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The Feminization Of The Western White Male

This is a trend that is bursting with fruit flavor.

exhibit-a1

exhibit-b

exhibit-c

mysteryfrilly1

Dandies have a long and storied history in the Western cultural canon, so these types of androgynous men are nothing new. But the sheer breadth and rapidity of the dandyfication of the 21st century urban Western white male, coupled closely with the pickup artist movement and the rise of game, signifies a profound cultural change. A nancyboy revolution is upon us.

Since women are by genetic dictate the choosers of men in the mating market (note: men do some choosing as well. see: lonely fat chicks), men who dandify themselves are simply responding to women’s choices. If you want to know where men are heading, follow the pussy. The interesting question is not why the urban white (and asian) man in his multicultural milieu is sporting long silky coifs and bejeweled bracelets, but why women are rewarding these men with their sex. I leave the answer as an exercise for the readers. As enlightened warrior-poets of the Republic of Poon you should have a pretty good idea of the hidden forces at work. Hint: No theory about the present day sexual market is complete without acknowledgement of the underestimated impact contraceptives, abortion, female economic empowerment and demographic upheaval have had on Darwinian sexual selection.

As a man who himself has acquired a splash of the dandy’s fashion sense to rave reviews from women, I don’t consider a man a femmed out beta if the NASCAR crowd scoffs. After all, other men are not the ultimate arbiter of what constitutes alphatude; women are. Men are merely proxy agents for judging other men’s alpha cred. But a woman’s open and willing pussy is the judge that matters most. As long as these modern day dandies with their black nail polish, handlebar moustachios and heart-shaped pendants are scoring more tail than your typical herb or aging frat boy swilling Miller Light in front of the TV, they are partaking of alpha privilege.

Not a sermon, just a thought.

711 Responses

  1. he asks a very good question, and here I for one am hoping the ladies in the room might wish to chime in: why DO Women fall so hard for the Dandies?

    Ladies…?

    O

    Like


  2. Time for some self aggrandizement. Here is my classic post on rockstar androgyny.

    Like


  3. Black and European men have long noted that, gasp, women actually prefer a man who looks good and dresses well. You can’t find much bigger dandies than most black guys. White American guys are slowly catching on to this fact. Next up, Australian guys.

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  4. on April 24, 2009 at 11:44 am ironrailsironweights

    One could argue that facial hair of any sort, even something as dandyfied as a handlebar mustache, is the opposite of androgyny as only men can grow it. All four of the men in your pictures have some facial hair.

    Peter

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  5. Facial hair being manly or dandy: depends on whether its intent is to make the man look tough or look pretty.

    Like


  6. I would say it acts much the same as giant antlers as a deer: demonstration of capability by actively taking on negative qualities, and proving quality anyway.

    Men who could get away with androgynous qualities while still demonstrating dominance have always been in high demand. Only difference is that feminization has softened men enough now that a lot more men can get away with it without getting killed by a gang of football jocks.

    I expect at some point it may reverse, as jocks become so rare and condemned, that androgyny is typical, and jockishness becomes the ultimate proof of capability.

    Like


  7. You are simply bowing to one group of women’s preferences over another. Dressing dandy will make you invisible or even repulsive to other women.

    I recall a stay in Washington at a time when every man in the city wore a red tie/white shirt. After a week of this standard uniform, I returned home to see my husband dressed in a brown tie/ olive shirt. I was all over him.

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  8. It’s the tension between the slightly androgynous fashion sense and the otherwise masculine self-presentation that makes it great. Not all guys can pull it off.

    You’ve got to be in good shape and reasonably young. Androgyny on a fat 45-year-old screams flamin’ queer, not tormented aesthete.

    Photo #4 is pretty nasty, though. What is the DEAL with the chin patch?

    I blame Howie Mandel.

    Like


  9. Let you know when you can see the kids? They’re your kids too. Tell her to fuck herself if she wants to take away your kids, until the courts actually side with her.

    That said, I know little about the divorce system. But don’t let her set the frame.

    Like


  10. “These are black nails, not pink.” – Mystery

    Hasn’t this always been the case? Who was more alpha, John Wayne or Cary Grant (in terms of female fans, not actual personal life)?

    Like


  11. The moustache is hard to pull of unless its two halves connect under the nose. Younger guys often can’t grow a full one like that. See pic 2 above.

    A moustache will also over-accentuate a big nose or a small chin, if that’s your flaw.

    The only kind of moustache to grow is the Rhett-Butler (aka used car salesman) lip-line. Or the full-macho Freddy Mercury one, if you’ve a strong jawline and enough T to grow a thick one.

    Like


  12. @Jason
    Go rot in hell.

    Like


  13. Michael wears a hat,
    This JUST happened last night…..I agree with you but the fact is that she has my DETAILED emails with said 11 year younger girl as evidence. There is no denying what happened between us. If we do divorce, theres no doubt she will bust those emails out. Shall I not try to chill her out at this point rather getting her fired up again, thus making her even more determined to go to divorce court and taking all my $?

    Like


  14. Jason,
    Sorry for getting personal, but what was the sex life w/Wifey like? Did she make herself sexually available to you in a reasonable fashion…say, at least once every two days? She recently had another child, fair enough-but is she skilled at oral sex? Did she offer it in lieu of vag/anal? For that matter, was anal offered? If applicable, was a tittyfuck on the table?

    See, my position is, that often, the wifey plays a bigger role in her Man going creepin that she and the Siserhood wants to admit, and yes, Sex plays a huge role in that. Women must understand, that if you ain’t goin’ Ho Mode, another Ho will. It ain’t a matter of if, but when.

    So, unless she puttin’ out for you almost on demand, we can really start there w/the bloodletting, and if she wants the Big D, there’s your defence-she failed in her Wifely Duties.

    Holla back

    O

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  15. Jason, I don’t have experience with divorce. But if I were in that situation, I would careful to not grovel or over-pologize. I’d look at her with seriousness and without any sign of begging for forgiveness, and say once “I fucked up. It won’t happen again.”

    Don’t touch her, don’t say anythign else. Just look for signs to see if she wants to to all-out pirhana, or work it out.

    Probably can’t hurt to discretely visit a lawyer.

    Like


  16. Dang, dude. Kids birthed sixteen months apart, and you pick this moment to fuck a younger, hotter model? AND leave the emails out in plain sight?

    This has to be a fun troll post.

    Like


  17. I take it as another obstacle to be overcome. Screw androgynes and guys who wear affliction tee shirts and sweat bands on their arms when going out for the evening.

    Dandyism I’ll endorse provided it’s done in a nice suit. Not a pirate costume. Or raiding Spencer Gifts to accessorize like Mystery does.

    Mystery is like Third Eye Blind or Bright Eyes. Sure, you can get laid going that route, but how do you look at yourself in the mirror when you’re not balls deep in some girl you don’t respect for falling for it? To play music that shitty just to get women is a line I couldn’t cross.

    Your boy T at the Rawness has it down. Pocket squares and tie clips are where it’s at. The kind the guy from the G Manifesto wants everyone to believe he can afford.

    Like


  18. Excellent post.

    There is so much dandyfication and feminization in the ways guys dress these days: Even look at the “tough guy” dressing of Ed Hard. Glitter on shirts.

    Since when do men wear “designer Jeans”?

    For the record, if you want to dress like a man, get your suits made in London. Savile Row.

    – MPM

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  19. “men who dandify themselves are simply responding to women’s choices”

    Exactly.

    Although I have swooped more hipster chicks than any lead singer of one of those crappy bands they like, hipster girls don’t typically respond very well to me.

    They like beta males.

    Lately, I have realized the best Game in town is beautiful rich Latina girls.

    They respond very well to Alphas.

    And they move their hips better.

    – MPM

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  20. Jason

    Did you read the war of the roses posts before or after she discovered? When she confronted you, did your reaction resemble those of the guys in the war of roses?

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  21. @obsidian,
    a man cheats on a newborn and a toddler , and you want to know about anal sex? You sound like a perverted monster.

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  22. At their respective heights, Michael Jackson was pulling way more females than the Governator.

    Possibly. But then again, I recall reading a Playboy article a long time ago about how Schwartzenegger would just walk up to girls on the beach in California, before he even spoke ten words of English, and tell them to come to bed with him, and they’d oblige.

    And was Michael Jackson even interested in girls? Not saying he’s gay, he’s not. But he might be one of those asexual man-child types.

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  23. O- The sex life was non existent, not necessarily because of her. Truthfully I didnt want to fuck her. I wasnt feeling it. We just had a kid and there were other issues with our marriage. In all the years weve been together this is the first time I strayed…..I wish this blog was around before I got married.

    PA- That was my basic response to her: “I made a mistake…..” I did add, “im not sure if this (marriage) is going to work.” How can I get back together with her knowing that the trust is gone. Years of therapy and she ‘ll always be on my back. My main concern at this point are the kids and whats best for them, 2 unhappily married parents staying together just to raise the kids?

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  24. One weaknes of a dandy: does not offer a reassuring air of physical protection that women respond to at the most primal level. In other words, an average herb could kick a dandy’s ass, much less a bona-fide thug.

    And no one pisses of a non-dandy alpha like a little turd with an attitude.

    To pull off a dandy in the long run, you gotta be either so socially powerful that you won’t ever need to fight, or carry yourself like with a “don’t fuck with me” attitude combined with enought of a physique to discourage someone thinking of you as an easy whoop-down.

    Like


  25. GIG. I read the post after she found out (last night). I got mad that she was going through my shit, but then I did tell her “I mad a mistake, it wont happen again…

    Like


  26. Jason — assuming your question is for real and not trolling — do you want to save the marriage? If not, then just lawyer up today, and follow the lawyer’s advice.

    If you do, then be hands-off and see how things progress. let her yell and let her cry. Women will often forgive an inconsequential straying once they get the yelling out of their system.

    “im not sure if this (marriage) is going to work.”

    That was idiotic, and that’s what makes me suspect that your question is not for real.

    Like


  27. we should separate the androginous men in those who respond to hipster chicks tastes and those who are simply assexual, like EMOS. Anyway, I always felt that there are not as many hipster chicks as hipster guys, so the hipster scene is even tougher.
    Lastly, even if the hipster guy do score a hot chick, most commonly she’ll wear a sort of gothic clothes, have piercings and tattoss, and so on. Those girls will devalue herselves through their fashion style. You should subtract 1 or 2 points from each of them.

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  28. Jason, what do you want? Do you love her still?
    I think the solution for your problem is that you need to rewind a bit and figure out what you feel about your wife.
    If i can ask, do you think she could forgive you?

    Like


  29. In Israel, the dandies are called “arsim”. It means “shepherd” or “pimp”, and it’s usually the domain of Mizrahi guys.

    My mom commented on her visit that the men are prettier than the women here.

    Like


  30. on April 24, 2009 at 12:43 pm de Tocqueville

    OK, maybe I misread the question.

    If the question is why guys would dandify themselves, the answer is because they may lack some or all of the 4 factors I listed above and they need something to make up for it — along the lines of social peacocking that Chuck describes in his post.

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  31. “Your boy T at the Rawness has it down. Pocket squares and tie clips are where it’s at. The kind the guy from the G Manifesto wants everyone to believe he can afford.”

    Not a big fan of tie clips.

    Pocket squares, however, are something I never leave the house without.

    – MPM

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  32. Thanks PA. I assure you this is very REAL. Im still in shock. You are right, I gotta decide if I want to save the marriage : years of therapy and mistrust just to put up a front for our kids. Im concerned with how the divorce would pan out.

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  33. on April 24, 2009 at 12:50 pm Anthony L Wrightson

    FUCK THAT SHIT

    A man doesn’t NEED to look like a sissy to get laid. You are less of a man if you do. Period.

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  34. biktopia, i still love her, but I do think we need to improve our marriage at this point not sure if thats possible. i wasnt happy even before I cheated. it was a fun escape.

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  35. I agree with Chuck’s analysis. Psychological dominance and rock solid confidence are probably the most important determining factors of a man’s sexual market value, and if you can dress dandily with swagger, it makes a very psychologically dominant statement. It basically says, “I am so fucking alpha that I don’t even need to exhibit the typical indicators of testosterone, manliness, and strength. In fact, all that is a bunch of bullshit. Those guys are tools, and you (woman) are a tool for being impressed by it.”

    It’s weird to me that a lot of commenters here, who frequently demonstrate their very deep knowledge of female psychology, find it so hard to understand the success of certain androgynous males. The ones that are successful display many typical alpha male qualities–mysterious aloofness, assertiveness, confidence, strong body language, ability to make powerful emotional connections, creativity, etc. I’ve read many comments in the past that have hypothesized the androgynous/artist alpha as an entirely alternative form of alpha, distinct from the alpha archetype discussed on this blog. If you accept the concept of “biomechanics is god,” this obviously couldn’t be the case. Dandiness may be off putting and perplexing to a lot of men here, but if you take a closer look at the behavior of these types, there’s nothing the least bit mysterious about their attractiveness to women.

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  36. I thought “arsim” were the equivalent of “guidos”. The spiked hair, the tank-top/wife beater/A-shirt, the track suit, the gold jewelry, the natural tan, the loud, cheap, flashy watch, the dangling cigarette.

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  37. De Tocqueville, men are naturally more beautiful than women. Most of them, so long as they stay healthy, don’t need to ornament much. A bald guy standing there naked just needs to have worked out, have no major defects, and have some water splashed on him.

    Your eyelashes are generally longer. Your noses and chins are more prominent. Your shoulders are more broad. You have beards. Nature was good to males.

    That men have so many visible markers of reproductive goodness, tells me that men are built, like the males of most species, to peacock. It just falls in and out of fashion.

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  38. I originally posted this in the War of the Roses post seeing that the topic was appropriate. But due to lack of traffic Im posting my comment/situation here for your feedback:

    Question for Alphas…….Been reading this blog for awhile, but never commented. Ive been away for a few days and this post is quite timely to my situation. Im looking for advice as to handle my current situation: Simply put….I GOT CAUGHT. Im married with 2 kids (18 month & 2 month). I have been hooking up with a co worker (11 years younger) for the last month. We had been flirting for six months, she knows Im married. I was with her last night and while I was away my wife found some emails that detailed everything! She sent the kids to her mom’s house so that we could “figure” things out. She cried, she yelled, she says she cant see how I did this to the family. As of now, she wants me out of the house and said she will let me know when I can see the kids…. This is my first time cheating. We have been together for 13 years (married for 4). I am ready to face the consequences, but Im basically looking for any alphas with experience in this matter for their advice as to what to expect and how to handle things. Divorce could be forthcoming.

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  39. If it’s just that you don’t want to lose money, the fact of the matter is that you’re going to spend a boatload of money on the kids whether you’re married to their ugly aging mom or not.

    Might as well get a lawyer and quit pretending you “care” about her.

    Freedom isn’t free, right? What is hassle-free fucking worth to you?

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  40. JM

    Succesful men wrt women display the same behaviour everywhere, in SOmalia or in Monaco. Those guys in the picture, otoh, cater to hipster chicks, and there are, at least in my experience, fewer hipster chicks than hipster guys. Also, hipster chicks tend to be uglier than average, because hipsterness acts as some sort of anti-make-up, where bad taste in clothes is used to hide fatness/facial assymetry and so on

    To be succesful in such a hard environment, a guy must have balls. And at least in Brazil, he’ll have to sacrifice non-hipster chicks

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  41. on April 24, 2009 at 12:59 pm Comment_Whatever

    Jason said:

    Im married with 2 kids (18 month & 2 month). I have been hooking up with a co worker (11 years younger) for the last month. We had been flirting for six months, she knows Im married. I was with her last night and while I was away my wife found some emails that detailed everything!

    I kind of sounds like you wanted to be caught. On the other hand, I know in real life someone who did almost the exact same thing. And he didn’t want to be caught.

    What is your age Jason? 30s,40s,50s?

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  42. de Tocqueville–I agree that height gives a man a big advantage–sometimes significantly so–but even that is irrelevant compared to confidence/power. A quick glimpse at the lifestyles of neil strauss or the pua Cajun seem to confirm this pretty incontrovertibly.

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  43. You can be a good conversationalist, but lacking in confidence and dominance and height, which makes you a Nice Guy loser.

    You can be a good conversationalist, and confident, but lacking in dominance and height, which makes you a chaste Nice Guy.

    “et Dieu créa La Femme, et l’Homme créa…Rohypnol.”

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  44. First,lets deal with G Manifesto. “get your suits at Savile Row.” LOL! You heard of some fancy place 1000 miles away and pretend to get your suits there. You kind of outed yourself,G. (But then,who knows,maybe you’re real,I dont really care. I just thought the pretentious name dropping was funny. ) As for dandies,when I was a child,two Irishmen dominated the hearts of the ladies:Paul McCartney and Sean Connery. One a preturnaturally nice-looking prettyboy,skinny and long haired who made beautiful music;the other a testosterone drenched darkly handsome muscled tough guy,who gave life to the character of an imaginary hired govt. killer. Who got more pussy? Thats a damn good question; I’d wager Sean,but I bet both were bested by the Welshman,Tom Jones. POINT? Its not whether you’re a “dandy/fag” or an “Ed Hardy Nascar dude” or whatver,it is ,”Do you spark attraction in a particular woman??” Girls running toward dandies or machos anything else will ALWAYS cause a backlash and send other women off in the other direction.

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  45. on April 24, 2009 at 1:02 pm ironrailsironweights

    One weaknes of a dandy: does not offer a reassuring air of physical protection that women respond to at the most primal level. In other words, an average herb could kick a dandy’s ass, much less a bona-fide thug.

    The man in the last picture, with the black nail polish, reminds me of the thugs from A Clockwork Orange.

    Also, apropos of an earlier comment, I often see black guys with a dandyfied look, and almost without except they do not look weak or wimpy.

    Peter

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  46. Eurosabra, come up to Haifa. We have a wide selection of the hyper-couture metrosexual sort that make guidos and douchebags look normal.

    We’re talking spiked *and* ultra blonde highlights.

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  47. Eurosabra: I’m not certain if confidence can be separated from dominance. If you’re confident, you don’t put up with other people’s attempts to control you, which plays as dominance.

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  48. “men are naturally more beautiful than women.”

    Wow. Nicole, I agree with you. I wrote a blog a while back about this. The male body has been demonized in modern culture for its utilitarianism. In an episode of “Seinfeld”, Jerry says that men’s bodies are like jeeps, they’re good for doing work but not nice to look at.

    looking at the male and female form from an artistic rather than sexual POV, i’d say the male form is more symmetrical and pleasing to the eye. the greeks idealized the male form for this reason.

    the demonization of the male form has further been used to promote the myth that more women are bisexual because the female form is so beautiful. i don’t buy it. it’s a societal acceptance thing, not a beauty thing.

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  49. on April 24, 2009 at 1:05 pm The Other JM

    When I first became aware of the existence of the seduction community, some of the first materials I came across were Youtube clips of Mystery doing seminars. I looked at him, with his black nail polish, eyeliner, oversized plush top hat, and feather boa, and thought, “THIS guy’s the #1 pickup artist of all time? Surely he doesn’t pick up hot babes looking like that, does he? Goth chicks, maybe, but mainstream, preppy, sorority-chick types, no way! He MUST give himself a quick makeover before going out, and enter the bars and clubs looking more like a typical frat boy, right?”

    Realizing that no, he does succeed that way, and morever, it actually HELPS him, was a major milestone in understanding female psychology.

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  50. I think men have peacocked more throughout history, than not. Our founding fathers used to get dressed in wigs, heels, stockings, and powder their faces for goodness sake. Yet they still kicked butt.

    Peacocking is both status display, and a way to catch a random girl’s eye more than your plainer brthren.

    Hell, its a nice change from the reality that wearing a clean t-shirt and jeans can get you called a fag in some areas.

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  51. on April 24, 2009 at 1:08 pm Default User

    The G Manifesto

    For the record, if you want to dress like a man, get your suits made in London. Savile Row.

    Are you sure about that?

    I know there is now a whole bunch of new up-and-coming slightly hipper tailors there, but the traditional Savile Row was always a bit more formal (stiffer construction etc.).

    For pick-up I would have though the more “drapped” European style would be better. The Savile suit might look a bit business-man-at-a-conference.

    Like


  52. on April 24, 2009 at 1:10 pm Default User

    BTW:

    In case nobody has noticed or has already mentioned. I believe picture number 4 is Mystery (of The Game fame).

    Like


  53. let me pose a question here…those more knowledgable about past cultures and civilizations may have some insight…

    we are operating under the assumption that this “dandified” look is biologically imprinted as somewhat feminine.

    if i think of the men of other cultures, past and present, ancient egyptians, greeks, native american cultures along with current african tribes dress in garb that would be currently be described as “dandy”.

    we are framing “dandy” in reference to our current culture, but the drivers of attraction haven’t yet caught up to nor are they ever going to be in sync with contemporary trends.

    Like


  54. on April 24, 2009 at 1:13 pm Default User

    ironrailsironweights

    All four of the men in your pictures have some facial hair.

    Figures that you would notice that. I guess you could call it male GNP.

    Like


  55. Right, but again we’re talking about whether dominance is social or physical. I *don’t* have a useable reply to AMOGing if I’m not as well-ensconced in the social structure as the frat boy telling me to “Stop bothering the lady and go refresh your drink” even if I can crush his windpipe with an elbow he’ll never see coming. I can “resist” that all I want, the fact that most women are status-seeking whores means that they’ll validate the put-down. There is no way to get taller once your bones fuse, not really any way to socially-network without inherited wealth, and no dominance without wealth, power, or the potential for violence in a context where violence is part of the pecking-order. Intangibles count for shit, although I suppose a lot of fat chicks really DID benefit from my being funny and good in bed.

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  56. Default User,

    I actually wear a lot of suits by Italian tailors as well.

    But I really like weaving in “Savile Row” into conversation.

    There are many newer tailors on Savile Row, ie Ozwald Boateng.

    That being said, last night I wore a ETRO from Milan, vanishing pinstripes, olive green interior, and had the whole room in a choke hold.

    It would have really sucked to be another guy at that gig.

    – MPM

    Like


  57. De Tocqueville, men are naturally more beautiful than women. Most of them, so long as they stay healthy, don’t need to ornament much. A bald guy standing there naked just needs to have worked out, have no major defects, and have some water splashed on him.

    This is only really true for Africa. Fortunately for us lovers of female beauty, in more northern climes male choice has been a significant factor in human evolution. As you move further north, resources became more and more important to the successful raising of children. Thus men brought more to the table in places like Europe. In Africa, if you impregnated a substandard women, it wasn’t a big deal. Due to the kind of agriculture practiced in sub-Saharan Africa, the woman was the one who did most of the work to feed the kid anyway, so there wasn’t much downside to impregnating an ugly chick. You could always spend most of your time trying to bang some other chick. On the other hand, if you were a European farmer who had to bust your ass everyday in order to get enough money to aquire a wife, then you better bet your ass you are going to make sure you were getting the best genetic value you can out of the deal. Hence the greater selection for female good looks among more northerly populations.

    Agnostic and some of the other people at gnxp have focussed on pathogen load as a major factor driving female beauty. While that is undoubtedly a factor, male choice seems to be a greater one. Hey, places like Spain and Italy may indeed have the hottest girls, but Russia and Sweden aren’t far behind.

    That said, this also means that African descended women probably have a greater appreciation for male good looks.

    Like


  58. Here are a host of additional prototypes for your viewing pleasure:

    http://lookatthisfuckinghipster.tumblr.com/

    Like


  59. Jason, you say, you are not sure if its possible to save/ change, the marriage, i think, because you write that you love her, give it a try, give some month’s,(if she is able to forgive) talk through the most important issues, try to change what went wrong, make an effort, it’s very easy to build a invisible wall in a relationship, try to tear that one down, very important to tell her everything you have on your mind, your problems and see if this can make some changes, if it doesn’t work, then go separate ways.
    I also think that with some time, you will see it more clear, what to do.

    Like


  60. I bet both were bested by the Welshman, Tom Jones.

    Female sheep don’t count.

    Like


  61. on April 24, 2009 at 1:28 pm Comment_Serious

    Let’s say a man didn’t want to wear the only appropriate male formal attire these days, a business suit.

    He can reject formality entirely… some men have done that.

    But let’s say he wanted to dress formal. Where would be his ‘masculine’ model in todays culture?

    Even very successful men all dress in their clone-boy business suits:

    4 men, with nearly identical suits, even though they vary in height, weight, and color. You could easily photo-shop those suits, one to another.

    As compared to women, who even for a board shot dress differently:

    6 women and at least four majorly different styles.

    Since the choice for ‘appropriate’ formal male attire has been reduced to one… a man who wants to do something else will probably end up imitating women.

    Because leaving his male options of 1 style of dress means he leaves all male examples.

    It’s really rather irritating.

    Like


  62. on April 24, 2009 at 1:29 pm ironrailsironweights

    As for dandies,when I was a child,two Irishmen dominated the hearts of the ladies:Paul McCartney and Sean Connery. One a preturnaturally nice-looking prettyboy,skinny and long haired who made beautiful music;the other a testosterone drenched darkly handsome muscled tough guy,who gave life to the character of an imaginary hired govt. killer. Who got more pussy? Thats a damn good question; I’d wager Sean,but I bet both were bested by the Welshman,Tom Jones.

    Tom Jones got married as a teenager and, despite some affairs, has been married to the same woman for over 50 years. Guess he’s had the best of both worlds.

    Peter

    Like


  63. i think there are several factors at play when a man dandifies himself…

    there is the risk/reward thing. a man takes a risk by dressing such as he does. as someone pointed out earlier, and there is a scientific term for it that escapes me (the peacock tail, lion’s mane, and deer antlers), a man displays value just by maintaining the status quo. he displays *greater* value by “surviving” despite taking on attributes that would seemingly weaken him.

    when i think of this, i’m picturing the book jacket of “Atlas Shrugged”. it shows the man with the world on his back, struggling, yet handling the added weight.

    also, that top picture bears a resemblance to other pics i’ve seen.

    Like


  64. Comment_Whatever,

    Im 34.

    Like


  65. Chuck, a straight guy might be more attracted to the female form than the male form, but the male form is still prettier…probably in part *because* of its utilitarianism.

    The female forms I can think of that are most beautiful are from cultures in which women were expected to be athletic and/or physically strong. Statues of Indian goddesses spring to mind.

    I think some people are uncomfortable with the idea of a male ideal beauty because it is empowering in a way that brings up fears of male homosexuality. It shouldn’t, but well, too many people are insecure.

    It’s anecdotal, but I’ve met more straight guys who say they have, at some point in life, encountered a male they might consider doing, than I’ve met straight women who say they’ve met a woman they’d consider doing, based on physical attractiveness alone. The male the straight guys mention was usually not a transexual or extremely feminine, just incredibly beautiful. The female the few straight women mention was usually very butch or looked like a man.

    It’s funny sometimes to ask questions you can only ask guys when they’re drunk. One of mine is a scenario where they’re away on a business trip, and a male celebrity is staying at the same hotel as them. They meet him in the bar, have a nice conversation, and then the guy asks him to come upstairs for you-know-what. Which male celebrity would they actually consider saying yes to?

    Most guys choose Tom Cruise. I had one very straight, very masculine bodybuilder answer Wesley Snipes. One answered Ben Affleck, and his friend chose Jude Law, and they playfully argued about which one of them was the gayest for his choice. Heheheheh…

    Like


  66. Dandy-ism done right is the opposite of boring. It also displays a total lack of fear of getting your ass whipped.

    Like


  67. on April 24, 2009 at 12:37 pm de Tocqueville

    Two points:

    1. He is correct that women are the arbiters of alphatude. If women understood this, they would rule the world. But most women are so deluded about what they think they want (versus what they really want) that they can’t grasp their own power. Women get annoyed by this blog thinking that it’s just a bunch of cavemen deciding what’s attractive and alpha BUT in reality, it’s a bunch of men using empirical evidence to cut through the fog of war that women emanate and to translate what women really think. The proof is in the pussy. If women really just wanted nice guys, the theory of game would not exist.

    2. Dandiness is irrelevant. The most important lubricating factors for women are (1) height and (2) confidence/power, and to a lesser extent, (3) good heart and (4) sense of humor. As long as the man has some combination of these factors, it doesn’t matter if he’s a flamboyant mustache-twirler, wears a burlap sack, or paints his toenails with glitter. Conversely, I don’t care how many zebra-striped hats you wear, if you’re short without extroverted confidence and aren’t a good conversationalist or talker, you’ll have some blue balls.

    Like


  68. Yeah women may decide whether these dandies get their attentions.

    But aging frat boys will still decide whether to give them a job. Imagine sitting across a desk from those so called Alphas? I wouldn’t let them push my shopping cart. . . . .

    Like


  69. As for dandies,when I was a child,two Irishmen dominated the hearts of the ladies:Paul McCartney and Sean Connery.

    Sean Connery is a SCOTSMAN, dam’ ye!

    Like


  70. “But aging frat boys will still decide whether to give them a job.”

    Where? The Mortgage Broker shop?

    – MPM

    Like


  71. Well, a guy can be a suit by day and a dandy by night.

    Like


  72. Right, but Israeli metrosexual culture (man-purse, hair, nail polish) is even more effeminate than American. I don’t think of “arsim” as either effeminate or metrosexual, and when I think of Sephardic dandyism, it’s not Zohar Argov but rather Enrico Macias, who is very much the French couturiers’ clothes horse, despite his actual Arab-Berber-Jewish-Algerian identity.

    Like


  73. looking at the male and female form from an artistic rather than sexual POV, i’d say the male form is more symmetrical and pleasing to the eye. the greeks idealized the male form for this reason.

    Sorry, but the main idealizers of the male form from the ancient Greeks to Michelangelo to Winckelmann to Walter Pater and moderns like Herb Ritts have been gay gay gay gay gay. So, while an man’s concern for his appearance shouldn’t be dismissed, one shouldn’t get carried away here.

    BTW isn’t it a shame that Michelangelo, the greatest visual artist ever, did horrible things to the female form. He appears to be the epitome of the female hating homosexual. I don’t think there is one genuine babe in all his vast output and there are some pretty nasty fuglies, including our mother Eve on the Sistine Chapel. The best representers of women, as far as I am concerned are Leonardo, Raphael and, my personal favourite, Botticelli. Ironically, it would seem that two of them were gay too.

    Like


  74. kick a bitch:

    I agree, masculinity is frowned upon right here in the US.

    But back to the dandies topic…
    “Dandies may never try to please, but in this one area they have a pleasing effect: by adopting psychological traits of the opposite sex, they appeal to our inherent narcissism.”- Robert Greene. Roberts intake gives this topic justice.

    Also, as far as mystery is concern, he has massive game. He doesn’t need all his lil feminine gimmicks to score. On the pick up artist i think it was the secound season, before the guys were up to appraoch, mystery first gave them a demonstration. He was saying something along the lines of,” And just to prove i dont need any of my accessories….i will take them off.”

    He went into the club with a plain gray t shirt and his black jeans..and bam, he still scored. Peacocking isn’t really all that, well maybe if your white it will help, but as a hispanic I always aims for to exude my masculinity. I’m sure the black men will say the same thing.

    Like


  75. Doesn’t Mystery have black nail polish or something like that?

    Like


  76. Thursday:

    Socrates was also a huge homo. He loved seducing young boys in training.

    I was shocked since socrates was a real mans man. He once said he worked out on his body physically everyday, because he would painfully regret reaching an old age, and “not feeling the true limits of his strength.”

    Like


  77. i believe that it will be discovered that the reason there are so many hot russian babes was the dearth of russian men after the two world wars.

    But then again this doesn’t apply to post-WW1 France or England, where a whole generation of young guys died. Or post-80s Iran/Iraq.

    The beauty of Russian/Slavic women may simply be a function of their fair features + pre-feminist taking care of themselves.

    Like


  78. black women’s focus on men’s looks is not indicative of the priorities of women of other races.

    Female dominated agriculture in Africa also explains black mens relative lack of pickiness as to the looks and the chastity/faithfulness of their mates. If they didn’t try and get in there at any and all opportunities, they wouldn’t have a chance to spread their genes. White men are on the whole just waaaaay pickier than black men on all fronts.

    Like


  79. Its all about swagger and holding your head up high. As long as you carry yourself like you have a set of balls, it doesn’t matter what you wear. Anything to separate you from the generic masses is a good thing, and if you can show off a little personality and style in the process, all the better.

    As someone mentioned with the antler theory, if you can wear something sorta fem and still be regarded as more of a man then the rest, you are demonstrating your value and security in your manhood.

    There is alot of truth in the saying “Real Men Wear Pink”

    PS: Style has to mesh with and accentuate your individual personality or else its just a costume others will see through. You cant just put on a dress and think you’ll be the biggest alpha at the club.

    Like


  80. Though I’ve never been to Russia, I have been all over east-Central Europe and took a look around to see of in fact the women are exceptional in beauty.

    What I mostly saw was pretty 6-7s with sexy personalities and nice fashion sense, very few fatties. I wonder it that’s too different from 1940s-50s America.

    Like


  81. Right now they are allowing themselves to be conquered, and the elites won’t even allow them to complain about it

    The white elites are as tough and ruthless as they were 100+ years ago. It’s just that now their genocidal attention has turned on non-elite whites.

    Like


  82. PA
    But then, the guys that was the leftover in Russia where a bunch of alcoholics, and that made the already slim number of guys even less, and close to impossible to find a normal guy,,, but then, i don’t think Russian women are that more beautiful then any other, but they sure spend 100% of their Money/time/effort, to be beautiful.

    Like


  83. Re softer races:black males as i understand it,have had a diffrent sex selection role than whites. They were NOT providers,but merely fought each other for the pussy. Their bones are thicker(why they dont swim so good),theyre more aggressive,more dominance-centered….( WHITE GUY:You took my fried chicken? Asshole!(gets more fried chicken.) BLACK GUY:You took my fried chicken?? You gonna die motherfucker!!! Shots fired….) have less body fat,less impulse control, less intelligence(sorry!:( ) and are basically more violent. I well recall getting jumped by a black on the bus in HS,I never saw that fist coming. The main reason,tho,that they integrated the Army so fast is that the all-black units deserted in battle so quickly! Theres a famous story of the all black artillery unit in the Battle of the Bulge—btw a ferocious counterattack whose well,ferocity,is rarely given its due–that surrendured w/o firing a shot. Stories of military,police,fire and rescue events always paint a similar picture:the white guys stay(relatively) cooler,on-mission and are braver. I think the white race is the bravest of them all,excepting the rare warrior groups like the Ghurkas…yet if the venue is who is the toughest throw-down thug,we whites–if untrained– will be pushed aside easily by the tough thug blacks. Story: When i was in Marine boot camp.a black male took a disliking to me and sometimes fucked with me. I shouldve smacked him,but didnt. One day we were practicing diving into the deep end. I did my dive. he was afraid–very. he looked at me incredulously:”How you DO that??”

    Like


  84. In 18th Century Europe and the Americas, the gentry wore stockings, heels, and wigs. The modern sense of appropriate menswear (jacket, tie, etc.) hasn’t changed much in maybe 100 years……..among the upper classes. What you wear has always represented status, reflecting your class, wealth, and power. In some ways the modern day interpretation of dandy-ism is something of a perversion. Dressing like Jack Sparrow, guyliner and all, communicates ample leisure time possibly even independent wealth but access to the vestiments of the upper classes has increased. Any man can look like a dandy so a man can fake higher status today more than he ever could in the past.

    Like


  85. ANSWER:
    when women no longer need men for money or security, and when the looming threat of pregnancy and unwanted children is mitigated, their priorities shift to choosing men for their colorful ornamentation, be that muscle, fashion, wit or humor.

    COROLLARY:
    in a multicult society like the USA where the four main races mingle, the “softer” races (white, asian) will stop competing head to head with the “harder” races (black, hispanic) and instead attempt to carve out their own sexual market niche to satisfy women’s innate desire for male status. these market niches open opportunities for men and take the form of dandyism, hipsterism, political activism, scenesterism, intellectual snobbery, PUAism and game, among others.

    Like


  86. What’s the pathogen load theory of female beauty?

    Basically, good looks are a good signal that you are able to resist disease, which is very important in more tropical areas. Hence, good looks will be more selected for in areas with a higher level of pathogens. The sweet spot for female beauty is probably the Mediterranean, where there was both a high enough level of pathogens and a high level of male choice, though male choice would seem to be the greater factor.

    Like


  87. My one fight with a black guy was when I was 31; got attacked by a thuggish dude about my age, a little shorter than me but heavier. It was a breeze. He ran away once I started machine-gun punching him all over the general location of his head and neck.

    The one adult fight I lost, and badly, was with a rednecky white guy who pinned me down (he was about 30 pounds heavier than me) pummelled the crap out of me.

    Based on my experience and just seeing things in general, I’d much rather fight a black than a white guy, size being equal. Black guys make a lot of noise prior to fighting and badly underestimate their opponent, especially the white ones.

    The white guy will just keep coming at you until he beats you to a pulp or gets beaten up himself. In other words, once the dogs are let loose, the white guy will take the fight much more seriously.

    Like


  88. ODB

    http://lookatthisfuckinghipster.tumblr.com/

    Wow. That site really is horrible.

    “scenesterism”

    What the heck is that?

    Sounds terrible.

    – MPM

    Like


  89. CH, since when are whites a soft race? We conquered the whole world, and our Alphas (in the buck sense, not the PUA sense) can hang with the best of them. SWPLs are not indicative of whites as a whole. They’re not even indicative of the upper middle class as a whole, they just dominate media.

    Like


  90. Liberals. Pardon my language.

    Like


  91. I’m not sure if I got this article from this very website or somewhere else, but it’s a good article relating to the subject: “Beware L’Homme Fatale!”

    Like


  92. Gotta cosign viciously w/JM-at 5’8″ I’ve never had any problem in the height department. Confidence is the key, I may be closer to Yoda in height, but I’ve always had a “Big Man” personality. In fact the main reason why I’ve dated a slew of Women pushing 6′ and over was precisely because of the fact that I never saw height, mine or hers, as a problem in the least.

    Remember fellas: Size, matters Not.😉

    O

    Like


  93. thursday:
    Hence the greater selection for female good looks among more northerly populations.

    this is undoubtedly the case. while the pathogen theory of female beauty may have some merit, i agree that male choice in low-resource northern climes was likely the greater engine spurring evolution of hotter white and asian babes.

    Hey, places like Spain and Italy may indeed have the hottest girls, but Russia and Sweden aren’t far behind.

    right. let’s not get carried away that southern euro chicks are that much hotter than russkies and baltics. while the evidence isn’t in (yet), i believe that it will be discovered that the reason there are so many hot russian babes was the dearth of russian men after the two world wars. fewer men = less competition = more options = choosier men.

    That said, this also means that African descended women probably have a greater appreciation for male good looks.

    this is what numbskulls like chic who prattle on and on about how a man’s looks are his most important attribute can’t seem to wrap their heads around, even after i have repeatedly explained it to them in my patient, gentle ways. black women’s focus on men’s looks is not indicative of the priorities of women of other races.

    Like


  94. “One weaknes of a dandy: does not offer a reassuring air of physical protection that women respond to at the most primal level.”

    Depends entirely on the dandy. I worked with a former linebacker for the Rams who was fond of Saville Row suits and pink neckties. Any woman who thinks this dude is fey and will run away at the first sign of danger because he wears pink ties has a freaking screw loose.

    Classic men’s suits generally don’t convey “weak sauce” to anybody but ignorant proles. In fact, if you do any bodybuilding, and aren’t careful with your suit drop, you’re going to look like a thug in a suit. Personally, I think retrosexual is the way to fly.

    Like


  95. Androgyny? I don’t know what that’s about. The closest I can envisualise is the Jack Sparrow character, but I think it was more the dastardly confidence and drunken silliness.

    I don’t get waxed male chests either.

    PA: So why do men get into so many fights?

    Jason: I have no personal experience, but don’t let the divorce happen and work it out. If there’s social pressure you can exert through relatives, use that. “This is between you and me. It’s not the kids’ problem. Don’t bring them into it.” The kids, the kids, the kids. You should be living in the same roof. Say it to her over and over again. I don’t know if pointing out your mutual failures or just her failures or just your failures or therapy (you speak of it like it’s torture. One hour a week with some person nodding at you, if you have the balls to be angry at her violation of your space, you have the balls to do that for god’s sake), ‘It won’t happen again’ or whatever lines will work and you have to make sure she doesn’t hold it over your head like an axe for the rest of the kids existence. There’s no point in trying to play happy families if she’s going to be 24/7 shrew and for you to both genuinely start over in some way.*

    But remember social/family contacts and the kids.

    My parents were seperated in all but name, but it was nice having them in the same house, even though it was seperate rooms. Now that I’m living away from one of them, I feel estranged and cut off from the man in question. Just today, I got a call from my mother asking me to wire some money from my account on behalf of my dad. It’s screwed up.

    This is where I get mad at you: CHEATING BASTARD. You deserve it (the children don’t), with your ‘dude, that marriage thing, I didn’t mean it’ and e-mails lying around of all things. Did you just leave it logged in for whomever wanted to to come by? Maybe you wanted her to find out.

    Example of what I’d instinctively go for but is a probable fail: ‘The cheating was a bad way to deal. I/we were not happy before then. Things need to change from before, I’ll always love you and the kids, and we’ll make it happen. I’m not going to let my family get ripped into pieces over this. You were dealing with so much, I didn’t want to make it worse and just deal with my issues on my own. It’s fucked up, but I thought if I didn’t bother you, that would be better for you.’
    That’s a nice speech, but God knows if she’ll remember it, just think it’s beta or if the trust has broken down so much she doesn’t believe one word from your lying mouth… I’m imagining shrieks of ‘How am I supposed to trust you?!’

    Understand that domestic dispute can be the same even if you’re living seperately. The kids still feel the tension and are caught in the middle of it often as pawns, spokespeople or spies. Couples can rationalise wanting to not live together for your own happiness, not theirs. I feel quite strongly about this because I’ve seen how bad kids can end up from broken families, even the ones with parents who’re trying their best to be civil, be 50-50, not argue with each other in front of the kid and make them the number one priority. On the other hand, you two could be complete asses to each other and they could turn out perfectly fine. The only side effect is that a disappearing parent or a dependent one is something that I think fosters less love and respect in the kids’ hearts for their parents.

    Imagine a messy divorce, a parade of men in the kids’ lives that aren’t you or watching mom alone and bitter… what’re the kids thinking and feeling even now? Harsh. I hope she doesn’t use them as pawns against you.

    Like


  96. ASDF:
    since when are whites a soft race? We conquered the whole world,

    that was then, this is now.

    and our Alphas (in the buck sense, not the PUA sense) can hang with the best of them.

    there is a rapid cognitive stratification of the West occuring right now. the guys making the bucks are the guys lucky to be born with the right genes for intelligence and diligence. and yes, those guys can cash in for high quality and quantity pussy. but not like they used to. as women are becoming richer, their screening mechanism is honing in on attractive physical and psychological male attributes at the expense of male provider attributes.

    SWPLs are not indicative of whites as a whole.

    elites drag the country in their wake, whether we like it or not.
    there is one exception to the above: revolution.

    They’re not even indicative of the upper middle class as a whole, they just dominate media.

    we live in an information age and the media is our pimp daddy. that is the seat of power.

    Like


  97. Female dominated agriculture in Africa also explains black mens relative lack of pickiness as to the looks and the chastity/faithfulness of their mates.

    Allegedly, I’ve heard that black women essentially function to the inverse of white and Asian women. In other words, black women in their pursuit of good looking men essentially “pay” their men to have sex with them, while white men “pay” their women.

    Of course, female dominated agriculture essentially sounds like single-motherhood, and I’d wonder if in such natural conditions, this weeds out women with low testosterone levels. In other words, does this explain the masculine appearance of black women and possibly the stereotypes of black women as bitchy, mean, and perpetually upset? If you’re alone, you’d need such mannerisms in order to protect your family.

    Like


  98. Thursday — What’s the pathogen load theory of female beauty?

    Like


  99. on April 24, 2009 at 3:10 pm ironrailsironweights

    I don’t get waxed male chests either.

    I can think of something much, much worse.

    Peter

    Like


  100. Mini-epiphany: The advantages of having a system where a woman accepts a cheating husband has just been cleared to me. I know an Arab in an Arabic country in this same situation (she came to me raging, asking for libido destroying drugs for him to stop it)who’s staying with her husband: financial, social, the children and so on. Whatever they were, they were powerful enough for this ordinarily ball-busting woman to not consider leaving her husband. It doesn’t look like she’s exposed the children to any of this either. Even though it’s a fairly crap deal for the woman in question who may turn into a crazed suppressed rage-filled demon, the family seems overall better off.

    Like


  101. Anthropologist Peter Frost has recently been posting about the gayification of straight men’s tastes in women as well as in what they want to look like. He says it’s been going on for roughly a century, so since before the widespread availability of effective contraception, vacuum cleaners etc. The stuff’s worth reading – see http://evoandproud.blogspot.com

    One of those posts inspired my pathogen theory of progressivism.

    On a less sciency note, I definitely agree with Lupo about suits, though I personally don’t mind looking like a thug in one. “Successful upscale thug” is a good look.

    Like


  102. Are those pictures of the same dandy at different age? They look very much alike.

    Like


  103. Jason, you fucked up.

    I’ll put it another way: You are fucked.

    First off, you agreed to a strictly monogamous relationship, when you’re obviously not cut out for that.

    Whatever happens, you pretty much deserve based on that alone. You lied to yourself, and then you conned someone else into living your lie, and created two innocent people who are now going to suffer because they were made based on a lie.

    The best thing you can do at this point is stop living a lie. Then you’ll at least be able to continue with some semblance of dignity. What ever costs you’ll have to pay will be in the name of truth and fairness to you and those you’ll cause suffering by continuing to live a lie.

    While you two are working things out, you can start with the truth. Don’t make excuses, and don’t try to pretend that you’re going to tow the line if you’re not. Whatever was missing that didn’t inspire you to be honest about yourself in the first place, or ask for a renegotiation once you knew you might think your family was worth risking for some external pussy, isn’t going to magically appear out of nowhere.

    The two somewhat spherical objects a guy has to have to live on the face have to descend and take some time to grow.

    She also deserves the option to continue the relationship or end it based on reality, not on the lie that you were living up to the point that you got caught.

    Good luck.

    Like


  104. JohnM,
    Coming from several generations of Marines, and having known quite a few Black Marines on top of that, I’d have to respectfully disagree with your assessment. I don’t deny that there were cowards amonb Black servicement, but I’d say no more than one would find among the White, and in in fact, if the shoe were on the other foot we might find quite a few White guys running off the field. The Tuskeegee Airmen and the Buffalo Soldiers are only two real quick examples of military valor on the part of African Americans.

    As for your comments about African mating patterns, while I don’t completely toss it out the window, I think we need to be a bit more careful with it. Africa is a big place, and in fact West Africa, and East Africa for that matter, is a weebit different than sub-Saharan Africa, which is where a great deal of focus seems to center when it comes to such discussions.

    O

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  105. I will def rock the thug suit look (basically, just-covers-the-ass jackets with tapered waists; thick pin stripes for the win) for poker games and some kinds of seedy bars. Mostly though, I’d prefer to look like a gentleman. I work in finance; the last thing I want to convey to my audience is “fingerbreaker.” I have too much of that already.

    Chicks totally dig the suited thug look though.

    There’s also the “loud salesman” look, which can be pretty great for a somewhat different reason. Checks make you look bigger and louder. If you’re already reasonably big and loud, it’s a look that can rule the school. You have to be a real character to pull it off; otherwise you’re just a dork with poor taste, but if you can do it: peacock awesomeness in loud check:

    Like


  106. DC Has 0 Style

    “For example, in somewhere like California where long hair never went out of style you can find some seriously alpha long hairs. Just ask G Manifesto to tell you about some hardcore ass surfer punching someone’s face in for dropping in on his wave. Shit I’ve seen it.”

    Absolutely correct.

    I have had long hair many times in my life.

    Beach culture has always had Alpha long hairs.

    Traveling, surfing, living.

    Some of the toughest cats you will meet are long haired traveling surfer expats.

    Roll down to Norte Baja (a place I know like the back of my hand). Plenty of outsiders living on the edge of life.

    Classic characters.

    – MPM

    Like


  107. on April 24, 2009 at 3:36 pm Gunslingergregi

    I had a friend like this in high school he went gay was like pretty got lots of girls wore the earing bla bla. Anyway. LoL

    Like


  108. i totally cosign everything ‘whatever’ said. “dandy” quirks and fashion choices indicate self confidence. a man that isn’t afraid to be an individual and attract a bit of attention to himself.

    otoh, if he’s adopting a style or accessory or nail polish because he read about it on a blog and/or is trying to be like other guys he knows, it will be an epic fail.

    hint: if you walk into a bar and notice other guys sporting your same quirky/dandy look or accessory, it’s time for a change. your look should make you stand out, not blend in.

    Like


  109. Dave Alex,
    Keep in mind please, that Italian Women, Arab Women, heck, even Indian Women (east) are also known for their fiery ways. Black/African hardly have the lock on that.

    O

    Like


  110. oh, and @jason: the best thing you can do is say “if that’s what you want, fine.” hang up. hire a good lawyer.

    Like


  111. on April 24, 2009 at 3:43 pm Cannon's Canon

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  112. db

    “dandy” quirks and fashion choices indicate self confidence. a man that isn’t afraid to be an individual and attract a bit of attention to himself.

    otoh, if he’s adopting a style or accessory or nail polish because he read about it on a blog and/or is trying to be like other guys he knows, it will be an epic fail.

    hint: if you walk into a bar and notice other guys sporting your same quirky/dandy look or accessory, it’s time for a change. your look should make you stand out, not blend in.

    Leader versus follower, put graphically. Good comment.

    Like


  113. Jason:

    You’re fucked. Get a lawyer. Your marriage wasn’t going very well; neither you nor your wife was happy. My wife hasn’t busted me cheating, but if she did, she wouldn’t ask for a divorce; she’d ask me to end the cheating. I might or I might not, but I wouldn’t apologize….I’d just say, “it was something I needed to do.” No apologies.

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  114. About Jason, he was cheating on her when the sex stopped.

    He needs to stop wasting her time and legally free her to find someone who does want to have sex with her.

    Like


  115. Jason’s beta behaviour plus his lack of efforts of hiding it from his wife make me believe that his wife has an affair. Divorce is certain

    Like


  116. Women care more about looks in some milieus than in others. Chic is from the fashion world, where everyone, whatever their sex or sexual orientation, cares about looks more than anything else.

    Oh, and the reason why men’s appearance, whether it be rugged and muscular or dandified and effete, counts for so much more now than 30 years ago, is the same reason that women’s looks are so much more important now: you meet each other in casual situations in which you can’t/don’t get to know each other, and the only medium by which to judge a person is his or her looks. “Game” can help men, but they need to get close enough to use it first, and in a place like a crowded and noisy bar, that can be difficult.

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  117. A person’s physical appearance can tell a lot about their personality. Basically, stereotyping. The first 3 pictures would lead me to believe that those guys are either musicians or artists (maybe writers?), or they are really into art of music. If a woman is into that type of person, they they would be attracted to guys who look like the 3 in those pictures. While “surfers” also are stereotypically long-haired, they have a completely different look and would possibly attract a different type of woman.

    That’s my take on it at least, I haven’t had lengthy discussions about androgyny with my female friends, but I do know that we all are attracted to different kinds of guys (personality-wise and physically).

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  118. Great, so instead of dressing like a douchebag, an old lesbian, or a thug, relatively normal guys apparently have to develop game or become good looking. As for the whole hard/soft thing, Willard, your you tube clip showed a lot of thugged up white guys.

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  119. Peacocking is a classic display of wealth- “I can waste my time and resources on my pretty looks cause I’m not some low class manual laborer who works all day getting his hands dirty.” It just draws on a womans primal desire for mates with resources to provide for their children.

    Also, a point that no one seems to acknowledge is that good looks in a male is the second (although a distant second) most desirable trait behind dominance. The reason for this is so damn obvious: daughters (50% of offspring) born to a pretty man and pretty woman will almost certainly be physically attractive, and in consequence be highly sought after by high status males- ensuring that these “pretty” genes are passed on to the next generation. Natural selection at its finest.

    Like


  120. re: Jason,

    i’m sorry, but if in 13 years a man manages to only cheat ONCE? that’s damn good. and before any of you chicks jump on my case, you have no idea the mental derangement that comes from walking around with a rock hard erection. until you do, you have no idea the type of temptation men battle daily. jason’s wife is crazy if she throws away 13 years over one infidelity.

    Like


  121. on April 24, 2009 at 4:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    Fuck a lawyer jason cut off the first joint of your pinky finger to prove you won’t be a lieing sack of shit again to her. Should work fine.

    Like


  122. on April 24, 2009 at 4:19 pm Gunslingergregi

    Then next time you want to fuck another woman just tell her about it beforehand.

    Like


  123. on April 24, 2009 at 4:20 pm Tupac Chopra

    Peacocking is a classic display of wealth- “I can waste my time and resources on my pretty looks cause I’m not some low class manual laborer who works all day getting his hands dirty.” It just draws on a womans primal desire for mates with resources to provide for their children.

    This is why I think the trend towards dandyism is a fool’s errand for alphas.

    Yes, you will get more female attention.

    Yes, you will get more “dates”

    Yes, you may even get more girlfriends.

    But you will have done so by basically advertising toward the provider instincts in women.

    And as we all know, this does not lubricate the Vaj.

    Masculinity and dominance does.

    So I guess if you’re a beta who wants to cuddle wuddle and play footsies with your hipster girlfriend, by all means…

    But if you want a woman to worship you and your cock, I recommend another tack.

    Like


  124. Birth control pills alter what types of men women find attractive:

    http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=birth-control-pills-affect-womens-taste

    “Recent research suggests that the contraceptive pill—which prevents women from ovulating by fooling their body into believing it is pregnant—could affect which types of men women desire.”

    This is just one study, and would only partially account for what women find attractive, but given that the pill messes with a woman’s hormones, isn’t it likely that, at a gut level, this will make them find dandyfied men more attractive?

    If this is true, even women who aren’t on the pill will be influenced by their friends who are, thus altering female standards of attractiveness from what they would be naturally.

    Like


  125. We’ve talked about how divorce rips society, children and a man’s finance into millions of little pieces; now it’s all ‘oh, she’s kinda pissed and well, it wasn’t working anyway. Yeah, go straight to lawyer, do not pass Go, do not try to solve like you should have done before and while you were still on the highground, you should be free’ even though there’s apparently no real benefit to it. Who’s destroying the American family and a man’s living now? Who’s giving up and practically handing over the money and the children, empowering the state now? Who’s giving up because they failed? It’s not ‘get out while you can’, it’s ‘it’s too late to get out.’

    We thinking the lawyers are magicians? You going to sit back and take it, take the option of backing out and giving up and join the ‘victims’ of feminism, of male masses? (READ: to be freed, and have as many lovely coworkers until the eventual burn out happens — without being annoyed about it — as much as you like, while Ms Mother bitterly takes as much out of you for the pain of her existence as possible.) Who’s going to take responsibility for themselves and their actions?

    Questions on US Law: Does she really have any power before they enter that court? Is she going to insist the divorce goes through if he under no circumstances agrees and uses all his social, financial and legal power to stop it?

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  126. Tupac:

    > But if you want a woman to worship you and your cock, I recommend another tack.

    How about “I’m a badass gangsta gunrunner that after a hard day of disciplining punks, likes wears to fur to the speakeasy to unwind. Anyone who talks shit to me gets taken for a long walk off a short pier by one of the large gentlemen in my entourage, capiche?”

    Like


  127. Suits? Social Suicide’s The Shark. In the proper shade of grey, of course. (I sure wouldn’t mind getting fitted at Anderson and Sheppard though. Even Prince Charles looks good in those suckers.)

    South of Geneva, I’d go for Brioni, Kiton. Actually, make sure you fit in one and you can’t really go wrong with Brioni. Marinella tie.

    Like


  128. Jason–

    I’m not going to sugar coat it. You’re in a very tough situation.

    O- The sex life was non existent, not necessarily because of her. Truthfully I didnt want to fuck her. I wasnt feeling it. We just had a kid and there were other issues with our marriage.

    That is of course poison. You probably have no idea how poison it is for her, now that she knows you were having sex elsewhere. Still, divorce for her would be very tough at this stage too, unless maybe you really make big money. Do you?

    The worst thing you can do though is grovel, or endlesslessly apologize for your cheating. You’ve done that. Don’t repeat it. Refuse to. Seriously. Instead focus on what was wrong with your marriage. Focus on why the no sex with your wife.

    What were the other issues in the marriage? Did you clearly wear the pants, or was she always nagging, and you complying, and so on?

    Where do you honestly think you fall on the alpha / beta scale. I’m talking subgroups (lesser, greater, etc.) How about your wife?

    You’re both in your early thirties?

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  129. Tupac Chopra–

    But if you want a woman to worship you and your cock, I recommend another tack.

    The feminized look is not for me either.

    Like


  130. Bhetti-

    We’ve talked about how divorce rips society, children and a man’s finance into millions of little pieces; now it’s all ‘oh, she’s kinda pissed and well, it wasn’t working anyway. Yeah, go straight to lawyer, do not pass Go, do not try to solve like you should have done before and while you were still on the highground,

    That’s not what I’m telling him, considering the two infant kids. Though I need more info.

    Like


  131. The thing about being an alpha male surrounded by betas in the natural state is that your harem years only last so long. After a golden few, you have a hunting accident or, if you’re a chimp, you get the living shit beaten out of you and perhaps your balls chewed off … and your trusted lieutenants rise to the top instead.

    Like


  132. The mustaches in the picture are not handlebar mustaches.

    The mustaches of Hulk Hogan, Gene Shalit, and Merv Hughes are handlebar mustaches.

    They can be quite masculine, if done properly.

    I will NOT wear black nail-polish, no matter how much value it has in Game.

    A man can dress well in a MASCULINE sense, like James Bond or Samuel L. Jackson. Even Bill Cosby’s sweaters are a trademark.

    The most Alpha Male of all time, however, wore clothes that only HE could make masculine : The Macho Man Randy Savage. Now, THAT is a role model for both Alpha behavior as well as peacocking.

    Like


  133. Talking about suits + Glengarry: Demonstrate the awesomeness of Shark with pics, please. Google isn’t being a good boy to me. Brioni = James Bond suit, says google. Hot.

    Whiskey: I think it’s the sex-driven female that loves dandies insanely, from my brief experience, although it does makes sense on a global level to me. If you’re looking for LTR material… probably not the way to go as well.

    Aw at men’s little core of mushiness. The sensitivity seems so strange.

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  134. on April 24, 2009 at 4:50 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “I see plenty of white chicks with black guys, but hardly any white guys with black chicks.”

    We have been over this. It is because there are far too few black women who qualify as highly attractive.

    The one-in-500,000 black women who ARE 9s and 10s, quite often end up with white guys.

    Like


  135. and white chicks want to see if the myths are real, plus blacks are perceived as the toughest men overall, and women like dickhead tough guys.

    Like


  136. on April 24, 2009 at 4:52 pm Gunslingergregi

    If you find yourself wearing black nail polish you are probably gay or at least bi.

    Like


  137. It is because there are far too few black women who qualify as highly attractive.

    plus most black women aren’t attracted to white men. it’s a mutual disinterest.

    Like


  138. Again, if a man is puny and pale-skinned, flamboyant attire looks faggotty.

    If a man is muscular and tanned, then long hair, jewelry, and flamboyant clothes can be very alpha. Check out fashion model Fabio, or many pro-Wrestlers of the 1985-85 period. Randy Savage, Razor Ramon, Ric Flair, and Shawn Michaels come to mind.

    Don’t forget Mr. T. You have to be muscular and look tough as nails to pull off feathered earrings, an extreme amount of jewelry, and a mohawk.

    Like


  139. on April 24, 2009 at 3:56 pm Tupac Chopra

    Doug:

    This Adam Carolla video link explains — and certainly illustrates — the phenomenon quite nicely.

    It all comes down to being a leader rather than a follower.

    I’d say that Carolla link does the opposite of what you are saying. He seems to be saying that unless you align yourself with some subculture or another which possesses its own look or “uniform”, you get passed over by the ladies for refusing to join.

    Like


  140. on April 24, 2009 at 4:56 pm Gunslingergregi

    I may get some more suits before I cut out of here. Iraq has turkish tailors on site.

    Like


  141. on April 24, 2009 at 4:56 pm Gunslingergregi

    They make the suits from scratch.

    Like


  142. on April 24, 2009 at 4:57 pm Gunslingergregi

    Just tailored pants no suit are comfortable.

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  143. on April 24, 2009 at 4:59 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “plus most black women aren’t attracted to white men. it’s a mutual disinterest.”

    Not true. The ones who *can* go white, invariably do.

    Like


  144. Gunny: Props on pinky comment. That’s one hell of a way to prove loyalty. Try putting on black nail polish in Iraq…

    …on second thought, really don’t want you to be brutally injured, so going to make it clear that was a ‘thought experiment’ suggestion.

    Like


  145. I dunno about black women being unattractive. The perv that I am, I do catch myself checking out late-teen-thru-early-20s black chicks on the Metro. Gaggles of them flood the subway cars in the early afternoon.

    That wasn’t always so. I don’t remember them always being hot. Loud and nasty/obnoxious would have been my description of them before. Now, I’ll catch regularly see real hot ones in the bunch. Could it be changes in black hairstyle / makeup / clothes?

    But it’s true in my observation that the very feminine and traditionally beautiful black girls who are 9s and 10s usually date/marry white guys.

    Like


  146. on April 24, 2009 at 5:06 pm Gunslingergregi

    Probably what keeps the g man alive noone wants to ruin a good suit he he he

    Like


  147. on April 24, 2009 at 5:08 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “But it’s true in my observation that the very feminine and traditionally beautiful black girls who are 9s and 10s usually date/marry white guys.”

    That is what I am saying. Black women who are 9s and 10s are so rare that you might go 2 years without even seeing one. They marry white guys, unless they can get a Dione Sanders or comparable top athelete.

    Tamron Hall is a 10, head to toe. She has tremendous tracts of land. A woman of such exquiste beauty is extremely rare, and is guaranteed a career in TV, film, music, or fashion.

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  148. “plus most black women aren’t attracted to white men. it’s a mutual disinterest.”

    —absolutely false. I’ve pointed out that I’ve been hit on by black women a ton when I lived in a black neighborhood.

    For them, feigning non-interest is a method of self-defense; they try to pretend they rejected you before you reject them.

    For a non-racial version of this, go to a strip club and pick out the ugliest stripper. She will invariably also be the biggest bitch/toughest broad there, constantly shit-testing people, giving attitude, etc. She knows she won’t win on looks alone, so develops this persona that some men try to pierce (which both garners her more money than with a nicer attitude and protects her ego).

    This might not jive with the idea that fat girls are nicer, but the latter situation the fat girls just want a bf, whereas the others are more materialistic/looking for a fuck.

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  149. @Tood
    I’d say if a male is tanned and muscular and trying to pull of the longer hair, etc. that it looks more ridiculous than a pale, skinny guy. Most of the people you listed as examples are not men that a lot of women would find attractive.

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  150. whatever you want to believe lurker. but on average, black women are the most hesitant of all races to date outside their race.

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  151. Not true. The ones who *can* go white, invariably do.

    oh yes, that’s why none of those black female 9s and 10s will never be seen on the arms of black actors, athletes, rappers and singers. because black 9’s and 10’s “invariably” go white. lol. get the fuck outta here, lol….

    Like


  152. on April 24, 2009 at 5:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””on April 24, 2009 at 12:37 pm PA
    Jason — assuming your question is for real and not trolling — do you want to save the marriage? If not, then just lawyer up today, and follow the lawyer’s advice.

    If you do, then be hands-off and see how things progress. let her yell and let her cry. Women will often forgive an inconsequential straying once they get the yelling out of their system.

    “im not sure if this (marriage) is going to work.”

    That was idiotic, and that’s what makes me suspect that your question is not for real.””””””””””””””””””””””””

    PA already pointed it out. If jason already crossed the line as in this is over then it is over. I’d say only redemption could be the pinky thing and she would understand she could trust him again.

    I got lucky I learned my lessons on cheating before I married so I never cheated in the marriage. Even when I said it was over and wanted her to leave. I went to bar and this chick won the best tits wet t shirt contest. The bar is closing and she proceeds to walk up to my table which I sat at all night by myself and asks me what I am looking for. I was able to not do shit. When younger It was actually my alpha friend who got me hooked up with the prettiest girl I have really ever seen. We met her and her mom at the mall. I didn’t even say shit to her. She asked my friend to hook us up lol. But yea went camping had sucker bites on my neck when I came back and look who shows up at my friends girlfriends house. My girl and her mom. Well I didn’t realize till later I had these big ass sucker bites on my neck. Was fucked up. Didn’t realize implications at that age. Why I say just be honest. Wierd thing is the chick still didn’t want to leave me. Then in school some chick walks up with some note that I’m fucking her too. Shit got out of control he he he

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  153. but on average, black women are the most hesitant of all races to date outside their race.

    Nah. It’s white women. Unless you’re talking fat fatherless blonde Walmart trash, the white girls who date black are with black guys who are exceptional among their own kind, be it game, money, looks, intelligence, etc.

    In other words, non-trash white females who date blacks are choosing elite black males over average white ones.

    Like


  154. Some white men on this site are extremely delusional and have low self esteem.

    Your responses about black men prove that your a dandy. Stop worrying about another man. If your are a real man. It wouldn’t matter how much essence another man has.

    You are showing your insecurity by trying to be an Interenet tough guy.

    Also. Bigots are that way because they usually come up short other areas in life. Deal with it.

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  155. here’s a study university of chicago did showing that black women are the most averse to interracial dating of all races:

    http://tierneylab.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/04/13/single-female-seeking-same-race-male/

    most interesting part of the finding:

    For equal success with an African-American woman, a Hispanic man needs to earn an extra $184,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $220,000.

    For equal success with a white woman, an African-American needs to earn an additional $154,000; a Hispanic man needs $77,000; an Asian needs $247,000.

    For equal success with a Hispanic woman, an African-American man needs to earn an additional $30,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $59,000.

    For equal success with an Asian woman, an African-American needs no additional income; a white man needs $24,000 less than average; a Hispanic man needs $28,000 more than average.

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  156. i would tentatively agree that black female 9’s would choose white males; it’s hard to decipher with the dearth of sociological data – it’s deemed not PC.

    If hi quality black females reject stereotypical black male “toughness” values and choose white men, that is significant.

    Just as quality white females rejecting white male hipsterism etc poses questions.

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  157. since black 9s and 10s invariably go white, does that mean jay-z is secretly white guy?

    Like


  158. absolutely false. I’ve pointed out that I’ve been hit on by black women a ton when I lived in a black neighborhood.

    so what? every black girl i know, even 6s, 7s, and 8s, also has stories of being hit on a ton by white men as well.

    doesn’t change fact that overall, white men and black women mutually don’t have much attraction for each other on average. black woman has to be extra hot to get a white man’s attention, white man has to have extra status and money compared to the black men she usually dates to get black woman.

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  159. I like GNXP’s practice of deleting comments from people who are too lazy to pick a handle.

    Like


  160. Bhetti — men fight over women. Because it works. At it’s base level, particularly once beyond hunter-gatherer societies, men can get together and conquer the neighbor’s, enslave their women and kill the men. Men fight because women have sex with the winners. Sometimes willingly, sometimes not. Ugly but true.

    He is right. The loss of Beta provider status as a “winning” strategy for women allows them to trade off on more satisfying characteristics that have no longer appreciable risk attached to them.

    It’s like buying a car, that might break down and require frequent maintenance. If you already have access to a fleet of taxis at your disposable and lots of money the dependable grocery getter is ditched in favor of the exotic and exciting but unreliable and high-maintenance exotic car.

    Celebrities rarely drive boring old beaters, they mostly drive exotic stuff that displays their power and status. What do they care if it breaks down? Call the limo!

    On a lesser scale, that’s the change in women’s choice.

    And it is VERY hard for men to go the dandy route. Look at how much men hate it here and on the sites linked. Men for the most part HATE being dandy. They identify it with being gay/female, unmanly. It conflicts with their image of being able to take a punch and give one out, handy enough to fix things, and tough enough to endure.

    More importantly, it makes them from self-centered, “I am what I am based on inner toughness” to female-centered “I am what women think of me” which is VERY hard for most men to take out of fear of female rejection. Any guy is willing to take on at least toughness challenges, physical pain, etc. and tests of endurance. An instant of rejection, based on your whole person from a woman? No. Men go to great lengths to avoid it and try to signal with other means (Adventure Sports being a prime example).

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  161. In other words, non-trash white females who date blacks are choosing elite black males over average white ones.

    same goes for non-trash black women. the problem is, lot more broke low status black women than there are broke low status white women. isolate black and white women of same status and class and it takes white guy more status and money to score a black woman than it takes for black guy to score white woman as shown by study.

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  162. on April 24, 2009 at 5:34 pm Gunslingergregi

    Really why it is important to learn certain lessons young. Like that your actions can hurt another human being. Things have consequenses. When your in the alpha zone though things like peoples feelings do tend to take a back seat to you living your life however the fuck you want. Like why I don’t like the severe punishment for dui because the kids that get them don’t realize at the time the consequences are so huge.

    Like


  163. on April 24, 2009 at 5:42 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Jason – I’ll second Bhetti’s & Doug’s advice…you need to get her to focus on the kids and who would be hurt the most by divorce.

    You already apologized. Done.
    Whatever happens from here on out, that should be it.

    She’s pissed at you. She’s furious. She’s angry.

    But you can survive that…IF she doesn’t have CONTEMPT for you if she perceives you to be a beta.

    Grovelling and begging for forgiveness will only inspire that marriage killing contempt.

    You should be honest with her, and tell her exactly why you no longer were sexually attracted to her, and what part she played in killing your desire for her.

    Without apologizing again, you can admit you were wrong in seeking sex elsewhere instead of dealing directly with your issues as to why you no longer wanted to have sex with her. Don’t take ALL the blame here…make her at least realize that she definitely played a part in this marital crisis.

    It usually takes two to make a marriage fail. Own up to your failures…but only if you can get her to acknowledge and admit her part in the failure as well.

    And keep the focus on doing what’s best for the kids.

    You can tell her: I’m not happy being married to a woman that I am no longer sexually attracted to, but I’ll work on it with you for the kids sake.

    If she can’t agree with that and refuses to see your points on working it out for the kids sake, than you need to lawyer up ASAP.

    One final point: in this discussion, where she tells you that you need to leave the house, she wants to be alone, etc….I would strongly suggest that you flip that script immediately.

    Tell her you will NOT leave YOUR house that you have worked and paid for. Tell her if she wants to go, she can, but you are not exiling yourself.

    But you must also remember the most important in all of this: no matter how mad she may get, no matter how mad you may get, do not DO NOT yell, scream, threaten, or break or destroy things in the house. Just be calm and as non-emotional as you can be. Do not let her suck you into her emotional turmoil.

    The minute you let your emotions get out of control, she will have the trump card in any future divorce proceedings she can file against you…including a restraining order and arrest for “threatening behavior.”

    Yeah, you made a mistake. Just remember that this is supposed to be a ‘no-fault’ divorce country. So don’t concede ANYTHING or agree to anything unless you have a lawyer advising you. Don’t feel like you can do things that will “help the situation” out of a sense of guilt on your part. It will only be used against you, and re-affirm any sense of “IT’S ALL HIS FAULT THAT THIS MARRIAGE HAS FAILED” in her mind.

    It takes two people to make a marriage work, and it takes two to make it fail.

    Don’t let her get it firmly planted in her mind that this is all YOUR fault. She had a part to play in it for certain. If you let her think like that, and do not get her to face the part she played in why you went elsewhere for sex, you will find yourself in a divorce with a woman who has all the self-justification and rationalization set in her mind to have no qualms in using the full power of the courts to get as much as she can from you, as well as justify alienating your children from you. In her mind, she will not see anything wrong with turning your children against you, since it was all YOUR fault.

    Good luck.

    Like


  164. Well, I see GNP is in rare form, LOL. Hey Apeman, you ever get around to interviewing those several thousand Sistas at UPenn yet? Holla back, I’m very interested in the results.

    Firepower, I think what you’re seeing on the college campus could be indicative of something else-perhaps those White Women who dated Black Men were dating Black Men who could find their way into an environment that’s a bit closer to what a lot of White guys are used to. In other words, based on what you said, it is not clear that these same White Women would go in for say, a Nelly or 50 Cent type of Black Man. Having said that though, depending on where you went to school, a big sports program could draw more “Alpha” Black Males, which the White Females could be drawn to. So, I would need a bit more specific information on what you’ve been seeing there, if you don’t mind.

    Oh, and yea, its largely true-most Black Women don’t find White Men as a rule all that sexy. This includes quite a few who could “go White” if they so choose. Trust me.

    O

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  165. “Most of the people you listed as examples are not men that a lot of women would find attractive.”

    Are you insane? Shawn Michaels and Ric Flair were legendary womanizers. Razor Ramon’s ‘Chicas are for fun’ vignettes were priceless.

    Randy Savage’s storyline with Miss Elizabeth was the sole factor a female audience was drawn to wrestling at the time. That was THE ultimate alpha-male/submissive damsel love story of our era.

    Shows how little you know.

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  166. on April 24, 2009 at 5:53 pm Gunslingergregi

    Dave,
    This dude fucked the goat man. He has got to pay something. He knew he would pay something. Boo Fucking hoo. I mean this is your woman right you had kids with her. Come up with some logical shit to solve the dilema. Man up time. Think about future scenerios of each action from here on out. Then go with one. She will probably never forget this and will give you payback in the future. When it happens act surprized maybe it will make you even. Either way a good learning tool for the rest of your life.

    Like


  167. on April 24, 2009 at 5:56 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Obsidian,

    Whatchhootalkkin’bout Obsidian? We have established that U of Michigan (where I was for twice as long as my time at UPenn) has thousands of black students, enabling me to see enough to put forth my opinion.

    UPenn has not as many, but quite a few nonetheless. Plus, it is in West Philly, where lots of other black women reside (thus simulating a Howard U setting).

    But the fact that you are going out of your way to ignore the Michigan point proves that you know it proves my bonafides.

    I also showed you mathematically how there are only 30 black women in America who would quaility as 9s or 10s. All of them are visible in TV, film, music, and fashion. If the prevalent obesity of black women dropped, this number could rise dramatically.

    Halle Berry does not count as a black woman, as she is half-white, and thus probably only 40-45% black (given that her black parent is not 100% black). Nonetheless, she still has great tracts of land.

    Like


  168. In other words, non-trash white females who date blacks are choosing elite black males over average white ones.

    Depressing, yet true. Given my current low status, it’s why I pretty much tarred non-date girl with the white trash label when she started to show interest in me. Hell, I labelled Wellesley Queen as white trash when she used to start talking to me, and I presumed she was a single mom with a kid, instead of a 17 year old high school student bored with high school classes. Hell, nearly every white girl I’ve met, a few conversations and observations about her family, and they’re labelled as trash or prole or tomboyish…

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  169. on April 24, 2009 at 6:00 pm Dave from Hawaii

    This dude fucked the goat man. He has got to pay something. He knew he would pay something. Boo Fucking hoo.

    Yup. All true. But my only real concern here is that his KIDS do not pay the price for their parents mistakes. He’s gotta pay…but for the kids sake, he SHOULD try to reconcile and make it work. And grovelling and apologizing for “his” mistake is the one thing that for certain is NOT going to work.

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  170. PA:

    “Based on my experience and just seeing things in general, I’d much rather fight a black than a white guy, size being equal.”

    The problem is that their size isn’t usually equal. Black dudes are more muscular in general, which all else being equal, gives them an advantage over white dudes.

    I see it like this…black dudes usually shy away from 1-on-1 fights. if you square up to a black dude 1-on-1 there’s a decent chance he can back it up…white dudes, at least at bars and those types of places are more quick to get into situations they aren’t physically prepared for. granted, i tend to hang around places that are more frequented by frat guys than bikers.

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  171. gnp is for apes, your mathematical proofs are astounding! i never knew that *invariably* all black 9s and 10s go for white guys. invariably! so is beyonce not a 9 or 10 or is jay-z secretly white? and only one in 30 black women in all of america are 9s or 10s? interesting. you get this from center for stats pulled out of your ass or the bureau of wishful thinking. as long as proof by assertion counts as fact round here, guess what, i had a threesome with monica bellucci and scarlett johanson last night. it’s true because i said so, lol! i have to admit, your a great parody of a racist. you are a spoof, right?

    Like


  172. on April 24, 2009 at 6:02 pm Gunslingergregi

    I’d still say take off the digit man the japs really got that i’m sorry shit down to a science.

    Like


  173. Anon, *excellent* points made. Personally, I really don’t see why so many White guys are so worked up over this thing. No big deal, there’s still plenty of White, Asian and Latin Women out there, so why all the handwringing? Believe you me, when I’m out there the last thing I’m thinking about is the proverbial White Man. LOL.

    These guys remind me of their reactions to my thoughts on the Fat White Polarbear Lady a little while back-as soon as I suggested that what she was doin could be a “White” thing, they stopped ridiculing her for being fat, and started defending her because she was White. Psychology, funny that.

    O

    Like


  174. The perv that I am, I do catch myself checking out late-teen-thru-early-20s black chicks on the Metro.

    Anecdote Zone: On my railfan trip on WMATA Metrorail, I did note that the young black women on the train were better looking than average. Hell, better looking than the black women I’ve seen on the subway up here…

    Could it be changes in black hairstyle / makeup / clothes?

    Well, there’s been that trend of natural hair styles amongst some college educated and high prole black women (like all of my cousins who all have some degree of college), but I’ve never found natural hair to be attractive at all. As for makeup, I remember reading a survey that stated that black women were the least likely to use makeup, while Hispanic women use the most, and blamed the lack of makeup products for dark skin for the low usage….

    Otherwise, I’m clueless. Maybe we just lucked out…

    Like


  175. Obsidian:

    Jason,
    Sorry for getting personal, but what was the sex life w/Wifey like? Did she make herself sexually available to you in a reasonable fashion…say, at least once every two days?

    Since you have no kids you have no understanding how absolutely exhausting taking care of two such small children can be. The wife may have simply been to tired and busy to be in the mood for sex.

    Like


  176. Pure randomness: Peter of GNP fame would make such a low maintenance partner.

    Like


  177. David Alexander,

    Didn’t I tell you not to comment here until you do the assigned homework of 10 genuine daytime approaches?

    Sure, you are resigned to a gloomy outlook, but at least you should respect the wishes of others here and not drag down our Game-spiced lives.

    Do the homework, and don’t come back until you do.

    Like


  178. One thing that nobody has really touched on is that dandyism/feminization has a historical quality that is related to basic changes in the culture. In European fashion, the retreat from male display (wigs, tight pants, makeup, etc) into the standard, simplfied garb that has evolved into the modern business suit is called the “great renunciation” and took place in the early-to-mid 19th century – exactly as the industrial revolution was taking hold, as well as egalitarian (anti-aristocratic) trends in politics, art, etc. So traditional male elites had seemed to lose the ability to influence culture, or at least parts of it, as the culture itself shifted to fundamentally new values.

    In the 20s, an age of prosperity and frivolity, female dress and style changed radically, becoming both more sexual and androgynous. Not male dress, though, unless you consider the beaver coats (heh). That was the first and most significant sexual revolution in the modern age. In the 30s-50s, with war, depression, and conformity, traditional roles/dress were asserted, but in the 60-70s, another age of prosperity in which a broad, wealthy middle class was for the time in history unconnected to traditional material constraints, the revolution was much more profound, and androgyny and display came back with a vengeance (remember the peacock 60s in London?) – and have been around ever since to varying degrees, reflecting the state of the subsequent culture wars and the relation one’s own subculture has to all that. So for example, in the pop music world alone over those years, David Bowie geared up differently than Miles Davis or Frank Sinatra or the Beach Boys – but a lot like Sid Vicious, etc. Even Elvis, the King himself, dressed to suit the times. Ditto the Beatles, who helped direct the trends. The hipster androgeny referred to above may be a generational echo of early punk fashions, or also related to the fact that many of them seemingly have no need to earn a living in any real sense – supported by trust funds or the mini-economy of a self-absorbed subculture based on bullsh*t.

    Why is this? It seems likely that that display and androgeny are related to the lack of material want, or more properly, the lack of fear of material want. (I mean basic material want, like shelter and food). Because that fear of material want is what inspires women to seek basic provider archetypes, which are male. (that’s his main point…) So the culture values this as the basic society and economy shift – example, the economic and social dislocation of the industrial revolution could have caused that same reaction. In otherwords, not a dandy aristocrat but a solid burgher or wage earner was what women saw as desirable because they needed providers, not the social top of the heap of the ancien regime. A flip side of this, closer to home, is that the hipsters’ basic lack of connection to the traditional economy or society allows the reassertion of frivolous roles and dress. None of this pertains directly to alpha behaviors in individual males – just what the culture views as a norm of male dress, or within acceptable bounds.

    I’m not sure what the answers are, and I apologize for the incoherence and the many things I left out of this quick post, but my point is that androgynous dress isn’t just an individual male choice an a given point in time to attract a mate: economic, social and historical context dictate the parameters, which women only partially set and respond to.

    Also, I thought the same thing about Mystery when I first saw him – his kind of androgeny is like Alex in “A Clockwork Orange.” Not traditionally male, but a little creepy and threatening. To me the black fingerpolish evokes vampire movies and that kind of thing.

    Thoughts?

    Like


  179. my question was not so much of black women pairing with white men, but rather the choices the females in his theory would be prone to make.

    I assume he was talking of the choices white women make in regards to WHITE males. I want to know what choices the respective races of women would choose in his model – white women included.

    Like


  180. on April 24, 2009 at 6:14 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “Pure randomness: Peter of GNP fame would make such a low maintenance partner.”

    NO. He would require you to use minoxidil on your groin to grow your bush. Plus, he would then make you rub it on your buttocks, as he as openly said that he wants a woman’s buttocks to be covered in hair too. Are you ready for all that?

    What he really wants is Zira.

    Like


  181. on April 24, 2009 at 6:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    Dave,
    I missed this part.

    “””””””””””””As of now, she wants me out of the house and said she will let me know when I can see the kids…. “”””””””””””

    She is already using the kids as a weapon. Dudes fucked.

    Like


  182. GNPS are for Apes: you have no clue how bad the hair problem is with some women, do you? ZIRA WAS PLAYED BY A HUMAN BEING!

    Like


  183. O – funny thing is, if they thing black chicks are so hideous, which is their preference, no biggie, why do they get so worked up at the fact that black chicks don’t like them back? is the self-esteem that fragile?

    i mean shit, i don’t find samoans or asian chicks attractive, just not my thing. if you showed me proof that they didn’t like me back, i wouldn’t give a fuck. no prob. i wouldn’t waste my breath trying to prove that every type of chick under the sun worships me, even the ones i claim not to want. true signs of low selfworth lol

    Like


  184. Nicole 12:42

    Funny you should mention that. As a member of The Tribe myself, when I lived in NJ I took a female friend from my midwest days (who was living in NY at the time) out to Williamsburg, Brooklyn to do some kosher foodie touring among the Orthodox.

    Her reaction to the sight of all the baby carriages to note the presence of all those cute young girls married to such ugly guys.

    Like


  185. on April 24, 2009 at 6:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    Woman should try to understand too that there should be a line that they should not cross. You want to make it so a man can’t see his kids. Don’t matter what he did. You are basically asking for the worste side of him you have never seen to come out. It like playing russian roulette.

    Like


  186. Apeman,
    LOL. OK, since you’ve admitted that you really haven’t interviewed 1/10th of the Sistas at UPenn, are we then to assume that you have at UMichichan? Hmm? I mean, you’re the “numbers man”-give us the numbers, Apeman. How many Black Women during your time at the Uni of Mich have YOU personally interviewed on these matters?

    Oh, and I thought you might find this interesting-perhaps you’ve heard of eHarmony.com? Last night they ran a commerical during prime time tv. A BLACK WOMAN w/locs, very darkskinned, very obviously African features, closer to Michelle O than your gal Tamron, met and then married her very WHITE HUSBAND. They married about a year ago. I’m pretty sure you can find the ad on the web if you wanna check it out.

    Other very obviously Black Women have had very White hubbies, including Grace Jones and Whoopi Goldberg.

    Oh, and you can explain Anon’s citing of Beyonce’ and Jay-Z, too.

    Holla back…
    😉

    O

    Like


  187. Long QT syndrome: I blame Obsidian. Anyway, I’ve never experienced racism or prejudice to my knowledge outside the Internets.

    Like


  188. on April 24, 2009 at 6:22 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Obsidian,

    So one has to interview a person to assess their beauty? Is that what you are saying?

    The eHarmony people are actors. And even if they weren’t, that is an anecdote.

    “Other very obviously Black Women have had very White hubbies, including Grace Jones and Whoopi Goldberg. ”

    Neither is beautiful (I’ll give Grace Jones some credit for muscle tone). Only someone who goes to Howard would consider Whoopi Goldberg a beauty.

    Beyonce is one of the 30 beautiful black women in America. There are only 30.

    Like


  189. on April 24, 2009 at 6:24 pm Default User

    Obsidian

    These guys remind me of their reactions to my thoughts on the Fat White Polarbear Lady a little while back-as soon as I suggested that what she was doin could be a “White” thing, they stopped ridiculing her for being fat, and started defending her because she was White. Psychology, funny that.

    Nobody defended her. We did question that it was a “white thing.”

    Many posters offered ideas as to why it might be a “white thing.” I do not believe anyone ruled it out, merely questioned the premise.

    Like


  190. Dave
    You have good points but this one is a bit off.

    “You can tell her: I’m not happy being married to a woman that I am no longer sexually attracted to, but I’ll work on it with you for the kids sake.”

    I don’t think i would ever want to hear something like that,
    By dropping that sentence, you say, i am not sexually attracted to you but i will force myself, coz we have kids, but i don’t give a shit about you..

    you should pull it together because of that you still love her, and if you don’t then you should have left before you betrayed her.

    Like


  191. Beyonce is one of the 30 beautiful black women in America. There are only 30.

    wait, so you admit that beyonce is one of the 30 beautiful black women in America. yet you said twice that beautiful black women “invariably,” i repeat “invariably” choose white guys. yet she’s with jay-z. does that mean jay-z is white? lol

    i think i get you now gnp for apes. you know how steven colbert is a leftie who makes fun of righties by posing as one and then saying utterly absurd and stupid shit? think your an anti-racist who is poking fun at racist by posing as one and acting retarded

    Like


  192. on April 24, 2009 at 6:34 pm Gunslingergregi

    Firepower,
    Just have the balls to walk into there venue as long as you don’t get killed you will do ok with the ladies.

    Like


  193. on April 24, 2009 at 6:35 pm Gunslingergregi

    “slaps obsidian” get a hold of yourself man.

    Form a line.

    Like


  194. on April 24, 2009 at 6:37 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Obsidian said at 3:39 PM :

    “Keep in mind please, that Italian Women, Arab Women, heck, even Indian Women (east) are also known for their fiery ways”

    Where as I said at 4:50 PM (more than an hour later) :

    “We have been over this. It is because there are far too few black women who qualify as highly attractive.”

    So not only did Obsidian begin the race-talk first, but my first sentence was actually a ‘we have been over this’ which indicates a desire NOT to rehash what has been established.

    Like


  195. Obsidian: What beautiful passion! I’m only teasing you. I think at this point, your presence is now a magnet for it, even if you don’t say a word about it😉

    A line for what, gunny?

    Like


  196. So let’s lay it all out from the beginning b/c I find this interesting.

    Blacks and hispanics are the “hard” races. I’m assuming they have more machismo and testosterone than the “soft” whites and Asians. I’ll accept that.

    Given that women opt for men with more testosterone, all else being equal, white men have had to seek different paths to display their high status and value.

    if, hypothetically, black women chose only black men and hispanic women chose only hispanic men, *and* a few white and asian women chose men of those races as well, this would leave a decent number of white men with no partner of their own race. (this is a gross generalization, but it at least fits the general direction of interracial relations).

    white men, in response, turn to other means of displaying status and value. thus the rise of hipsterism, dandyism, activism, liberalism, etc. from there, they rely on the “peacock effect” to do their attracting.

    but really, since game is a proxy for status and value, much like dandyism and hipsterism is, game is merely another avenue white guys are trying as well. this seems to gel with the general observation that most “gamers” are white dudes.

    Like


  197. JohnM

    McCartney was English of Irish descent. Connery’s loyalty to his native “Schkotland” is well-known.

    Like


  198. I’m 21…and I can tell you with 100% certainty that I and none of my friends find that attractive. Yea, those people were considered attractive in the past, but if we’re talking about what women find attractive in the present then that look would now be considered ridiculous.

    Like


  199. on April 24, 2009 at 6:43 pm Default User

    QT (cutie?)

    Also, I am not sure how this blog degenerates into what race is bigger badder and best, but it is really annoying, my two worthless cents.

    Because we are men. Because we are competitive. Because you chicks choose the bigger, badder and best. So it is important.

    Also, it is the Internet so long winded arguments about anything are the norm. Hey we could be out smashing windows, so it is not so bad.

    Like


  200. DB,

    Just seeing your name back on here gives me a hard on…

    Like


  201. I think at this point, your presence is now a magnet for it, even if you don’t say a word about it

    so even if he doesn’t start the discussion himself he’s somehow responsible for it? huh?

    Like


  202. biktopia: I think we could debate until the cows, the Welshman’s sheep and the guy’s goat come home about what lines or approach would work. Actions, actions, actions. That’s where it’s at. “I mean serious business, it’s the kids first and I will make this work if the fires of hell try to stop me.”

    Like


  203. Anon: Teasing. NOT SERIOUS BUSINESS. Like how Jesus takes in all sin, Obsidian now takes all blame for race talk. It is his heavy burden.

    Lighthearted teasing.

    I really need to communicate better sometimes.

    Like


  204. Thursday said:

    “BTW isn’t it a shame that Michelangelo, the greatest visual artist ever, did horrible things to the female form. He appears to be the epitome of the female hating homosexual. I don’t think there is one genuine babe in all his vast output and there are some pretty nasty fuglies, including our mother Eve on the Sistine Chapel. The best representers of women, as far as I am concerned are Leonardo, Raphael and, my personal favourite, Botticelli. Ironically, it would seem that two of them were gay too.”

    I wish I could remember the name of the Renaissance painter who did the Virgin Mary portrait I saw some years ago at the Baltimore Museum of Art. I just stared for at least a good twenty minutes at this portrayal of a breathtakingly beautiful young girl, who realistically was about the proper historical age–not the 20’s-30’s version typical of the times.

    Like


  205. The white guy will just keep coming at you until he beats you to a pulp or gets beaten up himself. In other words, once the dogs are let loose, the white guy will take the fight much more seriously.

    There is a lot of unrest and violence in both African countries and black ghettos elsewhere all the time. But whites tend to go industrial when in genocidal mode.

    Like


  206. on April 24, 2009 at 6:49 pm Gunslingergregi

    I like the old airplane skit when the captian is slapping the shit out of this chick to calm her down and then there is a line behing him that continues the work lol

    Like


  207. “black women are the most hesitant of all races to date outside their race.”

    —-lol, no they are most unable to do so.

    Like


  208. on April 24, 2009 at 6:59 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””Bhetti,
    “I mean serious business, it’s the kids first and I will make this work if the fires of hell try to stop me.”””””””””””””

    I see you read my just commit to your man to the point where you are willing to walk through the fires of hell holding hands speil. Really if two people commit like that to make it through anything. The problems will kind of go away. The man should be first though. Not the kids. Then the kids will be fine.

    Like


  209. Now I’ve got a guy and his name is Dooley
    He’s my guy and I love him truly
    He’s not good lookin’, heaven knows
    But I’m wild about his crazy clothes

    He wears tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    A polka dot vest and man, oh, man
    Tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    And a big Panama with a purple hat band

    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh
    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh

    He takes me deep-sea fishing in a submarine
    We got to drive-in movies in a limousine
    He’s got a whirly-birdy and a 12-foot yacht
    Ah, but thats-a not all he’s got

    He’s got tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    A polka dot vest and man, oh, man
    Tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    And a big Panama with a purple hat band

    Now Dooley had a feelin’ we were goin’ to war
    So he went out and enlisted in a fightin’ corps
    But he landed in the brig for raisin’ such a storm
    When they tried to put ’em in a uniform

    He wanted tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    A polka dot vest and man, oh, man
    He wanted tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    And a big Panama with a purple hat band

    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh
    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh

    Now one day Dooley started feelin’ sick
    And he decided that he better make his will out quick
    He said
    “Just before the angels come to carry me
    I want it down in writin’ how to bury me.”

    A’wearin tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    A polka dot vest and man, oh, man
    Give me tan shoes with pink shoelaces
    And a big Panama with a purple hat band

    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh
    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh
    Ooh-ooh, ooh, ooh

    And a big Panama with a purple hat band!!

    –Dodie Stevens, 1962(?)

    Like


  210. on April 24, 2009 at 7:01 pm Willard Libby

    GNPs are for Apes – Beyonce is one of the 30 beautiful black women in America. There are only 30

    And of course Beyonce is another example of a so called “black” woman who has plenty of White and American Indian ancestry and who does everything she can to “de-negrofy” herself with all those hair weaves.

    I think you have to understand that in the black male psyche it’s very painful for them to realize that their women generally aint shit. They know it but they just don’t want you to rub it in. You have to understand that blacks are obsessed with competing with White folks and beating Whitey is a big part of black psychology. And that includes dating or comparing their women to women of other races.

    Black folks have very fragile racial self esteem due to the legacy of 400 years of having their asses handed to them so you have to be aware of their self defense techniques against any perceived slight.

    Obsidian – Believe you me, when I’m out there the last thing I’m thinking about is the proverbial White Man. LOL.

    Obsidian, as a black male in America you are ALWAYS THINKING ABOUT THE WHITE MAN.

    GNPs are for Apes – Tamron Hall is a 10, head to toe.

    I just googled her and there’s no way she’s a 10. She looks like a plain jane, light featured black female with a weave.

    She’s nothing special. She’s maybe a 6. She’s nothing compared to top of the line White women and even on a separate black scale there are higher ranking women.

    But you are correct that black females are on average an unattractive lot. Black females have nothing to offer White men whereas White women are the precious idol of the black male psyche.

    That is why you rarely see White men with black females.

    Seriously, why would a White man want a black woman over better White, Latino, Asian or Indian women?

    I’m not saying black females couldn’t be decent co workers but as romantic/sexual interests? Come on now.

    Like


  211. “BTW isn’t it a shame that Michelangelo, the greatest visual artist ever, did horrible things to the female form. He appears to be the epitome of the female hating homosexual. I don’t think there is one genuine babe in all his vast output and there are some pretty nasty fuglies, including our mother Eve on the Sistine Chapel. The best representers of women, as far as I am concerned are Leonardo, Raphael and, my personal favourite, Botticelli. Ironically, it would seem that two of them were gay too.”

    Well, during the Renaissance using a live female model was very uncommon. Raphael was a notorious playboy and was around enough women to get a good sense of their body. Michelangelo on the other hand was using male models for the female figures he painted, which is why they are so masculine looking. It’s not a matter of him hating females. He pretty much hated everyone.

    Like


  212. So, i meant, that i am not convinced that the kids should be brought up in a family that is clearly lost and the only glue that keeps the marriage together is, not to hurt the children myth. to have 2 parents at home that are miserable with each other, could be even worse then a divorce in the long run. And then i think the most important thing is to heal the relationship between the married couple, which are the only way to make the kids happy, second choice is divorce, and worst one is to hang in there because of the children.

    Like


  213. —-lol, no they are most unable to do so.

    you mispelled “unwilling.” but it’s ok. you are stupid after all.

    Like


  214. willard libby, great beta rant there, but none of that changes the fact that black women are as uninterested in you as you are in them. i know that hurts you for some weird reason but hey

    Like


  215. jesus fucking christ,

    why can’t you all realize that white men and black women are pretty equally not attracted to one another.

    white men are insecure about it because it denotes a lesser masculinity whereas black people defend black women because race realism leaves them in a bad spot. both sides need to deal with the cold, hard reality of it all.

    Like


  216. on April 24, 2009 at 7:12 pm Cannon's Canon

    The most beautiful black girl I met at UMich was an 8. But, oh, what an 8! Sadly, my game was at a particularly weak point that semester.

    I seem to recall one or two other black possible 8’s on campus. And none of them belonged to DAAP BAMN.

    Like


  217. on April 24, 2009 at 7:12 pm Willard Libby

    Default User – Nobody defended her. We did question that it was a “white thing.”

    Many posters offered ideas as to why it might be a “white thing.” I do not believe anyone ruled it out, merely questioned the premise.

    Yes, I seem to remember something about that.

    Like


  218. why can’t you all realize that white men and black women are pretty equally not attracted to one another.

    actually i totally accept that white men dont find black women attractive. i never debated that claimed otherwise or got insulted by it. but for some reason. but when i pointed out the reverse is also true these guys started spontaneously menstrating and getting offended. the best part is how these wonks love studies and stats, but once they see one that doesnt support white men like my university of chicago one they conveniently ignore it and decide to argue from emotion instead lol

    Like


  219. I knew it wouldn’t be long before Willie would come crawlin’ outta the backwater woodwork. Hi Willie! Just in time. Pull up a chair.

    Now, Apeman, I kinda thought, you being such an erudite scholar and all, that you would be aware of the fact that eHarmony doesn’t use actors, but rather actual couples who met AND MARRIED using their service. They boast the biggest such service of its kind around.

    So, again, you can check out the ad I mentioned, and holla back…

    And yea, I wanna know how many Black Women you have actually talked to in order to come to the conclusions you have? Over or under 1000? Hmm? I’ll tell you what, you can use both Mich and UPenn, how’s that?

    And Willie…Willie, I can see comprehension isn’t your strong suit…among a great many other things (let’s see if Willie will layout what he wears out on the town, hmm?)…

    If Black Women were so undesirable, then why are so many White guys taking so much time to discuss it? Anon makes a powerful point here. For example, for the most part Asian Women don’t do anything for me, and the feeling’s probably mutual, but you don’t hear me doggin em out at every turn. So what?

    And this notion that Obsidian is some kind of Caucasian Manchurian Candidate, LOL!!! Gotta give you that one, didn’t think you could be that imaginative. Not bad. But wrong as two left shoes, of course.

    By the way, Willie-when you do head out the paint the town red, do you actually dance or do you hold up the wall? Ah, I got it, you do the hoedown, square dance deal, right? Well, gotta start somewhere, beats a blank.
    😉

    O

    Like


  220. on April 24, 2009 at 7:17 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Willard Libby,

    I think you have to understand that in the black male psyche it’s very painful for them to realize that their women generally aint shit.

    Yes. Obsidian is at least classy about it (despite his insistence that you have to interview a woman before you can judge her beauty, and living in West Philly + going to U of Michigan for 4 years does not qualify as having seen enough black females).

    Others, like the faggotty, wiggerish ‘anonymous’ don’t even have a command of English grammar (or Ebonics grammar, for that matter), and thus I am above replying to them.

    I have to point out the recent story of a white Marine who married an (attractive) black woman, where both the white Marine and his black wife were brutally murdered by 4 black Marines, simply because he took one of their ultra-rare attractive black women. Marine Code of Honor, santity for human life, etc. meant nothing.

    She’s nothing special. She’s maybe a 6. She’s nothing compared to top of the line White women and even on a separate black scale there are higher ranking women.

    Wow. You are much harsher than me. I at least give her very high marks, and keep saying that she has great tracts of land. I like her (but I note that she has contained form to her nose and lips, and straightened hair).

    But you are correct that black females are on average an unattractive lot.

    They would do better if the worked to shed their obesity, rather than comically try to normalize it. Part of this is also due to the fact that black men don’t demand higher standards from black women, as black men will still do an obese black woman, in a way that a white man would never do an obese white woman.

    Like


  221. I really wish someone could set up a PUA/MRA university (not me, I’m not equipped to do that). There’s so much research to be done. e.g. Hb levels in blood versus virility.

    Like


  222. Obsidian, as a black male in America you are ALWAYS THINKING ABOUT THE WHITE MAN.

    unlike you who isnt obsessed with people of other races at all right? pot, meet kettle!

    Like


  223. on April 24, 2009 at 7:20 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “The most beautiful black girl I met at UMich was an 8. But, oh, what an 8! Sadly, my game was at a particularly weak point that semester.

    I seem to recall one or two other black possible 8’s on campus. And none of them belonged to DAAP BAMN.”

    As a fellow Wolverine, I concur. A few black 8s. But no 9s and 10s, not in U of M, or all of Detroit.

    Meanwhile, there where white and Asian 9s and 10s galore.

    There are only about 30 black 9s and 10s in the United States at any given time.

    Like


  224. on April 24, 2009 at 7:22 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Obsidian,

    Again, are you insisting that one has to interview a woman (black or otherwise) before judging whether she is beautiful or not?

    Yes or no?

    Like


  225. to all focusing on it: using “stars” of screen and music is only useful to a small extent. ANY massively socially-proofed male gets laid like…well…a rock star. One can point to Nicole Narain balling Colin Farrell on video. She also balls Andrew Bynum or any guy in the public eye, fulfilling her role as certified Star Fucker material. Celebrity examples are highly limited in useful discussion.

    hey obsidian – those are good points you make.

    Although, I’m not referring specifically to current college situations; I graduated – alas, my college days are behind me.

    I see a few examples at bars/clubs etc in my city. The majority are indeed wf/bm couplings. Where I REALLY notice these pairings is on the vast cornucopia of MySpace. Gangsta guys seem to do well with white girls, actually; perhaps it is a 21st Century variant of the goyploy.
    =========

    my focus is on what selections of male alphaness the VARIOUS races of females will select.

    Then, modify my game to “swoop” [to quote a distinguished colleague] whatever current available ethnicity catches my eye at the moment.

    Like


  226. O:

    you know my stance on this argument. you’re a man. you know what pushes a man’s buttons.

    if you tell a man that he wants something but he can’t have it because it doesn’t want him back, he’s not going to take kindly to it. he’s going to have feelings of insecurity and rejection. it’s your delivery, and the fact that you try to have it both ways. it is true that black women don’t dig white guys for the most part, but it is also true that white guys don’t dig on black women either. sure they’ll fuck them if they can, but if there are alternatives, they most likely won’t choose black women. and vice versa.

    that’s why some white dudes on this board get up in arms about the subject.

    if they try to argue that black women aren’t attractive enough etc. etc. they can rest assured that black women don’t find them that attractive either.

    Like


  227. Others, like the faggotty, wiggerish ‘anonymous’ don’t even have a command of English grammar (or Ebonics grammar, for that matter), and thus I am above replying to them.

    or you could just lose gracefully, lol. Is “above replying” a face-saving way to say, “i got nothing?”

    Like


  228. on April 24, 2009 at 7:24 pm Gunslingergregi

    Because its not true chuck.

    Like


  229. on April 24, 2009 at 7:24 pm Willard Libby

    Anonymous – willard libby, great beta rant there, but none of that changes the fact that black women are as uninterested in you as you are in them. i know that hurts you for some weird reason but hey.

    Again, this is the black boy’s racial defense mechanism in full working order. There is no end to black folks need for White people’s attention and acceptance. If you ignore them or reject them they get threatened.

    Listen, Tyrone, the average black woman looks like shit…literally. They are not attractive or appealing to anybody but black males. And even black males would kick them to the curb if they had an option. And you know that.

    Chuck – why can’t you all realize that white men and black women are pretty equally not attracted to one another.

    white men are insecure about it..

    Chuck I don’t think many White men are “insecure” about black women’s views about them. Black women are barely on the White man’s radar at all.

    Like


  230. Willard:

    no, white men don’t go through life worrying about black women’s lack of attraction, but when the subject is brought up, white men tighten up about it.

    Like


  231. on April 24, 2009 at 7:26 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “If Black Women were so undesirable, then why are so many White guys taking so much time to discuss it? ”

    I’ll tell you why :

    Because black women are trying to make obesity normal. This has had some success, since now white women who are Obese are trying jump on board, and thus remain obese.

    Obesity, of course, is not normal. Black women would be rated more highly in looks by white men (as some were in the plantation days) if black women got up off their cetacean rumps and put some effort into slimming down.

    But the movement started by obese black women has decreased the supply of beauty in the world. This is a tragedy for ALL men (less so for black men as they don’t require beauty to the same degree as other men do, but a tragedy nonetheless).

    Like


  232. Jason; Dave from Hawaii–

    Dave’s advice is very good, and I endorce just about all of it.

    (Also, unusually, on this I’d say don’t listen to Gunny. Contrite will do you far more harm than good. If you’re gonna be that at all, as opposed to strong, rock solid and loving towards her, it should be over your side in letting things slide between the two of you. However as Dave says, also focus on her side in that as well.)

    BTW his advice about not moving out of the house is very good. That’s what you’ll hear from a lawyer as well. But you have to be a strong and unemotional rock. You can’t rage back at her at all. Even if there weren’t legal reasons why you can’t (and there ARE, big time), it’s by far the best way of attracting her back to you.

    If she moves out in response, perhaps to her parents etc., that’s much better than your doing so. Not ideal, but better.

    Doing little things like kissing her on the neck when her back is turned to you, even though she pulls away and yells at you, can be magic too. Not in a desperate to win her back frame of mind. In a strong rock that still loves her and feels affection for her despite her raging at you, sort of way. Women melt for that sort of thing. It may take a number of thunderstorms of fury for her to openly show the melting, but it will start having an effect.

    However there’s this which Dave said that I emphatically disagree with:

    You can tell her: I’m not happy being married to a woman that I am no longer sexually attracted to, but I’ll work on it with you for the kids sake.

    That is horribly counter productive. Women can’t stand that at just a deep emotional level. It’s essential in fact that you make her feel the opposite. Essential. The chance of the marriage working if you don’t are minimal. Hence kiss her neck tenderly, etc.

    However, Dave IS right when he counsels focusing on the things that have lead you to not want to have sex with her. However you need to treat them as discrete fixable things. (Don’t talk about her age vs. your tryst’s, that’s not fixable.) However, that’s ONLY after she starts responding to you again, or at the very least is calm, and wants to talk.

    Wait for her to bring it up. She will, in the form of “why did you do it”.

    Like


  233. as black men will still do an obese black woman, in a way that a white man would never do an obese white woman.

    colbert, take money into account. poor black men bang poor black women. poor white men bang poor white women. watch jerry springer if you don’t believe. your not taking into account for class level. its not race issue, its options issues. poor guys of both races have less options so they fuck fatties. more black guys are poor and broke so more black guys fuck fatties plain and simple

    can you name a rich black man who met his woman AFTER he got rich who is with a fattie? even hiphop dudes who had fat baby mamas wen they were broke upgrade to models and actresses when they get famous.

    Like


  234. So, how pretty do you rank this black female?
    http://twitpic.com/3xide

    Like


  235. If you ignore them or reject them they get threatened.

    i get it! like when you hear black women find you equally unattractive, therfore rejecting you, you get threatened? lol seems like a lot of the traits you mention about black people you have yourself. pot meet kettle again! your new name is honorary black man.

    Like


  236. on April 24, 2009 at 7:35 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “So, how pretty do you rank this black female?
    http://twitpic.com/3xide

    If you mean the one furthest away, looking down, it isn’t clear that she is black at all. Look at her hair, her eyes, her slender build.

    At any rate, I give her about a 6.5.

    Like


  237. O:

    fair points. i’m not throwing you in with the likes of willard, but it takes two to tango.

    the thing is, your counterpoints to theirs are that white men dig black women. i remember the strom thurmond, thomas jefferson argument of yours from the past. you’re accepting the argument that black women don’t like white men, but you try to prove it by saying that white men do indeed like black women.

    for a white man, it leaves us with nothing. as petty as it sounds, being told that you’re attracted to something but its not attracted to you, hits at your manhood and basic fabric of existence. that’s the real issue. being left with nothing.

    Like


  238. LOL!!! Willie the Magical Non-Negroe! I love it! Brother Anon, you art thou Genuis.

    You hear that, Willie? You’re an Honorary Brotha now, like fellow Bubba in Arms Bill Clinton. Now you gotta do a victory dance, that squaredance hoedown thing you do will work for now til we teach you how to work the Electric Slide…
    😉

    O

    Like


  239. on April 24, 2009 at 7:47 pm Gunslingergregi

    Bhetti don’t try to act black and don’t try to act like your arab family would consider themselves black either.

    Like


  240. QT,
    I think the general consensus is that we Brothas, on average do the Dandy thing very well, although I would argue that it has a bit more T-loaded punch in it than the examples he noted above. At any rate, gimme your opinion of one of Obsidian’s night out on the town lays:

    A navy blue three button soft pink pinstripe, three piece suit, tailored in 44 Atheletic, of course; with matching soft pink frenc cuff shirt and a solid 100% pink silk tie done up in a nice double Windsor knot.

    Since Obsidian only wears silver (never know if you gotta deal w/werewolves or vamps), a nice pair of big “O” shaped pure silver cufflinks go in the shirt, which matches the silver/chrome custom made walking stick.

    Matching pink socks slide into a very sharp pair of square front navy blue lizards to match the suit-notice how we Black folk like to “coordinate”, LOL. A fresh cut w/the 1 1/2 blade at my man Johnny’s and a fresh pair of silver rimmed Aviators tops it all off.

    Whatcha think?😉

    Sexy, sexy, sexy…

    O

    Like


  241. Gunny: Where did that come from?! I wouldn’t dream of it!

    Like


  242. QT,
    I think the general consensus is that we Brothas, on average do the Dandy thing very well, although I would argue that it has a bit more T-loaded punch in it than the examples he noted above. At any rate, gimme your opinion of one of Obsidian’s night out on the town lays:

    A navy blue three button soft pink pinstripe, three piece suit, tailored in 44 Atheletic, of course; with matching soft pink frenc cuff shirt and a solid 100% pink silk tie done up in a nice double Windsor knot.

    Since Obsidian only wears silver (never know if you gotta deal w/werewolves or vamps), a nice pair of big “O” shaped pure silver cufflinks go in the shirt, which matches the silver/chrome custom made walking stick.

    Matching pink socks slide into a very sharp pair of square front navy blue lizards to match the suit-notice how we Black folk like to “coordinate”, LOL. A fresh cut w/the 1 1/2 blade at my man Johnny’s and a fresh pair of silver rimmed Aviators tops it all off.

    Oh, wait, gotta include the pink silk pocketsquare, and of course, the fresh Pink Carnation in the left lapel. Um-hmm!

    Whatcha think?😉

    Sexy, sexy, sexy…

    O

    Like


  243. gnp for apes, o didn’t bring up race first. technically he brought up race first by talking about white men and men of other races. then several other people talked about race. black women entered conversation with thursday’s “african descended women” comment. this started a tangent about mating habits in african society among african women and men. this led to a comment by dave alex about the topic. the comment you put by o that you claimed was him starting the topic of race THEN came in response to dave a’s comment. so it was well underway already.

    good job at your colbert-ish “pretending to be a racist” shtick, another idiotic comment! lol

    Like


  244. The Apeman (after which I’ll reply to Chuck),

    Ok, so if your premise about obses Black Women messing it up for the whole World is true, it then confirms some things:

    1. That Black folk on a whole got a lot more pull than we thought

    2. That White Women on a whole can’t really be all that, if they gonna allow themselves to be influenced by Black folks

    3. That White guys are really up a creek w/o a paddle because more and more White Women are starting to get back like Sistas all the time, w/no end in sight…

    4. Which means, there’ll be a lot more people looking like Obama running around, because Black Men definitely like a Woman, ANY WOMAN, w/a Donkey.

    My condolences, Ape.

    Chuck:
    My point, remember now, was in response to utterly historically absurd nonsense Willie and others made, and yup, I can see where a lot of White guys are coming from, because up until very recently in American history, Black Women didn’t have a choice as to who ran up in em; they just had to take it. That’s all changed now, and the jury’s in-other than very notable exceptional cases, most Sistas aint diggin White dudes like that, and in fact would rather remain alone than get with one.

    Don’t take my word for it, interview Black Woman and see for yourself-wait, you can borrow Apeman’s copious notes, LOL!

    O

    Like


  245. on April 24, 2009 at 7:51 pm Gunslingergregi

    Just a preemtive putting your ass in check lol

    Like


  246. yep. i think it’s more about multiculti than b & w

    sooo….i says….

    ““
    COROLLARY:
    in a multicult society like the USA where the four main races mingle, the “softer” races (white, asian) will stop competing head to head with the “harder” races (black, hispanic) and instead attempt to carve out their own sexual market niche to satisfy women’s innate desire for male status. these market niches open opportunities for men and take the form of dandyism, hipsterism, political activism, scenesterism, intellectual snobbery, PUAism and game, among others.””

    that’s so full of chewy goodness, I emailed a link to a fellow suppressed graduate friend of mine. In the PC world of college, we weren’t “allowed” to discuss such heretical theories and had to keep silent.

    I assume your “open opportunities for men” and the subsequent forms are targeted at the White Female.

    I see plenty of white chicks with black guys, but hardly any white guys with black chicks.

    But what do you think the females of each respective race will select?

    Like


  247. Chuck, it’s not all that bleak. There is still intercultural dating going on despite the statistics. Also, just as outside of the U.S. Black women aren’t regarded with the same aesthetic scorn, they’re also less uptight about dating White men…well, except in Africa.

    So while you’re in eastern Europe, if you see one you find attractive, she’s probably not going to be any more or less hostile than her fairer skinned peers. She was very likely raised with similar values as well.

    Like


  248. Given my current low status, it’s why I pretty much tarred non-date girl with the white trash label when she started to show interest in me.

    Argument can be made, David, that you are an elite sort of a black guy. Not in the muscle/style/charm department, but in your unusual personality.

    the faggotty, wiggerish ‘anonymous’ don’t even have a command of English grammar (or Ebonics grammar, for that matter), and thus I am above replying to them.

    I think ‘Anonymous’ is a female. And by the strident tone of her comments, a very unappealing one. Sounds like that creature Dizzy. Best ignored.

    Like


  249. on April 24, 2009 at 8:04 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””on April 24, 2009 at 7:59 pm Nicole
    Chuck, it’s not all that bleak. There is still intercultural dating going on despite the statistics. Also, just as outside of the U.S. Black women aren’t regarded with the same aesthetic scorn, they’re also less uptight about dating White men…well, except in Africa.

    So while you’re in eastern Europe, if you see one you find attractive, she’s probably not going to be any more or less hostile than her fairer skinned peers. She was very likely raised with similar values as well.””””””””””””””””””””

    I think the bristling happens when pretty lies are thrown out. Black woman are attracted to white men. If the dynamic changes and white men start to seek out black woman to date they will be able to have as many as they want. Be carefull what you wish for.

    Like


  250. its so sad, you guys come here religiously and are no closer to being alpha you just become angrier betas instead.

    someone gives you an ugly truth rather than a beautiful lie by pointing out that black women find you as unattractive as you find them, and you take it as a personal insult. very feminine, very beta, very liberal acting. somebody points out a study with stats and figures and rather than deal with it you do snarky name calling tuants, emotional defensiveness, sidestepping inconvenient facts. very feminine, very beta, very liberal acting. you waste a buncha energy trying to prove desperately as if your very self-worth depends on it that women you claim to find hideous do indeed find you attractive and get your feelings hurt if told otherwise. yeah, alphas really waste time online trying to prove to strangers that even women they are repulsed by want them. alphas dont even think about the women their not attracted to, theyre too busy getting ass. more betaness. beta + angry whining dont equal alpha, just equals extra bitchy beta. i can even picture colbert and honorary black man willie breathing heavy and typing in a fury! lol

    meanwhile me, i just gave you guys a free workshop in that whole “amused mastery” thing alphas supposdly do. never lost my cool, kept making you lose yours, shit, colbert even resorted to a grammar nazi rebuttal and honorary black man willie used name “tyrone,” those tactics are last resort of truly outmatched, lmao. remember guy, amused master equal alpha. emotional rants, ignoring inconvenent stats and snarky namecalling? congrats, your a woman!

    Like


  251. Black women are probably very attracted to white men. Once you filter out these US-specific things:

    – An image of an uptight, herbish skinny “white boy” that is conjured up when she thinks “white guy.” When in reality white guys come in every type of look and personality type.

    – A general attitude of hostility from many blacks toward whites in the US. One little limited observation, but when I was in Paris (1997) I saw lots of good looking black women with classy-looking white guys.

    – Lots of black women being obese, they aren’t gonna find too many white guys who are bigger than them, and women prefer males larger than themselves.

    Like


  252. on April 24, 2009 at 8:09 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “Also, just as outside of the U.S. Black women aren’t regarded with the same aesthetic scorn”

    In fact, the opposite is true. In any Arab country, India, or East Asia, black women will be described in terms that even I disapprove of.

    When Condi Rice visited China, major Chinese newspapers openly described her as a monkey. In India, virtually all the words used to describe blacks are derogatory, and in Hindu Mythology, dark-skinned Sri Lankans were caricatured as cannibalistic demons. In Arab States, they conducted slavery of blacks for far longer, and with far more brutality, than was ever done in the US.

    An Estonian girl once told me a story that I found hard to believe. She had never seen a black person before leaving Estonia (where apparently Hollywood movies were not available while Estonia was part of the USSR). When she first saw a black person, she thought “What happened to him????” She had never seen one, or knew of one’s existence – much like when 20th-century human’s first see a Klingon who traveled back in time.

    I didn’t believe this story of hers, but she told it to me, whatever her motivation might be.

    Like


  253. on April 24, 2009 at 8:10 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””Nicole
    Chuck, it’s not all that bleak. There is still intercultural dating going on despite the statistics. Also, just as outside of the U.S. Black women aren’t regarded with the same aesthetic scorn, they’re also less uptight about dating White men…well, except in Africa.””””””””””””””””

    I may go to ethiopia just to fuck around he he he. The ethiopian chick here are fucking white men lol

    Like


  254. I think the bristling happens when pretty lies are thrown out. Black woman are attracted to white men. If the dynamic changes and white men start to seek out black woman to date they will be able to have as many as they want. Be carefull what you wish for.

    except for the fact that black women don’t want white men any more than white men want black women. otherwise your 100% right.

    Like


  255. on April 24, 2009 at 8:11 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “- An image of an uptight, herbish skinny “white boy” that is conjured up when she thinks “white guy.” When in reality white guys come in every type of look and personality type.

    – A general attitude of hostility from many blacks toward whites in the US. One little limited observation, but when I was in Paris (1997) I saw lots of good looking black women with classy-looking white guys.

    – Lots of black women being obese, they aren’t gonna find too many white guys who are bigger than them, and women prefer males larger than themselves.”

    PA,

    Agree on all 3 points, especially the third, which Obsidian is in denial about. I want to call him ‘Obese-dian’ again.

    Like


  256. on April 24, 2009 at 8:13 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “I may go to ethiopia just to fuck around he he he. The ethiopian chick here are fucking white men lol”

    You WANT AIDS????

    Seriously, though, Ethiopian and Somalian women can be quite attractive. Sadly, US blacks are descended from West Africans, hence the extreme rarity of beauty in US black women.

    Like


  257. Gunny, women are attracted to men, and men are attracted to women. Whatever people say with their lips, the truth comes out in their hips.

    It’s not about what I wish for. It’s just the way life is, and Europe hasn’t imploded from the presence of or mixing with African people. In a couple of generations they usually end up just mildly beige anyway. Heheheh…

    Like


  258. Apes says, “In fact, the opposite is true. In any Arab country, India, or East Asia, black women will be described in terms that even I disapprove of.”

    Yeah, and all of those terms have something to do with pussy.

    Like


  259. on April 24, 2009 at 8:18 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “Yeah, and all of those terms have something to do with pussy.”

    No. They have to do with simian metaphors. I don’t approve of that at all, but it is true.

    Dig deeply into Indian and Chinese journalism and cultural depictions of blacks. You may not like what you find.

    Like


  260. on April 24, 2009 at 8:22 pm Gunslingergregi

    Ethiops here tend to be very light skinned but their demeaner is very womanly along with there voices when they speak their language. Not bad. I wouldn’t mind the bragging rights alone. Oh yea my second woman is from africa whats up now lol

    Like


  261. on April 24, 2009 at 8:23 pm Gunslingergregi

    Yea GNP that is what I tried to explain before. Whites try to help blacks. Other cultures hate blacks.

    Like


  262. on April 24, 2009 at 8:26 pm Gunslingergregi

    Why I don’t get a lot of arguments from obsid because they seem to lean towards trying to make people hate blacks. I don’t get it.

    Like


  263. Apes, Hindus worship a monkey god called Hanuman. A simean comparison is not necessarily a negative one. A Hindu, Buddhist, Jain, and even the odd Confucian would wonder why you take it as negative, and even in the few cases that were, why you interpret propaganda as universal cultural values.

    You jump on it because it strikes a chord with you. That doesn’t make it what you think it is.

    This is not to say that Asians aren’t racist. They are, generally. So are Africans.

    Because Africans historically associated pale skin with disease and death, does this mean that Black men who date White women are all goths or something?

    Now, having said that, does any of the negative propaganda or the fact that racism exists against Black women, stop White or Asian men from wanting to fuck them?

    I mean, wanting to shag them even if they’ve never seen one in person.

    I mean chasing them down just to shake their hand, stare at them, smile, find out they don’t have a chance, and go home and fap to that memory for some years, and then tell the next Black woman they encounter about that one beautiful moment they had in 1972. :: twitch ::

    Apes, just because you want it to be so, doesn’t mean that it is. Black punani is a hot commodity outside the U.S.

    Apparently, this is so even when it’s 135 kg. and not all that feminine.

    Like


  264. on April 24, 2009 at 8:41 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””””””””””on April 24, 2009 at 8:10 pm Anonymous
    I think the bristling happens when pretty lies are thrown out. Black woman are attracted to white men. If the dynamic changes and white men start to seek out black woman to date they will be able to have as many as they want. Be carefull what you wish for.

    except for the fact that black women don’t want white men any more than white men want black women. otherwise your 100% right.””””””””””””””””””

    We could prove this wrong by having some volunteers to go to all black clubs but noone will volunteer.

    Like


  265. PA, Apeman,
    Funny, I’ve known quite a few Black Men who’ve done quite well w/Eastern European Women, in fact, PA, I happen to know a Woman from Poznan-very Catholic, very Blonde, very Blue-eyed, who married a Very Black Jamaican, about 50 years ago. They’re still married, at a time when pulling something like that off was very hard to do here in the States. And she’s not alone.

    As for “obsesity”, lookup Western African aesthetic values. Black Men there tend to like heftier Women, on average. Never said you had to like it.

    Oh, and I’ve said many times before, I’ve had many Women who were just Amazonian in height and size, and had no problem with em in the least; in fact, I was their first “short” lover they had, because I didn’t come accross as insecure about my or their height to them.

    Simply put, and Steve Sailer had a discussion about this over at his place recently on BMI, Western African-descended Black Women have different bone structures, etc than do the average White Woman. My God, you don’t need to be an egghead to see this. Again, you don’t have to dig such Women, fine, but you do have to understand that there are quite a few guys, Black and White alike, who would tear up 5’9″ Serena Williams in a heartbeat if they could.

    So, that whole the Woman has to be smaller than the Man, yea, that’s definitely a White thing.

    O

    Like


  266. That guy marrying Jessica Valenti is practically the dictionary definition of beta. Talk about whipped.

    Like


  267. on April 24, 2009 at 8:46 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Hindus worship a monkey god called Hanuman. A simean comparison is not necessarily a negative one.

    That is a different thing. Many Indians and Chinese are quick to say black people look like monkeys, and they mean it in a derogatory way.

    Separately, look up ‘Rakshasas’ in the Ramayana.

    stop White or Asian men from wanting to fuck them?

    If they look like Tamron Hall or Beyonce, yes. Sadly, only 1 out of 500,000 black women in the US can qualify as possessing such beauty.

    Apparently, this is so even when it’s 135 kg. and not all that feminine.

    There is no culture in the world where a 300 pound female is desirable. Black men will fuck a black woman of this mass, but that is not the same thing as ‘desirable’.

    Like


  268. I happen to know a Woman from Poznan-very Catholic, very Blonde, very Blue-eyed, who married a Very Black Jamaican, about 50 years ago.

    Ok, so one Polish woman turned her back on her people and married a man whose children will look nothing like her grandparents. Who fought in uprisings and survived Russian and German onslaughts agaist her people. Her choice.

    But why are you addressing that to me? My contribution to interracial dating topoics on this thread was to note that black women and white men are probably more attracted to each other than American circumstances allow.

    Like


  269. on April 24, 2009 at 8:49 pm Willard Libby

    OK, explain these in terms of alpha status/evolutionary causes.

    !!

    Daisy Lowe, right, and boyfriend Will Cameron

    ?

    Nice.

    ?!?!?

    Triple LOL!

    This stuff is nuking the shit out of Darwin. LOL.

    Boyfriend William Cameron Jr. was in an indie rock band. Her father is Gavin Rosedale a musician now married to Gwen Stefani.

    So this ugly freak is an example of a less than nothing male who has status for her as a ” no talent indie musican”.

    Amazing.

    Like


  270. Nicole,
    Thank you for noting what should by now be very obvious, when it comes right down to it, Men like to fuck, and when we get horny, the closest, wettest, warmest hole will do. Someone to walk down the aisle with, that’s a different story. Evolution really don’t care about that anyway-it cares about, as you put it, shagging. And on that note, a biggish African Woman is just as likely to get it from a horny White explorer as his counterpart on the Silk Route in Asia, or in the Netherlands or the Catalands.
    So, once again, our White brothers are foaming at the mouth about this thing. Really, they gotta get over this hangup, LOL.

    O

    Like


  271. The guys in the rock band *are* alphas, regardless of their appearance.

    Like


  272. on April 24, 2009 at 8:53 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “So, that whole the Woman has to be smaller than the Man, yea, that’s definitely a White thing.”

    er…That is true in virtually all mammals, whether terrestrial or aquatic. The male has twice the weight of the female in gorillas, elephants, bears, cattle, Orcas, sperm whales, etc. In horses, dogs, cats, etc. the gap is not quite so large, but the male is still larger.

    Now, if you are talking about insects like praying mantises, then yes, the female is larger than the male. She also eats the male.

    I can’t believe how otherwise brilliant people like Obsidian and Nicole are rationalizing obesity in black women. ‘Obese-dian’ of all people…..

    Like


  273. so one Polish woman turned her back on her people and married a man whose children will look nothing like her grandparents

    So, if I marry outside of my ethnicity, am I turning my back against my people? My children won’t look like my grandparents, but should that matter? There is nothing about dark skin that prevents children from learning Polish, listening to Chopin, eating kielbasa, going to Catholic church, and visiting Warsaw.

    Like


  274. on April 24, 2009 at 8:57 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “Men like to fuck, and when we get horny, the closest, wettest, warmest hole will do.”

    Again, no. Only black men are so unselective that they will fuck anything. This contributes to obesity in black women. If black men demanded some minimum standards from black women, black women would slim down. But black women don’t mind being 300, 500 or even 900 pounds, and black men will fuck them all the same.

    Other men, however, have standards below which they will not go. This is why other races of women contain their obesity to a much greater degree – their men will not have it.

    Like


  275. Apes bawls, “There is no culture in the world where a 300 pound female is desirable.”

    So how far would you drive for a woman you didn’t find desirable, when there are available, willing women of equal or less distance away?

    Like


  276. Apeman,
    I neither “rationalize” nor demonize “obesity”. I really don’t have an axe to grind one way or the other, beyond what I personally find attractive. What I’m doing, is presenting a counterpoint that is quite legitimate.

    Oh, and I suppose you never heard that old story about Jack Spratt and his wife, right? About how it seems, that so many plump Women always seem to wind up with more slimmer guys? There’s even a line of reason about this in the Indian Ayurvedic school of thought, but of course, you knew all about it, right?

    So, how many Black Women have to taked to, Apeman? Over or under 1000?

    O

    Like


  277. So, if I marry outside of my ethnicity, am I turning my back against my people?

    Men are supposed to ‘snatch’ other ethicities’ women. It’s a score for the team when a guy brings one home. But it’s a loss if a woman is taken by someone else.

    There is nothing about dark skin that prevents children from learning Polish, listening to Chopin, eating kielbasa, going to Catholic church, and visiting Warsaw.

    I can learn HanGul, sing Arirang and visit Seoul, but I will never, ever, ever be Korean. Only a fan of Korean culture, and there is nothing wrong with that.

    Like


  278. Apes, either you believe in statistics or you’ll accept anecdotes.

    Statistically, it takes alot more pull and alot more money, even in the U.S. for a White guy to get next to a Black woman.

    Outside the U.S. it’s not as grim, but the attraction is not only mutual, but guys will go out of their way just for a chance of a sniff of it.

    Where there isn’t the necessity to stay in one’s respective tribe when it comes to marriage or dating, plenty of mixing goes on and has gone on since times when miscgenation was still illegal in some states in the U.S.

    It’s quite common to see not just a Black, but hot off the subsahara African woman who is not particularly gorgeous, married to a White man. Bonita Hyman springs to mind. She’s an opera singer whose figure is like two of me stuck together.

    We even had a support group until my marriage ended and I had to let others run that.

    Like


  279. Snap…Bonita is not African, but African American. She’s just very very dark…and very very big too.

    Like


  280. Apes bawls some more, ” But black women don’t mind being 300, 500 or even 900 pounds, and black men will fuck them all the same.”

    Oh, I see…so mom was a chronic dieter because she got a dollar in the bank for every calorie she saved.

    Thanks for clearing that up.🙂

    Like


  281. on April 24, 2009 at 9:10 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””Nicole
    Apes, either you believe in statistics or you’ll accept anecdotes.

    Statistically, it takes alot more pull and alot more money, even in the U.S. for a White guy to get next to a Black woman.

    Outside the U.S. it’s not as grim, but the attraction is not only mutual, but guys will go out of their way just for a chance of a sniff of it.””””””””””””””””

    Come on Nicole lol this is the type of shit that is crazy.

    Like


  282. Man, gotta give you mad dap on that, Dave Alex-I was thinking the exact same thing, PA, why does the lady I mentioned gotta be a Benedict Arnold? I mean dang Man, all of her White girlfriends tried to talk her outta getting married to a Black Man, saying it would never work, and think about the kids, etc. All of her girlfriends got divorced from their White hubbies. In one case, three White hubbies.

    Maybe if they got hold of some Brothas, they too can boast of five decades of wedded bliss.

    And again I agree w/Dave-whether you or anyone else likes it or not, those kids are part Polish, one of whom could pass for it on the streets of Warsaw actually. The other couldn’t, a bit too swarthy, LOL, she’s often mistaken for a Latina. But they both know Polish culture, language, history, recipes, you name it, plus they’ve visited there several times and never had any problems.

    But I’m kinda taken aback by PA’s response. Hmm.

    O

    Like


  283. ch:

    there is a rapid cognitive stratification of the West occuring right now. the guys making the bucks are the guys lucky to be born with the right genes for intelligence and diligence. and yes, those guys can cash in for high quality and quantity pussy. but not like they used to. as women are becoming richer, their screening mechanism is honing in on attractive physical and psychological male attributes at the expense of male provider attributes.

    Sorry, I was out all day and couldn’t clarify. I meant buck in the sense of tough guy. Biker gangs, rednecks, Linebackers, UFC fighters, special forces. We’re not all pussies.

    I don’t know if black guys are tough in general, or if they just like to crow a lot as PA suggested, but I’ve seen some (Defensive linemen mostly) with whom I wouldn’t want to tangle. There’s certainly no way in hell you can lump us in with Asians and Mexicans. Look at skinheads in Russia or soccer hooligans for how poor whites behave. Having said that, you’ll never see bigger pussies than whites either.

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  284. on April 24, 2009 at 9:15 pm Gunslingergregi

    Even though I am not thin now or in shape. I still got the most attractive american black chick I have seen over here to chase me down and cook me steaks. So really it is not lack of attraction from the black woman.

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  285. Gunny, read my blog.

    Read the blogs of African and African American women stationed and living overseas.

    The ones doing without are doing without only by choice.

    Unless it was klansmen playing some kind of cruel joke joining my moderated group, apparently there are alot of us out here, most with “half breed” babies who didn’t come from immaculate conception.

    I live in Israel.

    I’m awake because I just got the usual string of 3-5am drunk dials and sms’s of baby can I come over, we need to talk, i hope you’re awake, are you asleep, hi, shalom, please call me…

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  286. Obsidian, no need to be taken aback by my response. We see eye to eye on lots of things, no need to agree on everything. I am no fan of interracial marriage, and I’ve never beaten about the bush abouth that on this blog.

    I’ll put it in the plainest way I can. I see a very strong drive on the part of black guys to mate with white women. Or more generally, with non-black women. I won’t pretend to understand more behind that, but it’s there.

    It could be an antagonistic thing: break a white man’s heart by taking his beloved daughter and piss of the young white guys who want her too. Or it could be just a desire to lighten the appearance of their offspring. I don’t know.

    But we white folk have our own perspectve on these things. As human beings, we’re entitled to that, no? And our perspective is that we don’t want our kids mixing with other races because we dig the way we look, and we don’t want grandchildren who look different.

    Not better, not worse, just different. We like the way we are.

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  287. Nicole,
    Now, you can’t go to quoting facts and figures to Apeman, remember, Anon already tried that w/his Uni of Chicago IR study. Look at how that turned out, LOL!

    Again: the real question isn’t Black Men putting “standards” on Black Women, but White Men putting em on White Women, which, if what Apeman says is true, they’ve failed, yet again. You guys really have a lot of trouble keeping your Women in check, don’t you?
    😉

    O

    Like


  288. Gunny, I am not the one saying that Black women are absolutely not attracted to any White men at all. I’m just saying that social problems in the U.S. muddy the waters too much for anybody to know just from the U.S. whether or not it’s an evo bio thing or a social trend.

    To really know what’s going on, one has to look at what happens in the world, especially in places where people can date freely between ethnicities, or where people might not be so socially free, but have more balls.

    European men are generally more gutsy than American men. So what would repel them would be severe incompatibility, or brainwashings and beatings level racist programming, and the latter is still iffy.

    In the U.S. all it would usually take is a guy wondering what his friends might think.

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  289. By the way, Muslims don’t let their daughters marry outside of their religion. I don’t know if this is an Arab thing or if it comes from the Koran, but clearly the instinct to keep one’s women from being a “benedict arnold” resonates more broadly that it just being a black-whites thing.

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  290. PA, but I assure you that if the day ever came that it was politically and socially and financially inconvenient to look the way you do, you’d be covering it up or mixing when you can, just like any other socially inconvenient European.

    There are those, you know.

    It’s your good fortune that someone in the late 1800’s got it in their head to invent White. Otherwise we’d be having this debate about how Irish men date Anglo women but Anglo men won’t date Irish women, because Irish women look too brutish compared to Anglos.

    Like


  291. PA,
    Oh, OK. Nope, I don’t begrudge you for your thoughts and views on IR marriages, though I think what you really mean is *Black/White* marriages. Somehow I have a hard time thinking you’d be so ardent in your opposition if Asians were more in the mix. But I could be wrong.

    As for *why* Black Men pursue White Women (of course, we have to ask why White Women choose Black Men as well), sure, I think it fair to say that at least in some cases, status plays a role. As much as it pains a lot of us to say this, it is stil true, though not quite as much as it used to be: the American standard of feminine beauty is still White, blonde haired, and blue eyed. That’s very painful to many Black Women, who cannot change who they are, try as many of them do.

    Plus, a Nicole Brown Simpson type Woman is a sign that yu have arrived as a Black Man. I don’t accept that personally, but I’d be a fool not to recognize that at least some Black Men do.

    Then, yea, I think there is a kind of sockin it to the White Man factor in some cases. Personally I think its silly to use another human being in such a way, but again, I’m not foolish enough to pretend that factor doesn’t exist.

    But again, that is at best, only a part of the story, assuming all that’s true; we’d also have to ask, why do so many White Women seem to don’t mind being “taken” by Black Men?

    Any ideas?

    O

    Like


  292. Not sure what you mean Nicole.

    But on a much less dramatic level you can say though that as a “wrong kind of white person,” I am in fact held in low regard by today’s Master Race, the liberal SWPL set.

    And I don’t mind, and don’t cover up beyond the minimum dissimulation needed to live and work as smoothly as possible.

    Like


  293. on April 24, 2009 at 9:43 pm Gunslingergregi

    I think it is the minority challenge factor really. Anytime you take a majority and add a minority there will be woman who will want to try it out.

    Like


  294. on April 24, 2009 at 8:46 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Thanks for that link Anonymous! Hilarious!

    Another blogger wrote about Andrew, featuring his picture and a link to his personal website, in a faux contest – “Beta of the month” – the idea being that a real alpha male wouldn’t be caught dead marrying a feminist. (Or a “ball-cutting cybersuccubus”, as I was, in fact, described. Think I can get that on a business card?)

    LMAO…so we know Valenti has certainly read at least the initial post…

    Like


  295. Obsidian, my mom actually did some research on that. The two major factors that came up most often were “once you go Black, you don’t go back” both positive experiences and negative shame, and just love.

    On the list of postive experiences was that the guys gave them a sense of both stability and passion. There was a balance.

    I smiled when mom got to that part. That aspect of Black culture really doesn’t get enough love, since most of the news folks are interested in is the bad news.

    On the negative end was the usual stuff about shady guys and codependence.

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  296. on April 24, 2009 at 9:47 pm GNPs are for Apes

    I see that Obese-dian is still not answering my simple questions :

    Obsidian,

    Are you insisting that one has to interview a woman (black or otherwise) before judging whether she is beautiful or not?

    Yes or no?

    Like


  297. though I think what you really mean is *Black/White* marriages. Somehow I have a hard time thinking you’d be so ardent in your opposition if Asians were more in the mix.

    The Asian/White thing just doesn’t come up that often. But your candor with some of the other points you mention is appreciated.

    And I’ll admit this much — in being opposed to IRs, I’m probably not as cognizant of the fact that from my point of view, I am just stating a strong preference, nothing more and nothing less. And a specific king of ethnic pride, if you will.

    But from your perspective, for whatever historic reason, you may take it more personally than is intended. Like you feel that by being black, you’re “not good enough.” Let me assure you that nothing of the sort is my intention.

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  298. I see that Obese-dian is still not answering my simple questions

    kind of like you avoided the study i posted and avoided my simple question of an example of a well-to-do black man who still chooses to hook up with a fattie?

    fucking hypocrit

    Like


  299. on April 24, 2009 at 9:49 pm Gunslingergregi

    I think that is the push here like yea you need to be getting with black woman. They are a challenge. Don’t you want a challenge. It is just not the case.

    Like


  300. PA please don’t compare being conservative to being a Gypsy in Romania, or even being Irish in the U.K.

    I’m also not saying that every single one covers up or assimilates…just that White is not really a race. It is a category of races that is pretty diverse, and that if you really want to get into an intellectual discussion, we’d have to go into how much being of the broader group mattered compared to the smaller groups.

    I will bet money that Nordic women are less sought after than Scandanavian women because the former are usually somewhat heavier and sturdier built.

    One could as easily argue that Nordic type women are less sought after by men of Anglo or French ancestry because they are ugly.

    …or perhaps they are just sturdier?

    Who can say?

    Who is the arbiter of ugliness really?

    I, personally, believe that it is nature…and as individuals pay for their mistakes in matters of the heart, so do races and broader groups inclusive of many races, when they forget that what they think is pretty is not necessarily superior.

    …and if and when someone else does recognize actual superiority, it is probably not a good idea to fault them their choices.

    I’m not saying Black women are superior, or Nordic women…just that regardless of what people want to believe, there is a reality that nature always bears out despite any of our wishful thinking.

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  301. Again, no. Only black men are so unselective that they will fuck anything. This contributes to obesity in black women. If black men demanded some minimum standards from black women, black women would slim down. But black women don’t mind being 300, 500 or even 900 pounds, and black men will fuck them all the same.

    Other men, however, have standards below which they will not go. This is why other races of women contain their obesity to a much greater degree – their men will not have it.

    i explained this to you colbert. its a class thing. blue collar and broke blacks fuck fatties and so do blue collar and broke whites. he even did a post on a redneck white guy and his fat neanderthal wife. now will you respond to my earlier question and tell me a celebrity black male who is rich and still married a fat chick?

    Like


  302. Men are supposed to ’snatch’ other ethicities’ women. It’s a score for the team when a guy brings one home. But it’s a loss if a woman is taken by someone else.

    Yes, but it would be hypocritical to say that I can snatch women of other races and ethnicities, but those trying to snatch those of my ethnicity is wrong. My cousin married an Australian man, and her children are both lighter skinned than her both of her maternal parents and near the skin tone of one of her grandparents. Should I be freaking out over the loss of dark skin and black facial features? Or should I cherish two cute children regardless of ethnic looks?

    I can learn HanGul, sing Arirang and visit Seoul, but I will never, ever, ever be Korean. Only a fan of Korean culture, and there is nothing wrong with that.

    But if your one of your parents were Korean, that would certainly make you Korean.

    Apes bawls some more, ” But black women don’t mind being 300, 500 or even 900 pounds, and black men will fuck them all the same.”

    Yeah, black women tend to be fatter than their white counterparts, and black men are more accepting fatter women, but I’d make the argument that there’s still too fat for black men as well. Hell, black guys certainly make fun of fat women as well…

    I live in Israel.

    I should visit. Plus, Tel Aviv and Jerusalem are building light rail lines…🙂

    break a white man’s heart by taking his beloved daughter and piss of the young white guys who want her too. Or it could be just a desire to lighten the appearance of their offspring.

    Why would I want to piss off some white guy by marrying his daughter? Why would I want to piss off white people or any other race in general? Plus, as somebody who has family from a town in the Caribbean with a sizable mulatto population, I’d argue that inheriting light-skinned can be hit or miss.

    So, if I’m marrying a white woman, it’s because I found her to be attractive and beautiful, intelligent with a great personality, and warm and open family.

    we don’t want grandchildren who look different

    My grandchildren could be darker than me or have blond hair and blue eyes. Regardless of they look, I’d love them to death because they’re my grandchildren, and that’s all that should matter.

    Like


  303. To my way of thinking it is simply bad manners to bash on the attractive-ness of others people women, or children, for that manner.
    If two people can stand each other enough to hook up; then God be Praised.

    Like


  304. on April 24, 2009 at 10:33 pm GNPs are for Apes

    Nicole Bawled : “Oh, I see…so mom was a chronic dieter because she got a dollar in the bank for every calorie she saved. ”

    So anyone under 300 pounds is too thin?

    Hell, David Alexander admitted that many black women are too fat even for black men.

    It is a fact that black men will fuck black cetacean women of 300, 500, or even 900 pounds. White men will not fuck obese white women.

    Surely you can concede this much.

    Like


  305. I just found this site today, and find it hysterical, especially as someone who lived in DC.

    That said, WTF is this about the interracial dating, etc, b.s. of the last 30+ posts. I can’t/won’t read all 315+ at this point.

    Isn’t this about the feminization of western men and not interracial dating?

    That said, experience has taught me that women of all ages respond to men who are confident and secure in themselves, whether they wear LL Bean and Orvis, or pussy-assed goatee (yes, it looks like a vag on your face) having Affliction-wearing, uber tan, frosted hair-tips having assclowns.

    Like


  306. on April 24, 2009 at 10:42 pm Gunslingergregi

    (yes, it looks like a vag on your face)

    Don’t know how true but that was funny.

    Like


  307. Surely you can concede this much.

    surely you can concede that you still can’t come up with an example of a successful black man that fucks or marries fatties? right? oh no you can’t. because your a bitch who avoids an argument when youre outclassed. carry on then little beta.

    I think ‘Anonymous’ is a female. And by the strident tone of her comments, a very unappealing one. Sounds like that creature Dizzy. Best ignored.

    can you please explain objectivly how my comments are any more “strident” or “feminine” than the people i’m responding to? seriously? no offense but i think your compulsive need to stand by your race is messing with your objectivity

    Like


  308. Obsidian —

    The reason White guys do NOT like White women dating and having sex with Black Men is because it is a zero sum game.

    Hispanic women DO NOT date or have sex with White men, even less when immigration opens up far more Hispanic men. Asian women with increased immigration DO NOT date or have sex with White men. And emigres from Asia are increasing every year.

    There is a limited amount of hot women available to White Men: White women, a few Asian women, NO Hispanic women and NO Black women in appreciable numbers.

    Further, Black men have a habit of using violence to make their point to White men who date/marry Black women. The recent case of the four Black Camp Pendleton Marines who murdered their Polish Emigre Sergeant who dared marry a Black Woman, in Riverside CA, complete with torture-rape-murder, stands out but is not alone.

    On a brutal level, it’s understandable. Hot women are a zero sum game. Unless allowing cross-racial dating opens up hot women for your group (it never does) in equal or greater numbers, it only provokes loss and violence to mitigate loss. This is why White women generally detest racism among other forms (it limits their opportunities and they find Black Men quite attractive) and Black Women embrace in particular anti-White Racism (they do not find White Men attractive and resent Black Men dating/marrying White Women).

    Both Black Women and Asian Men tend to lose out, but neither are interested in dating each other in a mixed-race environment. You’ll see Black men with Asian women, but never ever Asian Men with Black Women. Asian men find Black women, and Black women find Asian men, mutually unattractive. Despite the “sexual arbitrage” advantage so to speak.

    For men, cross-group dating/mating is a zero sum game guaranteed to provoke violence eventually. That is as old as the Trojan War. [Clearly women like music, as the great Louis Armstrong said, are divided into two categories: hot and not.]

    Think about Chuck’s points wrt winners/losers. The “way out of the Box” for White men (or Asian men) who lose more than win from cross-group mating/dating is enforcement of group-only selection. Eventually you will see that, particularly if there are enough men tacitly supporting it. Already Asian women are facing considerable pressure to abjure White guys for dating/mating within the group, enabled by increased immigration from Asian home nations.

    On a related note, the overwhelming majority (John Mohammed and Lee Boyd Malvo excepted) of mass-killers have been sexually frustrated White and Asian men. Guys who are invested in the system romantically not only don’t go nuts killing people, they can be persuaded to die in droves if need be to defend the system.

    Like


  309. on April 24, 2009 at 10:56 pm Keith Olbermann

    The personification of the world historical event known as the death of Western Civilization is Rachel Maddow.

    In its death throes, Western Civilization holds up this “person”, or “thing” rather, as its ideal.

    Like


  310. Holy shit.

    It amazes me how strong the pull of our own personal myopic bullshit is.

    Charles Darwin’s view of marriage and Rachel Maddow?

    WTF does any of this have to do with the thread’s subject?

    Also, I’d say the Darwin thing is bullshit also, as we are talking about a mid-19th century viewpoint vs. 2009. Nonsensical. @ different times. different cultural mores and vastly different legal structures. As a lawyer would say, it’s dicta…

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  311. on April 24, 2009 at 11:27 pm GNPs are for Apes

    I think ‘Anonymous’ is a female. And by the strident tone of her comments, a very unappealing one.

    You are too generous. I was convinced by the second sentence that ‘Anonymous’ is a faggot. And a wiggery faggot at that.

    Anonymous : Of course successful black men don’t marry obese black women. They marry black women who are 7s and 8s (the max score achievable for 99.9999% of black women), or otherwise, white women who are 6s. Thus, even they think that white women are an upgrade from black women.

    You have proven my point spectacularly. I wanted to avoid humiliating you so thoroughly, but you are a glutton for punishment (and for fatties) it appears.

    tee hee…..

    Like


  312. On a brutal level, it’s understandable. Hot women are a zero sum game. Unless allowing cross-racial dating opens up hot women for your group (it never does) in equal or greater numbers, it only provokes loss and violence to mitigate loss. This is why White women generally detest racism among other forms (it limits their opportunities and they find Black Men quite attractive) and Black Women embrace in particular anti-White Racism (they do not find White Men attractive and resent Black Men dating/marrying White Women).

    Bingo.

    Competition is only fair if everything is equal. In a sexual free market, it is not equal, because Asian and white men are not desired by black and latina women and black women are not desired by white or asian men (at least in the US). So if you open everything up completely, the “losers” are: black women, white men, and asian men. The winners are: black men, white and asian women. So making it a free market doesn’t mean it is fair competition — the sexual market in North America is a very imperfect one, and there are real imbalances embedded in it, particularly if it is opened up completely.

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  313. tee hee…..

    tee hee? and you call ME a faggot?

    I wanted to avoid humiliating you so thoroughly, but you are a glutton for punishment (and for fatties) it appears.

    so far you’ve done a good job at avoiding humiliating me thoroughly. or at all even. so congrats, good job there. maybe soon you’ll even score a point!😉

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  314. Anonymous : Of course successful black men don’t marry obese black women. They marry black women who are 7s and 8s (the max score achievable for 99.9999% of black women), or otherwise, white women who are 6s. Thus, even they think that white women are an upgrade from black women.

    by the way, this is just pure proof by assertion combined with some snarky taunting. you do know that right? if that’s the best you can do, i don’t blame you, you are totally outclassed after all, but don’t act like you’ve done anything noteworthy or impressive. why not tackle actual statistic proof like the university of chicago study? oh, because you’re a coward. carry on then.

    i really like you colbert. i feel like you and i are on the same side. you say something, make an ass of yourself, then i comment and make an ass of you too. kind of like a tag team! we work well together bro. okay, i’m done making an ass out of you for now. now your turn to make an ass out of you too.

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  315. Apes ass-umed, “So anyone under 300 pounds is too thin?”

    Try 5’4″ and 110 lbs.

    That was the point when she was passing out from doing one of my cousin’s relaxer.

    It was also when dad told her that if she didn’t eat, he was taking her to the hospital.

    Some guys would just rather have a live fatty than a dead Barbie wannabe.

    I’ll concede that most American White guys, from the looks of the standard female celebrity, would rather bang the corpse.

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  316. I think you should make a post about the great Charles Darwin’s view of marriage (in case you haven’t already). He explains his decision-making process in deciding to marry in detail in his Autobiography. You’ll see his final words are the battle-cry of every man who decides to marry.

    You can find a direct link to this passage in “darwin-online.org.uk”. It’s pages 233-235 of the Autobiography.

    “The second paper is headed: – This is the Question:

    MARRY

    Children – (if it please God) – constant companion, (friend in old age) who will feel interested in one, object to be beloved and played with – better than a dog anyhow – Home, and someone to take care of house – Charms of music and female chit-chat. These things good for one’s health. Forced to visit and receive relations but terrible loss of time.

    My God, it is intolerable to think of spending one’s whole life, like a neuter bee, working, working and nothing after all. – No, no won’t do. – Imagine living all one’s day solitarily in smoky dirty London House. – Only picture to yourself a nice soft wife on a sofa with good fire, and books and music perhaps-compare this vision with the dingy reality of Grt Marlboro’ St. Marry – Marry – Marry Q.E.D.

    NOT MARRY

    No children, (no second life) no one to care for one in old age. –

    What is the use of working without sympathy from near and dear friends – who are near and dear friends to the old except relatives.

    Freedom to go where one liked

    Choice of Society and little of it. Conversation of clever men at clubs.

    Not forced to visit relatives, and to bend in every trifle – to have the expense and anxiety of children – perhaps quarrelling.

    Loss of time – cannot read in the evenings – fatness and idleness – anxiety and responsibility – less money for books etc – if many children forced to gain one’s bread. – (But then it is very bad for one’s health to work too much)

    Perhaps my wife won’t like London; then the sentence is banishment and degradation with indolent idle fool.

    —–

    It being proved necessary to marry-When? Soon or Late. The Governor says soon for otherwise bad if one has children-one’s character is more flexible-one’s feelings more lively, and if one does not marry soon, one misses so much good pure happiness.-

    But then if I married tomorrow: there would be an infinity of trouble and expense in getting and furnishing a house,-fighting about no Society-morning calls-awkwardness-loss of time every day – (without one’s wife was an angel and made one keep industrious) – Then how should I manage all my business if I were obliged to go every day walking with my wife. – Eheu!! I never should know French,-or see the Continent,-or go to America, or go up in a Balloon, or take solitary trip in Wales- poor slave, you will be worse than a negro- And then horrid poverty (without one’s wife was better than an angel and had money)-Never mind my boy-Cheer up-One cannot live this solitary life, with groggy old age, friendless and cold and childless staring one in one’s face, already beginning to wrinkle. Never mind, trust to chance-keep a sharp look out. – There is many a happy slave.

    Like


  317. on April 24, 2009 at 11:50 pm russell rodriguez

    to me it’s simple right now: trendy girls (which is basically every girl) like trendy guys

    Like


  318. on April 25, 2009 at 1:03 am Comment_Whatever

    I am so glad that what looked like a decent thread has once again degenerated into a race shouting-match.

    Here are some comments that were buried:
    Thursday said:

    “BTW isn’t it a shame that Michelangelo, the greatest visual artist ever, did horrible things to the female form. He appears to be the epitome of the female hating homosexual. I don’t think there is one genuine babe in all his vast output and there are some pretty nasty fuglies, including our mother Eve on the Sistine Chapel. The best representers of women, as far as I am concerned are Leonardo, Raphael and, my personal favourite, Botticelli. Ironically, it would seem that two of them were gay too.”

    Kim replied:

    Well, during the Renaissance using a live female model was very uncommon. Raphael was a notorious playboy and was around enough women to get a good sense of their body. Michelangelo on the other hand was using male models for the female figures he painted, which is why they are so masculine looking. It’s not a matter of him hating females. He pretty much hated everyone.

    Comments like that made me open this thread with a happy thought.

    But now we are having the amazing screaming black people vs. the amazing screaming white people. Everyone’s position is already known. No one is going to change their minds, and no one cares about how the other feels.

    Bunch of five-year olds. Worse. If five-year olds got this worked up at least they’d exhaust themselves and need to take a nap after a short-while.

    I’m going to look at xkcd now:
    http://xkcd.com/523/

    Like


  319. on April 25, 2009 at 1:15 am Gunslingergregi

    Ya never know comment people have been known to change on here.

    Like


  320. Whiskey, Vino(?),
    Ok, so lemme get this straight: the owners, makers and creators of the Free market system, who historically wasn’t all that concerned w/others, read, non-White, having a fair shake at much of anything, NOW wanna bitch and moan and complain about “fairness”? What was it the Race realists say-life aint fair?

    Right?

    White Men must learn to adapt. Period, dot. Life is not fair. You do NOT have a right to an HB10, that is a matter to be settled in open competition for her among other Men now allowed in to compete; as per genetic dictate, she will now be allowed to choose who will mount her. May the best Man win. That’s about as fair as its gonna get.

    Lemme say something else, because I see this becoming something of a rallying cry: for every Pendleton case you or anyone else here can cite, I or anyone else Black here can cite at least two documented cases where a Black Man was lynched in the town square, on a Sunday afternoon in front of the White townsfolk, w/the Sheriff in attendance, for merely *looking* at a White Woman. In fact, as the film Rosewood clearly shows, it was not uncommon for White Women to lie on Black Men when they did their dirt and was about to be found out. Seems this country has quite a long history of, when in doubt, Blame it on a Brotha (Susan Smith, anyone? And that’s just for starters).

    By and large, Brothas really don’t care if Halle Berry or Whoopi Goldberg decides to go White; good on them. Most Brothas are interested in other things, and you’d be very hardpressed to find an internet forum where a bunch of em are handwringing like so many of you are. Maybe you could take a page outta their book?

    As for the Asian guy thing, according to the US Census, Asian Women continue to choose White Men as viable mates by a seriously wide margin. So either they gotta up their learning curve on Game so they can start bagging some White gals, or they’re really up the creek. Sistas like Chic aside, which are relatively few and far between, most Sistas will NOT hookup with them, period.

    And as for Sistas…lemme say this. For all their sound and fury wrt the IR thing, the real deal is, that a lot of em use it as a nice cover for the many problems *they* have and bring to the table. One of them is the fact that mny of them are stuckup-they think that because they got a degree and a nice salary in a cushy job that a Brotha who’s a bus driver or a factory worker ain’t good enough for them-then, when that same Brotha finds love w/a White gal or a Latina, now they get mad. Happens a lot more than they’re willing to admit, and I’m only chipping away at the iceberg. Trust me, there’s a lot more to it than you think.

    Still, none of you have actually answered me-WHY do so many White Women don’t seem to mind being “taken” by Black Men? It takes two, as they say.

    Comments?

    O

    Like


  321. on April 25, 2009 at 1:28 am Willard Libby

    Chuck – Willard: no, white men don’t go through life worrying about black women’s lack of attraction, but when the subject is brought up, white men tighten up about it.

    Chuck, YOU as a White male “tighten up” when you think about black women not finding YOU attractive.

    I don’t know when you became the representative of White men.

    The vast majority of White men have NO interest in black women. They don’t care about them, don’t pursue them, and have no interest in whether or not black women find them attractive.

    Some White men might be interested in them and guess what, the black females often reciprocate the interest just like White women or Latino women or Asian women. Maybe not with YOU but they probably wouldn’t be interested in you if you were black.

    You can’t hide behind your race and say that’s the reason women of any race don’t find you attractive. Most White men complaining about black or Latino women not finding “White men” attractive are speaking about themselves and their fellow White dorks who wouldn’t be attractive to many women even if they changed their race.

    I think GNPs are for Apes is going overboard on the view that the main reason White men don’t find black women attractive is the weight issue.

    It’s true that many White American men are conforming to an obsession with bony ass women and I find it to be irritating to hear one White guy after another complaining about a woman’s weight just because she has curves.

    But the reasons for the general White male lack of interest in black females has more to due with just RACE regardless of weight. Even skinny woman obsessed White men on average will choose to pursue a chunky White girl for dating or mating over a skinny black girl.

    vino – Also, I’d say the Darwin thing is bullshit also…

    Dumb fuck please kill yourself. “The Darwin thing”…unbelievable.

    Like


  322. Comment Whatever,
    Its really simple: your White brothers have to stop saying ridiculous, dumb, and stupid shit about Black folks, man. No one knocks em for their personal tastes; but when they go to making “proof by assertion” comments and the like, that’s when I feel its my appointedd duty to mop the floor with em, and evidently I’m not alone.

    They must learn that they do not live in a vacuum, that they must learn to accept that theirs is not the only way to do things or see the world, that what they say is no longer unchallenged law anymore.

    Also, please note that I have spoken directly to the topic of the thread in my reply to QT, which I haven’t heard back from I might add, and I might also note that none of the “screaming white folks” have actually spoken to the topic using themselves as an example, like I’ve done. Please also note that I have not broached the topic of race, they have.

    Now-

    We can have a civil discussion on these matters, I for one am all for it. But what will NOT happens is the kind of juvenile crap that passes for intelligent discourse which in reality is little more than pissing on another group dressed in pseudo-intellectual drag.

    It all comes, to an End.

    The Obsidian

    Like


  323. on April 25, 2009 at 1:56 am GNPs are for Apes

    For me, it is not so much race, but features.

    As I have said many, many times, a woman like Tamron Hall or Beyonce, or part-black Halle Berry captures my imagination just as much as the hottest white woman. They have great tracts of land, all three of them.

    So the color of the skin is not the issue. In fact, I do not white skin with freckles. Rather, it is the features of the race.

    There are only about 30 black women in all of America that have Tamron Hall/Beyonce levels of beauty. Period. I have extensive experience viewing large numbers of black women in two different locations, and I wish more of them were decent looking, but they are not.

    Another U of Michigan alum, in addition to myself, agreed that among thousands of black women there, only a couple qualified as 8s, and none as 9s or 10s. Period.

    A woman of 300 pounds, of any race, is not attractive in any culture. Period.

    In almost all mammalian species, the male is larger than the female, whether sperm whales, orcas, elephants, gorillas, lions, cattle, dogs, or cats. It is the natural order of mammals. Period.

    In a free market, which is what I support, black women lose. Asian men also lose, despite their high Beta-provider capacities, UNLESS they learn Game. Game is easier for some races than others, but effort trumps all this.

    That is all.

    Like


  324. on April 25, 2009 at 2:05 am Gunslingergregi

    Game owns because whether it takes 1 or 10000 it is still possible to find your match. Maybe lol

    Like


  325. “Men who could get away with androgynous qualities while still demonstrating dominance have always been in high demand”

    Absolutely. When you can still demonstrate dominance while you handicap yourself by behaving androgenously, the dominance is all the more enhanced.

    Like


  326. on April 25, 2009 at 2:11 am GNPs are for Apes

    “One of them is the fact that mny of them are stuckup-they think that because they got a degree and a nice salary in a cushy job that a Brotha who’s a bus driver or a factory worker ain’t good enough for them-then, ”

    I’ll agree with that. Plus, the brotha’s job is a genuine job in the private sector where he is expected to perform. On the other hand, the black woman with a degree quite often works in some bullshit public sector job where no value is actually produced. Their ego is misplaced, as they are of far less value to the economy than the brotha who is a bus driver or factory worker.

    The emergence of Michelle Obama does not help matters.

    The stupid woman who was sent to dig up dirt on Joe the Plumber was in a job titled ‘Director of Health Services’ or something, and was paid $142,000 a year in low-cost Toledo, OH. She is nuts if she thinks her salary makes her smart.

    Like


  327. on April 25, 2009 at 2:19 am GNPs are for Apes

    “Still, none of you have actually answered me-WHY do so many White Women don’t seem to mind being “taken” by Black Men? ”

    David Alexander answered it, and I will concur. The answer is : white women will choose a high-status black man (athelete, movie star) over an average white man. It makes sense.

    It is not the average black men getting attractive white women for marriage.

    Like


  328. on April 25, 2009 at 2:35 am Cannon's Canon

    “Another U of Michigan alum, in addition to myself, agreed that among thousands of black women there, only a couple qualified as 8s, and none as 9s or 10s. Period.”

    Ahh yes. Her name was Nicole, actually. She was very petite; perhaps 5’2 and no more that 100 lbs… possibly less – I am bad at guessing weights, especially in girls. (few people guess my own weight within 15 lbs)

    Her lips were supple but not over-pronounced. Her eyes were wide and hazel, but in the wrong light, they sparkled green. She wore her hair in long, tightly-knit braids, surely ten years in construction. She dressed flatteringly but without flair. She alluded to a distant boyfriend who was not treating her flawlessly.

    I had not learned ‘game’, but I also had the worst mojo of my life. I had been dumped out of an LTR with a girl who was a 9 (white). Thus, despite sharing a study group, our ships passed.

    We were in some class called Black Economics in America Today 410, or some such nonsense. I got a good grade because I engaged the professor’s sensibilities, but even before the advent of conceptual ‘race realism’ in my mind, I was doomed to be an outcast amongst my peers. The class debates, with five member teams, included affirmative action; I was one of two volunteers against it. Nicole and two swipples joined me and an Irish kid, the three girls by short straw name-draw. Irish invited me to join the ‘young national republican party,’ as an elected powerholder, though I never took him up on it.

    ‘Nicole’ was hot because she was that exotic to me. I’ve fucked asian, indian, ashkenazi, brunette, and blonde. I had a huge crush on her, but still can’t rate her above an 8.

    Also, despite wanting to fuck her for a few months, I do not recall ever masturbating to her. Those fantasies are RESERVED.

    Like


  329. In Sweden, i see white/black couples and married such, as a kid i never payed any attention over this, it was just as ordinary for me as any other relationship, my best friends father was from Colombia, her mom was Finnish/Belarusian. I loved her father, he was like a father for me and i always called him Papa Yesith, as for Hungary where i live now, black guys are super popular, and live with their possibilities, the black girls are more conservative,
    Unfortunately, Hungary have some problem with racism, in 99% of the cases its a Hungarian man feeling inferior. It’s not common at all but its there.

    Like


  330. on April 25, 2009 at 2:43 am Gunslingergregi

    Your right black people are kind of being racist aren’t they by dating white woman. They are ignoring their own woman poor things.

    Like


  331. “Ahh yes. Her name was Nicole, actually. She was very petite; perhaps 5′2 and no more that 100 lbs… ”

    Maybe she doubled in size and lives in Israel now…..

    Like


  332. David Alexander answered it, and I will concur. The answer is : white women will choose a high-status black man (athelete, movie star) over an average white man. It makes sense.

    Yup. Much like a white man needs to be higher in status than a black man to pull an equivalent black woman. My point exactly. it goes both ways.

    Like


  333. I don’t know when you became the representative of White men.

    you should ask yourself that same question honorary black man.

    Like


  334. I had not learned ‘game’, but I also had the worst mojo of my life.

    Cannon,

    It is precisely at moments like these that you can finally overcome inertia, inhibitions, and past track records, shuck it all, say “fuck it all”, and break through the wall.

    We define ourselves by how we pick up the pieces after disaster strikes.
    Some throw in the towel and hit the showers. For good.
    For others of us, it’s our finest hour.

    If there is one thing to be learned from PU, it is that every misfortune is but a learning experience, and that every low point is the first step of a journey upward.

    “Without discontent, there is no progress, no achievement.”
    — Ray Locke

    Like


  335. Apes is still kvetching, “For me, it is not so much race, but features.”

    …for you. You are a White American male. Your opinion on beauty means as much as a homosexual on this side of the pond.

    Whenever you guys come over here, you jump on the women nobody over here would dump a drunk fuck into.

    …and you want to lecture others about what is beautiful or not?

    Here’s a lesson in evolution for you: If Black women really were as ugly as you would like to think we are, we’d have ceased to exist, and would never marry.

    As it is, either Black women must not be so hideous, or maybe nobody else’s race is really that much hotter.

    Beauty is what it is, and that is determined by nature. You don’t get to decide what fitness is, any more than I do.

    However, perceptions of beauty, and the reactions people have to particular types of it, depend on social factors, some of which go directly against natural fitness.

    One thing is certain about beauty though: it will always elicit some sort of reaction. Whenever it is, but it is socially inconvenient, that reaction is almost always an attempt to exploit it, and failing that, to crush it.

    You (White males) as a group were in the habit exploiting Black beauty for many years. Now that you’re incapable of doing that as much, you feel that you need to deny it and to crush it.

    I feel sorry for you.

    Like


  336. …and this, by the way, is one reason I would never in my life go near a White guy who was afraid of guns or otherwise “SWPL”, and definitely none of the dandy sort, and absolutely none of the self pitying sort (even though that kind of took care of itself because I scare them), regardless of what any of my liberal type friends were doing.

    Pity kills attraction. I can’t fall in love with a man I don’t respect.

    Lack of respect is why Black women aren’t dating more White men, not lack of options.

    Like


  337. Nicole, you’re defending black men who prefer anything over a black woman the same way the black female jurors defended OJ, who made his esteem for his fellow black women equally clear.

    Standing by your man is a fine thing. But even when scorned by that same man?

    Like


  338. on April 25, 2009 at 8:25 am Tupac Chopra

    Ob:

    Lemme say something else, because I see this becoming something of a rallying cry: for every Pendleton case you or anyone else here can cite, I or anyone else Black here can cite at least two documented cases where a Black Man was lynched in the town square, on a Sunday afternoon in front of the White townsfolk, w/the Sheriff in attendance, for merely *looking* at a White Woman.

    That was then, this is now.

    Like


  339. for every Pendleton case you or anyone else here can cite, I or anyone else Black here can cite at least two documented cases where a Black Man was lynched in the town square

    As someone else a few threads back showed, the number of black-on-white murders over the past four decades dwarfs the number of white-on-black killings over 100 years from the Civil War to the 1960s.

    The blacks who were killed for “looking” at a white women (to the extent that’s not a hyperbole) at least knew the unwritten laws of the land, however harsh they were: don’t “look” at a white woman.

    Meanwhile, the young white couple in Knoxville (and thousands like them) weren’t even breaking any unwritten rules. They were lynched in January 2007 for no reason whatsovever.

    Invoking Emmit Till will ring hollow to me until smart black guys like the ones on this blog take a look inside themselves and face up to their people’s crimes against Chris Newsom and Channon Christian.

    Like


  340. I can’t join the chorus today, cuz I just saw a HAWT NAKED BLACK CHICK not too many minutes ago.

    Skimming the comments, I get the feeling that we’ve got a lot of really introverted people here who mistake simple extraversion for “toughness”, machoness or whatever. From what I’ve seen so far, Africans are a LOT more extraverted than Europeans… but tuff, muscular, whatever? BWAHAHA, are you people fucking blind?

    And WTF is this stuff about “Hispanics” not wanting white men? Over here Latin America is mainly known as a bride hunting area for men whose wallets look much bigger over there.

    As for interethnic dating, there are often bans even when there’s no visible race involved and they have the same form. I used to fuck a Swedish girl (from Finland) who kept telling me that her parents would disown her if they knew she was fucking a Finn.

    Like


  341. And WTF is this stuff about “Hispanics” not wanting white men?

    Whiskey is an eloquent guy but dawm! he wants to be depressed. I believe he also added that east Asian women don’t want to date white guys.

    Like


  342. PA:

    I got some questions for you on your stances and well, just some situational stuff for you to chew over.

    You like to mention the fact that similarity in likeness makes it easier to be assimilated into something, else, say an ethnic Pole into White Bread America (I’m not being a wiseacre when I say this, and if you disagree, please correct me). Another thing you mention is that while a white guy could love Korea and immerse himself in everything Korean, he could never be fully considered Korean. I don’t contest that, though in my experience, learning Japanese and practicing basic Japanese cultural mores certainly made people a lot more comfortable with my presence. However, if you asked any Japanese parent what they would prefer, their daughter marrying a white American, or their daughter marrying a Korean or Chinese, even one a third gen member born and raised in Japan who doesn’t speak more than a few words of Korean, 9 out of 10 would prefer the white dude, or hell, even a brown American like me. Also, if given a choice between a Japanese guy who’s committed to not having kids (a pretty fair percentage) and a white dude who will pop out a few descendants with his J-wife, a good minority will go for the white dude. What do you make of that?

    Also, who exactly are we mixed race dude supposed to date by your estimation? I got so much blood mixed in me and was raised under the notion that my character and community is bond, not my blood. Who do I date?

    Third, as a hypothetical, say it’s 25 years from now and your daughter comes home with her fiancee. He’s not white, but for all intents and purposes he’s a stand up guy of great character and a good provider. What’s your reaction?

    Again, this ain’t an attack on you. I respect you as someone who never gives a bullshit line in a world of people talking for an audience. Just curious as to what your thoughts are.

    Like


  343. — Also, who exactly are we mixed race dude supposed to date by your estimation?

    Whoever you want to, provided her old man is OK with it.

    As far as hypothetical daughter question… I don’t have any daughters, nevertheless contemplating a response is still too personal; I don’t wanna go there. But the instinct is to protect the daughter while applauding your boy when he brings an exotic woman home.

    Hey, as a white guy, I think white dudes who date black chicks are cool, while white women who date black guys are radioactive.

    Hypoctitical, as David Alexander says? Sure, but that’s the way we’re wired. And as I like to tell David, “white people are human beings too, not just feed for David Alexander.”

    — Again, this ain’t an attack on you.

    I never took it that way, I think you’re a cool and smart guy. My other three cents is that two very separate things get conflated in these IR discussion: (1) a primal ethnic self-love vs. (2) contempt for the ‘other.’

    While I don’t deny my feelings of the former, I have nothing to do with the latter. I like my own ethnic/cultura/racial makeup, but at the same time, I also like and respect cool black guys like Obsidian and DA.

    Like


  344. Apropos to this thread, I am sure that the film “Obsessed”, which released yesterday, will incite the kinds of issues and confrontations we’ve seen in this thread, to some degree. It’s a female stalker flick, with the twist that the stalker is a younger white hottie trying to steal away an attractive high status black man from his black wife. Definitely trying to pick on some of the angst black women have about white women in America currently.

    Like


  345. on April 25, 2009 at 9:29 am Default User

    Obsidian

    You keep asserting that nobody has answered the question about why white women choose black men. That is not true. I believe that various reasons have been discussed here.

    In essence the things that allow black men to excel in sports and entertainment are just those things that are good for sexual attraction. So compared to white and Asian men:
    on average black men will be more masculine (musculature etc.) – Running, football, boxing.
    on average they will have better game (in the moment flow) – Basketball, rap.
    on average they will have more style (the dandification, pimping attitude). – Rap and cultural preference.

    White and Asian men on average score higher on provider role but lower on all of the above.

    In a “free-market” without in-group preference and where the selection is not based on the provider role we would expect black males to be more successful.

    However, there is strong in-group preference and some selection for the provider role and that balances out (to some degree) the above.

    Nobody has declared black women inherently unattractive, merely that on average they will score lower on those things that are attractive (especially to white males).

    With all the talk of evo-psych here we have forgotten one important fact. For evolutionary reasons we are not very good at intuitively understanding statistics. We tend to think in either-or terms not probabilities. This makes sense: I don’t want to say something like “well that lion killed my buddy, but maybe it was an outlier.” But in all the things we discuss here it is probabilities that we are looking at and not either-or.

    We don’t just answer to the great god of our genes but also to the great god of probabilities.

    As to why we discuss those things (inter-racial attraction), several reasons:
    – Sexual attraction is important in game.
    – The choices women make are important in game.
    – As I have said before, men are competitive.
    – There are a lot of smart guys here that love to discuss ideas.
    – These are ideas are often undiscussed in “polite” company.

    Like


  346. I like to look at some of the Black men of my acquaintance; as Obsidian and others note, they dress better than your average White guy (around here, anyway.)

    And as Nicole notes, there’s just something ABOUT a lot of them that doesn’t even need the extra ornamentation.

    That said, I’ve only ever met one that I could have remotely imagined as marriage material, and he was actually half-Korean, and seemed not to even notice that women existed. ha!

    And, alas, per my rather conservative upbringing, I’m much too uptight to just sleep with a guy for the sheer FUN of it. ah well.

    Like


  347. PA had mentioned the Islamic prohibition on out-marriage for daughters, but that’s not an ethnic thing, as Islam is a universalist religion.

    My brother did a stint as a civilian contractor in Afghanistan; some of his funniest stories are of his Pashtun co-workers trying to marry their 15-year-old sisters off to him.

    “Only you must become Muslim first! No problem!”

    Like


  348. PA & Tupac,
    Last time I heard there was no statute of limitations on Murder, and indeed, when possible, those responsible for viciously murdering Black Men in the South are still being brought to justice.

    That’s point one.

    The Pendleton case was handled and justice was meted out, I understand-and in a much speedier fashion than the many, many cases of Black Men being viciously murdered and mutilated less than a century ago. That much of this wasn’t documented, goes to PA’s citation of Tarl’s recent point that I didn’t have time to respond to, but will in this post.

    Point three…

    Assuming Tarl’s stats are accurate, it still leaves a number of unanswered questions; both he, and apparently you PA, seem to be asserting that Black folk used a concerted, organized effort to murder White folk. If we compare those murders to those of the Klan, we can clearly see that this is not the case. The Klan was, from its inception and on through its many incarnations, an organized domestic terrorist group, national in scope and documented in its actions. At best by comparison, we cannot say the same of the White murders on the part of Black folks, and in fact, other motives could be cited.

    The interesting thing here, as Anon has pointed out several times to Apeman, is that the White guys here only seem to be willing to consider “stats” that agree with their POV to begin with; if and when countervailing evidence is presented, they suddenly go blind. I doubt if mny of you have actually looked into the work of Ida B Wells, who specialized in documenting and reporting on Black Male lynchings in the early part of the last century, or have read the works of John Hope Franklin, who is widely considered to be thee authority on Black roles in American history-but you sound so sure and authoritative in your assumptions, suppositions and (often basless) theories. Its one thing to hold an opinion or personal preference. Its something else to, as Anon said, try to prove something on the basis of your say so.

    Aint gonna happen. Uh uh.

    O

    Like


  349. on April 25, 2009 at 10:04 am Comment_Whatever


    Apropos to this thread, I am sure that the film “Obsessed”, which released yesterday, will incite the kinds of issues and confrontations we’ve seen in this thread, to some degree. It’s a female stalker flick, with the twist that the stalker is a younger white hottie trying to steal away an attractive high status black man from his black wife. Definitely trying to pick on some of the angst black women have about white women in America currently.

    It is exactly what this thread is about.

    If you want to believe Hollywood is unaware that it is pouring gasoline on the fire with this movie, then close your eyes and think happy thoughts.

    Or take the red pill:
    The New York Post ran this cartoon, which was then covered in the New York Times and all around the country, everywhere.
    http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/02/18/chimp-stimulus-cartoon-raises-racism-concerns/

    Gasoline on the fire. Gasoline by the tanker truck.

    Like


  350. asserting that Black folk used a concerted, organized effort to murder White folk. If we compare those murders to those of the Klan, we can clearly see that this is not the case.

    Are you sure? Black folk sure cheered as one across the land when OJ was acquitted. That to me counts as a racial-solidarity-in-murder. And following the Knoxville atrocity, masses of ordinary black folk gathered about the jailhouse for a candlelight vigil where the suspects were kept … the vigil was for the suspects.

    And you know that scene at the beginning of New Jack City, where a group of black gangsters hold a yuppie-looking white guy by his feet over a bridge railing while his wife is screaming hysterically?

    I watched that movie on VCR with a couple of black guys. They cheered with this ear-piercing wild primal ecstasy when the white dude was dropped to his death.

    With me, a white guy, in the room with them. Where’d that come form?

    Like


  351. PA,
    The OJ case from a Black POV, was about the inherent injustice of the Justice System, when it came to Blacks. OJ’s ability to successfully fight his case, while at the same time exposing for all the world to see, the rife corruption, racism etc of the LAPD, is what Black folk are cheering-not the murder of his ex.

    Btw, while we’re on the point-Black Women who backed OJ know good and well, that had his first wife, a Black Woman, had been killed in the same manner, there would have NEVER been such a hew and cry. Black Women understand very well that when you get right down to it, a Black Woman’s life is worth less than a White Woman’s. Something else to think about.

    As for the Knoxville case, people are innocent until proven guilty; I don’t know if those vigils took place before or after the trials, so I can’t say for certain. But what I can say, is that again, for every Knoxville case you can point to, I can point to two or three where the exact same thing was done to a Black Man by Whites , no worse, because there was no trial and the Sheriff was complicit in what was going on, a vicious lynchmob taking the man to his death.

    Lastly, NJC was an excellent film, and I do recall the scene you made-no doubt, it was grisly. But what you and so many other Whites seem to loose sight of, and which MVP made so well in his film, was that Nino Brown was first and foremost, a dire enemy to his OWN PEOPLE. Go back and watch the movie again, PA-the vast majority of the people he killed, had killed, maimed or otherwise hurt, were Black. In fact, this point was made in the film itself by several actors, I think even Scottie Applegate, played very well by Ice T (who never had formal acting training at that point) said as much.

    O

    Like


  352. Bhetti, not that it seems difficult to find plenty of info on that suit, but if you’re stumped, have a look at Social Suicide’s site under “classics”. The best pic is in the shopping section.

    Like


  353. On the film, Obsessed…

    I haven’t seen the actual movie and probably won’t, as it comes accross to me to be one of those cheapthrill throwaway type flicks ahead of the Summer season. But I saw the trailers and so have a sense of what the film is about.

    If you’re interested in what I consider to be a more thoughtful treatment of the issue, I would recommend the film adaptation of Terri MacMillan’s Waiting To Exhale, which boasted an all star cast and was directed by Forrest Whittaker.

    Then, there’s the Julia Stiles flick Save The Last Dance, which also covers similar themes. Kerri Washington speaks to the Black female position very well, I think, as did Angela Bassett’s performance in WTE. And I aint even gonna front-I cheered when she burned her hubbie’s stuff in the front yard.

    O

    Like


  354. I think even Scottie Applegate, played very well by Ice T (who never had formal acting training at that point) said as much.

    The scene at the end where the detective played by Ice T rips of an Africa medalion off the black gangster and says “you ain’t fit to wear it” was pretty good.

    Like


  355. NJC was an excellent film, and I do recall the scene you made-no doubt, it was grisly. But what you and so many other Whites seem to loose sight of, and which MVP made so well in his film, was that Nino Brown was first and foremost, a dire enemy to his OWN PEOPLE.

    Right, but the wild cheering of my black buddies occurred only in the scene where a white guys gets dropped off a bridge.

    It was the first scene of the movie, so no one knew the characters yet, only that a white guy is about to be killed in front of his screaming wife.

    Like


  356. Oh, and I wanna put a dagger in the heart of this notion that Black Men are fleeing Black Women enmasse for White Women or whoever else etc. Anon’s recent “pot meet kettle” comments to Apeman come to mind, LOL-if anything, we can make that very same argument wrt White folks, because the endearing and biggest form of IR marriages are White Man/Asian Woman, and as has been noted by quite a few here, Amy and Heather aint too happy about Brad and Seth choosing Ling and Lucy Liu over them.

    The fact of the matter is, that the vast majority of Black Men, even in the upper echelons of society, tend to marry or in some other way partner up w/Black Women. Don’t believe me? Take a quick look around the NFL, NBA and the Major Leagues. Most of the Black players have Black Women on their arm. Jordan, Iverson and Johnson (Magic) all married Black Women. Barkley and Rodman are the notable exceptions.

    O

    Like


  357. I’ve never actually heard a white woman complain about Asian women– they mostly seem to grab guys that we’re fairly indifferent to.

    Things might be different if marriage/motherhood were the only possible outlet for women, but even then the kvetching would be limited to the lower rungs of the female status ladder.

    Like


  358. Anyway, I’d tend to imagine part of the mix involved in interracial pairings is how cohesive the ethnic community is, and that goes for any race, for better or for worse.

    If your whole social life is wrapped up in an ethnic community, you are not as likely to want to step out of it to date, even if you could do “better” by stepping out.

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  359. PA,
    Obviously I wasn’t there w/your friends(?) at the time you screened the film together, and so I can’t speak for what they were thinking etc. On its face I’d say that at the least it was insensitive sense you were among them. At the end of the day, the White Man ended up dead just like so many other of Brown’s victims-most of whom were Black. Murder, is murder, that’s my point, and should be dealt with as such.

    Oh, going back to the Black on White murder stats thing: what would be interesting to see, is whether the Black on Black murder rate during the same time period, was the same, more or less than the other kind? Tarl doesn’t say, neither do you-yet, as NJC clearly shows, if anything Blacks were offing Blacks at a horrific rate during the height of the Crack Wars, which were from the mid 80s to mid 90s. There are a number of documentaries that have ben done about this period in American history, PA. I would strongly urge you and anyone else so inclined, to check em out.

    O

    Like


  360. @dougjnn that Adam Corolla audio is damn hilarious – casting directors, hah.

    It takes a lot of balls to roll about when you appear outside of the norm (dandy, thug, dapper). You pop your head out of the trenches and you will be shot at. A lot of guys don’t have the guts to do that. Restating what a lot of you guys said above. This in “honest signaling”, if looking that way would normally generate negative attention, haterade, and fight starting attention: yet confidence is held.

    Like


  361. on April 25, 2009 at 11:33 am Willard Libby

    PA – Right, but the wild cheering of my black buddies occurred only in the scene where a white guys gets dropped off a bridge.

    It was the first scene of the movie, so no one knew the characters yet, only that a white guy is about to be killed in front of his screaming wife.

    Why has it taken White men so long to even begin to recognize expressions of black racism and racial aggression?

    The White men who deny and avoid this just seem unmanly. It’s as if they think the realities of the world to go away if they just don’t notice.

    Better yet, I’d like to see some movies that turn the tables on this mentality. Just as so many Hollywood movies now simply remake White movies with a black lead actor, I think it’s time to remake movies that pander to black hate and switch up the race of the characters.

    Think we’ll get a White Samuel L. Jackson any time soon?

    Like


  362. Strange Willie, we all saw what happened to Reginald Denny, and not all Black folk cheered about it, I know I didn’t. That Man had nothing to do with the Rodney King events and the Black Men responsible deserved to be dealt with harshly.

    As for Black on Black crime of Till’s era, trust me, Black folk living in northern cities, where gangs of all racial groups tended to be, knew about such things all too well. Here in Philly truckloads of dead bodies of Black guys, killed by rival Black guys in gangs, was the sad norm in the late 50s thru the 60s and on into the 70s.

    Oh, and Nicole mentioned Bonita Hyman, an opera singer. Seems she had a very successful run in the hit play Porgy & Bess overseas, Germany I think. Nicole said that she had a White hubbie. Take a look at her pics, checkout the eHarmony ad I mentioned to Apeman (who once again disappeared when presented w/countervailing evidence-see Anon’s U of Chicago study, etc.) And holla back.

    O

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  363. PA says, “Nicole, you’re defending black men who prefer anything over a black woman”

    First off, I’m not defending any humans. I’m defending nature.

    Self hatred, in my opinion, is a genetically mortal sin. So is self pity. Nature bears me out.

    Some Black men foster the extinction of their various races through self hatred. Some White men foster the extinction of their various races through self pity.

    Nature doesn’t care who any of us thinks is superior. We should care more about what nature proves to be superior.

    “the same way the black female jurors defended OJ, who made his esteem for his fellow black women equally clear.”

    I’m going to remind you who you’re talking to, and pretend you didn’t go there.

    “Standing by your man is a fine thing. But even when scorned by that same man?”

    The U.S. is not the whole world, and Black American men are not the only men in the world or the only Black men in the world.

    People who scorn others pay the same price as those they look down on: living without the benefit of the other’s presence.

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  364. Willie, interesting point you made. You may recall a movie called The Pelican Brief. It starred Denzel in the title role opposite Julia Roberts.

    The role Denzel played was actually supposed to be played by a White actor; Denzel was so good that he was able to pull it off convincingly.

    So, I say, sure, why not plug in White actors into Black-intended roles, and see what happens. Does anyone honestly think that Tom Cruise or Tom Hanks could have did just as good a job as Denzel in Training Day?

    O

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  365. Williard says, “White men generally aren’t dating black women because they don’t find them the least bit attractive.”

    No, White *American* men don’t generally find Black women attractive. The whole world isn’t the U.S. and disliking Black women isn’t part and parcel of being a White male.

    You had to be socially programmed to not find any young, fit woman without major defects attractive.

    I’m not arguing that White American men generally find average Black women attractive.

    I’m arguing that White American men have been socially programmed against attraction to Black women, and will seldom admit to it, even if it’s there. Black women are also socially inconvenient to many White men, which, for your average person, who is moral silly putty, is enough of a deterrent.

    Men backwards rationalize to cover the fact that most of you are tools, the same as women do because most of them are tools.

    Where people weren’t socially programmed against Black women in particular, once the fear “otherness” is dealt with, it’s like trying to find one’s way through a cock forest.

    “The average White man finds the average black female to be ugly or just a turn off on so many levels.”

    Again, no argument there. You’re just saying again, that most people are tools, and this is how a specific group of tools who share similar complexions are programmed.

    “There are exceptions. There is also homosexuality and other people with weird sexual fetishes.”

    Enjoying sex with young, fit women is now a fetish?

    Well, looks like the feminists have won.

    Bring on the early aging anorexic wall kamikazes!

    Like


  366. OMW, Nicole,
    OMW, your comments point to something I’ve said before, that often, a lot of White Womendont “go there” because of the social pressures of her family, community etc. As these pressures lessen, we’ll see more White Women wanting to sample Men of other races, most notably Black & Hispanic.

    Nicole, your points about natural sexual selection are right on point, and its interesting to watch some White guys continuing to mire themselves deeper and deeper in the quicksand-Africa is rife w/examples of White guys not being able to keep his hands off very decidedly Black Women. Afterall, where’d the Mulattoes come from?
    😉

    O

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  367. obsidian:

    Last time I heard there was no statute of limitations on Murder, and indeed, when possible, those responsible for viciously murdering Black Men in the South are still being brought to justice.

    you’re changing the issue of the debate. no one here can reasonably deny that justice was likely not meted out for those lynchings. the point pa brought up was that the bigger issue today is the massive black on white crime rate. how long do black people want to use inexcusable crimes of the past that may never be resolved to somehow mitigate inexcusable patterns of violence today??

    you’re good at changing the issue of the debate, and i’ve seen you use this pretty effectively to evade points people bring up that you aren’t prepared to seriously debate.

    but, this tactic needs to be called out more by others when it happens.

    Assuming Tarl’s stats are accurate, it still leaves a number of unanswered questions; both he, and apparently you PA, seem to be asserting that Black folk used a concerted, organized effort to murder White folk. If we compare those murders to those of the Klan, we can clearly see that this is not the case. The Klan was, from its inception and on through its many incarnations, an organized domestic terrorist group, national in scope and documented in its actions. At best by comparison, we cannot say the same of the White murders on the part of Black folks, and in fact, other motives could be cited.

    i wouldn’t necessarily assert that anything concerted is going on. it might be an unorganized collective animus from certain large segments of black society to certain large segments of non-black society. the antipathy is likely driven by a thuggish ghetto mentality.

    however, one might ask the question: is the antipathy of ghetto black culture that is driven by a loose sense of rage at another group worse or better than a more organized animus of the kkk toward non- whites??

    i think numbers (i.e. amount of victims, for example) matter in such a debate. it’s obvious organized groups can potentially wield greater power to kill but today, the bigger threat to society as a whole comes from the less organized but as odious segments.

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  368. Freak Show,
    Interesting that you would charge me with changing the debte and evading questions, when you seem to do a pretty good job of it yourself.

    Both Tarl and PA are clearly making the case, that Black on White violence and more importantly murders, are not only on a par w/the KKK, but *exceeds* it, though neither provide any evidence that the former is truly an organized effort in a manner approaching that of the latter. Neither have you, in fact, you changed the debate.
    Nor have you taken up the question of whether Black on White murders is less than, on a par with, or more than, Black on Black murders for the same time period Tarl selected. I’ve already noted the Crack Wars, which was the subject of the movie New Jack City, which PA cited. Again, I have not heard from you on this point.

    It should be noted that neither PA, nor Tarl, have spoken to this either.

    Pot, meet Kettle.

    O

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  369. Ob:

    PA & Tupac,
    Last time I heard there was no statute of limitations on Murder, and indeed, when possible, those responsible for viciously murdering Black Men in the South are still being brought to justice.

    Nice way to sidestep the point.

    The significance of the violent crime issue is that, today, it is massively dispraportionate among the black population. Massively.

    Nothing will change that fact, not even handwaving about old Leroy gettin’ a whuppin from Massa.

    Like


  370. on April 25, 2009 at 12:23 pm ManWithNoName

    Re ‘whiskey” and others: Its been my experience that mexican women are open,ya might say,to white guys……(As an aside,it appears that mexicans have a marked Older-man/younger woman aspect to their sex style. This may be part of their indigenous culture. Many mexican men are attracted to frighteningly young girls. mexican girls seem -ahem-to be open to sex with older men to a degree I was surprised by!)……………………………..This may be in contrast to “blacker” latinoes like the PR’s,& the Dominicans. BTW black men(and black latinos) are extremely sensitive to the issue of white men with “their” women–at least thats surely the feeling I get. Lower class black men—who have STRONG “issues” re women, can be very touchy about this stuff. Black men dont care about BF going interracial?? Ask a black woman! A black female,from what Ive seen,(lived in Chicago) seems to be constantly monitoring her situation so as not to unduly invoke BM violence.

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  371. Man w/No Name,
    Can’t speak on the Mexican deal, but I’ve been Black all my life and probably know more Black Men than you, and can tell you, I’ve yet to run accross a Brotha who gave a shit if some Sista somewhere got w/a White fella. So what.

    O

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  372. obsidian:

    Interesting that you would charge me with changing the debte and evading questions, when you seem to do a pretty good job of it yourself.

    i did nothing of the sort- but nice try trying to change the issue to look like i did and then taunting me about it. again, let’s call your debating tactics out more often.

    i don’t know enough about whether or not black on white violence today exceeds or doesn’t exceed historical white on black violence. my points are more to how relevant this is for today’s society and how relevant the issue of organization of antipathy is to crime rates.

    obsidian, i think you’re a smart, high iq guy. but, i don’t like your debating tactics that too often imo relies on shaming and evasion. i have no problem conceding points when they need to be conceded. for example, when t was debating with some of the people here about how dunbar hs showed how blacks can succeed academically with better environmental/cultural conditions conducive to high iq, i had no problem agreeing with him publicly on this or hs’s site.

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  373. Estimating African American Admixture Proportions by Use of Population-Specific Alleles

    We analyzed the European genetic contribution to 10 populations of African descent in the United States (Maywood, Illinois; Detroit; New York; Philadelphia; Pittsburgh; Baltimore; Charleston, South Carolina; New Orleans; and Houston) and in Jamaica, using nine autosomal DNA markers. These markers either are population-specific or show frequency differences >45% between the parental populations and are thus especially informative for admixture. European genetic ancestry ranged from 6.8% (Jamaica) to 22.5% (New Orleans). The unique utility of these markers is reflected in the low variance associated with these admixture estimates (SEM 1.3%-2.7%). We also estimated the male and female European contribution to African Americans, on the basis of informative mtDNA (haplogroups H and L) and Y Alu polymorphic markers. Results indicate a sex-biased gene flow from Europeans, the male contribution being substantially greater than the female contribution.

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  374. I’m skeptical of the social programming explanation for the seemingly mutual antipathy between black women and white men in NA. If there was such social programming, it would also be applicable to white women in NA. But white women in NA are more attracted (a LOT more) to black men than white men are to black women, and vice versa.

    I think the factors mentioned by Default User are the real ones that drive this, not racist programming. Again, if it were racist programming, one would expect white women to be equally reluctant about black men as white men are when it comes to black women.

    I know the counterargument is that white women are different from white men, because white men were everyone’s oppressor. But that seems to amount to saying that white women are less racist than white men. Do you really believe that?

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  375. Obsidian, we just might have to rewrite an old saying to, “Hell hath no fury like a woman or White guy’s scorn.”

    It’s interesting to me how in the space of a mere hundred years, industry level sexual exploitation with advertisements, tourism, and the whole nine yards, turned into a general aversion.

    Speaks to the power of propaganda.

    I believe that the turnabout came from the same social changes that made prostitution illegal, and brought on prohibition. Prior to that time, it was fairly normal for men with money (and White men generally had more of it) to indulge in sexual tourism in Louisiana and south Texas particularly, well after placage degenerated. Then there’s the maids and general social climate being that it was dangerous to say no to a White guy.

    My grandmother told us horror stories of friends of hers whose families were threatened because a White guy with money wanted them. One woman she knew was forced to live with (actually in a house bought by) a guy she wouldn’t name because at the time he was still alive, on penalty of her former husband and kids being murdered.

    We were warned about White men because of these horrid memories, even though due to social changes, we have very little chance of something like that happening today. My grandmother would worry about White guys I was even studying or friends with.

    Once I got so upset with her badgering that I reminded her that we’re mixed. She turned around and gave me a look that would have burned me to a cinder if looks could kill, and told me that I should be worried *especially* because we’re mixed.

    …and much to my mom’s dismay throughout childhood, Grandma favored her darker children over her lighter ones.

    Prohibition and other related movements though, are what I think helped to spur the push in the opposite direction…to where Black women moved from being prime sexual exploitables, to untouchables. White women understood that if something wasn’t done to curtail it, those who were lighter skinned or passable, would become competition in greater numbers, and miscgenation would become more difficult to control if White men’s sexual energies were trained towards Black women until marriage. Not all White guys were wealthy or I suppose cold blooded enough to be able to rigidly divide their sexuality from their romanticism.

    Prostitution itself was a threat to monogamy once women got the vote and wanted more power over men. Race specific prostitution seemed even more a threat. So White men had to be actively discouraged from viewing Black women as sexually attractive at all. It wasn’t hard since we were already viewed as inferior.

    So with prohibition, the world wars, civil rights, and the Twiggy standard, now we have White American guys believing that it’s natural for them to be averse even to sex with Black women.

    Someone should tell them that outside the U.S. many of these movements that shifted their perceptions, didn’t happen. In some ways that’s bad, but in some ways, good.

    Like


  376. …and no, Gunny, I’m not saying that White guys should go out and shag Black women to prove their independence.

    In sexuality, I think it best to let sleeping dogs lie, so to speak…and just see what happens if you don’t overtly program your sons.

    It is most likely that without any hype in either direction, they’ll favor women who look or at least behave like their mom. Nobody should be pressuring anybody to exploit people of different ethnicities, to go with different ethnicities to prove something silly, or to shun other ethnicities based on artificial superiority.

    Like goes to like, and bad or screwed up intent often produces bad results. I prefer clean and natural selection.

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  377. …and no, Gunny

    Am I picking up on an affectionate address? wouldn’t be surprised, as he one of my favorite characters here. And a well worth reading wise little fucker of an oracle, once I unscramble his crazy run-on sentences🙂

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  378. Nicole, tru all dat. Right on, Sista.

    Freak Show, don’t know if you know this, but styles makes fights. Unlike many in this venue, I don’t care to wrassle and wrangle around. Much too pretty and sexy for that. So, I like to work that jab then get outta the way. Classic stick n move.

    Shall we dance?

    *loads Maze feat. Frankie Beverly*

    Alrighty then, FS, this is real simple-the argument Tarl and PA are making is that, in nour time, really the modern era, the past quarter of a century or so, Black folk have shown more antipathy toward Whites, than the Klan has toward Blacks, and they use as evidence of their claim, the Black on White murder rate.

    Ok, I say, so my question is, where is the evidence that Black organized themselves like the Klan did? Neither Tarl nor PA, nor you, have an answer.

    Moreover, I ask: in light of what we know about gang violence etc, what is the Black on Black murder rate relative to the Black on White murder rate in the same time period Tarl uses?

    Still, no response from him, PA, or you.

    So, you’ll please pardon me if I’m not really that into what any of you are saying, especially since its highly unlikely that any of you have actually studied Wells or Franklin.

    And, one mo thing-White folks gotta get outta this idea that life began yesterday. History, modern and ancient, matters.

    Anyway, thanks for the compliment.

    I think…?😉

    The Obsidian

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  379. — where is the evidence that Black organized themselves like the Klan did? Neither Tarl nor PA, nor you, have an answer.

    I did answer that by pointing out that blacks, while not necessarily well-organized, do collectively celebrate occurrances of black-on-white violence, be it real (OJ, Knoxville) or fictional (NJC).

    — what is the Black on Black murder rate relative to the Black on White murder rate in the same time period Tarl uses? // Still, no response from him, PA

    I’ve never brought up black-on-black murders, just like I’ve never brought up white-on-white murders, from some redneck bar knifing to the trenches of Verdun. Why? Not relevant to the topic of interracial crime. An “internal matter” for blacks and whites respectively, if you will.

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  380. Also, I wonder if anyone noticed that Nicole’s anecdotal accounts of her grandmother and Anon’s more scientific evidence tallies very well w/one another. Am most interested in the erudite counter arguments of Tarl, Willie and Apeman. They should be coming along any minute now…

    O

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  381. I’ve never actually heard a white woman complain about Asian women– they mostly seem to grab guys that we’re fairly indifferent to.

    then you’re not looking hard enough or living under a rock. i hear white women complain about this ALL THE TIME.

    http://black-misogynist.blogspot.com/2006/12/why-white-women-hate-asian-women.html

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  382. Nicole’s anecdotal accounts: nothing to comment; we all have family anecdotes because we all have our families, histories and struggles.

    Anon’s scientific evidence: I ignore commenters who are too boorish to choose a nick name (btw, I am not of the “black women are unattractive” persuasion; even said something on that point early in this thread).

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  383. White men generally aren’t dating black women because they don’t find them the least bit attractive. The average White man finds the average black female to be ugly or just a turn off on so many levels.

    Yup. And when you add the fact that black women find white men equally unattractive as white men find black women, that explains why black women and white men don’t date each other. It’s a mutual lack of attraction, as pointed out in the univ of chicago study:

    For equal success with an African-American woman, a Hispanic man needs to earn an extra $184,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $220,000.

    For equal success with a white woman, an African-American needs to earn an additional $154,000; a Hispanic man needs $77,000; an Asian needs $247,000.

    For equal success with a Hispanic woman, an African-American man needs to earn an additional $30,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $59,000.

    For equal success with an Asian woman, an African-American needs no additional income; a white man needs $24,000 less than average; a Hispanic man needs $28,000 more than average.

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  384. PA,
    Come on, your “OJ” and New Jack City examples are a bit thin, don’t you think? They’re not even comparable to the kinds of lynchmob violence visited on Black Men. Seriously, do you know who Ida B Wells was? Have you ever read up on her? I think you might, since you already have some familiarity w/Black lit and the like.

    As for my asking about the BOB murder rate in relation to the BOW ones, I did so because I wanted to “stress test” the idea that Black hated White so much that they killed them above and beyond even their own. So, let’s find out, shall we? As I pointed out in the movie you mentioned, NJC, more Black folk got killed, and much more viciously at that, than the one White guy at the beginning. Doesn’t excuse it no doubt, but it does put things into perspective.

    Remember, when the riots broke out in the 60s, it was Black areas that were destroyed most, take Watts for example. And the same largely held true in the 90s w/the King riots. If you lived in Orange County or Simi Valley, you didn’t have anything to worry about.

    You White folk sure do scare easy.😉

    O

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  385. so basically, white men turn off black women on “so many levels” too, honorary black man libby.

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  386. Yo Anon, speaking of the Uni of Chitown, are you familiar with their Black Name/White Name study? DEEP.

    Holla back

    O

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  387. You White folk sure do scare easy.

    Now ther’s fighting’ words! You must be thinking of that herb yuppie who will get shoved by a thug and only to grin sheepishly and mutter under his breath “fucking … African American!” and then go ahead and vote for Obama to atone for his white guilt.

    Me? my grandfathers, both in uniform and as partisants, killed men who invaded their country some 60 years ago. One grandpa was shot up so bad, the unit he was with left him in some barn with other wounded guys, and only some local townsfolk nursed him back to life. If not for his wounds, he would have entered Berlin in May 1945.

    Me, heh, living mostly in peaceful times, thank God. But at 31, I got provoked into a fight by a thuggish black guy (my only fight with a black dude) and my reaction was much different than the above-mentioned herb character.🙂

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  388. according to the university of chicago study, asian women would be the way to go. too bad they do nothing for me.😦

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  389. My admittedly anecdotal experience is that white women are indeed quite threatened by asian women — unless the white women are of very high mate value. I recall comments like “that guy must have an asian fetish” or “yeah, that guy just wants a submissive little asian doormat” (as if Asian women were pushovers or something lol). There are plenty of white women who see asian women as a threat, no question.

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  390. Nicole: “It’s your good fortune that someone in the late 1800’s got it in their head to invent White.”

    Nicole, you are entitled to your own opinions, as absurd as they may be. You are not, however, entitled to make up facts and attempt to pass them off as truth. The idea that white was “invented” in the late 1800’s is absurd. The very first United States Naturalization Law, passed in 1790, limited naturalized citizenship to whites. Other laws, including anti-miscegenation laws, had been passed much earlier during Colonial times, going back to the 1600’s.

    Of course, they could have just as easily said European. Nothing was “invented,” at least not in the way you claim. And even if you continue to suggest that it was, as I’m sure you will, you could at least do the board the courtesy of not spreading obvious misinformation.

    Of course, your agenda here is obvious. You want to deny that whites (Europeans) exist as a real people with legitimate interests. If whites don’t exist, then they can’t have interests, and therefore can’t defend those interests. This, in a nutshell, is the entire agenda of the “whites don’t exist” crowd. They are fanatical for a reason: it suits their selfish agenda.

    Once this crazy doctrine is accepted, it becomes o.k. to displace whites, reduce them to a minority in every single white country on the planet (not just the U.S.), and ultimately get rid of them altogether. And when whites oppose this anti-white agenda, you call them ignorant. LOL!

    Like


  391. Re black violence. Uhmmm…are you aware WHY the Klan was formed in the first place? When the slaves were “freed” they found a society reeling from war,with poverty and hunger everywhere. The N’s went on a crime spree from hell,including a LOT of rapes of white women;and no,not the Made-For-TV-type rape where the dumb white slut is screwing the noble negro and cries rape when they get caught– I mean real life rape,ugly and brutal,with victims often murdered,dismembered and other nasty stuff. The Klan was formed by a group of Confederate officers as a self defense group for their families. Black violence—-I mean Jesus H Christ,black guy,I assume you live in the ghetto,you dont see this???—has been the driver of LOTS of the Jim Crow stuff that was so onerous to black people. We have “passive’ Jim Crow today,as white people,SWPL assholes and white-hating Stop-racism-Hate -Anti-Semitism jewboys,ALL avoid you like the plague. Both are forms of self defense. :0 White women “dating” black men? UGH–makes me want to vomit. Would love to see them horse-whipped and tarred and feathered.

    Like


  392. Invoking Emmit Till will ring hollow to me until smart black guys like the ones on this blog take a look inside themselves and face up to their people’s crimes against Chris Newsom and Channon Christian.

    From the limited stuff that I’ve seen on this issue, I can’t say certainly that this was a bias or hate crime even if the races were reversed, but the way the victims were treated was certainly brutal and sad and deserving of long sentence regardless of intent.

    BTW, the trials for those accused of murder has been pushed back to 2009.

    Black folk sure cheered as one across the land when OJ was acquitted.

    As Obsidian stated, OJ became the proxy for a sizable chunk of the black population that connected OJ to some sibling, cousin, son, boyfriend, or friend that was put in jail, and the acquittal was a sense of relief of feeling that the system isn’t that rigged. Had the verdict gone the other way, you’d simply have a population that felt that the trial was rigged against him and that no black man can get a fair trial anywhere in the US.

    As for interethnic dating, there are often bans even when there’s no visible race involved and they have the same form.

    I know plenty of Caribbeans who don’t want their children to date African-Americans…

    And you know that scene at the beginning of New Jack City

    I’ll be honest, I really can’t give you an explanation as to why those guys were cheering. Maybe it’s because it was the first violent scene in the movie, or it may be a case where that yuppie served as the symbolic representation of their hate for white men. They may not hate you because you’re white, but in an acceptable ethnic sense, but they may hate the bland “white middle class” for being “rich” and having “easy” lives compared to their vantage point. Mind you, that doesn’t mean that every black guy is cheering for the same reason, or that every black guy would cheer at all.

    Of course they, and racially paranoid blacks, ignored all the black on black crime in Emmitt Till’s day as well.

    Dude, I’m probably the most racially paranoid person in this blog, and even I’d be afraid of the thugged out black guy walking down the street too.

    Both Tarl and PA are clearly making the case, that Black on White violence and more importantly murders, are not only on a par w/the KKK, but *exceeds* it, though neither provide any evidence that the former is truly an organized effort in a manner approaching that of the latter

    This is where things certainly do become murky. For an average black criminal, it may make more sense to target blacks because they’re closer targets in the neighbourhood while whites may simply be better targets because they’re more likely to be financially better off. The question is if it’s a bias crime to simply rob somebody because they’re better off.

    Regardless of the intent of the crime, it is obvious that we do have a high crime rate regardless, and we need to find a way to prevent people from turning to crime.

    Like


  393. on April 25, 2009 at 1:52 pm ironrailsironweights

    Get a load of this: age 58 and still a tasty GNP.

    Peter

    Like


  394. I wouldn’t know about it being a trend on the rise. I’ve seen guys dressed like that for years. Maybe more of them are now popping up in DC.

    I used to see them in Baltimore years when I frequented clubs there 05-08. Seen a few in DC, but non in College Park.

    Like


  395. as far as new jack city goes, a lot of it may have to do with anti-yuppie feeling. for example in movies where its all one race and a regular white dude does violence against a white yuppie i recall many white people cheering as well. not purely race issue all tho that has some factors.

    no comment as to phil’s revisionist history of the formation of the klan. i’ll let him wear his tin foil hat in peace.

    Like


  396. I mean Jesus H Christ,black guy,I assume you live in the ghetto,you dont see this???—

    yes because the reconstruction south and the modern ghetto are exactly the same and directly analagous. dumbass.

    Like


  397. Oh btw,to “Anonymous” the guy with the Univ of Chicago study, its spelled “menstruating” NOT “menstrating” as you wrote. Doesnt make ya stupid,just makes ya wrong!

    Like


  398. Re “Anonymous” No I never said the modern ghetto and the postwar south were “exactly” the same or even remotely the same;all I implied is that both contain young black men,so in THAT respect they will face similar problems.

    Like


  399. Anon,
    Yea, Phil’s rendering of Klan history is very interesting, LOL. And to think to this day in 2009, we still have White guys believing this stuff.

    PA, I meant my parting shot as a kind of tongue in cheek deal. I know a bit about the Polish peeps. You aight.😉

    O

    Like


  400. hahahaha you are so dumb phil. how do you even tie your shoes?

    Like


  401. Re “Anonymous” No I never said the modern ghetto and the postwar south were “exactly” the same or even remotely the same;all I implied is that both contain young black men,so in THAT respect they will face similar problems.

    This sentence is the equivalent of saying:

    “No Anonymous, I’m not saying water is wet. I’m just saying it’s not dry.” lmao

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  402. Re “Anonymous” No I never said the modern ghetto and the postwar south were “exactly” the same or even remotely the same;all I implied is that both contain young black men,so in THAT respect they will face similar problems.

    i like how instead of tackling the substance of the study when you mention it, you sidestep and point out a spelling error instead. very telling, very bitchy, lmao like most women, guess when you can’t deal with stats and proof that’s what you have to resort to!😉

    Like


  403. hey phil, since by your stellar logic we can use black modern urban places to make assumptions about black population in the reconstruction south, i guess in your mind we can also use white modern urban places to make assumptions about white population in reconstruction south right? so i guess i can read stuffwhitepeoplelike.com and use that to get a perfect picture of white life in reconstruction south, huh? since white and black life in modern cities and in reconstructionn south has same problems. seriously, you just make it too easy lol. and i though colbert was bad!

    Like


  404. Anon,
    Yea, I’m starting to notice the same trend among those guys. Why not take on the Uni of Chitown study directly? Is it on point or not, and why? I mean, Apeman went to two of the best unis in the country; Willie has White Man’s Manifest Destiny on his side and so on.

    So what about it fellas?

    O

    Like


  405. obsidian:

    Ok, I say, so my question is, where is the evidence that Black organized themselves like the Klan did? Neither Tarl nor PA, nor you, have an answer.

    i doubt that blacks ever did that to same degree.

    obsidian, it’s difficult to argue against points i’m not making.

    i think you are confused as to what you think i am arguing and what i actually wrote about this. my point was how relevant the issue of organization is/was to society compared to the impact of either process (organized vs disorganized states of animus) to crime rates.

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  406. Freak Show,
    My point is to try to see if what Tarl and PA are asserting does in fact hold true, that Black folk have a demonstrated organizational ability to kill White folks enmasse. Thus far, there is no such effort being shown. Dave Alex has brought up the possibilty for other motives.

    So yea, Whites are killed by Blacks-but we have to determine WHY this is so. Tarl, PA, and others merely assert that this is due almost exclusively to racial animus, yet they haven’t proven this to be so. On the other hand, I can present evidence that the Klan’s entire existence, from day one, was to visit violence, intimidation and even death on Black folks.

    O

    Like


  407. on April 25, 2009 at 3:22 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””Ryder,
    Of course, your agenda here is obvious. You want to deny that whites (Europeans) exist as a real people with legitimate interests. If whites don’t exist, then they can’t have interests, and therefore can’t defend those interests. This, in a nutshell, is the entire agenda of the “whites don’t exist” crowd. They are fanatical for a reason: it suits their selfish agenda.

    Once this crazy doctrine is accepted, it becomes o.k. to displace whites, reduce them to a minority in every single white country on the planet (not just the U.S.), and ultimately get rid of them altogether. And when whites oppose this anti-white agenda, you call them ignorant. LOL!:””””””””””””””””””‘

    This is truth

    Like


  408. on April 25, 2009 at 3:28 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””Obsidian
    PA,
    Come on, your “OJ” and New Jack City examples are a bit thin, don’t you think? They’re not even comparable to the kinds of lynchmob violence visited on Black Men. Seriously, do you know who Ida B Wells was? Have you ever read up on her? I think you might, since you already have some familiarity w/Black lit and the like. “”””””””””””””””””””””””

    They are not thin obsid. Almost every white person that has spent time with black people can more than likely come up with some racist shit those black people did. Now black people that have spent time with white people cannot come up with racist shit the white people did. Gang beatdown of white person by group of black guys. Gang beatdown of black person by group of white guys. This is just one of the more obvious ones. Blacks just hating whites and acting on it.

    Like


  409. on April 25, 2009 at 3:41 pm Willard Libby

    Obsidian – Alrighty then, FS, this is real simple-the argument Tarl and PA are making is that, in nour time, really the modern era, the past quarter of a century or so, Black folk have shown more antipathy toward Whites, than the Klan has toward Blacks, and they use as evidence of their claim, the Black on White murder rate.

    Ok, I say, so my question is, where is the evidence that Black organized themselves like the Klan did?

    The Klan organized themselves as to protect White people from disorganized black violence. The kind of violence rampant today. They saw themselves as ultimately defending White people not simply attacking blacks.

    Unfortunately what we have now in America is a very high rate of black on White crime that is perpetrated in a disorganized manner. It gets little attention for obviously political reasons. While at the same time much more rare White on black crimes like Emmitt Till/James Byrd get priority attention and moral outrage.

    Moreover, I ask: in light of what we know about gang violence etc, what is the Black on Black murder rate relative to the Black on White murder rate in the same time period Tarl uses?

    You’re running scared here. The black on White crime in America is often simply racist and not gang related. Black on White rape, assault and aggression is most often NOT gang related. So focusing on comparing gang related murder alone is an evasion.

    And the black on White violence referred to here is not confined to murder. It goes beyond that.

    Black on black gang/drug related murder is higher than black on White murder and much more common than White on black crime AT ANY TIME IN AMERICAN HISTORY. More than 1000 black males were killed in NYC by other black males during the 4 years of the Dinkens administration. That’s one city in only 4 years and the number is close to 1/3 the total black males lynched by White men in the US in the post Civil War period.

    Yet where’s the historical recognition? Blacks are forever complaining about black exclusion from the history books. OK, then why exclude the reality of black on black and black on White violence from the historical record and why put so much focus on lynchings and “hate crimes” by White men that are less common?

    It’s interesting to note the avoidance of black on black murder through the time of lynchings to the 1950s. I have not doubt that black males have murdered each other over women, ego, money and revenge at a rate higher than the rate of black males being lynched by White men.

    But America doesn’t seem prepared to admit that. Same with alleged rapes of black women during slavery. No doubt the vast majority of black female slaves who were raped were raped by black male slaves. But again, down the memory hole it goes.

    Nicole – Williard says, “White men generally aren’t dating black women because they don’t find them the least bit attractive.”

    No, White *American* men don’t generally find Black women attractive. The whole world isn’t the U.S. and disliking Black women isn’t part and parcel of being a White male.

    Nicole, you are a fat ugly black female. I don’t mean to rub it in but that’s the case. You obviously feel threatened that your type is not held up as an ideal by the world.

    The preference by White men on average for White women over black females in universal and not cultural. It is not limited to White American men or to White men. East Asian men also prefer the White female type over the black female. On average.

    This has many reasons. My theory is that in part we have a conflict between the more Ape like black racial type contrasted with the Whiter type which is the racial type that created modern global civilization. So “negroidness” can be viewed as something primitive and backward while Whiteness is viewed as something more modern and superior.

    Black folks simply have a more “prehistoric” look and White folks look more “modern”. Males generally want to breed away from their ape-like past and toward an ideal that is both less apelike/less negroid and toward a type with greater neoteny.

    The Japanese males take this to the extreme with their interest in anime and it’s high value placed on a female type that expresses extreme neoteny.

    Given a choice between two different women from “The View” men world wide prefer Elizabeth Hasselbeck types over Whoopi Goldberg types.

    That’s not culture, that’s evolution.

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  410. O, maybe the problem is that the findings of study are not covered in the sailer talking points so they are stumped when forced to go off script. guys, why not email sailer direct and wait for him to give you your responses? i can wait. i’ll help you out with some suggestions…how about everyone participating in study is liberal so study cant be trusted. oh and something about swpl, thats always good stock response. or you can say something really self-flattering and ridiculous like the black women deep down wanted the white guys but were saving face because knew white guys didnt want them and were heartbroken so thy rejected white guys first. even tho im joking i know some of these deliberately dumb responses are not beyond some of you😉

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  411. on April 25, 2009 at 3:49 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””””””something really self-flattering and ridiculous like the black women deep down wanted the white guys but were saving face because knew white guys didnt want them and were heartbroken so thy rejected white guys first. “””””””””””””””””””

    I am a one man myth busters. They don’t reject white men. This is a myth promoted by you.

    Like


  412. honorary black man libby, take your tin foil hate off. even most sites made by the ku klux klan themselves don’t claim the klan formed to stop black violence but rather as a backlash to reconstruction persecution and stripping of rights by the northern whites.

    http://www.kukluxklan.bz/historic.html

    your only criteria for whether a fact is true or not is whether it makes white ppl look good or makes black ppl look bad.

    Like


  413. on April 25, 2009 at 3:53 pm Gunslingergregi

    Now being fat yea it makes it more difficult on the club scene. Now if you go to the work scene. Myth busted you can still pull woman because of your brain.

    Like


  414. Willard, you make me laugh. Not only did you Ad Hommed Nicole and didn’t actually take on her points (did you checkout Bonita Hyman yet?), but you then give a revisionist history of the Klan, state completely ridiculous stuff about Blacks and crime rates that run in direct contravention to known experts in the field…whew. No wonder you rarely talk about Women in your life.

    Oh, and Nicole’s not the only Black Woman to make the case that elsewhere in the world, Sistas aren’t viewed in the same way as they are here. Chic said the same thing, based on her actual trips abroad in Europe. She’s not fat, btw.

    O

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  415. This has many reasons. My theory is that in part we have a conflict between the more Ape like black racial type contrasted with the Whiter type which is the racial type that created modern global civilization. So “negroidness” can be viewed as something primitive and backward while Whiteness is viewed as something more modern and superior.

    but if the reason is that whiteness is universally viewed as modern and superior, why are black women equally unattracted to white men as white men are to black women? by your logic, the lack of attraction would be a one way street if it was simply a matter of one trait being viewed as more modern and superior. since black women are just as physically turned off by white men as vice versa, this reason doesn’t work. a suggestion: it would help if you analyzed the facts with the intent of finding the truth rather than finding fanciful ways of boosting your fragile self-esteem.

    Like


  416. obsidian:

    Yea, I’m starting to notice the same trend among those guys. Why not take on the Uni of Chitown study directly?

    it’s hard for me to get motivated for a debate on racial beauty. if i see t commenting, i might be more game for it. otherwise, i tend to prefer to sit on the sidelines.

    however, this study has already been examined on previous threads.

    in a nutshell, i think it provides evidence that women across races discriminate against guys for a casual relationship and/or sex who are outside their race- along with other factors, like height & looks.

    however, evidence that i and others have brought forth for guys discriminating against certain women from a sexual selection standpoint include:
    1) the representation (or lack there of) of various women from different races in porn. porn is a unique industry in that it is entirely driven by men’s sexual preference and almost no other factor (like singing or acting ability, for example).

    2) interracial marriage statistics showing disparities in long term relationship patterns for various groups.

    the u of c study focused on casual/sex preferences of men and women. porn and interracial marriage stats provide better proof of more deep seated preferences of racial preferences among men, especially for long term or ideal relationships.

    Like


  417. obsidian:

    Oh, and Nicole’s not the only Black Woman to make the case that elsewhere in the world, Sistas aren’t viewed in the same way as they are here. Chic said the same thing, based on her actual trips abroad in Europe. She’s not fat, btw.

    this anecdotal evidence may or may not be relevant to the broader global society. however, if you look at heterogeneous societies, like latin america or india, you tend to see sexual selection patterns play out in their entertainment. this is even more interesting because the ‘brown masses’ are the ones who are maintaining such a set up. when one looks at bollywood or univision/telemundo you almost invariably see lighter featured actors/actresses in the key roles. as steve sailer once said, if you didn’t know where mexico was on a map and just saw univision or telemundo, you’d think it was in the baltic.

    i am seriously unaware of any heterogeneous country outside the anglosphere that accords high sexual prestige to darker featured chicks, for example. even positing that, this phenomena in the anglosphere is more recent an event and may not represent what anglosphere guys ideally prefer from a sexual standpoint anyway (see racial representation in porn, for instance).

    Like


  418. Freak Show,
    I think the study and porn jibe pretty well w/each other. For example BM/WM porn mirrors the BM/WM marital rate, while the same can be said to be true of the porn and marital rates among AM/WM.

    O

    Like


  419. accords high sexual prestige to darker featured chicks

    i meant- i am unaware of any heterogeneous society that accords significantly higher sexual prestige for a darker featured chick relative to a lighter featured chick, on average, of course.

    Like


  420. eh, I don’t think I’ve been living under a rock when it comes to Asian chicks; I lived in Japan for a little more than a year in my early 20s, and have known plenty of white guys with Korean or Japanese or Filipino wives.

    I just don’t think it’s this huge, revolutionary phenomenon that right-wingish guys sometimes make it out to be. That all strikes me as more revenge-fantasy than fact on the ground.

    So long as the couples are happy, it’s cool with me. Heck, in a few years, I may very well have half-Asian nieces and nephews.

    (Grandmama is quite disturbed by this idea, however.)

    I’ve never heard anyone describe Asian gals as “doormats,” and white guys seem a lot likelier to casually denigrate someone as “having yellow fever” than the white gals I know.

    That said, I do think some of the Asian girls of my generation, and a little younger, are shockingly, openly materialistic… but pushovers? Hell no! LOL.

    Like


  421. eh, I don’t think I’ve been living under a rock when it comes to Asian chicks; I lived in Japan for a little more than a year in my early 20s, and have known plenty of white guys with Korean or Japanese or Filipino wives.

    if doubt japan has a lot of white women bitching about white men marrying asian women simply because the white women make up such a small percentage of the population. in big cities where wm/af pairings are more common, believe that white women make a big deal about it.

    Like


  422. on April 25, 2009 at 4:20 pm Willard Libby

    The Feminization Of The Western White Male

    You might not like him but this is one ballsy son of a bitch. LOL.

    With the wife.

    Like


  423. Obsidian —

    You are missing my point.

    Losers: Black Women, Asian Men, White Men.
    Winners: Black Men, Asian Women, White Women.

    “Adapt?” Please. Black Women, Asian Men, and White Men exert to varying degrees considerable pressure to date/marry within the race. It’s STRONGEST AMONG BLACK WOMEN. See the reactions AMONG BLACK WOMEN to Obama’s dumping his White girlfriend for Michelle Obama, Klingon Warrior.

    At it’s BEST, the social pressure will be non-violent. At it’s worst, it will be violent. Re: the Pendleton case. Again you miss my point:

    Men at their core will AS A GROUP resort to violence rather quickly since it “solves” immediate problems of mating. This has ALWAYS been the biggest problem of mankind. No race, group, or creed is immune to it. It ALWAYS HAPPENS WHEN ONE GROUP LOSES. Or faces reasonable threats of loss.

    Lynching did in fact get motivated by White men unsurprisingly wanting to exert social control over sexual competitors, as in the Pendleton case, or Black reaction to the very obviously guilty OJ, or Reginald Denny, etc. This is about as obvious as the Trojan War, a fight over … a woman. Or the killings on Pitcairn Island with the Bounty mutineers. [The exploitation of Black women by powerful White men such as Strom Thurmond is merely the flipside to this.]

    Lesson: Men will KILL over women. In order to construct a stable society COMPETITION over women MUST be managed and mediated, so most men get a shot at a FAIR OUTCOME. OTHERWISE THEY WILL USE VIOLENCE to reproduce.

    No one is to “blame.” Men are tool-makers, and tools allow even the weakest man to kill another. Knives, spears, clubs, arrows, firearms, all deadly and allow give the option of “leveling the playing field” through violence.

    Advocating “Game” as a solution is not addressing the problem. Very few men can or will learn “Game” and innate preference for more testosterone-laden men (Black, Hispanic) won’t solve the problem no matter how much “Game” you pour onto the Asian/White male population. Their solution is simply to start killing. They are good tool makers by and large so that option is open to them. Black Women also lose by being women don’t like violence and are as a rule not good at it. We don’t need to worry about them directly, however the solution to simply have lots of kids by whatever guy, creates a system of competition for the most thuggiest. T AKA Ricky Raw has written on why this is disaster.

    In order to avoid violence at the Cho/Columbine level, or various anonymous attacks (enforcement through violence), outcomes MUST be managed. Free Markets have their limits, and they have them in sexual outcomes.

    In order for every man to be invested in the system, he must have a stake: a wife or girlfriend. Chos and Klebolds only create disaster. [I’m supremely uninterested in “morality” or status-mongering, only finding solutions proven to work to produce social stability. FWIW, more Black men are killed through what is basically competition for Black Women in the Urban Ghetto core than were killed by the Klan, year by year comparison. I.E. more killed in 2007, over status-competitions for women, than by the Klan say in 1937, again over women, by White men. It would seem to me that Black Men in particular have a huge self-interest in establishing “rules” and managed/mediated competition over women since they are most at risk but that’s just me. Black murder rates, always higher than Whites, exploded when constraints over competition for women vanished. It’s also high among the White British underclass, in the same time frame, exploding in like fashion from low to high rates, as being a male provider was uninteresting to women. See Lauren London “thugs.” Black men are not unique, the White British Underclass provides the same lesson on the need to manage competition.]

    The Free Market system does not generally impose permanent winners and losers economically, because opportunity is just around the corner (“Creative Destruction). For obvious reasons (limited supply of women and men, aging, etc.) opportunity is VERY limited for mating/reproduction. Losers don’t go quietly.

    [For the record, I don’t think that the specialization and hipster thing will make White/Asian men competitive with higher testosterone men, White, Black, or Hispanic. Only a few High T men like Mystery can pull that off, and he’s pretty tall, robust, and attractive on his own. Most of these guys end up in the derisive Hipster website or what have you.]

    PA — East Asian women find considerable pressure as immigration from home nations increase to marry within the race. This is relatively new (last ten years). It’s uneven in effect, i.e. much higher in the San Gabriel Valley than say, Seattle or Portland.

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  424. Yeah, but in an environment where basically any expat white guy who wants to, can land a cute little Japanese girl, I just find it striking and curious that so many of them did NOT, if all the hype is to be believed about Asian women.

    A lot of the white guys who did wind up with Asian mates were, well, your classic “betas” who were kind of sexually invisible to a lot of white girls anyway.

    This doesn’t mean those are lesser human beings, of course; I’ve got family members and family friends like that, and they are genuinely decent people.

    That said, Westernized California-style Asian girls may well be a different breed, and pose something of a real “threat” when it comes to landing a strong husband.

    But I have honestly never heard a white woman complain about them.

    Like


  425. on April 25, 2009 at 4:43 pm Gunslingergregi

    It is nice isn’t omw instead of needing the trinkets beforehand. You can get her all the trinkets she wants after.

    Like


  426. on April 25, 2009 at 4:46 pm Gunslingergregi

    So it is

    trinkets > love > loyalty > mass trinkets

    Trinkets > nothing

    Like


  427. Yeah, they may not push for a 10,000 dollar rock upfront, but their trips to the Prada shop during the honeymoon more than make up for it. LOL.

    Jokes, jokes.

    A family friend is married to a Korean gal; he’s constantly bitching to my husband about how she’s “bleedin me dry, man!”

    That said, she’s always immaculately dressed and coiffed, and I think he likes that enough to tolerate the strain on the ol’ family budget.

    people is funny.

    Like


  428. The Free Market system does not generally impose permanent winners and losers economically, because opportunity is just around the corner (”Creative Destruction). For obvious reasons (limited supply of women and men, aging, etc.) opportunity is VERY limited for mating/reproduction. Losers don’t go quietly.

    This is a key point.

    At a time when we are all up in arms about insufficient regulation of our financial markets, we are all so laissez-faire about our sexual marketplace. There will be a price to be paid for that, eventually, as well, I think.

    Like


  429. on April 25, 2009 at 5:09 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””””””””””””on April 25, 2009 at 4:49 pm omw
    Yeah, they may not push for a 10,000 dollar rock upfront, but their trips to the Prada shop during the honeymoon more than make up for it. LOL.

    Jokes, jokes.

    A family friend is married to a Korean gal; he’s constantly bitching to my husband about how she’s “bleedin me dry, man!”

    That said, she’s always immaculately dressed and coiffed, and I think he likes that enough to tolerate the strain on the ol’ family budget.

    people is funny.””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””

    I got to say I got lucky. Mine said she wanted me home. She meant it. She has set it up so I can go home and chill just like I told her I wanted.

    Like


  430. on April 25, 2009 at 5:18 pm Tupac Chopra

    This doesn’t mean those are lesser human beings, of course

    It does to metropolitan woman in their 20’s and 30’s.

    Like


  431. But I have honestly never heard a white woman complain about them.

    Per that link by The Black Mysogynist, it’s the young sluts who swing on Alpha cocks in their twenties that complain about Asian chicks swooping away their “plan B” (ie, a responsible beta guy) in case they aren’t able to secure commitment from an Alpha.

    Like


  432. A good woman is a good thing to find, Gunny. A good man is, too. They’re out there.

    Like


  433. ahem…. ok… can’t someone tell some hot stories about scoring with anti-World Bank protester chicks?

    Like


  434. on April 25, 2009 at 5:33 pm Gunslingergregi

    go ahead benjack

    Like


  435. on April 25, 2009 at 5:33 pm Gunslingergregi

    Hotest protester chicks I ever saw where in the pro life march washington dc.

    Like


  436. Yeah, I finally got through that article, PA. I see what he means. Guess I don’t know many real sluts, alas.

    Still, they’re misdirecting their hostility; it’s nobody else’s fault that they forgot to strike while the iron was still hot.

    I mean, seriously, if you accidentally have a kid with some loser and THEN complain that you can’t find a decent husband, then that’s just plain friggen stupid.

    If they weren’t losing out to Asian gals, they’d be losing out to younger white ones with less baggage in tow.

    Like


  437. Hotest protester chicks I ever saw where in the pro life march washington dc

    I agree 100%.

    Like


  438. OMW, sounds like you done well guy-wise… what is your advice for young girls of OK but not exceptional beauty in snagging a guy who is both alpha-enough for her, but also a good long-term bet?

    Like


  439. Ryder Jingleheimer says, “Nicole, you are entitled to your own opinions, as absurd as they may be. You are not, however, entitled to make up facts and attempt to pass them off as truth. The idea that white was “invented” in the late 1800’s is absurd.”

    As a social construct that included all people of mostly European descent, yes it was.

    Before that, a Native American who was not from a recognized tribe was legally either White or Black, depending on what choice they made for official purposes.

    “The very first United States Naturalization Law, passed in 1790, limited naturalized citizenship to whites. ”

    That’s pretty close to the 1800’s, and took awhile to catch on…though not very long since White people from lower class and “scientifically inferior” races were eager to embrace anything that would wipe off the “black” stain of underclass breeding…or Native American, North African, Irish, Spanish by way of Mexico, or other ancestries inconvenient at the time.

    “Other laws, including anti-miscegenation laws, had been passed much earlier during Colonial times, going back to the 1600’s.”

    Of course, but they were largely unnecessary, and didn’t require alot of hype until miscgenation became a real social possibility.

    “Of course, they could have just as easily said European.”

    …but guess what?

    Not all officially White people have a drop of European ancestry.

    “Nothing was “invented,” at least not in the way you claim.”

    I didn’t claim anything as to *how* it was invented aside from it being politically convenient for some people at the time, to consolidate into one larger bloc instead of many smaller ones. It was also convenient, as I said, to obscure the inconvenient aspects of one’s ancestry in order to get ahead.

    The hype about anti-nobility in the early history of the U.S. meant about as much as that “freedom and justice for all” thing.

    “And even if you continue to suggest that it was, as I’m sure you will, you could at least do the board the courtesy of not spreading obvious misinformation.”

    Ah…spoken like someone with Atlantic whale skeletons in their cave-I-mean-closet. I can smell the denial and blubber lamps from here.

    “Of course, your agenda here is obvious.”

    …if only…

    “You want to deny that whites (Europeans) exist as a real people with legitimate interests.”

    No, what I’m saying is that the amalgamation of races known in the U.S. as White, uses the term as a convenient method of obscuring specific ancestry.

    It works for you, and tends to equalize you in some ways, except that White is not a race. Anglo-Saxon is a race. Alba, a race. Finnish and indigenenous mixed Finns are races. Australian is basically a race now. White is a catch-all term that upon closer inspection, isn’t as mixed up as it seems.

    People still tend to settle for the best they can get in marriage, and until recently, selected based on local availability and familiar traits and culture. Anecdotal again, but many if not most people have been in a situation of meeting someone, being attracted to or befriending them, and finding out that they are relatives.

    There are places with more mixing than others, but generally Anglo-Saxons still prefer Anglo-Saxons, Italians Italians, and French, a little of everybody, but their features still need to be “fine”.

    I have a couple of friends, both obvious and recorded descendents of mostly Vikings, who somehow found love with one another in strange, unlikely circumstances. They laid eyes on each other and just knew…

    I don’t believe that biomechanics is God, but I’d put it on the level of a higher Orixa.

    “If whites don’t exist, then they can’t have interests, and therefore can’t defend those interests. This, in a nutshell, is the entire agenda of the “whites don’t exist” crowd. They are fanatical for a reason: it suits their selfish agenda.”

    White exists as much as Black does, or Native American. They are umbrella terms for myriad races.

    If it’s important to you, and real to you then great…but in my opinion, you’re missing the big picture, and your short sightedness will cost you in pride and awareness.

    “Once this crazy doctrine is accepted, it becomes o.k. to displace whites, reduce them to a minority in every single white country on the planet (not just the U.S.), and ultimately get rid of them altogether. And when whites oppose this anti-white agenda, you call them ignorant. LOL!”

    How could I be anti White without also being anti Black?

    I’m just anti stupid.

    Like


  440. PA:

    I tell ’em, “Join the military.” (or at least look for a civilian job near a military installation.)

    There are loads of reasonably intelligent, fit, standup guys with traditional values there, and the ability to decently support a family.

    And the gender ratios run crazy in your favor.

    Sometimes too much, to where the attention turns from “enjoyable” to “terrifying.”

    But if you keep your head up, don’t take shit from anyone, and don’t get married straight out of boot camp just because you’re lonely (argh!) you can pick out a great guy.

    Like


  441. on April 25, 2009 at 5:58 pm Gunslingergregi

    OMW just remember open a hair salon lol
    Seriously though the new amazon at work was telling me 30 dollars for a haircut. That would put the capability in states of making between 300 and 1500 a day when compared to my womans salon.

    Like


  442. The other good thing about the military is that, unlike in college, you can look a little above your age category, find one who doesn’t have to be dragged into adulthood kicking and screaming the whole way.😀

    The more I think about it, the more it seems to me that college is a tragic waste of time for (most) 18-22 year old women… it serves almost none of their best interests.

    Like


  443. The more I think about it, the more it seems to me that college is a tragic waste of time for (most) 18-22 year old women

    Not to mention the student loans afterwards. But hey, at least they get a nice shot at all these sociology-major guys with facial scraggle and sandals!

    Like


  444. But I only know how to do one haircut: the No Hair Left Behind.😦

    Like


  445. OMW: Haha, I like your advice. I can’t do it in this country, though, because it’s very wrong to think the answer to ‘So, shot a distant relative of mine?’ might be ‘Yes’.

    Like


  446. on April 25, 2009 at 6:06 pm Gunslingergregi

    You don’t do the haircuts you hire someone to do them. Your job should you choose to accept it is to pick up money. Then you go back to raising your kids.

    Like


  447. My younger sister was in college (legit major, practical yet feminine) and dated a guy who seemed hot at first. Sociology major, hehe.

    She once wore a Lynyrd Skynyrd concert t-shirt (not ironically — actually been to their concert, geriatric southern-rockers and all). He frowned when he saw the confederate flag somewhere in the melange of images on that T-shirt. And said that the confederate flag is racist and he can’t approve of her wearing it.

    She’s apolitical with SWPL tendencies, but that was too much for her. Broke up with him on grounds of his being a “weenie.”

    Met a real solid, stand-up guy shortly after — someone who is the exact opposite of a weenie sociology major, and about 10 years older than her — and married him. Her meeting him had nothing whatsoever to do with her having gone to college.

    Plus, she got me the best vodka-shots at a family party buddy any sis could ever get her bro🙂

    Like


  448. on April 25, 2009 at 6:10 pm Gunslingergregi

    Bhetti,
    Same would be true of me. My former sf english boss is always talking about the irish he used to kill. We get along great lol

    Like


  449. Ah, so your hair salon owner is just keeping the lights on and the stations staffed, not actually cutting hair or waxing eyebrows. Hm. Interesting

    yeah, my haircutter costs 25 bucks a pop. Ay! This is why I only go twice a year.

    Dude, Bhetti, you should go for it. All of our ancestors have shot at some of our other ancestors, if you go back far enough. Your grandkids would find it an amusing story.

    Like


  450. on April 25, 2009 at 6:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    Of course that is other benefit my woman can get her hair done every day if she wants to🙂

    Like


  451. aw, see? All’s well that ends with vodka.

    Like


  452. on April 25, 2009 at 6:27 pm Gunslingergregi

    PA,
    My older sis is where I see how it is hard for a woman when she makes too much money. Especially when a self created woman. She may need a shiek to tame her.

    Like


  453. Twentysomething Metro single women (ranking above a 7 on the smv scale) are just a tiny slice of humanity, Tupac.🙂

    Y’all are fighting over the same small slice at the top of the status heap.

    Like


  454. “Ahh yes. Her name was Nicole, actually. She was very petite; perhaps 5′2 and no more that 100 lbs… ”

    Maybe she tripled in size and lives in Israel now…..

    Like


  455. White exists as much as Black does, or Native American. They are umbrella terms for myriad races.

    Kind of true. But i’d need to see stats on Anglo-Saxons vis-a- vis West Africans, say, to be convinced. But personally I see no physical reason for WM not be attracted to BWs, and I had a BW GF in college, but I can see the trends around us and ponder them.

    [quote]The more I think about it, the more it seems to me that college is a tragic waste of time for (most) 18-22 year old women… it serves almost none of their best interests.[/quote]

    Yep, let them stay out of college, I agree.

    Like


  456. on April 25, 2009 at 7:20 pm Comment_IMBRA

    omw said:

    Yeah, but in an environment where basically any expat white guy who wants to, can land a cute little Japanese girl, I just find it striking and curious that so many of them did NOT, if all the hype is to be believed about Asian women.

    A lot of the white guys who did wind up with Asian mates were, well, your classic “betas” who were kind of sexually invisible to a lot of white girls anyway.

    This doesn’t mean those are lesser human beings, of course; I’ve got family members and family friends like that, and they are genuinely decent people.

    That said, Westernized California-style Asian girls may well be a different breed, and pose something of a real “threat” when it comes to landing a strong husband.

    But I have honestly never heard a white woman complain about them.

    The government has done everything in it’s power to make marrying of foreign brides as hard as possible. Foreign workers are great, but foreign brides aren’t. For some reason.

    The law is called IMBRA

    IMBRA isn’t talked about much, because, well, you know, the law is so vile that it can’t really be defended.

    IMBRA demands that men(not women, of course!) give information on all criminal arrests, criminal convictions, states of residence, divorces, and children in order to have ‘contact’ with foreign brides on web-sites. This includes arrests for which there was no conviction, because, as we all know, men are guilty unless proven innocent. In fact, they are guilty IF proven innocent in a court of law and are still required to report the arrest.

    Now, at what point does this information need to be turned over to the woman the evil man is talking to? The woman who is in another country, most likely hundreds of miles away? Before you marry her? Before you meet her in person?

    HELL NO! Before you say one word to her!

    Of course, a good boy, a Real Man, who knows what he wants, and he wants what OMW wants him to want, can talk to an American woman without all this paper-work. It just happened that way. Must be fate.

    All this paperwork is EXPENSIVE. That’s the reason for the states of residence demand. Quite a few men don’t have any arrests, divorces, or other problems on their record, and the US Government is going to get them some way. So it demands ‘all states of residence’.

    Now, obviously arresting people who talk to others without filing the appropriate paperwork first is a little problematic. Not to mention unconstitutional. So instead the government fines the web-sites themselves. Imposing very high fines and making it impossible for sites they don’t like to stay in business.

    But what about Match.com? Don’t they have trouble with this? Match.com is above the law! Match.com, Yahoo Personals, Eharmony and other mega sites are now ‘privileged’, and immune from this law.

    Men who find web-sites immune from US Government prosecution do to being in another country, or other reasons, will instead be slammed when they attempt to get a visa for their wife. They will be in ‘violation’, no Visa for them!

    http://www.visalaw.com/2006_06_01_blogarchive.html

    USCIS announced today that they will issue requests for evidence in 10,000 fiance visa cases to comply with provisions in the recently passed International Marriage Brokers Regulation Act of 2005 (IMBRA). And all K-1 cases are being held up for processing until a Request for Evidence template is approved by the Office of Management and Budget. Under IMBRA, all cases filed after March 6th are required to comply with the new law and USCIS has not yet received approval for a new I-129F form that will be IMBRA-compliant. That form is expected to be ready later this month.

    So, in short, omw, things just happened to turn out that less American men are marrying foreign brides. No one knows how it happened. Just happened. So very strange.

    But good for omw and her sisters. Oh yes, good for them.
    How fortunate that the US Government is so concerned for the American woman.

    Like


  457. Comment_, how old are you? Serious question, not messin’ with ya. No need for exact age, ballpark is OK.

    Like


  458. IMBRA is a hate law directed against american men to keep the american pussy price high.

    Like


  459. on April 25, 2009 at 7:55 pm Gunslingergregi

    It was irritating when I couldn’t get a tourist visa for my woman to be able to visit my parents. Even after she had around 50k of assets at home. They were like she might not return home. Didn’t show enough proof of something to return to. lol

    Like


  460. Another obscure song with poetic lyrics: Johnny Cash and U2, “The Wanderer.” The song appears on U2’s 1993 album “Zooropa,” its last track.

    I went drifting
    Through the capitals of tin
    Where men can’t walk
    Or freely talk
    And sons turn their fathers in

    A simple yet chilling snapshot of an unfree world. Hiya DHS!

    And this, on the same song, tells the story of Cash’s life in a few words:

    I went out there
    In search of experience
    To taste and to touch
    And to feel as much
    As a man can
    Before he repents

    Enjoy:

    Like


  461. Hey, Gunner, I hear ya. God forbid we let a nice young woman visit the US. Insane.

    Like


  462. Hmmm…Looks to me like there’s more to it than that. The timing is suspicious.

    It looks to me like this “hate law” is directed against first and second generation American immigrants to keep the number of Muslim immigrants low.

    Imagine what would have happened if, say, France adopted such a law before all hell broke loose?

    Even though it is possible for an Arab in Israel to import a wife, or a Jew to import a non Jewish wife, the process is long and humiliating. One isn’t even considered married, to the government, for 28 months after arrival…not their wedding date, but arrival in Israel.

    Even though it sucks that as an American, especially one who served, to have had to go through all that, I can understand why. Someone who hates Israel or doesn’t feel attached enough to their spouse, would probably give up.

    Immigration policing isn’t actually that severe here. Outside of certain hot spots where people solicit illegal foreign workers, in order to get caught, someone actually has to turn you in. So if someone gave up on the process and just decided to stay and live their life, by the time the government remembered they existed, they’d be the grandmother of some legit Israeli citizens.

    If, on the other hand, they get on someone’s bad side who knows their background and situation, they are out and quickly unless someone can come up with some serious money for their defense.

    I wonder if this is something the U.S. government is considering, since it’s very costly to regulate people who speak English and look and operate like normal Americans. I wonder how many of those cases that are being held up will even be looked at, and at what speed, and if anyone would actually be deported because they first made contact online in an unregulated IRC chat or somesuch.

    Like


  463. They were like she might not return home.

    About 8 years ago I tried to get my older buddy in Poland to come visit the US. In part to cheer him up, as his wife suddenly passed away. He had a solid job, owned real estate. Spent hundreds of dollars on the application fees.

    At the US embassy in Warsaw they told him that as a widower, he is a non-return risk and denied him the visa.

    Like


  464. on April 25, 2009 at 8:07 pm Gunslingergregi

    To give kudos where its due though the embassy did say I could marry her and bring her to states.

    Also when I called my dad on the night I thought I was gonna die and said good bye. Afterwards He called fbi and embassy. They had indonesian cops at the door by morning. So I guess really overall the us does take care of its people oversees.

    Like


  465. I like men who are well dressed an elegant. Barack Obama is elegant but at the same time very masculine. A man with a manicure and clear polish is good but the blk nail polish would turn me off. It’s like I can appreciate a man who looks like Mystery but at the same time not be attracted to him.

    @OMA- check out stories& comments on the Hipster grifter. that’s all the hate you need.

    PA
    Comment_, how old are you? Serious question, not messin’ with ya. No need for exact age, ballpark is OK.
    Yea I curious too?

    PA And you know that scene at the beginning of New Jack City, where a group of black gangsters hold a yuppie-looking white guy by his feet over a bridge railing while his wife is screaming hysterically?
    IIRC that guy was a dirty lawyer sort like the guy who defends all of the drug dealers in The Wire. Those types of hated.

    Like


  466. on April 25, 2009 at 8:12 pm Gunslingergregi

    Gonna have to see later. Would be nice to visit states with her so I could show her my old haunts so she knows where I came from.

    Like


  467. Yea I curious too?

    Yeah, he seems like a decent guy but the bitter tone makes me wonder. If he’s young (teen, early 20s) that it’s just a youthful earnestness and a clumsy attempt to sound forceful. He’ll outgrow it.

    But if he’s an older guy (over 30) he needs to rein that in. Like blaming OMW for foreign bride laws. When he feels the bitterness welling, he needs to transform it into humor.

    “Be funny like Tupac or Jaakelli” is what he’d need to remind himself before he writes.

    Like


  468. on April 25, 2009 at 8:16 pm Gunslingergregi

    Your are invited though when I cook some cows some day.

    Like


  469. on April 25, 2009 at 8:18 pm Gunslingergregi

    Plan on doing it kind of caveman style like you just kind of walk up with a knife and cut your own tbone lol I will probably also drink to be sociable he he he

    Like


  470. forget it
    *sigh*

    Like


  471. on April 25, 2009 at 8:25 pm Gunslingergregi

    lol chic you can come too we may cook you though he he he

    Like


  472. Barack Obama is elegant but at the same time very masculine.

    I’m not seeing the last part, myself.

    It looks to me like this “hate law” is directed against first and second generation American immigrants to keep the number of Muslim immigrants low.

    If true, the problem with that is…. ?

    Like


  473. Nicole, honestly, there is something wrong with you. I give you solid, irrefutable evidence that the concept of “white” was alive and well literally centuries before you claim it was…and it makes no impact on you whatsoever. None at all.

    “It works for you, and tends to equalize you in some ways, except that White is not a race. Anglo-Saxon is a race. Alba, a race. Finnish and indigenenous mixed Finns are races.”

    Um…these are your opinions. I’m not interested in your opinions. You don’t have the credibility for your opinions to be taken seriously. I’m talking about facts. You claimed that white was “invented” in the late 1800’s. When confronted with clear and irrefutable evidence that you are wrong, what do you do? Do you admit your error and move on? Of course not. Instead, you continue to spout yet another stream of ridiculous tripe.

    “I’m just anti stupid.”

    LOL! You should create a poster with that written under your photo. It would be good for a few grins.

    Like


  474. on April 25, 2009 at 8:45 pm Tupac Chopra

    Chic Noir:

    It’s like I can appreciate a man who looks like Mystery but at the same time not be attracted to him.

    Hey Chic, I think I’m ready to start dipping my finger in some hot cocoa:

    Can you hook a cracka up?

    PA:

    “Be funny like Tupac or Jaakelli” is what he’d need to remind himself before he writes.

    Nah. I say: “let the hate flow.”

    Like


  475. Hate as virtuoso performance rocks. Whiney bitterness… naah

    Like


  476. “Race” is not one of my favorite subjects, for a lot of reasons. But let me offer bit of hard-core wisdom about it. Race is what peoples instincts tell them it is. I mean, after the sun has gone down and the whiskey is flowing and the Fear is rising folks tend to sort themselves according to primeval reactions. When push comes to shove, most peoples antennae about such matters are remarkably consistent.

    Like


  477. on April 25, 2009 at 9:49 pm GNPs are for Apes

    It is a simple fact that in any Mexican soap opera, the people chosen are much lighter than most Mexicans.

    Almost no man expected to take a romantic lead role will be Aztec, let alone darker.

    The same goes for just about any Bollywood production.

    It is wrong. It is sad. But it is true.

    Like


  478. Hotest protester chicks I ever saw where in the pro life march washington dc

    I agree 100%.

    I’d give the edge to “ugly” girls on this one. Abortion today, abortion forver.

    Besides, without abortion, you’d be stuck paying child support or marrying that girl which may not be ideal if you viewed her as a short-term prospect.

    It works for you, and tends to equalize you in some ways, except that White is not a race.

    I look at it from a weird point of view. White can be a general proxy for those of European ancestry and Indo-Europeans in Asia with a certain set of facial and other biological features. White can be limited to a proxy for high ranking portion of our society with lineage from Southeastern England, Netherlands, and Germany. White can also mean to a certain extent, a range of cultural norms found in majority white countries (the so called pays blancs in Haitian Creole), and the idea that these norms can be spread and sometimes found in non-white countries.

    Not to mention the student loans afterwards.

    Admittedly, they have these cute things called public colleges that cost less than what my parents spent on Catholic high school for my brother and I.

    As for my future daughters, they’re going to college, and they’re going to major in something useful that will give them access to elite men so that they can marry upward.

    yeah, my haircutter costs 25 bucks a pop. Ay! This is why I only go twice a year.

    My non-date needs at least fifty-something to go every few weeks, and she notes that the women in her salon sometimes go every week at $100 per visit…

    Can you hook a cracka up?

    I want to encourage as many white men as possible to date and marry as many black women as they see fit.

    Like


  479. Nicole — Read your Shakespeare. Or your King James Bible. Or Daniel Defoe (Robinson Crusoe). Or your Don Quixote, or Caesar’s Commentaries, or Xenophon’s Anabasis.

    There is considerable written evidence, dating back from the mid 400’s BC, up through the 1600’s, of Europeans being very aware of differences between them and people of other races. Of certain shared characteristics among Europeans even those divided by language and nation and clan, as shared. Just as shared as those among Africans, though they be divided by language (Africa has the most languages), nation, and clan.

    Please note: different does not mean “better.” Just different. Oranges and grapes are both delicious. They are certainly different-
    ——————-
    I would not advise anyone to engage in the foreign bride thing. It’s a huge scam and destined to disappoint everyone. American women are simply going to have deal with the losers in the sexual free-market system, as NOVASEEKER points out.

    It won’t be pretty. But it will be instructive.

    Like


  480. “I’ve yet to run accross a Brotha who gave a shit if some Sista somewhere got w/a White fella. So what. ”

    The Pendleton Marine murder proves this wrong. A white marine and his black wife were murdered by 4 black marines.

    This is common in America. Giving examples of lynchings from 60 years ago is a copout. If the races were reversed in the pendleton situation today, it would be a national media story for years.

    Didn’t a black thug kill 4 white Oakland police officers recently? Isn’t that several times worse than the Rodney King episode? But where are the white people rioting? They are not even making this a race issue (even though it is one).

    Like


  481. Didn’t a black thug kill 4 white Oakland police officers recently?

    Your statement presumes that a black criminal would somehow hesitate to shoot four black police officers. I suspect that if you’re brave and stupid enough to shoot four white cops, you’d shoot four black cops too, and deride them as sellouts.

    Please note: different does not mean “better.” Just different. Oranges and grapes are both delicious. They are certainly different-

    Different can mean better. See IQ and testosterone levels.

    And grapes are easier to eat than oranges and not as sour, thus grapes are superior.

    Like


  482. on April 25, 2009 at 11:05 pm Orange You Glad

    Oranges have ample vitamin C and citrusy deliciousness in the trunk.

    Eat me.

    EAT ME!

    Like


  483. gnp colbert!!!!!! youre back!!!!! i so missed spanking you and making a bitch out of you, thanks. and i see your still keeping up the shtick of super retarded racist but i gotta warn you, your laying it on a little too thik now, no one can really be as dumb as you portray. but hey since both of us share the same goal of making racist look fucking retarded as hell, i’ll play along. as usual you probably will win the battle to make you look like fucking moron but i’ll try to keep up and make you look as dum as you make yourself look.

    Let’s begin:

    GNP Colbert:

    It is a simple fact that in any Mexican soap opera, the people chosen are much lighter than most Mexicans.

    Almost no man expected to take a romantic lead role will be Aztec, let alone darker.

    The same goes for just about any Bollywood production.

    actually in bollywood movies the premium is light WOMEN, the men are actually allowed to get quite dark. kind of like how black men find white WOMEN attractive but black women don’t find white MEN attractive. as shown in that study you keep dodging. don’t you hate people that dodge other people’s points gnp colbert? after all, didn’t you keep taunting o for supposedly dodging your point? yet when you are on the ropes you ignore all the inconvenient evidence i throw at you like the woman you are. 😉 lmao i can spank you at will and you know it. i dont ever want to see you badger someone about doging your points again after i made you into such an evasive cowardly bitch in this thread😀

    It is wrong. It is sad. But it is true.

    actually white men not finding black women attractive would only be wrong and sad if black women found white men attractive. but since black women find white men as unattractive as white men find black women, its a wash and all’s fair.

    fuck bro, we need to rename this thread “reverse slavery” because this black man FUCKING OWNED YOU AND WHIPPED YOU EVERY. TIME. I. POST. at will. i almost feel cruel if it wasnt so fun and easy.😀 anyway, i’ll repost it so you can sidestep it again coward:

    here’s a study university of chicago did showing that black women are the most averse to interracial dating of all races:

    http://tierneylab.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/04/13/single-female-seeking-same-race-male/

    most interesting part of the finding:

    For equal success with an African-American woman, a Hispanic man needs to earn an extra $184,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $220,000.

    For equal success with a white woman, an African-American needs to earn an additional $154,000; a Hispanic man needs $77,000; an Asian needs $247,000.

    For equal success with a Hispanic woman, an African-American man needs to earn an additional $30,000; a white man needs to earn an additional $59,000.

    For equal success with an Asian woman, an African-American needs no additional income; a white man needs $24,000 less than average; a Hispanic man needs $28,000 more than average.

    Like


  484. damn gnp colbert i own you so thoroughly id consider a second mortgage on your ass. if it wasnt for the fact your utterly worthless. lol😉

    Like


  485. Historical note: those men are examples of fops, not dandies. A dandy is Beau Brummell, Edward Prince of Wales, Fred Astaire, etc. — not flamboyant or in-yer-face, like fops.

    Like


  486. actually in bollywood movies the premium is light WOMEN, the men are actually allowed to get quite dark. kind of like how black men find white WOMEN attractive but black women don’t find white MEN attractive.

    yes, latino actors and bollywood actors can get darker than their corresponding actresses. however, there is still a lesser premium on lighter actors (i won’t argue that it’s still much greater for light featured women though). in addition, i’d offer 2 points:

    1) gnxp did a post about how men all over the world are about 10% darker on average than women for any particular race/ethnic group. so, the fact that ethnic actors are going to be darker is somewhat mitigated by the fact that men are going to be naturally darker, on average anyway.

    2) the vast bulk of the latino and bollywood actors are usually more ‘caucasoid’ than the average individual in a lot of these heterogeneous countries. i can name quite a few big time telemundo or bollywood actors that fit this mold.

    Like


  487. said: ‘the vast bulk of the latino and bollywood actors are usually more ‘caucasoid’ than the average individual in a lot of these heterogeneous countries.’

    meant to say: ‘the vast bulk of the latino and bollywood actors are usually more FACIALLY ‘caucasoid’ than the average individual in a lot of these heterogeneous countries.’

    Like


  488. but why even bother using bollywood and latino actors to prove a point. in those places skin color corelates very highly to caste and social status (darker = poorer and lower class indios and low caste members) movies sell glamor meaning high class images meaning in those cultures lighter people (but primarily the women).

    so why go to those examples in a discussion about WHITE AMERICAN MEN AND BLACK AMERICAN WOMEN when we can just go to the university chicago study i posted that specifically studies WHITE AMERICAN MEN AND BLACK AMERICAN WOMEN. gnp colbert goes to such stupid irrelevant extremes to prove a point about american blacks and whites by analogy when he has a study sitting right in his face specifically about WHITE AMERICAN MEN AND BLACK AMERICAN WOMEN. it just shows his evasiveness his inability to counter me and his inability to just lose with grace. next he’ll use some other stupid analogy to indirectly make his point about black american women and white men rather than simply confront the study that direct the study that directly and specifically talks about those two groups

    Like


  489. on April 26, 2009 at 12:03 am Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””””””””DA
    I’d give the edge to “ugly” girls on this one. Abortion today, abortion forver.

    Besides, without abortion, you’d be stuck paying child support or marrying that girl which may not be ideal if you viewed her as a short-term prospect.”””””””””””””””””””””””

    Yea but DA don’t ya think their might be a couple things ya might go to hell for. I’m thinking killing your baby might be one of them. Your still on the planet so you must of thought you might go to hell for killing yourself right.

    Like


  490. on April 26, 2009 at 12:03 am Gunslingergregi

    Sometimes things like child support don’t really matter in the scheme of things.

    Like


  491. allow me to predict gnp colbert’s next point:

    “i wish to continue discussing american black women and american white men and whether they find each other attractive. but rather than actually discuss the study that specifically talks about american white men and american black women and whether they find each other attractive, i will just continue to ignore that because im not trying to find truth just boost my self esteem. so this time around i will use star trek episode #134 to make my point. duuh, this is the episode where captain kirk had a chance to choose a darker green martian girl or lighter green martian girl. he chose lighter green martian girl. therefore american black women desperately want american white men and american whie men dont want american black women. and as a result i can now tell myself im a winner. in my mind this actually makes more sense than acnowledging a study that directly talks about the subject matter i want to make point about. duuuhhh”

    gnp colbert is like rain man of race realism

    Like


  492. on April 26, 2009 at 12:05 am Gunslingergregi

    lol anon your debating both sides look at the talent

    Like


  493. but why even bother using bollywood and latino actors to prove a point. in those places skin color corelates very highly to caste and social status (darker = poorer and lower class indios and low caste members) movies sell glamor meaning high class images meaning in those cultures lighter people (but primarily the women).

    i think that’s a fair consideration. however, i’m not convinced that class correlations are the only thing the ‘brown’ public in those areas is weighing when supporting various actors/actresses.

    i accept that it is more difficult to fully ascertain sexual preferences using non- porn entertainment media since there are always going to be criteria other than looks that these types of entertainers need, like the aforementioned class correlations, charisma, singing ability or acting ability. looks aren’t as clean a barometer of sexual preferences in such mediums as they are for porn.

    again, the ‘brown masses’ in all these countries financially support these elite entertainers. nobody’s putting a gun to their heads and nor are they uniformly robots that blindly accept whatever the entertainment studios throw their way.

    Like


  494. I think that the real decline in Western Civilization is the fact that Leonardo DiCaprio can date supermodels at will. This totally shoots to death the idea that women are drawn to testosterone. On top of that, Leo has lost the girlish prettiness he had in the late 90s, which admittedly attracted some women in the past, and has just become an ugly, fat-faced troll with pubic hair on his chin.

    Like


  495. damn gnp colbert you are like subprime mortgage. technically i totally own you but youre worthless so what good does it do me? lol

    Like


  496. Whiskey–

    You are so right, as my personal experience proves.

    Like


  497. I tend to view dandyism as representative of a change in male roles and psychology. For one thing, it is closely related to the particularly male art of war. The most notorious dandies are often young soldiers, such as this Taliban fighter:

    “Taliban”

    Spartan men, prior to a battle would stretch and flex their muscles, comb their long hair, and oil their bodies before donning their armor:

    It chanced that at this time the Lacedaemonians held the outer guard, and were seen by the spy, some of them engaged in gymnastic exercises, others combing their long hair. At this the spy greatly marvelled, but he counted their number, and when he had taken accurate note of everything, he rode back quietly; for no one pursued after him, nor paid any heed to his visit. So he returned, and told Xerxes all that he had seen.
    Upon this, Xerxes, who had no means of surmising the truth – namely, that the Spartans were preparing to do or die manfully – but thought it laughable that they should be engaged in such employments, sent and called to his presence Demaratus the son of Ariston, who still remained with the army. When he appeared, Xerxes told him all that he had heard, and questioned him concerning the news, since he was anxious to understand the meaning of such behaviour on the part of the Spartans.

    Then Demaratus said:

    “I spake to thee, O king! concerning these men long since, when we had but just begun our march upon Greece; thou, however, didst only laugh at my words, when I told thee of all this, which I saw would come to pass. Earnestly do I struggle at all times to speak truth to thee, sire; and now listen to it once more. These men have come to dispute the pass with us; and it is for this that they are now making ready. ‘Tis their custom, when they are about to hazard their lives, to adorn their heads with care.

    -Herodotus

    The Hebrews’ most celebrated warlord, and eventual king, was the swooned-over David, a handsome shepherd boy:

    When he had sized David up, and seen that he was youthful, and ruddy, and handsome in appearance, he held him in contempt.

    -1 Samuel 17:42

    Celtic warriors would style their hair and decorate their nude bodies with pain before rushing into battle, as shown in this famous statue:

    “The Dying Gaul”

    In the follow sculpture, “Gaul and Wife”, contrast the glorious, striking physique and physical beauty of the Celtic warrior with his plain and unimpressive colleen, who has just been slain for to follow him to the afterlife:

    Gaul and Wife

    Finally, if we want to see the connection between dandyism and violence in the modern West, we need only look into Kubrick’s exposé of the dark substrate of modern culture. In A Clockwork Orange, painted youths engage in ultraviolence with a dandified flair, mascara and all:

    A Clockwork Orange”

    The return of a culture that celebrates masculine beauty comes along with a drumbeat of war, and I neither encourage nor condemn it; it is simply a part of the natural cycle of things: the exhalation and relaxation that accompanies the worship of the female mental and physical form is inevitably followed by the hypoxia of male deprivation, which sparks once again the gasping for breath that leads to regeneration of the stores that sustain humanity’s momentum.

    The intoxicating smoke of youth, vigor and beauty combined with blood, violence and chaos is what propels us forward like the powder in the cannon’s breach.

    It is ironic, perhaps, that the pretty boys have historically fed the jaws of carnage, while the pretty ladies feed only themselves. It speaks to the true force for human progress, which was never the drive to satisfy the basic wants and needs of the female psyche – which are little different from those of the common female pongid – but rather the unleashed, unfathomable and tragic power of the human male, who is as a species apart, in exile as it were.

    Like


  498. david alexander

    As for my future daughters, they’re going to college

    aren’t you the one who has sworn off women, marriage, family, and all that?
    whence these future daughters?

    agnostic

    Historical note: those men are examples of fops, not dandies.

    “dandy” here is used à la robert greene’s the art of seduction, in which it is one of the author’s major categories of seducers. this category would likely include your “fops” as well.

    Like


  499. again, the ‘brown masses’ in all these countries financially support these elite entertainers. nobody’s putting a gun to their heads and nor are they uniformly robots that blindly accept whatever the entertainment studios throw their way.

    what will they do make their own movies? good luck to them with that. if you watch old bollywood movies when industry was local cheaper and less respected they had lot darker actors and actresses. now that its multibillion dollar international business only rich and elite can enter the industry on significant level. the masses take movies elite gives them or they just dont watch movies. period. and when you that poor movies and escapism are too important to just give up. like how in american movie viewership actually went UP during depression instead of down. when dirt poor movies become even moe important

    Like


  500. on April 26, 2009 at 12:28 am Gunslingergregi

    The only problem is that war will change and dieing in war will not have honor at some point. Maybe we could have like 1000 man gladiator events not neccesarily to the death. Winning side get to get there agenda passed as law (repubs vs democrats). That would get some poison out of the sytem. Men need some violence, men need some honor. Let the prisoners die with honor.

    Like


  501. aren’t you the one who has sworn off women, marriage, family, and all that?
    whence these future daughters?

    That’s daughters in a theoretical sense. I mean, yeah, I would like a family, but it’s unlikely for blah blah blah reasons.

    DA don’t ya think their might be a couple things ya might go to hell for.

    Yes, and aborting your fetus isn’t one of them.

    Your still on the planet so you must of thought you might go to hell for killing yourself right.

    No, but there are days where I’d imagine that the world (or my small portion of it) could have been a better place without my existence. And no, you do not go to hell for thinking that way.

    Like


  502. on April 26, 2009 at 12:33 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””Whiskey,
    I would not advise anyone to engage in the foreign bride thing. It’s a huge scam and destined to disappoint everyone. American women are simply going to have deal with the losers in the sexual free-market system, as NOVASEEKER points out.””””””””””””

    Yea don’t meet them on internet actually travel oversees. Save your pennies work two jobs make money buy rental houses then go looking for decent woman. Of course at that point you will be able to get any woman.

    Like


  503. on April 26, 2009 at 12:34 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””””DA don’t ya think their might be a couple things ya might go to hell for.

    Yes, and aborting your fetus isn’t one of them.”””””””””””””””””

    Dave I just saw the ultrasound of my buddies fetus it was a baby clear as day and it was still in his wifes belly. You might want to seriously think on that one.

    Like


  504. on April 26, 2009 at 12:41 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””No, but there are days where I’d imagine that the world (or my small portion of it) could have been a better place without my existence. And no, you do not go to hell for thinking that way.””””””””””

    Yea because you where raised to fear hell and also the fear of the unknown in death. No matter how much pain your in. Since you can’t die the way I figure it is you might as well try to do the best you can. So you can enjoy it while your here as best you can even if you were not born into the most ideal circumstances you would have liked. You can still blaze a path in life. You have your arms and legs and you have time and the capability to work for what you want out of life. To sieze the day if you will.

    Like


  505. You might want to seriously think on that one.

    No, I’ll stand firm on this case. It’s not a sin.

    Like


  506. DA: So you’ve abandoned the Catholic Church, then?

    Like


  507. on April 26, 2009 at 12:56 am Gunslingergregi

    I think the church does stand differently on that.

    Like


  508. DA, you’ll have to be one of these guys, it seems:
    http://www.rcrc.org/about/members.cfm

    Like


  509. on April 26, 2009 at 12:58 am Gunslingergregi

    I’ll hope a future woman doesn’t kill your kid if you don’t want her too.

    Like


  510. on April 26, 2009 at 1:00 am Orange You Glad

    the Church objects to porn and jacking off, too, but what good Catholic isn’t really a bad one?

    Like


  511. Murder!! vs porn = different realms of forgivable sinhood.

    Like


  512. on April 26, 2009 at 1:04 am Gunslingergregi

    Yea I guess if you can live with it on the concience. Man this world really is a shithole.

    Like


  513. on April 26, 2009 at 1:05 am Gunslingergregi

    Yea Bhetti I mean I just saw my friends baby recently to realistic looking.

    Like


  514. DA: So you’ve abandoned the Catholic Church, then?

    No, just like how PA ignores the Church on immigration issues and the death penalty, I ignore them on birth control, condoms, and abortion. It’s pretty commonplace to differ on official Church policy and teaching for most Catholics.

    And I’ll keep receiving even if they excommunicate me.

    I’ll hope a future woman doesn’t kill your kid if you don’t want her too.

    I obviously can’t force a woman to have an abortion that she doesn’t want, and I’ll simply have to accept whatever decision she takes and sack up.* Luckily for me, as one has seen from my writings, this will NEVER be a problem for me.

    *Fake death, change name, flee country, right? Or get married and give up trains forever and raise what is hopefully a cute, high IQ mulatto kid, right?

    Like


  515. those ultrasounds really are astonishing now. The still shots are nothing compared to the moving images on the screen; all the organs and muscles moving in perfect sync…

    DA would be head over heels about becoming a dad. He’s telling himself an ugly lie to hide from a beautiful truth, I suppose you could say.

    Like


  516. on April 26, 2009 at 1:14 am Gunslingergregi

    wish me luck next month.🙂

    Like


  517. Will do. lol.

    You’re fixing to get yourself into a mess, though, you know that?

    Like


  518. DA would be head over heels about becoming a dad. He’s telling himself an ugly lie to hide from a beautiful truth, I suppose you could say.

    Contrary to what everybody thinks, I’d be an awful dad. I’m too lazy and social phobic…

    Like


  519. You don’t need to be a social butterfly to be a good parent… in fact, I rather suspect introverted weirdos do better than average at it.

    And people are mostly only as lazy as have the leeway to be.

    Like


  520. on April 26, 2009 at 1:24 am Gunslingergregi

    Yea it will be interesting to have a little mini me thats from me probably be one hard headed sob. I will see my adopted version of mini me next month too. I’m always around little kids over there they make it fun. Taking em to seaworld, the ocean everythings new to them.

    Like


  521. Gunny: My personal psychology is that I view it as a person the moment ‘pregnancy’ occurs. I think it’s a parental instinct to do that, the ‘getting ready’, ‘what will it look like?’ ‘will it be healthy?’ mentality. Only person I knew who had an abortion had that mentality — since she’s “slow” and stubborn, it seems to have hit her after having it — thus suicidal guilt over it. Sometimes women don’t consciously get those thought processes or feelings upon finding out they’re pregnant. I’d question why. I find that really hard to understand. Especially when self-safe women have motherly feelings about other babies or pregnancies they keep. You can’t feel like that and then seriously consider aborting.

    I’d get out of medicine if I had to do any abortions, especially knowing the process the fetus goes through.

    All the technical arguments about souls and so on is irrelevant.

    DA: I think you’re demonstrating perfectly how the muslim label is dysfunctional for generalisation. There is practically no centralised religious authority. Apostasy has even more dramatic consequences in Islamic communities.

    Like


  522. People constantly encouraging you, DA, is probably more a sign of their character than yours. My character isn’t fantastic, I can tell you.

    Omw, I’m probably being pessimistic but I don’t believe in DA’s capacity to love anyone and that includes himself. If he actually liked the kids, instead of viewing them as unintelligent ugly annoyances wasting his time, money and space…

    Like


  523. I’d say Lynchings and the Channon-Newsome/Pendleton murders were pretty much the same. Brutal murders brought about by rage at sexual competitors. Come on. WHAT do guys kill over? Really.

    Heck the Lynchings and the murders, are almost EXACT DUPLICATES of each other. Right down to sexual mutilation of the bodies, particularly the men, and the fact that everyone in the White community knew about it (Lynchings) and everyone in the Black Community knew about it, down to visiting the corpses and taking pictures (Channon-Newsome murders, almost an exact duplicate of 1900’s lynchings with “postcards” yech ). SAME THING. Caused by the same desire to “punish” competitors.

    Men kill over women. THAT is the brutal reality, brought about by a zero-sum game for mating. If you can’t replicate your genes, you can kill someone else’s. You see that all the time in Lion prides, when the new male Alpha lion kills the old one’s cubs.
    ————————
    I just don’t see Hipster chic being enough to out-compete those blessed/cursed with higher testosterone. Men are fine with cross-race dating, as long as they come out even and ahead but that is almost NEVER possible. Particularly as hard times and lots of uncertainty close down the money avenue to compete …

    David A — IQ is not everything. Cooperation levels matter probably at least as much if not more than IQ. East Asia has higher IQ levels than Europe, but the latter has been far more cooperative since 1000 AD and has outcompeted East Asia for most of the last 1,000 years. IQ and cooperation are also changeable. The Jews were not considered “smart” by the Ancients, the Classical Greeks or Romans, or Arabs, or Byzantines, but were around 1300 or so. Meaning humans aver VERY adaptable. We have to be.

    Like


  524. Kids are fab. It’s ridiculous to evangelize for childbearing, but this is a pretty benign sort of ridiculousness.

    I never thought of myself as a “kid person” and still am not necessarily especially fond of OTHER people’s kids.

    But MY kids? Forget it. They’re the most gorgeous creatures on the planet, the missing link between yesterday and tomorrow, the sunshine of morning, the thing that obliges me to believe that God exists.

    They are alternately hilarious and maddening. Life would be a pale shadow of itself without them.

    NOW WHO LOCKED THE BABY IN THE CLOSET???

    Like


  525. on April 26, 2009 at 1:37 am Tupac Chopra

    You can do it Yuri

    Like


  526. whiskey: Even if we convince him of the IQ thing, which has been tried, then he’ll just find another reason to hate himself and probably extend that to progeny. DA’s awesome like that.

    Like


  527. the crazy thing is, he could hate himself, but probably not his kids, if he had them.

    You know what I don’t understand, is how people can HATE the parent of their own kids. Or their own parents.

    To hate your father is to hate half of yourself, which is bad enough.

    To hate your ex-husband is to hate half your children, which is worse still.

    Like


  528. Obsidian, why is it an issue what color women want to have sex with what color men?

    Do you really like white women that much? I bred a white woman because I thought it would be best for the kids and family to have a clear heritage and culture they could relate to. There really wasn’t much other motivation for that, except for the fact that I knew my family, even though they wouldn’t say it, wanted little blue-eyed blond kids. I guess I also look better with white women, being very white myself. If you took a picture of me with someone with dark skin it would be difficult to adjust the shutter correctly without making me look like a ghost or the other look like a tar baby.

    But white women are really not any better than other ones, as far as I can tell. It’s a pretty big weakness white guys have that they feel some need to protect their women from being “defiled.” For God’s sake, women are perfectly happy to defile themselves without any outside influence.

    What white women really need at this point is some serious behavioral training, and I just don’t understand why black guys want to get involved in that. I don’t want to have to deal with it, to be honest, but I don’t have much choice in the matter.

    Whatever the case, my dad always said: “They’re all pink inside.” It’s true, you know.

    Like


  529. Ryder bawled, “Nicole, honestly, there is something wrong with you.”

    No, that’s just the instinctive fear sheeple have for independent thinkers.

    In a few years you’ll be trying to make me your president despite my utter lack of political experience, and brutal contempt of humanity in general.

    You’ll tell yourself that my disdain is limited to White people, and then later only certain White people. Either way, your perception of this and many other issues is limited. Even though I’ve spelled it out for you, you still fail to understand what I’m saying.

    I do kind of feel like I’m playing the violin to a cow, but even a cow can benefit from well ordered sounds.

    “I give you solid, irrefutable evidence that the concept of “white” was alive and well literally centuries before you claim it was…and it makes no impact on you whatsoever. None at all. ”

    It did make an impact. It proved that you don’t understand what I’m saying, so I responded to clarify that the concept of “White” in 1750 was drastically altered by the mid 1800’s. It wasn’t until then that a birth certificate was required to obtain a marriage license.

    Many people who were not of European or predominantly European descent suddenly became White, and it was pretty flexible well into the early 1900’s.

    Black and Native American, and some Asian people are still magically disappearing.

    “’It works for you, and tends to equalize you in some ways, except that White is not a race. Anglo-Saxon is a race. Alba, a race. Finnish and indigenenous mixed Finns are races.’

    “Um…these are your opinions. I’m not interested in your opinions.”

    See, this is why you fail. You don’t even know what race is, and yet you presume to argue about it. Tell you what…go look it up, and then get back to me.

    Like


  530. I think one pretty lie that needs to perish is that All Parents Love Their Children. We know some people honestly aren’t like that, omw, and can appear that way for conformity or because they’re using kids for fulfillment vehicles such as status. People say and do all sorts of crap, when clearly the kids were the last things on their minds the majority of the time. The ‘I must love them, they are my children’ is a common rationalisation.

    Again, repeated pessimism and sharktastic tendencies, I think DA would be one of them, even if he had them. Every thing they do wrong would be a ‘failure’ deepening his disproportionate shame. He might wish they were never born.

    I hear you on the ex thing. Even the non-ex thing (Every parent: “do you know what YOUR daughter did?”)

    Gunny: I wanna goo to seaawooorld tooo. Whoo! (Feel like the pedos you are, people, feel it. Go on.)

    Like


  531. Welmer: This is where I go morbid and say they’re also all white if you give them severe burns.

    Like


  532. Nicole: Violins for Cows = Probably an SWPL charity somewhere.

    Like


  533. You can do it Yuri

    That is the fucking scariest thing anybody has ever written on this blog.

    Like


  534. Whenever David Alexander posts, it is like the proverbial guy taking a dump in the locker room shower in the presence of everyone. And I don’t buy that Asians are smarter across the board; on average they might be, but I read somewhere that their standard deviation of intelligence is lower, hence fewer geniuses.

    Like


  535. “That is the fucking scariest thing anybody has ever written on this blog.”

    Explain.

    Like


  536. ah, it’s true that some people are indeed too narcissistic to actually love anyone, even their own kids…

    still, there’s something there, something strangely transformative, for most people.

    Being overly world-weary and studiously cynical about the prospect seems like a hell of a way to pre-emptively cut oneself off from something essential about life.

    I’m so tired of cynicism. People use it as a sophisticated excuse to do nothing at all, you know? I suppose doing nothing, permanently, COULD be better than doing something and fucking it up, but probably not in the long run.

    Hey, we love to play the “YOUR kid” game.

    Fun to ponder which “side” of the family the propensity for eating dog food comes from.

    Like


  537. Nicole, white people really exist, and always have, but “white” it isn’t necessarily a race.

    I have met plenty of NE Asians with skin whiter than your typical southern European. Some Turkic people have the pink skin that is typical of Europeans, but they aren’t the same race (although they probably represent the ancestor race of Europeans). I have also seen Tamils who have black skin who are “Caucasian.”

    My daughter’s Brythonic name means “blessed and white” because she really is extremely fair. White looks good in some contexts, and ugly in others. Where I live it is beautiful; in sunnier climes it can be quite an unfortunate skin tone. I believe that we still are limited by our biology, and I like to go along with mother nature.

    I have a little brother who is half-black, and he has chosen Thailand as his ideal place. He is doing very well there, and has been smart enough to find a good Thai woman to bear his son without having to bother marrying her. He is a tall, thin, good-looking young guy, and fits right in in Thailand with his copper skin and soft, curly hair. Our father is a very white guy, but his mother was Africa black. It’s all about where you belong, I think, and smart people can figure out where that is.

    Like


  538. That is the fucking scariest thing anybody has ever written on this blog.

    He knows the true face behind the mask.

    Like


  539. OMW:

    But MY kids? Forget it. They’re the most gorgeous creatures on the planet, the missing link between yesterday and tomorrow, the sunshine of morning, the thing that obliges me to believe that God exists.

    Make sure you let them know that you feel that way.
    Very, very intermittently.

    And never put your children’s wants before your relationship with your husband. This is one reason why the Greatest Generation was, well, the greatest generation.
    The children’s needs are sometimes another story, but modern America’s caricature of “children’s needs” is so grossly distorted as to be laughable.

    And don’t, even for a minute, let them think that their gorgeousness isn’t conditional on not fucking up their lives.

    You know what I don’t understand, is how people can HATE the parent of their own kids. Or their own parents.

    Seriously?

    You must be blessed enough never to have met a feminist American mother who practices relentless parental-alienation tactics.

    The children of these mothers, especially sons, would have to have quite a few screws loose not to hate them.

    Like


  540. Bhetti

    Welmer: This is where I go morbid and say they’re also all white if you give them severe burns.

    I don’t think you got it, Bhetti, unless you really are THAT morbid. There is nothing painful about the revelation that women all share that quality.

    But then again you are a med student — perhaps you are being trained to think in such ugly terms as burned corpses. This is why I never could have handled med school — I am far too affected by graphic human suffering to have ever made it as a doctor. It is truly a dirty job — even dirtier than attorney in many respects.

    Like


  541. 87

    OMW:

    […]

    Seriously?

    You must be blessed enough never to have met a feminist American mother who practices relentless parental-alienation tactics.

    The children of these mothers, especially sons, would have to have quite a few screws loose not to hate them.

    She’s just trying to convince herself. It’s probably best to indulge the woman at this point, given that she has several very small children and is actively flirting with horny older dudes on a PUA blog — she might find some vestige of a soul lingering in the dark caverns of her psyche, thereby averting disaster for the children.

    Like


  542. IQ is not everything.

    IQ IS EVERYTHING. Without it, you cannot compete, you cannot build a modern civilization, and without out, you are the whipping post for a bunch of racists. I’m sick and tired of being the fluke in a race of morons and idiots who can’t control themselves or do anything useful and productive. I’m tired of pointing to a homeland that’s perpetually broken and useless and a source of embarrassment instead of pride. I’m tired of trying to defend it all to fight off the racists. And I’m especially sick and tired of wondering if my own spawn are useless even if I happen to dupe a high IQ white woman into breeding with me, and I can’t stand that fact that while I love my niece and nephew and the rest of my family, I spend time wondering if they’re all useless and easily written off just due to their low IQ, and if I too can be written off as well.

    Cooperation levels matter probably at least as much if not more than IQ.

    Cooperation plus low IQ produces nothing. And Asia has catching up to Western standards of living while African lags behind. It’s sickening and depressing.

    The Jews were not considered “smart” by the Ancients

    A small group of Jews managed to get rid of their stupid members over a millennium with some penalties in the form of inheritable and crippling conditions. Lucky them.

    Like


  543. :: scratches beach frolicking scene off of list of fantasies about Welmer ::

    The color matters much less to me than character. Most people on earth are not such stunning creatures or have such low sex drives that they would seriously be prevented from breeding with who’s available and either socially convenient or able to compensate. Motivations and long term commitments can be toyed with, but generally, humans are pretty horny and average looking.

    Screwed up as we are, most of us are born with some level of empathy as well. We may not show it well in war (aside of the rather low shoot-to-kill rate) but in the worst committers of atrocity, you also see the most self pity, self hatred, and suffering from making others suffer. Very few humans don’t die a little inside after torturing or harming someone…and those few are basically already dead inside.

    So my interest in this topic is somewhat personal, though I can’t say it has brought me more than my share of suffering. I’ve learned alot from the up close and personal experience with race as it relates to mate selection and treatment…lessons that I believe are important for women and men of every race to learn.

    One of them is that awareness of how one’s orientation was shaped is necessary in order not to fall victim to malevolent social engineers.

    White males, though they have been blamed for much that is wrong with the U.S. are both the most invested in whatever is the going status quo, and consequently, the most vulnerable to trends. The wide mental shift from Black women as default whores/disposable sex objects to Black women as sexually nonexistent went lock step with feminism.

    This is not to say that anyone is a tool if they don’t like Black women. I’ll be the first to say that, partly because of internalizing so much negativity plus the default victim feminist entitlement, Black women have played along with their own shut-out. The party line is that men are predatory (moreso than women) and oppressors, and that Black women are the most oppressed of all.

    So you were programmed to desexualize Black women in particular, as opposed to balancing as you tended to with say, Asian women (who were also *very* sought after as prostitutes back in the day), by making it racist for you to think of any Black woman as subordinate or submissive to you.

    Just as respect is required for a woman to love a man, the validation of his protective urge is required for a man to love a woman. No matter how submissive a guy is, the most flamboyant tranny needs to be petted and rewarded for standing up for his Mistress. He wants to make her proud.

    Speaking generally, Black women don’t validate your protective urges. They don’t appreciate your leadership unless they are working for you, and then it’s mostly platonic. You aren’t supposed to even think of a Black woman’s lips wrapped around your cock, cooking your breakfast outside a restaurant, or darning your socks unless she’s getting paid to.

    …and don’t ever EVER even fantasize about what it might have been like to see her sweating in the fields, be her overseer, and catch her alone.

    …and God have mercy on your soul if you ever cosplay as a very light skinned Black guy.

    You’re not even allowed historical fiction fantasies.

    White guys should free themselves. No, you shouldn’t assume every Black woman you meet wants to submit to you, but race should not exempt any woman of any color from having to be polite to you to keep your attention.

    In a sense White men have Black women on a platonic pedestal. Mileage varies in this, but generally, this is the “SWPL” mentality. I’ve dealt with couples in which the White guy, even after getting over the social barriers it took to marry a Black woman, had to be taught that it’s not racist to say no to the woman, and get a little caveman when she starts any crap.

    Like


  544. naw, you can dislike a parent’s behavior and attitude, but hating him is hating yourself. It’s just self-destruction. You see this person every time you look in the mirror, you hear his voice when you open your own mouth.

    Took me a long while to understand that.

    “Honor thy father and thy mother, that thy days may be long upon the land that the Lord thy God giveth thee,” eh? doesn’t say a damn thing about “honor thy mother… if she’s a loyal wife” or “Honor thy father… if he’s not a spineless beta bitchboy.”

    The honor they are due is conditional on their position, not their actions.

    Much the same way a wife is obliged to submit to her husband, even when she yearns to tell him she thinks he’s a moron, and the same way a husband much love his wife, even when he thinks she’s being a shrew.

    We are too fallible and fucked-up to hold court on the people we’re most intimately bound to. Our pride is what allows us to imagine ourselves the clear-eyed judge.

    Our foolish pride.

    Like


  545. omw

    Much the same way a wife is obliged to submit to her husband, even when she yearns to tell him she thinks he’s a moron

    I can imagine that this is an extremely powerful urge in the case of omw.

    Like


  546. What’s your deal with me, Welmer? I don’t like you, either, don’t get me wrong, but my online persona must stir up some serious unresolved business in your little psyche.

    Like


  547. omw:

    naw, you can dislike a parent’s behavior and attitude, but hating him is hating yourself. It’s just self-destruction. You see this person every time you look in the mirror, you hear his voice when you open your own mouth.

    “Hate” can, and should, evolve into “amused contempt” after enough years have passed.

    You are also underestimating the importance of what I’ll call “negative role models”.
    It is much easier, and much more instructive, to avoid the actions of poor role models than to emanate the actions of good role models.

    Among youngish men I know with unusually strong character, firm convictions, and uncharacteristic dedication to conservative ideals, a disproportionate number (including all of the ones coming from non-evangelical backgrounds) are motivated by NOT becoming a spectre of a loathed, failed parent.
    These men turn out at both extremes of the spectrum, but never in the middle.

    They are often simply unable to reject the albatross-around-the-neck parent’s toxic ways without achieving this amused contempt, which MUST be preceded by at least a short period of intense hate.

    It’s probably different for women.

    As much as it pains me to say this, women are much, much less likely than are men to overcome the pernicious legacy of shitty parenting, because they are simply less able to change their actions and thought patterns through intense, dedicated patterns of rational thought.

    The positive flipside, of course, is that it’s equally unlikely that truly good girls, from good homes, will go over to the Errant dark side.

    Like


  548. It’s a bank of hard flourescent utility lights illuminating a cracked concrete floor.

    If you don’t appreciaty the beauty of austerity, then you don’t belong here.

    Like


  549. Nope. There are no “conservative ideals” without the bedrock of honoring one’s own family.

    It’s a house with no foundation. It means that whenever you get tired of putting up with some authority figure, YOU are the final judge of whether that authority is legitimate.

    After all, if your father is a shiftless fool, and your mother is a worthless whore, and neither are worthy of your honor, then just anyone can be deposed in the blink of an eye. And any “ideal” can be disposed when it’s inconvenient to you.

    Like


  550. After all, if your father is a shiftless fool, and your mother is a worthless whore, and neither are worthy of your honor, then just anyone can be deposed in the blink of an eye.

    That’s only if neither any worthy.

    The body does just fine with one kidney.

    Like


  551. I like unsexiness. Shrug.

    My comment was more a response to Welmer’s idea that I’m here for the, er, romantic flirty vibe.

    Like


  552. *That’s only if neither is worthy.

    Shit.

    Like


  553. omw

    What’s your deal with me, Welmer? I don’t like you, either, don’t get me wrong, but my online persona must stir up some serious unresolved business in your little psyche.

    I could have asked you the same thing quite a while ago, but I’m not a bitch. Now, because you were impolite and insensitive, I’m simply rubbing some of the same into your fur (an old Maoist idiom, in case you were wondering).

    What you have to learn to do is take your proper role. It doesn’t impress me in the least that some men pant over you on the Internet, BTW (talk about classy…).

    Like


  554. My comment was more a response to Welmer’s idea that I’m here for the, er, romantic flirty vibe.

    If you honor your husband, and understand and fulfill the duties of a good wife – and if you’ll take it like a good girl when he turns you over his knee and gives it to you good for daring to call him a moron – then you’re OK in my book.

    Like


  555. No, the Biblical injunction stipulates that one must honor both parents. Maybe this matters not at all to you, and you feel you can create “conservative ideals” out of whole cloth. Fine, right?

    Now, the Ten Commandments weren’t written in what you could call a “hyper PC feminist” culture, and yet this curiously demanding passage doesn’t ask us to honor “one of thy parents” or “a suitable positive adult role model.”

    There’s something essential there, about finding a way to honor people who don’t “deserve” it.

    Because there is always SOME reason we can find to refuse this obligation. “No, I would honor my dad, honest, if he didn’t sit on his ass and watch stupid TV shows all day.”

    “No, I would honor my mom, really, if she weren’t such a filthy housekeeper.”

    Like


  556. on April 26, 2009 at 3:15 am Gunslingergregi

    What dave did you really think the internet was anonymous.

    Like


  557. I don’t have a “proper role” in relation to you, Welmer. And you’ve been quite rude to me from the get-go.

    Now, if you want to continue having a cat-fight, I’d suggest you find some other woman to work out your issues on.

    Like


  558. No, the Biblical injunction stipulates that one must honor both parents. Maybe this matters not at all to you, and you feel you can create “conservative ideals” out of whole cloth. Fine, right?

    This injunction isn’t a one-way street, my dear.

    “Honour thy father and mother; which is the first commandment with promise; That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth. And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.” (Ephesians 6:1-4 KJV)

    The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him” (Ezekiel 18:20 KJV)

    Like


  559. on April 26, 2009 at 3:21 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””Gunny: I wanna goo to seaawooorld tooo. Whoo! (Feel like the pedos you are, people, feel it. Go on.)”””””””””””””””””

    Dam Bhetti you do have some serious issues. I still give you permission to go to seaworld but I will be watching you.

    Like


  560. Yes, but a failure on one party’s end doesn’t excuse you from your obligations. If Dad pisses you off, this doesn’t give you carte blanche to write the old man off with amused contempt.

    There’s the whole crux of the problem, there. All the same goes for marriage; if your husband is screwing up at work, blowing the kids’ college funds on cars he can’t afford, he’s still the head of the household and you are still obliged to submit to him.

    If your wife is thirty pounds overweight and screaming at you about some trivial bullshit, you are still obliged to love her “as Christ loved the Church” which is some serious shit, because Christ was born and died for that hopeless slut.

    Like


  561. omw

    I don’t have a “proper role” in relation to you, Welmer.

    No, you do not, and that is because you have behaved improperly.

    Like


  562. on April 26, 2009 at 3:30 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””Bhetti
    DA, you’ll have to be one of these guys, it seems:
    http://www.rcrc.org/about/members.cfm“”””””””””””

    Wow those people where ugly. Like I said pro life woman hotter than pro death.

    Like


  563. Yes, but a failure on one party’s end doesn’t excuse you from your obligations. If Dad pisses you off, this doesn’t give you carte blanche to write the old man off with amused contempt.

    In serious enough cases, “honor” can be reduced to its bare essence, i.e., covering necessary obligations when the parent in question is old and frail, and keeping one’s mouth shut at the funeral.

    “Honor” doesn’t require daily interaction, and it certainly doesn’t require allowing a parent with known and inevitable toxic influence into his or her grandchildren’s lives.

    No ma’am.

    If your wife is thirty pounds overweight and screaming at you about some trivial bullshit, you are still obliged to love her “as Christ loved the Church” which is some serious shit, because Christ was born and died for that hopeless slut.

    Oh, I understand this.

    And, conversely, those thirty pounds are going to come off if I say they will.

    Finally, it’s easy to transform non-productive screaming into more productive screaming in a relationship that doesn’t allow “No” as an option.

    Like


  564. Yes, I would agree, honoring one’s parents is not the same as rolling over and letting them run your adult life.

    Like


  565. on April 26, 2009 at 3:51 am Gunslingergregi

    “Holds mike up to OMW” Would you let a boss at work run your adult life?

    Like


  566. on April 26, 2009 at 3:54 am Gunslingergregi

    True irony and what completely blows my mind woman can’t listen to the husband per current media theory but they can listen to a boss at work while the boss at work could be sitting on a couch in his office watching tv all day every day for the next 45 years of her working life.

    Like


  567. DA:

    He knows the true face behind the mask.

    David,

    Please, mister. So does anyone else who has been here for a while, has a modicum of curiosity, and possesses the ability to conduct a simple search.

    It’s ok, though. Judging by this thread, it seems that you
    have a long time ahead of yourself before you become unprofitable and stale.
    Heh.

    Nobody here is bent on your destruction, or even on “outing” you. In fact, at least a couple of people who know exactly who you are have posted lengthy treatises to try to help you.

    By contrast, you’ll find that your beloved Lefties would love to make a public “outing” of anyone with whose thoughts they may care to find the slightest objection. Privacy? You’ll find that over here.
    Yet another demonstration that true decency lies on the Right.
    Come on in; the water’s fine.

    Now go work on your life, and stop being a fucking disgrace of a “man”.

    By the way, I like highways, too.
    A lot.

    Like


  568. on April 26, 2009 at 3:56 am Gunslingergregi

    And not even about big issues the boss at work can plan out each minute of her day for different tasks.

    Like


  569. Me? I really only have to report back to my husband, so yeah, I would. LOL.

    Like


  570. 87

    “omw My comment was more a response to Welmer’s idea that I’m here for the, er, romantic flirty vibe.”

    If you honor your husband, and understand and fulfill the duties of a good wife – and if you’ll take it like a good girl when he turns you over his knee and gives it to you good for daring to call him a moron – then you’re OK in my book.

    How about if she frequently rejects his sexual advances?

    omw

    Why tell him, Gunny? Because he’s getting frisky, whilst I can barely keep my eyeballs open, that’s why. LOL.

    Sure, I could (and would) lay there and take it like a trouper, but the snoring is bound to be a bit of a turnoff, eh?

    Like


  571. How about if she frequently rejects his sexual advances?

    See: “duties of a good wife”.

    Sleep is sounder after a good fuck.

    Like


  572. Hai, yeah, I agree that that’s pretty fucked, Gunny.

    That’s one thing I don’t get about sending women out to work; so many of them develop this relationship with their bosses that resembles a marriage more than the relation they have with their actual husbands at home.

    There was a great article about this a few years back. lemme see if I can find it…

    Like


  573. Nicole

    I found your comment utterly fascinating. PC has done collateral damage in more ways than one.
    Of course, another problem is that affirmative action has made successful men in general more scarce and thus made the more abundant successful women give up hopes of a long term commitment with an economic-alpha. But in the black situation there was not a pre-existing cohort of already successful somewhat older men.

    Like


  574. It’s a bank of hard flourescent utility lights illuminating a cracked concrete floor.

    If you don’t appreciate the beauty of austerity, then you don’t belong here.

    Chez Heartiste is one of the few places left, brick-and-mortar or virtual, for people who attach positive connotations to the phrases “to lay bare” and “the naked truth”.
    Once upon a time, this was the domain of science. I was once a scientist myself, but the degradation of science by PC bullshit drove me away. The fall of James Watson was just the latest thud of falling masonry in the decaying edifice of Western science.

    This is a virtual locker room.
    This is a virtual Duluth shipyard at breaktime amidst whipping winter winds.
    This is a virtual biker bar.
    This is a place where Truth is the only god left standing.

    This is a place that, for some reason, attracts you with its irresistible unsexy siren song.
    Why?

    Like


  575. on April 26, 2009 at 4:09 am Gunslingergregi

    And then the boss can divorce her the minute she makes to many mistakes or fails to show up to work on time and doesn’t owe her a fucking thing.

    Does anyone else find this hilarious?

    Does anyone else find that they are not asking enough of their woman?

    Like


  576. on April 26, 2009 at 4:16 am Gunslingergregi

    Yea rum how do you talk about that it needs to be a topic.

    Like


  577. on April 26, 2009 at 4:21 am Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””Welmer,
    What you have to learn to do is take your proper role. It doesn’t impress me in the least that some men pant over you on the Internet, BTW (talk about classy…).”””””””””

    I havn’t seen anyone panting over OWM,

    I have seen her with interesting thoughts.

    She also had her husband on here at one point.

    Like


  578. on April 26, 2009 at 4:27 am Gunslingergregi

    For the record I don’t know who dave is.

    Like


  579. 87

    If you honor your husband, and understand and fulfill the duties of a good wife – and if you’ll take it like a good girl when he turns you over his knee and gives it to you good for daring to call him a moron – then you’re OK in my book.

    Yes, beating your wife because she called you a moron (possibly for a good reason) sure is a sound idea.

    See: “duties of a good wife”.

    Sleep is sounder after a good fuck.

    No such duty exists.

    I’m just going to guess that if your wife doesn’t have sex with you, you’ll just rape her. Am I right?

    .

    Like


  580. Contrarian, would your boss rape you if you didn’t do your job?

    Don’t be ridiculous. Someone who shirks their duties gets fired…or if the boss doesn’t want to go through the hassle of firing them, they get put into a position where they can’t prevent someone else from making sure the job gets done.

    It’s not as if the man doesn’t have the same duty in a marriage.

    …but more guys would step aside if they were no longer sexually interested in their wives, than women who would step aside because they were no longer sexually interested in their husbands. The men of course, play the villains and are accused of trading in their wives for “younger models” as opposed to more suitable wives.

    What’s funny about this is that in most cases I’ve seen, the “other woman” is less physically attractive on the conventional scale than the wife.

    Like


  581. Rum, feminism and PC are the new prohibition. A group will start a movement and forget that there’s a difference between a group making a strong decision for themselves, and enforcing that on an entire nation. When certain things are personal choices, they can be great, but when those choices are imposed on others, they require more than picket signs and foot stamping.

    Responsible social engineers must consider the long term effects, and count the costs required to get from point A, the adoption of a value by a group, and point B, the whole nation generally adhering to that value.

    Getting rid of the sense of entitlement to exploit people based on race or gender was a good thing. How it was done was shady.

    The collateral damage done to the Black American female psyche and social possibilities was either consciously or unconsciously considered a small price to pay for removing prostitution or dating out as socially legitimate alternatives for White men. You needed to be stuck between the choices of feminist White women and hostile Black women.

    Some of the older guys may remember the Black is Beautiful propaganda. From what my parents say, White guys got happy with that and it was like open season for awhile. Then came the heavy doses of guilt.

    It became socially okay for a Black guy to date White women because this was overcoming the oppressor. It became not okay for White men to date Black women because it was giving in to the oppressor.

    Forget that a great many White people’s ancestors were in Poland or France being oppressed themselves. The bit White umbrella covered all, regardless of their specific ethnicity and histories. None of those are important because you’re White…or at least that’s how it was. People are starting to look up their ancestries more lately.

    Between the big color umbrellas, it’s easy to forget the truth: that whatever trends and general tendencies may be, the U.S. is a country where many races rubbed shoulders and genitals in whatever context they were allowed to. For awhile, it was the only place in the world where a Russian guy and a French woman would have partly Scottish grandkids.

    That’s a big thing.

    In my opinion, White needs to become less of a social construct and more of an actual culture. The solidification of the culture needs to not be exclusively in the hands of separatists.

    It seems that it was a culture for a time, in a way, but that this was rolled back to social construct when American became the culture. For a time, I was behind the American culture thing, as it seemed the only viable alternative to “separate but equal”, but like Black and White, that isn’t a black and white issue either.

    American culture is corporations and mass media telling you what to believe. White culture is your parents teaching you. Educated Black parents tend to have this difference on lock. White parents should too.

    One very disturbing thing that made me start to despise the big “White” umbrella was learning about the Polish resistance in WW2.

    They were bigger and badder than the French, and yet in school, most of us were just taught that the Polish capitulated. We weren’t told much if anything about what happened up to that point or after.

    Little kids barely out of toddlerhood were hiding in sewers helping to carry home made grenades, and most of us hear of none of that until university if ever.

    So Black history isn’t the only thing being “whitewashed”.

    Like


  582. They were bigger and badder than the French, and yet in school, most of us were just taught that the Polish capitulated. We weren’t told much if anything about what happened up to that point or after.

    You are about the fourth American I’ve come across who knows that there is more to Poland’s WW2 history than (1) capitulation in 1939 and (2) Holocaust.

    Cool that you know about the “sewer kids.” I knew a guy in Poland who was a 10 year old courier in the 1944 Warsaw Uprising (not to be confused with the much shorter-lived 1943 Warsaw Ghetto Uprising.) Yeah, the sewer network was a way of getting around German patrols and it was mostly young kids who carried out the courier duties.

    Yeah, the whitewashing. La Resistance? got nothing on Armia Krajowa. The bombing of London? bitch please!

    Like


  583. He knows the true face behind the mask.

    I’ll confess that David A. is one of two internet personalities I was actually curious about meeting in real life. It’s the recent roadgeeking post on his blog. The other one is Shouting Thomas. About as different as two people can be.

    Of course, being paranoid, I’d have us meet up in some large chain restaurant in Delaware (halfway point) and I’d drive up in a rental car and use a fake name in case DA is really an operative for a shadow government entity tasked with flushing out enemies of the state per Napolitano’s report. Then drive back with one eye on the rear veiw mirror.

    Like


  584. on April 26, 2009 at 7:38 am Default User

    Anonymous

    here’s a study university of chicago did showing that black women are the most averse to interracial dating of all races…

    All the study shows is that women of all races express strong in-group preference. It shows that black women have the highest in-group preference. That is they are adverse to men of all other races. Granted, judging by the income gap, they appear to slightly disfavor white men. But the numbers are so large (an extra $184,000 implies an income of over $230,000 which is probably top one percent), that it really does not matter.

    What it does show is that all women will break taboo if the man is alpha enough (using wealth as a proxy). In other words it shows pretty much what everyone agrees on.

    Like


  585. on April 26, 2009 at 7:41 am Default User

    Rum said:

    …But let me offer bit of hard-core wisdom about it. Race is what peoples instincts tell them it is…

    Deserves repeating.

    Like


  586. on April 26, 2009 at 8:01 am Default User

    David Alexander

      DA don’t ya think their might be a couple things ya might go to hell for.

    Yes, and aborting your fetus isn’t one of them.

      Your still on the planet so you must of thought you might go to hell for killing yourself right.

    …And no, you do not go to hell for thinking that way.

    I thought you said you were Catholic.

    I believe that under Catholic doctrine you most certainly do go to hell for abortion and suicide. Both are considered a grave evil.

    You can seek forgiveness (for abortion at least) but not if you sanctioned the abortion on the basis of “I can confess this later and make it go away.”

    [OK you may not actually go to Hell (purgatory?), but they are considered very serious. More so than your casual dismissal would imply. Also, I realized that you were talking about thoughts of suicide not the act itself.]

    Like


  587. on April 26, 2009 at 8:05 am Default User

    David Alexander

    I see you already covered the topic of your Catholicism. I replied to points as I moved down the thread. I had not read the entire thing.

    Like


  588. Shut the fuck up about race already.

    Like


  589. Nicole,
    Your point about the realities of the “other woman” deserves repeating and focus; very often, far from being an “HB10” girlfriend is usually a lot more pedestrian, shall we say.

    I keep saying, that hot sex, which frankly speaking is rare for most of us, is its own reward-and often, it is NOT to be found among the HB10 class. I repeat: I’d rather have a Women who’s a 6.5 and fucks like she was channelling the spirit of Vanessa Del Rio, than have a “hot babe” like Kim Kardashian who’ll just lay there like a dead fish. More often than not, this is the case w/such Women, and Men on a whole, know it. Not only do such Women remain largely ignorant about the enterprise, but lots of guys are very wrapped up in what others wil think of them. Then they find out the hard way, what the real deal is. Unless your in pump & dump mode, you find out over the course of weeks or even days, to say nothing of months or years. One of the real drawbacks to focusing on such Women. Let the buyer beware.

    I happen to know of such a case, right now-a “high yellow” Black Woman, “good hair” and a serious rack, who was always catered to by Men all her life; got married to a Man 5 years younger, had kids, and soon after, he was creepin on her. She found his cellie and saw the pics of the other Woman-darkskinned, braids which most likely are extensions, not terribly attractive features wise, average at best. The only thing really attractive about the gal was her bigger rack than the wifey’s which also sported much bigger nipples. Obviously, hubbie’s a breast man.

    Comes to find out that the other Woman can suck & fuck like a bitch in heat, and the wifey ain’t doin’ none of that-after the kids came along, like so many wifeys, she clamped her thighs shut. Like Nicole said, and I’ve personally seen this borne out, there are Women out there for whom sex just isn’t that big a deal. That’s cool, but she should come to some kind of understanding w/her Man so things don’t blow up in her face. This is why I advocate open arrangements in such cases, because not only can they work and have indeed worked in the past, but because there’s a lot more at stake than just sex-this Woman has a life w/this Man, kids are involved, etc. Since she’s more “levelheaded” she needs to see the bigger picture.

    But, like so many Women in our time, she places all of the blame on her hubbie, and wants no more to do with him. The kids will suffer, and so will she. Singlemoms, especially Black ones, have a very hard time of it.

    O

    Like


  590. on April 26, 2009 at 8:44 am Default User

    David Alexander

    No, just like how PA ignores the Church on immigration issues and the death penalty, I ignore them on birth control, condoms, and abortion. It’s pretty commonplace to differ on official Church policy and teaching for most Catholics.

    There is a huge difference. Abortion and suicide are considered grave evils.

    The position on the death penalty is more like their position on war. It looks to the gravity of the crime and other circumstances (the so called just war). It is not against the death penalty ex cathedra, as far as I know but does tend to disfavor it on the grounds of justice and fairness.

    The position on immigration is much the same. It is about weighing up cost and benefits.

    Both (immigration and the death penalty) are part of its social policy and so open to disagreement. For a good Catholic the position on abortion is not open to disagreement.

    You can call yourself a Catholic, but if you favor abortion (or contraception) you are not in alignment with on of the more important positions of the Church. Those who disagree with Rome can always become protestant and still maintain their Christian identity.

    You cannot disagree and, in good conscience, call yourself Catholic. This does not make you evil, or a bad person, it just means you cannot dump one of the important tenets of your faith and still claim membership of the congregation.

    Like


  591. What it does show is that all women will break taboo if the man is alpha enough (using wealth as a proxy). In other words it shows pretty much what everyone agrees on.

    it is not showing what “everyone” is agreeing upon, since many in this thread are repeatedly claiming THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF WHAT THE STUDY SAYS, they’re claiming that black women are craving the opportunity to be with white men over even their own men. lurker claims black women are craving white men. gnp colbert claims that black female 9s and 10s “invariably” choose white men over black men. who is this “everyone” you are talking about? and how does the study i cite show the same things they agree upon? were you drinking this morning or somethng?

    if that study was really saying exactly what my opponents already agreed upon, DONT YOU THINK ONE OF THEM WOULD HAVE POINTED THIS OUT BY NOW TO GLOAT INSTEAD OF CONVENIENTLY DODGING IT OVER AND OVER FOR HUNDREDS OF COMMENTS? if that study was bolstering their point instead of refuting it do you really think theyd pass up the chance to gloat about it? you fail.

    Like


  592. Obsidian, I don’t get that at all. A sexless relationship isn’t monogamous. It’s platonic.

    If a woman isn’t having sex with a guy, he’s a platonic friend. He can be a very close one, like me and my second ex. He’s like my brother, only it isn’t perverted to pinch his butt.

    Still, if she doesn’t want him, she needs to allow him to find someone who does. Hell, as the primary wife, she should be helping to make sure her second is up to standard.

    That might be a little too honest for some folks’ taste, but oh well. I wouldn’t want someone I loved to get his heart broken.

    Like


  593. Nicole,
    I 100% agree, and actually what you noted is laidout in the Kama Sutra & even Qur’an-the Elder Wife has a direct hand in the selection of newer wives or even concubines.

    I really don’t see what the big deal is-she’s gotten what she wanted out of the deal, kids & a chance for a stable future for them and her. And she doesn’t have to deal w/his “weird” or even just strong sexual urges. She’s merely “outsourced” them, and they can do the once or twice a month, missionary thing. Done rightly, no one gets hurt. The kids don’t have to know, no one does.

    Again, I put a good bit of the blame of this on Feminism, which ushered in an era where Women have de facto unilateral power in the sexual area of life-and Women know it. They can decide, on their own, not only who gets to live or die (abortion etc), but also who gets to have sex or not. Lots of wives shutdown sexually on their hubbies for a whole host of reasons, many of them silly & stupid.

    O

    Like


  594. …were you drinking this morning or somethng?

    So much for that “amused mastery” thing you were boasting about earlier.

    We have two posters who a have different experience from the study. That is, two posters out of many that post here. So “everybody” might be an exaggeration, but not much.

    Indeed my own experience and taste also goes against the study. I and the other white men I know find fewer (not none) black females attractive compared to white females. As far as I can gauge these things, the level of black female attraction towards me is about the same as white women. It appears to be the same for other men I know. So it is a case of who you going to believe “some study or your lying eyes?”

    The study says one thing, and personal experience shows the other. So, I do not think the study is the knockout blow you think it is. As I said before, it merely shows that black women are more ethnocentric than others.

    Some notes:
    Of all the black female/white male couples I doubt many of them actually have that 200K+ income difference.

    I have no real opinion on the study or who is hotter other than my own taste. I would guess that GNP and lurker are arguing from a position of taste and experience.

    Like


  595. That is the fucking scariest thing anybody has ever written on this blog

    Heh heh heh heh heh

    You best get crackin’ on your developmental plan, boy.

    You never know who’s watching…

    Like


  596. Welmer: I was just backing up your point, we’re fundamentally the same (especially when suffering) and you don’t have to go as far as the pink bits to see that. It’s not ‘trained’ to think in ‘ugly’ terms, it’s just unavoidable grimness to deal with in the profession. Even though all the sanitised scientific naming and identifying is a very good defense mechanism using intellectualisation: I’m human, it becomes a part of my consciousness, and it’d be silly if some things didn’t haunt me, coming out in strange ways. E.g. why the compulsion for some guys to share images on the Internet that deeply disturb them? Anyway, I apologise for subjecting you to that.

    Like


  597. Who else thinks Tupac would probably have a very good evil laugh?

    Like


  598. Bhetti, Gunslingergregi, omw

    Regarding abortion and ultrasounds:

    I find it interesting that a woman that is pregnant with a wanted child always refers to it as a child or baby. It is only when it is unwanted that it becomes a fetus.

    I have never heard a happily expecting mother talk about the health of her “fetus.”

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  599. Default User, your onservation is apt. It’s also consistent with my basic view of abortion: it’s homicide.

    But so is killing an enemy soldier on the battlefield or euthanizing a victim of severe burns.

    Not being a pacifist or a pro-life (in its broadest sense) absolutist, I understand that sometimes homicide is the preferrable choice.

    But to repeat, however you look at it, it’s still baby-killing. A man whose wife conceived via rape should have an option of killing that child, however grim their choice.

    That baby is innocent, but so is a 50-year-old truck driver who is wearing the wrong kind of uniform.

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  600. The huge problem I have w/the Abortion Debate, actually two, is the fact that Pro Choicers refuse to acknowledge two very important things:

    1. That in our time, if a Woman doesn’t want to be pregnant, she doesn’t have to be, given so many different, and virtually 100% effective, birth control options (which I 100% favor, I’m not Catholic)

    And 2. That the Pro Choice side refuses to see that they deny to Men that which they assert is a fundamental human right for Women-to decide, whether they want to be a parent, or not. And for that choice to be completely seperate from their sexual choices and lifestyle.

    I think if we acknowledge these things, and made necessary adjustments along these lines, the Abortion shouting would die down considerably.

    O

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  601. @whiskey “Creative Destruction”

    is that a reference to Theodore Levitt’s Marketing Myopia?

    Like


  602. on April 26, 2009 at 12:11 pm Comment_IMBRA_2

    In response to some things written last night:

    I am 31.

    PA said:

    Yeah, he seems like a decent guy but the bitter tone makes me wonder. If he’s young (teen, early 20s) that it’s just a youthful earnestness and a clumsy attempt to sound forceful. He’ll outgrow it.

    But if he’s an older guy (over 30) he needs to rein that in. Like blaming OMW for foreign bride laws. When he feels the bitterness welling, he needs to transform it into humor.

    “Be funny like Tupac or Jaakelli” is what he’d need to remind himself before he writes.

    PA can call fury ‘bitterness’ if he likes. I’m not looking for a foreign wife. If I did marry a foreign wife, then I would probably move to her country. The law doesn’t effect me.

    It seems that PA doesn’t want me to talk about IMBRA because it disturbs him. Since IMBRA bans private non-political non-criminal email between two adults, you should be disturbed. Yes, that means all of you.

    As for my tone, it would be nice if people could handle today the quite ordinary sentiments of older times. Yes, ordinary.

    Someone else once said:

    “And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
    That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion
    A home and a country should leave us no more?
    Their blood has wash’d out their foul footstep’s pollution.
    No refuge could save the hireling and slave
    From the terror of flight or the gloom of the grave,”

    And I guarantee you every last dollar I have, the man who wrote this, along with other lines you are much more familiar with, reaction to IMBRA would be much, much worse than mine.

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  603. So much for that “amused mastery” thing you were boasting about earlier.

    oh trust me, i was amused. the drinking thing was a joke.

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  604. and honestly to give you credit at least you tried to address the study. i can respect you on that front unlike the others

    Like


  605. It seems that PA doesn’t want me to talk about IMBRA because it disturbs him.

    Comment_, I don’t care what you talk about. Where did I say that I don’t want you to talk about IMBRA?

    I was offering you a helpful suggestion to style your commentary in a way that is more effective toward your ends. Take it or leave it, dude.

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  606. contrarian

    87

    See: “duties of a good wife”.

    Sleep is sounder after a good fuck.

    No such duty exists.

    I’m just going to guess that if your wife doesn’t have sex with you, you’ll just rape her. Am I right?

    Yes the duty does (or did) exist. Refusing sex to a husband is breach of contract. Before no-fault marriage, it was grounds for divorce.

    The concept of “marital rape” didn’t even exist until some twenty years ago. Marriage implied consent to sex. Now that one can be charged with “marital rape,” marriage is absolutely meaningless.

    If any man ever has to deal with a wife who refuses sex, he should be very sorry that he ever got married to her in the first place, and should start thinking about getting a lawyer and divorcing her immediately, because he is only going to be miserable living with her.

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  607. epicolz:

    Its a reference to Joseph Schumpeter’s “creative destruction”

    Like


  608. I find it funny how every posting on this blog degenerates into ramblings about black/white/Asian/Jew differences.

    Like


  609. on April 26, 2009 at 2:17 pm Cannon's Canon

    Anonymous:

    That study was very intriguing; great link. I was skeptic, but in a matter of online dating, the clicks don’t lie (see: male height).

    As a statistical analysis, I considered the following shortcomings:
    1. sample size of 400 – plenty to notice the trends, to be sure. citing “average” income, however, WILL be a skewed variable. $62K for men sounds fine, but outliers will push the published results. of course, a white man who makes a million dollars will attract black women more favorably. if this study’s “attraction” variable is simply a matter of yes or no, as it seems, one very rich white man would ruin all averages.
    2. sample constitution – “graduate and professional students at Columbia University” implies a very high base level of financial independence, which should be enough to completely discard cited income figures as absolute. within the niche of comfortable personal income, racial preferences could (or should) be amplified.
    3. response bias – under the veil of anonymity, would black women still respond to a survey more selectively than if they were not being watched? i ask this rhetorically because i couldn’t say.
    4. existing cultural leverage – asians, in a position of minority over-achievement economically, could “afford” to trade down based solely on their attraction switch without risking judgment within their culture. assuming my implication of “comfortable personal income” holds, black women risk more by dating outside their race in terms of judgment.
    5. constitution of men – while i have attended Robert Allen’s ‘Multiple Income Streams’ lecture (not really) and racked up a myspace notch back in the day, i feel safe in saying the majority of male “online daters” are beta. since black men stereotypically embody more “inherent alpha traits” in terms of raw masculinity, so to speak (as Obsidian will assert), they should attract more women of all races within their pool, ESPECIALLY if the ‘graduate/professional’ tag has been established.
    6. consider the source – at the risk of discrediting myself on grounds of paranoia, IT’S THE FUCKING NEW YORK BETA TIMES!!!! What a pillar of androgynous race and gender apology! no need to expound here.

    In conclusion, I consider you to have contributed a fascinating counterpoint to GNP’s off-the-cuff discourse but not to have won the internet.

    Like


  610. Gotta cosign Welmer’s point 100% here. Even the most casual study of marriage, in just about any society in the world, lays out the fact that it was an explicit agreement that you would have sex w/only said spouse, and in a timely fashion.

    The no fault divorce thing has well, removed any hint of fault or blame on either side actually, but it can’t be denied that Women have greatly benefitted from this. Even if you think that’s a good thing you’d have to admit that this is the case. Personally I think we threw out the baby w/the bathwater in trying to give Women a break in the divorce area. Its a perfect case study in what happens when public policy is made w/minimal forethought.

    O

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  611. Now that one can be charged with “marital rape,” marriage is absolutely meaningless.

    As we all know, sex with an unwilling partner is always the best sex, right?

    They were bigger and badder than the French, and yet in school, most of us were just taught that the Polish capitulated.

    I’d argue that the French capitulation was due to a hastily formed army of conscripts that was poorly trained, military generals that were too old, senile, and conservative to fight the modern techniques of the Wermacht, third rate Belgian forts that were useless, the de facto abandonment of the British at Dunkirk, a degree of unwillingness to fight based on memories of the Great War, and a Fifth Column of Fascists in French society who viewed the invasion as their chance to install a Fascist government in France.

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  612. Default User said, “We have two posters who a have different experience from the study.”

    No you don’t.

    You have one commenter who attracted one Black woman who was willing to overlook his race, and consider him a possible romantic prospect.

    Depending on where he lived, I’d say that’s low stats.

    You have another user who, walking around looking like an alien visitor, was surrounded by whores who happened to be Black. I wouldn’t call a guy particularly sought after by White women if he went to Nevada flashing cash and behaving like a target.

    You have various users with anecdotes here and there that are worth about as much as anecdotes about my experiences as a 250+ lbs woman are to an argument that men aren’t really that repelled by obesity.

    Men are generally repelled by obesity as it often includes a certain amount of physical nastiness, apathy, antisocial tendency, or is an indication of hormonal problems that can be problematic for a guy who wants kids or regular sex.

    I don’t need to be liked as much as I need the truth. A few guys here should, like I did, accept the fact of the nature of humanity, trends, and figure out how to navigate them without the roadblocks of denial.

    Nothing about being White in the U.S. should be default repellant to any woman.

    Whether you want a particular type of woman or not, you should be a man to *all women*.

    If there is a demographic of young, nubile women who are not seeing you as particularly manly, something is either wrong with you or wrong with your society, which would make something wrong with those women, depending on how manned up you actually are. You should figure out how much of what it is.

    “That is, two posters out of many that post here. So “everybody” might be an exaggeration, but not much.”

    Two of us female posters here are women over 30 who don’t break mirrors, don’t lack for male attention, and most of us have some understanding that somethin’ ain’t right about feminism.

    We are not representative of the general population of American women. Neither are you.

    “Indeed my own experience and taste also goes against the study. I and the other white men I know find fewer (not none) black females attractive compared to white females.”

    Nobody was arguing against that. Obsidian was trying to explain to you that this is oddly new as a trend. I explained why it’s oddly new as a trend.

    In the past, if your family was in the U.S. before the 1940s you’d have been told hush-hush like, that you should probably limit your dalliances to women of color and/or women on “the other side of the tracks” until you find a nice White woman to marry. You wouldn’t have had many options to shag White women until you did, unless you were very lucky, and even then if you got her pregnant, things would get ugly or you would get married.

    “As far as I can gauge these things, the level of black female attraction towards me is about the same as white women. It appears to be the same for other men I know. So it is a case of who you going to believe ‘some study or your lying eyes?'”

    Women in general, flirt with men they’re not attracted to, because you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

    A game that I play often is flirting with guys I know I have no chance with, because regardless, it boosts their ego.

    Boosted egos get me free lighters and king size rolling papers, all the free, um, candy I could possibly want if I was into that, rides home, free beer at festivals, notified of sales at supermarkets, etc. Being even an “ugly” woman is cool.

    Sometimes flirting isn’t really to get you into bed, but just to get on your good side.

    This is not to say that none of them or even all of them weren’t attracted to you. It’s just that there’s a long way between attraction and the altar.

    …though I do have to wonder why a guy wouldn’t be attracted to a young, fit woman of comparable social status. That answer is likely social, though there are genes that predispose someone to me more or less racist. Nobody will say that outright though. They just say they “seem to cause a greater degree of anxiety when exposed to unfamiliar physical features”.

    Someone has to not grow up around any Black people, or be in an extremely racist/xenophobic environment in order to consider Black people unfamiliar or other.

    “The study says one thing, and personal experience shows the other.”

    No, interpretations of personal experiences seem to show another.

    My personal experiences as a fat woman weren’t bad at all in the U.S. and the ethnic issues overshadowed the fat thing here in Israel. I cannot presume to conclude that men in general don’t have any problem with obesity in women, based on my personal experiences.

    First, I was not an ordinary fat chick, and second, I’m not a telepath.

    What the statistics say are either that you generally have to have more money to get with a Black woman, OR that men with more money are less hung up about race. I’m more inclined to believe the latter since much of the aversion in the non specific umbrella-White community seems to be social. Once a guy is no longer under threat of what others will think of him, he feels freer to expand his horizons…and a mixed Russian-French-Scotch-Spanish guy probably does not have other-anxiety triggering genes.

    “So, I do not think the study is the knockout blow you think it is. As I said before, it merely shows that black women are more ethnocentric than others.”

    Ethnocentric includes less willing to get involved with guys of other ethnicities.

    “Some notes:
    Of all the black female/white male couples I doubt many of them actually have that 200K+ income difference.”

    There aren’t so many, but I assure you that in most that there are, the White guy is usually of a socioeconomic class that marrying a Black woman wouldn’t harm him. They’re not all Robert DeNiro, but a good chunk of them are businessmen, IT, and in the position to encounter Black women of a socioeconomic class that they don’t need to be particularly hostile.

    “I have no real opinion on the study or who is hotter other than my own taste. I would guess that GNP and lurker are arguing from a position of taste and experience.”

    I wonder how they’ll interpret their experience knowing a bit more of the history of the issue. If their families weren’t in the U.S. before the 40’s, they could easily be oblivious and have had no stories trickle down. Even some guys with pre-40’s families were protected from certain information that could have been considered shameful.

    Would your grandma tell you or perhaps even know if your great grandpa had a Black or Asian mistress? or if they were very poor back then themselves, that one of your great great aunts or uncles might have been the offspring of great great’s boss, or someone your great great grandmother worked for and extorted her?

    In earlier times, money meant alot more than it does now. Before DNA testing, and back when certain revelations could get you killed or were painfully embarassing, money meant you could pretty much do as you pleased to anyone who was dependent on your good will to survive.

    In some parts of the world, it still means that. If you’ve ever seen up close how these things can progress, it’s hard not to look at the world from the usual American programmed frame.

    People didn’t embrace the big White umbrella just because of their desire to lord over others. For some, it offered them protection that they didn’t have before. It became more socially damaging for a rich boss to rape or coerce a White woman, than back in the days when she’s be considered a Melungeon or somesuch.

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  613. This place attracts such a high volume of comments because the readers are frustrated losers with a lot of free time on their hands.

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  614. This place attracts such a high volume of comments because the readers are frustrated losers with a lot of free time on their hands.

    don’t be too hard on yourself.

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  615. David Alexander

    As we all know, sex with an unwilling partner is always the best sex, right?

    We don’t know anything of the sort. That’s shitty of you to imply that anyone here does.

    Marriage indicates willingness, or at least it used to. Did you read the “slut strikes back” whore blog where the wife stated in one of here posts that denying sex to her husband empowered her? And this is the same woman who is screwing multiple men on the side.

    You would defend that, wouldn’t you…

    Women deny sex all the time these days, and their husbands can’t do a thing about it. Shouldn’t that at least be grounds for a divorce where the wife gets no alimony?

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  616. Nicole,uhm,I raed your post and I am confused:Do black women like white guys..or not. I am confused!

    Like


  617. on April 26, 2009 at 4:43 pm Default User

    Nicole

    Women in general, flirt with men they’re not attracted to, because you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

    A game that I play often is flirting with guys I know I have no chance with, because regardless, it boosts their ego.

    Sometimes flirting isn’t really to get you into bed, but just to get on your good side.

    This is not to say that none of them or even all of them weren’t attracted to you. It’s just that there’s a long way between attraction and the altar.

    LOL. Come on. Just because I post on a blog does not mean I am clueless.

    Women of all races use their flirting skills to get what they want and will flirt outside of attraction. That is why I said: “As far as I can gauge these things…”

    I too flirt with women I am not attracted to because it is fun (and gives them an ego boost).

    Regarding the female flirting for stuff. It is sometimes laughably obvious: you know all friendly, sultry, and touchy followed by the favor they need. We men should be insulted that the women think we are that dumb.

    I am usually not mean, but after enjoying the attention of such self-seeking flirty behavior I love to turn around and say “sorry no-can-do” and return to whatever I was working on.

    …though I do have to wonder why a guy wouldn’t be attracted to a young, fit woman of comparable social status…

    Funny thing is that I am not attracted to many fit young women of comparable social status regardless of race. Fit and young are good, but like most men I am attracted to certain “looks” more than others. So she can be young and fit but just not do it for me. Indeed the classic blue-eyed blonde is one of the types that often don’t do it for me, so it is not necessarily a race or status thing.

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  618. on April 26, 2009 at 4:49 pm Default User

    Nicole

    PS:

    I would guess that some of our taste is gene based. We are looking for those that will allow us create healthy offspring.

    My guess is that includes thinsg like, scent, facial features, body size, etc. In other words we are probably prone to be attracted to complementary types (not the same but not very different).

    Culture, of course, plays a role. Culture, like genes, wants to protect and replicate itself.

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  619. Update: I read some more posts of you,Nicole,where you say white men used to “exploit” black women and niow cuz we cant,have “decided” that black women are not attractive??!! Whoa! That sounds a little crazy. It may be that if in the past cheap,easy,safe no-repercussion sex was morer available to white men—BTW a jewish friend has told dark rumors that her great grandaddy banged black chicks in his pickle factory,lol—then it seems they would spend more time thinking about BW in sexual terms,and having more contact might make them more attracted to black ladies as a group.so I cant totally disagree with this bold statement! (Its obv you dont like whitey,but thats typical of black,you are just a tribal people by nature,look how you fight each other over various differences) BUT..overall,if all the negatives of white men/black women sex were swept away tomorrow (fear of violence,crime,disease,political incorrect,gangs etc!)there might well be a bump in white/black love,but in this era of free sex,when white men who are NOT omegas can ususally get sex,it wouldnt amount to much. White men are not attracted to black women–in general. This should make you happy!!

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  620. John, it’s not trendy for Black women to like White men or vise versa.

    So, statistically they’re less prone to marry each other, but as to what people like, who can know from the U.S?

    Outside the U.S. many ethnicities of White men would generally give their left nut even to bang an ugly Black woman.

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  621. http://evoandproud.blogspot.com/2009/02/origins-of-male-homosexuality.html

    Basically, a theory that monogamy is a result of brain feminization, and Homosexuality is an unfortunate byproduct of this brain feminization; like sickle cell anemia is a byproduct of partial immunity to malaria.

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  622. Default User, your pickiness is not normal. Most guys can get it up for just about any young, fit woman, even if she’s not that great from the neck up.

    I’m taking generalities and trends here, not individuals. Individuals who aren’t overly invested in the dominant culture do all kinds of exceptional things.

    So my reasons for even discussing this topic in public at all are so that the exceptional people may consider the origins of their own and potential partners’ orientation.

    You, specifically may be curious to figure out how much of your preference is based on social programming against imagining a Black woman on her knees in front of you, and how much of it is simply preferring women with similar features to your mom.

    The latter is probably the case if there’s more going on there than being under the umbrella of White, young, and relatively symmetrical. Mind you, there is much more to the social/sexual feminization of the American male than PC…there’s feminism.

    If you find yourself drawn to the anti nurturing ideal, which spans the races, this is an indicator of self destructive programming. The masculine with somewhat feminine accents may be more objectively beautiful, since the optimal male form is the superior physical specimine in utilitarian function, but as beautiful as it is in entertainment or prostitution contexts, it is bad selection in an actually female mate.

    Part of the programming was to fiddle with your categorization mechanisms and convince you that the ideal look for a whore is the same as the ideal look for a wife. It is not. Men are supposed to be able to parse the signals on sight, even to the point of instructing their own more masculine daughters to find an appropriate way of expressing their nature.

    This is why, for me, though ideas of race are important to mention, they’re secondary to the overall issue of White males being socially programmed to genetically self destruct. It’s hard to breed leaders and independent thinkers, or even conscious followers, when you’re being herded into the slaughterhouse where financial exploitation and emasculation on penalty of isolation awaits you.

    Penises are a force of nature that have raised and toppled empires. Women are generally physically weaker. If you let us con you into screwing only who we want you to screw, you’ll end up fucking yourselves. Women suck at being the man. At least in your own pants, don’t let us do that to you.

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  623. on April 26, 2009 at 5:46 pm Lucius Vorenus

    Nicole: In Israel, the dandies are called “arsim”. It means “shepherd” or “pimp”, and it’s usually the domain of Mizrahi guys.

    My mom commented on her visit that the men are prettier than the women here.

    And you wonder why you got your asses handed to you on a platter by a bunch of 7th Century raghead illiterates in the summer of 2006???

    You know, I often look at all these limp-wristed, effete, panty-waist sorry-assed excuses for manhood at American universities, and think to myself that there’s no way in Hades that we could mount another Normandy or Iwo Jima, but now you have me thinking that the Yids couldn’t pull off a 1967 or a 1973, either.

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  624. I reckon CH should switch to this blogging style:
    http://www.breaktheillusion.com/?p=1542

    That’s +1 to my immoral male objectification score today.

    Like


  625. If you find yourself drawn to the anti nurturing ideal, which spans the races, this is an indicator of self destructive programming.

    This was quite an interesting comment. On a lighter note, there was a scene in “Two and a Half Men” that touched on this:

    Alan, who is a hapless, neurotic beta, sits in a bar with his very alpha older brother Charile (who is played by Charlie Sheen)

    Charlie is trying to help Alan work out his relationship issues and also meet a girl. So he asks Alan to point to a woman who looks most attractive to him.

    The camera then pans across the bar, showing us the place from Alan’s point of view. It briefly pauses on each woman he sees. Each is very attractive, and most either smile or ignore Alan they meet his eyes. Then the camera swings back to zoom in on one raven-haired, evil-eyed beauty who glowers at him with profound contempt.

    “That’s the one I like!” says Alan to Charlie.

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  626. on April 26, 2009 at 6:07 pm Lucius Vorenus

    Nicole: This is why, for me, though ideas of race are important to mention, they’re secondary to the overall issue of White males being socially programmed to genetically self destruct. It’s hard to breed leaders and independent thinkers, or even conscious followers, when you’re being herded into the slaughterhouse where financial exploitation and emasculation on penalty of isolation awaits you.

    Do you post at iSteve under the pseudonym “Testing99”?

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  627. “Outside the U.S. many ethnicities of White men would generally give their left nut even to bang an ugly Black woman.”

    er….NO.

    They would give their left nut to AVOID having to bang an ugly black woman.

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  628. Bhetti I think one pretty lie that needs to perish is that All Parents Love Their Children.

    You know I said this once but some of the men didn’t like it. Oprah and like have had shows on this very same topic and you can observe as much at any mall during the early morning hours.

    Anonymous said
    damn gnp colbert you are like subprime mortgage. technically i totally own you but youre worthless so what good does it do me?
    *DEAD FAINT*

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  629. Nicole — Men DO have a problem with obesity in women. Study after study have shown that.

    Re: attractiveness of Black Women, tastes have changed. Pam Grier and Nichelle Nicole from Star Trek aroused many a young man in the 1960s-70’s. However, today’s Black Woman has either overmuscled physiques like the Williams sisters (not attractive) or obese ones, and an unfeminine attitude. Black women like the VERY dark Angela Bassett are and were considered hot by way of physical beauty coupled with a feminine attitude.

    As per OJ, etc. both DA and Obsidian are in deep denial. The celebration of the verdict was EXACTLY the same as the racist White celebration of the acquittal of the loathesome Byron De La Beckwith, who cold-bloodly (hey, just like OJ!) murdered Medgar Evers in his driveway. In both cases the motives and the reaction of the populace (white and black) were abominable.

    Let’s be honest, Blacks today are among the most racist, anti-Semitic, and violence prone groups in the US today. Every measure reveals this, despite the excuses. Like the rebirth of the Klan in the 1920’s, it’s based on brutal sexual competition and threats from outside groups. Black people of today as a group mirror the Klan and the lynch mobs almost in every brutal detail. No one “made them turn evil.” Black were not always like that either. But they are now, and it’s going to be a very stupid indulgence (hate generally is among the worst vices a people can indulge in).

    Dr. King could read the numbers. Blacks are 12.5% of the population, and as more and more Mexicans come to the US, Blacks will only shrink. The “OJ precedent” or “I’m Black, it’s OK” is basically an argument on White Guilt (among status climbing SWPL yuppies and women) and pure power. Hint: Mexicans feel no guilt, have deplorable attitudes towards Blacks, and White Yuppies are likely in for a serious bit of decline as the economy remains tanked. Working / Middle class Whites feel zilch guilt and mostly want Ghetto Racist Blacks to go away. Tellingly, SNL and South Park feel free to ridicule Ghetto Black rap and rap personalities. Chronic of Narnia and Puff Daddy, Kanye West.

    Rejecting universalism and color-blind beliefs of Dr. King only guarantees that Blacks get it in the neck when SWPL face vastly reduced numbers and Mexicans exhibit demographic power. Blacks will once again be forced to the back of the bus JUST as Dr. King warned. Celebrating OJ’s getting away with Murder may have fed the racist hatred of Blacks, like that of the All-White juries that twice acquitted Beckwith, but it’s sure to lead to a pure numbers game. Blacks are 12.5% of the population. That’s it. Racial Identity politics = long term losing.
    —————————
    Re: the Klan. It had two phases and was mostly defunct for long periods of time, as racist White activity was largely self-generating. The loathesome Nathan Bedford Forrrest disbanded the Klan in the late 1870’s because it interfered wiith his ability to raise Northern Capital. The second Klan, around 1920-1933, was organized around Midwestern resentment of Blue Collar Ethnic Catholics, and Jews, as amply detailed in “Notre Dame vs. the Klan.” It largely fell apart due to murder cases, corruption, and the assimilation of Ethnic Catholics and Jews. True: Most of the second-wave Klan revenues and activity came from Indiana, Illinois, Kentucky, West Virginia (Robert Byrd was a Kleagle), and other places not known at the time for heavy Black populations. Sexual/Status rivals from Catholic/Jewish backgrounds were the Klan’s main targets.

    The obvious analog today of the Klan would of course be Louis Farrakhan and the Nation of Islam. Which is about as Klan-like as you can get right down to the anti-Catholic/Jewish/White enemies who are sexual/status/power rivals and the uber-macho intimidation uniforms of Klan 3.0 aka Nation of Islam (with Rev. Wright and Barack Obama as the Father Coughlin and George Wallace of today).

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  630. Do you post at iSteve under the pseudonym “Testing99″?

    No, that’s whiskey.

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  631. on April 26, 2009 at 6:41 pm Default User

    Nicole

    Default User, your pickiness is not normal. Most guys can get it up for just about any young, fit woman, even if she’s not that great from the neck up…

    I am sure I could get it up for many women if they offered themselves up.

    The thing is to getting to getting-it-up will take work on my part. She will have to be woed. Given that there is effort involved (effort that might not even pay off), why would I pursue every woman where I am not excited? I will put the effort where there is the most reward.

    That means I will pursue the women I find most attractive. True, my attraction will not always be reciprocated but that is life. Chasing after someone “just because” seems a waste of effort.

    If the tension gets too much (in the absence of a hottie to chase) I can always toss-off. I have a good imagination so I do not need a Dave Alexander style 400GB (down from 500?) porn collection.

    As to the rest, I hope that is directed at a broader audience because it seems an awful lot of analysis based on a few lines of reply.

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  632. Whiskey Tellingly, SNL and South Park feel free to ridicule Ghetto Black rap and rap personalities. Chronic of Narnia and Puff Daddy, Kanye West.

    Whiskey neither Kayne or Puffy are ghetto rappers both are more glamerous than gangster. Kayne is more of a Black Hipster aka blipster if anything. PS. One of the founders of South Park is married to a very dark skinned black woman and her first name is Keisha.

    venus said Do you post at iSteve under the pseudonym “Testing99″?

    jaakkeli’s response No, that’s whiskey.

    Man you just put Whiskey out on front street. Dry sniching like a mother.

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  633. Re: Catholic Church

    Interestingly, I’m writing this after returning from 5 PM Mass…

    Anyway, you could argue that I’m one of those so-called cafeteria Catholics who picks and chooses the attributes of the church that I like. So I’ll stick with the mass and liberal portions of the social teaching while dumping stuff the abortion and sexual teachings.

    While I may come across as some evil pro-choice type who does admittedly wonder if his brother and cousin’s lives who have improved without their respective children, I’m hesitant to magically offer it as a solution, and I know that it’s not an easy choice for anybody to make. I simply would prefer that it be an option available to those who need it. I personally know several women who have had abortions, and I will admit that it was never an easy decision for it, and their choice can linger with them for years.

    Shouldn’t that at least be grounds for a divorce where the wife gets no alimony?

    Yes, it can be grounds for a divorce. I have generally stated that couples that have sexual problems should have the right to a divorce.

    As I stated, even if your wife is simply serving as a de facto personal cum dumpster, who wants to have sex with a woman who couldn’t be bothered to be a willing partner, and simply fakes her orgasms? I’d rather masturbate than go through such an insulting process.

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  634. An incapacity to love fully doesn’t make you evil, just very alone.

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  635. Nicole

    :: scratches beach frolicking scene off of list of fantasies about Welmer ::

    Maybe you can think of my little brother.

    As my dad says, he’s “halfrican.” He thrives on tropical beaches. Would black women find his look attractive?

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  636. Lucius, no I don’t post at iSteve, but I was in Israel during the war, and didn’t see any ass-handing by “ragheads”.

    …not to say that it can’t happen. Israel is not what it was. People are fleeing the country like rats who know a ship is about to sink. Most likely, by the next war of that sort, all that will be left here are the people who can’t afford to leave, the very few who could profit from staying, and Arabs.

    It was kind of screwed up watching bombs fall on us while the people who get the most out of this running conflict were abroad on vacation. So it was poor Jews and Arabs getting killed, not the corrupt scum buckets who run this country like their personal money laundering scam.

    * * *

    Whiskey, part of my point was that men have a problem with obesity. My experience is not typical, and I couldn’t use it to determine that men love fat girls in general. I just tend to limit my activity to people who show a certain level of independence, and I’m feisty but not hostile.

    There is however, a big difference between clinical obesity and visual obesity. Most men don’t start having problems about it until it becomes disfiguring in a way that is not an enhancement.

    I’m sure you’ve seen women who were clinically obese, but not ugly.

    * * *

    Welmer, most Black women would probably find your brother attractive by looks. I don’t know what his personality is like.

    For my personal tastes though, he’s a bit too neat. Maybe that’s his city look and he has a different country look. Some of those easygoing guys can surprise a girl. Remember, I’m an ex boyscouts who hunt kind of chick. If I ever did get my navel pierced, I’d probably ornament the ring with fishing lures.

    You don’t need an extra $200K for me…just something you killed in the freezer that isn’t Gay Asian men, a cast iron pan, and a rock solid soul.

    A kid on his way to that had a crush on me in high school. Problem was he was 5 years younger than me, and even though I agreed to be his girlfriend because it was cute and I knew from his parents that he was going to turn out well, my parents accused me of pedophilia.

    I wasn’t molesting him, but I could see how someone could interpret that as grooming him for molestation, though that wouldn’t have happened until he was at least 17. His parents had no problem with it at all. In fact, after the breakup, his mom looked at me sadly one day and said, “You know, he really loves you.”

    Being kind of sassy, I was like, “He’s only 12. It’s just a crush. He’ll get over it.”

    She looked back at me and said, “I know you’re a good young lady, and that you wouldn’t do anything inappropriate with him, and in 10 years, those 5 years won’t matter.”

    I’m not sure if she was right about that, but I don’t think I ever got over it. I don’t know about him.

    I think a part of me wonders if he decided back then that women are evil, and is reading or maybe writing a PUA site.

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  637. on April 26, 2009 at 10:20 pm GNPs are for Apes

    “GNP’s off-the-cuff discourse but not to have won the internet.”

    For sure. That wiggery faggot posts some stupid survey that says attraction is highly tied to each dollar of income i.e. a man whose income rises from $100K to $110K will immediately do 10% better with women.

    Only an Omega with no concept of Game could think such a thing, which is what ‘anonymous’ is. As others have pointed out before me, this creature is not a straight male.
    Too afraid to even use a handle. Faggot.

    Plus, he/she/it doesn’t even have a grasp of Ebonics grammar (let alone English grammar).

    heh heh heh heh

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  638. @chuck gotcha, so I see Levitt borrowed it a few decades later. thanks

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  639. “and Barack Obama as the Father Coughlin and George Wallace of today”

    Uh, last I heard, Obama doesn’t go around attacking white people all the time.

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  640. on April 26, 2009 at 11:06 pm Comment_Whatever

    The following comments aren’t about race, honest!

    Nicole said:

    If you find yourself drawn to the anti nurturing ideal, which spans the races, this is an indicator of self destructive programming. The masculine with somewhat feminine accents may be more objectively beautiful, since the optimal male form is the superior physical specimine in u