The Forearm Grab
You’re holding court with three girls. You’re feeling good, on top of your game, and you’ve nailed the perfect stance — standing with your back against the bar surveying your kingdom. The words and the smirks are coming naturally. You know the whole place is watching, intrigued by your social mastery. Five minutes, ten, twenty… you’re not really sure how much time has passed. Your main target’s two friends say they are going to another bar. She shrugs her shoulders at you, smiling, and says she’s going to go with them.
You know this is an IOI to at least grab her contact info. Instead, you reply “You’re a cool chick. Have fun with your friends.” As she turns away and begins to walk off, you grab her forearm firmly and say “Hey”. She spins around, looking at you with a mix of surprise and desire. Her two friends have walked ahead of her. “You’re interesting. Let’s meet sometime. I’ll need your number.” Insta-close.
***
Why this works:
The rollercoaster concept. Girls love oscillating from high to low to high again. She was waiting for you to lunge for her number when she said she had to leave. You denied her that. Unpredictability. Disappointed, she prepared to leave. Then, you grabbed her arm like a mighty godlike hand from the heavens and denied her the disappointment as well.
The hard physical contact. Your grab was firm, fingers wrapped all the way around. This was no time for the light touch. The occasional unapologetically hard and bold kino is one of the purist demonstrations of alphaness. Done at the right time, it will shatter female defenses.
The non-neediness. You almost let her get away. And yet you seemed preternaturally calm about having nearly lost her to the crowd. She was left with the impression that you had no plan to get her number, but changed your mind at the last second. You’re different than every other guy.
Give it a shot.
“how many guys, upon her shrugging her shoulders and saying she’s leaving, would have either gotten mad or whined “Aww, you’re leaving me”?”
Don’t be too sure. The fundamentals of game are not that difficult to master; gamers are no more a protected class than autoworkers.
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do you understand the shackles that will have to be ripped off for most guys to actually do this?
how many guys, upon her shrugging her shoulders and saying she’s leaving, would have either gotten mad or whined “Aww, you’re leaving me”?
anyway, this move works.
a guy has to be sure that he’s received at least a couple of IOIs though.
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a guy has to be sure that he’s received at least a couple of IOIs though.
right. you need the IOIs first. IOIs are a girl’s subconscious way of saying “now you have permission to ratchet up your boldness.”
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That is so sad. Why? The calculation, the cunning nature of it, the unnaturalness of it…. Yes, I know. I don’t “get” it. Further, I don’t want to. Not badly enough to fall for that crap.
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What are the odds that this will actually happen, assuming a non-player as the guy and a fairly normal girl? Would not most girls be confused by the non-request and think that maybe you weren’t that interested? I’ve seen girls be confused by “mixed signals” when the only confusing thing is how they could be so clueless as to be in doubt of a guy’s interest.
Just asking.
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I like it. Simple, effective, and doesn’t require that much memorized dialogue, or anything unnatural; only requires the guts to go for it.
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God Sara, you have the virtual voice of one of my ex girlfriends. So what if his feelings are wrapped up in his image? Whose aren’t to some degree? I know mine are.
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What’s the most Alpha move of all? Savoring the delicious aromas and flavor of this GNP!
Peter
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What the hech is an IOI?
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Hey Peter, did someone shit on that girls crotch? Thats fucking gross. Just because you are into ugly chicks doesnt mean bush is always great. Here is an example of a truly G, NP:
http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.celebalbum.com/gall/stephanie_seymour/stephanie_seymour032.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.celebalbum.com/gall/stephanie_seymour/stephanie_seymour-5.html&usg=__b1z94LDpYV2kTnWbuY_1ZMAEKQ0=&h=860&w=610&sz=59&hl=en&start=51&um=1&tbnid=J4g3fJwVn84SLM:&tbnh=145&tbnw=103&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dstephanie%2Bseymour%2Bnude%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26start%3D40%26um%3D1
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Heck.
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Ovid, first answer, Just Google It Motherfucker. Indicator of Interest.
Sara, who says it’s unnatural? Lots of things we do are practiced in order to be natural. If I have to speak in front of a crowd, I practice so it comes out naturally. If I have an interview I do mock interviews. When I do the mock interview, I think of ways to answer questions to get me a job, to make myself look more attractive to my potential employers. Nobody would look at me funny and say “but that’s so calculated.” They’d say, “It’s good you prepared, you’ll look more polished and professional.” Now why is it, in this context, that being more polished is seen as a bad thing?
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JAW
Now why is it, in this context, that being more polished is seen as a bad thing?
Cuz you’re taking tips from someone who is highly imbalanced in favor of his image. He’s a phony and teaching you to be phony too. If it really gets you what you really, really want; great, but I have some serious doubts about that. Does Neil Strauss–his idol–look happy to you? When I look at him; I think SMARMY. If that’s what you aspire to there’s nothing stopping you.
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Ovid: good rule of thumb for looking up acronyms people use here is to hit google and search: pua ioi
It will find ioi and pua on the same page, which should be sufficiently specific to only find pick up artist terms.
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From what you’ve described, you’ve could’ve also gotten a quick makeout in if you wanted to. After she gives you her number, just look her dead in the eyes, seductively and with a smirk, and say “now gimme a kiss.” Makeout for no longer than 30 seconds or so. Then pull away, maintaining the eye contact/smirk, and say “Now run off, you’re gonna start to worry your friends.” This extra bit of compliance will augment alphaness, and decrease chances of future flake. Just keep that kiss quick, and make sure you pull away first.
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Thanks cptnapalm.Thanks JAW,(I think).
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“Would not most girls be confused by the non-request and think that maybe you weren’t that interested?”
Thus the arm grab. That’s a pretty strong IOI and as he mentioned it captures the element of unpredictability that is highly correlated with vaginal wetness.
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Ack, I misread toward the end. Note to self: read carefully before commenting.
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This concept has been very hard for me to grasp (when they leave, be nonchalant and indifferent – and then do a ‘turnaround’ move to get the makeout close or number close). Anyways, so few guys even KNOW about this let alone do it, that guys get away with saying something beta or acting beta all the time, because while it disappoints women, they expect that most guys (especially younger guys) won’t know to do anything else.
When I execute a move like this. It gives me a +5 advantage AT LEAST within a few seconds. While this is the hardest thing for me to do *in the moment* it is the most effective. Last night, Friday night, I approached a group of 3 girls. Everything was going great, I was feeling strong, good game, confident stance, had my target’s interest, etc. They said, “we’re going to the bathroom” to which I replied *HEAD SLAP* “You’re coming back aren’t you?* Then I thought about my notorious slip-up, shut up and resumed game when I came back for the number close.
Intellectually I know it, understand it, get it. Physically, in the moment, it’s hard to deny my instincts.
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You should study the enneagram type three which it appears more and more that you are. In many ways threes, sixes, and nines are the most fucked up in their own particular fucked up-edness. The three in Freudian terms has an ego-ego conflict. In other words your ego is in conflict with your ego, which is a double fuck basically and makes you obsessed with your image at the expense of your true feelings. Good luck with that.
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Sara,
You say this is all cunning and unnatrual. Perhaps it is, but so, also, is women’s spending large amounts of money on nice outfits, make up, boobs or push-up bras, fake tanning, etc. I like all of those things on women, but I realize it’s just another ploy to make the opposite sex more interested, just like the stuff H writes.
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— you’ve nailed the perfect stance — standing with your back against the bar surveying your kingdom
This reminds me of the cowboy sillhouettes you see in front lawns in the South.
By the way, I discovered an item of beta body language today. We were walking around the Inner Harbor in Baltimore and a young couple (mid 20s) was walking in front of us. The guys seemed like a greater beta and the girl about a 6.
My wife noticed this and pointed it out: they were holding hands opposite of how we always hold hands — with the girls’ hand being in front of the guy’s. In other words, the backside of her hand was facing the direction they were walking and the dude’s back of his hand was facing back, toward us. She said that this is a sign of the woman wearing the pants in that couple.
Interesting, I though, and I tried it — so I switched hands with her to do it like that couple does, and yes – it’s true. For some bizarre reason, as soon as I positioned our hands in the way I described above, I immediately felt this wierd, subordinate vibe inside. Quickly swithed back to normal. Whew! Try it. There is something to this.
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Good one.
I occasionally wish I was born male so I could be the hunter. I do because it’s fun, but only to an extent. Or I would come off too aggressive and it wouldn’t lead to the results I would like.
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Sara said: “Cuz you’re taking tips from someone who is highly imbalanced in favor of his image. ”
Ad hominem is the lowest form of argument there is and does nothing to discredit the logic behind his methods. But, being the emotional, illogical shrew that you are – I wouldn’t expect you to understand. Nor can you see the outright hypocrisy you exhibit by consistently reading and contributing to the blog of someone you find so “imbalanced” and “phony”. you epitomize everything wrong with the female pysche and your flawed attempts to discredit the information doing nothing more than provide a stark example of why game is necessary. For that we should probably thank you, but, I’d rather just tell you to STFU
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Sara —
Let’s just assume you are right, it’s all image and hype.
So what, it WORKS.
The most damning thing about Game is that it does, indeed, for men who are at least average level attractiveness, WORK.
A more damning aspect of female values could not be imagined.
Remember: a guy of average looks and status, suddenly goes to bed night after night with attractive woman after woman, where before he was sexless and alone. Case after case, this has been shown with dedicated students of Game.
If Game did not work, well then the point would be moot. As would your criticism. But it DOES (for a few men who apply it well, at least).
What does that say about women?
It says, that most women (not all) judge men purely on superficial images, will have sex with them first and a relationship after, and are fairly promiscuous and attracted to dominance displays at the expense of pretty much all other characteristics of men.
The corollary of course is that this strong female average preference for dominance displays coupled with sex first, relationship after guarantees a few Alpha players unlikely to ever commit, and frustrated beta boys sure to get their pound of flesh.
Remember: no free lunch, everything has it’s cost.
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Anonymous:
Well said. Nothing is Sara’s claim has any substance or reason to it, its basically, “I dont like this guy for some reason, so what he is saying is bad”. The whole “too calculated” argument is retarded, as if Sara herself has never purposely not picked up a guy’s phone call, or waited a longer amount of time that she first wanted to to call him back, etc.
PA:
Im in a LTR, and I never thought about this, but I know what youre saying. Good call.
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Game will never be understood logically by women in the context he explains it in.
The only way for a women to know if she were ‘gamed’ would be to watch the changes that take place in a man as they continue to see him. I truly skilled user of game doesn’t break it out like an ex-choir student at an open mic night, they make ‘game’ part of their identity and incorporate it into their personality on a level where it transcends the idea of skill but becomes who they are.
Women who are gamed will notice their man make repeated trips to beta-town immediately after that first night. But don’t throw the baby out with the bath water, the man is trying hard to be the alpha-male women truly want him to be.
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Sara,
The thing is, I can incorporate things that I think work, while eschewing things that I don’t. I disagree with her on many many things, certainly politically and morally, but I still think attraction is based on evolutionary psychology, and I’m unwilling to deny myself its pleasures because it might be a little calculated.
Negs work, being bold and alpha, they work. When I moved to New York, after having been in a long-term relationship, I went out on dates and they’d be pleasant but then…nothing. I had read the Game, while in my relationship, just because it was entertaining. So I started just throwing in casual negs. I did a bit of Kino escalation while at the bar. Same conversations, same two people enjoying each other. Except, in one instance I was getting nothing after, and in the second, stuff was working out for me. The difference is that I was less attractive in the first instance. Why shouldn’t I make myself more attractive?
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I don’t see Sara as particularly shrewy…She just has a problem with her Manian translator.
His online “image” is like my “image” to my students. Teaching/instruction mode isn’t the same (at least for men) as casual blogging with maybe a few kernels of wisdom here and there.
When he’s out at a pub, he may do some instruction, but he’s not in instruction mode. He’s in guy trying to get some or at least make an impression mode.
We also don’t know whether or not this move is natural for him, and he is analyzing why it works, or if this is something he had to train himself to do that is completely unnatural.
I will say that he most likely enjoys the results of such actions, so it’s very likely not to be entirely unnatural. If one wants something alot, then it’s natural for them to do what it takes to get it.
Wanting something and *not* doing what it takes, but expecting to get what you want magically, is what’s unnatural…and this is sadly how way too many men behave.
I could tell you stories… :: shaking my head ::
Obviously, guys who don’t want women who would be responsive to this, won’t do this…but guys who want women who will be responsive to the manly sort of touching gestures, should probably do manly touching gestures, rather than banking on hope and magic from a safe distance.
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PA:
For some bizarre reason, as soon as I positioned our hands in the way I described above, I immediately felt this wierd, subordinate vibe inside.
this is a great observation. yes, i’ve noticed the same thing when my hand was momentarily positioned behind my girl’s hand. a simple hand placement into a subordinate position is enough to trigger ancient emotions in our deepest brains. and it works the same way for women — they prefer their hands behind yours.
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This is the ultimate fatherly alpha thing to say:
If you have a son, or might have one day, remember it. Said like it needs to be said right here:
And check out some real alpha body language in the video as well, especially at 24-32 seconds.
As a bonus (the goodies just don’t stop!) this whole clip is set to the best rock song ever.
Whose lyrics, incidentally, are a perfect metaphor for the PUA’s life.
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Good game tip there. I like the psychological reasoning. Putting people in the right mood to say “yes” is a huge factor in them saying yes. This is why certain types of background music is used to sell different kinds of cars, trucks, and motorcycles to both male and female markets.
Whiskey,
Women’s susceptibility to game reminds me of an old joke I heard literally two decades ago. It went like this:
=========================================
“Did you hear the joke about the man who finally figured out what women want?
…….He died laughing before he could tell anybody. ”
=========================================
Status plays such a ridiculous role in female striving, that its hard for men to understand. The big weddings are just ways to say, “Im important, I had a bigger wedding than my rival even though she married the guy I was in love with, but Im still happy”. Getting the most socially dominant male available is something that is primally moving to females, even if the guy is hardly literate, has a record of felonies, is marginally employed, has a bad temper, and will likely abuse her physically and emotionally.
In a way, men are similar in that they will favor good-looking women despite many personal faults and negative personality traits over average-looking gals who are sweet as honey. I suppose both sexes are truly guilty in not picking the most acceptable mates for themelves. Both sexes will make up excuses to be with someone they are primally attracted to, partially because they like how that person makes them feel about THEMSELVES. A woman especially, wants a socially dominant man that other men fear/respect/defer to because they subconciously want others to revere them in similar ways, even if they’ve never mentally spelled it out.
“full of sound fury, signifying nothing”
or better yet:
“frailty, thy name is woman”
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It’s posts like these that make me keep coming back to this blog.
Solid info.
I have an open question for everyone. I understand that eye contact is extremely important. In other words alpha males look directly into a female’s eyes to demonstrate their fearless, uber-manhood. Now, what I need to know is how many out there ALWAYS try to have the women break eye contact first? I’m a newb so bare with me. I always feel a bit awkward staring into a girl’s eyes I’m talking to when she returns the intense gaze for a couple of seconds after we have both finished what we are saying. I usually look at her in the eyes and then I need to break away because after 2 seconds it seems bizarre to continue to hold solid eye contact when we have both finished what we were talking about. But I still hate being the first one to look away.
Thoughts?
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Btw, I don’t know why anyone responds to anything Sara I has to say.
Best way to get rid of a troll is to never feed it.
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Speaking of female mate selection.
I posted a while back about a younger women married to an older (22 vs 30) old guy, she a real partier, he a stick in the mud middle manager, very beta, and how, after a kid, she seemed to be looking to move on and up. She was getting some offers.
Well, she seems to be staying with him for now. My advice to her was this beta guy will stand by her through anything and give his life for hers unhesitantingly. Try buying this thing called love.
I spoke to one of her girlfriends recently. Her girlfriend, her contemporary, now both about 23-25. Her girlfriend pointed out to her that all she (the girlfriend) now has are dogs. She has gone through relationships (with jerks) but they have come to nothing. So, it looks like stability in a man starts to sound attractive about age 23-25. But, the problem is, where does a fading (age 24??) hottie partygirl go when she finds she needs a good beta provider aka husband.
These girls are not college grads. That seems crucial to their attitude that early pairing off with a beta type guy is not a really bad decision.
This points up the importance of economics in allowing “hot” girls to just party on into their late twenties and thirties. Economically they don’t need a man, so they don’t think they need a man. Period. One more evil effect of prosperity.
Well, none of this is new, having all been covered on this blog site repeatedly, but it is good to see these things confirmed in one’s personal experience.
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If you maintain eye contact with a chic across the room. You are more than likely going home with her if you press the issue.
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Gunslingergregi
I agree, as long as you can back it up with solid game.
But what about women that you are not trying to game, but they are giving you tons of eye contact during a normal conversation and holding it after? I may not be interested in gaming her, but I still want it to be clear that I’m not afraid to if I want to.
Btw, an example would be women at work that you talk to.
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Btw, an example would be women at work that you talk to.
At this point, I game all women I work with. Even older ones, fat ones, married ones, etc., though each in a different way. Not with the intention of sleeping with any of them, but just for fun
It’s become second-nature to me, and I don’t even think of it as “gaming” but as being “a fun guy.” The well-chosen negs, the confident body language, friendliness, etc.
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Sara wrote, “You should study the enneagram type three which it appears more and more that you are. Cluck cluck cluck bockety bock bock bock. The three in Freudian terms has an ego-ego conflict. Cluck cluck cluck cluck cluck bockety bock bock bock.”
I bet you believe in astrology too. Do you actually think those deranged chicken noises you’re making are anything remotely approaching rational thought? I mean, the enneagram? You could at least be original and come up with something from the lesser key of Solomon.
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whiskey: define “promiscuous”. I believe game definitely works in terms of primitive sexual attraction; being affected by that (and dominance is fairly rare) makes a girl a ho? How many of these actual women automatically put out immediately? Isn’t this idea also skewed by the primary location of game: an alcohol fueled setting, where sexuality is expected if not even sought for?
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“Carl Sagan
Gunslingergregi
I agree, as long as you can back it up with solid game.
But what about women that you are not trying to game, but they are giving you tons of eye contact during a normal conversation and holding it after? I may not be interested in gaming her, but I still want it to be clear that I’m not afraid to if I want to.
Btw, an example would be women at work that you talk to.”
Don’t know if this applies to woman at work or not. New chick at work was eye to eye with me the whole time talking with her. Not sure if that means I can get it in that situation. Usually seems like even if they make more than me the fact that I know a 100 times more than they do and have a plan for my life beyond work, plus having other guys bringing up my good points in front of them seems like they want my d. The ironic part (also probably helps to already be in love with a woman and them hear you talk to her on the phone) Building up your woman to another woman also makes them wet. Things I have noticed. The dynamic has changed with her arrival. Former tens bragging they have guys hitting on them all day have become 2’s now and trying really really hard to impress now that a real 10 is here.
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PA
At this point, I game all women I work with. Even older ones, fat ones, married ones, etc., though each in a different way. Not with the intention of sleeping with any of them, but just for fun
It’s become second-nature to me, and I don’t even think of it as “gaming” but as being “a fun guy.” The well-chosen negs, the confident body language, friendliness, etc.
I have the same philosophy. I spend a lot of my life at work. If I’m ever gonna get good at game I’m gonna have to use it practically everywhere I go until it becomes me.
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My modification of his line for fun:
“Hey” *grab her* “Actually,” *wait for her to look at you, hold that eye contact as if you’re contemplating something and squeeze/stroke subtly with your hand then smile knowingly* “I’ll have your number.”
Why I prefer this version is because the original can smack of a drunk slow reaction time or not having any balls to ask her out, instead of genuinely changing your mind. This doesn’t completely eliminate that though. Plus, (especially if you add on the 30sec kiss) you establish the sexual connection firmly.
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^ Beta Move of the Day?
I can’t believe that men still actually get down on one knee and propose. No wonder she said no. That beta probably hung himself that night.
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Create a message board
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^Look at the mascot in the video after she shuts him down, now THAT is priceless.
The announcers talking about how they wanted a woman to say no to one of these proposals before it happened happens to be a nice touch as well.
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Bhetti — the rate of sexual partners, and the habit of having sex first and relationship later, is well established among the Yuppie set: urban professionals. It’s tedious to recount, but the national average for all women (this includes women in their 70’s-80’s) is four, for men it is IIRC nine. Yet among young urban professionals 24-34 it is not unusual for a woman to have 3-4 partners a year. Year after year.
Women just have a lot more sex in urban professional environments. They can critically, “AFFORD” it like other luxuries, and do indeed engage far more in it than in times past. Just the way female consumer spending on all sorts of things is far greater than times past. One often-noted aspect: Women form the majority of new car buyers. This is why you see ads tailored to them now.
Women in their thirties, professionals, routinely report in the Yuppie Central newspaper, the NYT, that they rack up 40-60 partners. One quote “I stopped counting after forty” says it all.
Duh. Women enjoy sex. A lot. They can indulge in it, safely for the most part, and do.
Moreover, the “bar skank” critique does not work. These are for the most part not Strippers, or other pseudo-sex workers, but accountants, lawyers, corporate finance, corporate HR, marketing, and other executives, nurses, doctors, teachers, and others seeking casual sex first with the most thrilling guy they can pick up, THEN a relationship afterwards.
Sex and the City was written by gay men, but does probably reflect the lives of urban professional women. Dominated by status, their relationship with men focused on sex appeal first, the most intimate relationships emotionally being that of their female friends who form their support group.
Over and over again women say the same thing, that the only people they rely/depend on is their female friends. Which is to my mind a slender reed indeed. But there it is.
Again, the number of sex partners most “nice” women have is astonishing compared to prior levels just a few generations ago. A nice, sweet, decent young woman in her early thirties who gives to Greenpeace and Habitat for Humanity, works as an accountant in some corporation, and exudes girl-next-door wholesomeness, probably has about 45 sex partners already.
She has not gotten “slutty.” What has changed is that there is no social penalty for all those sex partners, indeed it’s viewed as a sign of maturity by most women to search for “the Right Guy” by having so many sex partners. And of course, sex first relationship afterwards.
After all, where is a nice girl to meet guys? Bars and clubs. That’s where. So that’s what drives everything. Workplace romance is both taboo and awkward, and the pickings there are slim. Fellow corporate drones who are not exciting and dominant, corporate life forbids that sort of thing.
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Tood just tell her she is your woman now. Either she agrees with that or doesn’t.
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I’ve learned a lot from this blog, as much from the comments as the topics themselves. I just came across this ad on the Philly craigslist and was wondering if anybody could suggest the best approach. thx
http://philadelphia.craigslist.org/w4m/1086107854.html
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whiskey: Have not observed yuppies yet; the literature and media agree with you on that one and waiting for myself to observe it will just confirm this. (There will always be exceptions and people with different priorities, but the lifestyle of the yuppie seems to be the one you outlined, even though I won’t follow that path.) I understand from what you’re saying is that you don’t equate sluttiness to promiscuity, or else that you don’t think the inherent promiscuity of women has changed.
My mother (who got obsessed with Sex & the City after getting here from Arabic society a couple of years ago), says it’s not a bad idea for the engine to be tested before the car is taken for a drive (i.e. sex before relationship; she definitely doesn’t support this for me but likes the idea theoretically). Personally, it’s so alien to my sexuality to be intimate with someone I don’t know. Pleasure in the act involves trust, respect and so on. An easy explanation is that I’m… frigid? Ow.
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Whiskey is a smart guy but a horrifically one-dimensional thinker. I read his comments closely because he really is worth reading but I also scan his writing with an eye for his usual single-factor fallacy.
Which is his usual error is of noticing only one quality/trend/fact and extrapolate everything else from that single item while ignoring competing trends or factors.
A caricature of Whiskey’s kind of reasoning: a small cut = bleeding = fatal hemorrhage = death. No room in this scenario for coagulation, sitting down, bandaid, etc. Thus, paper cut turns into bleeding to death.
For example, he recently, with great vehemance, announced that women love Islam and hate Christianity. How did he get there? On the (correct) premise that women like dominant men. In other words, women love this:
Right?
He also ignores the fact that married Christian women report very high levels of haqppiness and satisfaction with life, while bar sluts (another example of Whiskey’s caricature of teh fulfilled woman) tend to be unhappy.
So when Bhetti says “Pleasure in the act involves trust, respect and so on,” Whiskey blinks confusedly. Where is the testosterone and the dominant cock in Bhetti’s comment, he wonders.
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Can you do a big post on how to do openers, and how to find the right opener that works for an individual guy?
That is the biggest stumbling block that the largest number of novices face. This stumbling block prevents them from advancing to practice other aspects of Game.
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and it works the same way for women — they prefer their hands behind yours.
That’s weird. Whenever I’ve held hands with a girl, our palms face inward toward each other’s bodies respectively. My hand has never been in front or behind.
These girls are not college grads. That seems crucial to their attitude that early pairing off with a beta type guy is not a really bad decision.
My non-date doesn’t have a college degree, so she’s finding that beta males with college degrees tend to be picky, and blue collar guys with money can do better than her. So her current choice is either to stay single or day loser guys who make crap. She is going back to school in the hopes of increasing her income, and eventually finding a decent husband.
Economically they don’t need a man, so they don’t think they need a man. Period. One more evil effect of prosperity.
Dude, that’s not an evil effect, that’s a benefit. Why is it magically better for these beta males to have spouses that only view them as financial stability? This simply encourages the golddigging behaviour that the posters here generally complain about in women. I would feel insulted if a woman dated me because she saw me as a source of income, and I suspect most men would too.
Again, given the choice between staying single and feeding a golddigger, I’d rather stay single, and that’s even if she “gives in” to my fetishes to bribe me.
Even older ones, fat ones, married ones, etc., though each in a different way.
Joke: You’re being mean. You’re letting them think that they may have a chance. 😛
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PA,
I’ve encountered the battle of the hands….it feels very awkward to have the hand on the underneath of your woman’s….Another thing you’ll often see is the woman trying to drag the guy along like he’s her toy….i’ve had girls try this one on me in the past….i give their arm a good yanking in the same way when i’m walking my dog and he tries to outrun my pace….girls learn quick when their shoulder nearly comes out of socket
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Whenever I’ve held hands with a girl, our palms face inward toward each other’s bodies respectively. My hand has never been in front or behind.
DA: you can’t hold hands in a perfectly symmetrical way because someone’s forearm has to be in front of the other person’s. Just google/images “holding hands” and you’ll see.
I would feel insulted if a woman dated me because she saw me as a source of income, and I suspect most men would too.
Sure, if she dated you as a source of income without loving you independently of your income. Just as a woman would feel insulted because you dated her for the way she cleans the house or for her womb, and not because you also loved her independent of those qualities.
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PA: DUDE, there’re women under there! What’s with the extra blue scarf on top?! I learn something new about Xtreme Islam every week.
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Another thing you’ll often see is the woman trying to drag the guy along like he’s her toy
That’s a common shit test early in the relationship. When approaching a pole or a something else directly in yur path between you two, a girl will subtly tug you toward her to see if you follow her or if you make her follow your path.
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Off-topic. I went on a limb and decided, since I’m stuck in on this Saturday night, that I should play with a little online game. I got this response from an email I sent to a craigslist ad:
“Well, well. Do I detect the smarmy purview of the book-trained pick-up “artist?” You can only (successfully) dominate the directional flow if you first (successfully) prove intellectual/social dominance. Capitalization might help.
Nice effort, better hit the books a bit more”
I was wondering if anyone had any experience with getting responses like this from woman in online game. Better yet, has anyone received feedback from this in person? Discuss.
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This’ll be interesting: I just find it very difficult to conceive online game working. If you go for intellectual, you sound like the love of my life tokyo. If you go nice, you beta. All that I can see is strategies to get face-to-face asap.
What did you say to the chick, exactly, some sort of copy and paste from a well-known game manual? Is it me or did that sound a bit bitchy for a response to an ONLINE ad (you could argue its constructive. Vaguely.)?
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Brad, did you get that response from the link I posted above?
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Various studies have revealed that a much larger percentage of early 20s females are sexually active than men of the same age.
There it is. I mean, with whom are they fucking? A small percent of men. At a single stroke the whole foundation of monogamy is destroyed. Modern women, when given the opportunity, have taught men that they all want you or none of them do. Either way it makes little sense from a guys perspective to make a comittment for a lifetime if the truth is she never can really want you, sexually; or she plus all her sisters would like to take a turn with you as well.
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^Yes. I don’t even live in that area. Figured I’d give it a try.
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DA: you can’t hold hands in a perfectly symmetrical way because someone’s forearm has to be in front of the other person’s. Just google/images “holding hands” and you’ll see.
Actually, I just tested this out with my younger brother, and my hand was above his hand. Somehow, he felt weird when his arm was on top. We switches sides, and somehow, naturally, my arm was on top.
I’ll remember this the next time I hold a woman’s hand…
Sure, if she dated you as a source of income without loving you independently of your income.
No female is capable of loving a beta male or being sexually attracted to one, thus the only reason a woman is with a beta male is to extract his financial resources. At that point, it is an insult for her to fake attraction toward me and lure me with third rate sex.
Besides, if she wanted kids without the burden of a male interfering, there’s always a one-night stand. She’d probably be more likely to remember the conception.
Just as a woman would feel insulted because you dated her for the way she cleans the house or for her womb, and not because you also loved her independent of those qualities.
I would suspect that a woman would grow insulted if she found out that I was using her because I grew tired of porn, and she was the best and easiest that I could do, and that if I had the choice, I’d go back to porn.
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@Longtime Reader –
1. Really? No way did that! The point of doing online game for me (since there is such a small percent chance of return) is PRACTICE! How are you ever going to get better in *real life* if you aren’t practicing your own material? Especially if you are trying to actually meet and hook up with this woman! She will notice the incongruency IMMEDIATELY… I bet if you sent that message and it worked and she met you she would walk away as soon as she saw you (no offense, just the vibe I got from the email she sent me).
2. If she hasn’t replied yet, you probably won’t get a reply. I got a reply within 11 minutes.
3. Seriously, on the next one just be your *improved alpha game-wreaking* self.
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Ok, so I got a response. Didn’t go so well. However, funny thing…
She asked if there’s a convention in town or something. Seems she got two almost identical responses.
Now, I know I sent one, and I would have to assume that a reader of this blog sent the other.
Interesting coincidence, no?
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Yeah, I sent a message but haven’t gotten a response yet. I used as a template a response he wrote about in a post. No big deal if it doesn’t work, but I thought it was worth a try. Sounded better than the usual fat chicks with kids on cl.
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PA —
I’m not one-dimensional — I’m observing a HUGE shift in behavior. The women who are racking up 40-60 partners by their thirties are “nice” girls. They are not “sluts” as defined by the stripper-esque persona of say, Pamela Anderson or Lindsay Lohan.
They are stable, professional, sober, responsible women. Who have about ten times more partners than their mothers did about thirty plus years ago.
THAT is a huge shift.
It’s no surprise when Pam Anderson racks up that bednotch count. It’s a huge shift when Jane Average does. Note Bhetti B’s mother’s approval of sex before relationship.
THAT also is a huge shift (and a huge red flag on who has the power, hint it’s not men). Prior generations had women not having much sex before relationships, and not many partners either, since men don’t commit or care about women with a lot of partners. Women of past generations would have reacted in horror at test drive first, because the penalty for too many partners was too great: not much prospects for a good husband.
And you missed my point. Women no more like the burqua and other issues around Islam than they like getting smacked around. Yet woman after woman will return to abusive men? Why? Because they like the testosterone dominance of the abusive man, enough to put up with it to get that dose of dominance.
Women don’t like in the West much of Islam. Yet are it’s chief defenders, politically, socially, and culturally. Code Pink, ANSWER, the rest are dominated by women particularly in the volunteer ranks. Why?
Because women and Muslims have the same enemy: Single White Beta Men. For women it’s easy to see why they ally with and defend Muslim men against Beta White guys. Beta White guys subject them to unwanted male sexual desire, are awkwardly aggressive, a competition in the workplace, and not “fabulous” like gay men. White Women, married, single, or past the age of menopause, have no desire to be part of the Islamic harems of various Sheiks, or live in an Islamic world. But ANY enemy of the Beta White guy is an ally of theirs.
You can also see this in the basic values that Beta White guys espouse: male cooperation, an even playing field, “flat” social hierarchies, opportunities for strivers, and those that Women prefer: stratified aristocracies, particularly ones that favor connected/pretty women, intense male competition and deadly rivalries, keeping upward nose-to-the-grindstone strivers from achieving (and upending the aristocracy) and the like.
It’s why, at a basic level, guys like stuff such as “Band of Brothers” (which tells the entire story right there in the title) about guys coming together as one to overcome an opponent (or pretty much any team sports movie, or war movie) …
And women like stuff about sexy, dominant, rivalrous vampires.
Men like to control male rivalry so everyone pulls together, women prefer it amped up so they pick the winner.
It’s no accident as the Marxists say that Women form the main defenders of Islamists in the US and Europe, at every turn. Women hate the Beta (White) male and will ally with anyone that is his enemy, even or especially the Islamists.
[Yes women hate hate hate Christianity which has on it restrictions of absolute sexual freedom, they view Islam as something merely for colorful non-Whites, who only blow up Beta males who deserve it anyway. You’ll see this all the time in Europe where Muslim assaults on women who are White and Native Europeans are pointedly ignored because the real crime is “White Racism” aka icky Beta White males. Beta Males and Christianity are the near-enemy and Muslims the distant, only theoretical enemy, allied against the enemy they truly hate, the Beta guy who ogled them on the train.]
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Peter is the most perverted, sickest fuck I have ever seen.
He has latent bestial proclivities. He actually wants the woman’s buttocks to be covered with hair as well. Eeeeewwwwww!!!
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“But, being the emotional, illogical shrew that you are – I wouldn’t expect you to understand. Nor can you see the outright hypocrisy you exhibit by consistently reading and contributing to the blog of someone you find so “imbalanced” and “phony”. you epitomize everything wrong with the female pysche and your flawed attempts to discredit the information doing nothing more than provide a stark example of why game is necessary. For that we should probably thank you, but, I’d rather just tell you to STFU”
I expect I’ll piss off Sara, but anon, she’s just a normal woman. The majority of women don’t get game, and can’t get their heads around what it is and why it works and why it is what it is.
Women and men are different, which is why we need to sort out what the hell it is we are all dealing with.
Where a site like this is invaluable is in countering the feminist/matriarchal dogma which has done so much damage to our society, making it difficult for both men and women.
The idea that women are “equal” is a fallacy, but there can still be equivalence in some areas.
Unfortunately, when it comes to sexual behaviour, there is no equality.
A woman can’t play like a man and come away unscathed, a man can’t play like a woman and remain likewise unscathed.
Look at all the manginas and the pussywhipped out there. It’s not pretty.
Sara has a daughter, and this would be colouring her perception of what you all have to say: everying is being filtered through a prism of what is good for her child.
Okay, maybe I’m just projecting my own views here, because that’s how I look at the world these days.
In any case, it’s also very difficult for women to deal with this subject matter because it goes against so much of what we learn growing up and living our lives.
The idea of evolutionary psychology and gender realism is like a slap in the face to women who have been brought up with the idea that they can have it all (including the knight on the white horse) and they can get rather defensive about it.
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Z
Well, but how about if you fuck her silly, and keep her addicted to what you provide, and she knows other men can’t provide that for her?
Social dominance is not as powerful as sexual dominance.
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That’s a dim view of “nice” girls, posted above.
But, if true, and I suspect is has a lot of truth to it, it would behoove any man contemplating marriage to hire a private eye to check out his girl’s sexual history. After all, if getting married is like buying a car, (take if for a test drive, the girls say) certainly when buying a used car you want to check out its repair history and mileage, look for signs of misuse,( eg. Was this nice looking car ever used for racing or this nice late model pickup trunk ever used for plowing? Was this car in a accident? Is the frame bent? Rust damage? Does it burn oil? Does it need new tires? Don’t just look at the odometer and the paint job!) and think about the warranty.
I guess the question is this: How many quality (stable, productive, reliable) men would marry a nice women who had had 40 sex partners by the time she was 32 years old? I suspect the answer would be close to zero percent.
Those “skanks/strippers” may have had a lot of men, but they were doing it out of economic necessity, not for amusement. So, who is to be more strongly criticized for their behavior? Who would be more likely to cheap on you after marriage?
What goes around comes around.
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I’m also confused by Whiskey. He has a message, but too much of one. He’s, a, a bit political. Taken up by the mood of his view.
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Nilk
it’s so sweet to know that men are kind and sensitive.
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whiskey=evil neocon
He has a point, but he’s just too obnoxious.
He doesn’t need game, he needs to shut up.
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Whiskey – where are all these Western women who hate white guys so much they’ll ally theselves with Islam to destroy them? Code Pink, ANSWER, and the like are nut job lesbians, hardly a representation of “women.” Most are demented because of mental illness, hormonal imbalance, or possibly sexual assaults in childhood. Others are marxist sickoes or part of the white/Christian-hating left wing subset of the Jewish intellectual class.
The real-life white women I know tend to avoid thuggish non-whites, they date/marry white guys somewhere along the alpha – greater beta scale, and their erotic fantasies more likely feature Brad Pitt, Daniel Day Lewis, or some good looking white guy they work with than some smelly Arab in gallabyia and sandals.
Men like to control male rivalry so everyone pulls together, women prefer it amped up so they pick the winner.
You are a smart guy and a good writer, and quotes like that one above are one of the reasons why. But again — so fucking what? Girls have Cinderella fantasies. Reality check: how many princesses where there in aristocracies, vs. how many washer women who were slapped around by these princesses and groped by lesser courtiers?
You are a despair-monger and somethign of a monomaniac. You will see something and blow its importance out of proportions.
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One more reality check: working in DC, I often see various political protests. One contrast that sticks in my mind is from a couple of years ago. There was a feminist rally and then a month later a pro-life rally, both very massive in term of numbers of participants.
The feminist rally was loded with ugly and unwholesome looking women, of all ages, from fat college “activist” types, to boy-haircut silver-haired old women. Yechh. The men were faggy or hippie looking.
The pro-life rally, in contrast, was a mssive parade of various church groups, mostly from teh mid-West (their placards identified their affiliations) consisting of very pretty girls, from early teens through middle age, along with decent-looking guys of all ages.
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Whiskey:
You’ve changed your position. As you note in your last comment, feminist women in the West don’t politically support Islam because it is dominant and women like dominance. They support it because it has a common enemy in our traditional Christian culture and because they don’t really understand what it is.
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Others are marxist sickoes or part of the white/Christian-hating left wing subset of the Jewish intellectual class.
A-yup. Best captured by that loopy bitch Naomi Wolf::
“The West interprets veiling as repression of women and suppression of their sexuality. But when I travelled in Muslim countries and was invited to join a discussion in women-only settings within Muslim homes, I learned that Muslim attitudes toward women’s appearance and sexuality are not rooted in repression, but in a strong sense of public versus private, of what is due to God and what is due to one’s husband. It is not that Islam suppresses sexuality, but that it embodies a strongly developed sense of its appropriate channelling – toward marriage, the bonds that sustain family life, and the attachment that secures a home”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naomi_Wolf
Liberals in general are mainly just whites at war with other whites. The dusky races and what they do aren’t important to them to the extent they don’t give them leverage in the war for power against other whites.
So most feminist attacks against masculinity can be interpreted as merely a self-interested and greedy war for political, cultural, and economic dominance against white men.
The bad behavior of nonwhites is irrelevant, as usual, and the uncorrupted, illiberal masculinity of nonwhite, nonWestern men is excused, and indeed, openly fantasized about.
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“Whiskey
I’m not one-dimensional — I’m observing a HUGE shift in behavior. The women who are racking up 40-60 partners by their thirties are “nice” girls. They are not “sluts” as defined by the stripper-esque persona of say, Pamela Anderson or Lindsay Lohan.”
No man these are no longer nice girls after 40 to 60 parters if they weren’t working as prostitutes.
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PA: He also ignores the fact that married Christian women report very high levels of haqppiness and satisfaction with life, while bar sluts (another example of Whiskey’s caricature of teh fulfilled woman) tend to be unhappy.
This doesn’t say as much as you think it does. Most of these “married Christian women” are ex-barskanks themselves, I’d wager.
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JAW
Negs work, being bold and alpha, they work. When I moved to New York, after having been in a long-term relationship, I went out on dates and they’d be pleasant but then…nothing. I had read the Game, while in my relationship, just because it was entertaining. So I started just throwing in casual negs. I did a bit of Kino escalation while at the bar. Same conversations, same two people enjoying each other. Except, in one instance I was getting nothing after, and in the second, stuff was working out for me. The difference is that I was less attractive in the first instance. Why shouldn’t I make myself more attractive?
There’s no should or shouldn’t here. You say you were less attractive at first and after learning to “neg” and “Kino escalate” (I have no freakin’ idea what that means) you now find yourself more attractive to the opposite sex. Great. What next? Personally the negs are so stupidly obvious to me, they don’t EVER work. Please explain “Kino escalation” so I can avoid that one too.
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I bought the full clint eastwood movie pack. Watched any which way you can yesterday. Seems like in that movie everyone is treated as a human being. Cops, Bad Guys, Good Guys, Rich, Poor, they were all still human and capable of living a good life having fun and participating in life together. This is the same thing I see where I go. I don’t see that in the states. Why I think if you are a man it might behoove you to go to a different place to choose your life partner. Ending up with a slut cannot be good for your long term future. Better to end up married to a former hooker.
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Loopy Lupo
I bet you believe in astrology too. Do you actually think those deranged chicken noises you’re making are anything remotely approaching rational thought? I mean, the enneagram? You could at least be original and come up with something from the lesser key of Solomon.
Wow, I’m impressed.
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anon 4:40
Ad hominem is the lowest form of argument there is and does nothing to discredit the logic behind his methods.
Such passion. FYI logic only employ one half the brain. I prefer to use both halves when possible, not that it happens often.
For that we should probably thank you, but, I’d rather just tell you to STFU
That’s probably not going to work.
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Gunslinger —
Let’s take the cycle of an average, nice girl with a two parent family, middle class background, who goes to college.
In High School, she’s likely to have three sexual partners. One a “one-off” and two who were steady. From age 16-18. We might lament this, but it’s social reality. Even nice Preacher’s daughters and other girls from stable two-family homes have this pattern, the WE show “American Teen” focusing on HS girls showed this pattern (along with boozing it up in house parties) in the Kansas Heartland.
Now take College, a four-year party with no responsibilities, lots of booze, and little social stigma for many partners. A girl can easily have three partners a year in such a hot-house environment. By the time she graduates from College, she’s had 15 partners already.
Now, from age 22 to age 32, it’s also ridiculously easy for a woman to have three sex partners a year. It’s probably not going to spaced out evenly, a woman might have one partner for two years, and then six partners for one year, no partners for one year, and nine partners for the year after. But that’s probably the pattern.
If the woman lives alone, only she would know how many partners she has. If she has room-mates, they won’t condemn her partners numbers, but rather celebrate it as “empowering” and a search for the right guy.
Critically, the woman herself would not view her behavior as “slutty” nor would her female friends nor would female culture in and of itself. As he pointed out again, and again, anonymous urban living and contraception and higher female incomes pretty much guarantee this behavior shift.
To this I’d add a fourth and fifth set of factors: women’s willingness to share a few Alpha men, and female approval of many sex partners.
He noted, at length, the weirdness and “betatude” of a guy who’s fiancee/wife writes in their wedding announcement in the NYT about all her past boyfriends, sexual experiences, and so on. The guy is beta, true, but it also suggests that beta guys can at best get that kind of girl to marry them. The implications of THAT are pretty deep.
I’d say women’s partners will drop appreciably when three out of the five factors go away. [As for investigating a woman’s past partners, it’s probably impractical, given the highly anonymous urban life if a woman is at all discreet in simply not posting stuff on Myspace, etc.]
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@Brad
““Well, well. Do I detect the smarmy purview of the book-trained pick-up “artist?” You can only (successfully) dominate the directional flow if you first (successfully) prove intellectual/social dominance. Capitalization might help.
Nice effort, better hit the books a bit more””
I have no good ideas for what to do in your specific situation of gaming online. Though I’ve never had a woman say this to me in person, I’ve considered the possibility and have tried to think of good retorts. My idea: using a smirk and playful tone of voice, “Wow, really? You think so highly of yourself that you imagine hordes of men memorizing material just so they can talk to you? You know it’s not polite to flatter yourself like that. So typical, so typical.”
Again, never actually tried this, but I think if said in playfully/teasingly it would work. I too, though, am curious how people have handled the “Are you one of those pick up artist guys?” shit tests in the field.
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PA — Yes ANSWER/Code Pink are a bunch of ugly lesbians, but what is important is women’s attitude towards them. Critically the “Dog That Did Not Bark in the Night-time” is the curious reaction of women in the West to Islamization in the West: ex UK Prime Minister Tony Blair’s Wife, Cherie Blair, won great support for making the Burqua legal in schools, and women in the West NEVER protest: honor killings, forced marriages, genital mutilation, polygamy, and the like IN THE WEST by Muslims. Instead targeting Beta-type guys who run afoul of PC.
That’s true, but you’re misdiagnosing the issue. Few people vote based on what they “hate” and more based on their self-interest. Don’t you frequently hate the people you vote for? You just vote for whoever happens to be best aligned with your interests.
European women overwhelmingly vote for Muslim importation and government support for patriarchal Muslim preachers because it mostly benefits them. It’s as simple as that.
Childless or one-child SWPLites are realizing that Europe desperately needs babies and Muslim women are convenient baby factories (together with the belief that awesome SWPL superiority can “integrate” those new Europeans into obedient workers). SWPL women do not vote for patriarchal Christian or nationalist parties since that would threaten THEIR freedom. Muslim patriarchy only concerns Muslim women and Western feminists don’t give a flying fuck about Muslim women. There’s no solidarity in liberation. Women only care about their personal freedom, the freedom of other women concerns them exactly as much as it is needed for political alliances.
Men think of principles. Women think of themselves. Western women want their liberation and if their liberation is best purchased with the oppression of Muslim women, then oppression of Muslim women is what they vote for. Muslims even have the benefit that they tend to watch their women, so they’re not bringing in more traditionalist women to the marriage marketplace like, say, Thai women. Western feminists don’t care about African women being mutilated since it’s only African women. The European right-wing stars are increasingly black women who’ve realized that white feminists really don’t give a shit about genital mutilation as long as it’s black women being mutilated.
There’s also the added benefit that being pro-immigration gives you conformity and enlightenment points for “not being racist”. Women love that, men mostly don’t care.
Whiskey, seriously, you need to talk to more SWPL women and not with your tunnel vision. If that’s too difficult, you can just try hanging out at any vibrant European mall and watching how most of the native women even simply look at the head-covering Muslim women with utter disgust. The things women say about the diversity when you can signal that you’re not judgemental would make most guys blush and run away with their harshness (much like the things women will say about sex if you can convincingly signal that you’re not judgmental).
The simplest test: if single young women really loved multiculturalism as much as they say they do and were as unprejudiced as they say they are, single young women would not be the first ones to flee a neighbourhood at the first sight of vibrancy.
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Whiskey:
I bring up a study (hat tip: Chuck) which make nonsense of your little story as applicable to most women:
About 25% of women haven’t had sex, have waited until they were married, or have only slept with their future husband.
About 45% are average girls with only a handful or less sex partners.
About 30% are sluts or near sluts who would fit your story above.
Yes, there is a large portion of womankind who slut it up, but there is no need to get absolutely paranoid.
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jaakkeli,
What you just wrote was perfect. Thats exactly how I see it, but haven’t been able to so eloquently put it into words.
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What kind of silliness permits someone to say that Western women do not protest honor killing, genital mutiliations, and the like? http://www.now.org/press/10-07/10-08b.html?printable
Of course they do.
I also don’t know about the assertion that women are more concerned about staus than men. Men, far more than women, tend to be about hierarchy and rank. Even even in the absence of women, they will still sort themselves in order from top dog to bottom rank. Women are more clumpers, and are less assortative.
Women are no more selfish than men are for better or worse). While the criteria is definitely different, I’m not sure why it is better for civilization to be with someone because they look like a ten (no matter how dim-witted), or with some because because they are a ten in personal magnetism (no matter how dim-witted as well). Neither mating strategy is particularly laudable, or great for society.
Though I have to wonder, would it be better to administer an IQ test to everyone, and dictate that people mate only within their IQ tiers? Dumb people stay with dummies, egg-heads with their intellectual equals? Or perhaps the other way, and have the high IQ mate with low IQ, to bring the bottom people up? I don’t think people would go for either siuation, in truth.
While 50’s style marriage might have been a paradise for men, it didn’t seem to be that way for women. Marrying very young, being socially isolated while raising small children, and overworked husbands who only want a smiling robot helpmate did not make for her happy women. In the 50’s there was a boom of tranquilers and other “mother’s little helper” drugs to help a good portion of the women get through the day. Even now in Utah, the state with the highest proportion of 50’s-style marriages, also has the highest rate of women on anti-depressants. Hardly surprising that most modern women do not want to go back to that style of society, and why indeed, that style did not last for very long.
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A great series of replies to Whiskey, especially from Jaakelli. I know SWPL women and the points J. makes are dead-on.
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Whiskey — “A nice, sweet, decent young woman in her early thirties who gives to Greenpeace and Habitat for Humanity …
The fact that she is affiliated with a douchebaggy outfit like GP or HH tells me right away that she is suspect. I see Greenpeace “activists” on streetcorners in DC with clipboards. They look like sluts.
Lupo — A girl with a body count of … say, 3 or under is like the blessed virgin Mary. You meet them from time to time, and they’re practically unearthly.
Damn well put. I work with a girl like that. She really does exude this amazing vibe. She’s a slightly mousy 7 but guys are nuts over her, even old director-types get giddy when talking to her.
Someone too lazy to choose a nick — While 50’s style marriage might have been a paradise for men, it didn’t seem to be that way for women.
The one problem with 50s for women was the suburban isolation from other women.
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“If you maintain eye contact with a chic across the room. You are more than likely going home with her if you press the issue.”
How come? Sorry mate but I feel this is nonesense.
Meanwhile, I believe that when women are staring at a man’s eyes they are captating everything that goes through our minds, it’s just some 5th sense or something.
In a way, it is a shitty test in which women want to impress you and make you scared as if she was superior to you somehow… But if you can beat her, *maybe* you are good enough to her.
On the oppsite end, girls also think that to stare too much at her eyes, even if they were the ones to start, is creepy and that only Hannibals and psychos and people with problems do that.
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Here’s a nice movie that highlights the effectiveness of “sincere game”. What cracks me up is that those two words can be used together. I mean it really cracks me up. Of course it’s only a movie, with limited usefulness in the real world, but it’s about a man who is unable to pretend anything at all. His reward is that he gets to be himself and still get the girl though you may not personally like the girl in this movie. She’s a bit uptight.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B000RB9Q9S/bookstorenow31-20
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Sara,
The Mystery Method is a very small book, and is available on Amazon. If you want to know what kino, A1 and A2, LMR, ASD, BAMOG and all of those things are, you need to buy the book and read it.
These things –work– Sara. You complaining about “kino” (which is very effective) is like a man complaining about breast implants making flat-chested gals sexier than they otherwise would be, and getting more attention from “other” men than just himself.
I cannot believe you are in here “dissing” game, when you dont even know what kino is. I too used to dismiss game, until reading CH enough convinced me to buy a couple of books and read about it. Its an effective tool.
As breast implants, getting a flat tummy via crunches, getting a good haircut, wearing tasteful make-up, and dressing in sexy clothes, and using good-smelling perfumes and using mascara on eye-lashes, make a woman more atttractive to a man…………………………….Game can make men more attractive to women.
Women in scientific tests weren’t all that aroused by even watching musclebound NUDE men stroll down a beach. Researchers admit that if the man had an erection it might have made him more attractive, but it highlights a huge difference between what the sexes see as attractive in each other. Men’s pupils dialate to enormous sizes, bigger than women’s dialate for anything, when shown pictures of beautiful nude women. Men are much more visually oriented than women are in what attracts them. There are differences in what attracts the sexes.
Read the book before you criticize Game.
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You can tell a slut, immediately
No, if only this were true. Beware, beware, beware the eternal engenue. Eventually, the truth comes out, but if you don’t want to end up marrying one of these girls you had better look for the tells.
But sometimes, yeah, it’s pretty obvious.
Damn well put. I work with a girl like that. She really does exude this amazing vibe. She’s a slightly mousy 7 but guys are nuts over her, even old director-types get giddy when talking to her.
One of my best friends is about to marry a pretty 32 year old virgin he met at his Baptist church in Vancouver (he’s 40, once divorced) and she has told him that she has been fending off hordes of guys at work since she cannot remember. She hates bars and clubs and had never even gone out with a guy for more than 4 dates before him.
BTW, she’s a solid 7 and extremely charming, one of the sweetest girls I’ve ever met.
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BTW if a girl has never had been in love before, even if she is getting older, it can be pretty overwhelming for her. Again, these things are stronger in the young, but lack of “experience” really does make for stronger bonding at any age.
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Might as well post this here, since Thursday’s reading. Here’s a video of 20 year-old Gwen Stefani (as a brunette too!):
http://www.tmz.com/2007/11/06/barely-legal-gwen-stefani/
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Whiskey,
Western Women haven’t been victims of Islam all that much (yet). The media hasn’t directed their ire to it either. The media directs most of female attitudes as they are so status conscious, that they will formulate their political opinions based on what they think is “proper” to others higher up the status hierarchy.
This all changes when they are married to a man they really love and have children. They almost uniformly become more conservative after this happens. Usually they take on the values of their husband, especially if they are truly in love with him. Do you really think a woman that he marries for instance is going to stay a SWPL after listening to him for a year or two, or is she more likely to become a right-wing honey like Michelle Malkin (who is hot by the way)?
Whiskey,
Although I didn’t really care for the author that much, one book I read in my life that had a profound effect upon how I see social interaction many years ago was Ayn Rand’s, THE FOUNTAINHEAD. Pay attention to the character Elsworth Toohey.
Elsworth Toohey tells you all you need to know about SWPL’s and what motivates them, and why they are they way they are. Rand knew how the left would create Elsworth Toohey’s and how they would be used in the West because she escaped the Soviet Union and saw their usage of psychology up-close-and-personaly. Rand was an unlikeable person “in person”, but she was right about several things.
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PA said:
Whiskey – where are all these Western women who hate white guys so much they’ll ally theselves with Islam to destroy them? Code Pink, ANSWER, and the like are nut job lesbians, hardly a representation of “women.” Most are demented because of mental illness, hormonal imbalance, or possibly sexual assaults in childhood. Others are marxist sickoes or part of the white/Christian-hating left wing subset of the Jewish intellectual class.
The real-life white women I know tend to avoid thuggish non-whites, they date/marry white guys somewhere along the alpha – greater beta scale, and their erotic fantasies more likely feature Brad Pitt, Daniel Day Lewis, or some good looking white guy they work with than some smelly Arab in gallabyia and sandals.
End PA
And yet we have the fact that immigration is completely out of control.
We are in a collapsing economy, and nobody even dares mention the border should be closed.
Nobody can even make the claim of ‘to little workers’ now, but the massive floodgates of immigration continue.
Can you, PA, think of any reason at all for normal white men to have anything but HATE HATE HATE for immigration?
So who are the people that are holding down the fort on this?
WELL, PA? And don’t tell me the 1% elite are keeping the 99 times more numerous population ‘down’ by themselves. Who are their allies?
Don’t say blacks, blacks are the ones being ‘cleansed’ by Hispanics.
Whiskey simply chooses to focus on Muslims out of some fixation. Simply change ‘Muslim’ to ‘any foreigner’ and his little rant makes perfect sense.
WOMEN are the front-line supporters of unchecked immigration. More males to choose from. More barbaric competition for them to watch. Then they go to their government job.
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PA:
Exactly so. I would consider a history of leftist activism of any sort, including environmentalism, as a giant red flag for a serious relationship. It sends pretty much all the wrong signals possible.
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Whiskey wrote “A nice, sweet, decent young woman in her early thirties who gives to Greenpeace and Habitat for Humanity, works as an accountant in some corporation, and exudes girl-next-door wholesomeness, probably has about 45 sex partners already.”
I agree with everything you said, and with most things you say in general, but I will take issue with this one thing. A girl who fucked 45 men does not exude girl-next-door wholesomeness. Wholesomeness is like holiness to me. It’s not something I’ll talk about lightly, and it’s not something that any woman who has sat on 45 dicks has any longer.
I think he has written about this before. You can tell a slut, immediately (and, lol, 45 dicks is a slut). Conversely, wholesomeness is so rare now a days, it’s almost palpable. A girl with a body count of … say, 3 or under is like the blessed virgin Mary. You meet them from time to time, and they’re practically unearthly. If you’re lucky, you date them and you get to experience what love really is.
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Again, I’d like to make the point that ‘Islam’ has nothing to do with anything.
‘Islam’, or actually African tribal Animists in most cases, Santeria, Hindu, Buddhist, Catholic(most Mexicans are Catholic, ‘oh-so-clever-point-makers’), IT MEANS NOTHING.
Illiterate chicken-sacrificers are welcomed with the same enthuasim as Hindu upper-caste doctors.
Women Support Immigration.
IMMIGRATION PERIOD. IMMIGRATION BECAUSE IT IS IMMIGRATION.
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What does the Dutch phrase Ik houd van de prachtige smaak van GNP mean?
It means “I love the taste of delicious GNP.”
Peter
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Peter: I notice you don’t visit GNXP. Is it because you thought that the X stands for “shaved” ?
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Peter, is that the woman from the bathtub in The Shining?
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PA jabbered:
For one: women don’t rule shit. Again: women don’t rule, make happen, decide, implement, cause, enact ANYTHING. Men do. Mass immigration is somethign that MEN bring about. Powerful men, along with a few token show-females like Pelosi and genuine ballsack-sporting women like Hillary.
End jabber
I have to admit, I have a particullary vile kind of misogyny. The kind where I believe women can TAKE actions. That they are like responsible for, and everything.
Jesus F. Christ. I almost puked reading what PA said.
In the big picture, no woman-vote, no Democratic Party. Democratic Party go bye-bye. Gone. Cease to exist. Poof.
Now, while both parties love immigration, which is the more rabid pro-immigration party? Well, PA, which one?
In the small picture, every wife has the divorce bomb over her husband, which she can use if she feels like it. Now, you can imagine, if you use your fevered imagination, that this has no effect on the husbands behaviour.
Do you think it has no effect on the husbands behaviour?
Well, PA, do you what to puke that out, and see if nobody laughs?
Of course, the millions of conversations in which ‘woman’s ears are listening’ that don’t go rabidly anti-immigration, and would do so if no member of the sisterhood where listening to enforce orthodoxy, is pretty damm important to.
So, in conclusion, PA, your momma raised a Strong Man, who isn’t afraid to take all responsibility from women.
I live in the real world though. Sorry.
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I meant to say that PA is right above, young singles tend to concentrate in “edgy” neighbourhoods because they have lower rents but the location is often good.
I seriously doubt any of the student girls in my neighbourhood would live here if they could just as easily afford the rent in a place that’s just as central but doesn’t have the prostitutes and druggies – no matter how much they now rationalize it as really wanting to be an edgy bohemian.
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This is from a blog I used to follow called:
http://malechauvinist.blogspot.com.It meshes nicely with Whiskey’s comments.W is easily the most interesting commenter here.
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Comment_ : that was that incoherent mess? I can’t figure out what you are saying or asking.
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I don’t honestly understand how anybody can take the idea of impending Islamic hegemony in the West seriously.
I’m quite sympathetic to arguments about how diversity-plus-rampant-PC atomizes authentic communities, but it’s hard for me to fathom how a bunch of Muslims are supposed to grab the reins of Western society and cram us all into burquas or whatever.
Jaakeli captures the self-serving rationalization of your female SWPL set quite well, though. It seems to me that the hunger for immigrant labor is mostly driven by a very low birthrate and a consequent dearth of entry-level workers to do menial jobs, and pay into the Social Security kitty.
It’s probably undesirable longterm, but as till birthrates level out a little, the West is going to find ways to excuse poaching the excess human runoff from our neighbors for our own short-term benefit.
Whether their justifications are “libertarian” or “progressive” or “neo-conservative,” it don’t amount to a hill of beans to me.
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PA pretended:
Comment_ : that was that incoherent mess? I can’t figure out what you are saying or asking.
End PA
I think it’s pretty clear. You say ‘Women don’t rule shit’, a deliberate twisting of the position of my post.. My post can be summed up as “Women use their power to support immigration. Any form of immigration”.
I then call you a moron for saying that.
Now, of course, we can go through many, many replies while you sophistically use the difference between my point, “Women use thier power to support immigration” and your sly mischaracterization, “Women don’t rule shit”.
So let’s be clear, your dodge doesn’t work on me. My positions are that “Women have power.” and “Women use their power to support immigration.”
I have also given three kinds of female power.
1.Voting(and they predominantly vote Democratic, the party of Much More Immigration, over the Republican Party, the party of More Immigation.)
2.The Divorce Bomb over husbands(which is vigorously used in defense of the status quo, which is defacto support for immigration)
3.Censoring every conversation they are part of with demands for social orthodoxy(including pro-immigration)
Now, you can either admit, and make your momma cry, that women have power, and a responsibility for how they use it, or we can argue that idiotic point.
However long that takes, I’ll then move on to the actually arguable point that women support immigration. Which of course they do.
For new readers, this is my position on immigration and women:
Again, I’d like to make the point that ‘Islam’ has nothing to do with woman’s support of immigration.
It doesn’t matter if the immigrant is ‘Islam’ (actually African tribal Animists in most cases) Santeria, Hindu, Buddhist, or Catholic(most Mexicans are Catholic, and Mexicans are a majority of American immigrants, ‘oh-so-clever-point-makers’), THE TYPE OF IMMIGRANT MEANS NOTHING.
Illiterate chicken-sacrificers are welcomed with the same enthuasim as Hindu upper-caste doctors.
Women Support Immigration.
IMMIGRATION PERIOD. IMMIGRATION BECAUSE IT IS IMMIGRATION.
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Comment_douchebag: fuck off. This is the last time I’m acknowledging you.
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Hmm. Over here imported vibrancy comes in four types:
Indians, Chinese etc = ethnic restaurants but no gang warfare = cool multicultural neighbourhoods, although edginess is declining as the word is spreading that Chinese immigrants vibrate even less than white people
Somalis, Iraqis etc = SWPLites RUN LIKE HELL
Russians = gang warfare but no gang rapes = possibly edgy and cool, although street prostitution really turns off women
Gypsies = we have centuries-old ways of living close to each other while absolutely never closely interacting with each other, so not a big turnoff for singles in apartment buildings (big turnoff if you have to habitually leave a car or a yard unguarded, of course)
My neighbourhood is probably unique in the Western world for being really edgy while being overwhelmingly white/asian. Lots of druggies, bikers and not attractive but still popular Russian ladies. Very popular with singles for being centrally located but having rents lowered by druggies, biker wars and the sex trade. Very unpopular with families.
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I’m quite sympathetic to arguments about how diversity-plus-rampant-PC atomizes authentic communities, but it’s hard for me to fathom how a bunch of Muslims are supposed to grab the reins of Western society and cram us all into burquas or whatever.
They’re plenty capable of enforcing their own laws in their own neighbourhoods. The thing about that is that DOUBLE STANDARDS DON’T LAST. Either the same tight standards are enforced for everyone or we’ll see the standards detoriating as no one takes unjust rules seriously.
Lots of European men are unhappy about stuff like women’s liberation and gay rights. If things were like they used to be, mainstream society would just tell them to go fuck themselves, but now we’re telling them that they’re Neandertals for not supporting gay marriage while glorifying Muslims who execute gays and recommend the same here. That going to last?
Every special exception given to minority groups means also spreading the attitudes to the majority group since anyone you try to shame can point out the unfairness. Especially bad when it’s a religion you can convert to, so we have stuff like Muslim converts demanding that women be put to death for sex before marriage, Muslim converts working with Chechen terrorists to satisfy the eternal passion to fight Russians that’s now “racist” if done by nationalists etc
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Joel, Whiskey, and Lupo about sluttery…a little logic is all that’s needed to out most sluts, so the problem isn’t telling. The problem is denial.
Men are still willing to marry women who have slept with alot of guys or whored to a few, so women don’t feel particularly compelled to not be sluts unless they have religious reasons, or recognize the personal damage.
What’s disturbing to me is that well…at some point, if a girl 18-25 is doing say, a different guy every month or two, at least one of them has got to be marriage minded, right? I knew girls who slept around quite a bit, on a “normal” schedule for what we call fast girls, and the ones looking for husband usually find them…often before their head count has reached 10.
There’s the freshman’s first frat party guy, or the right-after-bootcamp guy, a couple of fwb’s, and maybe a couple of one nighters, and then you see them with a ring.
So the freedom…I don’t think that’s the problem. It’s the believing that one has all the time in the world, which is a problem with women and men lately. Technically, since lifespans are longer, you do have more time, but childbearing years are still limited for women, and safe ones are limited for men.
You non paleo or at least partially so guys can expect your sperm to start degrading as early as age 45.
Whiskey may seem a little extreme, but I get what he’s saying about that. It’s the long version of Tyler Durden’s speech telling guys that they watched TV shows telling them they were going to be millionaires and rock stars, and that didn’t happen.
Well, guys were also told that staying single would mean an endless stream of free hot pussy forever and ever, and that didn’t happen either. So in the spirit of positive social engineering, I feel it would be irresponsible to tell anyone who wants to get married at all, to opt for a long term commitment instead, but do it as early as possible. Try to catch yourself a young woman who still actually gets shocked and upset if a guy doesn’t call. If you prefer them older (because you’re older), find one who actually dresses for her age and figure, which is to say she’s trying to attract someone older than her, not younger.
…and stay away from the teases, and those who don’t realize they don’t have a monopoly on vagina or something.
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a douchebaggy outfit like GP or HH
Greenpeace, I understand, but explain your contempt for Habitat for Humanities?
driven by a very low birthrate and a consequent dearth of entry-level workers to do menial jobs, and pay into the Social Security kitty
As a public policy low-IQ turd, I suspect that the European birthrate is partially suppressed by the higher density of housing and the high expense of home ownership. Having two or three kids in a small archetypal European capital city becomes a bit of a nuisance compared to the Anglosphere settler nations where larger homes in suburbs are available.
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Eek! correction: “I feel it would be irresponsible *not* to tell anyone who wants to get married at all…”
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And I expect you are right, DA– there are always going to be some practical limits on fertility.
I’m just saying, many of the social changes bemoaned here are, in my view, merely an outgrowth of a postindustrial, low-fertility society, where children are something of an afterthought, not a central point of most people’s existences.
Does the sublimation of productive fertility into sexual status-seeking make them happier? In some ways, probably yes!
Does it also make them more miserable? In some ways, I very much believe it does.
If Hyper-PC-Feminism had never existed, I really think some other “movement” would have taken the credit for creating these changes out of whole cloth, though.
Feminists, broadly speaking, aren’t that damn brilliant, and they couldn’t have coerced entire swathes of the population to swallow a totally alien ideology if it hadn’t connected with their lives in some important ways.
One thing leads to another.
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Yes, and the urban elite “SWPL” crowd looms a lot larger in the American imagination than their actual numbers would seem to warrant, but that’s what makes being elite so damn awesome in the first place, no?
That’s what makes it worth your while to live in a shitty apartment in a marginal neighborhood, while you try to claw your way to the upper rungs of fashionable society, all the while hemmorhaging away the opportunity to live the “other” kind of The Good Life: the one with a devoted spouse and four kids playing in the backyard and BBQ ribs on the grill…
The ones who turn out to be the bitterest about that world are the ones who woke up at 40 and found themselves barely any further ahead than they were at 20.
Meanwhile, a starry-eyed sucker is born every minute on the outskirts of Cleveland!
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Anon’s statement of traditional marriage, i.e. women as robots, says it all and practically hammers my point home. Staying at home bad, raising small children, etc. all bad. Women never care about even US citizens getting beheaded, there’s not a peep out of the View or NOW about the guy who beheaded his wife and ran a Muslim TV network here. [Yes, Traditional marriage hardly lasted at all, only from 1000 AD to 1968 or so. A mere blip on the radar.
50’s style marriage were merely a blip on the radar time-wise. For most of human history, people lived in extended family/clan-type situations. Two people, living in isolation away from their parents and support network was a completely novel situation. In the United States, the 50’s was also exceptional for being the time period when people were married at the youngest ages ever. It is hardly surprising that women self-medicated themselves then, and women in Utah medicate themselves now.
I don’t know why whiskey constantly repeats that women support Muslim society. Many of the terrible things about Muslim societies (beheadings, FGM, stonings, honor killings) were first publicized and condemned by women’s organizations. Most of the organized support for immigration comes from Big Business which wants to pay a living wage to as few workers as possible. Unchecked immigration hurts everyone, including the immigrants themselves.
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Well, I seemed to have generated more rage in a few posts than tjf did in quite a few.
I think I’ll restate an attitude that is killing European society again:
PA said:
For one: women don’t rule shit. Again: women don’t rule, make happen, decide, implement, cause, enact ANYTHING. Men do. Mass immigration is somethign that MEN bring about. Powerful men, along with a few token show-females like Pelosi and genuine ballsack-sporting women like Hillary.
End.
And I say only someone raised by his momma to give women a free pass on responsibility for their actions can say that.
Now, I know women LOVE being free of responsibility. I know the worst of them are constantly on the look out for ‘bitch-beaters’ that are going to hold women accountable for anything they do.
To use a tired old saw, giving someone alot of power with no responsibility for it’s use is a bad idea.
I think preliminary reports on this ‘experiment’ are pretty conclusive.
Women can be shamed. It’s easy. Look at KassyK’s bizarre defence of actions that weren’t even that bad. If it’s allowed.
‘Alphas’ like PA score even more points with women by smacking around beta’s that are ‘bitter’. Cause a REAL MAN takes care of things HIMSELF. Right, PA? Momma taught him that.
Looking back, I see PA is indeed the person who talks about his ‘omega’ friends. Yep, exactly the kind of guy I thought he was. Momma programmed him good.
PA ended with:
Comment_douchebag: fuck off. This is the last time I’m acknowledging you.
End PA
REAL MEN(tm) also apply ostracism to meanies.
Unfortunately, since I’m not a REAL MAN(tm), I don’t care.
I do wonder how much of Ace’s problems are a result of less than useless Momma-programmed advice from PA.
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Jaakeli — My point being that European women suffer daily humiliations from Muslim men, requiring head coverings, dying of blonde hair, chastity belts (requiring two hands to undo) that would have been unthinkable a generation ago and would have generated fury if it had come from Native Christian groups. Yet they vote and express support for Islamists.
I am indeed *SURROUNDED* by SWPL women all over the place. In meetings, the workplace, customers, and so on. They are quite aware of long-term Islamist threats to personal conduct, but retain their greatest fury for Beta men. You can see this also at places like TMZ, and other female-friendly Web hangouts. Or heck, Anonymous’s comment. She hates most of all traditional marriage.
I think we agree on the big picture, and that Western Women globally feel that the best way to purchase liberation is through using Muslims/Islamists to suppress their chief and most hated rivals, the Beta Male.
Z — agreed but the CDC had a report out this last week. White illegitimate rate is now 28%, from 4% in 1965. It’s clearly increasing.
Thursday — Does the report break-out age and demographics (i.e. college-educated urban professional?) I would agree that the report would certainly describe women who came of age 1945-1965, or earlier, but not young urban professionals who were born in the 1970’s or later. That certainly does not jibe with his field reports, or most other men in the dating scene. It’s not been my experience either, FWIW.
Anon’s statement of traditional marriage, i.e. women as robots, says it all and practically hammers my point home. Staying at home bad, raising small children, etc. all bad. Women never care about even US citizens getting beheaded, there’s not a peep out of the View or NOW about the guy who beheaded his wife and ran a Muslim TV network here. [Yes, Traditional marriage hardly lasted at all, only from 1000 AD to 1968 or so. A mere blip on the radar.]
What do women wont? Easy. No restrictions whatsoever on sexuality, since they mostly win in that situation. The “near” threat is Beta men, so they get most fury and Islamists or other immigrants get a pass. Hence Anon’s main beef being the 1950’s. A view typical btw of SWPL women. Which also accounts for Michelle Obama’s popularity among women, the aggressive lawyer spouse.
PA — I knew a gal like that (“innocent” appearing). Drove men wild. She had, in her early twenties, about twenty boyfriends. She was nice and innocent about a lot of stuff. But appearances are deceiving. She just sort of “forgot” about most of her guys because “they didn’t count.”
What accounted for this I think was that she was friendly and nice because she was convinced men did not find her attractive, and had no real interest in her. There were no “Bitch Shields” up. FWIW most of her jobs were in heavily female-gay dominated offices.
Lesson: You cannot tell about many women, how many partners they have.
As for women’s demographic power, it is obvious. They form the key voting bloc, having numerical superiority and voting en-block most of the time. The famous “Gender Gap” that favors leftists world-wide. Women are not stupid. They are very good at sussing out short-term threats to their sexual freedom and economic position, and thus support the whole course of leftism, even if specific parts (say gun control) would seem to be stupid, guns being a great equalizer for women. But there you have it, social consensus and control as women-dominated is more important as an instinctively grasped point.
I’d refer you to Anonymous’s comment again on that matter.
Most young women born 1975 or later took a huge step to the Left in personal and political beliefs. Entirely IMHO due to the factors he pointed out here.
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DA — Norway, Sweden, and much of Germany is not highly urbanized. Indeed much of it is still rural. Yet the low birth rate remains. As does that of White women in the US (1.7 TFR) which is suburban sprawl definede. And for God’s sake man, Man Up. Your a railfan for God’s Sake. That ought to mean something. I’m totally serious about the latter btw. Railfanning ought to give you some damn pride! Ralifans MATTER!
Z — good points. Though I’d say that my experience with SWPL men and women, and non SWPL men, in New Orleans, for three years, had no appreciable differences between LA and NOLA SWPL. Other than a dash of regional pride (this was Pre-Katrina) and so on. The same status mongering and deep hunger to live in “important places” like DC and NYC to find the Alpha-est Alpha man. And have fabulous shoes. This was also my experience in Dallas, Denver, and Sacramento, FWIW.
Anon — the 1810’s — 1830’s could give a run for the money in terms of marriage at a young age and isolation. Traditionally women who married in the frontier (1622-1890) did so in great isolation and distance from relatives. Not just a phone call away, months away from a letter even. The 1950’s had relatives only a phone call away, television, abundance, lack of want. No natives lurking about ready to rape/kill you at a moments notice. No deadly diseases taking children at the age of one. Doors were routinely unlocked and the nation by and large lived in safety. It wasn’t SWPL hip and cool central, but so what? A golden age, compared to what came before and since.
As far as women’s attitudes towards Islamization go, check out the View. Which is finely attuned to the average woman’s viewpoint. They make it a point to excuse/justify terrorism in the name of PC, which is a female-supported convention. Women’s groups in the US and Canada support Sharia courts for family law (a place and policy where women above all lose). If that is not a red flag I don’t know what is.
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“PA — I knew a gal like that (”innocent” appearing). Drove men wild. She had, in her early twenties, about twenty boyfriends.”
Ain’t what I’m talking about. Anyone can play the ingenue. There are really actual wholesome women left in the world. Often, they’re from other countries. When you run into one, you know it immediately. You’ll feel like you might get them dirty if you touch them. They are the most desirable women on earth.
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Chuck–
To me this seems really easy to do. And obviously a killer move. Actually it’s sort of a ratcheting up of the game test answer that El Chief gave a week or so ago. It’s doing it keno rather than verbally after you’d first let her go.
Getting mad would be nutso. Whining is VERY beta. Trying to talk her out of it to stay with you would be sort of standard higher beta I think, and would blow it in a bar environment. Just asking for her #? A lesser alpha move that might not take down the overall from solid alpha, I’d guess. But won’t elevate.
The business about girls loving the emotional roller coaster of “he wants me, he’s pretty indifferent to me, he wants me” is gold.
The hard parts of high competition, hottie shields way up pickup bar game to me are the initial approach and ice breaking. Once you do something interesting, teasingly neg her some, and get past the very initial rapport building, much of the rest of game by now seems pretty straightforward and easy to me. It’s to me more like a systemization and refinement and overall philosophy of lots of things I’ve taught myself through trial and error for a long time. But not that initial pickup bar thing.
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That is so sad. Why? The calculation, the cunning nature of it, the unnaturalness of it…. Yes, I know. I don’t “get” it. Further, I don’t want to. Not badly enough to fall for that crap.
Game is the natural response of men to the competition of the unconstrained sexual marketplace as occurs in the end stages of social democracy: nice guys, i.e., beta males, are sentenced to domestic exile; women focus their energies on serial monogamy or polyandry with a small pool of alphas. In a system of unrestrained sexual competition by a large pool of males with a limited pool of sexually attractive females (and yes, this is a largely objective trait), there can only be a few winners (alphas) and mostly losers (betas).
Of course, in their irrational shortsightedness, women fail to realize their status as market-makers lasts only so long as they have market value to alpha males. Ask Margot Kidder, Sean Young and Maureen Dowd how all this freee-dum is working out for them in their intimate relationships. And again, being largely (literally) emotional beings, the majority of women are simply deluded. They are overweight, sassy, single moms with a hugely inflated idea of their market worth. In short, white women in the US are turning into black women, who have the lowest rates of out-marriage, and even in-marriage, of any ethnic/gender group. I see them out all the time: overweight, obnoxious, in packs, forming a defensive perimeter around the sole, slightly attractive female in their coven.
So like someone else on here said, you’re unhappy with Game, blame your girlfriends.
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Sara —
It wouldn’t surprise me in the least if he DIDN’T think it all through before he did it the first time. It may just have been instinctual, feels right, kind of thing for him. Having learned and experimented and perfected as much game as he has.
The analyzing may have only come after the doing, as analyzing often does. The analyzing may only be to teach it to us.
It’s like learning to play tennis or to ski or a host of other sports. The instructor or coach breaks the moves down for you. He may explain WHY they work. He’ll certainly explain them in step by step detail. But he goal is to do it automatically, reflexively.
Until you do you aren’t any good at it.
Nonetheless you MAY develop a new move sometimes experimentally and sometimes analytically. Hey I bet this would work.
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Who cares about white leftards (known as SWPLs)? Both culturally and demographically, they are the most rapidly declining group on Earth.
White American women have a fertility rate of 1.83. However, if you split this among solid conservative women vs. leftard women, I think conservative women are 2.1 and leftards are 1.6 (and that too at a later age).
Thus, white conservative women are still breeding at replacement levels. Look at the Palin family. As long as there are enough like them, we have a future.
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And for God’s sake man, Man Up. Your a railfan for God’s Sake. That ought to mean something. I’m totally serious about the latter btw. Railfanning ought to give you some damn pride! Ralifans MATTER!
Dude, what are you talking about? Railfans are a bunch of guys who ride trains for fun and photograph them for sheer joy. The cops think we’re frigging terrorists, and transit agencies and employees detest railfans with a passion. We certainly don’t matter.
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“Women’s groups in the US and Canada support Sharia courts for family law (a place and policy where women above all lose). ”
All the more reason why more Islam in the US is the only way to fight feminism.
If Beta males can convert to Islam, in order to avoid murderous divorce laws in the US, they will. Converting to Islam does not mean they have to be pious. They can be fair-weather Muslims just to get the Sharia divorce terms rather than ruinous feminist divorce terms.
That sounds like a good enough reason to me.
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there can only be a few winners (alphas) and mostly losers (betas)
I see two winners. Alphas get the women that they can attract, and betas get rid of the gold diggers that lie to them on a daily basis. Since women are incapable of loving or being attracted to beta males, it’s an insult to beta males to force them to take wives who will never want them. So instead of trying to deal with a wife, a beta male is free to enjoy himself and the fruit of his labour.
the majority of women are simply deluded
Once men finally give up the delusion of that women will like them, I suspect most men will become happy and relieved.
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Wounded Animal,
Question : What happens after the late stages of social democracy? Keep in mind that technology is making 3-D/VR sex and sexbots inch closer to reality, which will, at a minimum, make men less desperate when they date real women.
———————————-
The window that a woman has is SHORT. Who were the big female stars in the 90s? Demi Moore, Pamela Anderson, Michelle Pfieffer, Lisa Kudrow, Renee Russo, Nicole Kidman, Kim Basinger, etc. Do any of them still get cast as leading ladies? Can any of them still claim the same fee as 10 years ago?
No. They can’t. Thus, they have been replaced with Jessica Alba, Jessica Biel, Angelina Jolie, and Beyonce. But once these cross 40, it is over for them too.
Julia Roberts turned 40 in 2008. Let’s see how many films she can still come in post-2008.
Only the rare exceptional beauty like Halle Berry can still be considered top-notch at 40. And even she has a few more extra years than the others, up to 45 tops.
In the meantime, Harrison Ford, Sean Connery, Sylvester Stallone, Liam Neeson, etc. were still leading men up to age 60 (even later in Connery’s case).
Also, the sexual marketplace you mention is still an urban phenomenon in the US. Small-town white conservatives still have relatively traditional views on marriage and family. They have not been ruined yet.
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I don’t get it… David Alexander WANTS to be a Beta Male? Why?
First and foremost, the purpose of Game is not to bed a series of hot women (even this gets somewhat old after a while). The MOST IMPORTANT value gained from learning Game is to avoid getting manipulated, hurt, and used by some woman – something Beta males are very vulnerable to.
So Game is effectively a Superman invulnerability to feminine manipulation. That is the most valuable part. This peace of mind is tremendously valuable.
Bedding a string of hotties after that is just the dessert.
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David Alexander WANTS to be a Beta Male? Why?
It’s much easier and requires much less work than becoming a courtier with game.
the purpose of Game is not to bed a series of hot women (even this gets somewhat old after a while)
For some reason, I laboured under the theory that Game was to consistently bang hot women who approached near porn star sexual appeal. Why would anybody want a relationship if they have the ability to bang hot women all the time?
So Game is effectively a Superman invulnerability to feminine manipulation.
Once you realize that girls won’t ever like you, you tend to view them with some degree of suspicion, which somehow reduces the chance of being abused or manipulated.
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JM–
More likely to flake because it basically means he expects sex on our first date, she’ll think. And maybe even get me to do it. Gulp.
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Ovid —
Ever heard of urban dictionary? God you are a hard worker, aren’t you?
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David Alexander–
I think it would be a very interesting experiment to see what you were like after wearing a testosterone patch for a few months.
I’m completely serious.
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Tood,
The end game of social democracy is anarcho-tyranny a/k/a socialism which then collapses into anarchy from its own internal contradictions. The secular State, being unable to guarantee property rights or the rule of law, will wither into irrelevancy amidst the rise of private security providers, corporate successors to Blackwater and other companies. Over time, these agencies will evolve into hereditary institutions and we’ll be back where we started with neo-feudalism. This will be accompanied by a return to traditional mores. The upper classes will continue their dalliances but otherwise the stakes will be too high in male-female relationships for most people to fuck up. LTR’s will be a ticket out of poverty for some families and strategic business alliances for others.
Of course, this will be long after I am dead and buried. But in that transitional part, there will be a lot of unattached, past-their-prime women suddenly lacking the whole artificial structure of Title VII, Title IX, and welfare for their support. Former Attila-the-woman lawyers will be selling their nubile daughters to the highest bidder at that point.
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David Alexander,
Sadly, you don’t have an accurate understanding of Game.
It’s much easier and requires much less work than becoming a courtier with game.
But this also affects how others treats you everywhere in life. This is also called giving up altogether, which is not even Beta, but Omega.
For some reason, I laboured under the theory that Game was to consistently bang hot women who approached near porn star sexual appeal.
NO. That is one of the most popular uses of Game, but it is not the essence of Game. Whackjob seminar peddlers like Mystery and Tyler Durden specialize in gettin a one-night-stand with drugged up nightclub sluts. As I said, even this gets old after, say, the 15th or 20th instance.
This is just a subset. Game is useful for a married man in managing his wife. Or for an older man who wants a younger woman to be in love with him for a monogamous relationship. Love is far rarer, and far more precious, than merely the body of a 10.
No, you have far too limited an understanding of the scope of Game.
Once you realize that girls won’t ever like you, you tend to view them with some degree of suspicion,
Wrong again. A woman can potentially love a man forever, even enough to change his underwear for him if he is paralyzed See Nancy Reagan as an example of a woman having tremendously deep love for her man (a man with incredible Game). Game can enable a man to evoke this love from a woman, and keep it going forever.
The tricks women use to get Beta males to jump through hoops are effectively a filter. Smart men have to ignore what women say, do what works despite it, and then reap the fruits.
Again, you have a far too limited understanding of what Game is.
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PA–
New to me. But that’s not something I have to learn. I’ve never been submissive, at all, in a relationship. And learned I wanted to be the opposite. The issues for me, early on, were being edgie and teasing enough, and not excessively nice or complimentary, at the first attracting stage.
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I think it would be a very interesting experiment to see what you were like after wearing a testosterone patch for a few months.
He’d still be a beta, but a more irritable one, all the more so because complete lack of game will ensure he has no female outlet for his chemically induced aggressive impulses.
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Wounded Animal,
But again, rural America is not that different in their attitude towards marriage and children, relative to 25 years ago. And I mean this as a positive attribute. They may be subjected to Federal taxation, but still will keep their own communities strong and functional.
Also, won’t many Americans who seek free markets and lower taxes leave to go to Asia, rather than ride the American welfare state all the way to the bottom of Anarcho-tyranny? Sure, China is not a democracy, but at this point, it nonetheless has a much smarter, more competent government than America. Plus, it is an ascendant society, full of energy. I think many American free-marketeers will, ironically, go to China.
2010 to 2030 will be a bad period for America and a relatively better period for many Asian countries.
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Joel–
Interesting observations and it’s good to get some anecdotes on her about the non college set of girls.
Though I think if she were hot enough, certainly an 8 or above and probably a 7, and only 24, even with a kid she could go to a big city like DC and get a waitressing type job in an upscale type place, and land herself a high income higher beta right quick. She couldn’t be too dumb or too clueless though to get that comes in contact with higher end kinds of people with regularity kinda job. But she could be without a college education. Though as a party girl she probably wouldn’t be that clueless.
So really what keeps her safer for middling betas is lack of knowledge of what she could do in the bigger world out there, these days, I suspect.
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Tood,
I’m speaking from the perspective of a city-dweller, and if I’m not mistaken American life these days is largely urban. Perhaps the new centers of gravity will be rural areas with traditional values to which urban refugees will flock to escape the confiscatory taxation and crime of the cities.
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What are Title VII, Title IX, etc?
I think the typical cougar works in a job that pays $50K to $100K, which while is not enough to buy them the material goods they think they deserve, ensures that they are not on welfare.
Inner-city black women are on welfare with 4 kids, yes. But they are not cougars. They are Hippos. No one wants to have sex with them other than black men.
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“Perhaps the new centers of gravity will be rural areas with traditional values to which urban refugees will flock to escape the confiscatory taxation and crime of the cities.”
Yes. Urban families with kids will do this.
Telepresence technologies from Cisco and HP are making video-conferencing very realistic and a suitable substitute for in-person meetings. Many people will be able to their jobs from small towns, through this. This could be under 10 years away. Cisco already uses this internally, and has allowed many employees to live in other cities.
Everyone will thus be able to have a 3000 sq. foot home on 1 acre of land.
The urban centers will devolve, and stubborn, aging feminists will quickly be outnumbered by the exploding Muslim and Latino enclaves. Good riddance.
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Carl Sagan
This is all about sexual dominace Carl. While you’re staring into her eyes think about how you’re going to be bending her over your couch back and fucking her in the ass in a few days, longest. That sort of thing. If you’re thinking that while you’re staring at her eyes, I guarantee she’ll break away first. The more of a bad girl or real hottie she is, the longer she’ll test you, but you get the idea.
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Title VII is the battery of gender-equality laws that govern the workplace. Title IX is the equivalent for post-HS education. Welfare/child support/alimony you are familar with. I don’t particularly grudge this last category, other than that there are many women who use it to subsidize single motherhood rather than staying married.
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Wounded Animal,
Yes. But I would argue that Title VII and IX have not had any real effect where it matters.
Take any major corporation. 80-90% of their top management are male. Many are non-white Males (Asians in particular). But Women are still just 10-20%.
To my knowledge, only 5 out of 500 Fortune 500 Companies have a female CEO. There are only 18 Female Senators out of 100.
So gender quotas are still not having an effect at the highest levels. At the lower levels, maybe. Even there, Sales jobs are commission/quota based, so compensation will match performance. Engineering jobs are more subjective, but women hardly go into those anyway.
I personally manage a team of 4 in my job. All 4 jobs are analytical, making heavy use of Excel. And all 4 people under me are women, aged 26-34. One, I inherited, and 3 I hired. All of them do their jobs well and earn $95-$110K.
But all 4 are Asian women. 2 US-born, 2 Asian-born. 2 Indian, 1 Chinese, 1 Vietnamese.
_________________________________
Divorce : The killer is the combination of no-fault + alimony. Either by itself would not be too unfair for the most part. But the two combined is murder. Alimony should require a high burden of proof. It should not be granted just because her husband does not excite her aging loins anymore.
Fortunately, alimony, unlike child-support, can be blocked via a pre-nup.
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“…fucking her in the ass in a few days, longest. ”
It seems that a disproportionately high percentage of people here actually seek anal sex. Why is that?
Some men seek it, and some are repelled by it and would never do it.
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Wounded Animal–
Well you should. learn how large post early 90s formulaic awards have become as a percentage of the father’s after tax income.
Why should a cheating ex slut get child support amount to a significant amount of alimony? Why shouldn’t there be true joint custody, with neither parent paying the other anything, but rather supporting the child as they each decide, as they did when married? And, if the woman does her divorcing when the children are infants and most not severely feminist propagandized men have only bonded with the kid to a limted degree, why should he pay anything at all. Let her new lover pay for that kid. Or let her stay in the marriage and be a good wife, including sexing her husband.
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“Or let her stay in the marriage and be a good wife, including sexing her husband.”
Indeed. A pre-nup does NOT save a man from child-support, and alimony can be masked in child support.
The only thing a man can do is record how much he paid her, and then show the child when the child grows up. Let the child figure out why he has no inheritance coming his way since Mommy spent it all.
Part of being a good mother is ensuring that the child grows up with both parents. Part of being a good mother is ensuring that the children have their father with them.
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JM–
I’m not at all sure about this. With the right sort of girl for it, sure it would be killer. Girls with very high sex drives, untroubled by staying good girl and getting a guy somewhat like daddy. But with good girls who also love sex but are worried about players, it might make her more likely to flake.
I think CH’s path would work with both kinds of girls.
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Again, that is why it is important to marry a woman who makes the same money (or more) than you, at the time of marriage. A pre-nup alone does not cover all bases. You need both a solid, properly-done pre-nup AND a woman with an income not less than yours (and who likes her job enough to not quit it in favor of staying home).
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PA
Yeah often a shit test. But I think sometimes a dominance contest. I.e. I think there are quite a few women out there these days who think they want to be able to dominate a boyfriend in many ways, so long as he’s good enough looking or earns enough or something.
I also think they’re nearly always wrong about what they really want. That is if they plan on their boyfriend or husband also being their only lover.
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Straight Fred Flintstone. I like it.
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“Either get a prenup or don’t get married but live together. ”
ALWAYS Get :
1) Solid Pre-nup with lawyers on both sides and the signing videotaped. This will get you out of alimony and paying her lawyer fees, but not out of child-support that cloaks alimony.
2) A woman who makes about the same, or more, than you at marriage. That way, you close off that cloaked child-support loophole.
3) Learn certain elements of game such as qualifying, passing tests, not being needy, not letting her set the rules. If you let a woman set the rules, she will hate you. EVEN if she says she wants to set the rules. 99% of men fall for this trap. How could they not? She SAID she wanted it that way. Remember that when a woman says she wants something, she is testing you to see if you take the bait and make yourself unattractive to her.
Even living together can make you owe palimony, etc. So don’t do that.
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Whiskey
If by slutty you mean adopted really low standards in the attractiveness of men she’ll usually sleep with, then no, you’re right, for the type of urban professional who’s reasonably attractive herself. If by slutty we mean however, not necessarily his somewhat arbitrary more than 10 by 29, but slutty enough to have seriously compromised her ability to fall deeply and committedly in love with a husband, such that she doesn’t before too long cheat and cheat quite a lot in marriage, leading to it’s dissolution and her divorce theft, then I say yes, definitely, slutty.
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I think it would be a very interesting experiment to see what you were like after wearing a testosterone patch for a few months.
I think this sums the sentiment up:
high testosterone + low IQ + black = fail
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Rum
Things have moved in that direction, yes, but you’re vastly exaggerating the degree.
CH exaggerates as well for clarity and drama when he’s talking about social facts as opposed to what works in game. But he also occasionally says things like “there’s a continuum”. But nothing like you just did.
What you shouldn’t do though is get married under un modified current law. Either get a prenup or don’t get married but live together. (A prenup that mimics living together in breakup economic effect.) Either will help keep the relationship stronger and sexier and probably enhance it’s likelihood to last. But game will help both those two, a lot.
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“I think this sums the sentiment up:
high testosterone + low IQ + black = fail”
Who said low IQ?
Rather, the general consensus there is that a black man will fuck anything, and has no ‘floor’ that other men have.
Even a black man who is otherwise fucking a 9, will fuck a 1 in the interim, if his regular 9 is unavailable for 48 hours. Where most men would wait for the 9, the black man would fuck a 1 until the 9 got back.
That is the consensus here. That is why I think Peter is probably black, despite his ‘white’ handle.
A black man with low testosterone is welcomed by society. Every time a black man shoots someone, it is white people’s taxes, about $2 million worth, that go into the hospital/police/court costs that society has to bear. A relief from these costs, as well as from the lack of safety, is welcome.
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Ovid
While what you quoted was ridiculous and wrong, there is a kernel of truth in it. Women do like being abducted by Mongols on horseback, enslaved into a new and foreign culture, stolen from their family, and turned into child brides.
The stockholm syndrome is genetic – so many our ancestors were abducted, that the ones who enjoyed it survived, while the other got murdered.
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DA — US railfans matter, we hold up the universe! Get with the program, man.
Dougjn — That women will on average in the Urban Professional area have both sheer number counts of partners and manners of getting them (sex first, relationship after) says that things have shifted quite a bit. That what men think don’t matter since women have most of the power (when it counts, anyway) and that women certainly don’t regard it as “slutty.”
Basically for women now, “slutty” means three guys in one night while in a LTR.
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US railfans matter, we hold up the universe! Get with the program, man.
Dude, you’re on crack or meth…
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@Sara 1 – haven’t you figured him out YET? He’s a textbook narcissist.
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Sara:
Personally the negs are so stupidly obvious to me, they don’t EVER work.
So you don’t like playful bantering?
Please explain “Kino escalation” so I can avoid that one too.
“Kino escalation” simply means progressively intimate touching. Do you prefer being penetrated at first skin contact?
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My neighbourhood is probably unique in the Western world for being really edgy while being overwhelmingly white/asian. Lots of druggies, bikers and not attractive but still popular Russian ladies. Very popular with singles for being centrally located but having rents lowered by druggies, biker wars and the sex trade. Very unpopular with families.
You live in Kallio, Helsinki?
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I’m quite sympathetic to arguments about how diversity-plus-rampant-PC atomizes authentic communities, but it’s hard for me to fathom how a bunch of Muslims are supposed to grab the reins of Western society and cram us all into burquas or whatever.
By outbreeding us. It takes several generations, of course. Think Lebanon. PC helps by demonizing those speak out before the shit hits the fan.
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DA:
a beta male is free to enjoy himself and the fruit of his labour.
No, he’s not to the extent the fruits of his labor are confiscated by the government to provide for the children of women sired by their alpha-lovers.
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whiskey: Norway, Sweden, and much of Germany is not highly urbanized. Indeed much of it is still rural. Yet the low birth rate remains. As does that of White women in the US (1.7 TFR) which is suburban sprawl definede.
Norway, Sweden and Finland (states about the size of Germany with 1/10 of the population) have very rural areas that most of Europe doesn’t have and they do tend to have much higher birth rates, although it’s partially driven up by closed religious subcultures. So the point does work.
Most of my schoolmates who stayed in the countryside either got married and started having kids in their early twenties or (if male) entirely gave up the idea of ever getting a woman. Despite some fantasies here, the countryside is the furthest place from beta heaven you can imagine. Rural areas tend to have a man surplus and older widowed or divorced men can re-marry young women, so the least attractive men have literally NO chances at all of ever getting a young woman and competition in the middle ranks is brutal. Beta suicide is very common (I’ve known many). The rural school shootings we’ve seen are also all about that.
Markku: You live in Kallio, Helsinki?
Harju, technically, but my area is even more edgy than the actual Kallio district so it’s often what people really think of when they mention Kallio.
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Doug to DA:
I think it would be a very interesting experiment to see what you were like after wearing a testosterone patch for a few months.
I’m completely serious.
I think he’d not just masturbate until 6 am but continue until he fell asleep in front of the computer. Mom would find him at noon crouched and snoring over the keyboard with his dick in his hand.
Sorry DA, couldn’t resist. This is approximately what I think you’d answer based on your own writings – minus the mom finding you.
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z, good grief, Ellsworth Toohey hadn’t been in my consciousnes in better than 20 years until you brought him up. Toohey’s abound in the today’s MSM.
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Markku says, “No, he’s not to the extent the fruits of his labor are confiscated by the government to provide for the children of women sired by their alpha-lovers.”
That is actually only a tiny fraction of his taxes. Much more of it goes to provide for the luxury cars and salary bonuses of the alpha males who he works for, and may even be called to bleed and die for.
When someone is both mentally and physically enslaved, they don’t complain about being slaves unless conditions on the plantation are sufficiently unpleasant.
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What’s your take on alpha- or betaness in this Chris Cornell video? (Apart from Cornell selling out to R&B.)
I can’t tell.
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That is actually only a tiny fraction of his taxes.
In this world, yes. But in the hypothetical world where beta males have no wives and children of their own, not likely.
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Ktullah,
In a few lines you mentioned slavery, class war, criticized patriotism and, that leftie classic, blamed everyone else as alienated. Hey, Cuba has the lowest TFR in Latin Americaaa and has had the post since the revolution! BTW, recently the Castro brothers have enacted a series of feminist laws, anti-racist laws, to court the SWPL support in the First World.
Todd
“A woman who makes about the same, or more, than you at marriage. That way, you close off that cloaked child-support loophole.”
woman won’t marry men earning less unless she is herself reaching cougarhood. Men need not be rich. Men need income that is enough to pay rent+bills+car+supermarket+food. Anywhere on Earth, it is not much. It is the necessary to let her income become discretionary so that she can spend it buying gifts for her and for you. But she’ll settle the bar higher as her income gets higher.
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That’s exactly want I was talking about as well. The girl I mentioned (one I work with) is American, and she’s just like Lupo’s describing the type.
One other thing about these girls (genuine good girls and not slut-ingenues) is that they evoke very strong protective instincts in men. Not the cynical quid-pro-quo white-knight posturing but a sincere concern with her well-being.
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Fine, I”ll answer “Comment’s_” wild rants.
One, I was averse to responding to you because your comments to me were belligerent and it was hard to figure out what the hell your multiple points were. It came across like a drunk rant.
Two, by saying that women don’t rule shit, I wasn’t “absolving” women of any responsibility, but simply asserting that women for the most part don’t do policy. They aren’t the “deciders” who bring on unchecked immigration. They vote for it because powerful men want them to vote that way. Someone else made a great point last night about how the media creates new attitudes by manufacturing “alpha-grrlz.”
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i approve of this technique.
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That is actually only a tiny fraction of his taxes. Much more of it goes to provide for the luxury cars and salary bonuses of the alpha males who he works for, and may even be called to bleed and die for.
Balderdash. Executive compensation is generally not paid for with tax dollars, and in any event is a tiny fraction of spending on entitlements. Trillions in welfare spending, entitlements, and pork, but hey, how about the outrageous outrage of $165 million for AIG executives? Peasants, grab your pitchforks!
Red herring, anyone?
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Whiskey
Dougjn — That women will on average in the Urban Professional area have both sheer number counts of partners and manners of getting them (sex first, relationship after) says that things have shifted quite a bit. That what men think don’t matter since women have most of the power (when it counts, anyway) and that women certainly don’t regard it as “slutty.”
Basically for women now, “slutty” means three guys in one night while in a LTR.
It does not matter what women define.
If left to women, Albert Einstein would be a loser, Henry Ford a creep and Tesla a bum.
Brad Pitt in his good times and Mick Jagger would be Gods.
Women do not define based on objectivity.
A woman who has slept with 150 men has still her dignity intact because “she chose to do it”… Well, nobody claimed she was forced, no?
Here is another view, which takes little importance in my view of the topic: But what if the woman sleeping with many men has fucked away the dignity of the man who commits to her. In the end he is paying with his life for some commodity that has been shared with the men who least need it and least want it, possibly also least respect it.
And if you let women define things, the countless of men they slept with were meaningless because it was just sex. On the other hand though, in a relationship, it is never just sex, so the man gets sex on different conditions. 1. makes it harder to get 2. makes it more expensive 3. makes it relationship sex.
Mind you, I love sluts as long as I want them for the commodity they are good for,
For a relationship though, I want a car that has been driven carefully by little number of owners, not something that has been freely ridden as a free taxi by every douche, ass, pua, drunk in town…. Not if I am paying half my earnings for the rest of my life.
diamonds are valuable because they are rare.
Women forget that.
And what women define as slutty nowadays, the three guys bang fest while in a ltr, that is not slutty, that is being a criminal whore.
As this is my life,
I can judge people, and compartmentalize them. It is my duty. and it is based on their choices.
I am aware that any girl age 25 has had 20+ partners, but that does not mean I have to get myself to commit to the sexually empowered free and independent woman village bicycle.
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PA jabbered:
Two, by saying that women don’t rule shit, I wasn’t “absolving” women of any responsibility
and:
They vote for it because powerful men want them to vote that way.
End PA
Gee, I wonder how I got confused in the first place.
Oh yeah, cause “Women don’t have responsibility” is exactly what you said. Those poor women are just being lead astray by evil men. It’s the evil men’s fault, not the women’s fault.
It’s kinda hard, PA, to fail to contrast this with your hard nose ‘absolute responsibility’ nastiness to ‘omega’ males.
Let’s see… who benefits from your attitude of ‘blameless bitch’ and ‘men gots RESPONSIBILITIES’. Oh yeah, women.
So yeah, Momma programmed you good. This is all the same conversation over and over again.
How much have you damaged Ace with your attitudes, by the way? You know, dumping it all on him in your friendly one of the buddies kind of way?
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Fixed to avoid Moderation delays from o m e g a:
PA jabbered:
Two, by saying that women don’t rule shit, I wasn’t “absolving” women of any responsibility
and:
They vote for it because powerful men want them to vote that way.
End PA
Gee, I wonder how I got confused in the first place.
Oh yeah, cause “Women don’t have responsibility” is exactly what you said. Those poor women are just being lead astray by evil men. It’s the evil men’s fault, not the women’s fault.
It’s kinda hard, PA, to fail to contrast this with your hard nose ‘absolute responsibility’ nastiness to ‘o m e g a’ males.
Let’s see… who benefits from your attitude of ‘blameless bitch’ and ‘men gots RESPONSIBILITIES’. Oh yeah, women.
So yeah, Momma programmed you good. This is all the same conversation over and over again.
How much have you damaged Ace with your attitudes, by the way? You know, dumping it all on him in your friendly one of the buddies kind of way?
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OK, Comment_, it’s back to Fuck Off for you.
I gave you a pass yesterday afternoon on grounds it’s the weekend and you had knocked back a few. Now on Monday morning you’re back with “mommas” and “jabbering.”
So fuck you and fuck off, and yo momma too. Beat it, bitch.
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Dougjnn
You are right of course that the behaviors and categories we discuss here should be thought of a differing along a continuum and not as radically distinct types of things.
OTOH, it has occurred to me that traditional, monogamous marriage has always depended on a guy believing that his beloved bride sees him as a desirable sex partner. Whether from pre-marital sex with her or just the look in her eyes, he must have thought he was going to get lucky a lot with her. I think I am right when I assume that most guys entering non-arranged, non-forced marriages took that part for granted or they would not have signed on.
If guys in general come to understand the principles underlying game (ie the truth about female sexuality) I wonder how “marriage” can be sold to very many guys, especially non-alpha types, if they come to see female sexual interest towards them as fake until proven otherwise.
I believe that successful societies in the past have always understood this problem on some level and put serious efforts into making the average young man seem desirable to the average young woman – so the bulk of the population could be in a tolerable family situation. Nowadays, our young women are encouraged in the opposite direction – which synergizes powerfully which their natural hatred of beta-ness..
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A good illustration from a few years back involving a female judge in Deutschland.Arab guy was beating his Arab wife silly.She took him to court.Worthless Western Woman (WWW) declares that wife beating is ok as far as sharia is concerned,and thats good enough for her.She was removed from the case,but it still illustrates what WWW’s are all about.
Also,the stimulating effects of violence on WWW’s has already been noted.
Muslims are having quite a time for themselves with WWW’s in Europe.
Finally,most Western converts to Islam are WWW’s.
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David Alexander
But high testosterone + average to high IQ = success
I would guess that you have at least average IQ. The extra boldness and aggression that comes from the magic-T will help you achieve success in areas other than game. You can still toss-off to porn if you want.
This article on railfanning may interest you, http://men.style.com/details/features/landing?id=content_8398
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OK, Comment_, it’s back to Fuck Off for you.
I gave you a pass yesterday afternoon on grounds it’s the weekend and you had knocked back a few. Now on Monday morning you’re back with “mommas” and “jabbering.”
So fuck you and fuck off, and yo momma too. Beat it, bitch.
I don’t need a ‘pass’ from you, skippy. Your clearly exactly what I think you are.
You gots a popular view. Women have no responsibility and men, especially lesser men, need to get tough and take care of it.
That you can’t handle criticism is just another tired old saw.
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That is why I think Peter is probably black, despite his ‘white’ handle.
Bzzt, wrong.
Peter
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Women have no responsibility and men, especially lesser men, need to get tough and take care of it.
Men act, women react. That’s the whole basis for the PUA theory. Also, dumb twat, if you had read my comments about my two o m e g a male friends (one of whom just got promoted to a beta with momentum) that you’re using as ‘evidence’ of my being callous to ‘lesser men’ you’d have picked up on my very sympathetic attitude toward them.
And which attitude is more likely to make a ‘lesser man’ happy: bitching about life & women being unfair or doing something about your state of unhapppiness by taking responsibility for things you have control over?
That you can’t handle criticism is just another tired old saw.
I can handle criticism from intelligent people with a reasonable attitude. I choose to piss on belligerent morons like you.
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JAW
The thing is, I can incorporate things that I think work, while eschewing things that I don’t. I disagree with him on many many things, certainly politically and morally, but I still think attraction is based on evolutionary psychology, and I’m unwilling to deny myself its pleasures because it might be a little calculated.
Well, it does seem to irk you PUA worshippers that I for one am not impressed with what it works FOR. Pleasure? Mere pleasure? What is so impressive about that? A far higher emotion is JOY; something he knows just about nothing of it seems.
Look guys (idiots!) if a woman were trying to get into your wallet using calculated strategies like “negging” and “kino escalation” because spending money gives them tons of pleasure unlike any other; you’d be building up your defenses against those strategies.
If a woman’s biological clock is ticking and they just have to get knocked up because the thought of a cooing little bundle of joy gives them pleasure unlike any other and she employs a few strategies to cause that to happen, you’d be building up your defenses and he can give you lots of great tips on that.
If anyone, anywhere tries to coerce you into anything and knows the game that THEY are playing and YOU do not, you’d like to build up defenses against that….hmmmmm? Women who are healthy want to be respected above all else, not that most have any clue whatever how to accomplish that, but being used for purposes other than their own doesn’t add to their feeling of self respect. Is it your problem? No. Hence game is so effective.
Is it a free world? Pretty much. I just enjoy the show and listening to you guys bitch, moan, and try to calculate and recalculate your way through life, women, relationships and sex. Women are doing the same thing of course which makes it more tragic and interesting.
Maybe it’s just too logical and you can’t handle the correlation. Maybe it would make you have to think twice before practicing your seduction skills on an unwitting woman who does not really want to be part of your cunning strategies any more than you want to be part of theirs.
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Lehuster, I’m not sure if you’re aware of this but most politicians aren’t living in small apartments in the inner city.
A good proportion of them never have.
Are you one of those Obama worshippers or something? Cause if you are, we can stop this conversation now, because there’s no chance of your listening to anything like reason.
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Rick
The whole “too calculated” argument is retarded, as if Sara herself has never purposely not picked up a guy’s phone call, or waited a longer amount of time that she first wanted to to call him back, etc.
Yes, I have done the things you mentioned and found it to be so much juvenile bullshit I couldn’t handle it. If I can’t just be myself life is not worth living. If it means I am alone because I don’t play those types of stupid games, I would rather be alone. If I managed to “bag” a man using those strategies I wouldn’t respect the man or myself for having done so. It would mean I’d have to use strategies and play games forever! I don’t want to smirk my way through life. For one thing, it’s too much work.
Ian in Hamburg
@Sara 1 – haven’t you figured him out YET? He’s a textbook narcissist.
Oooooh a German?! Me too. LOL Yes, he is a textbook narcissist and he succeeds greatly in getting lots and lots of attention here. I use this forum to offload some of the byproducts of my overly active mind and general amusement. P.S. I think I love you.
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@Sara 1 – I’m no German!
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Gig, like most sheeple, you zeroed in on “enslaved”, and your mind went immediately to African chattel slavery.
I have little patience for either left wing or right wing sheeple. They’re all cogs in the same machine, railing against reality instead of shaping it…unable to shape it because they don’t even have the perspective to see it.
…and if someone tries to explain it to them, they can’t even fathom it, so it’s like a 3d being trying to explain height to a 2d being.
That’s basically what I was trying to say. Sheeple are worried about their “freedoms” only because their comforts have been threatened.
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…and Sara, a narcissist probably wouldn’t give two shits about helping other guys get a leg up (pun intended) in dating.
He especially wouldn’t care enough to spend so much time writing about it…especially about the times he’s swung and missed.
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Sara 1
Everyone gets why playing games and stage managing some aspects of ones persona is exhausting, for most people anyway. But there is still the problem, for a lot of guys anyway, that their natural, default selves – earnest, eager to please, somewhat introverted – makes womens thighs snap shut in disgust.
I do not expect you to grasp the truly grim implications that fact has for the health of society in general or mens happiness in particular – but there it is.
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Rum, in my view (which may or may not be accurate), earnest, eager to please, and introverted isn’t anybody’s natural self above a certain floor of intelligence and awareness.
Human’s natural selves are rather capable of compassion, helpful, and not extremely given to social exhaustion.
What’s screwing men up is being unnatural…being non men.
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David Alexander:
By the way, David, have you ever actually had your IQ tested? Or did you just self-diagnose your supposedly low IQ based on what you’ve read on blogs?
I’d bet that if you took an IQ test and made a serious effort to concentrate on solving it well, the result would surprise you.
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There are online conversions of standardized tests such as SATs into IQ, so maybe there isn’t even any need to take a full IQ test. Just make sure it’s a conversion that accounts for the post-1994 changes to SAT scoring.
By the way, I heard that the online “Tickle” IQ tests inflate scores so they can’t be taken too seriously.
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Lehuster, I’m not sure if you’re aware of this but most politicians aren’t living in small apartments in the inner city.
A good proportion of them never have.
Yeah, but I don’t see how that’s relevant unless you meant this statement to apply to politicians:
“That is actually only a tiny fraction of his taxes. Much more of it goes to provide for the luxury cars and salary bonuses of the alpha males who he works for, and may even be called to bleed and die for.”
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Z.g.
I strongly recommend you read the post of Vladamirs that I quoted in full in the “Inside The Horror Of Bridesmaid Dress Shopping” thread, which is just one thread back. Vlad’s post that I quoted was from a thread several months back. But it was good enough to post in full in something recent enough that people might still read it.
So guys interested in exactly why “reformed sluts” and certainly “reformed” super sluts are such a bad bet, no matter how much and how sincerely they’ve resolved to change their ways to move to a stable marriage and home life, go take a look.
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Kthulah
Leaving aside the question of nature vs nurture, there is still the issue that qualities of earnestness and eagerness to please in young men/men of all ages are a non-trivial reason why womens lives (in the West) have been as protected and as pleasant and safe as they have been.
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BTW, I think it’s much easier for a player to reform and become faithful to an attractive enough wife than it is for super sluts to both do so and have a good sex life with their husband.
The issue for the player is really the same issue for any high sex drive man (higher T combined with attitude towards sex), regardless of how many women he’s bedded or how few. Yes he’s going to crave variety after the first bloom of falling in love fades away. But the player guy HAS HAD a lot of variety.
Yeah he might be sorely temped to cheat some as all highly sexed men are, but that isn’t in itself going to make him lose sexual interest in his wife.
In contrast a super slut WILL lose sexual interest in her husband, or never have really had it strongly to begin with, but rather faked it for him and maybe herself for awhile, out of desire for a stable marriage and home life.
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Ian in Hamburg
@Sara 1 – I’m no German!
I love you anyway! Are you living in Hamburg? I like your site. You seem like a natural man; a rarity around here.
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Sara 1
My post did not ever use the word “needy”. You came up with it. I meant something subtly different. Your chosen word is quite a bit harsher and less nuanced. But even staying with your chosen word, there is still something to think about here, imho.
How can people get along thru lifes difficulties if they do not in some sense feel a need for one another and are unafraid to let on?
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Tood —
If done any kind of right way it establishes deep sexual dominance in her mind, and her sexual submission to you. Straight up plain talk, that’s the nub of it. Especially if you’re the first guy she’s let do it, which you have a shot at unlike her virginity. I personally don’t especially like it except for that aspect. But that aspect I DO like and it’s important.
So I do it early, and then repeat some. But not all the time.
There are other D/s ways and things.
Why am I letting these “secrets” out to a wide audience? Oh well.
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I’m having trouble digesting Feminists supporting Islam or terrorists. Does anyone have a link to a reputable source, or even feminist blog that links feminists and terrorists?
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Kthulah
…and Sara, a narcissist probably wouldn’t give two shits about helping other guys get a leg up (pun intended) in dating.
A leg up? That’s a good one. LOL I’m more into the Enneagram and if he is a three as it appears, when average or unhealthy they are highly narcissistic. There’s also that they like to think of themselves as role models/higher on the ladder; especially as the American Ideal image of success which can include helping others reach their “enviable” status. Tony Robbins is a three.
Rum
But there is still the problem, for a lot of guys anyway, that their natural, default selves – earnest, eager to please, somewhat introverted – makes womens thighs snap shut in disgust.
I do not expect you to grasp the truly grim implications that fact has for the health of society in general or mens happiness in particular – but there it is.
Needy is a turn off for anyone, or should be. Being needy is not natural, it’s neurotic. Supposedly game is teaching men to be more confident in themselves? Their true selves? I doubt that very much. It seems to be a way to camouflage neediness. It’s just another type of conditioning that will eventually have to be undone for real happiness to occur, but such is life. I’ve known some highly successful PUA’s and though they get laid QUITE frequently, they’re still miserable and neurotic as far as I can see.
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Rum
How can people get along thru lifes difficulties if they do not in some sense feel a need for one another and are unafraid to let on?
There is a subtle yet highly significant difference between want and need. Need is negative, want is positive. Need focuses on what is missing and can never attain to the missing thing. Want focuses on what is wanted, but doesn’t focus negatively on it’s absence. I want someone to want me, but I don’t need someone to need me and I certainly don’t want someone to need me.
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Rum —
This from Sara just above is quite good. She does have a good bit of wisdom about interpersonal relations, clouded by her desire to lash out at proxies for her player alpha ex boyfriend who broke her intensely in love heart repeatedly. There is no doubt that she’s a woman who has loved intensely.
A good bit of what game’s about is always avoiding communicating need, and in fact communicating want in only a teasing, ambiguous way to begin with. And to continue with in relationship game, from time to time.
Ambiguous male want feels unmistakeably far away from loser needing to the girl in question.
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Hmm. Interesting thoughts.
I’d just like to add a few to the pot:
First, Markku, if being outbreeded by Muslim immigrants is the problem, then why is it Whites can’t get themselves together to meet the challenge, ie, fuck more and have babies? Seems to me that’s the problem, not Muslim folk.
Second, how many people here have actually known Muslims? From the Arab World? From Africa? From Turkey? From Europe (Bosnia, etc)? From Iran? India? Pakistan? Afghanistan? How many have actually read the Qur’an? The Hadiths? Have actually visited a Mosque?
Bringing the previous point to bear on this question: how many Black people do you actually know? Have you ever visited a Black home for dinner? Attended a Black wedding? A Black funeral, or christening, or family reunion?
I’m asking this because it becomes painfully clear to me that a good number of people here don’t seem to speak from a place of personal experience and insight, but rather theoretical conjecture, perhaps fear, even hatred. And please, I think I’ve proven that I’m far from sqeamish when it comes to discussing what most would consider to be politically incorrect things.
For Dave Alex: maybe I missed it, but I would deeply appreciate it if you could please layout your view of Blacks and IQ, either way. My own view, is that even if the current meme is true, it is far from the be all and end all of life. Now, I’ve said before that I’ve never been tested for IQ. But I suppose I’m smarter than the average bear-or Bruh, lol. At any rate, I think its fair to say that unless we begin to temper or macro-assumptions w/a bit of realworld experience, we threatened to get a good bit of egg on all our faces.
Just some thoughts.
Comment & reply, holla
The Obsidian
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PA: “One other thing about these girls (genuine good girls and not slut-ingenues) is that they evoke very strong protective instincts in men. Not the cynical quid-pro-quo white-knight posturing but a sincere concern with her well-being.”
That’s exactly right. The funny thing about the most recent one I ran into is I was very protective of her … being in the same room with me! OMG, why are you hugging me; are you insane? Jeezus; don’t offer me a ride home! Don’t you know who I am? This probably means I’m a jaded old louche. Casanova wrote about similar things in his memoirs.
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Sara I
That was a good description.
It is the perfect attitude to pickup. I want you (an honest expression of interest) but I don’t need you (I can walk away).
If you can really feel that way (not fake it), you are off to a good start.
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“This is all about sexual dominace Carl. While you’re staring into her eyes think about how you’re going to be bending her over your couch back and fucking her in the ass in a few days, longest. That sort of thing. If you’re thinking that while you’re staring at her eyes, I guarantee she’ll break away first. The more of a bad girl or real hottie she is, the longer she’ll test you, but you get the idea.”
So, you are saying that in such a situation women would not know what you’re thinking about?
The eyes tell a lot, did you know that?
Have you ever did that to a good girl?
I would like some answers…
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Kthulah,
“so it’s like a 3d being trying to explain height to a 2d being.”
Good one. I remember that episode of Cosmos with the apple and the paper squares.
You are a thinker, you are.
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PA:
Yes, but I think that a real official good score would have an even better effect on David. Besides, he sounds like a decently intellectually active fellow, so it’s possible that he’d score much better today than when (if?) he took the SAT as a teenager.
Those “Tickle” tests that you see advertised on popular websites are complete rubbish. It’s mostly a random collection of puzzles of the sort you often find on crossword pages in newspapers, without any expert psychometric input whatsoever.
Also, you’re correct that the scoring is ridiculously inflated to make everyone feel smart (out of curiosity, I once tried giving completely random answers and the score was over 90). Altogether, a complete fraud — they’re just collecting web hits to make money on advertising, and they also sell bogus “expert analysis” of scores aimed at their most naive visitors.
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DA: I think you keep coming here because you need to convince yourself that you’d never have a chance at happiness if you put yourself out there. You keep looking for and “discovering” reasons for this (e.g. I’m inferior, I have contradictory impossible to fulfil needs, they only love/are attracted to alphas which I’m nothing like, I don’t want to be bothered with all that stuff, I’m Catholic and stuck for life with whoever, I’ll secretly think she despises me, she must be white, I have low IQ…). You seem to take joy in posts where you can go ‘Well! I’ll NEVER be like that, so it’s awesome I’m staying out!’
That’s just not true; there’s more than likely a chance at happiness, even if it might end in tears (or if God forbid, she’s ‘ugly’ and loves you). Learn to live with your decision to stay alone and not risk your present contentment/sanity such as it is (e.g. what if I try and fail?) — without the lies and the rationalisation. People’s actions are informed by their rationality but are driven by their emotions; you can throw up a million reasons BUT you’re human and as such you want to be with someone; you’d ignore all those reasons if you weren’t so afraid or some other negative feeling. You’d be conversely throwing up a million rationalisations as to why you SHOULD be going after the women.
Apologies for any feelings of being patronised or being misinterpreted, which is a risk with what I’m saying.
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David Alexander:
So you keep whining about your supposedly low IQ, even though you’ve never tested it? That’s like complaining that you have diabetes when you never even had you blood sugar tested.
I’d actually bet good money that you’d score well over average on any standard IQ test, and I wouldn’t be surprised at all if your score was 120 or higher. That’s assuming you took the effort to solve the test well, of course, not in a daydreaming half-assed sort of way.
High IQ doesn’t preclude laziness and impulsive stupid decisions by any means (I for one wish it did!). I think you’re spending way too much time reading silly rants on Half Sigma and similar blogs.
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David Alexander
http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/SATIQ.aspx
According to this table your IQ is certainly above average and probably in the top 20 percent.
Your writing also indicates someone of, at the very least, average intelligence. Whatever problems you may have, been dumb is not likely to be one of them.
Smart people do not always do well at school. In fact intelligent, imaginative, or misfit types often do far worse than a raw score would indicate. I was one of those (well a misfit anyway), so I know.
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Vlad yea don’t we all just wish high iq would make all problems dissapear.
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Virgin@40
Not specifically no. But she’d feel a very strong, confident, dominant vibe from you. A slight wry smile is good to. I think that’s what people mean by smirk, although smirking per se is much cruder. Not what to do when eye locking before you’ve spoken.
Yes.
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No, he’s not to the extent the fruits of his labor are confiscated by the government to provide for the children of women sired by their alpha-lovers.
I’d rather pay women to go away and leave me alone than to harass me and demand that I directly pay for their existence. It’s still cheaper than paying to support a wife who will never love me in exchange for third rate, orgasm free sex.
I think he’d not just masturbate until 6 am but continue until he fell asleep in front of the computer. Mom would find him at noon crouched and snoring over the keyboard with his dick in his hand.
Actually, that has already happened, I believe on two occasions.
I wonder how “marriage” can be sold to very many guys, especially non-alpha types, if they come to see female sexual interest towards them as fake until proven otherwise.
That’s my general problem with Whiskey’s theory. We can’t go back to the old system if more men finally realize what I learned, and discover that no female will ever really love them or find them attractive. Once you realize that’s true, you do regard any female interest as suspicious, and you tend to look for flaws, and you’ll presume that even the virginal girls will be seduced away by him when you’re not around. It’s far better for one’s emotional health to simply stop chasing impossible dreams, and just to let the girls have the alphas.
This article on railfanning may interest you,
Thanks for the article. Those guys seem a bit more dedicated and hardcore than me, and their interest seems to be geared toward freight. I’m more into passenger and electrics, so other than the Northeast and the scattered light rail and subway systems around the country, I have to go to Europe to get my jollies.
By the way, David, have you ever actually had your IQ tested? Or did you just self-diagnose your supposedly low IQ based on what you’ve read on blogs?
I haven’t had an IQ test in years, and I can’t find the results of the tests from when I last took them before going into Kindergarten. MY SAT scores from 2001 are 1010, 1060, and 1180 which for all intents and purposes aren’t that high, and were much lower than the rest of my friends. Plus, if I was high IQ, I probably would have done a bit better in CompSci and engineering classes, and I would have avoided the impulsive stupid shit that I did in college.
fuck more and have babies?
The problem is that certain sectors of the white population tend to view children as a burden and nuisance, or feel that large resources should be dedicated to raising children, or feel that large families are a sign of backwardness or indifference to the environment or resource utilization.
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maybe I missed it, but I would deeply appreciate it if you could please layout your view of Blacks and IQ, either way. My own view, is that even if the current meme is true, it is far from the be all and end all of life
I suspect that the legacy of low IQ in blacks is possibly due to the fact that Africa lacks the harsh winters that tend to prioritize conscientiousness and forward thinking in which one would need to prepare food for the harsh winter. In contrast, while Africa does suffer from floods and other natural disasters, outside of a potential crop failure, food was generally easy to secure for most of the year. In other words, the low IQ that died in Europe or Asia ended up surviving in Africa.
As for the effects, the problem is that in a world that is increasingly dependent on higher intelligence for the most profitable sectors. In other words, we’re going to get stuck with the bulk of the black population stuck in the poorer rungs. Mind you, I’m of the theory that the only way white people will ever respect black people is if we have the high IQ needed to get into the high ranking, high profit professional and business sectors.
So you keep whining about your supposedly low IQ, even though you’ve never tested it?
Low IQ just seems to be the only reasonable reason as to why I couldn’t write code in anything more complex than a “Hello World” C++ program, or why Calc and Physics were so hard. In other words, if I had high IQ, I should have had a college degree in something difficult like a STEM major, and I should be able to think critically or memorize stuff with ease, or explain how a frigging IGBT electric motor works.
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David, will you concede that your verbal skills are at least above-average?
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David
If you have a “low” IQ the sun rises in the west.
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“memorize stuff with ease” This is where people fuck up they think the people doing better than them are magically just better not working harder and just doing more than them. Unless it is aa then of course yea that would be true.
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You think that white people magically do better. Well if I didn’t sit down at night and make flash card for my drugs for pharmacy class and go over them over and over and over. I would not have been able to fill in the blanks to pass the tests. A low iq guy from my high school became an engineer. How do you think he did that? He probably had to study his ass off.
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David Alexander is a real downer. At a minimum, he should at least be trying to teach other men Game, so they can choose to use Game to pursue THEIR objectives, whatever they may be.
But he simply wants everyone to be as hopelessly depressed as he.
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“I suspect that the legacy of low IQ in blacks is possibly due to the fact that Africa lacks the harsh winters that tend to prioritize conscientiousness and forward thinking in which one would need to prepare food for the harsh winter. ”
Er…no. Indians have high IQ. Spaniards have high IQ as well, with no snowy winters.
I think that since all non-Africans are descended from about 70 Ethiopians who left Africa at the point where Ethiopia is joined to the Arab Peninsula (back when ocean levels were lower during the second ice age), it just happens that those 70 Ethiopians had a higher IQ than other Africans they left behind. Descended from those 70 Ethiopians are all whites, Arabs, Indians, Chinese, Polynesians, etc. of today.
I have never seen a single Khoi-San wearing modern clothes, or demonstrating white-collar knowledge.
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David Alexander:
Yes, David, we know that all those people spending their time obsessively studying and doing their homework are naive fools. They think that their success in school will actually depend on the amount of effort they put in. What a bunch of suckers! Everyone knows that when you just have high IQ, then C++, calculus, physics, and electromagnetic theory are trifling trivialities, as obvious as the nose on your face. For high IQ people, achieving mastery in any of these subjects is easier than reading through a grocery store tabloid for a low IQ prole. (The latter being defined as anyone who doesn’t belong to the former category, of course.)
I’ve heard that around really really high IQ folks (over 2 SD above the mean, they say), computers program themselves, and exams and homeworks write themselves as well. I think it’s because the inanimate matter is scared of being exposed to their penetrating intellects so much that it prefers to rearrange itself spontaneously into the desired order. What do you think?
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David Alexander:
This is probably because you have low IQ. For example, as a high IQ individual, I would never be caught dead using a dictionary, spell checker, or a grammar book. Even when I’m tempted to do so, I just imagine someone peering over my shoulder and catching me in flagrante delicto. I’m sure the word would spread in no time that I’m a low IQ prole.
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I’m having trouble digesting Feminists supporting Islam or terrorists. Does anyone have a link to a reputable source, or even feminist blog that links feminists and terrorists?
Feminists support immigration, therefore they support Islamic Immigrants. They also support Catholic Mexican immigrants, Animist’s, Hindu’s, and every other religion. Illiterate, criminal, or illiterate criminal. It hardly matters. Immigration is good.
People can argue why. Some people have come out and said “because they were told to”. I personally don’t really care why. They do. They do rabidly. They are responsible for that, whatever their reasons.
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Jump off the wheel
Hampster but why don’t they support state assisted suicide for the people who figure out that they are just a hampster on a wheel and that all of this is still not worth it if you could just give up in a nice state sanctioned way. That is where I need the enlightenment. I think it would lower crime as well.
My dam achilles heal.
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dougjnn
This from Sara just above is quite good. She does have a good bit of wisdom about interpersonal relations, clouded by her desire to lash out at proxies for her player alpha ex boyfriend who broke her intensely in love heart repeatedly. There is no doubt that she’s a woman who has loved intensely.
Thank you. I’m surprised anyone can tell as ornery as I can be here. Why do fools fall in love? I think it’s because there is a lot to learn from relationships and unless we have an overwhelming attraction we’d never go through it; and if children weren’t so beautiful they’d never live beyond their 2nd year.
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DA: MY SAT scores from 2001 are 1010, 1060, and 1180 which for all intents and purposes aren’t that high, and were much lower than the rest of my friends.
Jesus Christ, that sucks! I’m not sure I believe those scores; you’re obviously capable of coherent, grammatically correct writing.
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“We can’t go back to the old system if more men finally realize what I learned, and discover that no female will ever really love them or find them attractive. Once you realize that’s true, you do regard any female interest as suspicious, and you tend to look for flaws, and you’ll presume that even the virginal girls will be seduced away by him when you’re not around.”
This is where I’ll disagree with you, David. If you look around, you will always see some unlikely pairings.
Locking yourself away so that you don’t have to take the risk of meeting women who will reject you, then sure, you won’t get rejected.
You will also ensure that you never do actually meet a woman who loves you for you.
The thing to remember is that women tend to be irrational, and all the generalisations about Game are just that. They’re generalisations and there are always exceptions.
Game is about sorting the chaff from the wheat in a time when the old mores have been tossed aside and immorality rules.
There is no public shaming any more. There are no real consequences for sexual misbehaviour on the part of women, so how does a man find a woman to spend his life with whom he considers to be decent and worth committing to?
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Sara I
There is a saying (from whom or where I do not know):
Love is the history of a woman’s life; it is an episode in man’s.
Fools fall in love because they are fools. But who is happier the fool in love or the wise one lacking it?
[If you need help answering that question just consider why all the smart nerd-boys put so much effort into foolishly finding love – or at least a quick hit of lust]
Regarding your orneriness, please don’t change. A fluffy Sara would be less fun than a feisty Sara.
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DA needs the godfather to give him advice:
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For example, as a high IQ individual, I would never be caught dead using a dictionary, spell checker, or a grammar book.
If I had high IQ, I wouldn’t need the need to use them as often as I would have a superior vocabulary along with a mental database of properly spelt words and full recollection of grammar rules.
Everyone knows that when you just have high IQ, then C++, calculus, physics, and electromagnetic theory are trifling trivialities
They wouldn’t be easy, but I would have learned them in the same way that I learned algebra and high school. Hell, if anything, I should have remembered the French that I learned for four years, and I suspect my photography would be much better and more creative.
If you look around, you will always see some unlikely pairings.
That’s a fluke, or the prettiest partner has a massive flaw like mental illness or low IQ.
You will also ensure that you never do actually meet a woman who loves you for you.
That will never happen since women are only truly attracted to alpha males and the beta males that are capable of running game. Even if some woman magically loved me for me, and she was reasonably attractive, a guy like him could easily come along and seduce her away. It’s rather pointless as long as there are alphas out there, and even in the context of an old 1950s style marriage, there’s always the secret covert relationship that nobody knew about. Why compete with an alpha for women when as a beta, you’re incapable of competing at all, and most women couldn’t be bothered with you in a sexual context?
Let the alphas have their women, let women have their alphas, and let me have discount fares to Australia to ride the rail networks in Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane, and Perth. 🙂
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Obsidian,
Charles Murray has covered the science of IQ extensively and the consensus is in. See here:
http://www.aei.org/publications/filter.all,pubID.23075/pub_detail.asp
There is a significant, approx. 1 standard deviation, difference in average IQ between white and black americans. Further, this difference likely is 2/3 to 3/4 genetic (ie. unalterable) in nature.
Is this the be all/end all of existence? Of course not. But what it does mean, along with the other signficant and unalterable behavorial differences between blacks and whites as researched by Richard Lynn, is that all the black-white performance gaps that exist in our society: the education gap, wealth gap, income gap, crime gap, prison population gap, homeownership gap, etc. will never go away. They will alway exist, forever.
In short, because of the fact of large IQ and other behavioral differences, blacks will never achieve the same level of material success as whites across all the broad measures that exist. In fact, it isn’t nor will it ever be close. And this fact is significant since the ruling ideology of our elites mandates equality of outcomes between the races even if it means massive wealth confiscation and destruction for the purpose of redistribution. Not to mention the mandated silence on black-on-white crime that is reaching epidemic proportions.
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I’m not a big fan of the Murray’s the Bell Curve text… especially since most of the r2 are below 10%…. you can see Stephen Gould’s total ownage of the text here….
http://www.dartmouth.edu/~chance/course/topics/curveball.html
“Herrnstein and Murray’s correlation coefficients are generally low enough by themselves to inspire lack of confidence. (Correlation coefficients measure the strength of linear relationships between variables; the positive values from 0.0 for no relationship to 1.0 for perfect linear relationship.) Although low figures are not atypical for large social–science surveys involving many variables, most of Herrnstein and Murray’s correlations are very weak—often in the 0.2 to 0.4 range. Now, 0.4 may sound respectably strong, but—and this is the key point—R2 is the square of the correlation coefficient, and the square of a number between zero and one is less than the number itself, so a 0.4 correlation yields an R–squared of only .16. In Appendix 4, then, one discovers that the vast majority of the conventional measures of R2, excluded from the main body of the text, are less than 0.1. ”
It just seems to me that if he was being intellectually honest… they would put all the R2 data on the damn plots…
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epiclolz,
The IQ gap turns up every time it is tested. Without exception.
You can also look into Carleton Putnam’s books Race and Reason and its sequel Race and Reality for more hard data on cognitive differences between the races. See here for instance:
http://www.jrbooksonline.com/HTML-docs/race_and_reality_03.htm
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One other thing about these girls (genuine good girls and not slut-ingenues) is that they evoke very strong protective instincts in men. Not the cynical quid-pro-quo white-knight posturing but a sincere concern with her well-being.
An aspect of this that goes unconsidered by anyone but the good girls themselves: when you give off that unsulliable aura, it’s incredibly difficult to get someone to “sully” you, they’re so busy being protective.
You’d be surprised at how often girls like this get stuck in the friend zone by guys. Guys who might appreciate the quality, but aren’t at the point in life where they’re willing to engage it (via marriage/kids/etc.)
This I know quite well from first-hand experience.
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@ae understood. I never said there wasn’t an empirical gap. I’m just noting that the particular source stated is a bit suspect even to a reasonable person.
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