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Chateau Heartiste

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« Getting Rusty
Easy Living Fueling Left-Wing Extremism, U.S. Says »

Relationship Game: Tender Lovemaking Edition

April 14, 2009 by CH

I’ve been getting a lot of emails recently from readers who want to know how to square game with relationships. As has been discussed here before, game never ends. It is refined to suit the circumstances. In the beginning stages, your game portfolio is heavy on attraction and excitement stocks. Later, it diversifies into comfort and security holdings. But the fundamentals don’t change. You should be aware that after a woman has fallen in love she will begin to test your devotion to her as well as your alpha grace under pressure. So you see, the shit tests never die, they just reincarnate to annoy you unto your last breath. Fuck, my 87 year old grandmother gave me a shit test when I visited her at the home. “Grandson! You’re late! Do you think I can wait for you forever like one of your floozies?! Clock’s ticking!” I barely passed.

Here are some examples of what I’m talking about pulled from my own life:

  • Going to parties

When you’re in a relationship, you’ll be going to lots of house parties with your girl. This is because most likely she will have more “friends” than you, as it is a weakness of the female gender that they cannot survive long without oxygen or petty gossip. When you show up at the party, don’t hang onto your GF’s side waiting for her to introduce you to her judgmental friends. Walk in the door first, stay with her for about five seconds while she gets her bearings, smirk like the sadistic alpha warlord you are, then make a beeline for the liquor in the kitchen and get both of you a stiff drink. On the way, chat up people you know peripherally or don’t know at all. UNDER NO CIRCUMSTANCES should you ever wait for your GF’s nudging or prompting to talk to her friends. The alpha way is the proactive way. She will be impressed as she admiringly watches you work the room like Jerry Maguire. And for fuck’s sake, don’t fret about leaving her alone for twenty minutes. Give her room to brag — or joke — about you. House parties with peers are one of the few acceptable gatherings where she will like being separated from you to talk amongst her yentas. This probably has something to do with the erotic charge of seeing her lover engaged with other women, yet still close enough to carefully observe in case you get a little too flirty with her mortal enemies friends.
Tip: When your GF introduces you to someone, don’t look at her first like a puppy waiting to be petted. Keep your eyes focused on the friend and shake hands.
Tip #2: Women are natural self-deprecators. When you and her are in a conversation with a small group mention your GF’s job or accomplishments. She will invariably humble herself. This is a great time to mildy rebuke her modesty and then praise her good work or taste. In the interest of social niceties, she will transparently balk at your praise, but inside she will love you for it. Mentally prepare for volcanic sex later that night.

  • Visiting your family

I had been dating this stunning girl for a year when I decided to bring her to a Christmas family dinner with aunts, uncles and cousins. She was the introverted type and did not do well in large groups of people she hardly knew. She also didn’t drink, so I knew that option was right out. Family gatherings are completely different than house parties. I would need to ease her into the scene. She was nervous and self-conscious. I stayed by her side for a long time, and gently pulled her by the upper arm when I wanted to talk to someone else. She followed without hesitation, and after a half hour of me chaperoning her I could tell she was visibly loosening up. By the end of the evening, she was comfortable enough to talk with my bombastically charming rich alcoholic uncle one on one.
Tip: When a family member asks what your GF does for a living, don’t answer for her. Let her do the talking.
Tip #2: Sit next to your GF at the dinner table. Pour her wine. Put your hand on her leg under the table and rub the back of her knee. Mentally prepare for cataclysmic sex later that night.

  • Making Plans

I was dating a girl for a few months. I made plans with her to go to the beach. She packed her beach stuff in the trunk of my car, sat next to me with a big smile on her face, and I started driving… somewhere else. It wasn’t until a half hour into the trip that she noticed I was driving the opposite direction. “Are you taking a short cut? The beach is the other way!” “Maybe. Boy, you are too quick for me.”  I teased her like this for a while before I surprised her with my new plans. We were going to a quaint bed and breakfast in the mountains, complete with jacuzzis, horseback riding and candlelit dinners overlooking the valley river. She squealed with delight. After her astonishment wore off, she began to complain that she had only packed beach stuff. I told her not to worry. I had packed an alternate suitcase full of more appropriate clothes for her.
Tip: Make plans, change them, surprise her. Just be sure to cover all your bases. Chicks cream their panties when you remember the little things, like bringing along her favorite wine or knowing what types of vacations she really loves. They really love it when you’re unpredictable without being sloppy with the details.
Tip #2: If she’s uptight about this sort of thing, tease her mercilessly for being anal retentive. Then sweetly assure her that you took care of all the contingencies. Mentally prepare for event horizon sex later that night.

A few other pointers:

Frequently pat her ass.
Compliment her beauty sparingly.
Draw a picture of her in crayon.
Play “butt spatula” in the kitchen.
Tell her mom she’s a MILF.
Curse her in a foreign tongue.
Compare her to a chihuahua.
Call her Paris Hilton.
Leave handcuffs in full view.
Drip hot wax on her nipples.
Buy a handgun and let her caress the barrel.
Reenact rape scenes from movies.
Be impervious to her taunts.
Act cagey.
Hide your money.
Buy her gifts when they’re not expected.
Don’t buy her gifts when they are.
Avoid PDA one day and finger her in public the next.
Bang her within a stone’s throw of:
a church.
a Dunkin Donuts.
a public restroom.
a school playground.
an outdoor wedding.
a caged zoo animal.
Scare her till she pees herself.
Hide sexy post-it notes in her panties.
Get used to saying the words “Enough”, “Shut up”, and “Turn over.”
Look fantastic in a suit.
Look fantastic in casual wear.
Look fantastic in anything.
Sound good.
Smell good.
Kiss good.
Strut around with supreme confidence.
Be uncannily successful at your job.
Blow people away anytime you say anything.
Take six-hour lunches.
Disappear for weeks at a time.
Lie to everyone about everything.
And drink and smoke constantly.

Basically, be Don Draper.

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Posted in Game, Relationships | 248 Comments

248 Responses

  1. on April 14, 2009 at 12:15 pm ironrailsironweights

    By the end of the evening, she was comfortable enough to talk with my bombastically charming rich alcoholic uncle one on one.

    And by the following weekend, your bombastically charming rich alcoholic uncle was porking her so hard she was seeing stars.

    Peter

    LikeLike


  2. on April 14, 2009 at 12:16 pm Cannon's Canon

    tl;dr

    LikeLike


  3. on April 14, 2009 at 12:25 pm roissy

    your bombastically charming rich alcoholic uncle was porking her so hard she was seeing stars.

    i wouldn’t have put it past him.
    but, no.

    LikeLike


  4. on April 14, 2009 at 12:25 pm Anonymous

    This is because most likely she will have more “friends” than you, as it is a weakness of the female gender that they cannot survive long without oxygen or petty gossip.

    it’s not a weakness, it’s the reason chicks are a million times more advanced in social dynamics than men. they train young like athletes, and gossip is the ultimate social analysis drill

    LikeLike


  5. on April 14, 2009 at 12:38 pm schoolboy

    “Fuck, my 93 year old grandmother gave me a shit test when I visited her at the home. “Grandson! You’re late! Do you think I can wait for you forever like one of your floozies?! Clock’s ticking!” I barely passed.”

    lol too funny!!…no wonder i love this blog.

    LikeLike


  6. on April 14, 2009 at 12:39 pm DF

    it’s not a weakness, it’s the reason chicks are a million times more advanced in social dynamics than men. they train young like athletes, and gossip is the ultimate social analysis drill

    There is truth to this statement.

    Basically, be Don Draper.

    That’s all you needed to say.

    LikeLike


  7. on April 14, 2009 at 12:41 pm dougjnn

    I loved the crescendo ending, beginning with “look fantastic in a suit”. Don Draper was a pitch perfect role model. Or was until the idiotic moody wanderings in California the director / writers had to scrib in.

    LikeLike


  8. on April 14, 2009 at 12:42 pm pez

    This doen’t seem to fit from someone who just yesterday gave the advice of referring to women as “bitches and dirty whores”…

    you never answered me about the context…consistent, mysogynistic thoughts or playful sexy ones.

    LikeLike


  9. on April 14, 2009 at 12:42 pm dougjnn

    Oh and his wife’s revenge affair baby they had to inflict for feminist just deserts in the last episode.

    LikeLike


  10. on April 14, 2009 at 12:45 pm dougjnn

    pez-

    This doen’t seem to fit from someone who just yesterday gave the advice of referring to women as “bitches and dirty whores”…

    you never answered me about the context…consistent, mysogynistic thoughts or playful sexy ones.

    You need to feel on top.

    When you get there, be playfully sexy.

    LikeLike


  11. on April 14, 2009 at 12:50 pm The G Manifesto

    A few other pointers:

    Pour champagne over her
    Leave Desert Eagle in full view
    Leave Ski Mask in full view
    Hide your Drugs
    Bang her within a stone’s throw of:
    A Cemetery
    A cliff overlooking a beach
    A beach
    A Cave
    The edge of a tall buildgin

    Not sure who this “Don Draper” guy is but he is grabbing moves right out of The G Manifesto Playbook:

    “Look fantastic in a suit.
    Look fantastic in casual wear.
    Look fantastic in anything.
    Sound good.
    Smell good.
    Kiss good.
    Strut around with supreme confidence.
    Be uncannily successful at your job.
    Blow people away anytime you say anything.
    Take six-hour lunches.
    Disappear for weeks at a time.
    Lie to everyone about everything.
    And drink and smoke constantly.”

    I would only add:

    Don’t be afraid of Drug use
    Make sure your suits are Custom
    Get at least one pair of Handmade shoes (Bond Street)
    Have a dope Tie collection
    Show off your athletic prowess with an interesting activity like surfing or boxing
    Travel constantly

    – MPM

    LikeLike


  12. on April 14, 2009 at 12:56 pm Nashville

    This probably has something to do with the erotic charge of seeing her lover engaged with other women, yet still close enough to carefully observe in case you get a little too flirty with her mortal enemies friends.

    Well put. That reminds me of H.L. Mencken’s classic line:

    Misogynist: A man who hates women as much as women hate one another.

    LikeLike


  13. on April 14, 2009 at 1:00 pm biktopia

    Ok this is of topic but i just have to ask,
    If anyone want to decipher this incidence i had.
    So,
    I was at a place i usually don’t go to, its somewhat a posh meat market, i rather hang out in artsy places.
    So this guy came up to me dancing in my vicinity, he looked at me and he was surrounded buy my friends and me, and he seemed alone there, he was so handsome, instantly i liked him, so by teasing i pinched his butt but in a way that he couldn’t figure out who it was, so he looked around and didn’t know it was me, but i gave him some eye contact.
    So after like ten minutes a equally handsome girl come up to him and they hug each other in front of me and my friends, and i was like ehnhhh?
    I was a bit perplexed over his game, he really stood in my crowd, giving me eyes, where he had another girl there, then as she came they left, and i hastily forgot about the whole thing, then like ten minutes later, i went to the toilet and when i was going back i could feel a hand on my shoulder from behind and it was the same guy,, and i was so perplexed, and he asked where i like to go out partying and i told him that this is not really my place, then he suggested we should go to another posh place, coz he have to go to meet some friends, i said no because i didnt really know what the hell he was trying to do.
    So in my brain, and as i read this site i could come up with 2 things,
    either he played me against the other chick to make her jealous, or he played me in the roissy style, which failed miserably coz i just didn’t trust him anymore….
    If anyone have any suggestions,,,

    LikeLike


  14. on April 14, 2009 at 1:09 pm Himmler

    biktopia, you illiterate fuck.

    LikeLike


  15. on April 14, 2009 at 1:11 pm biktopia

    Thanks Desert Fox, i appreciate your feedback,,

    LikeLike


  16. on April 14, 2009 at 1:11 pm The G Manifesto

    biktopia,

    Sounds like the guy was simply working the room.

    – MPM

    LikeLike


  17. on April 14, 2009 at 1:15 pm Sparks123

    I know that obvious response is “it’s a TV show” but didn’t Draper cause himself a lot of unnecessary trouble with all that sleeping around? Yeah, his wife eventually took him back, but only because she was pregnant. It would have been easier if he had just fucked a bitch during the lunch hour and been home at 6 o’clock.

    And Draper might actually suffer the ultimate beta fate…raising another man’s kid!

    LikeLike


  18. on April 14, 2009 at 1:18 pm Anonymous

    Oh and his wife’s revenge affair baby they had to inflict for feminist just deserts in the last episode.

    dougjnn –

    I take it English isn’t your first language? At least i hope it isn’t. What the hell does that sentence mean?

    LikeLike


  19. on April 14, 2009 at 1:20 pm David Alexander

    “Fuck, my 93 year old grandmother gave me a shit test when I visited her at the home. “Grandson! You’re late! Do you think I can wait for you forever like one of your floozies?! Clock’s ticking!” I barely passed.”

    In contrast, on my de facto weekly visits to my grandmother, at least once per visit, she feels the need to ask me if I’ll ever find a girlfriend, and if she’ll ever see me get married or engaged before she passes away*. I usually end up saying something along the lines of “I don’t have enough money” as it’s easier to explain to her than going into the concept of alphas and betas, and as always she’ll dismiss that excuse and ask why don’t I turn one of my female friends into a girlfriend…

    *She’s 79 years old. Only two of her ten grandchildren are married.

    Oh and his wife’s revenge affair baby they had to inflict for feminist just deserts in the last episode.

    While I don’t watch the show, I’ve always questioned if cuckoldry was higher in earlier eras due to the lack of paternity testing technology and birth control and the low divorce rate. Hell, even if you had sex with a black guy or different looking white guy, you could always claim rape…

    LikeLike


  20. on April 14, 2009 at 1:20 pm Fabian

    Oh and his wife’s revenge affair baby they had to inflict for feminist just deserts in the last episode.

    dougjnn-

    I take it English isn’t your first language. At least I hope it isn’t. What the hell does that sentence mean?

    LikeLike


  21. on April 14, 2009 at 1:27 pm Nashville

    Draper’s wife was already pregnant before her dalliance in the Men’s room. The new child was conceived on the floor of his father-in-law’s guest bedroom when Draper and her went to visit him while he recuperated from a stroke.

    I won’t deny the feminist portion of it though. It’s chilling to see Betty completely emotionless, chewing on a piece of cold chicken while she recalls the experience of stepping out of her marriage.

    LikeLike


  22. on April 14, 2009 at 1:29 pm Jay Gatsby

    Some of this stuff is right out of The 48 Laws of Power:

    “Everything is judged by its appearance; what is unseen counts for nothing. Never let yourself get lost in the crowd, then, or buried in oblivion. Stand out. Be conspicuous, at all cost. Make yourself a magnet of attention by appearing larger, more colorful, more mysterious, than the bland and timid masses.”

    “To maintain your independence you must always be needed and wanted. The more you are relied on, the more freedom you have. Make people depend on you for their happiness and prosperity and you have nothing to fear. Never teach them enough so that they can do without you.”

    “Too much circulation makes the price go down: The more you are seen and heard from, the more common you appear. If you are already established in a group, temporary withdrawal from it will make you more talked about, even more admired. You must learn when to leave. Create value through scarcity.”

    “Humans are creatures of habit with an insatiable need to see familiarity in other people’s actions. Your predictability gives them a sense of control. Turn the tables: Be deliberately unpredictable. Behavior that seems to have no consistency or purpose will keep them off-balance, and they will wear themselves out trying to explain your moves. Taken to an extreme, this strategy can intimidate and terrorize.”

    “Your actions must seem natural and executed with ease. All the toil and practice that go into them, and also all the clever tricks, must be concealed. When you act, act effortlessly, as if you could do much more. Avoid the temptation of revealing how hard you work – it only raises questions. Teach no one your tricks or they will be used against you.”

    LikeLike


  23. on April 14, 2009 at 1:30 pm A-to-Z

    Reality is so harsh. This is what growth is.

    LikeLike


  24. on April 14, 2009 at 1:33 pm 11minute

    And Draper might actually suffer the ultimate beta fate…raising another man’s kid!

    That’s not the beta’s fate – that’s many a married man’s fate.

    In fact, I know several very alpha guys who get cheated on big time. It is way to easy if the guy believes that his high status will stop a woman’s cravings for a blended mix of cum inside her.

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  25. on April 14, 2009 at 1:34 pm Sara I

    You’re funny roissy. You can’t drink and smoke constantly and smell good at the same time like you didn’t know.

    Another unpopular pointer: Tell the truth. It’s the most shocking thing ever.

    LikeLike


  26. on April 14, 2009 at 1:39 pm Rain And

    Y’all the last 14 lines are from an SNL Don Draper bit, which he links in the post @ “look fantastic in a suit”.

    Pay attention now.

    LikeLike


  27. on April 14, 2009 at 1:39 pm schoolboy

    Jay Gatsby,

    read Robert Greene’s “The 33 Strategies of War,” also. Its superb, especially the 4th strategy.

    LikeLike


  28. on April 14, 2009 at 1:43 pm Jay Gatsby

    Schoolboy – sounds like the strategy Cortez followed when he ordered his men to burn their ships. No going back.

    LikeLike


  29. on April 14, 2009 at 1:49 pm kam

    i loved everything in this post except the following, which made me cringe:

    Drip hot wax on her nipples

    LikeLike


  30. on April 14, 2009 at 1:49 pm Backdoor Man

    I just got back from vacation in Mexico City and surrounding towns. One morning, my wife and I went looking for sweets to take back to our respective co-workers. My wife, who is Colombian, was in a foul mood and giving me shit. In these situations, especially in Spanish-speaking countries, I use strangers to remedy the situation. We walked into the sweets shop, and I announced to the girls behind the counter that we probably weren’t going to buy anything, because my wife was behaving badly. As always, this caused my wife to giggle, and it got the shop girls’ attention. I then start flirting with the girls, making fun of them and joking about the merchandise (I’m blonde and blue-eyed, with native-level Spanish and an accent that most Latin Americans recognize as Colombian…this attracts women, but also confuses them). My wife immediately cheers up, and starts joining me in the game. She says something (I don’t remember what), and I turn to the girls and say with a smile, “Do you see how she acts? How she treats me? She doesn’t deserve a guy like me.” Pretty soon, the shop is buzzing….who are these clowns, they ask? After more theatrics and horsing around, when it comes time to buy stuff, we get huge discounts and my wife is back to her lovey-dovey self. This never fails.

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  31. on April 14, 2009 at 1:50 pm Lance

    don draper is a throwback in so many ways. the idea that his disappearing and his wife cheating is some form of feminist payback is a little far fetched. it makes more sense to view him as the ultimate throwback: the tragic hero. as with all tragic heroes, he has a tragic flaw; it’s his inability to bring all his lives into one complete being. His relationship with his wife follows the same mode.

    draper’s cheating is so much more than alpha male needing to seduce every woman he comes in contact with. that’s why his cheating always takes the form of relationships with other women and not one nights stands. he has a real inability to view his wife as a sexual object. he sees her as a homemaker and mother; and he seeks sexual relationships elsewhere leaving his wife unfulfilled. anyone remember her discovery of the spin cycle? if draper slept around, but kept seducing his wife it’s likely his marriage would be fine.

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  32. on April 14, 2009 at 1:51 pm Sara I

    Roissy, your date switcheroo would not go over with many women. A feminine woman has cherished toiletries and skin care products–shoes, clothing, etc. You put her in the uncomfortable position of going along with your program or being a bitch.

    In my humble opinion, you’re not being dashing and exciting, but inconsiderate. You say you’re doing it FOR her but it sounds more like you’re doing it for you. Especially when you glossed over her feelings about not having her stuff. Saying you “took care of it” is simply not good enough.

    A real man tells a woman what he wants (to do) and asks her how she feels about it FIRST. It doesn’t mean you ALWAYS do things her way, but that you do CARE how she feels in general. Women are simpler creatures than you imagine. You’ll score big points with feminine women that way.

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  33. on April 14, 2009 at 1:52 pm Gunslingergregi

    Woman do test for sure. Hopefully you can pass and you can then move on to the worship phase where she builds you up and holds you in awe with still intermittant tests. She has got to be more afraid of your dissaproval and basing herself within the confines of your outlook on the things she does than on what friends say or society wants her to be. This can be done by you always being right because you always speak true therefore never any shit to hide and stand behind whatever descision you make to do. She has to look at the life you give her as the best it could possibly get by a longshot. She has to be afraid to lose you at a animalistic level but know consciously that you will always be there for her. Tell her you love her a million times. Kiss her for days. Tease her for sure in a joking way. Make her laugh. Make her cry. Be carefull of your words and what you say know that your power is great but with great power comes great responsability. Get her 10k worth of gold it looks good on her plus in a pinch you always have money. If you have a good woman understand that she is the most valuable thing on the planet to you. You can always get money but a good woman is hard to come by and create. Build her up to the sky let her know she is the best. Tell her your relationship tops the rest.

    Still got to actually live with her day to day. I think that will be hard to put the game in. I plan on taking the year to work on daily game with no interference and see what happens. Still in awe phase need to see what happens in day to day. I say keep cuddly talk keep the I love you’s flowing. Yea gonna be a challenge.

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  34. on April 14, 2009 at 1:53 pm Darth Maul

    Sara,

    Please, just shut the fuck up.

    LikeLike


  35. on April 14, 2009 at 1:53 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””kam
    i loved everything in this post except the following, which made me cringe:

    Drip hot wax on her nipples”””

    lol kam it will only hurt for a second he he he

    LikeLike


  36. on April 14, 2009 at 1:56 pm PA

    In fact, I know several very alpha guys who get cheated on big time.

    Some superalphas likely select for mercenary status-obsessed women. And unless you’re Egyptian Sun-God there will always be a higher-status guy around the corner.

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  37. on April 14, 2009 at 1:56 pm David Alexander

    It’s chilling to see Betty completely emotionless, chewing on a piece of cold chicken while she recalls the experience of stepping out of her marriage.

    I may not be a fancy literature major, but I’d argue that the emotionless display while eating cold chicken isn’t pro-feminist, but it may be interpreted as the disdain that women may have for their marriages. A feminist viewpoint would probably feature her being much more happy about her “liberation” from monogamy and marriage.

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  38. on April 14, 2009 at 2:05 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    Roissy, I love you in a hetero-mancrush way. Great article, you need to write a handbook and hand it out to herbs.

    LikeLike


  39. on April 14, 2009 at 2:11 pm Lisa

    I tell you this, there is nothing more disdainful than a man who wants to be in charge and then can’t pull it off with panache.

    LikeLike


  40. on April 14, 2009 at 2:12 pm datruthhurts

    Ah Don Draper. Very good.

    Can’t wait to get back to the states and start hitting the local haunts.

    LikeLike


  41. on April 14, 2009 at 2:14 pm Jay Gatsby

    Sara I – if a woman cares more about her makeup and toiletries than her man, then she doesn’t deserve him. Furthermore, being a bitch in response to a date switcheroo only demonstrates that she is a petulant child in need of a spanking, and then a swift kick in the ass out the door. Finally, asking a woman whether she wants to do something (i.e. gives her permission) removes the air of spontaneity that puts excitement in her life.

    Your ideal man sounds like a herb.

    LikeLike


  42. on April 14, 2009 at 2:15 pm HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    ““Fuck, my 93 year old grandmother gave me a shit test when I visited her at the home. “Grandson! You’re late! Do you think I can wait for you forever like one of your floozies?! Clock’s ticking!” I barely passed.”

    In contrast, on my de facto weekly visits to my grandmother, at least once per visit, she feels the need to ask me if I’ll ever find a girlfriend, and if she’ll ever see me get married or engaged before she passes away*. I usually end up saying something along the lines of “I don’t have enough money” as it’s easier to explain to her than going into the concept of alphas and betas, and as always she’ll dismiss that excuse and ask why don’t I turn one of my female friends into a girlfriend…

    *She’s 79 years old. Only two of her ten grandchildren are married.

    Oh and his wife’s revenge affair baby they had to inflict for feminist just deserts in the last episode.

    While I don’t watch the show, I’ve always questioned if cuckoldry was higher in earlier eras due to the lack of paternity testing technology and birth control and the low divorce rate. Hell, even if you had sex with a black guy or different looking white guy, you could always claim rape…”

    Your complacency with your beta status never ceases to astound me.

    LikeLike


  43. on April 14, 2009 at 2:15 pm Nashville

    @Lance

    Draper’s character is ancient in more ways than one. As you observe, the way in which he has categorized women for his various purposes is actually a classical understanding of the role of women. The author of the book I Don’t: A Contrarian History of Marriage makes this point in an interview she conducted with Salon.com:

    The husbands of Athens divided women into three roles. Wives were for breeding, courtesans were for socializing with and sleeping with, and then there were prostitutes — male and female. Athens invented organized prostitution, as well as democracy…The Athenian wives were not allowed out of the house because they would be seen by other men, and that might cause them to stray. It was considered unseemly for men to love women — either their wives or, more likely, their courtesans — because women weren’t worthy of the highest form of love. The highest form of love was cerebral love between men.

    It’s all enough to remind me of Nicolas Cage’s character’s line from Lord of War:

    Despite the other women, I have always made love to Eva as if she was the only one.

    One other quick point worth commenting upon is why Betty feels such hurt over Draper’s affair with the comedian’s wife. “She’s so old.” Telling then that for her own betrayal she chooses someone so much younger than herself – and Draper.

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  44. on April 14, 2009 at 2:22 pm schoolboy

    Jay Gatsby,

    I didn’t mean for its application in this situation. But that strategy struck me hard in overall life, thus making it my favorite. So i chose to put that in recommending the book. (but looks like you already read it.)

    LikeLike


  45. on April 14, 2009 at 2:25 pm Da_Truth_Hurts

    I can’t recall how many Italian dudes I knew growing up in Philadelphia that had wives and girlfriends. Most knew about each other.

    Took me awhile to ‘get it’.

    LikeLike


  46. on April 14, 2009 at 2:29 pm Alex Birch

    All of this information basically adds up to ONE thing: women are socialized rats who crave for self-confirmation. We men exist to give them that comfort, while still letting them socialize long enough to feel good about themselves.

    Life is hard.

    LikeLike


  47. on April 14, 2009 at 2:33 pm dougjnn

    Lance

    draper’s cheating is so much more than alpha male needing to seduce every woman he comes in contact with. that’s why his cheating always takes the form of relationships with other women and not one nights stands. he has a real inability to view his wife as a sexual object. he sees her as a homemaker and mother; and he seeks sexual relationships elsewhere leaving his wife unfulfilled. anyone remember her discovery of the spin cycle? if draper slept around, but kept seducing his wife it’s likely his marriage would be fine.

    Yes.

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  48. on April 14, 2009 at 2:34 pm omw

    That was an interesting interview, Nash. I’d like to read that gal’s book sometime.

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  49. on April 14, 2009 at 2:34 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””PA,
    And unless you’re Egyptian Sun-God there will always be a higher-status guy around the corner.””””””””””

    Funny shit but true. Now if you are willing to kill that puts you in same status as Egyptian Sun-god or a deity of some kind and every man can do that. This is end game the line that will not be crossed.

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  50. on April 14, 2009 at 2:39 pm omw

    The bit about the new-age “Good Wife” being eternally sexy and sophisticated like a courtesan, while faithful and domestic like a wife, seems particularly apt.

    Hell, the MILF thing is just an outgrowth of this ideal.

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  51. on April 14, 2009 at 2:39 pm Sara I

    Sara,

    Please, just shut the fuck up.

    Sure thing Darthy.

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  52. on April 14, 2009 at 2:55 pm The G Manifesto

    Gunslingergregi

    ““””””””””””PA,
    And unless you’re Egyptian Sun-God there will always be a higher-status guy around the corner.””””””””””

    Funny shit but true. Now if you are willing to kill that puts you in same status as Egyptian Sun-god or a deity of some kind and every man can do that. This is end game the line that will not be crossed.”

    Great points.

    The ability to kill brings you to a higher level. (a level I have never crossed, but have mentally debated with it over my life, almost to the point of insanity)

    Even Higher is the ability to command many to do killing.

    Crews, armies, or cartels.

    This is why the solo killer ie The Leopard (ie your humble author) is not the king of the Jungle . I almost always roll Dolo.

    It is the Lion and to a lesser extent the Hyena (Generals, cartel bosses, Hell’s Angel’s etc) are The King of The Jungle.

    – MPM

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  53. on April 14, 2009 at 2:56 pm Anonymous

    All of this information basically adds up to ONE thing: women are socialized rats who crave for self-confirmation. We men exist to give them that comfort, while still letting them socialize long enough to feel good about themselves.

    Men are also socialized rates who crave for self-confirmation. Who can dunk a basketball? Who can fuck most and hottest bitches? Who can become the most popular jock/stud in school? Come on now…

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  54. on April 14, 2009 at 2:58 pm Virgle Kent

    This post is nearly perfect, then you go into the comment section and Sara I opens her fucking mouth. Fuck

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  55. on April 14, 2009 at 3:09 pm dougjnn

    Sara–

    Roissy, your date switcheroo would not go over with many women. A feminine woman has cherished toiletries and skin care products–shoes, clothing, etc. You put her in the uncomfortable position of going along with your program or being a bitch.

    In my humble opinion, you’re not being dashing and exciting, but inconsiderate. You say you’re doing it FOR her but it sounds more like you’re doing it for you.

    There’s nothing humble about your opinion. Here you revert to your super bitch Sara. It’s not fun whatsoever. Of course Roissy did it to surprise and delight her. And he took care of the clothes issues. The toiletries thing is a pure red herring – more are required for the beach outing.

    These are the nasty grumblings or outright screachings of an inflexible older woman.

    There’s a reason why so many men avoid so many older women. Looks isn’t the only one.

    Though there are exceptions.

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  56. on April 14, 2009 at 3:10 pm Brad

    I love relationship game posts because I apply it to all the ex girlfriends that still call/txt/talk to me. They all still want me, even though I game all of them the same, they say they are “in love” with me for reasons. I will send 2 of them the same text within 5 minutes and get great responses from both of them.

    When I hear some of the shit that these betas (and even alphas, my exes look pretty fuckin’ good) are doing (when I want to hear about it, I’m not a “friend” to lend an ear I’m a fuck buddy) I just appreciate the concept of game, NS, Mystery, David D, roissy, vk and Roosh.

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  57. on April 14, 2009 at 3:11 pm dougjnn

    Anonymous–

    Men are also socialized rates who crave for self-confirmation.

    Not nearly as much in general. As well there are substantial numbers of men who aren’t much at all.

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  58. on April 14, 2009 at 3:11 pm lurker

    my idea of tender lovemaking is when I don’t leave a bruise.

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  59. on April 14, 2009 at 3:11 pm PA

    a level I have never crossed, but have mentally debated with it over my life

    Every man needs to mentally prepare himself for crossing that line.

    You never wanna be like that sobbing herb in movies who gets lucky and draws a gun on the bad guy, just to have the villain take it away from him because he can’t bring himself to shoot another man.

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  60. on April 14, 2009 at 3:13 pm dougjnn

    Nashville-

    Draper’s wife was already pregnant before her dalliance in the Men’s room. The new child was conceived on the floor of his father-in-law’s guest bedroom when Draper and her went to visit him while he recuperated from a stroke.

    Glad to hear I got that wrong.

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  61. on April 14, 2009 at 3:29 pm Sara I

    Jay

    Sara I – if a woman cares more about her makeup and toiletries than her man, then she doesn’t deserve him.

    Only a petulant child would put it like that. To each his own, my dear. I deserve/prefer a man who is more considerate. If that makes me a bitch so be it.

    Finally, asking a woman whether she wants to do something (i.e. gives her permission) removes the air of spontaneity that puts excitement in her life.

    You misunderstand me. You don’t ask her whether she wants to do something you TELL her what YOU want to d and then ASK her how she feels about it. If you dare try it, you’ll love the results, but chances are your ego is too delicate and you enjoy a playing a different game. Women are auditory creatures and they love to hear that you care about their feelings but it’s a far cry from being “Herb”, beta, or wimp. I think it’s too subtle for you to get.

    dougjnn

    There’s a reason why so many men avoid so many older women. Looks isn’t the only one.

    I’m really okay with that. I avoid older men too.

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  62. on April 14, 2009 at 3:34 pm Bhetti

    I learn new things every day, roissy. I am so weak for requiring oxygen. I swear you put these little comments in deliberately, just to see if someone will go ‘haha, roissy what a wit.’ then ‘Wait, that was a joke, right?!’ (HOT WAX?!)

    Party tip: “This is a great time to mildy rebuke her modesty and then praise her good work or taste. In the interest of social niceties, she will transparently balk at your praise, but inside she will love you for it. Mentally prepare for volcanic sex later that night.”
    You totally just said that *swoon*. Interesting that you haven’t provided an explanation for why that might be.

    “I stayed by her side for a long time, and gently pulled her by the upper arm when I wanted to talk to someone else… Sit next to your GF at the dinner table. Pour her wine. Put your hand on her leg under the table and rub the back of her knee.”
    That IS incredibly hot.

    Surprise her, “remember the little things” and she will want you?

    I think we’ve just established dominant niceness is an important part of LTR Game, then.

    Each one of your “tips” deserves their own post, roissy. Still, drinking & smoking’s a no from me.

    Remember, men, it’s alpha not to need oyxgen. As exemplified by smoking.

    DA: You could always go with ‘I’m gay but due to my religious beliefs, I refuse to act on this. I am using porn [if they know about the porn] to try to CURE me.’ It’s effectively the same thing as what’s actually going on. Perhaps vaguely more upsetting in terms of hope snuffing but hopefully will keep people from further pressure. I don’t think betas DESERVE what they get (or, at least, I recognise that it is wrong to feel that they do).

    pez: “This doen’t seem to fit from someone who just yesterday gave the advice of referring to women as “bitches and dirty whores”
    roissy is veering on madness and doublethink: silliness underlying seriousness underlying hyperbole. His writing’s
    strange brilliance and he can be unpredictable. I think it’s why people want to see what happens when it’s a book.

    Jay Gatsby: Strange that you’re not quoting out of Art of Seduction considering the topic? Do you reckon 48 Laws is ironically much more relevant?

    Sara: ‘Asking her first’ is the path to boringness. Roissy’s qualified what he said with talking about being considerate. It appears to be genuinely thoughtful and taking into account all the possibilities. A real man does not have to ask, because he’s learned enough to know and prepare without having to explicitly and lazily ask.

    I agree with the danger of The Backfire:
    ‘We’re going skiing and I’ve packed lots of nice, warm wool clothes for you!’
    ‘I’m allergic to wool.’

    Can you account for everything?

    A lot of ‘tips’ can backfire if they’re done wrongly and thoughtlessly. If you rely on observation, you have to observe well.

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  63. on April 14, 2009 at 3:37 pm z

    Mad Men is kind of a left-wing revisionist history of the early 1960’s.

    Left-wingers describe the past in the worst terms possible because they are well aware the present they have helped create is increasingly becoming a misery for most people.

    The former HBO series, Deadwood, was a similar slandering of the simple, extrodinarily hard-working folk of the old West.

    Beware of those who are attempting to cast aspersions on your ancestors history, they are preparing to mind-fuck you with a guilt trip. Mad Men is a feminists dream-series where women tell themselves that their grandmoms were raped and truly sexually harrassed at work, and were useful only to pour drinks, light cigarrettes and to drink cumshots of executives over them, and their own husbands were doing the same things with the ladies at his own office and how Bella Abzug, Betty Friedan, Andrea Dworkin, Catherine MacKinnon, Naomi Wolfe, Gloria Steinem, and Hanoi Jane saved them from similar fates.

    I suppose next weenie producers (like Deadwood’s David Milch and Mad Men’s Mathew Weiner) will come up with a series depicting revolutionary war generals like George Washington molesting teenaged ammunition boys while founding the country. Don’t believe it. It is propaganda, denigrating YOUR past.

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  64. on April 14, 2009 at 3:37 pm Sara I

    Here’s the thing, kids, if I might be allowed to “ruin” this enthralling post even further; Roissy is taking the role of LTR relationship advisor and his relationship with the date switcher-ee has ended. A man doesn’t view an aborted relationship as a failure, but most feminine women do. So why did it end? Did she break up with roissy? One can hardly imagine that, I suppose. Did he break up with her? Did they just “drift” apart? What happened to his game after the weekend trip? What about her game?

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  65. on April 14, 2009 at 3:41 pm Bhetti

    lurker: you’re such a sweetheart, bless. True Love and romance, you know these concepts well.

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  66. on April 14, 2009 at 3:42 pm Bhetti

    Sara: Ain’t an ex-smoker the best person to tell you ‘don’t smoke’?

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  67. on April 14, 2009 at 3:46 pm pcbpiper

    The former HBO series, Deadwood, was a similar slandering of the simple, extrodinarily hard-working folk of the old West.

    Yeah, people in the West who squatted on Indian lands they had no right to were saintly people who never swore, stole, or killed.

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  68. on April 14, 2009 at 3:47 pm Gunslingergregi

    Kind of like clint eastwood in outlaw josey wales when he goes to the indians and says he just wants them to have life and him to have life. Or they can have death and he can have death. It is this insignifigance of life that actually made life the meaningfull choice for all those involved in the situation. The chief saying because obviously his words of death were true than his words of life were also true. And it shall be life. In the same way a woman will understand you words of death are true so she can believe in your words of life. You are a man.

    These are things you should think about as a man for they may indeed come up.

    I got to experience this and see if my word of death was true. I called my family back home and told them good bye and went out the door singing my death song. This proved my words of death where true therefore my woman knows my words of life forever are also true. I am still here the “indians”chose life and I was forever changed.

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  69. on April 14, 2009 at 3:49 pm Sara I

    Bhetti

    Sara: ‘Asking her first’ is the path to boringness. Roissy’s qualified what he said with talking about being considerate. It appears to be genuinely thoughtful and taking into account all the possibilities. A real man does not have to ask, because he’s learned enough to know and prepare without having to explicitly and lazily ask.

    I definitely disagree with this. “A real man doesn’t have to ask”? Are real men mind readers now? I repeat: As a “real” man he TELLS her what HE wants, then asks how she feels about it. It
    DOES NOT mean he will change what he does or wants if she DOES not feel good about what he wants or does. Is anyone getting this? Am I the only feminine woman here? If a man just CARES that is ALL that is required!!!!

    That does not make him a doormat unless he KOWTOWS to her and is then not true to himself. She can then do whatever she wants with the scenario but if she’s a healthy woman she will respect him for being true to himself and caring for her at the same time. This takes intelligence, i.e. using both halves of the brain which is a dying art form at least one would think from reading roissy.

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  70. on April 14, 2009 at 3:51 pm Bhetti

    Sara: I’m not saying he’s going to be a doormat for asking. But it’s really sad to imply that a man can never surprise a woman because he has to ask, instead of actually knowing her well enough to be sufficiently confident about how to make her happy.

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  71. on April 14, 2009 at 3:52 pm chicnoir

    @z- So you think there was no sexual harassment during that period? You do know that it wasn’t normal in the 50’s for a marriage to have a don’t ask don’t tell policy concerning the husband’s outside activities?

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  72. on April 14, 2009 at 3:52 pm Seeking Alpha

    Sara – It doesn’t take a mind reader to know what someone you’ve been with for a long time wants. If you did it all the time, it might get annoying, but every once in awhile is spontaneous and fun. You don’t sound ‘feminine’, you just sound difficult. No fun. How does that mesh with the spirits of the earth Sara?

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  73. on April 14, 2009 at 3:53 pm lurker

    “pcbpiper”
    —I love when the SWPLers defend the Indians as saintly people, then you look back and realize they were killing and robbing and murdering and raping for land/territory/power/riches/women just like everyone else.

    Mad Men fetishizes the 1960s as well as denigrates it. SWPL women swoon over draper because he is what a man is, rather than what a hipster-beta is.

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  74. on April 14, 2009 at 3:55 pm Anony

    roissy, you didn’t tell us your uncle’s Japanese.

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  75. on April 14, 2009 at 3:55 pm Anonymous

    roissy, you didn’t tell us your uncle’s Japanese.

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  76. on April 14, 2009 at 3:56 pm lurker

    chicnoir, you’re reading the betty friedan again, huh?

    No, it wasn’t. Men, by and large, didn’t cheat, because they would have felt obligated as men to do their duty and take care of the other kids. Even black men. And their families would ahve certainly enforced that as well.

    Quite frankly, men had their balls drained by their wives as well, since women were taught to give it up to the husband when he wanted it, just as his duty was to fork over the paycheck.

    It was the lesbian-man haters who started the sex strikes/women away from home working and can’t give it up and ruining the home mentality that led us to the obama hell we find ourselves in.

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  77. on April 14, 2009 at 3:56 pm pcbpiper

    Lurker,

    I hope you’re more capable of comprehension than to misinterpret my statement mocking z’s opinion as claiming the Indians were saintly.

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  78. on April 14, 2009 at 3:58 pm biktopia

    Ok, back to this topic.
    it hardly puts my imagination on fire,
    I am getting advice here from someone that drinks wine but advertise water.

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  79. on April 14, 2009 at 3:59 pm David Alexander

    You could always go with ‘I’m gay but due to my religious beliefs, I refuse to act on this.

    The problem with faking gay with family is that it would support their original theories as to why I was single, and I’d have to deal with some family members who’d try and get me to act out on my supposed homosexuality while others would hate me and want nothing to do with me. In other words, it would be familial nightmare.

    And they have no idea about the porn. Only my friends know about the “500 GB collection”. Despite the large porn collection (where older files are piling up and sitting unused), I have a male friend who thinks my lack of interest in going out to meet women is a really repressed homosexuality, and any attempt to disprove this has generally failed.

    If I had the money, I’d pay some white girl of Craigslist to pretend to be my girlfriend just to throw off everybody…

    It’s effectively the same thing as what’s actually going on.

    Explain further?

    I don’t think betas DESERVE what they get

    Sadly, since most men are unaware of their unattractiveness to women, one may feel sorry for them, but that simply means that we should simply expose to men at a young age that they are and will always be unattractive to women.

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  80. on April 14, 2009 at 4:02 pm Anonymous

    —I love when the SWPLers defend the Indians as saintly people, then you look back and realize they were killing and robbing and murdering and raping for land/territory/power/riches/women just like everyone else.

    pcb never said the indians were angels who did nothing wrong. he’s just questioning the previous commenter’s notion that white men of the west were just simple hardworking folk who never bothered anybody. your “the other side is bad too” stock retort doesn’t work as a response.

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  81. on April 14, 2009 at 4:02 pm Bhetti

    Biktopia: That was really disturbing. I couldn’t stop myself watching.

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  82. on April 14, 2009 at 4:02 pm Anonymous

    oops, too late, i see pcb already pointed out lurker’s poor reading comprehension.

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  83. on April 14, 2009 at 4:05 pm Gunslingergregi

    It has got to be really hard to just live every day with the same woman. Just a normal life. I guess everyone needs a dream. Hard to figure out. What if you never get to experience transcendant situations. What if you are never tested. Altough when she met me at the door each day when I came home from work it was transcendant to see the excited look on her face that her man was home. How you keep that alive will be some work dam. I think why I come here to get ready for the next phase. It is easier to keep an ideal vision than to go and live reality maybe. I will see if possible to make the daily reality the ideal.

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  84. on April 14, 2009 at 4:07 pm Obsidian

    I fail to see what intra-Indian beefs etc have to do with the fact that White folk did indeed damn wiped out the Indians. Can’t both be true?

    O

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  85. on April 14, 2009 at 4:09 pm Bhetti

    DA: fair enough about the familial madness.

    Beta isn’t an incurable disease or some sort of permanent gene. Beta traits change according to location or mood (are you at work, with family, with friends?). Tendency to beta does disappear off with increasing age naturally.

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  86. on April 14, 2009 at 4:12 pm Game in BK

    Cannon’s Canon

    email me at
    game_in_bk@yahoo.com

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  87. on April 14, 2009 at 4:15 pm biktopia

    Bhetti.
    Yes it’s a sad little film.

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  88. on April 14, 2009 at 4:15 pm lurker

    “I hope you’re more capable of comprehension than to misinterpret my statement mocking z’s opinion as claiming the Indians were saintly.”

    —eejits. In attacking the settlement of the west, SWPLers and race hustlers always like to talk about “wiping out the Indians” and imply the saintliness of the Indian tribes by contrasting them to the “evil” white man.

    Basically, this was a fight over land, and over ways of life. Indians wanted to continue mostly hunter gatherer socieities or small-scale communities; whites wanted the urban-farming civilization we have today. Both “fought” over lands, and Indians would have gladly done the same to whtie civilization if possible.

    Missionaries attempted to bring Indians into the western fold, but the Indians were set in their ways. This wasn’t a conquest so much as it was ways of life squaring off; the western-urban-farming mode could not survive next to a hunter-gatherer and vice versa. something had to die off.

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  89. on April 14, 2009 at 4:16 pm Obsidian

    Betti,
    I’m sure you know this by now, I hope, but Dave Alex has zero intention to even try to change, and sees this and related venues as avenues to gain attention in a shameless way. Its you’re right to give him such attention but you should be advised as to what purpose its going.

    Oh, and I agree with you, the idea that a Dave Alex simply cannot do better in his love life is utterly absurd. He simply is too lazy to want to do better.

    O

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  90. on April 14, 2009 at 4:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    Really got to hand it to married guys who are faithful to an extent they are pretty strong. I mean I did allow my first marriage to go into mediocraty (didn’t cheat). You do have to pretty much every day analyze what is going on. I just think it hurt that I was lied to on the first one and thought she was with the get rich program. Maybe a first test long term ltr is good in a way you can make mistakes and learn what they are. On the other hand if the first ltr was the last ltr you would have to make it work out together and eventually probably would figure it out.

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  91. on April 14, 2009 at 4:18 pm z

    Chicnoir

    Talk to your grandparents about life back in the 50’s and 60’s. I remember my grandmother telling me that she didn’t like “rock n’ roll” because she thought it was “vulgar” and that a “foul toungue” was the sign that someone was “not right with Jesus”.

    These people went to church every single Sunday Chic. My grandad did smoke (the one thing Mad Men is half-assed accurate about…………….people DID smoke a lot back then) , but rarely drank. Both grandads had three kids and worked 50+ hours a week, staying late every night and usually going in for several hours on Saturdays. These men were not “cheaters”, nor did they paw the women at the office, they were far too religious and faithful, (and BUSY) for that.

    As for the other remark……………………………Indians weren’t much of the plot in Deadwood, a little mining town, where desperate people came to mine a mountain looking for a better life than the grinding poverty that they came from. It wouldn’t make much sense for these people to blow their money on whores atop a saloon after drinking firewater night after night, but that is what the show depicts. Lemme see……………………..work from daylight-till-dark, and then go drink booze and whore fuck night after night. Sure, thats how those people got ahead and provided for their families year-after-year. Its best to READ about the past from non-partisan voices that were there, and even better yet TALK to YOUR GRANDPARENTS to find out what it was really like back then. We usually only get the lives of the loud or wealthy or criminal from the past, much as we get the lives of the knights and barons and kings of the middle ages, but most folk were nearly peasants and merchants and craftsmen, working hard to eek out an existence for their brood. You dont hear their stories. As for the “poor Indians”, lemme tell you something——-if it wasn’t us it would have been the Russians or the Chinese or the Japanese. They had fallen behind militarily and didn’t even have metal when we found them, literally living in the stone age. That is a vacum, and we know how history responds to a vacum. Militarily stronger people have ALWAYS swooped in and took land from militarily weaker people, and its still going on. The Chinese and Russians would have been even crueler than we were, and I sincerely doubt they would have not only wiped them out, but erased them from history and history books under the Communists later, not wanting to even admit a mistake. Ever hear of how the Japanese have treated the Aniu (hairy aniu…….the ‘hairy’ Asiatic people who PREDATED them on that Island). Pretty terribly.

    John F. Kennedy might have behaved like Don Draper, but the guys at the office, most of whom were married with 2-3 kids, didn’t have that luxury. Actually, most of them went to mass or went to church. Reports of numerous affairs in the past are greatly exaggerated. The old America died slowly in the seventies and by the nineties was pretty much gone to the post-modernism of today.

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  92. on April 14, 2009 at 4:19 pm dougjnn

    Obsidian–

    have to do with the fact that White folk did indeed damn wiped out the Indians. Can’t both be true?

    We found innumerable wars with them, and by and large, we won. Too, too bad for the Indians.

    Though overwhelmingly what killed off so many of the N.American Indians were Eurasian diseases for which they had virtually no resistance. The evidence for this is overwhelming.

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  93. on April 14, 2009 at 4:19 pm Traveller

    Z –

    Classic Westerns provide us with a very different and vastly more nuanced portrait of the American West. For example, a film like William S. Hart’s tremendous HELL’S HINGES demonstrates both sides of the saintly pioneer/land stealing racists dichotomy. Hart stars as a lawless outlaw who is essentially “tamed” by a good woman and in turn becomes a model citizen (this is the plot model of nearly every Hart film, HELL’S HINGES though is very clearly the best), while the frontier preacher sent to the town drowns himself in hedonistic debauchery and burns down his own church. From 1916 – Hart himself actually remembered the period well and was fluent in American Indian hand signs.

    However, it was John Ford who probably best elaborated what you’ve written above in his film THE MAN WHO SHOT LIBERTY VALANCE. He understood that real history is itself too messy, ugly, and complex to be fully understood and appreciated. Instead, we prefer comforting falsehoods (“…print the legend…”) to give ourselves a collective identity. In this way, he essentially rejects the veracity of nearly the whole of his Western filmmography – but confirms their ability to inspire and unite.

    pcbpiper –

    “Yeah, people in the West who squatted on Indian lands they had no right to were saintly people who never swore, stole, or killed.”

    For an interesting take on this from a Classic Hollywood perspective, I’d strongly recommend Anthony Mann’s tremendous THE DEVIL’S DOORWAY from 1950. On that note, see all of Mann’s 1950s Westerns, they are superb and morally complex in the extreme (my favorite is THE MAN FROM LARAMIE but MAN OF THE WEST is also exceptional – to name just two).

    lurker –

    “It was the lesbian-man haters who started the sex strikes/women away from home working and can’t give it up and ruining the home mentality that led us to the obama hell we find ourselves in.”

    The idea of the “sex strike” has at least been around since the Greeks when Aristophanes satirized the Pelopponesian War in his play “Lysistrata.” Yes, a satire – but one that nonetheless confirms the powerful place of sex and the marriage role in society (Greek society being particularly repressive of female sexuality). The feminists used a tool that they knew would work.

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  94. on April 14, 2009 at 4:22 pm Anonymous

    —eejits. In attacking the settlement of the west, SWPLers and race hustlers always like to talk about “wiping out the Indians” and imply the saintliness of the Indian tribes by contrasting them to the “evil” white man.

    it’s easy to win arguments when you create strawmen at will. NO ONE SAID OR IMPLIED INDIANS WERE SAINTLY, STUPID. your problem is you can only argue using talking points and can’t figure out when they don’t apply to a particular discussion

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  95. on April 14, 2009 at 4:24 pm dougjnn

    Bhetti

    I learn new things every day, roissy. I am so weak for requiring oxygen.

    That’s a pretty dense reading by you Bhetti. I’m surprised.

    What Roissy was doing of course was equating women’s need for gossipy “friends” with her need for oxygen.

    Got it now?

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  96. on April 14, 2009 at 4:25 pm Obsidian

    Doug,
    Before the howling starts, I’m not making any value judgments here; all I’m asking is, why can’t we recognize both, that the Indians fought nastily amongst themselves, and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find? Why can’t both be true, and leave it at that?

    O

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  97. on April 14, 2009 at 4:32 pm Gunslingergregi

    don’t fall for it doug lol

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  98. on April 14, 2009 at 4:33 pm Gunslingergregi

    Hey I am taking a trip to philly next month lets hang out

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  99. on April 14, 2009 at 4:36 pm dougjnn

    Bhetti

    Sara: ‘Asking her first’ is the path to boringness. Roissy’s qualified what he said with talking about being considerate. It appears to be genuinely thoughtful and taking into account all the possibilities. A real man does not have to ask, because he’s learned enough to know and prepare without having to explicitly and lazily ask.

    Exactly.

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  100. on April 14, 2009 at 4:45 pm dougjnn

    Obsidian

    and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find?

    That’s the leftist cartoon for what happened, not what actually did, most of the time. Whites mostly sought to co-exist with Indians, day in and day out. But they were always land hungry. Settlers were always moving into land that seemed to them belonged to no one. Indians could tolerate some of this but after awhile younger hotheads got pissed and massacred some white settle families. They in turn raised a militia or called one in and so on and so forth. Indian wars were absolutely endemic until they ground to a halt in the 1880s.

    The myth of the peaceful Indian is complete horseshiit — though there were tribes that decided to pursue that strategy. There were also tribes that had always tended to be more that way. And tribes that were extradordinarily cruel to their captives, AmerIndian or white, skinning them alive (the Great Lakes Hurons customarily did that.)

    The whole point of the peaceful natural Indian is both as the embodyment right here of the “noble savage” of Enlightenment myth and delight, and as the VICTIM of white genocide and outrage.

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  101. on April 14, 2009 at 4:45 pm David Alexander

    Beta isn’t an incurable disease or some sort of permanent gene.

    Judging from the dynamics of my father and my uncle, I’d argue that it is a permanent gene. My dad has that beta provider instinct, and he’s much warmer and more personable than my uncle who’s harsher, more crude, and reeks of that gamer/player vibe. Even my dad has openly admitted that if he was more like my uncle, he probably would have had more sex in his pre-married days back in Haiti.

    Beta traits change according to location or mood

    From what I’ve seen from my own life, I’m probably just as quiet and betaish when I’m angry primarily out of fear of scaring people (and fulfilling bad stereotypes) and over-reacting.

    He simply is too lazy to want to do better.

    Damn straight. I don’t even bother to even go out and meet women and ask them out on dates. It’s just easier to nothing.

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  102. on April 14, 2009 at 4:47 pm Seeking Alpha

    Doug,
    Before the howling starts, I’m not making any value judgments here; all I’m asking is, why can’t we recognize both, that the Indians fought nastily amongst themselves, and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find? Why can’t both be true, and leave it at that?

    O

    Cause that’s not the case. The Indian’s didn’t just fight nastily amongst themselves. They fought nastily against the ‘White Man’ too. And the ‘White Man’ didn’t go out LOOKING for Indians to kill.

    Don’t worry… slavery is still wrong, even if the White Man isn’t the devil to all people.

    LikeLike


  103. on April 14, 2009 at 4:47 pm ASDF

    Obsidian:

    all I’m asking is, why can’t we recognize both, that the Indians fought nastily amongst themselves, and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find? Why can’t both be true, and leave it at that?

    Both are true, but leftists can’t just leave it at that. They subscribe to the myth of the noble savage, and constantly get on our case for coming out on top.

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  104. on April 14, 2009 at 4:52 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Damn straight. I don’t even bother to even go out and meet women and ask them out on dates. It’s just easier to nothing.

    Face the TRUTH DA.

    That’s just the rationalizatiosn you tell yourself.

    You’re real problem is FEAR OF REJECTION.

    You use everything else (women screwed by feminism, women who use beta’s as providers, the superior attractiveness of porn stars vs. regular women etc.) as excuses and rationalizations for you to face your real fear:

    Female rejection.

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  105. on April 14, 2009 at 4:55 pm Bhetti

    doug: I knew what he meant but that’s not what he wrote. Since the book deal’s happening any day now, criticising his writing seems like a fun little exercise.

    It was a bit silly, however. I’m just such a gibbering wreck today because of you ignoring my serious offer of sending you pics and overanalysing the appropriateness of doing it. They’re not that frightening!

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  106. on April 14, 2009 at 5:03 pm Obsidian

    Seeking Alpha, ASDF,
    All I’m simply saying is that this notion that the Indians or the White Man have to be all bad/good is infantile. Even the most casual reading of history says otherwise.

    Indians fought brutal wars amongst themselves, and when the White Man came along (and screwed them over on the many, many treaties I might add), fought viciously against them, too. The White Man, at turns, treated Indians well and harshly, nearly wiping them out genocidal style ultimately.

    Whether one thinks this is god or bad on either side is not my concern. What is my concern, is getting the facts right as best I can. And based on that, both Indians and White Men have no lock on being angles or devils.

    I neither romanticize the Red Man, nor do I vilify endlessly, the White Man. Both have their fair share of dirt.

    O

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  107. on April 14, 2009 at 5:04 pm David on ipod

    Yes it is easier to stay at home than to go deal with normal people who will say no for various reasons. So yes everything is a proxy for avoiding rejection whether in the short or long term.

    LikeLike


  108. on April 14, 2009 at 5:04 pm Bhetti

    DA: I’ve seen you being a non-beta right here, with your classic ‘Fuck you(r) *insert person or ideology here* ‘ moments.

    LikeLike


  109. on April 14, 2009 at 5:04 pm maurice

    Don Draper is awesome – and the show is very interesting, despite its flaws. I’m hooked and can’t wait for season 3 later this year. The coolest thing about Don, even including his obvious Alpha status and tragic-hero character arch, is that he is *totally* self invented – he literally walked away from his past as an abused farm boy and created himself in an idealized form. That’s even more impressive than picking up women all the time. Also, as one reader noted, his attitude towards women is more complicated than it would seem – he has relationships as well as flings, and is drawn towards independent, accomplished women (Midge, Rachel, Barrett) – alpha females, bascially – who are the opposite of his wife.

    Vika – that short is a classic – I saw it years ago and had forgotten about it. Also, Rommel was the desert fox, not Himmler. And that dude in the bar was probably just gaming you – keeping his options open despite the other chick. After all, you pinched his ass, and so opened yourself up for his attention. Who was hotter, by the way – you or her?

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  110. on April 14, 2009 at 5:07 pm dougjnn

    Backdoor Man

    We walked into the sweets shop, and I announced to the girls behind the counter that we probably weren’t going to buy anything, because my wife was behaving badly. As always, this caused my wife to giggle, and it got the shop girls’ attention. I then start flirting with the girls, making fun of them and joking about the merchandise (I’m blonde and blue-eyed, with native-level Spanish and an accent that most Latin Americans recognize as Colombian…this attracts women, but also confuses them). My wife immediately cheers up, and starts joining me in the game.

    That’s a very fun story. Your whole post was.

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  111. on April 14, 2009 at 5:07 pm Thursday

    The White Man, at turns, treated Indians well and harshly, nearly wiping them out genocidal style ultimately.

    Most of the loss of life among natives was due to their lack of resistance to European diseases, not any deliberate effort to wipe them out. Contrast Africa, where it was the white man who was driven out by disease.

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  112. on April 14, 2009 at 5:11 pm chicnoir

    Traveller The idea of the “sex strike” has at least been around since the Greeks
    You beat me to it. I would add that there was a similar strike in Liberia recently.

    Lurker No, it wasn’t. Men, by and large, didn’t cheat, because they would have felt obligated as men to do their duty and take care of the other kids.

    hangers and the rhythm method.

    Quite frankly, men had their balls drained by their wives as well, since women were taught to give it up to the husband when he wanted it,

    Not always. Men during that time frequently looked at some acts (the mouth the mouth) as things a wife should not do. Women of the night, not the drug addicts that we have now, were commonly used for such things.

    FYI, you come across as very bitter. Lighten up a little pal.

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  113. on April 14, 2009 at 5:13 pm Anonymous

    Both are true, but leftists can’t just leave it at that.

    no, it’s the nationalists who can’t “just leave it at that.” notice how NO ONE in the thread said the indians were saintly until nationalists made argument first. not one. no one said they are noble savages. the only assertion made was that it’s not liberal propaganda to say that white people in the old west were not peace loving saints who were just minding their own business. no one even said they were evil, just that they weren’t the innocent saints z claims.

    but nationalists can’t leave it at that. first they gotta create a strawman by inferring people making a “noble savages” or “saintly indian” argument where their not. then spend rest of the thread debunking the argument you never made, while using the usual talkin point terms like swpl lefty etc

    the nationalists introduced the noble savage element to the discussion not anyone else. they are the ones who “can’t just leave it at that.” they believe any sentiment that don’t actively celebrate them must therefore be attacking them and always wig out. you guys create and introduce your own strawmen, then blame the other side for bringing it into the discussion. very strange people you are.

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  114. on April 14, 2009 at 5:13 pm dougjnn

    Bhetti

    It was a bit silly, however. I’m just such a gibbering wreck today because of you ignoring my serious offer of sending you pics and overanalysing the appropriateness of doing it. They’re not that frightening!

    I didn’t think you were serious. Of course you can sweetheart. And of course I’ll treat it as completely private, never to be seen by anyone but me.

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  115. on April 14, 2009 at 5:16 pm chicnoir

    It wouldn’t make much sense for these people to blow their money on whores atop a saloon after drinking firewater night after night, but that is what the show depicts
    I haven’t watched this show so I can’t really say much about it.
    but… I’m sure some of that money being blowed on women of the night was for female companionship as much as for any between the sheets. Even those HBO specials about prostitutes, the working girls say as much.
    Nymag recently had a story about dance clubs where Hispanic men go to dance and talk with women because many of them are very lonely. As badly as some of you treat us, you seem to not fair very well without us. Women on the other hand, seem to do a lot better without a man.* The only thing that bugs women about not having a man is the fact that other people like to comment on it. If I had a dollar for every time someone can’t believe that I don’t have a boyfriend or tells me but “but your so pretty”, “your such a pleasant young lady” etc…
    I can recall coming across a few studies which pointed out that single men measure at the bottom of the heap when it comes to both mental and physical health.

    *That’s not bragging that just the truth.

    Lemme see……………………..work from daylight-till-dark, and then go drink booze and whore fuck night after night

    Z, it wouldn’t be entertaining if they didn’t 🙂

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  116. on April 14, 2009 at 5:18 pm chicnoir

    Z Talk to your grandparents about life back in the 50’s and 60’s
    I have Z, and I’ve quoted them a bit here. I even have a few great- grandparents around and I’ve learned a lot from them.

    I remember my grandmother telling me that she didn’t like “rock n’ roll” because she thought it was “vulgar” and that a “foul toungue” was the sign that someone was “not right with Jesus”.
    I’ve heard the same thing especially towards blues music.
    These men were not “cheaters”, nor did they paw the women at the office, they were far too religious and faithful, (and BUSY) for that
    Z, don’t fall for the okey doke being “religious” does not make one an angel. Even the devil knows there is a God. Plenty of men did their dirt on Saturday night and went to church on Sunday.

    

    Its best to READ about the past from non-partisan voices that were there, and even better yet TALK to YOUR GRANDPARENTS to find out what it was really like back then I agree 100% but keep in mind that all human beings have biases and it’s difficult for even most honest of us to keep them in check.

    We usually only get the lives of the loud or wealthy or criminal from the past, much as we get the lives of the knights and barons and kings of the middle ages, but most folk were nearly peasants and merchants and craftsmen, working hard to eek out an existence for their brood
    Another good point.

    They had fallen behind militarily and didn’t even have metal when we found them, literally living in the stone age
    If they were happy living in the stonge age then let them be. That goes for any other small tribe found living as “we” did hundreds of years ago.

    if it wasn’t us it would have been the Russians or the Chinese or the Japanese
    Still a bad thing. It doesn’t matter who/whom is guilty of the crime. Would the holocaust been any less horrific if the Japanese were in charge? Hell no!

    Militarily stronger people INSERTmen have ALWAYS swooped in and took land from militarily weaker people, and its still going on.
    Men

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  117. on April 14, 2009 at 5:18 pm Obsidian

    Thursday,
    Yup, European diseases did a job on the Indians, we all know that but that doesn’t negate what I said above: the White Man did indeed damn near drive the Indians into extinction. There’s simply no getting around this fact, and it doesn’t reflect well on those who try to gloss it over or say “well, the Indians were bad, too!”, or, as you and Doug have done, try to put the diminishing of Indian numbers solely at the feet of alien disease. Again: w/o a doubt, it played a profound role. But so did the wilful and deliberate acts of the White Man in the New World.

    Btw, checkout We Shall Remain on PBS. Good stuff.

    O

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  118. on April 14, 2009 at 5:21 pm chicnoir

    MU why can’t we recognize both, that the Indians fought nastily amongst themselves, and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find? Why can’t both be true, and leave it at that?

    Mu, that’s the way it was taught to me in school so I don’t understand what the problem is?

    Then again I think I do but I’ll leave it alone unless someone wants me to post about it.

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  119. on April 14, 2009 at 5:24 pm chicnoir

    seeking alpha

    YOu dare show your face in these parts again????

    You trader!!!!

    J/k

    LikeLike


  120. on April 14, 2009 at 5:28 pm Obsidian

    Anonymous,
    RIGHT ON. Excellent points, and makes one wonder, hmm, guilty conscience much?

    O

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  121. on April 14, 2009 at 5:33 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Women on the other hand, seem to do a lot better without a man.*

    Chic, this is a typical fallacy based on gender conceit. I’ve read and seen plenty of men that make the exact same case you just did, and they can offer just as much justifications and rationalizations as you can.

    Men and women will often tell themselves they don’t need someone of the opposite gender to justify or rationalize their relationship failures.

    We as a species were designed to compliment each other.

    Men NEED women…and women NEED men. Denying this is simply denying nature.

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  122. on April 14, 2009 at 5:44 pm Kthulah

    Sara says, “Roissy, your date switcheroo would not go over with many women.”

    I have to disagree somewhat. I’d have been okay with it, and if he forgot something that wasn’t absolutely essential (like my shea butter) then we’d get some there or on the way or something. I’d probably rattle off a did-you-remember-my____ list, but that’s about all the protesting I’d do.

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  123. on April 14, 2009 at 5:45 pm Bhetti

    doug: Maybe not a gibbering wreck! You can find my e-mail here so that I know who to send it to.

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  124. on April 14, 2009 at 5:47 pm Bhetti

    Dave: I could agree with your statement better if you said “Women need men like me”. Choose what type of women men need yourself!

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  125. on April 14, 2009 at 5:47 pm dougjnn

    Chic Noir

    MU why can’t we recognize both, that the Indians fought nastily amongst themselves, and that the White Man took out as many Indians as he could find? Why can’t both be true, and leave it at that?

    Mu, that’s the way it was taught to me in school so I don’t understand what the problem is?

    The problem is that that’s leftist propaganda and not true.

    White men very rarely took out as many Indians as they could find, except of course Indian warriors during Indian wars or skirmishes. There was never any widespread genocide effort against Indians among whites, though there were frequent genocidal fantasies among some Indian groups. As well, the fight was by no means one sided most of the time. Sometimes whites had a big weapons advantage, but sometimes they didn’t. (One of the principal trade goods Indians got for their furs, etc. was guns.) The main reason the whites kept winning was far better wide scale organization and unity.

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  126. on April 14, 2009 at 5:57 pm Obsidian

    Chic’s made a few comments that I’d like to respond to, if I may.

    Women are the socializers of Men, this fact should be deeply understood. This is one of the reasons why Marriage is so profound; we all know some guy who used to run around w/a lampshade on his head who got married and straightened out in a major way. I know marriage is greatly frowned upon in these parts, and to be sure, I’ve voiced my concerns as well. But if I’m gonna be honest, I’d have to say that its been a big benefit to a goodly number of Men, and Chic’s point about what happens when you have large numbers of unsocialized, non attached romantically, Males, is frightening.

    As to the whole question of whether Women really are better off w/o marriage, very interesting question. I would say that she can compensate provided she has a support social circle of friends and possibly family to fill the void, which is usually the case w/most Women. As for sexual needs, well for the most part, Women just don’t have the kind of driving sexual impulse that most Men have. So, Chich may indeed be onto something there-afterall, Men always alays remarry after getting a divorce, whereas not so much for Women.

    On the question of “sex strikes”-one very interesting question that comes up for me, in this age of obstensible “rights” of gay folk to marry, is this:

    What rights does a Married Man have?

    Think about that question for a moment. If you’ve never heard it before, or if it sounds strange or odd to you, there’s a reason for it. It would seem that the last person’s rights to have been asserted or even recognized, is the Man’s especially in this area.

    I often like to conduct socia experiments. Many of you know that. Well, when I’m feeling in a particularly mischevious mood, I’ll go up to a group of ladies and simply ask this question, especially if they’re already talking about Men and relationships anyway.

    The responses, or the lack thereof, is striking.

    Women in our time simply expect for them to have rights in a Marriage, and for the State to move in to protect and assert/evoke said rights. No such discourse is to be heard insofar as Men are concerned.

    And that is not fair.

    So, we come to the sex strike issue. If it were true back in the day, that a wife was expected to perfomr her “Wifely Duties” it certainly ain’t true anymore; the very idea is anathema to the vast majority of Women, and most see it more as a kind of special treat that they get to dole out unilaterally, rather than one of the things you do to keep your spouse happy. Quite as its kept, the many sexless marriages that exist today, do so because the wifey simply decided that sex was no longer necessary, and that’s it. This often happens after kids are born, but it can happen at other times as well. And, of course, with the Feminization of the Culture taking root for at least a generation or so, lots of Men take it. Lying down.

    I’ll hold here. Holla back

    O

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  127. on April 14, 2009 at 5:58 pm roissy

    ob belching PC agitprop:
    Yup, European diseases did a job on the Indians, we all know that but that doesn’t negate what I said above: the White Man did indeed damn near drive the Indians into extinction.

    intention matters. if european diseases were responsible for most of the indian deaths, then it follows that the white man did not drive the indians to near extinction. they killed some (many in heated battles) but ultimately the main cause belongs to non-human actors.

    Excellent points, and makes one wonder, hmm, guilty conscience much?

    speaking for myself, i have zero guilt over american frontiersmen winning decisively against the indian enemy. my rationale is clear: had the indians won, there would never have been a glorious america and i wouldn’t be here. either this land would still be dotted with teepees or some other world power would have settled the expanse.
    in the words of a truly amoral sonofabitch (that’s me):
    may the best culture win.

    chiclet:
    YOu dare show your face in these parts again????

    playing “let’s you and him fight”? i have nothing but contempt for you, chiclet. your personality is grating, your thinking is muddled, and your banal suckass PC afrophile conformity is the dull edge of a plastic spork. you are the comment i shouldn’t have read.

    You trader!!!!

    the word is traitor.

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  128. on April 14, 2009 at 6:07 pm chicnoir

    http://nymag.com/news/features/52013/

    ^^^^This is the link for that article about the dollar dances. Very interesting stuff and speaks about men and their need for female affection and hero worship.

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  129. on April 14, 2009 at 6:09 pm chicnoir

    Roissy playing “let’s you and him fight”? i have nothing but contempt for you, chiclet. your personality is grating, your thinking is muddled, and your banal suckass PC afrophile conformity is the dull edge of a plastic spork. you are the comment i shouldn’t have read.

    Now you know I really don’t care what you think about me. So go ahead and put me on comment moderation again.

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  130. on April 14, 2009 at 6:10 pm lurker

    chic, being her typical cuntish self:
    “hangers and the rhythm method.”

    —Ah, the old feminist lies. “abortions happened all the time in the old days, don’tcha know?”

    wrong. planned parenthood planted that idea to get their numbers up. abortion was always considered a dirty, low thing that only the paris hiltons or the mega whores did. if you got pregnant, you had the kid—and gave it to an orphanage if unwanted. now, you bitches just kill

    oh, and rhythm method? only became popular in 1930, after the catholic church endorsed it (in a way).

    wrong again, bizznich.

    “Not always. Men during that time frequently looked at some acts (the mouth the mouth) as things a wife should not do. Women of the night, not the drug addicts that we have now, were commonly used for such things.”

    —–hookers were used by 1) sailors 2) unmarried young men to “get their notch” b/c normal girls didn’t put out pre-ringand 3) wealthy men. Men didn’t go out for hookers or strange en masse; only a tiny percentage (1-2% did).

    Wrong again, feminist.

    “FYI, you come across as very bitter. Lighten up a little pal.”

    —I love when uptight, lying feminists start crying when someone challenges their false tales of the past. You and Roussou have a lot in commmon, except her realized he was making shit up.

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  131. on April 14, 2009 at 6:11 pm Obsidian

    Strawman, Roissy, strawman.

    Intention matters, indeed. We clearly saw the intention of the White Man over the course of the past oh, three centuries at least, when it came to the Indians? Not that I’m saying it was right or wrong-hey, I’m as glad to be here as you-it’s just I don’t need to do the herky-knee jerky thing like you apparently do.

    Let’s try this again: yes, diseases played a profound role in doing damage to Indian folk. No doubt about it.

    It is also true that the White Man-from Miles Standish’s era to the post Civil War period, also did a job on the Indians. Some of it justified, others not.

    And no, I don’t see Indians as automatic Noble Savages. In quite a few cases, they were simply savage. Just like the Praise-the-Lord-and-Pass-the-Ammo White folk.

    Let the culture with the strongest future orientation win, indeed.

    😉

    O

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  132. on April 14, 2009 at 6:14 pm whiskey

    The noble savage and the “Magical Negro” (per Spike Lee’s essay on stuff like the Green Mile and Legend of Bagger Vance and a zillion other movies where the “magical” Black guy shows up and his entire purpose is to restore spirituality to some uptight White guy) are all too real. It is indeed the core of SWPL and the view that “authentic” (read, tribal and primitive) people of color had moral and spiritual superiority. You can see that on Travel Channel or National Geographic specials on living with some disgusting stone age tribe, or Jared Diamond’s idiot musings on the intellectual superiority of the tribes of Papua New Guinea.

    I suspect the constant competition for status among SWPL causes them to look upon idealized primitive tribes-people of different races/ethnic background and view them as “authentic.”

    Which is laughable, the “authentic” pagan and pre-Christian European tribes say the Picts, Celts, Goths, Germans, Saxons, Jute, Angles, and Vikings were pretty “flat” hierarchically, and pretty ugly too, as those things go. Which SWPL know very well, the ugly brutality of daily life informed by random, personal violence and poverty.

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  133. on April 14, 2009 at 6:22 pm Obsidian

    Whiskey,
    You make some good points-but consider this. Perhaps if Black and Red folk weren’t systematically “whitewashed” out of American history to begin with, the SWPL crowd wouldn’t have as strong a leg to stand on. Hmm? Sure, we can blame them for the Noble Negro and Noble Savage stuff, but can we blame them for the whitewashing part, too?

    I don’t think so.

    Further suggested reading: John Hope Franklin’s works.

    O

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  134. on April 14, 2009 at 6:28 pm Gunslingergregi

    It appears tender lovemaking is significantly lacking here. I guess game does not quite have all the answers. It is still hard as hell to find someone who you actually can love.

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  135. on April 14, 2009 at 6:30 pm dougjnn

    Alright you all it’s official

    Bhetti is a genuine hottie.

    LikeLike


  136. on April 14, 2009 at 6:37 pm Gunslingergregi

    gj doug way to infiltrate

    LikeLike


  137. on April 14, 2009 at 6:38 pm Sara I

    Bhetti

    Sara: I’m not saying he’s going to be a doormat for asking. But it’s really sad to imply that a man can never surprise a woman because he has to ask, instead of actually knowing her well enough to be sufficiently confident about how to make her happy.

    If he knew her well enough there probably wouldn’t have been complaints after the fact. Most bitches (myself especially) would not trust a man to know what to pack. Maybe roissy is more girly than he lets on. Did she complain later on about some item(s) she wished she had? How long were they gone? Sounds like more than one night. Sorry, I am a CONTROLLING bitch especially when it comes to my personal toilette routine. I doubt seriously if after only a few months of dating if a man would be at all capable of understanding that or be able to pack for me.

    As far as “never” surprising her? First of all always and never in transactional analysis implies taking the role of child. I love surprises but not that kind.

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  138. on April 14, 2009 at 6:46 pm Anonymous

    The noble savage and the “Magical Negro” (per Spike Lee’s essay on stuff like the Green Mile and Legend of Bagger Vance and a zillion other movies where the “magical” Black guy shows up and his entire purpose is to restore spirituality to some uptight White guy) are all too real. It is indeed the core of SWPL and the view that “authentic” (read, tribal and primitive) people of color had moral and spiritual superiority.

    we know magical negro and noble savage are real. and we know swpl types love those myths. but no non-nationalist brought that up. you are responding to argument your opponent never make inthe first place. nationalists brought that stuff up first. z said deadwood was unfair slandering of simple hardworking ppl. fine. pcbpiper pointed out that this christification of white people in the old west was silly. fine. after that came the strawman of “strawman” and “noble savages” by the nationalists. so you making this indepth post to prove noble savage and magic negro is real is a waste of time because you are jus arguing with yourself. no one here brought those concepts up except the nationalists themselves. no one implied it until the nationalists started throwing one of their tantrums and brought it up first out of nowhere.

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  139. on April 14, 2009 at 6:46 pm Bhetti

    “jacuzzis, horseback riding and candlelit dinners”? Screw my Chanel compact!

    To each her own.

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  140. on April 14, 2009 at 6:52 pm Obsidian

    Anony,
    Again, excellent point; that Herky-Knee Jerky is vicious, ain’t it?

    😉

    O

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  141. on April 14, 2009 at 6:57 pm Tupac Chopra

    Roissy/Chic:

    You trader!!!!

    the word is traitor.

    A little gold dollarsign-wearing bird tells me Seeking Alpha likes “trader” better.

    LikeLike


  142. on April 14, 2009 at 6:57 pm dougjnn

    Sara —

    Did she complain later on about some item(s) she wished she had? How long were they gone? Sounds like more than one night. Sorry, I am a CONTROLLING bitch especially when it comes to my personal toilette routine. I doubt seriously if after only a few months of dating if a man would be at all capable of understanding that or be able to pack for me.

    I would be. And I’m sure Roissy would be. He’s VERY observant of details. Or I should say I would be in the main. Might I miss some little thing? Yeah, sure.

    Would that upset a vibrant, in love with me young woman? Hell no.

    Would that upset you, by the evidence that’s quoted above? Hell yes.

    You really are seeming very tight assed, controlling and unattractive Sara.

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  143. on April 14, 2009 at 6:59 pm dougjnn

    Bhetti

    “jacuzzis, horseback riding and candlelit dinners”? Screw my Chanel compact!

    Who on earth wouldn’t chose YOU over ahem for the weekend?

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  144. on April 14, 2009 at 7:00 pm lovelysexybeauty

    Wow, what a great post. Who knew Roissy could be such a romantic? And show so much caring for a girl? (Helping her feel better in an awkward situation, praising her in front of others, planning a surprise for her – just think of all the time he spent making arrangements. What a sweeeetie!)

    Sara: it may be futile, but I am also going to try and explain why so many disagree with you that surprises are rude.

    Some people hate surprises, and hate to go through any sort of unpredicted change. Perhaps you are one of them as you sort of indicated?

    But a BUNCH of the rest of us love surprises! Especially when they are from someone we care about, who took the time to listen carefully to what we like and make a plan to make us happy without bothering us about it.

    Someone who surprises us was thinking of us when we WEREN’T there; doesn’t that mean more than if you are in their face?

    IMAGINE… someone you care about, say your mother, told you for many years that she wishes she could have a particular pastry she tried in Italy when she was young.

    Let’s say you decide one year that you will specially research the little bakery that has that pastry and have it overnight shipped for her birthday.

    Her birthday comes around, and let’s say you decide to surprise her with the sweet treat at the end of the night.

    How would you feel if she said, “What? Don’t you know I’m on a diet? How could you do that? You would’ve asked if you cared! You’re just trying to hurt me and make me look bad!”

    Asking if someone is OK, or what they want exactly, is a very female thing to do. Guys don’t get why women talk to each other so much about stuff like that, they’re just wired different. Men love to plan out things and use their problem solving skills more.

    I think men show they care MORE through actions than words. If you could be a little flexible in appreciating how men show they care, rather than expecting them to only show they care in ways you like, wouldn’t it be a little more fair? Like accept their individuality in the way you want to be accepted?

    Just wanted to share a different perspective… I understand your logic though, just don’t think it’s the best way.

    P.S. Loved this:

    >>>>>>>>>
    on April 14, 2009 at 5:33 pm Dave from Hawaii

    We as a species were designed to compliment each other.

    Men NEED women…and women NEED men. Denying this is simply denying nature.
    >>>>

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  145. on April 14, 2009 at 7:04 pm Pupu

    This is really one of the sweetest posts.

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  146. on April 14, 2009 at 7:05 pm Tupac Chopra

    Whiskey:

    I suspect the constant competition for status among SWPL causes them to look upon idealized primitive tribes-people of different races/ethnic background and view them as “authentic.”

    I always felt “Holiday in Cambodia” by The Dead Kennedys was the original anti-SWPL song:

    So you been in school
    For a year or two
    And you know you’ve seen it all
    In Daddy’s car
    Thinking you’ll go far –
    Back east your type don’t crawl

    Play ethnicky jazz
    To parade your snazz
    On your five grand stereo
    Braggin that you know
    How the niggers feel cold
    And the slums got so much soul

    It’s time to taste what you most fear
    Right Guard will not help you here
    Brace yourself, my dear

    It’s a holiday in Cambodia
    It’s tough, kid, but it’s life
    It’s a holiday in Cambodia
    Dont forget to pack a wife

    Youre a star-belly sneech
    You suck like a leach
    You want everyone to act like you
    Kiss ass while you bitch
    So you can get rich
    But your boss gets richer off you

    Well you’ll work harder
    With a gun in your back
    For a bowl of rice a day
    Slave for soldiers
    Till you starve
    Then your head is skewered on a stake

    Now you can go where people are one
    Now you can go where they “get things done”
    What you need, my son…

    Is a holiday in Cambodia
    Where people dress in black
    A holiday in Cambodia
    Where you’ll kiss ass or crack

    Pol pot, pol pot, pol pot, pol pot, etc.

    And its a holiday in Cambodia
    Where you’ll do what you’re told
    A holiday in Cambodia
    Where the slums got so much soul…

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  147. on April 14, 2009 at 7:07 pm Tupac Chopra

    gj doug way to infiltrate

    The perimeter defense perhaps, but the inner sanctum?

    Good luck cracking that nut.

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  148. on April 14, 2009 at 7:12 pm Bhetti

    Tupac: Your language has such military beauty. I’ll need to send out extra squadrons of Bitchery just to shore it all up, shall I?

    Sara: To be fair, I am the type who has no clue what to do with a Chanel compact.

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  149. on April 14, 2009 at 7:12 pm Chuck

    “The noble savage and the “Magical Negro” (per Spike Lee’s essay on stuff like the Green Mile and Legend of Bagger Vance and a zillion other movies where the “magical” Black guy shows up and his entire purpose is to restore spirituality to some uptight White guy) are all too real.”

    Whiskey:

    You forgot about Chubbs (Carl Weathers) from Happy Gilmore. He was kinda magical.

    Also, unless I completely forgot, I don’t remember Jared Diamond trying to say that the people of New Guinea are intellectually superior to us. If I remember correctly, he merely pointed out that they are superior to us in the things that get them by, like hunting and surviving in the wild.

    Without lots of help from natives, neither New Guineans or westerners could survive if thrown into those environments.

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  150. on April 14, 2009 at 7:13 pm Gunslingergregi

    lol although some will be trying the email is out..

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  151. on April 14, 2009 at 7:13 pm lady la

    With regards to surprising a woman with a new destination en route, experience says: tread carefully.

    Is she an (inexperienced?) romantic like Bhetti or a (jaded?) planner like Sara? I’m somewhere in the middle– prepared to rough it a little for romance, but peevish if he only brought my best lingerie and high heels (instead of a sports bra and real shoes) and we’re supposed to be horseback riding?

    As admirable and romantic as the impetus is, unless you are truly prepared to handle *all* the details (and how many men really, truly are??)… just don’t.

    As an alternative, a romantic weekend away is just as romantic with short notice. The woman will look hotter and feel more comfortable at the destination and the man would still get all the points for planning, execution and spontaneity

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  152. on April 14, 2009 at 7:16 pm anonymous

    @dave,

    Men and women will often tell themselves they don’t need someone of the opposite gender to justify or rationalize their relationship failures.

    We as a species were designed to compliment each other.

    Men NEED women…and women NEED men. Denying this is simply denying nature.

    I agree with this heartily for younger women. Once women have nurtured their children to independent status, however, women no longer “need” men, and many opt out of male companionship. Women support each other emotionally at that stage. Older men still benefit from female companionship.

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  153. on April 14, 2009 at 7:21 pm Chuck

    this tactic can be done on birthdays, anniversaries, or just randomly (although rarely):

    buy your woman a gift, hide it, write clues to it’s location (have fun with it, writing corny-ass poems and what-not) and take her on a scavenger hunt.

    everyone loves scavenger hunts, especially women. this provides several positives. first, you’re making her work some for the gift. you’re saying, hey i got you a gift, but you have to find it. keeps you from being viewed as a beta-provider. second, it lets her know you’re still playful, and women love that even in the most alpha of men.

    i’ve only used this once in my life. my ex, who i took on the hunt about 6 years ago, still remembers it as one of the greatest moments of our relationship, and she has used it to mask a lot of the shitty things that occured after that.

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  154. on April 14, 2009 at 7:22 pm Dave from Hawaii

    I agree with this heartily for younger women. Once women have nurtured their children to independent status, however, women no longer “need” men, and many opt out of male companionship.

    You’re right. There’s a name for these types of women:

    Crazy Cat Ladies.

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  155. on April 14, 2009 at 7:25 pm Chuck

    Tupac:

    awesome song.

    I also enjoy “California Uber Alles”, the anti-ode to Jerry Brown:

    “Zen fascists will control you
    100% natural
    You will jog for the master race
    And always wear the happy face

    Close your eyes, can’t happen here
    Big Bro’ on white horse is near
    The hippies won’t come back you say
    Mellow out or you will pay
    Mellow out or you will pay!”

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  156. on April 14, 2009 at 7:27 pm Bhetti

    I love cats. I shall have one, or several as soon as I can. I have pictures of other people’s cats on my phone.

    Inside every woman, there’s probably a Crazy Cat Lady, waiting to get out.

    Song lyrics: a socially acceptable way of loving poetry.

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  157. on April 14, 2009 at 7:27 pm Dave from Hawaii

    As admirable and romantic as the impetus is, unless you are truly prepared to handle *all* the details (and how many men really, truly are??)… just don’t.

    Thank you lady la, for helping Sara to demonstrate to men EXACTLY the kind of Red Flag attitude you need to look out for when assessing a potential woman for LTR.

    If a man takes the time to do what Roissy did, and the woman is utterly pissed off about it because you didn’t handle “ALL” the details, than RUN from her as fast as you can.

    Who the hell wants to be involved in an obsessive, compulsive, uptight control freak that is worried about how he didn’t pack her three different brands of skin cleansers and emulsifiers, and her three shades of eye liner?! Don’t you know that it’s IMPOSSIBLE to enjoy a mountain retreat unless ALL THE DETAILS HAVE BEEN ACCOUNTED FOR?!?!?!

    Some of you ladies really are fucked in the head.

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  158. on April 14, 2009 at 7:32 pm Dave from Hawaii

    I love cats. I shall have one, or several as soon as I can. I have pictures of other people’s cats on my phone.

    Inside every woman, there’s probably a Crazy Cat Lady, waiting to get out.

    Yeah…every hard charging feminist that makes it to menopause without fulfilling her reproductive role has an unmet biological imperative to nurture something.

    It’s one thing to love cats. It’s quite another to use cats as a substitute for a meaningful relationship with other human beings.

    “I don’t need a man in my life! I have my kitties!”

    Thanks to the influence of feminism, the increasing demographic trend of single, menopausal women in society have increased exponentially.

    It may be quite profitable to invest in Kitty Food and Kitty Litter stock…

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  159. on April 14, 2009 at 7:35 pm Default User

    dougjnn, Sara I, LovelySexyVixen

    Obviously a man should know if his woman likes surprises. If he can figure out which of her clothes/makeup/underwear to pack he should be able to figure out if she does not like surprises.

    I mean that is not a little detail!

    Regarding toiletries, wouldn’t she have packed those herself (she knew she was going away)? It is mostly outerwear that would be different for a new location.

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  160. on April 14, 2009 at 7:37 pm Bhetti

    Dave: Kitties are clearly alpha.

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  161. on April 14, 2009 at 7:39 pm chicnoir

    dave It’s one thing to love cats. It’s quite another to use cats as a substitute for a meaningful relationship with other human beings

    Replace cats with dogs and you are talking about a sizeable portion of young Americans. Go to any east coast upwardly mobile but youthful neighborhood and count the number of stores which caters to dogs. Some dogs eat beter than people.*

    Dave some of us just don’t want children(of our own- me). There is nothing wrong with that. It’s better if a person is cognizant of the fact that they won’t make a good parent beforehand versus bringing a child into the world that they don’t want.

    Quick question: DA, would you like to have children some day?

    *no pun

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  162. on April 14, 2009 at 7:40 pm Kthulah

    Bhetti, indeed, all cats are Dom.

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  163. on April 14, 2009 at 7:40 pm lady la

    Thing is, Dave, I’ve yet to date a man who would even be mentally willing to consider packing a woman’s bag, much less actually do it. I’m in love and in a LTR with a natural born asshole. I think he’d rather send me off for a vacation on my own than try to pack a bag for me.

    which is why I didn’t address Roissy — he’s tending to the details — rather, cautioned the average Joe. It’s a lil trickier than it looks. Esp w/o appearing beta (don’t forget the pantyliners!).

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  164. on April 14, 2009 at 7:41 pm Bhetti

    Explaining what’s alpha about cats better than I ever could.

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  165. on April 14, 2009 at 7:42 pm chicnoir

    Bhetti
    Dave: Kitties are clearly alpha.

    Agreed we have some male cat lover here. I know two hood alpha guys who are cat people. One dude even called his old lady to ask if his cat had come home in front of another hood alpha and myself.

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  166. on April 14, 2009 at 7:43 pm Bhetti

    lady la: Roissy indeed goes into Dangerous Territory where no man has ever gone before.

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  167. on April 14, 2009 at 7:44 pm chicnoir

    lady la I’m in love and in a LTR with a natural born asshole
    *rolls eyes to the sky*
    Oh lord

    Why sister why?
    Do you prefer the ahole type? Was he sweet(sorry whiskey) in the beginning?

    ?

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  168. on April 14, 2009 at 7:47 pm Bhetti

    chicnoir: Let’s assume ‘strong man’ asshole and not ‘Chris Brown’ asshole for our mutual blood pressures and sanity.

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  169. on April 14, 2009 at 7:48 pm Seeking Alpha

    You trader!!!!

    Hehe, is that ironic or just poor spelling?

    LikeLike


  170. on April 14, 2009 at 7:52 pm Bhetti

    Seeking: I saw this article and thought of you.

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  171. on April 14, 2009 at 7:53 pm chicnoir

    ’strong man’ asshole
    Like donald trump?

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  172. on April 14, 2009 at 7:56 pm chicnoir

    seeking, I was being ironic/sarcastic since you mentioned that you were a trader and I was also joking- see j/k at the end of the post. I was going to point that out to roissy but I thought why bother.

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  173. on April 14, 2009 at 7:59 pm Bhetti

    roissy’s clearly gaming you, chic.

    We all know it’s Asshole Game he’s using at the moment to reel the fishies in 😉

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  174. on April 14, 2009 at 8:00 pm Bhetti

    I know zero about Trump’s personality 😦

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  175. on April 14, 2009 at 8:01 pm chicnoir

    Bhetti roissy’s clearly gaming you, chic.

    We all know it’s Asshole Game he’s using at the moment to reel the fishies in
    HEHE sadly I’m not responsive to ahole game although there are a few males who have sucked me in a bit.

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  176. on April 14, 2009 at 8:26 pm Gunslingergregi

    Just surprized the shit out of my woman said I am coming home in a month instead of december. He He He

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  177. on April 14, 2009 at 8:33 pm Bhetti

    What, gunny, you just didn’t turn up at the doorstep?! THAT would’ve been one hell of a surprise.

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  178. on April 14, 2009 at 8:40 pm Gunslingergregi

    You are correct the real surprize is I was kidding.

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  179. on April 14, 2009 at 8:41 pm Gunslingergregi

    lol I’ll take your advice for the next one.

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  180. on April 14, 2009 at 9:41 pm lovelysexybeauty

    Hey everyone in the USA and/or similarly developed countries who hates suprise trips: did you all forget about these really cool places called STORES, where you can buy things you might forget during vacation? You can find stores in big cities and small ones too. Stores have clothes, make-up, shampoo, even feminine products… all the stuff you can find at home!

    And hey, some hotels/etc. stockpile toiletries too (and the more higher end places can arrange for much, much more than just toiletries!). Even if they don’t carry your favorite brands, you can pretend to be a Glamour/Vogue editor trying to “make do with less” in this era of belt-tightening.

    P.S. Bad girls can guilt trip guys into paying for those impromptu store visits (just as much as a surprise as his maybe) lol

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  181. on April 14, 2009 at 9:44 pm lovelysexybeauty

    P.P.S. I was trying to be tongue-in-cheek, no offense intended to anyone. (Maybe that’s too masculine of a humor style, hm…)

    Just wanted to tease some of you for being a little princessy (because I thought I was really high-maintenance but now I’m thinking I’m not that bad 😉 )

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  182. on April 14, 2009 at 9:48 pm lovelysexybeauty

    Gunslingergregi:

    On the other thread did you say you’re scared of me or something like that? How can that be… you’re the one with the gun! 😉

    P.S. Sounds like you are in the armed forces, thank you for your service to our country. Best wishes with coming home soon to see your special someone

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  183. on April 14, 2009 at 10:00 pm Max from Australia

    I would add to the list – “never forget how evil they are”

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  184. on April 14, 2009 at 10:07 pm Gunslingergregi

    I know max right they are so cute and cuddly sometimes just like a polar bear.

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  185. on April 14, 2009 at 10:13 pm lovelysexybeauty

    Gunslingergregi:

    Ah I see, that’s a very important and tough job as well so mucho respect to you again but for your unique contributions.

    Scared to lose conviction about what?

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  186. on April 14, 2009 at 10:16 pm Max from Australia

    Never put them on a pedastal. Next time you feel like helping that little old lady cross the road remember this..

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov/11/first-world-war-white-feather-cowardice

    My Grandfather had three small daughters, which saved him from conscription, and his attempt to volunteer was turned down in 1914 because he was short-sighted. But in 1916, as he walked home to south London from his office, a woman gave him a white feather (an emblem of cowardice). He enlisted the next day. By that time, they cared nothing for short sight. They just wanted a body to stop a shell, which Rifleman James Cutmore duly did in February 1918, dying of his wounds on March 28.

    My mother was nine, and never got over it. In her last years, in the 1980s, her once fine brain so crippled by dementia that she could not remember the names of her children, she could still remember his dreadful, useless death. She could still talk of his last leave, when he was so shellshocked he could hardly speak and my grandmother ironed his uniform every day in the vain hope of killing the lice.

    http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-medals/white-feather.htm

    The practice of “awarding” the white feather often got out of hand. Many Australian women became excessive and over-reaching in their attempts to force men to enlist.

    A 15-year-old boy lied about his age to get into the army in 1914. He was in the retreat from Mons, the Battle of the Marne and the first Battle of Ypres, before he caught a fever and was sent home. Walking across Putney Bridge, four girls gave him white feathers. “I explained to them that I had been in the army and been discharged, and I was still only 16. Several people had collected around the girls and there was giggling, and I felt most uncomfortable and … very humiliated.” He walked straight into the nearest recruiting office and rejoined the army.

    I went to the recruiting office. The sergeant there couldn’t stop laughing at me, saying things like “Looking for your father, sonny?”, and “Come back next year when the war’s over!” Well, I must have looked so crestfallen that he said “Let’s check your measurements again”. You see, I was five foot six inches and only about eight and a half stone. This time he made me out to be about six feet tall and twelve stone, at least, that is what he wrote down. All lies of course – but I was in!”

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  187. on April 14, 2009 at 10:43 pm Rain And

    Check it out, someone at the New Yorker made a comic about Jessica Valenti and her betabeard

    http://www.cartoonbank.com/product_details.asp?sid=70307&did=4&sitetype=1&affiliate=ny-randomcart

    Can we get an open thread where we can dump this kind of off-topic shite?

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  188. on April 14, 2009 at 10:54 pm Gunslingergregi

    Apparently I will have to really really watch my ass when i implement my plans. Whiskey is truth.

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  189. on April 14, 2009 at 10:55 pm Gunslingergregi

    This blog is beyond gold

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  190. on April 14, 2009 at 11:01 pm Bhetti

    Gunny, I’d totally be your polar bear.

    Rain: You know, I think it says how much militant feminists scare me that I wondered if that was really true. For just one second.

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  191. on April 14, 2009 at 11:03 pm Bhetti

    Rain: Considering how many comments are on topic, that would reduce the amount of comments to ‘zero’ on some posts.

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  192. on April 14, 2009 at 11:34 pm Gunslingergregi

    That is quite hardcore max so did they choose betas or alphas to go to war?

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  193. on April 15, 2009 at 12:14 am Obsidian

    I’m watching Bonanaza right now; there’s a scene where a Spanish guy just got finished sweeping a Woman off her feet by doing a kind of Flamenco dance. Makes me think back to what T aka Ricky Raw said about the importance of a Man being able to dance well. Hmm.

    Scenes of Game in the tv show Bonanza…

    O

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  194. on April 15, 2009 at 12:24 am Gunslingergregi

    My posts getting erased a first here at roissy.

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  195. on April 15, 2009 at 12:26 am Gunslingergregi

    Or a glitch which it normally appears to be for others.

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  196. on April 15, 2009 at 12:38 am mnl

    “my 93 year old grandmother gave me a shit test when I visited her at the home. “Grandson! You’re late! Do you think I can wait for you forever like one of your floozies?! Clock’s ticking!” I barely passed.”

    Funny, I had an identical grandmother. Except that her words came wrapped in a thick southern accent. She could knock me on my heels while at the same time sounding sweet as sugar. Sure do miss her.

    More to your list:

    – If ever in doubt, it’s a shit test. Treat it accordingly.

    – Read the above again.

    – …And again

    – Defensive anger = beta. Avoid it. And her triggering you to anger is yet another shit test.

    – Jealosy = beta. Her triggering you to jealosy is… yes… you guessed it: another shit test.

    – The reason jealosy and anger is beta is that it subcommunicates you don’t have options.

    – And on that note, if you choose to be a faithful in the LTR, good. But never let her think the option’s not there for you to wander. And even if she doesn’t believe you have options, the important thing is that she see that YOU believe that you have options.

    – Believe it or not, your woman needs sex nearly as much as you do. For you it may be more physical while for her it’s more emotional. But she needs to know you value her sexually. If you don’t believe this, try saying “no” to her sexually sometime. If you’ve never done this before, you’ll throw her for a loop and you’ll see what I mean.

    – Learn phrases that “spank” her if/when she tests you with disrespect. Something like, “Who on earth ever taught you to talk like that?!” Or use nearly any type of qualifier.

    – On that note, push-pull and qualifiers work as well in an LTR as they do in traditional game. For example, tell her you were thinking about making love to her the other day, but then got totally turned-off by the thought of [insert some behavior you’d like her to extinguish]” She’ll be left thinking about that one for days.

    – Most men like peace and quiet in the relationship. She likes drama and a challenge. Get used to it.

    – There’s man language and there’s female language. They’re different. First, her sentences are sprinkled with *feeling* words and phrases that you have likely learned to gloss over because they don’t contain facts. Second, she will always read some sort of *feeling* subtext into whatever factual words tumble haphazardly out of your male mouth.

    …And that’s enough for now. Too many more to list and I’m tired.

    The LTR is a marathon. Club game is a sprint.

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  197. on April 15, 2009 at 12:40 am Tupac Chopra

    BTW Roissy, I forgot to say that this was indeed a stellar post.

    The section on how to handle your girl at a party was something I could have used back in my first forays into relationships — the kind of information that was not to be found among the usual suspects in the community.

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  198. on April 15, 2009 at 1:17 am Max from Australia

    Gunslingergregi
    That is quite hardcore max so did they choose betas or alphas to go to war?

    They chose anyone – but check the bit in bold.

    From the Book “The Blood of our Sons” (which I am going to give to my son when he’s 15)

    DR M Yearsley is one of the many diarists who erecalled that “young girls of all ages and styles of beauty, but particularly those of the type called “Flappers” were parading the streets offering white feathers to young men in mufti ” one of these inconsequent children offered her emblem of cowardice to a young man on leave who had just been awarded the VC”

    He argued that these “idiotic young women were using white feathers to get rid of boyfriends of whom they were tired”.

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  199. on April 15, 2009 at 1:24 am Max from Australia

    mufti = civilian clothes
    VC = the Victoria Cross the highest military decoration which is, “in the face of the enemy” to members of the armed forces of various Commonwealth countries, and previous British Empire territories. It takes precedence over all other orders, decorations and medals.

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  200. on April 15, 2009 at 1:34 am Sara I

    dougjnn

    ou really are seeming very tight assed, controlling and unattractive Sara.

    One thing is for sure and that is that roissy is not my type, but he might like my tight ass. The woman is lucky they’re not still together in my opinion. Roissy is hardly a great catch. Have you read some of his posts? Has she? I doubt it. It seems he’s “maturing” or trying to by giving LTR relationship advice. I should give him credit; but it’s difficult. You’ll never understand unless you’re reincarnated as a woman. The shit he writes about women, his passive aggressive bullshit….you can be impressed if you want. It will take a lot for me to be impressed with him. You’re not my type either, dougjnn and vice versa; so why would I put a lot of weight on your opinion?

    Seeking Alpha

    Sara – It doesn’t take a mind reader to know what someone you’ve been with for a long time wants.

    You think a few months is a long time? Perhaps if she had read his blog a few months would have been way too long.

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  201. on April 15, 2009 at 1:39 am Max from Australia

    Gunslingergregi

    So I guess the moral of my posts today is that you can listen to women and end up dying in a muddy trench at 16yo.

    or you can do this

    http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/people/ronnie-wood-or-ronik-vood-20090415-a6ui.html

    Ronnie Wood is called `Ronik’ by his girlfriend’s family.

    The 61-year-old Rolling Stones rocker has finally been accepted by 20-year-old Ekaterina Ivanova’s relatives and they now refer to him by the affectionate pet name.

    The rocker left his wife of 23-years – former model Jo Wood – last summer when he met the Russian cocktail waitress and whisked her off to Ireland for a drinking marathon.

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  202. on April 15, 2009 at 2:00 am epiclolz

    roissy, love the change of plans tip G, that’s straight ‘calm assertive’ application of the cesar millan ‘alpha roll’ =)
    In a work game context, this is kind of like making a call on the office intercom, saying there are donuts and soda in the conference room, then once everyone gets there locking the door and turn the free donuts into a meeting… dooooominateeee!

    all half joking aside, nice post

    LikeLike


  203. on April 15, 2009 at 2:55 am David Alexander

    I’ve seen you being a non-beta right here, with your classic ‘Fuck you(r) *insert person or ideology here* ‘ moments.

    I’d argue that’s the classic sign of an angry beta who has lost his cool. That is not alpha behaviour in any degree.

    Quick question: DA, would you like to have children some day?

    Of course it would be nice, but I’d probably be a questionable parent…

    We as a species were designed to compliment each other.

    Why should one be a compliment to somebody? The ideal should be the maximization of our independence so we no longer have to rely on each other.

    LikeLike


  204. on April 15, 2009 at 3:12 am Obsidian

    Dave Alex,
    Nice tilt at a windmill, but DFH’s right, human beings are social animals, arguably thee most social of all the animalson Earth; as such, we need each other, and documented studies have been done that clearly show what happens when a person is in one way of another cutoff from others. Its not pretty.

    Very few human beings, Male or Female, are completely and totally “self contained”. We just aren’t wired that way, and I for one say, thank God for that.

    I do think DFH is on to something about your extreme fear of rejection, which, if I had to hazard a guess, stems from a weakened father-son relationship, since ideally it is he who teaches his son to face and confront his fears. I know that was the case for me. Having said that though, I also have to respect your to be, or not to be. You have that right. I just think you should be very honest w/yourself, if no one else, as to *why* you choose not to be. Here I think DFH’s point comes back into focus, because it does appear to me that you kind of throw all manner of excuses and reasons and rationalizations into th mix as to why you are just so “doomed” to failure as a Beta. That may be, but the failure is due more to your inability and/or unwillingness to face down your own fears namely that of Rejection.

    Just some thoughts.

    O

    LikeLike


  205. on April 15, 2009 at 6:34 am Momus

    A VC went to an Aussie SAS guy fighting in Afghanistan recently ; last was in Vietnam 40 years ago.

    LikeLike


  206. on April 15, 2009 at 7:25 am PA

    Be uncannily successful at your job.

    This doesn’t get stressed ewnough at PUA sites. The idea of course is not to have a job that is more difficult or high-status than your talents and desire warrant. It’s to be and be seen as extremely good at whatever it is you do.

    You can be a mailroom clerk and with the right kind of workplace game and excellent performance be respected by VPs and directors and popular among female co-workers.

    LikeLike


  207. on April 15, 2009 at 7:28 am PA

    Fundamentals of worklace game:

    1) be equal-parts hard working and impudent.

    2) something that may seem counterintuitive but for a good reason is the No. 1 law in the 48 Laws of Power: Never outshine the master.

    LikeLike


  208. on April 15, 2009 at 7:32 am Brandy

    Basically, be Don Draper.

    Are you paying royalties to SNL?

    Terrific advice for any guy who can pull it off.

    LikeLike


  209. on April 15, 2009 at 8:17 am Tarl

    Here is an article about a beta who wants to teach boys to be betas:

    Once you start asking about whether there are special lessons that should be taught to boys, people jump pretty quickly from elevators to sex…

    My friend Dr. Lee M. Sanders is associate professor of pediatrics at the University of Miami Miller School of Medicine, where he takes care of many adolescent boys. “Six or seven years ago,” he told me, “a mother said to me: ‘Listen, there’s no dad in the home and I’m worried about the way I see my son treating other girls. Will you talk to him about it?’ ”

    Over time, Dr. Sanders incorporated this conversation into his regular exam room routine, starting with boys around age 12: “We’ll talk about respect, about whether they feel they are respected in their own families, the respect they have for their mothers, the respect they see other men paying to their own mothers or sisters — do you think that applies to other girls that you meet?

    [Well gee, what happens if you treat a girl the same way you treat your mom or your sister? Answer: she treats you like a son or a brother! Is that what you’re looking for from “other women you meet”?]

    Dr. Sanders thinks that a double standard is legitimate here — “maybe because I have two girls and no boys of my own.”

    “Girls need to be treated with more respect,” he said. “We need to focus more on empowering girls in relationships, particularly relationships with the opposite sex. I think of myself very much as a feminist.”

    So we see how this works – a bitter divorcee who hates men asks a beta male to accelerate the feminization of her son and to ensure his submission to feminist dogma. Thanks, mom! Thanks for making me into a eunuch instead of a man!

    LikeLike


  210. on April 15, 2009 at 8:19 am Tupac Chopra

    Max Hardcore:

    He argued that these “idiotic young women were using white feathers to get rid of boyfriends of whom they were tired”.

    Plus ca change, plus c’est la meme chose

    LikeLike


  211. on April 15, 2009 at 8:28 am Obsidian

    PA,
    Yea, I’ve heard of the “never outshine the master” thing, and I think there has to be a caveat-it works if the “master” has proven himself worthy of not being “outshone”. Besides, everyone knows how much we Brothas like to shine, I know that’s true for me. In anything I do, I gotta standout. Hardest working Man on the team, the toughest, puts in more man-hours on the clock, days in the work, does double shifts back to back, studies up on the craft in the off hours, etc.

    Plus, its been my experience that a whole lotta “masters” really don’t know what they’re doing and rely on their “subjects” to make them look good. Can’t respect that. You gotta show and prove that you can roll all day in the trenches w/o a break, etc, that’s the way I was raised.

    Of course, this will attract its share of hatahs. Let them come.

    So yea, there has to be a caveat to that “law”.

    Otherwise, yea, a successful Man on the job can definitely be an aid to his Game.

    O

    LikeLike


  212. on April 15, 2009 at 8:49 am PA

    All good points Obsidian. But from what I’ve seen, the “masters” are generally competent and fair. They wouldn’t bee where they are if they weren’t. Bad ones anyhow typically lack the respect of their peers and supervisors.

    Of course, that can depend on the line of work you’re in too. In low-end blue collar you may be supervised by dumbass assholes and in BigLaw by unethical jerkoffs.

    Sure, you can launch a coup against a weak or bad “master.” But if he’s strong and competent, respect his authority and spotlight. Because you’ll be disposed of quickly if you don’t know your place.

    Think Tony Soprano’s captains, who regardless of their alphatude, knew that in the end, it’s the big man who owns the show. Ones who got too big for their britches were pumped with lead.

    LikeLike


  213. on April 15, 2009 at 8:54 am PA

    In low-end blue collar

    In low-end service-sector is what I meant.

    LikeLike


  214. on April 15, 2009 at 8:56 am Obsidian

    PA,
    As one who’s walked off jobs rather than being a “subject” to a guy who don’t know his ass from a hole in a ground, beloeve me, losing a job is no bg whup to me. Never had that much of a problem getting work because my work ethic always won the day.

    The dirty little secret is that there is a lot of incompetence in upper management, and has been for quite some time; this is true in the Military too, as many a graveyard shows.

    The problem is that the grunts and suits don’t all “soldier” together. Most suits don’t know what it is to get their hands dirty and actually know their stuff. That’s a fact, don’t take my word for it. Now, I’m just a lot more vocal about it.

    O

    LikeLike


  215. on April 15, 2009 at 9:39 am Willard Libby

    Roissy, that’s too much damn effort to put out for a woman.

    Disappear for weeks at a time.

    OK, I can do that one.

    Sara I – A real man tells a woman what he wants (to do) and asks her how she feels about it FIRST. It doesn’t mean you ALWAYS do things her way, but that you do CARE how she feels in general. Women are simpler creatures than you imagine. You’ll score big points with feminine women that way.

    I agree with this. I’m cold, distant and aloof by nature. I’m very uncooperative with people in general and women in particular but I’m not completely insensitive to women’s feelings. I don’t like arrogance and I do want to know how a woman feels. I want that honesty.

    And only then will I most likely not go along with her. I’m just naturally that way but I don’t want to be arrogant.

    I think I’m sensitive and caring and then I just don’t follow through and go along with the knowledge I’ve acquired.

    maurice – Don Draper is awesome

    It’s genetics. Good looking men can get away with what ugly/average men can’t.

    chicnoir – As badly as some of you treat us, you seem to not fair very well without us.

    Yes, it’s called the Stockholm Syndrome. The male children are essentially hostage to the mother from birth where they are brainwashed into a bond with the females. Add to that later sexual feelings and it creates a pathetic combination.

    You should realize that that was what Jesus was talking about when he said men should die and be born again. The little Stockholm Syndromed boy/man needs to die and be born again of a different source than his mother and all future mother substitutes.

    lurker – “pcbpiper”—I love when the SWPLers defend the Indians as saintly people, then you look back and realize they were killing and robbing and murdering and raping for land/territory/power/riches/women just like everyone else.

    Of course. That’s their FEAR talking. They don’t want to view history with that kind of honesty because it brings up their childish fears of the play ground bully. They fear admitting that human history is a throw down among groups competing for power over land/resources/labor/money/mates.

    In their fantasy world the Noble Red Man simply represents the morally pure ‘Other”. The great irony is that the Indians were essentially Mexican gangbangers and the SWPL Noble Red Man is a White liberal wimp in racial disguise.

    roissy – i have zero guilt over american frontiersmen winning decisively against the indian enemy. my rationale is clear: had the indians won, there would never have been a glorious america and i wouldn’t be here. either this land would still be dotted with teepees or some other world power would have settled the expanse.
    in the words of a truly amoral sonofabitch (that’s me):
    may the best culture win.

    Where pretty lies perish! Interesting how the losers and their allies pretend that the winners need to fell guilty for winning. That’s the Beta Male Psyche applied to human history.

    Alpha Male Psyche knows better.

    Obsidian – Whiskey, – You make some good points-but consider this. Perhaps if Black and Red folk weren’t systematically “whitewashed” out of American history to begin with, the SWPL crowd wouldn’t have as strong a leg to stand on.

    The bigger issue is why did the Africans “blackwash” Europeans out of THEIR history? Why did the Indians “redwash” the White Man out of THEIR history?

    The White man has obviously pioneered modern world history. White people are the creators of modern historical scholarship and have worked harder than any race to accurately represent human history all the way back to the African Apes. No other culture comes close.

    If the blacks and Indians had been paying more attention they might not have had their asses handed to them by the superior White nations. Information warfare precedes physical warfare.

    Obsidian – Thursday, – Yup, European diseases did a job on the Indians, we all know that but that doesn’t negate what I said above: the White Man did indeed damn near drive the Indians into extinction.

    No such thing as European diseases. They are Nature’s Microbes. The Indians were overwhelmingly killed off by natural selection.

    It’s ironic considering all the Mythology about the primitive Indians “living in harmony with nature” that in fact they were killed off because they could NOT live in harmony with the new microbial nature brought in by the human migrants from east of the Atlantic ocean. Most life is and always will be microbial life.

    Obviously the superior White warrior class cleaned up the rest but basically Natural Selection played the biggest part. Indians prided themselves on being warriors and fighting with other Indian tribes. Problem for them is some bigger, badder warriors came along and tore their asses up.

    Welcome to Reality 101.

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  216. on April 15, 2009 at 9:53 am David Alexander

    Where pretty lies perish! Interesting how the losers and their allies pretend that the winners need to fell guilty for winning.

    I suspect that for some, there’s a magical alternative world where the natives and whites could have co-existed side by side without violence. It adds into the implicit and covert viewpoint of the SWPL types that violence is something that white people shouldn’t do because white people are better than that. It’s bizzaro white nationalism.

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  217. on April 15, 2009 at 9:56 am Seeking Alpha

    It’s bizzaro white nationalism.

    I think that’s actually incredibly insightful. Non-whites can’t help but be violent. It’s our job as superior whites to rise above that violence and help. them.

    Obviously that’s BS. We all just want women, children and comfort. We will all kill to get or keep it, whether directly or through proxy.

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  218. on April 15, 2009 at 10:10 am 11minutes

    Just stumbled upon this story of an (attractive) woman raping a robber to her store for three days straight. Thought that would be amusing to some of you on here…

    LikeLike


  219. on April 15, 2009 at 10:13 am lurker

    11minutes, between that and all the hot 25 year old female teachers doing 14 year old male students nowadays, I ask the same question: WHY DON’T THESE WOMEN LIVE NEAR ME?

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  220. on April 15, 2009 at 10:16 am chicnoir

    @11minutes
    I feel so guilty for laughing at that guy. Funny enough , how much you wanna bet he chases tail in nightclubs but when he meets a woman who can really give it to him, he runs off like a little itch. Not only that but she gave him some parting gifts.

    I see a link to his telling and male students snitching on their freaky older teachers.

    *shakes head*
    Men

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  221. on April 15, 2009 at 10:18 am chicnoir

    @lurker you must act innocent and look like butter won’t melt in your mouth. The innocence is partly what attracts those types of women.

    LikeLike


  222. on April 15, 2009 at 10:27 am Tupac Chopra

    *shakes head*
    Men

    Men? Someone posts an article about a woman who can’t overcome her inborn attraction to violent crimi nals and rapes him repeatedly and you say “Men”?

    gtfo

    LikeLike


  223. on April 15, 2009 at 10:27 am lurker

    chic, when I want your opinion, I’ll give it to you.

    LikeLike


  224. on April 15, 2009 at 10:50 am Obsidian

    Willard,
    “Welcome to Reality 101”?

    Yeah, riiiiiiight…

    Don’t know if you missed it, but Anony already addressed your fake the funk strawman arguments. No one here tried to make the case that Indians were good, White Men bad-no one hat is, but the “White nationalist” types like yourself. All that you said bove doesn’t address a darned thing of what was actually said about the issue in this thread.

    As for why Africans and Indians don’t include White Men into *their* history, well, I tink you answered that question yourself-the White Man had the books and quills, the African was barred from them on the threat of death, and similar was the case for the Red Man, athough we also have to note that many Indian tribes didn’t have writing and record keeping like White Men did. So, the whitewashing out o Black and Red folk was something that was done on the White Man’s watch, period.

    Holla back

    O

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  225. on April 15, 2009 at 11:19 am Bhetti

    11 minutes: That’s HORRIFYING. Call the police, crazy bitch. I can’t laugh at this, God knows how further screwed up this already screwed up kid will be.

    As we’ve established from Game, the natural state of man is to be in control. According to extrapolation from this logic, it would be even more horrifying and psychologically damaging for a male to lose this control, especially if he’s used to it. Still, who knows what fate will end for the guy if he ends up in prison.

    Vigilantism: the real reason why people shouldn’t commit crimes, anywhere. If you ain’t frightened of the police, be frightened of the “victims”.

    LikeLike


  226. on April 15, 2009 at 12:20 pm Willard Libby

    11minutes – Just stumbled upon this story of an (attractive) woman raping a robber to her store for three days straight. Thought that would be amusing to some of you on here…

    Yeah that’s funny but obviously fake.

    Obsidian – Willard, – “Welcome to Reality 101″?

    Yeah, riiiiiiight…

    Don’t know if you missed it, but Anony already addressed your fake the funk strawman arguments.

    Anony contributed nothing.

    No one here tried to make the case that Indians were good, White Men bad-no one hat is, but the “White nationalist” types like yourself.

    You are evading the point. When someone says – “pcbpiper – Yeah, people in the West who squatted on Indian lands they had no right to were saintly people who never swore, stole, or killed.” it is an attempt to create a scenario in which there is a clash of Good Loser (non White) – Bad Winner (White man).

    Typical Beta Male view of the world. And it has nothing to do with so called White nationalists. All lurker and I did was expand the discussion and force all you racial Beta boys to face a deeper historical truth.

    All that you said bove doesn’t address a darned thing of what was actually said about the issue in this thread.

    I’ll wait for the translation on that one. I haven’t read ANY intelligent critique of what I wrote.

    As for why Africans and Indians don’t include White Men into *their* history, well, I tink you answered that question yourself-the White Man had the books and quills,

    White men INVENTED modern printing, books, photography, television, film, computers, the internet, satellite technology, etc etc. And they have done a far better job representing the world than any other people.

    It’s not always accurate but my point is that the inaccuracies need to be compared to other races in accuracies – or wholesale omissions – not be compared to perfection.

    No, I’m talking about Africans in Africa, not the losers who were conquered and enslaved. I mean why weren’t the Africans developing a historical scholarship that allowed them to keep up with global affairs. Same with the Indians. They were all just sitting back living in their own cultural delusions, telling each other their own myths and excluding from their Psyches an awareness of other races and cultures. They were blackwashing and redwashing the White man our of their worldview and histories.

    That is until it was too late and they were forced to confront a superior invading force. As I said, Information warfare precedes physical warfare.

    the African was barred from them on the threat of death, and similar was the case for the Red Man,

    No, again I’m talking about before they got their asses kicked. Not afterward.

    athough we also have to note that many Indian tribes didn’t have writing and record keeping like White Men did.

    So, the whitewashing out o Black and Red folk was something that was done on the White Man’s watch, period.

    But “blackwashing” of White folks happened on the black man’s watch and that’s why he wasn’t watching out for the competitively superior threat coming from outside his narrow worldview.

    Same goes for the Indian.

    You have to be proactive in this world, that’s what the Alpha men do. In this context the black male is a racial historical Beta male. Same with the Indian.

    The White men who conquered and created the modern world were Alpha men. They weren’t concerned about being evaluated after the fact by the Beta males. Whether those Betas were black, red or SWPL White male Betas.

    Seriously, that IS Reality 101.

    I’m just noticing the obvious.

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  227. on April 15, 2009 at 1:02 pm John C

    Not sure why you guys jump on Sara so quickly– She brings up a fair point. You can’t follow a script without considering the range of personality in women. I don’t like suprise parties and all that nonsense, and don’t really see the romance in doing the date switcheroo. But there is intrigue with mystery. In any case, packing a woman’s bag is not a task for a newbie.

    Have her put together a “go bag” that we’re all supposed to have anyways in case of quick flight. It contains all her personal unforgettables and might stay in your closet for days or weeks. Maybe one evening as you’re parking the car at the restaurant, you say “do me a favor baby and put my raincoat in the trunk.” When she sees her “go bag” in the trunk, she’ll raise an eyebrow and ask what’s going on. You remain vague but smiling. Either she starts getting giddy or not. If she’s having a bad day and is not into an adventure that night, you remain cool. When she’s in a better mood she will pepper you with questions on what you had planned. Never divulge under any circumstances.

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  228. on April 15, 2009 at 2:32 pm Sara I

    love/sexy/beauty

    Sara: it may be futile, but I am also going to try and explain why so many disagree with you that surprises are rude.

    You missed the part where I said I love surprises, but I think it goes too far when a man assumes he can PACK for a woman. Certainly I don’t want a man packing for me. That seems to make me an impossible bitch. Seriously, I adore surprises, but if I might be so bold to say so, MOST feminine women are NOT going to love having that kind of surprise.

    IMAGINE… someone you care about, say your mother, told you for many years that she wishes she could have a particular pastry she tried in Italy when she was young.

    #1 My mother hates me! That could explain a lot. #2 the little pastry thing is a far cry from packing her off on a weekend trip without her pre-knowledge. She’s a bigger bitch than I am, so I can only imagine….. LOL

    You guys worry too much about me. I’m not as unbalanced as I might seem. Just today I’ve had a giant epiphany and as a result; if you don’t see my pretty face around here anymore it’s not because I’m dead and gone but alive and well, better than ever.

    Putting the past behind me, particularly a certain man if you can call him that, who has been the main source of most of my cantankerousness, which has been directed at roissy and minions all these….years? It feels like years.

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  229. on April 15, 2009 at 2:36 pm Sara I

    love/sexy/beauty

    If she got pissed about the lovely little Italian pastry, I WOULD EAT IT MYSELF! I don’t take her bitchiness personally; neither should anyone take mine personally. At least I’m honest and open in my bitchiness; more fun and fireworks and passion I might add. I can also get over things really fast if a man can handle it without turning passive aggressive or passive on me. I have yet to find such a man but there’s still time!

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  230. on April 15, 2009 at 2:41 pm Sara I

    lady la

    As admirable and romantic as the impetus is, unless you are truly prepared to handle *all* the details (and how many men really, truly are??)… just don’t.

    As an alternative, a romantic weekend away is just as romantic with short notice. The woman will look hotter and feel more comfortable at the destination and the man would still get all the points for planning, execution and spontaneity

    You see, roissy, you just don’t have enough experience with healthy feminine women. Lady la and I know what we’re talking about, but she is obviously a much nicer lady about it. If you want higher quality women/bitches and not just variation of D.C. feminist lawyer bitches you need to listen up and learn.

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  231. on April 15, 2009 at 3:12 pm Cannon's Canon

    ” ‘Smiles Predict Marriage Success’

    If you want to know whether your marriage will survive, look at your spouse’s yearbook photos.

    Psychologists have found that how much people smile in old photographs can predict their later success in marriage.

    Overall, the results indicate that people who frown in photos are five times more likely to get a divorce than people who smile.”

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20090414/sc_livescience/smilespredictmarriagesuccess

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  232. on April 15, 2009 at 3:47 pm dougjnn

    lady la

    Thing is, Dave, I’ve yet to date a man who would even be mentally willing to consider packing a woman’s bag, much less actually do it. I’m in love and in a LTR with a natural born asshole. I think he’d rather send me off for a vacation on my own than try to pack a bag for me.

    *** (don’t forget the pantyliners!).

    People keep forgetting that she packed herself for the most part. All the stuff like her toiletries and pantyliners.

    Roissy just had to add inland hill country clothes of hers to supplement her beach and general purpose packing.

    Jeesssh. The fussiness of women can never be overestimated (particularly once they’ve aged).

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  233. on April 15, 2009 at 3:51 pm dougjnn

    Tupac Chopra —

    Men? Someone posts an article about a woman who can’t overcome her inborn attraction to violent criminals and rapes him repeatedly and you say “Men”?

    I had the same reaction on reading her. Self important much. Uggg.

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  234. on April 15, 2009 at 4:48 pm lady la

    dougjnn — see, you’ve messed it up already!

    all you need to go to the beach is a swimsuit, coverup, sunscreen, towel, sarong and bottle of water, not full-on toiletries, sheesh! also I dont take my ID or phone charger to the beach. Maybe going to the beach has a different connotation on the east coast? out my way, it’s literally a walk in the park.

    In the original scenario, the guy needs to pack not JUST “inland hill country clothes,” but also “romantic candlelit restaurant clothes” — two outfits requiring totally different accoutrement, from shoes to underwear. You want I should go to dinner in hiking boots? mmm, sexy.

    fussy? perhaps. But thinking that packing a woman’s bag is an effortless endeavor belies an ignorant arrogance that has great potential to backfire. Again, not saying it could never work, but for most men, not realistically doable. And not the most masculine activity, regardless.

    What would Don Draper do?

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  235. on April 15, 2009 at 4:56 pm lady la

    oh and ladies (Bhetti and chicnoir) no my beloved natural born asshole is not physically abusive! never that.

    He’s more like, really honest. And impulsive. Which is by turns incredibly sweet and eye-poppingly inappropriate (like say, leaving me at a party if he doesn’t feel like being there, charming! then coming back to get me…). It’s almost natural game, he doesn’t need subterfuge or manipulation, he’s just himself and I love-hate-love him for it.

    Plus the sex is fantastic! ^_^

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  236. on April 15, 2009 at 4:57 pm dougjnn

    lady la

    In the original scenario, the guy needs to pack not JUST “inland hill country clothes,” but also “romantic candlelit restaurant clothes” — two outfits requiring totally different accoutrement, from shoes to underwear.

    Of course. That’s part of horseback riding inland hill country clothes. If she hasn’t already packed that herself that is, which she probably has, because after the beach, there’s romantic candlelit restaurant possibilities at the beach as well.

    My dear.

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  237. on April 15, 2009 at 5:07 pm lady la

    doug — u dense or wot? I already told you everything that’s in the beach bag. No date clothes included.

    Anyway, we’re def talking about different types of beach excursions. LoL. You can watch the towels and sun ur pasty thighs while I go out and catch waves.

    ta!

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  238. on April 15, 2009 at 5:50 pm dougjnn

    lady la

    Guess what? I’d look inside the bag. But yeah, my idea of a beach weekend (as opposed to day trip) could well include a romantic candle lit restaurant dinner. followed by a happenin club. Followed by back to the bungalo / hotel. She would have packed accordingly.

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  239. on April 15, 2009 at 5:51 pm dougjnn

    lady la

    like say, leaving me at a party if he doesn’t feel like being there, charming! then coming back to get me…

    Good for him. I think I’d like him.

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  240. on April 15, 2009 at 6:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””””””””””on April 15, 2009 at 1:39 am Max from Australia
    Gunslingergregi

    So I guess the moral of my posts today is that you can listen to women and end up dying in a muddy trench at 16yo.

    or you can do this

    http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/people/ronnie-wood-or-ronik-vood-20090415-a6ui.html

    Ronnie Wood is called `Ronik’ by his girlfriend’s family.

    The 61-year-old Rolling Stones rocker has finally been accepted by 20-year-old Ekaterina Ivanova’s relatives and they now refer to him by the affectionate pet name.

    The rocker left his wife of 23-years – former model Jo Wood – last summer when he met the Russian cocktail waitress and whisked her off to Ireland for a drinking marathon.
    “””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””

    Was thinking about this and I am pretty sure if I was alive in world war ii era I sure as shit would have been volunteering to go to that one to. Just like I am in this one now. I have been in every war that I have been able to go. I think war is actually good for a man. It cuts through a lot of pretty lies and losing your life is a small price to pay for that. The woman are evil thing though yea the bad part is you usually don’t find it out till they break up with you. This rocker thing is where I think the muslims have it right you don’t have to get rid of the first one. You can still get the 23 year old when your 61. Plus keep the 61 year old that you have already spent a lot of your life with.

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  241. on April 15, 2009 at 6:40 pm lady la

    dougjnn — Thanks, you probably would like him! He’s naturally got what you come here to try and learn. And he fucks like a volcano and he’s everything to me. Be inspired. Pax.

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  242. on April 15, 2009 at 9:39 pm epiclolz

    It should be noted that the arguments stated here with respect to human behavior operate at the ‘population level’. I would have thought that when making these observations that it was already implied that you would obviously calibrate per situation per person. I think that point is missed a lot of times by some whenever we discuss any of this human nature business. Just a thought the next time you think, well I certainly don’t act that way etc… or there is no way that people could possibly act/react that way. =p

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  243. on April 16, 2009 at 9:51 am Firepower

    lady la quotes Liz Phair. she’s too old for me.

    do u know where i can get an old Veruca Salt concert t?

    thx
    Firey

    LikeLike


  244. on April 16, 2009 at 8:43 pm omw

    Ah, yes. The bit about just taking off from a boring party is great, great, classic. There’s a guy who isn’t any too anxious about what other people think of him.

    Lady La’s dude is what women mean when they tell some poor hopeless schmuck to “Be Yourself.”

    As in, not the spineless social-approval-supplicating false-fronted worm you appear to be.

    We mean, “Bud, there’s surely a man in there somewhere. Just, you know, try letting him out! Be yourself!”

    And then you must just let the chips fall where they may.

    The Super Story Answer is: BE YOURSELF.

    LikeLike


  245. on April 17, 2009 at 12:32 pm Bhetti

    Sara: Brilliant news on epiphany. Cranky female? It’s not PMS, it’s a man!

    LikeLike


  246. on April 17, 2009 at 12:52 pm Default User

    Bhetti, Sara I

    Sara: Brilliant news on epiphany. Cranky female? It’s not PMS, it’s a man!

    I missed that post first time. Had I seen it, I too would have asked what epiphany’s name was.

    I hope he is Alpha (but not a player, God help us). I wonder if Sara is into magic tricks and palm reading. Regarding “negs,” I bet she gives as good as she gets.

    Sara I, please report back om Mr. Epiphany.

    LikeLike


  247. on April 21, 2009 at 6:30 pm LILGRL

    @ G Manifesto

    “Leave Desert Eagle in full view”

    Nice. That’s game.

    LikeLike


  248. on March 21, 2010 at 5:26 am Following up « The quiet earth

    […] of guile? Aren’t girls meant to be gorgons,  doling out the permanent shit test death stare til her dying breath? I think this guy has it about right: Not everything my LTR does is a shit test, but there are […]

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