Hope and change is in the air (hat tip: commenter Butters):
An adulterous Spanish woman has been ordered to pay €200,000 in “moral damages” for the suffering caused to her husband by her illicit affair.
The woman, who had three children by her lover, pretended for years that they were fathered by her husband, according to reports.
God bless the Spanish. While the Anglosphere countries are grabbing their ankles for their feminist and kleptocratic Overcunts and incomprehensibly, malignantly going down the path of forcing cuckolded beta husbands to continue footing the bills for the non-biological children of their whore wives’ adulterous copulations, the Mediterranean-style cultures — AKA the Jealousy Belt — are taking the exact opposite tack and squarely putting the blame and the punishment where it rests — on the cheating wife.
Of course, some women will cry “What about the kids?!”. Too bad. She should have thought of them before fucking around. Any harrowing consequences that befall the children are no longer the cuckolded husband’s moral crisis.
DNA tests showed that three of their four children had been fathered by the other man, the Times reports. The husband then took his wife to court, demanding compensation.
The court in Valencia, southeastern Spain, ordered her to pay €100,000 for the suffering she caused him. She fought the ruling, but the Supreme Court has upheld it, and doubled the damages to €200,000.
God bless DNA paternity testing. Besides the Pill, has any technological innovation in the last 40 years leveled the playing field as radically as paternity testing? Widespread use will have cultural — *and* genetic — changes we can only begin to fathom now. The last 10,000 years may have been a whirlwind of human evolution, but that will seem like slow going compared to the hurricane of human change I foresee arriving in the next 500 hundred years. When our distant descendants gather in their gleaming labs to pry apart the recent course of human history and evolution, they will all agree on one thing: The observers of our time severely underestimated the Tunguska-level impact that the pill, condom, abortion, and female economic empowerment would have on the very foundations of the human species.
And can you imagine an American judge having the sack to do what that Spanish judge did, and doubling the damages because the bitch showed no remorse in fighting the initial ruling? I can’t, which is too bad. It would be a step in the right direction to restoring America’s greatness. This story is so delicious it needs a Hollywoodization:
WHORE: But, your Honor, I did nothing wrong! My husband never paid attention to me. What choice did I have but to find love elsewhere? I am a good mother, I deserve respect!
JUDGE: Bitch, sit your whore ass down. You fuck around like a filthy slut, have three kids by another man, and then foist them on your bamboozled husband who works his ass off supporting you and the family, and you expect to be coddled like a small child by this court? Make it $200 grand!
WHORE: But…
JUDGE: $300 grand! Keep going, tramp…
The wife was judged to have “acted negligently in the conception of her children”, and the concealment of the truth “only added to the pain caused to the husband” who should be compensated correctly.
No shit. I guess it takes a Spaniard to demonstrate common sense.
In her defence, the woman told the court her extramarital activities had been “passionate and irregular” and blamed her husband for being cold, unfaithful and disinterested in the children.
Ha haa! I hadn’t even read this part when I wrote my short play above. Good to see there are still some people who understand the amoral nature of women.
The court ruled her claims were not credible.
Justice… is served.
I’m beginning to see a welcome trend. While I don’t expect women — solipsistic creatures of child-like, morally underdeveloped minds — to ever lead the righteous in advocating for fairness and justice of the sort meted out by the Spanish courts, I do expect them to step in line and follow the strong men who will fight for these basic rights and for real justice, not Oprahfied, Lifetime channel justice. This will happen when men grow balls and stop kow-towing in fear to the lesbian bulldyke mafia who runs the womens studies cuntdustrial complex, because women by nature are followers, and where the pack goes, so go they. Women self-govern by a simple (simplistic) motto: “It’s all in the numbers.” Once a tipping popularity point is reached, women will abandon their old principles for the new principles with a speed that will prove the shallowness and expediency with which they hold their beliefs.
What’s interesting to me, and not surprising given the clearness of my vision regarding human nature, is that this reinvigoration of basic gender justice is happening in the machismo cultures like Spain and Brazil. Perhaps those cultures’ experiences with the animalistic and passionate boiling sexual impulses of men and women, and the jealousies engendered, gives them a better grasp of the stakes at play. Perhaps in the Anglo-founded countries, where monogamy and beta cooperation have been the norm for hundreds of years (up until recently), this understanding of the volatile and untamed nature of women’s sexuality is missing, or weak, and thus there is less inborn defense against falling under the spell of the siren call of postmodern, feminist claptrap.
But that is now changing. It’s just too bad we have allowed our culture to regress to such depths that the emergence of this change was necessary.
If men would follow my sage advice, they could avoid all this bullshit and still have plenty of sex and love from women:
By the power of Greyskull !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Of course, some women will cry “What about the kids?!”.
Swine-vomit known as Leftists love to howl this in response to conservative developments such as cutting back of welfare or applying common sense to divorce rulings.
But where is their concern for “the children” when they push the dumbing-down of schools, immigration, and criminals’ rights?
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“In her defence, the woman told the court her extramarital activities had been “passionate and irregular” and blamed her husband for being cold, unfaithful and disinterested in the children.”
I’ve started reading a book, many of you have probably heard of or read, called “The Myth of Male Power” by Warren Farrell. He talks a lot about Stage I and Stage II relationships. A Stage I father focuses on the provision of housing, food, etc. for his wife and family. This is at complete odds with our current Stage II environment of self-actualization and transcendence where a man is supposed to focus on being passionate and warm and a doting father to his children. The truth is, the male, and the Spanish man in this story are suffering by their women during the transition from Stage I to Stage II.
Several years ago I was banging a woman who was married, with children. I knew about it, and am not wholly proud of the fact that I did it, but she told me she was doing it because her husband wouldn’t have sex with her as much as she liked. She even talked about divorcing him because of it. At the time, I was 20. I thought much more with my southern head than northern. Looking back I didn’t realize the simple truth that this bitch had way tooo much time on her hands. Her husband wasn’t neglectful, he was working a job all day long to provide for her and her 2 kids while she sat on the couch surfing the internet, watching satellite TV, and banging other guys.
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Spain is probably the dopest country on earth.
Best food in the west, great nightlife, dope beaches and endless fly girls.
Conquistadors.
Did I mention I am half-Spanish?
– MPM
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Very interesting analysis, Roissy. I especially liked how you compared the Spanish-based “systems” versus the Anglo-based ones. Very good work, and I do agree that when proven, the Man, be he married or not, be released from any financial responsibility whatever. And, if he has paid monies under false pretenses, that he be able to recover damages, just as in any other fraud case.
Women have the right to screw anyone they want. They do not have the right to screw over the lives of others in the process, especially innocent kids and duped dads.
The Obsidian
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reminds me of the latin countries where cheating lovers are murdered (by both genders)….and sometimes don’t even serve jail time. my buddies from Brazil affirm that chicks in Brazil often work much harder than American women to remain hot, b/c they know that a ton of poor, young, sexy chicks are more than willing to be a mistress and or his new wife/wait for him to divorce his sow of a wife.
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I second Farrell’s book – good choice
“The Manipulated Man” by Esther Villar is the best. Written in the 70’s, it’s obviously out of press. And suppressed by the mewling, fascist liberal press.
She was a doctor born of “German” parents in Argentina
It is a must read
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I have never been more proud of my countrymen! Well, at least not since last year’s Euro Cup victory over the Germans.
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I had no idea this existed until I read the article you linked of American judges forcing husbands of cheating wives to pay child support. That’s un-fucking-believeable
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Funny and smart posting.
Co-co-sign on the Warren Farrell book. I think Farrell eventually wandered off in a huggy Men’s Movement direction, but this early book is good and helpful.
I see that “Manipulated Man” (which I haven’t read) is actually in print.
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G is The Man
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Whatever did happen to Spain, after its imperial glory days? One seldom hears anything remarkable about it.
If Spain can turn the tables on the zeitgeist and reinstate the patriarchy, then any nation that cares to continue existing can do it, too.
But I am not holding my breath. How long have we had DNA testing, and done precious little with it?
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Ain’t gonna happen in America.
This story is why Anglo chicks dig Mediterranean types — those guys still have their balls because they don’t live in societies where they don’t have to hand ’em over at birth.
The ultimate winner of the story is the guy who fathered the 3 kids. His genes get passed on without him having to spend any resources, so he’s free to make even more kids.
The ultimate loser is society. The broad will probably declare bankruptcy and get funds from taxpayers (mostly working males) to raise the other guy’s kids.
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Roissy: “Once a tipping popularity point is reached, women will abandon their old principles for the new principles with a speed that will prove the shallowness and expediency with which they hold their beliefs.”
I’m generally in sympathy with your grossly reductionnist, neo-Darwinist take on female psychology. That said…. You spend most of your time talking about very young women at their reproductive peak. We can agree on the adjectives: flaky, faithless, unreliable, unprincipled, opportunistic…
But I think the psychology often changes once they’ve “invested” in — that is, had children by — a particular male. Having finally and irrevocably taken sides with their loins, women often become much more “principled” in your sense. To return to the gross reductionism: this is because they are now mothers and are interested in maximizing the life chances of their specifically configured offspring. This is of course what they were doing all along but once the kids are there, there’s no changing sides…
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Ditto. This and yesterday’s blog.
We need more level headed guys who aren’t blinded by bra size, or desperate to please anything above a “5”. If the number of male chumps continues, ladies will continue to perceive they can do whatever they choose.
Held accountable, they may act a little different. They may realize debts are not paid magically, someone may actually say “no” to them sometime in their lifetime, and no one is galluping up on a shiny white horse .
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“Judges said that the compensation should be “higher than if the children had been killed in an accident”.”
That’s a great line.
Any woman who has a kid by a man who is unable or unwilling to support the kid is basically giving birth to a baby that should’ve been aborted — a non-person.
Women always talk about having control over their reproductive organs. Well, if you can’t keep your legs closed to guys who can’t/won’t support a kid, then either abort the motherfucker or hand it over to an orphanage.
My taxes shouldn’t be going to support your DNA.
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put short: having babies turns women into stakeholders in the patriarchy.
Isn’t that the basic idea behind Sailer’s “Affordable Family Formation” concept?
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The court in Valencia…
My great-grandfather was forced to leave Valencia during the Spanish civil war. Another war between fascists and commies (what’s the fucking difference?) forced my father to depart the family’s new home in Latin America. I grew up culturally Anglo, except for one thing, I embrace traditional gender roles. I rejected Hispanic culture from an early age, but seeing how feminine my grandmother was and having my grandfather show me off to his mistresses instilled in me an appreciation for that aspect of Hispanic culture. I’m glad to see Valencia is fighting off the feminazis.
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The ideal should still be – especially where children are involved – a committed marriage relationship (which I think requires children in many cases).
But whatever the case, our American women need some serious reality checks…..and men bear some responsbility for that by putting up with waaaay too much status and attention whoring junk.
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“having babies turns women into stakeholders in the patriarchy.
Isn’t that the basic idea behind Sailer’s “Affordable Family Formation” concept?”
The patriarchy in America is the government.
Which is why women vote for more liberal welfare policies, increased taxes, support judges that ass-rape husbands/fathers, and vote for good looking candidates.
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Great story!! And no,I cant see that happening here!! Especially in Obama’s America,where pea brains who are too stupid to care whether they can afford a house or not are bailed out by the guys who DO care,and pay their bills. (God he is an idiot) But..here its all about how REEEEEEAAAAAAAAALLLLL men…anyone? Yes,REAL MEN RESPECT WOMEN!! RESPECT RESPECT RESPECT!!! The sickness of dumping this endless river of respect on the 2nd sex—-Oh my GOD! What an anachronistic expression!Dinosaur! Notice how bull-dyke feminism always equates itself with modernity and progress…snicker. —anyway,respect for women while NOT requiring women to earn respect or GIVE it,is why things are so fucked up!!
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Hey, Roissy, when you get a chance, could you please post one of those cute stick figure pictures where boys and gals with perfect round faces speak to each other, the gal’s hair in brunette and the boy’s peepee in coral. Life is more cheerful that way. The economy is so bad. It is depressing to be reminded everyday that we could not even trust the people we love.
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Well, that’s true, that the government is a public patriarchy.
Haven’t quite figured out why SWPL gals love the notion of an all-encompassing public patriarchy more than the old private variety.
At least you can blackmail a husband. heh.
But really, maybe they love the idea of the public patriarchy because it allows their segment of society to consolidate power over mine… it’s working out very well for them, too.
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Maybe the Anglo world isn’t totally hopeless:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1149382/The-great-house-husbands-lie-Men-mad-dont-work-mother-insists.html
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Why did Western people get married in the past? And why do they get married now? How have women’s rights and technology changed that reasoning?
In the past, marriage was much more of a cold-eyed transaction than it is now. For the upper class, a review of finances, status, and general family worth were taken heavily into account for both genders. For the lower classes, health and the ability to work hard were also considered a plus. Marriage was an economic unit primarily, used to advance the class, staus, or finances of the two families who were uniting. Love was great, but not required. Men married when they could support a family, and women married in their early twenties.
In modern times, people marry for love, and people who marry for explicit economic concerns are generally disparaged. But love doesn’t last as long as a partnership does. That “in love” feelingcaused by hormones generally lasts a maximum of two years. After that, what reason do two people have to be together? Only loyalty, and the people in this forum don’t really seem to place a premium on that.
Married men report being much happier than single men. Unfortunately, married men also report being much happier than married women. Probably the main reason women seek divorce over men. Marriage still seems like a good deal for many men, since for the most part, they don’t have to do much more than they have always done. Work, and discipline the children.
A married woman still has to fulfill her traditional duty of raising the children and taking care of the household, but also the man’s traditional duty of bring home the bacon as well. Many, many are unsatisfied with this. Yet not many would want to go back to being solely dependent on a man’s income to get by, unless he makes substantially above the average income. Other women find that working is the fulfilling part, but the raising of the children and taking care of the household is the part that they would rather get rid of. But not many men would want to be dependent on a woman, and the type of man who is willing to do that is normally not very sexually appealing to women.
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Hey, Roissy, when you get a chance, could you please post one of those cute stick figure pictures where boys and gals with perfect round faces speak to each other, the gal’s hair in brunette and the boy’s peepee in coral.
charm will get you everywhere pupu. stay tuned.
(i retract my statement if you are a man. fortunately, you write like a woman.)
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I could not agree more with that legal result.
Great post all around
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I’m 25. From the time i was a teenager I’ve said that i never wanted to get married. Both my older brothers got married within the last two years. Both of their wives are putting on weight.
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Some woman (mom?) must have really fucked you up. Why the all the vitriol towards women? Especially commentary on their amorality while you seem to spend a majority of your time scheming ways to get them in bed, expose their imperfections, and depending on their “worth” either “pump and dump” them or hold on to them long enough to take care of both your household and sexual needs.
You are the Ann Coulter of dating.
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Thank you, Roissy!
Pupu is NOT a man so don’t retract your statement, please.
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Ladies, I cost much less than 200,000 Euros. And, I care about you just as much as the guy you’re letting stick is dick in you on the sly. So, dont be afraid to spring for me. Saves money in the long term.
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Excellent link Michael.
I especially liked this line which pretty much sums up men’s plight.
“Loyalty – whether to a corporation or a football team – would more likely lead people, in an increasingly cynical culture, to conclude that you were a fool. “
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“Fan of G
G is The Man”
Took a while to get a fan here, even though I have been dropping Gems for a minute.
I kind of miss all my doubters the “I don’t believe you” crew.
They are probably too beat up from the down economy.
Continuing to doubt.
– MPM
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OMW
“Whatever did happen to Spain, after its imperial glory days? One seldom hears anything remarkable about it.”
It only seems like that because Spain is low-pro and they got the fuck out of the USA (probably a smart move).
Spain is leading the world in Cuisine these days…taken it over from France and Italy. El Bulli is widely considered the best restaurant in the world…and that is just the tip of the iceberg.
Their Art and Wine are making a move too.
The nightlife has always been top shelf.
The beautiful beaches with mad fly topless girls are easy on the eyes as well.
I probably shouldn’t prop it out too much, one of the advantages is idiots don’t go there (at least not as much as other places).
I have always thought I would early retire there. (which will be hopefully soon)
– MPM
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Part of the problem, right fucking here:
http://www.nbcchicago.com/news/weird/Indiana-Woman-Said-I-Do-23-Times.html?yhp=1
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@G–I too am a fan.
Good for the mouthbreathers among the commentariat to know that MPM supports the President, proof positive that Game is not monopolized by any political ideology. All the wrong-wing Repubs who decry the liberal view of women and children should remember that Sarah Palin–mother and grandmother of bastards–very nearly became the Rawdogger in Chief. Sex ed, contraception, and the miracle of abortion are the enemies of every conservative politician and the friends of every liberated man.
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“Are you serious?” – My thoughts as well. Given the generally amoral tone of this blog, the “get what you can, however you can” attitude, it seems like you should be praising this woman for her moxie. Except this is a site that advocates for men, not women.
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The Manipulated Man pdf free on the web is here among other places:
http://dontmarry.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/the_manipulated_man.pdf
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Maybe the Anglo world isn’t totally hopeless:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-1149382/The-great-house-husbands-lie-Men-mad-dont-work-mother-insists.html
^ Contrary to your assertion, the Anglo world IS fucking hopeless. Check out the second photo. It’s interesting that a UK article defending masculinity shows a UK political leader with his… SPANISH wife.
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@ El Topo/Are you serious?
When Roissy or anyone else games a woman into being his pump and dump for an evening…. it does not cost her $200,000 in lifetime earnings or 18 to 21 years of their working life.
That is the goddamn difference and that is why paternity fraud is such a huge issue for men.
But then again, you both know that and you’re just looking for reasons to be obtuse.
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G Manifesto
Allow me to reference my earlier codicil about you being retarded.
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SPAIN mobilizes against the scourge of MACHISMO.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F04E5DE163AF937A25754C0A9629C8B63
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Spanish Men killing their Women….
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9F04E5DE163AF937A25754C0A9629C8B63
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Does anyone have any stats on how many cases in the US go against the father? and go for the father as in the Spain one cited here? Otherwise it is just idle speculation on the extent of things in the US…
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Different reproductive strategies for the different sexes. Guys want sex with as many different women as who will let them, leading them all holding the reprouctive bag. Ladies want as many resources for their offspring as possible, which may come from one very resourceful man, or several less wealthy men, each of whom has some sort of stake in her offspring. You can no more knock the Spanish lady than you can knock practioners of game. I wonder how many deadbeat dads there are out there, as opposed to victims of paternity fraud?
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Chuck —
“I’ve started reading a book, many of you have probably heard of or read, called “The Myth of Male Power” by Warren Farrell. He talks a lot about Stage I and Stage II relationships.”
I’ve “read” the audiobook. Lots of valid critiques of the one way nature of feminism and it’s complaints.
The thing about Ferrell though is that the place he’s ultimately coming from is deeply at odds with psychobiology and Roissy’s principal insights about the nature of sex differences.
Farrell is a radical blank slater. He’s convinced that all sex differences are socialized and that they shouldn’t be. He
often argues the male side of the case from a radical first wave feminist point of view (gender differences other than sexual preference are artificial).
In The Myth for example he complains that even now it’s only men that have be drafted and go and potentially die in the military, if we face a big enough military crisis. Women only fill support roles which are generally much less dangerous (though terrorists swimming among civilians in occupied territory in Iraq do sometimes somewhat level the danger gradient – but the effort is to see that that doesn’t happen). I agree women should be reminded of this — and many other cases where only men do the really dangerous work (offshore fishing) in any substantial numbers — but Farrell very unrealistically wants it to change and equalize.
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A married woman still has to fulfill her traditional duty of raising the children and taking care of the household, but also the man’s traditional duty of bring home the bacon as well. Many, many are unsatisfied with this.
I agree. Womens Lib has made Married Women miserable. Hopefully Fourth-Wave Feminists will be able to fix this.
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Maxwell Demon:
Please take Obama’s dick out your mouth.
Any man who uses the term “liberated man” is a fag, a virgin, or someone who loves watching other men bang his fat girlfriend.
Oh, you are right about abortion being a miracle:
It’s a miracle because it happens so rarely since women would rather drain some guy for 18-21 years of child support or collect free welfare like every ghetto/brown/octuplet mom.
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Oh, you are right about abortion being a miracle:
It’s a miracle because it happens so rarely since women would rather drain some guy for 18-21 years of child support or collect free welfare like every ghetto/brown/octuplet mom.
40% of women between the ages of 15-45 will have an abortion in their lifetime. There are a huge number of unplanned pregnancies in the United States.
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dougjnn –
Yeah, there seemed something fishy about Farrell’s book thus far (I’m only about 75 pages in). He doesn’t seem to take into account the Ev Bio aspect of gender roles in relationships. He’s saying that men are protectors of women, to their own detriment, and it’s not fair that they are. In one passage, arguing from that blank state socialized point of view, he points out that the Vikings transformed from blood savages to passive agrarians based on the fact that the latter became their chief means of survival as opposed to having to kill off human competition.
Either way, I agree with his point of Stage I and Stage II relationships as it applies to the “masculinity crisis”. In Stage I men were loved for providing for the wife and kids. To do so may have required long work hours which led to its own sort of isolation from the goings-on of the family. This behavior, in today’s Stage II, is called “cold”, “work-aholic”, “neglectful”. How can a man be all things to all people? In short, he can’t fulfill Stage I and Stage II on a consistent basis based upon the simple constraints of time, money, and energy. Men are angry, and rightly so, that their transformation from Stage I to Stage II has been more rocky and cumbersome than that of women.
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Maxwell Demon,
I know you weren’t speaking to me, but I hope you don’t mind my jumping in for a bit.
I know this isn’t the venue for such a subject, but I just wanted to note that, for myself, as a Conservative, I am cool with whatever measures the people want to use when it comes to reproduction/contraception-provided the PEOPLE actually decides. And not an unelected few.
I say, let each State determine its Abortion/Birth Control policy. And let each State pay for it.
I say, if Planned Parenthood is so great, why must they take my tax dollars to operate? Can’t they get funding from the umpteen organizations out there who claim to be looking out for the interests of Women? I don’t want to shut PP down-though I personally find them repugnant, given their history-their very racist, history-I just want them off the gov’t’s teat. If people support Planned Parenthood, let them pay for it.
I do not oppose birth control, many conservatives agree w/my view. What many of us oppose is a wholesale imposition of values, and asset forfeiture in the form of tax dollars, to fund the agendas of a small group of people. Put all of this to a vote and we’ll soon find out how far people are willing to go, especially when they’ll have to pick up the tab.
And let’s be clear: Palin was hated on, because she was willing to have babies, and was the kind of Woman most Men walking around w/blood in their veins wouldn’t mind giving some of their DNA to. Women, especially those of a hard Liberal bent, are exceptionally sensitive to such things. As Tina Fey showed us all.
Just wanted to drop that quick note.
The Obsidian
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@ “Different reproductive strategies for the different sexes. Guys want sex with as many different women as who will let them, leading them all holding the reprouctive bag. Ladies want as many resources for their offspring as possible, which may come from one very resourceful man, or several less wealthy men, each of whom has some sort of stake in her offspring. You can no more knock the Spanish lady than you can knock practioners of game. I wonder how many deadbeat dads there are out there, as opposed to victims of paternity fraud?”
The difference here is that a woman engaging in this practice costs a man countless amounts of resources for 18-21 years of his life. If a bitch gets pumped and dumped, she gets upset about it for a few days and maybe becomes slightly jaded. Using less than ethical reproductive strategies as a man has a measurably less severe consequence than when a woman does. Roissy wrote a blog about this I believe, why a woman’s infidelity is more dangerous than a man’s.
I’d love to see a play of how this scenario would have gone down in the U.S with some beta pussy beggar judge, probably would have found a way to fine the man.
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I could give you my word as a Spaniard? … is there any way you’ll trust me?
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SeaFighter FSF-1,
“Allow me to reference my earlier codicil about you being retarded.”
If by “being retarded” you mean I swoop tons of fly girls.
Then yes. You can call me “retarded”.
I prefer “sick, demented and insane” more though.
– MPM
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@ 646Hedgie
No, I think being obtuse is justifying the blanket statement that “all women are amoral” with isolated instances of a woman acting in an immoral manner.
And while I agree that the pecuniary loss for being “pumped and dumped” is nothing compared to raising a child, I wonder if you equate all acts of immorality as to the financial cost that they incur the victim.
Lying to a woman, “playing her” by nitpicking her insecurities, and generally concealing your true nature so that when she is clued in on the fact that you were just “running game” does have emotional consequences and is the product of an immoral actor in the social arena.
This is compounded by the fact, that many of the “PUAs” on this site target young inexperienced women despite being in their thirties or forties.
I agree a woman has to take responsibility for her own actions despite her youth. Just don’t sit on your “real politik” high horse and justify general misogyny with evidence of some random Spanish philanderess and a married anal enthusiast.
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<iIf men would follow my sage advice, they could avoid all this bullshit and still have plenty of sex and love from women:
That’s really sweet. I know the women who read your blog love you if that’s any indication. LOL
I find the case here interesting, but I don’t really see how making her pay the equivalent of $286,000 U.S. makes any sense whatsoever. He obviously wants her to suffer like he has, but it does give the message to the kids that he would take back all the money he spent in supporting them if he could. Also, depending on how old the kids are, this will hurt them if it puts her in a huge financial bind. He’s basically saying as well that he wished he never had them in his life either. Doubling the fine goes beyond justice and into the realm of insanity. The judge was undoubtedly a man who took it personally; something judges are not supposed to do.
I would think there would be much better, more effective, creative means of him feeling like he had evened the score somehow without fucking over the kids so much.
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Maxwell Demon
“Sex ed, contraception, and the miracle of abortion are the enemies of every conservative politician and the friends of every liberated man.”
Don’t forget to add:
Gambling
Smoking
Drinking
Prostitution
Gentleman’s Clubs
Drugs
Nightlife
Sin
All some of my favorite things on a Tuesday night (save prostitution).
– MPM
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el topo:
“Are you serious?” – My thoughts as well. Given the generally amoral tone of this blog, the “get what you can, however you can” attitude, it seems like you should be praising this woman for her moxie. Except this is a site that advocates for men, not women.
oh, i understand why the whore would try to get the best of both worlds for herself. it’s her animal nature. but if we are going to have legal institutions that proscribe against this behavior in the interest of justice and social comity, then consider what i’m doing a happy roissy dance that her deception was discovered and she paid a hefty price. i may be amoral, but i also recognize a threat to my interests — and a legal system that rigs the game against men is not something i would endorse. the spanish court has taken a step in the right direction toward rectifying this aspect of the peculiar early 21st diseases afflicting the west.
just contrarian:
SPAIN mobilizes against the scourge of MACHISMO.
one thing my more advanced readers know to do is to read the subtext of my arguments. nowhere in my glorious jeremiad did i suggest the spanish machismo model is good for the anglo west. because it wouldn’t be. the cooperative beta provider model of the US-led anglosphere has perched it atop the world as an incomparable empire of amazing power, but that model is quickly being eroded by a constellation of antipathetic forces. i note that one of those demonic forces — equalist feminism — has a harder time gaining a stronghold in machismo cultures where men and women have a clearer idea of the innate differences between the sexes.
anon:
Ladies want as many resources for their offspring as possible, which may come from one very resourceful man, or several less wealthy men, each of whom has some sort of stake in her offspring.
in the state of nature, a woman whose cuckolding was discovered would be abandoned by the duped father, and her infants would die of exposure or malnutrition for want of resources. the only way a woman can successfully pursue a “multiple source provider” strategy would be either by possessing an amazing acumen for hiding her deceit from her duped beta provider for years on end, or having the safety net of a powerful sympathetic state to protect her and her bastard kids should the duped beta discover her lie.
btw, i don’t know what jungleland you live in, but in the modern west the fly by night cads are more likely to “seed and leave” a whore rather than shower her with resources over many years because they know the sucker hubby will be there to take care of the bastard kids in his absence.
You can no more knock the Spanish lady than you can knock practioners of game.
one lie costs a man his money and his time and his sanity. the other lie costs a woman a night of sexual pleasure followed by an empty unfulfilled promise.
see the difference?
now if a player were to knowingly impregnate a woman i don’t have a problem with him being on the hook for child support should she decide to do the stupid thing and refuse to abort. i can tell you that if i were to accidentally impregnate a girl, i would do my best to impress upon her that single motherhood is a hellish existence and will likely end up damaging the life prospects of the kid. i would then offer to pay for the abortion. if she still refused to abort, i would move all my assets offshore and leave the country.
but that’s just me.
usually:
Hopefully Fourth-Wave Feminists will be able to fix this.
4th wave feminism is a farce.
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He obviously wants her to suffer like he has, but it does give the message to the kids that he would take back all the money he spent in supporting them if he could.
Slight misprint, should read:
He obviously wants her to suffer like he has AND it does give the message to the kids that he would take back all the money he spent in supporting them if he could.
I understand that it is troubling to some that men prefer to NOT be duped into raising someone elses children.
He’s basically saying as well that he wished he never had them in his life either.
No, he is sating that he wants his $286,000 back. then they can go play catch.
Sara, idiot, remember, the mother screwed the children over. Not the non-father.
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“This is compounded by the fact, that many of the “PUAs” on this site target young inexperienced women despite being in their thirties or forties.”
What are these women, 14? Spare us, please. I’m not beuying the “young and inexperienced” bullshit. And neither should you…
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Roissy,
I hope you realize that this opens the door for all kinds of lawsuits that women will foist upon men as well. Cheating on them, may entail huge punitive damages depending on how “sensitive” they are. What goes around comes around, but why in the courts?
I made a big faux pas personally regarding renters in my house. Like an idiot I didn’t do a credit check and they have extremely bad credit. Instead of taking it to the courts and evicting them, I decided to take full responsibility for the consequences of my mistake. The good news is, they’re now wanting to work out a rental agreement that works for both of us.
Thinking that law enforcement is the road to happiness is really stupid, unnecessary, and a waste of energy. It’s usually the path of most resistance and just creates more problems.
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yes, he’s serious:
Lying to a woman, “playing her” by nitpicking her insecurities, and generally concealing your true nature so that when she is clued in on the fact that you were just “running game” does have emotional consequences and is the product of an immoral actor in the social arena.
you write as if you are unaware that women actually *enjoy* game, even when they know what the man is up to.
you also write like someone with a warped view of what constitutes game.
sare, my love my life my muse:
Doubling the fine goes beyond justice and into the realm of insanity.
not really. can you put a price tag on 18 years of a man’s life?
I would think there would be much better, more effective, creative means of him feeling like he had evened the score somehow without fucking over the kids so much.
if the kids suffer, remember…
she did it to them.
toodles!
ps i have no qualms about the bastard children of whores dying in the street from lack of parental resources.
pps i am not kidding.
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Then, massive Mexican immigration to the US is a GOOD thing. They will help overthrow feminism.
Either that, or Islam will. I prefer Mexicans.
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Again, while I don’t think sexbots will happen anytime soon (at any rate, soldierbots will happen before sexbots, to much greater consequences), the following will happen :
3-D, holographic video games with sexual themes, with realistic graphics and fully interactive AI. Whether you want romantic role-playing, or raw porn, there will be advance video games with 3-D/holographic interfaces.
This WILL happen by 2020. Take my word for it.
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Hey, from now on, let’s refer to that Octuplet mom welfare slut as :
OCTOPUSSY
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sara the roissy-shaped box:
Cheating on them, may entail huge punitive damages depending on how “sensitive” they are.
no it wouldn’t because cheating on a woman doesn’t saddle her with another woman’s kids.
ya doofus.
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roissy,
“i have no qualms about the bastard children of whores dying in the street from lack of parental resources.”
Then don’t cry, be upset or run to the cops when you get pistol whipped, stripped and robbed when you are walking to a girls crib you just picked up out of a bar.
– MPM
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ps i have no qualms about the bastard children of whores dying in the street from lack of parental resources.
pps i am not kidding.
Including your own, apparently.
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I think everyone here is missing the big picture – if you care about the alpha/beta distinction, then this guy clearly was a beta since he wasn’t man enough to keep his wife liking him. Instead of applauding the case’s outcome, you should be degrading him like all the other posts deriding betas. People are full of contradictions and double-speak on this forum.
Here’s another glaring example:
“If men would follow my sage advice, they could avoid all this bullshit and still have plenty of sex and love from women:”
in a blog that is all about scoring with one woman to another, what does LOVE have to do with it? Yet another contradiction….
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@ roissy – I may have a “warped” view of what constitutes game. To be honest your immortality in the procurement of pussy is not what bothers me. More it is the fact that you can’t simply enjoy these PUA stockholm syndrome victims.
You have to go on rants where you pick apart their physique, their mental acuity, and their moral compass.
I just don’t understand why you are so adamant about spending so much time and energy to stick your dick in something for which you only express contempt.
I am honestly curious.
It is just a biological imperative that you resent on some level?
Or does the contempt somehow make it better?
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In Spain, it’s more likely the women who are responsible for traditional and conservative trends. It’s one of the few countries where women are *more* conservative than men, even going back to the early 1980s when the country was in a democratic transition and leftism was rampant. Moreover, the gap has grown since then! —
http://scienceblogs.com/gnxp/2008/05/gender_gap_in_politics.php
Spanish chicks rule. Really wish I were living and working in Barcelona still…
Spanish men aren’t very macho — maybe in some parts of Latin America, or in Italy. But women consistently report that the men in Spain don’t follow them around like flies on shit, as Italian men do.
They’re not wimpy or anything, just more dark and brooding, or easy-going and non-confrontational. More introverted than other Mediterraneans (personality surveys show this — search GNXP.com for global personality).
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“i have no qualms about the bastard children of whores dying in the street from lack of parental resources.”
Then don’t cry, be upset or run to the cops when you get pistol whipped, stripped and robbed when you are walking to a girls crib you just picked up out of a bar.
If the bastard kids die real young, they won’t grow up to be criminals. Win-Win.
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Are You Serious,
W/all due respect you don’t know me well enough to lump me in w/others here. I agree and disagree w/quite a few here, Roissy included. Just want to note this fact.
The Obsidian
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Isaac–
“I’d love to see a play of how this scenario would have gone down in the U.S with some beta pussy beggar judge, probably would have found a way to fine the man.”
It’s an indication of how prejudiced against men’s interests the American media is that you don’t know the answer to that question.
The answer is he would be ordered to pay child support just as though they were his biological kids. At least that is the case if she successfully defrauded him for more than a couple of years (with some states not even having a birth paternity test out for married couples, incredibly enough).
More outrageous there is real opposition among feminists and their media echo chambers to routine DNA testing in married couples. There are actual restrictions on this in the UK I believe, by restricting the testing services.
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More outrageous there is real opposition among feminists and their media echo chambers to routine DNA testing in married couples. There are actual restrictions on this in the UK I believe, by restricting the testing services.
I couldn’t imagine why…
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tood:
Then, massive Mexican immigration to the US is a GOOD thing.
whatever upsides a somewhat more machismo culture the mexicans bring to america are swamped by the downsides.
Then don’t cry, be upset or run to the cops when you get pistol whipped, stripped and robbed when you are walking to a girls crib you just picked up out of a bar.
that’s not my scene, man.
anon:
Including your own, apparently.
doubtful.
but, hey, out of sight, out of mind, right?
jerry jerry quite contrary:
I think everyone here is missing the big picture – if you care about the alpha/beta distinction, then this guy clearly was a beta since he wasn’t man enough to keep his wife liking him.
i never said otherwise.
Instead of applauding the case’s outcome, you should be degrading him like all the other posts deriding betas.
who says i can’t do both?
in a blog that is all about scoring with one woman to another, what does LOVE have to do with it?
everything.
yes, i’m serious:
More it is the fact that you can’t simply enjoy these PUA stockholm syndrome victims.
i’m not holding any women against their will.
You have to go on rants where you pick apart their physique, their mental acuity, and their moral compass.
do you seriously think i talk about a woman’s moral compass when i’m gaming her?
as i am an amoral jerk of devilish charm, i do what is personally advantageous.
I just don’t understand why you are so adamant about spending so much time and energy to stick your dick in something for which you only express contempt.
false premise.
I am honestly curious.
no, you’re not. you just wanted to get a dig in at yours truly.
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“There are actual restrictions on this in the UK I believe, by restricting the testing services.”
And that is why of all the Western nations, the UK is the one where Islam is taking root the fastest.
Pretty soon, Muslims will be allowed to apply Muslim law to family matters, rather than British law, simply because British authorities are afraid to oppose Muslims on this point. Guess what then? Many Beta males in Britain will convert to Islam, simply to avoid the extreme bias against men in traditional British courts.
This is how feminism courts its own destruction, and deservedly so.
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“whatever upsides a somewhat more machismo culture the mexicans brings to america are swamped by the downsides.”
Roissy,
I used to think that. Now I am not so sure. Given than feminism has ruined the lives of 10m, 20m, or 40m American males, Mexican immigration can hardly do worse.
At this point, I’ll cheer on ANYTHING that opposes radical feminish, including Mexicans, and even Islam. I am sure there are men across America who have been pushed far enough to feel this way.
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roissy
Then don’t cry, be upset or run to the cops when you get pistol whipped, stripped and robbed when you are walking to a girls crib you just picked up out of a bar.
“that’s not my scene, man.”
Whats not your scene?
Picking up girls out of bars?
Just playing.
– MPM
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anonymous
“If the bastard kids die real young, they won’t grow up to be criminals. Win-Win.”
Only some don’t.
The Streets are Always Watching.
– MPM
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I’m against marriage in America too. Well, not really against marriage. I’m against the man raping which happens routinely to men, especially high earning men, in American divorce. But I’m also against the way that the feminist American media has shaped the sense of entitlement of American women in marriage, so it does go beyond the man rape of American divorce.
I’m not against long term relationships including living together ones.
I just think that when a couple decides to split up a man should cease to owe a duty to support his former partner, including giving her anything more than he did when they were together. In other words I think the division of property that occurs in living together unmarried couples is what’s fair – each takes what they own, or what they saved – or what they were clearly given. With big assets it should go by title. In a lot of cases especially if kids have come or are imminently planned, but often even if not, the principal residence and maybe a second one will be in both partner’s names. So that’s how they should be split. If the husband buys his wife a car, it’s hers. If he keeps two cars in his name but lets her drive one, it’s not. And so on.
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Tood
“whatever upsides a somewhat more machismo culture the mexicans brings to america are swamped by the downsides.”
Roissy,
I used to think that. Now I am not so sure. Given than feminism has ruined the lives of 10m, 20m, or 40m American males, Mexican immigration can hardly do worse.
At this point, I’ll cheer on ANYTHING that opposes radical feminish, including Mexicans, and even Islam. I am sure there are men across America who have been pushed far enough to feel this way.”
More Mexicans to America is Upside:
Better food
Hotter Girls
More Drugs
Bars will stay open later
Smoking will be allowed
More Action
More Excitement
Mariachi Music (although I hate Mariachi Music)
– MPM
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Although I should say I like “Narcocorridos”
– MPM
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@Obsidian.
Sorry if I offended you. I don’t remember addressing you directly or implying that you share the viewpoints of the blog administrator. Suggesting that all PUAs or contributors to this forum are misogynists would certainly weaken my point about making blanket generalizations. I was merely addressing the persons that were making these statements.
Also sorry if the reason you felt targeted was because I used “you” as a rhetorical devise. As in “you should not” instead of “people should not”
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Only some don’t.
The Streets are Always Watching.
– MPM
Any reduction in the population of future criminals is good. Nits make lice. Think of the money and life/lives saved even if 10% die before age 9. Like I said, Win-Win.
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the G:
Whats not your scene?
i try to steer clear of venues where pistol-whipping is a regular occurrence.
Picking up girls out of bars?
it is required.
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The solution to all this is quite simple: follow my example. Do not get married and spend all of your life fucking as many woman as possible. There is no greater bliss on earth than fresh pussy.
When I get too old to spend time and money on the younger chicks, I will take Roissy’s advice to heart: porn, prostitutes and liquor.
And to db or Chic Noir, I really want to fuck each of you, preferably at the same time, if you think you can handle me.
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@Obsidian–we don’t line up 100% on details, but reasonable people can disagree. The conservative view that skeeves me is when birth control etc. are completely dismissed. Gotta be pragmatic yo.
@G Man–the line gets blurry when you add smoking and drinking to the list. Plenty of conservatives are completely down with those activities. Debatably, sin too. Unless you mean the Spanish word sin.
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“in a blog that is all about scoring with one woman to another, what does LOVE have to do with it?
roissy: everything.”
vapid response without any substantiation.
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“jerry jerry quite contrary:
I think everyone here is missing the big picture – if you care about the alpha/beta distinction, then this guy clearly was a beta since he wasn’t man enough to keep his wife liking him.
roissy:i never said otherwise.
Instead of applauding the case’s outcome, you should be degrading him like all the other posts deriding betas.
roissy: who says i can’t do both?”
but you didn’t. and that’s the point.
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jerry jerry quite the fairy:
vapid response without any substantiation.
seducing women is a prerequisite to falling in love with women.
and on the hierarchy of life’s pleasures, falling in love is the most supreme delight.
but you didn’t. and that’s the point.
who says i have to deride betas in every post?
or: don’t be a bean counting nerd, jerr. nobody likes that guy.
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Maxwell Demon,
“@G Man–the line gets blurry when you add smoking and drinking to the list.”
Yeah, I know, Democrats and Trial Lawyers are actually to blame for the no smoking thing.
And I hate them for it.
– MPM
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“Any reduction in the population of future criminals is good. Nits make lice. Think of the money and life/lives saved even if 10% die before age 9. Like I said, Win-Win.”
The line between Criminals and Non-Criminals is completely blurred in this day and age.
G’s are the only ones that Win.
– MPM
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Racer X–
“The solution to all this is quite simple: follow my example. Do not get married and spend all of your life fucking as many woman as possible. There is no greater bliss on earth than fresh pussy.”
Yeah but.
But ooops pregnancies and child support.
If you’re the kind of alpha that gets there entirely on raw physicality and macho and are not otherwise so hot income or top half world status wise, then the risk goes down because the chances of her oopsing you, at least if you screw girls of higher socioeconomic background, are much lower. But they rise dramatically as your income does, and as the girls you play with get older, as e.g. you move into your late thirties and older.
For starters men need abortion rights too. All women have the right to an abortion during the first half of their pregnancy but no man has any rights at all as to whether she can stick him with child support, which generally amounts to 20% and in some states 25% of his BEFORE TAX income. That means like one third of his after tax. Note that while the formulas PRETEND to take the woman’s income into account they DON’T. It’s a feminist shame. It’s written out in words to hide the math. The mother’s income is in the numerator AND the denominator. It cancels out to a multiplicative 1. It’s irrelevant. It’s a fraud, like so much else in feminism.
(Remember or head of the entirely-made-up-out-of-whole-cloth NOW dictum, breathlessly and endlessly repeated in the media, that the most violent day of the year for women is Superbowl Sunday? It took a couple of years before that fraud was uncovered. Most people still don’t know about it, because it isn’t exactly repeated in the media.)
Men should have the right to abort their rights AND THEIR OBLIGATIONS to any child they didn’t agree to have. And no their fucking a woman, with or without a condom, does not constitute a commitment to child support the result any more than it today obligates the woman to bear the child to term. She can choose abortion, or unilaterally to give the child up for adoption. He shouldn’t be able to order her to have that surgical procedure but he should be able to abort any responsibilities or rights to that child.
I don’t support welfare either, at least not for more than a year or two.
And I think we need to return to a standard where birth control is basically the woman/girl’s responsibility. Among many other reasons only 1 of the 6 or 7 widely practiced methods of birth control are available for men to choose and that one is the one that’s most deleterious to the enjoyment of screwing for both partners, but esp. men. But also it’s simply what’s natural. Women are far chosier about sex partners than men of anywhere near the same level of attractiveness are, and far more demanding of some indications of commitment before agreeing to the sex act. Yes we’ve moved to maximal sluttiness in the West, but that’s easily changed among women. Responsibility for birth control would be a step towards less truly careless female sluttiness.
As a former semi or sometimes player, that sounds good to me. A middle course.
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Spain is one of the most PC nations on earth, by all measures. This is more a function of gender-blind PC than anything else. Not “Men’s Rights” but PC gender blindness, probably soon overturned.
Spain is ruled by a Socialist Government. Spain has basically surrendered to Islam, after the Madrid bombings, and has allowed Muslims to remain outside Spanish Law and even take over Catholic Cathedrals. Spain has among the lowest TFRs in Europe, around 1.1, matching Italy. Spain has a big, Islamic neighbor that covets it’s land and people (Morocco) without even the ability to begin defending itself. Spain has among the highest levels of abortions in Europe. Among the highest unemployment. G’s love for Spain is telling — decadence attracts like. A boring, middle class place has little use for much less attraction for a G. No offense, mind.
There is far less to this story than meets the eye. I am sure the Socialist Government will overturn the ruling, since Socialism is generally female-oriented “Mean Girl” consensus politics.
As for women to the tipping point, this is because women depend on their female social network, instead of husband and family. It’s no wonder they act like they do, and it’s at least a function of the destruction of family networks and marriage as it is “female fickleness.” Women were not always so, but they are now.
IF — Women today have low investment in their children. They don’t really care about them, which is why they pursue strategies known to produce poor results for kids, i.e. sleeping around with abusive/dangerous bad boys prone to beat the boys and molest the girls. Not to mention low sibling affection with different fathers for each kid.
This is because a daughter’s path to success now mostly relies on being “pretty” and extorting gender preferences from an expanding economy that can afford it, and a son’s path to success depends on being the most bad-boy aggressive person he can be for each socio-economic status slice.
Darwin does not care about “fitness” from a cultural or whatever perspective, only what produces the most descendants for a particular social/physical environment. A bunch of thug-aggressive low IQ men and stupid/pretty women can well be more “fit” reproductively than smart men and non-slutty, smart women.
Which is largely the case today.
What we are going to see out of this is a huge drop in male cooperation, investment in kids, respect for women, caring about kids, and things like that. Something between West Africa, British Underclass, and the Black American Ghetto is the future.
Sara — see above.
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Feb 18 should be a holiday.
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“As for women to the tipping point, this is because women depend on their female social network, instead of husband and family. It’s no wonder they act like they do, and it’s at least a function of the destruction of family networks and marriage as it is “female fickleness.” Women were not always so, but they are now.
IF — Women today have low investment in their children. They don’t really care about them, which is why they pursue strategies known to produce poor results for kids, i.e. sleeping around with abusive/dangerous bad boys prone to beat the boys and molest the girls. Not to mention low sibling affection with different fathers for each kid.
This is because a daughter’s path to success now mostly relies on being “pretty” and extorting gender preferences from an expanding economy that can afford it, and a son’s path to success depends on being the most bad-boy aggressive person he can be for each socio-economic status slice.”
Very interesting analysis, if only you forgot more about race and religion, you do have some profound things to say.
BTW there is no “West African” culture, if you are referring to Liberia and Sierra Leone, they are what they are, there is a war in Cote D’Ivoire that is a lot more civil and WWII-like with no child soldiers. You mentioned three cultures you felt were less then desirable, they are all urban, underclass cultures.
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Ohh yes lest I forget there is already a movement by this blog’s favorite “DC, female, lawyer types” to start a privacy movement for DNA testing. Some females have grasped the notion that with increased DNA testing the game is up.
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Just one more day until the weekend, so let’s start the fun with some GNP.
Peter
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Go Spaniards….
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Are you serious? said —
“Suggesting that all PUAs or contributors to this forum are misogynists ”
Hating much of feminism and disdaining sluts as long term relationship material is not REMOTELY equivalent to misogyny.
That is one tired old radical feminist trope.
In fact virtually none of what feminists have claimed to be misogyny. (I said virtually. There are rare exceptions.) What feminists really mean to do by charging misogyny left and right is to vilify any strong resistance to feminist, and certainly any reassertion of male machismo.
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In fact virtually none of what feminists have claimed to be misogyny, is.
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roissy,
“i try to steer clear of venues where pistol-whipping is a regular occurrence.”
It can happen anywhere.
Where do you prefer going out at night now?
Disneyland or Disney World?
-MPM
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Interesting post by Brian Beutler:
http://yglesias.thinkprogress.org/archives/2009/02/stark_contrast.php
“If a picture’s worth a thousand words, then two pictures are worth considerably less: Above, a bunch of Republican white dudes smile as they rob women of the right to seek a third trimester dilation and extraction, while below a black man, surrounded by a bipartisan, multi-ethnic array of women (and Steny Hoyer), gives women the right to equal pay for equal work.”
Here is the post he links to:
http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/01/29/a-story-in-pictures/
Roissy’s previous post on Beutler:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2008/07/04/blogger-shot-two-blocks-from-roissy-headquarters/
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Needless to say, the court decision brings joy to my heart. Taking child support from a man who is not the father of the children is grand theft, and should be treated as such.
Stick the bastard children in an orphanage if she can’t afford them. If you dont subsidize illegitimacy, you wont have nearly as much of it. She is a criminal in my mind, and should indeed be paying punitive damages for misleading both the kids and the man all these years.
Whiskey is very right about Spain’s demography. They are beginning to run out of time over there to make babies and keep Spain part of the West. The birthrate started really falling hard in the 80’s in Spain and hasn’t recovered yet. Thats been almost 30 years now.
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How did such a supposedly macho nation come to have such an abysmal birth rate?
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Needless to say, the court decision brings joy to my heart. Taking child support from a man who is not the father of the children is grand theft, and should be treated as such.
I’d take that analogy a step further: in the market of mating, a woman brings her reproductive ability as her primary asset, while a man brings his provider abilities as his primary asset.
So when a woman is raped and impregnated, her reproductive asset has been substantially despoiled/devalued.
This is why rape was always considered a horrible crime.
Well, what is cuckoldry but a woman devaluing/despoiling a mans greatest asset in the mating market…his provider abilities?
Cuckoldry is the equivalent to rape.
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How did such a supposedly macho nation come to have such an abysmal birth rate?
On that note, this heartless skank may be a philandering twat indeed, but a shockingly fertile one, in this milieu.
A patriot!
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“How did such a supposedly macho nation come to have such an abysmal birth rate?”
Birth control, women working and divorce being legalized.
“The birthrate started really falling hard in the 80’s in Spain and hasn’t recovered yet. Thats been almost 30 years now.”
It happened in most European countries.
Although:
The birth rate has climbed in 10 years from 9.10 births per 1000 people per year in 1996 to 10.9 in 2006.
Statistics are just that: Statistics.
You can skew them anyway you want.
Flavor Flav said it best: “Don’t Believe The Hype”
– MPM
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Well, yes, I understand the mechanics of how it happens– it just seems odd to assert that Spain is more macho than the Anglosphere, if the Spaniards are even worse than white Americans at knowing how to keep their wives barefoot and pregnant.
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(and thanks for the vid.)
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In a semi-related note, was Chris Brown justified in beating up Rihanna, if in fact, she gave him herpes? A beating can be recovered from, but herpes is forever.
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roissy-the-double-doofus
no it wouldn’t because cheating on a woman doesn’t saddle her with another woman’s kids.
What I’m saying (try to get it this time…hmmmm?) is that if pain and suffering can be mitigated legally by imposing monetary damages on the so-called perpetrator, leaving the so-called innocent victim the legal victor, then what is stopping people from taking other relationship issues to court? That may seem like a long shot, but I don’t see it that way. Why? Because I’m an idiot apparently.
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Here ya go, douche bags.
http://messageboards.ivillage.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=iv-rladultery&msg=43843.1
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we need another post about how women are the world’s biggest misogynists, not men
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Usually Lurking
Sara, idiot, remember, the mother screwed the children over. Not the non-father.
Save your insults. I already know that I am without a doubt an idiot which makes me not quite so idiotic as you. LOL
The universal law of attraction, which is greater than any man made made law (duh) states that the father was asking for it. Not consciously of course. But this case and the fact that he “won” removes all responsibility for the lack of trust and truthfulness in his relationship from his pathetic shoulders. In reality, he’s more responsible than she is. There you see? I AM an idiot. LOL
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Whiskey,
You are right about the socialist corruption of Spain. The greatest justice, perhaps divine, to me would be to see all those harpy feminists of the West being forced to submit to the patriarchal Islamic societies they so despise. Their own beliefs will help to bring on the Islamic takeover of certain areas of the West. The end of marriage for Westerners means fewer children which means the higher birth rates of Muslims is the future. The Muslims will be less sensitive to feminist needs.
Then again, I somehow think that these women would actually submit to the demands of these societies, simply because the men stood up to them. Somehow I think that might appeal to their need for a rigid moral structure.
I just plan to go on fucking what is left of the Western sisterhood.
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@dougjnn
I think you have a reading comprehension problem, which is probably why you don’t understand the true meaning of feminism. Many books on the subject contain sentences that are longer than 10 words.
I did not write “Suggesting that all PUAs or contributors to this forum are misogynists.”
I wrote “Suggesting that all PUAs or contributors to this forum are misogynists would certainly weaken my point about making blanket generalizations” to refute the suggestion that I said all PUAs and contributors were misogynists.
And I am aware that misogyny is defined as the hatred of all women, and as you so tastefully put it you only hate feminism (the belief that women are equal to men) and “disdain” sluts as relationship material. However, I was commenting on roissy’s comment that “ALL women are amoral” and to the constant disparagement of women that occurs on this site. Hatred can be implicit in actions as well as explicit.
For instance, why do you have to refer to promiscuous women as sluts, or as I have also read on this site “cumguzzling, knobgobling sluts?” Can’t you just not date them without expressing scorn? Or is it because your vocabulary is limited to four letter expletives and words whose meaning you aren’t clear on (“disdain,” “trope,” “vilify”)?
But do not worry. Once your movement of “male machismo” has squelched the fat, hirsute, feminazi movement, you and your compatriots can regress to knuckle-dragging and feral grunts. Then you won’t have to worry about pesky things like treating women equally, walking upright, or comprehending the English language.
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Whiskey, do you ever provide solid statistics for your assertions? If your hypothesis is correct, then why the hell has the teenage pregnancy rate in America dropped so much?
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G’s love for Spain is telling — decadence attracts like.
Decadence is what makes life worth living.
Decadence is what makes White people better.
Now let the DJ play the music and the Veuve Clicquot flow…
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What I’m saying is that if pain and suffering can be mitigated legally by imposing monetary damages on the so-called perpetrator…
Moron, she was not brought to court because he had his feelings hurt.
SHE KNOWINGLY STOLE HIS FUCKING MONEY!
As Husband and Father he is legally bound to provide for those children. Without knowing squat about Spanish law, I am certain of that.
But, of course, he was only father to one of them. So, the bitch needs to pay up.
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feminism (the belief that women are equal to men)
You are so right. I have become quite addicted to Feministing.com because of it’s dedication to equality:
It was amazing how much they loved the Duke Lacrosse “Rape” case, until, you know, it turned out that the girl was lying. Then,
“Kill those Nazi rapists,” http://www.feministing.com/archives/005101.html
Actually, the authors response in the comments was even better.
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So you support letting the injustice done to the man slide? He “had” the kids? WTF are you talking about? THEY AREN’T HIS KIDS!
You bitches just want us to pay, pay, pay no matter what you do. Why can’t the woman pay this time? Is that so cruel?
Add up 15 years of child support for two kids here in the US. Let’s be conservative and say $700 per month. That comes out to $126,000. If he makes good money it could easily be twice that. And if they aren’t his kids the woman just stole several hundred thousand dollars.
If women don’t think they should be responsible for their actions why should they ever be allowed to have any positions of authority at all?
You show your lurid colors, Sara. No wonder you’re twice divorced.
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G Manifesto,
More Mexicans to America is Upside:
…
Hotter Girls
I see shit like this I just laugh. We gettin’ Aztecs, bro, not the Spanish-descended gameshow hosts on Univision.
Of course, for all I know you consider five feet tall women with thick torsos, flat faces, stubby legs and dull eyes hot.
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All I’m sayin’ Welmer, dear, is that the courts is not the place to go go 9 times out 10; or maybe 10 times out of 10. The number of laws and laws suits is directly proportional to how devolved and irresponsible people are.
Did I say she was not responsible? Nope.
He “had” the kids? WTF are you talking about? THEY AREN’T HIS KIDS!
I said HAD them in his life. Read for comprehension, hmmmm? Being a father is more than biological; hmmmmmmmm? There are many sperm donors out there (her lover for example) who don’t deserve the label. This man does; or did rather.
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For example, Welmer, I was awarded seven years of alimony from my ex-husband and took only three years, because I felt seven years was excessive. I wanted enough time to re-establish the career (or start a new one) having quit my career when our daughter was born. See, honey, I walk the walk, though I’ve no doubt you’ll disagree.
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Being a father is more than biological; hmmmmmmmm?
being a mother is more than carrying the child of a rapist, hmm?
being a mother is more than getting implanted with the fertilized egg of another woman and carrying it to term and raising it for 18 years, hmmmmmm?
ya dumb fucking useless cunt.
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Not that it matters, (she owes him anyhow) but how *does* a guy manage to be so oblivious as to not know his wife is cheating on him for six entire years?
You can understand how a cuckold might not notice the foul-play conception of one kid, but to have three children fathered right under your nose?!
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@racerx – i’m flattered. but i think chic’s on one coast and i’m on another, so i’ll stick with purple saguaro and his friend magic bullet for now.
@roissy – the problem with kids left by the wayside as a result of lack of parental resources is that they become *our* problem – men and women taxpayers. i guess it’s better than putting the whole financial load on some beta who never even fathered the bastards, but i still don’t like it.
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@Usually Lurking
I detect a note of sarcasm? Just as I am sure that this blog does not encompass the entirety of your belief system on women (at least I hope not), the femilisting.org site, “I shot Andy Warhol,” and “the Feminine Mystique” do not capture the belief systems of most feminist women.
All groups have a reactionary branch, but I don’t assume that the Christian fundamentalist groups that blow up abortion clinics have the same ideology as the Christian dude that says a Hail Mary during March madness.
Some men are so begrudging of a woman’s right to be her own person even though the feminist movement has led to more free pussy then your forebearers and women who both bring both income and housekeeping to a family they still resent it.
Do you really think it was better back then? Women still talked back, withheld sex, cheated on men, and born bastard children out of wedlock. The only difference is that you were stuck with them for life, most loose women wouldn’t give it up without payment, and rape laws pushed the victims.
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hmmm… posted a comment that’s awaiting moderation. besides o m e g a, what words trigger roissy’s filter?
included in my prior post: p u r p l e s a g u a r o, b a s t a r d, l o a d.
any ideas folks?
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roissy: “ya dumb fucking useless cunt.”
AWESOME. please talk dirty more often.
on the real, though, wouldn’t you say a father who adopts an infant with his wife (and therefore has no genetic contribution to the kid) can still have an incredibly profound and meaningful relationship with and attachment to that child???
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“the problem with kids left by the wayside as a result of lack of parental resources is that they become *our* problem”
then the gov’t should stop subsidizing women (monetarily and legally) to put themselves in situations that are more conducive to kids being left by the wayside. like some famous economist said, if you subsidize something you get more of it.
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oh, I hope he didn’t ban the p u r p l e s a g u a r o; its very presence was making me feel a little pleasantly flushed, entirely against my will.
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@chuck – i agree. i also think they should stop the tax system penalizing marriages where the mom stays home. i don’t pretend to be an economist, so who knows how they can accomplish this goal, but it shouldn’t cost more for a married couple to have the wife stay at home (if they wish) and fulfill roles as a mother and caretaker.
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aw, but comparing adoption to cuckoldry is pretty messed up, from the guy’s POV. Lots of people decide NOT to adopt because they decide they cannot love an adopted child like their biological child.
And those who do make that choice were, mostly, not deceived about it.
(some of them do engage in cringeworthy levels of Blank Slatism, but that’s their own fault.)
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Sara I —
“For example, Welmer, I was awarded seven years of alimony from my ex-husband and took only three years, because I felt seven years was excessive.”
Sara you are showing that you are an individually fairer woman in a very unfair extremist American feminist legal system and culture, particularly in California.
The largest point I’d make is that the idea that you deserve ANY alimony at all unless he specially promised it in a pre nup is to me an obscene illustration of California hyper leftist feminism gone totally haywire — and SEVEN YEARS!!!??
In this feminist work enabled era? Rentier feminist class in California much? Complete female oppression. I’d counsel revolution. Violent revolution if needs be.
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Dang, doug.
I’d push for spousal support if I got divorced, too– marrying at 21 and having kids at 22, all while following the husband around the country pretty much wrecked whatever semblence of career I ever had.
It would take a few years to re-establish an independent income in such an awful event.
But, not all is lost.
If not for the assumption that women can, should, and must work, don’t you think the court system would be likelier to order lifetime alimony? On the grounds that we’re as helpless as children?
Paying off an ex for five years seems much kinder than being obliged to support her till death do you part.
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“i also think they should stop the tax system penalizing marriages where the mom stays home.”
what do you mean?
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Kato — Look it up yourself at the CIA World Factbook. They have TFR for each nation. Algeria and Tunisia and Iran btw last time I checked were 1.7. Replacemet rate is 2.1.
Sara — you can’t order the man to love kids not his. He doesn’t. He was told the truth, and does not love kids not his but some other man’s. No law or woman can make a man love kids not his own.
So, that’s how it plays out. Look at the bright side: no one got murdered. Yes I’m serious. Women have no clue how violent men can be. Really.
The playground of promiscuity and decadence = lots and lots of violence. Check out Brazil
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Look folks, this is a simple, open and shut case of fraud, just like in any other instance; one party is being mislead about a state of affairs where he is being asked to spend his money on assets he thought he ha a stake in, and in reality he did not.
Of course, the argument will be made, and is being made in most American courts, that the kids’ interests come before that of the putative father’s. Personally I think such reasoning actually works *against* said interests of the kids, because they too are being cheated out of their birthright. And of course, the guilty party gets off the hook, the cheating Woman.
A key component of Game as taught by Mystery is that Women are not wired to accept personal responsibility when it comes to matters related to sex/reproduction. This is explained in his book, and he goes on to say that the Man must then be prepared to assume the full weight of things should he wish to obtain the objective, in that case, bedding her.
If one accepts his arguments, it then makes perfect sense as to why something so straightforward as Paternity Fraud, which can be so easily rectified by a simple Q-tip, is so vehemently opposed by various Feminist groups and their allies in the courts and lawmaking bodies accross the country.
While one can lament the lac of a sustained and organized response on the part of Men’s Rights groups, I think the most appropriate response may already be happening: Men in increasing numbers simply opting out. Already, estimates countrywide put arrears for child support in the billions of dollars, and while I certainly don’t think it right for Men to shirk their responsibilities, I cannot in good conscience condone a system that so haphazardly and so deliberately socks it to Men regardless of the circumstance or actions on the part of the mothers, of which cheating and by extension, birthing the children of her lover(s) is only a small part. Indeed, even on this score, Women who are ordered to pay child support often are delinquent even *more* than are Men, and of course, one is hardpressed to recall any instance where a deadbeat mom was hauled off to the holding cells.
Mystery’s theories are deeply rooted in evolutionary psychology/biology. Again, if one accepts his views, then the issue is clear-Women are incapable of taking personal responsibility in these matters. This is not meant as a personal attack or value judgement, but an assessment based on the actions of Women as reported in stats and media/courts.
Comment or reply, holla…
The Obsidian
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Usually Lurking – feminism (the belief that women are equal to men)
You are so right. I have become quite addicted to Feministing.com because of it’s dedication to equality:
It was amazing how much they loved the Duke Lacrosse “Rape” case, until, you know, it turned out that the girl was lying. Then, “Kill those Nazi rapists,” http://www.feministing.com/archives/005101.html
Actually, the authors response in the comments was even better.
All you need to know about feminism can be found in the comparison of the feminist reaction to the Duke rape hoax and the real story of Eve Carson.
Google her name and ask yourselves why all the feminists and the media went berserk over the black prostitute’s lies yet almost completely ignored what happened to the student body president at Univ of North Carolina.
It’s simple – liberalism and feminism is all about hating White heterosexual men……..and the women who marry them and have their children. That’s all there is to it.
Which is OK, but let’s not lie about it.
Wounded Animal
G Manifesto,
More Mexicans to America is Upside: Hotter Girls
I see shit like this I just laugh. We gettin’ Aztecs, bro, not the Spanish-descended gameshow hosts on Univision.
Of course, for all I know you consider five feet tall women with thick torsos, flat faces, stubby legs and dull eyes hot.
This is so true. The difference between the Univision Amazons and the brown round hill women and their families coming over the border couldn’t more dramatic.
db – on the real, though, wouldn’t you say a father who adopts an infant with his wife (and therefore has no genetic contribution to the kid) can still have an incredibly profound and meaningful relationship with and attachment to that child???
“on the real?” Yes he can, so to speak. But she is exploiting his paternal and altruistic instincts to her advantage.
Women will find an alpha male to fuck and then find a beta male to feed her and the alpha fucker’s kids.
Some men like this arrangement. Then again some men like having their women use a strap on on them.
Either way they are pathetic losers.
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OMW–
This whole idea that men owe support to women who either leave them or can no longer keep them ( probably because they either aren’t having sex with them, are amazingly emotionally abusive which American women are WAY more than American men, have blown up to be repulsively fat warpigs, all of the above, or have gone off prospecting for they think a better man, or plan to) is way outdated. Support yourself feminist enabled American woman.
Make life choices on that basis. It’s YOUR responsibility. Or else the whole culture could change back to real patriarchy, and either rules or extreme cultural injunctions against female middle class and above work, under most circumstances (as before the 1940s, with the 20’s and 30s being female empowering decades under very larger other than feminist forces going on).
The current system is extremely unfair to men in many cases, and unfair under most.
The extremely unfair cases generally involve high earning and also huge hour working men supporting not working at all or only for status/stimulation wives who have infants and then take a lover and then take their husband to the cleaners. That kind of thing is the worst and now common but there are many gradations.
Also get not child support. Unless he wants to give it. (and I would support my kids at least if I’d lived with them beyond toddler into real person hood, but I’d do it with a REAL joint custody (joint decision making) arrangement on pain of money cuttoff. Well I’d prefer the law enforced that but that’s a second derrivative pipe dream in these hyper feminist times.
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OMW —
When you were getting “support” i.e. alimony (notice how the PC always want to create a euphemism) did you ever stop to know how large a percentage of his income that was. And then there was child support too, which isn’t tax deductible.
How much of his AFTER TAX income was that (you know the only kind you can actually spend)?
Or didn’t you ever even care?
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Ah, well, it is true that a person must make choices based on risk/reward in the social and legal climate in which one lives, and it makes little sense to have children with someone you think is a major divorce risk.
For some people, this means never having any children at all. This is sad for them, I suppose.
But yes, I think that turning mothers, and the women who should have been mothers, into a conflicted class of mediocre worker drones has been very, very bad for civilized society. I do not know if anything short of total civilizational collapse will reboot this error.
Onward!
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Doug, I’ve never had any alimony/child support/spousal support. I was divorced at 19 after a six-month marriage (no children) but that was a very simple, straightforward thing. Both of us walked out with the same stuff we carried in.
If my husband filed for divorce tomorrow, matters would not be so simple. Babies always complicate everything.
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And, really, toddlers are real people.
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Roissy, I’d like a reward for inspiring this post. Let’s go sarging. Email me.
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I saw that quite clearly, and considered it before responding. I read it as an attempt on your part to foist paternity on the poor guy.
So for being a good man he gets a double-whammy? Not only did his wife cheat him, but he has to pay support as well because he “deserves the label” of father? Do you have any concept of justice at all?
Jesus, you must have had a good attorney.
I’ll give you one thing, Sara: you must have been an impressive piece of ass to pull off what you did.
BTW, although this may make me look like a total beta to a lot of guys here, I have to admit that when you get attached to a child it would be extremely painful to reject him/her even if it isn’t yours (hasn’t happened to me, but I do get very attached to children). HOWEVER, that doesn’t mean a man should be made to pay for it. That a court would order a cuckolded man to pay for a child that isn’t his is a gross injustice, especially considering that child support is supposedly based on the responsibility one takes on for fathering children — not on having been tricked by some slut.
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@chuck – basically, congress has historically penalized a married couple with only one income earner compared to a married couple with two income earners (or an unmarried couple with two income earners living together raising a kid). it’s a tough dilemma, because i do sympathize with couples where both parents really need to work (and they need the tax break to help with extra expenses like childcare).
they’ve worked to remedy this issue (bush’s tax programs helped somewhat, if i recall), but i don’t think they’ve yet found a meaningful solution.
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weird. sorry for the handle change. i’m still new to all this.
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OMW
“If my husband filed for divorce tomorrow, matters would not be so simple. Babies always complicate everything.”
It’s much more likely in America that you will be filing tomorrow, or five years from tomorrow.
You will be told that you have NO obligation to your husband, who is primarily or entirely supporing you and your babie(s) to have sex with him. ( SAY WHAT??) It’s entirely up to him to make you want to, because your emotions should rule everything between you, unlike his, which are unimportant.
If while you refuse to have any sex at all with your husband, and very possibly much emotional envolvement either (it’s not mostly but 100% about the baby, and if you don’t like it pound impotent sand sucka American husband) as many American women do after birth and feel perfectly entitled to do and to still be entitled to the full support, in every way, of their husband, OF COURSE none of that would be your fault.
We have a disgustingly one way, feminist way, family law system in America at this time. It needs to change.
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Well, what are you doing about it, doug?
I agree the structure of the Western family is in shambles, but do you think the legal and political system is even remotely capable of reforming itself or the family it purports to govern?
I don’t.
So, I do my best to have a strong marriage, raise a sizable batch of good kids, seek rest in the ancient paths, and let the rest of the fools take care of themselves.
If you have some outlet that allows you to improve the world, then by all means, do it. If sniping at random strange women on the internet is it, though, then I guess that’s all right, too.
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Db:
I’m just wondering b/c I had never heard that before. I knew there was a marriage penalty, but I didn’ t know it had anything to do with whether the woman was single. By the looks of this below, it seems that a couple with both people earning about the same has the highest tax penalty. If this is the case (anyone else who knows the tax code feel free to correct me) it’s yet another incentive given by the government to screw men over (since it makes it less beneficial to have a second (female) income).
http://marriage.about.com/od/finances/a/marriagepenalty.htm
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OMW —
You are making me like you OMG.
Real.
No it’s not easy. We do have way to much unbalanced feminism, of that I’m sure, but NO I don’t want to go back to the fifties or whenever.
Can we work together?
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In my opinion, people are way too dependent on the government to solve family problems. Whatever the divorce laws are, nobody is forcing any of you to marry a whore. There are women out there who aren’t interested in taking a man to the cleaners.
The problem is those women are working and going to school, and/or finding guys who aren’t screwed up to marry or live with. While you’re out there looking for someone “hot”, some guys with healthy sex drives are looking for women who are pretty enough to do the job, but more importantly, good.
You can live in a fantasy world as much as you like, but that won’t change what the real world is. Marry/cohabit with a decent woman, and you don’t have the problem of alimony or even child support if you don’t want it.
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And anyway, I think the embarrassingly broken state of the Western family is, as they say, a feature and not a bug, for virtually every ambitious political figure and gimpy civil-servant you can think of.
Feminists, of themselves, hardly ever get anything done. Their ability to catfight over irrelevant horseshit is pretty well-known, no?
Other leftist groups will pump certain of them up to further the chaos and their own self-serving ends, but if you’ve met enough “feminist activists” you’ll know that they are entirely too flaky to get anything done on their own.
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chuck – it’s confusing to me as well, and it seems to change with every new president we get. i think it’s changed from the situation you describe (as hinted at in the about.com article), though the article doesn’t go into depth re how it’s changed. if the article you linked to is right, we’ll see what happens in 2010.
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Thanks, doug. Very kind of you. And no, we can’t work together– don’t you know men and women cannot be friends?? 😉
Kthulah’s right. There are actually lots of decent women out there.
Game seems to teach men how to pick up good-looking women, but not how to tell if they’re decent people worth sticking out more than just one part of your body for.
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Wounded Animal
“I see shit like this I just laugh. We gettin’ Aztecs, bro, not the Spanish-descended gameshow hosts on Univision.
Of course, for all I know you consider five feet tall women with thick torsos, flat faces, stubby legs and dull eyes hot.”
Sounds like you know a different part of Mexico than I do.
I roll with the fly ones.
Stay out of Carlos Murphys.
Go to the high end spots.
If you need help getting in, let me know.
– MPM
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We aren’t getting Aztecs. We’re getting Mayan fatties or fatties in the making, Chiapas dwarfs. Aztecs maybe I could take.
Anyway the numbers are way too large. Which is why they’re illegal. Not like we wouldn’t democratically agree to allow in some, actually quite a whole lot, of Mexicans and Central Americans.
There’s a conspiracy to let the illegals in, and to absolutely demonize anyone who wants to either effectively block the flow or evict them (RACIST!!!!). It’s a Jewish led, but by no means only Jewish composed, conspiracy. It’s leftist, as all Jewish lead social movements are (and as all major leftist Western social movements have been).
Jews across all poltitical divides, from neo-con to far leftist, want to let illegals come in without any real restrictions.
Why? Well there’s the cheaper (and far less hostile and entitled than blacks) housekeepers and nanny and yard worker reason. But even more there’s the MAKE AMERICAN WILLING TO TAKE IN ALL ISRAELIS IF THERE’S A SECOND HOLOCAUST to Arabs in the Middle East reason. And the historical reason, when yeah America saved a lot of Jewish hides in the run up to and resolution of WWII (mostly the smartest and richest ones, but should feel incredibly guilty for not saving all Jews because, well just because America claims to be good.)
Yuup. Well there are also Catholic lobbies and so on, but take away the Jewish lobby and it’s huge hold on the media, and virtual veto power, and it would be way, way different.
BTW, I’ve had two Spanish -American, that is to say, hot Puerto Rican American, girl friends in my time. Me hate on Latinos? Don’t thinks so.
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Me hate on Jews?
My ex wife was Jewish.
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Chuck
we need another post about how women are the world’s biggest misogynists, not men
Do you not see the irony in your statement? It’s kind of like saying, “Our relationship would be great if it wasn’t for YOU.” Funny stuff.
db
roissy: “ya dumb fucking useless cunt.”
AWESOME. please talk dirty more often.
Nice smile, db.
doug
In this feminist work enabled era? Rentier feminist class in California much? Complete female oppression. I’d counsel revolution. Violent revolution if needs be.
Are you on T? If there were a violent revolution, change would occur in spite of it, not because of it. We should look to other cultures perhaps who have better relationships between men and women. We should look at what works, not this obsession with what does not. How do we learn best? By example.
Welmer
That a court would order a cuckolded man to pay for a child that isn’t his is a gross injustice, especially considering that child support is supposedly based on the responsibility one takes on for fathering children — not on having been tricked by some slut.
So why don’t they go after the lover for back child support? If this is all about legalities and not revenge (which of course it is) why not go after the biological father? He must have had some clue they were his.
btw I had no lawyer in my divorce. He figured out what was half of our assets and I trusted him on that, not being an accountant type. We used a document service. It was quite peaceable, considering. My ex and I are great friends and of all the men I’ve been with (not very many) I’m glad I had a child with him. I love him as a friend. Having things work out that way doesn’t make headlines. Negative dramatic bullshit is far sexier to most people.
although this may make me look like a total beta to a lot of guys here, I have to admit that when you get attached to a child it would be extremely painful to reject him/her even if it isn’t yours (hasn’t happened to me, but I do get very attached to children)
Don’t worry, Welmer. It takes balls to admit you’ve got a heart these day. Jesus! WHY reject a child if it’s painful? The pain is telling you….don’t do it. The child is innocent. Give me a break.
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OMW
Game seems to teach men how to pick up good-looking women, but not how to tell if they’re decent people worth sticking out more than just one part of your body for.
An astute observation. Hormones don’t tell us much except who we are chemically attracted to, and if that’s all you’re paying attention to, you end up with half a life. All this obsessive sensation seeking is making people insensitive to deeper truths. Also, the women who gets swooped by game, is caught up in the same sexually addictive cycle. She doesn’t know jack shit about who is gaming her either, but before you know it, they are either addicted to each other (their own chemistry basically) or on to the next hormone high with someone else. .
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Sara,
You must understand that what Men want is a measure of accountability extracted from the wrongdoing Female. This is important. It matters. And part of the reason why we have an ongoing bitter fued btw and among the sexes is in large part because far too many Women refuse to take the real interests and needs of Men seriously.
O
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whiskey
Sara — you can’t order the man to love kids not his. He doesn’t. He was told the truth, and does not love kids not his but some other man’s. No law or woman can make a man love kids not his own.
True enough in some cases, but don’t lump all men into the not capable of unconditional love category. I think this is why women are the ones who bear children perhaps? They’re more capable/wired for unconditional love? No law can make anyone love period, or make them not love if that’s the case.
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roissy
being a mother is more than carrying the child of a rapist, hmm? being a mother is more than getting implanted with the fertilized egg of another woman and carrying it to term and raising it for 18 years, hmmmmmm?
I 100% agree with you. Does that still make me a dumb fucking useless cunt.?
Just checking.
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Obsidian
Women refuse to take the real interests and needs of Men seriously.
I agree. There’s a lack of appreciation and respect on both sides of the coin. Too much the sexes are seen as opposites at war, rather than complements at peace. A simple flip of the switch, or mind, is all that’s needed. Media loves to create tension, war, discord, because people buy more shit when they’re unhappy in an attempt to assuage the pain. Life is supposed to be fun. Pull the plug on the TV and life gets sweeter.
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Sara,
To some extent I would agree w/you on the big media piece; I watch very little networ tv myself, and even when it comes to DVDs, I don’t watch much. I spend most of my off time, reading and the like.
But, and here I have to tip my hat to Whiskey’s work, the issue is more on the Female, than the Male side. The former watches more tv by leaps and bounds, than the former. Therefore, according to your premise, it is the Ladies that need to “unplug” a great deal more than we fellas do.
Holla back
O
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Well, how about this:
The guy keeps the kid if he chooses, and the slut and her boyfriend pay him child support to help raise the kid. Some people might look askance at the setup (to each his own), but it would be something approaching justice.
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roissy:
Actually, in some places in the Anglosphere, things have been much better than that. Damages for paternity fraud have already been awarded in at least one case in the UK:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2007/apr/04/law.world
However, there was a very recent seemingly contradictory precedent (the only difference is that the couple in the above story wasn’t married):
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/rachel_johnson/article5580589.ece
In Australia, there was a verdict similar to the Spanish one in 2006, but it was overturned on appeal. Still, the husband was released from the child support obligations for the kids who are not his, and what he had paid for them earlier was treated as overpayment — he was denied only the punitive damages for the wife’s fraud.
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2006/11/09/1162661797800.html
The situation seems to be much worse in Canada and most U.S. states. But in any case, DNA paternity testing is a relatively recent technology, and it will take a while for the relevant case law to accumulate, and possibly also for the legislatures to intervene. The present (IMO grossly unfair) trend is towards legislating limited windows of opportunity, usually two years after birth, after which it’s impossible to challenge paternity:
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1144414531354
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thanks, sara. it reflects my general sense of humor and lightheartedness at the posts on this blog.
though it amazes me that the comments evolve into these incredibly long-winded, detailed, well-researched and articulate discussions about economic, racial, social and gender issues.
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Dougjn — There a number of Jewish restrictionists, such as Robert J. Avrech, Jonah Goldberg, Mark Levin, and Mark Krikorian.
Jews have historic reasons and current reasons to oppose restrictions: the US refused admittance to the “Voyage of the Damned” … Jewish Refugees from Hitler who were sent back to Germany and the ovens. Many Jews have relatives in Israel who they would like America to be the refuge of last resort.
In any event, their influence is tiny compared to that of the Catholic Church which represents the Largest Christian component in the US and a critical social institution in most Democratic Districts.
Sara — You fail to grasp the essence of what has changed. DNA testing is a reality. It is cheap and easy, not as cheap or as easy as a condom or the pill but nearly so.
PROBABLY any Husband with doubts can swab or otherwise collect samples from kids and test if they are his or not.
Now, if they are not his, more than likely he is not going to be able to love what was foisted upon him. This is both simple biology and evolution, and a function of extreme individualism. What, the man has an obligation? Because you say so? Because he “cares” one way or another about female approval?
Let tell you what will be reality for most of these cases: bitter divorce, the man doing everything to conceal most of his assets, not paying any more than he can cheat/conceal, and zero, zilch, nada investment in the kids. Who won’t get anything either from the biological father. Who will likely get a parade of men through Mom’s bedroom who want them either out (another “useless” mouth to feed) or beaten or molested.
A very small percentage will end in horrific violence, one we are all familiar with.
A larger, but still small percentage will have the guy playing sucker.
But here’s the thing: men mostly won’t CARE about women’s approval. This is your fundamental assumption error and one that nearly all women make, particularly ones that are pretty or were pretty. They think that because men flatter them, pretend to care about what they think, solicit their opinions, that once the reality of cheating and another man’s kids not his own sets in, any of that will matter.
It won’t. And women are going to have to deal with the reality of DNA testing, and “best case” a bitter divorce with disappearing assets and zilch from the fake father, or worse. The idea that women can “gay men up” to actually care about social approval of women they are very unlikely to sleep with (or act as gatekeepers for same) is something only women could come up with.
[Rest assured men have their own delusions about women, equally as stupid but their stupidity takes different courses.]
The reality of DNA testing is that cheating producing kids not the husbands will be found out, probably now quickly, with home paternity tests probably coming up as quickly as home pregnancy tests appeared.
The probable outcome will be marriage contracts stipulating no alimony, no support, if the kids are not his. Pre-Nup clause #1.
Women have wanted to destroy the nuclear family, and the idea of monogamous marriage, since well the 1950’s. Along with various Wealthy Yuppie “Rebels” (actually rich elitists) they have largely succeeded. This is it.
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“Spain is probably the dopest country on earth.”
Yeah, if by “dopest” you mean flat broke and being invaded by hordes of immigrants (meaning Spain will thus soon cease to exist as a nation as soon as the Spanish people are gone).
But yes it does have its good points.
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Willard Libby: “liberalism and feminism is all about hating White heterosexual men……..and the women who marry them and have their children. That’s all there is to it.”
And what group is massively liberal and feminist in America, leading the charge so to speak at the dispossession of White heterosexual men and women? No use denying the facts: it’s Ashkenazi Jews. They also have massive influence over the mass-media, academia, law and the courts, various cultural areas, and the macrofinancial sectors.
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Whiskey will now spring to the defense of Jews and may be mocked when he reaches the topic of Hollywood. (WASPy Harvard, etc)
To me, a more defensible thesis would be that modern American liberalism is descended from a very WASPy sort of liberal univeralism, combined with later Jewish radicalism.
Both were necessary, but individually insufficient elements for liberalism’s existence.
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Whiskey, do you post regularly on any other sites?
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Both things happened in brazil almost at the same time. A female judge made the cuckolded husband pay child support even after DNA because she cared for the children and a male judge made a cheating wife pay for the money her husband spent on the children
the feminist onslaught is very recent in latin America and is mostly a result of cultural imperialism in the Clinton Administration. Even IMF loans depended on adoption of laws protecting women, natives, rainforests and so on, among other conditions.
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There a number of Jewish restrictionists, such as Robert J. Avrech, Jonah Goldberg, Mark Levin, and Mark Krikorian
Isn’t Kirkorian an Armenian-descended Christian?
Jonah Goldberg is good on occasion but by real conservative standards, he’s a liberal. Lawrence Auster has a good name for most of the NRO types: right-liberals
Auster, by the way, is an excellent restrictionist who is Jewish by birth (presently a convert to Episcopalianism, as I recall it)
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historic reasons and current reasons to oppose restrictions: the US refused admittance to the “Voyage of the Damned”
That’s bullshit logic on their part. Immigrants and their descendants should be loyal to their host nation, not to foreigners.
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Jews have historic reasons and current reasons to oppose restrictions
So hey, how do they feel about unconditional Arab immigration into Israel?
I think this is why women are the ones who bear children perhaps? They’re more capable/wired for unconditional love?
Common sense and experience indicate that female capabilities for “unconditional love” are overstated. They initiate the vast majority of all divorces – where is the unconditional love for what in most cases is a perfectly decent, loving (and lovable) husband, eh? Oh, he is a disposable beta provider. Buh-bye!
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There is only one kind of unconditional love among humans: a mother’s love for her newborn baby. That’s it. All other love is conditional.
Houellebecq goes into that in “Elementary Particles.”
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Just a thing though. I don’t think this kind of ‘gender justice’ is really a trend in Brazil; although it’s true that feminism isn’t as strong in here, it is only growing, and I doubt a brazilian judge would have made this decision.
This has a lot to do with the recent (90s-00s) power shift to the left and its accompanying social movements. A similar scenario might have happened 30 years ago, but definitely not today – definitely not in the richer regions, at least.
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When the so called “Vovage of the Damned” occured in 1939, essentially no one at the time believed the people on board were in danger of their lives. Very few countries in the 1930s were taking in refugees for any reason. There was indeed some anti-semitism in the US, but a ship full of refugee Albanians would not likely have been welcomed either.
Smart women politicians should position themselves clearly on the side of men who have been tricked about the true paternity of the kids they have been led to support. This is only going to turn out one way.
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“Pull the plug on the TV and life gets sweeter.”
And you’re telling people to stop watching TV? Your comment was made at 3:48am. Try spending less time on the computer. That might help you out a bit.
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“I don’t really see how making her pay the equivalent of $286,000 U.S. makes any sense… it does give the message to the kids that he would take back all the money he spent in supporting them if he could. Also, depending on how old the kids are, this will hurt them… He’s basically saying as well that he wished he never had them in his life either.”
What about it don’t you get?
They’re someone else’s bastards that he mistakenly loved, raised, and spent his money on when he could’ve went off banging other chicks.
It’s a big “Fuck you and your fucking bastards!” They deserve a life of poverty if their real father is too much of a cad to support them and if their mother is too much of a stupid bitch to let herself get knocked up by a cad.
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@ Whiskey
You said:
I’m must disagree with several of your claims about Jewish influence.
First Mark Krikorian is not Jewish, but Armenian, as the following testimony demonstrates:
Second, strong Jewish pressure for mass immigration into the US predates any mistreatment of Jews by Nazi Germany. Jews fiercely resisted the Immigration Act of 1924 and were instrumental in causing massive 3rd World immigration by passing the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965.
Kevin MacDonald provides exhaustive documentation of this in Chapter 7 of his book The Critique of Culture.
See: Kevin MacDonald’s Books LINK
See: CoC: Chapter 7 LINK
Third, unlike the past near-universal Jewish consensus for mass immigration, NOW there is a small fraction of Jews trying to stop mass immigration, mostly because they observe the train wreck of Muslim immigration in Europe, with its increasing anti-Jewish violence, and have decided “it’s bad for the Jews”.
In spite our tanking economy, ever increasing unemployment AND the threat of Muslim violence against Jews, many major Jewish organizations are STILL pushing hard for mass immigration and amnesty RIGHT NOW. The following link includes many other links that point to the details, including a Jew that DOES oppose this amnesty madness:
See: LINK
Fourth, the US took many Jewish refugees before and during World War II. The following link quotes a 1991 book by Jewish authors stating the US accepted 200,000 Jewish refugees from 1933-1945.
See: remember.org (Holocaust site):
LINK
Fifth, regarding Jewish influence being tiny compared to Catholic Church influence, even just on the immigration issue, I must disagree. The RCC has limited power compared to the powerful influence of Jews through wealth, near full control of Hollywood and substantial influence in most newspapers, TV news, Wall Street, advertising, academia, government, foundations, etc. Many of the most prestigious and powerful positions are quite disproportionately staffed by Jews.
Jews are extremely disproportionately represented in elite universities, which then act as feeders into our elite institutions. e.g. around 35% of Harvard undergrads have Jews. See this for details and links.
The significant influence of cultural production in Hollywood for decades has partially “brainwashed” non-Jews from their natural interests toward favoring Jewish interests. For example, consider the massive number of sympathetic Holocaust references, including dozens of full length movies. The suffering of no other group or historical injustice receives such frequent attention, including the MILLIONS of Ukrainian and Russian Christians slaughtered with very disproportionate Leftist Jewish leadership (details in my blog post below).
Look at how the Neocons got us entangled in the Iraq War because they perceived that to be in Israel’s best interest using their media influence and placement in many sensitive government positions. It certainly made little sense for American interest. Was the Catholic Church able to stop the war in spite of its opposition?
Who do you think has predominantly created this propaganda war over the last 40 years pushing multiculturalism, mass immigration and hostility towards Whites having an ethnic identity like every other group?
Certainly there are other powerful non-Jewish forces pushing for mass immigration including big business, the RCC, non-Jewish Leftists and others, but historically the Jewish role has been extremely disproportionate and continues to be quite strong.
Or consider the massively disproportionate political contributions by Jews. The Republicans also receive significant funding, so whichever party wins, Jews have substantial influence.
See: J.J. Goldberg, Jewish Power
LINK
Browse through several pages around this (271, 276) to see discussion of the staggering sums that Jews contribute to both parties, particularly the Democrats (50%). And these numbers are from the mid-90s. The proportions went up during the recent bubble.
Don’t forget that most of the Jews that push these policies for the US, push very different policies for Israel. e.g. US is a universal nation while Israel is a Jewish ethnostate. Why doesn’t Israel take 300,000 Hispanics, Africans, Palestinians and Arabs per year until Jews aren’t a majority anymore?
I wrote a long blog post covering disproportionate Jewish influence with lots of links.
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Dougjnn, you wrote that …all major leftist Western social movements have been Jewish. Not so. The first and perhaps most influential of all, the Chartist labour movement in Englad in the early 19th century, which fought to get votes for “working” men, and better labour laws, was not led or inspired by Jews, or at least none important enough to have come down in history as famous names. Given the fact that the Chartists weren’t true revolutionaries, I don’t know whether I’d call it a leftist labour movement or not, but I suspect you probably would. Their goals looked revolutionary enough in their time.
Clio
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The English industrial revolution was brought about by new 1840’s technology – wheel driven cotton mills.
Liberals hypocritically embrace new technology, then damn it when it suits their political ends of the moment. like teh internet
Dickens’ novels were propaganda delivered by the most effective media method of the day. He was Keith Olbermann in a waistcoat and topper.
Odd, how he made Fagin a villain…
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Alias Clio–
Well dear Clio, if the the Chartist movement is the best you can come up with, you historian you, to counter my sweeping generalization, I’d say it was good enough for government work. Don’t ya think? -; xo
(Obviously that somewhat wine besotted rant should have had date qualifiers. Like since the Napoleonic wars or thereabouts.
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she was a hot, aspiring model. he was a bad boy into drugs. she got pregnant as a teenager, but neither she nor the baby survived.
the better question is how many guys feel that sorry for her, given the choices she made?
http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news/Pregnant_girl_murdered021909
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Whiskey said —
“In any event, their [Jews] influence is tiny compared to that of the Catholic Church which represents the Largest Christian component in the US and a critical social institution in most Democratic Districts.”
Clueless.
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“More Mexicans to America is Upside:
Hotter Girls”
You have not been to Mexico then. Or Los Angeles for that matter. You can get back to skimming Wikipedia for new brand names to drop. Here’s a fertile entry: “List of Royal Warrant holders of the British Royal Family.”
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Out of curiosity, how does mass immigration benefits Jews?
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Wow, amoral and solipsistic indeed…
that bitch deserves to get ktfo for that
unreal… that kind of shit is criminal in my opinion. the fact that she was given an appeal is ridiculous… bitch should’ve got a right-cross instead
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Mass immigration benefits the ruling elites economically by crippling the middle class and depreciating the price of labor, politically by supplying socialist voters, and culturally by deracinating the country’s core ethinc group.
Mass immigration, particularly of incompatible newcomers, is a classic divide-and-conquer strategy of the ruling classes.
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PA:
Mass immigration benefits the ruling elites economically by crippling the middle class and depreciating the price of labor, politically by supplying socialist voters, and culturally by deracinating the country’s core ethinc group.
Mass immigration, particularly of incompatible newcomers, is a classic divide-and-conquer strategy of the ruling classes.
While I disagree completely with everything you’ve said, I do agree with your implication that it doesn’t benefit Jews at all, it benefits the rich, and there just happen to be an overlap between the two. I’m glad we can find common ground.
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The interesting question is, if the evidence points to a motivation for the rich, and any motivation for Jews is coincidental, why do people go harping on for eight or nine paragraphs at a time about Jewish conspiracy?
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I was reading Whiskey’s comments to Sara, and by and large I agree w/his major point. The technological genie is out of the bottle Ladies, and there’s no going back. Somebody on the Feminist side should have had the foresight to be able to see the very real possible of a “Roe for Men” and Daddy Testing as realities in the not too distant future, and what this could mean for their cause. By all acounts, they have not done this.
Daddy Testing is about as cheap as its ever been now, my understanding is that its only a few hundred dollars to have done, certainly worlds away cheaper than the standard divorce costs or for that matter, child support costs. And, its my understanding that you can get diy home tests similar to the home pregnancy tests.
Again: a major premise is that Women are simply incapable to taking personao responsibility in these matters, as a result of evolutionary dvelopment. If true, it would explain why something so simple is so hotly contested by large numbers of Women.
Comments?
O
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Mass immigration benefits the ruling elites economically by crippling the middle class and depreciating the price of labor, politically by supplying socialist voters, and culturally by deracinating the country’s core ethinc group.
Mass immigration, particularly of incompatible newcomers, is a classic divide-and-conquer strategy of the ruling classes.
This is right on target, and I am puzzled why Seeking Alpha disagrees completely with it.
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@ Seeking Alpha
To answer your question, some Jews were and are very suspicious of the White majority, thinking they are anti-Semitic Nazis just waiting to send Jews to concentration camps. Here’s an illustrative quote from Jewish activist and author, Earl Raab (I got this from Chapter 7 of “Culture of Critique”):
Obviously Mr. Raab believes Jews will be safer by living in a multicultural society where the share of the population of non-Jewish Whites is much smaller and has lost its hegemony over society, supposedly leading to increased Jewish safety.
Another proposed motive is that some Jews consider their prospects for group success to be greatly enhanced if they live in a divided multiethnic society instead of a strong non-Jewish ethnostate, like the US was 100 years ago. e.g. increased opportunity to gain power, wealth and avoid persecution.
Jews have been the sine qua non of the century long movement to dispossess European Americans in the US, while simultaneously advocating polar opposite policies for THEIR ethnostate of Israel. I think Gentiles need discuss these double standards and the disproportionate influence Jews have had, which has and will greatly harm our people. (e.g. the Iraq War would NEVER have happened without Neocons having primary loyalty to Israel infiltrated in several critical government positions combined with a relentless media campaign).
I’m not saying Jews are 100% responsible, but for 2% of the population, they’re probably something like 40-70% responsible.
Ashkenazi Jews are believed to have an average IQ of 113-115 which is nearly one full standard deviation about the White average of 100, very similar to the difference between the White (100) and African-Americans average (85). So part of the disproportionate success comes from superior average Jewish IQ, character traits, priority given to education, etc. But part clearly comes from ethnocentric favoritism, e.g. networking, preferring to choose other Jews in Hollywood, academia, Wall Street, MSM, etc.
See: Steve Sailer post LINK
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Where do you see large numbers of women objecting to paternity testing? (even the double-digit-IQ female audience watching “Maury Povich” loves to see a skank served a fat dose of public humiliation when five guys take the test and none of ’em are the baby-daddy.)
People in general take personal responsibility when it’s required of them, and don’t when it isn’t.
We’re in a period of rapid social change, and there ARE some people who are caught between the forces of the old system and the forces of the new.
It does indeed suck to be them, but I am not sure this means all women everywhere are intrinsically incapable of responsibility.
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But part clearly comes from ethnocentric favoritism, e.g. networking, preferring to choose other Jews in Hollywood, academia, Wall Street, MSM, etc.
As opposed to the nepotism of the non-Jewish elite in those industries? All peoples promote nepotism. It’s human nature.
This is right on target, and I am puzzled why Seeking Alpha disagrees completely with it.
Because – ignoring cycles – this country has never been richer. Because apparently mass immigration began with the Immigration Act of 1964 and liberal influence went down in a straight line from that time. Because we continue to be a net exporter of culture and I’ve yet to see the influence of Mexican culture on mainstream America.
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@Seeking Alpha
No, I and many other dispute your interpretation of the evidence. The evidence, much of it from Jewish sources, points directly to Jews having a significant impact, as I discussed previously.
Jews need to start honestly confronting this large mass of evidence because they are losing their 50-year hegemony on cultural production and the news media. Trying to pretend its all a fantasy or anti-Semitism won’t work much longer.
The emergence of Al-Jazeera English shows that the Muslims are strategically trying to break the current highly constrained range of coverage given in our MSM.
The increasingly obvious pathetic bias of our MSM and emerging Internet technologies for the masses will likely result in the emergence of alternative news sources that break MSM control and gain critical mass among the population.
The Muslims will likely fund a variety of “anti-Semites” throughout Europe and the US, particularly on the Left, to apply the same cultural critique to Jews that predominantly Jewish scholars have applied to White culture.
As more Gentiles look at the massive evidence of Jewish involvement in these different areas, they will be angered by the perceived betrayal of inviting Jews into their country in good faith and finding out they have aggressively reshaped these societies in their own interests.
Of course Jews have made a strategic blunder in flooding our borders with 3rd worlders because most of these immigrant populations are much more anti-Semitic than Whites.
Jews need to start being proactive in dealing with the truth.
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So do you actually believe there is some council of big-nosed media titans discussing their secret plans for cultural control of America, or is this just emergent behavior.?
I would be pretty pissed if I had to earn my success the hard way when I could have just put in an application for the Elders of Zion.
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OMW,
W/all due respect I don’t think you’ve actually read Mystery’s work or that of leading EPs in the field, or even much of Roissy’s work right here. If you had, it would have been difficult for you to respond in the way you have.
Moreover, wrt Maury, please note that no Woman is ever, ever, asked to account for her very bad choices. Sure, the peanut gallery gets its yuks in, but that’s about it. No one, including Maury himself, ever thinks to ask these Women some very basic questions about their behavior and actions. This is true accross the spectrum, and forms a huge part of the abortion debate: one simply cannot ask a Woman, why she makes and in many cases, continues to make, so many blatantly bad choices; the matter is not open to debate or even honest inquiry. It is a “shaming” tactic of the likes Whiskey has spoken of, and Daddy Testing has made it harder and harder to sweep such things under a rug.
Also OMW, please see the case of Matt Dubay. There you will find virtually unanimous support in favor of rejecting his case among the fem-blogosphere/orgs. If that ain’t overwhelming Female support, in this case, against something, I don’t know what is.
Yet another case in point was the Duke Lacrosse Rape Scandal, where major and leading voices in the feminist movement, online and off, refused to recant their statements in the face of clear and blatant abuses of the law against the accused, and more importantly the completely discredited testimony of the witness. Indeed, if anything, the hysteria was stepped up, not toned down in that case’s wake on the part of folks like Pandagon and Feministing.com.
Your serve…
The Obsidian
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Jewish conspiracy and paternity testing. Never a dearth of diverse topics to discuss here at Chez Roissy.
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Obsidian, if you think the women at Pandagon and Feministing and various “feminist” blogs and orgs are particularly representative of women in general, then I don’t know what to say to you.
That bunch censors comments and articles heavily, and women who don’t toe the ideological line are either ridiculed as yokels or banned as trolls.
You are not going to see a broad spectrum of women’s ideas in that kind of venue, much like you aren’t going to meet a representative sample of women at a nightclub.
Yes, they come from a social class that lends their insanity much more legitimacy than it deserves. (much, much, much more…) but their upper-middle class brethren are apparently not offering any sort of meaningful resistance, and many of them are just as deluded.
The thing of it is, this is the direction the country has been moving in for decades.
Everyone knows by now that attempting to publicly stand against the bulldozer mostly just results in slowing the ‘dozer down a little against our mangled corpse, and so most of us just have the sense to stand off to the side and watch it roll through town.
If it makes you feel better, you can always check out “Ladies Against Feminism” as an antidote to the quagmire that is Pandagon.
Or any of a number of sites devoted to the quiverfull movement. Or Mike and Debi Pearl’s books about wifely submission.
These people don’t have the social and political clout to make their ideals go mainstream, but, who knows, let the current system collapse a little more and it may be the “fundies” who inherit the earth.
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@Seeking Alpha
No, I don’t think there is a grand conspiracy. But yes, many influential Jews are quite aware of what they’re doing. Come on, not every Gentile is a complete idiot.
Growing up in the 70s and 80s and watching TV it was hard to miss all the derogatory and snide comments and treatments of Whites and Christianity while Jews and Rabbis were NEVER portrayed disrespectfully. e.g. In the movie “Oh, God!”, the Christian minister is a hypocritical, loud mouth, phony buffoon, while God is a wise-cracking Jewish guy (George Burns).
There are many movies, including many classic comedies like Animal House, Caddyshack, Revenge of the Nerds, The Bad News Bears, etc, that essentially denigrate Whites, WASPs, Protestants, Christians, etc, while showing Jews as superior, witty, etc, and frequently a major theme is the displacement or defeat of boring, stuffy WASPs by a Jewish-led multicultural collection.
A more recent example with much more overt contempt and hatred of Whites and Christians was Harold & Kumar Go To White Castle. Here’s a snippet from my blog entry:
I urge everyone to watch this movie and consider these extremely obvious subtexts.
It’s one thing to make fun of yourself but quite another to savagely attack another group, at least according the our current politically standards, EXCEPT for Whites, that is.
Another example is Law & Order which grossly inverts the normal statistical reality of NYC murders by having an extremely large number of White murderers, frequently WASPS. They even had the gall to make the killers White in their Witchita Massacre episode (this was a brutal, murder, torture and rape of a group of seven White men and women by two Black brothers that was suppressed by the MSM–we all know if the identities had been interchanged it would’ve been headline news for a year or two, i.e. through any trials and beyond).
Regarding Jewish control of Hollywood, etc:
See: Joel Stein, “How Jewish is Hollywood”
LINK
Gotta love Mr. Stein’s conclusion:
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And, speaking of the Pearls, from what I understand, “Created to Be His Help Meet” is basically about how to “game” one’s own husband, by pushing his authority/protector/lover buttons instead of hassling him half to death.
Women who’ve read it freakin’ RAVE about it, give away copies, because they feel its power is that transformative.
You will not see these women’s viewpoints represented on the ever-so-inclusive Feministing.
You will not see the Pearls flatteringly interviewed in the New York Times.
One of these days I will have to finagle myself a copy, but not when my husband can see it. 😉
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I saw Harold & Kumar. What a loathsome bilge. I felt like I needed a shower after watching it.
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You have far too much time on your hands, my friend. I’m sorry if life has been unkind to you, but blaming it on others will never make you happy. It’s never too late to be successful in America.
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Aw, SA, you don’t have to be an unemployed cretin to notice that entirely too many Jews are balls-deep in subverting whatever is left of white gentile morals and morale.
Dunno what is so fun about it, except that it’s like a guaranteed win. But one would expect it to get old after awhile.
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@Seeking Alpha
Again. Jews need to proactively deal with the facts because their hegemony in culture and media is diminishing every year.
You’re not fooling anyone with straw men, ad hominem and changing the subject without confronting any substantive issues.
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OMW,
I am making a note of the book you mentioned; idea to Roissy if he’s reading along: you game to comparitively analyze said book and “The Rules”? I think that would make for an interesting discussion.
Going back to the main point, fair enough, OMW-how about Oprah? I think it fair to say that she certainly speaks to the broad spectrum of American Women’s interests, yes? And, I actually think she would be far more in agreement than disagreement, w/the likes of Feministing and Pandagon, but that’s another debate for another day.
My point is simply this: WHY DIDN’T WE SEE A SPECIAL OF HER SHOW DEVOTED TO THE DUKE TRAVESTY? We certainly saw Oprah devote quite a few shows to the Imus flap, and while I defended Imus I don’t begrudge Oprah’s right to air her view. I think we all know the reason why the nation’s leading “women’s voice” didn’t see fit to shine a light on the Duke issue, and neither did most of the media either, OMW. To ask the question, is to answer it.
Now to be sure, I’ve never been one to go in for conspiracy theories. But when one sees things like Duke go down, almost uncontested, it really makes you wonder.
I know it does, for me.
O
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I’m not trying to ‘fool’ anyone. I have no idea if a conspiracy exists or not and I don’t really care. I’m at the start of a successful career and I don’t think my religion (or identity really – I’m agnostic) will either help or hinder it at all. As long as in thirty years I’m well-off with a stable family and healthy kids, I’ll be happy.
And OMW – no one can take your morals from you. You can only give them up. Morals only come from culture when there is an absence of morals coming from parents. A gentile child growing up in a strong family and a religious background will do just fine morally.
Or do you believe in a victim mentality?
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Jews are running the media and finance. They are the main supporters of mass-immigration. You live in self denial if you ignore this.
Jews are unable to prevent any individual of succeding on his own merits. Unless, of course, you broadcast 24 hours a day your anti-semitism, but nobody, I mean NOBODY, has the necessity to talk about jews working as a lawyer, trader, doctor, whatever. By being personally succesfull you can shield yourself from the effects of jewish activism (crime, for example).
My personal conclusion: worry about the jews generates bitterness and bitterness is betaness. Send text messages to 5 guys to go a carnival party tonight, 2 of them jews, well, it is better than blog about their leftism, which is indeed true.
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db….
I would be quite happy just watching you play with your purples pleasure toys…
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dude, I have no idea. I’ve never seen Oprah. And none of the twentysomething women I know, or any of the older women in my family watch it either.
Shrug.
Yes, fighting back against the ever-creeping pop-leftism that is Western Civilization takes either some crazy or some guts or a little of both.
But I don’t think you can simply point a finger at women as a whole.
The men who ought to have put a stop to it generations ago apparently liked the newfound “enlightened” freedom to fuck around more than they were sorry to see their previous patriarchal authority fade.
And I see no reason to think they’re going to do anything about it now.
If you’re a lower-middle class or working-class stiff who’s not naturally magnetic to the opposite sex, then the New Order sure ain’t going to do much for you… but that goes for the homely girl who gets passed around like so much meat instead of landing a decent husband, too.
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Of course, some women will cry “What about the kids?!”.
I’m pretty sure the children have a father…. unless there was some sort of alien abduction/impregnation going on there.
Obviously, the woman CAN have the ACTUAL FATHER(s) pay child-support…. it’s an interesting comment on the hard-core nature of female entitlement that they demand that their betrayed husbands pay rather than the actual fathers.
Unless of course it was aliens.
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Top Ten Banks by Revenue
Bank of America. CEO Ken Lewis. Not Jewish.
Citigroup. CEO Vikram Pandit. Not Jewish.
JP Morgan Chase. CEO Jamie Diamond. Not Jewish.
Morgan Stanley. CEO John Mack. Not Jewish.
Goldman Sachs. CEO Llyod Blankfein. Jewish. Replaced Hank Paulson. Not Jewish.
Wells Fargo. CEO John Stumpf. Not Jewish
……..
So much for finance……
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@Seeking Alpha
A simple examination of your sequence of posts and the various rhetorical devices you attempted to use to dismiss the arguments with no substantive reply speaks for itself.
Let me also clarify (I have some disclaimers on my blog) that I’m referring to Jews as an ethnic group, not a religion. Many of the most destructive Jews have been atheistic Leftists. Also, I’m referring to an elite set of people that inhabit various institutions. This is a tiny fraction of the Jewish population in the US, although depending on the issue, they probably have 20-90% support among the general Jewish population. Also, the Jewish population is quite diverse and includes some Leftist ones, like Norman Finkelstein or Noel Ignatiev, who pursue policies that most Jews oppose (e.g. dissolving Israel).
My goals are:
1) To raise awareness among Gentiles so they can better defend their interests
2) Persuade Jews to reconsider their institutional hostility to White people and Christians.
– Stop trying to suppress free speech
– Stop the culture war against Whites and Christians
– Stop pushing mass immigration
– Stop pushing phony economics to make big money by selling off this countries future (they’re not alone in this)
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Good luck with your goals. The odds are great. The enemy vast. But with your steely determination, you will succeed.
With your scientist background, I’m confident many people will listen to your expert views on culture and economics.
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db
though it amazes me that the comments evolve into these incredibly long-winded, detailed, well-researched and articulate discussions about economic, racial, social and gender issues.
I hear THAT. LOL I prefer to spew my particular flavor of bullshit and be done with it. Occasionally I quote my favorite guru, Osho, the most beautiful old man I’ve ever seen in my life, knowing it irritates the hell out of them.
Or I post a link to something even more heinous in their limited world view:
http://www.abraham-hicks.com/lawofattractionsource/index.php
Or worse still:
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/
Most here have a distinct hatred for higher learning. Maybe you agree with them. Who knows? But I hate to miss an opportunity to either enlighten or irritate roissy and minions.
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@Seeking Alpha
Wow. Your ad hominem is soooo effective in rebutting anything I’ve said.
There’s sufficient evidence based on your many posts filled with rhetorical devices and logical fallacies to conclude you’re arguing in bad faith.
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Who will likely get a parade of men through Mom’s bedroom who want them either out or beaten or molested.
That’s funny, my dad didn’t beat up my older brother.
My uncle didn’t molest my cousins.
My cousin didn’t beat up his new step-sons.
Somehow, I find you comments on step-fathers to be somewhat insulting…
Mass immigration benefits the ruling elites economically by crippling the middle class and depreciating the price of labor
As a prole, I benefit from cheap car washes, cheap landscaping, cheap movers, and cheap home improvements.
Of course, you’ll bring up the argument that immigration depreciates labour for black men, but nobody wants black labour at any price. Hell, my aunt’s husband is one of the most afro-centric guys around, and he refuses to employ black labour, and prefers immigrant labour since he has essentially stated that it’s cheaper and higher quality.
particularly of incompatible newcomers
Fun question: Are my parents and the rest of my immigrant family incompatible? Are we restricting incompatible to just “No Muslims and No Mexicans” or “no non-whites”.
So part of the disproportionate success comes from superior average Jewish IQ, character traits, priority given to education, etc.
There’s a part of me that suspects that one of the reasons for high Jewish IQ is due to the fact that the low IQ Jews are de facto written off by the community and marry into gentiles. If a Jewish male is lacking in high IQ, he is unable to marry a high IQ female, and thus must slum around with unworthy gentiles.
I saw Harold & Kumar. What a loathsome bilge. I felt like I needed a shower after watching it.
It’s a funny movie to me. 🙂
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Scotch – what do you think my goal is? What do you think the central thrust of my argument is? I thought I was just toying around with some old crazy dude on the Internet because I was bored at work. If I had a contention, it slipped by me.
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uber troll:
That’s funny, my dad didn’t beat up my older brother.
My uncle didn’t molest my cousins.
My cousin didn’t beat up his new step-sons.
you argue like a woman. all anecdote, all the time.
As a prole, I benefit from cheap car washes, cheap landscaping, cheap movers, and cheap home improvements.
externalities are not your friend.
Fun question:
no it’s not.
Are my parents and the rest of my immigrant family incompatible?
a few DAs can be absorbed into the borg. a million of your less DA-like brethren, not so much.
It’s a funny movie to me.
you have no taste.
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db:
@roissy – the problem with kids left by the wayside as a result of lack of parental resources is that they become *our* problem – men and women taxpayers.
only to bleeding hearts like yourself. the tax code can be structured to avoid such thieving unpleasantry.
i guess it’s better than putting the whole financial load on some beta who never even fathered the bastards, but i still don’t like it.
that’s because you’re feminine sympathies are clouding your long term judgement. a few bastard kids dying in the streets because their cheating whore mothers made the wrong decision will create a wonderful incentive amongts the losers to refrain from engaging in self-destructive behavior.
if not, then it’s one less leech sucking the lifelbood of productive society.
ta ta!
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If you’re a lower-middle class or working-class stiff who’s not naturally magnetic to the opposite sex, then the New Order sure ain’t going to do much for you…
Old World Order: I get married, crappy sex, wife who secretly loathes my existance, and all my resourced poured into children and wife.
New World Order: I stay single, keep my money, enjoy my hobbies, and masturbate to women who are more sexually appealing than wife of old world order.
Yeah, I feel so sorry for those men. Ooops.
uber troll
Somehow, uber troll is a step up. Thanks for the compliment!
Of course they’re anecdotes, but I’m becoming sick of Whiskey’s painting every step-father as a step-son beating, daughter molesting tool. I find it to be personally insulting, especially since my father is a step-father to my older brother.
externalities are not your friend.
Well, that’s the thing. Is it better overall to have a pool of low IQ de facto servants in the country when compared against any possible tax burden that they place?
a million of your less DA-like brethren, not so much.
What magically makes me any different from the rest of them? What makes Roosh magically different? What makes VK or Rawness magically different?
Come on, be a brave alpha male. It’s okay to say that they’re inferior to you.
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more db:
roissy: “ya dumb fucking useless cunt.”
AWESOME. please talk dirty more often.
defending the indefensible is not the smart play.
on the real, though, wouldn’t you say a father who adopts an infant with his wife (and therefore has no genetic contribution to the kid) can still have an incredibly profound and meaningful relationship with and attachment to that child???
sure. but knowingly adopting a kid is qualitatively different from unknowingly raising kids that aren’t your own.
thought experiment: would you like it if i implanted the fertilized egg of another woman’s child into your womb and forced you to go to term with it and then spend 18 years raising it?
right, that’s what i figured.
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super duper troll:
What magically makes me any different from the rest of them?
if you have to ask…
What makes Roosh magically different? What makes VK or Rawness magically different?
irrelevant. but nice try.
Come on, be a brave alpha male.
you taunt like a woman, too.
It’s okay to say that they’re inferior to you.
is this what you think?
ps look up “individualism” and get back to me.
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if you have to ask…
You’re avoiding answering the question. What makes me *different*, Roissy? What makes the others different?
irrelevant. but nice try.
I think it’s highly relevant since they’re “special” too.
is this what you think?
Once you believe in race realism, there’s nothing but a cheap false wall that prevents one from believing in the superiority of one group versus the inferiority of another.
ps look up “individualism” and get back to me.
There are no individuals. Just groups of people lumped together into a collective by stereotypes.
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welmer:
BTW, although this may make me look like a total beta to a lot of guys here, I have to admit that when you get attached to a child it would be extremely painful to reject him/her even if it isn’t yours (hasn’t happened to me, but I do get very attached to children).
that’s what cheating whores are counting on.
HOWEVER, that doesn’t mean a man should be made to pay for it.
if a man is raped out of his money and time by a cuckold, he should be given restitution.
you’d be surprised how quickly the threat of a little of the old “hurt em where it counts” can clear a whore’s mind.
ps i would have no problem at all leaving kids raised by me for a number of years if i discovered they weren’t mine.
no
problem
at
all.
which, naturally, makes me feminism’s w o r s t n i g h t m a r e.
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incalculable troll:
You’re avoiding answering the question.
you’re the expert on avoiding answering questions.
What makes me *different*, Roissy?
there’s a new rule in town, troll. i no longer answer self-evidently idiotic questions.
don’t like it? go cry me a river.
and then drown in it, please.
I think it’s highly relevant since they’re “special” too.
they’re cool.
you, otoh, are “special”.
There are no individuals.
coulda fooled me.
Just groups of people lumped together into a collective by stereotypes.
the standards we apply when befriending people are not the same standards we use when crafting public policy.
hope this helps.
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Roissy – “thought experiment: would you like it if i implanted the fertilized egg of another woman’s child into your womb and forced you to go to term with it and then spend 18 years raising it?”
Almost happened: Japanese woman impregnated with wrong egg
And, although the mistake was discovered, and the resultant fetus aborted, the pain and suffering of the poor woman will net her about $220k.
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fembozo lacking empathy:
Jesus! WHY reject a child if it’s painful? The pain is telling you….don’t do it. The child is innocent. Give me a break.
if the child suffers the filthy whore has only herself to blame.
being a mother is more than carrying the child of a rapist, hmm? being a mother is more than getting implanted with the fertilized egg of another woman and carrying it to term and raising it for 18 years, hmmmmmm?
I 100% agree with you. Does that still make me a dumb fucking useless cunt.?
if you cannot comprehend the absolute evil of a whore cuckolding a duped man into raising another man’s kids, then, yes, you are a desiganted dumb fucking useless cunt.
hth.
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And, although the mistake was discovered, and the resultant fetus aborted, the pain and suffering of the poor woman will net her about $220k.
and there ya go.
another one of roissy’s worldviews vindicated.
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Sara I
So, which is your Enneagram Type?
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you’re the expert on avoiding answering questions.
READ: Roissy is afraid to admit he thinks black people are inferior to white people, and that if Roosh or VK weren’t his friends, he’d want them to be sent back to their respective hell-holes.
you, otoh, are “special”.
Real Answer: David is an oreo suckup who worships superior white people. Most other black people seem to be unable to do this, hence why David gets to “stay”, but everybody else who looks like him should stay at home.
coulda fooled me.
If I put a suit on and walk through my 95% white neighbourhood, I’m merely a white collar nigger who’s wearing a suit as an attempt to build trust and steal/rape/attack/kill white people.
the standards we apply when befriending people are not the same standards we use when crafting public policy.
That’s rather hypocritical, IMHO. If you’re inferior by the standards of public policy, you’re certainly inferior for a friend.
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Everyone seems very angry today. Me included. I blame the gap between expected and actual hope and change.
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seeking alpha:
The interesting question is, if the evidence points to a motivation for the rich, and any motivation for Jews is coincidental, why do people go harping on for eight or nine paragraphs at a time about Jewish conspiracy?
some conspiracies are deliberate.
others are emergent.
As opposed to the nepotism of the non-Jewish elite in those industries? All peoples promote nepotism. It’s human nature.
true, more or less. (though the evidence suggests that NW euro WASPs possess the least amount of ethnic nepotism. to their detriment, i might add.)
the difference is that ethnic groups with higher average IQs and stronger proclivities toward in-group cohesion will be more successful at self-promotion than other ethnic groups.
Because – ignoring cycles – this country has never been richer.
two words: lag time.
Because apparently mass immigration began with the Immigration Act of 1964 and liberal influence went down in a straight line from that time.
see above.
Because we continue to be a net exporter of culture and I’ve yet to see the influence of Mexican culture on mainstream America.
check the education, illiteracy, high school dropout, crime, and teen pregnancy stats.
or is that not what you meant by “influence”?
So do you actually believe there is some council of big-nosed media titans discussing their secret plans for cultural control of America, or is this just emergent behavior.?
why did you throw in the “big-nosed” ref when no one else had brought that up in conversation?
argument by adjectival assholery is no way to go through life, son.
I would be pretty pissed if I had to earn my success the hard way when I could have just put in an application for the Elders of Zion.
lame.
I’m sorry if life has been unkind to you, but blaming it on others will never make you happy.
said the bolshevik to the kulak as he was being hauled off to the gulag.
Morals only come from culture when there is an absence of morals coming from parents. A gentile child growing up in a strong family and a religious background will do just fine morally.
do you believe the overarching culture has no impact on individual behavior at all?
Or do you believe in a victim mentality?
sometimes there really are victims.
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the femilisting.org site, “I shot Andy Warhol,” and “the Feminine Mystique” do not capture the belief systems of most feminist women.
All groups have a reactionary branch, but I don’t assume that the Christian fundamentalist groups that blow up abortion clinics have the same ideology as the Christian dude that says a Hail Mary during March madness.
People who blow up abortionists are not amongst the most popular Christians on the web. Feministing is. Hell, the person that started the site got a book deal and an interview on the Colbert Report to help publicize the book.
They are mainstream. And they could not care less about equality. You get the same seething hatred at Feministe as well.
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cosmically expansive troll:
READ: Roissy is afraid to admit he thinks black people are inferior to white people, and that if Roosh or VK weren’t his friends, he’d want them to be sent back to their respective hell-holes.
project much?
Real Answer: David is an oreo suckup who worships superior white people.
real answer: david alexander is an emotionally imbalanced fuckup.
If I put a suit on and walk through my 95% white neighbourhood, I’m merely a white collar nigger who’s wearing a suit as an attempt to build trust and steal/rape/attack/kill white people.
save your rhetorical pity ploys for someone who gives a shit.
cunt.
If you’re inferior by the standards of public policy, you’re certainly inferior for a friend.
which number is larger?
a. 1
b. 10,000,000
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I’m too tired to argue. With respect to lag time, you could be right and I could be right. It’s the future so who knows. The big-nose was an asshole reference. I’m atheist and my mother is Northern European Catholic anyway, so I don’t know why I’m even bothering. ScotchFiend just seemed like too easy of a target.
I wouldn’t mind discussing the last two bits though, as they are less subject to hyperbole.
Of course the overarching culture has some impact. My point was just that the size of that impact is directly related to the parenting. Two strong parents and a strong moral education will most often outweigh any cultural impacts. There are plenty of strong community-based groups that have kept their morals intact.
As for the victim part, it sounds more like you’re trying to win an argument than stick with your convictions. If we were discussing the urban black community, I’m guessing you’d come down on the side of victim mentality and personal responsibility.
I know I come down on that side in all communities. That might be a Jewish thing though – for a group that is universally disliked (note I didn’t say persecuted – I’m sure we can all agree most people don’t like Jews) we’ve managed to be (on average) very successful because of hard work, a strong moral education, nepotism, and strong family values. That formula works for all groups (including both the apparently-beseiged white community and the it’s-whiteys-fault black community).
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Because – ignoring cycles – this country has never been richer.
That is probably not true when thinking about what it is that people want to get.
Assuming that people want to be able to afford a home in a neighborhood that has a crime rate equal to or better than, say, the average homicide rate of 1909 or 1959, then we are probably considerably worse off. But, if we are simply talking about being able to buy a Plasma TV, then, yeah, we are aces.
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if the child suffers the filthy whore has only herself to blame
Should the child suffer for its mother’s decision to have sex with other men, and how do we come up with a solution that avoids the suffering for the child without penalizing the father? That’s the question which nobody has answered, and I suspect nobody is capable of answering.
project much?
I smell the blood of an angry race realist who is too afraid to reveal how he feels about the ethnicities of his non-white friends.
save your rhetorical pity ploys for someone who gives a shit.
That’s not a ploy, it’s the truth. You’d be freaked out by a black guy in a suit walking around a suburban white neighbourhood too.
which number is larger?
Obviously 1 is smaller, but it doesn’t mitigate the fact that the 1 person is made of the same genetic and visual components of the 10 million. He is no different than the others, and there’s nothing preventing his off-spring from having the same behaviours of the 10 million that you don’t like.
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I know, and it’s a pretty evil thing. I’ve read some feminist anthropological discussions of tribes where the women get knocked up by some local tough and then as soon as they miss a period they shack up with the local fisherman, who would often be considered a stable provider.
The feminists highly approved of this, and suggested that it’s a more enlightened existence.
I agree. I think a man should get restitution in cases of adultery even if it doesn’t result in a bastard. If it does, just ratchet up the damages.
I’d probably leave, too, but I’m sure I’d have a problem with it (for a number of reasons), which is most likely typical. This enhances the justification for restitution, which would otherwise be based only on financial support of the child. If you look at the judge’s ruling in Spain, it appears that the emotional trauma the adulteress inflicted on her husband (as opposed to the money he spent on the children) was the most important basis for damages.
These quotes put it succinctly:
“Judges said that the compensation should be ‘higher than if the children had been killed in an accident’.
The wife was judged to have ‘acted negligently in the conception of her children’, and the concealment of the truth ‘only added to the pain caused to the husband’ who should be compensated correctly.”
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@ Sara I at 3:23am
I think given the likely severe emotional consequences on the children, and the very large monetary, emotional and opportunity costs to the husband, the intentional deception of a cuckolded spouse by a women of the paternity of her children should be a crime. Perhaps it is a middle misdemeanor with say a week or two in the county jail, or perhaps it’s worthy of a felony, even if the judge is likely to suspend jail time. The only problem with making it a felony would be the possibly severe consequences to the woman’s future employment opportunities and the harm that would cause the children.
It would also be very fair if she lost significant privileges during the divorce and settlement, e.g. liable for significant damages.
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I’m sick of the generalisation about Islam. I don’t know what the hell you mean by muslims somehow magically curing radical feminism, mainly because there are so many different types and people living within the realms of Islam.
Secondly, the stereotypical image that you guys seem to be utilising: if any standard traditional female cultured on that (fictional? corrupted?) Islamic diet had to be partnered with maybe half of you guys who call yourselves ‘alpha’, she’d probably cut off your femme balls and feed it to you due to your unworthiness of their ownership. Something like this happens with the Islamic world. It’s not like a more patriarchal system gets rid of the betas, especially when camp guys have to repress themselves.
As well as this, segregation of the sexes as well as patriarchy can cause a greater unity and sense of community within the genders: no female is left alone to bear injustice, she’s got the rest of the embittered female pack to feast on the remains of a male who goes too far and manipulate their husbands/male family members into getting involved.
Weak males are exactly WHY feminism exists, and the sooner you realise that, the happier everyone will be. Beta masculinity is the causation to feminism, and not the other way round.
Political correctness is the last thing I’d want to rant about and not something I particularly endorse, especially on here of all places. My point is that I’m not sure what picture of Islam you’re thinking about. Can you be specific?
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In the vast majority of the country you can afford a home in a neighborhood that has a low crime rate. Just avoid any big city. And you can have the plasma TV too.
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Dave Alex,
Your points about Black employers being relunctant to hire Black workers is something I have hired before; yours is the first actual “live” account though. Very interesting.
O
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Obsidian
Women watch more TV. Who says?
Whiskey
But here’s the thing: men mostly won’t CARE about women’s approval. This is your fundamental assumption error and one that nearly all women make, particularly ones that are pretty or were pretty. They think that because men flatter them, pretend to care about what they think, solicit their opinions, that once the reality of cheating and another man’s kids not his own sets in, any of that will matter.?
I don’t expect any man to care more about what I think than what he thinks, especially about himself. If he can conditionally love children because he believes they are biologically his offspring and then later finds out they aren’t biologically his and un-loves them, more power to him if he can do all that and unconditionally love himself. His opinion of himself is all that really matters.
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@Seeking Alpha
Your dishonesty and bad faith is pathetic. I have no respect for your sleazy tactics in avoiding confronting the facts. You’re STILL engaging in duplicitous ad hominem.
Anyone who wishes to check this can merely review the sequence of posts.
As I stated in an earlier post, Jews are going to have to honestly confront these facts because their disproportionate influence is weakening. The wealthy Muslims will gleefully finance various projects that accelerate the process.
The consequence of bad faith argumentation can be seen in the blogger Tanstaafl at Age of Reason. He began as sympathetic to Jews and Israel and has become a bitter opponent of both.
Israel needs all the friends it can get given the certain proliferation of nuclear weapons to Iran and likely other Muslim states and the distinct possibility of nuclear terrorism or nuclear missile attack.
I hold out the hope that if Jews can acknowledge some of their sins and change some of their policies, then a relationship of mutual respect can be salvaged between Jews and Gentiles.
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seeking the special lessons of roissy:
With respect to lag time, you could be right and I could be right.
the evidence favors my contentions.
I’m atheist and my mother is Northern European Catholic anyway, so I don’t know why I’m even bothering.
sometimes mixed race/ethnic/religious persons are the most self-conscious about their chosen group’s place in the world, for psychological reasons that i don’t have the time or inclination to go into here.
see: obama.
My point was just that the size of that impact is directly related to the parenting.
ok, but in which direction is the rate of single motherhood going — up or down?
Two strong parents and a strong moral education will most often outweigh any cultural impacts.
wasn’t there a study recently purporting to show that parents don’t have nearly the impact on a child’s life progress as his genes do?
There are plenty of strong community-based groups that have kept their morals intact.
what happens when the dysfunctional “communities” (god i hate that word) outnumber the functional communities?
If we were discussing the urban black community, I’m guessing you’d come down on the side of victim mentality and personal responsibility.
yes and no. while i believe it is in the interest of the larger culture to promote the concept of individual responsilibity, i also recognize that people are not born equal, that abilities are meted out unequally, and that this will have an effect on the distributrion of life outcomes.
I know I come down on that side in all communities.
you better hope that you are securely ensconced from the coming blood-dimmed tide.
That might be a Jewish thing though
at the very least it’s a myopic thing.
(note I didn’t say persecuted – I’m sure we can all agree most people don’t like Jews)
i really don’t see this. a lot of people may be pissed at what certain jewish elites are doing to the country, but i don’t think that translates into how those people feel about jews in general or jews they know in their own lives.
anyhow, this smacks too much of DA pity partying. it’s an effective group cohesion tactic, though. really works to rally the members to circle their wagons.
That formula works for all groups (including both the apparently-beseiged white community and the it’s-whiteys-fault black community).
the ultimate problem is that life success is not, and will likely never be (in the forseeable future anyhow), equitably distributed, and this naturally bothers a lot of people, because status striving is the fin de siecle of human existence.
there is no solution for this except to refrain from making the consequences of such a reality worse through misguided and, yes, evil, policies.
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I can’t resist…
Where was I dishonest?
And which sin do I need to acknowledge and change? Or do you only mean the powerful Jews? Am I innocent because I’m just a kid and haven’t entered the conspiracy yet? When I’m older and successful, can I still repent or does it only work if I do it now before I’ve done anything to destroy the moral fabric of gentile civilization?
And for the record, ad hominem is attacking your opponents character in order to discredit his position. I’m not trying to win over some amorphous audience by discrediting you. I’m just making fun of you cause you’re some crazy old man writing long diatribes on a blog by day. It’s not ad hominem if you’re not trying to win anything.
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I’ve read some feminist anthropological discussions of tribes where the women get knocked up by some local tough and then as soon as they miss a period they shack up with the local fisherman, who would often be considered a stable provider.
Old World Order: Woman looks for stable provider to support her and babies she will have.
New World Order: Woman has sex with Roissy and other alphas for five to ten years, then looks for stable provider to support her and babies she will have.
I fail to note the long-term difference between the two.
The feminists highly approved of this, and suggested that it’s a more enlightened existence.
In theory it makes sense since it has the men specializing in their respective superior areas, but in doesn’t work in practice since the equivalent for men doesn’t really exist.
Your points about Black employers being relunctant to hire Black workers is something I have hired before; yours is the first actual “live” account though.
If you get a chance, read when When Work Disappears by William Julius Wilson. I regret selling my copy, but it’s a work by a black professor of sociology at Harvard that takes a moderate view at explaining the failures of the black urban community of the late 1960s, 1970s, 1980s, and early 1990s.
I would also recommend There Goes the Neighbourhood which partially explores four different neighbourhoods in the Chicago, one of which explores a “high prole” black neighbourhood that’s starting to shift with the influx of poorer blacks.
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Assuming that people want to be able to afford a home in a neighborhood that has a crime rate equal to or better than, say, the average homicide rate of 1909 or 1959, then we are probably considerably worse off.
2009 is certainly better than 1909. Yeah, you might be slightly more likely to be murdered, but if you’ll be less likely to die of diseases like Tuberculosis. The life expectancy in 1910 was only around 50.
1959 vs. 2009 basically comes down to culture vs. creature comforts.
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I’m proud. I got a mocking, modified name.
wasn’t there a study recently purporting to show that parents don’t have nearly the impact on a child’s life progress as his genes do?
You were arguing that culture has an impact. I agree that in addition to parenting, genes play a huge role. I believe in inherent IQ differences and all the rest. Please stay consistent.
i really don’t see this. a lot of people may be pissed at what certain jewish elites are doing to the country, but i don’t think that translates into how those people feel about jews in general or jews they know in their own lives.
That’s more what I meant. I’ve never once in my life been disliked as a Jew. I more meant that the average joe dislikes the idea of monolithic Jewish power.
As for self-pity, you’re off base. I wasn’t complaining about anyone disliking me. I love my life.
And I would definitely agree that mixed people are particularly defensive of their chosen group’s place. Overall, I identify as an American before a Jew. I take America’s side over Israel’s and in my opinions, I really only consider what would advance American wealth and power, not any one group within America.
But I’m sure your boring people arguing with me. Everyone likes the much more vitriolic fights with DA or Sara (not being sarcastic). Don’t forget you have an audience.
Actually, speaking of which… no ads and no book. You’re fairly well known. Are you just biding your time or are you independently wealthy and this is all just for fun?
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Scotchfiend
I think given the likely severe emotional consequences on the children, and the very large monetary, emotional and opportunity costs to the husband, the intentional deception of a cuckolded spouse by a women of the paternity of her children should be a crime.
So, I take it you don’t think the biological father has any monetary responsibility? I posted a link earlier citing a case where a woman sued her husband’s MISTRESS for emotional damages and “lack of affection” and won if you can call that winning. …blah, blah, blah.
So why doesn’t her husband sue the biological father for back child support? Hey, as long as we’re taking this to court, might as well throw in a few more lawsuits. How about 100,000 from the wife and 100,000 from the lover? It just would not be my way of doing things, but to each their own. What do I care, except, as you so astutely pointed out the children are going to be fucked up, but then any kid with PARENTS is going to be fucked up so what’s the difference?
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seeking the firm but fatherly ministrations of roissy:
You were arguing that culture has an impact. I agree that in addition to parenting, genes play a huge role. I believe in inherent IQ differences and all the rest. Please stay consistent.
i never said culture has no impact.
to wit: a bright kid raised in a war zone will likely have a harder time reaching his full potential than that same kid raised in a serene leafy suburb.
the word of the day is: interplay.
although, personally, i was surprised to find from that study that genes have a much greater impact on a kid’s future SES than his parents. we’re all reductionists now.
I more meant that the average joe dislikes the idea of monolithic Jewish power.
he dislikes it if he feels, not unjustifiably, that that monolithic power is working against his interests.
and, really, who can blame him?
I really only consider what would advance American wealth and power, not any one group within America.
that’s a noble sentiment, but unfortunately once the cards are shuffled and dealt it doesn’t often play out that way.
Everyone likes the much more vitriolic fights with DA or Sara (not being sarcastic).
i won’t be pigeonholed.
Don’t forget you have an audience.
they can wait.
Actually, speaking of which… no ads and no book. You’re fairly well known. Are you just biding your time or are you independently wealthy and this is all just for fun?
doens’t make sense not to live for fun.
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Well I’m glad you kept it civil. We both agree that there are a myriad of factors effecting morality, of which culture is one. We just might disagree about the order – although I suspect we don’t.
As for the average joe, he probably feels that way about all sorts of monolithic power – including the mostly non-Jewish legislature. We’ll never agree about whether it’s justified, so we’ll stay out of there. But we both agree with that the sentiment exists.
As for the groups, there’s no doubt one group will always benefit more than another. We agree here too.
And when it comes to money – follow the advice of your prodigious commenter G Manifesto – it’s a down economy, get a side hustle.
Enjoy your weekend. Good luck on the hunt. Thanks for giving everyone here a place to relieve workplace boredom.
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DA – “Should the child suffer for its mother’s decision to have sex with other men, and how do we come up with a solution that avoids the suffering for the child without penalizing the father? That’s the question which nobody has answered, and I suspect nobody is capable of answering.”
So? How about the biological father paying for HIS children? How about the bitch getting a job and (as necessary) living frugally in order to take care of HER children?
Is that truly inconceivable to you?
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the ultimate problem is that life success is not, and will likely never be…, equitably distributed, and this naturally bothers a lot of people, because status striving is the fin de siecle of human existence
Yes, and I’m one of those people that’s bothered by it, and I suspect it’s because I’m in the group that is sadly known for being disproportionately on the poor. It’s rather disheartening to think that my children or myself have no chance at being successful, and while I can dissipate any spiteful thoughts, I question the ability of others to simply brush off the idea that it’s okay for whites and Asians to be rich while blacks are poor. It’s just not sustainable in the long-term even in a global context because eventually black people will become resentful and spiteful of their richer white and Asian neighbours.
Sadly, I suspect the easiest solution is to get rid of the people who just can’t compete. There is no policy that can save these people from being perpetual losers.
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In the vast majority of the country you can afford a home in a neighborhood that has a low crime rate. Just avoid any big city.
In the vast majority of the country there are very few jobs. Arkansas is wonderfully affordable, but has basically one employer.
So, just avoid any place that has jobs. LA, SF, NYC…you are basically talking about at least a 1 hour one-way commute to FIND a place that is both affordable and low in crime. Yet, 50 years ago, 100 years ago, this was not a problem. Low crime neighborhoods were everywhere.
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“…how do we come up with a solution that avoids the suffering for the child without penalizing the father?”
Look, we don’t worry about avoiding suffering for the child for any other crime – muggers, or embezzlers, or confidence tricksters don’t get off lightly. Why is defrauding someone by misleading them about the identity of your child’s father any different?
And most duped fathers don’t unilaterally dump the kids. Frankly, the best solution is: (1) mother jailed for her crime; (2) duped ‘father’ allowed to claim damages against her, and keep them, I don’t want the cash transfered back in a divorce settlement; (3) duped ‘father’ given custody if he wants it – he’s clearly a better option than jailed fraudster mum or absent dad; (4) allowing the duped ‘father’ the associate right to claim child support from the bioparents.
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@Seeking Alpha
Your post at 11:37 AM is dishonest.
I had a post at 9:38 AM that explicitly laid out with some detail and many links exactly why. So your rhetorical question of why someone would “go harping…about Jewish conspiracy” is intellectually dishonest. You had detailed answers in that post. But of course, you’ve never made any effort to rebut any fact or assertion. You just play dishonest rhetorical games.
Of course a reading of your two posts following PA’s post reveal a self-serving and deceptive interpretation of PA’s comment.
In your post at 1:47 PM you state:
This is a lie. Previously you engaged in a sequence of evasive posts that try to discredit me through insults without addressing ANY arguments or assertions. Anyone can read the post trail and make up their own minds. That use of ad hominem attack WAS an attempt to discredit my detailed posts with many links for further research.
You said at 4:42 PM:
If you read my post I wasn’t addressing you personally but rather Jews as a community. You may think you’re clever or persuasive when you play these bad faith rhetorical games, but my point was that the Jewish community needs to transcend these dishonest tactics because otherwise they’ll make unnecessary enemies they may regret later when they need friends. I gave you a classic example with Tanstaafl. Check out his blog. He’s extremely articulate and probably has at least a 150 IQ and now he hates Jews and Israel.
For the record ad hominem has a broader definition that you stated. Broadly it means to “attack the man and not the argument”. That is EXACTLY what you did several time by using insults and slights.
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Seeking Alpha,
But I’m sure your boring people arguing with me. Everyone likes the much more vitriolic fights with DA or Sara (not being sarcastic). Don’t forget you have an audience.
Whoo hooooo!!
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Good news, roissy, I’ve taken the day off so we can spend some quality time together.
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tingling new age pussy:
Good news, roissy, I’ve taken the day off so we can spend some quality time together.
great. aren’t you gonna make your osho blow-up doll jealous?
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@ Sara I
Yes. I would think the BIOLOGICAL father does have some financial responsibility. But it would not be the cuckolded husbands job to litigate that, but the cheating wife.
My purpose in treating this spousal fraud as a crime is NOT to create a massive volume of litigation, but rather to create a strong societal sanction against women behaving in this manner to hopefully significantly reduce such cases.
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roissy,
tingling new age pussy:
Good news, roissy, I’ve taken the day off so we can spend some quality time together.
great. aren’t you gonna make your osho blow-up doll jealous?
I wish.
Scotchfiend
My purpose in treating this spousal fraud as a crime is NOT to create a massive volume of litigation, but rather to create a strong societal sanction against women behaving in this manner to hopefully significantly reduce such cases.
Indeed, the world would be a better place if more people took complete responsibility for their actions in which case we wouldn’t need all these laws.
If we go on trying to find the blame for who is immorally fucking around and creating bastard children, eventually we will need to sue the biggest rapist of all: God. After all he fucked the Virgin Mary without her consent and created that Jesus bastard.
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“Immigration Act of 1964”
1965. Civil Rights was ’64.
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Seeking Alpha:
Good luck with your goals. The odds are great. The enemy vast. But with your steely determination, you will succeed.
With your scientist background, I’m confident many people will listen to your expert views on culture and economics.
Remember, SA — evasion is the original sin…
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Interestingly, when I did some research into adultery legislation, it was most frequently women who opposed it or suggested it was a waste of time.
To me, this suggests that more wives than husbands cheat, or at least more wives want to keep the option open. What I think is going on is that a few men cheat on their wives a lot, and a lot of women cheat some.
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@ Sara I
Just to clarify my proposed law is NOT for adultery or the birth of a cuckolded child. The crime is FRAUD against the cuckolded husband.
I think it makes the most sense to have series of crimes of varying severity depending on the extent of defrauding. e.g. if she fesses up in 3 months that’s less severe than 2 years and so on. In this modern era of genetic testing it will almost certainly be found out eventually with severe emotional consequences for the child. Note that defrauding someone of $100,000 is a serious felony. Essentially, this, the emotional damage and the painful opportunity cost of what the cuckolded husband might have had if he’d invested his time with a better woman are powerful arguments for making this a crime.
Imagine the pain, as a previous commenter mentioned, of finding out you wasted 20 years on a no good, cheating spouse and your kids are someone elses?
I’m outta here tonight but will check back tomorrow.
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Scotchfiend
Imagine the pain, as a previous commenter mentioned, of finding out you wasted 20 years on a no good, cheating spouse….
You were expecting this I hope. Many women can relate to the part about the cheating spouse. I worked with a woman who was the world’s biggest daddy’s girl until daddy left her mommy found out daddy had a whole ‘nother family with a wife, kids, and the works and left her and her mother for them. That woman was in her 40’s and incredibly fucked up. Talk about FRAUD. Should her mother have sued her father and prolonged the misery of the entire family? You tell me.
Life is incredibly painful at times, but I’m still not one to take my personal problems to court. Im one of those rare people who had a very civilized divorce sans lawyers and we had a house, assets, kid, and 4 cats. We agreed on every aspect of the divorce including child support, alimony, dividing the assets, and custody.
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anon 3:48
I thought no one would ever ask; eight with nine wing.
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Scotchfiend
Not that I’m completely against revenge, but as Oscar Wilde said I think, it’s a dish best served cold. When it comes to being a cold-hearted bitch WHEN the occasional calls for it, there is none better than I. Hear, hear…
For example (roissy will love this) when I first started posting on this site I was going through an extraordinarily distressing 50th and final break up with “the love of my life”. (I failed to realize that the love of my life would also love ME. Duh) Oh yes, I wanted revenge, and I’ve got it without having to lift a finger. It’s so much sweeter that way. The guy is engaged and really miserable. If and when he walks down the aisle, I’ll be celebrating.
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If the divorce was so civilized and amicable, which suggests your husband was a reasonable guy, why did you need to get divorced in the first place? This is one thing that confuses me. You’ve got a good life with your husband, including a kid and property, and yet you still think divorce is a good idea. I’m sure it was your idea, so why did you do it?
Oh, now I get it. You didn’t think your husbands were the “love of [your] life.” And now you don’t think the love of your life is the love of your life. In fact, you take pleasure in his misery. From your self-description, it appears that the men you’ve had in your life are better off without the “cold-hearted bitch” you so proudly call yourself.
Have you ever stopped to consider that you may have made a lot of bad mistakes along the way?
It never ceases to amaze me how women expose their primordial need for chastisement to be kept in line. That chastisement has been taken away, and hence the inherently destructive nature of women like Sara has been unleashed upon society.
Currently, there are very many men in prison in America; perhaps it is time for gender equality in all spheres of life. With equality comes responsibility. Some day we’ll see how women like that arrangement. IMO, they’ve already failed the test, but might as well give them a chance through more equitable family law.
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Settle down Welmer,
There is much room for miscommunication in the blogosphere. The ex I was referring to was not either of my husbands and as far as why I divorced them? At the risk of boring those who’ve heard the story already, my first husband was a certified woman hating (in fact people hating) genius who had no qualms about unleashing his vitriolic rage against me whenever the thought occurred to him. Long story, I’d rather not go into.
Second divorce I was dealing with alcoholism and workaholism. Yes, I know the difference between a man busting his ass in his career FOR the family and one who is certifiably unbalanced. The former I could have handled if not for the alcoholism. We are great friends to this day. He’s cleaned up his act considerably, remarried, and sometimes I wish he had done that before the divorce, but you know how it goes sometimes.
As far as the cold-hearted bitch routine, well he deserves it. What can I say? Some people just do. I took him back 50 times too many, so give me a break. Loooooong story including cheating, lies, passive-aggression, blah, blah, blah…real boring shit. Please don’t make me get into it. LOL
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Sara I
From the website:
I have some understanding of Myers-Briggs typing. Enneagram Eights sound like Extraverted, Sensing, Thinking types (ESTx).
My guess is that “naturals” at game are more likely to be Enneagram Threes (Myers-Briggs Extraverted, Sensing, Perceiving types – ESxP).
The guys who have most trouble with game are probably Introverted Thinking types, especially “N”s (INTx). Those would be Enneagram Fives and Fours.
I believe that Eights and Fives share some relationship on the Enneagram (fives are introverted, eights extraverted).
For those who care http://tap3x.net/ENSEMBLE/typeframe.html allows you explore “typological space.”
As an aside, at the above link I found this as part of an eight’s description:
When I lived in New York, I met a lot of that type. It did not feel like a relationship, more like an attempted hostile take-over (many were I-bankers or similar). I still refer to that type as “trader chicks,” or “warrior chicks” (everything is a fight). As a mild-mannered beta 🙂 I found it too much.
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In the USA 3-4% of newborns have DNA unrelated to their Fathers.
The hospitals keep it to themselves, b/c they know society will fall apart (and not pay the Hospital bill) if this is disclosed
google it
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anon 9:26
My guess is that “naturals” at game are more likely to be Enneagram Threes
I used to think roissy was a five of sorts but three is more likely; the definitive poser. I generally do NOT get along with average threes.
I believe that Eights and Fives share some relationship on the Enneagram (fives are introverted, eights extraverted).
My daughter is a five and I usually get along very well with fives. They’re smarter, funnier, and more genuine than average threes I have to watch out for average sixes (my last love interest) as they go to three under stress and begin lying to preserve their image. Eights cannot stand hidden agendas and manipulations. Eights are “what you see is what you get” types. I think in New York there are a lot of eights, but perhaps more counter-phobic sixes which can easily be mistaken for eights.
I still refer to that type as “trader chicks,” or “warrior chicks” (everything is a fight). As a mild-mannered beta I found it too much.
My strong nine wing softens my personality quite a bit. You’re describing eights with a seven wing and they are the most aggressive of all the personality types. Eight women in general have a hard time with relationships, because we need a strong man who won’t back down or turn passive-aggressive (my last relationship nightmare) when conflicts arise. We can be hard on the outside to protect our soft gooey interiors. You know the story…..
You’re a mild-mannered beta? How sweet! The meek shall inherit the earth they say. Hang in there…:)
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Thing about sweetness (and any other flavour you get too much of): you eventually throw up if it’s too much.
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Silver Lone Wolf,
They hardly ever do the DNA testing of the fathers unless there’s an indication for genetic counseling anyway. If you further break down the cuckoldry stats into “high confidence” and “low confidence” the ones where the fathers have “high confidence” the rate is about 1.7%. So it happens… but it is pretty rare in modern US.
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>More Mexicans to America is Upside:
>Better food
Agree
>Hotter Girls
On average? NFW. Most of them are butt ugly or fat. It has to be one of the ugliest ethnic groups on average
>More Drugs
ok
>Bars will stay open later
But they just congregate in groups and smash windows
>Smoking will be allowed
sucks
>More Action
>More Excitement
full employment for riot cops
>Mariachi Music (although I hate Mariachi Music)
This sucks big time. They keep taking my radio stations away and turning them into Mariachi/third world gibberish. In SF bay, we call it the “Mandatory Mariachi”. The FCC should clamp down and give stations a $11000 fine every time they pollute the public airwaves with this filth. It was cute when it was 1 or 2 stations.
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Welmer,
The first person to call if you are going to get a divorce is a tax accountant and you both sit your butt down with him and work it out right there. Lawyers will sell you a line of bullshit that they are going to make the other person pay but guess who’s really going to get paid since the judge is probably going to follow the cookbook formula anyway.
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Sara I
My guess is that means you are a Myers-Briggs “Feeling” type (e.g., ESFx), or have only a mild preference for “Thinking.” About 65 percent of women have a preference for F (e.g., xxFx), while 65 percent of men have a preference for T (xxTx). That difference might explain some of the frustrations in dealing with the opposite sex.
Regardless of type strong Ts will always seem “harder” than Fs.
Yeah, I know the story and understand the dynamic. I just found it tiring. Despite my “poor little beta me” jibes, I don’t back down. However, I tend to keep my energy for fights over points-of-principle (things I care about) and be more laidback about points-of-order (things where I have no strong preference). This probably comes from being a Myers-Briggs Perceiving type. P types are comfortable with options remaining open (in other words, on points-of-order type things we really don’t care). This can be mistaken for weakness.
Most PUA/game “experts” will tell you to avoid politics. I ended up with one type Eight [a guess] after a
fierce rowvigorous discussion on politics. I think she liked that here was someone not just standing up to her, but attacking. I presume that many guys would have just performed the me-too tap dance. Sadly, she soon got bored when she realized that I did not want every day to be a version of “Hardball.”Just for fun, try to guess my Enneagram type (I have given you a little help with my chosen screen name).
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I’m totally for this kind of ruling in Spain, because women should not get off scot-free for doing this to a man. Most women I know would agree.
On the flip side, then, Roissy must then favor heavy penalties on a man who cheats on his spouse. Yeah, Roissy will bleat “but it’s not the same.” But hell, even if it ain’t exactly the same, what exactly does Roissy believe that faithful women deserve from their men, if not fidelity? If he answers something lame like “the glory of my cock,” then he’s totally a douchebag omega.
And Roissy must sure as hell enthusiastically favor heavy penalties on older richer men who ditch their wife for someone younger, especially if that wife faithfully stuck with hubby through the lean years.
Roissy is right that there’s a lot of injustice against men, and there’s a large group of women who are coldly indifferent to this injustice. He’s right; it’s fucking disgusting.
But then Roissy sits around and says that fat women should be so shamed and humiliated that they shouldn’t go out, lest Roissy have to see them. Even from a raw practical point of view, how the hell are they supposed to lose the weight, then? Roissy does not express any opprobrium for men who simply leave wives and children and skip child support. He pretends that doesn’t exist.
And that’s where Roissy goes Omega. He’s an omega when it comes for advocating justice for males, because he has no credibility, because he doesn’t give a shit about justice for females. That endless self-love that he says makes him an “alpha” when it comes to women, destroys his ability to lead on anything that matters.
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There is a very simple solution to the reigning paternity conundrum. Immediately upon birth , while the baby’s footprints are being taken, collect a sample of the baby’s DNA and have it tested. The putative father, before signing on the dotted line of the birth certificate, would also have his DNA tested. If he proves to be the father he signs on the dotted line. If not he has the OPTION of signing on the dotted line. Upon signing, all DNA results are to be destroyed. In any case the “guy” pays for HIS test. The baby’s test is included in the cost of delivery. Simple.
But there’s not a snowball’s chance in hell of this happening. Why? The state has a vested interest in producing as many divorces, unwed mothers, castoff fathers, welfare, and prison sentences as it possibly can. Think of the direct and indirect monies generated from these systems that flow into he states’ coffers.
Want to make no fault divorce, if not fair, at least sane?
Easy. Reaffirm the meaning of divorce. The marriage is severed. You go your way, I go mine; we are no longer responsible for each other. Any assets acquired during the marriage gets spit 50/50 INCLUDING CHILDREN. Mothers will be given preference when awarding custody of a single female child. Fathers will be given preference when when awarding custody of a single male child. For multiple children , mother chooses first , and each parent picks much as one would choose teammates in a pickup game of basketball. If they can’t choose the judge chooses for them. The parents will have to show compelling reasons why they are NOT to be given custody. No alimony or child support for either party under any circumstances. This forces fathers to be fathers and it forces everyone involved to give serious thought as to just how viable and attractive the option of divorce is. As things currently stands divorce definitely benefit women and the state. For a man, other than raising YOUR children there really is no incentive for a man to get married other than the illusion of on demand sex. However, since the the state has pretty much eliminated any rights you have as a father and since pussy is running relatively free and in abundance (with the right training, thus the emergence of the PUAs) why in the world would any sane man get married?
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yeah… no alimony sounds great….
but i did take my six figure wife… knocked her up… and told her to quit and never work again …. it probably damaged her career a bit …. it sure helped mine – she threw dinner parties in our home where a bunch of big shot “friends” would attend and I’m sure it helps get my name mentioned in board roams and golf courses from time to time…
if this were to continue on for a decade… wouldn’t alimony be fair? she owns early series A equity in JerrDogg, Inc. does she not?
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JerrDog
I’m quite sure she enjoyed the dinner parties and the fruit of your labors just as much as you. Remember, under my scenario she gets half of everything, including your pension. She has no right to your potential. your dreams, your growth. Again, divorce (be it at her insistence or not because that’s the gist of “no fault” divorce) makes her ineligible to partake in the realization of those resources. These were relinquished the day divorce proceedings were instituted and alimony is just a not so subtle method of stealing from those real and intangible resources of potential, dreams, and growth. If she was making six figures before you married she can certainly make six figures after. And believe you me she was probably networking as much, if not more than, you were at those dinner parties. By necessity she would have had to in order to simply coordinate the event. I know of very few women who are completely dependent upon the income of their mate and incapable of caring for themselves. Alimony is anachronistic and punitive. If women (and men for that matter) approached their marriages with as much zeal, conviction, and healthy fear of losing it, as they would their careers I think there would be a lot fewer divorces. Alimony and child support are inducements for divorce. It is primarily women with children who drive the divorce system. It is the golden carrot that lawyers and the state dangle to perpetuate and enlarge the system, thus ensuring them their fat fees.
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ScotchFiend–
Well said and well done re your debate with Seeking Alpha, touched off in part by something I guess I started.
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ScotchFiend–
“Yes. I would think the BIOLOGICAL father does have some financial responsibility. ”
Yes and no. I’ve been giving the issue of child support and divorce payments a fair bit of thought, mulling thought and some research, for some time now. Started with my childless divorce but that was more than a decade ago. But there’s nothing like a divorce in which I high earning man has to pay out big for reasons that seem very unjust to him, to get him thinking. Pretty much the only thing that DOES or has until very recently gotten men thinking on this subject, given the near total blackout of discussion from rebellious men’s point of view in (Jewish liberal controlled) Hollywood and TV. The net is starting to have an effect though. Still it’s not what guys WANT to think about when they’re young.
I think we’d probably be better off as a country, with a somewhat tough transition, if we simply never gave women government mandated from any man ever. I.e. women could only get child support from men who wanted to give it to them, principally men they were married to or otherwise living with, and ex husbands who wanted to.
I would in fact want to make a few, I said a few, exceptions, but the more I’ve mulled it the less I think the legal establishment wouldn’t totally pervert that. It would have to be cold turkey, at least to start with. Yeah that would be a sort of revolution.
Actually one exception I would make is that if the kids are from an ex husband (or any other man who provably agreed with the woman to have them), he would have to pay the current support scale capped at welfare benefit rates, if welfare was being paid. But then again I certainly wouldn’t expand the currently scaled back welfare rules.
Oh, horrors for the children you say. Mostly not but some. First of all this idea that money is so important for a kid’s upbringing is mostly wrong. The caring and intelligence and values and yes two parent caring and intelligence of the upbringing is what’s important. Usually that’s correlated with income among people that have been in the country for a while, but among those that haven’t, it’s often not at all. I.e. these days Chinese Americans. Previously Jews. Many imigrant groups. What matters much more is their origin country social status, or if they were artificially restricted by ethnically repressive laws or customs, things like their IQ for starters.
My real point though is that esp. when women can earn just like men (even though they often chose not to when a man is supporting them in whole or in part), and they have complete freedom to divorce because e.g. 1) they are after four or 6 years bored with their sex life and want to go prospecting, or 2) have found someone but are much better at hiding it than husbands are for lots of reasons (lead by the media’s lulling husbands to sleep while having put women on red alert for a century), or 3) decide that a genuinely just sex liason by their husband is a good excuse for the real agenda which is 1. or 2., they shouldn’t be encouraged to do so by getting child support which is so high for high earning men that it amounts to mostly alimony. Like often 40% of after tax income for two kids. Way beyond marginal child costs, unless you make continuing the woman’s lifestyle with the husband she decided to leave, and including the children in it, child costs. Which, basically, feminist American law does.
All of this makes having children in America a license for the woman involved to put the male into indentured servitude for 18 years.
As for out of wedlock kids, if the man didn’t want them, and had no right to make the abortion or adoption decision, he shouldn’t remotely have to pay for them.
The result of American women not getting bucks from men who don’t want to give them to them, i.e. through government coercion, would be a greatly increased tendency among women to be more responsible about child birth and upprotected sex (where all but one of the many options are within a woman’s sole knowledge and control) and a greater tendency to seek LTRs with more economically responsible and productive men. Which would be good for society, as all societies have known since even before the birth of agriculture, and certainly after, when real Civilizations were born. Cities, specialization, knowledge industries, accelerating economic progress, and so on. Also empires, and much greater division of wealth.
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There would be a lag though. Because women wouldn’t just coldly rationally decide to be more responsible about unprotected sex or so quick to end a marriage. The culture would have to change to urge/shame them in these directions. So yes there would be a lag. But the economics would tend to create that cultural shift. Would have to be other things too though, I guess.
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ScotchFiend —
I meant to start off saying that as between the defrauded husband whose wife had three kids by other men while married to him but pretended they were his while she knew otherwise, then yes of course the bio dad should be the one paying child support, not the husband. In fact between her and him they should owe the husband for statutory child support from date of birth for all three.
It’s just that I’d go further. Unless the bio dad was in on the wanting to have kids thing and dupe the sucker husband, as opposed to just wanting to have he though protected (she taking care of it) sex, then pay the bitch wife and her brood nothing. Fend for their whore and kids of a whore selves by themselves. Maybe she’ll have to start hooking for real.
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Or you could just ban contraception– both sexes could relearn the stodgy old lesson that sex makes babies, and learn rather quickly not to fuck people they don’t want to be tied to forever.
But that would be less fun for you, would it not?
On the other hand, banning child support means you can have a starter family till your career takes off, then dump the wife’n’kids into some shack eating powdered cheese– hey, the wifey can work again, since the daycare bill isn’t your problem anymore, right?
Then pick a 15-year-old too dumb to know any better, and do the same thing to her. Rinse, repeat.
Culture-building at its finest!
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In fact, if divorced sluts need to be back in the workforce flipping burgers rather than cruelly leeching off their saintly former husbands, then how about we get rid of some other ridiculous feminist interventions that make raising kids so goddamned expensive?
No more car seat laws, no more daycare inspections or minimum staffing levels.
Let’s abolish child labor laws and compulsory education policies; a slut’s kindergartner isn’t going to amount to much anyway, and wasting money educating him is pointless.
If he can pick trash and earn his keep, then so much the better.
Problem solved!
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And prosecution for medical neglect? Obviously a feminist thing– if Daddy doesn’t wanna pay for a doctor, that’s not anyone’s business.
(but if Mommy can’t, then that’s because she couldn’t keep her legs closed, right? Burn the witch!)
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What I think WOULD be a more reasonable solution is for the woman to get zero cash and zero custody, and for the man to be stuck raising the kids, with all the attendant costs and hassles.
Then neither party gets what they want. Perfect!
And both sides of the extended family would see the divorce as being the cataclysmic event that it is.
The husband’s parents, in most instances, would be forced to sacrifice their retirement years to babysit for the next ten or fifteen years, which they do NOT want.
And the wife’s parents will wail that they’ll never see their grandbabies again.
Talk about reducing your in-law problems! They will WANT that marriage to work!
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Sara I
“Obsidian
Women watch more TV. Who says?”
The market research. It’s big. Women watch quite a lot more TV. Men play more video games and spend more time otherwise online.
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Once could argue that there could be some unintended consequences. If one believes that women are only attracted to alpha males, one could presume that females will simply not marry beta males for fear of being stuck in a marriage with him for financial reasons. In effect, it pushes the value of beta males even lower as potential marriage partner as women will fear the lack of an escape route, and makes women crave the alphas even more for short-term relationships.
Now, if you wanted to help men, give them custody rights to their children, create a registry for divorced couples with children so parents can keep track of their kids, permit more flexible arrangements between parents, eliminate idiotic jail-sentences for men who don’t pay immediately pay child support, itemized spending for child support, and allow for child support to be tax-deductible on the state and local level.
First of all this idea that money is so important for a kid’s upbringing is mostly wrong.
Depending on one’s social status, one may want the kids to live in a non-trashy area and wear nice clothes to school to prevent them from being social outcasts, then yes, one may want higher child support payments.
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OMW
Your attempts at sarcasm needs a bit of work- if not direction.
Divorcing husband and wife get half the assets and half the kids. No more bitching about deadbeat daddys and bloodsucking ex-wives. Each has equal footing on making the life of their child the best that each think it should be. If he doesn’t like the way she’s raising the kid well fuck him; it’s not his kid anymore. He has no rights he has no say; but the converse holds true. That’s his baby now so tell her to shut the fuck up! But you see, women will NEVER EVER agree to this because despite paying lip service to “it took two to make this baby; it’s your baby too. Step up and be a man”, bull shit, if you take the baby chit, the kid leverage out of the equation then she can no longer talk that bilge, which means she will default to the age old female truism, “that’s MY BABY!! The baby came from my womb and nobody is going to take MY CHILD!”
Herein lies the nub of the matter which accounts for your oblique ramblings and misdirected sarcasm.
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Well, if you say it is misdirected sarcasm, then I suppose it is. You certainly have a gift for succinct, elegant prose.
Nah, no kids for the woman, though.
Divvying up the kids merely increases the retail cost; it’s cheaper to raise them in bulk, and as a society don’t we always wind up taking the cheaper way out?
Daddy gets the babies, the chores, and the bills. If the “single dad” thing snaps all the local pussy shut, that’s nobody’s problem but his own.
Mommy gets nothing. No kids, no cash, no visitation, nothing but the clothes on her back.
If she wants to cry and wail about the loss of the fruit of her womb, that’s nobody’s problem but her own; the divorce papers are as final as an abortion to her.
I’m dead serious. *That’s* how divorce should work.
It’ll never happen, though.
The current system is softly rewarding both parties– Daddy gets cut loose to play the field again, to a host of sympathetic fresh meat, and Mommy gets a child support check.
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And when I say *that’s* how divorce should work, I mean, “that’s how divorce should work if we belonged to a society that was actually serious about avoiding it.”
But we don’t belong to that society, and so, since divorce is seen by people of both sexes as being acceptable, even inevitable, the system is necessarily going to be set up to make the whole thing as pleasant as possible.
Of course, making divorce as pleasant and easy as possible merely fueled more of it, but even the seemingly ever-climbling rate has been leveling off in the last decade, as I understand.
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DA, one may want to pay them directly to these causes to make sure they are being spent that way. It is amazing what people can justify to themselves are useful for the children.
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Incredible post and correct decision by the Spanish judge. Perhaps it will send the message that cuckolding and adultery will not be rewarded, and eventually deter other women from attempting paternity fraud?
Now, if we can get rulings like this in North America — it just might remove the profit incentive out of paternity fraud. I better pince myself and wake up.
It is rare to find an American judge to make a similar ruling in favor of the deceived husband. I am encouraged to see the term “paternity fraud” being used to label this behavior.
The tide is turning since I founded US Citizens Against Paternity Fraud and http://www.paternityfraud.com in 2000.
Equal rights means equal responsibility. The judge correctly held the children’s mother responsible for her conduct. No more rewarding bad behavior based on gender discrimination.
It is time for the next phase of paternity fraud reform to become statutory law in the US. And why not complete a legal DNA test after birth to confirm paternity?
Like it or not, some mothers (married and single) do not tell the truth until confronted with the paternity test results.
Please see PaternityFraud.com site and warn military men, civilian men and teenage boys about paternity fraud.
Lastly, you can be named as the father of child in the US even if you NEVER had sex with the child’s mother. There is no protection for men unless there is a paternity fraud statute that frees using legal DNA paternity testing.
Cheers,
Carnell Smith PfV “6th year freed from fraud trap”
Founder of US Citizens Against Paternity Fraud
Legal DNA / Paternity Fraud Expert / Advocate / Speaker
http://www.PaternityFraud.com
http://www.911DnaTest.com
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@ Sara I at 2/20 9:34pm
Again, my main point is to create a criminal law against paternity fraud (thanks for the official term, Carnell Smith) with the goal being fewer cases since there would be serious consequences. Will and Carnell Smith’s suggestion of routine DNA paternity tests at childbirth would pragmatically solve the problem. Even with that policy in place I think it makes sense to have the paternity fraud law with appropriate penalties as a backstop and official recognition that society disapproves.
Such laws should be state-based so they would probably vary somewhat by state. We need to stop the accumulation of power by the federal government and courts and revive the 10th amendment. In this way widely different policies can be tested and the results assessed to more efficiently discover what really works and what doesn’t (as well as turning back the power grab by our crappy elites).
Regarding the woman traumatized by finding out her father was a bigamist with a separate family, yes, that bigamist father committed fraud on his original family (the telling implies he was deceptive with the mother). In fact we have laws against bigamy that are still enforced (see below). I do believe that as bad as the bigamist father’s fraud is, with its likely devastating consequences on the wife and child, the paternity fraud is even worse, since in the first case, they’re still related to the bigamist even though he betrayed them, while the cuckolded husband has been duped into into investing his time, money and emotions in a total falsehood perhaps for many years.
According to this source, this kind of fraudulent bigamy is still prosecuted:
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@dougjnn 2/22 at 11:18pm – 12:06am
Thanks for the kind word’s regarding the exchange with the duplicitous Seeking Alpha.
One reason I made the effort was to get him on the record providing a classic demonstration of deceptiveness and bad faith in trying to diminish arguments he couldn’t rebut honestly. He used many rhetorical devices and fallacies and then wanted to pretend “poor little ole innocent me” was just teasin’ and passin’ time at work. Bull****.
As for the responsibilities biological fathers have for their children, I agree with you that modern day America is biased against men and fathers shouldn’t have to pay excessive child support. I’d argue that an upper limit of welfare level payments is too low, unless the father doesn’t earn too much, and would hope that most fathers wouldn’t be that stingy in helping their own kids. Certainly those cases where the fathers are forking big chunks of their net income are a travesty and an ex-wife should have no expectations of continuing to receive large alimony to live luxuriously after divorcing a rich man. Adultery should be punished, in part, by reducing or eliminating alimony.
As for biological fathers with only a casual relationship with the mother (e.g. one night stand), I’d have to disagree they should be absolved of all responsibility. In spite of their limited control over the choices the mother makes after conception, they still participated and bear that responsibility. They have more responsibility for supporting a proven child than taxpayers do. This would be a reasonable case for bare minimum support though and certainly no payouts to subsidize the woman’s lifestyle.
I agree with your general goals of structuring the incentives to improve society. Right now our laws are badly out of balance.
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ScotchFiend–
Please KEEP remembering that where I’m basically coming from is that the explosion in divorce rates and out of wedlock or any other kind of genuine male commitment childbirth is due to feminist enabling of female base instinct choice, while shielding them of a great deal of the past consequences. Government coerced and extracted child support and societal welfare payments mostly, plus fierce elimination of the “bastard” and unwed mothers stigmas, etc.
“I’d argue that an upper limit of welfare level payments is too low, unless the father doesn’t earn too much, and would hope that most fathers wouldn’t be that stingy in helping their own kids.”
I’d argue that this should be up to the father. How much he wants to support his kids. It’s always incredibly fact specific and complicated. He should decide. And she shouldn’t conceive with a man she doesn’t trust to decide. Demand with consequences otherwise a little responsiblitly for all those sluttly thrill seeking females, please.
Some examples:
Ok, we drifted apart, and she kept wanting less sex, approaching none (once a month at best) even though other hot women flirted with me, and my efforts with her weren’t working. So shoot me, I cheated, and more than a little, with the same woman. But I wouldn’t have left my wife, at least while the kids were still living with us. My oldest was 16 and youngest 14. She divorced me.
My response: She’s deeply guilty for not even trying to meet his sexual needs. That’s a duty of all wives. Yes I said DUTY in sharp contradiction of feminism, that vile ideology. But if it were me I’d definitely amply support those kids, fully raised mine, or close. But she would damn well have to at LEAST split big decision making, but to tell you the truth, if it’s my bucks and she wants those bucks big time, no the big decisions are gonna be MY decisions — after listening to her. Or money reduction or cut off. Which she benefits by to, and yeah she loves our kids too.
I think it should be my choice, leaving out the paying so welfare inclined tax payers don’t have to scenario, which I said from the get go above in this comment thread, and you seemed to have missed, would be a clear exception in my schema: Bio dad pays rather than tax payers, but no more than they would have.
Another scenario.
They have kids aged 2 and 4. Slut mother, who skillfully kept her slutty history secret from her husband before marriage (as girls these days are wholesale inclineded to do). High numbers, fast first meeting completions quite a lot, not basement male hotness standards but not so high either, necessarily, when that competes with the urge that drunk night, and the like. But she started back up on sluttiness by cheating. Massively. Some but enough of which he found out.
Give her and the kids zero. That’s what I’d want. And do, law permitting. I’d try law not permitting.
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Why not just have the mom hand the kids over to the dad, doug? Cramp your style too much?
A wise older woman friend of mine once told me that if a woman hits a bad marital rough patch, she should leave the kids with Dad and take a solo separation.
Leaving the mom-and-kids unit intact while Dad finds a bachelor pad somewhere kind of caters to the “easy way out” instincts of both parties, and leaves them in a constant limbo of not being married, but not being really unmarried, either.
He’s mad that he’s providing cash, she’s mad that she’s providing unpaid invisible labor, both of them are mad that everything is more expensive and difficult than it used to be, and they each have an extremely convenient target in each other.
Endless bickering.
Leaving the kids with Dad forces both parties to re-evaluate the value of the marriage in preserving the family unit.
You’d think dads would rally around this idea. LOL.
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OMW
Dad taking the kids and living mom destitute makes no more sense than the insane system we now have. There is nothing equitable or reasonable about your plan. Many women would just stop having babies. “Americanized” women would most definitely become no more than disposable cum soaked distractions. These fathers would, as you said, initially rely somewhat on the aid of his and her parents but would eventually find women, usually of a different cultural bent who still value having and raising children, to join them as their mates. Here, yet again we’d have the classic case of women cutting off their noses to spite their faces.
You seems to be suffering from some really naive misconceptions. Alpha men, true alpha men, who are fathers really do provide for and protect their woman, their women, and all their children and I’m not talking about forking over a child support check. This notion of divorced fathers deliriously running about anxious to find their “bachelor pad” is juvenile.
That wise old woman who gave you advice probably had a terminal case of twat desiccatorus.
Given the tone of your previous posts I suspect the subtext of your message is “Let these whiny assholes raise the kids and see how well they like it. They will come back crawling on their hands and knees for us to take the kids and them back after they realize how much they miss us.
If that is the subtext of your posts dream on. To love and raise my children with my name, my values, my traditions; to instill in them values, that I consider, make them a great human being, and watch them grow into that exceptional man or woman happy, healthy, and grounded, combined with my having access to the free flow of a la carte pussy without fear of any financial or legal recriminations or ramifications? Doesn’t get much better than that.
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OMG
Yes, I would go for the core of your proposal. Not my first choice but better than what we have now.
It does have some merit.
What I would do is bring in a new woman right quick. That is ONCE she left me.
Believe it or not I wouldn’t leave a marriage on my bat except under truly extreme circumstances. That’s not to say I wouldn’t have sex outside of marriage, but don’t take that to mean I would ignore my wife either, if she were herself making and effort.
How about her outside sex you ask? Maybe. It’s different because women are different, on average. It would actually be easier to go this way, with strong rules, with a slut than a fairly or sorta good girl, i.e. a relationship girl w/exceptions.
Trouble is sluttery in women is correlated with irresponsibility about lots of things including I have no doubt motherhood issues, and family issues. But there are also exceptions.
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[…] of third world mass immigration (and, yes, it is evil) in my post on the justice meted out to a whore wife who cuckolded her beta hubbie: Mass immigration benefits the ruling elites economically by crippling the middle class and […]
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You know most U.S. States have a “2-year law”, meaning if it takes you longer than 2 years to prove you aren’t the father you’ll be stuck paying child support for the whole 18.
I’ve seen guys get DNA results proving they aren’t the father. Not only do these non-fathers not get their child support back, they’re forced to keep paying.
Best interest of the child?
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I don’t know where you get the idea that cuckoldry is a huge problem. Studies show the cuckoldry rate to be about 4%. It would suck to be in that 4% but it’s not the huge phenomenon you imply it to be.
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