate for more than owning and operating a vagina and you can enjoy spoiling her as much as you enjoy puring a load on her pretty face.

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  33. on June 5, 2008 at 7:46 pm Michael Katcher

    Back then hoes didn’t want me / Now I’m hot hoes all on me

    I’m sort of curious about this question now. I only have two friends close enough that I think I could judge their outlook on women who fit the discussed criteria. One is kind of beta, one is pretty alpha. Then again I’ve only known the latter since after his “fame” (it’s a relative term), so that might just be validation of your theory.

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  34. on June 5, 2008 at 7:48 pm Abhs

    There are women who would take their chances with a sociopathic death row inmate over law-abiding nonmurderous free men they know.

    Bad logic. Not the women we would want.

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  35. on June 5, 2008 at 7:54 pm Wonka

    “I think every man who was not born with his dick in a girl’s mouth needs to go through an asshole phase in order to seduce women in a healthy way.”

    I can accept a lot of things from roissy, but I cannot accept that any of his suggestions are healthy.

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  36. on June 5, 2008 at 7:55 pm Usually Lurking

    If more cocky, assholey behavior is better, you could be born that way — but you’d risk getting the shit beaten out of you when young and both weak and lacking powerful allies.

    Right on. Remember, Casanova was always on the run. A more modern example might be the lead character in Animal House who said that when he was a freshman he got a ritual beat-down from the seniors every week. He was the guy who had no problem being cocky/funny/sexually-assertive with the girls.

    It is only the last few decades that a young man could be a total asshole and basically suffer no (real) consequences.

    And, remember, with evo-psych approach:
    – the beta just needed one girl to be willing to bear his children
    – the alpha just needed one guy to wish, and act on that wish, that he was dead.

    I believe this played out somewhat with the Alpha Vikings in Scandinavia killing one another leaving behind the more calm betas.

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  37. on June 5, 2008 at 8:00 pm 12 o'clock shadow

    “…The problem is, every so often the girl will call your bluff, so to speak, and will dump you…”

    Then don’t bluff. Bluffing is for those that have something to lose. There is plenty more where that piece came from anyway…

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  38. on June 5, 2008 at 8:01 pm agnostic

    How could I forget — try tutoring or teaching high school students. Assuming you aren’t a complete sucker (which actually many people are), you’ll see that they aren’t innocent, kind souls, and Lord knows teenagers these days need lots of discipline. Even better, you get to do so with impunity, and their parents will probably thank you for being able to reach them.

    It’s not “knocking pussy off the pedestal” exactly, but anything you can do to put females in their place is good. Girls get away with too much shit today in our pussified country.

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  39. on June 5, 2008 at 8:05 pm sara

    38 agnostic

    “..anything you can do to put females in their place is good.”

    Life in Hell. EGAD.

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  40. on June 5, 2008 at 8:26 pm BTK

    “It’s not “knocking pussy off the pedestal” exactly, but anything you can do to put females in their place is good. Girls get away with too much shit today in our pussified country.”

    Amen to that. Kim duToit wrote an essay about how we are becoming a pussifed society. Women want to be treated just like the guys, but with additional special privileges. What a disaster it has been.

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  41. on June 5, 2008 at 10:28 pm Ben

    38, sara.

    Roissy’s influence on agnostic is palpable . If you read his posts from a few years ago, he was a whiny, sorry for himself betaboy, but now he’s suddenly grown some balls! He reminds me of my former roommate. Typical tough talker with the anonymity of the internet, the language they use is almost the same, but I’m skeptical as to the extent he ‘walks the walk’.

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  42. on June 5, 2008 at 10:35 pm sara

    41 Ben

    Yes, I too am a big talker. Sometimes I will get in my daughters face and when she threatens to retaliate, I cringe like the big pussy I am. Correction: little pussy.

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  43. on June 5, 2008 at 11:15 pm agnostic

    Ben is welcome to introduce me to his girlfriend or daughter and see if I walk the walk…

    You suffer from a confusion typical of the feeble-minded — Y came just after X, so X caused Y. In reality, there’s usually some deeper cause of both X and Y. Like, you stop believing the baloney you were taught in college and act like you should. That causes you to change the tone and content of your writing, as well as seek out like-minded individuals.

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  44. on June 5, 2008 at 11:26 pm Anonymous

    “Women want to be treated just like the guys, but with additional special privileges.”

    Some of us just want the same opportunities available to men, *without* any “special privileges”. We want to be able to get an education, and have a career, and support ourselves, and own property, not *be* property.

    What’s the “proper” place for women like that in your dream society?

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  45. on June 5, 2008 at 11:28 pm Alex

    Agnostic, hate to say it, but you come across as a blustery fraud, popping in here to parrot back an amped-up, dumbed-down version of everything Roissy says. Your false machismo is neither convincing nor amusing, but simply grating. Perhaps you should spend less time perfecting your supremely masculine prose and more time actually trying to become the Alpha monkey you try to pass yourself off as on the Internet.

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  46. on June 5, 2008 at 11:37 pm kay gee

    …anything you can do to put females in their place is good

    It’s called cock therapy.

    Most antics are symptoms of sexual frustrations that go away when you teach (yourself and then) her to totally let go, be comfy in her own skin and enjoy it all. Multiple intense orgasms during vaginal and (particularly) anal sex are a potent drug that will make a submissive little pleaser out of a feminista.

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  47. on June 5, 2008 at 11:39 pm Peter

    The Glorious Natural Pelt is wonderful! Haven’t said that in a while, have I.

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  48. on June 5, 2008 at 11:50 pm roissy

    kay gee, you’re back! how have you been man? i thought you left the country. i’ll call you tomorrow.

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  49. on June 5, 2008 at 11:51 pm sara

    47 Peter. Finally someone who makes some sense.

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  50. on June 6, 2008 at 1:09 am David Alexander

    needs to go through an asshole phase

    Sorry, I can’t be an asshole and live with myself. Oh well, no women for me!

    The average PUA would be pretty pissed if we returned to that, but, I think that most men would fall right in line.

    Well, that’s only true if men lack the willpower and give into such silliness. The only choices for sex should not be disease ridden or boring and “slightly” better than masturbation.

    putting women on a pedestal for being hot

    The ratio of hot black women to ugly black women is rather out of whack compared to its white counterpart.

    Look at the hip-hop videos and the sheer amount of beautiful women in them.

    Nobody would watch videos of ugly ass rappers if it didn’t have any hot women…

    Hey, no big deal — when fall semester starts, there will be thousands of freshmen to make new friends with, as well as people I met going out four nights a week. There is always an abundance, and you never have to settle.

    If the loss of these friendships is not inducing any feeling of sadness, one may suspect that these friendships were not really serious to begin with. Mind you, as I’ve stated before on my blog, I miss being the “reserve” boyfriend and emotional pal of my female friends. Sure, they were probably being gamed (and fucked) by some other guy, but given their sexual attractiveness, I suspect that I got the better end of the bargain.

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  51. on June 6, 2008 at 1:25 am Chic Noir

    Hope said,”People place on pedestals things that are “hard to obtain” or “out of your reach.” Don’t guys want women to be the sexual “gatekeepers” and tell them to keep it guarded? But then they don’t want that because it makes it too difficult to access. They can’t have it both ways.”

    I2I hope I2I

    Michael Katcher, there are a few black people who visit this blog: Virgile Kent, T, David Walker, Reggie and myself. Not all of us are African-American but we are all black and I think most of us have spent a large part of our life living in the United States.

    Said T “Most “nice guys” of any race are the same way, they can be mean-spirited to ugly girls that don’t interest them, but suddenly turn beta and worshipful when dealing with a girl they find hot and unattainable, and black men are no different”

    I agree with this ^^^T. Why do men think they deserve the woman of their dreams just because?

    I am sick of men who are 6s and below talk about how they refuse to date a woman who is less than an 8.5

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  52. on June 6, 2008 at 1:43 am Chic Noir

    “/blockquote” Whoops, sorry about that. Hope I didn’t offend“/blockquote”

    Unlike T, I am still liberal and you did not offend.

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  53. on June 6, 2008 at 1:58 am Chic Noir

    “/blockquote” The Glorious Natural Pelt is wonderful! Haven’t said that in a while, have I. “/blockquote”

    Now that is the Peter that I know and love.

    Big Kiss 😆

    I give up on the quotes.

    “/blockquote” The ratio of hot black women to ugly black women is rather out of whack compared to its white counterpart “/blockquote”

    I am nice to everyone here, even when I disagree BUT…….

    David, your self-hatred is simply over the top. If you think this endears you to your non-black friends think again. No one respects a person who does not respect himself. Notice that none of the white males on this blog talk about white women (just women) with the same hateful tone that you talk about black women.

    If the white men on this blog started to write about black women, and how better they are better than any other group of women, I bet you would start to chase after black women too. Think for yourself David. The things you write on this blog make it hard for any woman to give you sympathy p*&^y. At some point, women lose their ability to have empathy for a “beta”, at which point he becomes pathetic.

    P.S. It is possible to have black pride and be best friends with a white person or even marry a white person.

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  54. on June 6, 2008 at 2:22 am mr mike

    see:

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0312310846/ref=sib_dp_pt#reader-link

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  55. on June 6, 2008 at 2:52 am Gannon

    I am sick of men who are 6s and below talk about how they refuse to date a woman who is less than an 8.5

    This is something I can agree on. I think that a true alpha loves all kind of women, including 5, 6, and 7, and maybe even a 4. Average girls can be very sexually fulfilling, specially if their are still in their teens. Most girls are pretty in their teens and lose their charms slowly at around 23. In high school the guys who only obsessed over 9s and 10′ and criticized top models were the guys who didn’t have access to women. I enjoyed making love to average college girls, even the chubby ones. I can relate to DA however: I definitively have a preference for white, mestiza, jewish or persian women. Hindu girls are still okay but just a little bit too exotic for my tastes. I’m not really into the facial features of east asian, black or pacific women. This is not to be offensive, but I think a quiet common preference of a lot of white man, and it might be mutual, since Japanese women always complain about the huge noses of gaijin men.
    Men who like bit butts probably should like black women, since big butt porn usuallly stars mostly black women with one white one.

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  56. on June 6, 2008 at 3:17 am David Alexander

    David, your self-hatred is simply over the top. If you think this endears you to your non-black friends think again.

    Interestingly, when the topic comes up with my white friends, they either think I’m delusional or pathetic. Wellesley Queen would probably have kicked my ass if she knew how I felt about black women since most of her childhood and teenage friends were black girls.

    I grew up in a working & middle class black neighbourhood in the outskirts of New York City, but I went to school with white ethnic students in Catholic school. This isn’t something that’s fueled by self-hatred or appeasement to non-black friends, but it’s something that I’ve noted in observations over a number of years. I’m not saying that there are no attractive black women, but I’ve noted that I’m considerably more likely to find attractive white women than black women. Even in a large pool only composed of black women, it just seems that the ratio of attractive beautiful black woman to ugly black women seems smaller than it’s equivalent white pool. It’s certainly not a skin colour issue either, as I’ve met plenty of beautiful dark skinned women and ugly light skinned girls.

    Mind you, I’ll admit to some bias when I say that Caribbean black women are better looking than their African-American counterparts…

    If the white men on this blog started to write about black women, and how better they are better than any other group of women, I bet you would start to chase after black women too

    IIRC, I’ve noted that on several occasions, the women that the group here has found attractive didn’t meet my standards of beauty, while the group as routinely deemed my choices in porn stars to be aberrant. My views on women aren’t forged out of some desire for approval from the men (or women here), but from my own experiences and what induces my sex drive.

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  57. on June 6, 2008 at 3:29 am Days of Broken Arrows

    I disagree with Thursday that you should never neg hit someone about their weight.

    My mother told my younger brothers and I this growing up because we had a fat older brother. Since no one “corrected” his behavior, he became morbidly obese and has pretty much ruined his life. Calling a person on their faults can sometimes help them CORRECT their faults.

    As for women, well, some women won’t hesitate to insult you by going way below the belt. In those instance, I think, weight is fair game. Women can’t expect to act like Roseanne Arnold but get treated like Queen Victoria. Because of various laws in the US, women think they can behave any which way at home and in the workplace, but you still have to treat them like little gods.

    The fact that we shouldn’t is exactly what Roissy was trying to get across.

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  58. on June 6, 2008 at 3:45 am sestamibi

    11 Peter

    What you have described is called “dyadic power”, as I have pointed out frequently here. In relationships, just like in any other transaction, the party who cares least wins.

    And just like in any other transaction, a participant in a relationship stays involved through a continuous assessment of the availability of alternative (and perhaps better) relationships. So one may have his/her dignity intact, and have a better deal in the wings!

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  59. on June 6, 2008 at 4:21 am sara

    58 sestambi

    “In relationships, just like in any other transaction, the party who cares least wins.”

    He who cares the least, cares the least. Is that winning? ALL it says is that in that particular relationship they cared the least!!! That says something about THEM not caring. It says nothing whatever about the other person now does it? In a relationship where you have cared the most, did that make you an automatic loser? Some of you guys are so fucking egoistic that you seem genetically unable to put yourself in another person’s shoes.

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  60. on June 6, 2008 at 5:05 am katie

    Well I live in England and am a girl and I dont know whether this is a culture difference issue, but most girls here prefer a guy who treats them nicely and shows compassion, however she is obviously not going to stay commited to the guy who she knows is way below her standars too ugly or short for her so if you are an ugly guy and are wondering why girls are not nice to you they are probably not nice to you because they are not attracted to you. If you ever notice goodlooking guys who are nice to all girls even the ugly ones (these may be described as alpha males) get gorgeous girls and lots of freinds who are good looking girls, regardless of the fact that they are not hard and chavenistic. Although most women are more flexible when dating as they may not mind dating below their standards, they are unlikely to stick with (although they might date just for fun) a guy who is way below their standards especially if he acts like an idiot. However if they see a guy who is below there standars but is nice to even the ugly girls a pretty girl will find him pleaable eventhough she may still not want to settle down with him (if he is way below her standards) this is because pretty girls see other pretty girls as competition and you may find them more attractive to her one day, after all eventhough its very very sad and sickening we are all going to turn ugly one day eg when we are 29 may be but while your 20 make sure u enjoy the good life.xxx

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  61. on June 6, 2008 at 5:52 am jaakkeli

    Usually Lurking: A more modern example might be the lead character in Animal House who said that when he was a freshman he got a ritual beat-down from the seniors every week. He was the guy who had no problem being cocky/funny/sexually-assertive with the girls.

    I had this, too, as a teen. I got beaten up many times by self-righteous guys for talking to women the “wrong” way – and the “wrong” way was usually the cocky way that never offended girls. I did get some excessive crushes, too, and with them it was generally the opposite: girls were very uncomfortable with an obsessed guy, but guys don’t gang up to beat up guys with crushes who think it’s a bright idea to ask their dream girl out to see Titanic (yeah go ahead and laugh at me).

    Partly because of this, I gave up attempting much in the small town and it took some serious time to grow back my balls in the city. That was probably the normal experience before urbanization: even if you tried being seductive, you got it thoroughly beaten out of you. I think those “nice guys” understand women just fine (if they really thought that girls don’t go for sexual or cocky guys, why would they get so worried?), they just don’t have the balls to do what they intuit to be right (which is often the right move if you don’t want to get beaten up).

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  62. on June 6, 2008 at 5:54 am sestamibi

    59 sara

    Before you shoot your mouth off, why don’t you Google the term.

    ALL relationships are based on power, whether we like to admit it or not. If you are a 20-year old smoking hot chick, you have a great deal of dyadic power as you can easily replace your current interest. Similarly if you are a 51-year old US President you have options other than your bitch wife, and she knows it.

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  63. on June 6, 2008 at 6:12 am Days of Broken Arrows

    What Sestamibi means by 59 is that the one with the power in any given “deal” is the one who is prepared to walk away.

    Wasn’t this in Donald Trump’s “The Art of the Deal?”

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  64. on June 6, 2008 at 6:21 am jaakkeli

    Chic Noir: P.S. It is possible to have black pride and be best friends with a white person or even marry a white person.

    The self-respect thing guys like roissy speak about is really perfectly general: it’s just not guys putting women on pedestals that doesn’t work, people sometimes put other people on pedestals for completely different reasons and that doesn’t work either.

    Ethnicity is one thing. Like, I know this fruitcake multicultist (unfortunately closely) who cannot talk to black people (or dark-skinned people who she assumes to be black people, not being very good at these things) without starting to blabber about what a hero Nelson Mandela is and how much she respects black people. And of course I’m the insensitive jerk if I talk to non-Finns like they’re normal people and don’t give respect to people just because of their ethnicity. And of course every foreigner thinks she’s weird.

    It’s the same thing, really: the more eagerly you go around giving people special respect just for being in some group (whether it’s gender or ethnicity or whatever), the more you’re broadcasting your uncomfortability with people of that group. Guys with the pedestal problem don’t need to learn special ways of talking to women, they need to learn how not to have a special way of talking to women.

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  65. on June 6, 2008 at 8:13 am johnny five

    gannon
    This is something I can agree on. I think that a true alpha loves all kind of women, including 5, 6, and 7, and maybe even a 4.

    i’m with you on this one. although i enjoy a round of beers with the fellows as much as does anyone else, i adore the company of women of all stripes.
    this includes not only the sexually charged atmosphere of young hotties, but also the refined company of older ladies.

    the sole exception, of course, is the company of bilious feminist viragoes who are mired in an intense misery that is all their own fault.

    da
    Men who like bit[sic] butts probably should like black women, since big butt porn usuallly stars mostly black women with one white one.

    it’s hard for someone who came of age in a Southern grammar/middle school, surrounded by a coterie of black hourglasses and white toothpicks, not to like black girls.
    mmm, memories.

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  66. on June 6, 2008 at 9:00 am katie

    (jaakkeli) Funny how people in America are always getting beaten up for stupid things, I must say I havnt seen much of this type of behaviour in England.

    AND (sestamibi) I dont think for women its a power issue I know that I am 20 and that probably if a guy does not treat me with respect I believe I deserve I will not even acknowledge his existence again but I think that even if I get old and ugly (god forbid) I will never be with someone who does not love me unconditionally regardless of everything else. i mean that I would rather be alone than be with someone I dont love or doesnt love me unconditionally. Another thing I find is that men need women so desperately and are constantly seeking them however women dont really show that much interest in men, women do however have an affection towards children. Perhaps men have instincts tocourt women and women just have instincts to look after children, so women only need men to make children then if they dont like them they can get rid of them?
    and because they know men will still like them and place them on the pedestel because of their instincts they can act how they want
    another piece of evidence that women dont need men is that last month in the london lite geri halliwell said she likes a vibrator better than a man because it performs better in the bedroom, I dont know about that havnt really tried a vibrator if i had one amd my mum found it it would be like wtf

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  67. on June 6, 2008 at 9:39 am chronicguise

    Interesting entry…though what’s more interesting is your comments, didn’t know so many people on wordpress were budding psychologists and therapists!

    Whoever said girls think the same as your..pretty thoughts was right. Of course we did. Stars and the beach. Perfect. The only problem is that when you’re at the age to start thinking all of this, you’re surrounded by a very very very tiny percentage of the population, and half of them haven’t discovered these feelings yet anyway. Hence the constant rejection.

    But did you know: When you meet the right someone at the right time, they come back and come true?

    Something to look forward to perhaps.

    x

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  68. on June 6, 2008 at 10:02 am jaakkeli

    katie, I’m Finnish.

    And while English people may be wimps when sober, now that the English bachelor parties have invaded Eastern Europe, we’ve finally lost our reputation as the world’s worst drunken scum. Thanks!

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  69. on June 6, 2008 at 10:07 am katie

    I dont understand what jaakkeli is saying, or implying

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  70. on June 6, 2008 at 11:10 am johnny five

    agnostic my man,
    c’mere and sit for a spell so i can give you some learnin’.

    everything you say may, indeed, be true; perhaps you really do have an inexhaustible stream of undergrad pussy on tap. hell, you may even be so pimp that your bottom bitches come with mute button, auto-dilating anal sphincters, and swollen lactating mammaries with Baileys instead of colostrum.
    but…
    that’s not the problem.

    the problem is your sauntering onto this blog and yammering about YOURSELF: your magnetic good looks, your majestic curtailing of your relationships with female friends, your biometric statistics… hell, even the exact departments in which you study. as if we care.

    it would be one thing if your comments offered original insights or angles on roissy’s material, or even an entertaining and witty redux.
    but, instead, your writing combines the humor value of a fluid dynamics textbook, the smoothness of sandpaper, the creative éclat of a retirement-fund prospectus, and the appeal and persuasiveness of a nigerian 419 offer.

    what’s more, i can tell you’ve spent most of your life as the kid who leaves a wake of raised eyebrows and quizzical expressions everywhere he goes because he’s SO FUCKING SERIOUS ABOUT EVERYTHING.
    lighten up a bit, son; this is a pua blog. if we want gravitas, we’ll read this.

    finally, as for the posters accusing you of inauthenticity, that is probably because your writing reflects NONE of the essential qualities of a PUA, even though you claim to be irresistible to any nubile undergrad who dares to pierce your event horizon.
    to wit:
    * you’re SO FUCKING SERIOUS ABOUT EVERYTHING
    * you write over-literal prose that lacks any semblance of humor, double entendre, innuendo, or wordplay
    * you give detailed answers to questions about your professional life
    * you fill in details. about yourself. all the time.
    * you have NO IDEA how to respond to shit testing, as evidenced by post number 43.
    any one of these 5 would spell death for a real-life PUA, and you have all 5.

    work on it.

    i’m trying to help you here.

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  71. on June 6, 2008 at 12:35 pm When It Is OK To Call A Woman Fat « Roissy in DC

    […] 6, 2008 by roissy Commenter and blogger Thursday had this to say from yesterday’s post: Somewhat off topic, but never, ever neg someone with a reference to their weight. Not even a 10. A […]

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  72. on June 6, 2008 at 12:59 pm Usually Lurking

    Johnny, are you a writer?

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  73. on June 6, 2008 at 1:30 pm alias clio

    Um, yes, johnny 5. I would have made the same suggestions myself, but I know Agnostic wouldn’t have believed them if they had come from a woman. Coming from you, they just might persuade him to reassess.

    Ag, darlin’, you and your posts used to be charming. You may have been “beta-ish” (I couldn’t tell), but the charm undercut that. Now you’ve ditched the charm in pursuit of dominance but haven’t quite achieved it yet. Thing is, I think the charm would likely have worked better for you. From what I’ve learned here, those PUA fellows teach you to play into your strengths.

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  74. on June 6, 2008 at 2:44 pm redhead

    Fuck all the racist crap! Let’s talk about 46 from kay gee-

    MOST. BRILLIANT. INSIGHT. EVER.

    Love it! I’m usually one of those in-your-face women, but give me great sex, and I’ll totally be your bitch. And, I hate admitting that.

    K

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  75. on June 6, 2008 at 3:05 pm sara

    62 sestamibi

    I googled the term and read an article from Norah Dunbar who seems to have originally coined the phrase “dyadic power.” May I shoot my mouth off now? LOL Bottom line, I think she’s an overly educated idiot, but then most overly educated people are. She says:

    “For the most part, the students are idealistic – they don’t think inequality exists anymore. But when I ask the women if they would ask out a man on a date, they say no,” she said.”

    Men and women ARE equal (to suggest otherwise is pure idiocy), but not the SAME; in fact if she was paying attention she would have noticed that. That is what education can do for a person.

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  76. on June 6, 2008 at 4:00 pm katie

    I agree with red head satisfying sex is a big part of it. And in the scenario where there are two men and they are equal in most respects niceness,looks, wealth etc the woman is likely to settle down for the one who is the best in the bedroom

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  77. on June 6, 2008 at 4:17 pm dizzy8

    “Roissy in DC – Advising aspiring domestic abusers since 2006.”

    It’s quite a lovely service for our city provided here.

    I love that crap like the above “stay in touch with your inner asshole (or risk that girl getting out of hand)” is paired with so many other posts about women being “uppity,” “trying to gain the upper hand,” or only wanting to “punish” men.

    Are you really sure it’s the women who are angry and controlling? Because it doesn’t sound that way. The behaviors you complain about in women sound pretty normal. Expecting a man to pay a percentage of his income to support his kids (especially since you so disapprove of women working) isn’t being controlling. Preferring not to have to talk to a stranger in a bar isn’t a personal attack on that stranger. But the strategies you described above are definitely both.

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  78. on June 6, 2008 at 4:25 pm dizzy8

    DOBA: “Because of various laws in the US, women think they can behave any which way at home and in the workplace, but you still have to treat them like little gods.”

    How are women treated like “little gods” again in the workplace? Because there are laws against grabbing them whenever you want, or forcing them to sleep with you to keep their jobs? Is that the special treatment we’re getting? Sounds VERY unfair. You poor boys. How can you bear to go to work every day when you’re not allowed to stare at people’s boobs?

    The day you have to sit through an extended and detailed mid-work-conference conversation about how much size does matter is the day I feel sorry any of you. (Bonus points if the girls try pat your fanny and say something like, “You’re so cool for not believing that PC baloney about things people can’t talk about at work…”)

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  79. on June 6, 2008 at 4:32 pm sara

    77 dizzy8

    “I love that crap like the above “stay in touch with your inner asshole (or risk that girl getting out of hand)” is paired with so many other posts about women being “uppity,” “trying to gain the upper hand,” or only wanting to “punish” men.”

    It’s pure projection.

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  80. on June 6, 2008 at 4:39 pm David Alexander

    it’s hard for someone who came of age in a Southern grammar/middle school, surrounded by a coterie of black hourglasses and white toothpicks, not to like black girls

    That wasn’t my quote, but I’ll answer it.

    What I’ve noticed is that there is an increasing acceptance of white girls having asses, and it’s seen by the popularity of porn films such as “Big Wet Asses” and sites such as “assparade”. So instead of films having 4 black stars and one 1 girl with a black male cast, now you’ll find white men having sex strictly with white girls with big asses, and black women being “segregated” to specialty versions of the same films only with black women. Admittedly, I’ve never been into porn with black female casts primarily because your average black female in person is considerably more attractive than your average black female porn star. In contrast, white female porn stars are better looking than the average white female.

    I’ll also not that for many of these big ass films, the larger asses still refer to “tight, but larger than average”. It’s nice, but it’s no match for a “fat ass” which something that’s worth grabbing IMHO. So while guys may make fun of chubby white girls, I’ll cherish them because it’s a great way to get big DD cups and a 40 inch ass…

    BTW, most of the black-directed or oriented porn comes across as rather ghetto-influenced, which makes watching their scenes difficult regardless of the female talent. The only black porn that I consistently watch is Justin Slayer’s stuff, and that’s because he doesn’t play on ghetto stereotypes to sell films, and the girls genuinely enjoy working with him and his crew which shows in their performances.

    I am sick of men who are 6s and below talk about how they refuse to date a woman who is less than an 8.5

    Some guys simply want hot women under the theory that it will boost their social standing and remove the loser stink. For others, the girls who are below 8.5 may not entice them sexually. An emotional bond may form, but a sexual bond may not form in at all. It’s no different than my desire for porn stars when most normal woman cannot engage or entice my sex drive.

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  81. on June 6, 2008 at 5:21 pm roissy

    dizzyclearedherblowholeandspouted:
    “Roissy in DC – Advising aspiring domestic abusers since 2006.”

    i can always count on you to stay in character.

    I love that crap like the above “stay in touch with your inner asshole (or risk that girl getting out of hand)” is paired with so many other posts about women being “uppity,” “trying to gain the upper hand,” or only wanting to “punish” men.

    both sexes are trying to get the best deal they can afford in the sexual market. it just so happens that women respond very well to dominant men and being an asshole is one way to trigger that attraction reflex.

    Are you really sure it’s the women who are angry and controlling?

    aren’t you trying to control this conversation with your lame arguments?
    fo shizzy dizzy, men and women employ tactics, conscious and instinctual, to snag the best partner they can. what you see as controlling is really advice for men to increase their power to get what they want and neutralize the power of the women they desire to thwart them from getting what they want. you feel like this is “losing control” because you want all the power for yourself. that’s perfectly natural. everyone wants illimitable power. it’s encoded in our DNA.

    Expecting a man to pay a percentage of his income to support his kids (especially since you so disapprove of women working) isn’t being controlling.

    no, it’s being selfish.
    actually, i have no problem with child support in cases where the man up and leaves the woman with the kids. if he reneges on his end of the deal, then he should compensate her. but if she leaves him and breaks the deal then he should have no obligation to pay one red cent to her or the kids. that is why i have said that no fault divorce has helped make marriage a very bad deal for men.
    if the woman wants the man’s money to help her raise the kids, she should STAY MARRIED to him, or put the kids up for adoption. i hear some orphanages in new england are quite nice.

    Preferring not to have to talk to a stranger in a bar isn’t a personal attack on that stranger.

    when have i said it was?
    you are dense. how many times do we have to go over this until it sinks into your blocklike, and probably very ugly, skull? if an attractive woman hates to be hit on by men in bars and it causes her great psychological distress, she should stay the fuck out of them. men have no obligation to telepathically read her mind and refrain from talking to her in a public venue and she has no right to demand freedom from male intrusion in a bar where people go to meet and mingle.
    would you suggest the bouncers cordone you off with chicken wire and electronic sensors so that men cannot bother your dainty repose?
    stop being such a 100% dumbass.

    But the strategies you described above are definitely both.

    did you squirt in your panties when you wrote that? god, i can smell it. mmm….. beef taco-flavored haagen daz….

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  82. on June 6, 2008 at 6:45 pm Eurosabra

    Look, if what we have is dueling entitlements, it is *ludicrous* to expect men voluntarily to ratify a situation which privileges female entitlement over male, in a situation in which men (overwhelmingly) experience total powerlessness. America is the only country in which stripping and porn so predominate that gutless males fork over real cash for a simulacrum of sex, because fake hints at sex from a beautiful woman are more exciting than rutting with the ca$h cow$ available to the “average” male. While I am tender-hearted enough to value some of the intangibles good-hearted women of size brought me, I am NOT able to convince myself that 36D-40-48, 5’3″ and 180lbs was an erotic thrill for any reason other than that I’d been “high and dry” for 9 months. Oh, and a pretty face, FWIW.

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  83. on June 6, 2008 at 7:52 pm johnny five

    Johnny, are you a writer?

    ul, you got at least eight inches for me?** if so, then i might be.

    (**column inches, that is, in a widely circulated publication)

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  84. on June 6, 2008 at 8:02 pm sestamibi

    66 katie

    You demonstrate exact what I was talking about. If you feel you are better off without him (with or without an alternative option), then you hold the balance of dyadic power in the relationship–provided he doesn’t feel the same.

    Gerri Halliwell, for example, has her vibrator alternative. Different strokes for different folks, I suppose.

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  85. on June 6, 2008 at 8:03 pm Usually Lurking

    I was being serious. It is the way that you write/speak.

    You have a decent vocabulary and you can write “fluid” sentences. I can’t write/speak for shit, so I tend to notice these things.

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  86. on June 6, 2008 at 8:05 pm anonymous

    Great post, roissy. Very good.

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  87. on June 6, 2008 at 9:05 pm tschafer

    “There are women who would take their chances with a sociopathic death row inmate over law-abiding nonmurderous free men they know.”

    Yeah, I know – I dated a few of them back in the 1980’s…

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  88. on June 6, 2008 at 9:31 pm David Alexander

    dizzyclearedherblowholeandspouted

    I see you’re keeping it classy and dignified?

    that is why i have said that no fault divorce has helped make marriage a very bad deal for men.

    Actually, removing no fault divorce would make marriage less attractive to both sexes. I’d love to see how you’d get out of a marriage if you discover a young hot woman who makes you happy when compared to your aged wife who’s too tired for sex since she’s taking care of the kids. You could *cheat* on her on, but adultery is grounds for divorce.

    With a high risk of falling out of love in a marriage, without the escape valve of no-fault divorce, there is no incentive for anybody to get married.

    if the woman wants the man’s money to help her raise the kids, she should STAY MARRIED to him, or put the kids up for adoption

    So, in other words, if a man is tired of his wife, he can leave, but if a woman is tired, she must stay until the man grow tired of her? This must be an excellent home to grow up in…

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  89. on June 6, 2008 at 9:33 pm Chic Noir

    Gannon
    I do not have a problem with your preferences or any other man who posts on this blog. We all have them but there is a difference in the way that you write about your preferences, and the way that DA does. He attempts to demonize black women as if they are creatures from hell. I personally do not like men with blond/blue (although there is always one) but I don’t demonize them by comparing them to the dark complexioned men(most often black) who I do find attractive.

    In high school the guys who only obsessed over 9s and 10′ and criticized top models were the guys who didn’t have access to women

    The Truth!

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  90. on June 6, 2008 at 9:54 pm dizzy

    Oh Roissy.

    Every time I read one of your circuitous, completely ridiculous attempts at argument, I realize again that you are your own worst enemy.

    With logic skills like, ‘Your response to my argument is an attempt to control…” you definitely haven’t made it through any graduate degree program. Lemme guess – the tests didn’t show your “true” intelligence? Or was it that you were too cool to try?

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  91. on June 6, 2008 at 9:58 pm agnostic

    Oh I’m willing to listen to advice if it’s based on correcting real faults, rather than online faults. That’s why I read a book by the Mystery Method people, RooshV’s Bang, and watched some clips on YouTube.

    And I learned a decent amount about what I was doing wrong, and have corrected the major faults (e.g., approaching at an angle, not leaning in to talk, focusing on telling stories about the adventures I’ve had, etc.)

    Like I keep saying, I really don’t care how I come off online — I pay attention only to the feedback, explicit or implicit, that I receive from real-life people who I have interacted with in real life. For example, I’ve learned that when approaching girls who are 18 or younger, subtle humor or witty banter doesn’t work at all — they just won’t get what you’re doing, and expect you to be more direct — but it’s second-nature to a 26 year-old.

    None of the younger girls told me straight up, “Hey that doesn’t work,” but if you’re a good intuitive psychologist, you can tell by reactions.

    I think most of you are falling victim to the fundamental attribution error, where you think that what you see of my in one particular situation — writing online — reflects how I am in a variety of other situations — like interacting with real-life people.

    How stupid do you think I am — in real life, would I really talk about how to statistically test whether younger or older girls like better movies, or what evolutionary reasons there may be for being beta while young, etc.? Outside of a classroom, anyway?

    Online, my goal is to increase the knowledge of others and to see if they can increase mine — period. I’m not here to be witty, charm the pants off of girls, or whatever else I may like to do in real life. So, I only pay attention to feedback from the internet if it relates to these goals (like if I didn’t explain a point clearly enough, or if they found an error in my reasoning).

    LikeLike


  92. on June 6, 2008 at 9:59 pm dizzy

    “she has no right to demand freedom from male intrusion in a bar where people go to meet and mingle.”

    She has every right to decide who she will mingle with. I have no idea why you see that as a bad thing… Wait. Yes I do.

    LikeLike


  93. on June 6, 2008 at 10:08 pm David Alexander

    and the way that DA does. He attempts to demonize black women as if they are creatures from hell.

    Maybe I think black women are creatures from hell because I’ve had the chance to compare them to their white counterparts? After a while, one can become sick of ghetto acting, yet attractive middle class black women too.

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  94. on June 6, 2008 at 10:14 pm T.

    With logic skills like, ‘Your response to my argument is an attempt to control…” you definitely haven’t made it through any graduate degree program.

    Oh get off it. I’ve done graduate school, and I’ll be the first to tell you that education credentials do not correspond with intelligence, no matter how often graduate school students will try to convince one otherwise. Some of the most idiotic, brainwashed people I’ve ever met have been products of graduate programs.

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  95. on June 6, 2008 at 10:19 pm roissy

    dizzy wailed to her alpha muse:
    She has every right to decide who she will mingle with.

    no shit sherlock. read what i wrote. demanding freedom from male intrusion (i.e. getting approached) is not the same as deciding who to mingle with. you can control the latter; you cannot control the former, unless you retreat to a private space.

    to put it in terms even a tard like yourself could grasp: men don’t read minds. if you don’t want men hitting on you, you can do one or both of the following:

    leave the bar.
    be your lovely feminine self.

    does your slope-like forehead throb when you have to think this hard?

    by the way, when was the last time you were hit on by a man? i mean, besides your father spanking you for masturbating to his lesbian porn.

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  96. on June 6, 2008 at 10:59 pm roissy

    DA:
    I see you’re keeping it classy and dignified?

    the term of art is: “stay classy, roissy.”

    admit it, you laughed.

    LikeLike


  97. on June 6, 2008 at 11:05 pm David Alexander

    admit it, you laughed.

    No, I think you’re capable of better introductory insults that refrain from referring to your female opponents as fat whales. Such insults only enhance your reputation as a douchebag.

    LikeLike


  98. on June 7, 2008 at 12:26 am Anonymous

    “she has no right to demand freedom from male intrusion in a bar where people go to meet and mingle.”

    Oh, really? Will you be advocating eve-teasing next? The nerve of those women! Going out in public like they have *rights* or something!

    LikeLike


  99. on June 7, 2008 at 12:34 am dizzy

    If I’m an ugly lesbian, would that make you right? What if I were a grandmother? Or a castrating bitch of a lawyer?

    It’s the internet. You’ll never know. It’s interesting the things you pick to call me, though. Says a lot about your world view.

    I think your just bitter because you honestly believe that someone like you – not professionally successful, not very good looking (your pics out there) – deserves to be discounted the way you try to discount women who you don’t want to sleep with. As if your dick were the ultimate arbitrator of human worth or something.

    Everyone has value and rights. It’s such a basic concept, and it makes you crazy.

    LikeLike


  100. on June 7, 2008 at 12:35 am dizzy

    Omg. I somehow just did the thing where you type “your” instead of “you’re.”

    That one does deserve some abuse 🙂

    LikeLike


  101. on June 7, 2008 at 12:52 am Chic Noir

    jaakkeli comment 64

    I’ve come across people like your friend. Makes me feel uncomfortable or like the circus freak.

    Sometimes, I think it’s cute when a guy approaches me and he is a bit nervous but most of all I would prefer a man to be himself. If a guy looks at me across the room like a piece of steak, he can forget about getting my number.

    ijohnny five said
    it’s hard for someone who came of age in a Southern grammar/middle school, surrounded by a coterie of black hourglasses and white toothpicks, not to like black girls.
    mmm, memories

    Those days are gone Johnny, as both groups of women are now out of shape. I am also noticing a rapid increase in the number of overweight Asian women. The American diet and its’ portion size is a B*.

    Another thing I find is that men need women so desperately and are constantly seeking them however women dont really show that much interest in men, women do however have an affection towards children

    I think this is what most men find so frustrating about women.

    Men and women ARE equal (to suggest otherwise is pure idiocy), but not the SAME

    Comment of the week.

    DA said I’ve never been into porn with black female casts primarily because your average black female in person is considerably more attractive than your average black female porn star. In contrast, white female porn stars are better looking than the average white female.

    One of my first posts on this blog was my trying to explain the above with another poster. There are a few reasons why the blk women you see in bl*e movies are for the most part not very attractive.

    Usually Lurking, I like Johnny’s writing style also. In addition, there are few other posters here who have a writing style that I admire.

    LikeLike


  102. on June 7, 2008 at 12:58 am anonymous

    Good, very good!

    LikeLike


  103. on June 7, 2008 at 12:59 am Chic Noir

    Maybe I think black women are creatures from hell because I’ve had the chance to compare them to their white counterparts? After a while, one can become sick of ghetto acting, yet attractive middle class black women too

    The type of behavior you label as ghetto, can also be found among some middle class white women. Except when white women behave in this manner it’s referred to as redneck of trailer park trash behavior I am willing to bet that because they are white you are willing to let it slide, and that is a clear sign that you are indeed a self hater.

    I do not have a problem with your preference as I said once before but your need to demonize black women is over the top. There are a number of blk men who post here who date and like WW like yourself but don’t write about black women with the amount venom that you do.

    LikeLike


  104. on June 7, 2008 at 1:35 am David Alexander

    One of my first posts on this blog was my trying to explain the above with another poster.

    IIRC, your theory was that social constraints pushed attractive black women away from such roles, while I thought that rap videos provided a more lucrative market for those attractive women. We may both be right in this case and both issues are at play.

    The type of behavior you label as ghetto, can also be found among some middle class white women.

    A ghetto white girl is a pig with a dress and lipstick. Whatever ghetto behaviour she has would take away from her attractiveness. Trust me, I would easily reject as a ghetto white girl primarily because we would never get along with each other. It’s rather embarrassing to be a black guy dating a white girl because it implies a certain degree of loserness about the black male. Besides, I don’t need family members chastising me about my choice.

    As a third rate omega male, I could probably date ghetto white girls because it’s easier than meeting quality women, but I have enough self-respect to refrain from such actions. I would much rather be alone than marry the trash of any race.

    don’t write about black women with the amount venom that you do

    It’s not my fault that I found more white women attractive than black women.

    LikeLike


  105. on June 7, 2008 at 2:56 am anonymous

    This is not very interesting at all.

    LikeLike


  106. on June 7, 2008 at 3:24 am jaakkeli

    agnostic: Like I keep saying, I really don’t care how I come off online

    Yes, you keep saying that, OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Those of us who read the same blogs cannot have failed to have learned that AGNOSTIC REALLY WANTS US ALL TO KNOW THAT HE DOESN’T CARE ABOUT HOW HE COMES ACROSS TO US.

    Of course, since you don’t care about how you come across to us, you won’t get defensive if I tell you how you’re coming across to me. You sound like an aspie who’s immune to subcommunication. You “keep saying” something, baffled by why people don’t take the message, utterly oblivious to the fact that it’s not only the logical content of your words but when, how, where, how many times and in what context you’re saying it that tells us something about you. Now, it may be that you’re not similarily oblivious IRL… but that would be the first time I’d ever see that happen.

    And trust me, if *I*’m getting the impression that someone is retardedly oblivious, things are pretty bad.

    Moreover, I’ve been sporadically hanging out in these places on the net for over a decade and you’re like a film I’ve seen a hundred times. A decent-sounding guy who seems well adjusted to the life he has discovers game, notices how awesome it is to have balls and then goes way over the top with it, thinking that merely acting like an ass and constantly calculating like a sociopath makes them alpha. You’re following the script pretty closely – first getting pointlessly abrasive on the net and then ending up proudly talking about how you’re thinking of your RL female friends as bitches. Have you started to think of your RL male friends as “chumps”, “betas” or “AFCs” yet? Are you thinking of how you don’t need such inferior company when you can hang out with women and cool game guys? That’s how it goes.

    LikeLike


  107. on June 7, 2008 at 6:48 am Spike Gomes

    Agnostic:

    Our Finno-Ugric friend is right, man. What you’re doing begs the question like a skid row wino begs for spare change.

    Hey, do what you want online, but if you’re serious about the whole convincing others about your analysis and being convinced by others (and I’m assuming that there’s some truth to this, otherwise why have your own blog?), you get more flies with honey than with vinegar. Don’t need factor analysis to know that hoary old chestnut has got truth to it.

    If you’re going for the performance art angle like Roissy here (with props to M. Blowhard), well then you got to be original and entertaining. I don’t think agent provacateur is your strong suit, though. Hell, I couldn’t be Roissy, nor could I be your number-crunching PYT-chasing soul. I don’t wanna be either. I take from guys like Roissy, Roosh and even yourself what works for me and ditch the rest.

    Take that analysis or leave it. As for myself, I got an embittered girl with a pageboy cut and a mean lick on the bass to see tonight. The dew is slightly off her lily, and we’re going to trade insults over drinks and a hookah. You’d hate her, but I’m gonna have a freaking grand time.

    Have fun with your undergrads, and I mean that sincerely (Really, I do. Not begging the question here.)

    LikeLike


  108. on June 7, 2008 at 4:45 pm anonymous

    Stupid misogynistic rant.

    LikeLike


  109. on June 7, 2008 at 6:19 pm Anonymous

    Chic Nor,
    Don’t worry about it when you look at black woman actually from africa they are quite attractive. DA check out the African Africans it would be an experience.

    LikeLike


  110. on June 7, 2008 at 7:48 pm dizzy

    “There are women who would take their chances with a sociopathic death row inmate over law-abiding nonmurderous free men they know.”

    So, of course, all women should be treated like shit.

    There are men who will don Renaissance clothing and play sword games all weekend while speaking only in Elvish. Does that mean all men should be punished for the deviant few?

    LikeLike


  111. on June 7, 2008 at 8:12 pm Poseur

    “There are men who will don Renaissance clothing and play sword games all weekend while speaking only in Elvish. Does that mean all men should be punished for the deviant few?”

    Since, when is playing an innocent game a form of deviance.

    LikeLike


  112. on June 7, 2008 at 8:39 pm John David Galt

    As I see it, there are two major errors in the way most discussions in western countries treat the sexes.

    1) They continue to assume that reproducing is, or should be, the main motivation of all sex- and relationship-related behavior. That’s just plain obsolete thinking.

    Most sex is and should be for pleasure. Religions will adjust to that fact or go under. And sex is a commodity, which needs to be available to all (and Adam Smith’s invisible hand guarantees that it will, whether governments approve or not).

    2) Notwithstanding point one, they try to change our evolved behavior, but in unbalanced and unsustainable ways.

    The lady who said

    If the playing field is changing we must acknowledge that and not stick to the same ideas that have held by default in the past.

    has a good point, but it’s not the one she tries to make.

    For most of our evolutionary past, traditional marriage involved heavy work, sacrifice, and even risk-taking by both partners to make the family work. But between technological change and today’s feminist laws, marriage is now a totally one-sided deal. Technology has eliminated not only most of the work of household chores but also most of the risks of childbirth. Therefore it is the height of arrogance for women to expect that they’ll continue to be rewarded as if they were still equal partners.

    It’s time society stopped assuming that men should have to subsidize the expensive hobby of producing children just to get a comfortable supply of sex.

    It’s time to fully legalize the sex industry.

    LikeLike


  113. on June 7, 2008 at 11:11 pm anonymous

    99 dizzy,

    Roissy devours your and everyone’s criticisms against him like a ravenous parasite. You’re only making the problem worse, though your intentions are good. It’s obvious he hates women and he thinks that makes him unique somehow. Men since time immemorial have been afraid of women; hence the hate. It’s nothing new or even interesting. Just something to avoid.

    LikeLike


  114. on June 7, 2008 at 11:47 pm Comment_On_Fear

    ***
    Men since time immemorial have been afraid of women; hence the hate.
    ***
    I feel the need to dismantle this retarded argument.

    Men “hate” and “fear” those things that can inflict harm against them and against which they have little protection.

    “Men since time immemorial have been afraid of thieves; hence the hate”
    “Men since time immemorial have been afraid of murders; hence the hate”
    “Men since time immemorial have been afraid of poisonious snakes; hence the hate”

    TODAY:
    Women who are out-of-control are a menace. Given “divorce” laws and “child-support-even-if-its not your baby”
    laws. Thus men “hate” and “fear” that which may inflict harm on them, and against which they have little protection.
    If wifey goes crazy, oops, your whole life is gone. I understand that anonymous may have trouble seeing why a man would be upset by the destruction of his life, when he should be on his knees begging forgiveness that his ex-wife has winded herself climbing the courthouse steps. Men are funny creatures.

    LikeLike


  115. on June 8, 2008 at 5:28 am Anonymous

    jaakkeli just owned agnostic.

    LikeLike


  116. on June 8, 2008 at 3:27 pm anonymous

    114 Comment

    “Men “hate” and “fear” those things that can inflict harm against them and against which they have little protection.”

    Do you think women feel protected from men? There is no “protection”! The very idea puts you at risk. The very idea of this continual threat is the problem. The fear is the problem. Do you think laws are going to protect you from anything? There are laws against thievery and murder, but people still get robbed and murdered. Why some and not others? These are deeper questions that 99% of people don’t even address. You think everything that happens is mindless and random.

    But you’re so hung up on your idea that because of the potentially aberrant, destructive, hysterical, and insane ‘nature’ of women and the laws that your fear is justified; so guess what? It’s all yours and until you get over the fear, you’re best to avoid women as much as possible. That’s probably why roissy and this blog exists. So you can “get in” and “get out” as quickly as possible without any damage to your delicate natures.

    You could take some time to establish trust with a woman before you bang her and possibly get her pregnant. Did that ever occur to you? Better it occurs to her, but that is her problem I suppose. Oh wait, there is no repercussion for her if things so wrong is there? None whatever!

    LikeLike


  117. on June 10, 2008 at 12:05 am Chic Noir

    One of my first posts on this blog was my trying to explain the above with another poster.

    IIRC, your theory was that social constraints pushed attractive black women away from such roles, while I thought that rap videos provided a more lucrative market for those attractive women. We may both be right in this case and both issues are at play.

    David, I think the answer to his question had two parts. You point about YBW having another avenew open to them was important.

    As a third rate omega male, I could probably date ghetto white girls because it’s easier than meeting quality women.

    No, I doubt you could get a ghetto WW to date you. Most of ghetto WW like thugs. You cannot give her the 50cents experience.

    It’s not my fault that I found more white women attractive than black women.
    I’ve addressed this in earlier comments.

    LikeLike


  118. on June 10, 2008 at 12:09 am Chic Noir

    I won’t comment on Agnostic BUT

    jaakkeli comment 106- I’ve noticed this about a lot of men who discover game. It seems to bring out a lot of hatred of women from some men.

    LikeLike


  119. on June 13, 2008 at 7:15 pm Ryan

    Chic Noir,

    imho, the reason why misandry grows as game does is because we realize just how FUCKED up you women really are. seriously, every one of you is fucked in the head.

    we have to develop game in order to get anywhere with you all. the majority of hot women i have dated are straight up sharks. i started actively developing game simply to keep from getting my shit pushed in by 9’s and 10’s.

    chicen, egg, dick in your fucking ass? i think i know what comes first…

    LikeLike


  120. on June 13, 2008 at 8:29 pm Sara

    119 Ryan

    Where did you crawl out of? LOL

    LikeLike


  121. on September 11, 2008 at 3:40 pm Through The Valley Of The Shadow Of Human Nature « Roissy in DC

    […] is lowballing it. If Scott Peterson receives nearly 40 phone calls from bold women pledging their love for him on the first day of his prison term (when the techie guy who updates the software on my computer […]

    LikeLike


  122. on July 10, 2009 at 6:05 pm Feminism and the Destruction of the West Part II « HBD Books

    […] is lowballing it. If Scott Peterson receives nearly 40 phone calls from bold women pledging their love for him on the first day of his prison term (when the techie guy who updates the software on my computer […]

    LikeLike


  123. on July 19, 2009 at 12:01 am Feminism and the Destruction of the West, Part II | The Occidental Quarterly

    […] is lowballing it. If Scott Peterson receives nearly 40 phone calls from bold women pledging their love for him on the first day of his prison term (when the techie guy who updates the software on my computer […]

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  124. on August 31, 2009 at 1:58 pm Chicks Dig Jerks: A Series « Roissy in DC

    […] Peterson was on death row barely an hour when he received his first marriage proposal from a female fan. Do all women love convicted killers? No, but the sheer volume and intensity of sexual attention […]

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