As I’ve said before, marriage as it is currently constituted is the worst deal imaginable for men: You give up on all other women forevermore only to run a better than 50% risk that the aging pussy you’re stuck with will walk off with half your money and the house on nothing more than her personal whim.
My advice to men has always been simple — don’t get married. The blessing of marriage is no longer needed to score a steady supply of sex and love.
But since I am the very Moloko Plus of human kindness, and understanding that companionate marriage has served the West well, I give some steps society can take to get the institution back on firm footing.
- Abolish no-fault divorce
When the law relieved husbands and wives of the obligation to give a damned good reason to leave their partners, it was a race to the exits, and beta males took the brunt of it under the new polygynous rules. Yes, some individual divorce parties will suffer without the easy out of no-fault. But the suffering of the few is to be weighed against the betterment of the whole.
- Stop browbeating women to go on to higher education (especially law school)
Only a person — like, oh, myself — with an excellent grasp of human nature could say this. Economically empowered (which is basically the same as educationally empowered) women face a smaller pool of dateable men. This is because it is in the very core of a woman’s nature to date and marry up. Women are not happy unless they are surrendering their bodies to higher status men. By pricing themselves out of the sexual market, they have been forced, when they do get married, to marry at their level or below, increasing the likelihood she’ll turn off the pussy spigot and make him go to the bathroom in the woods as her lawyers sharpen their carving knives. This trend will get worse as the ratio of women to men in higher education grows more skewed. Only the beautiful women have the luxury of marrying up to their hearts’ content.
Now of course, many women will bitch and moan, somewhat justifiably under the current cultural regime, that they need the education and better paying jobs to survive because they can’t rely on men to support them adequately. But here’s what they’re missing: Weaker women *inspire* men to protect and provide for them. In a social climate where women aren’t doing as well occupationally you will see men MORE motivated to improve their own job outlooks because they are fired up to provide for, instead of compete with, the women around them.
Women would be better served concentrating on improving their looks through whatever means necessary. Only ugly women should seriously consider grad school.
- Wives of alphas should learn to ignore their husbands’ affairs and mistresses
Alpha husbands who can get their rocks off with younger pretty mistresses won’t be as liable to walk away from their marriages because their sexual satiation, coupled with the wives’ loyal acquiescence, would discourage them from seeking divorce to clear the way to hot sex. Double plus societal bonus: More alphas tied up in marriage means more women available to marry betas.
The reverse scenario does not apply because a cheating wife is much more dangerous to the stability of the marriage than a cheating husband. Double standard? Of course! Deal. Human nature cares not for your equalist shibboleths.
- Reinvigorate the manufacturing sector of the US economy
This is related to point #2 above. It’s no coincidence that the slide in manufacturing in the past 40 years has tracked the rise in divorce. Without a solid manufacturing base to shore up the pride in self and incomes of left-side-of-the-bell curve men the cruel and merciless shark infested waters of the modern cognitive economy have chewed them up, leaving them utterly defenseless against the onslaught of fickle masculinized women armed with the imprimatur of no fault divorce and burgeoning incomes.
I haven’t seen this written about anywhere else. I believe the loss of manufacturing in America has contributed a lot more to divorce than people think. Manufacturing jobs gave men ill-equipped or ill-tempered for the academic life a shot at decent money and respectable standing in society, without leaving them castrated as office drones or service workers. And manufacturing, appealing so directly to men’s interests, ran no risk of being overrun by a workforce of women eager to operate heavy machinery. In a word, globalization has been bad for the American institution of marriage.
Libertarians may shudder at this suggestion, but then libertarians have never had a firm grasp of male-female natures.
Egalitarian liberals will shudder at all my suggestions, but then egalitarian liberals are discredited.
- Fire all the divorce lawyers
You’ve gotta clean house of the parasites before any of these ideas can be put into action.
- Fathers of daughters have to take a stronger role in punishing and publicly humiliating male interlopers and their slutty daughters
This goes against the trend of feminized doofus befuddled fathers acting like their presence is superfluous, but the return of the powerful patriarchal father would go a long way to curbing the excesses of both the interloper cads and the slutty daughters. Personally, I love sluts, and this suggestion would make my life harder, but what’s good for me is not necessarily, or even very often, good for society.
- Reform the ass-ramming that is child support and divorce laws
In the event of divorce, what beta ex-husband wants to pay a hefty sum to an ex-wife who has his kids 90% of the time and spends it on lingerie and beer for her bad boy lover? A lot of provider betas imagine this scenario and decide that learning game is a better option than walking down the aisle. I don’t blame them.
- Think carefully about gay marriage
Besides the slippery slope argument (which I believe is a legitimate one in this case, opening the door to polygamous arrangements), gay marriage undermines the procreative justification for marriage. Western companionate marriage is as much about kids as it is about love. Scrap the one reason and it’s harder to justify getting married for the other reason. (After all, it’s easy to leave a spouse you no longer love if there are no kids involved, and it’s easy to stay childless and love a partner without the codification of marriage.)
Undermining the procreative reason for marriage with legally sanctioned innately nonprocreative pairings undermines the whole. (Spare me the counterargument that infertile hetero couples can get married. The important concept lies in the potential of the couple in a natural unadulterated state to procreate, not the actual capability.)
Now personally I couldn’t care less if gays get married; it doesn’t affect my life one way or the other, so I will never agitate for or against it. What I’ve written in this post is a primer for society, not for my own hedonistic pursuit. The thing to remember is that INCENTIVES MATTER in human affairs, and right now there is a huge structural disincentive for men to marry and a structural incentive for women to initiate divorce.
Actually, I hope none of these changes happen. It would really cramp my style.
Postscript: Another option is to get the state completely out of the business of marriage. They’ve gone ahead and fucked it up pretty well, so why not try the alternative?
Fathers of daughters have to take a stronger role in punishing and publicly humiliating male interlopers and their slutty daughters
Correction:
Fathers AND MOTHERS of daughters have to take a stronger role in punishing and publicly humiliating male interlopers and their slutty daughters
Their is no point in having a stern father around if the mother, in her attempt at being her daughter’s bff, sides with and tells her to just “live her life”.
Like you said, guys LOVE sluts. Girls hate them. Both women and man need to act like adults.
Stop browbeating women to go on to higher education (especially law school)
However, feel free to browbeat everybody to learn and acquire marketable skills. This includes things like cooking (that means Pot Roast, not Ceviche of Langoustines with an Onion Confit), knitting, sewing and nursing. And for the men, feel free to stick to the old standards: math, (hard) science, engineering, plumbing, carpentry, etc. The girls can take these up as well, but something tells me that they won’t want to.
Also, if a girl does learn a marketable skill and decides to not marry, or survive a broken marriage, she will have, well, a marketable skill. Something to survive on. Instead of taking 4 years of Psychology and working in the leasing department of some apartment complex.
Wives of alphas should learn to ignore their husbands’ affairs and mistresses
If your husband cheats on you, feel free to cut his balls off. This is marriage, not college-days hanky-panky. Men tend to only learn the hard way. Men, if you don’t like this, and you want to keep your options open, DON’T GET MARRIED.
Think carefully about gay marriage
Think carefully about having the government involved in your marriage. We did not have the government involved in our marriages throughout the 1700s and most of the 1800s in America. Yet, somehow, someway, society advanced. If some Unitarian church wants Mike and Harry to get married, who cares. And if the Catholic church won’t let them get married in their churches, again, who cares.
But, AFAIK, marriage has never existed outside of some “shared set of strongly held beliefs” framework. That is, when culture or religion was not involved, people did not get married. This is no coincidence. And marriage will not last too long amongst the “Will & Grace, we believe in nothing” crowd. They are the elite, and their cities (LA, NYC, Miami Beach, London, Paris, etc) are falling.
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“Half a million lonely elderly men are paying the price of the divorce boom”
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1025312/How-half-million-lonely-old-men-paying-price-divorce-boom.html
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woops
“… in her attempt at being her daughter’s bff, sides with and tells her to just “live her life”.”
Should be:
… in her attempt at being her daughter’s bff, sides with her and tells her to just “live her life”.
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I don’t know, man – I think you’re out of your element on the macro issues here.
Why humiliate cads and sluts? Wouldn’t that just discourage people from indulging their natural instincts? It seems to me that marriage as an institution would be best-served if it evolves to be more compatible with those instincts. Systematic oppression of those instincts is a band-aid that never works.
Given that divorce law will never change, lawyers are a man’s best protection in divorce court. A pre-nup is essential.
Wives of alphas shouldn’t ignore affairs – they should embrace and encourage them, and participate when appropriate. I would never marry somebody who doesn’t appreciate my hobbies.
The “manufacturing sector” stuff is total nonsense, and I will never understand the gay marriage argument.
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Abolish no-fault divorce
The problem with abolishing no-fault divorce is that you end up with people creating all sorts of absurd situations designed to flee the marriage, or people perjuring themselves in the courts. In other words, if marriage isn’t easy to flee, it simply creates an incentive to not get married in the first place.
Weaker women *inspire* men to protect and provide for them.
Poor black women have certainly not inspired their poor black men to improve their situations. Besides, a generation of women have learned that independence has given them the lifestyle that living off a male certainly doesn’t provide.
Besides, you would bitch about having to pay for your wife’s spending habits. Stuff certainly isn’t free…
Women would be better served concentrating on improving their looks through whatever means necessary.
I would suspect that improving looks and high educational attainment would have a great payoff. Beautiful people tend to have more luck in networking, especially if they can back it up credentials.
BTW, are there any statistics showing the breakdown of masters degrees for males and females? I suspect that masters degrees in education are inflating those counts.
would discourage them from walking away from their marriages in order to get hot sex
Or, alphas can become smart and not get married in the first place? If marriage is so important, one of its most important rules needs to be respected, and both partners shouldn’t cheat. As long as you advocate for men to cheat on their wives, and for the women to accept it, it shows that your concern isn’t for strong marriages.
Reinvigorate the manufacturing sector of the US economy
Except the problem is that a significant part of the so-called low IQ pool has been written off as unemployable due to poor work habits and low educational attainment in general. I suspect that even if manufacturing stayed in the US, it would have been heavily mechanized with some skilled labourers (with trade school) or outsourced to our favourite friends, illegal immigrants.
The only place that has even remotely discussed the role of the decline of manufacturing on communities has been the work of some urban sociologists as an attempt to explain the collapse of the urban black community.
Fathers of daughters have to take a stronger role in punishing and publicly humiliating male interlopers and their slutty daughters
Slutty daughters provide better sex than their non-slutty counterparts. It’s obvious that they enjoy sex since they go out and seek it. In contrast, non-slutty women obviously hate sex. Removing our ability to discern between slutty and non-slutty women can lead to men spending years wasting their time on sex-less partners in marriage.
Reform the ass-ramming that is child support and divorce laws
You could always create child support cards like the current food stamps program uses, and have periodic audits of purchases to itemize spending.
A lot of provider betas imagine this scenario and decide that learning game is a better option than walking down the aisle
No, they’ve simply wised up and learned that have sex with the same woman for the next 50 years is simply a dead end even with all the reforms you’re promoting.
Western companionate marriage is as much about kids as it is about love.
So gay people can adopt the kids that nobody wants…
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Wouldn’t that just discourage people from indulging their natural instincts?
A large minority of men feel the instinct to be violent, but we sure as hell discourage that. Taking a shit is natural. That doesn’t mean we encourage people to do it in public.
Just because something is natural, doesn’t mean that we always want it present.
Systematic oppression of those instincts is a band-aid that never works.
The grand majority of Western History revolved around the idea of suppressing sex outside of marriage. And the West did amazingly well.
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In contrast, non-slutty women obviously hate sex.
Where the fuck do you get that from?
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And marriage will not last too long amongst the “Will & Grace, we believe in nothing” crowd. They are the elite
Who will inherit their vast sums of money and power? I don’t think the elite will easily give up their power. They certainly have enough money to ensure that the lower classes don’t become a problem to them. If a small elite can maintain power in places like Mexico or Brazil, it can certainly do so here in the US.
Instead of taking 4 years of Psychology and working in the leasing department of some apartment complex.
Knitting & sewing aren’t marketable skills in a country where the lowest rung perform that work for $2/hr in some cases. Working in a boring office is probably the best way out of working in some dreary industrial complex or marrying David Alexander. College isn’t to impart magical knowledge in most cases, but simply a means of weeding out unwanted job applicants and employees.
that means Pot Roast, not Ceviche of Langoustines with an Onion Confit
It’s highly likely that the restaurant was doing a better job of that.
BTW, for some odd reason, nearly all of my feminist friends knew how to bake or cook and were always willing to feed me…
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The comments score so far:
Usually Lurking: a good counterpoints to Roissy’s outstanding post
Grady: Nonsense
David Alexander: True to himself. 1/10th insight, 9/10ths stand up comedy.
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“Only ugly women should seriously consider grad school.”
Hilarious, laughed out loud at that one, ha ha!! Thanks for the chuckle.
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They certainly have enough money to ensure that the lower classes don’t become a problem to them.
Yes, Los Angeles must not exist in the real world. Nor Detroit. Nor Baltimore.
It has already happened in many places.
Knitting & sewing aren’t marketable skills in a country where the lowest rung perform that work for $2/hr in some cases.
These are perfectly good skills for a housewife. She doesn’t need to contribute a ton to the homes income, but these are things that she can do while tending to the family. And, even if she only does those things for domestic purposes, well, a penny saved is a penny earned.
It’s highly likely that the restaurant was doing a better job of that.
Yes, most families dine at Le Bernadin most nights, but I am trying to think of those few that don’t.
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Your remark on the decline of the manufacturing sector and its general effect on certain American males is, I think, pretty astute. But what’s not obvious to me is how this would affect the divorce rates of these men. I could see it just as likely going the other way — emasculated, depressed men might be more likely to stay in loveless marriages for lack of better options and the self-respect needed to seek out something better.
As for your whether ignoring a husband’s infidelities would decrease the divorce rate — well, yes, obviously. But so would not filing for divorce in the first place. Neither one is a very satisfying solution, in that they don’t lead to happier marriages for both parties. Rather than ignoring their husbands’ infidelities, women should be focused on eliminating the causes behind his straying. Arguably impossible for some men who will stray no matter what, but women could certainly reduce the likelihood on average by taking certain fairly obvious steps.
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“I haven’t seen this written about anywhere else. I believe the loss of manufacturing in America has contributed a lot more to divorce than people think.”
I’m offended!
“Solution No. 3: Stop destroying the middle class. The government’s complicit destruction of America’s manufacturing sector and drive towards globalization (i.e. imperial profit) has made it impossible for a man to raise a family on one income—to take on a role that creates stable households and balanced women who do not starve for attention and validation.”
http://www.rooshv.com/2007/solutions
haha
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I think you make good points. Marriage needs to be repaired in this country but ultimately for a stable healthy society and you have to make it amenable to heterosexuals before dolling out rights to homosexuals. As I usually say, “don’t add a mod to an already busted engine.”
I’m not particularly optimistic about where this country is headed anyway so I’m not holding my breath. However, you’re pointing out spurious correlation between divorce and the move from a manufacturing to a service economy. It would be impossible to prove that the transition spurred divorce given so many other cultural factors have been at work in the last 40 years. A return to manufacturing won’t help.
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DA: BTW, for some odd reason, nearly all of my feminist friends knew how to bake or cook and were always willing to feed me…
Why is this odd? Sometimes feminists take time off from throwing their used tampons at men to do things like…eat. Sometimes, friends are involved and sharing happens.
I get the “us” v “them” thing, but a bit of a stretch, eh?
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You forgot a few:
1) Recriminalizing adultery. Society should send the message that it takes marriage vows seriously. (Alphas will do what Alphas do, but they will just have to take their chances with the law.)
2) Making marriage the sole broker between men and their children. Women who have children out of wedlock should not be able to claim any support from men, and men who father children out of wedlock should have no access to their children. (Hat tip: Murray and Herrnstein, The Bell Curve)
3) Abolishing any legal status and outlawing any benefits for co-habiting couples.
BTW I think you’d enjoy the essays of F. Roger Devlin. Mensarefugee has put them online here:
http://public.box.net/mensarefugee26388
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Sociologists have been writing about the possible relationship between the decline in manufacturing jobs and divorce for decades. Most notably, starting in the 1980s William Julius Wilson pushed this hard as an explanation for the collapse in black marriage rates from the late 60s onward.
However, researchers have not been able to prove any real connection — increases in divorce rates seemed to be unrelated to how many jobs a demographic group lost in manufacturing.
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roosh: noted!
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As I usually say, “don’t add a mod to an already busted engine.”
Please tell that to the kids adding an intake to a rusted out ’89 Civic…
Why is this odd?
I was shocked that they spent their time cooking food for me and not for their boyfriends, and they never expected me to reciprocate.
Yes, Los Angeles must not exist in the real world. Nor Detroit. Nor Baltimore.
White flight has been the cool thing to do since the 1920s. Pesky non-whites move in somewhere and the whites end up moving somewhere else. Ooops.
These are perfectly good skills for a housewife.
Shudder, non-fashionable clothes. How white trash/poor/third world must we become to cater to your desires?
Yes, most families dine at Le Bernadin most nights, but I am trying to think of those few that don’t.
Yeah, but eating out generally tastes better. From the wide sampling of food cooked by various people that I know, no amount of seasoning can compete with America’s vast food-industrial complex…
David Alexander: True to himself. 1/10th insight, 9/10ths stand up comedy.
A compliment or an insult? I’ll let my mood decide.
I’m offended!
Roosh – pseudo intellectual underpinnings + radio show humour = Roissy
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If you wanted to get really radical on the economic policy end of things, you could try to revive the family wage. In the 1890-1950 period, unions and employers pushed for a wage that would allow a man to support a family. To fund this family wage, married women were paid less or not hired at all. Such discrimination was legal then.
Some employers did give working single mothers access to the family wage.
I don’t see this getting a lot of support today, it would of course be illegal under current law.
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Oh, forgot to say, single men were also sometimes subject to wage discrimination in favor of married guys supporting a family.
That’s a society serious about patriarchal marriage.
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Smartest thing DA has ever said.
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DA: I was shocked that they spent their time cooking food for me and not for their boyfriends, and they never expected me to reciprocate.
One would think that maybe? Hopefully? You offered them something else in your friendship. Why is it only feminists that would expect reciprocation?
Stop saying shit just to say shit.
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White flight has been the cool thing to do since the 1920s. Pesky non-whites move in somewhere and the whites end up moving somewhere else. Ooops.
Detroit was an absolutely booming town in the 1920’s. And continued to grow and remain stable until the early 60’s.
You would not believe how many books and movies have been made that either reminisce or mythologize Baltimore in the 1950’s. People had cars in these places (definitely, Detroit) yet, they were great places to live.
And, of course, LA was the city of the future throughout the 40’s, 50’s and most of the 60’s.
Cars and mobility had nothing to do with it.
Yeah, but eating out generally tastes better. From the wide sampling of food cooked by various people that I know
Yes, restaurants often serve up tasty food. WHAT THE FUCK DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING?!?!
We are talking about average families trying live better lives.
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Thursday said:
“2) Making marriage the sole broker between men and their children. Women who have children out of wedlock should not be able to claim any support from men, and men who father children out of wedlock should have no access to their children. (Hat tip: Murray and Herrnstein, The Bell Curve)”
Finally, I agree with Thursday about something! This makes more sense both legally and socially.
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“2) Making marriage the sole broker between men and their children. Women who have children out of wedlock should not be able to claim any support from men, and men who father children out of wedlock should have no access to their children. (Hat tip: Murray and Herrnstein, The Bell Curve)”
I see how you can easily do the first part but the second seems quite difficult. If the mother of the children wants the father around and the father wants to spend time with them, how is it possible to stop them from spending time together? I am missing something here?
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the second seems quite difficult
Clarification: these men should have no legal right to access their children.
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Reinvigorate the manufacturing sector of the US economy… In a word, globalization has been bad for the American institution of marriage… It’s no coincidence that the slide in manufacturing in the past 40 years has tracked the rise in divorce.
Not only has globalization been manifestly economically good for the poor, your assertion about the “rise in divorce” over the last 40 years is false. There has been no rise in divorce over the last 30 years! Economists Wolfers and Stevenson have already shown a more compelling explanation for the rise in divorce during the 1970s was the technological and economic switch from a specialization function of marriage to a campanionate function.
Any political promises to “bring back manufacturing” are luddite nonsense. There are certainly lots of untapped vocations for the left half of the bell curve that can be nurtured, such as skilled manual trades.
The paleo-conservative (roissy)/lefty (roosh) understanding of economics is atrocious, and sadly, extremely politically correct!; remember all the presidential candidates making the same stupid promises in Michigan?
Tyler Cowen may be at a loss for criticizing game, but he could certainly school the players on econ.
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Rain And,
Please explain the difference between manufacturing and skilled manual trades.
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yeah, so, a couple of things
some astute observations here concerning the demand side, but you’re neglecting the supply-side issues as well: the institutions of higher ed need to stop granting preference to women in admissions.
a large part of the problem lies in the fact that, for females (and minorities of all stripes**) with any brains to speak of, the path through higher ed is a well-greased waterslide powered by firehoses.
i agree with you completely.
HOWEVER,
with the current state of affairs, this would exacerbate, rather than ameliorate, the problem faced by men.
to wit, current domestic violence laws in most states allow women to kick their husbands out of their houses because of nothing more than an amorphous sense of “fear”, and the kangaroo courts that try DV cases will always convict.
what you’re missing, roissy, is that the same dirty fake-DV tactics currently used to stack the deck in child-support and alimony negotiations would immediately be turned into howitzers, dropping “fault” indiscriminately upon the heads of unsuspecting men. and then,
dim, through the misty panes and thick green light /
as under a green sea, [we’d see them] drowning.
this would make an excellent substitute for the pledge of allegiance at the beginning of the school day.
note the interesting parallels between PUA culture and feminism:
1) both were founded and promulgated by the marginalized (feminism by ugly women, PUA culture by beta males who weren’t at all naturals)
2) both have spread far beyond the orbit of those original, marginalized subgroups
3) the practitioners of both have become extremely, and understandably, reluctant to relinquish any of their newfound power
roissy, just how alpha are you talking here?
if you’re using your usual definition of ‘alpha’, encompassing a significant (and ever-growing, due to the PUA community) fraction of the population, then you’re effectively endorsing the same polygamy that you vitiate elsewhere in this post. pick a side and stay on it, dude.
if you’re suddenly equivocating and using ‘alpha’ to refer to an extremely select cadre of males, then fine, but you should say so.
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DA: ok buddy, i’ve got good news and bad news for you.
good news:
You could always create child support cards like the current food stamps program uses, and have periodic audits of purchases to itemize spending.
i’m impressed by this idea.
it should of course go further; the “periodic audits” would be too, well, periodic, and would easily be circumvented by feminist auditors. instead, the cards would involve automatically itemized purchases (not unlike WIC vouchers), which would be restricted to essentials such as groceries, non-luxury clothing, activity fees, and the like.
the bad news:
dude, i’m sick of your personal victimology.
number one, you’re a black man, and number two, as evidenced by your writing style, you’re obviously above average in intelligence (although maybe not in common sense).
if you really are a degree-less call center worker as you say you are, that’s entirely your fault. i think i can safely say that all of us here at roissy in dc are exasperated at your complaints about dead-end jobs and potential racial discrimination.
if you aren’t a complete fraud, then a few years of decently hard work, combined with your intelligence and complexion, will get you everywhere you want to go, and perhaps even further.
sack up or shut up.
thank you.
—
UL:
i’m not so sure that sewing and knitting are valuable skills anymore, unless you’re talking about this sort of thing, which would then obviate your points about their household economic importance.
i think you’re underestimating the cost (or, more appropriately, lack thereof) of mere replacement. don’t get me wrong – i actually know how to work a sewing machine, and i’ve repaired some of my favorite old clothes, but i don’t labor at all under the delusion that doing so is at all economically efficient, especially considering the opportunity cost of the time.
by the way, ul, thanks for the props re: writing style. chic noir, if you’re here, thank you as well. lots of hearts and flowers here for an evil blog, eh?
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mq
“If you wanted to get really radical on the economic policy end of things, you could try to revive the family wage. In the 1890-1950 period, unions and employers pushed for a wage that would allow a man to support a family. To fund this family wage, married women were paid less or not hired at all. Such discrimination was legal then.
Some employers did give working single mothers access to the family wage.
I don’t see this getting a lot of support today, it would of course be illegal under current law.”
Actually this does happen today in the Army. When you get married your benifits go way up. Your cash goes up about 70 percent vs single. You get money for your own house money for food etc. Downside you can’t eat in chow hall. Otherwise as single you get a roommate not of your choice and of the same sex. Which makes it nice for non hetro.
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When I was in AIT triaining they had to put out that if they caught any more females in each others beds that the “I was scared”, excuse will no longer work. There would be repurcussions.
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Please explain the difference between manufacturing and skilled manual trades.
You can’t outsource your plumber, mechanic, landscaper, or carpenter to Asia, like you can a factory worker.
” … economists say the change in manufacturing, albeit painful, is healthy for the sector and for the overall economy in the long run”.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/2002-12-12-manufacture_x.htm
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The problem for the left half of the bell curve is the decline of manufacturing, as Roissy says. Traditional line manufacturing that is. Plumbing, being a mechanic, and other ‘trades’ professions are surprisingly g-loaded occupations. Most of the left half, for example, would not be intelligent enough to be a decent, self-sufficient plumber.
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i’m not so sure that sewing and knitting are valuable skills anymore, unless you’re talking about this sort of thing, which would then obviate your points about their household economic importance.
Fair enough. I was simply trying to make a point about how much time is spent acquiring non-skill knowledge. And I was trying ot think of non-masculine skills. Personally, I think that the greatest housewives would become proficient in plumbing, but I doubt it.
——————
re:writing style – your welcome. Hug and Kisses to all the evil players.
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One would think that maybe? Hopefully? You offered them something else in your friendship. Why is it only feminists that would expect reciprocation?
The earlier comment was to dispell the belief that feminist women can’t cook. Hell, these are the same women who have argued with me over their choices to date significantly older men or stay at home with their potential children. The latter comment had nothing to do with feminism, and was probably a stupid rant that shouldn’t have been included.
For the purposes of brevity, I’ll refrain from answer the question of what I offered these women as friends.
instead, the cards would involve automatically itemized purchases (not unlike WIC vouchers),
The problem with that solution is that you’ll end up with some degree of fraud where the women may trade cash for the money on the cards. Of course, implementing a signature based system may work, but that presumes no forgery on the part of the recipients. I prefered the audits because it allowed for periodic luxury purchases for the kids, while allowing for screening of all costs to ensure that the money isn’t being wasted on unneccessary items. Mind you, any system is probably better than the current system where there are no audits at all. Of course, for all intents and purposes, one will require a wholesale reform of the divorce process in this country. To a certain degree, it’s going to require people to stop thinking of fathers as simple revenue sources, but as actively involved men who actually care deeply about their kids.
you’re obviously above average in intelligence
That’s just spell-check and basic grammar at work. It is certainly no indication of above average intelligence. If I was above intelligence, I probably would have been able to do the work in my engineering and comp sci courses without much effort…
if you really are a degree-less call center worker as you say you are, that’s entirely your fault
As I’ve stated before on other blogs including my own, the only person to blame for my failings is myself and nobody else. It wasn’t racists that lead me to skip class or not do my assignments, it was simply a decision by myself to do so. Instead, I spent a good chunk of that time sitting in my car sleeping or listening to NPR, roadgeeking, riding trains, or taking photos.
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Rain And,
What if 100 of your mechanics get together under one roof to build –manufacture– something? Nurture that too?
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Sebastian,
Look in the back. You are wrong, people with below average IQs can perform in those jobs.
http://www.ssc.wisc.edu/cde/cdewp/98-07.pdf
I don’t disagree that manufacturing jobs provided a place for the very low IQ, as did agricultural jobs before that. That doesn’t mean we can or should try to rewind our economy back to a time when most people lived on a farm.
Importantly, the modern economy serves the poor in other ways, by boosting overall living conditions and keeping prices low; compare the poorest people in America, to say, average people in Africa and Asia. African-Americans (IQ 85) are the 8th richest nation in the world (!) because they live in a modern developed capitalist country. Globalization has been and will be good to the poor both nationally and internationally.
Anyway, there is no currently feasible magic bullet solution for people with very low IQs. They will always lag people with above average IQs in important ways.
The only solution is eugenic, and society will slowly wise up to the fact as the technology to improve our offspring improves.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prenuptial_agreement
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Actually, I hope none of these changes happen. It would really cramp my style
I wouldn’t sorry too much about any of these changes happening, at least not in your lifetime(and probably at least a few after that). Liberal, globalist, queer-marriage advocating, women-can-do whatever-men-can believing leftists and feminists are in control. They don’t particularly care about anyone’s happiness either or what holds society together. Remember, they are trying to deconstruct everything and doing a pretty good job with it. However, they should be careful what they wish for.
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Stupid guys are usually alphas anyway. They are too stupid to let anything like shame or integrity get in the way of their game.
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Well America has a conversative head of state (currently), Canada has a conversative head of state, more than half of the continental European governments are conservative, conservatives are on the rise in England…
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Stick with roissy’s first piece of advice. If you don’t think marriage is fair, don’t get married. Do EVERYONE a favor. And I apply this advice to both men and women.
But a few corrections. The divorce rate is not now, and never has been 50%. That oft-reported number relies on bad math. The actual rate is was 41% at its peak, and has been falling.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/19/health/19divo.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=divorce%20rate%2050%&st=cse&oref=slogin
Divorce rates are also lower in families with highly educated mothers. (Same source.)
And, while women with MBAs are less likely to marry and more likely to divorce than women with bachelor’s degrees, women lawyers and doctors, also less likely to marry, are less likely to divorce than women with bachelor’s degrees. All three groups of women are more likely to divorce than their male counterparts, though. (And less likely to divorce than women who only have highschool degrees.)
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120701350606879161.html
Not that it matters. People should get married only if they want to and if they have a high degree of compatability. Couples who learn how to fight fair, who agree on values, finances, and how they want to live their lives have a better chance of making things work than those who don’t.
And regardless of what Roissy says, most people marry well within their own age bracket and educational range.
The funny thing about so-called alpha men. How many of you who self-identify as alphas would be just as happy letting the little lady have a bit on the side? If so, why not just marry someone poly or have an open relationship instead of being all angsty.
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Very interesting, insightful, and amusing analysis.
Monogamy is absolutely central to a stable social order. When the economic and social forces that once encouraged it are weakened or eliminated, watch out folks, it’s going to get even uglier than it already is. The future we are creating is not going to be pretty.
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Fathers AND MOTHERS of daughters have to take a stronger role in punishing and publicly humiliating male interlopers and their slutty daughters
Females already do most of the suppression of other females’ sexuality (Baumeister & Twenge 2002, “Cultural suppression of female sexuality,” Rev of Gen Psych). I can’t wait to boss my daughters around, frankly.
We also need to do something about dampening all the female-female competition that goes on now — that’s what the careerist stuff is. It’s horseshit that they require that much education and income to survive: it’s just to prove that they’re better than all those other bitches out there. Obviously has nothing to do with attracting males.
This competitive instinct is strong in females — just rewind to middle and high school for a reminder — but modern society offers them too many ways to get stuck in female-female competition, without ever moving to the attracting a male stage. It’s the chick version of guys who play X-box and football with their frat buddies all their life, without ever doing what it takes to attract a mate.
Maybe it’s easiest just to not let women compete in the labor market anymore — they could still get some education and do meaningful work, like homemaking, writing / singing / drawing / dancing, or doing scientific or mathematical research at home (obviously the kind that doesn’t require an expensive lab). That’s how things worked back when women stood out in the fine arts and sciences.
They would be supported first by their husbands, and if they really needed it, from the state. You couldn’t call it welfare, but “grants” or “patronage” would go over better.
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Well America has a conversative head of state (currently), Canada has a conversative head of state, more than half of the continental European governments are conservative, conservatives are on the rise in England…
These are emasculated right liberals, not real conservatives. The election of “conservative” leaders is pretty much a symbolic protest against a culturally left wing multiculti feminist regime that is firmly in control.
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Is Ben Bernanke secretly a left-wing transvesite feminist financed by the Rothschilds?
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Is Ben Bernanke secretly a left-wing transvesite feminist financed by the Rothschilds?
Right liberals have won, and continue to win, some victories in the economic realm, but in the cultural realm conservatives have had their ass handed to them. The feminization of the West is complete.
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Roissy wrote:
“Besides the slippery slope argument (which I believe is a legitimate one in this case, opening the door to polygamous arrangements)…”
Astute observation.
See, generally: http://www.law.ucla.edu/volokh/slipperyshorter.pdf
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You know, republican patriot, perhaps your party should stop electing divorced people, if you think the family is so valuable. Intersting that one party has more divorces and more sex scandals than the other.
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Increasing levels of education are not contributing to a higher divorce rate. The divorce rate has fallen quite a bit among the college graduate set. (I doubt education per se has anything to do with it, more a matter of intelligence.)
http://www.russellsage.org/publications/workingpapers/divorcedivide/document
DA
“In contrast, non-slutty women obviously hate sex. ”
Ah, evidence of your unfamiliarity with women. Women love sex, but aren’t going to make themselves feel slutty to get it.
“I was shocked that they spent their time cooking food for me and not for their boyfriends, and they never expected me to reciprocate.”
An alpha is comfortable with people waiting on him, because he has a high estimation of himself. You sir, are the opposite.
“If I was above intelligence, I probably would have been able to do the work in my engineering and comp sci courses without much effort…”
I got a perfect score on the math SAT I & II, and over a 1500 on the old scale, and I still couldn’t cut it in physics at my engineering school (switched to econ). average intelligence is still pretty low.
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Rain And… I read about the intelligence required of plumbers somewhere, quite an in depth article, but cannot find it now. it was above average, leaning heavily towards the visuo-spatial component. I’m too depressed to argue further… sigh… back to fishing in Zelda.
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“Liberal, globalist, queer-marriage advocating, women-can-do whatever-men-can believing leftists and feminists are in control.”
Thank god!
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Women love sex, but aren’t going to make themselves feel slutty to get it.
One would suspect that if women enjoyed sex, they would actively go out and seek it from the men that they desire. Instead, they wait and use it as an incentive to sucker men into making long-term commitments. Some will say that women who enjoy sex just simply prefer to do so with the same partner, but IMHO, monogomous sex is simply boring and increases in tediousness with each instance, especially with the attractiveness of the average person.
Hell, if my female friends wanted sex, they certainly did everything in their power to ensure that they weren’t getting it. In contrast, my non-railfan male friends were running around attempting to have sex as much as possible, and they were succeeding at it.
An alpha is comfortable with people waiting on him, because he has a high estimation of himself. You sir, are the opposite.
Omega males generally have nothing to offer while their alpha male counterparts have everything to offer.
I got a perfect score on the math SAT I & II, and over a 1500 on the old scale
I had a 480 on the Math SAT II, 520 on the Writing SAT II, 560 on the Bio SAT II, and 780 on the History SAT II. I cranked out a 1180 on the SAT I, but that was after two other attempts with scores of 1060 and 1080. My scores certainly do not indicate any real above average intelligence.
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http://streetbonersandtvcarnage.com/blog/baby-born-with-extra-manhood/
Uh no Roissy, this is how you save marriage. Even when you are worn out, the wife can still “get hers”
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//streetbonersandtvcarnage./blog/baby-born-with-extra-manhood/
Roissy,^^^^that is how you save marriage. Even when you are worn out, the wife can still “get hers” . I think the doctors should save the larger one but…..
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Anon 50 said-I got a perfect score on the math SAT I & II, and over a 1500 on the old scale, and I still couldn’t cut it in physics at my engineering school (switched to econ). average intelligence is still pretty low .
Maybe you did not find the material interesting. Did you really enjoy your engineering classes or were you in it for the prestige?
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#17, 20, 21 mq
Damn, you beat me to the punch re W.J. Wilson and family wage references.
I agree with roissy on all points except manufacturing jobs. Sorry, roissy, but you are making the same fraudulent case as Pat Buchanan and his minions. The manufacturing jobs you envision are the unionized $75/hour loaded with bennies for semi-literate (white?) auto workers to bolt bumpers to Dodge Neons.
Here’s some news for you: those jobs are gone and they ain’t coming back (ref. B. Springsteen for further info). We can still have manufacturing jobs in America, but the days of the high-wage low-skill job are long gone. If there’s any growth in manufacturing jobs these days, it’s in light assembly paying $8-10/hour.
On the other hand, you are dead right about women in law school and other professions. The intense competition for political and economic power between men and women (with the outcome fixed in the latter’s favor) does not bode well for the future of marriage, and if I may be so bold, sex as well. For all their bullshit about it, liberals have far less sex than conservatives do–and produce far fewer children to boot.
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sestamibi said-
manufacturing jobs you envision are the unionized $75/hour loaded with bennies for semi-literate (white?) auto workers to bolt bumpers to Dodge Neons
Those types of jobs were the kind in which a man could settle down with a wife at 18-21, have two children, and buy a house without going into a huge amount of debt. I think the extended adolescence of many Americans, especially American men, is a result of the loss of these types of jobs
P.S. I am going to rent Fight Club this week.
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liberals have far less sex than conservatives do–and produce far fewer children to boot.”
Conservatives have frea.ky sex more often than liberals do. The trannies, S&M, and other fetish s.ex workers have more business when the conservatives hold their conventions.
Women compete with men in professional schools with men because many of us do not have the brute strength and are discouraged from doing the types of jobs that pay good money but require workers to get dirty or do heavy lifting.
ex. Pluming, auto mechanics, some types of construction(I know).
I bet American women make up a larger percentage of this country’s doctors versus plumbers.
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DA,
“One would suspect that if women enjoyed sex, they would actively go out and seek it from the men that they desire.”
Actively initiating sex with a stranger is deemed the province of sluts.
“Omega males generally have nothing to offer while their alpha male counterparts have everything to offer. ”
His pleasant presence is enough. You throw a party, you know two people equally well, but you clearly would invite one way before the other, and not because he is great at World of Warcraft or has pi memorized to 300 digits. It’s because he’s a fun, chill dude. Dude, check out Sean Stephenson – he’s a wheelchair-bound midget, and he gets mad pussy, or so it seems. Stop expounding the scientific laws behind why you’re such a beta – you said you blame yourself, but here you are citing immutable laws explaining your failure.
Chic Noir
I succeeded in math and science in HS, so engineering seemed like the natural next step. Math in engineering wasn’t too difficult, but the physics seemed overly convoluted (eg, torque – wtf?) and I didn’t seek help. Also didn’t like any of the engineering fields I tried. Poor visuospatial skills didn’t help either (I’m Jewish, we tend to be poor visualizers esp. vs. Asians).
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Stop browbeating women to go on to higher education (especially law school)
In my experience, lawyers make awful lays. With them, your lack of satisfaction in sex is always your fault, not their shitty head-giving skills. To deny this is to strike a hammer blow to their over-wrought, education fueled ego.
So my honest question to the audience (and our magnanimous patron) is: Is it law school that makes them such bad sexual pursuits or are bad sexual pursuits attracted to law school?
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Agree with almost all of it, especially the “punish male interlopers” bit. I personally swore to my sister if she brought a boy home late I would grind his bones to make my bread. Now she only dates sissies. Mission accomplished.
Disagree with the bit about manufacturing, though. Manufacturing, worldwide, is dying. The Chinese do it better than us, my robots do it better than the Chinese, and before you know it we’ll have self-replicating nanoassembly seeds for everything under the sun. Don’t put your money there. Now becoming a technician / programmer for those robots & nanoassemblers, that’s another matter.
Your marriage postscript: ’bout time. Marriage is a function of the church, and separation of church and state should absolutely apply. If a man can find a church that will let him marry another man, an underage girl, a saltwater squid and a Nascar die-cast collectible model car, more power to him. But that doesn’t mean I should surrender unto him any tax loopholes.
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Roosh – pseudo intellectual underpinnings + radio show humour = Roissy
I like Roosh. He doesn’t have the obsessive bile thing going.
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So my honest question to the audience (and our magnanimous patron) is: Is it law school that makes them such bad sexual pursuits or are bad sexual pursuits attracted to law school?
It’s the increased confidence to call you out on your underwhelming skills and not fake orgasms, and generally be less inclined to stroke your ego.
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What I don’t like of conservatives is that they are full of closet homosexuals: liberals like Bill Clinton just love to screw pussy, whereas it’s always Republican politicians who are screwing boys. By the way Jewcano, marriage of underage girls was the standard for almost all of civilization: that’s the reason why men used to ask the father for the hand of his daugher: the father had to literaly authorize the marriage, at least until the woman was around 23 or so.
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I like Roosh too, he has a very nice voice. Every now and then Roosh scares me thought.
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To really save marriage, women should marry young, not later than 25.
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It’s the increased confidence to call you out on your underwhelming skills and not fake orgasms, and generally be less inclined to stroke your ego.
I refuse to have sex with somebody who fakes an orgasm. Either state that you’re not aroused or that I suck and that I’m doing an awful job. Faking it is simply insulting and patronizing and we should shame those who do it.
liberals have far less sex than conservatives do
Yes, but is it enjoyable sex, or is it that boring monogamous sex that we keep talking about?
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Roosh is pretty cool, although a little bit too hippy and alternative for my taste. But he likes to travel: a big plus.
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Gannon
What I don’t like of conservatives is that they are full of closet homosexuals: liberals like Bill Clinton just love to screw pussy, whereas it’s always Republican politicians who are screwing boys
I agree
johnny five said:“by the way, ul, thanks for the props re: writing style. chic noir, if you’re here, thank you as well. lots of hearts and flowers here for an evil blog, eh?”
Your welcome johnny. As a woman you know I am a bit mushy(written with sarcasm).
Dare I say, DA writes very well too.
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60 Chic Noir
Yes indeed. You said what William Julius Wilson did (check out #17 above). Also see Kay Hymowitz’ “Child-Man in the Promised Land” at city-journal.org. She describes the situation correctly, but unfortunately assigns the blame in wrong place.
Hope you like Fight Club and will provide your review in this space.
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Actively initiating sex with a stranger is deemed the province of sluts.
And that’s why sluts are better than normal women.
you said you blame yourself, but here you are citing immutable laws explaining your failure
My personality doesn’t really lend itself to having fun with normal people, so using “teh game” wouldn’t work for me. Any normal beta male can gain enough courage to flirt around and do a decent job of it, but somebody like myself even with when liquored up will fail miserably.
BTW, Sestamibi, I’m amazed you referenced William Julius Wilson since he’s not typically associated with conservative ideological research.
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I come back to find I’ve stumped Rain And with a simple yes or no question?! What gives? Putting 100 mechanics under one roof to make things is like nuclear fusion or something, like entering a fourth dimension of social-political-economic thought? What, it wasn’t covered in your textbook Cliffnotes version of Adam Smith?
To review:
Roissy: “Reinvigorate the manufacturing sector of the US economy.”
Rain And: “Any political promises to “bring back manufacturing” are luddite nonsense. There are certainly lots of untapped vocations for the left half of the bell curve that can be nurtured, such as skilled manual trades.”
Moi: “Please explain the difference between manufacturing and skilled manual trades.”
Rain And Roll: “You can’t outsource your plumber, mechanic, landscaper, or carpenter to Asia, like you can a factory worker.”
Me again: “What if 100 of your mechanics get together under one roof to build –manufacture– something? Nurture that too?”
***crickets***
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Rain And Roll: “You can’t outsource your plumber, mechanic, landscaper, or carpenter to Asia, like you can a factory worker.”
Me again: “What if 100 of your mechanics get together under one roof to build –manufacture– something? Nurture that too?”
***crickets***
People’s bathrooms will flood while all the plumbers are getting together in a factory doing outsourceable shit. Rain And answered your question adequately, cricket.
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“What if 100 of your mechanics get together under one roof to build –manufacture– something?”
When your car breaks down, you can more cheaply get it fixed towing it 5 miles to a local mechanic, than you can “towing” it 10,000 miles to China for a mechanic to fix there, and ship it back to you.
On the other hand if a mechanic or team of mechanics invents a widget that needs to be assembled, they can much more profitably have that assembly done in China, while they use their skills to fix your car at home.
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The manufacturing sector of the American economy is not in that bad of shape. This is one of the left’s huge boogeymen, probably the equivalent of the right’s claim that if we don’t waste billions trying to sort out a giant mess in the Middle East that has been raging for centuries, a truly significant number of Americans will die at the hands of terrorists (terrorist deaths are scary, but take automobile related fatalities which are mangnitudes higher than terrorism and imagine the justified backlash if the government announced they were going to spend $1.2 trillion on safety improvements for roads).
Technological improvements are more responsible than outsourcing. The U.S. steel industry, despite Hillary’s chicken little act during her last ditch effort appear blue collar and nab the democratic nomination, is doing great. Shipments in 2007 were 16% higher than in 1970s. The change is that output per worker is up tenfold. In 1970 it took 12 man-hours to produce a ton of steel and it now takes 1.2.
But if you’ve got beef with this, and purposely want to make things inefficient to create jobs, we might as well jump back to before the bronze age (this way we’d need tons of labor and no one would be unemployed). Heck, this is what the greens want us to do anyway.
Textile production in the Southeast is also doing well and growing jobs at present. Other manufacturing industries are doing poorly here.
There’s a lot going on in America and things aren’t uniform across the country. Tell someone in Dallas or Phoenix that the middle class is shrinking and they’re rightfully think you’re insane. Say the same thing in Seattle and you’d meet with agreement (and both groups here are making the correct observations).
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“On the other hand if a mechanic or team of mechanics invents a widget that needs to be assembled, they can much more profitably have that assembly done in China, while they use their skills to fix your car at home.”
Is that a yes or no regarding nurturing your 100 mechanics under one roof? Cause you proposed nurturing mechanics and other skilled trades. I’m just wondering where the cut-off line is.
BTW, there’s also the line regarding the definition of manufacturing on a micro level. Mechanics, for lack of a better term, invent stuff all the time. There’s a feedback loop there, e.g. shit, maybe if we shave this part off and add crap to that end and wire that around and….. You see? To be forthright, I think you’re trying to have your cake and eat it too with your let’s nurture low-level service workers line of argument. You’re ok with service workers cause installing cable can’t be outsourced, has to be done on-site, and that’s probably great advice on an individual level –in fact, you’re so ok with it you want to “nurture” it. But then when we move up the line, up the scale, or whatever, you can’t answer, or seem to say no. Why? Why have a hollowed-out third-worldish Mexican economy? Oh, right, cause you ran the numbers and it all works out GDP-wise. Really? Try running those numbers a little more; run’em over a couple of generations. Run’em through the question of whether we have been, in our politics, laws, rules, trade agreements, nurturing manufacturing, neutral on manufacturing, or encouraging outsourcing, i.e. fucking our regular guys.
“(The typical comment I get at this point will be from some jackass who pipes up to declare we are exporting obsolete jobs which are the equivalent of making buggy whips. Then it must be asked in return, we are importing trillions of dollars in buggy whips? The stuff we are importing and the jobs making it must not be so obsolete if we are paying billions and trillion [six] of dollars to get our hands on it.” Robert L. Kocher, Economics 543, http://members.mountain.net/theanalyticpapers/ch243.htm. See also, on male-female relations, http://members.mountain.net/theanalyticpapers/.
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That “[six]” should be “[sic]”. Sic.
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A few states have authorized “covenant marriages,” which are a form of marriage not subject to no-fault divorce. Some other states are considering the idea. While specifics vary, as a general rule divorce is allowed only if good cause is shown. This is, in many respects, a return to the way things were several decades ago.
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I got late to the party here, but this is a great post Roissy. Excellent point about the manufacturing, I’m on board with that idea.
You could expand that to say how rising academic standards for quality jobs hurts men because men have lower average IQ’s than women.
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I recommend a book called The Two-Income Trap. It’s a book, written by women ironically enough, that states that before women entered the workforce en masse after feminism, traditional households with a single income earned by the male actually made more in REAL DOLLARS than today’s two-income families where the husband and wife work. The rationale is that the surplus of job-seekers in the job market that arose from the entry of women into the workforce actually drove down wages. One more reason why women getting overeducated and ultrasuccessful en masse is a bad idea.
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DA–
I’ve been partial to urban critics named Wilson (William Julius and James Q.–the latter being white) because they don’t buy into the victim mentality. Why do you think the likes of John McWhorter, Juan Williams, Shelby Steele, and yes, even Bill Cosby are taking such un-PC stands these days?
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You’re ok with service workers cause installing cable can’t be outsourced, has to be done on-site, and that’s probably great advice on an individual level –in fact, you’re so ok with it you want to “nurture” it. But then when we move up the line, up the scale, or whatever, you can’t answer, or seem to say no. Why? Why have a hollowed-out third-worldish Mexican economy?
1) By nuture he probably means subsidise training. People will always need these low-level service workers, and making training easier lowers the cost of entry. Now matter how much you train people to work manufacturing jobs, if it can be done cheaper in China, it will be.
2) Is a hollowed-out economy a third-worldish economy? I didn’t realize there were a lot of third world economies that did design, marketing and sales (high value-added processes) in country while outsourcing manufacturing (low value-added). You’ve mixed two phrases that have nothing in common. It’d be like saying all these wimpy, insecure alpha males. Well by definition a (real) alpha male is someone secure with himself so it’s an oxymoron. Idiot.
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It’s funny how everyone seems to have an opinion on economics without any understanding of the subject. This doesn’t happen in the hard sciences. If I say gravity is the cause of pollution, we should outlaw gravity to help the environment, that’s stupid but I’m not a scientist so no one listens. Yet people who don’t know a single thing about economics spout nonsense, people seem to nod their head in agreement.
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It’s funny how everyone seems to have an opinion on economics without any understanding of the subject.
Most people might not have a MS in Economics but they grasp the fundamentals.
People also opine on the subject because this affects them personally and because a lot of what the experts say on the subject triggers their bullshit detector:
Larry Kudlow lips may say “free trade is wonderful” but what people are hearing is “my stock options are growing, so fuck you and get your 50-year old mortgage-and-three kids-paying Ohio prole ass to a community college.”
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PA
I think they grasp the conventional wisdom which is wrong. Now it might seem comforting to the 50 year old to hear a nice story of why he has problems and tell him the only solution is one out of his grasp.
Here’s another.
Move to Oklahoma or West Texas. We own energy companies out there engaged in oil and gas E&P activity. Entry level positions can command 75k+. People can earn six figures very quickly. More importantly, living costs are substantially lower.
People shouldn’t have to move? Well almost all of my colleagues here moved from another part of the country to get the finance jobs that are concentrated in NYC and Greenwich. If I had gone into the VC industry instead, I wouldn’t have bitched that there weren’t any good VCs near me. I would have moved to the Bay Area. There are plenty of unskilled jobs in this country.
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MK,
1. So taxpayer subsidies to train US citizens for un-outsource-able service jobs, but not a dime for local manufacturing projects?
2. There aren’t. Which is why I added that suffix. Jackass.
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1) Well our country does offer re-training for people who lose their job to offshoring. And yes, I think it probably makes more sense to train people for jobs that exist then to train them for jobs that don’t exist
2) I’m not even sure what that means. A suffix is something you add to the end of a word, like ‘ed’ to make something past tense or ‘s’ to make it plural or ‘ism’. Do you mean ‘ish’? Well a third world economy isn’t a ‘type’ of economy at all. Mexico is primarily a ‘resource economy’ although they’ve taken steps to wean themselves off of their dependency on oil revenue by creating a manufacturing base. Either way, a hollowed-out economy is a post-industrial economy, which is in no way a third world economy or a Mexican economy.
This is what prompted post #86. It’s clear you don’t know what you’re talking about, but that doesn’t stop you from saying it. I don’t know a lot about female nature, so I read Roissy’s blog and stay quiet for the most part and try to learn. It’s not hard to be quiet and listen but the first step is to accept your own ignorance, which I do.
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How about no taxpayer subsidies for anything. EVER.
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Kevo,
But what is and is not a subsidy? Do the courts subsidize buisness by enforcing contracts? Do the police subsidize property ownership and personal safety by stopping theives and attackers? Or what about the fact that semi trucks create grooves in the road by breaking at stoplights. By paying for road repairs, are we subsidizing road-system transit over other methods (rails, air, navigable waters)?
Not that I disagree with your overall point. Not a fan of long-term subsidies.
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Wow.
1) “(The typical comment I get at this point will be from some jackass who pipes up to declare we are exporting obsolete jobs which are the equivalent of making buggy whips. Then it must be asked in return, we are importing trillions of dollars in buggy whips? The stuff we are importing and the jobs making it must not be so obsolete if we are paying billions and trillion [six] of dollars to get our hands on it.” Robert L. Kocher, Economics 543, http://members.mountain.net/theanalyticpapers/ch243.htm.
2) Anyway, yeah, I mean -ish. As in somewhat. As in somewhat, or, like, a third-world economy, plus the part about being hollowed-out, plus the context of our little discussion about manufacturing’s decline in the US and men and women and stuff.
You have a problem with me stringing a few adjectives before the word economy?
“Either way, a hollowed-out economy is a post-industrial economy, which is in no way a third world economy or a Mexican economy.”
Oh, yeah, right. In no way.
Except for the similar lack of a middle class. Just that. Otherwise, no way alike.
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1) I didn’t say the jobs were obsolete, just that they can be done cheaper in other places. And anyway, there are manufacturing jobs in America. Toyota not only manufactures in the US to avoid import taxes but is doing so cheaply enough to begin exporting from America.
2) I have a problem when the adjectives are both inaccurate and contradictory. Anyway, how do you figure we don’t have a middle class? There are plenty of middle class jobs, not the least of which is the skilled manual trades Rain And talked about. My buddy’s Dad is a contracter, with his expertise in carpentry and they live a solid, middle-class lifestyle in one of the highest cost areas of the country. Another family friend is a plumber who makes plenty of money. The vanished middle class is a myth.
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3) Not to mention the energy-related jobs I mentioned earlier to PA.
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But this isn’t an economics or politics blog, so maybe this argument has gone on long enough. No more posts from me.
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1) See how easy that was?
2) Apology accepted. Vanished or vanishing? All that stuff about wage gap and income disparity and real wages and inflation and marginal income tax rate bracket creep is just bullshit, yes/no?
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Despite some economic misconceptions, a very good post.
Economically empowered (which is basically the same as educationally empowered) women face a smaller pool of dateable men. This is because it is in the very core of a woman’s nature to date and marry up. Women are not happy unless they are surrendering their bodies to higher status men. By pricing themselves out of the sexual market, they have been forced, when they do get married, to marry at their level or below…
This is something I have witnessed firsthand. I know a beautiful woman at my school working towards her Ph.D. in an area of molecular biology and her marriage prospects are very bad. Any guy at her level would need an advanced degree from a top 10 school and be attractive enough to get a girl such as she. But most guys at that level are effeminate weak-chinned betas. In her words Most of the guys I’ve dated around here give me the gay vibe.
Women would be better served concentrating on improving their looks through whatever means necessary. Only ugly women should seriously consider grad school.
Probably good advice if you’re trying to strengthen the institution of marriage but not for a smart, attractive woman who will only settle for a high quality husband. I would never marry a woman who wasn’t smart enough to earn a graduate degree. Now, if I knew she was smart enough to get her Ph.D. in physics but she decided she wanted to settle down and start having babies right after high school, I would marry her, but only imaginary gods have perfect information. A degree is a cheap (for me) source of information about a person’s intellect. Furthermore, a woman would be wise to have the means to support herself even if she never plans to leave her husband and knows he will never leave her. Shit happens, and if I die, I need to know that my wife can provide a good life for my kids.
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New York does not have no-fault divorce. You have your case study and it fails.
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Michael Katcher said:
It’s funny how everyone seems to have an opinion on economics without any understanding of the subject. This doesn’t happen in the hard sciences. If I say gravity is the cause of pollution, we should outlaw gravity to help the environment, that’s stupid but I’m not a scientist so no one listens. Yet people who don’t know a single thing about economics spout nonsense, people seem to nod their head in agreement.
With all due respect Micheal, I think we can all agree that it would be diffcult for a man to support a wife, two children with a job that pays $9.00 an hour and no healthcare benefits.
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Furthermore, a woman would be wise to have the means to support herself even if she never plans to leave her husband and knows he will never leave her. Shit happens, and if I die, I need to know that my wife can provide a good life for my kids
An excellent point,and a major reason why some women get “hard” degrees.
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***
Importantly, the modern economy serves the poor in other ways, by boosting overall living conditions and keeping prices low; compare the poorest people in America, to say, average people in Africa and Asia. African-Americans (IQ 85) are the 8th richest nation in the world (!) because they live in a modern developed capitalist country. Globalization has been and will be good to the poor both nationally and internationally.
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Cause nothing says happy like killing yourself because you lost the farm your family had for centuries!
http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/rough/2005/07/seeds_of_suicidlinks.html
Of course the people who did this, and stole their land, had no idea it would happen. No idea at all. The key is to constantly gabber about being a super-smart retard.
Remember Rain, you are both the All Seeing Nice Guy and the Helpless Baby, Innocent and Blind.
Could you please crawl in a hole and die?
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***
Economically empowered (which is basically the same as educationally empowered) women face a smaller pool of dateable men. This is because it is in the very core of a woman’s nature to date and marry up. Women are not happy unless they are surrendering their bodies to higher status men. By pricing themselves out of the sexual market, they have been forced, when they do get married, to marry at their level or below…
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This is something I have witnessed firsthand. I know a beautiful woman at my school working towards her Ph.D. in an area of molecular biology and her marriage prospects are very bad. Any guy at her level would need an advanced degree from a top 10 school and be attractive enough to get a girl such as she. But most guys at that level are effeminate weak-chinned betas.
In her words Most of the guys I’ve dated around here give me the gay vibe.
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But most guys at that level are effeminate weak-chinned betas.
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This should read, correctly:
Most guys at that level WHO ARE NOT ALREADY MARRIED are effeminate weak-chinned betas.
Scientists probably tend to be provider-betas. But add in from Top 10 school and successfull, and they are SUPER provider betas. So they CAN get women, they CAN marry, and then they DO. Unless they have a gay vibe. And, at their level, they are probably marrying someone they WANT to marry, and NOT settling.
She is after the men every other women below her bracket is after as well. However, being a scientists DOES give her an edge, but she is still in fierce competition.
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***
1) I didn’t say the jobs were obsolete, just that they can be done cheaper in other places. And anyway, there are manufacturing jobs in America. Toyota not only manufactures in the US to avoid import taxes but is doing so cheaply enough to begin exporting from America.
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Hey, they can be done cheaper here to. Just bring back slavery. I nominate you for the first Pain Collar. It only hurts when you are bad!
See how not-so-very-funny your little speal is when the person doesn’t wove you wonderfulness?
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It’s the increased confidence to call you out on your underwhelming skills and not fake orgasms, and generally be less inclined to stroke your ego.
Reading comprehension, like LSD, is not what it used to be. I was talking about their ability to satisfy me, not the other way around. I would speculate that you’re being a defensive lawyer, but I think you’d be used to reading the fine print…
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Animus,
If you think those things wouldn’t have influenced how you remember the sexual prowess of lawyers you’ve bedded, you are clueless about psychology, and about yourself. In fact, stroking ego is a large part of sexual performance.
The other way around? You mean those things would affect… your ability to satisfy them? I don’t think you correctly reversed the situation in your head there. Must be the bad LSD.
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Roissy are you implying that only ugly girls go into higher education that is simply not true have you ever seen the people who go to university. Having an excellent education is the next levelof competition between pretty girls hence the facebook group ”I have a law degree bitch’,pretty girls too can be clever and compete with men that only enhances their superiority,they get to make men who are dumber than them feel more inferior (not that they would lol),and the prejudice that exists against pretty girls showing them to be dumb is fast being eradicated, now the pretty woman can choose to be as independent as any other girl
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Afterall being pretty and clever is better than just being pretty or just being clever, you can make the girls who are only pretty or only clever feel inferior ( of course not purposely but only if they are not being nice)
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No matter how good looking you are, take 4 points away if you have a law degree.
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With all due respect Micheal, I think we can all agree that it would be diffcult for a man to support a wife, two children with a job that pays $9.00 an hour and no healthcare benefits.
I agree completely Chic. What I’ve tried to convey is that the story of how all those good jobs for low IQ people are gone is a myth. By way of example I would offer working at a Toyota manufacturing plant in Kentucky, working for an oil and gas E&P company as a driller or rig hand, or (for those young enough to learn a new skill) going to a trade school and becoming a plumber, mechanic, carpenter, etc.
I wouldn’t expect a man to try to support his family in Cincinnati, OH or Troy, MI on $9/hr working at Walmart. I would expect him to be willing to move to Oklahoma City or Lexington. I don’t think this is too much of a burden. People in the high-paying white collar jobs commonly move across the country to one of the coastal financial centers in search of better pay.
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I dont have a law degree yet this year is my final year then Iwill be granted my law degree
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* Reinvigorate manfacturing in the US.
– OK, seen the GDP report? Why is manufacturing at or near an all-time high as a share of GDP if it’s hollowed out? Just because automation has meant that bloated workforces are not needed does not mean output has declined. Unless you’re using this as short hand for “halt technological process,” or “unsustainable union jobs for all,” this is not borne by the facts.
A general aside is I wonder about those talking about the declines of the middle class. Where does your data come from? I really prefer a pithy anecdote about the price of your fuel rising or something equally rigorous.
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In fact, stroking ego is a large part of sexual performance.
Very true. Social status, ego, and the genitals are directly connected. This blog is kind of a continuing testimony to that.
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should have noted — social status, ego, and genitals are directly connected for *men* as well as women.
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I completely agree with the idea of abolishing legal access and child support from fathers of bastard children. I think it would go a long way in curbing the “Oops I got pregnant (on purpose)” ploy that many women employ to hold onto men. But more importantly, it would do wonders for women’s safety, since the number one cause of death in America for pregnant women is homicide at the hands of their baby’s daddy. Without the spectre of 18+ years of child support hanging overhead, guys would (hopefully) be less homicidal.
And if women know that they can’t rely on someone else paying for their decision to have a baby alone, then odds are they won’t be slutting it up so eagerly.
Also, I wish to disagree with the sentiment put forth earlier that slutty women enjoy sex more. I enjoy sex very much and crave it always, but I’ve only ever had sex with one man, my husband. In contrast, I have noticed that among my many varied girlfriends, those who enjoy sex the least, have had the most partners. I think it’s because the slutty ones are pretty submissive girls who have sex not because they want to, but because the guy they like wants to. So they don’t really enjoy themselves and they are completely lame in bed.
Of course there are beautiful women who love sex and seek it out with many partners. They’re called porn stars.
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Futilius gurgitated forth:
If you think those things wouldn’t have influenced how you remember the sexual prowess of lawyers you’ve bedded, you are clueless about psychology, and about yourself. In fact, stroking ego is a large part of sexual performance.
Since this is obviously difficult for you to understand, I’m going to go slowly. I think of things in a binary way, like many men. Ejaculating and not ejaculating. This is something discrete that’s not subject to myopia. It’s not how good or bad she was on a scale of grey. It’s that something specific did not occur. Two specific lawyers I’m thinking of: one I could never ejaculate with, and the other attempted multiple times to do so via oral sex and always failed. On top of this, they enjoyed themselves plenty. Unless they were faking, which totally invalidates your first comment. In fact, I’m still trying to figure out why you made one at all since I was there, and you weren’t.
OH, and this is lovely, you said:
>The other way around? You mean those things would affect your ability to satisfy them? I don’t think you correctly reversed the situation in your head there.
The ‘other way around’ from ‘talking about my satisfaction’ is ‘talking about their satisfaction’, not ‘those things affecting my ability to satisfy them’. Not hard to figure out.
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[I]But what is and is not a subsidy? Do the courts subsidize buisness by enforcing contracts? Do the police subsidize property ownership and personal safety by stopping theives and attackers? Or what about the fact that semi trucks create grooves in the road by breaking at stoplights. By paying for road repairs, are we subsidizing road-system transit over other methods (rails, air, navigable waters)?[/I]
Enforcing contracts and the rule of law is not a subsidy, its the one valuable function of government.
Collectively paying for roads is a subsidy and is inefficient. You are right that it is subsidizing road transit over other methods and I think it should be stopped.
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I dont have a law degree yet this year is my final year then Iwill be granted my law degree
My commiserations.
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“I wonder about those talking about the declines of the middle class. Where does your data come from?”
Second web response on Google for “decline of middle class us” looks like a good place to start: http://www.spiegel.de/international/0,1518,439766,00.html
This one looked a little light on the numbers, but was pretty bold so I can’t pass on pasting in on the assumption that the guy can back up his assertions somewhere else in that blog: http://mises.org/story/2983
Love this guy, but, crap, I need a graph: http://www.lewrockwell.com/north/north574.html
Another favorite, with a link to an analysis: http://voxday.blogspot.com/search?q=middle+class
Hey, this looks heavy (graphs!): http://www.frbsf.org/news/speeches/2006/1106.html
Fuck me, fair play to another favorite:
Q: “Another fascinating thing in the book was where you talked about the statistical fallacy that leads some people to declare that the middle-class is vanishing. Can you talk to us about that, how people get the false impression that the middle-class is vanishing?”
A: “Oh my, it’s so simple that it’s hard to explain. If you take some fixed amount of income and you say that people between these two sets of income, we’ll call that the middle-class. Fine.
“But, what happens over time is that the average income in the country increases and so the whole distribution of income moves to the right and now there are fewer people in those fixed brackets. Of course, what that really means is that the middle-class is having a higher income.
“This is how people create hysteria, saying the middle-class is vanishing and there will be nobody but the few rich and the masses of the poor, etc., etc. Once people, particularly on the Left, find something that fits their preconceptions, they grab it and run with it. They don’t investigate any further.”
–Thomas Sowell, http://www.rightwingnews.com/mt331/2008/02/an_interview_with_thomas_sowel.php
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I enjoy sex very much and crave it always, but I’ve only ever had sex with one man, my husband.
Where I come from, we call women like you liars.
but because the guy they like wants to
That’s certainly another problem, and it’s one of the reasons why I refuse to have sex with women who fake orgasms. Either you want to have sex with me, or you don’t. Trying to please me with a fake orgasm and little effort just simply frustrates me, and I would again rather stay with my porn than play around fakers.
Of course there are beautiful women who love sex and seek it out with many partners. They’re called porn stars.
It depends on the female. There are some porn stars who are clearly doing this because it pays better than working in a mall, and there are others who enjoy fucking, and just think the check is simply an extra bonus. From what I’ve seen, the former tends to be hotter, but they deliver less realistic and enjoyable experiences. Amongst porn connoisseurs, hot girls are generally desirable, but *only* when they deliver solid scenes. After years porn watching, even extremely beautiful girls are of no use if they’re uninspiring.
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Maybe your views on marriage aren’t acquired over a long period of careful observation; you’ve always believed them. This also explains how most girls, according to you, know to be leeches before grade school:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/13148/Kids-on-Marriage
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“In the event of divorce, what beta ex-husband wants to pay a hefty sum to an ex-wife who has his kids 90% of the time and spends it on lingerie and beer for her bad boy lover? A lot of provider betas imagine this scenario and decide that learning game is a better option than walking down the aisle. I don’t blame them.”
As as I see it, your stunted imagination allows only two possibilities; exploit or be exploited. As you know I’m not a big advocate of legal marriage, but am not totally against it either. I think it goes without saying that you personally should not ever get married.
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I think all you bitter men have had bad experiances with women. Women are only mean if you are mean to them first, and because women are so sensitive they can easily be offended for example spending too much time with your friends could be considered as a form of neglect, women need constant attention and devotion but also a man that has principles, goals, and a humble outlook on life and other people if you fulfill this criteria, and your partner is physically attracted to you there is no reason why she would want to leave you, also you should treat her as a person listen to her thoughts views ect, and not treat her like a piece of meat or trophy because she will soon get bored of that.I think that some of you men should phone up the women who have treated you badly and heal yourself and find someone to marry after all dont you want children?, and children need the stability and support of a stable family home with both parents present. I mean do you really want to die old aloneand elderly with no one around you?
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So to paraphrase #123… women are easy. All you need is to be nice, don’t spend time with your friends, give them constant attention and devotion, have principles, goals and be humble, be attractive, and listen to her thoughts and views. Very easy indeed.
By the way, even if you do all of the above, they will still find something to complain about. Seeking validation from a girlfriend or wife that you’re doing a good job will never work. You simply have to be wise enough to judge for yourself where you’re doing a good job and where you need to improve and treat their unreasonable complaints the way Roissy treats a shittest: amused mastery.
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paperdreamer,
That link was hilarious. I loved this one:
“How can a stranger tell if two people are married?
You might have to guess based on whether they seem to be yelling at the same kids.”
katie,
You write like an 8 year old. Seriously, no one is charging you by the character: try using periods to end sentences.
When I read what you wrote it comes off like a kid who speaks really fast because she’s afraid that the adult will tell them to shut up so she wants to get everything out before that happens.
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Well I got the highest A grade in English language and literature in my high school so you must be delusional (lol)
and dont be so angry its not good for you xxx
and it’s not like im writting in my LLb hons exam its only a blog I can write like a two year old if I want to, let alone a 8 year old, and theres nothing you can do about it except get fumed grandpa lol
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Steve — I thought Roissy would have agreed with the little kids haha
I wish I could be mad at you for making fun of katie because she sounds kind of young. But you’re right. She does sound like someone talking fast before a grown up tells her to wait her turn. Sorry katie — no offense; you probably are smart in real life.
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“Women are only mean to you if you are mean to them first” -katie
The real question is, does she actually believe this? It fails as a generalization on the precipice that it’s patently false. Amongst men, all but the lowest of betatude have awareness of the female gender’s capacity of deception and cruelty.
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“Women are only mean if you are mean to them first, and because women are so sensitive they can easily be offended for example spending too much time with your friends could be considered as a form of neglect, women need constant attention and devotion but also a man that has principles. . .”
“Well I got the highest A grade in English language and literature in my high school so you must be delusional (lol)
and dont be so angry its not good for you xxx”
Note the blatant level of self-centeredness in the first quote and the defensiveness in the second that proves roissy’s (and DA’s) points beyond any doubt.
By the way, Katie, we’re not impressed by your high grades in high school. Education today is more concerned about making sure your pwecious widdle feewings are not hurt rather then whether or not you actually learn anything.
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121 Paperdreamer
That link was good. Children are so fucking awesome. Roissy is so delusional to think they are some horrendous burden.
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130 Sara
Well then I guess roissy thinks parents shouldn’t have to be punished with a baby.
(Where have I heard that before?)
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131 sestamibi
Now it’s my turn to ask; WTF? I have no clue what your point is, or if you have one.
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There has been alot of criticism concerning the way I write. I cover alot of points in a few words, and someone says that this sounds like a child talking really fast. Now you may feelthis becausr I’m English and Im asuming most of you are American, I write to the point whereas you lot like to mix lots of other unneccesary word into your speech? (joke)
On the other hand I would just call it writting concisely were taught that at law school, I think most law schools teach how to write concisely, on the other hand I am not aware of the situation in American law schools. Any american lawyers here on this blog?
I mean you wouldnt want to waste the courts precious time with unneccesary words would you ?
you may have noticed I wrote some extra words in this piece Im submitting just so Im not too concise for you
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There has been alot of criticism concerning the way I write. I cover alot of points in a few words, and someone says that this sounds like a child talking really fast. Now you may feelthis becausr I’m English and Im asuming most of you are American, I write to the point whereas you lot like to mix lots of other unneccesary word into your speech? (joke)
On the other hand I would just call it writting concisely were taught that at law school, I think most law schools teach how to write concisely, on the other hand I am not aware of the situation in American law schools. Any american lawyers here on this blog?
I mean you wouldnt want to waste the courts precious time with unneccesary words would you ?
you may have noticed I wrote some extra words in this piece Im submitting just so Im not too concise for you
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Most things here no longer cause me to say anything, but reading what you write is painful… akin to reading Charlie Gordon’s progress reports before they did the operation.
There’s also a striking similarity to the opening chapter of the Sound and the Fury.
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Katie, cut the BS: a lawyers basic rule is overkill: say a lie enough times and people will start to believe it. Lawyers, again and again, repeat their main arguments in every trial.
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134: If English is, indeed, your mother tongue, then your spelling and punctuation leave much to be desired.
“and it’s not like im writting in my LLb hons exam its only a blog I can write like a two year old if I want to, let alone a 8 year old”
You’re certainly free to write as poorly as you desire, that goes uncontested. But you must also realize that if you insist upon writing like an 8-year-old, your opinion is going to be taken about as seriously as an 8-year-old’s would be.
Don’t behave ridiculously and then complain when you are ridiculed.
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I guess Katie was told in High School how bright and special she was: in reality her writing is poor and confusing.
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Sara:
It just reminded me of a lot of things Roissy says.
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Gannon and Anonymous I just dont get what your complaining about, it could be argued that you too write like an 8 year old. Just out of curiosity when you ganon and anonymous text their friends on cell phones do you write in full prose with competent punctuation and no flaws? I mean if you want me too write like an academic I will but you might become confused, if you are not an academic yourself.
note if you would like me to write like an academic please request it. Furthermore I am worthy of the grades I achieved and am completely competent.
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@28
@Rain And
“Any political promises to “bring back manufacturing” are luddite nonsense.”
Hey, I have to call you on the carpet for that. (for what?)
For using words that you don’t even understand the meaning of. Your lack of comprehension belies your many flappings of thy lips.
This is not a Flame, for Flame’s sake.
Instead this is a defense of the post-modern english language as practiced by the North Americans Netizens.
Now observe your lesson carefully, I will not teach you twice, on this.
we will use the modern sense of the word in this lesson
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=luddite
luddite:
1. One who fears technology (or new technology, as they seem pleased with how things currently are…why can’t everything just be the same?)
2. A group led by Mr. Luddite during the industrial revolution who believed machines would cause workers wages to be decreased and ended up burning a number of factories
in protest.
A luddite generally claims things were “just fine” back in the day, and refuses to replace/update failing equipment/software/computers on the basis that they were
just fine 10 years ago.
as the the above definition shows, Your usage is out of context:
Because A: we want/need our Industrial Revolution Machines (that ludites fear) back, because of the jobs we had.
Go look around the rustbelt, see all the unemployed folks.
Don’t you understand that a single manufacturing job spawns four supporting jobs.
Or go to the Silicon Valley ghost-towns of Former Giants of IT and you will see more of the same.
Because B: Where are the many promised Jobs of the “Information Age” Era that replaced our “Industrial Age” Era (which killed off the Agricultural Age Era)?
The jobs in IT that manifested, were outsourced to the same countries with lower labor costs. This was done by the same wall street stockholders/ and Boards of Directors (at large) who Flipped our Manufacturing Base.
{These are people, Who see the world with a Quarterly Earnings Statement world-view. Why? Could it be that their pay and bonuses as written into their contracts are stipulated with such criteria? Why Yes Indeed.}
Summery:
Don’t try to impress us with flashy words, that you recently came across, and have been waiting for an opportunity to throw into some dialog.
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@123
@126
@Katie….
Futher proof that “no child left behind” means making sure no child can get ahead.
You realize, she is the best her school has to offer?
If she is too independent then she will get some ADD Dope (adderal-ritalin) and become a good sheeple citizen.
And to think that states are now passing legislation to ban homeschooling…
This bodes not well for the Republic.
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@Katie
I’m not an English native speaker, but your style reminds me a lot of my 15 year old pupils. Also, your vocabulary is rather poor. For example:
“I write to the point whereas you lot like to mix lots of other unneccesary word into your speech?”
Using the adjective “superfluous” would have been much more efficient. You also repeat too much the same words.
Content wise, your posts are acceptable.
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“it could be argued that you too write like an 8 year old.”
Really? On the basis of what, exactly?
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The qualifications I recieved in high school were A-levels and if you look this qualification up on the net you will realise that it is assessed nationally. Nationally means that all the students taking english literature and language in all the different schools sat the same exam, the examiners mark lots of different exam sheets fromlots of differnt scool according to the same criteria. Thus I am not only the best my school has to offer, the grades I procured reflect criteria that is ascertained nationally. Furthermore I by no means thought that the words I used in my previous submission were ‘flashy’ and I did not learn them recently either.
If you don’t want me to use what you call ‘flashy’ words then I won’t , but have you noticed something first I was accused of writting like an 8 yo now I am being accused of using flashy words that I recently learned, and for your information Mr you dont get past two years of a law degree if youve only recently learnt words your expected to know. If that were the case dont you think it would be highly detrimental to your client if you could not even construe what the words in his contract meant. Naturally tactics that lots of lawyers use is to use words which you have reffered to as flashy to decieve a commoner, like yourself perhaps who ofcourse would not be expected to know what these flashy words mean, as a result you may end up in trouble and require the aid of a lawyer and thus the vicous cycle proceeds.
ps: Don’t be afraid to admit that a girl can be cleverer than you, and you may even need help from a female lawyer and how would that make you feel? as a man?
Thats not very alpha like now is it? being intellectually inferior to a girl
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I realize that this blog post was several weeks ago and the discussion has ended, but I want to jump in with a point about women seeking higher education. There are other points I disagree, and some I agree with, but I’m focusing on this one because as a woman who IS seeking higher education and have several female friends doing the same, I think you REALLY missed the boat on this one.
Point 1 – Women aren’t all automatically searching for men with higher economic status. Some women do, perhaps even the majority, but there is still a significant minority who do not. Although this is the easiest way to be assured that offspring will be well taken care of, there are many a broke man who has enormous economic potential, and women spot that through intelligence, good personality and adaptivity. Even if that man never REACHES his economic potential, if he is intelligent and adaptive, he’ll prove capable of caring for offspring and thus he can still be incredibly attractive to a woman. An example: creative, confident, BROKE men get lots of action.
Point 2 – Intelligent women, by virtue of being intelligent, naturally ALREADY have a smaller pool of men to choose from. Every single intelligent woman I have known (including me) has no patience for relationships men whose intelligence is significantly lower than our own, regardless of their economic capacity. And if they do have the patience, they’re looking to scheme, not to be in a happy relationship.
Point 3 – Going on to higher education gives intelligent women an easy signal to attract intelligent men who are interested in intelligent women. Many intelligent men I know will not settle for dating a dumb woman, no matter how beautiful she is. This kind of man is EXACTLY the kind of man an intelligent woman wants to attract.
Point 4 – Becoming extremely economically self-sufficient, for an intelligent woman, widens her pool of potential mates, because she is now free to go after the poor but highly attractive, creative, and confident starving artists (for example) without worrying about how he will provide for her children. Whether or not a man in that position is comfortable with her being the provider is another issue altogether, but I have seen at least a few happy relationships based on this dynamic.
A side note – those of you men who believe that non-sluts hate sex: you are forgetting the fact that women require more mental stimulation than men do, and that mental stimulation comes more easily (no pun intended) in a relationship because of the stability involved. In other words, for many women, a relationship is carte blanche to start having the wild, hot, awesome sex that she always wanted to have but never felt comfortable enough to have with strangers.
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Amy,
Amen to what you’ve written. Currently, 1/3 of American women outearn their husbands, so not everyone is uptight about who makes the money in a marriage. I don’t understand why some people on this board simultaneously post about women being after their money, and then argue that a woman who outearns a man completely unmans him.
Maybe, just maybe, some of us like you because of who you are, not what you make.
-M. Bradwell
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Thursday 47 —
“These are emasculated right liberals, not real conservatives. The election of “conservative” leaders is pretty much a symbolic protest against a culturally left wing multiculti feminist regime that is firmly in control.”
Well put and I agree.
I’m not actually conservative. Well not really, only in terms of what I oppose. Which is mostly various forms of leftist dogma. They have total supremacy in the intelligencia, where I live.
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hi,
EVERY MARRIAGE CAN BE SAVED………….
it just needs a little working upon.
I know how you feel when you talk of the spiraling events towards the bitter end (DI***CE), the feeling of not being able to contain the motion.
Sometimes people go through a turmoil in their relationship, all it takes is a little help, a little advice to make them come through. a little help to save their marriage.
http://helpkeepmarriage.wordpress.com
or visit my site:
http://helpkeepmarriage.com
ps: you could pass this on to anyone you feel is in need.
because all it takes is a little help, a little advice to make them come through. a little help to save their marriage 🙂
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Amy and M.Bradwell,
Both of you dish out some anecdotal evidence as a proof for your assertions. Your response lacks detailed analysis and are largely superficial.
–Women aren’t all automatically searching for men with higher economic status–
Women ARE in constant search of mates who are high in Cash or Social Status or IQ. A woman that mates with a male of inferior social status and IQ and Cash is an exception and rarely found. You may have a scenario where a female CEO marries a professor of Electrical engineering. Here she is not looking at economic aspects but at Social status and IQ. Will she ever marry a ditch digger or a Cop?
NEVER….
–Going on to higher education gives intelligent women an easy signal to attract intelligent men who are interested in intelligent women. Many intelligent men I know will not settle for dating a dumb woman, no matter how beautiful she is–
Men rejecting beauty is antithetical to scientific theories behind Male Sexuality and Evolutionary Psychology. Frequently intelligent men are just incapable of social and PUA skill required for dating a beautiful woman. Their preference of “intelligent” woman is more a reason of their inability to court hot and sexy women.
–Becoming extremely economically self-sufficient, for an intelligent woman, widens her pool of potential mates, because she is now free to go after the poor but highly attractive, creative, and confident starving artists—
This is in more with my first assertion. Even here the woman has fallen for a person with higher IQ or Intellect.
–Currently, 1/3 of American women outearn their husbands, so not everyone is uptight about who makes the money in a marriage—
The women may out-earn their mates but these “low-earning” husbands are of same or higher social status or IQ. Ex:Michelle Obama outearned her husband Barack Obama, when he was Illinois Senator, by a factor of 2.5:1
In essence, woman look out for a male high up in the hierarchy. It is not necessarily money: It can be social status or Intelligence.
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[…] 23, 2008 by roissy I’ve lovingly detailed how the institution of marriage, the cultural zeitgeist, and the government have it in for beta males, and now the matrifocal rot […]
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You clearly have absolutely no idea what constitutes a successful marriage. If you’re even married yourself, which I doubt, it’s a sham and you know it. Your ideas are juvenile and laughable.
Furthermore, your ideas about “alpha” and “beta” males are disgusting and antiquated. Do you even know what really matters in a person? Or does high income and social standing mean more to you than someone’s personal worth, including the strength of soul and goodness of heart?
A man who has a tender spirit, a good mind, and no cash is a MUCH better catch than a lying, cheating millionaire. You seem to view marriage as a social and economic match, not as a sacred and beautiful sharing of souls.
You are such a joke. You need to quit spreading your poison. It’s people like you that are making society what it is.
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[…] as currently constituted so intrinsically opposed to men’s interests; if it wasn’t so damnably evil and buried up to the neck in a shitpile of its own making, I’d say go ahead and get married, […]
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of all Roissy’s posts, this one, IMHO, is his closest so far to a magnum opus.
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Hey nice write up. It really open my eyes on whats going on. PS. Love your blog design
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[…] are ways to save marriage, but I can sleep easy at night knowing no one will take up the cause. My lifestyle will remain […]
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I interesting your site.It useful for methank you.
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Can I put a link back to yours?
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[…] the marriage racket was reformed in this way we’d see a lot fewer bored housewives leaving for sabbaticals in Italy to get boned and […]
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This article is a joke. Stop pandering to the chick-hating community to try and make them like you – because they already don’t if you haven’t figured it out.
The concept of the double standard, “Oh it’s alright for my husband to cheat but not me!” is already a killer for any marriage, especially if you DON’T want a divorce. Having ladies on the side is deplorable as it is, but to expect the male to go crazygonuts while the woman sits at home is absolute tripe. Any woman worth her weight in salt would also freely sleep with other partners as they desire. Allowing the man to run about rambunctiously having mistresses would lead to an angry, brooding wife — even if she “accepted” it.
And the entire idea of weaker women make men want to protect them? Bullshit. There’s plenty of weak women out there who settle, and wind up with a McDonald’s wage-earner for the remainder of their days. They never strive to be anything better, because their wife doesn’t have any high expectations of them. They don’t have any concept of their wife going out into the world and doing it on her own, because of this.
So how dare women better themselves through higher education, and try to live on their own! Depending completely on one male for the entire life is clearly the ticket! Never mind if a pretty girl can’t find a semi-decent guy, and has a shit job and struggles alone, waiting for her prince Charming.
I’m guessing this is an amazing troll attempt, but I could be wrong. Regardless, people believing this just makes me outright sad.
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“The important concept lies in the potential of the couple in a natural unadulterated state to procreate, not the actual capability.”
Huh? There is no “natural unadulterated” state of human beings. There is no platonic ideal of Man and Woman floating in the ether, there are simply 7 billion individual humans, alike in some ways and very different in others. This argument is spurious.
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Hey. LOVE your blog. You are already an amazing writer, so this is a bit of a nitpick.
“None” is SINGULAR. It comes from “NO ONE”
In a bunch of places on your blog you say “None of them ARE. . .”
It should be “None of them IS”
It isn’t “none are” its “none is”
Thanks.
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