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Washington Post Fembot Tells Cuckold ‘Suck It Up’

A diligent reader emailed me a ‘Beta of the Month’ submission about a guy who fears he may have been cuckolded and who turns to a Washington Post advice columnist for support in his time of need. I read the article and decided that the real value to be gleaned was not in the unearthing of stupefying betatude (after all, at Chateau Heartiste where the better angels of humanity are handcuffed to bedposts and repeatedly gangbanged by their demonic cousins, mewling cuckolds are mere run of the mill betas), but in the reply to the beta chump by Carolyn Hax, a Washington Post Style columnist.

I reprint the column in full along with my remarks, so that you may glimpse the true face of woman.

Here is the original cry of anguish by the man who believes his child is not of his beta loin:

Hi, Carolyn:

I’m writing to you because I don’t know who else to ask. My wife and I have been happily married for six years. We have a beautiful daughter, age 2. For about the past six months I have suspected my daughter isn’t really “mine.” I have never suspected my wife of cheating on me, but for a number of reasons I cannot quiet my suspicions about the baby. I have not confronted my wife because I know that might devastate our marriage. But I have to know. What should I do?

Suspicious

If a man suspects his wife has cuckolded him, the odds of his child not being his rise to 30%. The general nonpaternity rate is around 4%. Low confidence “fathers” are right to be worried. Cuckoldry is serious business because it is the female form of rape.

So by the second sentence I know this guy is a Natural Born Beta. It’s always the guys getting most screwed by their wives who persist in believing they are “happily married” seconds before she’s caught with her boss’s dick in her mouth. Another telltale sign of the beta: If he cajoles tepid sex out of his wife once a month he thinks that is proof the marriage is full of love. If you want to know how well a marriage is doing, don’t look at the husband’s face for hints of marital bliss; look at the wife’s face.

Now we’ll examine the Style columnist’s family counseling advice. You may want to prepare a crucifix and garlic.

Give careful thought, please, to what you “have to” know.

This is going to be good. The first words out of her mouth are a slopbucket of shame aimed straight at… the man.

When just seeking the truth could change your life in dramatic and irreversible ways, it’s best to start not by actually doing something but by inviting each possible truth into your imagination as fact.

What the fuck does she mean here? This is postmodern therapeutic age gibberish squared. Nonsense on stilts. “Invite each possible truth into your imagination as fact”? Screw action, just imagine everything is true. Embrace the female way: Wallow in your psychodrama while getting nothing accomplished. It’s no wonder the newspaper empire is crumbling with the third rate hacks they have writing for them nowadays. I spewed more sensible shit after a 12 hour dorm room pot and Milwaukee’s Best bender.

That way, you can figure out the way you want your life to look before you start saying things you might regret.

Wait, did I miss something, or did Miss Hax Off Your Balls just guilt trip the guy who got cuckolded?

If your life were a physical structure, this would be the “blueprint before sledgehammer” approach.

Translation: If you just take a breather and don’t let your anger and pain get the best of you, you’ll find that life as a beta provider for an alpha’s kid isn’t so bad. Your wife will love you for your measured approach and self-sacrifice, and the most important thing is to keep your wife happy, right? Right? At the very least…

…do it for the children.

If your “number of reasons” points to infidelity, for example, then you need to imagine the worst, and assume your wife did cheat — Imaginary Scenario 1 — and then you need to decide whether you’d want to stay in the marriage or leave.

I’d think the decision would be self-evident, but hey, we’re talking about spineless betas and amoral women here, so everything is up for grabs. Bizzaro America!

If the answer is to stay (Scenario 1a), then you need to ask yourself, is that outcome better served by not digging into the past?

If the guy decides to stay and prove to the world what a pathetic sap he is, then I suppose he deserves the indignity of having his worthlessness as a man rubbed in his face every time his non-kid is in the same room with him. If he’s that low on the self-esteem pole then he might be able sack down and survive eighteen years without once mentioning his wife’s whoring and the kid who doesn’t look anything like him. I can imagine the thoughts going through his head, when years later our protagonist is coaching his daughter’s soccer team: “Wow, she’s so athletic and assertive. And so attractive, too. Maybe it’s for the best that my genes weren’t passed on. Life is beautiful!”

If the answer is to leave (1b), are you ready to challenge your paternity — or have it challenged by your at-that-point-estranged wife?

1b? Is this superfluous numbering system supposed to make her sound scientific? Maybe it’s just my male logic, but if the guy decides to leave the marriage on account of strong evidence — say, oh I dunno, a paternity test — that he is a cuckold, then it wouldn’t much matter if his cheating whore of a wife is estranged from him or challenges what he already challenged.

If, on the other hand, your suspicions are based solely on your child’s appearance, then you need to ask yourself if you’re being irrational; genes are a lot more complicated than the “She has a cleft chin and therefore can’t be mine” parlor games would suggest.

More shame. You starting to notice a pattern? This is what women do when they have nothing left to fall back on but hollow arguments. Fact: Babies look more like their fathers than their mothers. This is an evolutionary adaptation that ensures fathers will stick around to care for the infant. “Cleft chin” red herring notwithstanding, if the guy thinks his kid doesn’t look like him and therefore could be the cable guy’s kid, he’s got a 30% chance of being dreadfully right.

But let’s say instead you have an unshakeable gut instinct that this is someone else’s child. If you’re right, then the percentages would be obviously (and heavily) in favor of infidelity, which loops you back to Scenario 1.

Still, you can’t entirely rule out the rarer than rare, yet not unprecedented, hospital error — Scenario 2 —

She’s flailing.

so you also have to imagine your way through to the conclusion of a different worst-case altogether: If the baby turns out to be neither yours nor your wife’s biological child, would you still love this baby?

Alpha answer: No.
Beta answer: No, but I’ll say yes because it’s what’s expected of me.

Want to raise her?

Alpha answer: Hello, orphanage drop off box!
Beta answer: My wife said she’ll stop giving me biannual handjobs if I don’t say I’ll love the child as if it were my own.

Want to find your biological child and switch?

Style columnist Hax either has a weak grasp of human nature, or a weak grasp of rhetorical devices.

In other words, would it make a difference if this were error vs. deception?

No. If it was a hospital error, then the wife should be equally pleased as her husband to know the truth. Their marriage would remain strong, or at least viable, as they made arrangements with the hospital to find their true baby and swap kids with the other victimized family who mistakenly got their kid.

If it was deception, then their marriage (hopefully, but you can never know for sure with these congenital betas) will dissolve, but the cuckold will have spared himself the humility and genetic metadeath of providing for another man’s legacy with his sweat and tears while his own sad seed withers to dust.

If you decide you’d want this child no matter what, then the question becomes, again, why you’d want to risk everything to scratch even a torturous itch.

Is the idea of robbing a man of eighteen years of his life and a chance to bear and love his own children meaningless to this Style columnist? Here’s an analogy, Miss Hax, you could try wrapping your twisted cancerous soul around: A man getting cuckolded is the moral equivalent of a woman getting secretly implanted with another woman’s fertilized egg, giving birth to it, and raising it for eighteen years.

Is any of this getting through to you? Bitch?

And finally: What if you started digging, wrecked your marriage and learned your daughter is “yours”?

Q-tip swab of the kid’s cheek while the wife is away takes two seconds. He can have the sample tested with no one the wiser. If the kid is his, hey, he can sleep easy at night and feel good about helping his kid with her homework. The proof of his paternity might even motivate him to go down on his wife. If the kid isn’t his, the marriage was wrecked long before he “started digging”.

I urge you to imagine your way down every painful avenue here, best cases as well as worst.

Translation: I urge you to find it in your heart to put aside your doubts for the good of your wife and bastard child.

Then, once you’ve figured out what you can live with emotionally, please, if you’re considering any action at all, have a lawyer vet it legally.

Vet? Vetting is beta. Get the paternity test done before consulting any lawyers, and when you do get a lawyer with test results in hand, make sure your wife doesn’t find out about any of it until you slap her with the divorce papers. You don’t do battle with a whore by playing nice.

Only then can you be confident whether truth-seeking serves your interests — and your family’s — or smashes them to bits.

Shame! It’s what’s for dinner! Gotta love her admonishing a cuckold — the victim, remember? — that he needs to serve his family’s interest along with his own. I guarantee every woman reading this Post article nodded their heads in agreement with the author, and probably quite a few limpwristed faggy SWPL betaboys agreed, too. A better illustration of the second class status of beta males in society — as foretold by our evolutionary heritage — would be hard to find. Women are simply assumed to be moral paragons and Vestal Virgins, and betas are… there to be ransacked.

Give, betas, give till it hurts. And when the hurt begins, don’t bitch and moan about your endless torment. Just keep giving. While you’re paying the last ounce of tribute in self-respect, here’s some porn to keep your senses dulled.

***

Whenever I read articles by women attempting to grapple with the evil of cuckoldry, the impression I am always left with is one of fear. I can smell the fear in their words. It emanates from every ill-conceived shaming maneuver and transparent rationalization. The emptiness of their amoral excuse-mongering is beyond lame.

“If you confront your wife over her cheating your family will shatter.”

If she cheated the family is already shattered.

“You have to suck it up for the good of the child.”

She should have thought of the child’s welfare before spreading wide for the alpha interloper to blast in her pussy.

“What good will come of the truth?”

Good has got nothing to do with it. But justice and dignity do. Not to mention the Darwinian prime directive.

Finally, my favorite of all the cuckoldry excuser tactics:

“Be the GOOD MAN and take one for the team. After all… *wink wink*… it’s not like you’re gonna find another woman.”

To which a man should answer in the only way acceptable: FUUUUUUUCK YOU.

The fear coming from women when the spotlight is on efforts by men to expose cuckoldry is perfectly understandable. Humans fear most the loss of mating power, and the prerogative of women to get impregnated on the sly with an alpha while foisting the bill on a beta is a hardwired preference millions of years old. Any threat to the established order, especially an existential threat as game-changing as DNA paternity testing, will send women into involuntary apoplexies of hair-raising moral myopia. The beastly decrepitude of their animal souls will lay bare for all to see.

Hallmark doesn’t make cards for moments like these.

The first Sexual Apocalypse was heralded by the death song of the following Four Sirens: the Pill, No-Fault Divorce, Economic Gender Egalitarianism, and Misandrist Laws. But a new era is upon us. As I see it, the future of humanity will radically change once again with the coming of the Three Horsemen of the Second Sexual Apocalypse:

Widespread, accurate and accessible paternity testing.
The male Pill.
Realistic sexbots.

Paternity testing alone is enough to alter women’s sexual behavior in a big way. Mandatory paternity testing is already on the docket in some legislatures. There have been hopeful signs of justice being served. It’s not enough to say “Well, only 3-4% of women cuckold their husbands. So really, not much will change.” The impact isn’t in the marginal loss of cuckoldry as a mating strategy, but in the *perception* of loss by *all* women. Even the most faithful, loving wife has the corrupt core of a cheating whore buried deep in her hindbrain. Blasting rays of sunlight on her gnarled, caged id won’t be met with good cheer. I predict very few fertile-age women will be emotionally invested in men’s paternity rights, and in fact most of them will advocate against it. Pussywhipped beta males and opportunistic alpha males sufficiently sequestered from the negative consequences of their decisions will likely defend the women in hopes of short term gain in payment of sexual favors. If you think alpha males of middling resources would vigorously support mandatory paternity testing, remind yourself who benefits the most from cuckoldry.

Here is Miss Hax’s contact info:

Write to Tell Me About It, Style, 1150 15th St. NW, Washington, D.C. 20071, or tellme@washpost.com.

It would be fun if my readers sent her a link to my post under the ruse of fan mail. The goal isn’t to change her mind — no, that will never happen — the goal is to drive a chainsaw through her soul. To make her hurt. To sear her ego with the harsh, ugly truth. Sadism is an exquisite pleasure for those practitioners trained in the art of administering it.

***

A final note: I will play therapist for a moment and give proper counseling to Mr. “Suspicious”:

Q-tip. Swab. Paternity testing clinic. The rest is commentary.

And because I am a gracious and good man of charitable inclination, I also give my tender and supportive counseling to Miss Hax:

“Please, Miss Hax, take a seat on the couch over there. Yes, that’s good. Ok… now… tell me only the bad things that come to mind when you hear the word

C  U  N  T.”

1,048 Responses

  1. Preach it, my man. I cannot tell you how appalled I’ve always been by my (supposedly ethical) female friends’ barely-veiled-yet-brazen endorsement of exactly this kind of female behavior. You’re doing the Lord’s own work.

    Like


  2. Carolyn Hax has always been unintelligible. I tried to read her a few years ago, but I quickly gave up when I realized I had NO IDEA what she was saying. Worthless.

    Like


  3. This guy’s problem isn’t that he’s a beta.

    It’s that he’s a fucking idiot. You think “your” 2-year-old kid isn’t yours, and your first action is to write to a fucking newspaper columnist?

    Like


  4. Wow.

    Its stuff like this that makes me realize I am correct (for the millionth time) in never wanting to get married and to swoop mad amounts of fly girls.

    There is really no other option in life.

    Not like I mind.

    I like swooping tons of fly girls.

    – MPM

    Like


  5. I’m writing to you because I don’t know who else to ask
    friendless

    but for a number of reasons I
    insisted on self denial

    I have not confronted
    fearful

    I am with the women in this one. Guys like this must suffer. And be wiped out from the gene pool.

    Like


  6. It’s just ugly out there. Why don’t we paint the letter “A” on these women anymore?

    Like


  7. My wife and I have been happily married for six years. We have a beautiful daughter, age 2. For about the past six months I have suspected my daughter isn’t really “mine.”

    yeesh. i knew kassyk was cruel, but i never knew she married lol

    Like


  8. Imagine if paternity testing was required at the time of birth. Since fembots control our politics, it’s not very likely.

    Like


  9. on May 12, 2009 at 1:11 pm ironrailsironweights

    Does my wife have the seed of bald-eagle loving david alexander in her?

    Peter

    [editor: we’ve got to make you more interesting. it’s audience appreciation day.]

    Like


  10. Why all the beating around the bush. He should just simply say to her what is on his mind. After a nice conversation where she verbally expresses her affection for him (he DID say they were “happily” married) he could sandwich his question thusly;

    I hear you telling me you love me and it makes me feel so good knowing that, but I’m wondering right now if that kid is actually mine or someone else’s. I think we should schedule a DNA paternity test. By the way, I love you too.

    See? Nice, sweet, simple, to the point, gets the job done.

    Like


  11. P.S. Too bad there’s not a test where a woman can test her husband’s DNA for children produced outside the marriage. Big difference I’m sure as she is not “paying” for them; or is she? Just a different type of payment. A payment called life, time, and trust wasted with lying cheater.

    Like


  12. sara I

    See? Nice, sweet, simple, to the point, gets the job done.

    i prefer Lifetime Channel stuff where one spouse is applauded for burning to death the one that smacks the other one around.

    just think how much more deeeeeee-lish-uss the TV-VL warnings shalll be when Torquemada’s tools are dusted off to punish one guilty of an even worse 18 years of anguished fraud

    Like


  13. Another telltale sign of the beta: If he cajoles tepid sex out of his wife once a month he thinks that is proof the marriage is full of love.

    A proxy for a low sex drive that could be common to all beta males or merely relief that he’s having more sex than his beta friends who get nothing at all?

    “Wow, she’s so athletic and assertive. And so attractive, too. Maybe it’s for the best that my genes weren’t passed on. Life is beautiful!”

    The flip side of that is that if people can’t really tell, then the success of that child is attributed to you, and in theory, you could leverage that to attract other women who may find you attractive. Of course, what I just wrote was basically pointless since it’s the equivalent of using a rented car to attract women. Eventually, your beta ways will reveal all and remove any options for an extra-marital affair. Plus, that presumes she stays around and you’re not plunking money down on child support for her when you barely see her at your court ordered custody meets.

    The fear coming from women when the spotlight is on efforts by men to expose cuckoldry is perfectly understandable.

    As I stated last night, some men are for hugging and other men are for fucking, and I suspect there’s a subconscious operating practice in women that attempts to maximize that situation. Of course, it doesn’t work if the betas know that they’re only useful for hugs and either opt-out entirely or just go the platonic friend route which only gives limited support and resources.

    Like


  14. “I am with the women in this one. Guys like this must suffer. And be wiped out from the gene pool.”

    If he’s a loser (which he is) then she’s the loser who married the loser.

    Whatever way you come at it from, it boils down to social acceptance of the rape of man. Its ethically wrong, no matter how much the man sucks. If he sucks that bad, let him die alone.

    Like


  15. Ha Ha

    Sara I is full of shit.

    Like


  16. i’ll be the devil’s advocate here.

    given that women that cuckold are not shamed anymore, but rather feel “empowered”, and this kind of behaviour towards betas is unlikely to go away until the mexican-islamic order dawns over America,

    option 1: he breaks the marriage. She takes part of his income in alimony. It will be too much for him, but too few for her. The child will get a sub-par infancy. the woman can only re-enter the sexual market as a cougar. The guy can re-enter, but I don’t see THAT many wounded betas getting an alpha conversion after such a massive cuckold.

    option 2: marriage remains. Alpha offspring gets the best education possible. Cheating whore remains with EXACTLY the same sexual options she would get after a divorce. cuckolded beta pays entirely for the child education. And is wiped from the gene pool.

    coldly speaking, divorce hurts woman and child and won’t necessarily benefit the beta. After divorce, it is quite possible that the husband won’t have ANY sex life excluding hookers. How old is he? how much of his income will he keep after alimony? does he still have friends going out?

    people just assume that the cuckolded husband will go from once-a-month-sex to G-manifesto like massive swooping of fly girls.

    Like


  17. on May 12, 2009 at 1:18 pm sara I

    “I hear you telling me you love me and it makes me feel so good knowing that, but I’m wondering right now if that kid is actually mine or someone else’s. I think we should schedule a DNA paternity test. By the way, I love you too.”

    Knowing human nature as I do – the angriness of the woman’s ouburst at that point would be a solid indicator of the test results.

    Like


  18. woman are practical. not in a business-like way, but in what concerns relationships. Practical to the point of forgetting about ethics. Just like any successful businessman will always resort to anti-ethical behaviour given the chance

    the rbeak up of this marriage hurts two of three certainly and doesn’t necessarily benefit the third. the maintainance benefits two of three and is not necessary a worst outcome for the third.

    there is also the bonus-argument, the hitlerian argument, that the gene pool is improved by more alpha offspring.

    Like


  19. on May 12, 2009 at 1:40 pm Cannon's Canon

    “When just seeking the truth could change your life in dramatic and irreversible ways, it’s best to start not by actually doing something but by inviting each possible truth into your imagination as fact.” – Hax

    I’m actually in partial agreement with the author’s female psyche here. I am in the process of employing the same strategy toward the future murders I will commit. I want to make sure that I can face myself confidently and proudly after the fact. So, I try to address myself as a cold-blooded killer to see if I can deal with it (so far, no problems).

    I used the same deliberation process before my first steroids cycle.

    Like


  20. gig: the beta has better chances as he gets older. Furthermore, the simple act of kicking his cuckolding wife to the curb may serve to make him a little less of a little bitch. Obviously, if he’s too chickenshit to do so, he wouldn’t have better prospects outside marriage anyway.

    That said, this strikes me as a situation where damage to the individuals serves society’s best interests. Over the long run, society will be much better off if cuckolding women are ruthlessly shamed and them and their children cut out from the ‘pack’. The man should be encouraged to act like a man in the true sense of the word, not in the be-a-beta-provider sense.

    Like


  21. Over the long run, society will be much better off if cuckolding women are ruthlessly shamed

    Unless mandatory paternity testing is imposed, or Sharia becomes the law of land, as Americans say, this kind of behaviour has ZERO chance of going away.

    Since it won’t go away, individual tragedies won’t add to the common good. They will remain individual tragedies.

    Like


  22. Dont forget artifical wombs Roissy.

    That will be the biggest blow to women of them all, and there are coming, probably in about 20 years.

    When men can pick beautiful, intelligent, college age-women’s eggs, and have a couple of kids on their OWN, that no woman can (via the courts) take away from them, why would any of them settle for an actual wife at all (other than for religious reaons).

    I would think a man would be better off paying for some hot European chick’s eggs, having the 9 month incubator “birth” them at a lab, and enjoy raising his -own- couple of kids while he chases pussy out there openly for the rest of his life.

    Women, basically have this option now. They can just get knocked up, and make some chump pay them child support, and enjoy chasing a variety of men while their kids are still theirs—-and cannot be taken away by the biological fathers.

    When men have the same option, it will truly change out there.

    What really happened between the sexes, happened when the state determined that children BELONG to the mothers, and routinely awarded the mothers custody and child support. I think the state should always award joint custody (kids at one house one week, and the other house the next) IN ALL cases, and NO CHILD SUPPORT (he has them just as much as she does). That would fix most of the unfairness we see in “family” courts.

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  23. Sara I, you bizznich. You take the child our for the afternoon “to give you the day off, honey.” Take it to a doctor in another town that you’ve never seen before and pay cash to him for a genetic test. Get the results mailed to your work/pick up a few days later.

    Or do it at home, but at a Dr.’s office is safer.

    Asking a wife’s permission? Just hand in your balls right there.

    Like


  24. on May 12, 2009 at 1:51 pm Default User

    sara I

    Why all the beating around the bush…

    Stop taunting GNPeter (ironrailsironweights)

    Like


  25. on May 12, 2009 at 1:52 pm ironrailsironweights

    Why all the beating around the bush.

    Do you mean the sweetly trimmed bush often seen on the types of pretty young women i no longer have access to? *sigh*.

    Peter

    [editor: construction ahead.]

    Like


  26. Oh please. This guy is useless as husband and mate. Speaking as the bull from a couple hot-wife/cuck situation (long ago in a galaxy far far away) this guy is almost a poster child.

    He dutifully goes about his business, oblivious to all female signals that his wife is lonely, unhappy and horny as hell, doesn’t stand up to her because he has no backbone, etc etc etc. When hotwife goes on the business trip, her roaming eyes pick up on some tall, dark, handsome male (or the other holy trinity of big brain, big muscles, big cock), then both use the 1000-mile excuse for free-wheeling banging, and since women are most ready to stray at egg-time, viola — little cute girlie baby with double serving of I’m-gonna-fuck genes.

    I bet the odds in this case are 99% that the kid isn’t his. I bet if remembers, there will be a moment about two weeks too late for his baby’s conception where hotwife decided to bang hubby out of style for a few days to cover the stray, and then she conveniently “backdated” the sex at the OB/GYN’s office.

    If he were a real man he would get the damn paternity test and with a positive result in hand prepare the multiple nuke strikes of a crushing divorce proceeding making sure alimony and child support were nil.

    Like


  27. It’s the same in every society that’s ever existed: when women and gay men are given free social reign without condemnation for their actions, the society falls.

    Like


  28. All the cartoons that accompany Caroline Hax’s columns are drawn by HER EX HUSBAND
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carolyn_hax

    …………………..she would definitely know all about betas…..

    Like


  29. sara I, being the womyn she is:

    “Just a different type of payment. A payment called life, time, and trust wasted with lying cheater.”

    -lol. Or a lifetime of hot sex, trying to prevent her man from screwing around yet secretly enjoying the fact that he beds hotter women besides himself yet doesn’t leave her, making her feel worthy.

    If sara’s man went muff diving in 22 year old pussy but came up for air to pay her bills, she ‘d hem and haw publically and then spread her legs nightly just thinking about what other pussy his dick’s been in.

    Hmm, maybe women ARE secretly all lesbians.

    A woman talking about trust being the foundation to a marriage (typical modern pseudo-intellectual nonsense) is always talking about the man *never questioning* her actions, not the other way around.

    Like


  30. Related stories here:

    http://www.reason.com/news/show/29035.html

    http://www.reason.com/news/show/28570.html

    Please not that the power of the State is behind this kind of shit. You will be fucked over, once buy your cheating whore of a wife and again by the State. Forget any sense of justice, that idea is long gone (true justice being something that many would never want to actually confront).

    lurker is correct however, the society in which we live is an increasingly shaky edifice that is actually in the process of collapsing. Free reign has been given to culture destroyers, not culture bearers and creators. We are paying the price. One good thing though is that bloody revenge will be wrought upon those who have put us in this situation. Perhaps even men like the one who wrote this letter will become Men again.

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  31. — Why all the beating around the bush. He should just simply say to her what is on his mind.

    Sara is right. If a husband can’t look at his pregnant wife and joke “you know that if I have my doubts, I’m taking a DNA test?”

    Or look at his little bouncing toddler and joke “is he/she mine? ’cause I don’t run like that. I think I’m getting a DNA test”

    … then it’s like Guns n Roses said:

    What we’ve got here
    Is failure to communicate.

    Is it that damn hard to swing enough of a sac in your marriage to make veiled warnings wrapped in a joke to your wife?

    Why do so many men walk on eggshells with their women? Where’s the damn fear coming from?

    Like


  32. on May 12, 2009 at 2:06 pm Roissy is a Troll

    Roissy calls cheating women female rapists….and yet he won’t codemn the men who sleep with these women. If men would simply stop sleeping with committed women, we wouldn’t have these situations.

    Like


  33. Look at who gets to advise women in our society folks (boy am I gonna catch some shit for this!)

    1) Ann Landers (real name Ester Lederer)
    2) Pauline Phillips (Ann Landers real-life sister, “Popo” Lederer—-

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Landers

    3 Judith Martin (Miss Manners) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judith_Martin

    4 Heloise (Ask Heloise)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heloise_(columnist)

    5 Ruth Westheimer (Dr. Ruth) (Karola Siegel)
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr._Ruth

    6 Carolyn Hax http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carolyn_hax

    What do ALL of these women have in common? Its impolite as all hell to mention it, but why do the gals from one little group get to be the advice columnists in newspapers all across this nation because of syndicated newspapers?

    (told you that it would be impolite) Just pointing out something that is true folks…….sorry.

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  34. Gig

    After divorce, it is quite possible that the husband won’t have ANY sex life excluding hookers.

    Maybe – but necessity is the mother of invention. He’ll re-invent himself, one way or another, if his T level is high enough. Might take a few decades, but whatever it takes is worth it. Living a life of quiet desparation is not living.

    Like


  35. I would like to see paternity testing mandatory in welfare payments from the state. To qualify for welfare, a girl/woman would need to identify the father, as in, “I know who my baby-daddy be.” NO DADDY, NO MONEY. It could transform the welfare culture.

    Like


  36. Makes me want to just kick a bitch! (wait..Where is kick a bitch??)

    People in general don’t want you too see the truth in anything. In this case it would be questioning marriage and or a womens amoral nature.

    In this case the more you are kept ignorant about this topic, the less of a threat you pose to the established, “shut the fuck up beta, and provide” order that has been going on since the dawn of time.

    I still dont get how this man can’t just go up to his women and say what the fuck is on his mind. How ball-less can a man really be?

    Like


  37. Agree – paternity test first, then legal action depending on results. Relocate to the state with the most male-friendly paternity/divorce laws efore filing. On that point – question for this group: anyone happen to know which state that is? Nevada?

    Advice columnists will *always* be biased toward the female point of view. Duh.

    Like


  38. gig

    coldly speaking, divorce hurts woman and child and won’t necessarily benefit the beta.

    What should happen is what happened in this sort of situation in America only a few years ago.

    The cheating woman should get no child support or alimony from the man who’s child it isn’t and who upon learning that doesn’t want to support her. Instead the courts view her conduct (including her deception of her husband for so long about some of such crucial importance, reproduction) with disgust and disdain, and award her very little of her husband’s accumulated savings.

    If anyone is going to have to support her it should be the father of her child, though there too since (presumably) he didn’t provably undertake to do so, the cheating slut and her bastard are on their own.

    This treatment will make this behavior rare again. Instead, while the feminist inspired fairly recently changed family law remains as it is in the Anglosphere, I truly do expect the percentage of cuckolded babies to grow greatly among gen Y there.

    So guys, test paternity at birth. If she doesn’t agree, do it anyway. If you divorce her within a year or two of birth then I think in every state (or certainly the great majority), you wlll not be on the hook for child support.

    Like


  39. gig–

    BTW, I consider murder fully morally justified in a case such as this, if the divorced wife does go after her hoodwinked ex husband for child support that isn’t his.

    I don’t give a rip how agast lefties and most women will be. Tough. Fully justified.

    That’s not the same as saying it’s the wisest course of action for him, though credible threats along that line probably is.

    Like


  40. typical female:
    I would like to see paternity testing mandatory in welfare payments from the state.

    i would like to see mandatory paternity testing for every child born. MPT would remove the discomfort of having to make an emotionally charged choice at a sensitive time.
    but the benefit of avoiding 18 years of slavery is worth it.

    To qualify for welfare, a girl/woman would need to identify the father, as in, “I know who my baby-daddy be.” NO DADDY, NO MONEY. It could transform the welfare culture.

    if you’re willing to take that step, there’s no argument you can make against taking the further step of instituting MPT for all births. after all, the cuckold’s money is just as green as the government’s money.
    and just as ill-gotten.

    Like


  41. Two words. Drew. Peterson.

    Like


  42. “Roissy calls cheating women female rapists….and yet he won’t codemn the men who sleep with these women. If men would simply stop sleeping with committed women, we wouldn’t have these situations.”

    Because its a man’s job to honor a woman’s commitment?

    The only way we should blame men for a woman failing to honor her vows is if women fundamentally lack self control. If that is the case, they should lose all rights and be put back into the kitchen.

    How do you think they would respond to that?

    No, we live in an era where women lay claim to opportunity and free will. Therefore, when they take that free will and do horrible things with it, we lay the blame at their feet.

    Like


  43. @lurker,

    A woman talking about trust being the foundation to a marriage (typical modern pseudo-intellectual nonsense) is always talking about the man *never questioning* her actions, not the other way around.

    A woman, (me), who talks about trust as the foundation of a marriage can enjoy a long-term marriage. Those who can’t trust will be doomed to loneliness.

    Like


  44. on May 12, 2009 at 2:20 pm johnnymarks

    I had a long debate with a female friend of mine the other day about her sister, who after, being married for less than 1 year, has already cheated.

    While my supposedly (at least in her own eyes) moral friend begrudgingly admits that her sister’s cheating was wrong, she added the caveat that “whatever’s wrong in a marriage is never just one person’s fault.” (Hence, of course, shifting the blame in part to the cheated-upon husband.)

    What followed involved a debate over how best the husband should punish her sister (she didn’t enjoy this very much). At first, I admitted (my own begrudging) respect for the Muslims in Pakistan and elsewhere who throw acid in the face of a cheating woman.

    My friend tried to shame me out of this (perhaps rightly) with the argument that “you can’t punish her for life for a one-time event.” Partial agreement from me. (Her sister is quite beautiful, btw.)

    However, for the cases that Roissy describes, of a woman saddling a man with not only genetic metadeath, but also with 18 years of raising some other man’s progeny, I think the acid-facial too weak a punishment.

    My alternative–and I would love to see some cuckolded bastard do this just once to set an example for all women–would involve tying her upside-down and naked, spread-eagled between two trees (posts, etc).

    Then, the jaded ex would shove a funnel into her cheating cunt, and pour a bottle of professional strength liquid drano into her whore-hole until it rotted out her uterus.

    The best part–especially for v. attractive cheaters like my friend’s sister? She could forever bask in the adoring attention of interested men but could never again receive any sexual fulfillment. Her rotted-out pussy would mirror her rotten heart and justice would be served.

    Like


  45. What do you say about bringing back chastity belts?I hear modern updated belts have been brought out somewhere.(I forget where exactly).An ounce of prevention…

    Like


  46. doug

    you just made me remember of a song in portuguese, called “entre a serpente e a estrela” (between the serpent and the star)
    the first verses are like this

    “there is always a shinning knife, whetever love appears
    because no one has a map, for the soul of a woman
    nobody leaves without a bleeding heart, once he tries to uncover
    a marvelous being, between the serpent, and the star”

    I fully agree with your assesment about murder. This is how Western Civilization was built and gained its edge over the rest of the world.

    Like


  47. @roissy ,
    if you’re willing to take that step, there’s no argument you can make against taking the further step of instituting MPT for all births. after all, the cuckold’s money is just as green as the government’s money.

    Big difference. For almost all women, being presumed guilty by the state destroys trust all around. For the welfare mom, finding a genetic daddy is simply a hoop to jump in order to obtain a money gift from the state.

    all analogies are incomplete.

    Like


  48. Hmmm…Interesting…wonder what the take will be on Ayelet Waldman….she wrote a two page article in the NYT basically saying, in a nutshell, despite their four children, her husband dick her is the center of her life. This focus the characteristics of her husband(as described by her.)

    Here is the article.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/27/fashion/27love.html?pagewanted=1

    Like


  49. Roissy is a Troll

    “If men would simply stop sleeping with committed women, we wouldn’t have these situations.”

    That would only happen in a fantasy land.

    It is also not a principle of nature.

    On the other hand, Alphas swooping mad amounts of girls is.

    – MPM

    Like


  50. roissy

    Cuckoldry is serious business because it is the female form of rape.

    It isn’t because it cannot be. You might want to consult a dictionary.

    Alpha answer: No.
    Beta answer: No, but I’ll say yes because it’s what’s expected of me.

    This hardly has anything to do with the alpha/beta dichotomy. You may think it’s important that your child is biologically yours, but not everyone does. Personally, I don’t see what difference it makes. Given the choice, I would rather adopt.

    The G Manifesto

    Wow.

    Its stuff like this that makes me realize I am correct (for the millionth time) in never wanting to get married and to swoop mad amounts of fly girls.

    There is really no other option in life.

    Not like I mind.

    I like swooping tons of fly girls.

    Is it possible that you could take your roleplaying nonsense to a more appropriate venue, like, say, World of Warcraft?

    z

    think the state should always award joint custody (kids at one house one week, and the other house the next) IN ALL cases

    Even in cases where one parent is abusive and incompetent?

    Like


  51. Gig

    the rbeak up of this marriage hurts two of three certainly and doesn’t necessarily benefit the third. the maintainance benefits two of three and is not necessary a worst outcome for the third.

    there is also the bonus-argument, the hitlerian argument, that the gene pool is improved by more alpha offspring.

    Some people choose to adopt, so not all people consider kids as a gene passing on thing. They see legacy as more familial than paternal.

    But as for what benefits the man? If his being cuckolded is any indication of his alpha or beta status, of who wears the pants in his marriage, then he’s best to get out, at all costs. ALL costs.

    As I said, it’s better to be dead than merely alive.

    Like


  52. I’ll add my comment from another column:

    which has more destructive long-term consequences?
    -the state to undermine trust in it’s women, or
    -a tiny percentage of men to be cuckholded?

    Trust is a fundamental nurturing value to society. Everyone wants to be trusted. Presumption of guilt cuts deep. Imagine how you’d feel toward your state if you were presumed guilty, and had to prove your innocence.

    Like


  53. gig:
    i’ll be the devil’s advocate here.

    i’ll be the devil.

    given that women that cuckold are not shamed anymore, but rather feel “empowered”, and this kind of behaviour towards betas is unlikely to go away until the mexican-islamic order dawns over America,

    paternity testing is not the same as ushering in an islamic caliphate.

    option 1: he breaks the marriage. She takes part of his income in alimony.

    this is an example of how far basic moral reasoning has fallen among western men. blame no-fault divorce, SWPL suckassery, and parasitic lawyers for this mess.
    if he breaks the marriage over cuckoldry, she does not deserve ONE RED CENT. in fact, ex-wives do not deserve any alimony at all. but that is a subject for another day.

    It will be too much for him, but too few for her.

    not at all. if the divorce industrial complex were dismantled, he could rightfully walk away from his cheating wife and her bastard child scot-free, with zero obligations and a new lease on life.

    The child will get a sub-par infancy.

    so? a real man couldn’t care less if his ex-wife’s child of another man’s seed were to be exposed on a hilltop to hungry vultures.

    the woman can only re-enter the sexual market as a cougar.

    her body, her choice.

    The guy can re-enter, but I don’t see THAT many wounded betas getting an alpha conversion after such a massive cuckold.

    you are confused. even if such an alpha conversion were not forthcoming, the beta would be able to hold his head high that he is not toiling day and night to reward a whore who came multiple times in orgasmic release with another man on his watch.
    he would be released from a veritable prison to at least have the opportunity, if not the guarantee, of finding another woman who hasn’t betrayed him in the worst way imaginable.

    option 2: marriage remains.

    fool.

    Alpha offspring gets the best education possible.

    what good does this do the cuckold?

    Cheating whore remains with EXACTLY the same sexual options she would get after a divorce.

    not quite. she’s a single mom with a kid. that cuts into cougar clubbing right there. and don’t make the mistake of conflating sexual options with commitment options. a ssingle mom could still have some sexual outlet while suffering badly in the commitment market.

    cuckolded beta pays entirely for the child education.

    it’s quite a thing to live in fear, isn’t it?

    And is wiped from the gene pool.

    good for society? maybe.
    good for him? no.

    coldly speaking, divorce hurts woman and child and won’t necessarily benefit the beta.

    wrong. it will benefit the beta in ways he has yet to comprehend.
    if the whore and bastard suffer, well, like i say…
    she should have thought of that before fucking around.

    After divorce, it is quite possible that the husband won’t have ANY sex life excluding hookers.

    at least he gives himself the chance.

    How old is he? how much of his income will he keep after alimony? does he still have friends going out?

    you could say all the same things about the ex-wife. except for one glaring albatross — he doesn’t have to worry about a kid cutting into his funtime.

    people just assume that the cuckolded husband will go from once-a-month-sex to G-manifesto like massive swooping of fly girls.

    sex is not the crux of the issue, gig. slavery to a whore and her ill-conceived child is the issue. he may not get any more sex than he had in marriage (though that is unlikely as a wife who cheats is a wife who isn’t sexing her husband) but he has spared himself the horror of the cuckold’s fate.
    the freedom alone is worth the marginal odds of slightly more frequent sex staying with his whore.

    Like


  54. on May 12, 2009 at 2:34 pm Kick a Bitch

    Writing the fucking harpy now…

    Like


  55. artifical wombs

    These will never be much of a factor, because:

    1. For a man, a big part of the thrill of having kids is actually having sex with the said hot woman and essentially colonizing her body for nine months. Getting an attractive woman to bear your children is an accomplishment. Yeah baby!
    2. Much as many of us like kids, really we mostly want the wife to do the day to day stuff.

    Like


  56. Anony

    Those who can’t trust will be doomed to loneliness.

    Utter bulshit. Trust has no place in a marriage. Predictability does. You trust her to do what you expect. What she says is irrelevent, entirely.

    Therefore, being a student of human nature, and knowing that all women are deep down devilish whores is essential for any good marriage.

    Trust is for chumps.

    Like


  57. xsplat–

    They see legacy as more familial than paternal.

    They’re wrong.

    Lots of delusions exist. The delusion about the primacy of culture and environment rather than genetics has a lot to do with the openness to adoption that many people have in the West. That delusion is knowingly perpetuated by the left, much of which knows it’s really at least partly false.

    Myself I’d never agree to adopt. Children are enough of a pain and a burden that at least I’d want a genetic immortality out of it, as well as a cultural imprint.

    Like


  58. johnnymarks,

    I know what you mean.

    One of my family members cheated on her husband. After 21 fucking years of marriage, and 3 kids. When asked,why did you do it?

    …Her response,” It was both of our fault.”

    Bitch please..

    Like


  59. Roissy, you sound like a Good Christian Boy who grew up on a steady hypno-diet on the purity and holiness of monogamy, only to be pushed by reality into the very extremes of misogyny. And I say this as guy who would have slapped sense into the whimpering idiot who asked that question. We, men and women, have always been calculating even if these calculations have been folded into the creases of our subconscious.
    We all live within the protective shade of some delusion; religion, a better life around the corner, love. By letting pretty lies perish, you are standing naked in the bitterly cold winds of depressive realism. And what would you accomplish by that?
    Some of us may be disgusted by the thought of nurturing a blood parasite, but the cost of cuckoldry is only one among the many factors we weigh in a marriage. Marriage itself has been a convenient cultural institution offering social mobility or stability, and steady non-sexual companionship through our entertainment impoverished history.
    A beta’s love for the companionship and cultural status as a married provider may outweigh the cost of the cheating whore he’s married to. Why then must he acknowledge the glaring truth of fake paternity, when he can continue to cocoon himself in his six year delusion? Yes, we can still use paternity testing at the very outset (and when possible, right after fertilization) to influence the reproductive calculations women make. What the vague Carolyn is couching in fuzzy sentences is a reminder to weigh all costs. Some guys can handle the truth, and some like this one need it in gentle sugar-coated doses. We humans have always been calculating whores, conveniently promiscuous in all our relations, but you seem to have realized that a bit late and look at world in the starkest possible tones.

    Like


  60. which has more destructive long-term consequences?
    -the state to undermine trust in it’s women, or
    -a tiny percentage of men to be cuckholded?

    There has to be some real basis for that trust. Right now 30-40% of women cheat.

    Like


  61. on May 12, 2009 at 2:39 pm Dr. Grzlickson

    “editor: we’ve got to make you more interesting.”

    Do G-Manifesto and Obsidian too.

    Like


  62. schoolboy

    …Her response,” It was both of our fault.”

    She’s replaying what she’s learned countless times through our entertainment media.

    In contrast, women rarely if ever say the same thing when their husbands, or the husbands of their friends or family members, cheat.

    Then it’s all or certainly overwhelmingly the man’s fault.

    Think about that from examples known to you. It’s not an exaggeration, is it?

    Like


  63. Sara I:
    “A woman, (me), who talks about trust as the foundation of a marriage can enjoy a long-term marriage. Those who can’t trust will be doomed to loneliness.”

    –lmao. You mean you beta-whipped your husband while you sleep around? Yes, I’m sure you’re quite happy. Keep telling yourself that.

    Trust in a marriage is SWPL language, invented out of some disney-movie-haze and has no basis in reality.

    Trust, but verify.

    Anony, with no logic”
    “For almost all women, being presumed guilty by the state destroys trust all around.”
    —lmao rofl. Translation: I am afraid of being caught. Only betas trust women; you’ve been lyign to us since the day you were born, there is no trust.

    “For the welfare mom, finding a genetic daddy is simply a hoop to jump in order to obtain a money gift from the state.”
    —not really. most ghetto whores sleep around constantly—its not just a one time mistake (lol, love how feminists still try to make them “the fallen woman.”)

    Having to force a bunch of shiftless bums to take a paternity test—or, goodness forbird, trying to track down the one rapper you were a groupie for for one night and get him to take one—would be onerous task for every welfare queen. The ones who were worthless whores would end up giving up the kids to adoption, which is probably better than living with a skank mom. See: Rorshach.

    Like


  64. on May 12, 2009 at 2:41 pm Kick a Bitch

    My email:

    Carolyn,

    Do the world a favor and check out the following blog about your May 10th article in which you attempted to shame a cuckolded male into raising another man’s DNA.

    http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/05/12/washington-post-fembot-tells-cuckold-suck-it-up/

    You are a proponent of male-rape. Shame on you…

    haha…. let’s see is she has the balls to face Roissy-poo.

    and Sara, go gargle some nuts in your mouth please…

    note i said “please”.

    Like


  65. Good post Roissy.

    Mandatory Paternity Testing is inevitable. Nothing can stop it, it is the logical next step from The Pill and Abortion. Think about it.

    Moreover, the Maury Show has made Daddy Testing widespread in its existence and usage; everyone knows the procedure, and a quick look through the phone book or Google reveals numerous locations where it can be done. Additionally, there are indeed home test kits available.

    There should be no time limit imposed on the validity of test, since Women are well known to be excellent concealers; the only thing that matters is whether the test results indicate that so and so is or is NOT the father. Period.

    In the case of unwed mommys who approach the State for funding, no fingering the putative dad so he can be tested, no money; and if no dad can be positively ID genetically as the daddy, again, no money. There are (religious) charities out there who can do the job. A little judgment, lecturing and guilt goes a long way in such circumstances. As do orphanages and adoption when proven that the mommy is incapable of raising her baby on her own.

    In a marriage, proof of cuckoldry is a breach of the marital contract and as such is immediate grounds for divorce, removing any and all chances for the wife to receive any form of settlements, support payments and the like. Until the states reflect this sound reasoning, the Man should take all steps necessary to go off the grid and move his money around into impregnable-pardon the pun-tax shelters. Failing that, he should emply what every captain of every ship does-self destruct-get rid of all money and assets, from giving it away to charities, to literally burning it down to the ground, so as to prevent the whore wife from getting *anything*. Besides, a Man can always rebuild.

    MPT costs can easily be bundled into the hospital bills upon birth, fully refundable to the putative father should they be negative; if a father cannot be found, the mother should pay. In the case of welfare, the properly ID daddy should pay, along w/the usual reimbursments for services rendered. In the event the daddy cannot be found, the mommy should pay, and it be deducted from her wages whenever she gets work.

    The feminist arguments abou what’s in the best interest of the child are easily countered. One need not recount them here, but a simple retelling of the many arguments feminists themselves have used to advance everything from single(mom) parenting by choice to Roe v Wade will suffice. Logic would dictate that the same arguments apply here.

    One final thought. Just as Rape is a test of whether Men will come forward, enmasse, to call their own into account, the question of Paternity Fraud is a test of just how humane Women are; will they remain largely silent, even in the face of overwhelming evidence based on the facts of our age? Or will they fight on in their effort to justify the actions of their sisters? Or wil they be noticeably conspicuous in their relative silence?

    Time will tell. Mandatory Daddy Testing, one way or another, is coming, soon.

    O

    Like


  66. “These will never be much of a factor, because:

    1. For a man, a big part of the thrill of having kids is actually having sex with the said hot woman and essentially colonizing her body for nine months. Getting an attractive woman to bear your children is an accomplishment. Yeah baby!
    2. Much as many of us like kids, really we mostly want the wife to do the day to day stuff.”

    If we have artificial wombs, we’ll probably have fairly realistic sex-bots. You aren’t going to combine them into one figure, but it probably wouldn’t matter to most men.

    An artificial womb wouldn’t hurt women much, for the reasons you mention.

    Sex-bots would cause them a lot of problems, but still be manageable in that most beta male providers would still have to settle down with a woman in order to have children.

    Sex-bots and artificial wombs? The bottom would fall out of the beta male provider supply. If the supply of beta male providers drops by even 10%, that would probably have catastrophic affects on the gender power balance, moving from feminism back towards equality or even over to masculism. Women are never going to run out of alpha males willing to fuck them when they are young, but they’re going to find the supply of beta male providers willing to take care of them after 35 suddenly dry up. Shit would hit the fan.

    Like


  67. piece of shit:
    Big difference.

    no.

    For almost all women, being presumed guilty by the state destroys trust all around.

    if that were the case, there would be no need for marriage contracts.

    For the welfare mom, finding a genetic daddy is simply a hoop to jump in order to obtain a money gift from the state.

    and duping a beta provider chump is simply a hoop to jump in order to obtain a money gift from an individual.
    in both cases, the money gift is an ill-gotten gain.

    all analogies are incomplete.

    your morality is incomplete.

    Like


  68. I don’t care what anyone says, Cuckolding IS rape, done to men. Even though women may have used my seed to cuckold other men (through the sperm bank), it is BAD, and I don’t want even my own to be used that way.

    This is why I utterly lost all respect for Chic Noir. This ditz had the gall to say that (wait for it)…

    “Women give up so much when they get married”

    (implying that men give up much less).

    This was one of those times when a single sentence from a commenter immediately disqualifies everything else they say, since they have revealed a warped worldview that is so heavily flawed that it is absurd.

    Women give up more than men by getting married….sheesh.

    Like


  69. Micheal

    Over the long run, society will be much better off if cuckolding women are ruthlessly shamed and them and their children cut out from the ‘pack’.

    You’ve got it backwards. It’s in societies best interest that the genes of the alphas are widely promoted. Society is based on people, and the best people have the best genes. The alphas tend to have the best genes. All animals know that, including female human animals.

    Like


  70. Thursday–

    Right now 30-40% of women cheat.

    Which is a huge increase.

    The media want to say it’s all because women are working outside the home far more than previously. Horseshiit.

    It’s primary because: 1) women are no longer generally scorned and treated with contempt for doing it, but rather often sympathy and rarely clearly disapproving judgment. (At least at the left half or even 2/3 of the spectrum.) Judging is bad!!

    2) It’s due to divorce law changes. Women no longer pay a huge divorce property division and child support / alimony diminution for being proven to have cheated, as they did not long ago. This is huge. People often don’t think so. They’re wrong. It’s not a dollars and cents calculation thing. It’s the lack of economic horror stories as object lessons among her girlfriends.

    Like


  71. anony:

    “which has more destructive long-term consequences?
    -the state to undermine trust in it’s women, or
    -a tiny percentage of men to be cuckholded?”

    —isn’t that just like a SWPLer? Rationalizing cheating and your being a bitch”for the good of everyone?” I feel like I’m in Animal Farm here; men are just Boxer the Horse to these people.

    “Trust is a fundamental nurturing value to society.”
    —lmao. Someone has no idea about history or civilization or how they are formed.

    And if that were true, SWPLer, then you should be against diversity, since it breeds mistrust.

    “Everyone wants to be trusted.”
    —so they can fuck with everyone

    “Presumption of guilt cuts deep.”
    —for a woman, because they are always guilty.

    “Imagine how you’d feel toward your state if you were presumed guilty, and had to prove your innocence.”
    —so pay up for the cable guy’s child, kid!

    Down, down we go….

    Like


  72. “What the vague Carolyn is couching in fuzzy sentences is a reminder to weigh all costs. Some guys can handle the truth, and some like this one need it in gentle sugar-coated doses.”

    “gentle, sugar coated doses?”

    i.e when she’s good and ready to tell the man after years of extortion or never at all!

    The Turth shall set you free. A bucket of cold water across the face, a smack across the mouth and a foot up your ass. Stop peddling the modern, therapeutic bullshit, please.

    Like


  73. johnnymarks

    At first, I admitted (my own begrudging) respect for the Muslims in Pakistan and elsewhere who throw acid in the face of a cheating woman.

    My alternative–and I would love to see some cuckolded bastard do this just once to set an example for all women–would involve tying her upside-down and naked, spread-eagled between two trees (posts, etc).

    Then, the jaded ex would shove a funnel into her cheating cunt, and pour a bottle of professional strength liquid drano into her whore-hole until it rotted out her uterus.

    I sincerely hope you are hit by a bus as soon as possible, you fucking oxygen thief. I’m guessing you you also give your “begrudging respect” to Muslims who throw acid on the faces of girls and women who dress “immodestly” or go to school.

    I predict that I’ll be the only male here who has anything against johnnymarks’ post. Despite any claims to the contrary they may make, anti-feminists are violently misogynistic and about the only thing preventing them from committing rape or murder is fear of punishment.

    The G Manifesto

    That would only happen in a fantasy land.

    It is also not a principle of nature.

    On the other hand, Alphas swooping mad amounts of girls is.

    You can choose to not get involved with married people. Nature has nothing to do with it.

    Like


  74. All-

    Actually guys, here’s a test for you. All you who are aspiring to alphadom.

    You’re having a talk with your fiancé about the prenup your lawyer is drawing up.

    **********

    Aspiring to be Alpha: Of course there will be a paternity testing clause, just to set our minds completely at rest. It’s silly, really, but many things are.

    Lovelygoodgirl: Really? For ME? Don’t you trust me? I’m crazy about you. Now I’m upset. That’s horrible. I thought you loved me.

    AA: You know I love you gorgeous. But as a wise man once said, “trust but verify”. Really, it’s nothing. Just a pin prick or even a cotton swab. Routine.

    LGG: But it still means you don’t completely love me.

    Here’s where the having stones or not test comes in:

    AA: Actually sweety, it’s for your benefit more than mine.

    LGG: What do you mean? How?

    AA: Well first of all it will be yet another incentive, beyond all my awesomeness, to not even consider strying when seven year itch time rolls around.

    LGG: That’s stupid. I never would.

    AA: I know hottie, but there’s more. I would save you from me having to kill you, if you did make a horrible mistake. Yeah. I mean if you regretted it but kept it from me, and I found out from medical tests or something when your kid but not mine was six or something. Where you could actually get child support from me under our horrific feminist child support laws. Then I’d have to kill you. And would.

    LGG: [Stunned silence.] You’d really kill me?

    AA: Yes. If you ever did that to me I would. Otherwise I’d protect you with my life.

    ************

    OK, which of you would say that to your intended?

    If not, why not?

    Like


  75. @xsplat,
    interesting that you didn’t address the subsequent loneliness. So, you don’t deny it.

    Like


  76. and yet he won’t codemn the men who sleep with these women. If men would simply stop sleeping with committed women, we wouldn’t have these situations.

    And I condemn neither. Neither is “guilty”. I have fucked married women, and will continue to do so. I’ve been cheated on, and expect more off that. It’s neither right nor wrong.

    If I don’t want to be cheated on, then it’s up to ME, and only ME to take steps to avoid that.

    And again – knowing that women are devilish whores is an essential first step in avoiding being cheated on. It is in their nature. Say it ten times, and another ten, and again, until you can face this.

    NO woman is not a cheating devilish whore. Not one.

    It is not condemning a woman to know her nature. It is knowing them.

    Like


  77. “Mandatory Paternity Testing is inevitable.”

    —O, I’m not so sure.

    Feminists have fought mail order brides, dating teenage girls through age of consent laws and societal “shaming” for dating outside the age bracket for young girls (allowing the girls to develop their manipulative game before being exposed to experienced men and while experiencing innocent men), common sense divorce laws (men always pay), rights over children (abortion, custody), and for affirmative action for women—–think they can’t find some half-assed argument against this that will be pushed down girls throats in the Universities and to the Lesbian Hordes?

    It’s already starting, with this bullshit abut “trust being the foundation of marriage” you’re seeing here and in Hollywood movies. They;ve already got their Jessical Valenti hats on.

    Roissy, mandatory testing would be ideal, and should be required. I fear it won’t come about because of lying bitches like Hax and Sara I and anony.

    Like


  78. @Thursday,
    There has to be some real basis for that trust. Right now 30-40% of women cheat.

    but (to believe the data presented here) only 3% babies have misappropriated paternity. I don’t believe its that high, but will stay with the blog line.

    Like


  79. Obsidian asked :

    will they remain largely silent, even in the face of overwhelming evidence based on the facts of our age?

    In a word, yes.

    Women are far less constrained my morals, decency, and fairness than men. Women are far more comfortable with gaping hypocrisy.

    This is why feminism failed. It need not have failed, but this is why it did.

    That is why paternal societies are better – as when men hold the cars, they, on average, will treat most women well. When women hold the power, they are guaranteed to abuse it far more widely. Sure, the media fixate on ‘bad men and female victims’, but on balance, when men hold the power, they are more benevolent towards the opposite than when women hold the power.

    Now, a medical question :

    Exactly how is Paternity Testing done? Can’t the father simply take the kid to the hospital, find out for sure, and then plan his course of action over a period of months(hiding/donating/spending assets, quitting his job/moving to a friendly divorce jurisdiction, and then divorce?). Do they test off of blood, or just saliva? If the latter, the father doesn’t even need to take the kid to the hospital.

    Like


  80. lurker

    Sara I, you bizznich. You take the child our for the afternoon “to give you the day off, honey.” Take it to a doctor in another town that you’ve never seen before and pay cash to him for a genetic test. Get the results mailed to your work/pick up a few days later.

    That’s probably what I would do. Fuck it. I would tell her after the fact. Look honey, I love you, but I don’t trust you, so this is what I did. Sorry! Seriously, if you have suspicions, voice them, act on them, but just DO something…. or stop being suspicious.

    It’s not the end of the world if the kid IS his or is not. Is it? Or is it? No. It’s not. It might FEEL like the end of the world, if she’s not, but eventually he will realize that his wife is only human and flawed at that, just like HE is. Only he’s flawed or delusional in other ways. It’s that ego shattering thing we talked about earlier. Relationships have a way of shattering our egos, if we let them. I’m talking about having a healthy ego; not one that’s too strong or weak.

    Like


  81. Artificial wombs will be a great boon…mostly to gay men and career women who don’t want to bother with the physical hardships of pregnancies. But most men don’t want to have kids by themselves, because kids are a huge amount of work. You will have no time to “swoop” other women, because you will be at home giving your kids baths, checking on homwork, or attending parent-teacher conferences. Most men would rather avoid the day to day drudgery of it all, which is how marriage proably came about in the first place.

    Like


  82. anony:

    “the subsequent loneliness”
    –of being separated from a cheating whore? that’s why they invented prostitutes.

    Or her lonliness? She’s not lonly. So long as a woman has a man to fret about, she is completely occupied. Betas aren’t frettable.

    Like


  83. “Look honey, I love you, but I don’t trust you, so this is what I did. Sorry!”

    —Nope. the only time she’d hear about is if the test was positive. Then she gets an earful from my lawyer.

    If not, she gets to be free. For now.

    Like


  84. Doug1:
    “Think about that from examples known to you. It’s not an exaggeration, is it?”

    No, it isn’t.

    On a lighter note, roissy’s minions remind me of the space monkeys in Project Mayhem.

    Its all for the greater good.

    Like


  85. Anony, you stupid bitch – wtf are you talking about?

    I haven’t been lonely in years. You don’t have to live in a fantasy land in order to have love and companionship.

    I love imperfect people, not fairy tale Cinderellas and Prince Charmings.

    I hate hate hate with a vengeance and despise good people.

    Hate them.

    Got it?

    Like


  86. on May 12, 2009 at 2:55 pm It's my first day

    contrarian is clearly that TokyoJesusFist clown who was posting here a lot earlier this year but seems to have taken a bit of a hiatus (until now).

    Like


  87. Xsplat,
    The question isn’t who has the best genes; that is irrelevant. The issue, as Roissy has rightly noted, is the *ill gotten gain* the Woman gets from another party, deliberately kept in the dark about the whole thing.

    That is the issue. And that is why MPT can clear the air once and for all.

    No one is trying to prevent a Woman from getting the best genes possible. What we are taking issue with is the way many have gone about it.

    O

    Like


  88. cuckolded beta pays entirely for the child education

    There’s a decent chance that the child might actually love the father. Mind you, that’s the equivalent of offering $25 as replacement when somebody lost $100.

    coldly speaking, divorce hurts woman and child and won’t necessarily benefit the beta. After divorce, it is quite possible that the husband won’t have ANY sex life excluding hookers. How old is he? how much of his income will he keep after alimony? does he still have friends going out?

    Admittedly, that’s the dilemma. I’d certainly understand why a husband would want to divorce after finding out his wife is a cheater who saddled him with a kid that isn’t his, but for all intents and purposes, a mental auditing of what being an “ex-husband” is like may make some men put up with the situation. Yes, game can make him attractive to women after divorce, but it’s not the same as being a twenty-five year old man unencumbered by the repercussions of divorce.

    Fun Question: Would be cheaper and easier to have the guy learn game and use it in his broken marriage, or is it merely too late with his fate as beta provider/platonic friend cemented in the eyes of his wife?

    Why do so many men walk on eggshells with their women? Where’s the damn fear coming from?

    It’s a weird generational effect, IMHO. A lot of guys grew up watching their parents argue, and a lot of them just want to avoid that problem by simply avoiding angering their wives. Thus, the presence of no arguing and doing what your wife wants is the sign of a good marriage.

    Like


  89. lurker wrote :

    Feminists have fought mail order brides, dating teenage girls through age of consent laws and societal “shaming” for dating outside the age bracket for young girls

    Yes, but they have not been able to shut down strip clubs. This shows that feminists are powerless against the organized desire/will of men.

    The problem is, most men are still too slow-witted to realize the passive, incremental slavery they are being put under. Men even vote less then women.

    There are ‘Tea-Parties’ to protest taxes. Why not the same to protest feminism?

    THAT is the solution. And yes, the movement needs to rope in traditional-values women (Sarah Palin types), AND the Islamic-American community. THEN, action may take place.

    Like


  90. xsplat:

    Its only in society’s best interest to promote the genes that benefit the society. Alpha males, as defined by society right now, do NOT have those genes. Unfortunately, our busted-ass civilization promotes men who are stupid, useless, but sufficiently testosterone-laden to tell society to fuck itself as alpha males. Society benefits from promoting genes for intelligence, honesty, and dedication, not stupidity, duplicity, and anti-social behavior, all of which get promoted by the fucked up system right now over those more traditional values.

    What you’re missing out on is that the best genes do not determine alpha-hood in the modern society. Instead, the right combination of genes to display dominance in the current busted system determines alpha-hood. An example of that is the typical snot-nosed rebel thug. In modern society he is rewarded. In pretty much any society prior to todays, the villagers gang up on him and kill his ass.

    Like


  91. “It’s not the end of the world if the kid IS his or is not. Is it? Or is it? No. It’s not.”
    —lol. Because the womyn’s genetic material has gone on while she raped a man, all is ok.

    ” he will realize that his wife is only human and flawed at that, just like HE is.”
    —lmao rofl. When a man cheats, he’s evil. When a woman cheats, its because she’s human.

    Or a lying filthy whore trying to make him pay and care for a bastard alpha child.

    “It’s that ego shattering thing we talked about earlier.”
    —You mean you preached about while we men, who use logic, ignored you.

    “Relationships have a way of shattering our egos, if we let them.”
    —bastard children shatter bank accounts and genetic material, not to mention time wasted.

    “I’m talking about having a healthy ego; not one that’s too strong or weak.”
    —lol. Women would take being a whore as havign a “healthy ego” and completely ignore facts.

    Like


  92. but (to believe the data presented here) only 3% babies have misappropriated paternity.

    I’ve heard that in the U.K. the figure is roughly 11%.

    Like


  93. —“Women give up so much when they get married”

    (implying that men give up much less).

    This was one of those times when a single sentence from a commenter immediately disqualifies everything else they say, since they have revealed a warped worldview that is so heavily flawed that it is absurd.

    Women give up more than men by getting married….sheesh.—

    She’s a fucking idiot, so what do you expect? Women, could you know, not get married, but that’s too easy, I suppose. They are always the victim, no matter what. In reality, women seem to be metally deranged to a certain extent, but no shock there. The sooner people figure out that the female mind is a rather unsettled place full of contradictions, the better.

    Like


  94. I have a Modest Proposal:

    Since women get to murder children without anyone being able to stop them—not even the pruported father—in abortion—

    If a man finds out a child is not his, but had been told it was by the woman or assumed it was because they were married—

    Man gets the right to murder the child at any time before the child turns 18. Not even the mother can stop him.

    Fair is fair.

    Like


  95. —“It’s not the end of the world if the kid IS his or is not. Is it? Or is it? No. It’s not. It might FEEL like the end of the world, if she’s not, but eventually he will realize that his wife is only human and flawed at that, just like HE is. Only he’s flawed or delusional in other ways. It’s that ego shattering thing we talked about earlier. Relationships have a way of shattering our egos, if we let them. I’m talking about having a healthy ego; not one that’s too strong or weak.”—

    Heard this one before…We all make mistakes, honey, that’s just the way things are…We’re both to blame….We’re only human, it isn’t the end of the world….

    That’s the sound of fear that the gravy train is coming off the tracks….More effort into CYA!

    Like


  96. “Women give up more than men by getting married.”

    –She’s right

    They give up having sex with their husband.

    They give up taking care of their disgusting bloated bodies.

    They give up supporting themselves.

    They give up housework (feminism!).

    They give up not cheating on a man.

    They give up letting the man make any decisions.

    They give up not ripping a man’s soul to shreds.

    Why, women give up everything!

    Like


  97. women are simply enjoying and prospering from the societal Double Standard set up for them by the diligent work of their fugly predecessors and emasculated Alan Alda Betas

    ‘Baldas’ – i tells ya

    Like


  98. Micheal, I’m not sure if women on the whole are not the best judges of the best source of parentage. One would imagine that they would be genetically, not socially, programmed to be adept at this.

    Your criteria may not be evolutions criteria.

    I get your point, but suspect that women also get it, and are highly evolved to make sex-mate choices.

    Like


  99. Sara–

    That’s probably what I would do. Fuck it. I would tell her after the fact. Look honey, I love you, but I don’t trust you, so this is what I did. Sorry! Seriously, if you have suspicions, voice them, act on them, but just DO something…. or stop being suspicious.

    Yes. Exactly. What I’d do if I didn’t already have an agreement (which I would) and hadn’t gotten her to agree (which would be a huge red flag).

    It’s not the end of the world if the kid IS his or is not. Is it? Or is it? No. It’s not.

    It wouldn’t be the end of the world to me, no. My self esteem would survive just fine. The marriage would not. I will not pay child support for a child that isn’t mine, period, end of story. That’s me.

    BTW, I wouldn’t necessarily leave a wife for her cheating on me to a limited degree, if she stopped completely and truly regretted it, and was desperate to preserve and regain the relationship. (But don’t tell her that.) She’d have to be willing to go through the ringer for quite awhile though, the way virtually all American women put their husbands through it if they cheat, and she doesn’t simply tear the marriage up irrevocably right there (as our culture now greatly pressures wives to do, starting with her girlfriends).

    Now is the world better for having some men that can remain in a cuckolded relationship and raise another man’s child that they were hoodwinked about for an extended period? Maybe so. I won’t be him though. No way no how.

    Like


  100. Tood:

    “This shows that feminists are powerless against the organized desire/will of men.”
    —Well, for one thing, those enterprises are run by criminal enterprises/shady guys—alphas who if a woman steps up and bitches at them, they smack them down. Prostitution falls into the same category.

    So long as money can be made on the edge of legality, an alpha will make it, fuck the woman.

    To wrap their pretty little heads around it, women try to pretend being s tripper/hooker is somehow a “choice” and “empowering” and not the result of being molested as a child or growing up without a Dad.

    Like


  101. Maurice

    Advice columnists will *always* be biased toward the female point of view. Duh.

    Ya, and future Oprah Winfreys will be female. Duh. Advice colums are mostly read by women. It’s the Oprah venue of print.

    Like


  102. David Alexander asked :

    Would be cheaper and easier to have the guy learn game and use it in his broken marriage,

    Learning Game isn’t THAT easy, and can’t really be done in an emergency time-pressure situation.

    Also, learning Game requires a lot of approaches to other women, to practice on (even for LTR Game). This is hard to do in a marriage.

    The only solution is to FIRST get Game, practice on a lot of women, use Game to persuade a suitable women (in both looks and income) into a pre-nup, then use LTR Game post-marriage.

    Learning Game when you are already drifting into divorce is just not possible.

    Like


  103. doug1, man up. Once a woman cheats, she will do it again.

    A man sows his wild oats but tires–he will not always cheat.

    A woman will continually be a whore long after she gets any pleasure from it, merely because she enjoys fucking another man over.

    Like


  104. piece of shit:
    I’ll add my comment from another column:

    braced for illumination, i am.

    which has more destructive long-term consequences?
    -the state to undermine trust in it’s women, or
    -a tiny percentage of men to be cuckholded?

    irrelevant. since i am a believer in individual rights and freedom from slavery, i fall squarely on the side of the angels — that is, the individuals who might suffer the unkindest cut of wifely betrayal.
    that the state may have an interest in keeping cuckolds in the dark about their bastard children and their lifelong slavery to the state via marriage contract does not surprise me in the least.

    Trust is a fundamental nurturing value to society.

    “trust but verify”

    Everyone wants to be trusted.

    especially liars.

    Presumption of guilt cuts deep.

    only if you’re guilty.

    Imagine how you’d feel toward your state if you were presumed guilty, and had to prove your innocence.

    bad analogy. the wife is not required to prove anything. the DNA testing does that for her.

    anony you are a vile piece of shit. a cunt. you have just laid your wretched soul out in all its putrid rot. in so doing, you have earned my illimitable contempt. from this point onward, i will shit down your virtual throat until you are choking on my words in your worst nightmares.

    nighty night, bitch.

    ps i find it funny how all these women are suddenly coming out of the woodwork with faux concern about the loneliness that betas might suffer if they leave a cheating wife for the open market.
    where was that concern when it was needed most?

    Like


  105. Obsidian

    The question isn’t who has the best genes; that is irrelevant.

    There you go thinking in terms of right and wrong again. As if what we really need to do, first and foremost, is to assign blame.

    Blame has nothing to do with it. Right and wrong is useless commentary.

    The only thing that matters is pragmatism. What to do.

    Men and women have different agendas. Neither is right, nor wrong. Right and wrong is a linguistic human social concept. The man has an agenda. He can take steps to promote his agenda. Blame and shame can work for him, but on the whole, there is no blame and shame.

    Like


  106. I won’t be him though. No way no how.

    Indirectly, as taxpayers, we all are, unfortunately. Some women pay taxes too, but income tax is disproportionally paid by men.

    Like


  107. —ps i find it funny how all these women are suddenly coming out of the woodwork with faux concern about the loneliness that betas might suffer if they leave a cheating wife for the open market.
    where was that concern when it was needed most?—

    Like I said, the Gravy Train won’t pull into that station anymore. Parasites need a host…

    Like


  108. xsplat–

    I’ve heard that in the U.K. the figure is roughly 11%.

    There’s lots of misinforation floating around about this. A lot of that stems from lousy population samples.

    Specifically, if one simply surveys paternity testing labs, one is going to get truly alarming but very skewed results. That’s because the overwhelming majority of paternity tests are done in circumstances where the mother and/or purported father are seriously in doubt as to the true paternity. In those cases about 30% of the time the initially named father is not the bio dad.

    In cases of high paternity confidence in the UK and US the numbers for non paternity (cuckolding) have come in around the 3-4% range.

    Some have calculated that the BLENDED percentage might be around 10% — i.e. that could be the percentage of all men claimed by mothers to be the fathers, who are not. (I have no idea how good this estimation is or isn’t.)

    This all comes from GNXP write ups and links from several years ago.

    Like


  109. with faux concern about the loneliness that betas might suffer if they leave a cheating wife for the open market.
    where was that concern when it was needed most?

    Bingo.

    I think these women are worried that the divorced Beta might learn Game. Remember that the best students of Game are often those who hit excruciating, rock bottom misery in the past.

    I will go so far as to say that SWPL American women are very un-American. They are anti-freedom, pro-slavery, and anti-individual responsibility.

    Like


  110. Lurker,
    Recall the Gipper’s all time best quote: Trust, but Verify.

    Its really that simple, and you can tell if a Woman is really yours just by how she responds to such a suggestion of paternity testing. Both of mine have no problem with it whatsoever, in fact the Nurse offered it just so the record was clear. I didn’t even have to ask her.

    I tell guys all the time, you gotta get a Ride or Die chick. One who’s down with you till the end. And they are out there. Just gotta know what to look for, etc.

    O

    Like


  111. Tood–

    Indirectly, as taxpayers, we all are, unfortunately.

    I agree. I’m very much in favor of mandatory and automatic paternity testing. If a man then decides to live with and help bring up and support a kid that isn’t his, that’s his decision.

    I’m against welfare for any extended period also.

    Think of how much would change if the default marriage contract enforced by the state was that upon dissolution of marriage no child support would be mandated by the state and each spouse would divide the marital assets in proportion to their earnings.

    Unfair to mothers many will scream. Horrible for children!!!

    Actually, it would lead to far fewer divorces, 70% of which are initiated by women, and nearly all of them in marriages with infants or young children. It would also lead many women to be more careful about who they marry.

    Female infidelity and bearing of other men’s children in marriage would go WAY down. Infidelity used to be way lower in fact.

    Under current law and culture, look for cuckolded babies to go way up soon. The percentages I cited are basically for boomers and to some extent gen x, not gen Y.

    Like


  112. Artificial wombs will be a great boon

    I hate all this talk about fictitious ‘artificial wombs’.

    Not. Gonna. Happen in the next 25 years.

    It pretty cheap to get a surrogate mother in India or somewhere.

    In terms of anti-feminist technology, the soonest/most likely will be 3-D/VR/Holographic porn with tactile interfaces. A distant second would come sexbots. ‘Artificial wombs’ would be far harder and later.

    Like


  113. “Micheal, I’m not sure if women on the whole are not the best judges of the best source of parentage. One would imagine that they would be genetically, not socially, programmed to be adept at this.

    Your criteria may not be evolutions criteria.

    I get your point, but suspect that women also get it, and are highly evolved to make sex-mate choices.”

    You give women a lot more credit than they deserve. Women respond to dominance, pure and simple. In nature, and in MOST societies, that works just fine; the best genes tend to rise to the top, and when an asshole pretends to have top genes and be dominant even though he provides nothing to the society, he gets his ass beat like a bitch. Women who get fooled by “fakers” get ostracized, and they and their bastard children are cast out from the society.

    None of that works any more in our modern feminist, equality-obsessed society. Would even half of the bullshit that black men get away with nowadays be allowed in traditional societies? They’d get shot or lynched or something else. Women who were stupid enough to have children with those men would not find another man, they’d be ostracized. Same for a number of other behaviors: I remember hearing that Britain has the highest crime rate in its history right now, because being a thug is now acceptable there. 18th century Britain, being a thug got you dead. It cuts across all races: being a stupid douchebag is now acceptable because of the restrictions against punishing stupid douchebags. And being a dumb woman who gets a bastard child with a stupid douchebag, while not exactly condoned, does not have the enormous repercussions it had 300 years ago.

    When we took the law and justice away from the people and started punishing people for ‘racism’, ‘sexism’, and any form of protecting their interests through force, we gave the scum of society free reign to do as they wish. Then we proceeded to hurt the men who have something to lose by having children. The men who have the least to lose by fathering bastard children are the men who are too stupid to actually make anything of themselves.

    There are plenty of dominant, valuable males in the world who benefit society very much. The world should be filled with tiny Bill Gates and Richard Bransons, but I would guess that there are thousands of worthless thugs who each have more children than almost any valuable man in the world. How many children does Roissy have? The system is designed right now to punish valuable men for having children.

    Like


  114. Roissy, excellent.

    Obsidian, that is true, I will always do it, but I don’t think we’ll get it into law.

    Like


  115. Maurice: Advice columnists will *always* be biased toward the female point of view. Duh.

    Xsplat: Ya, and future Oprah Winfreys will be female. Duh. Advice colums are mostly read by women. It’s the Oprah venue of print.

    Yes, but we should return to a culture where woman are ashamed to say such things to each other, or even a little afraid, if men should be listening in.

    Like


  116. What kind of a fucking idiot gets married in twenty-first century America?

    Sheep get sheared.

    Like


  117. Tood

    I will go so far as to say that SWPL American women are very un-American. They are anti-freedom, pro-slavery, and anti-individual responsibility.

    Cosider it as women following a sex biased agenda. Consider it to have always been and to forever remain, as long as we have similar genes as to today.

    All this moral talk is boring. There is no universal morality. There is only agendas.

    Like


  118. I have noticed that women don’t really mind being exposed as parasites, hypocrites, etc. At least in this day and age.

    Plea to Islamic Leaders : Faster, please.

    Like


  119. on May 12, 2009 at 3:28 pm Howard Roark

    I have a friend whose “father” has a fat little face and black hair, and whose mother is a skinny Irish whelp with scraggly reddish hair. They are divorced. My friend, on the other hand, has piercing blue eyes, a strong jaw and dirty blond hair – one of the best-looking guys I know. I personally believe, with no other evidence, that his father was horribly cuckolded. And maybe the father even knows it, but they never told my friend. Further, the mother is now re-married to a MUCH-older doctor and lives in a palace, works sporadically. Cannot figure out how she has pulled it off all these years. I have a powerful urge to interrogate this woman, but how can I? She has a strange, furtive demeanor, too. Never looks at you when you speak to her. I truly believe she has been living with this filthy little secret for years, and that it weighs on her soul.

    Like


  120. Yeah, my friend (who is Muslim) told me I’d probably be best off with a Muslim girl, since they’re the only ones who actually keep their morality—even if it is on pain of death. Sadly, the Catholic ones are Catholic in name only.

    Bhetti, my love, are you listening?

    Like


  121. Doug

    Yes, but we should return to a culture where woman are ashamed to say such things to each other, or even a little afraid, if men should be listening in.

    I respectully disagree on this point, Doug. Although I understand and commend the valid view. I think men have powers other than blame and shame and morality to use to assure appropriate behaviour from mates.

    Blame and shame and social conditioning are, in my malnourished view, not nearly as strong forces as people assume. Teens fuck and will always fuck, and no social conditioning has ever stopped them from fucking.

    Women will always gossip with other women – not with men. They have their own social powers, indipendent of men. Always have, always will. Makes no never mind. A strong man can own his woman.

    Like


  122. Lurker

    Yeah, my friend (who is Muslim) told me I’d probably be best off with a Muslim girl

    That’s a load. My current GF is Muslim. And my other current one is also. Girls are girls are girls are girls are girls.

    Like


  123. xsplat, perhaps, but growing up in a household can keep a girl straight or loose depending. Catholic girls once weren’t so easy, due to heavy church indoctrination and parental involvement. Currently, Muslim girls are the only ones who have that kind of force upon them

    Like


  124. on May 12, 2009 at 3:37 pm Days of Broken Arrows

    I think it’s more like 10 percent of women who lie about paternity. I wish I could find that stat. I remember seeing it in an article years ago. I would double check the 4 percent figure.

    Like


  125. Micheal, I just don’t see this “system” that you are talking about, nor do I see wide differences among traditional, versus modern cultures.

    I’m living in Indonesia, which is about as traditional as you’ll ever find. Women here are extremely materialistic, and highly favor alphas. There is plenty of cheating going on. Plenty.

    I doubt the cultures you dream of have ever or will ever exist.

    Like


  126. It’s probably 30% of women cheat, but only 5-10% bear a cuckolded child; the others either don’t get pregnant or luckily sleep with their husband and get pregnant by him.

    Like


  127. Lurker, the say that overly restrictive parenting makes for overly unrestrictive behaviour in teens.

    There is not and has never been a system that restricts sexual behavior. Sexual behavior can not and has never been restricted.

    The best you can do is to physically keep the women under constant watch. Anything less is hopefull. Nothing but hopefull.

    I don’t care how religious a girl is – I can fuck her.

    Like


  128. There is plenty of cheating going on. Plenty.

    I agree. In India, there was very little cheating, until the proliferation of :

    1) Cellphones
    2) Internet
    3) Cable TV with soap operas that glorify cheating.

    1) makes it 10 times easier to sneak around relative to when a household shared a single landline. 2) makes it easier to meet people. 3) changes the value system.

    Divorce LAWS in India have not changed yet (there is not asset division or alimony), so divorce rates are low (but rising).

    But there are other screwed up laws. For example, an accusation (even if false) of dowry extortion can get the husband AND his parents tossed into jail, until the court date.

    Like


  129. @Roissy,
    although I enjoy your hypertensive histrionics, I fear it interferes with your comprehension.
    -my concern is for the loneliness of men who can not trust (ie. Roissy’s campfire here), not for betas.
    -I share your contempt of cheating and cuckholding women
    -MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence; a toxic presumption. DNA testing may be easy, but mandating it would destroy trust of women by the state.
    -“trust but verify” really means “no trust” in the context of an intimate long-term commitment.
    -I, and I suspect most women, would support a cuckholded beta to demand recompense for misappropriated paternity.

    Like


  130. MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence

    In many states AIDS tests are mandatory or “highly encouraged” for pregnant women. Does this presume crack-whoredom for every soccer mom with a belly who reports for prenatal care?

    Like


  131. on May 12, 2009 at 3:48 pm johnnymarks

    I forgot one thing in my post about “punishing a cuckolding wife” above.

    The husband has a DUTY to kill the offspring that is not his as part of the punishment to his cheating whore of a wife. (Preferably, committing this action right in front of her.)

    Like


  132. Their marriage would remain strong, or at least viable, as they made arrangements with the hospital to find their true baby and swap kids with the other victimized family who mistakenly got their kid.
    Uh this could present a problem. IIRC, there was a case a few years ago where this very thing happened to a family and one family didn’t want to switch babies. That’s the thing about parents bonding to children. There was also another family who had a child, mother blond, dad haired, their son who had the dark coloring of an Italian or Arab looked less like his parents as he became older. The husband brook up with the wife because she thought she stepped out on him. Come to find out the hospital accidentally gave them a biracial blk baby.

    A man getting cuckolded is the moral equivalent of a woman getting secretly implanted with another woman’s fertilized egg, giving birth to it, and raising it for eighteen years
    I’ve never discussed this with another woman before but something tells me that this won’t bother a woman as much as it would bother a man.

    proof of his paternity might even motivate him to go down on his wife

    WHAT????
    🙄

    That is a husbandly duty, he should need to motivation to do it.
    I guarantee every woman reading this Post article nodded their heads in agreement with the author,
    I beg to differ.

    Like


  133. Obsidian–

    Mandatory Paternity Testing is inevitable.

    I don’t think it’s inevitable either.

    Instead we’re gonna have to fight for it.

    In the mean time, we need to expect / demand it from any woman we want to have kids with (not to mention if she pulls an ooops).

    Like


  134. on May 12, 2009 at 3:51 pm Dave from Hawaii

    ”trust but verify” really means “no trust” in the context of an intimate long-term commitment.

    No, it means the husband is simply testing whether the trust is well deserved or not. A negative result on a secretly conducted paternity test would only increase a husband’s trust for his wife. A positive result will let him know that the trust was misplaced and she didn’t deserve it in the first place.

    There’s a difference between trust and naivete.

    Like


  135. It could very well be that the husband has seen a few episodes of Maury and has become paranoid. After seeing that show, I find myself looking at children to note any resemblance with its’ parents.

    Like


  136. anony, lying and cheating like a whore:

    “MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence; a toxic presumption.”
    –when womena re naturally whores, its no different than the blood test already required before marriage in most states.

    “DNA testing may be easy, but mandating it would destroy trust of women by the state.”
    —the state already does not trust straight white males to hire competant women and minorities; it assumes racism.

    the state does not trust men with children or not supporting their wife.

    women who cheat are liars.

    welcome to the club, bitch.

    “I, and I suspect most women, would support a cuckholded beta to demand recompense for misappropriated paternity.”

    –pretty lies. Betas may fall for it, not Roissy.

    And who compensates the man for the time lost? This method saves time and money.

    Any woman who rejects this, gentleman, is a woman who is a whore. Liek anony.

    Like


  137. johnny makrs, scroll up and see my post on my “Modest Proposal.”

    Or Control F the phrase.

    Like


  138. Anony,
    The procedure is quick, painless and most of all accurate. What’s the problem? Moreover, what about medical concerns? If the child isn’t his, then we have to locate the real father for the sake of the child’s medical wellbeing. To think that Women don’t even consider this, is disgusting to me quite frankly.

    O

    Like


  139. on May 12, 2009 at 3:56 pm johnnymarks

    I agree with Lurker’s Modest Proposal, just calling it a duty rather than an option.

    Like


  140. Tood and Anonymous,

    Artifical wombs could be here “WITHIN A DECADE”,
    http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2005-08/artificial-wombs
    All they really are is long-term incubators like we have now. They will be perfected in Japan first (Japanese are ahead in the research), and then sold here. Any laws passed against them here will just ensure men go overseas to have it done.

    It wont be men who will be eager for them to become a reality either. It will be women. Nine months, getting fat, mood swings, stretch marks, cellulite, pain of childbirth., paternity leave……………………….all GONE.

    Anonymous……………..ever heard of maids? Grandmothers? Aunts? Uncles? Plenty of people to help with babies until school starts. Men would be MUCH better off not BEHOLDEN to child support.
    Men could have their two kids, and enjoy a delicatessan of new pussy instead of being stuck married to the same fucking hag who holds a legal lever on them. They’d be assured the kids were theirs and nobody else’s, and could never be taken away by some fuck-assed backdoor-motherfucking court.

    Mandatory Paternity testing, artificial wombs………………..the power structure out there will indeed right itself, and science will indeed lead the way.

    One of you mentioned “sexbots”. I cant concieve of the pleasure of seducing a damned robot myself, but assume that some men could. Artificial wombs (really just long-term incubators like we have now, but better), will give men that option also.

    Like


  141. Here is an update on Japanese robotics. They have a robotics conference going on right now.

    While the robots described here are not sexbots, always remember that an advancement in any area of robotics can still apply to other areas (or at least speed things up elsewhere). Check out the videos under the ‘multimedia’ heading.

    Like


  142. Those Japanese researchers……gotta love ’em.

    Extreme Beta/Omega humiliation leads to the most determined scientific research.

    Like


  143. chic noir–

    someone else: I guarantee every woman reading this Post article nodded their heads in agreement with the author,

    chic: I beg to differ.

    So do you agree with me chic, as several men on here have said they do and none have said they don’t, that if:

    He gets the paternity test done, and the six year old daughter isn’t his; and

    He divorces her and wants to stop supporting the child he was hoodwinked into believing was his, and never undertood to support on the basis that she wasn’t his; and

    the wife nonetheless goes after him for full child support = alimony; THAT

    he then has the moral right to kill her. Stone cold murder her, in that case.

    I would be more than able to kill her under such circumstances, I assure you. Just totally could.

    What say you chic?

    Like


  144. “-MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence; a toxic presumption. DNA testing may be easy, but mandating it would destroy trust of women by the state.”

    Negative, it would only cement the bond between 2 committed people even more. And destroy the trust of women by the state? Why does the gov’t always have to be involved? Oh yeah:

    http://www.reason.com/news/show/29035.html

    http://www.reason.com/news/show/28570.html

    Maybe protect some innocent men, but hey, that’s just a nothing issue.

    Like


  145. Dave from Hawaii,

    You hit the nail on the head about trust. Exactly.

    Like


  146. A bit more, Doug. I do believe that blame and shame are a last resort and usually unnecesary tactics, but agree that they are usefull. I prefer to use seduction and humor over fear. I constantly tease my girlfriends about cheating. Whenever they go out the door I’ll say something like “Don’t fuck anybody. Blow jobs are ok, but no fucking”. I love to roleplay cheating scenarios. Keep the fact that I know and love women – REAL women, not Cinderellas – out in plain sight. And when I said a strong man can own a woman, I meant that he can own her, for a while. How long that while is varies – but unless kids are involved, does how long really matter?

    If kids are involved, you still own her for as long as you own her, and not a day more. And vice versa. So I agree that mate selection and all possible weapons of sugar and vinegar, stick and carrot, are needed. Shame is but one small and weak weapon in the arsenal.

    Like


  147. @pa,
    MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence

    In many states AIDS tests are mandatory or “highly encouraged” for pregnant women. Does this presume crack-whoredom for every soccer mom with a belly who reports for prenatal care?

    Wrong. The presumption behind HIV testing is that – HIV is not diagnosable clinically until end stages, -that HIV is placental transmissible, and -anti retrovirals are effective to reduce transmission. There is no “guilt” presumed in infectious diseases.

    And I agree with chic here,
    A man getting cuckolded is the moral equivalent of a woman getting secretly implanted with another woman’s fertilized egg, giving birth to it, and raising it for eighteen years
    I’ve never discussed this with another woman before but something tells me that this won’t bother a woman as much as it would bother a man.

    I suspect most women would raise and nurture the implanted embryo like her own.

    Like


  148. The most basic reason women don’t want MPT’s?

    It takes a woman’s most potent weapon in manipulating and controlling men:

    her ability to lie.

    Like


  149. “If a man suspects his wife has cuckolded him, the odds of his child not being his rise to 30%. ”

    I can still see no link to pubmed or anything that proves this. unpublished study? from where?

    Like


  150. anony, please. it is not guilty, it is establishing a legal fact. You’re just worried about burden shifting—that a skanky female might not get her pay from the her bitch boy beta.

    “I suspect most women would raise and nurture the implanted embryo like her own.”
    —lmao rofl. Yes, the kidn caring women of today’s world who slaughter their children at the drop of a hat?

    lol. yeah, right.

    Like


  151. “MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence”

    And marriage presumes that the kid is the fathers. If you find out that the whorewife spit out a bastard and you are not within about a year of birth to contest paternity, guess what? You have to keep paying up, for 18 years, on threat of imprisonment.

    Women want money. There is no way in hell that they will give up the possibility of soaking any man for their own benefit. Justice is a male virtue.

    They may as well simplify the law to state:

    Any man who the state says is the father, is the father. Upon birth, said man shall be sentenced to 18 years in prison in a jury-less trial. The state will make up an arbitrary amount of money to be paid by said man to the woman who says he is the father of her child. This amount can be changed at any time, for any reason, up to any amount. Should the said man make his arbitrary payments on schedule, for that month he shall be allowed on furlough.

    Like


  152. comparing cuckolding to the male version of rape is a bad characterization. its obviously more akin to thievery or robbery, and really, unless the State starts making cuckolded fathers pay for another man’s child (read, his wife’s child, and this wouldn’t be too far-fetched) its really not thievery or robbery at all just disingenuity.

    Like


  153. —-The procedure is quick, painless and most of all accurate. What’s the problem? Moreover, what about medical concerns? If the child isn’t his, then we have to locate the real father for the sake of the child’s medical wellbeing.—

    That’s exactly the problem with it, now isn’t it? The real issue is that it is too easy to find out the truth. Goodbye carefully constructed feminist good times being paid for by men’s money.

    Like


  154. @lurker,

    when women are naturally whores, its no different than the blood test already required before marriage in most states.

    You are adorable, lurker, but you are wanting to compare a genetic inheritance with an infectious disease. To my understanding, the “blood test” is for syphilis . an outdated public health strategy.

    Like


  155. on May 12, 2009 at 4:09 pm Dave from Hawaii

    This post is one of Roissy’s best to date…and it’s quite instructive to see just how defensive the sisterhood gets when they close ranks to justify, excuse and/or rationalize cuckoldry.

    Look at anony – while expressing a half-hearted condemnation for cuckoldry (it really is male rape), she is far more concerned with “trust” in a “marriage” that would be “broken” by a paternity test.

    Somehow, I doubt a man that suspects cuckoldry is just being a paranoid making up fantasies in his own mind. Even an extreme beta will have to have a confluence of events and facts in front of him that he cannot dismiss no matter how badly he wants to, for him to connect the dots in his mind that add up to his overall suspicion.

    If you feel like your trust was misplaced, what’s wrong with secretly confirming whether or not that trust was misplaced?

    Women do that sort of shit all the time…like having their friends hit on their men just to see if their man takes the bait.

    Like


  156. All

    One of the great eternal lies, that’s passed off as women’s wisdom:

    “Women KNOW who the father is; and you should of course (hear must) believe her”.

    Like


  157. @obsidian,
    What’s the problem?

    The problem is the effect it has on the overwhelming majority of women who respect and trust their state. The message is, “we don’t trust your actions.” ” you must prove yourself to the state and to your husband.”

    Like


  158. I agree with Chuck,
    its obviously more akin to thievery or robbery

    Like


  159. xsplat–

    I prefer to use seduction and humor over fear.

    Of course. By a country mile and then some.

    I do believe that blame and shame are a last resort and usually unnecesary tactics, but agree that they are usefull. *** So I agree that mate selection and all possible weapons of sugar and vinegar, stick and carrot, are needed. Shame is but one small and weak weapon in the arsenal.

    I wasn’t even thinking of shame or fear meted out individually by a man. I was talking about culturally induced shame and fear. Those are POWERFUL social forces.

    They’re weak individual ones usually. Well fear may not be, but that’s a terrible way to maintain a relationship. Don’t even know anything ’bout that.

    Like


  160. —The problem is the effect it has on the overwhelming majority of women who respect and trust their state. The message is, “we don’t trust your actions.” ” you must prove yourself to the state and to your husband.”—

    Women are just going to have to accept that and get over their hurt feelings. I had always thought the that modern grrl was supposed to be tougher than that, with all the shit that gets done to guys who get cheated on and forced to pay for kids that aren’t theirs. But a simple, easy test? No, too much to ask. Not a surprising response though.

    Like


  161. Anony, you are a stupid selfish little cunt. Your feelings are irrelevant. Suck it up.

    Like


  162. “people just assume that the cuckolded husband will go from once-a-month-sex to G-manifesto like massive swooping of fly girls.”

    Are you shitting me? Who fucking cares! Supporting bastard offspring is a fake worse than death. Even if he has one arm and needs a face transplant, he can always get hookers. Hookers are way cheaper than supporting some mongoloid’s kid in return for a biennial handjob.

    Nice work, Roissy. I’ll be writing this hatchet faced witch a love letter.

    Like


  163. on May 12, 2009 at 4:20 pm Dave from Hawaii

    comparing cuckolding to the male version of rape is a bad characterization.

    No, it’s not.

    Why is the rape of a female considered such a horrible crime in the first place?

    Before birth control and legalized abortion, rape was particularly horrifying way of forcing a woman to have a baby from a genetic “donor” she did not want.

    A woman, forced to have a child from the DNA not of her own choosing.

    That is what the crime of rape was really all about.

    So a woman doing the same thing to a man, forcing him to raise a child not of HIS choosing, is certainly a form of rape.

    Like


  164. My brothers, do not be troubled. The End is near. Technology is making it harder to cheat the system, the truth will come out, nothing can stop it. In the meantime, more and more Men wll simply opt out, as they’re doing right now. Women have fought for the right to fend for themselves, they can support the kids they’ve made via their private decisions, either w/or w/o the aid of the true fathers. What matters here is the facts. MPT will get those facts.

    O

    Like


  165. Here is a link to some of the stats: http://www.canadiancrc.com/Newspaper_Articles/Globe_and_Mail_Moms_Little_secret_14DEC02.aspx

    It is a newspaper, so you might have to dig a little bit deeper to find the original sources of the info.

    Most scientists studying this field say 5-15% of babies are cuckolded.

    In one English classroom 30% of children had different fathers than the were supposed to.

    The American Association of Blood Banks is the source for the quote that 30% of fathers who suspect their children aren’t actually theirs are correct.

    I hope this helps.

    Ben

    Like


  166. Doug

    culturally induced shame and fear. Those are POWERFUL social forces.

    I’ve lived in a number of societies. I’ve yet to witness one in which culturally induced shame and fear had much social influence at all.

    People merely get sneakier.

    Like


  167. dave from Hawaii Why is the rape of a female considered such a horrible crime in the first place?
    you must be kidding right???

    *puts hand up to god*

    I refuse I refuse

    Like


  168. Chuck–

    unless the State starts making cuckolded fathers pay for another man’s child (read, his wife’s child, and this wouldn’t be too far-fetched) its really not thievery or robbery at all just disingenuity.

    You are truly in a bubble. You have a LOT of learning to do lad.

    The state does JUST THAT right now. In some states if the divorcing husband discovers non paternity and divorces within a short time, one and two years have been used by courts in different states, then he can escape paternity. If it’s longer even though through no fault of his own, then he’s on the hook. In many states this hasn’t been judicially determined, but that’s far from meaning a husband such as the one Roissy wrote up would be likely to prevail. Given the other states precedents (and those in Australian and the UK), he probably wouldn’t. It’s all about the best interests of the child (read and mother as an indisoluable unit), with the man coming dead last — and hardly considered.

    Yuup, it’s that bad right now. It really is. Google around and verify. Please. Then report back to us.

    Like


  169. on May 12, 2009 at 4:25 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Not quite, xsplat. Shame and fear don’t stop morally/socially destructive behavior…and yes, people do get sneakier…but when you have a social stigma attached to behavior, you will get a lot less instances of it occurring in the first place.

    Like the rise in single mother households.

    Under the cultural stigma of prior to the 60’s “sexual revolution,” the single mother household was far less prevalent than what we have today when the stigma and shame is all but gone.

    Like


  170. Dave:

    “rape was particularly horrifying way of forcing a woman to have a baby from a genetic “donor” she did not want.”

    it was also a particularly horrifying way of forcing an unwanted penis into her vagina against her will…on a much more simple level, it violated her “natural rights” against physical harm and unwanted contact.

    also, if we want to accept your definition of male rape as being forced to raise a child; there is no “force” per se. she lied and manipulated, both horrible in their own right, but there is no “force”. a cuckolded man who raises a child does so on his own accord, whether knowledgable about the paternity of his child or not.

    you guys can’t just make up a whole new definition of rape.

    Like


  171. anony, being anony:

    “but you are wanting to compare a genetic inheritance with an infectious disease.”
    —Actually, its quite an apt comparison. Your whorish little offspring that you foister upon some poor beta for sustenance are the festering germs of society, parasites that feed off of the world just as their mother does, without contributing anything.

    “To my understanding, the “blood test” is for syphilis.”
    —which you probably have

    “an outdated public health strategy.”
    —like assuming the married man is the father.

    It was put best above: if you want the ring, and get guaranteed payments for the kid, then man up and submit to the testing. Tit for tat. But women don’t understand that.

    Like


  172. chic noir:

    dave from Hawaii: Why is the rape of a female considered such a horrible crime in the first place?

    chic: you must be kidding right???

    When no child results, and when compared to a situation where a wife deceives a husband into believing a child is his when it’s not, and then sues him for child support (which in NY will extend to her college education) when he divorces her,

    I completely agree with Dave. In fact I think mere rape (with no resulting child) is NOTHING in comparison to that.

    Like


  173. on May 12, 2009 at 4:28 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Chic, I’m speaking of the historical context of rape.

    Aside from that, you women have been conditioned by society to consider rape a fate worse than death. Sorry dear, but there are worse things one can endure than simply rape.

    Just as you females recoil in visceral horror at the thought of a man you do not desire violating you, so too do men recoil in visceral horror at the thought of another man impregnating the woman he THOUGHT he was starting his own family with.

    Cuckoldry IS rape…not in they physical sense, but in the mental sense, it most certainly is.

    Like


  174. “biannual handjobs”

    you had me rofl at that, and I was about to say this was a legendary post, but it just kept getting better and better.

    Write the book already, or the screenplay for “alpha in the city”
    roflmao

    Like


  175. on May 12, 2009 at 4:29 pm Stupid Links Each Time

    Chic noir
    dave from Hawaii Why is the rape of a female considered such a horrible crime in the first place?
    you must be kidding right???

    *puts hand up to god*

    I refuse I refuse

    Go be offended somewhere else, please.

    Like


  176. I would not kill her or the innocent child, but I would :

    1) Get the test done. Twice, to make sure.
    2) Start an asset relocation/donation/spending spree plan
    3) Move to a place where divorce is more favorable (even if this means quitting my job). Try to make an excuse about how I have a job there, so that she is not suspicious (although this is the risky part of my plan, which is why part 1) is a buffer).
    4) File for divorce there.
    5) Eventually inform the child what happened and give him/her a copy of the report (if he is old enough).

    Like


  177. oh and a serious point, if DNA test proves the cuckoldry… where/when is the law ascribing criminal charges and damages for the biznitch for:
    willful fraud,
    intentional mental anguish, and
    theft (garnish those wages for them expenses honey)

    Think the day will ever come when female rape gets persecuted too?

    Like


  178. Dave

    Under the cultural stigma of prior to the 60’s “sexual revolution,” the single mother household was far less prevalent than what we have today when the stigma and shame is all but gone.

    Correlation or causation? Birth control is the cause, not social mores. Social mores changed BECAUSE of birth control. Social mores didn’t affect the behaviour. Social mores are mere stories people tell themselves to justify whatever it is that they are currently doing.

    Like


  179. Question :

    If you do the DNA test and find that the child was not yours, and then file for divorce…

    …what is to prevent the woman from bribing a doctor to give her a fake test, so that she can get child support from the man?

    Sure, you have your report, and can sue the doctor, but still…..

    Like


  180. Chuck, the emotional and financial damage inflicted on a man from being cuckholded is equal to rape. Try for equality is playing the feminine game; there is no equality between the sexes.

    As any feminazi will tell you, “rape is about power.” So is cuckholding; it is power over a man’s livlihood.

    Or, put it another way: a woman’s value, first and foremost, is her sexuality: she’s attractive but not slutty, not had too many partners. When she lost that, it was a huge losss, thus why rape was such a bad crime; it deprived her of ehr natural advantages. In ancient Rome, there was no crime for raping a prostitute, precisely because such women had nothing to lose by it.

    For a man, his financial success has long been a big ticket to status and women. When he voluntarily gives up women in marriage, and then loses not only that one woman but also his money for both her and another man’s seed—-that is societal rape.

    Like


  181. @too bad,
    Women are just going to have to accept that and get over their hurt feelings. I had always thought the that modern grrl was supposed to be tougher than that, with all the shit that gets done to guys who get cheated on and forced to pay for kids that aren’t theirs. But a simple, easy test? No, too much to ask. Not a surprising response though.

    OKay, you appealed to a “tough girl” challenge. I don’t know where the “cuckold pays for the bastard child for ever” started. This is beyond the pale injustice. I suspect that most women would support legislation to stop that.
    Agree that a cheek swab seems simple enough technically, but the message from the state to women is “you are not to be trusted.” and then women should respect their state?

    Like


  182. Chuck = SWPL Beta.

    Anyway, this is someone who thinks Mao and Stalin were not left-wing, so judge his words accordingly.

    Like


  183. @doug- the paternity test should take place at time of birth before the father is allowed to sign the birth certificate.
    Forgive me for being a little testy about this but I’ve been saying this once a week for almost a year now. Getting the DNA test done early prevents any messy bonding between a man and a child that’s not his. If the man chooses to stay, then it’s his decision but he should be given the facts and the truth.

    fun fact: I also think a women should have their fiancés take lie detector tests before they marry. It would save alot of money for both parties. Females won’t hitch themselves to trash for the long-term.

    Do know that if someone cheats on you and you forgive with ease, he/she will probably do it again. The quicker you make up, the sooner he/she will be face down in new poon/pean.

    PS. Some of those couples we see on Maury are in fact not couples. They are just two poor people who want a trip to NYC in a five star hotel. Their dignity, morals and ethics, if they have any, take a back seat for the opportunity to leave their project, trailer park, or shack for a few minutes of peace.

    Like


  184. I too am noting w/great interest the cringing at the very notion of MPT among our lady members, a most telling sign, yes? Afterall, again, the test is painless, easy and accurate. Why would any Woman who’s on the level cringe from it being administered? Shouldn’t it put to bed, once and for all, any questions in the matter? If the interests of the child is what truly matters, isn’t knowing the truth in said child’s best interests?

    O

    Like


  185. P.S. free advice: many states calculate alimony and child support on the basis of how much you’ve earned or expect to earn over the last or next 3 years. So its best to investigate that amount and downsize your pay accordingly—take a nonprofit/social worker job, sell the house for a smaller shack and rent, etc. Claim to the cheating whore you want to give back. Then, when the time period is up, divorce her and go back to a better career. Many places won’t adjust alimony/child support even if your income zooms up.

    Like


  186. doug1:

    with all due respect, if you read my comment i state that its entirely possible that our government would have no qualms about forcing a cuckolded man to pay for children, but if you have the sources to support that claim (the one you claim i’m naive about) then you should provide those links.

    as far as male rape, people in this country are “forced” to pay for other people’s children all the time, it’s called welfare and CHIPS and other such programs. should we start calling that “rape” or better yet “male rape” since men pay the majority of taxes?

    i’m just trying to tamp down the hyperbole around this issue that’s all, i agree with the roissy’s sentiment and POV. men are getting screwed, but when we start playing the victim card, crying that our gender is being raped, i wonder how long it is before our “masculinity movement” turns into a slightly higher T-leveled feminist movement, complete with shirllness.

    Like


  187. Stupid Links Each Time

    How nice that you click on my links. I feel honoured.

    Go be offended somewhere else, please.
    you say this now but if something was to happen to any of your female family members, you would feel otherwise.

    Like


  188. Do women reading this know what the penalty for adultery (let alone cuckolding) under Islam is?

    While I do not agree with the severity of Islamic punishments, it nonetheless is pretty easy for Western men to merely stop fighting against Islam’s agenda of domination, and just step aside.

    Let’s step aside, so that there is only air between Muslims and feminists/Perez Hilton.

    Like


  189. Obsidian
    I too am noting w/great interest the cringing at the very notion of MPT among our lady members, a most telling sign, yes

    Not all of us. IIRC, Elizabeth, your love lost Mu🙂 and possibly hello had no problems with MPT.

    Like


  190. […] abomination is not the doctors’ fault because the politicans and judges set the rules and stupid advice columnists don’t care.  While I hate politicians more than doctors, the government’s actions do not excuse the […]

    Like


  191. “I suspect that most women would support legislation to stop that.”

    –anony, lying will get you no where.

    I distinctly remember that cunt Leeza Gibbons having an entire show (when she ahd her talk show in the 90s) where she tried to make the case that men who discovered they weren’t the father *had a moral obligation* to not only pay, but raise the child.

    But it was through that show that I learned that Harry, Prince Charles and Diana’s 2nd son, is probably not his. Diana was rumored to be having an affair at the time with her military bodyguard…who looks exactly like Harry (red, curly hair, freckles, while Charles is dark).

    And Leeza claimed Prince Charles would be *bad* for casting the wretch off.

    Like


  192. —“Agree that a cheek swab seems simple enough technically, but the message from the state to women is “you are not to be trusted.” and then women should respect their state?”—

    We use the breathalizer, don’t we? What’s the message there? Or the fact that my taxes get deducted automatically. Or that to own a firearm I have to submit to a background test. Whining about a test that may make women not “trust” thr gov’t is bullshit. You’re just upset the easy money will stop.

    I get it. Women trust that the state will financially rape men. Can’t have that “trust” broken now can we? Toughen the fuck up.

    Like


  193. Obsidian wrote :

    I too am noting w/great interest the cringing at the very notion of MPT among our lady members, a most telling sign, yes?

    One correction in that sentence. They are ‘ladies’ no more. Not after this.

    lurker wrote :

    So its best to investigate that amount and downsize your pay accordingly—take a nonprofit/social worker job, sell the house for a smaller shack and rent, etc.

    Even better, do a startup, that too in a place where laws will be in your favor (emerging economy, etc.). That way, it does not look like you are faking it. You are simply being an entrepreneur, who is drawing no salary while you build your company.

    Divorce in the meantime.

    Like


  194. The anony argument against MPT’s as a requirement for children reminds me of shakespeare:

    *Methinks the lady doth protest too much.*

    Like


  195. @Dave,
    I’m agreeing with this , and have discussed it with other women who’ve agreed.
    Aside from that, you women have been conditioned by society to consider rape a fate worse than death. Sorry dear, but there are worse things one can endure than simply rape.

    I had a roommate who was raped by a man she met at a bar. She recovered fast, but did get the satisfaction of contributing to his court verdict. Court cases are rare, but i suspect, contribute to some satisfaction. My point is that not all women would consider rape worse than death. The public voices are those who skew toward elevating its heinousness. Voices like my old roommate don’t get heard because she recovers and moves on to flirting in bars with guys again.

    Like


  196. @doug- You do known that sometimes men are raped as well as molested as children. Men who have been raped are as troubled about it as women. Some people never get over it. That feeling that someone took something from you that wasn’t theirs to take. Someone that is such a part of your being human and possibly exposing you to diseases and pregnancy.

    The fact that a few men are throwing around rape with ease makes me wonder whose really reading this blog?

    Like


  197. on May 12, 2009 at 4:45 pm Stupid Links Each Time

    —How nice that you click on my links. I feel honoured.

    Go be offended somewhere else, please.
    you say this now but if something was to happen to any of your female family members, you would feel otherwise.—

    Nope, just rolled over them. And I don’t care about your bullshit family member claims about rape. Whine, bitch, moan, suffer, etc… Heard it all before. Feel free to peddle your shit as usual, it ain’t my website to police.

    Like


  198. Doug1

    > OK, which of you would say that to your intended?

    I’ve essentially done all of that… but not the prenup. From what I’ve gathered about Ontario law, the prenup is essentially useless once children enter the picture (and we intend to start our large family fairly soon after we marry).

    I have screened my fiancee heavily for things in addition to physical attractiveness, and she stacks up very well with the social indicators (good family, *very* low number of boyfriends, fairly religious, spontaneous demonstrations of love, alpha father I respect, etc). I have LTR game. She will be earning a large fraction of what I make (thanks Tood).

    Anyone else have any advice on the matter? I figured it wasn’t worth the potential emotional damage if the agreement would be invalidated in a couple years anyways.

    I did tell her about the paternity testing and punishment for infidelity (which will be the same that many here have advocated for cuckoldry, lol), though.

    Like


  199. Roissy

    We all agree on the plain evil of divorce laws.

    What I see is the trade-off between:
    – life working for the benefit of a whore who give him occasional sex, fullfills the social roles of a wife (i.e, he can still go to those events where only couples go) and a bastard who may love him in old age
    – sexless life, still paying , but paying less, for the whore/bastard, possibly lonely in old age, and impoverishment of the whore/bastard.

    with a good dose of self-denial, which the guy has already shown, the first option is quite viable

    What I don’t see is how the break-up of this individual marriage will help dismantle the divorce industry. It can only happen through a revolution, like MPT/sexbots or the Caliphate. Obviously the Caliphate implies a lower standard of living, to say the least.

    Like


  200. @lurker,
    The anony argument against MPT’s as a requirement for children reminds me of shakespeare:

    *Methinks the lady doth protest too much.*

    what’s “too much” lurker? MPT would be an egregious slap at almost all women. We don’t want to be treated with such distrust and lack of respect.

    Like


  201. Toad:

    “…what is to prevent the woman from bribing a doctor to give her a fake test, so that she can get child support from the man?”

    Nothing is preventing her from doing this, but HAS THAT EVER HAPPENED? you can think up all the shitty what-if scenarios you want, but this discussion is one of trends and patterns and possibility, not the realm of outliers and freak occurences.

    “Chuck = SWPL Beta.”

    OK. if you think so Toad.

    “Anyway, this is someone who thinks Mao and Stalin were not left-wing, so judge his words accordingly.”

    No, dick nose, i said hitler was not left-wing. mao and stalin had strictly socialistic desires that culminated in totalitarian regimes. hitler was almost stricly nationalist, xenophobic, and for racial purity, all traits common to the right-wing extremist topic of our previous discussion.

    If you read at all on the subject, right-wing and left-wing, when they enter their extreme phases often have over-lapping ideologies and goals for their nations. Perhaps they have conservative or liberal viewpoints in their fledgling years, but by the time they reach full-blown dictator status, there is very little difference in their ruling styles; its all about control, control, control.

    Like


  202. stupid links time
    Nope, just rolled over them
    WOw just wow.😦

    Like


  203. Lurker

    And Leeza claimed Prince Charles would be *bad* for casting the wretch off.

    When creditors used to call me, leaving a voice message that they had a “very important situation to discuss”, I always mentally responded with “Important to whom?”

    It’s the same for morals. Important to whom?

    There are no universal morals. Men and women have different agendas. Grow up.

    Like


  204. anony, speaking lies to the truth:

    “what’s “too much” lurker?”
    —-at all, anony.

    “MPT would be an egregious slap at almost all women.”
    —only to the sluts like you.

    “We don’t want to be treated with such distrust and lack of respect.”
    —then don’t get married or demand child support.

    Like


  205. anyone else up for bringing back people suing cheating wives for “breach of contract”?

    Like


  206. @anoy and dave- what’s the point of chatting up a ten in the bar when you can just follow her home and take it from her? Who needs game when you have brawn.

    Personally, anoy, being rapped troubles me a heck of lot more than having to take a MPT. I would smile as I’m having my mouth swabbed because I would know without a doubt who the father of my kid is.

    Like


  207. xsplat:

    “There are no universal morals.”

    —there are. Men discern justice, women discern convenience. For themselves. Always has been, always will be.

    This is why most religions prevent women from being religious leaders—they are incapable of looking for good or truth; it is the antithesis of their nature.

    Its also why men gravitate to the hard sciences and math; women can’t handle cold logic, rational thinking, or answers that can’t be massaged into what they want.

    Like


  208. Robin Hanson blogged this on Overcoming Bias, asking:

    “Is there any other common betrayal situation where neutral third parties would so strongly advise not looking to see if you’ve been betrayed? I can’t think of one.”

    http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/05/ignoring-betrayal.html

    Like


  209. xsplat- claimed Prince Charles would be *bad* for casting the wretch off

    harry looks an awful lot like Princess Di’s brother. He has the same red hair and tall lanky build.

    Fun Fact: Harry is a red head Mandingo. He’s packing at least 9 and as thick as a polish sausage.

    Like


  210. “The fact that a few men are throwing around rape with ease makes me wonder whose really reading this blog?”

    Chic don’t act like your some divine saint here.

    Like


  211. on May 12, 2009 at 4:54 pm Dave from Hawaii

    You do known that sometimes men are raped as well as molested as children. Men who have been raped are as troubled about it as women. Some people never get over it. That feeling that someone took something from you that wasn’t theirs to take. Someone that is such a part of your being human and possibly exposing you to diseases and pregnancy.

    The fact that a few men are throwing around rape with ease makes me wonder whose really reading this blog?

    No, you’re merely seeing the script flipped here, and as a female, you don’t like it one bit. To your femi-centric way of thinking, the horror of a rape that some people never get over is a thought that cringes your female soul.

    Well, my dear, how long do you think it takes a man who discovers his wife’s cuckoldry to get over that particular mind-fuck?

    What about the numerous court cases that involve judges ENFORCING cuckoldry because the “father” and the child have already “bonded?” That the ‘Best interests of the child’ were served?

    It’s not that we men here are trivializing rape. We’re merely comparing it to an equally disgusting and horrifying crime.

    You say there’s no comparison. I say that you women, and a few SWPL-libtards are simply throwing around cuckoldry with ease.

    Like


  212. Toad:

    “Do women reading this know what the penalty for adultery (let alone cuckolding) under Islam is?

    You’re going to call me SWPL beta for questioning the definition of the term “male rape”, and in the next breath tout the virtues of Islam? I’ll take “male rape” over Islamic rule any day.

    “While I do not agree with the severity of Islamic punishments, ”

    then why bring it up?

    Like


  213. schoolboy- believe it or not, there are plenty of women who don’t lay about with multiple men at the same time.

    Like


  214. chic–

    fun fact: I also think a women should have their fiancés take lie detector tests before they marry. It would save alot of money for both parties. Females won’t hitch themselves to trash for the long-term.

    I think girls in America today would be far more reluctant, as a group, to allow this than men.

    E.g.: “How many sexual partners have you had? Have you ever had sex outside a relationship? Really, you’ve never been fooled? How many times have you let that (rephrase, has that) happened? What’s the shortest time after meeting a man that you’ve had sex with him? Tell me about each man you have fallen in love with. How deep were your feelings at the time?”

    I’d answer all these questions no problem (and have) despite large numbers because I’m not hiding that. Marriage minded women, if they have more than small and committed ones, almost always are, at least to a large extent.

    Yes it’s a double standard. It should be. I celebrate it.

    BTW, there are ways of getting truth out of girls on these things. It’s best done early, before she falls in love with you and knows your true feelings re: girls you’d considering committing to.

    Like


  215. on May 12, 2009 at 4:56 pm femalemisogynist

    I agree, but I did have one thought: the strategy this bimbo suggests would be a good and workable strategy for a woman who suspects she’s being cheated on. It’s possible that she’s giving this cuckold the advice she’d give another woman. No doubt she’s too clueless to realize why it doesn’t work that way.

    Like


  216. Most women don’t realize how absolutely horrific cuckoldry is for a man. I can’t speak for every guy out there, but for me I would much rather be sent to prison and anally raped than have my wife cheat on me and bear another man’s child.

    Like


  217. Dave from Hawaii- If MPT are done at time of birth, this will stop such occurrences.

    What about the numerous court cases that involve judges ENFORCING cuckoldry because the “father” and the child have already “bonded?” That the ‘Best interests of the child’ were served?

    bullshit, the father should be reimbursed for any monies he spent on a child that was not his.

    Like


  218. Tood–

    I would not kill her or the innocent child,

    It never even occurred to me to kill the child.

    As well I’d simply leave her rather than kill her, if that could be the end of that.

    It’s when she then moves to make me pay her lots of my accumlated savings when the marriage ended because of her deepest possible deception in lying about he paternity of her child, and even wants ongoing support of that bastard that’s not mine …

    Then and only then do I start to have thoughts of murdering her.

    And feel totally morally justified in having them.

    I’d sure as hell feel it more than alright to credibly threaten to kill her if she doesn’t totally drop the child support suit.

    Like


  219. “I agree. In India, there was very little cheating, until the proliferation of :

    1) Cellphones
    2) Internet
    3) Cable TV with soap operas that glorify cheating.”

    This is patently absurd. There has always been plenty of cheating in India (and every other country on the planet), just as there has always been plenty of premarital sex (perhaps not in India or other places where couples were often wed before puberty, but that’s beside the point). I’m not sure why this simple truth is so hard for some to grasp.

    Like


  220. Chic, being chic:

    “harry looks an awful lot like Princess Di’s brother. He has the same red hair and tall lanky build.”
    —and the bodyguard she slept with.

    “Harry is a red head Mandingo. He’s packing at least 9 and as thick as a polish sausage.”
    —-and you know this how? Chuck is all ears.

    Like


  221. As for mandatory paternity testing, I’m only cautiously optimistic it will be widely adopted. I forsee some innocuous law requiring both parents to consent to such a medical procedure.

    My friend in the Marines described their attitude to war as:
    If you get in a fight in a bar, most people will try to act tough, maybe through a punch. A Marine will smile, wait for you to turn around, then grab your head and smash your face into the bar.

    That’s the alpha attitude you need to take. When you find out, put on a good face for a while, get the legal papers ready, then buy her a trip to the spa for the weekend to get her out of the house and while she’s gone, move all of your stuff out of the house into locked storage, give the key to your lawyer then slam her with the divorce papers sunday night when she gets back and then go out, get drunk with the boys and fuck some other chick. That’s how you have to roll.

    Like


  222. thursday Most women don’t realize how absolutely horrific cuckoldry is for a man. I can’t speak for every guy out there, but for me I would much rather be sent to prison and anally raped than have my wife cheat on me and bear another man’s child.

    😯

    Wow thursday and that’s considering that prison ain’t the easiest place to surive even if your not raped.

    something tells me you may change your mind after coming across this guy.

    Like


  223. @lurker there are pics all over the net. Prez hilton puts pics of Harry being Harry up often.

    Like


  224. twiceaday- It’s because it’s right in our faces now and to an extent, celebrated.

    Like


  225. I’m a strong anti-cuckoldry man, but I must respectfully dissent from Thursday’s view. Anal rape in prison seems worse to me. (Don’t you watch Oz? ;-p )

    Like


  226. on May 12, 2009 at 5:08 pm Dave from Hawaii

    If MPT are done at time of birth, this will stop such occurrences.

    Yeah…but what does this have to do with our debate about the equivalence between rape and cuckoldry? This is the exact sort of deflection you regularly do here that draws roissy’s ire.

    You were trying to argue that there is no comparison between a female being raped and cuckoldry, and when I rebut, you resort to this? Where did I say I was against MPT at birth? I’m all for that.

    bullshit, the father should be reimbursed for any monies he spent on a child that was not his.

    This is not what happens frequently…

    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=child+support+not+father&btnG=Search&cts=1242162516881

    Like


  227. Carolyn Faux.
    She is a prototype of the girl that would stretch anything to her benefit,
    I hope everybody here can see through the lies of those that believe in them themselves…

    Like


  228. I think that the dicussion surrounding rape is very interesting. Insofar as I am concerned, it is a crime where a person is sexually violated against their will. Commonly this is associated w/Women as victims, although as Chic has rightly noted, kids and even other Men can and have been raped.

    Chuck’s disagreement with the use of the word “rape” within the context of Paternity Rape is also interesting. He suggests instead that it is more akin to fraud, robbery and thievery. I don’t disagree w/this view. However, in light of the grave implications involved, from an evolutionary and genetic point of view, coupled with wilful deception and indeed theft, I must respectfully disagree w/Chuck, someone whom I usually enjoy reading and often agree with. Let me be clear: the very nature of Cuckoldry is indeed a form of rape, if, we accept that rape is the violation of another’s body on sexual grounds. Here, a Man is violated on sexual grounds-he is led to believe that he is investing time, emotions and resources/money into a child he believes is his own but very well may not be, and the child is the product of sexual actions taken on the part of his wife and another Man, yet he’s led to believe his own sexual acts have brought the child about.

    Moreover, in many ways, given the coercive nature of many courts etc, I would strongly argue that Cuckoldry is inherently worse than the garden variety female rape, in that the cuckold has to continue supporting a child he knows is not his own for years, and all that comes w/it in emotion and mental health terms. That Women in the main are nonplussed by this, is again, most telling.

    If Chic is reading along, I do not recall Liz or Hello making such statements, and in any event are not here now to speak for themselves; what we do know is that the current Women in the room seem to have opted for fighting tooth and nail against a simple, painless and astonishingly accurate test to put everyone’s mind at ease. Fascinating.

    O

    Like


  229. Prison rape has been exaggerated by the last 20 years of movies and TV shows (think Oz) about prison. Mostly, the shows depict gay male (and closeted men’s ) fantasies about having sex with a straight man or being “forced” to do so, so its “not really their fault.”

    It’s every gay man’s fanatasy to have a macho straight virgin, just like straight men like the idea of having an innocent Catholic school teenage virgin.

    At this point, I think the movies have affected reality—life imitating art—but most people who talk about prison say the same thing: its mostly just veyr boring, intespersed with bouts of violence.

    Like


  230. on May 12, 2009 at 5:11 pm Marcus Aureliette

    I too am noting w/great interest the cringing at the very notion of MPT among our lady members, a most telling sign, yes?

    Not all. I support it wholeheartedly. I actually think that making it mandatory takes away the honey-don’t-you-trust-me?! aspect of it: just lump it in with all the other millions of tests done throughout pregnancy/post-pregnancy, and let the chips fall where they may. No individual guy will have to request it, nor deal with the relationship brouhaha that such a request would likely cause.

    If you haven’t done anything dishonest, you have nothing to worry about.

    Like


  231. Chic, have you heard of stuffing?

    I’m not lookign up Harry nude, btw. Give me a news story.

    And Perez Hilton? that faggy lying bitch? Citing him just put your whole argument in doubt.

    Like


  232. “Harry is a red head Mandingo. He’s packing at least 9 and as thick as a polish sausage.”

    Yes, its a well-known fact that redheads pack more heat than non redheads. It’s likely evolutionary, making up for our hair color.

    Like


  233. On a tangential note, a both sad and happy day for me was when I found out most porn stars aren’t as hung as the movies claim.

    1) smaller women (many porn girls are undersized)

    2) no accurate measuring system (who will verify claims? the U.S Census)

    3) shaving balls (looks longer)

    4) camera tricks

    5) claims based on anecdotal evidence only—porn girls willing to lie for co-stars (or for cash and coke).

    For every guy, knock off at least 1.5 inches of their claim. Probably the biggest in reality is 9 inches, which only Holmes/Steele can pull off.

    Like


  234. ” I’m not sure why this simple truth is so hard for some to grasp.”

    er… because you are wrong.

    Today, in Saudi Arabia, very few women are having pre-marital sex (outside of certain specialized circles).

    This was true in India as well, until recently. They were virgins at marriage, and cheating was just very hard to logistically execute, and too risky if caught. Period.

    Sure, you know more about it than people who actually lived there.

    Like


  235. “schoolboy- believe it or not, there are plenty of women who don’t lay about with multiple men at the same time.”

    and you are exempt from this “gangbang” how?

    Like


  236. Piglet
    I’m a strong anti-cuckoldry man, but I must respectfully dissent from Thursday’s view. Anal rape in prison seems worse to me. (Don’t you watch Oz? ;-p )
    Piglet, season 1 Alabese rapped the young Italian mobster. That poor man was never the same. They couldn’t get him to talk or anything, he just sat in bed looking at the ceiling all day.

    I’m gonna go out on a limb and say that OZ was as good as the wire.

    @chuck- the emo pete weitnz(tp) was a shocker too. Who would have thought that such a sensitive boy could be so manly.

    Like


  237. To wit: Asia Carrera, the famous porn star with the high IQ (and possibly the murderer of her husband, whose brakes got cut mysteriously close to the time she took out an insurance policy on him) stated that she would not work with a man over 8 inches.

    yet her roster of guys all looked very large on screen, even in the pre-internet days. As big as the guys claiming 9-10 inches now.

    Like


  238. Chic, you do understand the difference between fiction and reality, right?:

    “Piglet, season 1 Alabese rapped the young Italian mobster. That poor man was never the same. They couldn’t get him to talk or anything, he just sat in bed looking at the ceiling all day.”

    —its FICTION, chic. Not real.

    Like


  239. 691

    that’s the correct attitude. A guy who would take those attitudes is right to divorce. But the spineless beta, this one would never follow what you say.

    The guys who would follow your advice, or doug’s (murder) are the guys who would be benefited from divorce.

    Like


  240. twiceaday–

    There has always been plenty of cheating in India (and every other country on the planet), just as there has always been plenty of premarital sex (perhaps not in India or other places where couples were often wed before puberty, but that’s beside the point). I’m not sure why this simple truth is so hard for some to grasp.

    Numbers matter.

    Losey goosey concepts and thinking such as “there’s always been this and always been that” don’t. That’s worth crap.

    The percentage of women who cheat during marriage has gone WAY up in Anglosphere countries at least.

    If you think the fact that married women are no longer scorned for cheating on their husband as they used to be absent truly compelling circumstances, but widely sympathised with or at least treated with an “I won’t judge” attitude, hasn’t had a huge impact, you’re deluded. (Examples of the sort of compelling circumstances that used to be thought necessary before many would not judge a cheating wife harshly are: endemic and for years continued cruelty, or total and complete neglect despite concerted and extensive efforts long continued by her, combined with utter refusal to allow a divorce.)

    If you think the fact that women used to be severely punished economically in divorce if they could be proven to have cheated has not had a LARGE effect, you’re a moron.

    Feminism has caused both these changes. Feminism is directly responsible for the greatly increasing percentage of cheating wives, and the greatly increased percentage of divorce since feminism really took hold at the end of the 1960’s in some parts of society, and all over in the 1970’s.

    Like


  241. doug1, don’t forget the twin heads of the pill and abortion. They probably have encouraged it as much as feminazism.

    Like


  242. Oooooh. Bitchy little Chucky is getting prissy..

    1) Mao and Stalin were LEFT-wing. No hemming and hawing, they were left-wing, period.

    2) Hitler was left-wing. I showed you proof. You did not like it, so you ignored it.

    Chuck = SWPL Beta.

    Like


  243. Marcus Aureliette

    No individual guy will have to request it, nor deal with the relationship brouhaha that such a request would likely cause.

    I welcome the opportunity to brass out and request/demand it as a condition of getting married. See my script on that in the comments above.

    Any woman that wouldn’t easily agree, I don’t want to stay with.

    Like


  244. Chuck, by a strict definition, Hitler was left wing. He sought greater convernmental control over economic and social policies. Simply because he hated on non-whites instead of white males does not make his system any less left wing.

    Left wing groups all seek blaming some sub-group for problems and use government to reduce that group; these are always the richer groups. Commies killed lots of Jews and others, because they were wealthy; the Nazis blamed the Jews for the Weimer’s failures and non-Jewish poverty, so they killed.

    Nazis were avowed socialists. TThatw as the name of their party.

    Like


  245. Dave from Hawaii,

    Oh I know it doesn’t frequently happen but if I had my way, that’s the way things would be. if you are apart of the menz movement, it’s something you should be working on along with mpt. If I was a guy I wouldn’t sign a birth certificate until a DNA test proved the kid was mine.

    The crazy thing is, if women waited a simple three weeks before moving on to a new partner, the need for dna tests would decrease sharply.Just three short weeks Dave.

    I don’t agree with screwing up the lives of innocent children. Women need to think long and hard about who they have children with. There is too much birthcontrol available for so many women to become single parents.

    lurkerwhich only Holmes/Steele can pull off.
    lexington steele hurts his costars. Mr. Marcus puts it down. His costars really enjoy themeselves sometimes. Cuba was very popular in his day too. Some stars would make a request to work with him.

    mu Commonly this is associated w/Women as victims, although as Chic has rightly noted, kids and even other Men can and have been raped.

    Yea that sick itch from Cali comes to mind. Had she not killed the little girl, I wonder how/if the little girl would have gone on to live a normal life.

    Like


  246. anony–

    I agree with Chuck,

    Chuck: its obviously more akin to thievery or robbery

    You would.

    No, it’s more like rape. Or a regularly scheduled home invasion at gun point, once a month, for 21 years.

    A single instance of rape without issue sounds better.

    Despite all the female propaganda and hysteria about their special issues, and extraordinary lack of concern for exclusively male ones.

    Like


  247. Another way of looking at is that there is a sharp split in left wign ideology: fascists, while seeking governmental control voer economic and social policies, seek to keep nations separate from others (see Franco’s isolationism), and think that their socio-fascisitic policies will enable success of their nation over others. In other words, they are economically and socially socialistic but in terms of foreign policy they do not seek to break down borders but build them up; meat for us, not for you. Depend on each one another to beat the other.

    socialist-Commies seek to unite the economic and social strata of all people every where; no nations. meat for all. But commies avow that they cannot practice communism so long as one person holds out; therefore, socialism is only a short-term solution.

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  248. Doug

    Feminism has caused both these changes. Feminism is directly responsible for the greatly increasing percentage of cheating wives, and the greatly increased percentage of divorce since feminism really took hold at the end of the 1960’s in some parts of society, and all over in the 1970’s.

    There is little to no feminism in Asia, yet the trends are the same.

    I see the causes as financial independence, and birth control.

    All these social causes are the stories we tell ourselves.

    A woman will fuck around if she can. Period. Social shaming does not stop women – a lack of options does. Give a woman options, she will take them. Period.

    Like


  249. lurker its FICTION, chic. Not real.

    yes it was but a very powerful piece of fiction. Remember Passion of the Christ was fictiona and the actor playing Jesus was not killed. That didn’t stop audience members from having heart attacks,asema attacks,crying, and fist fights amongst themselves.

    Even thought it’s TV&fiction, it can still play with our emotions.

    Chic, have you heard of stuffing?

    I’m not lookign up Harry nude, btw
    You meen he sliced it down the middle and stuffed something inside of it?
    naw, I don’t think Harry would so such a thing cause it ain’t that serious.

    Like


  250. on May 12, 2009 at 5:31 pm Comment_Whatever

    It doesn’t matter if the kid isn’t yours. There are rules, accidentally made up for situations like this, that JUST HAPPEN, by accident, to make the husband pay. The judge screaming about your ‘contempt of court’, the police pressing a gun in your face, the screaming ‘be reasonable’ guy ‘friends’ you have, don’t like it, but they sure as hell are going to enforce it. Fully.

    http://www.menshealth.com/cda/article.do?site=MensHealth&channel=guy.wisdom&category=family.guy&conitem=4a096f83c9821110VgnVCM10000013281eac____

    Your solution to the situation is simple. Liquidate all you can, run up every credit card, and then leave the country. If you secretly tested, then your ‘wife’ will have NO IDEA that you are preparing to leave. Take a month, take two, learn a foreign language. You have a time. Then, she’ll come home and you won’t be there.

    The ONLY states that will give you, as a worthless cockolded man, justice are:
    Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Maine, Mississippi, Ohio, Virginia, and Wisconsin

    Notice, that is only 10 out of 50 states.

    Like


  251. C’mon doug1, where’s your sense of trust?

    Like


  252. Chuck:
    “yes it was but a very powerful piece of fiction. Remember Passion of the Christ was fictiona and the actor playing Jesus was not killed. That didn’t stop audience members from having heart attacks,asema attacks,crying, and fist fights amongst themselves. ”
    —um, Chuck? Non sequitor. Chic was arguing that the rape in the movie showed how rape happened or affected people in real life prison situations. It is fictional. Its affect on the audience was not at issue.

    Like


  253. The irony is strong in this post, the man who stands to benefit most from cuckoldry is lamenting the female amoral creature.

    Yet more proof that the only honest men in this world are alphas.

    Like


  254. an even simpler way to think of the fascist/commie divide is this:

    Fascist desire to put all the systems of socio-communism into place except 1) destruction of national sovreignty and 2) destruction of class.

    Like


  255. Myself I’d never agree to adopt. Children are enough of a pain and a burden that at least I’d want a genetic immortality out of it, as well as a cultural imprint.

    I’m sorry to be somewhat rude but I’ve run into this falsehood enough times here. Genetic immortality is completely illusory. You would realize this if you had any inkling of the basic facts of the genetics of sexual reproduction. In the long run, by reproducing you only make a tiny difference in allele frequencies in your gene pool. Your degree of relatedness to your direct descendents is cut in half every generation. Your great-great-great-great-grandchildren might as well be complete strangers, genetically speaking.

    The real value of having genetic children is in having the opportunity to see familiar traits develop in them. From the point of view of an extended family such as an ethnic group with relatively crisp genetic boundaries, it makes little difference who precisely does the reproducing so long as no important traits are signifigantly over-represented among those who have children.

    If you want real immortality, get with the transhumanist program already. Choose to work in some of the relevant fields of science and technology.

    Like


  256. on May 12, 2009 at 5:36 pm Dave from Hawaii

    lurker – you’re attributing chic’s argument to chuck…but that’s okay, it’s not like theirs a substantive difference between the two.

    One is a chic, and the other thinks like a chic.

    Like


  257. Chic:

    “Mr. Marcus puts it down.”

    —proof?

    “Cuba was very popular in his day too. Some stars would make a request to work with him. ”
    —again, proof? Porn whores will say anything—these are people pretending to be in love/lust with the pizza guy! Show me some data.

    Like


  258. sorry, thanks Dave. names are similar, sometiems I read too fast

    Like


  259. Wouldn’t mandatory paternity testing hurt both men and women though? If a women does have a baby with someone who isn’t her husband (shame, etc. etc.), then that means that she’d probably hold the father responsible for child support ($$$$), right? If this actually came to fruition, does that mean that men would be more cautious about sleeping around too?

    Like


  260. on May 12, 2009 at 5:39 pm Tupac Chopra

    lurker:

    Yeah, my friend (who is Muslim) told me I’d probably be best off with a Muslim girl, since they’re the only ones who actually keep their morality—even if it is on pain of death. Sadly, the Catholic ones are Catholic in name only.

    Now see here, young man. Please refrain from speaking of my Clio in that manner. She’s not one of those trollops.

    Like


  261. Obsidian-

    Moreover, in many ways, given the coercive nature of many courts etc, I would strongly argue that Cuckoldry is inherently worse than the garden variety female rape, in that the cuckold has to continue supporting a child he knows is not his own for years, and all that comes w/it in emotion and mental health terms. That Women in the main are nonplussed by this, is again, most telling.

    Exactly.

    It goes on, and on, and on, and on.

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  262. For those who are wondering about Prince Harry’s father, google “Prince Harry”, “James Hewitt”, “Charles, Earl Spencer”, and “Prince Charles”. Then tell us whether you’re still so certain that Hewitt has to be Harry’s father.

    First, Hewitt looks quite a bit like Lord Spencer. Second, Harry looks more like Lord Spencer than like Hewitt. Third, Harry has his father’s narrow, slightly too-close-together eyes, though he’s better-looking than either of his parents.

    Clio

    p.s. The reason compulsory paternity testing won’t ever be imposed (I think), is that it isn’t in the state’s interest to impose it. What if the baby turned out not to be related to his “legal” father but his mother couldn’t or wouldn’t name the biological father? Or the biological father refused to be tested? The state would then be stuck with the child-support costs.

    I don’t think that any of this is fair to men, mind you. I’d stop it if I could do so by fiat, and I would definitely tell that Post columnist to take a hike. In fact, I will do so, just to prove that I do in fact support men in this situation.

    Like


  263. porn chicks have 4 concerns in mind:

    1) how much will I get paid?

    2) will there be any coke?

    3) how famous will I be (fuck you dad!)

    4) again, how much will I get paid?

    Barring that, they’ll sleep with anyone who doesn’t tear up their vagina and doesn’t smell or otherwise hurt their earning power. This is why many refuse interracial, because it can hurt a girl’s earning power—a niche market can turn off the bigger market.

    Porn shotos last hours, not the 20 minutes a scene works, so the girl never orgasms, or if she does, its early on and she’s then being rubbed raw. Porn girls just want a guy that can stay hard, isn’t ugly (ron jeremy), and treats them acceptably.

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  264. “does that mean that men would be more cautious about sleeping around too”

    -Male pill. Vasectomy. End scene.

    Like


  265. kim–

    Wouldn’t mandatory paternity testing hurt both men and women though? If a women does have a baby with someone who isn’t her husband (shame, etc. etc.), then that means that she’d probably hold the father responsible for child support ($$$$), right? If this actually came to fruition, does that mean that men would be more cautious about sleeping around too?

    I don’t think careless sluts should get any child support. You know, like in days of yore. A few decades ago. (After all, all of the seven or eight common methods of birth control are within their sole control and knowledge. And women have always been the ones to regulate when the sex act occurs, or doesn’t — and still are.)

    Guess what, since they started to be able to, and were no longer called sluts and whores, and their issue bastards, but rather unfortunate single mothers, their number has EXPLODED. Funny that, what?

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  266. sorry, clio, but he loooks like hewitt. An dit would be natural that two lighter red-headed genese would result in a more redheaded child. its science.

    Like


  267. Since we are on this whole child support and MPT theme. Let me add this gem. Don’t for any reason give your sperm to a single woman or two lesbians who want to have a child. I don’t care if they’re your childhood friends, like a sister or any of that other BS, don’t do it I don’t care how many papers you sign and/or you assemble your own version of a dream team.

    Men have been cuckoled this way too. I read a story about two lesbians who got a guy to give them some juice and they turned around & sui they guy for child support. Can you imagine how stupid that guys feels??? He didn’t even get a chance to taste/feel the walls yet he has got to dish out his loot. If you gotta pay and least have a chance to play.

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  268. meanwhile, this is Diana’s brother:

    Like


  269. Lurker–

    A vasectomy is like a woman having her tubes tied. It must be assumed to be, and usually is (esp. after a number of years) permanent.

    Valved vasectomies on the other hand are very interesting. They’re in clinical trial in Australia. I think perhaps India as well.

    Like


  270. The reason compulsory paternity testing won’t ever be imposed (I think), is that it isn’t in the state’s interest to impose it.

    Yep. Just like marriage is bad for the state, since two single people pay more in total taxes than a married couple.

    But paternity testing need not be compulsory. All a man has to do is get a Q-tip and go get it done, secretly.

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  271. To Chuck:

    Canada: http://thescottross.blogspot.com/2009/01/man-has-to-pay-child-support-for.html

    Notice the sex of the judge.

    U.S.: http://lawvibe.com/dna-proves-not-biological-father-but-forced-to-pay-child-support/

    No hope here, 7-0.

    There are cases where a boy who was a victim of statutory rape was ordered to pay up, one where the cuckolded husband had to send child support payments to the guy that was fucking his wife and more.

    Anyhow, you asked for citations on men ordered to pay child support for kids that are not theirs and so here a couple are.

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  272. FYI, the pill is there. You just need a company to make and distribute it. It’s been around for a few years now. People in the medical community think no men will take it so that ‘s why they are having problems getting in on the market. Men who are apart of the men’s movement, get working on this.

    Like


  273. don’t do it I don’t care how many papers you sign and/or you assemble your own version of a dream team.

    That is why one donates to a bank, where you don’t know who the recipient is, and they can’t find out who you are, until the kid is 18 and chooses to contact you.

    Of course, most men don’t have this option.

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  274. I wouldn’t take it (let the woman fuck up her body if she wants); I bring my own condoms and use them. and I insist on paternity tests.

    But then again, most women in NYC don’t want to trap me into being a father and are on the pill. NYC 22 year olds are like that😉.

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  275. doug1,

    I don’t think careless sluts should get child support either, and chances are that if mandatory paternity testing was made legal, that the amount of careless sluts would go down making everyone more monogamous…including males (not by choice but because women would be scared to sleep around), no?

    Like


  276. clio First, Hewitt looks quite a bit like Lord Spencer. Second, Harry looks more like Lord Spencer than like Hewitt. Third, Harry has his father’s narrow, slightly too-close-together eyes, though he’s better-looking than either of his parents

    yea, I agree with you. Harry’s eyes look more like Prince Charles and he has the coloring of his uncle.

    Like


  277. Guess what, since they started to be able to, and were no longer called sluts and whores, and their issue bastards, but rather unfortunate single mothers, their number has EXPLODED. Funny that, what?

    Taiwan is also experiencing profound cultural changes, and many men get their wives from the mainland. It seems that if women become financially independent, they tend to become in many other ways independent. I guess you can call that “feminist”.

    The root of the reasons for Taiwanese women opting to not be good wives is financial, and related to birth control. Give a woman options…

    I see and see it and see it. There is no culture that is stronger than the economic and materialistic forces around it. If women have access to well paying jobs and birth control, they are free to fuck around as much as they like.

    Like


  278. @lurker- you can a few of mr. Marcus movie’s for yourself as well as reading about Cuba. Some stars are rougher than others and have a sort of hatred for their female costars mandingo being one of them and westly pipes being another. saw something with bella donna and rocko and was complety turned off. something ain’t right with bella donna, I don’t care what no one says. there is freaky and then there is sick.

    Like


  279. lurker bring my own condoms and use them.
    better take it with you and I hope it doesn’t break. It would be smatter to double up.

    Like


  280. On another note, it might come as a surprise that Women call virtually all of the shots in the straight Porn world; very few males can ascend into “stardom” unless they go the Gay Porn route, and many have done just that, including Peter North and Byron Long. In fact, its widely speculated that most male porn stars one sees in the movies have done at least some Gay Porn first. Barring that, the only other way to break into the business is to either be a rarified Alpha Male who can get it up, keep it hard and cum on cue while also having mad charisma that makes the ladies keep coming back for more, or, form your own porn company. This is what TT Boy has done, a Man who was nearly blacklisted outta Porn on the grounds that a number of Women didn’t want to work with him. His Evasive Angles has become a force to be reckoned with and he calls all his own shots.

    As for the size issues, I’m not surprised that there’s not much truth in advertising in Porn, lol. This happens with big bust porn stars as well, playing around w/their bra cup size and the like. And, again, we have to remember-most Women don’t particularly care for a Mandingo/Lexington Steele type of endowment, as Chic noted, that can be quite painful for most Women. The Size Queens of the world are almost all Gay and Male. Very few Women are into that sort of thing.

    Most of the Sisters I’ve spoken with report they tend to favor Mr. Marcus over Steele, Mandingo, and others, and as he’s not nearly as endowed, this seems to confirm my own views that such things aren’t the number one concerns of most Women.

    Personally, my problem w/most porn in our time is its utter lack of sexual chemistry, to say nothing of the piss poor condition of the male stars, who have NO seduction skills at all. Most Women don’t get wet during their scenes, the editing is fast and choppy, etc. Its quite a bore to watch most porn these days, I know it is for me.

    Anyway, back to the MPT debate…

    O

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  281. Gig —

    Paternity testing kits are cheap and easy. They were a plot issue in “Veronica Mars” during it’s run about five years ago, and they have gotten cheaper and easier since.

    And the social driver, absent the clueless beta in this instance, is to make most marriages where cuckolding is true, dissolve quickly, often with the man doing his best to “punish” the woman by hiding assets and so on, and many more men refusing to get married.

    “Enough” women exposed as cuckolds and it’s the same thing as counterfeit currency. Even is the majority of women don’t cheat, most men will treat them as if they do. This is particularly true for men considering marriage.

    Most men would like marriage, since it’s a good deal for them, in terms of companionship and reproduction. But faced with a real risk of raising another guy’s kid, a lot of guys will simply refuse marriage and adopt “spread your seed” attitudes. It won’t happen overnight but can happen fairly rapidly.

    In 1950’s Britain, White working class men were mostly faithful, married, relatively meek, law abiding, and mild. By the 1980’s, around thirty years later, that changed considerably and by the 1990’s almost no White British working class men were married, nearly all (90% or more) had adopted “spread your seed” tactics.

    The bad news for women is that human beings including men are flexible. Men can and will quickly adapt to cuckolding by even a minority of women by going forward with spread-your-seed.

    Johnnymarks — that is a terrible thing to say and you should be ashamed of yourself. Cheating is bad, it’s not worthy of what you describe which should be limited to things like bin Laden. Societies where women are treated like cattle are no better than ones where women hold unlimited social and sexual power. No real man would react emotionally LIKE A WOMAN. Cheating is distressing, the only appropriate response is to remove one’s self from any such woman as quickly as possible and bang as many girls as possible. Anything else is acting like a woman with lots of testosterone.

    Act like a goddamn man. Men CONTROL their emotions.

    Anony — It does not MATTER what the state will do (typical female response by the way). Enough men will Paternity test because it’s cheap and easy and they’d like to know. Some men, weak, feminized, deplorable, will give way to cheap and easy emotion and murder their wives or do terrible things. Others, men in the real sense of the word, will simply divorce them and hide as many assets as possible and move on with their lives.

    [Women LOVE and almost to a woman support forcing beta men to pay for cuckolding and support, while worshipping guys like Obama, Edwards, and Clinton, who were Alpha Males cheating on their wives.]

    But for most, men will treat women as a currency with significant counterfeits. ANY commitment at all will require extensive “test and proof” just like nations with large amounts of counterfeit bills have transactions achingly slow as everyone checks laboriously for counterfeits.

    Women cannot FORCE men to commit and get married. Enough women cuckold men who do so, and pretty much most men will simply act like Roissy or G.

    As for wiping the beta from the gene pool, all that does is make the next generations of children the result of aggressive, socially dominant men. IQ, and particularly IQ related to abstract thinking (technology, biological science, engineering) will all collapse. Since notorious womanizers are notably absent from those fields and certainly the mass of work required to create technological advances. Even the Wright Brothers and Edison depended on a whole network of other “beta” men who provided light-weight gasoline engines, or electrical wires and batteries, for their basic research.

    We already know what a female paradise of “spread your seed” looks like: the Congo.

    Xsplat: The Mighty culture of Mongolia is shaped by Ghengis Khan, who must have monopolized nearly all fertile women to produce today, centuries later, 15% of all men in direct male descent. So icky awful data suggests that Alpha male societies (Afghanistan, Mongolia, Congo, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia) are absent oil discoveries violent failures that produce nothing and easy prey for cooperative beta men who enforce female fidelity.

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  282. Kim–

    that the amount of careless sluts would go down making everyone more monogamous…including males (not by choice but because women would be scared to sleep around), no?

    I think it would have a big effect on female carelessness but a much smaller effect on sleeping around.

    After all, girls at elite colleges especially if they have grad school in mind really, really don’t want to get preggers, by and large. In fact they almost always get abortions if they do become preggers, in my experience. This has not dampened the amount of casual sex at elite colleges compared to elsewhere in this age group, from what I can tell. If anything, this age group at top colleges does more rather than less quick rotation hooking up, compared to those in the workforce, from what I’ve seen.

    But would there be a decrease in children born to unwed mothers if the unwed didn’t get child support? Oh yeah.

    Like


  283. Roissy,

    You have been off on the last few posts…but this is dead on and important. Thank you for telling it as it is.

    Like


  284. dave Yeah…but what does this have to do with our debate about the equivalence between rape and cuckoldry?
    I wrote that I don’t think the two are equivalent. I guess that’s just my way of looking at things. I don’t harp on soemthin over and over for the most part.

    I think my response to doug just about covered it.
    You do known that sometimes men are raped as well as molested as children. Men who have been raped are as troubled about it as women. Some people never get over it. That feeling that someone took something from you that wasn’t theirs to take. Someone that is such a part of your being human and possibly exposing you to diseases and pregnancy

    Like


  285. Peter North and Byron Long.

    NOOOOOOOOO not peter north. He was one of the few who looks to give his female costars a good time. Byron long is the very light skinned brother right?

    Like


  286. As for artificial wombs and sexbots, I think most men have already created a classic case of substitution.

    For companionship and sociability: the “bromance” and hanging out with male buddies.

    For sex, pr0n. Which is a trillion dollar industry, making money constantly.

    Reproduction? Probably not, absent the wife who is faithful, I don’t see much impetus or desire for men to reproduce. Which creates a genetic bottleneck, guys who are lower in testosterone but higher in IQ in particular with unbounded female freedom and choice get frozen out of the reproduction market, absent Game and spread your seed.

    What you’ll see is on the bottom end, endless thugs as the only ones reproducing (lower socio-economic scale). For middle and upper income women, only Game type Alphas will impregnate them. With all due respect to Roissy and Roosh, these types of guys are unlikely to provide the next generation of engineers, bio-med researchers, geneticists, scientists, and mathematicians who will power our technological advances.

    What’s likely is Congo-like attitudes on the bottom and decadent aristocrats on the top and middle end.

    Which is already creating a crisis for women wanting Beta Men to marry them. Women play the field (particularly for women in their twenties) always chasing the more Alpha guy in the bar that night. In their thirties they’ve racked up 30-50 sex partners easily, and want to get serious. Female bloggers like “Dawn Summers” have noted how hard it is for them to date quality men, the few men who will date women in their thirties are either bitter betas, or quite lacking in attractiveness and social qualities.

    Most higher quality beta men have concluded that pr0n and male companionship beats being a cuckolded beta in a loveless marriage. Alphas are busy with girls in their twenties. A woman in her thirties is worthy of only pump and dump.

    Men have REACTED already to the shift in female power and selection. Most women just are not going to get married, as they age into their thirties, and they’ll just have to deal with that.

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  287. Chic,
    The Male Pill is irrelevant; the issue wrt Paternity Fraud is that the Man was deceived into caring for a child not his own. Period. This is what must be rectified. MPT is one such way to address this.

    As for porn, I believe Belladonna has the interesting distinction of successfully deepthroating Lexington Steele. I haven’t seen this myself but have read about the feat. Wesley Pipes I consider to be a hoot, the guy’s funny. At least I think he is.

    There are guys in porn who could be considered misogynistic, but we have to remember as well, that quite a few Women like their sex rough n ready. So, I say to each his or her own.

    O

    Like


  288. Something tells me that a lot of people on here who support mandatory paternity testing also disapprove of legal abortions…but that’s just a guess.

    Anyway, I personally just don’t think that mandatory paternity testing would really help make society a better place. I get what people are saying about it and why they think it’s a good idea…but it just seems a bit radical to me. Like someone above mentioned…guilty until proven innocent doesn’t seem fair to me.

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  289. whiskey

    So icky awful data suggests that Alpha male societies (Afghanistan, Mongolia, Congo, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia)

    I’m not informed on the geographical spread of his seed, but are you correct that it was in the countries you listed? And even so, how do you know that his 15% is not a net boon, rather than drain, on the society?

    I get your point – the tecnically inclined are a social strength, and I agree that such people often lack social skills. Still and all, geeks get paid well, and don’t seem to be suffering badly, in the sexual marketplace.

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  290. How the hell can Caroline Hax dissuade the man from getting a paternity test? It is so cheap, easy, and discreet.

    I suspect Caroline Hax has herself cuckolded her husband, which is why she is being evasive and wants to scold the Beta male for being beta.

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  291. Why the fuss? Hax is a hack. Besides she’s only defending her gender. And there are no limits when self-preservation is at stake.

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  292. ROISSY!!!!

    Listen what a culture slowly destroys the drive to reproduce among its people, the population that follows that culture withers away.

    The world doesn’t end, only those who follow the directive to NOT reproduce cease to exist.

    Call it “Cultural Darwinism” if you will….. (btw this is not a scientific term I just made it up)

    Now…. what culture will replace the present one? Simple a culture that values polygamy and encourages both men and women to procreate.

    And it is already happening:

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  293. Mu Most of the Sisters I’ve spoken with report they tend to favor Mr. Marcus over Steele, Mandingo, and others, and as he’s not nearly as endowed, this seems to confirm my own views that such things aren’t the number one concerns of most Women.

    yea there is just something about Mr. Marcus. Besides being very handsome and one heck of a licker. he just radiates manliness on screen. He seems alpha but a little beta(shy and sweet) at the same time while being able to fix your car or the plumbing in your kitchen zinc.

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  294. Why the fuss? Hax is a hack. What can you expect? After all, she’s defending her gender. And there are no limits — moral, ethical, logical or otherwise — when self-preservation is at stake.

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  295. @Mu- Obsession is one of the few females who looks like she is really enjoying herself.

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  296. on May 12, 2009 at 6:24 pm Dave from Hawaii

    That feeling that someone took something from you that wasn’t theirs to take. Someone that is such a part of your being human and possibly exposing you to diseases and pregnancy

    Oh? And you think the cuckolded man doesn’t feel like someone took something from him that wasn’t theirs to take? Like his own family? His offspring? His Wife’s Matirmonial Vows?

    Something like your own offspring is certainly part of being a human….and not to mention possibly exposing you to tremendous heartbreak in finding out that the child you may have spent YEARS supporting, raising and caring for is NOT YOUR OWN?

    Sorry chic, you will never understand that cuckoldry can be just as much if not worse of a violation of a man’s basic human rights as the rape of a female.

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  297. Dave

    Sorry chic, you will never understand that cuckoldry can be just as much if not worse of a violation of a man’s basic human rights as the rape of a female.

    And what would be her motivation to understand? The search for truth, goodness, and beauty?

    Ha. When attributing intentionality to women, cynicism is a habit better than trust.

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  298. “better take it with you and I hope it doesn’t break. It would be smatter to double up.”

    -Chic, you do know that doubling up on condoms *reduces* their effectiveness, right?

    and your basic opinion on which male porn stars are beloved is based on…the kinds of movies they do? Not real convincing there. Id take a stat on who was requested.

    O, I hear you. In fact, many female stars are allowed a “No” list, of male porn stars they’ll never work with. Most, like you have supposed, base it on size—they don’t want to be torn up. Most women want a man who is above average in all respects (height, looks, money, penis size, smarts, etc.) but not extremely above average—especially penis size.

    Most female stars are beat up after 3-5 years–it’s the same shelf life of an NFL running back, and, if you think about it, they both take the same amount of people pounding them (heh). Even MILF porn stars usually start late (28-29) and are flabby messes in half a decade, despite their “experience.”

    However, if you become a “studio girl” you can last a long time now . Studio girls—girls who sign exclusive long term contracts with big porn studios, like (or maybe only) Vivid–are carefully controlled: the studio only puts them in high quality productions, limits the numbers of scenes or men they take per year, limits exposure in magazines and stripping, prevents them escorting (how many girls make extra money on the sly), etc. That includes barring them from being in most internet porn (good bye Bang Bus).

    They set up P.R. as well; Howard Stern doesn’t choose them as guests blindly, you know.

    This is, sneakily, how Jenna Jameson lasted so long–she limtied her exposure so she was the desireable whore.

    ‘Course studios only invest contract money in top quality girls; ugly or plainer girls don’t get the protection. Notice how Bree Olsen isn’t so available anymore on downloads —or maybe that’s just me—she signed a contract.

    And now, with my in depth knowledge of porn industry insider information, I will now light myself on fire.

    Like


  299. Obsidian
    Chic,
    The Male Pill is irrelevant; the issue wrt Paternity Fraud is that the Man was deceived into caring for a child not his own. Period.

    Actually it’s not. Prevention is the best type of protection. If a woman comes to you and says she pregnant you can tell her “hell no, it’s not mine”. Then proceed to tell her that your on birthcontrol . IIRC there was a man here who posted such a story just that he had had a vasectomy.

    Like


  300. lurker -Chic, you do know that doubling up on condoms *reduces* their effectiveness, right?
    Lurker, doubling up with the male pill and condoms not two condoms.

    Like


  301. “That feeling that someone took something from you that wasn’t theirs to take.”

    So sort of like when a girl says “I’m on the pill” or the equivalent?

    “possibly exposing you to diseases and pregnancy”

    So sort of like when a girl cheats on you, perhaps all virused out and, well, pregnancy which (unlike a woman) you have no say so over?

    If it is diseases and pregnancy which makes a rape so awful, then cuckoldry is actually worse in as much as it has the same things but one more on top: threats of prison if you don’t pay up the cash for something you have no say so about.

    Not saying that this *is* what makes rape so horrible, but if that is what makes it so horrible, then cuckoldry + pregnancy is worse.

    Like


  302. This guy needs a lawyer. I think he’ll find out he is screwed. There is a statue of limitations to challenging paternity.

    He should just come straight out and ask for a paternity test.I don’t think if their marriage is happy she will be so unhappy to take the test. If she loves him, she will have no problem reassuring him. It could even flatter her, by making her realize that he appreciates how sexy she is.

    If she refuses, that’s your answer.

    The reluctance of women to allow such testing is all the argument you need, as men, for insist on this testing.

    This is just an example of the mistreatment of men in our society. He will be forced to pay child support no matter what the testing shows. The woman will suffer not the slightest legal or financial penalty. He should divorce her if the child is not his. After all, this will just happen again and again. He deserves better. Betas are essentially good people. They have just believed all the lies.

    Like


  303. O, one reason female stars are in power is that guys just want a generic cock in there—a cock that looks like their’s. Its the hotness and wildness of the chick that matters.

    Some guys, like lex steele on being black and extreme, or North, being a large firehouse, get famous, but most guys just need to be reliable and generic.

    Like


  304. lurker and your basic opinion on which male porn stars are beloved is based on…the kinds of movies they do?
    No there costars reactions.

    Not real convincing there. Id take a stat on who was requested.
    read intervews of movie directors. That’s where I got my info from.

    Even MILF porn stars usually start late (28-29) and are flabby messes in half a decade, despite their “experience.”
    Nina Hartley is an exception. I bet Peter loves Nina.

    And now, with my in depth knowledge of porn industry insider information, I will now light myself on fire.
    LOL
    DA said you don’t know jack buddy.

    Like


  305. Chic, I ain’t fucking like that. Rather have somethign I can remove than a pill messing with my chemistry.

    I’ve been with many girls who refuse the pill for the same reason–its too important an area for something like that. That’s fine—my own condoms and shooting on their face works just as well.

    Lick it up, bitch!

    Like


  306. said to the tune of
    “no shirt, no shoes, no diiiiiice!” from fast times at ridgemont high.

    Just say….

    “no prenup, no dna test, no deal!”

    Like


  307. Ya, Chic, guys with vasectomies get that drama all the time. Sure, that works. So does paternity testing.

    Paternity testing is even better. You know what I love? I love it when the spider has me in her web, only to discover that I’m the real spider. I use a woman’s spider lair as my spider lair. I make her trap into my trap.

    Like


  308. lurker:

    didn’t write anything about “Passion of the Christ”

    Like


  309. Chic:

    “No there costars reactions”
    —so your stat is how well a porn star fakes her orgasm. Not strong Chic, not strong.

    “read intervews of movie directors. That’s where I got my info from.”
    —that I would take, but the msot requested list works better.

    “Nina Hartley is an exception. I bet Peter loves Nina.”
    —Nina quit for several years to live ina threesome. And looking at her now makes you cry for the cruelty of time.

    Like


  310. Nina Hartley is an exception. I bet Peter loves Nina.

    chic, don’t derail the thread. this one is too juicy and i want you to savor every pertinent comment. it has been delightful for me to witness the reactions of the women here confirming all my predictions.

    Like


  311. lurker Chic, I ain’t fucking like that. Rather have somethign I can remove than a pill messing with my chemistry

    I can respect this. I will say that I’ve taken something and my body became a little weird. I knew someone who had to be hospitalized for while behind her choice of BC.

    FUN female to female Joke: The reason they call it birth control is because it takes away your desire.

    Yup stuff made me dryer than the Sahara and colder than Greenland.

    and shooting on their face works just as well.
    A man was arrested for doing something of the such resently.

    Like


  312. Chic,
    I’m familiar w/Obsession and largely agree w/your assessment. She also seems one of the relatively few Women in porn who enjoy giving good blowjobs w/lots of spit.

    I haven’t noticed Mr. Marcus to be particularly adept at eating pussy but I’ll take your word for it. What I will say is that a Man learning how to make a Woman arch her back and make like Niagra Falls on the strength of his tongue certainly can’t hurt. This comes from direct personal experience.

    Kim,
    I do indeed support MPT and I am Pro Life. I fail to see your point; please explain?

    O

    Like


  313. chic, don’t derail the thread.
    no problem sir

    but i wasn’t trying to derail I just saw her as Peter’s type.
    this one is too juicy and i want you to savor every pertinent comment.
    why me?

    it has been delightful for me to witness the reactions of the women here confirming all my predictions.
    UH I could have told you that most women won’t agree.

    Like


  314. Chuck–

    You asked for links to cases in various states (and the UK, Canada and Australia) where men have been required to pay the full freight child support for the full statutory period for children which DNA tests have proven are not his. I’ve seen this many times. I don’t have them at hand. I could easily dig them up. So can you. Do your own looking. It’s a fact. I know of NO examples of an Anglosphere court (which was not reversed) holding that a man who’s acted as the father to a child for more than two years has been allowed to not pay full freight child support. Not a single one.

    i’m just trying to tamp down the hyperbole around this issue that’s all, i agree with the roissy’s sentiment and POV. men are getting screwed, but when we start playing the victim card, crying that our gender is being raped, i wonder how long it is before our “masculinity movement” turns into a slightly higher T-leveled feminist movement, complete with shirllness.

    First I’m not worried about “higher T-level feminists in a movement or otherwise. The only thing that makes feminist arguments effective is when they get lots of male support. That’s generally based upon misinformation, and a failure for contrary men to get their message out.

    As far as playing the victim goes, that’s the wrong way to look at it. Sure that charge will be thrown or more often implied. (That’s what “bitter” and similar that is reflexively thrown out by feminists including here sometimes, is all about. Doesn’t work so well on men that have a long history of success with hot women.)

    Anyone can suffer from unjust laws aimed at them as a group. In that sense men as a group are victims.

    The notion that alphas are never divorced is simply untrue. It’s also not impossible that an alpha could have a cheating wife conceive a child by another alpha, and hide it from her husband, who she really doesn’t want to lose. Some women are sluts. Some women who were goodish to catch a catch of a husband allow themselves to relax and become sluts later.

    Read cheating wives blogs. Although most seem to be married to higher betas, some seem to be married to alphas of one kind or another. Women almost always say there’s something wrong with their husband to deflect blame from themselves for cheating, which residually remains although just barely in many corners of our culture.

    Sometimes though it’s pretty clear that she’d cheat on ANYONE after awhile, unless she was terrified of ending up on the street with a kid with little to no money. There really does seem to be something to Michelle Langley’s theory (taken from some in socio biology / evo psych) that women tend to have a four year period of strongly bonding with a man they fall deeply in love with, but thereafter it’s often much weakened, and especially if she has a high sex drive, she’s likely to look for her next attractive man, who’s attraction to her renews her sense of special female worth.

    Consider how long Hollywood alpha male marriages last, particularly to celebrity equals or near equals.

    Yeah it’s less likely that alphas will be cheated on or have their wife bear another’s child. But it still happens.

    Like


  315. @lurker- you can almost always tell a faker or at least I can.

    Like


  316. Cptnplm:

    From the link about the man in Florida ordered to pay support for a child that wasn’t his.

    “Unfortunately, however, Florida has a one-year statute of limitations to prove fraud after a divorce, and Parker didn’t file in time.”

    The fact that he has to pay for another man’s child makes me sick to my stomach. I would move to another country, but unfortunately, they got him on an unrelated legal technicality which makes this case somewhat different.

    I do not doubt whatsoever that the legal system in this country would force a man to pay for a child that isn’t his, I’m merely arguing that those taking roissy’s claim that this is akin to “male rape” are misguided in their analogy.

    it’s highway robbery, and really, it’s just as bad. i’m merely arguing a semantical point here because i cringe when i think of men playing the rape victim card given that rape has a certain connotation of weakness that being robbed doesn’t really carry.

    Like


  317. on May 12, 2009 at 6:43 pm michael farris

    “a real man couldn’t care less if his ex-wife’s child of another man’s seed were to be exposed on a hilltop to hungry vultures.”

    I guess this also means a real man doesn’t care if his changeling children are exposed on a hilltop to hungry vultures.

    That would explain why alphas aren’t necessarily the evolutionary powers they think they are – they really don’t care about their children whether changeling or legitimate (assuming they ever try to commit).

    Betas might raise some changelings along the way but they also have a better track record of raising and protect their own kids to reproductive age. Alphas are basically turtles, they reproduce without knowing it and abandon their children to the caprices of fate.

    Like


  318. @chuck- A smarter bit would be to take custody of the child if you are attached to the child. I read about such a case where the cockuled husband/ex husband to his wife to court and won. if you really want to sock it to her, make her pay child support.

    Like


  319. I predict that this comment box will reach 900 comments before 12 midnight. Wow, nothing gets men going like this topic.

    FYI, you can purchase DNA testing kits in CVS.

    Like


  320. Chic

    FUN female to female Joke: The reason they call it birth control is because it takes away your desire.

    Yup stuff made me dryer than the Sahara and colder than Greenland.

    I read on newscientist.com that for some women the pill causes PERMANENT loss of libido.

    I always advocate Diane as the pill of choice – seems to have less adverse side affects, such as hair loss and bad temper, and sometimes makes the tits grow and grow.

    By the way, I previously posted here under the name Guy Noir, and wondered if you saw that and chose your name, or if you’ve been here longer, and I saw your name and subconsciously chose that one.

    Like


  321. Joe, I bet cuckoldry has very little to do with how attractive the woman is..

    anyone got stats on this?

    Roissy, how about a combined “cuckodress or not?” poll combined wiht a hotness rating/scale challenge?

    Like


  322. on May 12, 2009 at 6:49 pm Dave from Hawaii

    I predict that this comment box will reach 900 comments before 12 midnight. Wow, nothing gets men going like this topic.

    Sorta like the topic of rape with women, eh?

    Like


  323. on May 12, 2009 at 6:50 pm Marcus Aureliette

    Doug:
    I welcome the opportunity to brass out and request/demand it as a condition of getting married. See my script on that in the comments above.

    Any woman that wouldn’t easily agree, I don’t want to stay with.

    That’s entirely your prerogative, but it’s possible that not all men share your taste for confrontation. They still deserve to not be deceived about the paternity of the child they’ll be supporting, and making the test mandatory would accomplish that with far less potential drama.

    Like


  324. Chic: “you can almost always tell a faker or at least I can.”
    —why does every woman think her bullshit detector is the best on the planet? Probably b/c they each think they spew the most as well.

    No one can tell. That’s why I no longer care.

    Like


  325. MPT is the greatest idea since denying women the right to vote.

    Like


  326. Chic,
    OK I’ll bite-which of the better known female porn stars are faking it in your view? I’d be interested in hearing your views.

    O

    Like


  327. O:

    “Let me be clear: the very nature of Cuckoldry is indeed a form of rape, if, we accept that rape is the violation of another’s body on sexual grounds.”

    But O, rape is the violation of one’s body on sexual grounds because of the physical act of unwanted touching. Rape has a definition already:

    http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Rape

    It is forcible sexual relations with a person against that person’s will.

    there are plenty of other legal terms for what happens to a cuckolded man; robbery, theft, breach of contract etc. there is no need to alter the definition to fit a hyperbolic statement.

    “Here, a Man is violated on sexual grounds”

    no, the grounds upon which he was violated involved sexual activity, but he was not violated sexually per se. there is a difference here.

    “he is led to believe that he is investing time, emotions and resources/money into a child he believes is his own but very well may not be, and the child is the product of sexual actions taken on the part of his wife and another Man, yet he’s led to believe his own sexual acts have brought the child about. ”

    very well. she’s a raging cunt, i agree. i wouldn’t care if she were locked up in prison.

    Like


  328. Obsidian,

    Sorry, part of that is my fault because I forgot to put that it was a response to Doug. Anyway, if you look at his comment to me above he is saying that MPT wouldn’t have an effect on sleeping around because girls have control over most birth control methods and can get abortions. My argument was that MTP would mean a more monogamous society for both men and women because women would be more scared of sleeping around and cheating. Also, I think that men would probably be more cautious about it too because MTP would mean they’d end up being more responsible for children they produced with random women.

    Like


  329. Doug

    There really does seem to be something to Michelle Langley’s theory (taken from some in socio biology / evo psych) that women tend to have a four year period of strongly bonding with a man they fall deeply in love with, but thereafter it’s often much weakened, and especially if she has a high sex drive, she’s likely to look for her next attractive man, who’s attraction to her renews her sense of special female worth.

    Consider how long Hollywood alpha male marriages last, particularly to celebrity equals or near equals.

    Ya, I prefer the realists attitude as well, and tend to try to have it sit well with my personal emotional attitudes.

    Women are what they are. Rented.

    Like


  330. kim–

    Something tells me that a lot of people on here who support mandatory paternity testing also disapprove of legal abortions…but that’s just a guess.

    I support abortions. Enthusiastically. (So btw does Roissy.) I think there should be a lot more of them. I think an infant should only be brought into the world when both bio parents want to have and raise that child.

    I’m so in favor of abortion rights that I think men should have them too. No, not the right to order a woman under the knife (really in most cases the suction device). Instead the right to abort his obligation to support the child (in a timely manner the woman can take into account in making her own decisions), but with that all rights of visitation or otherwise of parenthood if she goes forward and births the infant and doesn’t give it up of adoption.

    Anyway, I personally just don’t think that mandatory paternity testing would really help make society a better place. I get what people are saying about it and why they think it’s a good idea…but it just seems a bit radical to me. Like someone above mentioned…guilty until proven innocent doesn’t seem fair to me.

    Et tu Brute? I’m really disappointed in you for that Kim, truly. I though you could put yourself into a man’s position better than that, as so many men try to do with women. *sigh*

    It would be a better place for a lot of men. Is that completely unimportant to you?

    It would also make a lot of women more careful — both in deciding to have and affair and in being careless, or even subconsciously excited, about getting pregnant if she does. (Of course if theirs is one of the tiny minority of true willing cuckold relationships that extend to “pregnancy play” or intentions, that’s fully consensual. Just covering all the bases here.)

    Requiring paternity tests of all women SELF EVIDENTLY DOES NOT assume that all married women are guilty of both cheating and doing it in a manner that allows a real possibility of having gotten pregnant that way. Instead it assumes that some percentage of women fall into this category, and that in some of those cases that will have occurred, and that their husband ought to be able to find out. That later assumption is in fact not that, but a FACT.

    So the whole stated basis for your objection is totally bogus.

    Like


  331. Chuck, its unwanted touching if my dick or wallet has touched the seed of another man and not known it wasn’t my own.

    Like


  332. Guys, it is basically a waste of time arguing with females about the evils of false paternity attribution. They are your enemies on this issue; they really cannot help themselves. The best they will ever do is grant that cheating a man in this way is sort of bad, then say, “Yes, but…”
    Just get testing the done. You do not need a womans permission. Besides, the brave new world of genetic-based medicine will solve the problem automatically, with or without female approval.
    One reason that mandatory testing will prevail is that women obviously do not know who the father is in many cases so what is the point of asking them? It is just stupid to even ask them.

    Like


  333. O,they all are. The scenese are 3-4 hours long. They might get 1-2 orgasms right away, but the rest is fuck-fuck-fuck-pause-pause–bang-bang-bang….. you cut 3 hours down to 20 minutes, and nothing there is real.

    Like


  334. on May 12, 2009 at 6:59 pm michael farris

    MPT would only work if women could call in suspected ‘real’ fathers to be tested (and a man found responsible for a married woman’s pregnancy was forced to pay support for the child instead of the husband).

    Men basically have very low standards about casual sex partners (and unrealistic ones toward wives) and women have different standards for casual sex partners vs husbands. You’ve gotta crack down on both or neither.

    Like


  335. on May 12, 2009 at 7:02 pm Let fury have the hour!

    “A universal criticism of men has become their emotional withdrawal, their inability to convey their emotions, their inability to communicate and that they are not good at expressing their feelings. The assumption being made is that the feelings men are suppressing are supposed to be nice feelings and are not to be held back. That assumption is derived from liberated women’s egocentric premise that men should automatically be an unconditional source of good feelings at convenience instead of being independent entities. The feelings he’s not communicating are supposed be nice because that’s what would be useful for other people. That’s an erroneous assumption. It’s my observation that the nation should encourage this condition of emotional repression and pray to whatever deity is currently in vogue that it continue. If the serious men in this country began to regain their capacity for indignation and express the backlog of barely-controlled wrath they are repressing, there is likely to be an all-out civil war.” You ever read this guy Kocher? http://members.mountain.net/theanalyticpapers/polam13.htm

    Like


  336. Michale, jigga wha?

    Women can sue for paternity/child support now, so your issue is moot. What we’re talking about here is a father not being sold into slavery.

    “You’ve gotta crack down on both or neither.”
    —A cheating whore is worse than a man who cheats. This “equality” bullshit is just that: bullshit.

    Like


  337. Kim
    Yea, you hit on another very important point which again, is interestingly sidestepped by the feminists-MPT would greatly cool out the deadbeat daddy issue, by ensuring beyond a shadow of a doubt that so and so IS the baby daddy and as such he’s gotta pay. I mean, there’s really no logical, rational reason as to why a Woman wouldn’t want MPT-its good for the child.

    Again, I fail to see your connection btw pro MPT supporters, and their views one way or another wrt Abortion. Please explain?

    O

    Like


  338. Doug

    Et tu Brute? I’m really disappointed in you for that Kim, truly. I though you could put yourself into a man’s position better than that, as so many men try to do with women. *sigh*

    Ha! Oh, to be naive again. I almost miss it.

    Women do not think as men do. They think emotionally and for purely selfish ends. When they appear to act socially, it is in the better interest of their groups, often womens groups.

    They have no use for truth. They can’t use truth, when emotions are involved.

    I know of no exceptions that are worth fucking.

    Like


  339. Tood:
    “This was true in India as well, until recently. They were virgins at marriage, and cheating was just very hard to logistically execute, and too risky if caught. Period.

    Sure, you know more about it than people who actually lived there.”

    I haven’t lived there myself, but I’ve heard numerous accounts of cheating from people who did in the 30s and 40s. Yes, many were virgins at marriage, but many were married at 12 or 13 (some as early as 9). And since when have logistics gotten in the way of libido?

    Like


  340. “And since when have logistics gotten in the way of libido?”
    –when the consequences (pregnancy, societal condemnation, loss of finances) outweighed the benefits.

    Like


  341. Doug,

    Hey now. I said that I get it. I just think getting the government involved in stuff like this isn’t helpful. I feel the same way about child support. The government is involved in too much already, but unfortunately most people in this world are irresponsible fucks who ruin it for everyone and then require the government to step in to make things “fair.”

    I also am glad you support abortions. I feel the exact same way…that in most cases a child would be better off not being born than being born into some sort of destructive unloving situation or being born and put into an orphanage.

    Like


  342. POS:
    although I enjoy your hypertensive histrionics,

    funny, you don’t sound like you enjoy it.

    I fear it interferes with your comprehension.

    braced for your backpedal, i am.

    -my concern is for the loneliness of men who can not trust (ie. Roissy’s campfire here), not for betas.

    anony you have lost all perspective. my words must have shaken you to your core. the kind of men who trust women the least are the same kind of men who rarely go without the company of women.
    mull it over.

    -I share your contempt of cheating and cuckholding women

    your shucking and jiving on this subject says otherwise.

    -MPT would presume guilt until proven innocence; a toxic presumption.

    what do you think a marriage contract is but a presumption of “guilt” that one or the other partner may pack up and leave on the slightest pretext?
    yet there is nothing inherently toxic about taking marital vows (or at least there wasn’t until recent history). it doesn’t destroy “trust in the state” to agree to its legally binding conditions.
    although, destroying some trust in the state wouldn’t be a bad thing for the USA at this time.

    DNA testing may be easy, but mandating it would destroy trust of women by the state.

    government mandates lots of things that hinder this amorphous “trust” you blather on about in a transparently feeble effort to find some loophole with which you can escape the serious reduction of your ovarian power that MPT threatens to bring.
    for instance, the state mandates that teenagers have to take a driver’s exam to earn a license to drive. this is an aknowledgement by the state of a lack of trust in teenagers’ self-taught driving skills. do you think driver’s tests are a “toxic presumption”?

    put simply, “but don’t you TRUST me??” is not a legitimate line of argument. and judging by your hostility to MPT on this humble blog, any state distrust of women may not be misplaced.

    -“trust but verify” really means “no trust” in the context of an intimate long-term commitment.

    you can bitch all you want but you can’t deny it worked to bring down the soviet empire.
    and really, isn’t that your main beef? that MPT will work as intended? by which i mean, it will work to remove an unfair mating market advantage that women currently possess.

    -I, and I suspect most women, would support a cuckholded beta to demand recompense for misappropriated paternity.

    MPT at birth would save so much time and energy, not to mention the psychological sanity of the parties involved.
    but if it’s recompense you support, you should be prepared for what exactly that entails. 18 years is a LOT of backpay the whore is gonna owe her cuckolded hubbie.

    somehow i doubt that when the MPT rubber hits the road and the lawyers are clamoring for restitution to the cuckolds that would nearly impoverish the whore mothers who dragged them into their web of lies for years, you’ll be at the forefront of the MPT movement cheering the handover of your gender’s power.

    Like


  343. Rum

    Rum

    Guys, it is basically a waste of time arguing with females about the evils of false paternity attribution. They are your enemies on this issue; they really cannot help themselves.

    A breath of fresh air. Thanks.

    I don’t understand why MEN are arguing for the state to help them to obtain a paternity test.

    I need a beer. Hey, state, get me a beer.

    Like


  344. When just seeking the truth could change your life in dramatic and irreversible ways, it’s best to start not by actually doing something but by inviting each possible truth into your imagination as fact.

    I think she means something along the lines of, “Don’t ask questions to which you’re not ready to hear the answer”. Which I think is good advice in general. Prepare yourself for the worst so that you’re not so overwhelmingly surprised by the answer that you blow your brains out upon groking it.

    Of course I agree with you on what the guy should do.

    Like


  345. Obsidian,

    I guess basically…I feel that if MTP ever came about that abortions would most likely be made illegal. It just seems like a government that would implement that would also take away legal abortions. Meaning…a lot more unwanted children, but hey, at least they know who their parents are, even if they don’t actually want them.

    Obviously there is no way to prove that because I doubt any sort of research has been done between the two…but I’m sure someone on here will be able to find some mysterious statistic somewhere.

    Like


  346. kim, that is simply not logical; that is feminist bullshit to the extreme.

    I hate abortion. i want it made illegal. i want doctors and women who get abortions to be thrown in prisons. But this has no relation to that at all. That you can’t draw any sense of a connection between the two betrays your feminist fear that cheating whores will be right castigated for being cheating whores, and left in the penniless destitution they so richly deserve.

    This is Kim’s last salvo—she’s reaching out to Roissy and other pro-abortion guys to try to prevent their rising up.

    Thye’re too smart for thsi bait. And so am I.

    Like


  347. xplat I read on newscientist.com that for some women the pill causes PERMANENT loss of libido.

    could this have happened to me😯 maybe this is why I only like the lick?

    @Mu- I don’t want to hyjack the thread but I will say india, sometimes sky blue and the other petite girl like india, i think her name starts with an L or something.

    Like


  348. aliasclio–

    I don’t think that any of this is fair to men, mind you. I’d stop it if I could do so by fiat, and I would definitely tell that Post columnist to take a hike. In fact, I will do so, just to prove that I do in fact support men in this situation.

    Part of the reason you’re so beloved by many, and respected by all, who’ve read you enough here and/or at your own sites to have a good idea who you are (I mean aside from being hot and real smart) is that you’re so genuinely fair minded including towards men. We aren’t used to it. (That’s different from always agreeing with you. The point is it’s clear that that’s your effort.)

    The reason compulsory paternity testing won’t ever be imposed (I think), is that it isn’t in the state’s interest to impose it. What if the baby turned out not to be related to his “legal” father but his mother couldn’t or wouldn’t name the biological father? Or the biological father refused to be tested? The state would then be stuck with the child-support costs.

    In the US many states currently makes it very, very hard for woman to collect welfare unless they name all possible fathers. They could do the same in cases where she was married when she conceived by a man not her husband.

    As well, only a small minority of such cases would present for welfare.

    Like


  349. on May 12, 2009 at 7:20 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””””on May 12, 2009 at 4:06 pm cptnapalm
    Any man who the state says is the father, is the father. Upon birth, said man shall be sentenced to 18 years in prison in a jury-less trial. The state will make up an arbitrary amount of money to be paid by said man to the woman who says he is the father of her child. This amount can be changed at any time, for any reason, up to any amount. Should the said man make his arbitrary payments on schedule, for that month he shall be allowed on furlough.””””””””””””””””””””””””””

    Holy fuck that is the way it is. That is current child support.
    Fucking amazing.

    Like


  350. Chode, i mean “Toad”:

    “Oooooh. Bitchy little Chucky is getting prissy..

    1) Mao and Stalin were LEFT-wing. No hemming and hawing, they were left-wing, period.

    2) Hitler was left-wing. I showed you proof. You did not like it, so you ignored it.”

    The first sums up my thought about left/right wing ideology and how the totalitarian dictators of this century fit into it.

    http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/04/15/easy-living-fueling-left-wing-extremism-us-says/#comment-68799

    I dont’ want to bog this thread down with long orations about political ideology.

    Hitler was a populist totalitarian. He espoused programs were counter to the status quo under the Weimar republic at the time of his ascension, which included what was viewed as a raw deal in the aftermath of WWI mixed with rampant hyperinflation and economic strife. He preached whatever he could to seize power, unfortunately, the biggest draw to his rhetoric was his blame for Germany’s woes on the Jews.

    Hitler had things in common with socialists, but he also had things in common with fascist right wingers like Mussolini. He was for corporatism (favoritism in industry). Hitler also favored a traditional national identity which is very similar to some of the ideas espoused by conservatives and right wingers today.

    And here is your contribution to the discussion, a link to some dude standing against a wall putting in his 2 cents. Wikipedia is a better source than this shit:

    http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/04/15/easy-living-fueling-left-wing-extremism-us-says/#comment-67019

    Like


  351. on May 12, 2009 at 7:21 pm Gunslingergregi

    To go through that because of a womans lie to amazing to believe.

    Like


  352. POS:
    MPT would be an egregious slap at almost all women. We don’t want to be treated with such distrust and lack of respect.

    talk about giving the game away. busted!

    ps if you have nothing to hide then you won’t have a problem with a state-mandated paternity test.

    pps respect must be earned.

    ppps cunt.

    Like


  353. lol lurker, what are you talking about? MTP and anti-abortion would both go under the category of “anti-women’s rights,” obviously. Is it really THAT hard to see the connection?

    “she’s reaching out to Roissy and other pro-abortion guys to try to prevent their rising up”

    huh? who’s rising up? pro-MTP campaigners? let’s be honest here, MTP is something people can wish for all they want but it’ll never happen. It doesn’t matter whether I support it or not, there is no way that would ever be passed in the US or any Western civilization. Sorry.

    Like


  354. sorry, MPT**

    Like


  355. Kim,
    W/all due respect your above remark is illogical. How does abortion rates, one way or another, have anything to do at all w/MPT? Indeed, if anything, the abortion rate may go UP in the face of widespread MPT, not down. I fail to see your argument. Please clarify and elaborate?

    O

    Like


  356. xsplat I don’t understand why MEN are arguing for the state to help them to obtain a paternity test.

    I need a beer. Hey, state, get me a beer.
    for some people debate is thrilling, even when it’s for something very trival.

    Like


  357. on May 12, 2009 at 7:23 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””Roissy,
    No. If it was a hospital error, then the wife should be equally pleased as her husband to know the truth. Their marriage would remain strong, or at least viable, as they made arrangements with the hospital to find their true baby and swap kids with the other victimized family who mistakenly got their kid.”””””””””””””””””””””””””””””

    This is how the mandatory law gets passed. It is for the children to make sure they go with the right parents when they leave hospital.

    Keep chanting.

    It is for the children
    It is for the children
    It is for the children
    It is for the children
    It is for the children
    It is for the children
    It is for the children

    Should get it passed.

    Like


  358. kim:
    “MTP and anti-abortion would both go under the category of “anti-women’s rights,”
    —-lol. only a woman would think that being forced to admit she’s a cheating whore and not lying to a man to get him to pay for a child not his would think that is a violation of *her* rights.

    Dear feminazi, I thought this was for *the children.*

    “MTP is something people can wish for all they want but it’ll never happen”
    —feminist attempt at demoralization. O, this is why we must fight!

    Like


  359. it’s better when betas pay child support payments to cheating cunt wives

    better than me, via taxes and welfare

    betas are cannon fodder

    drones

    Like


  360. Brief, humorous conversation I just had at work:

    Went for a smoke and was chatting with this older, black dude. Told him the story of the guy that wound up having to pay child support to the guy that was having sex with his wife.

    His response: “I love my wife, but you cannot trust a woman. They are evil.”

    Like


  361. Xsplat, to make the situations equivalent, the government would have to require you to pay for the beer whether you drank it or not.

    Like


  362. doug1:

    fwiw, here’s what I said, i think you misread it.

    ” wonder how long it is before our “masculinity movement” turns into a slightly higher T-leveled feminist movement, complete with shirllness.”

    i was saying that i don’t want some kind of men’s movement to resemble just a response to the feminist movement, in that i don’t want to take the same tactics they have used in order to hijack society.

    the feminist movement’s strongest weapon was to paint women as the victim, but as anyone who knows anything about women, their victimization has long been overblown. T aka Ricky Raw linked to Chinweizu’s book called “Anatomy of Female Power” and Warren Farrel wrote a book in the early 1990s called “The Myth of Male Power”.

    I think it’s no shock that the pioneers of feminism and the most ardent supporters of it today are the women who would have no ability to “control” men through the institutions of cradle, womb, and kitchen that Chinweizu discusses. Feminists are either ugly or lesbian which would decrease their ability to wield power. (Ok, to test this theory, Roissy should post pictures of Women’s Studies majors to test their attractiveness…guaranteed they will be 2+ points lower on the attractiveness scale).

    Since these women could not gain power through traditional means, they had to convince other women, some men, and the courts to grant them power. The shit has been bastardized ever since.

    Like


  363. I must say, that the level of angst on the part of quite a few lady members of the forum, is quite fascinating to take note of. Interesting.

    Kim, I wouldn’t be so sure about “MPT never happening”. We said the same thing about the Wall coming down in Berlin, that happened; we used to say that a Black Man could never be President of the United States, that’s happened, and so on. MPT WILL happen, simply because the means and demand is there. As has been previously noted, home test kits are already widely available.

    And besides, whether or the State is concerned about being stuck with the bill is irrelevant, since Women are fully self supporting now, yes? So again, what’s the problem here? Please explain, clarify and elaborate?

    O

    Like


  364. Obsidian,

    It’s not so much about rates as it is about legislation. Like I said, there is no way to prove it, but in my opinion, it seems like a government that would pass MPT would also ban legal abortion. How it would affect the rates, I don’t know?

    Like


  365. Gunslingergregi, very good idea. Women have no sense of justice, but they have every sense of empathy for kids. Well, sometimes.

    Like


  366. Captain Searing Pain

    His response: “I love my wife, but you cannot trust a woman. They are evil.”

    Another window letting in the light and fresh sea breeses. Devilish whores, all of them. No matter how much they are in love with you, and no matter what their upbringing, or how religious. Its in their dna.

    Like


  367. off topic- kim I like your tumblar

    on topic: Lurker are you Catholic?

    Kim, I think you may be on to something about some men prolife men being for MPT.

    Like


  368. O, don’t be unfair, you’re makign a woman explain her logic?

    “We said the same thing about the Wall coming down in Berlin, that happened; we used to say that a Black Man could never be President of the United States, that’s happened, and so on.”

    —yes, note who said those things: liberals. Liberals always believe in the existence, always, of communism, racism, sexism. Hence why Kim has to see sexism/anti-woman in this, as opposed to pro-men/pro-child: because that’s all she knows.

    It’s like asking a puppy to read shakespeare when you ask her to explain herself.

    Like


  369. Kim

    MTP is something people can wish for all they want but it’ll never happen. It doesn’t matter whether I support it or not, there is no way that would ever be passed in the US or any Western civilization. Sorry.

    Utter rubbish.

    Of course it could be passed.

    No the mood isn’t there right now to pass it, but that hardly means that can’t change.

    Like


  370. kim is busted.

    anony is terrible. What a horrid monster.

    It is funny how many women are refusing to stand up and say that it is wrong for a man to pay if the child is not his, and his trust has been betrayed.

    Women are truly lacking in moral fiber.

    Islam….Islam…..Islam…..

    Like


  371. kim “MTP is something people can wish for all they want but it’ll never happen”

    *puts hand on kim’s shoulder*
    my queen, never doubt what people can do when they come together, the civil rights movement, women’s movement and elderly people with money collecting social security Medicare. If enough men get togeather, they can make a change.

    Like


  372. Me? Yes I am, Chuck. But banning of abortion desire comes from science, not religion. Roissy’s an atheist. We both agree.

    Like


  373. Xsplat — Mongolia was around the 12th Century, Ghenghis’ time, the ruler of pretty much the known World, from Poland east to China, from Iraq to Siberia and into India.

    The inability to sustain the Mongol Empire and keep pace with technology was part and parcel of nearly all the descendants of Mongols being Ghenghis Khan.

    Think: Genetic Bottleneck. If Khan is the only one making babies, only his genes get expressed later in generation after generation. Which means valuable genes for abstract thinking, like say, how to adapt Mongol ponies and mobility to challenges from outsiders, in places where the Mongol composite bow just is not effective, are simply lacking.

    Europe in the 1100’s was the same as Mongolia, in terms of literacy, achievement, and so on. Because most men in Europe under enforced monogamy reproduced, there was no genetic bottleneck and genes that were favorable for say, taking Chinese wooden block printing and creating the same with moveable type with lead, or improving constantly firearms, got expressed. Icky Darwinism but there you have it — the larger the gene pool the more likely favorable genes will get expressed. Since you never know what will turn up.

    Female paradises of lots of Alpha men tend to be poor, violent, and stable, in that they last forever, but are often conquered. Guys like Shaka Zulu, Nebuchadnezzer, Xerxes, and Khan can create a basic pattern that lasts but their descendants tend to be conquered by cooperative beta men.

    As for geeks, enjoy their fruits now. There will be few geeks after them, because geeks do POORLY in the marketplace, women avoid having kids with them like the plague, preferring guys lke Roissy. Who aren’t going to invent new ways to cure cancer or produce energy.

    Unless forced to, women will never mate with geeky guys.

    Like


  374. So again, what’s the problem here? Please explain, clarify and elaborate?

    No chance. You are asking a Westernized woman to not be a hypocrite. Impossible. See how much of a total failure feminism is?

    No straight answer will be forthcoming from kim.

    Like


  375. Lurker,
    I never said this was for the children. It’s about the government wanting to know more than they need to.

    Obsidian,
    Those things you listed are all movements in a progressive direction. MPT would be a huge step backwards. MPT is like something out of Orwell’s 1984.

    Like


  376. Chic, not chuck.

    But I love how women try to twist MPT into abortion—again, with no logic—to drive a wedge here. isn’t that just like a woman?

    Like


  377. Lurker

    Xsplat, to make the situations equivalent, the government would have to require you to pay for the beer whether you drank it or not.

    It seems your drunk instead of me, for a change.

    WTF? It’s only a few bucks. Get it done yourself. You don’t need anyones permission. Just do it. What on earth does any government agency have to do with it?

    And as regards to the state extracting welfare and child support, get a passport.

    People are talking about reforming a broken system. More power to you, but it seems silly to me. Just get and use your passport.

    Like


  378. “It’s about the government wanting to know more than they need to.”

    —the father needs to know, as does the government. By your twisted feminist logic, they shouldn’t know the names of the parents either.

    The government needs to know who the parents are so they know whom to send the bill to.

    Like


  379. Kim,
    Again, I don’t follow your logic because I fail to see the linakge btw MPT and Abortion, one way or another. As far as I see it they are two completely different issues, and should be viewed in that context. However, if one wants to make a case for the role Abortion could play in the case of widespread MPT, one could plausibly argue that if anything, Abortion rates would likely go up, since a potentially cheating spouse knows she is likely to be found out if she carries a suspect pregnancy to term. Since married Women already have the right to abort w/o the knowledge or permission of their hubbies in any event, again I fail to see what the problem is here.

    I remain somewhat in a fog as to the clarity of your argument. I need more clarification, please?

    O

    Like


  380. xsplat, not the cost here. Its that many betas are too timid or fooled to do it. A required MPT would break many men of their weird worship of women. And force sluts into poverty.

    Like


  381. on May 12, 2009 at 7:44 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””””””””Chic Noir
    The fact that a few men are throwing around rape with ease makes me wonder whose really reading this blog?”””””””””””””””””””””

    False accusations of rape happen too often. Lies from woman about life changeing events for men happen too often. We need solid lie dtector tests for these woman when they are accusing someone of anything. (sexual harrassment,rape,stealing, cuckhold) Anything.

    Like


  382. O, no fair, you’re using logic to bash her pretty little whorish skull in!

    Like


  383. kim wrote :

    Those things you listed are all movements in a progressive direction. MPT would be a huge step backwards. MPT is like something out of Orwell’s 1984.

    It seems you don’t care about men’s rights at all. You are just as bad as Southern KKK whites who subjected blacks to Jim Crow laws.

    I suppose you oppose men secretly getting the DNA test done on the kid that is supposedly theirs too?

    Like


  384. clio:
    The reason compulsory paternity testing won’t ever be imposed (I think), is that it isn’t in the state’s interest to impose it.

    the state is the fist of the public. if enough of the public decides that MPT is in its interest, then it will be in the state’s interest by default.
    but in the narrow sense, you may have a point. it is in the state’s interest to keep beta males married and working to the bone chained to the machinery of society to support their families even if it means said betas live under the cloud of a great lie. what’s the truth to a few individuals when the glorious collective of big brother needs their sacrifice?

    What if the baby turned out not to be related to his “legal” father but his mother couldn’t or wouldn’t name the biological father?

    wouldn’t? the man is immediately freed of all obligations to her or the bastard.
    couldn’t? same as above. sucks to be her! oh well, i guess she should have thought it through before auditioning for the part of town orifice.

    Or the biological father refused to be tested?

    see above. again, if the whore wants to avoid a situation where the man whom she fingers as the biological father refuses to get tested, she should have thought of that potential fallout before spreading her legs.
    ultimately, what you cannot get away from, despite your best efforts, is the fact that a woman cheating on her husband and conceiving a child by another man is wholly responsible for the world of shit she puts herself in.
    the government, the beta chump, the universe, is not going to relieve her of moral and practical culpability.

    otoh, if you prefer that the state continues to treat women like children, then perhaps we can extend this paternal magnanimity to women’s right to vote and let the grownups vote for them?

    The state would then be stuck with the child-support costs.

    this is where you let your religious impulse get the best of you.
    the only one who should get stuck with anything is the whore. if the kid suffers because she is an unfit mother of few resources, well… tough shit. cull the herd.

    I don’t think that any of this is fair to men, mind you.

    coulda fooled me.

    I’d stop it if I could do so by fiat, and I would definitely tell that Post columnist to take a hike. In fact, I will do so, just to prove that I do in fact support men in this situation.

    you’ll be too nice about it. now my method, while i’m under no pretense that it will change minds, sure does fill me with a warm glow!

    Like


  385. Tood

    No chance. You are asking a Westernized woman to not be a hypocrite.

    Tood – you make the same mistake feminists do. Attributing to culture what is genetic.

    Women of all cultures are hypocrites. Much more so in non western cultures.

    I know it’s hard, guys. I know its very difficult. Women are not like us. At all. They don’t think like we do. They only pretend to do that.

    Like


  386. Yes, tood. Don’t you knwo women never lie?

    Like


  387. Kim–

    Even if Mandatory Paternity Testing doesn’t happen anytime soon, I think it becoming a common practice among men to get such testing done IS likely.

    is there any man on this board who’s read Roissy’s post and the comments today who WOULD’T get paternity testing done.

    Sure it’s a long shot she’s done that to you, being such an awesome man and all, but why not be sure? What if she did?

    Actually I strongly recommend that all men reading here casually mention to their serious girlfriends, and seriously talk with their wives or live in girlfriends that any pregnancy would of course be subject to such a test, just as a matter of your assertion of strong male rights.

    Well I’ve always had these talks. There’s the abortion talk. “You get mistakenly pregnant when we both haven’t agreed to raise a kid together before hand, both of us, that includes me, and you’ll get an abortion, right? No question about that, right?” I’ve never lived with a woman who hasn’t agreed in a convincing manner, or for that matter had any long term relationship with one.

    Like


  388. a government that would pass MPT would also ban legal abortion

    true. but the first is MUCH easier than the second. So I would rewrite your phrase as:
    ” a government that would try to pass MPT and also ban legal abortion, would achieve the first and fail in the second “

    Like


  389. Tood,

    Do you care about women’s rights? It sure doesn’t seem like it. I do care about men’s rights, but I don’t think that mandatory paternity testing is fair. That’s a simple invasion of privacy. YOU can never understand a woman’s perspective on this because you can’t give birth. Go ahead, quote that and then leave your “oh, the typical feminist argument” bullshit, but it’s completely true.

    Like


  390. lurker

    xsplat, not the cost here. Its that many betas are too timid or fooled to do it. A required MPT would break many men of their weird worship of women. And force sluts into poverty.

    And why would I care? I have no solidarity with the menz. Let the betas lose out, if they are too stupid to learn a clue.

    There is a reason why Alphas get the pussy, you know – and it is NOT because of thuggish behaviour, as Whiskey purports. It is greater social skills, combined with above average skills in manipulating materials and wealth. Or any number of above average skills – intelligence included. Art, science, music, writing. There are alphas in all of the worthwhile human persuits, and they get laid more than most.

    What do I care if such alphas fuck married women? I don’t. I’d do it myself, and sometime try to do that.

    Like


  391. Sorry, unfair*

    Like


  392. Okay, wow. Take back the “sorry, unfair*” I can’t read anymore and am just making myself look like an idiot …it’s almost 1 AM and I’m going to bed.

    Like


  393. Lurker But banning of abortion desire comes from science, not religion
    Kim MPT is like something out of Orwell’s 1984.
    Huh, you’ve thrown me with this. MPT isn’t government’s way of controlling a woman, it’s a man’s way of knowing if he is the dad or not. It’s allowing him his freedom to move on with his life if he is in fact not tied to you.

    But I love how women try to twist MPT into abortion—again, with no logic—to drive a wedge here. isn’t that just like a woman?
    Not really, some men will see MPT and abortion as issues linked. I’m for mpt and pro choice. Anyway, MPT is good just in the instance the child has any type of genetic disorders.

    xsplat WTF? It’s only a few bucks. Get it done yourself. You don’t need anyones permission. Just do it. What on earth does any government agency have to do with it?
    It like welfare mothers suing the government for not receiving enough benefits when they had the option to terminate or use bc like every other female.

    Like


  394. chuck:
    comparing cuckolding to the male version of rape is a bad characterization. its obviously more akin to thievery or robbery,

    rape is thievery of a woman’s womb.
    cuckoldry is thievery of a man’s resources and life.

    the integrity of a woman’s womb is as precious to her as the lifeyears remaining and the accumulation of resources are to him.

    hence, why i believe it is a valid comparison.

    Like


  395. For a man, a big part of the thrill of having kids is actually having sex with the said hot woman and essentially colonizing her body for nine months.

    I must admit that I enjoyed telling the mistress that I’d knock her up and she’d have my little mulatto kids. There’s something inherently masculine about that, and I’d imagine submitting to letting some guy dump his sperm in you is submissive and very feminine. As seen from websites dealing with the topic, some men (and women) do have an impregnation fetish.

    The ones who were worthless whores would end up giving up the kids to adoption, which is probably better than living with a skank mom.

    Given that there’s no market for black children, I’d wonder if it’s better to have the kids live with mom who is more likely to love them than in foster care or in orphanages.

    Sex-bots and artificial wombs? The bottom would fall out of the beta male provider supply.

    The problem is that artificial wombs and sex-bots aren’t mother replacements.

    Actually, it would lead to far fewer divorces, 70% of which are initiated by women, and nearly all of them in marriages with infants or young children. It would also lead many women to be more careful about who they marry.

    Of course, the unintended consequence is that women may not even give a beta male a chance for marriage, and stick to single motherhood to avoid even dealing with a beta male. Plus, quite frankly, I’m not interested in living with a woman who doesn’t love me, but only stays around because she can’t get child support. At that point, I’d pay her to go away and leave me alone than to continue the insulting fake marriage.

    Infidelity used to be way lower in fact.

    I suspect we were much better at hiding it.

    but for me I would much rather be sent to prison and anally raped than have my wife cheat on me and bear another man’s child

    From what my brother and cousin have noted about their stays in prison, I’d rather have my wife cheat on me. There’s still more freedom in a cuckold marriage than in any prison.

    Like


  396. Sad thing is I live next to a guy who got cuckolded. The poor sod was dutiful to his wife’s child for 18 years after which she left him and went on a cock merri-go-round.

    The worst thing is everyone seems to have known except him. I didn’t have the heart to collapse his world after I found out so I let him be in his beta universe……..

    Like


  397. on May 12, 2009 at 7:57 pm Gunslingergregi

    “””””””””””””Jam,
    I did tell her about the paternity testing and punishment for infidelity (which will be the same that many here have advocated for cuckoldry, lol), though.”””””””””””””

    That is it no lawyers needed between you and your woman. Just some basic laws of whats up.

    Like


  398. kim That’s a simple invasion of privacy

    Which is no worse that having a 1/5 of your income stolen from you. Or having your emotions played with when you are 12 years into raising a child that isn’t yours.

    Like


  399. “some men will see MPT and abortion as issues linked.”
    —betas

    “What do I care if such alphas fuck married women?”
    —I care if cheating whores are taken care of and lauded. They ought to be dragged low in the dirt.

    “MPT isn’t government’s way of controlling a woman, it’s a man’s way of knowing if he is the dad or not. It’s allowing him his freedom to move on with his life if he is in fact not tied to you.”
    —Don;t you understand that a feminist sees everything as part of her body when convenient? When the child is removed from the womb, tis still her body. When it goes to college,s till hers. Feminists are delusional.

    Like


  400. “That’s a simple invasion of privacy.”

    Who’s privacy is being violated. She’s named him the dad, so according to her, it is his kid. He is not getting any DNA from her at all. Just him and his kid. She is not involved at all. Who’s privacy is being violated?

    Like


  401. kim squeaked :

    YOU can never understand a woman’s perspective on this because you can’t give birth.

    YOU, as a woman, cannot understand what it is like to be cuckolded. So far, you are on par with Southern White racists of the KKK in their treatment of blacks. You are trying to excuse the subjugation of men.

    You didn’t answer the question :

    Do you oppose men secretly getting the DNA test done on the kid that is supposedly theirs too?

    Answer it, bitch.

    Like


  402. Dave from Hawaii

    Chicnoir: I predict that this comment box will reach 900 comments before 12 midnight. Wow, nothing gets men going like this topic.

    DfH: Sorta like the topic of rape with women, eh?

    Bullseye!!

    Hole in one.

    Home run with bases loaded.

    Kickoff Touchdown!

    Like


  403. I see the argument that Clio presents, ie the role of the State and its interests in preventing MPT from happening, is w/all due respect a logical fallacy; I say this because there have been and are today many charitable organizations that have and continue to help Women in trouble w/babies. The problem is that these organizations are almost always religious in nature, and impose their standards of judgment, morality and guilt upon those they serve, and rightly so-their souls need just as help as their bodies.

    What a lot of Women want is assistance w/o any rebuke or censure, someting I’m completely against. Shaming has proven highly effective for the female half of the species. Severe penalties coupled w/powerful shaming measures will serve to drastically reduce these problems.

    While I’m on my logical kick, let me address another logical fallacy:

    And this is the “numerical” argument.

    Some argue that, because Paternity Fraud is relatively low in terms of documented occurance, we shouldn’t be too concerned about it; yet many of the very same people who take this view will often turn around and say, that one rape is one rape too many, and so on. I only ask that those who take this position be consistent in heir application of logic and reason: the issue wrt rape isn’t about numerical occurance, but about the egregious nature of the crime, a blight on the whole of society. I say the same is true for Paternity Fraud.

    O

    Like


  404. O, sing it brutha.

    Like


  405. Roissy et al, I think you’re reading into that advice column things that aren’t there for the sake of your anti-cuckoldry agenda. From my interpretation of femspeak: It was a nice way by the columnist of saying ‘make your own decisions, fool, and since you sound like a nice guy beta, remember your delicate feelings and get other guys e.g. lawyers to do the asshole work for you. I’m not going to advocate anything illegal here’ in typical advice columnist language. Maybe I’m projecting.

    Still, this does promote the cause for social acceptability of paternity tests which would help remove the ‘presumed guilty’ argument if its commonly or routinely done. The figures speak loudly about the necessity for them and the lie in the trust given. I don’t see women losing from this: either it’s his whereas you get to play martyr and noble pure woman (oh, honey, aren’t I the best loyalest wife evar? And you doubted me?) or… it’s not his. We’ve had cases in medschool where the kids would accidentally discover it by their blood types. xsplat/doug: Yeah, 10% is the commonly quoted figure at me, and the lecturers love to go ‘well, there are 200 of you in this lecture theatre…’. Reducing the rate’s all well and good.

    I’ve rather become inured to the massive misognyism and there’s too much to tackle today but let me just say, I really need to see a woman scorned who’s actually anywhere near as angry as this for some perspective, because this is alarming.

    Also, this was well-timed after my own post; it must be some sort of anti-cuckoldry vibe this week or some such.

    xsplat: Although I’m skeptical, tell me any venues I’d find you so that I can avoid rather than test your ‘I can get any woman’ skills.

    lurker: it’d have to be a pious woman from any religion in a Western country. If you went to pick off a muslim girl from a muslim country then that would be more true, and she’d already be compromising on muslim morality by being near you (unless she was given away unwillingly by family; not very Islamic but I heard it happens). I don’t know if I’d be a best bet, actually. I wouldn’t cheat and am apparently strongly socially conditioned against it according to doug but I’m also not the model religious girl. 30%’s a shocking figure; one that was definitely not true where I came from. Thinking about where I came from, the penalties on a cheating wife… it doesn’t even bear thinking about it. I haven’t even heard of any such scenarios and they’re usually generous with the female sexuality horror stories.

    chic: Lie detector tests work?

    havana: I’m not surprised. I was limited to a mere 3 kids maximum by a Westerner in terms of suggested family size. There were some things about traditional good Catholicism…

    Rape vs. cuckoldry: Give it a rest. Cuckoldry is its own crime, while sharing things with rape, it can be worse in some ways. It has aspects of violation, gross betrayal, humiliation, emotional damage and genetic threat to it. To think everything’s ok and then to discover how you were lied to and for so long and regarding the most important part of a long-term relationship by the one person you thought you could trust or even have power over…

    The main point is that YES, it should be taken SERIOUSLY for MEN like RAPE is taken SERIOUSLY for WOMEN.

    Like


  406. Chic,
    I’m glad you like my tumblr. Also, I don’t see how MPT isn’t the government controlling a woman. And I agree, it isn’t fair for men to have to raise children that aren’t theirs. It seems like a lot of commenters on here want to have their prospective or current wives/mother’s of their children, engage in a paternity test, and that’s fine. It should be up to the couple, not mandatory by the government. If the woman doesn’t want to take part, then maybe they shouldn’t have children together.

    Tood,

    “So far, you are on par with Southern White racists of the KKK in their treatment of blacks”

    wtf are you talking about??????????????????

    If the man wants to do that on his own, that’s fine. I’m not saying paternity testing is wrong, I’m saying that making it mandatory is wrong. If a man and woman want to do that, then that’s just fine, if a man wants to go and do it on his own, then that’s fine too. That’s completely different from the government forcing it on everyone.

    Like


  407. Let me reiterate: the feminazi attempt to tie this to abortion will be a runnign theme in fighting this, if only to drive a wedge in the men’s movement on it. Be warned: it has nothing to do with abortion.

    Like


  408. kim

    I do care about men’s rights, but I don’t think that mandatory paternity testing is fair. That’s a simple invasion of privacy. [doug editing: You mean like mandatory syphilis testing, initiated primarily for women? YOU can never understand a woman’s perspective on this because you can’t give birth. Go ahead, quote that and then leave your “oh, the typical feminist argument” bullshit, but it’s completely true.

    What a complete crock of shit – the italicized part.

    Now you’re thoroughly pissing me off.

    It’s looking like I was massively wrong about you.

    Well maybe you are too tired. Still telling.

    We’ll see.

    Like


  409. Kim:
    “I don’t see how MPT isn’t the government controlling a woman.”
    —-You see. DNA testing a CHILD is controlling a WOMAN.

    Feminist logic at its finest.

    “It should be up to the couple, not mandatory by the government. ”
    —-If the government is going to force payment on someone, it is its duty to get it right.

    “I’m saying that making it mandatory is wrong.”
    –because my beta husband might find out why I get home so late….

    “That’s completely different from the government forcing it on everyone.”
    –when you bitches voluntarily give up child support and alimony, come talking to us, slut.

    Like


  410. but in the narrow sense, you may have a point. it is in the state’s interest to keep beta males married and working to the bone chained to the machinery of society to support their families even if it means said betas live under the cloud of a great lie. what’s the truth to a few individuals when the glorious collective of big brother needs their sacrifice?

    That’s the problem with entire system. Cuckoldry relies on the greater system in general of beta males being sacrificed to keep society moving. As I’ve stated on numerous occasions, beta males sacrifice themselves for third rate sex from women who don’t love them, and nearly all of their pay being handed over to their wives and children. Guys like Whiskey and novaseeker may paint the ancien regime as a perfect world for beta males, but given that we know of the potential sexuality of women and their lack of desire for betas, no regime gives beta males any benefit.

    Because most men in Europe under enforced monogamy reproduced, there was no genetic bottleneck

    The question is how did Europe get to point where there was no genetic bottleneck?

    Unless forced to, women will never mate with geeky guys.

    But why should geeks be punished with women who aren’t attracted to them?

    Like


  411. chic

    nothing gets women going like topics about the disparate effects of aging on men and women

    Like


  412. Kim, you paranoid delusional illogical bitch, go back to your womyn’s meeting, where this bullshit flows like wine.

    Like


  413. on May 12, 2009 at 8:15 pm michael farris

    “Roissy et al, I think you’re reading into that advice column things that aren’t there for the sake of your anti-cuckoldry agenda.”

    He has an anti-cuckoldry agenda? I thought he had an anti-being-cuckolded agenda that was pretty ….. unexamined. If he’s been with half as many women as he claims the chances that he hasn’t cuckolded a married man or six (or fathered a child or four being raised by one of the betas he so despises) is pretty remote.

    Basically, men can’t demand faithfulness from wives unless they demand faithfulness from themselves and other men (or openly support the creation of a prostitute/mistress class).

    Basically neither men nor women are biologically programmed for marital faithfulness and demanding higher standards from one than the other is …. foolish.

    Like


  414. when you bitches voluntarily give up child support and alimony, come talking to us, slut.

    Amen. I will say it as many times as necessary :

    Feminists are THE most hypocritical group in the world, bar none. More hypocritical than Palestinians, communists, Jesse Jackson, etc.

    Women haven’t really denied this accusation much either. They don’t mind being exposed as hypocrites.

    Like


  415. bhetti chic: Lie detector tests work?
    they range from about 70%- to 90% effectiveness.

    Roissy she fingers as the biological father refuses to get tested, she should have thought of that potential fallout before spreading her legs.
    Can’t buy it. Why should a man refuse to be tested? It doesn’t hurt. He may refuse because he doesn’t want to take responsibility. If you refuses to take, then he should be forced to pay child support.

    ultimately, what you cannot get away from, despite your best efforts, is the fact that a woman cheating on her husband and conceiving a child by another man is wholly responsible for the world of shit she puts herself in.
    the government, the beta chump, the universe, is not going to relieve her of moral and practical culpability

    But sometimes it’s not a cheating woman. It’s a woman in a relationship with a man who for whatever reason, decides she is no longer the flavor of the month. Therefore, he dumps woman and child to move on to someone new.

    Doug “You get mistakenly pregnant when we both haven’t agreed to raise a kid together before hand, both of us, that includes me, and you’ll get an abortion, right? No question about that, right?”
    I agree the two of you should talk it over before hand but beware. For some women, even the most prochoice, Mother Nature kicks in and they will carry the child no matter what. All of the previous thoughts and opinions go out the door.

    Lurker Don;t you understand that a feminist sees everything as part of her body when convenient?
    Don’t let my Charlie Brown theory fool you, I’m a bit of a feminist myself. I just believe that fair is fair.

    Like


  416. Roissy is a dreamer; he mentioned once in a post that a virgin girl is “sweet manna from heaven.” We would all love faithful, loving girl, its that women are not those images we’ve been taught to beleive in, but cunning, manipualtive whores.

    That said, Roissy wants to give us a wake up call, and release us from betahood, and under the thumb of women. A society ruled by men is always better. Hetakes our blinders off; he is a truth teller.

    Like


  417. on May 12, 2009 at 8:18 pm Tupac Chopra

    Doug:

    Part of the reason you’re so beloved by many, and respected by all, who’ve read you enough here and/or at your own sites to have a good idea who you are (I mean aside from being hot and real smart)

    Give it up Doug, she’s mine all mine.

    Seriously though, I think Clio and Whiskey would be a good match. A blogosphere power couple.

    Like


  418. Bhetti–

    xsplat: Although I’m skeptical, tell me any venues I’d find you so that I can avoid rather than test your ‘I can get any woman’ skills.

    You skepticism is more than merited, as you or anyone else will realize if they peruse his blog a bit. I could be real nasty but I guess I won’t be.

    Like


  419. “Basically, men can’t demand faithfulness from wives unless they demand faithfulness from themselves and other men (or openly support the creation of a prostitute/mistress class).”
    –lmao. what a beta bitch.

    Men and women are different.

    A cheating woman is worse than a cheating man.

    Welcome to enlightenment, kiddo.

    Like


  420. Michal

    Basically neither men nor women are biologically programmed for marital faithfulness and demanding higher standards from one than the other is …. foolish.

    A rat bastard after my own heart.

    Although, I do believe some small proportion of men and women tend towards monogamy and family life. It seems those same people have an impossibly difficult time understanding that they are not the norm.

    They are so intensely interested in enforcing their social norms. I don’t get it.

    Live and get fucked over, and get wise.

    Like


  421. Tupac–

    Give it up Doug, she’s mine all mine.

    Seriously though,

    LoL Tupac.

    I’m in the respect camp. Your (and Whiskey’s) coast is clear, re: me. Not trying to muscle in bro. (LoL)

    Like


  422. “they range from about 70%- to 90% effectiveness.”

    lol, no. lie detectors are notoriously unreliable. That’s why courts don’t accept them as evidence. try 50%, at best.

    Maury Povich notwithstanding.

    Like


  423. doug1

    Bhetti–

    xsplat: Although I’m skeptical, tell me any venues I’d find you so that I can avoid rather than test your ‘I can get any woman’ skills.

    You skepticism is more than merited, as you or anyone else will realize if they peruse his blog a bit. I could be real nasty but I guess I won’t be.

    You’d both be right to be skeptical of my exageration. But it was merely an exageration – not a falsehood. Religion is a weak barrier to seduction.

    And if you are in the mood to be nasty, Doug, go for it. Most of what I leave up on the blog I’m content with – so have at it.

    Like


  424. Kim

    You are doing great work convincing the men here – all of them – that talking to women about this is pointless. You keep saying, in one way or another, that only a fool would believe anything a woman says about true paternity and then you want to talk about what is “fair”?
    You must be a little drunk because you keep giving away the main female “secret-game-plan” without much prompting or pressure.

    Like


  425. kim It should be up to the couple, not mandatory by the government. If the woman doesn’t want to take part, then maybe they shouldn’t have children together.
    Who is the “they” that shouldn’t have children together.

    Hypothetically speaking, I can married to PA but decide that I want to sample MU on Tuesday and Whiskey on Wednesday followed by Roissy on Friday. There is nothing PA can do about it if I fall pregnant, nothing. He will be forced to wait on the side with the other three for the DNA results.

    bottom line, even after having a talk, it’s still the woman’s body to a make decision if and when she will have a child. The best thing men can do is use a condom in addition to male pill or vasectomy. I’m getting sick of hearing men say “she trapped me” anyway. Shit sounds very betaish.

    Lurker what’s up with the heavy name calling. If you don’t agree with kim fine you don’t agree. There is no need to call her everything but a child of God.

    Like


  426. I love the feminist trope about “invasion of privacy.” Nobody knows what it means, everyone has their own definition, and it sounds awful, but it has no basis in law or fact.

    Just like everythign else feminists say.

    Like


  427. on May 12, 2009 at 8:27 pm Marcus Aureliette

    kim:
    I do care about men’s rights, but I don’t think that mandatory paternity testing is fair. That’s a simple invasion of privacy. YOU can never understand a woman’s perspective on this because you can’t give birth.

    How is it any more an invasion of privacy than any other medical test done in the course of bringing a child to term? It’s in everyone’s best interest to have that data on the table, but let’s be honest: if a woman is, in fact, trying to pass off another man’s child as her unsuspecting husband’s, clearly the unsuspecting husband has far and away the most to lose by that deception. It is patently unfair that any man should get saddled with that responsibility, and if taking a simple test will spare that happening, how can you justify not testing?

    Also, just to be clear: being capable of giving birth has absolutely nothing to do with the question at hand, and I say that as a fertile female.

    Like


  428. Kim is the typical illogical slut.

    Thats, that. Now about those MPT at CVS?

    Like


  429. m. farris:
    He has an anti-cuckoldry agenda? I thought he had an anti-being-cuckolded agenda that was pretty ….. unexamined. If he’s been with half as many women as he claims the chances that he hasn’t cuckolded a married man or six (or fathered a child or four being raised by one of the betas he so despises) is pretty remote.

    i’ve never claimed to be a good man. i have slept with married and taken women. in those cases, i was not informed of their marital or relationship status until after penis had crossed the plane of vagina. i can’t say i’ve never targeted a taken woman, (who can remember all their conquests? not i), but i can say with some confidence that i generally refrain from the practice. it’s not kosher.

    i can also tell you that none of the married women i banged insisted i wear a condom, not even on the first night.
    now why would that be?
    things that make you go hmm….

    Like


  430. on May 12, 2009 at 8:28 pm michael farris

    “Men and women are different.
    A cheating woman is worse than a cheating man.”

    Uh….. unless the man is gay or paying for it, a cheating man is often going to be cheating with a woman who’s also cheating. You can’t have horn dog alphas without having cheating women and pretending that Game can exist without cuckolded men in LTR’s or changeling children is just …. not realistic.

    Like


  431. “Lurker what’s up with the heavy name calling.”
    —women want to argue like men? Then grow some balls and get over it.

    “If you don’t agree with kim fine you don’t agree.”
    –I agree with nothing that no-good cunt has said.

    “There is no need to call her everything but a child of God.”
    —save your hand-holding and “no put downs” for kindergarten and the sewing circle; men insult, deal with it.

    Like


  432. “Uh….. unless the man is gay or paying for it, a cheating man is often going to be cheating with a woman who’s also cheating.”
    —Roissy’s post immediately above yours proves you wrong.

    “You can’t have horn dog alphas without having cheating women and pretending that Game can exist without cuckolded men in LTR’s or changeling children is just …. not realistic.”
    —wrong again, beta boy.

    Like


  433. Sorry, m. farris, I keep forgetting these fine distinctions suffered of ‘do not do unto me what I allow to be done to others’.

    I’m glad roissy tries to avoid it.

    roissy: Just to confirm for the general public, you DID wear a condom, anyway?

    Like


  434. Kim,
    I am also having trouble following your argument, that MPT is somehow tantamount to a rolling back on Women’s Rights-could you please specify, in what way? The Woman has chosen to carry the child to term and is indeed the mother, these facts are not in dispute; what *is*, is the putative father’s status as the de jure/de facto father. This is what daddy testing solves.

    Again, I am havin trouble following your arguments in opposition to MPT. I await a more thorough clarification of your views.

    O

    Like


  435. “it’s still the woman’s body to a make decision if and when she will have a child.”

    In that case, there will be no need for a paternity test as this logically eliminates all responsibility from men. After all, how can you have responsibilities for the decisions of someone else?

    Like


  436. O, you know how we ignore tokyojesus/contrarian, because he’s just a troll? Same rule applies with kim. She’s just spitting nonsense, and when called on it, she’ll spit it again.

    Like


  437. cptnapalm:
    “After all, how can you have responsibilities for the decisions of someone else?”
    —-you clearly have not read any feminist literature. Men are always at fault.

    Like


  438. on May 12, 2009 at 8:41 pm michael farris

    “Roissy’s post immediately above yours proves you wrong.”

    You mean the one where he admits he’s had sex with married women (with no condom) and shown no concern about or interest in the possible children that resulted (and who will, if they’re lucky, never know he existed? That post?

    Listen I’m sympathetic to the human condition and the very different sexual interests of men and women. I just don’t have much sympathy for willful ignorance and it takes willful ignorance to simultaneously favor sexual freedom for men (the essence of ‘game’) and want monogamy from the women one is in a LTR with.

    Basically, if men want absolute monogamy from wives then they’re going have to get used to the idea that a) they’re not gonna get any till they’re married of b) they’re gonna get nailed for child support if their wild oats can be traced to them (unless there’s an open prostitute class which is problematic in lots of ways).

    Like


  439. Bhetti, my love, when is our wedding, dearie?

    Like


  440. schoolboy

    Kim is the typical illogical slut.

    Thats, that. Now about those MPT at CVS?

    Consider this as friendly advice from an uncle you like. It’s not intended as a diss.

    Don’t call Kim a slut. She probably isn’t. Doesn’t sound like one. In fact she sounds very much not like one. So if so, she’s coming from a very different place than you’ve announced.

    So calling her a slut if I’m right (and I tend to be on these kind of things) is very counter productive with her. It might get you some street cred with with lowest common denominator of men, but what is that really worth? It’s easy to get in much better ways.

    Illogical yes. Actually she often hasn’t been. But she sure was lately, especially not long before signing off.

    Rolling that around in your mind and saying something that gets at it is far more powerful.

    Just some friendly thoughts.

    Like


  441. I don’t even see what all the heat is about here. Women, if you’ve got nothing to hide, all a paternity test does is pay for a little domestic peace of mind.

    Guys, if you’re either practically or ideologically concerned about it, you can get it done pretty cheap on your own.

    As for the State, it cares about none of you. It exists to serve its own ends.

    Like


  442. “You mean the one where he admits he’s had sex with married women (with no condom) and shown no concern about or interest in the possible children that resulted (and who will, if they’re lucky, never know he existed? That post?”
    —yes, beta, the one where didn’t know she was married and avoids having sex with women he knows are taken. There are plenty of sluts out there he bangs who aren’t married.

    “I just don’t have much sympathy for willful ignorance and it takes willful ignorance to simultaneously favor sexual freedom for men (the essence of ‘game’) and want monogamy from the women one is in a LTR with.”
    —Well, as I stated, many here would be satisified with a faithful, loving virgin who acts like a submissive woman.

    And, as stated, those who would not are spreading their seed; cheating women are forcing men to rtaise a child not their own. One is a good natural instinct, the other is not.

    “if men want absolute monogamy from wives then they’re going have to get used to the idea that a) they’re not gonna get any till they’re married.”
    —moron. men here don’t want monogomaous gfs, they just want to bang. Men who want to get married want monogomous wives, which are rarer than they protray themselves.

    Like


  443. doug1, are you insane:

    “Don’t call Kim a slut. She probably isn’t. Doesn’t sound like one. In fact she sounds very much not like one.”

    —yes, she just wants to deny men the right to not pay for a child not theirs and allow a cheating wife to live high on his hog and spread her legs. Also, she wants to lie and somehow bizarrely claim this is related to *her* privacy or abortion.

    The onyl women that panicky that we’re in favor it? Sluts.

    “So calling her a slut if I’m right (and I tend to be on these kind of things) is very counter productive with her. ”
    —logic is counter-productive with kim.

    “Actually she often hasn’t been. But she sure was lately, especially not long before signing off.”
    –lmao rofl. No, far from it.

    “Rolling that around in your mind and saying something that gets at it is far more powerful. ”
    —have you not been here while O and I ripped her aknew with basic facts.

    doug, really, are you going soft?

    Like


  444. Lurker–

    doug, really, are you going soft?

    No, I’m being smart.

    I comes naturally.

    Like


  445. “No, I’m being smart.”

    –sucking up to a screeching feminist skank isn’t smart at all.

    Like


  446. lurker: Our wedding? Has noone supplied you with muslim proposal techniques: Where is the request for my mother’s number? Wasn’t I relegated to slut, now, anyway? Don’t you hate me too much as an inferior female to have to spend eternity with me?

    All irrelevant, since I’m set ruthlessly/heartlessly on doug.

    schoolboy: CVS = chorionic villus sampling? If so, increased risk of miscarriage makes it unethical. It has to wait until its born.

    Like


  447. Doug1, kim is a typical illogical slut. She is as ignorable as contrarian.

    Like


  448. on May 12, 2009 at 8:53 pm michael farris

    “Men who want to get married want monogomous wives, which are rarer than they protray themselves.”

    ITA. Like I said, neither men nor women are biologically programmed for monogamous marriage (for different reasons) and both men and women want and expect higher standards of behavior from their partners than they’re willing to adhere to themselves (again in different ways).

    Basically men have very low standards beyond ‘willing’ while women realize that some guys who might be fun sex partners are probably not good husband/father material (and don’t require or expect that of them).

    Basically, I don’t idealize either male or female behavior, it is what it is and the wise person doesn’t expect seals to behave like buffaloes or buffaloes like seals.

    Like


  449. CVS: the American drugstore chain.

    Like


  450. “It”

    Wow, dude…. profound. 🙂

    Like


  451. bhetti, why do you deny your lust for me?

    Like


  452. Tupac Seriously though, I think Clio and Whiskey would be a good match. A blogosphere power couple.
    *slings Tupac into a chair law and order style*
    Are you serious??? Are you out of your darn mind???
    Don’t you ever utter such garbage again for as long as you live. Whiskey is mine, all mine.
    1. lurker Men and women are different.
    A cheating woman is worse than a cheating man.

    You and a few other men here are beating a dead horse. Women under 30 don’t agree, even if she tells you she agrees, she is lying. Hoing is hoing. A cheating man cheats with another man’s woman (or potential woman). There are 6 billion of us and it’s pretty much evenly divided in number according to gender so there aren’t enough women around for men to get experience with, before they take anther man’s woman.
    michael Basically neither men nor women are biologically programmed for marital faithfulness and demanding higher standards from one than the other is …. foolish.
    agreed but for some people this small truth is so painful.
    Sometimes I wonder what men would do if women went on a poon strike. Watch the alpha of alpha become beta for just a taste. All least it will help bring the people back in line morally riiiigggghhhhtttt.

    Like


  453. lurker: lust does not a marriage make.

    Like


  454. Chic’s right about the Pill, though. I swear that stuff works primarily by annihilating your libido.

    Like


  455. omw
    CVS: the American drugstore chain.

    yes

    Like


  456. on May 12, 2009 at 8:56 pm michael farris

    “the one where didn’t know she was married and avoids having sex with women he knows are taken”

    and carefully avoids finding out she’s married (or otherwise taken) after the jizzbomb horizon …..

    Like


  457. doug1:

    Just wanted to get this topic moving by asking a question. Everyone is attacking kim but it won’t work in changing how she views things. That is all.

    No more friendly thoughts. *shudders*

    Like


  458. OMW, thank you! Too many abbreviations in medicine.

    You guys better not think about it anyway.

    Like


  459. “Basically men have very low standards beyond ‘willing’ while women realize that some guys who might be fun sex partners are probably not good husband/father material (and don’t require or expect that of them).”

    —translation: men want to spread their seed,a nd good women want to be choosy. Skanks are not choosy. Cheating broads are liars and try to get good men to take care of children not their own.

    Women who cheat on husbands are filthy whores.

    “Basically, I don’t idealize either male or female behavior, it is what it is and the wise person doesn’t expect seals to behave like buffaloes or buffaloes like seals.”
    —-WTF kidn of half-assed anaology is that. I expect my women to act like dogs, myself. beta boy.😉

    Like


  460. “and carefully avoids finding out she’s married (or otherwise taken) after the jizzbomb horizon …..”
    —lol. Jealous, beta boy?

    “Women under 30 don’t agree”
    –my gosh,a flighty skanky broad won’t stop hoing? please, tell me more, truth teller.

    ” Hoing is hoing. A cheating man cheats with another man’s woman (or potential woman). ”
    –some who don’t know. Just liek Roissy didn’t know.

    “There are 6 billion of us and it’s pretty much evenly divided in number according to gender so there aren’t enough women around for men to get experience with, before they take anther man’s woman.”
    –yes, but if she cheats when married she is worse.

    A man who cheats is acting naturally.

    A woman who does is acting unnaturally. And poorly.

    End scene. You lose.

    Like


  461. first :lurker
    Doug1, kim is a typical illogical slut. She is as ignorable as contrarian.

    then: lurker
    bhetti, why do you deny your lust for me?

    *looks at lurker like the oracle from the matrix*
    *takes long pull of cigarette*
    *exhales over shoulder*

    Sometimes son, we can answer our own questions if only we take a deep look at ourselves.

    Like


  462. LOL bhetti aren’t you from london?

    CVS is an american drug store. Like “Boots The chemist” in london.

    Like


  463. lol chic. quoting crap like the Matrix? Maybe next you can use an oh so intelligent Beyonce song in your argument.

    “Sometimes son, we can answer our own questions if only we take a deep look at ourselves.”
    —Chic, I am a man. Men cannot be sluts, unless they are gay bottoms, which I am not.

    Women who sleep around are sluts.

    A woman feeling desire for a man is not sluttish for the desire.

    i know that hurts your tiny female brain but try to keep up.

    Like


  464. OMW, thank you! Too many abbreviations in medicine.

    You guys better not think about it anyway.

    Girl, I try to avoid thinking, but the unseemly habit keeps creeping back.😦

    Do they still do lobotomies?

    Like


  465. A woman who does is acting unnaturally.
    not true. Even lesbians cheat sometimes. I understand if you don’t want to believe this thought.

    A woman can be married to Denzel but if Reggie Bush walks past, she will think, my God that boy is fine. Followed by the whole imagine what he looks like naked, the size of it, wonder if he is any good in bed blah blah blah. The thing is, will she act out on it. Probably not and I would like to believe that average man doesn’t act on his impulses if he has Naomi and Tyra walks by.

    Like


  466. Whiskey is mine, all mine.

    Whiskey is much too Scots-Irish to be associated with a Negro woman.

    Like


  467. Aw, lurker, surely you of all people, aren’t going the Natural=Good route.

    Like


  468. “not true. Even lesbians cheat sometimes.”
    –when did I say it didn’t happen that dykes acted like dykes?

    “A woman can be married to Denzel but if Reggie Bush walks past, she will think, my God that boy is fine.”
    –Chic, I know you’re slow, but you do get the difference between “feeling” something and “acting on that feeling” right?

    And any woman lame enough to find reggie bush attractive is pathetic.

    “The thing is, will she act out on it. Probably not ”
    –so? again, chic, you are wrong; I never said being attracted to someone else is slutty. Acting on it is.

    Dumbass woman.

    Like


  469. on May 12, 2009 at 9:07 pm michael farris

    “Skanks are not choosy”

    Talk about naive ……

    When men give in to their basest biological urges (spreadin’ the seed whenever and wherever possible) they’re dopes (maybe happy dopes like Roissy, but dopes nonetheless) if they don’t expect women to give in to _their_ basest biological urges (find a good, dependable day-to-day partner to bond emotionally with while still having the occasional fling with a charming rascal).

    Expecting one side of the male/female dynamic to suddenly develop higher morals is a fool’s game and wanting the state to enforce one side or the other is morally reprehensible (I’ll agree that the current state of affairs is unfair to men, making it unfair to women is not the answer).

    Go ahead, demand MPT (I have nothing whatsoever against that, really, none as long as it’s 100% exception proof) but be aware that any casual squirt in the dark could come back to haunt you bad. The alternative is to accept that not every man is going to raise his biological child (and that some of one’s biological children will be raised by other men).

    Like


  470. Natural for a man=spread his seed.

    natural for a woman: choose her mate carefully, not have just any man’s kids.

    Natural.

    Like


  471. Yes, from London, thus the ‘WTF?’ at ‘CVS’ which I think I’ve had three corrections for now! Nice of you to know about Boots, although its so bastardised as a store that I remember one distinct incident where I was looking for a chemist and there was a Boots RIGHT THERE which I went past a couple of times. Forgetting what it was.

    Yeah, I’m not that clever. Right, I’m going to sleep.

    OMW: no lobotomies done in this country, to my knowledge, no. Now, I don’t rightly know what ye yankees do.

    Like


  472. “if they don’t expect women to give in to _their_ basest biological urges”
    –besides your overwhelming beta desirre to be “please bang my wife” you are not describing any successful society on the planet.

    “Expecting one side of the male/female dynamic to suddenly develop higher morals is a fool’s game and wanting the state to enforce one side or the other is morally reprehensible.”
    –at what point, beta, did anyone here want the state to punish cheating whores? THIS IS ABOUT NOT PUNISHING CUCKHOLDED MEN, beta.

    “be aware that any casual squirt in the dark could come back to haunt you bad.”
    —oooh, I’m sooo afraid. Please tell me more of thsi scary thing called “pregnancy.”

    “The alternative is to accept that not every man is going to raise his biological child.”
    –with MPT, onl;y true losers like you will take that option.

    Like


  473. ay, lurker, but your average cheating wife isn’t cheating with EVERYBODY in town. She’s picked out Mr. Provider for social and status reasons, and is now picking Mr. Stud to make her sons sexier. Not consciously, of course.

    But that’s pretty choosy. “It’s natural!”

    If you buy off on all of the standard evo-psych Just-So stories, of course.

    Like


  474. Bhetti, go to bed, you’re useless.

    Like


  475. “She’s picked out Mr. Provider for social and status reasons, and is now picking Mr. Stud to make her sons sexier. ”
    –not really. Cheating whores destroy their own nest, as it were; in the wild, they would be cast into nature to die. finding mr. stud is just acting unnatural, since she puts her world on the line for a mere orgasm and dead children. not a biologically logical reaction. Provider man was mroe valuable than stud.

    Un. Natural.

    “But that’s pretty choosy.”
    –lol. you think a cheating wife just gets laid by one guy?

    Go see Your errant wife and let me knowhow that goes.

    Once a hoe, always a hoe.

    Like


  476. My empty bed. So sad and useless. I could’ve filled it with lurking lovin’. *weeps*

    Like


  477. dream on.

    Like


  478. She’s picked out Mr. Provider for social and status reasons, and is now picking Mr. Stud to make her sons sexier. Not consciously, of course.

    One is for hugging, the other is for fucking. The problem is that is the man made for fucking doesn’t care about being used, while the man used for hugging may resent paying for the kids of the other man, and he certainly wants to think he’s the man for fucking AND hugging.

    Like


  479. I’d argue that “cheating wife” blogs are run more for the thrill of flamboyant semi-public exhibition than for the actual enjoyment of the cheating.

    If we’re talking about the standard extramarital affair, wherein wife falls madly in love with her boss, or her neighbor, then no, she’s not fucking everyone in town. Just one guy.

    (not that this isn’t plenty bad enough!!!)

    She winds up caught between her passionate love of the other man, and her fear of losing the husband and social status.

    You don’t know women if you don’t know that.

    As for what happens “in the wild,” this is like speculating about what human beings are “without culture.”

    Aside from a couple sad specimens locked in closets from infancy, no such critter has been found yet.

    Like


  480. Bhetti wrote:
    “I’m not surprised. I was limited to a mere 3 kids maximum by a Westerner in terms of suggested family size. There were some things about traditional good Catholicism…

    Can I get an Amen?????

    Like


  481. Yeah, I agree, DA; in large numbers it’s quite untenable.

    Like


  482. on May 12, 2009 at 9:22 pm michael farris

    “Natural for a man … natural for a woman”

    Stupid = wanting to punish cheating women and not punish the men they cheat with.

    And get over the beta label, lurker. In primate studies where the terms come from, alphas are not pussy hounds like Roissy, they’re leaders of other males and protectors of the troupe (esp females and infants) who have first access to fertile females (but don’t necessarily get sole access [it’s hard to say whether they expect sole access or not but they don’t get it in any primate species known AFAIK]).

    And when it comes to humans, societies run for the benefit of betas have produced the highest living standards (for everyone) the world has ever seen. Societies run for the benefit of (true) human alpha males (like Idi Aman, Saddam Hussein, Kim Il-Sen) are shitholes that sane people as far away from as possible as fast as their feet can take them.

    Betas make the world go round, pseudo-alphas like Roissy are at best an irrelevant degenerate sideline and at worst a cancer on society.

    Like


  483. “If we’re talking about the standard extramarital affair, wherein wife falls madly in love with her boss, or her neighbor, then no, she’s not fucking everyone in town. Just one guy. ”
    —and once he pumps her and dumps her, she moves on to another cock. She doesn’t fall madly in love, she falls madly in lust.

    “She winds up caught between her passionate love of the other man, and her fear of losing the husband and social status.”
    –which danielle steele novel you getting that from? lol

    “You don’t know women if you don’t know that. ”
    –I know she likes her bills paid while being on the cock merry-go-round.

    “As for what happens “in the wild,” this is like speculating about what human beings are “without culture.” ”
    –lol. like speculating about how natural it is for women to whore it up? Look at nature: animals kill offspring not theirs. Men will nto tolerate another’s seed.

    “Aside from a couple sad specimens locked in closets from infancy, no such critter has been found yet.”
    –tokyo?

    Like


  484. Bhetti

    My empty bed. So sad and useless. I could’ve filled it with lurking lovin’. *weeps*

    Stop. Please.

    I should be doing other things but this is SO fun!

    Like


  485. lurkerAnd any woman lame enough to find reggie bush attractive is pathetic.

    *gives lurker a shake*
    You have lost your damn mind.

    This serves space by itself. Do you see that face,skin and body. yea you are crazy.

    *looks for white jacket*

    Like


  486. “Stupid = wanting to punish cheating women and not punish the men they cheat with.”

    Stupid= thinking a man cheating is the same as a woman cheating.

    “And get over the beta label, lurker. In primate studies where the terms come from, alphas are not pussy hounds like Roissy”
    —Easy beta, must’ve hit a nerve. If you hate Roissy’s alpha lessos, why are you here bitch boy?

    “societies run for the benefit of betas have produced the highest living standards (for everyone) the world has ever seen.”
    –except when women act unnaturally and start taking advantage of the system. Then it goes to hell. Like now.

    “Betas make the world go round”
    –until betas like you bow down to feminists and let them take power.

    Face it, beta boy, you’re screwed.😉

    Like


  487. http://www.cannold.com/academic-work/2005-01-01/sperm-wars-book-2005.pdf

    Has some juicy assertions in it such as assigning fatherhood to a man based upon his signing the birth certificate or adoption papers, making him legally responsible for children even if they aren’t his own.

    She’s off her rocker on some points, but provides some interesting facts.

    First, she cites 3 cases in which men have received refunds for paternity fraud. Courts in the U.S., Australia, and U.K. have all sided with men in various instances, so at least this isn’t a full-fledged rout against the cuckolded man.

    Second, the author states that U.K. and Aussie courts are more likely to support the cuckolded father’s rights than courts in the U.S. because of the definition of “Dad” in those countries.

    Years back, the author maintains, U.K. and Australia started defining fatherhood in terms of sperm donator whereas in America fatherhood refers to financial provider.

    What simply needs to happen are paternity tests on demand at birth for “fathers” who wish to have them, with confidential results for the father of course.

    Like


  488. Schoolboy Thats, that. Now about those MPT at CVS?
    Oh gosh I would hate to think that you would need one of those. You come across as so sweet and innocent. But yea they are available at CVS, I think maybe not in all states. Basically, you swab you mouth and kid’s mouth and send it in to some lab. I think the total cost is 200-300 bucks. It’s been a while and “people” were working to have it removed from the shelves.

    Lurker women want to argue like men? Then grow some balls and get over it.
    Arguing like men doesn’t always entail name calling. There are a number of men here(mu, doug, Whiskey) who bring heat with little to no name calling. Speaking of which, were the heck is PA. I expect him to be on this topic like a hot potato.
    save your hand-holding and “no put downs” for kindergarten and the sewing circle; men insult, deal with it.
    I see very few men talking to each other like this. Actually, it’s something we women do to each other. Men for whatever reason throw a few insults then somebody is going to get punched or threatened. This seems to cross cultural boundaries.

    lurker
    lol chic. quoting crap like the Matrix? Maybe next you can use an oh so intelligent Beyonce song in your argument

    yes I’m a geek. Hold on the Beyonce song is coming. I’m going to quote “single ladies” and how if everyone woman follow the lyrics no woman would reach 30 without a ring on her finger.

    DA Whiskey is mine, all mine.
    Whiskey is much too Scots-Irish to be associated with a Negro woman.

    What do you have against Whiskey’s Scots-Irish background huh??? Been hanging around HS house to much DA. Anyway, tell that to Rosa Park’s grandad.

    Lurker men here don’t want monogomaous gfs, they just want to bang. Men who want to get married want monogomous wives, which are rarer than they protray themselves Well I hope you aren’t one of the prior because that conflicts greatly with your religion.

    Like


  489. on May 12, 2009 at 9:30 pm Tupac Chopra

    Chic:

    Sometimes I wonder what men would do if women went on a poon strike. Watch the alpha of alpha become beta for just a taste.

    Fat chance.

    Men (the real ones) will go on kicking ass, taking names, building stuff, and making shit happen.

    It’s the women who will shrivel into utter irrelevancy.

    DA:

    Whiskey is much too Scots-Irish to be associated with a Negro woman.

    Oh snap!

    Like


  490. Obviously, the strategy of cuckholdry carries risks, lurker, if we’re just talking about Darwinian fitness. (It also carries rewards, or women would be as reliably monogamous as we are bipedal.)

    Hell, all reproduction carries risks.

    But to argue that it’s “not natural” is plain stupid.

    It’s immoral, it’s antithetical to the creation of the sort of advanced society most of us would like to live in, but that doesn’t make it “unnatural.”

    Like


  491. “You have lost your damn mind. ”
    –you like talentless brainless 2nd stringers? lol.

    “*looks for white jacket*”
    –from the same bitch who thinks Beyonce is the purest of pure virgins? lol. I think that’s for yourself

    Like


  492. Roissy can also tell you that none of the married women i banged insisted i wear a condom, not even on the first night.
    *DEAD FAINT*
    Sweet mother of Jesus

    I don’t know maybe I’m to idealistic about the word and the genders. The danger, she is risking her life and that of her children.

    *throws boxing gloves on the mat*

    Kim and lurker you can have the rest of my gateraid ,Vaseline, and wraps.

    Like


  493. on May 12, 2009 at 9:31 pm michael farris

    “animals kill offspring not theirs. Men will nto tolerate another’s seed”

    Actually the pattern (in some species, not all by any means) is that a new dominant male kills all the very young in the group at the time he becomes dominant (motives are uncertain – it’s probably less related to supporting other males’ offspring than trying to make females become fertile again as soon as possible).

    Are you suggesting that an infant/child discovered to not be the genetic offspring of the woman’s husband be killed? While, yes, that would be a fine example of ‘natural’ law I think you’ll have trouble getting that past any legislature.

    Like


  494. on May 12, 2009 at 9:32 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Stupid = wanting to punish cheating women and not punish the men they cheat with.

    Farris, you mistake a lot of male rage here for this misconception that men want to punish cheating woman and give a pass to cheating men.

    The fact of the matter is that under our current legal system, not only are women NOT punished for cheating…in many cases, they are outright rewarded for there behavior.

    And the guy that ends up paying for it, is the victim…the cheated on husband.

    The only thing MPT really represents is ending the ability of women to fool another man into paying for their offspring derived from infidelity.

    It’s not about “punishing” the cheating woman so much as it’s about preventing her from victimizing the cuckolded man.

    Like


  495. on May 12, 2009 at 9:32 pm Tupac Chopra

    lurker:

    Natural for a man=spread his seed.

    natural for a woman: choose her mate carefully, not have just any man’s kids.

    Nope. Natural for women is hypergamy, not monogamy.

    Like


  496. Aw, c’mon, Dave, Doug was talking about KILLIN a bitch about 500 comments ago.

    And hey, killin is natural.

    If it feels good, do it!

    Like


  497. “Obviously, the strategy of cuckholdry carries risks, lurker, if we’re just talking about Darwinian fitness. It also carries rewards, or women would be as reliably monogamous as we are bipedal.”
    —no, the sexy sons hypothesis is self-defeating, precisely because the “sexiness” of the son is purely irrational, i.e. not based on success. Risking it all for a provider who won’t help you is unnatural. thinking the risk is worht the reward is plain stupid.

    women don’t go for flashy studs except when society allowes them to cheat with impugnity. As in every failing society. as in unnatural circumstances.

    Like


  498. on May 12, 2009 at 9:36 pm Tupac Chopra

    lurker:

    and once he pumps her and dumps her, she moves on to another cock. She doesn’t fall madly in love, she falls madly in lust.

    There’s a difference?

    The love I think you’re talking about it the calculated business we call “marriage.”

    “Aside from a couple sad specimens locked in closets from infancy, no such critter has been found yet.”
    –tokyo?

    LOL

    Like


  499. “Stupid = wanting to punish cheating women and not punish the men they cheat with.”

    some court rulings have ordered the actual father of the baby to refund support to the cuckolded man.

    http://glennsacks.com/blog/?p=3254

    while the biological father should have financial responsibility *after* paternity is determined, it is the female’s “fault” for assigning (falsely) paternity to the cuckolded man.

    how about some punishment for her trying to lead her merry life, having sex with a more “alpha” man, maintaining her beta provided relationship, and having that child raised with no questions asked?

    Like


  500. “Actually the pattern (in some species, not all by any means) is that a new dominant male kills all the very young in the group at the time he becomes dominant (motives are uncertain – it’s probably less related to supporting other males’ offspring than trying to make females become fertile again as soon as possible)”
    –lol. yes, because a dominant male really wants to take care of offspirng not his own. Or he wants his genes only to survive.

    “Are you suggesting that an infant/child discovered to not be the genetic offspring of the woman’s husband be killed? ”
    –a modest proposal (scroll up). More so, make the true father pay, and fuck up his parasitic nature.

    “While, yes, that would be a fine example of ‘natural’ law I think you’ll have trouble getting that past any legislature.”
    —so you agree that wanting to take care of your own kids and your wife having kids by another when you are in control is natural.

    Thanks, beta.

    Like


  501. If you accept the idea that there are indeed “alpha males” in the world, (guys who get laid more often, and with better mates) and if that alphaness is even somewhat heritable, then how is it “unnatural” for a woman’s genes to want some of that for her sons?

    I mean, I’d agree that it’s not the only force behind mate selection, but it isn’t nonnegligible, right?

    Like


  502. on May 12, 2009 at 9:40 pm michael farris

    Dave, you’re still only talking about the responsibility/sins of women and not those of the men they cheat with.

    I’m in favor of a) punishing women for infidelity along with the men they cheat with (whether or not the men ‘knew’ she was married before gifting her with his ejaculation) b) punishing neither (and men being more relaxed about paternity in general). Either is possible (and I realize how the current system penalizes cuckolded men who don’t want anything to do with children they’re not biologically related to).

    But wanting a system that punishes women who stray (with no thought given to the men they stray with, they couldn’t help themselves poor things) is …… not wise. (I’m trying to be diplomatic here).

    Like


  503. “Oh gosh I would hate to think that you would need one of those. You come across as so sweet and innocent.”-chic

    and all this because my screen name is schoolboy…

    Like


  504. Roissy, and fellow blog followers:

    http://therawness.com/female-swagger/

    That is all.

    Like


  505. I have no problem with the law turning a blind eye to a man killing his wife’s lover and her.

    Similar to how some time ago in Baltimore a guy caught a stranger in his 5 year old daughter’s bedroom with his pants unzipped. The intruder jumped out the window and ran, and the father ran after him, caught him, and beat him to near-death. Neither the criminal nor civil court judged against the father.

    Same principle in both cases. Let’s bring back honor.

    Like


  506. “If you accept the idea that there are indeed “alpha males” in the world, (guys who get laid more often, and with better mates)”
    —I do, but alpha is the guy with social dominance. In successful societies, social dominance is an ability to lead men to victory in war, business, or to beat men down financially or socially; when females get in charge, the rules change for alphaness, which Roissy has figure dout.

    “and if that alphaness is even somewhat heritable, then how is it “unnatural” for a woman’s genes to want some of that for her sons?”
    —-the parasite sleeping with married women on purpose or not caring isn’t alpha. Roissy, as he has stated, doesn’t want that, and he is alpha. It is parasitic in nature, not alpha.

    Like


  507. on May 12, 2009 at 9:46 pm Tupac Chopra

    michael fairy:

    But wanting a system that punishes women who stray (with no thought given to the men they stray with, they couldn’t help themselves poor things) is …… not wise. (I’m trying to be diplomatic here).

    It’s not so much the infidelity as such that is at issue, but the financial and psychological rape of the husband when a pregnancy results.

    Yes, infidelity for a married man sucks balls, but for a woman to father the child of her lover and dupe her husband into paying for it is a whole nother level of depravity entirely.

    Don’t conflate the two issues, Fairy.

    Like


  508. Michael Ferris Beta, as the female hysterical reaction here to MPT suggests, women who cheat are much worse than men who do.

    Like


  509. Yes, Tupac, lead the charge!

    Like


  510. on May 12, 2009 at 9:49 pm michael farris

    “make the true father pay, and fuck up his parasitic nature”

    I somehow don’t think Roissy will welcome this option (anymore than he would the idea that most of the women he ‘seduces’ know exactly what he’s doing and go along with it for their own reasons).

    What _does_ he think of those kids of his out there …. somewhere …. does the guy raising them love them? neglect them? abuse them?

    For that matter, does he really think that 99% of the women he scores with don’t know exactly what he’s doing? (ohh, that’s a neg, i’ll give him a shit test so he can think he’s in charge without going through the whole wingman game …)

    Like


  511. on May 12, 2009 at 9:51 pm Tupac Chopra

    PA:

    I have no problem with the law turning a blind eye to a man killing his wife’s lover and her.

    So you think the husbands of the wives Roissy fucked would be justified in killing Roissy?

    The person with the loyalty to the husband is the wife, not any other man.

    I myself have banged a couple wives. I’m not proud of it, but in my defense, they were whores who used their husbands as beta-provider wallets. And they were treated by me commensurately to that fact.

    Like


  512. heh. I think Roissy is more “don’t ask, don’t tell” when it comes to pouring out his manhood for the married chicks.

    And, anyway, per Roissy and our other amoral-when-convenient PUAs, no chick can possibly turn away from their charms, regardless of cultural background or marital status; that’s all just “pretty lies” betas tell themselves as they drift off to sleep at night.

    Sure, alphas can be parasitic. My jaundiced view inclines me to suspect that more of them are than aren’t.

    Like


  513. on May 12, 2009 at 9:53 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Since a few of you have side tracked towards a discussion of “natural,” here’s a great, online book that discusses the “natural” state of familial organization…aka “Matriarchy” and the artificial construct of “Patriarchy.”

    The Case for Father Custody

    Some of you really need to read this book.

    Like


  514. Michael Fairy, being wrong:

    “I somehow don’t think Roissy will welcome this option”
    –who do you think is in favor of MPT? Who pbrought it up, Beta boy? Roissy himself.

    “For that matter, does he really think that 99% of the women he scores with don’t know exactly what he’s doing?”
    –he doesn’t care. Game is about what works, not what the owman is thinking while its working, dumbass.

    Like


  515. so if we have a cheating woman and a cheating man, both of whom have taken necessary precautions to prevent pregnancy (for the sake of argument assume this is true) is the cheating woman still worse than the cheating man? or are they now equal?

    Like


  516. omw–

    Aw, c’mon, Dave, Doug was talking about KILLIN a bitch about 500 comments ago.

    And hey, killin is natural.

    If it feels good, do it!

    No, but if it feels really but level good, don’t ignore it.

    I said I’d feel morally justified in killing her, and challenged those who demurred to challenge me. No one did.

    I also said it wouldn’t be the smartest course given our current laws and culture. I said that credibly theatening her that you’d do that if she sought child support for her bastard, not yours, spawn, was maybe a smart move.

    Where I’m coming form is I simply wouldn’t pay it. Period. Really.

    So the question is, should I kill her, threaten to repeatedly, with escalting violence, or threaten to and then actually disfigure her face, or what?

    Yeah I might move all my money overseas. Actually in my case that might work, but I’m not even slightly worried.

    But comply? Forget about it. Never.

    I’d go nuclear, one way or another.

    All men who are men should.

    Like


  517. “Game is about what works, not what the owman is thinking while its working, dumbass.”

    lol.. lurker…you are the truth sir.

    Like


  518. Beta males take to much of a beating here sometimes.

    As much as men like Roosh and Roissy brag about like life styles they only able to exist because of betas who are willing to do the grunt work to keep society stable. Just imagine if all young American men between the age of 25-30 suddenly tuned out Roosh style.

    Like


  519. on May 12, 2009 at 9:58 pm Tupac Chopra

    Chuck:

    so if we have a cheating woman and a cheating man, both of whom have taken necessary precautions to prevent pregnancy (for the sake of argument assume this is true) is the cheating woman still worse than the cheating man?

    What do you think champ? Who made vows?

    Like


  520. on May 12, 2009 at 9:59 pm michael farris

    “he doesn’t care”

    ITA. He doesn’t care about any of his partners (long or short term) or any of the children he may have unwittingly fathered (or marriages or relationships he may have derailed). He doesn’t care that he may be being used as much as he’s using. He’s a living dildo who thinks he’s a real live boy.

    Like


  521. Ah so you’ve made a apperance PA. I was wondering what happened to you.

    Like


  522. Ah so you’ve made an apperance PA. I was wondering what happened to you.

    Like


  523. completely off topic, but two truths

    – life without soccer is for suckers
    – soccer is the ultimate alpha sport.

    PS: those who have a little bit of knowledge about what ” Libertadores Cup” means will see the irony i the second truth

    Like


  524. That’s cool and all, Doug, but Dave is trying to pretend the discussion is all about merely extricating an otherwise helpless victim, not about revenge or punishment at all.

    Clearly, there’s some fantasizing about revenge going on here.

    And I’m not singling you out for attack, darlin. I just remember everything you say. LOL.

    Like


  525. I haven’t read all of the comments so this may have been addressed already, but aside from PA’s suggestion, what should be done with the men with whom the women cheat?

    I’m not fan of cheating women, but the cynical side of me thinks that a fair portion of the posters here would be rather lenient on the man; mainly because they’ve been that man or would someday like to be.

    Like


  526. before I start my tuesday drinking in honor of what just happened in the most important event on Earth today (hat tip: google Libertadores Cup), one last comment: I am with those who support plain murder for cheating wifes.

    Like


  527. on May 12, 2009 at 10:04 pm michael farris

    “or would someday like to be”

    I think “would like to be” is really the operative phrase here.

    Like


  528. on May 12, 2009 at 10:05 pm Dave from Hawaii

    I’m not trying to pretend anything. Revenge and punishment are really only the consequences of MPT revealing a cuckolding whore.

    Quit pretending that Doug’s feelings of justification for murdering a cheating wife is the primary topic of discussion.

    It’s about Mandatory Paternity Testing stripping away the current paradigm in which women hold ALL of the cards when it comes to reproductive rights.

    Like


  529. Tupac Chopra:

    both, champ.

    Like


  530. lurker

    If sara’s man went muff diving in 22 year old pussy but came up for air to pay her bills, she ‘d hem and haw publically and then spread her legs nightly just thinking about what other pussy his dick’s been in.

    You don’t know me very well. If my man went muff diving on the side, I’d tell him to to go hell and that would be the end of it. Short, sweet, and to the point. Some lies aren’t so pretty. I’d rather live on the street than suck up to a man who is lying cheater. If he was “cheating” and not lying about it, that would be different. Then we’d just be incompatible. I

    Default User

    Stop taunting GNPeter (ironrailsironweights)

    Peter can beat around me bush any time he likes.

    Peter

    Do you mean the sweetly trimmed bush often seen on the types of pretty young women i no longer have access to? *sigh*.

    Okay, Peter. What is your very favorite type of bush and we know you must have one. Or give us your top 3.

    A woman talking about trust being the foundation to a marriage (typical modern pseudo-intellectual nonsense) is always talking about the man *never questioning* her actions, not the other way around.

    Yeah, sure. You’re full of shit. #_#

    Like


  531. The flip side of the Roissy figure is the homewrecking skank!😉

    “He was married? Oh, Mami, I didn’t know! But now your daughter will finally have a little sister!”

    Like


  532. chic noir

    Beta males take to[o] much of a beating here sometimes.

    In many ways i agree Chic.

    Most betas will marry. Actually, the great majority of them.

    (Get a prenup men. Settle a little to get one if you have to. It will help keep things better, not just help you if it all turns to shiite. Stone up about asking / requiring it. That in and of itself is a good precedent and selection tool.)

    Most betas have had girlfriends. What they can’t do is pick up girls easily, or bounce quickly after being dumped. And they rarely themselves dump. They suck at getting casual sex and if they ever do it’s a fluke. Yeah all of that matters a lot but it’s not as apocalypticly bad for betas even today as Rossy and especially Whiskey (goading towards revolution) want to make out. Though of course they’re jealous looking in.

    Here’s my thing Chic. I care about highly productive betas getting attractive women. I don’t much care that loser omega’s and lower clerk kinds of betas don’t. To bring it home, though David Alexander is articulate and in some puppy kinds of ways charming, I can’t really see how so far he’s of any value and needs to reproduce. I’m neutral about that with him. Fine if he can, don’t care if he can’t. Though actually I’m rather sure he will manage to do ok, given that he’s personality wise quite attractive to women. Far from a stud, and always will be, but not every woman wants that.

    It’s terrible for society if software engineers and mechanical ones can’t get hallway attractive women to marry them. It really is.

    Like


  533. on May 12, 2009 at 10:14 pm Dave from Hawaii

    “He was married? Oh, Mami, I didn’t know!

    If she didn’t know, than how is she a homewrecking skank?

    The “home wrecking skank” deliberately and knowingly screws a married man because it makes her feel powerful in her desirability…she gets off on knowing she has seduced a man away from his wife’s bed.

    Your scenario is more like a “reverse” cuckold…except the law would still make the cheating husband pay child support for the little bastard.

    Like


  534. “is the cheating woman still worse than the cheating man”
    —chuck, yes. basic biology.

    Like


  535. and, dave, the husband would still pay for his poor, putupon wife

    Like


  536. on May 12, 2009 at 10:18 pm Tupac Chopra

    Chuck:

    both, champ.

    My bad, I thought you were talking about a wife cheating with a single guy.

    Like


  537. Nah, the little imaginary slut only pretends she didn’t know.😉

    Who can be bothered to ask such mundane questions in the heat of the moment?

    Sure, the law makes Daddy shell out for the little bastard; it’s not the kid’s fault his parents didn’t stop to ask each other some basic questions before they got busy making him.

    Like


  538. @I_Affe_ If the guy was aware of the woman’s husband prior to, he deserves to have his ass pounded too.

    PA1. Neither the criminal nor civil court judged against the father.
    Same principle in both cases. Let’s bring back honor.

    So the pervert had the nerve to take the case to civil court?

    lurker said “is the cheating woman still worse than the cheating man”
    —chuck, yes. basic biology.

    DAve from Hawaii & Tupac, some men beg to differ. It’s about more than being cuckholed.

    Like


  539. Michael Fairy Beta:

    “He’s a living dildo who thinks he’s a real live boy.”
    —-and you’re a walking talking vagina.

    Like


  540. lurker,

    but the “basic biology” rests on reproductive concerns. if those concerns are taken out of the equation, how would the cheating woman be any worse than the man?

    Like


  541. @chuck- No he’s thinking the man has the part that goes in. the banana part and the female has the apple part.

    Like


  542. Dave from Hawaii–

    Doug’s feelings of justification for murdering a cheating wife

    Please. Not what I said.

    I’d let any cheating wife go. Lots of women out there who want me. In fact in limited circumstances, with huge remorse and effort on her part I might forgive, as I’ve said above. Might. Huge remorse and proving herself to me. Have to be huge things right. Totally up to me.

    What i said with respect to 1) a cheating wife, who 2) had a bastard chlld, and 3) deceived me about it for years, who I then discovered and divorced, as i would, who then 3) sued me for child support under our current incredible feminist divorce and child support laws (that very few men really know about, courtesy of our media), her, I would have murderous thoughts towards, and feel fully morally justified in feeling that way.

    I also said it wasn’t the smartest thing to do. But that credibly threatening her along those lines, or disfiguring her face etc., might well be.

    It seems a lot of people here have taken me pretty seriously. Do you think she would too?

    Like


  543. on May 12, 2009 at 10:25 pm Tupac Chopra

    Chuck:

    but the “basic biology” rests on reproductive concerns. if those concerns are taken out of the equation, how would the cheating woman be any worse than the man?

    http://www.womensinfidelity.com

    In a nutshell: when a man cheats, it’s usually just meaningless sex. He can still manage his family.

    When a woman cheats, it’s usually because she’s lost all respect for her husband and doesn’t respect him as a man. Women fall in “love” when they cheat. Much more disastrous for a family unit.

    Like


  544. Chuck,
    evo speaking,we’re only at the point now where those concerns are out of the picutre, and they;ve only been out of the picture for 50 years at best. That’s opposed to 10,000 years of human evolution.

    Thus, the cheating woman’s mindset is still reproductively based, even if it is unnatrually twisted by our current decadence.

    If this keeps up for 1000 years with no collapse of society (highly unlikely) or radical rejection of the methods (also unlikely), we can talk.

    A cheating woman is always worse than a cheating man.

    Like


  545. Yep, ask any man who’s been cheated on—-wait, they don’t talk about it, right? Because its emasculating: emabrassing, makes him seem like less of a man. Because his wife is calling out his betaness for all the world to see.

    A woman who cheats blames her man–and never feels bad, except in fleeting moments.

    Like


  546. on May 12, 2009 at 10:31 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Doug – I get your point. I believe I’d probably seriously consider it myself in the face of a long term cuckolding deception myself…especially if the courts ordered me to pay child support after I kicked her cheating ass to the curb.

    I was merely responding to OMW trying to simplify your post — and all the men that have been participating in the discussion — as the primary topic of discussion here. It’s NOT about murdering cuckolding wives.

    Like


  547. The more I live, the more I get those old movies and stories where people would meet in the city but move out to the country. it wasn’t just the old “start a farm”mentality; it was “get the whore out fo the decadent city before she cheats” mentality.

    Like


  548. on May 12, 2009 at 10:34 pm michael farris

    lurker, can’t you think of any funnier insults?

    I mean I really don’t care what anonymous people call me (knock yourself out) but you haven’t addressed any of my points in detail or explained any of yours. Womens’ infidelity is bad because you say it is, mens’ infidelity is teh awesome because …. you said so. Those aren’t arguments.

    I’m actually pretty non-judgemental and think people should by and large pursue the lifestyle they want (and realize what they want isn’t for everyone and realize that most people want lifestyles they can’t really live up to).

    Again, sexual freedom for Roissy means non-exclusive access to girlfriends and wives for you, lurker, for you. Exclusive access to womens’ sexuality means Iranian or Saudi style control and brutality and a whore class for Roissy to play with. Which is it you want? You can’t have everything.

    If a man wants a faithful wife, then guys like Roissy are his sworn enemy, as Roissy himself says despite some passive agressive non-denials of responsibility for wrecking lives in the pursuit of whatever it is he’s pursuing.

    Like


  549. Cuckoldry has a purpose. It allows stronger genes to propagate without bogging down the men with stronger genes. We can no more afford to ban cuckoldry now in the modern era than we could before if we want a fit species. Otherwise we become a race of ugly pussies.

    Personally I hope my quality seed fathers many children. I refuse to ever get snipped.

    Like


  550. Nah, but it’s also not about a clean, equitable reform of the legal system. It’s about proving Natural Male Superiority to the wickedness perversity of the female id.

    That’s fine and dandy, too; I think that’s an interesting point of view.

    It merely sort of irritates me to hear this stuff couched in terms of Equality.

    MRAs don’t want equality, though– they crave supremacy. Bitches ain’t shit.

    Like


  551. on May 12, 2009 at 10:41 pm Tupac Chopra

    MRAs don’t want equality, though– they crave supremacy.

    “You want a 50/50 relationship? It means she owns you.” – David D.

    Like


  552. “mens’ infidelity is teh awesome because ”
    —nice straw man there, nevber said it. I said the wife’s infidelity is worse (much worse) than the man’s, beta boy.

    “I’m actually pretty non-judgemental and think people should by and large pursue the lifestyle they want”
    –attention: SWPLer alert!

    “sexual freedom for Roissy means non-exclusive access to girlfriends and wives for you, lurker, for you”
    —no, it doesn’t. Roissy finds unattached women or women who make no protest about their attachment until after he bangs them–the married women he stays away from. There are plenty of unattached whores out there.

    “Which is it you want?”
    –False choice. You can have a society of hedionists and asubset of good girls. Been going on for thousands of years. We’re just running out of good girls, thanks to the “non-judgmental types” like you bitch boy.

    “If a man wants a faithful wife, then guys like Roissy are his sworn enemy, as Roissy himself says despite some passive agressive non-denials of responsibility for wrecking lives in the pursuit of whatever it is he’s pursuing.”
    —lol wrong, and a lie. Roissy does nto want to, but it is not his job to ferret out whether he’s banging a cheating wife or just your mom.

    wrong again, fairy boy. Back to the hipster commune with you.

    Like


  553. on May 12, 2009 at 10:42 pm Tupac Chopra

    Bitches ain’t shit.

    Only now, at the end, do you understand. 😉

    Like


  554. Could he be considered alpha if he raised his non-kid daughter, and molested and raped her throughout her most fertile, fresh teen years?

    Like


  555. Hey, then all I have to worry my pretty head about is shoe-shopping!😀

    Like


  556. on May 12, 2009 at 10:48 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Could he be considered alpha if he raised his non-kid daughter, and molested and raped her throughout her most fertile, fresh teen years?

    Only if he starts doing so when she’s around 2 or 3 years old.

    She has to at least be potty trained first.

    Like


  557. I have no problem with the law turning a blind eye to a man killing his wife’s lover and her.

    I’m sorry, but that’s why my parents moved to a white-people country. White people don’t do that anymore, and as far as I’m concerned it’s a sign of civility…

    Like


  558. @DA- I think your jealous of my love for whiskey. This isn’t the first time you’ve thrown out slurs about my love for him.

    At one point, I was looking to you to be my husband you and the father of my children but you’re not being able to protect me turned me off. Imagine the high iq blk kids we may have had. Little Condi,Obama,May Anderson, and Ben Carsons to make our people proud.

    *sigh*

    Like


  559. on May 12, 2009 at 10:53 pm michael farris

    “I said the wife’s infidelity is worse (much worse) than the man’s, beta boy”

    You just can’t explain why in a way that would allow any of us to keep a straight face.

    “Roissy does nto want to” (sic)

    Poor thing he just can’t help it, the words “Are you married?” represents too much effort (and might spoil all the effort he’s expended to get into Mrs Beta’s pants). He’s a victim! A victim I tell you! These slutty women just use him and forget all about him.

    “it is not his job to ferret out whether he’s banging a cheating wife or just your mom”

    I cannot believe you’re lame and/or desperate enough to pull the ‘your mom’ card.

    Like


  560. Michael, these men don’t cry uncle.

    Like


  561. on May 12, 2009 at 10:59 pm Dave from Hawaii

    Gee Michael, do you think that maybe a married woman is all grown up and bears the responsibility for her choices?

    Why do you care about the cad, when he’s not the one that made the vows of monogamy?

    One person takes a vow to “forsake all others.” The other took no such oath.

    Now, I don’t think the guy banging a married chick is admirable..but the person breaking their vow is more culpable and reprehensible in my book.

    Like


  562. on May 12, 2009 at 11:00 pm Tupac Chopra

    Hey, then all I have to worry my pretty head about is shoe-shopping!

    As you wish.

    As long as you service your husband and don’t mouth off to him, it’s all good.

    You can even read books in your free time if it suits you.

    Like


  563. on May 12, 2009 at 11:05 pm Tupac Chopra

    I’ve seen so many faces, and always left my mark
    I’ve kissed so many faces, lips smooth, just like a shark
    I have no friends, I hope that’s understood
    I take what I can take, when the taking’s good
    It’s not for love but I’ll gladly take your money
    I can pretend to be so sad or funny
    You’ll just love the way I move when I dance
    My young hips, they know how to entrance
    Nevermind him, he’s not here now
    It’s really not my problem anyhow

    An angel of love is what I may appear
    Your lonely ache, I can make, dissappear
    Yes, take me deep inside so I can heal your pain
    No angel of love takes another man’s gain

    You want to keep me held inside your cage
    You best remember, you’re twice my age
    You think I’ll wan’t you for evermore
    It’s only been two weeks, and you’re such a bore
    I can see you’re new to this, you don’t know the rules
    You’re just another one in a long line of fools

    Can you be happy for one moment in your life
    It doesn’t bother you you’re someone else’s wife?

    An angel of love is what I may appear
    What I really am is really not so clear
    I don’t live for love, you sticky bitch
    All I care about is if you’re rich
    You decide if you still want to play this game
    The price to you for this is nothing will ever be the same

    — Alex Lifeson

    Like


  564. Hey, then all I have to worry my pretty head about is shoe-shopping!

    I’d say “Useless, stupid, lazy bitch who is incapable of taking care of herself”, but with more civility and gentleness.

    Like


  565. on May 12, 2009 at 11:06 pm michael farris

    “In a nutshell: when a man cheats, it’s usually just meaningless sex. He can still manage his family.
    When a woman cheats, it’s usually because she’s lost all respect for her husband and doesn’t respect him as a man. Women fall in “love” when they cheat. Much more disastrous for a family unit.”

    Now you make a better case than lurker does in all his flailing about and (charmingly childlike) name-calling.

    If I understand your position: Male infidelity is not necessarily a critique of the wife’s performance as a wife (given male madonna/whore hangups and generally low standards regarding sexual partners and ability to separate sex and emotional investment) while female infidelity is ofen very much a critique of the husband as a husband (given womens’ generally pickier sexual standards and desires for sexual and emotional needs to be met simultaneously).

    There’s a lot you leave out (a man may not intend to be insulting his wife through infidelity while she’ll absolutely feel the insult and some women can separate sex and emotions pretty easily) but yours is a position I can at least respect if not totally agree with. Well done.

    Like


  566. JerrDogg has a good point. Its the whole Cads v Dads thing again. Women want the excitement of having sex with someone that sexually excites them but wants to have a man that will provide for her and her offspring. It’s biologically imprinted.

    But its funny which direction everyone is approaching the issue from. The worst epithet hurled on this board is “Beta”, and the beta is pitied and despised yet everyone gets up in arms about the beta being wronged.

    many here defend the beta and really it seems as if you all wish we had a system of sexual egalitarianism, but at the same time, the spoils of the alpha are heralded by most here.

    if you have a system (HBD) which realizes the ugly truth of things, and you accept the alpha and even aspire to fill that role, you can’t also have sympathy for the beta. the beta is beta by definition of the alpha. without alpha, there is no beta. the terms are relative.

    plus, as jerrdogg points out, what if we had some sort of device (MPT) to weed out cuckolded children. what if the number of cuckolded children decreases? we’d have to assume that those children receive “weaker” genes compared to the Cad alternative. perhaps we’re screwing with the natural order of things.

    from a purely Darwinistic view, perhaps the cuckolded man *should* be forced to pay for the other man’s child. this would reallocate resources to a more socially and reproductive optimal end, the Cad’s.

    Like


  567. on May 12, 2009 at 11:12 pm Tupac Chopra

    Male infidelity is not necessarily a critique of the wife’s performance as a wife

    P r e c i s e l y

    yours is a position I can at least respect if not totally agree with. Well done.

    I aim to please.

    Did you check out the link to http://www.womensinfidelity.com ?

    It’s written by a woman.

    Like


  568. on May 12, 2009 at 11:14 pm Tupac Chopra

    from a purely Darwinistic view, perhaps the cuckolded man *should* be forced to pay for the other man’s child. this would reallocate resources to a more socially and reproductive optimal end, the Cad’s.

    This is expat’s position, but as Whiskey points out, it is the high IQ betas that push civilizational progress forward.

    Like


  569. on May 12, 2009 at 11:15 pm michael farris

    “these men don’t cry uncle”

    I don’t expect them to. Mostly they’re reacting pretty much as I would expect.

    “do you think that maybe a married woman is all grown up and bears the responsibility for her choices? Why do you care about the cad”

    I guess I haven’t been clear. My position:

    Punish both the cheating spouse (and the person they’re cheating with) or punish neither. Don’t go whining to the law to punish one more harshly than the other. If men have the short end of the stick now the answer is not to make women get the short end of the stick but to punish (or not) adultery equally, married cheater and unmarried cheater.

    And …. be careful what you wish for. Insisting on female monogamy has traditionally led to high levels of male sexual frustration (no matter how much game he has).

    Like


  570. Re: Cuckold children

    Maybe we should offer a tax credit for raising the children of cuckoldry. In other words, pay betas to be betas with something more useful and better than once a month sex.

    Like


  571. on May 12, 2009 at 11:20 pm Tupac Chopra

    For OMW:

    Like


  572. Michael Fairy, being the beta:

    “You just can’t explain why”
    –except I pointed out biological reporductive needs. But hey, sticking your head in the sand is more fun for you…

    “Poor thing he just can’t help it, the words “Are you married?””
    –typical beta response: she’s out, drinking flirting, going home wiht him—but he should assume she’s married, the cad! Evil man.

    “He’s a victim! A victim I tell you! These slutty women just use him and forget all about him.”
    —at what point did Roissy or I claim he was a victim? He used her, she just concealed information he was under no obligation ask. She’s at fault, not him, beta boy.

    “I cannot believe you’re lame and/or desperate enough to pull the ‘your mom’ card.”
    –lol said the bitch blaiming the single guy hitting on an apparently single woman for not ruthlessly investigating whether she was secretly married.

    betas. can’t live with ’em. can’t shoot ’em.

    Like


  573. “Punish both the cheating spouse (and the person they’re cheating with) or punish neither. Don’t go whining to the law to punish one more harshly than the other.”

    —those 2 sentences are in confict, moron.

    but, as we explained, the cheating whore is worse than the cheating man. If she is cheated on, she still gets all the benefits of the marriage or divorce. If he is, he does not.

    “If men have the short end of the stick now the answer is not to make women get the short end of the stick”
    —lol. or take away their long end.

    “but to punish (or not) adultery equally, married cheater and unmarried cheater.”
    –ah, the beta. still believing men and women are equal. How is that dildo up your ass, boy?

    “And …. be careful what you wish for.”
    –oh noes! a warning from a fairy!

    “Insisting on female monogamy has traditionally led to high levels of male sexual frustration (no matter how much game he has).”
    —really? do tell. because it is precisely the opposite: monogamy has lead to marriage —marriages where the wife had to give up sex by law and religion, so no frustration. It is polygamy that leads to frustration.

    You lose, beta boy.

    Like


  574. ha, Tupac, I was listening to that today in the car. Which, of course, got me thinking about Roissy.

    Ben Folds– ironically tired of being ironic before it was even cool.

    Like


  575. Tupac:

    true. society does need betas, but everyone is up in arms when what happens to them is the shit that *always* happens to betas.

    they get cheated on, used, abused, cuckolded and maligned in the name of women and alpha men.

    to account for this, high IQ beta men have retreated to their own endeavors to seek out a proxy for sex with hot chicks: academia, video games, science, blogs, etc. there they gain the favor of like-minded betas, and competition on those grounds is akin to getting women.

    Like


  576. marriages where the wife had to give up sex by law and religion, so no frustration

    Having sex with a woman who isn’t sexually attracted to me is a form of sexual frustration, especially if I have to “pay” for it.

    Like


  577. Roissy has staed Chuck, that his work is about dealing with the evolution of how the world has become; he praises virgin women, he just doesn’t beleive women live up to their virginal uses, therefore, he treats them as the sluts they really are.

    We decry unfairness heaped on men by women by the law.

    We also know that if betas realize how often they have been cucklolded, they will turn alpha and put women in their place.

    Like


  578. on May 12, 2009 at 11:31 pm Tupac Chopra

    ha, Tupac, I was listening to that today in the car. Which, of course, got me thinking about Roissy.

    Ben Folds– ironically tired of being ironic before it was even cool.

    When a limpwristed herb like Ben Folds does a cover of Bitches Aint Shit, you know there is a sea change afoot.

    Like


  579. yeah, but he’s doing it purely to mock his own herb persona. Same vein as “Rocking the Suburbs,” only much more amusing.

    Not much of a sea change to be found in whiteboy self-deprecation.

    Like


  580. on May 12, 2009 at 11:42 pm Tupac Chopra

    yeah, but he’s doing it purely to mock his own herb persona.

    Joke: What do you call herbs mocking their own pathetic personas?

    Answer: A good start.

    Like


  581. Those who can’t trust will be doomed to loneliness.

    Words of wisdom:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trust,_but_Verify

    Like


  582. Cuckolding wife = curb.

    Expensive? maybe. Self respect? Priceless.

    Like


  583. Cheating does not justify murder.

    And a man is supposed to control his emotions.

    That is all.

    Like


  584. on May 12, 2009 at 11:50 pm Comment_Whatever

    Points to take away from this thread:

    1.Secretly test to see if ‘your’ children are yours. It’s cheap. If they are yours, then great! No harm, no foul. But you should test, because they might not be yours.

    2.The law in almost all states doesn’t care if you can prove the child isn’t yours.

    http://www.menshealth.com/cda/article.do?site=MensHealth&channel=guy.wisdom&category=family.guy&conitem=4a096f83c9821110VgnVCM10000013281eac____

    If you want to avoid child support payments, then you need to make use of your passport. Remember, the results of your SECRET DNA test is known only to you. You have time. Breath in, breath out. No need to tell anyone.

    3.Women, take note that the issue of cuckolding will turn placid guys turn into maniacs screaming for blood.

    4.Men, take note that many women can’t bring themselves to say cuckolding is wrong…. even though the men here are very mad and it is clearly a VERY BAD IDEA to support it. They just can’t help themselves. They really can’t.

    Doing my part to help thread-count reach 900.

    Like


  585. A woman who cheats has lost her value. Hence why the Romans thought you couldn’t rape a prostitute, since she had no value worth suing over.

    After that, she a worthless asset that you must nonetheless take care of and be shamed for it. Destroying the asset is a logical response, but not legal. that’s why divorce laws must be reformed.

    MPT: It’s for the children.

    Like


  586. on May 12, 2009 at 11:54 pm Tupac Chopra

    Whiskey:

    Do you like Clio like I like Clio?

    (They Call Me Bruce reference for any oldsters out there)

    Like


  587. Biased divorce laws :

    It is not an exaggeration to say that married men in America today have it just about as bad as blacks did under Jim Crow laws, around, say, the 1950s. The court circuses that destroy a dutiful husband and father are merely the modern feminist equivalent of a lynching.

    How did things get this bad? Particularly when most women wouldn’t go too far out of their way to implement such judicial changes (even if they exploit them after they exist). This is America, isn’t it?

    I think it is a combination of :
    1) Feminist lawyers working tirelessly in collusion with male divorce lawyers. Full-time feminists are still a small percentage of the female population, but have a disproportionate impact.
    2) The general chivalry/goodwill that most men still bestow upon (now undeserving) women. Men are behind the curve in this regard, and are analogous to ‘house slaves’.
    3) Many men still believing that it is their ‘duty’ to marry and have a family. This is noble, but now that the game is rigged against them, they have yet to swallow the fact that they have to re-assess what their obligations really are. This is the era of the cad, not the dad.
    4) The unwillingness of men to go vocal and share their horrors with other men, and organize around this political cause. Political causes much more trivial than this can readily gain a following, but this cannot. How many men will even write a letter to their Senator about this? None.

    So Beta men do have themselves to blame. Particularly for point 4).

    All this in combination allows the current status quo to continue.

    This will be busted apart by 2020, however, due to 1) technology, and 2) Islam, as I have written about before. Game is also a factor, except that I am convinced that we will never get to a point where more than 2% of men are moderately good at practicing Game.

    Like


  588. on May 12, 2009 at 11:57 pm Gunslingergregi

    “”””””””””””””@Bhetti
    Bhetti
    lurker: Our wedding? Has noone supplied you with muslim proposal techniques: Where is the request for my mother’s number? Wasn’t I relegated to slut, now, anyway? Don’t you hate me too much as an inferior female to have to spend eternity with me?

    All irrelevant, since I’m set ruthlessly/heartlessly on doug. “””””””””””

    I guess I revoke my offer then. He He He

    Doug won good job bud.

    You won a ruthless heartless bitch. lol

    Like


  589. on May 13, 2009 at 12:00 am Comment_Dave_From_Hawaii

    Dave, do you know if the blog ‘The Reality Method’ is still present anywhere on the web?

    I read a little of what he wrote, and was curious about the rest. If you saved any articles, and I know this is a big favor to ask, then could you zip them and send them to whatever894@yahoo.com?

    I know you have no reason to take the trouble to do that, but the blog seems to be gone from the web. No problem if you can’t.

    *Doing my part to help thread-count reach 900.

    Like


  590. Doug1 wrote :

    Yeah I might move all my money overseas.

    From what I understand, that does not work if you are a salaried worker at a corporation. They can merely subpoena the account that your paycheck when to, and will ask what all the withdrawals are. Since your income came from a known source, you are screwed.

    There are other things a salaried worker can do, however. But he will always be at a disadvantage to a business owner, in terms of divorce discovery.

    The best insurance is the combo of 1) pre-nup, and 2) marrying a woman who makes the same or more than you. Then, your risk, while not zero, is much less.

    Like


  591. I am female, and I agree with the “male” take on this issue. FWIW, I belong to a traditional subculture.

    By the way, Dr. Laura takes the “female” side of the issue. I used to read her columns. She thought a married woman pregnant with her lover’s child should stay with her husband on the grounds that multiple future generations of her family’s well being were at stake.

    Like


  592. I’m going to pressure the harpies a bit more.

    Direct question to all the women reading this :

    Is cuckolding a man, within marriage, wrong?

    Bhetti, is it wrong?

    Kim, is it wrong?

    Anony, is it wrong?

    Chic Noir, is it wrong?

    Who else is a woman here? You better answer, all of you.

    I think Nicole is the only one who will truly be fair here. Where is Nicole when you need her?

    Like


  593. blue, that might be true, but I also know Dr. Laura would have castigated the woman to death, and probably made her perfom sexual penance. The shaming via radio is what Laura does best–she understands how women unshamed are going to stray, and that society has abandoned shame to control women, because its judgmental. Dr. Laura is adamantly against divorce, I know, so she is conflcited there.

    And I’m guessing that the woman had other children by the husband, no? That may be an impetus; some children were his, which, for Laura, is good enough to keep mommy and daddy at home.

    Like


  594. I also remember an article from several years ago in a woman’s magazine by a lady who had cuckolded her husband.

    The thing I remember about it is the lady said she didn’t feel guilty about it at all because she felt she had always been a good wife to her husband.

    She also said she and her husband maintained an active sex life during her extra marital affair and had always had an active sex life though her heart wasn’t in it.

    I was only in my early teens at that time, so I didn’t really understand these issues at all. I found the sentiments expressed sooooo puzzling. I don’t now.

    Like


  595. Prediction:
    Bhetti: yes.

    Kim: oh, no, its both of their fault. They should work on strengthening their relationship and not being petty.

    anony: No.

    Chic Noir: *sassy black dialectic remark* No woman should cheat, but lord, this hate coming out of here makes my head spin!

    Like


  596. Re: Dr. Laura

    I also remember a certain call to the show. A certain divorced guy had a child and had divorced because his wife had cuckolded him.

    He was calling because whenever he had his kid over, his ex-wife apparently expected him to watch the illegitimate child as well, which he did not want to do.

    The issues people have! Amazing!

    Dr. Laura took the guy’s side.

    Like


  597. Damn right she should have. Frickin’ bitch wants a babysitter, he’s there to see his kid, but she, like most women nowadays, expect the man to serve them.

    Like


  598. Chuck:

    comparing cuckolding to the male version of rape is a bad characterization. its obviously more akin to thievery or robbery

    Rape IS thievery or robbery. Rape is robbery of sex, which is the quintessential female resource. Paternity fraud is thievery of the equivalent male resources.

    If you have trouble seeing rape as theft, I recommend reading Baumeister, R.F. & Vohs, K.D. (2004). Sexual Economics: Sex as Female Resource for Exchange in Heterosexual Interactions. Personality and Social Psychology Review, 8, 339-363. See my blog for how to find it.

    That said, one could argue, as some do, that false accusations of rape really is the most apt moral equivalent of rape of the things women do to men. But false accusations are actually much worse than rape when they succeed, it seems to me, and so is potentially paternity fraud because it could mean the man does not get to reproduce at all.

    And with what passes for “rape” today, under current feminist jurisprudence, as in what is usually understood by “date rape,” or the Norwegian invention of negligent rape without mens rea, date fraud is in fact most on a par with rape, i.e. when a woman refuses to have sex after leading a man on and letting him spend money on her.

    lurker:

    As any feminazi will tell you, “rape is about power.” So is cuckholding; it is power over a man’s livlihood.

    Feminazis will tell you that for hateful ideological reasons, but they are wrong. Rape no more about power than robbing banks is about guns or visiting a brothel is about the urge to give money to women. Rape is of course about sex. Get A NATURAL HISTORY OF RAPE by Thornhill & Palmer (MIT Press, 2000) and read chapters 5-6 for a thorough refutation of this most invidious and demeaning of feminist lies.

    Like


  599. High IQ men who are good looking and socially assertive get more pussy than good looking men with low IQ. But we have celebrate the Bill Clinton lifestyle to make it effective. Just the other day I asked out a hot married chick who’s hubby is studly in looks but is a loser. The gleam in her eyes and glow on her face said it all but it was especially the change in her breathing pattern that showed her excitment. The problem is that I got to her 2 late. She has 2 kids who could otherwise be crippled with loser traits.

    Ceteris peribus, the status of high-IQ careers is valued more by women than their martial vows. Paternity laws suck in that this could come back to haunt me. Hopefully I can spread enough seed to make up for the prisoners knocking up drunk chicks who should know better. It is the quality of cuckoldry that we should be worried about.

    Like


  600. Arpagus, I do agree; I’m just using the feminists own illogic against them. But it really is sill of me, ’cause they’ll just change the rules.

    Like


  601. MPT: It’s for the children.

    Like


  602. on May 13, 2009 at 1:18 am Comment Ninja

    It blows me away that the columnist is equating cuckoldry with hospital error and suggesting that there is nothing different between the two.

    Newsflash: in the case of hospital error, the wife is not (necessarily) an untrustworthy deceitful whore.

    Like


  603. “Rape IS thievery or robbery.”

    Sure, but are thievery or robbery rape? It’s easy to see paternity fraud as thievery or robbery, but its not so easy to see it as rape if we use the traditional legal definition of rape, which is unwanted sexual contact.

    to get pedantic, the man fucked the woman of his own accord. she lied to him about paternity, thereby defrauding him, but there is no *rape*.

    comparing this to “male rape” has the same literal meaning as the phrase “raping the land”. i mean, unless you’re fucking the soil, it’s merely hyperbole, much like roissy’s “male rape”.

    i get the comparison, but it is merely a literary device. it seems that many here actually believe paternity fraud is “rape” in the legal sense.

    “Rape is robbery of sex, which is the quintessential female resource. Paternity fraud is thievery of the equivalent male resources.”

    equalizing each gender’s resources does not mean one can equalize the infractions upon those resources.

    if argentina’s quintessential resource is iron and cancun, mexico’s quintessential resource is pretty beaches and tropical climates, each locales resources would be confiscated by different means, straight up thievery in the case of argentinian iron and pollution, arson, etc in the case of Cancun.

    paternity fraud is just that, fraud.

    Like


  604. This is your life…and its ending one minute at a time.

    Like


  605. on May 13, 2009 at 1:54 am Marcus Aureliette

    lurker:
    Stupid= thinking a man cheating is the same as a woman cheating.

    For a lot of good (in the sense usually meant on this board) women, the price of their fidelity is their man’s fidelity. You’re not entitled to one without the other. You may not like that, but it’s true.

    doug:
    I’d let any cheating wife go.

    And I wouldn’t blame you one bit. I’d do the same to a cheating husband.

    tood:
    Who else is a woman here? You better answer, all of you.
    I think Nicole is the only one who will truly be fair here. Where is Nicole when you need her?

    Already answered with my support of MPT. And Nicole is the only one who’ll be fair? WTF?!

    The best insurance is the combo of 1) pre-nup, and 2) marrying a woman who makes the same or more than you. Then, your risk, while not zero, is much less.

    This is sound advice for either sex. If you’re a well-earning person, it’s only wise to protect yourself.

    Like


  606. Sure, but are thievery or robbery rape? It’s easy to see paternity fraud as thievery or robbery, but its not so easy to see it as rape if we use the traditional legal definition of rape, which is unwanted sexual contact.

    The traditional definition of rape is not merely unwanted sexual contact (that would be the feminist definition, which also includes activity unwanted merely in retrospect and all sorts of sexual contact which is not sex — under Norwegian law e.g. rubbing a penis against a woman’s stomach is sufficient) but intercourse against her will ACCOMPLISHED by force, in other words the woman has to resist to the best of her ability unless she or someone she commonly protects probably will get killed or seriously injured (in contrast, any threat is sufficient under current law around here, even perfectly legitimate threats such as breaking up with the woman if she won’t have sex!).

    I see your point that calling paternity fraud rape is mostly a literary device, an analogy, but please don’t call any merely unwanted sexual contact rape like the feminists do. I you believe all unwanted sexual contact is rape, then you are a feminist.

    And considering how trivial most of what the feminists call rape is, rape is probably too mild a word for paternity fraud and so should be avoided — I concur.

    if argentina’s quintessential resource is iron and cancun, mexico’s quintessential resource is pretty beaches and tropical climates, each locales resources would be confiscated by different means, straight up thievery in the case of argentinian iron and pollution, arson, etc in the case of Cancun.

    You don’t really confiscate anything by pollution and arson. You merely destroy it. Rape is about taking something from the woman (with only instrumental damage) for your own benefit, as is paternity fraud about taking something from the man, and in that sense they are comparable, whereas comparing either to arson is as nonsensical as the feminist delusion that rape is motivated by power and violence.

    Like


  607. Suddenly, one starts to see the logic in foreign traditions such as “honor killings”. Funny how the MSM has been brainwashing us to see this as barbaric evil. Deeper examination reveals this was those socities’ way of punishing the cheaters, and keeping the monogamous order healthy and alive.

    Like


  608. Comment Ninja
    It blows me away that the columnist is equating cuckoldry with hospital error and suggesting that there is nothing different between the two.

    Newsflash: in the case of hospital error, the wife is not (necessarily) an untrustworthy deceitful whore.

    I guess mathematically Carolyn Hax is saying that being an untrustworthy deceitful whore is null. i.e. Not important.

    Like


  609. Anony, from upthread:

    Presumption of guilt cuts deep. Imagine how you’d feel toward your state if you were presumed guilty, and had to prove your innocence.

    This is idiotic.

    One:
    A paternity test is a neutral entity. It “presumes” NEITHER innocence NOR guilt.
    It is black or white. There is no “significance level” or “preponderance of the evidence” or “reasonable doubt” standard that implies ANY presumption.

    When I was a college athlete, we were all tested for drugs. Does that “presume” that all athletes are juicing? Or is it merely quality control?

    Two:
    The indiscriminate application of the paternity tests to EVERYONE, ironically, ELIMINATES any stigma associated with the tests.

    If one particular group of women – say, upwardly mobile white women – were singled out for mandatory testing, then you’d have something there with your “stigma” thing.

    Three:
    The NEED to establish paternity dwarfs your poor wittle hurt feewings, thousandfold.

    which is worse:
    (1) subjecting cuckolded husbands to deception, uncertainty, wage slavery, and unknowing genetic extinction, or
    (2) making some over-sensitive women feel “not trusted”, but ultimately vindicating all the women who aren’t cheating whores?

    Hmm. Tough one, that.

    Like


  610. Xsplat:

    That’s a load. My current GF is Muslim. And my other current one is also. Girls are girls are girls are girls are girls.

    Muslims in minority-Muslim, Western countries != Muslims in majority-Muslim countries.

    Like


  611. on May 13, 2009 at 2:35 am HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “I’m writing to you because I don’t know who else to ask
    friendless

    but for a number of reasons I
    insisted on self denial

    I have not confronted
    fearful

    I am with the women in this one. Guys like this must suffer. And be wiped out from the gene pool.”

    I would agree, but keep in mind how bad a hit masculinity has taken in our society. When 40% of children grow up in single parent homes of which the majority are single-mothers, and when men are betaized from birth and alpha characteristics are strongly discouraged in favor of raising spineless gentlemen women think they want, you can hardly blame the guy. I would contest that there are very few natural betas, but that most men would be reaching or exceeding the current “alpha threshold” if they were simply socialized properly.

    Like


  612. Arpagus:

    yes, rape involves intercourse of some kind, either vaginally, anally, or orally. the other stuff is sexual assualt or something along those lines.

    yes, rape is an overused definition applied for many things that don’t constitute rape, i agree. the same goes for the analogy of paternity fraud as “male rape”.

    Like


  613. Xsplat:

    Society is based on people, and the best people have the best genes. The alphas tend to have the best genes. All animals know that, including female human animals.

    Either you’re trolling, or you’re a complete moron. At your age, and with some of your previous trenchant observations about humanity, I doubt it’s the latter, so I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you’re just stirring the pot a bit.

    The only reason we even have “society” is because the strictures of Judeo-Christian culture have allowed beta males to procreate, and beta morals to predominate. The reason society has not decayed, though, is because these beta morals have been enforced with an iron fist, until recent times.
    (Not “beta” in the derisive Roissy sense, but, rather, “beta” in the “self-sacrificing for the good of society” sense.)

    With the exception of some very religious alphas:
    * Alphas don’t create technology.
    * Alphas don’t enact, promote, and enforce laws that protect society at the expense of individual licentiousness.
    * Alphas don’t further science and higher learning.
    * Etc. Alphas don’t further “society”.

    A society ruled completely by alpha genes will regress quickly to sub-Saharan / British underclass / ghetto norms.

    Do you really think that a society of people largely endorsing your particular moral stances could stay afloat?
    Think about your own country, Indonesia. Were it not for the legacy of (a) Dutch rule (founded on beta Judeo-Christian principles), (b) Japanese rule, and (c) oil to power engines invented by betas, your country would be 237 million destitute untouchables in dirt hovels. Many would be alphas, but alphas in untouchable dirt hovels.

    Idiot.

    Like


  614. on May 13, 2009 at 2:46 am Comment_Whatever

    Chuck said:

    if you have a system (HBD) which realizes the ugly truth of things, and you accept the alpha and even aspire to fill that role, you can’t also have sympathy for the beta. the beta is beta by definition of the alpha. without alpha, there is no beta. the terms are relative.

    I’m surprised, Chuck, that you’ve never been in a situation where you felt two things, each intense, each very different, about the same thing.

    1.Most here recognize that sexual hedonism is bad for society.

    2.They also believe that it is good for them, as individuals.

    3.Or, to say it better, they believe it is the best they can do.

    And that’s three things right there. Worry, perhaps, over the effect on society. Lust for the conquests they will have, and the feeling of regret over the loss implied by the third statement.

    So being of two minds on something is easy, Chuck! Three isn’t that hard either.

    *Doing my part to help thread-count reach 900.

    Like


  615. Suddenly, one starts to see the logic in foreign traditions such as “honor killings”.

    Now you see how Islam wins so many people over. including people who used to be appalled by Islam (such as I).

    What we have learned from this thread so far :

    1) The majority of women want to get away with cuckolding. They can scarcely conceal their wishes.
    2) Cuckolding is just about the worst thing that a woman can do to a man.
    3) Kick a friendly dog enough, and eventually you have a mean dog. Discovery of cuckolding can turn a placid, polite Beta male into a raging madman quite capable of slashing the woman’s throat.
    4) Large-scale cuckolding will make many men quietly approving of violence against women.

    Women are playing a dangerous game here. Traditional religions knew about this, and had rules for it (aside from Islam, burning at the stake or the equivalent was prevalent in both Christianity and Hinduism).

    Like


  616. yes, rape involves intercourse of some kind, either vaginally, anally, or orally. the other stuff is sexual assualt or something along those lines.

    Oral intercourse? That is the first time I’ve heard that. Even the feminists I’ve read don’t call oral sex intercourse, but they do consider it rape, and I have a real problem with that. Oral sex is of far less value to me than sex, and so I don’t accept that it can qualify as the ultimate in terms of negative sexual value for women.

    Like


  617. I think many commentators on this have an exaggerated paranoia that reveals morbid jealousy. Morbid jealousy is not good.

    Only about 4% of the US births is “cuckholdry” Unless you’re a clueless dipshit the chances of this happening to you are small.

    All the married women I’ve been banging were married to dweebs. Usually they are fat or their wives claim they are “impotent” although I suspect that they just aren’t attracted to them.

    Women tend to do this (seeking outside sex) in their mid 30’s – right when their eggs are going bad. I think it is either a rational or evolutionary adaptation to accelerate their stud stalking to get good seed in their aging womb.

    Like


  618. Arpagus:

    if you stick your dick in a woman’s (or man’s) mouth (probably not a wise move), it would be rape, sure.

    when i think of the word intercourse i think of an object physically entering one’s body.

    either way, to keep this from getting too pedantic, rape is penetrating someone against their will. these are to be differentiated from sexual assault or sexual battery.

    Like


  619. lurker said:

    >A woman who cheats has lost her value…

    A woman who cheats has lost some of her value. That of a long-term mate. On the other hand a desirable woman who is known to have cheated is probably an easier lay.

    Like


  620. Aspargus said:

    “… but they do consider it (oral intercourse) rape, and I have a real problem with that. ”

    Hmmm… I’m trying to think which guy I’d rather be in that Deliverance movie, the piggy ride boy or the one with the pretty mouth…

    Like


  621. Surprised that no one has commented on this little excerpt in the original post:

    Their marriage would remain strong, or at least viable, as they made arrangements with the hospital to find their true baby and swap kids with the other victimized family who mistakenly got their kid.

    Two years after a hospital error, I wouldn’t “swap kids”. I would just suddenly have an adopted daughter.
    This would be cool with me.

    Of course, I’m positively biased toward adoption, and I’m (perhaps wrongly) assuming that the wife in question is young enough to bear another, biological child(ren) without much trouble.

    I wouldn’t want to “swap” for a kid with two years of mystery parenting.
    Especially given the near-100% chance that the mystery parents would be ill-educated, liberal, indulgent morons who already would’ve compromised the child’s mental wherewithal.
    No sir.

    Like


  622. on May 13, 2009 at 5:29 am HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO

    “Suddenly, one starts to see the logic in foreign traditions such as “honor killings”.

    Now you see how Islam wins so many people over. including people who used to be appalled by Islam (such as I).

    What we have learned from this thread so far :

    1) The majority of women want to get away with cuckolding. They can scarcely conceal their wishes.
    2) Cuckolding is just about the worst thing that a woman can do to a man.
    3) Kick a friendly dog enough, and eventually you have a mean dog. Discovery of cuckolding can turn a placid, polite Beta male into a raging madman quite capable of slashing the woman’s throat.
    4) Large-scale cuckolding will make many men quietly approving of violence against women.

    Women are playing a dangerous game here. Traditional religions knew about this, and had rules for it (aside from Islam, burning at the stake or the equivalent was prevalent in both Christianity and Hinduism).”

    lol, just curious, but did you get the line in #3 from Devlin?

    Obviously we can’t go back to honor-killing, it’s not much better than the current divorce-rape in it’s barbarity. The solutions are deceptively simple. Change the way people think and shame the fuck out of these women, remove financial obligation from men to children that aren’t theirs, and make paternity testing easier and more accessible, possibly mandatory. I just solved cuckoldry.

    Like


  623. on May 13, 2009 at 5:45 am Comment Ninja

    JERRDOG: “Only about 4% of the US births is “cuckholdry” Unless you’re a clueless dipshit the chances of this happening to you are small.”

    This assumes that 4% is an accurate figure. Stats are often under-reported. This is especially true for something as stigmatizing as cuckholdry. Most people are going to be reluctant to report these things, so the figures may actually be higher than 4%.

    It’ll take something like Roissy’s suggestion for mandatory paternity testing to suss out what the true figure is.

    Like


  624. A little while back Chic observed that “Betas take a bit of a beating here”. Meaning that perhaps we and possibly others in the seduction community whip up on the Beta Males of the world a bit too much. Perhaps she has a point.

    Nevertheless, from all that I’ve personally read from Chic herself, she would NOT choose to go out w/a Beta Male, and neither would the vast majority of the ladies who regularly post here. Most of them have clearly stated their preferences, and Beta Males aint it.

    Chic has also said, not long after she made the remark referred to above, to Dave Alex, that he would be unsatisfactory because “he couldn’t protect her”. Now I personally don’t have a problem either way w/Chic’s or any other Woman’s preferences. My point is that most of us would agree that Dave Alex is basically a good guy. But as we all know, being a “good guy” ain’t enough.

    Chic has rightly pointed out that in our time, which is really unprecendented, Women can determine who they will partner with, devoid of economic considerations. In other words, we get to see what Women *really want*. And over the past 30-40 years, I think its fair to say that the jury is in. Beta Males, for the most part, need not apply. That’s not *me* saying that, that’s what Women are saying, all day, everyday.

    The harsh truth is that Chic and other ladies will drop their drawers for the Roissys of the world a heck of a lot faster than for the Dave Alex’s. Again, I’m cool w/who a Woman chooses. But we need to be brutally honest about who they choose and why.

    If Women wanted a different tune to be sung on the mating front, they could change it overnight by simply signalling that which they preferred. They don’t, because, as Whiskey has astutely noted, they can afford the downsides-and there ARE downsides-of hooking up with the Alphas of the world. Amy and Heather can afford it outright in the form of their self supporting salaries; Shaniqua and Lourdes can afford it in the form of the Welfare State picking up the tab after the party’s over. In either case, the Betas are left out in the cold, unless they’re tapped to help pick up the pieces. That’s not the way the Betas would prefer it-thats the why the Women themselves would prefer it.

    So, I’m not inclined to beat up too much on the Beta Guys of the world-every Man can’t have leading man looks, mad charisma, or towering height-instead I put the blame where it belongs, on those whom Nature has deemed is the Decider in who gets to hook up and who does not-Women.
    O

    Like


  625. on May 13, 2009 at 6:01 am Comment Ninja

    OBSIDIAN: “instead I put the blame where it belongs, on those whom Nature has deemed is the Decider in who gets to hook up and who does not-Women.”

    As a famous pua guru repeatedly says: attraction is not a choice. If this is true, then women can’t really help what it is that they are attracted to anymore than men can be attracted to youthful, bouncy boobs. Blame is counter-productive.

    What we should be asking ourselves is this: what sort of a society do we want to have? We should then acknowledge that men and women have innate differences and try to work towards that sort of society with full knowledge of our limitations and sex-differences. I see at least three obstacles for accomplishing this:

    1. Feminism: by holding onto the belief that men and women are ‘equal’ in every way and failing to acknowledge the obvious differences, feminism is preventing us from creating a society in which sex differences are acknowledged.

    2. Scientific illiteracy: unacceptably high numbers of people in North America don’t even believe in evolution.

    3. Politicians: the people who rise to prominent positions of power will necessarily pander to the people mentioned in 1 and 2. This means that for the forseeable future, we’re fucked.

    Like


  626. I’d also like to reiterate a point I made earlier wrt JerrDogg’s suggestion, going back to what I call the “numerical” argument wrt Paternity Fraud:

    The issue isn’t number of occurance, but rather the nature of the crime and its impact on the body politic. As Whiskey has noted, the relatively small number of cases-which we can’t know for certain until MPT becomes a reality-are enough to “sour” the pool of Women in general, because Men overall will begin to seriously question whether they can be trusted. Which to my mind stands as yet another reason why Women should be all for MPT, so as to restore trust and faith on the part of Men overall toward them. Fighting it only makes matters worse, especially for those Women who are indeed on the up and up.

    Look, if we go down the path of *how many* cases of this has happened, versus the *nature* of the crime itself, we’ll end up in a world of hurt-how many Bernie Madoffs do we need before we say that what he did was wrong in extremis?

    O

    Like


  627. Comment Ninja,
    Yes, I am familiar w/the axiom you noted and is not in dispute in this line of inquiry. However, as we’re quoting key ideas of Game Theory, you might be familiar w/an axiom from another famed PUA, which states that Women are inherently incapable of taking personal responsibility for their actions (Mystery Method)? Hence the oft-repeated line “he seduced me”. Wink and nod.

    And this is the crux of the matter-accountability, personal responsibility. What Feminism has done, intentionally or otherwise, is made it so that Women get all the joy and none of the guilt. Which works against every bit of hardwon wisdom ever known to human beings-how can one be both free and blamless? Indeed, isn’t a pre-requisite of freedom, responsibilities? Yet Women enmasse demand one and vehemently resist the other, and this is writ large in just about every major “talking point” in their agenda, from the so-called Glass Ceiling and Pay Wage Gap to Abortion. All bennies, no paying the piper.

    It’s the same deal here-Women want to choose the Alphas w/no appreciable downside, hence roping in Betas outright, or, failing that, roping the rest of us taxpayers collectively in the form of the Welfare state. MPT is about accountability, for the freely chosen actions done in private-no one is trying to restrict her choices. Only that she be held accountable for them.

    O

    Like


  628. Coming in late to the game again as usual.

    P.S. Too bad there’s not a test where a woman can test her husband’s DNA for children produced outside the marriage. Big difference I’m sure as she is not “paying” for them; or is she? Just a different type of payment. A payment called life, time, and trust wasted with lying cheater.

    Sara, Sara, Sara,

    This is not a blog about poor women who’ve been cheated on and are stuck with a kid.

    At least she knows whose child it is.

    A man who is cuckolded (what a great word, nice to see it coming back into use, btw), does not know if the child is his. There are a lot of men who suspect their children aren’t theirs, and have admitted a preference for not confirming their suspicions.

    In any case, there are too many men out there who pay for children they didn’t father.

    Not a way to inspire confidence in the fairer gender now, is it?

    Like


  629. Knowing human nature as I do – the angriness of the woman’s ouburst at that point would be a solid indicator of the test results.

    HR Lincoln, I’d be really pissed at the suggestion just on principle, and I’ve never cheated.

    Mind you, I believe that a DNA/paternity test at birth or if you have to get an amniocentesis done should be mandatory. Since DNA screening for genetic defects is done at birth in quite a few places is the rule rather than the exception (here in Oz, anyway), what’s one more test?

    Like


  630. Comment Ninja,
    Furthermore:
    Just to pickup on your point above-I as a Man, cannot help that I’m turned on sexually by a voluptuous Woman-but I CAN help how I choose to respond to said Woman, and the actions I take going forward. Attraction is one thing, *acting on it* is something else. A very important, key distinction we need to keep in mind here. Women may not be able to help who they’re attracted to, but they can help what they choose to do about it.

    O

    Like


  631. OMW, sensible, as often

    I don’t even see what all the heat is about here. Women, if you’ve got nothing to hide, all a paternity test does is pay for a little domestic peace of mind.

    Guys, if you’re either practically or ideologically concerned about it, you can get it done pretty cheap on your own.

    As for the State, it cares about none of you. It exists to serve its own ends.

    My comment is on your last sentence, about the state. We have a similar attitude.

    I know many people want the state to reflect their interests, and that is the essense of participatory politics. I don’t happen to believe in it. I’m deeply cynical about political and economic systems, and advocate opting out as completely as possible from other peoples systems of power.

    Game the system, game women, game your brain, game everything. Everything is an operating system, susceptible to hacks and tweaks and viruses. Playing the game by the rules, trying to change the system – I don’t see rewards versus effort as practical.

    Government is not by the people and for the people. I’d like to say it has never been and will never be, but it seems that’s getting trite. So I’ll say that I can’t see how such a government is compatible with our hard wired human nature. I believe such a government to be a genetic impossibility.

    Like


  632. on May 13, 2009 at 6:36 am Cannon's Canon

    ‘Chuck’ is telling himself like a dog with a flush hand of fleas. This is the entity who reflexivly insulted my gene pool for defending the possibility that mike tyson did not rape his purported partner. His alliance lies above his dalliance.

    Like


  633. Nilk,
    If I may, Sara is indicative of just how alien it is to so many Women to grasp the Male side of the evolutionary ledger. Recently I was talking w/a lady and shared w/her the fact that while roughly 80% (read, almost ALL) Women who ever lived has gone on to reproduce, only *half as many* Men did. Even accounting for shortened lifespans due to disease, harsh work and wars, the fact remains that Women ultimately choose who will climb between their thighs, and when given the choice most Men simply will not make it.

    My ladyfriend simply could not accept what I was telling her, even though I backed up what I said in the form of internet links to various scholars in the field of evo-psych/bio, anthropology and so on. Its completely understandable-Women, almost all of them, *constantly* have to fend off offers, the vast majority of them unwarranted, for sex from Men, while the *vast majority* of Men get laid, at best, about a dozen times a year-about once a month. That’s if they’re lucky. If guys really told the truth that number probably drops even more.

    Getting sex is no big whup for Women, you know this. But its a BIG DEAL for most guys, because its so hard to do-and hence why Studs get so much dap from the Brotherhood, while Women with a history are derided as sluts. One reason why is because its nothing to simply lay back and spread your legs, just about any Woman can do that.

    Anyway…

    O

    Like


  634. But its a BIG DEAL for most guys, because its so hard to do

    This statement should be refined to indicate that getting sex from attractive women is hard for most guys.

    Like


  635. I agree, Obsidian, and it’s eternally frustrating for me.

    I know women who are happy to discuss how they’ll turn the tap off in the bedroom if the other half doesn’t do what they want, women who’ve cheated and will rationalise it away with comments about how they just couldn’t help themselves, and the usual fluffy crap.

    However, I can’t have a discussion with them about the other side of the story – as a rule, women just cannot get their heads around it. (I’m a freak – both male and female friends agree on this, as do the blokes at work lol).

    It’s too confronting, and women tend not to be capable of the necessary emotional detachment to dig into the differences between us.

    Like


  636. I just feel like if a man doesn’t trust that his supposed child is his, then he should ask for a paternity test on his own. I think that there are plenty of couples who don’t need MPT in place. If you really want to know, then fucking ask. Or do it on your own when the woman is gone. It seems like the consensus here is that it’s so easy and accessible to just do it, then….do it. But there’s no reason to make it mandatory. If you’re so alpha, then why do you need the government to step in when it’s just so easy to do it on your own?

    Like


  637. If you’re so alpha, then why do you need the government to step in when it’s just so easy to do it on your own?

    An ounce of prevention, etc.

    Women will respond to a firm hand, whether the hand is that of their man or their government.
    If such laws are in place, then women who are otherwise devoid of morals will (at least sometimes) be deterred from getting knocked up by the pool boy, because They Know They Won’t Get Away With It.

    The goal is not just to identify and ostracize cuckoldresses, but, even better, to PREVENT cuckoldry in the first place, via the spectre of guaranteed detection.

    Why is this so hard to understand?

    Like


  638. 87,

    I think if you make it clear to your SO, which it seems like a lot of people on here have done, that you’re going to expect a paternity test from early on then it’d have the same effect.

    Like


  639. 87,

    I think if you make it clear to your SO, which it seems like a lot of people on here have done, that you’re going to expect a paternity test from early on then it’d have the same effect.

    “A lot of people on here” are alphas, or at least alphas within the context of relationships.
    If the average American man had the stones to do that, then the legislation wouldn’t be necessary.

    Like


  640. It’s absolutely jaw-dropping how widely approved rape is on this site (just like at the-niceguy.com’s forums where being anti-rape is considered trolling and a bannable offense). All this factually incorrect nonsense about cuckoldry being exactly like rape, or rape not being a big deal, reveals exactly what people here think about rape. For now, the anti-feminism movement will just imply and insinuate things, and casually trivialize rape, but it’s easy to see what they really have in mind. The posters here would absolutely de-criminalize rape (and any other legal protections that women have) if they somehow could. The anti-feminism movement (and related parties) is nothing but a shallow front for nihilistic misogynism, violence and anarchy. Both feminists and anti-feminists seek to destroy modern civilization, and it makes no difference which side wins.

    I was not greatly suprised to discover that no one, with the exception of me and whiskey, had any objections towards the post where johnnymarks fantasizes about throwing acid on the face of an unfaithful woman, and “[pouring] a bottle of professional strength liquid drano into her whore-hole until it rotted out her uterus.” When someone posts something on this site that others deem objectionable, they will waste no time responding, but there was no response this time. Why would there be, when everyone is in agreement?

    I like how many posters still keep insisting that it’s the women who have no morals.

    doug1

    OK, which of you would say that to your intended?

    If not, why not?

    If I feel that a paternity test is essential, it means I don’t trust my wife, and if I don’t trust her then there’s no point in being with her.

    And I condemn neither. Neither is “guilty”. I have fucked married women, and will continue to do so. I’ve been cheated on, and expect more off that. It’s neither right nor wrong.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethics

    NO woman is not a cheating devilish whore. Not one.

    This new learning amazes me, sir doug1! Explain to me again how sheep’s bladders may be employed to determine that not even a single woman out of billions is absolutely faithful.

    They’re wrong.

    They cannot be wrong, because it’s entirely a matter of personal preference.

    xsplat

    I hate hate hate with a vengeance and despise good people.

    Hate them.

    Blame has nothing to do with it. Right and wrong is useless commentary.

    The only thing that matters is pragmatism. What to do.

    Men and women have different agendas. Neither is right, nor wrong. Right and wrong is a linguistic human social concept. The man has an agenda. He can take steps to promote his agenda. Blame and shame can work for him, but on the whole, there is no blame and shame.

    You belong in a mental institution (but then, the same could be said for most people here).

    Like


  641. Well, what does it matter if another man is supporting/raising a child that isn’t his own because he didn’t do a paternity test? How exactly does that affect you? It doesn’t. If you want to make sure you’re not in that situation, then you should perform a paternity test. But there is no reason to make everyone do it.

    Like


  642. Well, what does it matter if another man is supporting/raising a child that isn’t his own because he didn’t do a paternity test? How exactly does that affect you? It doesn’t.

    To paraphrase Niemöller, “First they came for the cuckolds, and I did not speak out because I was not a cuckold.”
    Etc.

    Those of us who value Western civilization are up against a group (feminists) that uses legislation to achieve its ends.

    You can’t fight increasingly encroaching legislation with head-in-the-sand rugged individualism.
    Fire must be fought with fire, if society is not to perish before it is reformed.

    Like


  643. It’s not the end of the world if the kid IS his or is not. Is it? Or is it? No. It’s not. It might FEEL like the end of the world, if she’s not, but eventually he will realize that his wife is only human and flawed at that, just like HE is. Only he’s flawed or delusional in other ways. It’s that ego shattering thing we talked about earlier. Relationships have a way of shattering our egos, if we let them. I’m talking about having a healthy ego; not one that’s too strong or weak.

    By that reasoning, Sara, a man should just build that bridge and get over himself. After all, he’s just as flawed as she is.

    Excuse me if I disagree with that.

    Sure, we’re all flawed, but presumably we’re grown up enough to be able to rein in our base animal urges.

    If one half of a couple either can’t or won’t control themselves, then that may – and probably will – destroy the relationship.

    I see no reason to cheat. If you want someone other than your partner, then leave them. That’s it.

    A woman who conceives a child outside the marriage is perpetrating a massive fraud that damages all parties when it is uncovered.

    But, since his wife is flawed, that’s okay.

    Like the fellow who found out both children of his marriage weren’t his. Well, he knew definitely that the older child was – he figured the younger was, but refused to go further because he still loved them after so many years raising them.

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  644. 87,

    I get what you’re saying. I feel like the intention of MPT is selfish in most people’s cases on here though. If you are really campaigning for it because you don’t want to see your fellow male get burned, then that’s fine, but it seems like most people are in it for themselves, in which case they should take action themselves and not leave it to the government.

    Like


  645. There is simply no way I could continue to support, monetarily or otherwise, kids I know, for a fact, are not my own, genetically. Moreover, I could not continue in good faith supporting them, and by extension their mother, after having found out that I was lied to, perhaps for years. To do so is to add insult to injury.

    Every Man alive has every inalienable right to look out for and protect his interests-emotionally, socially, legally, genetically, financially-and we have only ourselves to blame when we refuse to protect said interests under some cockamamie “reasoning” that, because I’ve been raising them this long, they’re “my” kids no matter what. Everytime I see such a display from a weak excuse from a Man it makes me physically ill.

    Men must have the backbone to turn off their emotions like a light switch, wish the mommy good luck in finding the real baby daddy, and be Audi 5000. There is nothing wrong in the least in doing this, indeed, there is EVERYTHING RIGHT in doing it.

    Only when more Men start doing this will Women begin to think long and hard about spreading her legs, because she knows that she’ll be alone when the party’s over and the music stops.

    And Kim…

    You still have not madena cogent case for any of your counter arguments against MPT; all you have done to date is make appeals to assertion. Simply saying something is so does not make it so. I thought Feminists were more reasoned thinkers.

    Then again, perhaps not.

    Please explain, clarify and elaborate your positions?

    O

    Like


  646. Lurker

    Yep, ask any man who’s been cheated on—-wait, they don’t talk about it, right? Because its emasculating: emabrassing, makes him seem like less of a man. Because his wife is calling out his betaness for all the world to see.

    A woman who cheats blames her man–and never feels bad, except in fleeting moments.

    Nonsense and naive nonsense. You think like a man, and I don’t mean that as a complement. You think only like a man. Just a feminist with no ability to see the male perspective is blinkered, your thinking process is male-morality-blinkered.

    I’ve been cheated on a few times. My lover once left me to go get married. She’d then call me up and complain of crying all night, and of thinking of me when fucking her husband. Another time a loveless rental-wife left me after I started cheating a bit. Another time some chick I was trying to get serious with was toying with me, for giggles and the desire for cash. Another time I was having non-monogamous serious long term relationships, and the girls considered it fair play.

    Get over yourself, Lurker. You take yourself far far too seriously. It’s just fucking around. The pain passes. No harm, no foul.

    Like


  647. And it’s the attitude of Tood and Lurker and others who want fidelity while also wanting game that will get in their own way. You’ll trip over yourself, maintaining such a serious, romantic attitude.

    Women can smell clinginess. You care too much.

    Like


  648. on May 13, 2009 at 8:37 am richmondbachelor

    I’m convinced tood is a virgin.

    Possibly also lurker.

    Like


  649. 87,
    You’re refinement on my statement is so noted; however, as Roissy himself has noted, the massive social, technological and economic changes that have come down the pike in the past four decades have artificially inflated the sexual marketplace value on Women who would be at best 5s, 6s and 7s on said market; they in effect, act as though their 8s, 9s and even 10s because of their increased marketshare power and, at the same time, decreased power on the Male side. Result? Said Women can afford to act in such a way that it makes getting sex from them almost as hard as it is/was from the true Dimes of the world.

    And so, my general proposition holds: for most Men walking around, getting sex from that 80% of Women is no small feat, and the numbers indicate this is so-only 40%, that’s less than half, of all Men who ever lived, actually reproduced themselves. Not all sex leads to pregnancy and childbirth fair enough; but the stat is enough to go on to give us a pucture of just how tough it is for Men to get sex from *most* Women in our time now, when Women, from the homely to the comely, can *afford* to be choosy.

    Your serve…

    O

    Like


  650. “And I agree with chic here,
    A man getting cuckolded is the moral equivalent of a woman getting secretly implanted with another woman’s fertilized egg, giving birth to it, and raising it for eighteen years
    I’ve never discussed this with another woman before but something tells me that this won’t bother a woman as much as it would bother a man.

    I suspect most women would raise and nurture the implanted embryo like her own.”

    Most women probably would, Anony. There’s a reason so much emphasis is placed on the mother-child pairing. It’s one of the most powerful there is.

    No man can ever understand the feeling of another person growing inside you. Sure our bodies get fat, after a couple of years of breastfeeding we get a bit saggy and then there are the stretchmarks, but you know what?

    As powerful as men are, they can only help conceive a new life. They can’t protect it, or nurture it or help it develop to the stage where a child is born.

    This doesn’t mean their feelings towards their own children are less important – just that they’re different.

    When my girl was a preschooler, I used to take her to the indoor playground to catch up with my friends who also had little tackers.

    One thing that always amazed me was that the place could be full of screaming kids, and I could be sitting with my back to the room, but I always heard my girl cry.

    A woman should always know the child she gave birth to.

    A man rarely has that sort of confidence. Especially in this day and age of elastic morality.

    Heh. And re Roissy’s comment about children taking after their fathers? My girl has only a faint resemblence to me. So faint that I was once asked what the relationship between us was. The look on the woman’s face when I just said, “Birth” was priceless.

    The child is a dead ringer for her father. One look at him and there is no doubt at all. MPT? Who needs it?

    Like


  651. OMW

    MRAs don’t want equality, though– they crave supremacy. Bitches ain’t shit.

    Equality is craved only by underdogs. Top dogs no longer have any need for it.

    Like


  652. Obsidian,

    It doesn’t really matter what I say because you’ll never agree with it or understand my position on it. I think I’ve explained why I think MPT is unnecessary. I think men who want to have physical proof that a child is theirs should just ask or do the paternity test themselves. There is no reason to get the government involved. Grow a pair and ask, if you’re too scared to like the man in Roissy’s original post then oh well, that’s a personal problem.

    This outlook that all women are cheating whores is so bleak and depressing that it doesn’t even make sense why a lot of people on here would want to get involved with women beyond fucking around if they feel that way.

    Like


  653. Tupac Chopra

    from a purely Darwinistic view, perhaps the cuckolded man *should* be forced to pay for the other man’s child. this would reallocate resources to a more socially and reproductive optimal end, the Cad’s.

    This is expat’s position, but as Whiskey points out, it is the high IQ betas that push civilizational progress forward.

    I disagree with Whiskey that Alphas are low IQ thugs. I think todays Alphas include a variety of upper-echelon people, and that generally sociaties top dogs are mentally superior.

    I understand that some aspergergy engineers have a bit of trouble with the chicks, but think Whiskeys case is hugely overstated. Engineers get married easily enough. Most betas are not that bright. Bright people tend to do just fine with women. Societies top dogs are not all thugs, and women don’t see only the thugs as societies top dogs. Alpha does not equate to stupid thug, it also equates to Jack Kerouac, Carlos Santana, investment bankers, entrepreneurs, and even some engineers.