A sexually frustrated beta has sublimated his pain into a murderous shooting spree aimed at his ex-girlfriend. He left an online diary behind offering a glimpse of his blackened soul:
Sodini’s Aug. 3 online diary entry, which included a date of death, was full of disturbing musings about religion and his plans for the attack. He noted that he hadn’t had a drink since 2:30 on Friday as part of his preparation.
“Total effort needed. Tomorrow is the big day. Unfortunately I talked to my neighbor today, who is very positive and upbeat. I need to remain focused and absorbed COMPLETELY,” the diary read. “Last time I tried this, in January, I chickened out.”
The diary also indicated that Sodini hadn’t had sex since 1990 and that his so-called “practice papers” — details about the planning of the attack — are welcome to be published afterward because “maybe all this will shed insight on why some people just cannot make things happen in their life, which can potentially benefit others”.
When men kill women, the underlying reason is almost always an unfulfilled psychosexual need. This goes for spree shooters, rapists, and serial killers. I’m not surprised Sodini hadn’t had sex in nearly 20 years. As I’ve written before, to some men on the losing side of the desireability bell curve celibacy is walking death and anything is justified in avoiding that miserable fate.
Click on the first link to see a picture of Sodini. He’s not a bad-looking guy and he’s in shape. There is nothing outwardly repulsive about him that would cripple his chances with women. But as we know the physical appearance of a man reveals little about the state of his spirit. A decent looking guy can harbor the sunken ship of a broken beta heart, and clearly Sodini was a beta, if not an omega, as his 20 year dry spell attests.
If Sodini had learned game he would have been able to find another woman and gotten laid after his ex dumped him. He wouldn’t have spent the next 20 years steeped in bile and weighed down by his Sisyphian blue balls, dreaming of vengeance. Game could have saved the lives of the women Sodini killed.
I agree with the gist of what commenter Whiskey has written — as the West reverts back to the ancestral sexual market that is currently in operation in sub-Saharan Africa, we are going to see a growing eunuchracy of involuntarily celibate betas and the marginalized men in their ranks decide that exiting in a blaze of hot lead beats living in loveless obscurity. And ex-girlfriends are target #1.
What is the future of a society-
when a guy who is educated, not ugly and has a good job (systems analyst) cannot find a woman for 20 years.
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I think he should have just bought sex, a systems analyst at a law firm is not a bad job.
A few trips per year to the safer places in S.America and E.Europe could have given him all the pussy he ever dreamed of.
I mean he had no real financial obligations, heck he could get a new escort every week and still spend less than if he was married or divorced.
[editor: which goes to prove the importance to men of being with a woman who *wants* to be there. whores are an acceptable sexual release for most betas and omegas, but they will never feel as good as sex with a woman who loves you.]
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Same guy?
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/george-sodini/3/2aa/466
George Sodini
Systems Analyst at K&L Gates
Greater Pittsburgh Area
Connections:28 connections
Industry:Legal Services
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George Sodini is an MRA hero as much a reason to learn game. Finally a mass murderer writes a relatively coherent manifesto. Could be better, but at least it is implied that feminism is to blame and he is taking a last stand. I had been waiting for this (almost thinking I had to do it myself) and I am impressed. Kudos.
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Law firms typically pay at the higher end.
2007 Salary: Business Systems Analyst
2007 average salary range: $61,250 – $86,500
One escort on an unlimited menu (in N.America)= maximum 300$/hr
8 escorts per month= 300 * 8 = 2,400 /month
2,400 *12 = 28,800/ year.
12*8 = potentially 96 different women per year (many more if he traveled abroad to buy sex).
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I read the guys on-line screeds. It is so spot-on for terminal malignant betatude, I would call hoax if there were not real life corpses and pools of blood on the gym floor in PA.
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Lucifer, you’re 80% of the comments in this post. Slow down. Put multiple thoughts in one comment. Or don’t feel the need to say everything that comes into your head.
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I can’t help but think that if Sodini had smoked some weed, and paid for sex (via stripper or in Amsterdam or something), he wouldn’t have been as wound up.
Alcohol, although it loosens inhibitions, can compound the problem because excessive drinking leads to whiskey-dick. Pot may make you clam up a bit, or be a bit paranoid perhaps (i.e., can potentially hurt game), but physiologically you’ll be fine.
Also, maybe get the fuck outta PA, at least for a bit. Even if you have no friends. Go to Thailand for shit’s sake. He said he had 250 K….he should’ve gone on a sex & drugs binge before the massacre, just for the fuck of it. Maybe that would’ve made him reconsider.
Jesus.
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According to him, at least a hundred women told him that he was “nice.”
This reminds me of the Virginia Tech case, although that guy was too creepy to even get that.
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A MRA hero? You’re joking right?
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I think that we can all agree that if you want to attract girls, go in for serial killing, not a mass killing.
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One thing that might help prevent future incidents of this sort is repealing IMBRA, the federal law that essentially put the mail order bride industry out of business.
Peter
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@Richard Hoste:
I don’t know this guy, so I can’t say, but girls not trying to be rude can say that to creepy guys as well. Or strange guys. Or guys that make them mildly uncomfortable.
“Oh you’re so nice and different!”
The VT guy didn’t even get that because he was so extremely creepy no one even wanted to talk to him.
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Roissy,
Most of my cousins are girls and by observing their behavior, I realized that female love was not real before I was 14.
So, I was cynical about the whole subject. I see it as fickle infatuation, at best.
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In my early late teens and early 20’s I was much better than average looking- plus I had a great body.
I was super nice and naïve on women- I was shy and romantic- I was NOT cocky funny, sexual, or an asshole to women.
I could not get laid- I could not get laid- I could NOT get laid.
I have to tell you- those were dark times, dark thoughts- I was in a very bad place.
If you scored women naturally in HS you don’t know what it is like to be brutally rejected over and over at such a young age; you don’t know what that can do to a young man. If you haven’t experienced that first hand you can’t really understand what life is like as a beta.
When you are young- if multiple women reject you while you are being sincerely nice and genuine it can devastate your psyche.
Dr. Paul has mentioned on numerous occasions that the lack of “game” for males is a major public health hazard.
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The idea that anybody can be saved by game is like the liberal idea that any child can be saved by “education.”
There are natural limits. It looks like this guy was really into self-improvement. And considering he liked the internet, I’d be shocked if he hadn’t heard of game. Whatever “it” is that leads to bonding with women, he didn’t have it.
Some are simply not fit for the modern world.
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C’mon. 20 years of celibacy has to make you an Omega, or Beta becomes such a broad term as to be meaningless. I thought “Beta” described the typical American male – married men who have sex 6-10 times a year with their wives and maybe visit the occasional prostitute or have a random office affair at some point in their lives with some beta female co-worker. This guy is in a whole different category.
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5’10” and 150. 150!? That’s a lightweight. Which can be great, but it seems a little inappropriate for a guy in his 40’s.
“At 20 a man is a peacock, at 30 a lion, at 40 a camel, at 50 a serpent, at 60 a dog, at 70 an ape, and at 80 nothing.” Baltasar Gracian.
Per that advice, I wonder: had he gone through a lion or bulk-up phase? An camel endurance phase? At 48 he should be thinning down into a wily tough dude, if he’s thinning at all. I’m wondering if he might have done better to put on 20-30 lbs of muscle; hit the plates instead of the aerobics.
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I’ve yet to checkout this Man’s site(s), etc, but from the buzz I’m getting from the internet, it seems real enough, and again goes right to points I’ve made earlier, and to which Roissy has eloquently stated. To briefly re-cap:
1. Men NEED Women to help them grow. This includes emotionally, socially, perhaps even spiritually. Men who spend long stretches of time away from Women w/no way to release sexual tension etc, invariably crack up. We have seen this over and over, and Sodini is no different.
2. The WORST thing that can happen to a Man is coming into a good bit of money, because, unless he has some measure of Game already, it only serves to hurt him. One way or another. Sodini by all accounts, made a nice dollar and had no major expenses to speak of-yet, he was miserable. Sure, he could have bought sex as Lucifer and a few others have suggested, but I’m with Roissy on this one-its hard to beat sex from a Woman who wants to be w/you. Just my take on it, though I concede that in this case its definitely better than nothing if he used ho’s.
3. SOCIETY DOESN’T GET IT, Men w/o Women in a sexual and social/emotional sense=a disaster waiting to happen. First it was Atta & the Towers, then it was Cho and Virginia Tech, and now this. Not even counting all the other shoot em up incidents in between. When are we gonna get it?
This is some shameful shit.
The Obsidian
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The 9-11 hijackers should have had more game. Could have figured out an easier way of gotten laid by dozens of virgins.
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I’m having trouble with this one. I havn’t read his diary because it is down now, but I can’t help thinking there is something more here. That guy (looks OK and has $) could get laid in less than a week on match.com or some similar sight.
And could also find some sort of “seeking arrangements” situation even if he didn’t resort to actual whores.
This guy had bigger issues.
Thats not to say that it isnt an interesting commentary on women not liking “providers” but I think he had more issues than merely being on the wrong end of the sexual market place.
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In continuation of above…I’m in complete agreement regarding soft polygamy and flaky women turning the world into a giant, non-committed brothel with tons of unknowning cuckolds picking up the bill…
…but the whole idea of mass hordes of celebate guys, no. I see and know douche bags every day going on dates, getting married, getting laid, etc.
[editor: douchebags are not betas. in fact, they are often the opposite of betas.]
I just dont see the massive celebacy Roissy talks about IRL.
[are you a woman? because only a woman could be ignorant or disbelieving of the multitudes of sexless men in her midst, and of how much more difficult it is for the average man to get laid than it is for the average woman.]
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Obsidian,
I see it as an example of system feedback. Systems that cannot accommodate, adjust and change in response to feedback wither away.
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-Madras-
Of course you see douche bags dating. That’s who women want to date.
As a young man i could never figure out why women dated assholes and complained to me (their non sexual boyfriend) about them.
Now i know- and i know because of blogs like this.
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Madra
Maybe he did have some “other issues” but whatever they might have been, unwanted perpetual celibacy could not have been a positive influence on his emotional balance. And a little nookie might have been enough of a cure to keep him from going over the edge. I would bet on it, actually.
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Reading though his blog posts a bit. This guy is a sad case (who morphed into a murderer). He mentions some woman giving him the eye at the gym, but not really attempting to pursue her, as he doesn’t want to get “distracted” from his “mission”. He keeps reinforcing negative outcomes in his mind, the very opposite of what should be done. (paraphrasing: “Oh well, nothing will change anyway. I can’t achieve my goals, so why bother”).
He touches on a mindset familiar to any man who’s been through a prolonged dry-spell: the idea that womankind has rejected him. That women, as a whole find him unworthy. In some sense, this is obviously true, as evidence by his dry-spell-of-epic-proportions. But in another sense, it’s an illusion. It’s as if he thinks all women are in cahoots, and have formed a pact to keep him sexless. (paraphrasing: “30 million women have rejected me”.) This illusion helps reinforce his negative mental spiral, as implicitly assumes that every woman who is not his has implicitly rejected him. This leads him to preemptively assume that his next interaction with a woman will be unsuccessful, etc.
While women can definitely be generalized about, but they are not identical automatons. Liberals, woman-on-pedestal-placing social conservatives, and many chicks are mistaken about the former (e.g. the “special snowflake” syndrome). But uber-betas are often mistaken about the latter.
I note that suicide rates are higher in the summer than in winter, and that the clinically depressed often put their suicidal ideation into action once the begin medication. Why is that? The thinking is that going through with suicide (or murder/suicide) in this case takes a bit of cojones, some testosterone. Those who are severely depressed often simply cannot be bothered to carry out their awful thoughts (just as they can’t bring themselves to bathe, or perform other basic functions). But…once they get a jolt of SSRIs, or prolonged sunlight, or extra energy from lifting weights, then suddenly feel a bit better and have a bit more energy. The tragedy is that they don’t feel so much better that they want to do the hard work it takes to heal, but feel just enough of an improvement that carrying-out their awful visions doesn’t seem so onerous.
In Sodini’s case this common tragedy lead to an atrocity.
PS – The VA TECH shooter seemed much more disturbed than this guy.
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@Madras:
FSU did a study where random guys and girls went up to people of the opposite sex and asked them for sex.
All (or nearly all) of the girls that were asked said no.
All of the guys said yes and were disappointed to find out it was a just a survey.
How can you be blind to celibacy in men?
@Obsidian:
Very true and insightful post.
I hear most guys lamenting that there is nothing for men to offer women anymore nowadays; at least not in the traditional sense. A man can’t offer to provide for her, what with all these power women (“I don’t need a man!”) providing for themselves.
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Rum,
Thats probably right.
Roissy,
As per your comments to mine above: I am a guy. I live your in city. I went to a really nerdy college. Everyone was fuking like rabbits. The same on the Hill in DC. The quality might not be good and the women are playing some fucked up games backed up by feminist-bull-shit-empworment….but at least at 28 years old, I just don’t know that many guys who are truly celibate(over maybe a month or three). The longest I’ve gone is 3 weeks since I was 16. I dont consider myself a high Alpha by any means. Sex is just sort of there if you dedicate yourself. Now, good sex? no Loving women? no. But some sort of consentual sex with a female? Yeah. Maybe I’m not looking hard enough or I only have non-omega friends. I honestly don’t know. I really buy into your views on most things, and I could see celibacy becoming a cultural issue down the road. But right now?
[editor: social circles matter. if you are a guy who does OK with women, then most likely you are hanging out with dudes who also don’t have a lot of trouble getting laid. call it assortative befriending. but if you step outside your horizons and know what to look for (that is, most celibate men aren’t going to admit their failure with women; you have to know the signs) then you’ll see that there is a sizeable minority of average men who are living lives of de facto celibacy.]
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I’m not convinced that game is going to help guys that are so socially inept that they remain sexless for two decades. There are deeper psychological problems unaddressed here and we trivialize how disturbed some people are merely because they don’t have access to regular pussy. It is not hard to land a girl, any girl if you have a social circle. Only among PUAs is there such a focus on cold approaches to broaden the pool of prospects. There is also a problem with men that feel entitled to a 9 or 10 just because they’ve got a steady job and a mortgage.
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I’m with Richard on this. Some people just can’t cope. If he was looking for answers, he would have found them, like Arpagus (whose honesty I appreciate) did.
What jumps out at me about the guy is the domineering mother. Where was this guy’s dad? Apparently whatever was wrong with this guy was made to be so long before he became a disgruntled adult.
He was programmed with an ideology that did not allow him to see the (mere) humanity of his mother, and this made other women smaller scale monsters. She also, by example, apparently raised him to be a brat who couldn’t handle the fact that people don’t have to do what he wants them to.
The “violence veto” however, is the reason I don’t mess with people who aren’t trying to harm me. It’s also one reason that I’m glad not to look like the preferred objects of people with the high entitlement/low motivation combo. If a guy was depressed over losing me, people who don’t know me would laugh at him.
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If the best solution and outlet he could find and think of, especially considering the availability of many resources if you look or are open to them, is murder…
Then yes, his genes should not have been passed on.
Sexual selection was working.
The biggest mistake his ex made was being associated with him in any way.
That said, he’s useful as a symbol for the sexually frustrated male and their struggles. He could shed more light on the issues, or conversely be used as a symbol for generating more anti-male sentiment. Realise how potent the weapon of a ‘nice guy’ breaking into violence is in generating propaganda and oppressing and distrusting even the mildest mannered men.
The facts about the mechanics of the causation don’t matter in generating propaganda.
However, I wouldn’t cheapen anyone and their personality by equating them to this guy.
The problem with e.g. Arpagus’ MRA stance is that there is this assumption that all men deserve to get laid. They do not.
[editor: deservin’s got nothing to do with it. similarly, it is also a false assumption that all women “deserve” to get laid. the fat and ugly and old and frigid women do not.]
That is how it has always worked. The best must get selected. The problems these days is that they are not, it is perhaps more whiskey’s Thug hypothesis.
I’m sorry, Mr. Shooting Spree does not qualify as The Best, Mr. I Thought About It But Got Over It is.
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Arpagus: calling this loser beta a hero? A guy who isn’t laid in 20 years and kills a bunch of women who are doing the right thing by attempting to get fit and attractive?
Kill yourself.
Obsidian, surprised you haven’t remarked on the shooter’sdiary entry on his resentments toward black men having the pick of the best white women. WTF? That totally goes against stereotype of black men only getting the white leftovers.
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Bhetti,
There is an interesting corollary to your belief that all men do not deserve to get laid. I think you just saw that in action… did you like it?
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Bhetti
From a womans perspective – and maybe froms Darwins – many men should never get laid and by all means should never pass on their tragically flawed genetic offering.
Your next assignment is to explain all of this to a very angry, very frustrated, heavily armed man.
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All this talk about celibacy and yet most miss the important point of it. A celibate needs to actively work to transmute his sexual drive or else it will only lead to frustration. Celibacy if done actively in a way that seeks to reduce all sexual stimuli, is not harmfull for man. The problem with people today is that they instead feed their frustration. The very idea that a man Needs a woman. is what makes the man act like a beggar.
Singlehood without abstinence is like a car without fuel.
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Moral to strory if your gonna go out in a blaze make sure you make the news. Be famous.
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@Hansen:
“A celibate needs to actively work to transmute his sexual drive or else it will only lead to frustration. Celibacy if done actively in a way that seeks to reduce all sexual stimuli, is not harmfull for man. ”
But this is usually through chosen celibacy. People who don’t want to be celibate, but are, are bound to experience a crippling frustration.
Celibacy by choice is an entirely different thing and can be beneficial.
(Although now I’m prompted to think of Catholic priests molesting small boys. Great)
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Too bad this guy missed Mandy! XD.
Feminism is the creationism of the left.
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Yea guys need to be taking out the indirect political causes of there pain not the direct causes so the shit changes. I mean it is obvious the politicians judges lawyers don’t give a fuck if woman get killed.
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Mandy! XD, being a dumbass:
“Although now I’m prompted to think of Catholic priests molesting small boys.”
—The percentage of Catholic priests accused of molestation (of both boys and girls) is actually lower than the population in general.
However, a liberal feminist media highlights them to “prove” how “evil” the Catholic Church is.
You NotMyPresident’s supporters sure do know how to distort the truth in furtherahnce of your destructive agenda.
Onwards, Comrade Bizznich!
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Hansen
The weird thing about the catholic priestly mindset of “celibacy” is that the main concern seemed to be about the need to avoid healthy sexuality with adult, enthusiastic women. Terrified little boys apparently were not so problematic.
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Roissy,
What are your thoughts on Ted Bundy?
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Yeah, I agree with A-Bax.
Why no prostitutes? Wouldn’t that have helped?
I think some men are beyond the reach of game. If someone has a really messed up personality and they don’t relate well to others at all, there is only so much Mystery, Roissy et al can teach them.
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“But this is usually through chosen celibacy. People who don’t want to be celibate, but are, are bound to experience a crippling frustration.”
Wether chosen or not, the way to deal with the situation is the same. The path of the celibate man is one that yhas been walked for eons.
So if you are non-eligible, you have to deal with the frustration. Either you learn game and deal with your frustration that way, or you learn transmutation.
Being in unvoluntary singlehood and saturating ones neural pathways with pornography will only reinforce the reasons one is single in the first way, and will also remove any fruitfull spiritual gains from singlehood.
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Rome, Arpagus is just saying what many men in his situation are thinking.
It’s not really sex that they feel entitled to. It’s respect. The problem is that many don’t understand that they’re not entitled to respect, but they should demand as much as they give of it anyway. Then if they don’t get it, they don’t take it personally, but they also filter out the people who don’t or won’t respect them.
Entitlement makes people seek and expect things that if they don’t get, they feel wronged. Demanding what you want while understanding that you’re not entitled means that if you don’t get what you want, you may feel disappointed, but not wronged unless you were actually wronged, and even that in realistic proportion.
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Site is down, but I saved a copy of the log:
Why do this?? To young girls? Just read below. I kept a running log that includes my thoughts and actions, after I saw this project was going to drag on.
November 5, 2008:
Planned to do this in the summer but figure to stick around to see the election outcome. This particular one got so much attention and I was just curious. Not like I give a flying fcuk who won, since this exit plan was already planned. Good luck to Obama! He will be successful. The liberal media LOVES him. Amerika has chosen The Black Man. Good! In light of this I got ideas outside of Obama’s plans for the economy and such. Here it is: Every black man should get a young white girl hoe to hone up on. Kinda a reverse indentured servitude thing. Long ago, many a older white male landowner had a young Negro wench girl for his desires. Bout’ time tables are turned on that shit. Besides, dem young white hoez dig da bruthrs! LOL. More so than they dig the white dudes! Every daddy know when he sends his little girl to college, she be bangin a bruthr real good. I saw it. “Not my little girl”, daddy says! (Yeah right!!) Black dudes have thier choice of best white hoez. You do the math, there are enough young white so all the brothers can each have one for 3 or 6 months or so.
December 22, 2008:
Time is moving along. Planned to have this done already. I will just keep a running log here as time passes. Many of the young girls here look so beautiful as to not be human, very edible. After joining this gym, started lifting weights and like it. Much info about weight programs, diet etc on the web. Or anything for that matter. Instead of TV I can Google for hours to relax. TV and most movies are dull.
December 24, 2008:
Moving into Christmas again. No girlfriend since 1984, last Christmas with Pam was in 1983. Who knows why. I am not ugly or too weird. No sex since July 1990 either (I was 29). No shit! Over eighteen years ago. And did it maybe only 50-75 times in my life. Getting to think that a woman now would just, uh, get in the way of things. Isolated. I have extra money and enjoy traveling, too, wtih my 25-30 days of vacation. LA was the best! But going alone is not too fun. Invited to a party on Christmas day tomorrow. Seems about 15-25 people will actually show. I like her parties; I can meet new people and talk. Got the next 8 days off. I should have exit plan done and practiced by then. I know nothing will change, no matter how hard I try or what goals I set.
December 28, 2008:
Glad I stayed around. All these days off are great. I will shoot for Tuesday, January 6, 2009, at maybe 8:15. I have list of to-do items to make.
December 29, 2008:
Just got back from tanning, been doing this for a while. No gym today, my elbow is sore again. I actually look good. I dress good, am clean-shaven, bathe, touch of cologne – yet 30 million women rejected me – over an 18 or 25-year period. That is how I see it. Thirty million is my rough guesstimate of how many desirable single women there are. A man needs a woman for confidence. He gets a boost on the job, career, with other men, and everywhere else when he knows inside he has someone to spend the night with and who is also a friend. This type of life I see is a closed world with me specifically and totally excluded. Every other guy does this successfully to a degree. Flying solo for many years is a destroyer. Yet many people say I am easy to get along with, etc. Looking back, I owe nothing to desirable females who ask for anything, except for basic courtesy – usually. Looking back over everything, what bothers me most is the inability to work towards whatever change I choose.
December 30, 2008:
While driving I radio surfed to a talk show. The caller was a 30ish black man who was describing the despair in certain black communities. According to him, life is cheap there because you are going to die anyway when you get old. It is the quality of life that is important, he said. If you know the past 40 years were crappy, why live another 30 crappy years then die? His point was they engage in dangerous behavior which tends to shorten the lifespans, to die now and avoid the next 30 crappy years, using my example. The host got sarcastic and ended the call instead of trying understanding his point. Agreement wasn’t necesary. I put music back on. But it was an interesting, and useful point for me to hear.
December 31, 2008:
My anger and rage is largely gone since I began lifting weights. Lifting drains me but I still have energy. Somebody else suggested running but that did not help me. I guess strenuous exercise is necesary for a man. So I just learned that now at 48. Maybe 30 years later than I would have liked. My dad never (not once) talked to me or asked about my life’s details and tell me what he knew. He was just a useless sperm doner. Don’t know why, find it fun talking to young kids when I visit someone. Brother was actually counter-productive and would try to embarase me or discourage my efferts when persuing things, esp girls early on (teen years). Useless bully. Result is I am learning basics by trial and error in my 40s, followed by discuragement. Seems odd, but thats true. Writing all this is helping me justify my plan and to see the futility of continuing. Too embarassed to tell anyone this, at almost 50 one is expected to just know these things.
I hope it doesn’t snow on Tuesday. Just thought of that. The crowd will be thin so I would postpone. Shit!
Now that I am on the topic of family and people I know, I might as well make a summary of sorts to show where things stand. This is New Years Eve I have time, no date tonight of course, so:
Honorable mention:
Tetelestai Church in Pittsburgh, PA – “Be Ye Holy, even as I have been Ye holy! Thus saith the lord thy God!”, as pastor Rick Knapp would proclaim. Holy shit, religion is a waste. But this guy teaches (and convinced me) you can commit mass murder then still go to heaven. Ask him. Call him at (724) 325-2655. If no answer there, he should still live at 439 9th Street, Oakmont, PA 15139. In any case, guilt and fear kept me there 13 long years until Nov 2006. I think his crap did the most damage. Their web site: http://www.tetelestai.org.
Mum – The Central Boss. 717 Highview Road, Pgh PA 15234. Don’t piss her off or she will be mad and vindictive for years. She actually thinks she’s normal. Very dominant. Her way and only her way with no flexibility toward everyone in the household. A power and control thing. People outside the immediate family like her. Why are people vicious with their closest ones? She is the Boss above all other Bosses.
Michael Sodini – A Boss, my brother (Mike Sodini) 216 Horseshoe Dr, Mars PA – Always the big bully, twice the size of most others. When he bullied or harassed someone, it was the other person who “deserved it”. It was always about him. Way to self absorbed, too. Still is. Used to like to embarrass guys in front of their girlfriends. Lots of other shit. Kind of guy you actually loved to hate. The biggest, most self-centered jagoff I know. He took those bullying “skills” into the business world and is doing good financially. He is a big wheel only in his mind. Most people can see thru all his manipulation. He calls only when he wants something.
Sherry – sister – More of a victim than anything. Copes by exercising much control over her adult children. We used to be close until her control of L & D caused a conflict. Never the same after.
David – neph, sis’s son (girlfriend Mallory Squires). Good young guy, though.
Lisa – niece, sis’s daught. Attractive, smart, emotional – all good YW qualities.
Idiots:
Andy Pulkowski – I have been in barrooms and church groups. The worst people by far are the religious types. Especially a right-wing, stiff-faced fundie like Andy. A condescending, demeaning, passive-aggresive person. Frigid, rigid, linear and totally inflexible. Being a very serious person, he cannot hide his frown-lined face. He better not try to smile; lest his face might crack. I knew children of parents who grew up in strict religious homes. Religion has a certain stink to it of guilt, shame, fear, and that moral standard that always contradicts the natural tendencies and desires of a person. Therin lies the conflict. Young person cannot experiment with things to decide on their own and establish their own parameters. So they tend to cut loose and really rebel much worse than the average young person. Ma and Pa never know what goes on. They easily BS their parents because they want to believe their little one is an angel. Andy has a young daughter Bethany Pulkowski away at college, High Point University. I saw her picture on his desk. She’s your basic, attractive, young girl. Please reread my entry made on Nov 5th. That’s only one thing she can do. You Andy types out there need to further strengthen your strict resolve and do more of the same thing! Because those girls were great when I recall my college years! She is someone’s (or many guy’s) little hoe now, I am sure.
Another point about andy. How can someone be cold, vicious, sarcastic and generally nasty ALL THE TIME and then make the claim about their church life and how good they are? Total hypocritical idiots.
That’s all for now. That felt good.
Let’s continue…
January 5, 2009:
Was at the gym to lift. Very crowded. Tomorrow should be good. There is a woman there that gives me a certain look every time I am there. I decided to walk over and make a comment about the crowds but she left when I finished the exercise. Better that I do not get sidetracked from tomorrow’s plan anyways. Life is just playing games. One or two dates with her, then the end. No matter how many changes I try to make, things stay the same. Every evening I am alone, and then go to bed alone. Young women were brutal when I was younger, now they aren’t as much, probably because they just see me just as another old man.
I see twenty something couples everywhere. I see a twenty something guy with a nice twentyish young women. I think those years slipped right by for me. Why should I continue another 20+ years alone? I will just work, come home, eat, maybe do something, then go to bed (alone) for the next day of the same thing. This is the Auschwitz Syndrome, to be in serious pain so long one thinks it is normal. I cannot wait for tomorrow!
January 6, 2009:
I can do this. Leaving work today, I felt like a zombie – just going thru the motions. Get on the bus, get the car, drive home…..My mind is screwed up anymore, I can’t concentrate at work or think at all.
This log is not detailed. It is only for confidence to do this. The future holds even less than what I have today.
It is 6:40pm, about hour and a half to go. God have mercy. I wish life could be better for all and the crazy world can somehow run smoother. I wish I had answers. Bye.
It is 8:45PM: I chickened out! Shit! I brought the loaded guns, everything. Hell!
April 24, 2009:
Early last month, we had our second general layoff. I survived. First one was in November. When I began 10 years ago, that used to be a nice place to work. I understand the need to reduce staff when times sour, but this is out of proportion to the economic problems at this time. The economy is shrinking by about 4-5%. They decided not to pay Christmas bonus – for staff that amounts to about 8% of yearly pay. Well, OK. Plus no yearly “merit” raise, another 3.5%. That totals to about 11% cut. Plus two layoffs of 5% staff in each case. Do the math. I know this firm is using this downturn as an excuse to take advanage of a bad situation and kill jobs UNNECESSARILY. The second layoff people who actually did work were let go. We all need to pick up the slack so the company can cut beyond what is necesary. Wasn’t going to mention it, because of all this shit, it is K&L Gates, the large law firm headquartered here in Pittsburgh. Just call it K&L Gates Corporation. Most people there are OK and I would never have a shoot ’em up there. They paid me for 10 years, so far!
I predict I won’t survive the next layoff. That is when there is no point to continue. RIght now, life is bearable and I can get by indefinitely. Something bad must happen. The paycheck is all I have left. The future holds nothing for me. Twenty five years of nothing fun. I never even spent one weekend with a girl in my life, even at my own place. Also unlikely to find another similar job. I guess then is when I take care of things. I don’t have kids, close friends or anything. Just me here. If you have nothing, you have nothing to lose.
I enjoy writing these entries, I have no plans to go back and edit or even read most stuff already written. If you get bored, just click that “x” at the top, right corner of your browser. Bye.
May 4, 2009:
I was so eager to do this last year. The big problem on my mind now is that my job will end soon. One project is being transistioned to another. The other one I am solely responsible, but is being fast tracked to production. I estimate maybe a month. I am not ready for the job market. I am ok what I do, a .NET software developer. Not at the top of the class, but I do a good job. I survived two general layoffs and other little layoffs they are having but keeping quiet about. I hear things.
The problem is I feel too good now to do this but too bad to enjoy life. I know I will never enjoy life. This is an over 30 year trend. Some people are happy, some are miserable. It is difficult to live almost continuously feeling an undercurrent of fear, worry, discontentment and helplessness. I can talk and joke around and sound happy but under it all is something different that seems unchangable and a permanent part of my being. I need to realize the details of what I never accomplished in life and to be convinced the future is merely a continuation of the past – WHICH IT ALWAYS has been. I am making a list of items that will provide motivation to do the exit plan, it won’t be published. I always had hope that maybe things will improve especially if I make big attempts to change my life. I made many big changes in the past two years but everything is still the same. Life is over. Even though I look good, dress well, well groomed – nails, teeth, hair, etc. Who knows.
What is it like to be dead? I always think I am forgetting something, that’s one reason I postponed. Similar to when you leave to get in your car to go somewhere – you hesitate with a thought: “what am I forgetting?”. In this case, I cannot make a return trip!
I like to write and talk. Ironic because I haven’t met anybody recently (past 30 years) who I want to be close friends with OR who want to be close friends with me. I was always open to suggestions to what I am doing wrong, no brother or father (mine are useless) or close friend to nudge me and give it bluntly yet tactfully wtf I am doing wrong. A personal coach or someone who knows what he is doing would be perfect. Money is highly secondary for a solution.
May 5, 2009:
To pull the exit plan off, it popped into my mind to just use some booze. I want to do this before I get laid off, for reasons not worth mentioning but don’t seem to have the balls. After the gym, I stopped at Shop N Save and got a fifth of vodka and a small bottle of Jack Daniels. I haven’t had a drink since September 1, 1988, just over 20 years. It doesn’t matter now, I need to use it to take the edge off of carrying out the exit plan. I will be taking some every now and then to get used to it and see if the alcohol effects will embolden me. Weed would be fun to try again. I don’t know who has any. Life is over, who cares? I just need to use common sense, can’t drink and drive, etc. This idea just hit me at a point in time and I immediately acted on it. Same thing happened when I decided to go back to Pitt full time, first day was Monday, May 8, 1989, and to buy the house that closed on Friday, September 30, 1996, to name two examples I remember so well.
The list idea yesterday is working. I carry it in my wallet and add to it. I am feeling to good to do carry this out, but too bad to enjoy ANYTHING. My life’s dilema.
May 6, 2009:
I started the JD. About one ounce with some tea to get me started. No big deal.
May 7, 2009:
Went to the gym and did mostly cardio. My heart rate was 117 just from walking on the treadmill at 3.4. This should be done a few times a week for maybe 15 mins or so to keep the heart active. I sprinted a few times to push the limits.
May 18, 2009:
I actually had a date today. It was with a woman I met on the bus in March. We got together at Two PPG Place for lunch. The last date for me was May 1, 2008. Women just don’t like me. There are 30 million desirable women in the US (my estimate) and I cannot find one. Not one of them finds me attractive. I am looking at The List I made from my May 4th idea. I forgot about that for several days. That tells me where I stand. These problems have gotten worse over a 30 year period. I need to expect nothing from me or other people. All through the years I thought we had the ability to change ourselves – I guess that is incorrect. Looking at The List makes me realize how TOTALLY ALONE, a deeper word is ISOLATED, I am from all else.
I no longer have any expectations of myself. I have no options because I cannot work toward and achieve even the smallest goals. That is, ABOVE ALL, what bothers me the most. Not to be able to work towards what I want in my life. I believe I am deserve that. I read recently it is called “self efficacy”, but who knows. Is that more psychobable?
May 25, 2009:
I was invited to a picnic, and I went. An older woman there, out of the blue, asked if I liked high school. Then quickly asked if I was picked on very much. Intersting why she would ask that. But, thanks, I already know what the problem is, but a solution eludes me.
May 29, 2009:
Another lonely Friday night, I’m done. This is too much.
June 2, 2009:
Some people I was talking with believed I date a lot and get around with women. They think this because I showed an email I got from a hot woman to the department gossip, but it didn’t work out. All this is funny. Actually, I haven’t had sex since I was 29 years old, 19 years ago. That’s true.
June 5, 2009:
I was reading several posts on different forums and it seems many teenage girls have sex frequently. One 16 year old does it usually three times a day with her boyfriend. So, err, after a month of that, this little hoe has had more sex than ME in my LIFE, and I am 48. One more reason. Thanks for nada, bitches! Bye.
July 4, 2009:
Wow, already late evening. I stayed in all day. Can’t believe there was NOTHING to do today. No parties or picnics. WTF. No need to leave now.
July 20, 2009:
Been a long time since last write. Everything still sucks. But I got a promotion and a raise, even in this shitty Obama ecomomy. No more grunt programming. Go figure! New boss is great. He tactfully says when you did something wrong or complements on good things. Never confused with him. But that is NOT what I want in life. I guess some of us were simply meant to walk a lonely path. I have slept alone for over 20 years. Last time I slept all night with a girlfriend it was 1982. Proof I am a total malfunction. Girls and women don’t even give me a second look ANYWHERE. There is something BLATANTLY wrong with me that NO goddam person will tell me what it is. Every person just wants to be fucking nice and say nice things to me. Flattery. Oh yeah, I am sure you can get a date anytime. You look good, etc. Pussies.
Awwww, wait. I can just start being self-righteous and say I live a good, clean life. I am holy, that’s all Rick Knapp stuff. Hear that you mother fucker: I Am Just Good!
July 23, 2009:
Wow!!
I just looked out my front window and saw a beautiful college-age girl leave Bob Fox’s house, across the street. I guess he got a good lay today. College girls are hoez. I masturbate. Frequently. He is about 45 years old. She was a long haired, hot little hottie with a beautiful bod. I masturbate. Frequently. Some were simply meant to walk a lonely path in life. I don’t usually look out, but just happened to notice. Holy fuck. I have masturbated since age 13. Thanks, mum and brother (by blood alone). And dad, old man, for TOTALLY ignoring me through the years. All of you DEEPLY helped me be this way.
I wish I can go back to 1975 and fix things. Awe, that wont work, big BULLY BROTHER would assert his bull shit. He was twice my size. He never messed with guys bigger than 5’10, or so. He is a PUSSY at heart. Remember, Michael is my brother (we have common parents, that’s all) is still a BOSS. Repetition only for emphasis: HE IS ONLY A BULLY, even at 50ish! Never forget that! Because he exudes confidence. People believe bull shit if delivered WITH CONFIDENCE. Get it??
On the same thought, things occured to me today. Michael NEVER had an attractive girlfriend. Debbie, Barb, Kim, … then I lost track. Not to say I had any (execpt Pam, who was about a 7.25). He married a Chinese-descent, petite woman with no body, no ass, no chest and no personality. She never laughs or smiles, neither does he. But she is highly intelligent and an excellent cook. I can testify to that! She home bakes her own DELICIOUS wheat bread! But who cares about that type of small bull crap? Mike even mentioned when we were visiting dad that “she’s not very attractive”.
I don’t know where I am going with this. I am getting tired, feels good to write and get it all out.
On still another thought, I had 20+ years of sobriety and achieved nothing about friendships, girlfriends, guys, etc. Zilch. What a waste.
Bye, for today.
August 2, 2009:
The biggest problem of all is not having relationships or friends, but not being able to achieve and acquire what I desire in those or many other areas. Everthing stays the same regardless of the effert I put in. If I had control over my life then I would be happier. But for about the past 30 years, I have not
August 3, 2009:
I took off today, Monday, and tomorrow to practice my routine and make sure it is well polished. I need to work out every detail, there is only one shot. Also I need to be completely immersed into something before I can be successful. I haven’t had a drink since Friday at about 2:30. Total effort needed. Tomorrow is the big day.
Unfortunately I talked to my neighbor today, who is very positive and upbeat. I need to remain focused and absorbed COMPLETELY. Last time I tried this, in January, I chickened out. Lets see how this new approach works.
Maybe soon, I will see God and Jesus. At least that is what I was told. Eternal life does NOT depend on works. If it did, we will all be in hell. Christ paid for EVERY sin, so how can I or you be judged BY GOD for a sin when the penalty was ALREADY paid. People judge but that does not matter. I was reading the Bible and The Integrity of God beginning yesterday, because soon I will see them.
I will try not to add anymore entries because this computer clicking distracts me.
Also, any of the “Practice Papers” left on my coffee table I used or the notes in my gym bag can be published freely. I will not be embarased, because, well, I will be dead. Some people like to study that stuff. Maybe all this will shed insight on why some people just cannot make things happen in their life, which can potentially benefit others.
Miscellaneous:
1. Probably 99% of the people who know me well don’t even think I was this crazy. Told by at least 100 girls/women over the years I was a “nice guy”. Not kidding.
2. Lee Ann Valdiserri had my baby in early 1991. Haven’t seen her since she was about four months into it. I knew her sister, Chris, from high school.
3. Net worth slightly more than $250K, (after all debt) as of end of 2008.
4. Death Lives!
© 2009 George Sodini
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Rum
Prostitution often thrived near monasteries as well.
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Game, like democracy, is not a coat you can put on.
While a lot of men can be marginally helped by concepts you discuss here at this blog, I think, you could no more teach guys like this Game than you can teach it to a dog or a cat. The concept of Game as something that guys like this can learn to get and keep women is so much snake oil.
Import ten, twenty million nubile, lithe, young women to America and repeal the prohibition on prostitution and it would go a long way towards eliminating these sort of incidents and the anger brewing inside of millions of men like Sodini, not so much because they could get safe, affordable blow jobs, but it would result in the lowering of the bitch shields of millions of women by orders of magnitude if they had to compete with those millions of nubile, lithe, young women.
Safe, affordable blow jobs. In a society as sex obsessed as America it is spectacularly incongruous that prostitution is illegal, it only makes sense if viewed as a means to make men’s lives miserable.
Safe, affordable blow jobs.
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@ aspargus
You’re such a fucking idiot. (ban? please?)
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the site was taken offline alright, here’s his entire blog for you peeps to read :
George Sodini George Sodini
Age 48. Age 48.
DOB 9/30/1960 DOB 9/30/1960
DOD 8/4/2009 DOD 8/4/2009
5-10, 155 lbs. 5-10, 155 lbs.
Never married. Never married.
Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania USA Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania USA
Me Me
Why do this? Why do this?? To young girls? To young girls? Just read below. Just read below. I kept a running log that includes my thoughts and actions, after I saw this project was going to drag on. I kept a running log that includes my thoughts and actions, after I saw this project was going to drag on.
November 5, 2008: November 5, 2008:
Planned to do this in the summer but figure to stick around to see the election outcome. Planned to do this in the summer but figure to stick around to see the election outcome. This particular one got so much attention and I was just curious. This particular one got so much attention and I was just curious. Not like I give a flying FCUK who won, since this was already planned exit plan. Not like I give a flying fcuk who won, since this exit plan was already planned. Good luck to Obama! Good luck to Obama! He will be successful. He will be successful. The liberal media LOVES him. The liberal media LOVES him. America has chosen The Black Man. Amerika has chosen The Black Man. Good! Good! In light of this I got outside ideas or Obama’s plans for the economy and such. In light of this I got ideas outside of Obama’s plans for the economy and such. Here it is: Every black man should get a young white girl how to hone up on. Here it is: Every black man should get a young white girl hoe to hone up on. Kinda a reverse indentured servitude thing. Kinda a reverse indentured servitude thing. Long ago, many a older white male land owner was a young Negro girl Wenche for his desires. Long ago, many a older white male landowner had a young Negro wench girl for his desires. Bout ‘time tables are turned on that shit. Bout’ time tables are turned on that shit. Besides, dem young white sleeves dig da bruthrs! Besides, dem young white hoez dig da bruthrs! LOL. LOL. More so than they dig the white dudes! More so than they dig the white dudes! Every daddy know when he sends his little girl to college, she be bangin a bruthr real good. Every daddy know when he sends his little girl to college, she be bangin a bruthr real good. I saw it. I saw it. “Not my little girl, daddy says! “Not my little girl”, daddy says! (Yeah right!) Black dudes have Their choice of best white sleeves. (Yeah right!!) Black dudes have thier choice of best white hoez. You do the math, there are enough young white so all the brothers can each have one for 3 or 6 months or so. You do the math, there are enough young white so all the brothers can each have one for 3 or 6 months or so.
December 22, 2008: December 22, 2008:
Time is moving along. Time is moving along. Planned to have this done already. Planned to have this done already. I will just keep a running log here as time passes. I will just keep a running log here as time passes. Many of the young girls here look so beautiful as to not be human, very edible. Many of the young girls here look so beautiful as to not be human, very edible. After joining this gym, started lifting weights and like it. After joining this gym, started lifting weights and like it. Much info about weight programs, diet etc on the web. Much info about weight programs, diet etc on the web. Or anything for that matter. Or anything for that matter. Instead of TV I can Google for hours to relax. Instead of TV I can Google for hours to relax. TV and most movies are dull. TV and most movies are dull.
December 24, 2008: December 24, 2008:
Moving into Christmas again. Moving into Christmas again. No girlfriend since 1984, last Christmas with Pam was in 1983. No girlfriend since 1984, last Christmas with Pam was in 1983. Who knows why. Who knows why. I am not ugly or too weird. I am not ugly or too weird. No sex since July 1990 either (I was 29). No sex since July 1990 either (I was 29). No shit! No shit! About eighteen years ago. Over eighteen years ago. And did it maybe only 50-75 times in my life. And did it maybe only 50-75 times in my life. Getting to think that a woman would now just, uh, get in the way of things. Getting to think that a woman now would just, uh, get in the way of things. Isolated. Isolated. I have extra money and enjoy traveling, too, wtih my 25-30 days of vacation. I have extra money and enjoy traveling, too, wtih my 25-30 days of vacation. LA was the best! LA was the best! But going alone is not too fun. Invited to a party on Christmas day tomorrow. But going alone is not too fun. Invited to a party on Christmas day tomorrow. Seems about 15-25 people will actually show. Seems about 15-25 people will actually show. I like her parties, I can meet new people and talk. I like her parties; I can meet new people and talk. Got the next 8 days off. Got the next 8 days off. I should have done and practiced exit plan by then. I should have exit plan done and practiced by then. I know nothing will change, no matter how hard I try or what goals I set. I know nothing will change, no matter how hard I try or what goals I set.
December 28, 2008: December 28, 2008:
Glad I stayed around. Glad I stayed around. All these days off are great. All these days off are great. I will shoot for Tuesday, January 6, 2009, at maybe 8:15. I will shoot for Tuesday, January 6, 2009, at maybe 8:15. I have to-do list of items to make. I have list of to-do items to make.
December 29, 2008: December 29, 2008:
Just got back from tanning, been doing this for a while. Just got back from tanning, been doing this for a while. No gym today, my Sore Elbow is again. No gym today, my elbow is sore again. I actually look good. I actually look good. I dress good, am clean-shave, bath, or touch cologne – yet 30 million women rejected me – about an 18 or 25-year period. I dress good, am clean-shaven, bathe, touch of cologne – yet 30 million women rejected me – over an 18 or 25-year period. That is how I see it. That is how I see it. Thirty million is my rough guesstimate of how many desirable single women there are. Thirty million is my rough guesstimate of how many desirable single women there are. A man needs a woman for confidence. A man needs a woman for confidence. He gets a boost on the job, career, with other people, and everywhere else when inside he knows he has someone to spend the night with and who is also a friend. He gets a boost on the job, career, with other men, and everywhere else when he knows inside he has someone to spend the night with and who is also a friend. This type of life I see is a closed world with me specifically and totally excluded. This type of life I see is a closed world with me specifically and totally excluded. Every other guy does this successfully to a degree. Every other guy does this successfully to a degree. Flying solo for many years is a destroyer. Flying solo for many years is a destroyer. Yet many people say I am easy to get along with, etc. Looking back, I owe nothing to desirable females who ask for anything, except for basic courtesy – usually. Yet many people say I am easy to get along with, etc. Looking back, I owe nothing to desirable females who ask for anything, except for basic courtesy – usually. Looking back on everything, what bother me most is the inability to work towards change whatever I choose. Looking back over everything, what bothers me most is the inability to work towards whatever change I choose.
December 30, 2008: December 30, 2008:
While driving I surfed to a radio talk show. While driving I radio surfed to a talk show. The caller was a 30ish black man who was describe the Despair in certain black communities. The caller was a 30ish black man who was describing the despair in certain black communities. According to him, life is cheap there because you are going to die anyway when you get old. According to him, life is cheap there because you are going to die anyway when you get old. It is the quality of life that is important, he said. It is the quality of life that is important, he said. If you know the past 40 years were crappy, why live another 30 years then that crappy? If you know the past 40 years were crappy, why live another 30 crappy years then die? His point was they engage in dangerous behavior which tend to short the life pans, to die now and avoid the crappy next 30 years, using my example. His point was they engage in dangerous behavior which tends to shorten the lifespans, to die now and avoid the next 30 crappy years, using my example. The host got Sarcastic and ended the call instead of trying understanding his point. The host got sarcastic and ended the call instead of trying understanding his point. Agreement was not necesary. Agreement wasn’t necesary. I put music back on. I put music back on. But it was an interesting, and useful point for me to hear. But it was an interesting, and useful point for me to hear.
December 31, 2008: December 31, 2008:
My anger and rage is largely gone since I began lifting weights. My anger and rage is largely gone since I began lifting weights. Lifting drains me but I still have energy. Lifting drains me but I still have energy. Somebody else suggested running but that did not help me. Somebody else suggested running but that did not help me. I guess strenuous exercise is necesary for a man. I guess strenuous exercise is necesary for a man. So I just learned that now at 48. So I just learned that now at 48. Maybe 30 years later than I would have liked. Maybe 30 years later than I would have liked. My dad never (not once) talked to me or asked about my life’s details and tell me what he knew. My dad never (not once) talked to me or asked about my life’s details and tell me what he knew. He was just a useless sperm donation. He was just a useless sperm doner. Do not know why, find it fun talking to young kids when I visit someone. Don’t know why, find it fun talking to young kids when I visit someone. Brother was actually counter-productive and would try to discourage me or embarase my efferts when persuing things, esp girls early on (teen years). Brother was actually counter-productive and would try to embarase me or discourage my efferts when persuing things, esp girls early on (teen years). Useless Bully. Useless bully. Result is I am learning basics by trial and error in my 40s, followed by discuragement. Result is I am learning basics by trial and error in my 40s, followed by discuragement. Seems odd, but thats true. Seems odd, but thats true. Writing all this is helping me justify my plan and to see the futility of continuing. Writing all this is helping me justify my plan and to see the futility of continuing. Too embarassed to tell anyone this, at almost 50 one is expected to just know these things. Too embarassed to tell anyone this, at almost 50 one is expected to just know these things.
I hope it does not snow on Tuesday. I hope it doesn’t snow on Tuesday. Just thought of that. Just thought of that. The crowd will be thin so I would postpone. The crowd will be thin so I would postpone. Shit! Shit!
Now that I am on the topic of family and people I know, I might as well make a summary of sorts to show where things stand. Now that I am on the topic of family and people I know, I might as well make a summary of sorts to show where things stand. This is New Years Eve I have time, no date tonight of course, so: This is New Years Eve I have time, no date tonight of course, so:
Honorable mention: Honorable mention:
Tetelestai Church in Pittsburgh, PA – “Be Ye Holy, even as I have been Ye holy! Saithe Thus the Lord thy God!”, As pastor Rick Knapp would proclaim. Tetelestai Church in Pittsburgh, PA – “Be Ye Holy, even as I have been Ye holy! Thus saith the lord thy God!”, as pastor Rick Knapp would proclaim. Holy shit, religion is a waste. Holy shit, religion is a waste. But this guy teaches (and convinced me) you can commit mass murder then still go to heaven. But this guy teaches (and convinced me) you can commit mass murder then still go to heaven. Ask him. Ask him. Call him at (724) 325-2655. Call him at (724) 325-2655. If no answer there, he should still live at 439 9th Street, Oakmont, PA 15139. If no answer there, he should still live at 439 9th Street, Oakmont, PA 15139. In any case, Guilt and fear kept me there 13 long years until Nov 2006. In any case, guilt and fear kept me there 13 long years until Nov 2006. I think his crap did the most damage. I think his crap did the most damage. Their web site: http://www.tetelestai.org. Their web site: http://www.tetelestai.org.
Mum – The Boss Central. Mum – The Central Boss. 717 High View Road, PGH PA 15234. 717 Highview Road, Pgh PA 15234. Do not piss her off or she will be mad and Vindictive for years. Don’t piss her off or she will be mad and vindictive for years. She actually thinks she’s normal. She actually thinks she’s normal. Very dominant. Very dominant. Her only way and her way with no flexibility toward everyone in the household. Her way and only her way with no flexibility toward everyone in the household. A power and control thing. A power and control thing. People outside the immediate family like her. People outside the immediate family like her. Why are people viciously with their closest ones? Why are people vicious with their closest ones? She is the Boss above all other Bosses. She is the Boss above all other Bosses.
Michael Sodini – A Boss, my brother (Mike Sodini) 216 Horseshoe Dr, Mars PA – Always the Big Bully, twice the size of most others. Michael Sodini – A Boss, my brother (Mike Sodini) 216 Horseshoe Dr, Mars PA – Always the big bully, twice the size of most others. When he bullied or harassed someone, it was the other person who “deserved it”. When he bullied or harassed someone, it was the other person who “deserved it”. It was always about him. It was always about him. Way to self-absorbed, too. Way to self absorbed, too. Still is. Still is. Used to like to Embarrassing guys in front of their girl friends. Used to like to embarrass guys in front of their girlfriends. Lots of other shit. Lots of other shit. Kind of guy you actually loved to hate. Kind of guy you actually loved to hate. The biggest, most self-centered jagoff I know. The biggest, most self-centered jagoff I know. Bullying He took those skills into the business world and is doing good Financially. He took those bullying “skills” into the business world and is doing good financially. He is a big wheel only in his mind. He is a big wheel only in his mind. Most people can see through all his manipulation. Most people can see thru all his manipulation. He only calls when he wants something. He calls only when he wants something.
Sherry – sister – More of a victim than anything. Sherry – sister – More of a victim than anything. Copes by exercising much control over her adult children. Copes by exercising much control over her adult children. We used to be close until her control of L & D caused a conflict. We used to be close until her control of L & D caused a conflict. Never the same after. Never the same after.
David – neph, sis’s son (girlfriend Mallory Squires). David – neph, sis’s son (girlfriend Mallory Squires). Good young guy, though. Good young guy, though.
Lisa – niece, sis’s daught. Lisa – niece, sis’s daught. Attractive, smart, emotional – all good qualities YW. Attractive, smart, emotional – all good YW qualities.
Idiots: Idiots:
Andy Pulkowski – I have been in barr uncles and church groups. Andy Pulkowski – I have been in barrooms and church groups. The worst people by far are the religious types. The worst people by far are the religious types. Especially a right-wing, prim-faced fundie like Andy. Especially a right-wing, stiff-faced fundie like Andy. A condescending, demeaning, passive aggresive person. A condescending, demeaning, passive-aggresive person. Frigid, rigid, linear and totally inflexible. Frigid, rigid, linear and totally inflexible. Being a very serious person, he can not hide his frown-lined face. Being a very serious person, he cannot hide his frown-lined face. He better not try to smile, lest his face might crack. He better not try to smile; lest his face might crack. I knew Children of parents who grew up in strict religious homes. I knew children of parents who grew up in strict religious homes. Religion has a certain stink to it or Guilt, shame, fear, and that moral standard that always contradicts the natural tendencies and desires of a person. Religion has a certain stink to it of guilt, shame, fear, and that moral standard that always contradicts the natural tendencies and desires of a person. Therin lies the conflict. Therin lies the conflict. Young person can not experiment with things to decide on their own and establish their own parameters. Young person cannot experiment with things to decide on their own and establish their own parameters. So they tend to cut loose and really rebel much worse than the average young person. So they tend to cut loose and really rebel much worse than the average young person. Ma and Pa never know what goes on. Ma and Pa never know what goes on. They easily BS their parents because they want to believe their little one is an angel. They easily BS their parents because they want to believe their little one is an angel. Andy has a young daughter Bethany Pulkowski away at college, High Point University. Andy has a young daughter Bethany Pulkowski away at college, High Point University. I saw her picture on his desk. I saw her picture on his desk. She’s your basic, attractive, young girl. She’s your basic, attractive, young girl. Please reread my entry made on Nov 5th. Please reread my entry made on Nov 5th. That’s only one thing she can do. That’s only one thing she can do. Andy types out there you need to further strengthen your resolve and strictly do more of the same thing! You Andy types out there need to further strengthen your strict resolve and do more of the same thing! Because those girls were great when I recall my college years! Because those girls were great when I recall my college years! She is someone’s (or many guy’s) little way now, I am sure. She is someone’s (or many guy’s) little hoe now, I am sure.
Another point about andy. Another point about andy. How can someone be cold, vicious, Sarcastic and generally nasty ALL THE TIME and then make the claim about their church life and how good they are? How can someone be cold, vicious, sarcastic and generally nasty ALL THE TIME and then make the claim about their church life and how good they are? Total hypo critical idiots. Total hypocritical idiots.
That’s all for now. That’s all for now. That felt good. That felt good.
Let’s continue … Let’s continue…
January 5, 2009: January 5, 2009:
Was at the gym to lift. Was at the gym to lift. Very crowded. Very crowded. Tomorrow should be good. Tomorrow should be good. There is a woman there that gives me a certain look every time I am there. There is a woman there that gives me a certain look every time I am there. I decided to walk over and make a comment about the crowds but she left when I finished the exercise. I decided to walk over and make a comment about the crowds but she left when I finished the exercise. Better that I do not get sidetracked from tomorrow’s plan anyways. Better that I do not get sidetracked from tomorrow’s plan anyways. Life is just playing games. Life is just playing games. One or two dates with her, then the end. One or two dates with her, then the end. No matter how many changes I try to make, things stay the same. No matter how many changes I try to make, things stay the same. Every evening I am alone, and then go to bed alone. Every evening I am alone, and then go to bed alone. Young women were brutal when I was younger, now they are not as much, probably because they just see me as just another old man. Young women were brutal when I was younger, now they aren’t as much, probably because they just see me just as another old man.
I see twenty something couples everywhere. I see twenty something couples everywhere. I see a twenty something guy with a nice twentyish young women. I see a twenty something guy with a nice twentyish young women. I think those years Slipped right by for me. I think those years slipped right by for me. Why should I continue another 20 + years alone? Why should I continue another 20+ years alone? I will just work, come home, eat, maybe do something, then go to bed (alone) for the next day or the same thing. I will just work, come home, eat, maybe do something, then go to bed (alone) for the next day of the same thing. This is the Auschwitz Syndrome, to be in serious pain so long one thinks it is normal. This is the Auschwitz Syndrome, to be in serious pain so long one thinks it is normal. I can not wait for tomorrow! I cannot wait for tomorrow!
January 6, 2009: January 6, 2009:
I can do this. I can do this. Leaving work today, I felt like a zombie – just going through the motions. Leaving work today, I felt like a zombie – just going thru the motions. Get on the bus, get the car, drive home ….. My mind is screwed up anymore, I can not concentrate at work or think at all. Get on the bus, get the car, drive home…..My mind is screwed up anymore, I can’t concentrate at work or think at all.
This log is not detailed. This log is not detailed. It is only for confidence to do this. It is only for confidence to do this. The future holds even less than what I have today. The future holds even less than what I have today.
It is 6:40 pm, about hour and a half to go. It is 6:40pm, about hour and a half to go. God have mercy. God have mercy. I wish life could be better for all and the crazy world can somehow run smoother. I wish life could be better for all and the crazy world can somehow run smoother. I wish I had answers. Bye. I wish I had answers. Bye.
It is 8:45 PM: I chickened out! It is 8:45PM: I chickened out! Shit! Shit! I brought the loaded guns, everything. I brought the loaded guns, everything. Hell! Hell!
April 24, 2009: April 24, 2009:
Early last month, we had our second general layoff. Early last month, we had our second general layoff. I survived. I survived. First one was in November. First one was in November. When I began 10 years ago, that used to be a nice place to work. When I began 10 years ago, that used to be a nice place to work. I understand the need to reduce staff when times sour, but this is out of proportion to the economic problems at this time. I understand the need to reduce staff when times sour, but this is out of proportion to the economic problems at this time. The economy is shrinking by about 4-5%. The economy is shrinking by about 4-5%. They decided not to pay Christmas bonus – for staff that amounts to about 8% of yearly pay. They decided not to pay Christmas bonus – for staff that amounts to about 8% of yearly pay. Well, OK. Well, OK. Plus no yearly “merit” raise, another 3.5%. Plus no yearly “merit” raise, another 3.5%. That totals to about 11% cut. That totals to about 11% cut. Plus two staff layoffs or 5% in each case. Plus two layoffs of 5% staff in each case. Do the math. Do the math. I know this firm is using this downturn as an excuse to take advanage of a bad situation and kill jobs UNNECESSARILY. I know this firm is using this downturn as an excuse to take advanage of a bad situation and kill jobs UNNECESSARILY. The second layoff people who actually did work were let go. The second layoff people who actually did work were let go. We all need to pick up the Slack so the company can cut beyond what is necesary. We all need to pick up the slack so the company can cut beyond what is necesary. Was not going to mention it, because of all this shit, it is K & L Gates, the large law firm headquarters here in Pittsburgh. Wasn’t going to mention it, because of all this shit, it is K&L Gates, the large law firm headquartered here in Pittsburgh. Just call it K & L Gates Corporation. Just call it K&L Gates Corporation. Most people there are OK and I would never have a shoot ’em up there. Most people there are OK and I would never have a shoot ’em up there. They paid me for 10 years, so far! They paid me for 10 years, so far!
I Predict I will not survive the next layoff. I predict I won’t survive the next layoff. That is when there is no point to continue. That is when there is no point to continue. Right now, life is able bear and I can get by indefinitely. RIght now, life is bearable and I can get by indefinitely. Something bad must happen. Something bad must happen. The paycheck is all I have left. The paycheck is all I have left. The future holds nothing for me. The future holds nothing for me. Twenty five years of nothing fun. Twenty five years of nothing fun. I never even spent one weekend with a girl in my life, even at my own place. I never even spent one weekend with a girl in my life, even at my own place. Also unlikely to find another similar job. Also unlikely to find another similar job. I guess then is when I take care of things. I guess then is when I take care of things. I do not have kids, close friends or anything. I don’t have kids, close friends or anything. Just me here. Just me here. If you have nothing, you have nothing to lose. If you have nothing, you have nothing to lose.
I enjoy writing these entries, I have no plans to go back and edit or even read most stuff already written. I enjoy writing these entries, I have no plans to go back and edit or even read most stuff already written. If you get bored, just click that “x” at the top, right corner of your browser. If you get bored, just click that “x” at the top, right corner of your browser. Bye. Bye.
May 4, 2009: May 4, 2009:
I was so eager to do this last year. I was so eager to do this last year. The big problem on my mind now is that my job will end soon. The big problem on my mind now is that my job will end soon. One project is being transistioned to another. One project is being transistioned to another. The other one I am solely responsible, but is being fast tracked to production. The other one I am solely responsible, but is being fast tracked to production. I estimate maybe a month. I estimate maybe a month. I am not ready for the job market. I am not ready for the job market. I am ok what I do, please. NET software developer. I am ok what I do, a .NET software developer. Not at the top of the class, but I do a good job. Not at the top of the class, but I do a good job. I survived two layoffs and other general layoffs they are having little but keeping quiet about. I survived two general layoffs and other little layoffs they are having but keeping quiet about. I hear things. I hear things.
The problem is I feel too good now to do this but too bad to enjoy life. The problem is I feel too good now to do this but too bad to enjoy life. I know I will never enjoy life. I know I will never enjoy life. This is an 30 year trend. This is an over 30 year trend. Some people are happy, some are miserable. Some people are happy, some are miserable. It is difficult to live almost continuously feeling an under current of fear, worry, discontent ment and help less ness. It is difficult to live almost continuously feeling an undercurrent of fear, worry, discontentment and helplessness. I can talk and joke around and sound happy but under it all is something different that seems unchangable and a permanent part of my being. I can talk and joke around and sound happy but under it all is something different that seems unchangable and a permanent part of my being. I need to realize the details of what I accomplished in life and never to be convinced the future is merely a continuation of the past – WHICH IT ALWAYS has been. I need to realize the details of what I never accomplished in life and to be convinced the future is merely a continuation of the past – WHICH IT ALWAYS has been. I am making a list of items that will provide motivation to do the exit plan, it will not be published. I am making a list of items that will provide motivation to do the exit plan, it won’t be published. I always had hope that maybe things will improve especially if I make big attempts to change my life. I always had hope that maybe things will improve especially if I make big attempts to change my life. I made many big changes in the past two years but everything is still the same. I made many big changes in the past two years but everything is still the same. Life is over. Life is over. Even though I look good, dress well, well groomed – nails, teeth, hair, etc. Who knows. Even though I look good, dress well, well groomed – nails, teeth, hair, etc. Who knows.
What is it like to be dead? What is it like to be dead? I always think I am forgetting something, that’s one reason I postponed. I always think I am forgetting something, that’s one reason I postponed. Similar to when you leave to get in your car to go somewhere – you hesitate with a thought: “what am I forgetting?”. Similar to when you leave to get in your car to go somewhere – you hesitate with a thought: “what am I forgetting?”. In this case, I can not make a return trip! In this case, I cannot make a return trip!
I like to write and talk. I like to write and talk. Ironic because I have with anybody recently (past 30 years) who I want to be close friends with or who want to be close friends with me. Ironic because I haven’t met anybody recently (past 30 years) who I want to be close friends with OR who want to be close friends with me. I was always open to suggestions to what I am doing wrong, no brother or father (mine are useless) or close friend to nudge me and give it bluntly yet fully tact wtf I am doing wrong. I was always open to suggestions to what I am doing wrong, no brother or father (mine are useless) or close friend to nudge me and give it bluntly yet tactfully wtf I am doing wrong. A personal coach or someone who knows what he is doing would be perfect. A personal coach or someone who knows what he is doing would be perfect. Money is highly secondary for a solution. Money is highly secondary for a solution.
May 5, 2009: May 5, 2009:
To pull off the exit plan, it popped into my mind to just use some booze. To pull the exit plan off, it popped into my mind to just use some booze. I want to do this before I get laid off, for reasons not worth mentioning but do not seem to have the balls. I want to do this before I get laid off, for reasons not worth mentioning but don’t seem to have the balls. After the gym, I stopped at Shop N Save and got a fifth of vodka and a small bottle of Jack Daniels. After the gym, I stopped at Shop N Save and got a fifth of vodka and a small bottle of Jack Daniels. I have not had a drink since September 1, 1988, just over 20 years. I haven’t had a drink since September 1, 1988, just over 20 years. It does not matter now, I need to use it to take off The Edge or carrying out the exit plan. It doesn’t matter now, I need to use it to take the edge off of carrying out the exit plan. I will be taking some every now and then to get used to it and see if the alcohol effects will embolden me. I will be taking some every now and then to get used to it and see if the alcohol effects will embolden me. Weed would be fun to try again. Weed would be fun to try again. I do not know who has any. I don’t know who has any. Life is over, who cares? Life is over, who cares? I just need to use common sense, can not drink and drive, etc. This idea just hit me at a point in time and I immediately ACTED on it. I just need to use common sense, can’t drink and drive, etc. This idea just hit me at a point in time and I immediately acted on it. Same thing happened when I decided to go back to Pitt full-time, first day was Monday, May 8, 1989, and to buy the house that closed on Friday, September 30, 1996, to name two examples I remember so well. Same thing happened when I decided to go back to Pitt full time, first day was Monday, May 8, 1989, and to buy the house that closed on Friday, September 30, 1996, to name two examples I remember so well.
The list idea is working yesterday. The list idea yesterday is working. I carry it in my wallet and add to it. I carry it in my wallet and add to it. I am feeling good to do to carry this out, but too bad to enjoy ANYTHING. I am feeling to good to do carry this out, but too bad to enjoy ANYTHING. My life’s Dilema. My life’s dilema.
May 6, 2009: May 6, 2009:
I started the JD. I started the JD. About one ounce with some tea to get me started. About one ounce with some tea to get me started. No big deal. No big deal.
May 7, 2009: May 7, 2009:
Went to the gym and did mostly cardio. Went to the gym and did mostly cardio. My heart rate was 117 just from walking on the treadmill at 3.4. My heart rate was 117 just from walking on the treadmill at 3.4. This should be done a few times a week for maybe 15 mins or so to keep the center active. This should be done a few times a week for maybe 15 mins or so to keep the heart active. I sprinted a few times to push the limits. I sprinted a few times to push the limits.
May 18, 2009: May 18, 2009:
I actually had a date today. I actually had a date today. It was with a woman I on the bus in March. It was with a woman I met on the bus in March. We got together at Two PPG Place for lunch. We got together at Two PPG Place for lunch. The last date for me was May 1, 2008. The last date for me was May 1, 2008. Women just do not like me. Women just don’t like me. There are 30 million desirable women in the U.S. (my estimate) and I can not find one. There are 30 million desirable women in the US (my estimate) and I cannot find one. Not one of them finds me attractive. Not one of them finds me attractive. I am looking at the list I made from my May 4th idea. I am looking at The List I made from my May 4th idea. I forgot about that for several days. I forgot about that for several days. That tells me where I stand. That tells me where I stand. These problems have gotten worse over a 30 year period. These problems have gotten worse over a 30 year period. I need to expect nothing from me or other people. I need to expect nothing from me or other people. All through the years I thought we had the ability to change ourselves – I guess that is incorrect. All through the years I thought we had the ability to change ourselves – I guess that is incorrect. Looking at The List makes me realize how TOTALLY ALONE, a deeper word is isolated, I am from all else. Looking at The List makes me realize how TOTALLY ALONE, a deeper word is ISOLATED, I am from all else.
I no longer have any expectations of myself. I no longer have any expectations of myself. I have no options because I can not work toward and achieve even the smallest goals. I have no options because I cannot work toward and achieve even the smallest goals. That is, ABOVE ALL, what bother me the most. That is, ABOVE ALL, what bothers me the most. Not to be able to work towards what I want in my life. Not to be able to work towards what I want in my life. I am believe I deserve that. I believe I am deserve that. I read recently it is called “self efficacy”, but who knows. I read recently it is called “self efficacy”, but who knows. Is that more psychobable? Is that more psychobable?
May 25, 2009: May 25, 2009:
I was invited to a picnic, and I went. I was invited to a picnic, and I went. An older woman there, out of the blue, asked if I liked high school. An older woman there, out of the blue, asked if I liked high school. Then quickly asked if I was picked on very much. Then quickly asked if I was picked on very much. Intersting why she would ask that. Intersting why she would ask that. But, thanks, I already know what the problem is, but a solution eludes me. But, thanks, I already know what the problem is, but a solution eludes me.
May 29, 2009: May 29, 2009:
Another lonely Friday night, I’m done. Another lonely Friday night, I’m done. This is too much. This is too much.
June 2, 2009: June 2, 2009:
Some people believed I was talking with I date a lot and get around with women. Some people I was talking with believed I date a lot and get around with women. They think this because I showed I got an email from a hot woman to the department gossip, but it did not work out. They think this because I showed an email I got from a hot woman to the department gossip, but it didn’t work out. All this is funny. All this is funny. Actually, I have not had sex since I was 29 years old, 19 years ago. Actually, I haven’t had sex since I was 29 years old, 19 years ago. That’s true. That’s true.
June 5, 2009: June 5, 2009:
I was reading several posts on different forums and it seems many teenage girls have sex frequently. I was reading several posts on different forums and it seems many teenage girls have sex frequently. One 16 year old does it usually three times a day with her boyfriend. One 16 year old does it usually three times a day with her boyfriend. So, err, after a month of that, how little this has had more sex than me in my LIFE, and I am 48. So, err, after a month of that, this little hoe has had more sex than ME in my LIFE, and I am 48. One more reason. One more reason. Thanks for nada, bitches! Thanks for nada, bitches! Bye. Bye.
July 4, 2009: July 4, 2009:
Wow, already late evening. Wow, already late evening. I stayed in all day. I stayed in all day. Can not believe there was NOTHING to do today. Can’t believe there was NOTHING to do today. No parties or picnics. No parties or picnics. WTF. WTF. No need to leave now. No need to leave now.
July 20, 2009: July 20, 2009:
Been a long time since last write. Been a long time since last write. Everything still sucks. Everything still sucks. But I got a promotion and a raise, even in this shitty Obama ecomomy. But I got a promotion and a raise, even in this shitty Obama ecomomy. No more grunt programming. No more grunt programming. Go figure! Go figure! New boss is great. New boss is great. Tact fully when he says you did something wrong or compléments on good things. He tactfully says when you did something wrong or complements on good things. Never confused with him. Never confused with him. But that is NOT what I want in life. But that is NOT what I want in life. I guess some of us were simply meant to walk a lonely path. I guess some of us were simply meant to walk a lonely path. I have slept alone for over 20 years. Last time I slept all night with a girlfriend it was 1982. I have slept alone for over 20 years. Last time I slept all night with a girlfriend it was 1982 . Proof I am a total malfunctioning. Proof I am a total malfunction. Girls and women do not even give me a second look ANYWHERE. Girls and women don’t even give me a second look ANYWHERE. There is something wrong with me BLATANTLY NO Goddam that person will tell me what it is. There is something BLATANTLY wrong with me that NO goddam person will tell me what it is. Every person just wants to be fucking nice and say nice things to me. Every person just wants to be fucking nice and say nice things to me. Flattery. Flattery. Oh yeah, I am sure you can get a date anytime. Oh yeah, I am sure you can get a date anytime. You look good, etc. Pussies. You look good, etc. Pussies.
Awwww, wait. Awwww, wait. I can just start being self-Righteous and say I live a good, clean life. I can just start being self-righteous and say I live a good, clean life. I am holy, that’s all Rick Knapp stuff. I am holy, that’s all Rick Knapp stuff. Hear that you mother fucker: I Am Just Good! Hear that you mother fucker: I Am Just Good!
July 23, 2009: July 23, 2009:
Wow! Wow!!
I just looked out my front window and saw a beautiful college-age girl leave Bob Fox’s house, across the street. I just looked out my front window and saw a beautiful college-age girl leave Bob Fox’s house, across the street. I guess he got a good layout today. I guess he got a good lay today. College girls are covers. College girls are hoez. I masturbating. I masturbate. Frequently. Frequently. He is about 45 years old. He is about 45 years old. She was a long haired, hot little hottie with a beautiful bod. She was a long haired, hot little hottie with a beautiful bod. I masturbating. I masturbate. Frequently. Frequently. Some were simply meant to walk a lonely path in life. Some were simply meant to walk a lonely path in life. I do not usually look out, but just happened to notice. I don’t usually look out, but just happened to notice. Holy fuck. Holy fuck. I have masturbated since age 13. I have masturbated since age 13. Thanks, mum and brother (by blood alone). Thanks, mum and brother (by blood alone). And dad, old man, for TOTALLY ignore me through the years. And dad, old man, for TOTALLY ignoring me through the years. Deeply All of you helped me be this way. All of you DEEPLY helped me be this way.
I wish I can go back to 1975 and fix things. I wish I can go back to 1975 and fix things. Awe, that wont work, Big Brother Bully would assert his bull shit. Awe, that wont work, big BULLY BROTHER would assert his bull shit. He was twice my size. He was twice my size. He never messed with guys bigger than 5’10, or so. He never messed with guys bigger than 5’10, or so. He is a pussy at heart. He is a PUSSY at heart. Remember, Michael is my brother (we have common parents, that’s all) is still a BOSS. Remember, Michael is my brother (we have common parents, that’s all) is still a BOSS. Repetition for emphasis only: HE IS ONLY A Bully, even at 50ish! Repetition only for emphasis: HE IS ONLY A BULLY, even at 50ish! Never forget that! Never forget that! Because he exudes confidence. Because he exudes confidence. People believe bull shit if delivered with confidence. People believe bull shit if delivered WITH CONFIDENCE. Get it? Get it??
On the same thought, things occurred to me today. On the same thought, things occured to me today. Michael NEVER had an attractive girlfriend. Michael NEVER had an attractive girlfriend. Debbie, Barb, Kim, … Debbie, Barb, Kim, … then I lost track. then I lost track. Not to say I had any (execpt Pam, who was about a 7.25). Not to say I had any (execpt Pam, who was about a 7.25). He married a Chinese-descent, petite woman with no body, no ass, no chest and no personality. He married a Chinese-descent, petite woman with no body, no ass, no chest and no personality. She never laughs or smiles, neither does he. She never laughs or smiles, neither does he. But she is highly intelligent and an excellent cook. But she is highly intelligent and an excellent cook. I can testify to that! I can testify to that! She bakes her own home DELICIOUS wheat bread! She home bakes her own DELICIOUS wheat bread! But who cares about that type of small bull crap? But who cares about that type of small bull crap? Mike even mentioned when we were visiting dad that “she’s not very attractive.” Mike even mentioned when we were visiting dad that “she’s not very attractive”.
I do not know where I am going with this. I don’t know where I am going with this. I am getting tired, feels good to write and get it all out. I am getting tired, feels good to write and get it all out.
On still another thought, I had 20 + years of Sobriety and achieved nothing about friendships, girlfriends, guys, etc. Zilch. On still another thought, I had 20+ years of sobriety and achieved nothing about friendships, girlfriends, guys, etc. Zilch. What a waste. What a waste.
Bye, for today. Bye, for today.
August 2, 2009: August 2, 2009:
The biggest problem of all is not having relationships or friends, but not being able to achieve and acquire what I desire in those or many other areas. The biggest problem of all is not having relationships or friends, but not being able to achieve and acquire what I desire in those or many other areas. Everthing stays the same regardless of the effert I put in. Everthing stays the same regardless of the effert I put in. If I had control over my life then I would be happier. If I had control over my life then I would be happier. But for about the past 30 years, I have not But for about the past 30 years, I have not
August 3, 2009: August 3, 2009:
I took off today, Monday, and tomorrow to practice my routine and make sure it is well polished. I took off today, Monday, and tomorrow to practice my routine and make sure it is well polished. I need to work out every detail, there is only one shot. I need to work out every detail, there is only one shot. Also I need to be completely Immersed into something before I can be successful. Also I need to be completely immersed into something before I can be successful. I have not had a drink since Friday at about 2:30. I haven’t had a drink since Friday at about 2:30. Total effort needed. Total effort needed. Tomorrow is the big day. Tomorrow is the big day.
Unfortunately I talked to my neighbor today, who is very positive and upbeat. Unfortunately I talked to my neighbor today, who is very positive and upbeat. I need to remain focused and absorbed completely. I need to remain focused and absorbed COMPLETELY. Last time I tried this, in January, I chickened out. Last time I tried this, in January, I chickened out. Lets see how this new approach works. Lets see how this new approach works.
Maybe soon, I will see God and Jesus. Maybe soon, I will see God and Jesus. At least that is what I was told. At least that is what I was told. Eternal life does NOT depend on works. Eternal life does NOT depend on works. If it did, we will all be in hell. If it did, we will all be in hell. Christ paid for every sin, so how can I or you be judged BY GOD for a sin when the penalty was ALREADY paid. Christ paid for EVERY sin, so how can I or you be judged BY GOD for a sin when the penalty was ALREADY paid. People judge but that does not matter. People judge but that does not matter. I was reading the Bible and The Integrity of God beginning yesterday, because soon I will see them. I was reading the Bible and The Integrity of God beginning yesterday, because soon I will see them.
I will try not to add anymore entries because this computer clicking distracts me. I will try not to add anymore entries because this computer clicking distracts me.
Also, any of the “Practice Papers” left on my coffee table or the notes I used in my gym bag can be published freely. Also, any of the “Practice Papers” left on my coffee table I used or the notes in my gym bag can be published freely. I will not be embarased, because, well, I will be dead. I will not be embarased, because, well, I will be dead. Some people like to study that stuff. Some people like to study that stuff. Maybe all this will shed insight on why some people just can not make things happen in their life, which can potentially benefit others. Maybe all this will shed insight on why some people just cannot make things happen in their life, which can potentially benefit others.
Miscellaneous: Miscellaneous:
1. 1. Probably 99% of the people who know me well do not even think I was this crazy. Probably 99% of the people who know me well don’t even think I was this crazy. Told by at least 100 girls / women over the years I was a “nice guy”. Told by at least 100 girls/women over the years I was a “nice guy”. Not kidding. Not kidding.
2. 2. Lee Ann Valdiserri had my baby in early 1991. Lee Ann Valdiserri had my baby in early 1991. Have not seen her since she was about four months into it. Haven’t seen her since she was about four months into it. I knew her sister, Chris, from high school. I knew her sister, Chris, from high school.
3. 3. Net worth slightly more than $ 250K, (after all debt) as of end of 2008. Net worth slightly more than $250K, (after all debt) as of end of 2008.
4. 4. Death Lives! Death Lives!
© 2009 George Sodini © 2009 George Sodini
This should not be taken off the web. This should not be taken off the web. It is obviously my view and opinion. It is obviously my view and opinion.
Reproductions this as you wish, in its entirity. Reproduce this as you wish, in its entirity.
** Copy this to usenet / news groups where my voice will speak forever! ** **Copy this to usenet/newsgroups where my voice will speak forever!**
Do not modify it, you can correct my spelling errors, I used WordPad. Don’t modify it, you can correct my spelling errors, I used WordPad.
Unless the names are legally required to be blotted out, then fine. Unless the names are required legally to be blotted out, then fine. Thanks. Thanks.
Maybe all this will shed insight on why some people just can not make things happen in their life, which can potentially benefit others.
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Subcomandante Dave
I agree.
Someone in the Middle Ages (Mann maybe?) said that “Prostitution is like Sewers in the city. Society doesn’t function well without either.” (I’m paraphrasing a little)
Many feminists are in fact in favor of prostitution. So much so they would prefer all sex be of the paid for variety. I think that is the philosophy underlying the child support and alimony system.
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“Rum
Hansen
The weird thing about the catholic priestly mindset of “celibacy” is that the main concern seemed to be about the need to avoid healthy sexuality with adult, enthusiastic women. Terrified little boys apparently were not so problematic.”
Rum, the statistics prove otherwise. The rates of sexual molestation amongst the catholic clergy is lower in comparison to other areas of society where children are handled.
There is a very strong meme in society against any kind of real celibacy, and the catholic clergy are of course a source of cognitive dissonance wich makes any crime amongst their kind a natural target of media coverage. Women are often very agitated against the idea of sexual transformation in a man.
That said, somwhere in the sixties the clergy changed some doctrines, among one they abandoned the idea of no-stimulation, a bad idea for anyone adhering to celibacy.
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Rome82:
I am calling him a hero for being a symbol for the consequences of denying men sex, not for killing those women. Obviously they didn’t personally deserve it. But something like this has to happen, perhaps hundreds of times over again, before feminists get the message. As Bhetti observed, it can easily go the other way and create more anti-male sentiment instead. There probably won’t be much sympathy, but maybe fear. From reading his blog it is so clear-cut that celibacy was the problem. (No wonder it has been taken down.) And even fear of the “nice guy” is an improvement. Fear can cause social change even if sexually frustrated men always will be met with the attitude that they don’t deserve to get laid and are basically human garbage as Bhetti believes.
I know the feminist media will try to emphasize his other issues and downplay the sexual frustration. Even so, his other issues mostly seem to result from an absent father (who was just a “sperm donor” in his words), and that is not supposed to be a problem according to the feminists either. So either way this is good press for the MRA movement.
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Ghost of Nicole.
Women will never get this. “Respect” of any kind means less than nothing if your fate is to stand to the side while watching other men fuck attractive women.
I stand by my comment to Bhetti. The problem is not that some men will never get laid, the problem is that those men are in the same small room as the men and women who are getting laid.
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@Hansen:
“Wether chosen or not, the way to deal with the situation is the same. The path of the celibate man is one that yhas been walked for eons.
So if you are non-eligible, you have to deal with the frustration. Either you learn game and deal with your frustration that way, or you learn transmutation.
Being in unvoluntary singlehood and saturating ones neural pathways with pornography will only reinforce the reasons one is single in the first way, and will also remove any fruitfull spiritual gains from singlehood.”
I hear you. As has been stated numerous times before (by Roissy and others) that porn and prostitutes is not the same as sex from a woman who loves you.
If I butchered that meaning guys, feel free to shout at me.
And I know this doesn’t have to do with game, but does anyone else worry about the impact this incident might have on our freedom of speech through the internet? I know of similar cases in which free speech was almost restricted on the internet (a University student wrote a graphic story about killing a girl in one of his classes and published it online; another one involved a website in which a man gave advice on how to pick up girls ages 10 and under for pedophiles) but they were overridden because the perpetrator actually didn’t commit any of these crimes.
Now that this man is admitting to all this on a blog and actually carrying through with it, I wonder if things are going to be taken more seriously.
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Rome82,
As I said above, I’ve yet to actually read the reportage on Sodini himself, so his alleged remarks about Black Men is news to me. Still, in a way its kinda irrelevant, just like when Harris & Klebold talked about getting back at the Black atheletes at Colombine. The issue ain’t Black folks here, its what happens when Men are seperated for long periods of time away from Women emotionally, socially and sexually. Whiskey is right in many ways-get ready for Lord of The Flies Reloaded.
O
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If Madras ran a site like ours, he would understand the magnitude of the problem with a quick look at our email inboxes.
A very large percentage of guys have trouble getting laid consistently.
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No surprise, I disagree with Bhetti and Roissy.
I think every man DOES deserve to get laid.
For every nerdy, smelly, fat, or otherwise socially undesirable man out there, there is an equally unattractive woman walking around. (more than one actually because there are more women than men on the planet)
The problem is, our feminized society has given every woman the power to hold out for higher quality men than they deserve.
This creates an imbalance that leads to tragedies like the one in PA.
For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. (Newton’s 3rd Law)
If empowered women keep applying pressure, they will create an explosion.
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Bhetti: Then yes, his genes should not have been passed on. Sexual selection was working.
The scary thing is that this guy’s genes WERE passed on, if his miscellaneous note about Lee Ann is to be believed.
It sounds like he may have had the raw materials to be “normal” though, so it’s not as if his spawn is destined to follow in his footsteps.
Boys need to be taught how to become men though, and it looks like this guy never found a teacher, and never really learned. (Who knows though, we’re only privy to his side of things. Maybe his father, brother, and acquaintances would paint a very different picture).
But a larger point – that males need to learn how to become men, is something lost on our society. Males are often ignored and/or demonized in the effort to prop up the self-esteem of women.
Not every male will “figure it out for himself” without any help, sadly.
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“Then yes, his genes should not have been passed on.
Sexual selection was working.”
Not according to the guy’s screed: he mentions at the bottom that some woman had his baby.
A-Bax makes some good points above.
More generally: sure, prolonged celibacy and loneliness can’t be good for someone’s self-esteem or mental health, but my guess is that this guy’s other issues caused the prolonged celibacy in the first place.
Ultimately, this guy was an evil loser who refused to take responsibility for his own life and happiness. It’s too bad he had a shitty upbringing and hated his parents and brother, but it’s a big country, and he could have started fresh in another city. His whining about his mother reminds me of an anecdote Wayne Dyer mentioned in his recent PBS special about how patients used to do that when he was working as a psychologist in New York. He’d say something like, “What’s your mother’s number? Maybe I should be treating her.”
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“Import ten, twenty million nubile, lithe, young women to America ”
Aye Aye! That’s something I can get behind.
Game is a service to women. The ‘affected’ asshole will not beat, abuse, stalk women like some real assholes would. Roissy et al are not assholes.
They say a few cheeky words, lie a little, turn the woman on, and bang her on their own terms. Nothing malicious or criminal about that.
“I went to a really nerdy college. Everyone was fuking like rabbits. ”
Bullshit. At college, 80% of college students had 0 or 1 partner within the past year of being surveyed. 20% of college kids are virgins. 59 percent of students reported having no sexual activity within the past 30 days.
Everyone thinks there’s much more sex going on at college than there actually is, college students included. For a few girls and guys in a few circles yes, otherwise no. Source: http://www.goaskalice.columbia.edu/2095.html
With numbers like that, if men didn’t differ in attractiveness, their college notch count would be in the low single digits. Of course they aren’t, so you have a few casanovas, and plenty of involuntary celibates.
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@Hansen:
I can’t find any Church specific statistics as of yet. I wouldn’t be surprised if the numbers are lower, though; I wouldn’t just attribute it to women hating men for not needing them sexually. I would attribute it to the media hating hypocrisy. People of faith are held to higher standards than “normal people,” which is a bit ridiculous because all humans are humans and all humans are inherently sinful.
Although try telling that truth to a mother whose son had been molested by a Catholic priest.
@A.J. Travis:
So are you saying that each person has his/her match out there? More or less like The One, except maybe not that specific?
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Hansen
Yes indeed there was change in attitude during the 60s. And the thing that did not change was the attitude that the worst situation for a celibate was normal, consensual heterosexual activity. Anything else, like with little boys, was not so stigmatized. That itself is very fucked up, imho, and is a major reason the church reacted as slowly as it did to the emerging revelations.
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Ghost of Nicole-
Bullshit. Every man knows they have to EARN respect.
They DESERVE to get laid.
A decent looking man who earns a good living and does not abuse women DESERVES to get laid. Period.
The fact that so many do not, is a crime.
And in a just society, all crimes are eventually punished.
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I think it is a mistake to say that game-awareness has little benefit to most guys. It all depends, doesn’t it, on what they have been programmed to think beforehand.
Just throwing over-board a lot of stupid and wrong ideas about womens nature cannot but be good for any guy. And a lot of middle class white guys have been massively lied to their whole lives.
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Rum: What’s the only way to explain to an angry man with a gun that he’s not supposed to reproduce? You shoot him first.
Arpagus: Tried to make it quite clear here that I don’t believe betas are garbage:
Speaking of this, can somebody please help Mr. Virgin@40?
Lucifer: It’s not a belief, it’s a fact. Not all people are meant to or should reproduce. And yes, roissy: should I have to state this? This applies to women as well.
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I know a few men that have been celibate for going on ten years.
Some are good men, but they have zero game.
They are so dejected, so morose so angry at the opposite sex- that they have given up.
I try to teach them game- try to steer them in the right path- but they may be too far gone.
There may be some hope for one man- he just finished reading “the game” he is intrigued. I offered to sarge with him, so far he hasn’t taken me up on my offer.
Multiple generations of young men have been lied to since childhood.
They don’t know how to romance or seduce women.
Because of feminism, sexual harassment, political correctness, and the MSM, men have become neutered and sterile.
If they ask women for advice on dating- women straight-out lie to them.
Women almost universally make fun of or belittle game.
Don’t discount any of this as major hurdles that many cannot get past.
Even if men stumble upon game- they may not believe what they are reading- they may refuse to believe it.
For lack of a better term:
I was indoctrinated with false information, and as I read “the game” and other PUA material I still couldn’t believe my eyes.
How is one to learn and accept that everything they have been told has been a lie?
How does one take that tidbit? Anger- certainly, but then what?
As an aside:
Have you guys noticed a trend in fat women? Some of the ones I have spoken to actually believe they can get alpha cock. They don’t want to hook up with beta men either. This is a troubling development.
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“Arpagus said
From reading his blog it is so clear-cut that celibacy was the problem. (No wonder it has been taken down.)”
He was not celibate. To qoute directly from his blogg
“She was a long haired, hot little hottie with a beautiful bod. I masturbate. Frequently. ”
It’s sad that celibacy has become synonymous with a sex obsessed guy that have a hard time “getting any”. The guy was single, but he was not celibate in any form of the traditional meaning. Celibacy does not mean obsessing about sex. He could have walked a diffeent path if someone had told him about the value of directing all that frustration into works. Instead he fueled his own frustration even further.
I think the PUA movement is paradigm shift in that it clearly exposes the truth about how the female mind works. But he could also have gained from some ancient views on how the deal with the endless barrage of the senses. The idea of restraining the impulse and transmuting same impulse has been lost in todays world, and yet this was a very common idea in older times.
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Not sure if anyone else has already done it, but I nominate him Beta of the Year, posthumous.
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Arpagus, A.J., Nicole:
The issue of entitlement in the sexual marketplace is interesting here.
Arpagus, you write of the shooter as a heroic symbol of “consequences of denying men sex” and A.J. writes that every man no matter how fat, smelly etc. deserves to get laid.
I think Nicole’s on the money about entitlement: the world doesn’t owe you a thing. Isn’t that what Roissy’s blog is about–applying yourself to better learn how to take what you want and not sitting back and excuse-mongering, like this loser shooter or like David Alexander?
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By definition celibacy is voluntary.
Not being able to get laid, after jumping through all the hoops women tell you to jump through, is NOT celibacy.
It is forced sexual slavery.
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Why does he wait until the very end of the diary before mentioning that he has a child?
Peter
[editor: because he secretly feared it was not his child.]
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Bhetti-
“Speaking of this, can somebody please help Mr. Virgin@40?”
Yeah, YOU can give him some.
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O,
I agree the real issue isn’t black folks, but this provides some interesting perspective on the common mindset of scapegoating black masculinity. Sheer beta outlook. Maybe the coming race war will be one and the same with the “beta revolution,” ha ha…
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Ok..did I read that right and this guy also didn’t drink for 20 years until recently?
Imagine that!? Sex and drinking often go togehter!?!?!
Reason number 999,999 to always get a fucking drink (or 10…going to a heavy drinking place compared to a “suave cocktail lounge”) on a date you think you can f-close on the first night.
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Hansen
Monasticism in its many forms can have its place, imho, but offering it as a solution for involuntary sexual frustration seems a lot less practical in the real world than just explaing to guys how to avoid frustration in the first place. More betas can get laid thereby than frustated men can find contentment in celibacy.
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My point above being, I bet this guy is the type who would take a girl on a date to get coffee or to an art museum or on a nature hike. And then wonder we he doesnt get any.
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@ Hansen: methinks you’re hair-splitting a bit much with the scholastic distinction between “celibacy” and “never-gets-laid”.
So fine, we can avoid referring to him as “celibate” since he clearly wanted sex and companionship. “Involuntary sexlessness” is a bit clunky as a term, but I think that’s what Arpagus was getting at. And it was clearly among the root causes, if not the root cause, of Sodini’s homicidal behavior.
It’s all well & good to advocate ancient views of sensory minimization to deal with sexual frustration, but until we get back to ancient taboos on rampant female sluttiness, guys like Sodini are going to be inundated with the sort of hyper-sexual imagery, tits-&-ass flaunting, and unrepentant slatternly behavior that would make the most stoic of the ancients blood boil.
That’s all.
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Bhetti,
If someone said that killing all arabs is a good idea, would you feel the same? Trust me, it is very easy to drum up support for that idea.
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“Rum said
Hansen
Yes indeed there was change in attitude during the 60s. And the thing that did not change was the attitude that the worst situation for a celibate was normal, consensual heterosexual activity. Anything else, like with little boys, was not so stigmatized. That itself is very fucked up, imho, and is a major reason the church reacted as slowly as it did to the emerging revelations.”
Nonsense. The sin of child molestation was not debated for the same reason that the sin of murder was not debated. What was debated a principle in the path of the celibate clergy, as they abandoned an important principle of transmutation, that of no-stimulation.
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Abax, Bhetti, Mandy, Nicole, etc et al,
Over on another thread I was telling Lovely Sexy Beauty that Game is an inherently MALE thing, that the idea of “Girl Game” is a misnomer. Why? Because of the inherent differences between Men and Women.
This is why Women cannot be helpful to Men along these lines in the main, because their life experience is so fundamentally different. Girls become Women automatically, upon the first sighting of their period. From then on, very little is needed for them to get suitors. As we all know, Men do the gruntwork in the realworld, AND in the bedroom.
By contrast, Manhood is a SKILL, NOT something that just “happens TO you”. Boys have to be taught how to be Men, and this is something Women simply cannot wrap their heads around.
What was said earlier about the dreadfully painful time boys have in highschool and even college is oh so true. And for every Woman who tries to argue that girls go through the same pain, they are seriously deluded and w/all due respect they really need to shut the fuck up. It is NOT the same, because unless girlfriend is looking like Creature from the Black Lagoon, she can get laid. The average guy, can’t.
It is for this reason that the AVERAGE Woman walking around simply cannot be of any real help to Men in these areas, because they at almost any time, can get laid if they want it. Not so for the vast majority of Men. Understand this, Ladies reading along, and please pass it on to your friends:
MOST MEN DO NOT GET LAID.
By that I mean:
1. W/a Woman who is at least a 5 and up on the attractiveness scale
2. At least once a month
That’s right. I’m saying to you, that at any given time in any given locale, most of the guys you see aren’t getting their dick wet at least once a week w/an average looking gal or above. That’s a measley what, 48 times a year? Less than 50? But wait, it gets better:
You’d be surprised by just how many Men don’t even get laid a dozen times a year.
That’s right. Once a month. Don’t believe me? Try doing what Norah Vincent did. Look her up, her story, which eventually became a book, is easily accessible online.
Like Roissy said, most Men simply cannot openly speak on these things, and as The Urban Scientist says over at Psychology Today, there are real evolutionary reasons for this, as well as for not “bitching” in general. Call it what you will, but simply put, its unmanly to openly admit that not only don’t you get laid, BUT THAT YOU CAN’T. Checkout what Style has to say about this in The Game in the very beginning when he first meets Mystery and he and Sin ask for his “number”. Its some of thee most poignant writing I have ever come accross, because virtually every Man here knows exactly what the fuck Style’s talking about. And it hurts.
I gotta give the devil his due here-I agree w/Roissy, Whiskey is onto something here. The vast majority of Women simply do not understand how volatile, dangerous and downright violent this thing can be here. Men KILL over pussy. Wars have been started over it, big and small. And Women aint exempt from the bloodletting. Indeed, if anything they are increasingly being targeted, as the targets.
Literally.
We can go ahead and try to palm this off as yet another headcase who went off the deepend, but I’m not so glib on that score-afterall, only the deluded thinks that they can’t be driven over the edge. Errbody’s got their buttons. All you have to do is give em a little push.
The Obsidian
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I just want to clarify that the main benefit of importing ten, twenty million nubile, lithe, young women to America and legalizing prostitution is not so much the safe, affordable blow jobs – although that would be sweet – but rather the dramatic decline in the power women currently hold over men and resulting lowering of bitch shields. As Roissy says in the comments, paid sex is not an acceptable long term substitute for the real thing, but legalized whoredom is a means for more men to get the real thing without having to put up with so much BS.
It’s a question of supply and demand, and of making them compete. Part of the reason American women are a tad bitchy is that there is a lineup of about 3 billion men waiting to get into America, mostly for teh sex but also for green cards, and they know it. If you aren’t willing to put up with a woman’s crap there are three billion other guys who are. That matters. That manifests itself. And then there are the illegal immigrants, most of whom are working age men, that matters too.
The balance of power is skewed to begin with in the best of times but adding immigration to the equation increases it by orders of magnitude. Outside of America, which has a relatively low (legal) immigration rate it’s a big problem, most of the immigrants are working age men, the female immigrants tend to be grannies that the men bring over later. I’m hearing that it’s a big problem in the Netherlands, and having met more women from the UK than I would’ve liked to I imagine it is a big problem there too.
The best part is if prostitution is legalized and normalized we can say that there aren’t enough “sex trade workers” to fill the demand – there never will be – so whore house employers can justifiably demand millions of visas for nubile, lithe, young women from abroad to satisfy the demand for their perfectly legitimate business, sort of like how America uses H1-Bs and TN visas to satisfy the demand for computer programmers, which not coincidentally was Rodini’s profession.
If your average bitch shield brandishing bilious harridan had to compete with millions of nubile, lithe, young female immigrants you would see a dramatic improvement in the attitudes of women. Women aren’t stupid, though, and they’ll oppose any measure to legalize prostitution, even the staunches feminist and dykes – there’s no solidarity like The Sisterhood.
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sad, tragic, pathetic, unnecessary.
nicole beat me to it, to the first thing that leapt out at me: he hated/feared his mother, had no father, and had bad relations with his brother (but, curiously, not the sister).
failure with women, like failure in other areas of life, can damage, stunt, and frustrate a man. but *truly* broken and dysfunctional personalities are usually traceable to a bad childhood, to the absence of unconditional love or positive role models from the parents.
would game have fixed a guy like this? he was decent-looking, decent-earning, well edcuated and intelligent. but roissy said it right: he had a twisted or broken spirit, and so may have been beyond repair even if mystery himself winged for him every night.
also, women pick up instantly on the damage, the anger, the alienation of this kind of guy. they can smell it the way a shark smells blood, one molecule per cubic meter of water. (are you listening, arpagus?) and it’s scary and off-putting for them. really, who wants to date or sleep with a guy full of hate? so it’s a self-reinforcing cycle that guys without basic insights into female psychology have no way out of. (and on that, pace roissy, i’m with bhetti: there are some guys who don’t deserve to get laid, if they can’t make the basic mental and social adjustments necessary to do so. those adjustments are hard for some guys, but … so is losing weight for some girls. suck up and do it.)
also, i think the lord of the flies thing is overstated. you can’t build a model of future society based on a relative handful of damaged people who crack and go crazy. there may be a sizeable minority of clueless men (and undesirable women) who never get sex, but … it’s a minority, and most people grow out of their insecurities and into the ability to sustain some kind of relationship as they get more life experience and better rounded. the sodinis, chos, and klebolds, statistically, are meaningless outliers compared to the masses of men who *do not* behave like that, despite their psychosexual frustration.
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Bhetti
Yes indeed, shooting the heavily armed angry guy first is a good idea. But step back a little and see the bigger picture. In real life, on-the-brink people rarely wear a sign that allows you to know whom you should shoot next.
Also, this approach does nothing to treat the real problem.
The combination of widespread near public sex via the media and hook-up culture plus the barren reality of many mens experience is pretty toxic.
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Hansen,
You are speaking of voluntary celibacy. That is all good for those who choose it, but most of us don’t. Involuntary celibacy means not getting any against our will, and obsessing over it to the point of depression and violence is nature’s way of getting us to do something to improve our situation. Telling a loser (by his own standards; if you want celibacy, then I respect that, but don’t tell me it is good for me) that he should just accept his lot and kill his desire too is really bad advice. Depression is adaptive and should preferably be dealt with by addressing the cause, not the symptom as you are preaching.
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Rome82,
hope that you can repeat that same statement in the appropriate situation.
One of the reason that an alpha, beta, omega concept does not work well in human civilization is that once technology has gone past a certain point, anyone can kill anybody.
Remember the saying about how samuel colt made all men equal? and now you can do far worse without firing a single shot.
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In most systems it makes sense for these people not to reproduce. Now that we have protection and so on, I guess the perspective is different. As well as the reduced impetus for taking advantage of a provider type.
It is a crime — really unbelievable — but violent outbursts isn’t a solution. ‘Justice’ maybe (although it’s very difficult to determine who’s The Enemy when there’re a lot of complicated factors i.e. The System that’s to blame), but not a solution.
I don’t think this particular battle is one that can be fought with guns.
AJ Travis: Heh. Point. Am not free to and I’m not that type. Too costly for me in several ways. The most blatant being honour killings and all. I have actually tried with betas and have not made it work. Though if you think women should give it to whoever looks like they need it**, then I suppose you’ve decided to leave LILGRL alone?
Getting laid will help with the obsession with The Ten, right? I hope so.
** charitable organisation providing free Prostitutes to Those In Need run by Lucifer is what I’m thinking. Call it The Sodini Foundation.
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“Rum
Hansen
Monasticism in its many forms can have its place, imho, but offering it as a solution for involuntary sexual frustration seems a lot less practical in the real world than just explaing to guys how to avoid frustration in the first place. More betas can get laid thereby than frustated men can find contentment in celibacy.”
I dont think its about all the going monastic.
Rum, I am not a clergy and I hold no idea as to holyness in regards to my own interest towards asceticism. So I agree with you that “game” may indeed be a good thing to learn.
That said I wish there where at least an awareness in todays world about the ascetic path, I say the betas should try that path too, if even just for a few weeks.
For me it has proved a rich source of inspiration, but hte sad thing is that its actively shunned in todays zeitgeist.
The idea of the ascetic being a hypocrite is one example that is constantly reinforced, but take one lonely guy away from his internet porn and have him meditate upon the ways of the warrior instead, and watch him start to glow instead of boil.
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Hansen
Maybe I was not paying attention when Church Authorities reacted to pederast Priests the same as if they were murderers. Or maybe, since I am not RC, I am unaware that Priests who commit murder are routinely shuffled to new parishes without a word being said to anybody.
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“Then yes, his genes should not have been passed on.
Sexual selection was working.”
By this criteria, natural selection worked on his victims because they weren’t bulletproof.
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Here’s a diary entry from May 7 that just might offer a clue:
Went to the gym and did mostly cardio. My heart rate was 117 just from walking on the treadmill at 3.4. This should be done a few times a week for maybe 15 mins or so to keep the heart active. I sprinted a few times to push the limits.
Unless the treadmill was at a very high incline, there’s no way that a trim, fit man’s heart rate should be anything close to 117 just from walking at a not-very-fast pace. Could he have been on some sort of psychiatric medications that boosted his heart rate?
Peter
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Rum says, “Women will never get this. “Respect” of any kind means less than nothing if your fate is to stand to the side while watching other men fuck attractive women.
I stand by my comment to Bhetti. The problem is not that some men will never get laid, the problem is that those men are in the same small room as the men and women who are getting laid.”
The fate of a person who respect themselves is not to stand to the side while watching other men fuck attractive women.
The fate of a person who respects themselves is to live their life, and along the way, only fuck people who respect them regardless of how attractive they may be to other people.
A person who respects themselves is not lowering their standards to the masses. The desires of the general public are a fascinating anthropological note with little relevance aside of how best to profit from, lead, or exploit them outright.
So it really does start from within. You can torture yourself about the facts of life, or you can accept them and learn to thrive within them. From there, you can demand respect from others, and if they don’t give it to you, you can kill them in your mind instead of needing to kill them physically.
Some guys here don’t like to hear this because it’s against the internalized beta mentality…they just don’t get it and never will, but for a man who respects himself, it doesn’t matter if a woman is a 10 if she doesn’t respect him. He’d rather be with a woman he only considers minimally physically attractive who respects him than a woman he considers physically “perfect” who doesn’t.
It just happens that guys with self respect are more attractive to generally considered physically attractive women, because they’re the guys who won’t take crap from a woman no matter how she looks. They’re less pussies than guys who are following the herd standard even if it’s leading them off a social and sexual cliff.
Western society’s skirting the edges, and this guy, Sodini, fell off and took a few women with him.
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Maurice,
W/all due respect the very existence of the PUA community-which is GLOBAL in scope and revenues-stands in stark contradiction to what you’ve just said. We simply refuse to accept just how much of a powderkeg this thing is. As Dana mentioned in the other thread, Falling Down aint just a movie, and happens a lot more than we’re willing to admit.
O
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A.J. :
We are indeed talking about “the world” and how it works. You say, a man deserves the drink if he walks into a Starbucks with his $5.
But there are always conditions. If that man walks into the Starbucks with no shirt and no shoes, or tries to pay in foreign currency, for example, he will not be served his latte. No matter how badly he wants it, or thinks he deserves it.
But there he is, still waving that money around, saying he’s got the money and that’s all that should matter.
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“Rum
Hansen
Maybe I was not paying attention when Church Authorities reacted to pederast Priests the same as if they were murderers. Or maybe, since I am not RC, I am unaware that Priests who commit murder are routinely shuffled to new parishes without a word being said to anybody.”
The RC are probably guilty of alot more than pedophilia given its status as a global organisation. And if they have pedophiles in their midsts I would not be surprised if they have (co-operating) murderers there too. But neither sin is a result of celibacy.
The point I was originaly trying to make was that pedophilia was not discussed for the same reason murder was not discussed. Since they are both terminal sins.
And I am no I am not a catholic either.
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A.J. Travis says, “A decent looking man who earns a good living and does not abuse women DESERVES to get laid. Period.”
A decent looking man who earns a good living and does not abuse women, who REJECTS the women who would shag him, does not deserve to get laid.
I can appreciate the resolve it takes for a guy to hold out for the unicorn, but like many spinsters of days gone by had to accept about waiting for the perfect love with the perfect man learned, men must learn that not all gamblers win all the time.
If you hold out exclusively for the 10 with a heart of gold, you may never get her.
Hell, nowadays, holding out for a 7 with a heart of gold is a gamble.
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There seems to be an opinion here that more and more men will become angry / dejected because they aren’t getting laid, and outbursts like this are symptomatic of a lack of respect/sexual attention from women.
In that case, it seems that women are being blamed (in part, not wholly) for this.
For accepting favors, for not putting out, for whatever it is that lowers the male confidence.
So, what are women expected to do? What would be considered acceptable female behavior to ameliorate these issues?
I have always been taught that when a man approaches and you’re not interested, you should still be nice, smile, even talk to him. The worst thing to do to a man, I’ve been told by other guys and more experienced women, is to ignore him.
It’s a valuable lesson all women need to learn.
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@Nicole- agreed. There had to be a good deal of women who would have dated this man. Just not the types he thought were worthy.
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Nicole
No guy really wants a fat chick. Deal with it.
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Someone could also say “No woman really wants a beta. Deal with it.”
That’s the problem.
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Every woman who posts here should read what Obsidian wrote very carefully.
It is the absolute truth. Eloquently stated.
A few years ago, a female friend of mine and I decided to try and experiment.
We are both about the same level of attractiveness to the opposite sex, and both above average. (Higher than a 5)
We agreed to keep track of how many members of the opposite sex flirted with us in the course of a day.
She tallied over 100 in a day. I had 5. And they only reason I had 5 was because I initiated them. She never had to initiate anything.
But as disheartening as this was, I found out something even worse.
If I was not at work, and I didn’t initiate: I could go through an entire day, and not only would no woman flirt with me, but no woman would even ACKNOWLEDGE me.
And neither would any man.
In fact, outside of the office, I could go for days without ANYONE speaking to me.
And then I noticed that I wasn’t alone. Everywhere I looked, there was some nice, harmless looking guy, being ignored by the entire world.
It is impossible to experience something like that and not doubt your worth as a human being.
I defy any woman who is a 5 or above to get through any day (if you are not locked inside your house) where NOBODY says a word to you.
It won’t happen.
Therefore, no normal woman will EVER know the loneliness inherent with being a man.
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“Arpagus said
Depression is adaptive and should preferably be dealt with by addressing the cause, not the symptom as you are preaching.”
But in alot of cases the symptom and the cause are entwined. Are the fat girl fat becuase she eats too much or does she eat too much because she’s fat?
Depression and desperation are two things that certainly will hold the girls off. One should controll those by first becoming self reliant and see value in oneself based on something other than the number of scoremarks on the bedpost
From an evolutionary perspective, most animals are not constantly in a state of sexual desperation, I dont think this is the natural state for humans either.
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That’s a silly statement. It is a fact that some Arabs should die and “deserve” death at this moment in time.
When did I say all men should not get laid?
Hear, hear. Thought it was difficult anyway, with a man needing sex.
Hear, hear. I don’t feel strongly on this, actually. Would like to see decent provider types providing and a more conservative climate that allows this. I’ve been trying to get across that while this guy seems irretrievably damaged, there’re others who aren’t that should not be living a sex-free life.
Certainly not all men are attractive enough for sex, or put enough effort to warrant it.
Why should one of life’s greatest pleasures and needs be easy?
Does food — essential for life — come without effort? It’s not supposed to. It’s only thanks to modern society that we have relatively easy access to it.
While you can argue sex is a human right, so is being able to choose who you have it with.
Natural selection also works via death. More like reflexes, responses to bleeding. More an element of wrong place at wrong time: random chance.
It wasn’t random chance that he was rejected over and over, so natural selection worked ‘better’ for him.
Do you have a point? Specifically about what that pertained to, which is that ‘looks like rejecting him was a good idea in this instance, looking at how he turned out!’
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lol… why does it have to be about men wanting a fat chick or not? there are men who like large women.
and there are women who genuinely like betas.
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Your giving serious consideration to the writings of a madman? When he says he was “nice” that’s what other people thought, too? Because his version of events is going to be accurate, right? He’s really the best judge of those situations, the guy who went on a crazy killing spree? Your assumption that women rejected him and that made him go mad is backwards. Obviously women rejected him because he was batshit crazy. I love how you’ve used two facts about him to establish how perfectly “normal” and representative of the average man he is and how those things should have gotten him laid, “a good job” and “not ugly” as if that’s all it should take. There was obviously something very wrong with this person that made him very undesirable to women, possibly because he was the sort of man who would plot to kill random women for over a year and never once question whether that was wrong and that maybe he shouldn’t do that. Saying you’ve “chickened out” isn’t experiencing a moral delimma. Does this sound like the sort of person who could have normal responses during a conversation with a woman? Does he mention having any female friends? Does he mention having friends at all? I haven’t read the diary, but I strongly suspect the answer is “no”. What does that say about how much people enjoy his company or how good he is with other human beings in general? This was a sick man, and you’re justifying his actions by explaining it the way you have.
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“Are the fat girl fat becuase she eats too much or does she eat too much because she’s fat?”
mind = blown
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It’s hard to diagnose what this dude’s issues were in regards to his not being able to get laid. He could have had a personality disorder, been depressed or simply had impossibly high standards. I don’t believe its the latter simply because a man will lower standards for pussy (if what I read here is correct), not for an ltr but certainly for sex alone. Twenty years is not just a celibacy streak its a freak of nature for a man of his age and appearance. There are factors at work here we don’t know of in my opinion. Game will work for men of average intelligence (and up), for the attractive/unattractive and for the committed. I’m not sure it would work for a disturbed individual. Just sayin…
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Rome82:
Fuck off.
I disprove your bullshit argument, and just like any other intellectually dishonest person, you try and change the conditions of the test, to suit your desired outcome.
You’re wrong, you know it, and you’re a fucking pussy.
Deal.
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Dreamer,
The plain, ugly truth is, that Women are now, have always been, and will continue to be for the forseeable future, the gatekeepers of sex. They determine, by and large and barring largescale rape, who gets lucky…and who doesn’t.
And because of the loosening of cultural and social mores that has taken place over roughly the past 4 decades, Women have a freer hand to really go buckwild w/their sexual wants and desires, w/little if any repurcussions. Well, as we’ve been seeing over the past decade, it may be time to pay the piper.
The problem in all this is that, as always is the case, girls tend to mature faster than boys; they’re usually the last one to get the memo. So, since so many of them have been ingrained w/being a nice, chivalrous guy when in fact that usually puts Women off, this creates a great deal of bitterness in guys. Not good.
If Women want different outcomes, they have to send out different signals: stop rewarding jerks and playas. Start rewarding nice and chivalrous guys. Learn to settle for the things that aren’t sexy, but are better in the longrun. Guys only react to the signals Women put out; if Women want better Men, they need to be better Women.
It’s really as simple as that.
Until then though-Yippee Kiyay MFer…
O
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Bhetti–
Yes. That’s exactly right. Both sides of what you said.
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Obsidian
I would sign my name to your comment.
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Ghost of Nicole-
“nowadays, holding out for a 7 with a heart of gold is a gamble.”
A man who is a 5 should be able to have sex with a woman who is a 5. A man who is a 7 should be able to get a 7, etc.
The numbers should equate, with a slight edge to men because of the numerical imbalance.
But they don’t.
Women who are 5’s, bang men who are 7’s because they have been ’empowered’ to do so by our feminized culture.
And even if those 5 women ‘limit’ themselves and lose some opportunities to get laid (with 1-6’s), they will still close escrow much more than a guy who is a 5, and working his ass off to get laid with a female 5.
That’s an unjust system, even though you as a woman benefit from it.
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“Some guys here don’t like to hear this because it’s against the internalized beta mentality…they just don’t get it and never will, but for a man who respects himself, it doesn’t matter if a woman is a 10 if she doesn’t respect him. He’d rather be with a woman he only considers minimally physically attractive who respects him than a woman he considers physically “perfect” who doesn’t.
It just happens that guys with self respect are more attractive to generally considered physically attractive women, because they’re the guys who won’t take crap from a woman no matter how she looks. They’re less pussies than guys who are following the herd standard even if it’s leading them off a social and sexual cliff.”
Ghost of Nicole makes a good point, and it’s really not that far off from a point Roissy himself made in a recent post (the one with the photo of the four girls and their male friend), when he smacked down as basement dwellers (or whatever the phrase was) guys who claimed those girls were unattractive.
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Dreamer-
“There had to be a good deal of women who would have dated this man.”
Just because you want this to be true, doesn’t mean it is.
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I wonder if there were any illegal aliens in his area? While most Mexican women are not that attractive,a good many really are,and some of the younger ones are beautiful. And theyre good to go! Too bad for this idiot!
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Roissy-
“Women (like LR and others) enjoy love, affection, and devotion of men and then reneg on the sex.
[editor: a man who falls for the ol’ bait and switch routine has himself to blame as much as the cocktease he tried to ply with favors.]”
That would only be true if everyone acknowledged that what those women are doing is wrong.
But outside the people who read blogs like this one, and have had their eyes opened, that kind of behavior from a woman would get the response:
“Well… Just because he cooks and cleans and pays her bills, doesn’t mean he DESERVES sex. She’s not a prostitute!”
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A.J.-
I hear a lot of angry hot beta-air but nothing logical in your response.
Didn’t like the way I used your own metaphor against your false premise?
Let me clarify this for you. You think a man deserves to get laid because he brings to the table the basic currency for what he wants in return.
Fine. But who does that man have to blame if he refuses to recognize all the conditions that go into that exchange? Or if he refuses to hear when he’s being told that he’s bringing the wrong currency?
Roissy’s right–if you are strung along by some gold digger who withholds sex, you’ve yourself to blame, as much as if you’re pay a bill every month for cable service when the cable doesn’t work.
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Come on, you don’t think he could have banged a 4 or a 5 or a fattie? He was low-status, surely he could have banged a low-status chick himself.
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I’ve been meaning to send this in for some time now.
This seems appropriate time.
At 50 I go through dry-spells of betwen 5 and 10 years.
I trace all this back to a number of catastrophic sexual rejections in my teens.
At 17 I persuaded a hot looking blonde 16 years old on a date. I could hardly believe my luck and as we were on a riverside walk we met a tall, good looking school mate of mine coming the other way. He was taken aback with the sight of me with this girl and though she rather too eagerly entered into conversation with him, he took my surrepticious hint to go on his way.
After a lengthy making out session the girl announced she had to return to her hotel for a cardigan. She never returned and I consoled myself with the thoght that perhaps her parents had grounded her.
Early next day the police are pounding on the door of my mothers house looking for me. The girl never returned. The parents are hysterical. I was the last person to see her.
Pulling me out of bed into the back of the police car I’ll never forget the look on Ma’s face or the ride to the station or the questioning session or the formation of a search party. I was in tears when the girls parents called the police. Turned out the girl had ran after my schoolmate and spent the night with him.
The public shame of exactly what happened together with the sight of the happy couple arm in arm for the rest of the summer was a confidence shattering experience for me.
Two years later I was amazed when a pretty girl I knew agreed to go to a party with me. It would be full of sporting types. I was discomfited on the wayto discover she vaguely knew some of the more alpha pro football types there by reputation.
It was already very drunken and boisterous when we got there and there peoply hanging from the bannisters and lining the hallway.
On entering a huge sports gorilla made his way over and scooped up my girl and embarked on a prolonged French kiss which brought the house down and had everyone except me laughing hysterically.
As the seconds passed and the kiss continued it became clear that the gorilla’s enthusiasm was more than reciprocated.
As the laughter began to die down everyone began to notice me. My face turned scarlet as it became obvious the girl was taking the lead.
A merciful schoolfriend signalled for me to follow him on through the house and into the kitchen where he unlocked the back door and let me out as discreetly as he could. I never saw any of those people again.
Those were easily two of the three most formative events of my life. I had a good media career with status, property and money but it all disappeared as my social problems with women became too difficult to ignore in my advancing years.
I was astonished by Sodini’s diary. I felt I could have written it myself.
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As many of you know, recently I’ve been really been studying the hit HBO drama The Wire. Its been hailed by virtually every tv and film critic as one of if not the best series ever to hit television, for is gritty storytelling and deep exploration of sociological themes.
In Season 3 or 4, I don’t recall exactly, Lex, a youngbuck drug runner working for Bodie, kills Fruit, a young drug runner working for the new kingpin in town, Marlo Stanfield. Lex is livid that Fruit has been seen about town w/Lex’s baby mama.
One night on the way out of a party and hugged up w/said baby mama, Fruit’s head is blown off, one shot to the dome by Lex. W/his face spattered w/blood, and his baby mama screaming in shock and horror, Lex greets her.
This is a scenario that happens quite a bit in the hood, and please do not get it twisted, it can happen out in the boonies as well. If Sodini and Cho’s cases are any indication, its the wave of the future.
Just a thought. You really should checkout The Wire when you get a chance.
O
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To all those of you who keep saying,”Sodini couldnt find a woman because he was obviously a nut,” I have a few questions.
If he was such a nut,why did it take 48 years for his nuttiness to finally burst out?Wouldnt a bonafide nut go berserk well before?It makes more sense to say Sodini was driven nuts.The question then becomes;why,and by whom?
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Seems his mom fucked him up.
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Rum says, “No guy really wants a fat chick. Deal with it.”
I’m not male or a telepath, so I only have anecdotal evidence to the contrary.
…but that’s not my point. There are plenty of skinny women in the world who are decent. They’re just not available to, or dressed to to catch pump and dumpers.
Betas don’t notice them. They’re busy kvetching because the hoes aren’t merciful.
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Judging from this thread, seems like there’s a profound misunderstanding of Darwinism, evolution, selection, sexual selection, and related topics out there.
One of the dumb twats on here, I think it might be Bhetti, keeps revealing how confused she is about these issues, with a dumbed down, mistaken, pop evolution outlook on them.
There is no “best” in terms of evolutionary theory. There is no “deserve” or “should” or “should not” “pass on one’s genes”. There’s no teleology, there’s no goal. You’re imputing your narrow, goal oriented experience and psychology onto the complex process of evolution, which scientifically speaking has no goal, and no anthropomorphic conception of “good”, “better”, “best”, etc.
To put it simply, individual organisms are adaption-executors, not fitness-maximizers.
Read a fucking book, you dumb cunt.
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It is impossible to experience something like that and not doubt your worth as a human being.
Only if you have zero ability to parse out your own worth as existing independently of other people’s opinions.
I defy any woman who is a 5 or above to get through any day (if you are not locked inside your house) where NOBODY says a word to you.
It won’t happen.
It happens. Regularly. But you don’t see me holding mankind responsible for it, nor plotting to shoot up random strangers because waaah, interpersonal communication is haaaard! I was never led to expect anyone or anything to fall at my feet, so I don’t view it as a hardship.
This guy’s inability to interact on any meaningful level — with anyone, not just women — suggests that his problems were the cause, not the result, of his sex-drought.
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There are some pathetic ass men posting on this site. Feminism is responsible for your unhappiness? Nah, I think being a punk ass idiot is responsible for your unhappiness. I’ve never encountered such a group of entitled, pathetic whiners. God almighty. No wonder you aren’t getting laid.
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Obsidian,
I finished season 1 a couple nights ago. Amazing. One of the best seasons/series I’ve ever seen.
Are the subsequent seasons of The Wire of similar quality? Worth watching?
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Rome82-
“Didn’t like the way I used your own metaphor against your false premise?”
I know that’s what you think you did, but clearly you’re not that smart.
My premise was and is true. You did nothing to refute it.
Instead, you refuted a completely different premise than the one I gave. Hence the term ‘Straw Man.’
“Let me clarify this for you. You think a man deserves to get laid because he brings to the table the basic currency for what he wants in return.
Fine.”
Wow, you finally got around to understanding what I am saying. Congratulations for finally catching up.
Of course, everything else in your post was just you, once again, trying to save face for your initial stupidity.
You should have stopped after you typed ‘Fine.’
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One problem with the Travis formulation is that the terms of any deal must be negotiated in advance for it to have any force or meaning. Just asserting, ” I did this thing for you now so you owe me XXX” is a non-starter. It might work that way in prisons or in the mafia but not in saner precincts.
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Obsidian,
“if Women want better Men, they need to be better Women.”
So good it needs repeating.
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AJ,
Thanks for the kudos on my post, Man. No disrespect to any of the ladies here, but you’ll pardon me if I say that I am not holding my breath waiting for any of them to really get what I’ve said.
The simple, brutal, harsh, and bitter truth is, that most Women simply couldn’t care less that most guys are treated like Stop signs. Read Mystery Method-he says it all right there. Women go to clubs and bars all the time with the intention of getting as many free drinks and favors as possible w/o doing anything in return from guys, and think nothing of it-and worse, neither do any of her girlfriends. When this topic comes up in conversation w/Women, I often defy them to cite an instance where she took any of her friends to task for either doing that, or, for viciously shooting down a guy approaching her.
Would it surprise you to know that I’ve yet to get an affirmative answer? Only defensive barbs and rationalizations/justifications.
The harsh truth that so many people really have a hard time getting their head around, is that Women often act this way because they can-eggs expensive, sperm cheap. Its really that simple. Add to that a society that supports Women right or wrong, and leans on guys right or wrong, and viola!-you get ish like that which we’re discussing right now.
I’m generally a very optimistic guy, but I gotta level with ya: I don’t see any uprising among Women anytime soon about any of this, if anything I see the exact opposite, a push for even more laws and the like to attempt to contain the “problem”. Women gain from the way the game is rigged presently. Only the most disengenuous among us would attempt to spin it otherwise.
What can I say? I say the only real option, the only real “weapon”, the average American Male has, is GAME. Failing that, he’s just twisting in the wind.
Smh
O
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Ghost of Nicole-
” There are plenty of skinny women in the world who are decent. They’re just not available to, or dressed to to catch pump and dumpers.
Betas don’t notice them”
Bullshit.
They don’t notice betas.
Or they notice and actively avoid them.
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Obsidian
Isn’t there a lot of unhappiness expressed on this board about how women have been taught to be unfeminine and, to paraphrase, ballcutting succubi? Granted, it’s normally expressed via the converse, how feminism has taught men to not be men, but there allusions to, or personal stories by, women also.
So while women may not have a scientifically proven mystery method of game, there is a corollary that just as men have to be taught to be MEN women have to be taught to be WOMEN. Game partially teaches men to be men, no? So, women have to be women, it’s just that their aim isn’t necessarily just sex. I don’t think women are somehow innately knowledgeable about how to be “women”, and we are then that is some powerful unteaching going on.
Being an attractive woman might equal sex, but it might not if she is an unmitigated ballcutting succubus. Or so I understand. 😉
It is true, I’ll never understand the intensity of adolescent male sex drive, or the agony of being 16 yr old boy with hot teens wandering around my gym class while refusing to have sex with me.
I have to think on if I think that men hurting more or just expressing it differently (e.g. wars over women.) Not sure how I’ll figure that one out, but I’ll be thinking of all the girls who are crying because every man thinks of her as a friend, and at 26 she still hasn’t has a boyfriend. [I think this sounds like I’m being flippant, but really, the violence v. crying, sex v. love, urges, etc.]
So true, imho.
I defy any woman who is a 5 or above to get through any day (if you are not locked inside your house) where NOBODY says a word to you.
If I can break myself of the habit of smiling and saying hit to people (except on the subway) I’ll try this.
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Jeez, all the poor nutjob needed was an Eharmony account.
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In all likelihood, PUA tactics would not have helped this guy. The Seduction Community is great for guys who are otherwise normal but just don’t understand how to attract a woman: mostly because they’ve been lied to all along about what they’re supposed to be doing to bring women into their lives.
OTOH, there are guys that can’t get women into their lives because they’re just fucking broken. They might initally appear to be normal, but they’re not. I’ve seen guys like this try some PUA tactics but it just doesn’t work for them, and they wind up quitting in disgust.
Anyone who would pull one of these mass killing things is probably psychotic and therefore, fucking broken.
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Aoefe,
As a man who has been severely depressed all his life, sometimes effectively treated and sometimes not, dating women who were often depressed, sometimes effectively treated and sometimes not, I can tell you how simply and quickly a mood disorder ends your relationships or budding relationships if your partner isn’t equipped to handle it as a known part of the human condition. Pair that with being average in conventional attractiveness, and you have a recipe for disaster: months spent getting up the courage to ask someone out, a panic attack doing it, and self-esteem dependent on the response.
Learning Game was a godsend to me because I could use it to induce women to tread a path with me that I was ill-equipped to take alone, moreover, it gives me “filler” for the times when (thanks to depression) my sex drive disappears for weeks even when in a relationship. I can prod, cajole, tease, sexualize a situation and an existence which (as a depressed person with multiple disabilities) our society’s mores broadly insist should NOT be sexual.
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Oh yeah, and is it me or has anyone else noticed that Willard has been strangely silent?
Coincidence?
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A.J. Travis: With all due respect, your insistence that a male 5 “should” be able to bang a female 5, a male “7” “should” be able to bang a female 7″, etc., and that situations where this is not the case are somehow instances of “injustice” strikes me as an exercise in wishful thinking.
Perhaps, in some ideal world, what you describe would be the case. But that is not the way it is. To rail against the “injustice” of women not putting out equitably is to ignore the fundamental asymmetry between men and women: that eggs are few in number and thus valuable, and that sperm is plentiful and thus cheap. All else flows from this basic biological disparity. Obsidian’s eloquence regarding women as the “gatekeepers” of sex reflects an understanding of this basic asymmetry. Roissy has alluded to it a number of times.
Women are under no obligation to put out to those who are equally attractive, and hypergamy is their natural instinct and their desire (just as polygamy is a man’s natural instinct and his desire). There are sound evo-psych rationales for both women’s hypergamous strategy and men’s polygamous strategy. These strategies are obviously at odds with one another, and there’s been a subsequent arms race between the sexes to gain (if only briefly) the upper hand in this never-ending struggle.
Game is simply another step in this dance…it’s a psy-op adaptation to women’s frustrating bait-&-switch tactics (among other things) that so many of us men find frustrating. But I’d suggest taking women’s bait-&-switch tactics for what there are: an attempt to qualify, an attempt to secure additional resources, and an unconscious shit-test. Don’t presume it to be a “cosmic injustice”. They kinda can’t help it at some level. (Just like we men can’t help watching a nice ass twitch as a hottie walks by, or repeatedly glancing at a pretty face or cleavagey-goodness). The better response it to apply game as your abilities allow, or simply not participate in the dance.
The world as-it-is does not respect our human-invented sense of justice. And that may ultimately be a sad and frustrating thing. But wishing something so will not make it so.
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Marcus Aureliette-
“Only if you have zero ability to parse out your own worth as existing independently of other people’s opinions.”
Wrong. That’s SELF-WORTH.
Your ‘Worth’ is the value that others assign to you.
If even the girl who rings you up at the grocery store doesn’t bother to at least acknowledge your existence, I contend that the world will not miss you at all if you were not there.
Most guys will not cure cancer or invent the lightbulb in their lives. Their worth is contained primarily in their ability to find attract and keep 1 good woman, aggregate some assets, and reproduce.
Deny him those things unfairly and there will be trouble.
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snatch magnet
Oh yeah, and is it me or has anyone else noticed that Willard has been strangely silent?
It’s you.
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-A.J. Travis-
Makes many valid points. roissy states that men are in part to blame for friending a girl without the sex.
This is only somewhat true- most men don’t have game, without game they don’t know what to do (or how to act) in a situation such as this.
The female can ensnare and enslave the beta man she is not fucking, and he will find it very hard to escape in one piece.
i speak from experience.
Dr. Paul states this very well.
Friended beta Men provide women with attention, time, and an ear- all of these are valuable resources- he does this expecting to be paid in sex. The woman knows this all too well, yet she refuses to pay.
Men shouldn’t discount the time them spend in the presence of a women they are not fucking. That time could be better spent and in many situations it is worth more than money.
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”””””””””’Maybe soon, I will see God and Jesus. At least that is what I was told. Eternal life does NOT depend on works. If it did, we will all be in hell. Christ paid for EVERY sin, so how can I or you be judged BY GOD for a sin when the penalty was ALREADY paid. People judge but that does not matter. I was reading the Bible and The Integrity of God beginning yesterday, because soon I will see them.””””””””’
He convinced himself he wouldn’t go to hell makes it easy.
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M. Aurielette
I my first comment on this post I said that if there were not actual dead bodies here, I would have called this guys screed a hoax. Because this guy COULD communicate. He was not brillant, but he could express himself better than a lot of folks I know. I had trouble after reading the manifesto believing anyone who could explain himself at that level could not somehow manage to talk in a non-scary way to woman.
I do not know, but I will bet that he not especially scary to women. Just creepy in that special way that happens after too much rejection.
I am guessing but if he blundered across a indescriminant slut when he was 16 his whole life might have been redeemed.
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@FK
You are pathetic.
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Lynch,
ALL FIVE SEASONS OF THE WIRE IS DA FUCKING BOMB.
I can’t make it any plainer than that.
Get it.
O
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Bob-
“There are some pathetic ass men posting on this site. Feminism is responsible for your unhappiness?”
Typical wrong assumption from a lower-IQ, alpha male.
I never said that feminism is the cause of my unhappiness.
It is the cause of the unfair system that we all now ‘enjoy.’
My happiness is not subject to such things.
But my anger is.
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Rome82,
Once weapons that did not require physical strength to operate appeared (gunpowder), things changed.
Once such weapons could be mass produced (Colt), it changed further.
Once the world became more dependent on technology, it changed even more (box-cutters and airliners).
You and almost all women are fighting against the irreversible effects of technology on options and possibility. Your call.. I am just enjoying the show.
The alpha, beta, omega concept cannot coexist with the world we have now, and we cannot reverse time. Humans will either adapt or perish because of their stupidity. I don’t care..
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A.J. Travis,
People believe they are gods until they are about to fail. Let them believe what they want, it just makes the failure even more catastrophic and fun to watch
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Rum-
“One problem with the Travis formulation is that the terms of any deal must be negotiated in advance for it to have any force or meaning.”
You should direct this comment to the women who do not seem to realize that in accepting things from men, they are indeed negotiating a contract for intimacy.
Not the men who get cheated.
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Obsidian on August 5, 2009 at 1:09 pm – damn good post Obsidian.
By contrast, Manhood is a SKILL, NOT something that just “happens TO you”. Boys have to be taught how to be Men, and this is something Women simply cannot wrap their heads around.
Society doesn’t get this. Most men don’t get it. I’ve only recently come to recognize this truth. Seeing how an Alpha friend is raising his son has been like having a spotlight put on my own childhood and some of the things I was missing. My father was overworked and, for various reasons, was struggling with depression while I was growing up, and he just didn’t have enough day to day influence in raising me. I needed a stronger male role model but didn’t find it at my (feminized) schools or among my peer group.
But at least my dad stuck around. I can’t imagine how much worse it would have been if I had been raised by a single mother.
It takes a lot of effort to raise a boy into a man. And it has to be done by men, real men, not SWPL feminist loving beta types or empowered feminist single moms. Feminists are delusional. Men have the harder challenges in this life. And men must be taught how to rise to those challenges, face them and conquer them head on. We’re no longer teaching our boys to be anything but boys. Hell, most boys grow up without a father around to even try to teach them how to be men and face the challenges life will throw at them.
Along those lines, men need to be able to act like men, not walk on eggshells trying to meet some stupid damn policy of political correctness. Political correctness and feminism has destroyed the work place. Just having women in the work place is often a wrench thrown into the gears of male cooperation. Male bonding and cooperation is the only reason anything gets done in society, but the precious little snowflakes never understand this.
Add to this the fact that women often insist on being everywhere men are, and then imposing their stupid little PC rules on men. Men need to be able to get away from women at times. It’s hard to get women to understand this whether you’re dealing with a girlfriend (‘why are you going out with your friends tonight instead of ME?’) or with all of society (‘why can’t women be in this field like men?’).
I’ve noticed that the strongest male bonds are formed in fields where women are rare due to natural disadvantages, i.e. construction, military, police, fire. These also happen to be the fields where SWPL beta boy behavior doesn’t last long. And where unit cohesion, cooperation, and productivity tend to be high. Women don’t help when it comes to male productivity.
A.J. Travis – It is impossible to experience something like that and not doubt your worth as a human being. I defy any woman who is a 5 or above to get through any day (if you are not locked inside your house) where NOBODY says a word to you.
I remember the first time I watched a female friend go through a divorce. At first she didn’t have a very large social circle and found herself spending nights at home alone. She literally could not handle being alone for 5 minutes. She had to have male attention, had to have a boyfriend, had to “go out”, had to be sexually admired constantly. I remember thinking “if this girl had my life she would kill herself or somebody else.” Not being acknowledged as a worthy sexual being for just one night was virtually enough to send her over the edge.
She was cute with a decent body so it wasn’t long before she found the attention she needed, she just needed to find her social circle and go out. And then she literally rode a carousel of cock.
(Stupid beta me…I know for a fact that just before the divorce I could have taken advantage of that, but I didn’t think it would be “right”. Back then there were a number of opportunities that I over analyzed and backed away from for “moral” reasons, as if I was trying to protect the women from their own carnal desires. I saw women as precious, pure little snowflakes and didn’t want to ‘dirty’ a woman outside of a ‘proper’ relationship. All the women did was go fuck somebody else. Man I’m angry over some of what I was taught as a teenage boy, stupid shit from idealistic women and beta role models about ‘respect’ and being a white knight. All crap.)
Yeah, women have no idea what it’s like to be a man. Women say they hate being constantly hit on and flirted with, but when women are denied their daily dose of sexual worship things get ugly fast.
I’ve often wondered what would happen if all men in the world suddenly had no sexual desire for, say, one week. Just a week of not giving a shit about women, flirting, or getting laid. I’m convinced that by the end of the week women would be going bat shit insane.
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lynch
Obsidian, I finished season 1 a couple nights ago. Amazing. One of the best seasons/series I’ve ever seen.
Are the subsequent seasons of The Wire of similar quality? Worth watching?
Obsidian is the reigning authority of the Wire, but I’m on record as a huge, huge fan who’s see the show in its entirety.
Short answer, IMHO Season 3 is as good as Season 1. Maybe, possibly a teensy bit better. Season 4 is up there as well, perhaps just a tad bit under Season 1 in quality.
Season 5 suffers a bit from preachiness, but it is still pretty damn good and of course wraps up the many loose ends.
Season 2 was my least favorite, but it’s still better than most of what’s on TV and introduces plot threads and elements that are necessary to fully appreciating the rest of the series.
I’d recommend slogging through 2…don’t give up if it is a bit disappointing, and watch through 3. My guess is that after 3 you’ll want to see the rest of it just on principle.
Peace.
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Rum,
I have a bad feeling that his screed is real. This guy was in IT.. think about that one.
Another question- Could you get more “free” action if you were a person making 100,000 + a year in a technically demanding profession or you were a drummer in a garage band even if both men looked the same.
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”””””””Rum
M. Aurielette
I my first comment on this post I said that if there were not actual dead bodies here, I would have called this guys screed a hoax. Because this guy COULD communicate. He was not brillant, but he could express himself better than a lot of folks I know. I had trouble after reading the manifesto believing anyone who could explain himself at that level could not somehow manage to talk in a non-scary way to woman.”””””””””””””””
Kind of like me I could see my whole life before me at 18 and was asking the question why?
Why work a lifetime?
Why give a fuck about money?
Why care about eating?
Why stay on the planet?
I could not come up with any good reasons to stay after seeing my dad divorced other than I might go to hell.
Which sure as shit ain’t a reason to stay it is just a little fear.
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-Obsidian-
Speaks the truth.
Boys need to be taught how to be men.
Unless you are a natural you need to learn how to game women.
Before the internet and mystery- there was nowhere for the average working man to go and learn these skills.
There are no men’s support groups- and many are afraid and embarrassed to admit that they can’t get laid.
I randomly stumbled upon “the game” in a book store, I learned of mystery, and the pua world- then that led me here, to this blog.
I still remember that one day in the book store- I saw this book that looked like a bible- I had to open it, and once I began to read it I was in awe- it changed my life- my fucking entire life.
This was just two years. Even after I read it- it took one year to sink in, that is when I began to game in earnest.
If I hadn’t found the book “the game” I never would have learned or changed into a better and happier man.
All of it a lucky chance.
how many won’t get that chance?
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When was “the system” ever fair?
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LR-
“Men don’t realize that we can take sex or leave it. It’s no biggie.”
No stupid. We realize you don’t give a shit.
To you sex has no value because you can get it whenever you want it.
To those poor guys that you take advantage of on a daily basis, sex, even with an selfish bitch like you, is worth a great deal.
If you don’t give it up to the pool of men who are trying to get you to give it up, they CAN’T just take it.
Thanks for making my point.
You are the poster girl of an entitled cock-tease.
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Gunslingergregi,
While we may not agree on much, this guy certainly had balls.
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Lucifer I’ll come hang out with you and get you some woman all right. No biggie. If you make money we can get you some free bitches.
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al – So while women may not have a scientifically proven mystery method of game, there is a corollary that just as men have to be taught to be MEN women have to be taught to be WOMEN.
The difference is that women can get sex regardless of their behavior. It takes a lot of effort to raise a girl into a woman worth having around as a LTR or a wife. But any girl, regardless of how well she was raised, can get sex as soon as she starts wanting it.
Men must be raised to be men in order to get any sex. They must learn how to seduce and manage women. Men need game for sex. Women just need what they were born with.
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Rum:
Because this guy COULD communicate. He was not brillant, but he could express himself better than a lot of folks I know. I had trouble after reading the manifesto believing anyone who could explain himself at that level could not somehow manage to talk in a non-scary way to woman.
He could express his thoughts in writing. That’s not a substitute for being able to interact with people face-to-face, which seems to be where he had difficulty.
In his screed he also mentions not having any friends, and also not coming in contact with anyone he wanted to be friends with.
The guy was fundamentally broken, in a way that apparently prevented him from having even acquaintances, let alone friendships with other guys, let alone a healthy romantic relationship.
If it were only about getting laid, clearly he could have done that. He was not repulsive and was sufficiently well-off enough to have paid for it, if the physical release were of primary importance. He had the means to secure a lay, which didn’t involve gunning down innocent people.
If he couldn’t form an emotional connection to make some semblance of a male-female relationship happen, you can probably trace that back to how his family failed him, rather pin it on womenkind not putting out.
If a man has no friends, none at all, that’s a serious warning sign.
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This guy was true alpha he shit on society and god and made his own rule and said I will not be on planet and followed through.
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A-Bax-
I don’t disagree with most of what you are saying.
I know we are not living in the just society that I describe.
But I am no longer OK with that.
I am working for something better, not with guns, but through other means.
And in the meantime, I will point out the injustice when I see it, even if some don’t want to hear it.
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i can´t believe FK´s horror stories. They are too one-sided. if he is beta enough to be subject to such monstruous rejections, and the girls are slutty enough to reject him in such absurd way, he wouldn´t have got a date with them in the first place
I bet that FK is a man, who was indeed rejected by girls he fell in love with during youth, but he is putting the entire blame on them. This is a female trait – transfer the entire blame – and shows one reason of his rejections. I, from my part, can describe in details when women cuckolded me, the reasons for it and the signs they gave before. If you don´t want to get burned, don´t play the game.
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Happygirl says:
“When was “the system” ever fair?”
I dont know the answer to that one.But I know this;”the system” sure had better become fair-er if those who benefit by/exploit it dont wanna get shot.
Dont care about unfairness,girlie? Who cares about gunshot victims either?
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A.J. –
Here’s an idea: sound angry and attack cyberstrangers instead of actually engaging logically with any counterarguments.
Make it obvious that you will refuse to accept the validity of counterarguments simply because you don’t like them. Throw in some unsupported accusions (“you think that’s what you did, but you’re not that smart”) instead of concretely discussing the ideas at hand.
Insist that you refuted counterarguments, as a substitute for actually refuting them.
Sounds like a plan.
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I find it amusing that women who believe that genetic diversity is good for plants and animals (by having more genes available to respond to environmental factors) enthusiastically support a massive genetic bottleneck by having only a few men reproduce. Which tends to produce massive genetic flaws due to that bottleneck: inherited diseases, deformities, and the like. Not to mention fragile resistance to disease, environmental factors and the like.
The problem is not, I think, with the random Chos or this guy (who I don’t know much about other than what people have posted here). It’s the withdrawal to indifference that men unconnected to women produce. Single mothers of course imply lots of single guys, who don’t give a damn about women and kids one way or another. Why is Cleveland such a dump? Because for fifty years, men didn’t care enough to fight for the city. Because they had no investment in it.
The danger is probably gradual thuggery, as men respond to women’s incentives by a ‘short cut’ to Game, and massive DA-style withdrawals from society with men not caring. Ala the Cho incident or the Montreal Massacre, where men did nothing to stop the slaughter of their female classmates. In contrast with the Titanic, where women and children went first into the Lifeboats.
The guy was clearly mentally ill (and knew it), had drinking problems, did manage to father a kid, and did have at one point some sort of relationship with a woman. Enforced celibacy will of course kick a number of these guys into Cho/Klebold/Harris like killing sprees. This will only re-inforce women’s desire for A-Lister Alphas or thugs, more “icky nice guy” stuff from women (totally predictable) and as a result, more guys figuring being a thug (this won’t be a lightswitch, a gradual process) is the easy path to women. The other thing is of course, men not caring.
Far more dangerous than lone nuts is most men just not giving a damn about women.
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“We may expect male dysfunctionality to assume many forms under the distorting pressure of feminist innovation. Not all of this would involve violence, but all of it would tend to the entropic degradation of the world, and be marked by a state of false consciousness. I mean that men and boys would behave in chaotic or entropic ways because, for want of a guiding theory or conceptual roadmap, they wouldn’ t know what else to do! They would not recognize what was being done to them and, for want of an identifiable target, they would lash out randomly. This would be unhealthy for society and we could anticipate, in consequence, much suffering of the innocent.”
http://counterfem.blogspot.com/2008/02/cf-is-more-predictive-than-prescriptive.html
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Happygirl-
“When was “the system” ever fair?”
You handle says it all.
And why shouldn’t you be happy. “The system” is rigged in your favor and has been for at almost 100 years.
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””””””””Ovid
To all those of you who keep saying,”Sodini couldnt find a woman because he was obviously a nut,” I have a few questions.
If he was such a nut,why did it take 48 years for his nuttiness to finally burst out?Wouldnt a bonafide nut go berserk well before?It makes more sense to say Sodini was driven nuts.The question then becomes;why,and by whom?”””””””’
He probably already figured that shit out early. You can see how the fear of hell is what kept him slaving at a job on the planet. The government needs to have free condoned by media suicide rooms so that people who don’t want to be on earth can leave peacefully without having to blaze out.
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“The government needs to have free condoned by media suicide rooms so that people who don’t want to be on earth can leave peacefully without having to blaze out.”
I once gave a speech arguing this very point to an auditorium full of college students and nearly started a riot.
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I think agree with sex part, assuming some basic non-trollness. To clarify, though, is this true even if she is a ballcutting succubus or has a ridiculous bitchshield, or are we assuming those are choices she makes that makes sex available with fewer men?
I guess I was saying that as men sex is part (or totally) the end game and that women control it. I agree on that (the control part, I take y’alls word for the end game bit.) I was pointing out that if women’s goals are different than men, which I think they are, then women are also being taught wrongly. I’m not sure being inherently submissive or ‘feminine’ is easier than being inherently dominate or masculine. As men are being castrated by soceity, women are being (to a lesser extent) metoidioplasty. (*hand waves* I looked that up, you get the idea.)
Or something like that it’s not just men who are being screwed, even if they’re bearing more burden now, or something. But I’ll let it go.
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@Willard
“Its you”
Thanks man, it usually is.
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OH I definitely cared about how unfair this mess is to the families of the victims. You know, those women were probably some one’s wife or girlfriend. They were definitely some one’s little girl. But I really don’t see how this guy had such an “unfair” life, just because he “couldn’t” get laid by women up to his standards. OH and maybe one reason people didn’t sleep with guys in high school is because involved parents usually look down on a daughter for that type of stuff. I’m just saying. OH and I think the natural selection argument is stupid since it doesn’t seem like many on this board even want kids, heck it didn’t seem like this guy wanted the kid he may have had. Also, I’ve never known any feminist who was against the legalization of prostitution, but again it seems clear that this guy didn’t want to buy sex. Maybe he didn’t even know what he really wanted.
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Gunslinger,
Sodini was clearly unbalanced,but something finally pushed him over the edge.Also,he could have simply commited suicide -every generation contributes its quota- but instead he lashed out against the lasses.Why?
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Now I want to address the Prostitution angle of this thing. By way of a little, but true, story from my life, since I just brought up The Wire a little while back.
About 8 years ago, I worked for a Jewish family owned business, retail, that was a competitor to a national chain in the tri-state area. I was Number Two to the manager assigned two stores, one in NJ, the other in Philly.
The son of the business was kinda like the VP, and would make the rounds. One day he sat in on a heated and passionate debate we were having. The question: whether to legalize drugs or not.
He listened to both sides of the debate intently, and when the raucous finally died down, he simply said this:
If the drug trade were legalized today, we ALL would be out of business tomorrow, along w/at least half of all the stores in this big assed mall, right off the bat. In fact, the death of the drugs trade would cripple the American Economy. There is a very good reason as to why drugs hasn’t been made legal-its because we can’t afford to. The money is too heavy now. Our economy cannot do without it.
The end.
We all sat in silence, contemplating heavily on his words.
Now, having actually seen in excess of $100K on a dining room table-and keep in mind, I was still a teenager at the time-I think my old boss was 100% right. There aint no way in hell the drugs trade will EVER be made legit, because there’s just too much money in it.
Now, what does that have to do w/our current discussion and prostitution? Simple.
We will NEVER see prostitution legalized, for several very simple, yet powerful reasons:
1. Because the most chivalrous, and often most “Alpha” of the males don’t want it
And
2. Most importantly, powerful Feminist lobbying interests don’t want it.
Both work to prevent Men from exercising any real control over his reproductive and sexual lives. Prostitution, like mail order brides and the like, would greatly cripple other areas of the legal and economic sectors of the country that basically rely on keeping Men Without Game chained down on the reservation, so to speak. Less outright sexual competition for one thing, and for another, less chance of a diverting of assets from one group of Women to another.
That discussion nearly a decade, among other things, really sharpened my thinking as to whenever I wanted to get to the root of a problem. I simply learned to ask-who benefits from this situation?
Just some thoughts.
O
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Aoefe—
I think it was the later in part probably. Yes MOST guys will lower their standards enough to get laid but not him very possibly. Not DA either remember. Note he may have had to lower his standards to a 4 or below, given how utterly little confidence with women he felt, and how zero game he had.
He’s actually, I think, more than “not a bad looking man” as Roissy put it. He’s actually quite good looking and very trim for a man of 48. (We have a tendency to see in men’s looks what we know about them especially if it’s really bad, remember. It takes an effort to be objective when looking at him.) But small and slight I think.
From his web diary it seems he was a shy, introverted, “nice guy” (until he snapped) milketoast wuzz, used to being bullied mercilessly by his older brother and also his mother. That carried on into and through school. He seems to have been introverted to the extent of being a loner, though he yearned for a wife. He seems to have been both short and slight, from his descriptions of his big brother being “twice his size”. He backed down and was differential and diffident it seems. Perhaps passive aggressive, although not social enough to be very good at it. The opposite of dominant. However he also doesn’t really seem to be submissive, in the sense of enjoying that in any way. He’s someone who always wished he could be a little dominant but was always intimidated and mostly afraid to try. I would also bet money he has a small and probably very small penis. Given all the porn these days that glorifies monster dicks and which essentially never even shows anything smaller than 7” and thick (considerably above the American average of 5.7”, like more than 1sd up probably), a male endowment well below average has a big effect on a lot of insecure male minds it seems. That’s all over the web. Particularly those with little experience as well, or some bad/belittling ones.
After reading his fairly long, quite lucid and generally calm diary, he doesn’t strike me as crazy in any way, or even really disturbed. It’s easy to dismiss him as crazy – that avoids thinking hard thoughts. What he did wasn’t so irrational or incomprehensible given what he THOUGHT his prospects were of ever turning things around. If he’d discovered this site a couple of years ago he might have developed a whole lot more hope. The advantage of here over most PUA sites for someone like him is that it doesn’t just impart game tips, but a whole different way of understanding sexual attraction, sexual relations, and the genders’ respective motivations. His apparent lack of drive at work as well though doesn’t bode well for game actually turning him around much. At 48 he doesn’t seem to have any kind of supervisiory role at all in his while collar programming job of some sort at a law firm. Unless sexual depression has played a big role in his not caring there much.
In most cultures he would have been “assigned” a wife. He’s sufficiently functional for that. Not an attractive one in looks or status or wealth. If his wife had much sex or any other kind of drive it wouldn’t have been a very happy marriage.
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OMG, lol…..Roissy I see the point you’re trying to make with this one, but in actuality it’s only showing how incredibly weak the male gender is. How unable to control their urges, and how utterly emotional they are.
I wish to God I could watch you hit the wall. It’s going to be so entertaining for all of the beta house cleaning losers you’ve used all these years who get to watch it.
Who thinks about sex and relationships that much? Who obsesses about being alone?
Pick up a woman’s magazine. It’s hilarious to see a (clueless) woman paint this man as an example of male weakness. The dude was lonely and hopeless for 20 fucking years. NO woman could handle that. Most couldn’t handle lack of male attention for a couple of weeks without developing a life long eating disorder or some other major psychological problem.
Men don’t realize that we can take sex or leave it. It’s no biggie.
Women feel that way about sex because it’s always available to them. I guarantee you that you could not go 20 years feeling hopeless that you’ll never have sex again and remain sane. Being a woman you might not ever consider lashing out in a violent fashion, but you would be pretty fucked up in the head. (Worse than even now, believe it or not.) I’ve seen what just a short dry spell can do to a woman’s mentality, and it is sad.
As whiskey often points out, you’re a perfect example of a clueless woman for everyone on this board to learn from. Men, take a good, hard look at LR’s posts. Women do not understand what men need. They therefore cannot raise boys by themselves (I feel sorry for your son LR), and should not be dictating social conduct through feminist laws and PC rules.
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-The Rookie-
Most men will never learn about the existence of game.
How can you learn about game- if you don’t even know that it exists in the first place?
Most men will blindly follow the advice that women give them on how to court other women- and this will destroy them.
The overwhelming majority of men will never learn of roissy or come to this website.
Some may get lucky and stumble upon PUA by chance, but at what age?
Probably not during their most formative years.
I went through my 20’s before I knew any of this existed.
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Obs
If the drug trade were legalized today, we ALL would be out of business tomorrow, along w/at least half of all the stores in this big assed mall, right off the bat. In fact, the death of the drugs trade would cripple the American Economy. There is a very good reason as to why drugs hasn’t been made legal-its because we can’t afford to. The money is too heavy now. Our economy cannot do without it.
What do you mean by this… it doesn’t make much sense? The drug trade isn’t that big a part of our economy. And if drugs were legalized, the market for them wouldn’t disappear. The volume would go up slightly while the price would go down.
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Time for me to step away from the keyboard for a while.
This type of topic brings out the worst in me.
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“And why shouldn’t you be happy. “The system” is rigged in your favor and has been for at almost 100 years.”
___???? I haven’t been around for a 100 years, although you are right, I definitely like this time period more than I probably would have liked the previous 74 years.
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Obsidian–
That’s nuts.
Yeah you’ll do WAY better with game if you make a good income than without it, but with a given amount of game you’ll also get a hotter girl with money that without it. Esp. for ltr but not only.
As well this guy’s probable income according to IT guys on here wasn’t that hot, not really upper middle class even.
His 250k claimed net worth is probably mostly in retirement accounts. If it’s outside them maybe part of his problem getting girls was that he lived like a skinflint church mouse.
Sometimes it seems you say things simply because they feel good to you.
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I totally relate to this…
I’m 26 and still a virgin
I have a job as a project management consultant, drive a decent car, buy nice clothes…6’3”
and yet I’m still a virgin….I’m so tired of being celibate…its not funny…
I just have no idea what I’m doing
I even dropped 11k on cosmetic dentistry recently in hopes of helping me out…but I just don’t get it…
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[…] of the bluster of pickup artists and “game” aficionados, but a glance at repugnablog Roissy in DC reveals a connection. In a post about the shooting, Roissy […]
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A.J.-
Here’s my point. What sense does it make to complain about whether or not the “system” is fair unless you’ve done all you can using the data at hand?
Fair, unfair… there is only what works and what doesn’t. If you ignore the data from the PUA community about male-female relations, it could be argued that you’re not fully doing your part in the male/female exchange.
If you’re going to play by old rules and ignore the new ones, what sense does it make to complain?
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Men even with no game have to rely on what they already know from first hand experience(which on average isn’t much), some luck, and a heap of hoops (shit-test) to jump trought.
Women on the other hand just have to open there legs in order to have sex.
Game to a man on the brink of celibacy is like CPR to a man suffocating.
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Tim, have you read this blog for a while?
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I was pointing out that if women’s goals are different than men, which I think they are, then women are also being taught wrongly.
Absolutely. Girls are not being raised into decent women who are LTR and wife material. Feminism promises to deliver to women what they want and need, but too many grow old only to find out it was all a lie.
As a society we are not teaching our children the right things on many levels.
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”””””’Ovid,
3. 3. Net worth slightly more than $ 250K, (after all debt) as of end of 2008. Net worth slightly more than $250K, (after all debt) as of end of 2008.””””””””””
””””””’on August 5, 2009 at 3:02 pm Ovid
Gunslinger,
Sodini was clearly unbalanced,but something finally pushed him over the edge.Also,he could have simply commited suicide -every generation contributes its quota- but instead he lashed out against the lasses.Why?””””’
Build up courage easier to pull trigger on someone else first because after that it is like ok fuck it you have gone to far to stop at that point. Plus makes more of a statment.
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Whiskey,
You stole my thunder, brother-while we all dig on the Man Bites Dog aspect of the Attas, Chos and Sodinis of the world, the Silent Kill here are the guys who are just a shade meaner than Dave Alex, the guys who will simply not give a fuck about Women as a group. If the Titanic happened today, they’d be a whole helluva lot of Female Shark Food.
This thing’s about to get deep for real in a minute. Y’all aint seen nothin’ yet…
O
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Allright if there is anyone else with 250 g’s that doesn’t know how to change there lives please drop me an email.
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Erm, we haven’t heard from David Alexander lately. Maybe we should pass the hat around for a hooker for DA so he doesn’t go batshit and kill us all.
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Why do you think thugs really pull triggers on people for 20 bucks they are ready to leave planet and we don’t even show them mercy.
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Willard, what’s your take on all this? Drop some science.
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Come on…are half of the men on this site even being serious? You think “game” will stop murder sprees? That it’s the manifesto at the center of what makes you a man?
Let me tell you something. As a woman, I was not put here on earth to make. you. feel. like. a. man. No one, for all of our history, has ever given two shits about making women feel like PEOPLE. So why the hell do you feel as if women owe you sex and companionship just because you’re attractive and successful? This man shot up a fitness center–he writes racist and misogynistic blog entries. He’s obsessed with his own “game” in a way that drives at a narcissistic and slightly manic personality. Clearly, he had some major issues, and I would guess THIS is why he had allegedly not had a girlfriend in so many years…and rightly so. I’m certain you’re all selective about who you choose to date–let me guess: nice face, big breasts, legs for days, and no opinions on international politics? Well, if you get to choose who you give your “game” to, then we get to choose who we have sex with. And we’ll continue to avoid anyone with major personality and psychological problems like Sodini, as well as the ones like all of you who believe his actions of murdering innocent women were justifiable due to our constant rebuffing your sexual wiles.
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Dam that shit is fucked my upbringing caused me to work 15 years more than I would have done. Good job catholic upbringing you made another good slave for society woo hooo!!
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Game in BK
I somewhat disagree. I think most have heard of it, but just don’t take it seriously. In fact, most guys I know have that reaction. I mentioned that somewhat on VK’s blog. As Roissy said, the more logical you are, the less likely you’ll believe it actually works. I’m willing to bet that this shooter heard of it and thought it was stupid.
Tim
Learn some game. If you can’t do it yourself, find a mentor. Pay someone. If you dropped $11K on dental work just to get bitches, drop a few hundred on a workshop or something.
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”””””Really?
Come on…are half of the men on this site even being serious? You think “game” will stop murder sprees? That it’s the manifesto at the center of what makes you a man?
Let me tell you something. As a woman, I was not put here on earth to make. you. feel. like. a. man. No one, for all of our history, has ever given two shits about making women feel like PEOPLE.”””””””””””””
Your are a retard please stay away form men. You are not the woman the people are referring too.
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”””””Tim
I totally relate to this…
I’m 26 and still a virgin
I have a job as a project management consultant, drive a decent car, buy nice clothes…6′3”
and yet I’m still a virgin….I’m so tired of being celibate…its not funny…
I just have no idea what I’m doing
I even dropped 11k on cosmetic dentistry recently in hopes of helping me out…but I just don’t get it…””””””””””
Your prob trying to pick up college bitches right?
You need some hot fast food bitches.
Will change your life.
You need a trailer park bitch that will run your house for you.
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As well this guy’s probable income according to IT guys on here wasn’t that hot, not really upper middle class even.
IT sucks and is not any where near upper middle class. If I could go back I would have chosen a dozen different careers before IT. But it’s not always easy to change and I haven’t even decided what I might change to yet.
At least I’m self employed and can exert some influence over the projects I work on and my schedule. (Though being self employed poses its own sometimes painful challenges.) I (literally) couldn’t handle doing IT work in a cubicle. I would never, ever recommend IT to a kid entering college. It’s a one way ticket to being a middle/lower-middle class wage drone in a country that actively seeks to export your job.
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@ Really?
Actually I prefer to have my women with their vocal cords removed so I don’t have to hear the constant white noise of they’re ‘opinions’
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“Clearly, he had some major issues, and I would guess THIS is why he had allegedly not had a girlfriend in so many years…and rightly so.”
Oh really?Why is it that guys with “major issues” like say,Charles Manson, have harems of adoring female companions?
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Save up 100k retire any more questions?
e-mail me at my blog I will walk you through saving the hundred. I am on my third trip and almost done.
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Doug,
W/all due respect, I should like to point something out to you.
In White People’s Dollars, 250K ain’t much. But to Black folks, you done hit the jackpot. Seriously.
Hands down, THEE BEST PLAYAS I KNOW don’t have much money. In fact, their Women take care of them. This is a lot more common in Black society than White, for the obvious reasons, which are many and varied. But I’m telling you something I know and have seen firsthand, not some feelgood stuff.
Conversely, some of the guys I’ve ever seen with thee WEAKEST Game, were dudes who were rolling in cash, which again is contextual here. These are the guys who think they can just buy the pussy. They’re wrong-and they find this out the hard way when their girl is getting her back banged out by youngbuck w/no gig at all but is cute and got wicked Game. In fact, like Kanye said in Gold Digger, she buying shit w/HIS money, lol. I’ve seen it, firsthand.
I bullshit you not.
O
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A.J. Travis says, “A man who is a 5 should be able to have sex with a woman who is a 5. A man who is a 7 should be able to get a 7, etc.”
They are able to. They just generally don’t want to.
Guys say it, but they don’t seem to truly understand that women don’t care as much as men about looks. A male 5 is a middle income Joe Average without any major physical defects and passable looks. He doesn’t want a female 5, which is by the current rating, a passable looking woman of median safe breeding age. If only female 5’s are approaching him, he feels that life isn’t being fair to him.
Lots of people “settle” for what they can get, but most of them feel bad about it, and whoever ends up being their partner bears the brunt of that.
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Obsidian is quite correct on the impact of a lot of guys priced out of the relationship market.
The long term is pretty dim: stuff that happens on the Wire (fairly graphic from what I understand) will happen eventually in middle class White communities. Not all at once, and not everywhere, but most places.
This guy was mentally ill, but seems to have been pushed over the edge by impending firing, and having nothing in his life but looking forward to loneliness. Urban life for men is not very fulfilling, it tends to produce loneliness (something Paul Schrader in Taxi Driver and other movies covered in depth). For women it’s the opposite — it allows them to go from one Alpha guy to another.
Is this guy Travis Bickle? Bickle after all got “healthy” by blowing away the pimps and gangsters holding the tween girl semi-hostage, after his plan to assassinate the candidate went awry. But the movie clearly implied it was only temporary, that the city of NY itself made Bickle sick by dissolving human connections.
Hell this guy seems right out of Travis Bickle. But like I said he’s not the main problem. There won’t be that many of him.
What there will be, is a ton of guys who just won’t give a damn about women. At all. When LR is aged out of even cougar-dom, she will be as invisible to men (and women) as Bickle or this guy. Her son is likely to be somewhere on the beta or worse continuum. The most likely indicator of alpha-dom is the presence of a father in the home giving status.
—————–
For most guys, HS is hell — only the few early maturers do well. College, given booze, lowered inhibitions, a four year party, and favorable sex ratio (60-40 in some places women/men) that forces women to lower their standards are good times for most guys.
Then there’s professional life, no status to speak of, in a city or workplace with no social network built-in like College, and no boozy mixers to get girls drunk enough to make plays for betas. It usually takes the late twenties before guys make enough cash, have enough maturity (Obsidian was dead right that men have to learn/earn becoming men) and enough experience with women to become moderately successful. There’s usually an overlay of bitterness to resentment at being lied to regarding women’s true nature, white knighting and so on promoted by the media, changing social conditions (making a parental model obsolete) and just plain unhappiness about years of enforced celibacy.
[I will say women DO need teaching how to be women, which mostly involves putting the breaks on the bad-boy urges. Even smart Lizzie Bennet in Pride and Prejudice falls hard and heavy for bad-boy gigolo Wickham, knowing what he is anyway, and rejects Mr. Perfect Mr. Darcy. However, she wins because she puts the breaks on the bad-boy tingle, and doesn’t screw everything up by having sex with said bad boy.]
As for looks, the most bewitching and intensely sexual woman I knew was a 6 at best. She was, however, blessed with “it” and any guy who came into contact with her got entranced. At least until negatives like her personality came into play. I’ve met women who were mere 6-7 at best who radiated sex, and those who were near 10 who seemed asexual (though “cute”) and complained not enough “good” guys approached them, just d-bag a-holes.
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One thing that must be said is that the man wasn’t just missing sex. He was missing touch!
He was touch deficient and it is a bigger problem than lack of sex. When a man goes without the touch of a woman’s soft hand, he is hopeless. I once went 3 years with barely any female contact. It is the worst feeling in the world. It is unimagineably bad; you wish every day you were dead. Sexual urges can be semi-satisfied through masturbation, but nothing can redress a lack of touch. Your humanity is never acknowledged, your life is nothing but suffering.
I clearly remember one day when it had been more than 8 months since I had touched a woman. My secretary gave me a great big extended hug. As pathetic as it sounds that was such an awesome moment. The feeling of a woman against you is very, very powerful. Even a hug from a woman 20 years older can give you some tiny hope that you can figure your life out and find a partner. My situation was not so different from the shooter’s. I had a great job, was in great shape, was an amazing conversationalist in general, and was not ugly. However, for whatever reason, I was terrible with women. I was so paranoid about rejection that on many occasions I didn’t follow-up with women who basically told me they wanted to screw right then. I was a sad case, but still a human with great love to offer. Today, I am happily married and my life couldn’t be better. But I know the pain the shooter must have felt. I also know that he must have suffered from a severe lack of touch which would leave him completely and utterly hopeless. For a lack of touch means your humanity is never acknowledged; you are so unworthy that a hug is deemed “too much” for you.
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Also, A.J. Travis:
You say women will never know the loneliness men feel because we don’t initiate flirting with you (based on your experiiment with your female friend)?
Then you probably will also never know the irritation of being hit on when all you want to do is go about your daily routine. Walking to your car in the parking lot of your office building, buying a birthday card for your father, asking “Are you in line?” at the check-out in the grocery store..THIS is a uniquely female experience. In no way are we ASKING for you to hit on us or come up and try to flirt in these situations. We are not dressed in provocative clothing; we are not presenting a posture or walk suggestively in your direction; we are not standing at a bar making eyes at you across the room. Your attention is uncalled for and unneeded when I am trying to buy a tube of toothpaste at Kroger, or mail a letter at the post office. Perhaps it is really that we just have more respect for you as a human being to not treat you in the same way you treat us…there’s something for you to consider when analyzing your experiment’s very scientific data.
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IT sucks? If you live somewhere worth living, an intermediate developer can easily make 100k a year. I know senior developers making 150k. I don’t even want to know what my team lead makes. If you don’t make much money in IT, it’s likely you don’t have a degree, and don’t have any in-demand skills.
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Whenever I read or hear “As a woman” I know something self-serving and likely false will follow.
Here’s a tip to all the ladies out there: Just make your point….or just state your opinion. If you have to preface it with “as a woman”, the unspoken implication is that what follows can’t really stand on its own merits.
Even if you’re talking about your menstrual cramps or your foggy emotional state, don’t preface it with “as a woman”. You might as well say “feel free to dismiss what I’m about to say”.
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Mandy XD
Why isn’t that and much else a strong argument for reversing affirmative action for women and giving it to men instead? As well as having national campaigns extolling traditional sex roles or things in between (part time or less time work for many women), without forcing that, and national campaigns to increase relative male college enrollment?
Not baring women in the workplace or from any high position there, and certainly nothing to prevent super talented women from rising, but steps that would promote family formation and stability.
Consider also that most inventions and truly creative works are still by men, by a wide margin. There’s been plenty of time for that to have been changing a lot but it hasn’t been nearly as much as women’s heavily bureaucratic employment including at quite high levels. Staff all over the place. Line way less. A lot of these high IQ guys are beta nerds. Shouldn’t society care about creating or rather restoring a provider earnings differential or gradient for men so that the real prospect of attracting a decently attractive wife can motivate them?
Guys as far gone as this one wouldn’t be helped much if he didn’t learn some game, but others would.
Remember that these issues impact the divorce rate as well.
I know you agree with me about elimating affirmative action generally. But if we’re going to have it anywhere, why shouldn’t it be for men?
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Really?
Of course more sex (better game) would mean fewer murder sprees by guys like Sobini. That one is a no-brainer. Most murders thruout history have been related to pussy, one way or the other.
No one (or very few, actually only one) person here has ever said that women have any obligation to put out.
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Fuck the haters. I am also a good-looking guy (so I have been told) and I totally understand the loneliness this guy felt, the indifference women display to introverted, nice guys. (I am trying hard to change, though).
So his genes should have been weeded out? Except ancestors of his with his personality type managed to pass their genes in previous eras.
The difference then was that intelligent introverts could use their intelligence to kill off alpha bullies with cunning. Today the courts and law enforcement complex will throw the beta to jail for retaliating against school bullies (as they deserve) and low-IQ thuggish alphas getting the majority of the super-hot chicks.
While betas brought civilization, civilization will take down the betas.
This guy is a fucking HERO. I salute him. Had he not done it, his cries would have been ignored by society. Let this be a wake up call.
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Gunslingergregi:
@Really?:
“Your are a retard please stay away form men. You are not the woman the people are referring too.”
Clearly. You are right…two bachelor degrees and having mastered basic grammar and spelling principles make me so undesirable and inferior to men. Should have warned the boyfriends who bedded me to go to a clinic…hopefully they don’t catch the retard. You win again, oh great one!
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AJ Travis ” experience with a female friend” is so obviously a lie that I am amazed as how many people fell for it
just because you have seem it written on your screen it doesn´t mean that it is true
Approach anxiety usually is men´s greatest obstacle. AJ wants me to believe there are alphaseverywhere so that a 5 gets approached 100 times a day?????
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some commenters are really showing their inner beta today
labeling this man an “evil loser” and such, just on principle
i have practically come to peace with the concept of killing people without motive. the mental exercise is figuring out if you can live with your own guilt, as you will ultimately have no one else to confide in. it is similar to when i debated using steroids for the first time: could i live without being “all-natural” for the rest of my life? i felt guilty at first when addressing the idea, then over a few years, i rationalized it and followed through. much easier than killing though, because i had plenty of confidantes.
this guy, of course, did have a blanket motive.
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Obsidian–
Yeah and it’s a social disaster. It HEAVILY saps male inventive and other energies away from socially productive applications. It’s thoroughly degenerate.
There’s good reason why this is taboo and widely scorned by both sexes in white and Asian society. May we work to have it remain so. Else the engine upon whom all in this country depend wind down.
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Is @Really the only “screeching, flapping twatstorm of [a] jezebeler” that is coming today or do we have a much more controversial post in the works?
Because she is a pretty tame, boring one.
[editor: perhaps they came, they read, and they agreed? or maybe they all spontaneously orgasmed upon sight of my wonderworks and in their pleasurable spasming couldn’t muster the fine motor control to post a scathing comment.]
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“…two bachelor degrees…”
Yeah,you really are stupid.Keep posting though,I love a good farce.
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Lucifer:
“The alpha, beta, omega concept cannot coexist with the world we have now, and we cannot reverse time. Humans will either adapt or perish because of their stupidity. I don’t care..”
I understand your point about technology neutralizing the alpha/beta construct, to some degree. Physical prowess and brutality no longer strictly determine a man’s ability to provide.
But doesn’t it seem more likely that humanity will ultimately adapt than perish? Won’t the instinct to survive always take final authority?
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Obsidian–
Again more black than white society but it’s definitely spreading to white with our current feminst divorce laws and diverse media culture.
I certainly agree that a guy with money need game too. Lots of it.
I also think he should be able to punish the cheating bitch by totally cutting her off. With nada. As it has always been, unless she was the one coming with the fat dowery, etc. Even then he could just give it back. Or for her cheating it would often be forfeit to him.
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hahaha – fucking pussy dago.
legalize prostitution now.
give joe’s mom a job
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””””””””””””’Really?
Gunslingergregi:
@Really?:
“Your are a retard please stay away form men. You are not the woman the people are referring too.”
Clearly. You are right…two bachelor degrees and having mastered basic grammar and spelling principles make me so undesirable and inferior to men. Should have warned the boyfriends who bedded me to go to a clinic…hopefully they don’t catch the retard. You win again, oh great one!’
””””””””””’
I am a great one.
One question.
Are you retired?
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Hofmann
How is this guy a hero? He killed other people’s family members. Seriously, I’m sure if this guy had killed your wife you wouldn’t call him a hero. Again, this seems to be about not getting a certain “level” or “type” of woman that you are suppose to have.
Heck, at the college I went to many girls were looked upon as failures if they didn’t have that ring by mid junior year. Girls would straight up go to my University because of its record of people getting married (11 percent).
One girl was so in love w/my husband by that she lost 75lbs, started smoking, and got a nose job. He was a shy guy w/a lot of friends (and she was one of his best friends at first) but he seriously never knew she was in love with him, and she seriously thought he wouldn’t date a heavier girl. I know not all colleges are like this, but it is pretty easier to find out what colleges are like this, or what cities are full of single women.
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“One thing that must be said is that the man wasn’t just missing sex. He was missing touch!
He was touch deficient and it is a bigger problem than lack of sex.”
A few years ago, someone ran with that idea and created possibly one of the creepiest/weirdest businesses to cash in on it, the Cuddle Party. A more elegant solution, in my opinion, would be to find some European or Brazilian women and become casual friends or acquaintances with them. That way, a “touch deficient” man can at least get to brush cheeks with some pretty women. Plus, the language/cultural gaps might obscure the negative social cues a “touch deficient” American man might give off to American women.
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Arpagus
Listen asshole, you do nothing but damage to the MRA cause with stupid stuff like this.
Maybe you should be peremptorily thrown into prison.
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@Really: “No one, for all of our history, has ever given two shits about making women feel like PEOPLE.”
That’s something, particularly considering the context of this post, that can only be answered with art:
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doug flashing beta, for example
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”””””””doug1
Arpagus
George Sodini is an MRA hero as much a reason to learn game. Finally a mass murderer writes a relatively coherent manifesto. Could be better, but at least it is implied that feminism is to blame and he is taking a last stand. I had been waiting for this (almost thinking I had to do it myself) and I am impressed. Kudos.
Listen asshole, you do nothing but damage to the MRA cause with stupid stuff like this.
Maybe you should be peremptorily thrown into prison.”””””””””””””””’
Why doug men dieing for a reason is what will change the system. Nothing else is gonna work.
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“legalize prostitution now
give joe’s mom a job”
ahahahahhahahahha.. hilarious
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Interesting theory, however, it does appear to be a part of the settling of accounts many men undertake prior to suicide. Also, before he was sure about his plan, he may not have wanted to pay 18 years of back child support, which would probably erase about half of his net worth.
Whatever the case, I hadn’t considered the idea that he may not have mentioned it due to there being some question as to whether the child was his. Glad you brought it up.
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Really — I doubt you’d complain if it was George Clooney, or Brad Pitt, or Leo Dicaprio bothering you in line. Because it’s “icky, low status betas” it’s terrible.
It’s like the Tom Brady sexual harrassment skit on SNL. Women LOVE to be approached by top Alphas. If Brady and Clooney pestered you could not get enough of it. It’s the guys who look like George Costanza who frost your mug.
Well, you only have yourself and fellow women to blame. The average guy won’t do well in bars and other places where looks and instant Tom Brady status predominate. So they’re CONSTANTLY on the prowl and will approach EVERY woman with a pulse who is between 18-40, 5 and above. Hoping to get lucky one time out of 200.
If you don’t like that, you better change the marketplace. Create lots of mediated, day-meet places where the sexes dance and mingle and “vouching” means as much as how the bad boy tingle down there makes you feel. Then men won’t approach you on the street — they don’t like it any more than you do, since their rejection rate is probably 90% and it’s humiliating. They’ll have a safe alternative and men would love to make three approaches, and succeed once, for a fail rate of “only” 66%, vs. a 90% fail rate and literally thousands of rejections.
But you like the system, the way it is, so you’ll just have to take the good with the bad. Picking up Tom Brady types in bars and what have you guarantees that men will hit on you all the time. Until you are no longer pretty — which will happen sooner than you think.
Then men will ignore you like your mother gets ignored. Study her. That’s your future.
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ya know, something about LR makes me want to corn-hole her.
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[editor: perhaps they came, they read, and they agreed? or maybe they all spontaneously orgasmed upon sight of my wonderworks and in their pleasurable spasming couldn’t muster the fine motor control to post a scathing comment.]
Might explain why Keith hasn’t said anything either.
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Maybe I’m missing something here but someone else must have opined that the reason this guy couldn’t get laid was because he was fucked in the head.
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@ smoothvirus
…pretty much what I said.
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Kick a bitch: “ya know, something about LR makes me want to corn-hole her.”
Dr Lupo has it figured out for you: it’s her face.
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i think dude was on to something
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@ Ovid
Because the Manson girls were equally screwed up. Read “Helter Skelter” if you want a real look into their life at Spahn Ranch…they were all nuts.
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huh… i wouldn’t mind dropping a load on her face as well. i bet she’s into that sort of thing too
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I certainly couldn’t wade through the whole discussion, but this kind of polarity of behavior is really just cumulative sexual frustration. After my first real break up, my mood was on the whole dampened through not having a sexual outlet, and that was by choice. I can’t imagine being unable to get laid.
I often feel sorry for nice, quality, moderately attractive guys who just can’t get a girlfriend because of social ineptitude. Or lack of game. Or whatever you want to call it. I’ve often thought about doing those sorts of men out of pity. Meanwhile, dog-faced whales can still get cock.
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“…pretty much what I said.”
Hey bozo,get a load of this:
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/criminal_mind/psychology/s_k_groupies/3.html
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Really?,
Actually, I can relate to Women’s unfortunate experience of being approached unwarranted by Men.
Just last week, while out on a nice evening bus ride coming back from the avenue w/my Brown Sugah, a Woman grabbed for my crotch by calling herself falling on me. She did it several times, in plain view of my Woman, and several other passengers.
I’ve also been blatantly hit on by Women in the presence of my Woman, and I didn’t like it. Mainly because crass behavior, especially coming from Women, turns me off.
I’ve been propositioned numerous times down through the years by Women, almost all of them unwarranted. I have no problem saying that it left me feeling quite violated, to say the least.
The problem is though, that there aren’t any places where Women and Men can get together *with the express understanding that the former will be approached by the latter*. There aren’t any more church socials. The bar and club have replaced this, w/its Everyman/woman for his/her self themes. As w/all pyramid schemes, it works for the few, at the often painful expense of the many.
O
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Ok, now I want to see that casual connections picture.
I hate to agree with whiskey, since he is so fond of the generalizations/hyperbole, but, as much as it hurts me to say it:
I’ve seen this before as well. Some women have sex appeal out of proportion to their looks.
Shakespeare’s “Dark Lady” was one of these, apparently.
However, when you get the incredibly rare combination of extremely good looks and mystical sex appeal you have the kind of woman who can wreck empires (Cleopatra, Helen, etc.).
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Roissy–
In the large majority of the most primitive tribes in all kinds of ecosystems, most men eventually get wives. Further the getting of a wife is rarely left totally up to her gina tingles. It’s instead often largely a tribal decision dependent on his social and warrior and maybe hunting status within the tribe and then his choice. Roughly analogous to status and money today. Though he might not want to choose someone really unhappy about it, but she’ll be propagandized big. Most societies have been somewhat polygamous in what they allow for the highest status men, but as well the great majority of marriages within them have been monogamous or serial monogamous, as is true in Islam today, where less than 3% of marriages are polygamous.
As well girl stealing was often the major reason for tribal warfare in primitive tribes. The stolen girls didn’t get to choose their mates most often. (They also might not end up staying with the first one though.)
The gina tingle method of solely girl choice mate selection from a socially almost unrestricted range of the male population has never been as true anywhere in human history, that I’m aware of. We are in uncharted territory. If we are in a throwback to ancestral conditions, they are probably more pre homo sapiens monkey ancestral ones, rearing up in girls’ hindbrains, as all social restraints most cultural ones are for ideological reasons taken off and allowed – for the first time as humans ever.
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“If you don’t like that, you better change the marketplace. Create lots of mediated, day-meet places where the sexes dance and mingle and “vouching” means as much as how the bad boy tingle down there makes you feel.”
Don’t these options already exist? E.g., church brunches, the “It’s Just Lunch” dating service, etc.
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Haha, that was actually funny for once. Guess even a stopped clock is right twice a day. 😉
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No sympathies. Let society fall and perish.
One issue not identified on this site is the way bright and gifted kids are forced into the same closed environment as low-IQ aggressors from a very early age. The current school system obviously did not exist in prehistoric times, in which a high-IQ introvert could EASILY dispatch the low-IQ aggressor in a socially approved manner — the bully simply disappeared, and no one gave a fuck, or if they did, they figured, given the primitive system of justice, that the bully deserved it somehow.
Yes, they will call this beta a monster, call him mentally ill — fuck all you bipolar/Aspie hypocrites — because he simply did not tolerate the intolerable.
It’s destiny at work — the world has a reason for everything. People don’t shoot up buildings, women and alpha fucks for kicks.
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–Therefore since my son and I have a good normal relationship, the chances of him being “messed up” are actually really slim. (mostly because I don’t have BAD male influence in his life at all)–
Pure fucking idiocy. Men raise boys not women. Christ, do you ever watch the Discovery Channel? When juvenile male elephants mature without adult male oversight they go crazy and act violently towards all. It is the same in humans. Dad is incredible important because without Dad, the house only has the weak mother. Mom may be strong but she is always irrational. Any woman who denies her children a father figure is a bitch. The fact that you do so, indicates that you care not for the truth or your own children. You care only for yourself and are willing to distort reality to satisfy your emotions.
–A more elegant solution, in my opinion, would be to find some European or Brazilian women and become casual friends or acquaintances with them. That way, a “touch deficient” man can at least get to brush cheeks with some pretty women. Plus, the language/cultural gaps might obscure the negative social cues a “touch deficient” American man might give off to American women.–
The normal hugs from Brazilians are great. But my guess is that the man would not have the courage or confidence to overcome his American upbringing to enjoy a hug. He would refuse. Then he would build up the confidence to go for the hug, but it would be too late after months of refusal. I speak from experience on that issue as well. It so hard when you are introverted but good yet get nothing. Then you have to listen to bitches “dog” men in your position. The shooter decided that he couldn’t overcome his inhibitions to meet women and that life was not worth the suffering. So he made a statement. The dumb ass women on this website cannot grasp that a society built around the emotional demands of women is going to prove unstable.
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Sodini?
I think not.
notice david alexander and lilgirl haven’t posted here since the tragic event.
coincidence?
i’d say it was finefantastic! but that Government Vicodin works wonders for gnarly canucks.
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50 rounds and only 3 dead women? Pfft, that the best you can do America? Looks like my high score still stands:
Marc Lépine (October 26, 1964 – December 6, 1989) was a 25-year-old man from Montreal, Quebec who murdered fourteen women and wounded ten women and four men at the École Polytechnique, an engineering school affiliated with the Université de Montréal, in “the Montreal Massacre”, also known as “the École Polytechnique massacre”.
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hey joey – I really didn’t know you appreciated whop jokes.
you’re ok
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damn. i have a new
job opening just
tailor made
for you
how do you feel about black midgets?
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“Do you have a point? ’”
Yes. Reductio ad absurdum.
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Obsidian, women may be the gatekeepers of consensual sex, but men are the actual gatekeepers of sex.
With the exception of a very few societies that purposefully instructed women in the martial arts and defense of their fellow women, men have been the ones deciding who has access and who doesn’t.
So a lot of the problem is that feminism and social movements leading up to it, let men off the hook on a family/clan level, and women are deciding who to and not to have sex with, largely with little or no male guidance or enforcement power.
So for the most part, men have sold their chances of getting a good wife for the very slight chance of getting a few bangs from a hot chick.
:: passes the popcorn ::
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@ Hofmann’s & Once Touchless:
Some reasons are more valid than other reasons. Some ‘statements’ are more valid than other ‘statements’.
The Virginia Tech shooter also had his reasons and statements. Charles Manson had reasons and statements. Et cetera.
“dumb ass women on this website cannot grasp that a society built around the emotional demands of women is going to prove unstable.”
This is absolutely true. But it does not change the fact that society is made up of accountable individuals. Clearly, most betas are not reacting to the sexual marketplace the way this man did. So you have to wonder if one can really use his actions as a litmus test for where society is headed.
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IT sucks? If you live somewhere worth living, an intermediate developer can easily make 100k a year. I know senior developers making 150k. I don’t even want to know what my team lead makes. If you don’t make much money in IT, it’s likely you don’t have a degree, and don’t have any in-demand skills.
The industry averages are in the 75K – 100K range with degree and “in demand” skills. I’ve done a lot of contract work and I actually think those averages sound high based on what I’ve seen. Though there could be selection bias in my observations, i.e. I’m getting contract jobs at places which won’t pay enough to get full time employees who can handle the more technical and difficult work which ends up handed off to me. The places that pay more don’t seek my services because they have people who can handle all their needs.
Having said that, even $150k in a place that’s worth living isn’t much. $75k, closer to the true average, is nothing. You cannot have a house, wife, and kids on $75k a year in most places that have a decent demand for IT work. I have a friend in another field who makes $120k a year and his wife just went back to work because they weren’t making it. Shit, to have a nice existence where I live requires at least $120k a year for a single man, and that would still be considered middle class at best. I don’t personally know anyone in IT with an upper middle class existence. Anyone. Granted the housing market has imploded, but during the 90’s and most of the 2000’s I had friends and family in housing (construction, escrow, real estate) who could buy and sell IT workers all day long, and they didn’t need college degrees or debt to do it. Watching them it slowly dawned on me that I was no where near upper middle class, and probably never would be in IT short of a miracle (i.e. a valuable patent or hit software product that I create and license).
Hell, the plumber who recently fixed my house and sounded like he dropped out of high school pulls more per hour than anyone I know in IT.
I know there are places in the country where the kind of money available in IT buys a lot more, but then those places don’t tend to have a high demand for IT, or pay those salaries for what IT work is available.
What’s not captured in the salary statistics is the number of guys who have been laid off and are unable to find any more full time work. I know plenty of IT people who have left the field for this reason. It’s an odd field to me because as jobs were exported and/or visa workers imported, salaries didn’t drop as much as one might expect. Instead people just found themselves completely out of work.
My other warning regarding IT is going to make me sound a little spoiled, but it’s the way I feel about it: most of the work is just boring and repetitious. Every once in a while I’ll get a project which reminds me of why I loved programming in HS and college. But the stuff that pays the bills is the same old business database / web site / intranet app / “me to” BS over and over again. Only the select few get to work on stuff that’s cool, challenging, and exciting. I guess that’s true of any field though.
Back to the main point, there’s not a good future in IT, at least not in this country. Foreign competition will continue to erode the market. Again, I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone. (HS has written on this topic a few times and I think would concur.)
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Nicole,
…what?
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IT is for losers. it sucks.
What hi iq fuck wants to take credit for the outstanding job he did
on Windows Vista
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“Manhood is a SKILL”
I wish that had been written on my bedroom wall in foot-tall letters when I was growing up.
I thought Game in BK was writing my biography way up above. When I was 18 and in college, girls used to say I looked like Arnold Schwarzenegger. This was about the time he was in Predator, so I’d say that was a compliment. But they didn’t want to sleep with me, because I was “too nice.” Fifteen years later, 60 pounds heavier with far less hair, and so broke the only date I could offer was a rented movie in my bedroom, I had far more luck with women because I finally learned some game. (Nowhere near mastered it, just learned a little.)
Attitude is everything for a guy who’s even halfway ordinary. Whether it could have helped this nut, who knows.
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””””””’My other warning regarding IT is going to make me sound a little spoiled, but it’s the way I feel about it: most of the work is just boring and repetitious. Every once in a while I’ll get a project which reminds me of why I loved programming in HS and college. But the stuff that pays the bills is the same old business database / web site / intranet app / “me to” BS over and over again. Only the select few get to work on stuff that’s cool, challenging, and exciting. I guess that’s true of any field though.””””””
Got to save money and move past the bs. I mean you can ge an apartment in nyc for 800 a month. You could share and get it cheaper. So really it is your choice about this nice lifestye. How the fuck could it ever be a nice lifestyle if you are always accountable to some bs.
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I’m trying to think of how to turn this thing back…
I’m thinking there should be a male epiphany day or something, during which the men of every family gather together to talk about how they are going to rein in their women.
Maybe it can’t start out with a violent veto reminder…just talk about how you really feel about say, your mom showing any cleavage, or your sister going to clubs.
Guys should get really really honest about how they feel about the behavior of the women in their families, and stop hiding because it’s not politically correct.
It means the women are probably going to tell you how unfair you’re being…so for awhile, maybe humor them. Tell them that if they give up acting like sluts, you’ll give up chasing sluts. Something. Anything to get the sanity back.
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yep – that Anniston marriage thing worked out well for that poor, choiceless Brad Pitt
poor bastard, relegated to consoling himself with Angelina’s lips on his cockhead
mout
today – this place is as lively as a VT reunion
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@ Cannon’s Cannon:
? What pretty lie did I purvey? Honestly curious. Maybe you disagree with something I wrote, fine. But which pretty lie did I promulgate? Specifics please.
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Firepower, the internal politics of whores and gigolos are not my concern.
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hey michael vick still gets tons of pussy – mssr. Slaydini should’ve learnt a valuable social skill – like tossing a ball around – if he wanted hordes of hot, intelligent female labia seeking his cock.
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@ Cannon:
The only pretty lie I might have purveyed is that humanity could adapt to the shifted sexual paradigm rather than perish.
What can I say, hope keeps me going.
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I guarantee you that you could not go 20 years feeling hopeless that you’ll never have sex again and remain sane.
Been there. Doing it. Wearing the t-shirt even as I type.
A poster upthread commented about taking one’s focus from the sexual arena and applying it to other areas of life. Yes. That’s what you do to remain sane.
It works. And it IS work.
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so, what are you doing here? loosen up. don’t be so frigid
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Huh? Dude, I’m 28 I can’t be a cougar.
ROTFLMAO!
Second, I could care less if men or women pay attention to me because unless they have something to offer me, other people are relatively useless in the sense of what you’re saying here.
You’re an attention whore, something that is obvious to everyone here.
Furthermore, how would my son end up Beta when I openly oppose beta-ness and lazy people?
Your son will end up beta because there is no father in his life. It takes a man to raise one.
Check the stats. They don’t lie.
Ever read what the stats say about boys raised by single mothers?
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looking from the 60s, the world certainly looked like a very bad place. After almost 50 years, no one can deny that:
women are amoral and fickle creatures largely incapable of having political rights. Rome considered women at the same level of children in political rights. The Romans were correct.
Blacks should not have free movement. The cost imposed on a few nice blacks is too low compared with the huge costs the huge majority of blacks impose on society, both black and non-black. Like women, blacks should have no voting rights
gays look cool, and mostly are genetically related (i.e. they are form your race) to you, but homosexual lifestyle is a disease time-bomb. Homosexual prey on children and their lifestyle is the single greatest incubator and disseminator of the most deadly diseases
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wow, sorry A-Bax. after re-reading your first post, you purveyed no pretty lies.
i was thrown off when you opened by calling sodini’s “a sad case.”
certainly, we can call this event “sad.” i mistakenly thought you were labeling the man, not the incident. in other words, dismissing his rationale with a paltry put-down. sincerest apologies!
A-Bax REDACTED from list!!!!
CARRY ON, SIR!
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@ Cannon’s Cannon:
ROFL
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anyway, financial capitalism is so productive that we have a duel of titans now: in one side, women, blacks and gays trying to unleash their true selves and destroy civilization. On the other side, a small minority of uber productive men unbounded by capitalism to produce unthinkable wealth trying to keep civilization
I say the sooner the “cool order” collapses and women, blacks and gays are put in their places, the better
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I can’t imagine being unable to get laid. I often feel sorry for nice, quality, moderately attractive guys who just can’t get a girlfriend because of social ineptitude. Or lack of game. Or whatever you want to call it. I’ve often thought about doing those sorts of men out of pity. Meanwhile, dog-faced whales can still get cock.
At least some women understand life is very different for men in this respect.
If you ever did decide to fuck a beta friend you could really help him out and teach him some things. On the other hand you run the risk that he will suffer oneitis and cling to you, then become really hurt when it doesn’t work out.
If you ever do decide to engage in the mercy work of helping a loser beta sexually (and God bless you if you do, you will be doing the work of angels ;-), be very clear to him that you are not his girlfriend or future wife, but that you are only helping him learn some of the things he needs to find those.
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Rome82:
To be fair, telling a self-professed lesser beta like Arpagus to “kill himself” is not a pretty lie. Who wants a beta male anyway?
I found flaw with your reasoning behind that emotion though. Arpagus simply expressed a great comradeship with this particular beta who acted out against his frustration, albeit not constructively. It is the endgame to what surely must be many betas’ thought experiments.
Doesn’t mean you yourself are beta, just that you’re failing to relate.
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DT, i’ve been there and i really think it does guys more a disservice. doesn’t help your self esteem much once you see it for the pity fuck that it is. in hindsight, i’d rather have just kept on jerking off and kept the shred of self respect that i had, lol.
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@ Obsidian
> That discussion nearly a decade, among other things, really sharpened my thinking as to whenever I wanted to get to the root of a problem. I simply learned to ask-who benefits from this situation?
Indeed. As Stalin once said: Who Whom? It applies to every aspect of interpersonal relations.
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He wrote
“Planned to do this in the summer but figure to stick around to see the election outcome,”
LOL. Too bad there wasn’t an exciting international crisis to keep him around for longer.
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Roger that, Cannon…appreciate the look-back & the honesty.
Now where are those feminista-jezebal twats? Cowering in fear? 😉
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DT, i’ve been there and i really think it does guys more a disservice. doesn’t help your self esteem much once you see it for the pity fuck that it is. in hindsight, i’d rather have just kept on jerking off and kept the shred of self respect that i had, lol.
Depends on the woman. A one night pity stand is damaging. A woman who actually does care and is trying to teach you a few things while fucking you for a little bit can actually help a lot.
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–Oh, and OneTouch? If you knew my situation at all, you’d know why no dad is better than HIS dad. If you think an abusive parent is better than no parent, you clearly led a very charmed and sheltered life. You have no opinion here because the fact you think I’m illogical and “too emotional” to raise a “man” means you know absolutely nothing about me and are just looking for someone to take your woman-hate out on.–
I don’t hate women at all; quite to the contrary. I never claimed that you should be with the boy’s father. There is no shortage of men who would be happy to raise your boy. Through your choices, you deny your son a father figure. Men and women are very, very different creatures. There are many things I tell my son and which resonate with him that do not resonate with his sister. Find the best man you can and give your child a father. Do not deny him the knowledge of life that only a man can pass to a boy.
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Al, you gotta admit Whiskey nailed you on that one, and its something Women need to be really honest about. So long as you got either mad Game, or serious status or preferably both, you might as well not even waste your time stepping to halfway decent and above young Women such as yourself.
And then, deal w/the aftermath that’s surely to come.
Not saying that its right or fair, or that I’d do it myself; just saying that’s Life. And in Life, there are always tradeoffs. This, is one of those.
O
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The Rookie:
Your pretty lie was nominating this guy for BoTY. That award is a shaming device.
Morality can behoove us to label Sodini shamefully. However, he seems to have fulfilled his personal directive, misguided or not. He took monumental action to address his deficiencies head-on; he does not fit in amongst those nominees.
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Firepower says, “so, what are you doing here? loosen up. don’t be so frigid”
You know, guys have been telling me that since puberty.
I understand that they say that for their benefit, not mine.
I do not, nor have I ever wished to become a sperm dump for men who consider me substandard…and managed to avoid this until I came to Israel, and got a taste of what it is like to be on the wrong end of a hate campaign that people actually take seriously.
I learned something.
Nobody is going to reward me for not having self respect. The only slight chance I have of a whiff of respect from others comes only because of a hard core love and respect for myself.
In other words, nobody loves a pussy…especially not one that’s wide open to all takers.
Women who are still women know this. Men should learn it, and reteach it to their mothers, sisters, daughters, girlfriends, and wives who might have forgotten.
If everybody got the women in their own family back to some semblance of sanity, then there would be sane women to go around.
There just won’t be any more fat ugly girls available for the bottomfeeders among you to exploit the insecurities of.
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maybe muslims are right to restrict the ability of single men to interact with gaggles of free range cameltoe they can’t have
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”””””on August 5, 2009 at 4:58 pm A-Bax
Roger that, Cannon…appreciate the look-back & the honesty.
Now where are those feminista-jezebal twats? Cowering in fear? ”””””””’
Yea really was kind of weak sauce.
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@obsidian
how so, and where? I agreed with his point discussing another’s comments.
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@ Cannon’s Canon: Duly noted.
I don’t lack empathy–I have a different definition of it. Encouraging a victim/defeatist mindset like the one Arpagus continually expresses is doing more harm than good. To label Sodini a hero, or a fulfilling representative, is horribly misguided. That construct was what I attacked.
If Sodini in fact “took monumental action to address his deficiencies head-on,” as you say, then he would be a hero.
Sodini capitulated to his deficiencies, was mastered by them, rather than addressing them. He addressed his frustrations–not his deficiencies.
Arpagus should be looking to PUAs, not indulging in the same unhealthy mindset that led Sodini down his dark road.
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Arpagus–
Given what a dominating Harridan his mother apparently was to everyone, who can blame the father for leaving – if she didn’t leave him?
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Subcomandante Dave
Hear hear.
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@ Cannon’s Canon:
I disagree. Roissy described him as a beta. He went 20 years without sex. Some of the BOTM winners actually got laid. This guy was clearly lower than them. Just from the 20 year dry-spell, he’s clearly repugnant enough to be omega.
And he insured that he would never, ever get laid again.
If the guy didn’t kill anyone, and still blogged about his loserness, he’d be a clear winner. The fact that he kills others and commits suicide means he’s undeserving of shame? I have no sympathy for those who commit suicide, even to escape years of child payments. Real men man up.
As for him achieving some personal directive, and taking monumental action… sure, monumentally bad actions. That’s what makes him BOTY. His actions were so monumental, and finite, that he assured he’d never get laid again. Roissy’s whole post suggests that studying game, which isn’t that big a step in comparison to murder/suicide, would have saved lives and helped him. He chose the opposite. Clearly he had no clue.
BOTY
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I’m surprised “Really?” is the only jezebel fug to come over here.
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”””””’doug1
Subcomandante Dave
Safe, affordable blow jobs. In a society as sex obsessed as America it is spectacularly incongruous that prostitution is illegal, it only makes sense if viewed as a means to make men’s lives miserable.
Hear hear.”””””””
Seconded.
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Game (PUA) tells men that it’s ok- to be a fucking man.
I have a dick and I want to fuck you- this desire is my God-given right.
You may not want to fuck me back- and that is your right- but i am sure that the next girl I see- does.
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Hey, I’m all for the game, when it involves consensual players, and I think a lot of the criticism of men for “pick up techniques” is pretty overblown, as there really isn’t misogyny or ill-will behind it the vast majority of the time.
But Roissy, don’t you think that the division of men into “alphas/betas” that you’re premised on is part of the problem? I mean, sure, you see it as something that women impose on men; but by buying into the division you legitimize the argument that men who act a particular way DESERVE to be socially ostracized/alienated from women?
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giggles I say the sooner the “cool order” collapses and women, blacks and gays are put in their places, the better
I can picture you on the front line of the upcoming war with your slingshot in one hand and your super soaker in the other.
Wakeup on your day of deployment and kiss the blowup doll goodbye before you go off to war. Or maybe you should give her to DA to look after. You can be sure he will defile her but hey, you won’t need a paternity test.
One touchless I don’t hate women at all; quite to the contrary. I never claimed that you should be with the boy’s father. There is no shortage of men who would be happy to raise your boy. Through your choices, you deny your son a father figure. Men and women are very, very different creatures. There are many things I tell my son and which resonate with him that do not resonate with his sister. Find the best man you can and give your child a father. Do not deny him the knowledge of life that only a man can pass to a boy.
A new voice of reason around these parts.
* looks over to the bartender*
This man’s drinks are on me.
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What needs doing I think is creating a lot more mediated spaces for men and women. “Just Lunch” and other stuff lacks the critical input — OLDER WOMEN who know the men well and can sort through the BS bad boy tingle for suitability for long term relationships:
“He’s shy but loaded and treats his sister nice, he’d make a good husband.” [This was indeed Mr. Darcy]
“He’s outgoing but got two girls pregnant and abandoned them, you’ll be number three.”
“He never sticks with any girls longer than three months.”
“He has five DUIs and beat up his last girlfriend when she was pregnant.”
All of those things serve to put the brakes on women making the decisions by tingle instead of their heads. It gives Joe Average upstanding guy a break, and makes women care the most about … what other (older) women who have more social power think of them. As not airheads, bimbos, or losers but together young women who choose the best (but not perfect) guy for them, who does inspire romantic and sexual feelings, but also “deep” compatibility. This was basically how Western Society was run.
—————————
DT is too right on IT. I also have been getting “in-between” gigs, stuff too complicated for cheap on-staff, or too demanding of client handholding for Indian cheap outsourcing, but not enough to get a full time staff to handle. This is particularly true for website development.
I want to thank Microsoft for screwing over folks who were running Windows 98-ME-NT-XP, with aging client-server programs that need porting over to the Web. Thanks for Vista/Seven! That’s basically a good chunk of my business. Machine falls over, “oh my god we need to get ported ASAP” and clients need hand-holding. But it’s a crap business. A lot of folks just got canned, with no replacement. Nobody invests if they can avoid it in IT spending. [I think there’s a lot of black market stuff on Hackintoshes, but that’s another issue — Apple really screwed themselves by making a desirable system but too pricey.]
———————-
I’m not surprised this guy came out of IT. The problem is not the guy who shoots up a health club full of aerobics women he doesn’t know. It’s a hundred guys who are like him who just don’t give a damn to being hostile to women. This has never, ever, worked out well.
Everything has it’s price.
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I think the question about whether betas deserve to be shunned by women or used as emotional tampons is as pointless a topic for prolonged debate as whether fat hoes deserved to be shunned by men or used as blubbery pump-and-dump sperm receptables.
All that matters is are they unwanted or not? And if not, what can they do to turn it around? Dwelling on whether or not its deserved is a waste of time.
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See, we was having such a nice and fruitful discussion until Gig goes and gets to talking outta the side of his neck:
G: looking from the 60s, the world certainly looked like a very bad place. After almost 50 years, no one can deny that:
G: women are amoral and fickle creatures largely incapable of having political rights. Rome considered women at the same level of children in political rights. The Romans were correct.
O: Imposition of such “tests” are strictly prohibted by the US Constitution I believe, as well as later legislation pertaining to voting rights. Women may indeed be fickle and amoral, but neither are considerations, legally under American federal law, as to whether an American citizen may or may not cast his or her vote. Y’all may do it differently in Brazil however.
G: Blacks should not have free movement. The cost imposed on a few nice blacks is too low compared with the huge costs the huge majority of blacks impose on society, both black and non-black. Like women, blacks should have no voting rights
O: First off, the vast majority of African Americans live among other African Americans, and their civic franchise as Americans was a hard won RIGHT. And I’m sure Obama and the DNC would strongly disagre w/your notion that Black folk having the vote was a bad idea. Oh, and “restricted movement” was rightly killed by the 1954 Brown v Board of Education US Supreme Court decision, which was brilliantly argued by the late great Thurgood Marshall, who Clarence Thomas couldn’t carry the former’s sweaty jockstrap. I’m just sayin.
G: gays look cool, and mostly are genetically related (i.e. they are form your race) to you, but homosexual lifestyle is a disease time-bomb. Homosexual prey on children and their lifestyle is the single greatest incubator and disseminator of the most deadly diseases
O: Uhh, the vast majority of pedophiles aren’t out Gay Men. Second, any diseases Gay Men have are largely contained and limited to them, ie HIV. In the USA (unlike Brazil I hear, where transexualism runs rampant and HIV testing isn’t as high quality as in the USA-recall Darren James), the vast majority of total such cases are to be found within the Gay Male Community.
C’mon Gig, don’t be a buzzkill here.
The Obsidian
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signs you are full of shit:
1. chic noir calls yours a “voice of reason”
2. tbd
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@cannon’s canon- read what I highlighted, then come at me. A boy need’s a (mentally sound)father,the end.
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gig,
hmm… if no one can deny it… you know, i’m just going to deny it anyway.
you make the same mistake that progressives make. you imagine some utopia in your mind and rationalize a whole set of injustices that flow from the real world not living up to your imagined fantasy land. the problem with what you’re proposing is that you ignore the costs of maintaining such a system.
there’s a reason that the south is stereotyped as being filled with rednecks and yokels. all that time and energy southern states spent keeping blacks in their place throughout slavery and jim crow was time and energy that could have been spent on educating their populations and developing industries. slavery and jim crow did very little for the average white man in the south. it was really just a means for the planter elite to have cheap labor and keep themselves on the type of the social hierarchy.
roissy is right. the answer is not turning women into indentured sex servants or building black townships. the answer is game. if you don’t have any, then get some. all you betas, please quit your collective bitching. some of you guys sound like the mirror image of the feministing commenters.
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Obsidian
See, we was having such a nice and fruitful discussion until Gig goes and gets to talking outta the side of his neck:
gig is a troll in the same vein that GNP is. Don’t let gig sidetrack the discussion. Blog host should put gig and gnp on comment moderation to see if comment sections flows smoother when the two aren’t around.
They could take some hints from biting beaver and aveola on the art of being an amusing troll.
I can’t put lurker or willard in with the other two because there are times when both make good points and/or have interesting things to add.
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As a woman, I can’t help but laugh at the true idiocy of these comments. All the losers here are either celibate because they’re not worth fucking let alone loving (probably because you’re still living out your third and fourth adolescence) or they have girlfriends and wives who would divorce them in one hot minute if they ever saw these ridiculous comments.
I do agree that it is far easier to get laid being a woman than it is for a man, and I have no problem with that.
Goodnight losers!
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Firepower:
I was referring to pity-fucking men who would probably get fucked with a marginal amount of game, but who, as it is, are involuntarily celibate.
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I would accept a pityfuck from one of my JewCrushes.
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roissy to madras are you a woman? because only a woman could be ignorant or disbelieving of the multitudes of sexless men in her midst,
*puts hand up to God*
Yea, I really really really didn’t know this before reading it here. I figured most people got some at least once or twice a month. I thought the people not getting any where the very unattractive and socially awkward. *And even those two groups can always pay for it.
It might be something to get the word out to most women.. On the otherhand, it probably won’t changes things but at least most women won’t be ignorant of the fact.
and of how much more difficult it is for the average man to get laid than it is for the average woman
now this I was well aware of. I think most women know this because of the sheer amount of attention they get on a daily bases from men.
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Cannon’s Canon,
How have I perpetrated any pretty lies? That the guy was Not Right in some fundamental way is something a number of posters have opined. That he had a problems with his mother, mostly-absent father, and bullying brother, and that he apparently had a very difficult time relating to anyone, not only women, is stated clearly in his screed.
If he had some sort of personality disorder, as it appears he might have, then odds are good that it was developing before he even got to the age of asking women out/being rejected by them.
I have no more insight into his plight than you do: all we have to go on are the ramblings of an unbalanced murderer. Theorizing that he was a little off before he ever got rejected in a dating environment is hardly the stuff of pretty lies.
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@obs- you shouldn’t have bit on that one, it was a ludicrous and unrealistic comment.
@al, obs-
*in voice of butthead* heheheh. heheheh. heheheh.
@dana-
lol- another striking phrase from you. but- just the cameltoe? what, we’re supposed to be interested in oddly shaped patterns of fabric? it’s the pussy underneath, doll, as you know perfectly well. why so uncharacteristically indirect?
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DT, its true, you can learn a lot.. being the beta fuck buddy for a few months, the sort of guy she’d half heartedly fool around with in private but wouldn’t want to be seen with in public, really opened my eyes to a lot of what roissy is preaching. i think that’s when i really started to think about the dichotomy between what women want, and what women say they want, and really to just be more mindful of their fickle natures in general instead of putting chicks up on a pedestal all the time.
but still in this sort of scenario, the poor male subject is almost certain to get clingy just like i got clingy; i think that is perhaps a defining trait of the beta, is that it is too difficult to seperate out just sex from wanting a real relationship, developing an emotional connection. and when it ends (invariably, badly) the guy is almost certain to be worse for the wear. it took me a while to patch myself up after that one, and in some regards i still think my sense of self respect isn’t what it used to be. bitch stole what little mojo i had in the first place; rather counterproductive, really.
i think my issue with it now, in hindsight, is that it’s just not dealing from a position of strength. better just to see her for the cheap slut she is and avoid getting tangled up in it in the first place, or be damn sure you can just use her for the sex and toss her. but if you can do that, you’re already alpha enough so as to not need the tutorial.
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really?,
i’m tempted to start an argument with you whether it’s better to deal with too much hassle or to be completely free of it and rendered invisible in the sexual marketplace. it’s tempting, but what’s the point?
rather, i just hope you will remember you own words one day when you’re old and wrinkled and shamelessly flirting with any man in site just so you can once more know the pleasures of being desired. all women will eventually learn what it’s like to be a beta male. father time makes sure of that.
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Holy jesus fucking shit, his log is SCREAMING “I AM VIOLENT BECAUSE I AM DEPRIVED OF WOMEN” I’ll be eager to see what the pc police concoct as his motivation other than his crippling involuntary celibacy. Women are unblameable, rest assured his deprivation will be entirely painted as a symptom of his insanity, and in no way a cause. When a relatively intelligent, good looking (6.5-7 on pure look), hard working slighly above average straight white man is less likely to procreate than a violent thug/drug dealer/unemployed biker, our society will start seeing the effects in a few generations.
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@Chic, and other people who are saying it’s easier for women because we get more attention.
Sure, we get a lot of offers for sex, but women don’t usually want only sex. We want relationships.
Some of us have been convinced (hello Firepower) to *settle* for less than this, but in doing so, it reduces our value to potential partners who might have wanted more than that.
So the best thing for a girl to do is keep her legs closed and hold out for a commitment. The lower her perceived social value the more obviously chaste she should be. For western women, this means anybody < 8 should dress very modestly and have tight home skills.
Being alone with your dignity, for women, is better than being a sperm dump. It won't likely result in being alone though…at least not for long. I think many dominant men can "smell" true princesses (and make them their slaves :: evil laughter :: ).
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you are all acting as if the only alternatives are 1. what we have now, a world where betas get nothing or become like this guy and alphas get harems and everything’s bad or 2. what we had before, with monogamy, conservative social structure, etc.
BUT THESE ARE NOT THE ONLY OPTIONS! BETAS HAVE AN ALTERNATIVE OTHER THAN “GAME”
this is to become willing slaves to hot girls and learn to take pleasure in seeing them get serviced by alphas and even to become feminized and hope to serve the alphas sexually themselves!
I have done this with my hot girlfriend when she decided to start fucking a muscular alpha lacrosse player, and I get off on watching him fuck her! And I want to suck him off.
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Chic Noir’s definition of a troll : A person who says inconvenient truths about black people.
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selenium, enjoy basking for this brief moment in the shade of the raised boot that will inevitably come smashing down on you. diseased faggotry won’t tolerated forever, and less and less as the country browns and average IQ drops
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@whiskey- excellent point and detail re the breakdown of the traditional (community, extended-family, intergenerational) aspects of courtship and matchmaking. they had their flaws and constraints, and no doubt many individuals chafed at them over the centuries, but they did maintain stability and community values, in addition to pairing off most the eligible people in a community. there’s a reason that events marking family milestones (weddings, christenings, etc.) are celebrated with meaningful, semi-public rituals. they’re community events, marking the continuity of the generations. the replacement of this with “promiscuous breeding” (a phrase i seem to remember in an essay by Shaw), and the consequences thereof, are what we talk about every day.
i went back and printed that longer Devlin article (i had read the shorter one, the book review) – my weekend reading.
@selenium – pound sand, bro. this is not the place to troll with that shit.
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maurice google “the garbage genration” as well
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http://www.fisheaters.com/garbagegeneration.html
the whole book
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Rome82: “Encouraging a victim/defeatist mindset like the one Arpagus continually expresses is doing more harm than good.”
No one is encouraging this mindset, including Arpagus himself. Your shaming words show you are refusing to acknowledge it altogether.
“To label Sodini a hero, or a fulfilling representative, is horribly misguided.”
It is as misguided as being a beta in the first place. The man had sexual urges that he could not fulfill. After 20 years of depression, homicidal urges manifested. It was easier for him to go on a suicidal killing spree than it was to get laid. If he learned game, he’d be a much bigger hero to betas. As it were, he still found some satisfactory release of those urges.
“If Sodini in fact “took monumental action to address his deficiencies head-on,” as you say, then he would be a hero.”
Again, not nearly as heroic as getting laid with effort, but he satisfied his basic sexual urge in a very roundabout manner. In context, this is more than almost every beta is capable of.
“Sodini capitulated to his deficiencies, was mastered by them, rather than addressing them. He addressed his frustrations–not his deficiencies.”
His sexual frustrations were a product of his deficiencies.
“Arpagus should be looking to PUAs, not indulging in the same unhealthy mindset that led Sodini down his dark road.”
Arpagus DOES look to PUAs and has gotten himself laid through a false display of confidence, which he said has done wonders for his morale, even though the chick was quite beastly. That is the point of this post: game changes the lives of betas.
You can cast stones and call it “a dark road,” but it is a very real predicament for plenty of men.
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@LR,
Unless you want to argue that ALL the people who raised messed up kids of the other gender were messing them up on purpose, then you must concede that some fraction of the parents messed their kids up without knowing they were doing it, and thus your conclusion that he is probably not messed up is untenable because you don’t know what you’re doing to mess him up. It could be entirely unconscious and inadvertent.
The mere fact that you pulled the plug on a bad dad does not mean you’re going to succeed in raising him well. In fact, the odds are considerable that you’re going to fail.
Needless to say, there were choices that came before “his dad or no dad” – like, “sleep with the loser or not” and “keep the loser’s baby or not”.
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Obsidian,
I’m generally a very optimistic guy, but I gotta level with ya: I don’t see any uprising among Women anytime soon about any of this, if anything I see the exact opposite, a push for even more laws and the like to attempt to contain the “problem”. Women gain from the way the game is rigged presently
Don’t forget the Four Horsemen of Male Vengeance. These will happen by 2020 whether women are prepared for them or not.
As I wrote yesterday, lopsided situations can continue for a long time, but when they correct, they correct very fast.
The main article of a guy going on a shooting spree is merely Horseman #4 : Increasing violence against women.
Game, of course, is HorseMan #1.
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He mentions some woman giving him the eye at the gym, but not really attempting to pursue her, as he doesn’t want to get “distracted” from his “mission”.
I think that woman might have subconsciously sensed he was about to kill people. Hence they eye.
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@dana- you are so concerned for my literary wellbeing! thanks. and just ’cause it’s you, i’ll get around to reading everything you recommend. haven’t read that article on fascism/progressivism you recommended last month – it’s on the list. if only i had unlimited time to read everything i want to…
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you’d be me
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Markku
Nice shot.
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@Cannon’s Canon
I see nothing in the original news article, Roissy’s post or the comments that would indicate this individual is a MRA hero (or a hero of any kind), as described by Arpagus in his first comment.
I would go on to say that the last few lines of Arpagus’ comment indicate he is out of touch with reality. If you don’t see that, I must conclude that you too are out of touch with reality.
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@dana
I am not gay! however I do think that betas can learn to take real pleasure in watching studs pleasure hot women, wearing panties and hoping to suck off the alpha studs!
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Fifth, I think and hope that female vengeance against radical feminism will happen before male vengeance really gets to a critical level.
Many women are rolling back to a more sane lifestyle, and requiring some manhood of men, and benefitting from this.
Hopefully there will be a balance and guys will see there’s more than one way to be alpha. An alpha male is the leader of a social group, and a family is exactly that.
Men go where the pussy’s at, and now that they’re figuring out it’s not at the clubs except for players, maybe they’ll remember when their dad tried to introduce them to a nice girl at church or one of his friend’s daughters who has been on balanced lockdown.
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Obsidian — The Black Community (or White British Underclass) was not always violent. The words that elderly residents spoke to Obama in his first book “Dreams from my Father” and Dalrymple wrote about his own 1950’s upbringing in East London in “Life at the Bottom” are almost identical: both poor, both facing class or racial discrimination, both places absent of violence where kids could play unmolested. The same thing: women wanting higher status men, drove thuggishness to replace cooperation and safety.
However, the cultural effect of gays is terrible. They norm (see the gay troll above) sexual promiscuity among women, gay sexual behavior, polygamy (Barbara Ehrenreich and feminists have joined gay activists in seeking Justice Dept. recognition of polygamy). They make Sex and the City, and other how-to manuals for hypergamy indulgence, and amplify women’s worst instead of best behavior. The replacement of older aunts, family friends, mothers, and older sisters by gays as confidants for women has produced gay male behavior (rampant promiscuity, seeking the most dominant “hot” men, deviant behavior celebrated as norms) to new and unseen heights.
This is why straight men dislike gay men even though on the face of it, gay men should be encouraged (less competition for straight men). It’s their negative influence on women that leads to less sex for all but the biggest Alphas.
Interesting thought experiment. Take Soldini, and instead of an IT man make him a thuggish biker. Keep everything the same, same disconnect from women and others, same resentments towards parents, and older brother, same loneliness. But put him on a pimped-out Harley (and I LIKE Harleys) running with the Mongols or Angels, dealing meth on the side, no money to speak of, a tough persona, and count the number of women he has. Probably a new babe, and hot one, every week.
Ladies, collectively that is the market incentive you create. You CREATE THE THUGS YOU DON’T like. Even a guy disturbed like Soldini could get regular sex, every week, from a hot chick, if he was a thuggish biker.
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George Sodoni is straight out of Houellebeqc’s Extension of the Domain of the Struggle, where a 6 figure, 40 year old virgin beta computer programmer plans to exact his revenge against the teen girls of humanity.. who have cast him into the eternal celibate darkness.. by stabbing a black guy and his white girlfriend to death and then kill himself in a car crash.
His diary is just like reading the book.
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Marcus Aureliette:
First you diagnose the man with this:
“This guy’s inability to interact on any meaningful level — with anyone, not just women — suggests that his problems were the cause, not the result, of his sex-drought.”
then you defend your point with this:
“I have no more insight into his plight than you do: all we have to go on are the ramblings of an unbalanced murderer.”
My disappointment with your reasoning stems from your automatic shaming language. Until he becomes homicidal, he matches the description of countless beta providers. Sodini developed his attitude while passing for a normal guy in a respectable, specialized job. This alone assures that he could interact with other people at a rudimentary level. Plenty of people are strikiningly less capable.
You have him painted as a lunatic in your mind and will rationalize his behavior backwards, from this perspective. Not a de facto lie, but not very objective of you either.
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This guy’s blog really hit home for me, because I actually do the same damn thing as him, get the same 4 weeks of vacation, and am the age he was when he last got laid (and starting to feel like I might spend the rest of my life without any future sex.)
I’m not a murder or violent by any measure, but I’m seriously sitting here wondering if the only difference between this guy and myself is 20 years of involuntarily celibacy.
I’ve read The Game, but I tend to convince myself the stuff can’t work because women must have heard all these lines by now.
Can anybody point me to where to begin to develop Game?
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“oh dear”?
good place to start is not talking like a fag
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Am going to make myself clear here:
— The natural state of things is that all men (and women) do not reproduce.
— “deserve” is an outlandish idea and trying to make this happen for all males is counterproductive to society.
— I’m not hugely interested in arguments about who should and should not: that’s a complex and emotive issue. Except to say: definitely not everybody.
— I personally think that this guy is An Inferior Human Being because he indulged himself in a shooting spree. As we’ve said, The Suffering he has had is widespread and prevalent and those in similar positions do not go on shooting sprees. My morality scale can be harsh and forgive me if I still think the best of those who can sympathise but have not actually done it. Ergo, I personally believe that whomever rejected him sexually was right to do so. Who knows if they did or did not detect something ‘off?’ But it was the right thing to do and thus, the drives behind it are “working correctly” from my perspective, in this instance. Unfortunately, natural sexual inclinations of women do not apparently work very well in modern society due to the Whiskey Hypothesis.
— My personal opinion on this man is not the point. Although it’s interesting to see what shaped him and how he’s used as a symbol of male frustration. Is he really a warning signal or a screwed up human being? What to do?
— My personal opinion on this specific instance does not mean I think sexually frustrated men should remain so or that the right people are reproducing due to ‘natural selection’. To reiterate: I’m not hugely interested in arguments about who should and should not compared to who does or does not, that’s a complex and emotive issue.
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Rome/Cannon:
Rome82: “Encouraging a victim/defeatist mindset like the one Arpagus continually expresses is doing more harm than good.”
No one is encouraging this mindset, including Arpagus himself. Your shaming words show you are refusing to acknowledge it altogether.
Yeah, I notice a slight contradiction in some of the posters here regarding this issue.
For instance, Obsidian — to his credit — will frequently upbraid someone like DA for not learning Game and getting his sexual needs fulfilled, implying DA is morally culpable.
But then OTOH, when addressing the sociological factors of the sexual marketplace, Obs will opine about the coming D-Day of too many betas being relegated to the Darwinian metadeathbin of sexual irrelevance, implying women will soon pay for the choices they make.
But why point a finger at women, Obs, when you should be pointing it at the men who just need to learn Game, like DA?
(Rhetorical, btw)
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Whiskey says, “Ladies, collectively that is the market incentive you create. You CREATE THE THUGS YOU DON’T like. Even a guy disturbed like Soldini could get regular sex, every week, from a hot chick, if he was a thuggish biker.”
Don’t put that on me or women at my rating. We’re not the hot chicks, and you don’t have to be a thug or even a biker to get to most of us.
As someone else here joked, you just need to show up, and hopefully be talking something serious.
So even a disturbed guy like him could get regular and even some freaky sex daily, from a decent wife if he was interested in that.
Problem is that he was disturbed and not interested in that. It’s not non hot chicks’ fault if we’re invisible to the overly entitled looking for trophies.
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Rain And
That is why this whole story is so compelling, imho. It is almost too perfect an example of the depravity that results from trying to live out a lifestyle of malignant betatude.
It feels like a hoax, in a way. But then there are the spreading pools of blood on the womens gym floor…
That makes it fully certified as serious in real-life.
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David Alexander:
I am not gay! however I do think that betas can learn to take real pleasure in watching studs pleasure hot women, wearing panties and hoping to suck off the alpha studs!
!
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Whiskey nails it, as usual. The real issue is not the lone nut or the sensational made-for-TV slaughterfest, but rather the less exciting reality that more and more men are no longer invested in the stability and well being of the broader society. They aren’t stakeholders anymore, and many have no real prospect of ever becoming a stakeholder. This isn’t nearly as sexy or exciting as lone-nut-goes-wild, but it has enormous implications. Most people don’t understand just how serious these implications are going to be.
We still get, even on this blog, the boneheaded “You’re just a bunch of whiners! No wonder you don’t get laid!” type of post. This type is completely ignorant of the broader societal trends – political correctness, globalization, immigration, anti-white propaganda, feminism, demographic transformation, media control (just to name a few) – that are leading a higher and higher percentage of men to become angry and alienated with little left to lose.
Just a few short decades ago, the typical guy could reasonably expect to have a stable career, a faithful wife and kids, his own house, and so forth. He could reasonably expect to become a trusted and respected member of the society, and was therefore invested in that society doing well.
My, how things change! Most guys are just not going to get all of those things anymore. They might get one component, but fewer and fewer will get the whole package. We’ve gone from a society where almost anyone who behaved responsibly could become a stakeholder and hold his head high, into one where huge numbers of men are marginalized sexually, romantically, socially, economically, and so forth. Like Rodney Dangerfield, they get no respect.
I should also note that the lone nut in this particular case was in decent financial shape, yet was utterly alienated from the society around him. As the religious types might say, man does not live by bread alone. This is true for normal men as well, not just mentally ill wack jobs.
A man needs more. In our current society, that “more” is sorely lacking. Fat, drunk, stupid and being a politically correct, deracinated consumer is no way to go through life, son. And it’s not very satisfying to a man worthy of the name.
Point is, the deeper and more intimate connections that give life context and meaning are fraying, or are already just plain gone. So sure, expect some more lone nuts. But what matters far more is what those millions of alienated, pissed off and just plain miserable guys will do as society continues to deteriorate around them.
Hint to the boneheaded: they aren’t going to form the “Beta Party” and carry banners demanding access to vaginas. So what will they do? Answer: On the micro level they will increasingly make life difficult or unstable for the people immediately around them, one way or another.
On the macro level they will be much more likely to support a movement that promises to upset the status quo in some fundamental way. The same status quo that has set most of them up for failure. A system that hates them, or at best despises them. Peaceful change? Maybe. Violent change? Maybe. Should be interesting, however it plays out. Stay tuned!
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Oh Dear:
Some common recommendations:
The Mystery Method
Art of Seduction by Robert Greene
The Game by Neil Strauss
http://www.rsdnation.com/forum
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Rome82:
I do look to PUAs personally at this point, but game is not enough to defeat feminism. Game is only powerful as long as few are good at it. If we all became PUAs, we would be back to square one and might as well not have bothered. Playing within the current rules is a zero-sum game, because women are hypergamous. There can only be so many alpha males. Women are also the majority in any democracy. As long as they can afford it, women will go for the best men, and they won’t give up their equality, largely backed by affirmative action, without massive violence perpetrated by the minority of men who are left sexless under feminism.
Therefore I applaud rape and purposeful violence against women where it is made clear that embittered men are hurting and killing them for not putting out. Only then will women hopefully abandon their equality and be forced to settle monogamously by sheer economic necessity. That is the only language they understand, on an societal scale, human nature being what it is, and as long as most men aren’t happy, nobody will be happy, because violence like this will be commonplace.
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The Game by Neil Strauss <– yup, you've read that.
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dana:
“oh dear”?
good place to start is not talking like a fag
lol
Something tells me Dana and Mrs. Moira Breen from 2blowhards would get along nicely.
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Fifth, I think and hope that female vengeance against radical feminism will happen before male vengeance really gets to a critical level.
I do too. But I am a realist, and say that it is not likely. I see none of the necessary introspection, long-term thinking, and self-restraint from the majority of women, sad to say.
Of the 4 forces against women, two help men, while the other two are just lose-lose situations, but are worse for women than men.
Since you were away in the interim, let me list out the 4 Horsemen, in case you missed them.
1. Game
2. Sex technologies (3-D/VR/Homlograms, sexbots, etc.)
3. Islam becoming stronger in the West, and demanding the right to practice Sharia Law in matters of family law.
4. Increasing violence against women (as in the article above).
1 and 2 help men. But all 4 are bad news for the power advantage women presently have.
Of course, many good women will suffer in the fallout. As always, the extremists (in this case, feminists) do the most harm to their own group, rather than the group they are trying to damage.
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Oh Dear: You’ve read The Game! Sorry.
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Arpagus, how well do you think that embittered men raping and killing women for not putting out would fly if you were just not permitted access to women?
As things are, I understand how the current system creates a relative deprivation problem…but would total deprivation be better?
Do you think your life would be easier if your only option for sex outside of marriage was prostitutes?
…if to get consensual sex otherwise, you had to pass the scrutiny of a woman’s family and commit to her?
I’m asking because some families here have actually rolled back to that. The previous generation saw the bad consequences of being more liberal, so they’ve rolled back to not allowing the girls to go anywhere without a chaperone, and older wives are either chaperoned or time checked.
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I have a feeling that we are going to see many more of these events in the next few years.
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Tupac,
Good question you ask, and deserves what I hope is an equally good response.
I personally think that the two points you raised are not mutually exclusive. On the one hand we do have the individual to consider, say Dave Alex, and to that extent we should try to do what we can to assist him and he should do what he can to assist himself.
But on the other hand, we have the wider social implications of such massive shifts taking place on the dating and mating scene, especially wrt the Male side of it, which The Urban Scientist at Psychology Today writes so eloquently about. We are social beings and as such are impacted by larger groups of people.
From a purely practical standpoint, the individual guy’s last, best hope is learning Game to the best of his ability. In this way he has some chance of getting some degree of happiness in our postmodern, postfeminist world.
But on the larger collective level, we have to grapple w/how these massive shifts and changes on the dating/mating market can and will mean for all of us-socially, politically, economically. Clearly, I think we call agree, that there are indeed real costs to consider.
Hope I’ve addressed your question.
O
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Arpagus and others should read this!
let me give an example of the kind of situation betas can learn to find enjoyable!!
http://www.literotica.com/stories/showstory.php?id=136498
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dana to oh dear
good place to start is not talking like a fag
have some empathy dana.
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no
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It seems to me the last thing more widespread violence and rape is going to do is reverse feminism. It’s only providing grist for the feminist mill. Feminism is fulfilling its own prophecies (well, asserted as facts, but now actually coming true). Fabulous.
The most likely dominant ‘solutions’ which’re practically unstoppable can be found in Tood’s list.
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CT:
Arpagus was incorrect to call Sodini an MRA hero, but he can still be a hero of sorts to a pocket of MRA subscribers.
Arpagus lived the life of an archetype beta for many years, developed a latent homicidal rage, which he admits to, and was still far from acting on it. Arpagus applied game for a fraction of the time since his sexual frustration began and got laid. He has said that this did wonders for his mental state, although the act was shallow and the girl was not attractive. Without game, as he says himself, Sodini could have been him.
In a world without game, Sodini acted out on his sexually-repressed urges more than any other beta. Definitely not “admirable,” but something other betas might aspire to as their greatest outcome.
But let’s not nitpick – the statement was made for shock and awe. Did the trick on you, too.
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Cunthulah:
So even a disturbed guy like him could get regular and even some freaky sex daily, from a decent wife if he was interested in that.
Problem is that he was disturbed and not interested in that. It’s not non hot chicks’ fault if we’re invisible to the overly entitled looking for trophies.
Again with the “trophies.”
No, it’s like this:
Long ago, people paired up equally: 3’s with 3’s, 5’s with 5’s, 8’s with 8’s, etc., more or less.
But with female “empowerment”, women were allowed to indulge their hypergamous natures and thereby sportfuck men way out of their league.
That wouldn’t be so bad if women were realistic enough to understand that this exactly how they were viewed by the men who were glazing their faces in babybatter.
Unfortunately, the stupidity of women ensures that they frame these “relationships” as being born of “love” gone “tragically” wrong. So they hang on to these trainwrecks of sluttery with all the fervor that tween girls clutch their Twilight books to their chests.
That guy who left her with a bleeding anus and fresh wad on her back before bailing to hang out with his buds at the bar? He’s not taking advantage! No, he’s a dark brooding romantic badboy who just needs to be “loved” and “understood” to win his heart. They had something SPECIAL! If only for a few days.
So what ends up happening is that men who never *once* gave any thought to chasing “unicorns” or “trophies” are simply left standing alone with their dicks waving in the wind.
So don’t blame men who aren’t eager to dip *below* their sexual market value and date fatties.
Although I’m sure *you* think this would be the proper denouement to this particular morality play.
As Obsidian would say:
Hmm.
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Fifth says, “Of course, many good women will suffer in the fallout. As always, the extremists (in this case, feminists) do the most harm to their own group, rather than the group they are trying to damage.”
Very, very true. When I was younger, I fell for some of it, but never got too deep. I just sensed something about mindless shagging was wrong, and that was confirmed when I stupidly got into a FWB situation.
I’m really glad for the non radicals. It’s nice to have the freedom to be a freak and not be condemned for it…but things in moderation, you know? Folks should give a damn about one another and their overall wellbeing, and women are having the opposite encouraged.
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Democrats = Homocrats = Faggots
Chic Noir’s definition of a troll : A person who says inconvenient truths about black people.
read some of willard’s comments then get back to me.
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“Therefore I applaud rape and purposeful violence against women where it is made clear that embittered men are hurting and killing them for not putting out.”
Ok, that I don’t cosign with… but I do find it hilarious!
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From the diary An older woman there, out of the blue, asked if I liked high school. Then quickly asked if I was picked on very much. Intersting why she would ask that. But, thanks, I already know what the problem is, but a solution eludes me.
I’m pretty sure I could have done the same thing after observing him for 5 minutes. I could have given him his life story as if I was a fly of the wall for all of his 48 years.
There is a reason women can do that and it’s because we are more perceptive by nature than men are. Women also use hidden ques like women’s intuition to make snap judgments about people. It’s the reason why two women who have never met one another can tell you how they feel about each other within 30 seconds of meeting. For those reasons, as men, it’s very important that you give off signs of health, protector, and confidence.
dana
no
you made me giggle but okay dana.
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George Sodini is an MRA hero as much a reason to learn game.
The man is a piece of shit who brings shame to other men. Your inability to secure female attention is not and will never be an excuse to resort to violence. He makes sub-human males like myself sick.
The Church has spoken.
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“Therefore I applaud rape and purposeful violence against women where it is made clear that embittered men are hurting and killing them for not putting out.”
While I don’t approve of this, I fully understand that when a person has been so heavily subjugated, abused, and dehumanized, they will root for something, anything, that strikes back.
Urban women today, are sowing the seeds of violence against themselves. From guys that seem harmless today (like Sodini was until last week).
chic noir wrote :
There is a reason women can do that and it’s because we are more perceptive by nature than men are.
On some matters, yes. On other matters, a big fat NO.
If women are so perceptive, why don’t they see how extremely anti-male divorce laws and general misandry are hurting average women a lot? Why don’t average women rise up to roll back feminism, which is preventing them from getting a guy to marry them?
Why do women who consider themselves ‘feminists’ hate Sarah Palin so much, when in fact she is a role model for every goal the feminists said they support?
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That’s because “game” is not contingent on “lines.” It’s about having a confident, assertive, masculine demeanor… a “line” is really just the starting point for a man to offer to the female the opportunity to interact with him so that he can demonstrate his social dominance.
A well practiced player can deliver the cheesiest, most well worn pickup line in the world, and still pickup the lady…because it’s not actually “what” he’s saying more than how he’s saying it…and how he carries on the conversation/pickup attempt after the opening line is delivered. Read: I Tried the Apocalypse Opener.
The nerdy, feminized, meek and needy guy could come up with the greatest pickup line in the world…but his demeanor, presence and lack of masculine charisma would absolutely kill any chance of having it work in attracting the lady he used it on.
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Tupac, again, I do not think men should date or even shag anyone they find unattractive.
I’m getting tired of having to repeat that.
Obsidian said, “From a purely practical standpoint, the individual guy’s last, best hope is learning Game to the best of his ability. In this way he has some chance of getting some degree of happiness in our postmodern, postfeminist world.”
I hope that’s followed up with marriage game and family game for those who don’t want to be eternal bachelors, and need help maintaining alpha status in their homes.
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The Fifth Horseman wrote:
“chic noir wrote :
There is a reason women can do that and it’s because we are more perceptive by nature than men are.
On some matters, yes. On other matters, a big fat NO.”
Chic was describing picking up details about a man quickly. And yes women are very good at. But it’s internalized as feelings like ginia tingles and creeped out, ect.
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are you not allowed to post links here? i would like to illustrate what im talking about by linking to a literotica story, but it’s not possible
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Nicole,
I hope that’s followed up with marriage game and family game for those who don’t want to be eternal bachelors, and need help maintaining alpha status in their homes.
Now we are getting somewhere. Most men want exactly this to be the case as they get older.
BUT….
Divorce laws are ruinous towards men. They are a direct violation of every belief in self-responsibility that most of us have. Pre-nups are only a partial shield at best.
70-90% of divorces are initated by women. So it seems that women are the ones who cannot commit long term, rather than men.
Many men who wanted nothing more to age with a family of their own, are stacking up the pros and cons of marriage, and coming to the conclusion, with a heavy heart, that the risks are just too great.
And if even 20% of the men come to this conclusion, women are screwed. 100 women are competing for 80 husbands, with 20 other men as PUAs raiding the field.
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Oh Dear,
I’ve read The Game, but I tend to convince myself the stuff can’t work because women must have heard all these lines by now.
OK, now go read a second book : The Mystery Method. Do that immediately.
‘Game’ is not about lines, but about a sequence of steps that push the right buttons at the right time. No one line is indispensible. These are not magical ‘spells’ that have some special effect.
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Fifth, I think part of the problem is that the current media message is to minimize the contribution of the father aside of financial…and to kind of minimize that as if taking care of Maslow 1 and 2 has nothing to do with 3+ or something.
The laws are a bigger nut to crack than the social situation. This is why I’m saying that dads, brothers, and sons need to be more honest about how they see things. The first few thousand who do it will be accused of turning into religious nuts or being hypocrites, but when it grows to the point that teenage boys go to school and tell girls they are dressed like whores and look 30 years old and already used up, things will change.
One my my friends’ younger brother started a Facebook group along those lines, with photos of some washed up prematurely aging junior hoes.
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Long ago, people paired up equally: 3’s with 3’s, 5’s with 5’s, 8’s with 8’s, etc., more or less.
That’s the problem. 3s shouldn’t be mating with other 3s. If they can’t secure 7s and up, they should just simply “drop-out” of the relationship market. If you’re ugly, why should you reinforce your ugliness with an ugly partner?
Hell, how can you even get an erection for an ugly girl?
Maybe we should pass the hat around for a hooker for DA so he doesn’t go batshit and kill us all.
David will not turn to the dark path. David has no need for your fake orgasming prostitute.
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sodini’s trance anthem:
http://www.
youtube.com/watch?v=fN-Ia072Vy4
arpagus getting mad love in the jezebel comments! someone said they cried!
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DA asks, “Hell, how can you even get an erection for an ugly girl?”
You might want to ask some guys who can. Here nobody but Obsidian will admit to getting a bone for someone who’s even a little chubby.
Try the disabled sex forums. After the initial horror, someone will explain it to you.
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oh my gawwwd, the jezebel comments are high comedy! i am going to have to start reading there recreationally.
http://jezebel.com/5330560/gunman-murders-gym+going-women-misogynists-approve
Check out this gem:
“I agree that its sad, and currently I am having my own battle with loving a male friend of mine for four years. He likes the little house on the prairie type, long blond hair, homely looks, skinny as a rail. Me? I’m 300 pounds, I have sometimes red sometimes black hair, and I wear glasses and I have catapillar eyebrows.
I tried convincing him that what is in the inside is what counts, and that we would make a great couple. He couldn’t get past my weight.”
hahahhahahahahahaha
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The problem is, beta males don’t realize that asking attractive chicks to overlook their betaness is just as laughable in the eyes of an attractive chick.
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You might want to ask some guys who can.
Viagra, alcohol, and drugs don’t count.
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@Tood
I don’t think Sarah Palin represents very much of what feminists support. She’s amazing for not being afraid to have a large family and running a career, but the execution is sloppy.
But you are right. I am astounded always by how intelligent, extremely capable, and stronger men can be than women in a multitude of day-to-day or even more extreme situations in which women are generally just lost.
Women can be perceptive, certainly. But our perceptive gifts are nothing without the protection, guidance, input, and actions of a strong man.
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@grim-thanks
Tupac Again with the “trophies.”
No, it’s like this:
Long ago, people paired up equally: 3’s with 3’s, 5’s with 5’s, 8’s with 8’s, etc., more or less
Come on Tupac the cuntullah was unnessary. For the love of God, I’m sure you’ve seen and heard some men who are 2-5 brag about only blessing 8+ with their rancid seed.
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Nicole:
I agree, you can prevent violence against women by segregating the sexes. Some cultures have understood this and it is not a bad idea, especially when lots of men are deprived of sex.
Of course not, but I am assuming the alternative is not total deprivation, but steady access to one woman.
Yes, definitely, if I had a marriage. My point is that it is better for most men if we have a good chance of getting a wife.
That is understandable. It is not safe to let women associate freely with sexually frustrated men. But if most men had a wife, I don’t think there would be such a great need for chaperoning.
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I don’t think “game” would have prevented this crime. Lack of sex is just a symptom of his disorders; low self esteem, severe depression, and a consuming sense of isolation seem to be the root cause.
As a thought experiment, let’s say he was in an unhappy marriage. Would he still have shot up LA Fitness? Probably not, but I can see him going on a rampage at his workplace or a similar venue. I agree with other commenters that having kids would have made him more invested in society, but, modulo that involvement, the guy was clearly unhappy with society. An unhappy marriage or a few cheap flings would only serve to focus that aggression into a different pigeon hole.
Related note: I recently picked up Houellebecq’s “Elementary Particles” after learning about the author from one of Half Sigma’s commenters. Many Roissy-isms seem to be derived from his work; it’s highly recommended.
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From his pictures he looks a little…gay. Just a tad effeminate. Pretty smile. Small and slender like a …woman? I think this guy may have had some latent homosexual issue going on that he either completely repressed and perhaps this “blog” of his was a means of covering that up before he planned on going out. No sex for twenty years? No girlfriend? It is not THAT hard to find these things. A certain amount of men who go violent in this way have some sort of issues like latent homosexuality. I think part of the problem with violence in some Islamic societies is the hidden homosexual subculture which exists, fueled by inaccessible women and religious fanaticism. Men engage secretly in homosexual acts, then hate themselves for it, and then become violent as a way of acting out. I am sure Mohammad Atta was flaming queen who could just never come out. This guy probably would have been better off if he found some other dude to share blowjobs with. Who knows. Whatever the case, this dude was just fucked up. It had little to do with him being “rejected” by women. They rejected him because he obviously creeped them out. Women are not attracted to creepy men. Ever.
The danger with the PUA stuff is that it makes fucking women the be all and end all of life. This is not the case, there is more to life than just sex, and becoming obsessed with scoring endless babes can be damaging after a while. There is a lot more to life than pussy. Everyone needs a balance. Everyone need love, whether from women or from friends, etc. Go after pussy, enjoy the thrills of seduction, and learn from it, but also cultivate other things as well, such as your mind and, if you believe in it, your soul. Hell, even Roissy believes he has a soul, because he knows he is at least going to hell and plans on enjoying life as much a possible while he is here before his father Satan calls him home to say, “Good work my son, your spread my message well, now welcome back home.” So you got to respect him for that. Plus I am sure there is lots of quality and kinky pussy down there by the river Styx. When Roissy ends up in hell I expect some blog posts on the pussy down there.
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Problem is, beta males don’t realize they come off just as laughable and pathetic when they try to convince attractive chicks to resist their natural revulsion and overlook their betaness because they would make such a great couple.
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Sorry for double post, thought the first one didn’t go through
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DA, it’s probably going to be something along the lines of:
She may have (insert mass approved definition of ugly) but she has (insert mass approved or unique feature of beauty/suitability).
The strength to deal with the fact that life is brutally fair is a crucial plus. One has to be comfortable with the idea that the rain falls on both the righteous and the wicked, as the good book would say.
One cannot have moral values attached to physical evidence of human mortality.
Read the chapter about the ugliest man in _Thus Spake Zarathustra_.
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“More generally: sure, prolonged celibacy and loneliness can’t be good for someone’s self-esteem or mental health, but my guess is that this guy’s other issues caused the prolonged celibacy in the first place.”
As usual, DaveinHackensack nailed it before me.
Ugh — that has an unintended connotation on Roissy’s blog.
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Re: 3s dating 3s, 7s dating 7s, etc. and female entitlement
I don’t know how many women really think they deserve a man hotter than their own level?
Out of curiousity, I’ve posted on hotornot a few times and consistently received 8.4-8.8. But I don’t feel entitled to date an 8 or 9, and would much prefer a man who will treat me well and connect with me emotionally. Someone rated 5 or 6, I would be comfortable and happy to date as long as he treated with top love and respect. A 7 or + man looks wise is something to feel lucky about and not entitled to have, and I’m sure there’s more women who feel that way.
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Nicole,
The laws are a bigger nut to crack than the social situation.
But the laws are the only thing that really matters.
Evangelical Christians and social cons never stopped sermonizing about the ‘sanctity of marriage’. That still is a pea shooter against steel when the judicial system itself has laws that provide incentives for women to divorce rather than stay married for life. So clearly, this is not enough.
Social shaming has a small effect against the might of judicial machinery. Remember, if the ‘laws say that the man has to pay this much’, most people, particularly women, will automatically consider it morally acceptable. It takes outside the box thinking to change a law, since most people will go along with the status quo. This is one reason why Jim Crow laws lasted as long as they did.
Well, the way men are treated in divorce court and the media is very much like a 21st century version of Jim Crow, with men instead of blacks being the victim.
Changing the laws are the only silver bullet. Every other change is a downstream derivative of this. This, unfortunately, will not happen soon, so my Four Horsemen scenario is presently the most likely outcome for the Western World of 2020.
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Tood If women are so perceptive, why don’t they see how extremely anti-male divorce laws and general misandry are hurting average women a lot?
Ignorance or perception, I don’t think the average woman really believes the average man loses much in a divorce. Those tails of men losing half and/or millions are from hollywood and the oligarchy.
Why don’t average women rise up to roll back feminism
because feminism came with good things for women. I can have my husband arrested if he beats me. My child won’t be left destitute if my husband or I decide to leave the marriage. I can become more than a teacher, nurse or secretary if I have the aptitude.
Some women simply are meant to be housewives…period. Just as some men aren’t meant to sit of the table with the CEO and CFO.
which is preventing them from getting a guy to marry them?
Many women don’t want to get married and others just want to wait and enjoy life a bit before they do. Women give up a lot when they marry, I know my writing that upsets you of which I don’t mean to btw but we do.
If you and I were married tomorrow, you would probably want a lot of sayso over how I live my life, what I look like, how I spend my free time, and hassle me to sleep with you, curtail my traveling, tell me what to wear, pick choose and delete my friends at will etc.
Some women come to resent those things overtime even if they love(d) their husband.
Why do women who consider themselves ‘feminists’ hate Sarah Palin so much,
I don’t hate Sara Palin and I don’t think the average woman who calls herself a feminist hates Sara Palin. If Palin had Hillary Clinton’s intellect in addition to her other charms, people could make a better argument about feminists hating Palin because she is pretty or has a large family etc…
when in fact she is a role model for every goal the feminists said they support?
Not really, she is a bit rightwinged and her teen daughter got knocked up. She doesn’t come across as being knowledgeable about the issues. The Katie Kouric interview is legendary and will haunt her days in politics. Even I, blk low iq prole female from NYC could of taken a stab at the Supreme Court discussion question.
Tood, I didn’t write these answers to make you angry so if they upset please don’t become hostile. I’m simply writing how I and other women whom I come in contact with, feel.
The problems between the sexes can be largely blamed on perception and the way the two genders communicate.
During my first couple of months here, I thought roissy was just being an ass at times. Then it dawned on me that his perception and that of most of the men here will be very different from my own because they are men. Looking back, I realized that I often saw things differently than my brothers and boyfriends did. Maybe I should of pushed things more but because I not much of a debater or arguer (in person) I just let most things go.
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joe via jezz He likes the little house on the prairie type, long blond hair, homely looks, skinny as a rail. Me? I’m 300 pounds, I have sometimes red sometimes black hair, and I wear glasses and I have catapillar eyebrows
the catapillar eyebrows can be changed in 20 minutes. a set of twizzers and wax will fix that. nice eyebrows can make a plain woman pretty.
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Epistemological rabbit hole:
“This guy was a psycho because he couldn’t get chicks”
“This guy couldn’t get chicks because he was a psycho”
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Evangelical Christians and social cons never stopped sermonizing about the ’sanctity of marriage’.
Kthula was onto something when she said that the critial mass moment will come when cool teenage boys start telling girls that they dress like whores.
This goes along with Mencius’s assertions that massive social change happens when those who are cool, young, smart and fashionable start promiting these new ideas.
Unfortunately Evangelical Christians and social cons are uncool and in a way for that reason they undermine the cause by being its spokesmen.
In other words, one Roissy is worth 100 Larry Austers.
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@ Ryder–
With regard to the true % of the “walking dead” (ie, celibate men) in 2009 Amerika, what proportion of these men do you suppose have a legit shortcoming that prevents them from getting laid?
You’ve often written about the undeniable cultural rot and the promiscuity it fosters in women. I think Whiskey would argue that, although the rampant promiscuity makes it relatively easy to bang a chick, if said chick is a 5 or above you’d better be an Alpha…or at the very least, you better have Game.
Is it realistic to expect a 48 year-old man with a full time job to go out in the urban bars (which are basically obnoxious cesspools) on a CONSISTENT enough basis to learn Game and score some trim? Should an adult man with decent looks, education, and sense of humor have to jump through such hoops to get his dick wet? (we’re assuming our man has no legit shortcoming that is a dealbreaker with women)
In other words, is it really that easy for a brohiem to get laid in this wondrous culture of ours?
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@tood- I ansered your questions but the comment is in moderation for now(8:00pm).
Nicole So even a disturbed guy like him could get regular and even some freaky sex daily, from a decent wife if he was interested in that.
Problem is that he was disturbed and not interested in that. It’s not non hot chicks’ fault if we’re invisible to the overly entitled looking for trophies
I gotta say I think you hit it out of the part here. Either he was giving off an pycho aura or his standards were too high. I recall a lady given the nickname “chipmunk”(forget cigstash) from one of Roissy rate the women surveys. She was given a 4 by the men here.
I wonder if Sodini would of passed her up hoping for a hotter piece.
We given see something similar with virgin@40(no disrespect v40) ignoring an 8 for a chance with a 10.
On the otherhand, he was a nice looking older man from his pic but he should of recalibrated his standards if he couldn’t pull the 9&10’s.
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Arpagus
There is a story on literotica called “Third Wheel Takes Over,” and it contains what I’m talking about, I encourage you and all other beta males to read it and enjoy it!
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“That’s the problem. 3s shouldn’t be mating with other 3s. If they can’t secure 7s and up, they should just simply “drop-out” of the relationship market. If you’re ugly, why should you reinforce your ugliness with an ugly partner?
Hell, how can you even get an erection for an ugly girl?”
Pussy’s pussy.
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Arpagus – Only then will women hopefully abandon their equality and be forced to settle monogamously by sheer economic necessity.
Rape and violence towards women is not going to change things. Sheer economic necessity can and will, but by different means.
I’m of the opinion that the American economy and government cannot continue. Whether it is this recession which plunges into a depression, or the next one, we are heading full speed towards a hard crash. We’ve exported too many good, stable careers. We’ve burdened our businesses with tax and environmental laws which make it impossible for them to compete globally. We’ve made electricity expensive and made ourselves slaves to oil exporters all in the name of the environment. We’ve made it so expensive to live, between over regulated products, energy prices, and taxes that family formation is more difficult than it ever was for our parents and grandparents. And we’ve expanded government spending far beyond a sustainable point. Rather than reverse these trends we are accelerating our efforts to make things worse. (IMHO this is all driven primarily by female participation in politics. Giving women the right to vote was one of the worst decisions this nation ever made.)
Right now there is not one, but two bills before Congress either of which can single handedly destroy what’s left of our economy (the Cap and Trade bill and the Health Care bill), and our so called president and Congress are trying as hard as they can to pass both over massive and angry citizen opposition. Our yearly deficit spending is around the $2 trillion mark and NotMyPresident wants to accelerate spending into collapsing tax receipts. He is completely ignorant of the fact that the bond market is already showing signs of a break down. China, Japan, and the middle east don’t want more of our worthless debt. They know we’re falling apart as an economy and are unlikely to produce our way out of this mess or ever pay off the debt.
When, not if, our culture of debt collapses the rules will change and women will be forced to make different decisions in the name of survival.
What scares me is that there’s no way to predict how the collapse will play out. It’s not going to be a pretty correction, and there’s no reason to believe America will emerge the same strong and free nation it has been for so long.
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Dreamer,
But you are right. I am astounded always by how intelligent, extremely capable, and stronger men can be than women in a multitude of day-to-day or even more extreme situations in which women are generally just lost.
Women can be perceptive, certainly. But our perceptive gifts are nothing without the protection, guidance, input, and actions of a strong man.
Well said. Yes, women can be very perceptive IN THE MICRO about judging a guy, judging the dynamics at a small party, etc.
But women are AWFUL at estimating the MACRO. By macro, I mean the broader social/political/technological trends that do affect them.
Of the top 20 Futurists in the world, none are women. There is no possibility of sexism here, one becomes a Futurist by building a track record of good predictions.
Also, I could not help but notice that American men are the ones condemning mistreatment of women in Islamic countries. Western Women, who have more reason to condemn this, were significantly less vocal on this issue…
That is why my Four Horsemen scenario is a virtual certainty by 2020, even if only 2 or 3 of the four happen (search the archives for more on this). 99.9% of women are totally clueless about this series of events that will affect them greatly.
I urge you to really think outside the box to see what CAN happen. Consider that the collapse of the USSR, the dot-com bubble, and the real estate bubble were unanticipated even 2 years before they happened.
Women will be in big trouble by 2020, largely due to feminism.
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@dreamer -” A 7 or + man looks wise is something to feel lucky about and not entitled to have, and I’m sure there’s more women who feel that way.”
I have said in other posts that I prefer a man to be less or equal to me in points on the looks scale. A man who I feel is much better looking than I am makes me feel insecure. I have no sense of entitlement in regards to super good looks. I know I’m very similar to many women in this regard, besides we’re into more than looks alone us females (LR excluded – she likes em hot!). That said if Mr. Hottie makes me His Naughty comes along I’ll live with it. 😉
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Arpagus says, “It is not safe to let women associate freely with sexually frustrated men. But if most men had a wife, I don’t think there would be such a great need for chaperoning.”
Whew! I was pretty sure I understood what you were saying, but I had to make sure. You know many of the guys posting here are a bit off balance and don’t see the whole picture.
So you agree this thing is messed up from both sides, and that a big part of the problem is depletion of the supply of suitable wives. Segregation is one way of combatting frustration and rampant voluntary (read socially encouraged) devaluing of women in the ways nature determines value. I’m not sure if that’s plausible for everyone at this point in time, so in my opinion, encouraging modesty, politeness, and realistic self care is probably the best most people can do, like, today.
…though in the interfaith clothing giveaway programs, we found that many girls actually did not own any modest clothes. That was some scary stuff.
Accountability is something men can do though. They can be honest about their feelings, at least with female friends and relatives.
My relatives are far away, but before my boyfriend, my friends were still very honest with me. Guys should not be PC about these things.
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@chic noir
that’s really nice regarding the woman w/ the crush on the friend, but after the cosmetic treatment she’s still 300 pounds.
someone that heavy must be suffering from some type of emotional and / or physical issues, which sorta show they aren’t the best choice for a starting a devoted romantic relationship.
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PA Kthula was onto something when she said that the critial mass moment will come when cool teenage boys start telling girls that they dress like whores.
http://jakandjil.com/blog/?p=2609
sexy without being ^^^trashy. A-cups PA 🙂
Some women are deserate for attention, just as some men are desperate for poon. I can across a recent study that said people in my age group would take fame over wealth. Reread that, fame over wealth, so what does that say about young Americans. fame is fleeting but wealth is power which can lead to a dynasty.
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Narcissism is being blamed for a recent horrific murder mutilation here in NZ.
For those who wish to explore a dark mind…
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10586061
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@ PA–
Was it Larry Auster who once described the Chateau Roissy as “pornographic”?
Any so-called “conservative” who would do that is tone deaf.*
Roissy hits the cultural Marxists where it hurts, by both acknowledging that he is “not a good man” and rejoicing in the good times the daughters of the SWPL crowd afford him on his Bed of Sin.
*–then again, conservatives are deaf, blind, and dumb in more ways than one. That’s why they lose and the Left wins.
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sexy without being ^^^trashy. A-cups PA
If all women on Earth had boobies larger than B-cup, I too would be shooting up gyms.
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For some reason I can’t post links so I will post the whole story here,
Third Wheel Takes Over
I’m just your average everyday guy. About 5’10”, decent shape. Not a model but not hard on the eyes either. I had gotten out of a one year relationship and decided to ask a girl from work if she wanted to go out. I had worked with Kim for a few months and we had hit it off pretty well so I asked her if she wanted to hang out one night. I was hoping she would agree because I had been admiring her red hair and 5’1″, 100 pound tight little body for a while. She said yes, so we made plans to go out that Friday evening to a local restaurant. Dinner was going great and we decided to end the evening with a nightcap and (hopefully) a trip back to my house. I couldn’t wait to get a shot at her tiny little body. Since I knew how I was hoping the evening would end, I picked a bar close to my place and we settled in.
As we were enjoying a drink, I felt a strong hand slap me on the back. I looked up and saw Nate, a friend from class and the basketball courts who was a good guy, but extremely cocky. However, from what I saw (and had heard), he had reason to be. Unlike most guys, Nathan really did look like he could be a model standing 6’2″ with brown hair, tan skin and body that looked like it had been carved from stone. Without really being invited, Nate sat down at our table and ordered a drink. I introduced Nate to Kim and could tell right away that might have been a mistake as it was obvious that she thought he was very attractive. After another drink and more small talk, Nate looked around and then said “Ryan, I don’t see a waitress, go get another round of drinks.” Though I was a little taken back by the way he just told me to do it, I found myself rising from my chair and walking to the bar. As I waited for our drinks, I glanced back at the table and saw Kim laughing at something Nate said and slapping him playfully. It was almost like I was the third wheel instead of him.
When I got back to the table, Nate took his drink and without looking up at me said, “I was just telling Kim that I have some pretty good smoke back at my house. Why don’t you two follow me over? It’s not far.”
He then stood up and Kim stood too. Before I could protest, I heard her say “come on Ryan, it will be fun” so we followed him out to the parking lot and started driving to his house. I asked Kim if she was sure about this and without even looking at me just said that she was sure it would be a good time. We got to Nate’s apartment and he welcomed us in. He quickly produced the pot he had promised and lit up the first joint. Combined with the drinks I had already had, I was beyond high and started rubbing Kim’s back. She surprised me by moving her hand immediately to my chest as Nate just watched. I pulled her in for a long wet kiss, my hands moving up and down that little body I had been wanting for so long.
I then heard Nate say that she appeared a little too dressed and telling her to stand up. She a look of pure lust on her face as she stood and Nate wasted no time telling her simply “take off your clothes now.” I looked on in disbelief as she proceeded to do exactly that, peeling off first her shirt and then her jeans. I pulled her down to me in just her bra and panties. My 6 inch cock as hard as it had ever been straining against my jeans. She kissed me hungrily as I grabbed her ass and felt her hand undoing my jeans. My cock sprang out and her hand wrapped around it before she fell to her knees and took it into her mouth.
I was enjoying the feel of my cock in her mouth when I glanced up and saw Nate starting to undress. I remembered quickly how much I always admired what great shape he was in as he removed his shirt. He just smiled and winked at me as he watched Kim’s head bob up and down the length of my cock. His hands started working on his own jeans now and he pulled them off. That’s when I got the first surprise of the night as Nate’s cock popped into view. I had only seen something like this in a porn film as his cock dangled far out in front of him. It had to be at least 8 inches long and twice as fat as mine, certainly bigger than any that I had seen. He lewdly stroked it a couple of times and it actually seemed to swell larger. I felt Kim’s mouth leave my cock and then saw the startled look on her face as she saw Nate standing there. I was obvious that she was on fire from the sight of his ripped body and huge cock. Without even a “sorry” I watched as she crawled over to him and started to lick and suck at his big dick. It wasn’t quite as easy for her as mine had been as her mouth stretched over the head and it looked like she could only get an inch or two of the shaft into her mouth.
As I watched, all thoughts of having my date stolen or any angry feelings over Nate taking over my date were forgotten as I watched Kim struggle to suck his cock. I had started to remove my clothes and rub my cock as I watched her get as much of that big cock into her mouth as she could. I then heard Nate say “hey man, you might want to fuck her first. Otherwise, you might not feel a thing.” Even though he chuckled as he said this, I knew he was right and quickly shed the rest of my clothes and moved in behind Kim. I reached down between her legs and was stunned to feel how wet she was. I then slid my cock in completely and started to fuck her from behind as hard and fast as I could. Little moans escaped her mouth as she continued to suck on Nate cock. As turned on as I was, I knew I would not last long and after only a couple of minutes, I pushed in as far as I could go and came in probably the hardest orgasm of my life. I pulled out spent and heard Nate pull Kim’s mouth off his cock and tell her to get on the bed. He smiled down at me, nudged me out of the way and told me to “watch this.” He then stood over the bed, pulled Kim to the edge and slammed his big dick all the way inside her soaked cunt with just one thrust. Her screams filled the room (and probably woke a neighbor or two up) as Nate wasted little time putting that big dick to work.
As I sat on the floor, spent, high and still a little drunk, I watched as Nate put on a clinic on how to fuck a hot girl to orgasm after orgasm. First on her back, then on all fours, then in his lap and it went on and on. Nate fucked Kim in positions I hadn’t thought of or wasn’t equipped to actually fuck a woman in. His big cock sliding in and out as the sweat rolled off his muscular frame and Kim just screamed, panted and begged for him to “fuck me hard with your big dick baby.”. I just watched as this stud took my date to heights I could only dream of.
Finally after at least an hour of this, I heard Nate ask her where she wanted his cum and she told him to cum in her mouth. I then watched as he pulled his cock out and aimed it at her willing and ready tongue. Then I watched her lips close over the head as he came in her mouth, spurt after spurt and she swallowed it all. My own cock was now hard again as I stared in disbelief.
Before I could do anything about my own hard-on, I heard Nate say “hey man, I need a towel, go in there and get me one.” Again, it wasn’t a request and I just did as he said. When I got back in the room, Kim was still just laid out on the bed, almost passed out from the fucking she had just received. I also couldn’t help but notice how the sweat on Nate’s body really put every muscle on display. I had to admit he looked incredible. As I offered him the towel, he just said “get my back” and turned around. I started rubbing the towel over his shoulders and back and without even thinking about it, found myself on my knees running the towel over his ass and legs. I was surprised at how hard his body felt. It really was like stone and my hands moved the towel along his calves until he turned around. Suddenly I found myself only a couple of inches from that huge cock that I had watched him work my date over with. From this angle, it looked even bigger as I couldn’t help but smell Kim’s scent on it. I looked up at Nate and he looked down at me, smiling. He then nodded and I felt one of his hands on the back of my head. To this day, I am not sure why but I didn’t resist as I felt the head of his cock press first against my lips and then into my quickly stretching mouth.
Nate slowly started to pump his cock in and out of my mouth as I struggled not to gag and just relax. I licked the sides and tried to suck in with my cheeks just like women had done to me when giving me head. I heard Nate grunt above me to watch my teeth and to just relax. Then I heard him say “you like that baby” and glanced up to see Kim, her eyes on fire and her hand furiously rubbing her clit as she watched me suck him. Kim just nodded as she took in the sight of her “date” sucking off the stud that had just fucked her senseless.
After a few more minutes of having his cock in my mouth, Nate pulled me off by my hair and made his way back to Kim. He then got on this back and told her to ride him. Like me, she did as she was told and I watched as she came again and again while straddling his cock. After she came with her loudest scream of the night, Nate held her tight against his hips and his body jerked as he came yet again. Kim just rolled off of him back onto her stomach, her eyes glazed and he pointed at her and told me to take a turn. I know I shouldn’t have but I just had to cum again so I moved in behind her sliding my cock into her sopping cunt. Nate was right when he said I wouldn’t feel anything as his tool had stretched her good but I didn’t care. I pumped for just a few minutes before emptying my second load of the night into her spent pussy. She just kind of looked up and then passed out. I just looked back at Nate as he smiled at me with his cocky grin and I wondered what I had gotten myself into.
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@aoefe
right. a man’s value is much more and beyond his looks.
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dreamer
that’s really nice regarding the woman w/ the crush on the friend
thank you
*blushes sweetly*
but after the cosmetic treatment she’s still 300 pounds.
very true. some men can look past a big body(although 300 is pushing it) if the face isn’t too bad.
someone that heavy must be suffering from some type of emotional and / or physical issues, which sorta show they aren’t the best choice for a starting a devoted romantic relationship.
agreed, unless she is apart of that 10% who are heavy because of health related problems, she has an eating disorder which is related to other things gone wrong in her life.
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Auster called Roissy a “whoremonger” and demanded apologies from the reader who forwarded R’s blog to him. He said this blog is pornography.
However, a few months later one of Auster’s regulars did point out that Roissy may be worth reading. The topic of discussion was attractive women who run off with thugs and get killed.
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having beaten my head against auster’s brick wall in many exchanges about evolution i imagine he would get the vapors and die if he read this blog. he’s a neurasthenic old lady in pants
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The dude was fucked in the head. Learning some PUA wouldhn’t have uncrazified him.
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@ PA–
No doubt about it, Auster is beta.
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stan b Pussy’s pussy.
*shakes head in agrrement.*
With all the “frontin” being done here you would never think so.
hansen A celibate needs to actively work to transmute his sexual drive or else it will only lead to frustration.
bingo my good man, you’re right. I recall reading something about a sect in India who exercised for an excessive amount of time per day to burn off the sexual energy. The Shakers(American) had their thing with dancing to burn off the energy.
from the diary Most people there( at his job) are OK and I would never have a shoot ‘em up there.
Can you imagine what his coworkers are thinking after reading this.
*slow exhale*
*wipes brow*
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What a sad story. Sounds like his entire sense of self-worth was based on his lack of having any female companionship, and felt like a hopeless failure.
Too bad he didn’t have any caring friends, coworkers, or family to try and help him though his personals struggles.
About male vs. female despair and unlearning messed up gender roles, a lot of people here made points similar to what I would have. Just throwing in my thoughts, apologies if this is inappropriate to the topic or seems insensitive in light of the tragedy:
Men are biologically driven to seek out sex with as many women as possible in order to spread their genes. So Male Game = Sex Game.
Women are biologically driven to seek out the most worthy candidate to help them propagate their genes through their precious limited eggs; this includes a man with superior genetics along with *a man who will protect her and support in making sure the the precious fertilized egg survives.* So Women Game = Marriage/Commitment Game.
Men obsess over getting laid. Women obsess about having a boyfriend/husband. In both cases, it seems like getting the opposite is easy (men can get married easily if they want and lower standards, women can get laid easily if they want and lower standards).
A woman can be getting laid but she will most likely hope to get a boyfriend or husband out of it.
When women first meet each other, one of the first questions they ask is “Do you have a boyfriend?” Women spend their entire lives completely openly OBSESSED about finding a boyfriend, then about whether that guy is going to propose, how their wedding will be, how their new house will be, how many kids they’ll have, etc.
Men on the other hand, I doubt ever talk about having a girlfriend and instead talk allll the time about getting laid, and the quality of the lay, etc.
Many men use women for sex, and lie to get it too. And, many men out there are perfectly using a girl for companionship and emotional support, they’ll move in with her but not marry her, or go out with her for years and then dump her and marry someone younger in months. This is a big cause of angst for many women. I know several girls in deep depression now over stuff like this.
That’s all, it’s interesting to hear the male perspective here. I feel for many of you, not everyone gets support to overcome early rejections or has exposure to good Alpha role models. I hope you don’t turn your anger to women as a result though – and I really hope you don’t do what this guy did. We can all change, it’s never too late to make tomorrow better than yesterday.
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List of commenters who seem to have the same email picture/address:
Lucifer
Snatch magnet
Dreamer
Joe
StanB
Selenium
MA
Hungry Hungry Hippos Yo
Marcus Aureliette
Madras
Game in BK
Tommy
The Rookie
College Boy
Dr. Grzlickson
lynch
Mandy Been Here a While
There you Go:
Christ
Am I missing something?
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That is just the avatar you get when you don’t enter an email address.
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chic noir writes:
“stan b Pussy’s pussy.
*shakes head in agrrement.*
With all the “frontin” being done here you would never think so.”
Thank you. That bit of crudely-put wisdom was given to me from the greatest natural PUA that I ever had the pleasure to meet. I asked him why, after his personal slump of not getting laid for a couple of weeks, why he decided to bed a 4. That was his response.
It hit me like I was the Buddha mediating under the Bodhi tree. Enlightened, I passed the wisdom to other AFC in my own predicament, and a slum-buster aphorism was born.
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Thanks for the info.
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About this Sodini guy, it could have been far worse :
He had 4 guns, yet killed only 3 people. VTech’s Cho killed 33, with fewer guns.
He merely was getting rejected. Imagine if he had been a guy who had been ground up in divorce court. I expect we will see a lot more of those, rather than rejected lonely guys.
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The Fifth Horseman (formerly Tood),
While we may have our differences about some issues, I think we can agree on a few things:
1] Women are NOT good at understanding complex systems or innovating.
2] Feminism and technology has driven us into uncharted territory.
3] The current system is screwed, unsustainable and in it’s last gasps.
4] It cannot end nicely, as many will try very hard to maintain status quo.
5] It is going to be hard to predict the event that will break this system’s back.
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@chic – “nice eyebrows can make a plain woman pretty”
I say it t’aint so! Proof is in the pudding (or puddings in her case).
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Shocking story in that the guy’s picture shows him to be pretty nice looking for a 48 year-old man. Perhaps he was absolutely clueless about women, and as Roissy suggested, needed game very very badly. Im allowing for the possibility that he aimed way to high, but that really is an outside consideration. This guy probably hit on 5’s and 6’s in their middle/late 30’s.
It really is a shame. A women who was relatively equally attractive would never do without dates.
Once in a while a story shocks me. This one did. When I heard about it, I was figuring the line would be, “ex-husband/boyfriend……………….blah blah”, but it wasn’t.
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a-bax He mentions some woman giving him the eye at the gym, but not really attempting to pursue her, as he doesn’t want to get “distracted” from his “mission”. He keeps reinforcing negative outcomes in his mind, the very opposite of what should be done
And
rome 82Obsidian, surprised you haven’t remarked on the shooter’s diary entry on his resentments toward black men having the pick of the best white women. WTF? That totally goes against stereotype of black men only getting the white leftovers.
When you read these two together, you can’t tell me this doesn’t sound like whiskey. I’m not teasing whiskey this time btw. I mean really, look at the two passages. Whiskey I hope you can see the similarities between yourself and this man in the same way that you can see the similarities between yourself and chuck
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z,
Precisely, Even if that picture is a few years old, he looks better than 7/10 white men who reach 48. He had a good job, was not overweight, had over 250k saved up.. not retarded.
What more does a woman want?
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Chic said you can make a plain woman pretty. Susan Boyle was not plain, she was fucking hideous. So she’s not a good example to use to refute.
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He merely was getting rejected. Imagine if he had been a guy who had been ground up in divorce court. I expect we will see a lot more of those, rather than rejected lonely guys.
It shocks me that we don’t see more of that already. I can’t imagine shooting someone over a dry spell. For that matter I can’t imagine shooting people who have never done a thing to me.
But if I had kids and an ex wife who used the courts to steal my children and my money? I can easily see myself going over the deep end because of that. I wouldn’t shoot people who had nothing to do with it, but I could snap and hunt down the judge, ex, and her lawyer. Given what goes on in family court I don’t understand why we don’t see stuff like this on a daily basis.
I have a friend who put a loaded gun in his jacket and went to his ex wife’s house after years of abuse from her and the courts. He fully intended to kill her. (I obviously didn’t know this until after or I would have tried to stop him.) For some reason rather than pull the gun he told her he fucking gave up and she could have the kids and ruin them, but that they would hate her later in life. Then he disappeared for weeks. I wonder how many close calls like that occur in our fucked up society. I can’t imagine the pain he was going through that drove him that close to the edge, or the pain of literally being forced to choose between killing her (and most likely himself) or giving up his own children. I can only imagine that he stopped short thinking that the children would be better off with a bitch and seeing him on the occasional weekend than with both of their parents dead in a murder/suicide.
We have created one fucked up society and have destroyed marriage and family.
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What more does a woman want?
Alpha confidence and dominance. The man desperately needed male friends who understood game and could help him. He may have been unbalanced in other ways, but the loneliness took him right over the edge.
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DT,
He did give it to them finally, all 50 rounds of it.. pity they did not like it.
“Alpha confidence and dominance.”
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joe Chic said you can make a plain woman pretty. Susan Boyle was not plain, she was fucking hideous. So she’s not a good example to use to refute.
joe that’s aoefe example. but to answer your question yes but probably not gorgeous and certainly not beautiful.
dove did more than eyebrows.
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Tood If women are so perceptive, why don’t they see how extremely anti-male divorce laws and general misandry are hurting average women a lot?
Ignorance or perception, I don’t think the average woman really believes the average man loses much in a divorce. Those tails of men losing half and/or millions are from hollywood and the oligarchy.
Why don’t average women rise up to roll back feminism
because feminism came with good things for women. I can have my husband arrested if he beats me. My child won’t be left destitute if my husband or I decide to leave the marriage. I can become more than a teacher, nurse or secretary if I have the aptitude.
Some women simply are meant to be housewives…period. Just as some men aren’t meant to sit of the table with the CEO and CFO.
which is preventing them from getting a guy to marry them?
Many women don’t want to get married and others just want to wait and enjoy life a bit before they do. Women give up a lot when they marry, I know my writing that upsets you of which I don’t mean to btw but we do.
If you and I were married tomorrow, you would probably want a lot of sayso over how I live my life, what I look like, how I spend my free time, and hassle me to sleep with you, curtail my traveling, tell me what to wear, pick choose and delete my friends at will etc.
Some women come to resent those things overtime even if they love(d) their husband.
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from the diary I know this firm is using this downturn as an excuse to take advantage of a bad situation and kill jobs UNNECESSARILY.
Hehe so he wasn’t trully left or right wing.
from the diary I never even spent one weekend with a girl in my life, even at my own place.
There must have been something about him that set of the female intuition danger signal.
from the diary Even though I look good, dress well, well groomed – nails, teeth, hair, etc. Who knows.
He looks alone should have been enough to get a woman who is looks first.
From the diary I was always open to suggestions to what I am doing wrong, no brother or father (mine are useless) or close friend to nudge me and give it bluntly yet tactfully wtf I am doing wrong. And dad, old man, for TOTALLY ignoring me through the years.
A father is so important to a young boy. As I’ve said many times, picking the father of child your child is the most important decision a woman will ever make.
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My disappointment with your reasoning stems from your automatic shaming language. Until he becomes homicidal, he matches the description of countless beta providers. Sodini developed his attitude while passing for a normal guy in a respectable, specialized job. This alone assures that he could interact with other people at a rudimentary level. Plenty of people are strikiningly less capable.
You have him painted as a lunatic in your mind and will rationalize his behavior backwards, from this perspective. Not a de facto lie, but not very objective of you either.
With all due respect, I have him painted as a lunatic in my mind because in real life he walked into a public place and started shooting at random people who had nothing whatsoever to do with whatever grudges he was nursing.
What he did was the response of someone who was fundamentally unbalanced, not merely sexually frustrated. Frustration happens — blowing away strangers who’ve done nothing to harm you is never a reasonable means of coping with it.
If he wanted to off himself, that’s his right. It’s sad, and it’s a shame he didn’t have anyone in his life to help him out of that despair, but it’s his right. But there’s no excuse for taking innocent people with him. That is the act of a coward.
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chic noir,
Female Intuition= Bullshit
If women were really intuitive, they would not end up in bad relationships so often. But almost every woman keeps on selecting for such guys. If you call that intuition.. that is your problem.
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Chic — what similarities between me and Chuck?
There is no doubt that a certain section of women, educated and attractive, prefer Black men. Not many. But they are there. It does not affect me, one way or another, but it does tick off White guys who are not getting any. Since there is not an endless supply of hot women, and the more partners a woman has the less valued she is as a potential mate. And preference for more high-T guys tends to leave out the nerdy low-T guys. [Most attractive, educated women I know lust after various Black athletes, but would never go for it in person fearing “too much” T and aggression. The fantasy is harmless IMHO.]
Again the danger is not guys going postal, but guys going tribal preferences, i.e. demanding their own AA preferences for Whites in dominant Black areas / spaces (like say, NFL mandating certain percentage White WR) and resisting inroads in their own domains.
Violent outliers like this guy or the Black thug who murdered White Teen Lily Burk as she ran an errand in LA are more indicative of where the median has moved to than the violence itself. Because even violence tends to have limits. Note the guy did not want to go postal at work because he liked people there. The Black thug made no effort to hide his handiwork, because he’d had a revolving door of parole for decades. Same age too btw as the Pittsburgh killer. Guy was picked up dead stoned a few hours after he killed the gal.
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Marcus Aureliette,
I do not think he killed the undeserving.
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Obs:
Good question you ask, and deserves what I hope is an equally good response…
I personally think that the two points you raised are not mutually exclusive…
From a purely practical standpoint, the individual guy’s last, best hope is learning Game to the best of his ability. In this way he has some chance of getting some degree of happiness in our postmodern, postfeminist world.
That may be true, but it’s peanuts compared to the biological and social factors which condition and shape an individual’s chances in this world.
I’m just saying, you can’t respond to every man’s cry of desperation with “Just learn Game”, as if it was a panacea.
I’ve seen DA’s picture. I’ve known a couple DA’s back in my college days. I know the personality type. A personality type that is not amenable to change.
Character is destiny.
I’m telling you that there is no way in hell someone like DA will EVER bang anything more than a 5 (MAYBE a 6, if the chick is freaky enough…MAYBE) even with all the Game in the world.
Just ain’t gonna happen in this new America.
In another age, things might have been different.
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The reason why we don’t see more of this is because men who have children, for the most part, at least have some contact with their children. Even in the cases of extreme alienation, Father’s don’t want to have to have their children grow up knowing their father was an infamous mass murderer.
No…I think as wretched as the divorce court industry is right now, the Father’s still have at least a minimal investment in society for their childrens sake.
It’s these cases of betas/omegas facing a life time of rejection while watching other guys getting pussy galore who are going to continue to carry out such mass murders.
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it does tick off White guys who are not getting any.
Not really. Numbers-wise, white guys more than make up for the loss of mostly ugly white girls by dating high quality Asian girls.
It’s not the single guys who don’t like miscegenation, Most don’t care. It’s parents of teenage girls.
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It shocks me that we don’t see more of that already. I can’t imagine shooting someone over a dry spell. For that matter I can’t imagine shooting people who have never done a thing to me.
But if I had kids and an ex wife who used the courts to steal my children and my money? I can easily see myself going over the deep end because of that.
The reason why we don’t see more of this is because men who have children, for the most part, at least have some contact with their children. Even in the cases of extreme alienation, Father’s don’t want to have to have their children grow up knowing their father was an infamous mass murderer.
No…I think as wretched as the divorce court industry is right now, the Father’s still have at least a minimal investment in society for their childrens sake.
It’s these cases of betas/o m e g a s facing a life time of rejection while watching other guys getting pussy galore who are going to continue to carry out such mass murders.
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Dave from Hawaii,
We will see more of this, especially with the ongoing economic situation.
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Cunthulah:
Tupac, again, I do not think men should date or even shag anyone they find unattractive.
I’m getting tired of having to repeat that.
Fine, but yet you keep repeating the notion that mens’ gripes about not gettin’ any are because they are holding out for “unicorns” and “trophies”.
That may be true for a subset of men, but there are many men who are shut out from the type of women who would have been within their reach 30-40 years ago.
DA:
That’s the problem. 3s shouldn’t be mating with other 3s. If they can’t secure 7s and up, they should just simply “drop-out” of the relationship market. If you’re ugly, why should you reinforce your ugliness with an ugly partner?
Hugs?
I kid.
Hell, how can you even get an erection for an ugly girl?
Some of us here have testosterone. Ever heard of it?
Maybe we should pass the hat around for a hooker for DA so he doesn’t go batshit and kill us all.
David will not turn to the dark path.
Yeah, you’re just a pussy.
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It is amazing that so many SWPL guys are trying to demean this guy and push for gun control.
Are they stupid, deluded or just nuts?
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Chic:
Come on Tupac the cuntullah was unnessary.
Aw, I’m just straight reppin O.G. style. Nicole knows what time it is.
Ain’t that right Nubianne?
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Racer X:
There is a lot more to life than pussy.
OK who are you, where is Racer X and what have you done with him?
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John Gosselin: Stop Blaming Me, I Tried Therapy, Kate Ended It.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/05/jon-gosselin-stop-blaming_n_251617.html
What is the biggest difference in your life now, compared to a year ago?
Let’s go back to October of last year — that’s when all of this happened. Kate basically came to me out of the blue and said, “I am done. You are going to live your life, and I am going to live my life.” I was like, “What?” I didn’t really know what was going on. When she said that, I was really upset and nervous.
Why did she want to break up?
I think she initiated the split because she wanted a career. Maybe I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do, and she was going to move on regardless. I said, “Are you sure about this?”
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Damnit, the first two sentences were supposed to be blockquoted…
Oh Lucifer, I think this latest case is us already seeing “more of this.”
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but there are many men who are shut out from the type of women who would have been within their reach 30-40 years ago.
Personal theory: 85% of men would be happy to marry 3s-6s as long as they weren’t fat.
Women just don’t fucking understand how repulsive fatness is. It’s worse that pussy odor. It’s worse than open sores. Fatness is a complete and utter disqualifier.
And those 3s-6s have gotten fat. Leaving guys with their dicls in the wind and non-fatties with cosmically-inflated expectations.
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Given the high cost of ammunition, I practice careful gun control myself. It does help that I have a reloading press.
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http://www.fathers-4-justice.org/f4j/
I think they did more for MRA than any gun-toting fool.
Tupac: The DA persona is somewhat of a celeberity. That’s been known to make things happen. Who knows?
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Lucifer:
Precisely, Even if that picture is a few years old, he looks better than 7/10 white men who reach 48. He had a good job, was not overweight, had over 250k saved up.. not retarded.
What more does a woman want?
Gina tingle.
“Twas not beauty, but hypergamy that killed the Beast.”
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Tupac Chopra,
I am sure that some women in that place felt a tingling sensation during or after the 50 rounds were discharged… many will probably remember that experience for years to come.
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PA
Fatness is a complete and utter disqualifier.
……for White guys. On the other hand black, latino and pacific islander men not only have no problem with it they actually prefer fat women to the thin women so many White guys crave.
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http://fathers-4-justice.org/f4j//index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=40&Itemid=72
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Lucifer – If you look deeper, here’s the REAL reason why she wanted to break up:
John:
He beta-ized.
She lost all attraction and respect for him.
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This is my first time here and I’m perplexed about some of the comments. What happened to just talking to women? Just talking, no jedi mind tricks or other bs.
If men made it a goal to initiate a conversation with a woman once a day, any woman: the waitress, the barrista, the woman in line ahead of you at the supermarket, I think eventually they’d grow accustomed to approaching women in a casual and non creepy way. I think women can sense when some guy is perpetrating a game on them, and it’s off-putting.
Maybe the conversation thing is the key – when you meet someone spontaneously and just start talking, you both can sense if there’s an attraction, and go from there.
I don’t mean to lecture anyone here, just offer some constructive suggestions – I think if you operate with a game mentality, you’re going to find yourself perpetually playing games and being played.
My advice would be to look for someone whom you find attractive who also seems nice and fairly laid back. If you devote all of your attention to a game with the objective of bamboozling some random bimbo, you’re going to miss out on developing a real relationship with a woman capable of loving you back.
In any case, good luck to you all – if anything I’ve said rings true, great, if not… then by all means return to the tried and true doctrine of that ponytail dude with the furry hat and space goggles who appears to have been cryogenically frozen circa 1992 and reanimated in 2007 as the host of a reality show : )
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Dave from Hawaii,
What about the system that created men like him? He is the product of a fucked up system.
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mellow pixie dream girl,
Why would a guy do that? oh, I get it… you want alimony, child support and the satisfaction of fucking over a guy who cares.
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No doubt. Just pointing out the key factor that nobody even recognizes precisely because of the ‘system’ that molds men to turn into beta wimps when they get married and have children.
Ask permission to go out?
Never…ever….ever….EVER ask your woman for “permission.”
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@Lucifer/DT
-What more could a woman want?
The man didn’t need to be earning 6 figures or even look better than 70% of men his age. Not asking for “alpha dominance” either.
If he has no friends and doesn’t have a single friendly relation with any neighbor, he doesn’t appear as a suitable mate.
If he can’t empathize even loosely w/ others, how can he empathize in a relationship or with future children?
@Willard Libby
LOL @ your generalizations about only white men preferring thin women and ethnic men outright preferring fat women.
Thin women are appealing to men across all races, just like there are probably more white men out there than you’d like to think who would date a size 12+ woman and marry her.
@PA
You’re right. If women across the board would slim down, they would see many of their issues dissappear. Not all, but many.
But what about the men? This is a nation of overweight people, not overweight women.
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Lucifer:
What about the system that created men like him? He is the product of a fucked up system.
Consumerist turbo-capitalism, where fleeting fashion trumps classic beauty.
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Dreamer,
People get what they deserve.. too bad he was not thoughtful in his selection of ammo or aim.
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……for White guys. On the other hand black, latino and pacific islander men not only have no problem with it they actually prefer fat women to the thin women so many White guys crave.
This is true. This has been written about at great lenght by me. Obese-dian has confirmed this.
An entire article was devoted to why Obese-dian is attracted to Scarlett, shown here.
This is because it reminds him of this.
Of course, given Obese-dian’s small size and mahout roleplaying, his ultimate fantasy is THIS.
Black men prefer that their women resemble the largest creatures of Africa (elephant, hippo, rhino, and cape buffalo) in size, shape, color, and texture. Texture is important too. This is because in Africa, these beasts have no natural predators, and are dominant. Thus, they are admired by black people in Africa, and black mem prefer the same traits in women. It makes sense in terms of resource maximization.
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This is one of the most pervasive “pretty lies” or our era of societal decay.
Yes, you are. You are simply looking at the word “dominance” and immediately ascribing negative connotations to it…like physical violence and abusive behavior. One can be dominant without being abusive.
For example – you want a man that is “confident” and “assertive” who can “lead” the conversation.
When a woman say “He has a great sense of humor” that really means he can lead a conversation that is highly entertaining to that woman.
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Tupac Chopra,
I disagree.. consumerism is not the problem.
The real problem is a system that is divorced from the reality of human behavior, and a lot of men who seem to support this BS.
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Ryder — Love that. Yes many men will be deeply invested (and in China too, which is why it’s been historically infested with cults) in overthrowing the status-quo with something that gives them a better “deal.” Mostly by pushing down others to elevate themselves. Whatever Alexander promising to loot Persia, or Caesar, or Napoleon, presents himself, will get enormous amounts of backing.
Chic —
Women are blithering idiots about men. Consistently, without fail. Witness the morons who married the Petersons, Scott and Drew. Or the one who went off with Johan Van Der Sloot. Or the ones who went off with Ted Bundy.
Women are stupid about men, even stupider than men are about women. They have NO ZERO ZILCH NADA intuition about men, other than getting the tingle from dominance. For example, Scott Peterson, a manure salesman (no kidding) bs-ed his way into the cheap blonde bimbo’s pants as he plotted to kill his wife. What insight, intuition, and so on did either of them have? Heck if he’d gotten away with it, the blonde bimbo would have probably married the guy because it was “hot.”
Anyone who thinks women have special intuition has swallowed feminist idiocy hook, line, and sinker.
People want fame because fame beats wealth. Arnold when he was making True Lies could pull far more women (and he was married) than a single Bill Gates. Even the latter was actually far more powerful. Why? Because FAME MATTERS. Women are hard-wired to seek fame/patronage status as a result of agricultural societies ruled by patronage. It’s high-risk and high-reward. You can get killed, also your offspring, in power struggles or by the big dog, but the payout is fantastic. It’s why a D-bag like John what’s his name from “John and Kate Plus 8” has women ALL OVER HIM.
Like DT said, this is a function of lots of wealth pouring in. Economic dislocations, nuclear proliferation, a combination of WWII and the great Depression (cities make GREAT! shipping container nuke targets) will change the BS that women drive in culture from spending more money. Go to any supermarket. Pace off the men’s grooming aisle space and the women’s (exclude feminine hygiene). It will be about 7-1 ratio. Heck women are still spending in shop-therapy in the recession. It’s ridiculous. But unsustainable.
Put it together with Ryder’s hypothesis (lots of guys invested in a leader who promises a whole new order) and you get big big trouble.
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Sorry, the Scarlett link was here.
I did not mean to link to the Haradrim rider picture twice.
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I’ve known several people who have gone looooooong periods being celibate, and even a few lifers. It’s not uncommon amongst my cultural group. Nobody is murdering.
I also know very ugly parents who have given birth to gorgeous kids and vice versa. In fact, I have to say, the really attractive couples I know NEVER give birth to equally attractive kids.
Funny how that is.
Anyway, this dude obviously had more pressing issues wearing on his psyche other than just not getting laid.
He needed meds.
Or was he already on them?
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high-risk and high-reward. You can get killed, also your offspring, in power struggles or by the big dog, but the payout is fantastic. It’s why a D-bag like John what’s his name from “John and Kate Plus 8″ has women ALL OVER HIM
You haven’t seen the show, have you? Jon Gosselin is very beta. He is a half-white / half-Korean 32-year-old who just divorced from his ballbusting older wife Kate. Tabloid notoriaty gave him access to hot young women but at least one has publically dumped him over his mopey beta ways.
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Whiskey, why do you call John a “d-bag?”
Read the article Lucifer just linked to…
…Kate initiated the divorce to pursue a career. Good for him that he’s out hooking up with other women…
…however, he’s already making the mistake of one-itis with his current girlfriend. That too will end badly for him eventually if he doesn’t man up.
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I said, “Tupac, again, I do not think men should date or even shag anyone they find unattractive. I’m getting tired of having to repeat that.”
Tupac answered, “Fine, but yet you keep repeating the notion that mens’ gripes about not gettin’ any are because they are holding out for “unicorns” and “trophies”.”
Yes. They are holding out for unicorns and trophies and therefore shagging or dating women they find unattractive/substandard is a waste of both their and the reject’s time.
…or are you saying that women who are holding out for a commitment should have pity on the poor, sex starved dreamers, and kick ’em down with a little unenthusiastic enzyme harvesting?
Is that what you want from us ugly girls? Pity?
“That may be true for a subset of men, but there are many men who are shut out from the type of women who would have been within their reach 30-40 years ago.”
30-40 years ago, you weren’t in forums bombarding us with fat cunt, fatty mcfatfat, and telling us out loud that you felt entitled to women who looked “better” than us because the television told you so.
If you want to know where the women within most of you guys’ reach went, consider how I’ve been treated here, and whether or not it should inspire me to open my legs or vomit.
Nothing personal…I totally understand where it comes from, and I pity most of you for it.
…but not enough to have sex with you.
See, pussitude for me is like fat for PA. I’d rather deal with open sores.
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I disagree.. consumerism is not the problem.
When Don Draper types get passed over for Ashton Kutcher types…we have a problem
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Heh, PA, beat me to it. No, I never saw the show, nor did I pay any attention to the MSM coverage of their sordid tale or their reality show.
But I did read the link lucifer posted, and could tell right off the bat that Kate divorced him because he was a pathetic beta.
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WHAT ABOUT THE STORY I POSTED ABOVE??? “THIRD WHEEL TAKES OVER”?
I POSTED IT FOR ARPAGUS, AMONG OTHERS!!!
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And I am rooting for Jon. He did say that the problem with his marriage was that he was passive and let his wife rule the roost.
Learning Game doesn’t happen overnight. Former betas have lots of ear wax that gets in the way before they can change their attitude and habits with women.
And I am not even sure of Jon “knows” about Game. For alll I know he might still be grappling in the dark, thinking that it was OK to be “nice,” just not with a bad woman like Kate.
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I feel the way this man felt. I work hard in school, against my basic laziness, to get a career. Why? So I can live a “normal life” – respected by friends and family. But I don’t really know if it will help. I have a lot of trouble both forging good male friendships (which are crucial to meeting women) and in keeping women for relationships. Perhaps these people can see my underlying bitterness about 15 years of rejection by women. In New York City, I am invisible to women. They don’t even acknowledge my existence. I’m not the only one who feels this way, but how do you think it feels to pass by happy-looking couples, day after day after day? Knowing I have nobody, and that everyone can probably sense it.
I really don’ t know what to do. I’m much younger than Sodini but I feel I might be near my breaking point. I feel game cannot help me – I get uncomfortable “negging” and I’m not good at improvising good lines in the moment. I have a deep emptiness. Murders like this one don’t impact me at all. I couldn’t care less. It becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy when people can probably sense my underlying issues, preventing me from carrying on good relationships, repeating the cycle.
Maybe foriegn women tend to be different. I started chatting with this pretty Spanish girl last night. I was pretty beta, as usual, though I still got the digits. She seemed interested and with so much rejection, I almost could not believe it was true. I’ll see if she wants to hang out but I’m sure I will find a way to blow it also.
More of these kinds of situations will probably occur, if more and more good, average guys are spurned by women. I don’t believe this guy Sodini was always fucked in the head, I believe it was a slow progression of problems based in our fucked society.
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Ghost of Nicole,
Keep telling yourself that.
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GNP:
Sorry, the Scarlett link was here.
I did not mean to link to the Haradrim rider picture twice.
I think I speak for all of us here when I say we appreciate the scholarly effort and exacting standards you apply to your…uh….work.
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Tupac, Clio liked your little poem.
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Lucifer,
While we may have our differences about some issues, I think we can agree on a few things:
1] Women are NOT good at understanding complex systems or innovating.
YES. They don’t even know what they don’t know.
2] Feminism and technology has driven us into uncharted territory.
Yes, but the next technological disruptions are more likely to work in favor of men than women.
For example, Game would not exist without the Internet as a knowledge sharing, marketing, and community-building tool.
3] The current system is screwed, unsustainable and in it’s last gasps.
Well, no. It is always evolving. It is more likely that developing countries (like India) will migrate in this direction, than the reverse.
Rural America is still in far better shape (with most women getting married and staying married) than urban America.
4] It cannot end nicely, as many will try very hard to maintain status quo.
5] It is going to be hard to predict the event that will break this system’s back.
The combination of Four Horsemen will greatly crash the present dominance that feminist-oriented women have.
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Starbury,
Don’t you worry, I have feeling that we are seeing the beginning of a pattern. A feedback loop.. so to speak.
Humans cannot learn any other way.
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PA,
LOL—–I agree wholeheartedly about the fatness being a disqualifier. Exactly. There would be plenty of fuckable women who are currently 3’s, 4’s, 5’s and 6’s that would increase their looks a good 2-4 points if they were simply in shape.
We see em’ all the time. Her face is pretty cute, but my god………she’s a “sunbathing walrus” as Roissy put it. No shape at all. One can imagine how bad that fat pussy smells.
Lucifer,
This guy would have done better to buy pussy once or twice a week while he went out and tried to meet women relentlessly. I cannot imaging going without the physical personal acceptance of another human being for 19 years, even if I was in my 50’s. I’d certainly buy hookers before I’d go an entire year.
A man of means Lucifer, like yourself, in many ways has it made. Im assuming you make quite a bit of money. You can buy pussy a couple of nights a week and game women two or three other nights a week with no closing pressure at all. You know you can buy it at any time. That would be a distinct advantage for a man with a few years on him, but who has some financial advantages, on a young completely broke guy just starting out. The experienced man, worse come-to-worse, can spare the $400 bucks on a run-of-the-mill-call girl push come to shove, and should have that in the back of his mind. It should make him even more confident.
You are quite right about the man’s appearance Lucifer. He looks waaaaaaayyyyyyyy better than most 48 year-old women. It is suprising that he didn’t land any older gal at all. Maybe he was just painfully shy? Its a shocker. I expected to see a “Son-of-Sam” looking-dude, full of flab. This guy wasn’t/
One comenter in the thread mentioned ex’s, child support, and whatnot. I too, wouldn’t be suprised if we seen a few of those. I wouldn’t be suprised if we didn’t see some judges and lawyers getting whacked by financially wrecked guys either. Its no small wonder that lawyers are so pro-gun control. If one fucks other people over for a living, I suppose they wouldn’t want them to have firearms.
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Nicole:
Fat is a choice.
And a whole HELL of a lot easier to fix for a woman than a wholesale regeneration of one’s very personality/soul is for a man.
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That good looking men fuck women who are 5s makes it near impossible for an average looking guy to bed women with any level of success.
Scarcity helps create nutjobs like this guy.
When said “5” fucks an 8-10 man, her standards get artificially inflated. Hence, next week she’s at the club and rejecting a guy who’s a 7…to his astonishment.
Until top quality men get some standards, the averge Joe will get a piece of meat knuckle maybe once a month.
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lucifer If women were really intuitive, they would not end up in bad relationships so often. But almost every woman keeps on selecting for such guys. If you call that intuition.. that is your problem.
no those who go from one bad relationship to another and another are usually sick. I’ve had two boyfriends and both treated me like the apple of their eye and I loved them for it 🙂
There are plenty of women who don’t get into relationships with jerks and a-holes. The real question is why are there so many unhappy, confused women walking around. Some people love drama.
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Lucifer says, “Keep telling yourself that.”
Keep telling myself what?
…that pity doesn’t make me wet?
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The Fifth Horseman (formerly Tood),
Current system = Feminist dominated fakery built on bullshit and supported by spineless men.
and yes, technology will work in favor of men.
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@Eurosabra, you are one of my sweeties. Please don’t allow yourself to spin out of control like sodinni.
Cannon’s cannon- i have practically come to peace with the concept of killing people without motive
No more gangster rap for you.
Snatch magnet Oh yeah, and is it me or has anyone else noticed that Willard has been strangely silent?
Coincidence?
*elbows snatch*
I was thinking whiskey before I read the location then I went to willard when I saw sodinni was from PA. Willard made one comment today so it wasn’t him, thank God.
Doug 1 to mu That’s nuts.
Yeah you’ll do WAY better with game if you make a good income than without it, but with a given amount of game you’ll also get a hotter girl with money that without it. Esp. for ltr but not only. Sometimes it seems you say things simply because they feel good to you.
Reread Mu’s comment. It looks like you want to diagree with him for the sake of arguing. A man with money but no game is soon a man with no money and no game.
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PA:
Tupac, Clio liked your little poem.
Fat lot of good that does me.
Do you think it induced a gina tingle?
Rhetorical.
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Ghost of Nicole,
You seem to mistake men for farm animals who are docile or can be controlled. Let’s see how it works out..
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Lucifer:
A feedback loop.. so to speak.
Humans cannot learn any other way.
Wise words.
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pixie: Too many men have trouble. Talking to women generates a lot of anxiety for them. Especially women a man finds attractive. Especially after getting rejected and not just that, but repeatedly.
If I go into a situation which makes me anxious, I want to know every detail and manoeuvre I could possibly need and could use for maximum advantage. For men in these situations: it’s called Game but it makes for more interesting, charged conversation and interaction which showcases the best of the man’s attractiveness. It teaches confidence.
Conversation’s both an art and a science, and approaching it from either way depends on the person’s personality and natural capabilities.
Men are more than welcome to have their own version of the Endless Dating and Beauty Advice women get e.g. your advice to just approach women? That’s a Game tactic.
It’s more finding ways of increasing his sexual attractiveness. Advice such as going to the gym has also been given out (if that’s Game or not, doesn’t matter, but it has) within Game’s context. It increases the likelihood of both and being successful with them.
Why are you using the word bamboozling here?
How Game Seems to Work:
— Young man is concerned because he’s not getting any [men, especially some men, really need it].
— He consults the seduction community.
— He goes to the gym more often.
— He alters his clothing style to give himself a style.
— He finds a group of like-minded men.
— He approaches women, hopefully persisting despite initial failures with various fun conversation openings (and closings, and conversation styles). Men’re actually more interested in conversations if there’s a goal for them.
— His confidence and masculinity hopefully gradually builds up as he begins to succeed. He is in disbelief about what women are attracted to.
— He goes through a female-hating phase because he’s figuring out The True Nature of women and those with husbands or boyfriends are sleeping with him condomless.
— He comes to acceptance with the true nature of women as the yin to his yang as opposed to the yang to his yang.
It’s a proven method and it’s kind of silly to begrudge it when both him and the women he ‘picks up’ are getting what they want, being equally responsible for their decisions as adults.
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Tupac, maybe Clio was unnerved by your having discoverd her new disguise (black-dyed hair) and spying on her as she dined wiht her man and some other people.
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Tupac wrote :
“I think I speak for all of us here when I say we appreciate the scholarly effort and exacting standards you apply to your…uh….work.”
Thanks. Soon, I will write a detailed thesis that compares and contrasts the three fetishists here : xsplat, Obsidian, and Peter. I have completed most of my research and interviewing of the subjects (amicably or otherwise). It will be funny, but also instructive about the great similarities that exist between seemingly diverse fetishists. The exhibits will include images, references, and even a song by Isaac Hayes.
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[…] Or take Roissy in D.C.: […]
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z,
I am younger than you think. I just use money differently..
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for 10% of all fat people in this country it isn’t.
Correct. And for 90% of them it IS.
There aren’t enough black men to service all the fat black women AND fat white women. Even if black dudes are being circus trainers to three elephants at once, there are still too few black men to service all the fat women.
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WTF. Because this loser couldn’t get laid, planned murder was only to be expected and justified? And feminism is to blame of course. Because goddamn, us wimmin shouldn’t have a say in who we fuck right?
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Lucifer
America will grow strongly on this quarter and mildly on the next one. get over it. The recession is gone
wrt men dating unnattractive girls, creative men around the world invented a substance called “alcohol”. Unnattractive girls should have the dignity to understand the social costs plus the self esteem effect on a man of waking up to see the Joker on his side, and leave as early as possible and minimize social contact hence
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Sharon: and to the other girls:
I posted a story above called “Third Wheel Takes Over”
what do you think of this story???
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question for the forum
I have never banged an ugly girl who was virgin, nor have any of my friends, and I posed this question to close friends in drunk moments, have done that either
are ugly girls born without the hymen?
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Sodinni’s issues started as a kid. Being bullied by his older brother. Having a father who was indifferent &didn’t give a darn. A ball busting controlling mom who made him feel emasculated. He carried all of this along with a genetic propensity for psychosis into adulthood. I bet he was hoping to meet a warm good-looking woman who could help erase his childhood scars. His social awkwardness with women only helped to make his adult life as harsh as his childhood. On paper Sardini was a good bet but his demons prevented him from closing.
On game: for men who come from cultures where one does not look authority figures in the eye.
In America you must stop that. Women look at it as a sign of weakness. When you approach a woman you must believe you are the hottest thing since white bread. Even if you have to repeat to yourself over and over again that you are the best man in the bar before approaching, do it.
@ryder- if you write a tribute to chic, remember I like the gentle stuff.
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a feminist created a blog called “wine, cats and feminism”
some jokes just write themselves.
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HELP PLEASE – someone I know casually confided in me earlier today about her son. She’s very concerned about him, he doesn’t date girls, he doesn’t have a lot of friends. I’ve met him, he seems like a dejected young man. She tried her best to raise him as a single mother, and I think he def. has some masculinity issues. I’m starting to think that’s the root of all of his issues in fact.
GAME WOULD HELP HIM, BUT WHAT IF HE IS TOO BLINDED BY DEPRESSION? WHERE ARE SOME MEN’S RIGHTS FRIENDLY THERAPISTS/COUNSELORS?
How can I find those therapists who can deal with men’s rights issues? I doubt he would attend a seminar if we signed him up, or read this website or Mystery Method if we recommended it. Even if we were to hire Roosh or some other PUA to do one-on-one coaching, he probably wouldn’t even show up.
The idea is to this young man him back on his feet and get him to feel better about himself. And then slowly he can eventually get to the point of being open to Game.
Any help will be GREATLY APPRECIATED. I really would like to help this guy. I think Starbury and others might be able to use this help too.
Please, pleeeeeaseee do some helping out today guys. You will help make the world a better place, starting with one or more men who were just like you.
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gig are ugly girls born without the hymen?
bike riding,tampoons, and horse riding can destroy the hymen.
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Tupac says, “Fat is a choice.”
Bleating is unsexy.
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Women simply have to accept this incident as a tax.
Women get men to buy them drinks, dinners, etc. their whole lives. Women have no moral restraints about being moochers while doing nothing for the man in return.
Every now and then, a few women will get shot up by a man. That is the tax on the freebies women gladly accept with no reciprocity.
It is a very minor tax if just 3 women die in return for the $100 billion or whatever than men pay to women each year (if you count divorce court theft, the number is much higher).
Murder is always wrong, but women are not willing to accept their own hand in creating this backlash.
Societies where unmarried men and women don’t ‘date’ (i.e. where an average man is guaranteed to be able to marry an average woman) are also societies where this sort of incident doesn’t occur.
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@Mu’Min seeks FAT WuMin – you are being disrespectful to roissy when you come into his blog and throw his comment sections. please be respectful.
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gig,
I understand economics a bit better than you and most of the clowns who fill university chairs.
The current economic problems are one symptom of a more fundamental dislocation. We have a society that requires few to work but almost all to consume. However most people have to work to make that money. We are running a 21st century tech based world on 19th century idea.. similar to flying a supersonic plane with a biplane manual.
We have been filling this gap for the last 30 years with various ponzi schemes and financialism.
It cannot end well.
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bike riding,tampoons, and horse riding can destroy the hymen.
I have a dirty theory that many girls lost their hymens while being fingered by their BFs
Girls are nasty.
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are ugly girls born without the hymen?
Two ugly women team up to buy a double-headed dildo, and see-saw each other from time to time.
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lovelysexybeauty: slap that dumb bitch for being a single mother (unless she’s a widow). Then tell her in front of the boy that she is a worthless piece of shit.
As far as the boy: get him to a gym. Have a trainer prescribe him a weight lifting workout that will be easy at first, but will start giving him progressive results. He shoudl do cardio, and start with the machines for weight lifting. After about 3-6 months of doing machnes, he should start working with dumbbells for th eupper body.
Working out will stimulate his testosterone production, make him feel good about his appearance, make him more confident. It is also legitimately a loner’s activity, or a social one so he can strike up friendships with cool guys his age who work out at that gym, or just do his thng alone.
Then go back to his cunt single mother and spit in her face.
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@ Bhetti
“How Game Seems to Work:
– Young man is concerned because he’s not getting any [men, especially some men, really need it].
– He consults the seduction community.
…”
Brilliant listing of the phases a man who learns “Game” goes through, as opposed to those who naturally acquire it. The woman-hating phase was particularly interesting.
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HA!
just met anIndian economist today. he considered himself from the UK.
he said : “Brazil amazed me, people here are much more sophisticated than I thought” . Moron. . later on I sent to the fund´s email group a story about how Indian men have some of the smallest penises in the World.
anyway, the guy was uber-bullish, and reasonably so
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GAME WOULD HELP HIM, BUT WHAT IF HE IS TOO BLINDED BY DEPRESSION? WHERE ARE SOME MEN’S RIGHTS FRIENDLY THERAPISTS/COUNSELORS?
Ain’t no such animal.
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Cunthulah:
Bleating is unsexy.
Which is why I only do it here.
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Marcus Aureliette:
“With all due respect, I have him painted as a lunatic in my mind because in real life he walked into a public place and started shooting at random people who had nothing whatsoever to do with whatever grudges he was nursing.”
Fair enough. I would probably start with a few homeless people to acclimate myself to the sensations. You know, to maximize performance.
Just going off the cuff like that with no physical preparation? Lunacy!
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LSB:
You’re best bet is to find some natural alphas to take him under their wing and mentor him in being a man, long before he starts learning to be some “PUA”.
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I agree with PA. It is her fault that she is a single mother, and her son is suffering from EXACTLY what happens to fatherless boys.
What a selfish woman she was. Why did she divorce her husband?
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Lucifer says, “You seem to mistake men for farm animals who are docile or can be controlled. Let’s see how it works out..”
Dude, a guy just shot up a gym because his Hollywoodian dream did not come true.
Even on a well run farm, sometimes you get an animal who will go wild and upset the order the herd has set up. He’ll take on the most dominant male even though he has no chance, start killing the females instead of mating with them or starting a harem of the females who are drawn to him, or very very rarely, turn on the farmer.
….but almost never does one say “fuck it” and go live in the forest with some deer or purposefully throw himself to the wolves so maybe some of what is him will be born into a free predator.
Docile is a matter of perspective. This man sacrificed his own life and took out a few others on the altar of the feminist Venus of elder boned fancy boys with vaginas who could give a rat’s ass if he lived or died until he was shooting at them.
If only the herd had more like him, I’d start a diet cult where the girls were rated and the ones who were >7’s had to screw all of the guys.
Y’all would pay me big bucks for that.
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Two ugly women team up to buy a double-headed dildo, and see-saw each other from time to time.
I´d rather be waterboarded than see it befoer me
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PA – I don’t know her story but she seems normal and feminine, so I bet she wishes she wasn’t a single mother. So she just has to try to make the most of the situation I guess.
The idea about getting him to work out sounds good. As his body improves I bet he’ll feel good to see how his hard work results in progress too: he’s a success (encouraging). And exercises releases endorphins as well. And increasing testosterone with weights, that’s good.
But… how to get the guy to go? I wonder if it would bother him if a bunch of women tell him to go to the gym, “We got you a personal trainer.”
It might reaffirm that he’s worthless, that women boss him around and see him as needing help, maybe? It might work better coming from male figure, that’s why I’m thinking therapist?
I’ll talk to her tomorrow, but my impression is that it’ll feed his anger that his mother/any woman is telling him what his “loser” self should do. I hope she listens to my advice, I’m already thinking about how to present all this to her.
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“After about 3-6 months of doing machines, he should start working with dumbbells for the upper body.”
Months 7-12 should feature squats, deadlifts, and hang cleans. You may also want to get the boy used to needles, cuz he’s going to be seeing a lot of them in Year 2.
You know what I’m talking about!
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LSB wrote :
I don’t know her story but she seems normal and feminine, so I bet she wishes she wasn’t a single mother.
Then why did she divorce the father, giving no thought to her son’s well being?
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lovelysexybeauty – that’s a legit conunndrum. I suspect that any advice from his mother or other women, even about the gym, will be something he instinctivelly will say NO to. Even in healthy homes, boys can recoil from what their moms tell them.
Not sure how to get him to go. Do you know any cool guys under 50 who are good with teenagers that could invite the boy to try the gym?
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Tupac Chopra – getting some natural Alphas to take him under their wing sounds good too. But how to do it… I could ask guy I’m seeing to do so, I think he’s pretty Alpha lol. But that could get weird… I mean it could cause problems in our relationship and stuff.
I’m thinking through all the guys I know that might fit the Alpha description, but I don’t know if any would want to take on such a burden. I could try to ask I suppose, maybe even use some of my feminine charmmmm lol….
Would need to strategize how to get the young guy to not feel like it’s some bossy women trying to “help” him and thereby insult his manhood though. Hm….
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Interstingly, I was at the gym today (I’m in my late 30s) and I usually see the same group of teenage guys working out there.
They seem very alpha, but also smart and friendly… if the boy can eventually make friends with guys like them, it would be a huge boost for him.
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On the other hand black, latino and pacific islander men not only have no problem with it they actually prefer fat women to the thin women so many White guys crave.
I’ll refrain from making the case about other men in general, but some skinny girls just don’t look attractive. Exposed bones on a girl just aren’t attractive to me. I don’t mind a little chubbiness if it gets me warm hugs, tits to play with, and an ass to grab.
Some of us here have testosterone. Ever heard of it?
You mean the thing that turns somebody into an impulsive train wreck?
Even with elevated testosterone levels, wouldn’t the girl’s low attractiveness just depress the ability to become aroused and form an erection? I’d rather have low T if it means I avoid something as degrading as having sex with an ugly woman.
Fine, but yet you keep repeating the notion that mens’ gripes about not gettin’ any are because they are holding out for “unicorns” and “trophies”.
I think she’s referring to David Alexander-esque men who basically narrow their focus on “hot” looking women instead of just merely beautiful women. The equivalent would be telling David Alexander to consider that friendly 6 who thinks I’m smart instead of holding out for the 6 who has all of the physical attributes David wants.
A personality type that is not amenable to change.
Tupac knows too much. David is the kind of guy who gets upset just because his mom wants to go out shopping, which is only a slight deviation from the home-work-home lifestyle.
I’m telling you that there is no way in hell someone like DA will EVER bang anything more than a 5 (MAYBE a 6, if the chick is freaky enough…MAYBE)
With nails, makeup, heels, tits, and ass, right?
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The reason betas at least below higher beta aren’t getting laid much in their 20’s today but girls at the same rank are has to be because girls have become a lot sluttier. It’s mathematically necessary if there is the discrepancy in that direction. They’re either doing one nights, short and longer flings or maybe short soft polygamy relationships.
Otherwise if e.g. each girl was always paired monogamously in steady two year relationships with a guy, their wouldn’t be enough alpha guys to go around so beta girls (4-6 and some 7s) would have to pair with beta guys (male 4-7*) or be going without sex themselves. That mathematically has to be the case.
I’m leaving out hookers, but not that many 20yo American guys have much illegal hooker sex, and anyway if that’s counted it would up the sex beta males are having, not decrease it. Unless we count them in on the female side as well. Seems best to leave out.
Further, as I’ve said before, if higher betas (male 7) wanted to bang 5’s and the occasional 6 that they could get, and middle betas would go for casual 4’s and the occasional 5 they can get, those two ranks of betas would I think get a lot more sex in their 20s. I simply don’t believe that alphas are banging 5’s much less 4’s except very rarely. Maybe alphas especially lesser alphas do go down to 6’s sometime if they’re real easy and real slutty fun. But not 5’s and 4’s.
*Roissy gives male middle betas both the 5 and 6 spots.
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he doesn’t date girls, he doesn’t have a lot of friends. I’ve met him, he seems like a dejected young man
buy the best PC available. contract the fastest internet connection possible. call Diners or Amex and ask for a fast-food credit card that accumulates points the more you eat
buy a counter strike of world of warcraft CD.
I humbly confess that aLL THE OTHER SUGGESTIONS TO YOU ARE UTTER BULLSHIT. And that I am the only one here thinking about the rest of the human race
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Nicole,
hubris is my favorite sin.
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That boy sounds like my brother actually. A combination of pills (though cognitive behavioural therapy is reputedly better) and gym worked somewhat for him. Also, Get Him Out Of The House.
Most probably Away From Mother.
(Have done this right now myself, he has been nonstop smiling. Won’t stop playing this computer game he’s addicted to esp. since his gym membership expired though… one step forward… but, well, he at least looks happy as opposed to perpetually pissed off.)
Sharon: Recognise that the problem is not this guy — he’s only a symbol for the anger and frustration — but the problem that nice guys with good jobs and good looks who don’t indulge in shooting sprees are not getting laid.
If some people start thinking murder’s not so bad if it highlights this issue, then men have been sorely neglected.
This problem itself can be explained by women’s sexual liberation, with the freedom to pursue what your average feminist likes to call her patriarchy-induced desires and what your average scientist likes to call her natural desires, not taking the risk of conception into account. As well as the loss of accountability to her family. Essentially, there’s no help here. She’s simply let out in the world with the encouragement to simply be sexual, without warnings or guidance: aside from asserting she can cry rape at any moment and to use a condom.
What more can be laid at the door of feminism is an imbalance in divorce laws and custodial arrangements. How many times have you heard the line ‘She cleaned me out in the divorce’ in the media?
All this is hurting both men and women. Women aren’t taught on how to make a long-term relationship work or particularly encouraged to do so nor how to appreciate a loving husband of theirs. They’re not forced to be accountable if they abuse him.
There’s no reason to go for the nice guy if the sexier badboy is what you want. That’s the problem.
The problem doesn’t apply here.
But that is the problem.
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lovelysexybeauty – I agree with PA that the first step is getting him to a gym. He needs a trainer and he needs to be there nearly every day. He doesn’t have to have a trainer every day, but the trainer must teach him what to do and let him know what’s expected of him on the days when he is on his own. He needs to keep a detailed, honest log.
After he gets in a little better shape, he needs to also be enrolled in some form of martial art. You have to be careful to choose a class that will push him to improve, but not be so hardcore or competitive that he gets discouraged and quits, or starts to become too aggressive. He needs the confidence and discipline of a martial art.
Hopefully he will start to meet more friends, perhaps not at the gym but at least in martial arts. I’m struggling to think of something else that would expose him to the types of male friends he probably needs. Perhaps a local baseball or flag football league?
Depending on his age and current job situation, a job as a waiter might be beneficial. It will force him to learn to socialize. It might make him really nervous at first, but after a while he will learn to relax and socialize in a friendly way with people he just met. Waiters (and waitresses) tend to meet a lot of people and form a lot of social connections over time. He will meet plenty of girls at a good restaurant as a waiter and if he’s getting in shape (gym) and building discipline and confidence (martial arts) then he should be able to flirt with them and start to learn on his own.
At some point in all of this he should feel good enough that you can introduce him to game and he will take to it. You’ve got to do this in stages. You can’t throw everything at him at once. First step is to get him in the gym, with a trainer, ASAP.
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DA:
With nails, makeup, heels, tits, and ass, right?
Follow my developmental plan and find out for yourself.
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5th Horseman/Tood – I don’t know the circumstances, and I’m guessing that attacking her about the past wouldn’t really help the situation. It might just put her on the defensive and deflect from the real issue of helping her son as soon as possible.
PA – maybe that’s a start, just get some guy to get him to come to the gym. Hm…. would have to be very, very sneaky though so it doesn’t come across as some sort of pity act. I’m sure a smart, Alpha guy could figure out how to set up the whole thing in a non-insulting way…
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hubris is my favorite sin
yeah
it would be the same if a guy who ordered pizzas every night considered himself the greatest connaisseur of food on Earth
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I think the devaluing of the reliable, loyal and sometimes brainy provider type male in getting hot or fairly hot females, unless he manages to also be alpha which only maybe 10% of provider types do, is a civilizational disaster in the making. I really do.
I’m not saying this as a bitter beta. I’m saying this in the triple digits, older and living with a hot very young for me woman and having some freedom to play.
Talk about needing to undo some social engineering. Talk about needing to reverse course. As a temporary measure, why shouldn’t there be a reversal of affirmative action for women but instead for men, since so much of our society has been dedicated to advancing women explicitly relative to and at the expense of men in the areas men have always been preeminent, work and governance.
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Follow my developmental plan and find out for yourself.
Fuck it. I’ll go work some overtime then so I can go ride Acela First Class…
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All I know about that Jon guy is he looks “guido/flatbiller” in the tabloid coverage, based on the stuff I read in the checkout counter on the cover of magazines. Perhaps too hasty — my impression was he bailed on his wife/kids and I don’t find that cool. I have no idea why some hot young things (two plus the one at home) were all over a guy with no money, no prospects of any, just a reality TV tabloid star. To me that screams D-bag.
Who the hell puts their lives out on TV anyway? I’d die of embarrassment or shame. I’m enough of a dick myself to know it. I don’t need to broadcast it to everyone.
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order pizza is to food like sex with a hooker is to sex
google Earth is to travel as sex with a hooker is to sex
call center waiting songs are to music as sex with a hooker is to sex
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Wolff
If you really are thinking of Bhetti as opposed to many people your complaint could be far better leveled against, then go back and gather quotes to illustrate your purported point, you dumb shoot from the hip blowhard. You think most men here understand your point about evolution not being goal seeking? You think that Bhetti doesn’t? She’s in the top 10% of her about to be 3rd year of med school in London.
Almost everyone telescopes talking about evolution into teleological terms to some extent. Also it’s not entirely true that there’s nothing that at least looks like “goals” in evolution. There are niches and fitting them better. There isn’t any single goal and it’s not a goal driven process beyond survival and replication, but better fitting a niche or a shifting niche can look a lot like a goal in retrospect and can be far more comprehensibly talked about in that way. We fill the highest living beings intelligence niche, requiring tons of ancillary defenses, and also requiring a lot of competiveness since a lot of how we got here is by inter tribal war, initially girl stealing. Language /cultural evolution coexisted with biological evolution for a long time.
To put it simply you’re a ‘tard blowhard idiot.
Take on Bhetti in this kind of ad hominem attack and you’re taking on me. Every time. Count on it. We’re close. Very.
Little diddler.
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Interesting find. The seduction community is full of guys like this. They seem very normal, are successful with their careers, aren’t bad looking, but they still can’t get laid. Game isn’t going to help these guys much. After talking to many of these guys, it is very apparent to me that they understand game, but they don’t quite understand how to just be social and be a man.
I run across these guys all the time. I actually had one guy I knew from the local lair approach me a few weeks back, and I asked him how he was doing with women. In short, he said “fuck these girls. they’re all bitches”, because he was just so depressed about constantly getting rejected over the years, even with the use of game; and I know several other guys with similar stories.
You can’t necessarily place all the blame on women. When you look at a lot of these guys, they grew up sheltered, overprotected by mommy and daddy, and stayed inside the house playing dungeons & dragons and world of warcraft. These guys avoid conflict at all costs, and grow up being afraid of rejection. They clearly missed out on something that other guys were exposed to, and I think the missing piece is learning how to interact with people and deal with conflict and rejection as a youth.
I don’t think this guy was all that out there, as he was able to get dates. Most PUA’s struggle to make it that far (hence, why they complain about phone numbers going nowhere). I bet his problem was that once he was out on a date, he supplicated too much or came off as a very nervous guy due to his lack of experience interacting with real life people.
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gig – I think he might already be spending a lot of time escaping from reality, so mm… well thanks for the input
Bhetti – thanks for sharing that. I just found this: http://www.centerformenandmasculinity.com/. Maybe they could do some phone counseling.
DT – thanks as well about the gym idea. And martial arts, super great idea thought I’m not sure he’s young enough. He’s college age I believe, actually flunked out or something. I don’t know why his mom doesn’t push him to get a job, but becoming a waiter sounds good. Maybe his new “mentor” could intro. these ideas…
Oh man, I really hope I can help. I feel for the guy… in him, I recognize the sort of “loserish” loner guys from high school and college. I interacted with some in my classes and well… I can see how someone in despair can go to the dark side, it’s OK if it’s an artsy/express my anger/vent with my fellow losers dark side. But the sort of dark side the shooter had is also possible. And something in me just wants to help any sad/unhappy person feel better.
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doug to the rescue! hooray!
(gay)
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Gig —
We are going down, down, down. Firms plan only to maintain slightly higher inventory levels against inflation. It’s a jobless recovery. Consumer spending and advertising are down to flat. Starbucks is doing time-motion studies to shave seconds off making a latte. DVD sales are way down, as are music sales and PC sales. Profits at firms are flat excluding one-time cost savings or sales of assets.
Where’s the recovery? Meanwhile that moron Obama plans Obamacare and Cap and Trade to add trillions of costs, deficits, and taxes to strangle the economy and regulate every single aspect of life, down to GPS in cars for mileage tax and banning BBQ (bad for the planet).
After basic productivity gains in the late 1980’s-mid 1990s from computerization and the internet, where are basic productivity gains in manufacturing, agriculture, transportation, and energy, the backbones of any economy?
The “New Girl Order” of fashionable young women globally spending $400 on Jimmy Choos or Coach purses is ending before our eyes, as is the pursuit of Alphas without care.
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gig,
I see it as eating in a nice restaurant, instead of cooking at home. You can always go the restaurant you want.
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Lucifer says, “hubris is my favorite sin.”
I enjoy it, but try to limit its expression to posting sick ideas from time to time…you know, steam venting.
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Cannon–
Twerp.
You don’t stand up for girls that are fully loyal to you?
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Whiskey,
I actually had to look up “flatbillers”.
Hysterical. That is such a tacky “style” to have. Baseball caps and bling and tattoes and toy cars. Silly silly silly
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Assanova — good point. The guy DID get dates. So he was able to do that. Probably did supplicate too much. And yeah, probably not anyone’s fault but the way he was raised.
But if you took the same guy, same basic personality and experience, and instead of a IT guy you get your low-level thug? He probably has women all over him even if he is supplicating, because the thug game is that strong.
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http://exiledonline.com/revenge-of-the-nerd-what-the-media-wont-tell-you-about-the-rampage-killer-who-attacked-a-pittsburgh-aerobics-class/
Mark Ames tells it like it is.
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doug to the rescue! hooray!
(gay)
“Those guys are fags!”
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Yeah Flatbillers are ridiculous. Did I mention how much I hate Kottonmouth Kings? It’s like this insane version of Jessie James (himself a walking cartoon) mixed with girl-next-door Sandra Bullock types.
Carolla was right. Chicks dig A-holes.
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I’ll take you bait Whiskey, what’s your magical solution to the problem?
The “New Girl Order” of fashionable young women globally spending $400 on Jimmy Choos or Coach purses is ending before our eyes, as is the pursuit of Alphas without care.
I would pray that it continues as the last thing that I’d want is for beta males to be lied to and tricked into marriages with
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@Ludwig
“In other words, is it really that easy for a brohiem to get laid in this wondrous culture of ours?”
Yes, I think it is that easy to get laid – relatively speaking. Over the years, I’ve had the opportunity to ask older guys (guys who came of age prior to the late sixties) about how easy it was to get casual sex. Answer: it wasn’t. A real “stud” (otherwise normal guys, I’m not talking celebrities banging two chicks at a time at the Sands) back then might have been with a FEW women, but nothing like the numbers that guys can routinely put on the board today. Nerdy guys can put up numbers that only studs could have achieved not so long ago.
Having said all of that, there are still a lot of guys out there that are being, in effect, locked out of sex. They *could* probably get laid, most of them, but they are really not suited for the rough and tumble of modern male/female interactions. It can be brutal. It can be really brutal. And even when it is not brutal, it can be very unsatisfying. This is what progressive liberalism has ushered in – not an Age of Aquarius but a disposable society where people treat one another much as they would yesterday’s garbage.
I can certainly understand why many guys retreat into other areas – video games, porn, work, fantasy, what have you. This is why I don’t necessarily disagree with David Alexander. His take is not irrational, though it may be overstated for effect. (Sorry David, you still can’t be a citizen of the coming ethnostate, but I’ll read your posts!lol)
Our current shitculture confounds normal men every step of the way. The fundamental problem is that there are fewer nice girls. More girls are slutted out, burned out, taught to be rude and self serving. They’ve been boned by god only knows how many guys, and by god only knows what.
The market has fundamentally changed, and females have done the changing. The result is a much higher proportion of nasty, mentally and even physically screwed up women, much higher than what our ancestors faced. Not all of them, obviously, but enough to create a severe shortage of “nice” girls. The “nice” guy might get to bang one of these screwy chicks from time to time, but is this really all that great? Wow…you scored with a chick that has already been bedded by twenty guys, and is heading on to the next twenty. Cool. Alert the media.
Against this basic change in the market – far fewer nice and marriageable females- there have been all sorts of other changes. Divorce laws, cultural expectations of the relative duties of wife and husband, ability to pair bond after having been boned by half of the town, you name it. The bottom line is that the modern culture makes it difficult for non-alphas (i.e. normal men) every step of the way. At every step they are at best inconvenienced and discouraged, at worst thwarted outright. No wonder so many are just checking out and playing Warcraft instead. Or buying hookers. Can’t really blame them. Sure, they could learn game. But that won’t change the fact that the market is rigged and there won’t be enough nice, marriageable girls to go around.
That’s the heart of the issue: in a decent civilization, most people (guys and gals) can “win.” Not everybody will win, but most can. In our current society, a huge percentage of the population is guaranteed failure. It’s baked into the cake.
As to the question of what percentage of men have inherent “dealbreaker” characteristics, I just don’t know. I’d guess relatively few. Up until recently, the vast majority of men found wives, raised stable families, had solid jobs, and were valued stakeholders in their society. I suspect the vast majority still would if we had something resembling a real civilization, instead of the ridiculous shitculture that we currently endure.
So I don’t think the issue is that all that many men have dealbreaker characteristics, it’s just that the nature of the game has changed at every point, from how we meet one another, to how we “court” (doesn’t that sound ridiculous now?), and so on through the whole process. This has fundamentally altered the cost/benefit analysis of the whole shebang. To sum it up, this culture makes it much easier for the typical guy to score a few chicks, but it makes it much more difficult for him to do the things that give him respect (including self-respect), and give him a solid chance at having a sustainable and satisfying life. For thousands of years Western civilization developed a finely calibrated way of handling the sex issue, and this resulted in a stable and prosperous society in which nearly all of the girls got kissed, found reliable husbands, and so forth. Now the nice guy is playing Warcraft, alone and lonely, and what could have been the nice girl is picking up STDs and blowing some dude in a bathroom stall – and then on to therapy. We’ve blown it all in little more than a generation. Amazing.
Casual sex is not satisfying in the long run, sorry to say. lol. I know a lot of guys who have racked up the big numbers. Do they speak of the various casual lays that they’ve had down through the years? Not usually. What do they speak of when they talk of their past with women? The One. The One that got away. The rest don’t matter, and that is kind of the point.
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Nicole
The only reason that you cling to the idea that shooter-man had Hollywoodian, unreal expectations is that you cannot face the real truth – that he was a shy, basically nice guy that no woman ever really wanted despite what his standards might have been. Nowadays, either they all want you or none of them do; more or less. I know this because I have been on both sides.
Like all young females, your mind cannot grasp the reality of anyone having ZERO sex appeal. That is, until you are a little older. Then, if you are capable of empathy, you might feel a bond with shooter-man and his lethal frustrations – if your herd of cats do not fill all your needs.
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Ames does not tell it like it is. Even a guy as disturbed as Soldini, in times past, would have had sex with someone, on a regular basis. His life would not have been happy. But it would have had meaning.
Roissy’s maxim: Contraception + Anonymous Urban Living + Rising Incomes for Women = many men lose. And a few win.
I think women all in all are happy with this. They’ll trade a very small chance of dying in a massacre for as much sex with Alphas as possible. Heck women will trade risks of getting killed by one (the Petersons, Drew and Scott, Van Der Sloot) for sex with Alphas.
But like Frederic Bastiat wrote, it’s what not seen that is costly. Which is men’s not caring about society and being willing to follow any crackpot leader who promises a total overturning.
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“Sexual selection was working.
The biggest mistake his ex made was being associated with him in any way.”
So are you cosigning those brilliant revelations, Doug?
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“He can’t be bought, bullied or negotiated with…some people just want to see the world burn.”
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I think many men lack the balls to call out a bitch.
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I wonder about how quickly this guy’s blog got “disappeared” from the internet. For what purpose?
One thing “society” knows how to do — very well — is to remove the “dead” who stink up the place, i.e., those victims whose very existence threatens to expose the “pretty lies” which make the whole shebang go around.
Society — which is largely founded upon pretty lies — can’t afford the heartfelt ramblings of the individuals who get ground up in the maw of the deathmachine.
It’s like the Disney policy of ensuring there are no cigarette butts or trash to be seen anywhere on the premise. Keeping up appearances.
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Feminism= giving society a rope and detailed instructions to hang itself.
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LSB,
5th Horseman/Tood – I don’t know the circumstances, and I’m guessing that attacking her about the past wouldn’t really help the situation. It might just put her on the defensive and deflect from the real issue of helping her son as soon as possible.
Agreed, attacking her now does not help the son.
But at best, the next time some woman tells you she is thinking of leaving her husband, and they have a kid, slam her for her selfishness, knowing that the kid will invariably end up like the first one.
So the kid you are currently concerned about is, sadly, a casualty of feminism. God forbid, he may grow up to go out in a blaze of glory like the guy in the original article did.
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Tupac,
There are more than a few thousand copies of his blog. It was so much easier to censor reality before the Internet.
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Now the nice guy is playing Warcraft, alone and lonely, and what could have been the nice girl is picking up STDs and blowing some dude in a bathroom stall
I fail to see what’s wrong. Everybody is having fun and nobody is having shitty sex…
And yes, no sex is better than crappy sex.
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I think this is exactly why so many people pick bones of contention with you, Whiskey.
The vast majority of women have not a conscious thought about this.
They don’t think in terms of “trade off” like “I can bang as many bad boy alpha’s I want, I don’t care if it means civilization will go to hell…I want my alpha sex!”
No, most women nowadays have been brainwashed by society – the media and the public education system, to feel like any other way than our current modern zeitgeist is “oppressive” and subjugating to women.
Just as men are told by our society that they have to be nice and cater to women and put them on pedestal’s and worship the goddesses as the key to sexual fulfillment, so to are women fooled into believing they can have it all…that there is no such thing as opportunity costs.
They are conditioned to value “LOVE” and the emotional highs of infatuational lust as the penultimate quality in mate selection. This is what leads to the alpha chasing…
…not a conscious, deliberate and purposeful choice to flush Western Civilization down the toilet.
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Rum, I have plenty of empathy…just not much mercy.
I know exactly what he was feeling, and have been close to homicidal rage myself a couple of times.
Problem is that when it gets to that point I get a kind of chill and then they’re dead to me already. Not worth going to jail for someone who’s already dead.
…and both times, when they were out of the way in my mind, there was only me left, and I thought about how I let myself get into that situation. The first time was a shock and could have been an anomaly, but the second time I understood there was a pattern. I decided not to repeat it.
…and worse was done to me than being rejected. I wish I’d been rejected in both of those cases. Instead, I was tagged as disposable because of my ethnicity, and they felt they were using me for more than a year and then tossing me away.
If I wasn’t such a big fan of personal responsibility, I’d felt that this is what they did…but in truth, I, as their superior, was using them, and it just didn’t work out. I no longer slum with the weak. I have lost mercy permanently.
Forgive me for seeming unempathetic. It’s just that I offer no mercy. I will reciprocate respect and kindness, but those who presume to look down on me should not ask for mercy. It’s like digging through your trash.
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David —
My solution is both real wage growth, and anti-consumerism, with women forming social consensus for mediated and moderated sexual pursuits of men. I.E. suppressing the urges down there when bad boys come to call, in a rational desire for marriage and family. Moderated and mediated by older female relatives and friends who are better judges of character once menopause has had it’s way (older women can be an invaluable resource for society). No more “New Girl Order” instead family formation. Women ought to have kids early too, and pursue careers and education later. This makes beta men damn valuable (they can help with childcare later so their wives can pursue their career). Most women would be happier too. CHILDREN sure as hell would be.
Yes, I’m arguing for the “Modified Jane Austen.” So be it. It worked, didn’t it?
Ryder — Brilliant. Absolutely BRILLIANT. Although I think on balance most young women would be perfectly happy to trade a nice decent husband for as much sex with Alpha types as possible, and then single motherhood. Women certainly celebrate both. I think a critical component is female-self delusion about how long they’ll be pretty (look at Madonna of the hideous arms) and how much they can control Alpha men.
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whiskey,
You know that is not realistic. What about letting the current system destroy itself? Most people cannot learn any other way.
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lovelysexybeauty – why does he have to be any younger to start martial arts? People start in their 30’s and 40’s and benefit. You have no idea how beneficial this will be to him if he starts and sticks with it.
If he flunked out of college and is living at home with nothing going for him then he needs a job and he needs to start taking classes again. And I say that as someone who thinks college if often overrated. The goal doesn’t have to be some grand degree and career right off the bat. Some cheap JC classes in something he would enjoy just to get him out of the house, working on something, meeting people, moving forward, and thinking about what he can/should do in relation to a future career. Have him take an intro to photography class, which is usually interesting and fun for people even if they never get that into photography. Or a massage class. Massage will really force him to socialize with people and introduce some touch therapy into his life.
Again I’ll mention the waiter job: he can’t be allowed to just sit at home doing nothing while his mother provides for him. Parents allow this out of love, but this will cause more damage to his self esteem. Waiters can make decent money (tips) all things considered (no degree, resume, etc.). And he will have to deal with people, socialize, resolve conflicts, etc. Even though it’s a good job at his age, it’s also a job that will force him to think about his future because no one wants to be a waiter at 30.
I’m not sure how you could best approach him. Subtle hints and suggestions may not be strong enough. Direct confrontation may trigger an angry, defensive response. But your friend cannot allow her son to waste away his best years like this. Trust me on this. If he doesn’t get moving and start having some success no matter how small, some life experiences other than TV and video games, he will deeply regret it later in life.
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My solution is both real wage growth, and anti-consumerism
But I like stuff. Hell, to be honest, one of the reasons I feel so wonky is that I can’t buy as much stuff as I’d like with my low wages…
Mind you, how do you plan about bringing real wage growth? Are you planning on bringing back manufacturing? Are you planning on magically controlling healthcare costs? Are you planning on basically imposing severe tariffs on imported products? I just don’t see how you can magically build wages upward in the current economic environment, and I would have said the same several years ago during the boom.
This makes beta men damn valuable
The problem that I’ve generally had with your theory is that it’s not really any better for the beta. It’s really enslavement of betas and in lieu of 40% of his wages going to taxes, he’s still paying tax, but his wages are basically going into the larger black hole of the wife and kids. Even if you pump up his buying power, it’s all wasted on the women and kids in lieu of himself.
Yes, I’m arguing for the “Modified Jane Austen.” So be it. It worked, didn’t it?
Somehow, I believe white people are capable and better of a superior society than that.
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whiskey wrote :
I think they (women) have been handed huge social power, mostly by accident, and have used it predictably to maximize short-term sex over long-term family interests.
Wow. When you least expect it, one of the better sentences in a long time gets posted.
Yes, their power is by accident. Technologies like the vacuum cleaner, dishwasher, etc. enabled women to move into the workforce, which is a good thing, but this new power (as with all power given to immature people) was not wielded well. If 20% of men get cut out, that is fine. If 70% are getting cut out, it is not.
Technology enabled feminism. Technology will also destroy feminism (which was largely created by an accidental set of circumstances, after all).
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Canon:
“Sexual selection was working.
The biggest mistake his ex made was being associated with him in any way.”
So are you cosigning those brilliant revelations, Doug?
WELL?
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Lovely sexy beauty-
The solution for your friend’s son’s problem is right between your legs.
Give him some, and/or help him get laid with one of your friends.
A woman who is fucking a man can get him to do damn near anything, so after the pussy, you could easily get him into the gym, employment office, therapists office, as needed.
If you are not willing to do this, I have to question how much you REALLY want to help him.
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Yes manufacturing will have to come back. China and India are unstable, and anyway the days of cheap energy making sneakers imported from China (and other cheap garbage) are likely over. Depression = global trade ceases. Simple as that.
What’s wrong with Jane Austen, with men and women being restrained, polite, professional, while of course working?
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AJTravis wrote (to LSB)
The solution for your friend’s son’s problem is right between your legs.
No, LSB is Indian. That is not the answer here.
I am saying the best thing she can do is point out to any other woman ever again who is thinking of becoming a ‘single mom’ by getting a divorce – “this is what will happen to your kids”. The first poor boy will have to become a martyr for the collateral damage of feminism.
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China and India are unstable
While I don’t trust the motives of the PLA, I will assure you that the PLA will break the Mandate of Heaven.
anyway the days of cheap energy making sneakers imported from China (and other cheap garbage) are likely over
If we’re not able to import cheap sneakers from China due to energy concerns, I’ll assure you that we’ll be too poor to purchase American made sneakers. Either we’re going to have (white) workers willing to work for minimum wage to make sneakers or we’re going to have to eat away at corporate profits. Besides, less cheap stuff from my perspective is a decline in my standard of living.
Mind you, if you believe in peak oil, we might as well blow our current wad on rampant alpha sex and let civilization around the world to die out and let the next dominant species take over.
What’s wrong with Jane Austen, with men and women being restrained, polite, professional, while of course working?
I’m not willing to give up potential to have great sex, and I don’t want to see beta males enslaved to women.
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@Ryder:
“not an Age of Aquarius but a disposable society where people treat one another much as they would yesterday’s garbage. ”
This could be for a number of reasons:
a) Everyone is, essentially, disposable to their employers. Employees can be replaced new people easily. In fact, nowadays, they don’t even need to be replaced. They just need to be fired. The product of downsizing.
b) People are replacing on another in relationships rapidly because of increased city living. Face it, in a small town, or “tribe,” the males and females had few choices. One female might have many choices, others might have few. Now people have more choices than ever, which leaves them wondering if there’s something bigger and better beyond. Combine that with looking younger longer than back then (when people were old in their 30’s) and you’ve got today’s society.
c) The habit of seeking the “better” version of something (or someone) lies with constantly getting newer, better, technology.
d) Newer attitudes in society (declining morality, radical feminism) play a role in the way things are.
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DA:
What’s wrong with Jane Austen, with men and women being restrained, polite, professional, while of course working?
I’m not willing to give up potential to have great sex
Oh my ribs!
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But I like stuff. Hell, to be honest, one of the reasons I feel so wonky is that I can’t buy as much stuff as I’d like with my low wages…
As a nation we cannot continue to like stuff so much that we go into debt to pull forward demand for said stuff, digging a hole we cannot get out of. Imagine how much better off the world would be right now if Americans had purchased homes they could afford rather than homes they wanted for the past 20 years.
Mind you, how do you plan about bringing real wage growth? Are you planning on bringing back manufacturing? Are you planning on magically controlling healthcare costs? Are you planning on basically imposing severe tariffs on imported products?
We need to make it possible for Americans to compete globally and for businesses to thrive in our nation once again. We need to:
* Slash government spending at all levels, simplify the tax code, and lower the overall tax burden.
* Slash government regulations and business compliance costs, especially environmental regulations which have long since gone over into the absurd.
* Stop massive, unsustainable immigration into this country.
* Develop cheap, reliable energy as opposed to wasting money researching SWPL ‘green’ energy nonsense. This means nuclear and more domestic natural gas and coal.
* Develop our domestic oil supplies and get off foreign imports.
* Deal with health care costs by actually addressing supply rather than just who pays. Find ways to get more doctors and nurses into the system at a lower cost per person (i.e. per education). Streamline drug development. Cap malpractice lawsuits and costs. Do anything and everything to encourage and force free market competition among doctors and hospitals. Change the tax code so individuals buy insurance, not employers.
* Oh yeah: get rid of the fucking carb heavy food pyramid which has Americans growing fat and lazy.
* Fire all the “make work” government bureaucrats in our system and make them get real jobs.
* Privatize public schools, a move which will dramatically improve competition and results while even more dramatically reducing costs.
I could go on…
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whiskey,
You cannot reverse an evolving system. There is no ‘back’.. or even a modified version of ‘back’.
Humans will either adapt or die. I could care less.. I have given up on humans a long time ago.
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whiskey wrote:
“But if you took the same guy, same basic personality and experience, and instead of a IT guy you get your low-level thug? He probably has women all over him even if he is supplicating, because the thug game is that strong.”
Just wouldn’t happen. When you look at thugs, they come from backgrounds where they are forced to be social. I think that’s the biggest advantage that most black guys have. With the way we grow up, we are forced to interact with each other. When you’re poor, many resources are shared. Not only that, but if you want to survive, you learn how to fight and be a man at a very early age due to parents not being around and just having to have a very high social aptitude if you don’t want to be a target from physical threats as a child in a poor neighborhood.
And it’s not just a black thing; it’s this way with just about any poor ethnicity. Where I grew up, both the Caucasian and Asian guys behaved almost exactly like black guys and are just really socially aware. I think that when you take away the necessity to depend on others and give kids the option to warehouse themselves away from social interactions, you in effect cripple them socially.
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The guy admits to not having a single friend for 30 years and all you fools are debating why he couldn’t get laid? They guy didn’t even have the social skills to make ONE FRIEND.
You people are not geniuses.
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whiskey wrote:
“But if you took the same guy, same basic personality and experience, and instead of a IT guy you get your low-level thug? He probably has women all over him even if he is supplicating, because the thug game is that strong.”
Just wouldn’t happen. When you look at thugs, they come from backgrounds where they are forced to be social as children. I think that’s the biggest advantage that most black guys have. With the way we grow up, we are forced to interact with each other. When you’re poor, many resources are shared. Not only that, but if you want to survive, you learn how to fight and be a man at a very early age due to parents not being around and just having to have a very high social aptitude if you don’t want to be a target from physical threats as a child in a poor neighborhood.
And it’s not just a black thing; it’s this way with just about any poor ethnicity. Where I grew up, both the Caucasian and Asian guys behaved almost exactly like black guys and are just really socially aware. I think that when you take away the necessity to depend on others and give kids the option to warehouse themselves away from social interactions, you in effect cripple them socially.
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j r said to Really?
“rather, i just hope you will remember you own words one day when you’re old and wrinkled and shamelessly flirting with any man in site just so you can once more know the pleasures of being desired. all women will eventually learn what it’s like to be a beta male. father time makes sure of that.”
Game in BK said:
“Game (PUA) tells men that it’s ok- to be a fucking man.
I have a dick and I want to fuck you- this desire is my God-given right.
You may not want to fuck me back- and that is your right- but i am sure that the next girl I see- does.”
j r, Really?, like all other cunts of her age bracket, has absolutely no sense of time and will never realize that she will eventually become that.
Game in BK, I couldn’t have said it better. Really?, like all other cunts of her political orientation, thinks she should be able to go through life without the slightest inconvenience such as you hitting on her. Someone ought to tell her that she wouldn’t be here if that didn’t happen to her parents.
The discussion so far has focused on George Sodini and other similar incidents which seem to be getting more and more frequent, even if they are still pretty sporadic and random. What I’m waiting for is the time when the victims won’t be innocent random women, but rather the cunt politicians, judges, and corporate whores who brought this upon us. When it becomes a criminal act to express sexual interest, they’ve crossed the line.
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DT,
You do not understand the difference between money and wealth.
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God I love the news! Really, is there a better, more consistently novel, and solid source of entertainment in the modern world than… The Daily News?
George Sodini’s blog is one of the most entertaining reads of recent history; right up there with the Unabomber’s manifesto, Steve Sailer’s work, The War Nerd, and other purveyors of the genuine, sordid, often horrifying truths about the REAL nature of that awful creature, The Ordinary Human Being.
Get a forum going, Roissy; this thread will easily go to two thousand posts in a matter of days.
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bob11,
I think he had a different definition of friendship.
His linkedin profile had 28 accquaintances.
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You guys are pathetic. No wonder why you guys don’t get laid. It’s so transparent that when you’re defending him, you’re actually just trying to justify why you can’t get any.
Still waiting for the explanation about why George’s inability to make any friends for 30 years turns out to be the fault of feminism. I’m sure you assholes can figure out a way to blame that on women, too. Sick, sad, and so glad you don’t procreate. Sexual selection works!
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If we’re not able to import cheap sneakers from China due to energy concerns, I’ll assure you that we’ll be too poor to purchase American made sneakers.
It’s a myth that you have to have low wages to have cheap goods. You can have cheap labor, or you can have very well paid labor where each person has very high productivity thanks to machines. Businesses went the cheap labor route not because cheap labor is all that great versus machines, but because business in America has too much government related BS overhead. It’s just easier right now to go to a foreign country.
Mind you, if you believe in peak oil, we might as well blow our current wad on rampant alpha sex and let civilization around the world to die out and let the next dominant species take over.
Peak oil as a theory is valid. The predictions SWPL and environmental types make using the theory are BS because they invariably fail to catalog all the oil we actually have.
The Green River Shale formation has a solid century plus worth of oil at current U.S. consumption rates. U.S. coal resources (coal can be used to make all the fuels we need) would add another 2-3 centuries to that figure.
I would say within one century we will be off fossil fuels due to technological advancement. Nuclear power is man’s future and using fast breeder reactors we can power all our needs until the sun dies. That’s current technology. Fusion will sooner or later be mastered and that to can give us all we need for as long as we need.
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Lucifer,
Really? You think that indicates “friendship”? The guy’s LinkedIn account? Even more pathetic.
I also love the selective trust in his ability to report the “truth”. When he says that he’s so normal and “nice” to women and there’s “no reason” why women should reject him, why he’s telling the truth When he says he hasn’t made a single friend in 30 years, well, he just wasn’t honest, just that one time in his diary.
Hilarious!
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bob11,
There are many people like him… but women want to remain oblivious.
You too want to blame him.. works for me. I am just enjoying the show.
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Whiskey
Re Biker
That is so true Whiskey, I know an ex biker (with a dent in his forehead from a crow bar and looks over his shoulder where ever he goes) who is now lamenting his biker days when he had chicks.
Mind you this is an articulate and intelligent man with good money but sans his posse he cant get chicks anymore. So he’s contemplating going back.
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DT wrote:
“But if I had kids and an ex wife who used the courts to steal my children and my money? I can easily see myself going over the deep end because of that. I wouldn’t shoot people who had nothing to do with it, but I could snap and hunt down the judge, ex, and her lawyer. Given what goes on in family court I don’t understand why we don’t see stuff like this on a daily basis.”
Google “Darren Mack”
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There really isn’t a lot of opportunity to learn, in the west. During a prolonged dry spell I would fill my social calender with events that would bring me in contact with women who shared my interest. That didn’t teach me how to introduce myself or flirt.
So I worked for years as a travelling salesman, vending in colleges and music festivals, to hone my flirting with college girls skills. Made me more comfortable, at least.
The only thing that seems to work is actual dating.
I’m reminded of Tom Cruise as the vampire, his blood let all over the floor and then vanquished to the swamp. That man drank the blood of rats, to build up his strength, to the point where he had all his powers again.
It’s the same for men who aren’t getting any. We’ve got to fuck older women. Date some crazies. Whatever it takes to get enough blood to gather our strength.
What really changed my fortunes after the long dry spell was wealth. I went from 0 to three girlfriends – one a hottie airline stewardess. A year later I leave a troublesome LTR to go to Canada and 3 weeks later I’m dating a hot Czech girl (this time without flashing cash).
It’s each past history that accumulates on a guy – so you’ve to start somewhere. Anywhere.
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Even a guy as disturbed as Soldini, in times past, would have had sex with someone, on a regular basis. His life would not have been happy. But it would have had meaning.
Nah, he would have been a hermit, or an explorer, or joined the Navy, or just blown his brains out in private (as he should have done just now). There were plenty of guys in the past who didn’t get any but didn’t go postal. Needless to say, it is not true now, and has never been true, that life without sex is “meaningless”.
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Lucifer,
Seriously? You don’t think he’s to blame? You don’t think a man who admits to having no friends for three decades, no sex for two, who plotted the murder suicide of “young girls” for a year, isn’t personally to blame for his actions? AND you’re claiming that there are lots of men like him? Jesus, man, start getting some therapy, RIGHT NOW. You need serious help dude.
And I don’t understand why you brought up how “women” ought to be aware of your belief that there are tons of guys like George. Are you saying that they should only work out in bullet proof vests? Because that’s the only way I see it concerning them at all.
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[…] common.” She quotes “Roissy in D.C.” whose blog she cleverly and accurately calls a “repugnablog,” who post, entitled “Game Can Save Lives” […]
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Rum: “And a lot of middle class white guys have been massively lied to their whole lives.”
Oh, yes. And the thing is, deprogramming takes time and experience – it isn’t merely a theoretical construct that has to get replaced. To really get the nature of women, you need sexual and relationship experience with a lot of them.
It’s like a blind man touching an elephant. Is it a snake? Is it a tree? If he touches enough elephants and works to know them, he’ll know the nature of elephant. Reading a blog or some books will help him understand, but the hands on experience will let him know.
Deprogramming takes dating all sorts, to find the underlying pattern of what is woman.
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DT nailed it, once again, on wages/health care/immigration and the rest. America traditionally has prospered on cheap land, expensive labor.
Assanova — you might be right wrt socialization and conflict. Good point about Warehousing.
bob11 or feministing troll — The problem is not Soldini. He’s a blip, sad though his Kamikaze ways were for his victims. Or Cho. Or Klebold. Or any of these other guys disconnected from society. It’s the guys you DON’T SEE. They don’t go out in a blaze of glory.
They just don’t give a damn. And make life miserable for those around them, day after day after day. At a minimum they’ll step over a woman past her forties, who fell and hurt herself, because society means nothing to them but a paycheck. Take away only Soldini killing those people, he’s still a disaster.
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bob11,
I could not find his actions logically inconsistent.
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@whiskey:
“They just don’t give a damn. And make life miserable for those around them, day after day after day. At a minimum they’ll step over a woman past her forties, who fell and hurt herself, because society means nothing to them but a paycheck. Take away only Soldini killing those people, he’s still a disaster.”
I have met a woman who feel the same disconnect from people; and it isn’t that people won’t talk to her, it’s that she already hates people so much that any interraction with a human being would remind her of that hatred even more.
More than anything, it’s a feeling of unhappiness. Whether it’s caused biologically (chemical unbalance) or a combination of factors (not getting laid), it really affects people. And they think it’s unfair that others are happy while they’re suffering, so they’ll drag others down to be with them.
Misery loves company.
@doug1:
I missed your post.
“Remember that these issues impact the divorce rate as well.
I know you agree with me about elimating affirmative action generally. But if we’re going to have it anywhere, why shouldn’t it be for men?”
I agree with everything you said. Especially about creating stable families.
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How about a zoo first date? Worked well for me. Although we did drink heavily during the whole walk, and drank heavily some more when we went back to my room.
So, ya, good point. Drink.
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Mellow pixie dream girl, your advice is well-taken and a lot more people would be a lot happier if they observed it.
Problem is that if I tried it out, I wouldn’t know if it were you or Really?–and that could be the difference between ultimately getting laid or immediately being arrested. Most guys would just as soon not find out rather than take that chance.
This is the result of the feminist Junior Anti-Sex League mentality brought about through public policies such as VAWA, IMBRA, Title IX and CEDAW.
Feminism must be smashed by any means necessary.
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xsplat,
I realized the essential truth about women far earlier than most… maybe because I never drank the kool aid.
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Oh my ribs!
Your insult needs an explanation like your third rate game…
You can have cheap labor, or you can have very well paid labor where each person has very high productivity thanks to machines.
The problem is that machinery requires high capital costs that some firms are not willing to endure due to the fear that it eats away at profits. Chinese labour is decidedly low-tech in most cases and rather labour intensive due to the low wages of the workers.
Peak oil as a theory is valid.
I believe in peak oil as well, but I generally tend to be rather pessimistic about the future because of it even with greater efficiency, biofuels, unconventional sources of fuel, and coal liquefaction. Even if these technologies were to yield as three centuries of oil, the problem remains the high cost of producing unconventional supplies and the environmental risk to doing so. Besides, as non-conventional sources decline and as demand increase, prices will increase as other countries seek to buy for their needs as well.
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Lucifer,
Shoot yourself in the head right now. You are so fucking pathetic. So sorry you can’t get laid, dude, but maybe it’s because you “could not find his actions logically inconsistent.” You’ve got bigger problems than getting laid. Bet you think you’re so smart, too, don’t you, yet you haven’t figured out how to get laid and you blame that on women. Seriously fucking pathetic. I knew it the moment you claimed that George’s 28 LinkedIn acquaintances meant that he lied when he said he didn’t have any friends for the previous 30 years. How does a man who can’t make a friend get laid? I bet you’ve been trying to answer that question, Lucifer.
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My suggestion..
If you can spare 500 $/month, and do some research on your local escort review boards, you can get at least 2 gals (7-8s) per month on an unlimited hourly menu.
That is about 2 solid lays a month or 24 a year. Much better than your average married guy. Plus you can still play the field.
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This problem of increasing numbers of white men not reproducing because a radically changed culture has left them with no stake in any kind of future that involves reproducing…. or however you wish to characterize it: It’s self-correcting, so fear nothing.
In Victorian times, white people were approximately 40% of the world’s population. Now, it’s about 8%, and falling fast, with no end in sight.
We’re on the way out!
As Lenin (or Stalin, I forget which) said, “No man, no problem.”
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If we’re not able to import cheap sneakers from China due to energy concerns, I’ll assure you that we’ll be too poor to purchase American made sneakers.
This is Dead Wrong
I have been all over the world in the last 15 years for business and inside these Chinese factories… And let me tell you American (western) workers ARE NOT less efficient that those in other countries.
Sure Labour is CHEAP in alot of places, but alot of time their are 3 people doing a job that could be done effectively by one smart worker.
The problem in America is Taxes and Levies on Labour. I run a business and say I want to pay a decent lower middle class living family wage of $900 per week to be a well skilled Tradesperson, car Manufacturer or quasi professional. Lets look at the real life Numbers for my Business in Australia
Top Line income $120,000 (My out of Pocket to give someone a Job )
Income Tax -$35,000
Payroll Tax -$8,153
Workers Comp -$1,205
Super Contrib -$11,113
Long Service -$2,400
Cash in Hand $62,129.32 The amount in the employees Pocket to go to work
Less the Opportunity Cost of Sitting on ass and getting Disability Pension / Welfare and all the associated handouts. @ approx $15000 p.a.
= $47,129.32
So to employ one Smart Body in Australia it costs me $120k but they only feel like their getting $47K
Australian and American workers are definately NOT Lazy or DUMB or outclassed by anyone in the world – I have seen this with my own Eyes. AND they are definately NOT expensive.
ITS THE GOVERNMENT THATS EXPENSIVE and it puts all of these evil taxes and charges on peoples labour (that is their own under the UN charter of human rights) to pay for its bloated inefficiency, while good jobs go overseas.
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bob11,
I think you don’t get it.. I can and DO buy all the pussy I want.
I can specify race, mix, age, size, tit size, type of ass, amount and shape of hair on pussy, hair color, eye color, clothes, attitude,day, time.. my rules. I have never fucked anything below 6 for years..
I am just enjoying the show.
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Whiskey,
I just find it amazing that George admitted to not even being able to make a friend in the previous three decades, yet all of you morons are pondering why on earth a woman wouldn’t want to fuck him. Because he was obviously unfuckable. Could it be because he was so bass-ackwards that no one even wanted to share his company, much less let him put his pathetic little weiner inside her. Clearly every woman had a better option than George. And all you guys who are relating to him are just the most pathetic people on the planet. Way to align yourself with the biggest loser on the planet.
Hey wait a minute, according to your idiotic “game” theory, shouldn’t THIS GUY have been getting some every night? I mean, he’s obviously a fucking asshole,a he doesn’t give a shit about women other than to have sex with them, shouldn’t women have been falling at his feet and begging him for attention? You believe that women just want a man with money who’ll be a jerk towards them. That’s George! Your hero!
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bob11,
I have fucked girls that were italian, east european, south american (almost all the range), persian, thinner blacks, all kinds of whites, blonds, redheads, brunettes..
I have even fucked mixed ones like italian-indian, chilean-chinese, vanessa william types..
I do like mediterranean women though..
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The problem is that machinery requires high capital costs that some firms are not willing to endure due to the fear that it eats away at profits. Chinese labour is decidedly low-tech in most cases and rather labour intensive due to the low wages of the workers.
Things don’t break down the way people often think. In most fields machines + a small labor force is quite competitive with a large, cheap labor force. When businesses are afraid to stay home and invest in capital equipment it’s because of government BS, not because cheap labor clearly costs less.
I believe in peak oil as well, but I generally tend to be rather pessimistic about the future because of it even with greater efficiency, biofuels, unconventional sources of fuel, and coal liquefaction. Even if these technologies were to yield as three centuries of oil, the problem remains the high cost of producing unconventional supplies and the environmental risk to doing so. Besides, as non-conventional sources decline and as demand increase, prices will increase as other countries seek to buy for their needs as well.
Shale oil is profitable at $35 a barrel, and we have enough of that to hold us over for a century. But we can’t do anything with it so long as Congress bows to environmentalists.
As for environmental risks, unconventional oil supplies will prove cleaner with modern technology than conventional oil was just a few short decades ago with the technology of the day.
If we face a bleak energy future it is only because we listen to religious nuts (i.e. Earth worshiping environmentalists). America is loaded with energy, we just have to get it and use it.
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Katto — Unless you want a Stalinesque war, to eliminate masses of White Men (who will shoot back, guaranteed) you have a man. So you have a problem. And Stalin was an idiot. The cost of his no man, no problem policy is the demographic implosion of Russia as a pathetic, third world with nukes nation. All those dead guys never had kids.
And yeah, it matters if guys don’t reproduce. Genetic bottleneck. You’ll never know what genes you’ll need. Plus like I said, guys with no stake in the system are looking for a Napoleon or Alexander to lead them to spoils.
Nuclear weapons guarantee that failing peoples can take down lots of others with them. And you can’t just wish them away.
These guys are here. They can’t be wished away or ignored. Most won’t go Kamikaze like Soldini. But they sure as hell will extract their pound of flesh. Disaster.
—————
David A. Machines and capital are cheap. It’s only money. I can run (with a bit of skilled labor) a machine 24-7. Always running. It never gets tired. Never creates negative sweatshop images. Never creates wage controversy. Never has angry unionists and organizers at my door. Never asks for raises. Never requires a payoff. China is cheap until you factor in the never ending payoffs, bribes, corruption, knock-offs, piracy, strikes, congestion in the ports, and shipping expense.
Politically, free trade becomes impossible in sustained recessions. That’s why Honda and Toyota build cars in the US.
No nation has ever gotten rich off cheap labor. EVER.
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Blue balls made him do it???
Bwahahahah!
Fuckin’ hilARious.
He was a 21st C psycho.
Question: Did he keep his dead mama in the basement or the attic?
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Hansen, I think celibacy only works in monastic or retreat environments, and only when combined with prolong periods of meditation.
For most people living in the world will not allow enough of a retreat from pavlovian responses.
I’ve lived in the forest, not masturbating, meditating 5-8 hours a day, for weeks and months on end. It’s amazing, and recommended. But in the city, that doesn’t work for me. I need sex, good sex, and lots of sex.
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whiskey,
The US system until 1934 was based on cheap labor.
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Lucifer,
Jesus Christ, I don’t give a fuck about who you’ve fucked!!! You said that you couldn’t find George’s actions to be logically inconsistent! You’re a fucking psycho! You’re morally bankrupt! You’re probably a fucking criminal! Your existence on this planet consists of nothing but selfishly fulfilling your basest desires and somehow you think that’s praiseworthy. You’ve got idiotically stupid ideas about how you ought to behave and what’s okay to say out loud. Your pathetic multiple posts bragging about the women you’ve fucked are only further proof that you’d be doing our species a favor by committing suicde right now. Seriously, get some professional fucking help.
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@doug
Great job on the defence of our Bhetti! I wanted to as soon as I saw what he wrote, but knew I’d not manage an intelligent response to the evolution argument. I would have pointed out her med school attendance and her standings. It wasn’t gay in my opinion, realizing of course this comes from a woman and may in fact reinforce certain opinions. 🙂
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As a nation we cannot continue to like stuff so much that we go into debt to pull forward demand for said stuff, digging a hole we cannot get out of.
Oddly, those who we have borrowed quite a bit of money from are heavily dependent on our buying habits. The internal demand in consumer markets in Asian markets is basically crap, and the same is true for Europe. For all intents and purposes, the American consumer has stopped purchasing and the world’s economy isn’t humming as well as before.
Slash government spending at all levels, simplify the tax code, and lower the overall tax burden.
Congrats. That Chinese guy is still dirt cheap, and his Mexican and Brazilian counterparts work for $5 per day. I still have to pay my American employee $20.00/hr to be middle class, or I’m stuck pooling the questionable segments of the labour pool.
Slash government regulations and business compliance costs, especially environmental regulations which have long since gone over into the absurd.
Given that I like clean air and water, I’m not willing to take that risk to eat away at environmental regs. Nor am I willing to get rid of OSHA so companies can let their facilities become accident prone hellholes where employees become disabled and thus become burdens on the state when they’re no longer able to work. If companies don’t want to comply with regs, they maybe they should pay high premiums into indemnity fund in case we have to clean up their messes…
Find ways to get more doctors and nurses into the system at a lower cost per person (i.e. per education)
The only way you’re going to do that is to basically pay the full cost of schooling nurses and doctors, because there’s going to be considerable resistance to cutting corners in training.
Change the tax code so individuals buy insurance, not employers.
My dad passed away so my mother is facing the prospect of having to pay for insurance on her own. She hasn’t worked in nearly twenty years so her employment value is low, and her health condition* is basically a disincentive for employers to employ her or for private insurance to deal with her. COBRA is roughly $800 a month and doesn’t include prescription drugs, and private market insurance is $1000 and doesn’t cover her pre-existing conditions. In other words, private individual insurance is just too expensive, and unless the Feds are willing to pay for most of the cost of it for most Americans, it’s going to be considerably more expensive than making my employer pay for it, and I assure you, our employers aren’t going to pay us more to compensate.
Do anything and everything to encourage and force free market competition among doctors and hospitals.
So in other words, your plan is to drive doctor’s wages downward and basically make medicine less enticing as a career? It’s one thing to magically choose a doctor for a yearly checkup, but once you’re severely sick, one doesn’t want to choose between “which costs less” when dealing with matters of life or death.
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bob11
Lucifer,
… you’d be doing our species a favor by committing suicde right now.
Just don’t take anyone with you!
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I spent some months after a harsh breakup living alone in my rented house, working from home. Trying to get social contact through social events. Living hell. A lifestyle that is itself mental illness.
I decided to rent a larger house and get housemates, to at least get some social interaction an unavoidable. It helped, a bit.
But the not getting laid bit – or rarely getting laid – for months on end. That’s still living hell, and approaches living a life of mental illness.
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Machines and capital are cheap.
So why are we making clothes overseas when we could easily build machines to do the work here in America and not worry about our IP being stolen by foreign counterparts? The machines basically only need a few baby sitters to supervise, so if it’s magically cheaper, why are companies choosing to set up shop in such a corrupt country where their assets could be easily seized?
Interestingly, the question still remains. Would highly automated manufacturing still employ the vast majority of unskilled labour in the way that it did in earlier eras, and would it do so at high enough wages to promote middle class labour.
Shale oil is profitable at $35 a barrel, and we have enough of that to hold us over for a century.
Except the tar sands in Alberta are only profitable at $75 to $80 per barrel, and hell, Venezuelan crude isn’t of much value if oil is below $100/bbl. Coal liquefaction isn’t particularly cheap either.
But we can’t do anything with it so long as Congress bows to environmentalists.
Drilling for seven years worth of total oil usage is in a fragile ecosystem is pointless. Mucking up beautiful scenery (that frigging market to tourists) for conventional or unconventional oil doesn’t make much sense. Once we start drilling, it’s not going back, and we’ve lost that natural beauty.
Bias Point: I am a photographer, and yes, I’m a roadgeek and railfan who wants to travel on this “plane” thing…
Earth worshiping environmentalists
But that’s part of what makes us white and better than the savage Asians.
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bob11:
YOU are a BoTY nominee, faceless troll status notwithstanding. Your insults to Lucifer regarding his “not getting laid” ring true with the gold standard of feminist shaming.
If you do in fact get laid:
– I am glad you took the beast you underachieved in tagging off the sexual marketplace
– conditionally, I am concerned that her over-achievement will empower her peers to exercise over/hyper-selection
If you do not get laid, or if you are a chick, transgender, “pansexual”, or “gender-neutral”:
– I disregard my empathetic reactions from earlier in the day urging detractors to “empathize” with this super-duper-beta of topic… put some barrels to your face and kill yourself. i can MAYYYYBE spare a passing grade to those aforementioned who respond and react, but to you, who jumps into the proverbial den of lions to scream your virtue at dissenting voices… no mercy**.
** unless you are a chick with big boobies and a thin waist – if so, holler at your MFB!!! promise i was just kidding about all that noise!
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Obamacare should include a provision for escort services under its “mental health services” wing.
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O
Is it really so bad in the west, that this doesn’t happen?
As far as I tend to see, many girls avoid the rakes, and aim for security. Sex is not a priority to them.
Women have a variety of mating strategies. I’ve never seen this mono-strategy being played out, as you and Whiskey describe.
I go for the hot girls who love sex, because they mesh with my rakish strategy. Many girls have told me they would never date me because they know I’m not the settling down and security giving type. You can see it on my face in an instant.
Yes, no girl wants to date a beta who can’t flirt. But many girls don’t want to date a rake who can. Most betas can have relationships.
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This is terrifying to me. A man kills a bunch of women because he thinks he’s entitled to a date and he’s lauded as a hero? And feminism, because it promotes a woman’s right to turn a man down is evil? No wonder you can’t get laid if you think that treating women like sex toys is the way to get one.
Protip: blaming women for your own failings is pathetic and disgusting. Worse that you blame it on lack of sex. Grow up.
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aoefe cup preliminary ties:
“@doug
Great job on the defence of our Bhetti! I wanted to as soon as I saw what he wrote, but knew I’d not manage an intelligent response to the evolution argument. I would have pointed out her med school attendance and her standings. It wasn’t gay in my opinion, realizing of course this comes from a woman and may in fact reinforce certain opinions. 🙂 ”
1. bhetti’s sexual selection proposition is absolute horseshit. from killers to bad boys to flat-billers, these men hold great positive esteem to women. in prison, sodini would get fan mail.
agree or refute?
2. bhetti’s assertion that this ex-girlfriend was “better off not dealing with the guy at all” is a faulty premise since, in his late twenties, Sodini was educated, employable, financially stable, and, by implication, faithful.
agree or refute?
3. that bhetti being a top-10% third year “medical student” does not discount her from reacting as a “dumb twat”, both instinctually and contemplatively. her specialization or field-generalization is a far cry from absolute cytopathology.
agree or refute?
// “i’m killa, you andre miller: got a basic game – “cam’ron”
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I’m pleased to know the Roissy commentariat has endorsed Mr. Sodini’s actions.
The rich man’s in his castle, the poor man’s at his gate!
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Oddly, those who we have borrowed quite a bit of money from are heavily dependent on our buying habits. The internal demand in consumer markets in Asian markets is basically crap, and the same is true for Europe. For all intents and purposes, the American consumer has stopped purchasing and the world’s economy isn’t humming as well as before.
The American consumer has stopped spending because Americans can’t service their debt. Borrowing money from other countries to buy products produced in other countries is an obvious path to poverty. It makes for good times right up until the sucker doing the borrowing can’t pay back their debts.
Congrats. That Chinese guy is still dirt cheap, and his Mexican and Brazilian counterparts work for $5 per day. I still have to pay my American employee $20.00/hr to be middle class, or I’m stuck pooling the questionable segments of the labour pool.
You don’t understand that machine + well paid employee is often preferable to many low cost employees.
Given that I like clean air and water, I’m not willing to take that risk to eat away at environmental regs.
At this point the bulk of environmental regulations and compliance costs have nothing to do with insuring clean air or water. Our regulations are way over the top. Long, expensive environmental impact studies and endless litigation by extremists are grinding this country to a halt.
Nor am I willing to get rid of OSHA so companies can let their facilities become accident prone hellholes where employees become disabled and thus become burdens on the state when they’re no longer able to work. If companies don’t want to comply with regs, they maybe they should pay high premiums into indemnity fund in case we have to clean up their messes…
You don’t have to get rid of OSHA, but you absolutely must streamline the regulations and costs. If companies don’t want to comply with business killing regulations they won’t bow to any of your demands, they will simply leave the country leaving you without a job. How much more of that can we take?
The only way you’re going to do that is to basically pay the full cost of schooling nurses and doctors, because there’s going to be considerable resistance to cutting corners in training.
Nonsense, there are plenty of places for greater efficiency. Let’s go all the way back to high school and fast track kids who have the IQ and drive to be in the medical field. Get them into college at 16 and quit screwing around wasting time keeping high school teachers employed. (Four years of high school is a tremendous waste of time in this country, both for college bound kids and for kids who should be studying a trade and starting their lives.)
In other words, private individual insurance is just too expensive, and unless the Feds are willing to pay for most of the cost of it for most Americans, it’s going to be considerably more expensive than making my employer pay for it,
You have that backwards. Group policies ultimately make insurance more expensive by limiting competition. Your employer doesn’t pay anything, not your medical, not half of your SS, nothing. It’s all just a cost of doing business, and it generally impacts your wages, though it can also come off profits. But for the most part you pay whether you want to pretend your employer is doing it or not. Your mother wouldn’t be facing those costs in a market where individuals shopped for and purchased health insurance. She would most likely have had a policy with your father that would enable her to continue at an affordable rate after his passing since the policy would be family based and not job based.
and I assure you, our employers aren’t going to pay us more to compensate.
I assure you they will to attract and keep good employees against other employers doing the same thing.
So in other words, your plan is to drive doctor’s wages downward and basically make medicine less enticing as a career?
Do you want to control costs or not? Do you want medical procedures, and therefore insurance, to be affordable to people like your mother or not? Competition is how you control costs. Cap liability so their insurance is cheaper, get them out of school and working sooner with less debt, streamline their paperwork and overhead, and they will be better off even if prices are pushed down by competition.
Karl Denninger had a good post on The Market Ticker which got into more detail regarding medical billing practices which stifle competition and would be considered fraud in other fields. We have to end this nonsense. Doctors must compete like everyone else. Let the market clearing price fall where it may. I guarantee you it won’t fall so low that people will no longer want to be in medicine.
but once you’re severely sick, one doesn’t want to choose between “which costs less” when dealing with matters of life or death.
So you prefer that an insurance company or government make those decisions? Because they will. They already do.
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FK
A truly disturbing experience – one that would make a man question social values and actions. Troubling.
I had a similar experience a few years ago. I started dating a hot 21 year Balinese girl. We were at a club, sipping it up, dancing, and mingling. After while her dance moves start to get a bit hot. She’s doing the fuck-me-from behind dirty dance with some random stranger!
The girl I was chatting up asked me “Is that your girlfriend?”
“No, I’ve only dated her a few times. Don’t really know her yet”
It was all too embarassing after 1 minute of this, and my emotions were turning to rage, so I grabbed her wrist and pulled her out of there and sat her down on my motorcycle.
“Don’t you want a man to own you? Don’t you want to be owned?”
Over the next few weeks, as she tried to string me along, I found out she’s a whore. No harm no foul. I kept dating the whole time she was trying her best to rip my heart out. I didn’t let her compromise me. Bitches be bitches. She didn’t win. And I got a few free lays out of her.
Point being – in an impossible social situation, in which there is no possible way to win, there is a way to win. If the girls truly doesn’t care about you, then are not dating. She has no hold. Move on. Next!
That’ll teach just how precious her pussy is.
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I’d imagine Sodini, in his late twenties, was also *incredibly* tone-deaf to ordinary social interactions, a tendency that got worse with age instead of improving.
He spent all his self-improvement energies on things that HE liked to see in the opposite sex. It seems he lacked the ability to even halfway put himself in someone else’s shoes.
Now, it is probably true that making marriage or prostitution the only economic activities available to most women will drive more of them to marriage, but it is also certainly true that some proportion of women will elect poverty/spinsterhood over having to live with the George Sodinis of this world.
Just last night, I was reading a late 1800s article reprinted in the local paper. One of its news items was that the town debate team planned to tackle the topic, “Should Old Bachelors Be Taxed for the Support of Old Maids?”
There’s never been a time when the ugliest girls and the weirdest guys did not find themselves unable to stand the thought of committing to each other.
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me and DT are muhfuckin eye-to-eye on economic opining. gig, you really ought to check yourself with all that inventory-driven bullshit that GE Capital is broadcasting, even though you and me are boys – i would love to get blasted with you one night, no rainbow.
i own about one+ share of goldman sachs because that stock will someday soon go up to “infinity” dollars and all other stocks will drop to “zero”. if this doesn’t happen, it’s still a decent hedge against doomsday.
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“i used to watch the show ‘i dream of genie’ and dreamt about WHEN I WOULD BE LARGE LIKE (SODINI)” – blastmaster kris
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So why are we making clothes overseas when we could easily build machines to do the work here in America and not worry about our IP being stolen by foreign counterparts? The machines basically only need a few baby sitters to supervise, so if it’s magically cheaper, why are companies choosing to set up shop in such a corrupt country where their assets could be easily seized?
Because the government imposed costs of doing business are too high in America.
DT – Shale oil is profitable at $35 a barrel, and we have enough of that to hold us over for a century.
Except the tar sands in Alberta are only profitable at $75 to $80 per barrel, and hell, Venezuelan crude isn’t of much value if oil is below $100/bbl. Coal liquefaction isn’t particularly cheap either.
What does any of that have to do with our shale oil resources?
And how long have we been paying around $70 a barrel or more? We can survive that. We can grow and prosper at even $100 per barrel, especially if that $100 is spent on Americans to drill/refine the oil at home as opposed to being sent to the middle east. What we can’t survive is $500 a barrel thanks to the loss of foreign imports due to terrorism, war, or the collapse of our currency.
DT – But we can’t do anything with it so long as Congress bows to environmentalists.
Drilling for seven years worth of total oil usage is in a fragile ecosystem is pointless.
What are you talking about? The Green River Shale formation has over 100 years worth of oil.
Are you talking about ANWR? Where they want to drill is not a fragile ecosystem, it’s an Arctic wasteland. Regardless they could drill there for 7 years, get all the oil, and when they left nobody would ever know they were there. I agree there’s not much oil there, but there’s enough natural gas to make it worth drilling even if drilling did do some damage.
Mucking up beautiful scenery (that frigging market to tourists) for conventional or unconventional oil doesn’t make much sense.
Our civilization runs on oil. Without oil you do not travel, or take pictures, or surf the Internet, or even have food to eat. Oil is used for more than just transportation, though that’s a pretty big use we can’t survive without.
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THE WIRE
Sailer’s views on “The Wire”
http://www.takimag.com/blogs/article/its_so_authentic/
Some highlights:
“The Wire is the stuff that white people like. Indeed, Christian Lander came up with the concept for his blog/bestseller while bemoaning with another white person The Wire being on the verge of cancellation for its chronic low ratings. Similarly, The Wire was Barack Obama’s favorite TV show, and Omar, the implausible gay Robin Hood with the heart of gold, was the President’s favorite character.”
…”The Wire’s central thread is old-fashioned Jewish liberal sentimentality straight out of a Stanley Kramer message movie from the early-1960s. According to Simon, it’s The System that keeps the typical crack dealer from becoming what he always, deep down inside, aspires to be: a nice Jewish boy with a B.A. in English from a state flagship university. (Simon, the son of a B’nai B’rith PR man, graduated from the U. of Maryland and became a Baltimore Sun reporter.)”
…”An occasional blog called Jeopardy Green Room points out:
****************
The Wire is simply repeating liberalism’s oldest and most discredited tropes: … [Early 1960s] liberals fully expected that one day “blackness” would simply disappear as a public phenomenon and with it all of the coarse traits associated with ghetto culture. …
*****************
…”In “The Effect of Urban Flight on IQ Distribution,” the pseudonymous statistical analyst La Griffe du Lion estimates from 8th grade test scores that on a scale where non-Hispanic white Marylanders average 100, the effective IQ of the average black 8th grade public school student in the city of Baltimore is 76. “More than a third have death-penalty immunity on grounds of mental retardation,” he surmises. (In 2002, the Supreme Court more or less abolished capital punishment for murderers scoring below 70 on their IQ tests.)”
“After generations of urban flight, the IQ of ***WHITE*** eighth graders stranded in Baltimore City’s schools is only 86, versus 99 for whites and 86 for blacks in suburban Baltimore.”
…”the reason that so many pundits swoon over The Wire is because the message Simon is preaching to blacks—Be like me! Be a nice white liberal!—is, deep down, their solution for everything.”
[And the reason some black people like The Wire is:]
“Simon pens show-offy speeches to illustrate that inside most every black teenage drug dealer beats the heart of a 115 IQ Wire fanboy. For example, there’s D’Angelo Barksdale’s long AP English Lit soliloquy on the meaning of The Great Gatsby: “Like at the end of the book, ya know, boats and tides and all.”
[or as the “Jeopardy” blog puts it:]
******************
And it is exactly such faded, 40-year old product that the “innovative” and “cutting-edge” Wire is still peddling. Scratch beneath the surface of any ghetto kid, allow for the tough exterior and colorful street idiom, and underneath you’ll find a potential chess champion, or insightful social critic, or Great Books lover.
******************
[However, some of us grumpy old white men have seen through this bullshit for many years now — once again, “Jeopardy”:]
***************
All of this is … somewhat embarrassing to non-geriatric “advanced whites” who’ve grown up on multiculturalism and are acutely aware of the “culturally imperialistic” premises inherent in race-blind liberalism.
****************
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sorry to cover points if they’ve already been discussed.
first, after reading this guy’s blog, i have to say that i’ve never felt so much pity in my life. i’m not trying to be like the douchebag arpagus here. what he did to those women was unconscionable, but i could feel what the guy was feeling when he wrote those posts. the simplicity with which he stated he was going to bed, alone, once again was stirring.
second, this man was as sane as any murderer could be. he had a handle on his thoughts, feelings, and rage. he knew what it stemmed from.
third, i’d be interested if he read roissy or others in the community. he hit on some themes that are often discussed here. is there a way to track the IP address of his computer from his blog?
fourth, i truly think that a blog like roissy’s would have prevented something like this if the guy had read it. roissy does have its men who think the whole deck of cards is stacked against them, but it also has a large number of guys who see what’s happening and want to change it by becoming aware. if this blog didn’t actually get him success with women, it would have helped him process the “problem” and hopefully deal with/accept it.
fifth, he pointed out that there were 30 million available (he also implied datable) women in the country. none chose him. but i’m wondering what his standards were. was he unwilling to settle? if not, did he have some sort of self-entitlement? if that, where did his entitlement come from?
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DT,
Just glancing at your last couple of posts, the economic points you make are spot on. You ought to start a blog, if you don’t have one already. You might also be interested in checking out this post I wrote a few months ago, taking on a prominent lefty’s ideas for the American economy: “How not to create broad-based prosperity”. I’d be interested in your thoughts on it.
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ohhh well done, katto! where have you been these past two months?
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You don’t understand that machine + well paid employee is often preferable to many low cost employees.
Except that the machine induces capital costs that hurts earnings and reduces the stock price of the company which scares away shareholders.
Let’s go all the way back to high school and fast track kids who have the IQ and drive to be in the medical field.
Interestingly, I’ve argued we should take the Quebecois approach and end high school in the equivalent of junior year, and basically have most students attend community college as a transitional bridge between high school and university while serving as a cheap job training, vocational programme for those that want it.
IIRC, a number of countries basically start med school in the equivalent of the third year of college, and shave one or two year off medical school. Of course, as I noted, some would argue that cuts corners in training and the long eight year process turns out the best doctors in the world.
Group policies ultimately make insurance more expensive by limiting competition.
The only way individual policies will make any sense is if you get rid of the ability of insurance to deny claims for pre-existing coverage. If my dad was to sign up for insurance and be told his wife’s two previous strokes and fibromylagia prohibit her coverage, then individual insurance is useless. At least with group coverage, we get around such restrictions, and we get some degree of buying power via our employer.
quit screwing around wasting time keeping high school teachers employed
Fun question: How does an unemployed widow who makes $0 per year pay for her home and her maintain her lifestyle, let alone pay for an insurance policy? Extract it from her college student son that makes $0 or the unemployable son that works part-time?
Trust me, the situation sometimes makes me want to pull out a gun and “solve the problem”.
I assure you they will to attract and keep good employees against other employers doing the same thing.
My employer could pay $16/hr and attract white labour, but for some reason, it chooses to offer $11/hr and in turn complain about the quality of it’s “negro” workforce. They’d rather offer third rate customer service because it’s cheap and allows them to shave off more in terms of lower operating costs. As I stated in my previous comment, I don’t see companies remitting the full value of what they pay to their employees healthcare (or payroll tax) back as income to employees.
Do you want to control costs or not? Do you want medical procedures, and therefore insurance, to be affordable to people like your mother or not?
That’s the problem. I generally don’t see us having the ability to control costs without running into the nasty rationing issue, driving down incomes of those in the industry makes it less enticing even if you lower their training costs. The only way that you’re going to make insurance affordable for people like my mom who have somewhat intensive health needs is to basically have the government write a blank check.
And I am against capping liability because liability is the only tool we have to keep doctors and other professionals and businesses in line. The fear of lawsuits is what keeps doctors from fucking up and thinking they can get away with it.
Because they will. They already do.
As somebody who watched his dad fight cancer, I can assure you that the last thing people need to do while they’re being treated is to worry about whether “chemotherpy X” low price is worth it’s possible side effects and lowered efficacy or if Hospital X’s lower prices aren’t going to cause death in the long-term.
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”””””””’on August 5, 2009 at 9:22 pm Dave from Hawaii
It shocks me that we don’t see more of that already. I can’t imagine shooting someone over a dry spell. For that matter I can’t imagine shooting people who have never done a thing to me.
But if I had kids and an ex wife who used the courts to steal my children and my money? I can easily see myself going over the deep end because of that.
The reason why we don’t see more of this is because men who have children, for the most part, at least have some contact with their children. Even in the cases of extreme alienation, Father’s don’t want to have to have their children grow up knowing their father was an infamous mass murderer.
No…I think as wretched as the divorce court industry is right now, the Father’s still have at least a minimal investment in society for their childrens sake.
It’s these cases of betas/o m e g a s facing a life time of rejection while watching other guys getting pussy galore who are going to continue to carry out such mass murders.””””””””””””””””
Naa man google that shit. There are a ton of families getting wacked over this unfair divorce shit. Feminists don’t give a shit about woman obviously or they would maybe try to fix divorce laws. When you back a guy into a corner and he is a man then he will react. What you have mostly in these divorce cases is the walking dead.
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chuck:
i really sync up with your second and fourth points. as far as if he knew about “game”, i’d venture a big fat no. i consider all the many thousands of dollars spent on boot camps by dejected betas in his shoes.
as far as sodini’s standards-threshold, we may never know the true depths into which he’d delve. earlier, i mocked a 300 lb. woman who could not convince her love interest to overcome his physical “preferences”. commenter ‘joe’ added that convincing a man to love an obese woman was the equivalent of asking a woman to love a beta male.
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It makes for good times right up until the sucker doing the borrowing can’t pay back their debts.
To be miserable consistently or to be happy for a little bit and then miserable later…
Because the government imposed costs of doing business are too high in America.
And as I stated, even if you yank out the cost of providing health care and payroll taxes, it’s hard to compete with the Chinese guy working for $2/day or his Mexican equivalent at $6. And since we tend to like paved roads, decent teachers, money for the old folks, and kick-ass stealth bombers, we’re going to have some degree of imposed costs to ensure those things continue to function.
Of course, I’m probably more Dirigiste than the average Roissy reader.
Our civilization runs on oil.
Obviously, but I’d like to look for an alternative that doesn’t require us to muck up the environment to keep our civilization running.
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[…] practitioner Roissy, on the LA Fitness gym shooting in Philadelphia: When men kill women, the underlying reason is almost always an unfulfilled […]
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”””Lucifer,
This guy would have done better to buy pussy once or twice a week while he went out and tried to meet women relentlessly. I cannot imaging going without the physical personal acceptance of another human being for 19 years””””””””””’
Yea I think the guy was trying to be a “good” guy live a moral life and that is what broke him. In order to survive that shit you got to toss some of the garbage out from you head. Cannot follow the “good” book the way the church tells you in the new divorce paradigm.
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i meant to add earlier…one issue this man faced, and one that may be at the heart of any forthcoming scenarios similar to the one in Pitt, is lack of proper male-bonding.
yeah he wanted pussy, but i think that was only one of the things he was looking for. he wanted to know where he fit in life. he wanted to know what he was and what he deserved out of life. what questions he should ask and what he should expect. he wanted a father, an older brother, a mentor to help him figure these things out. his lack of positive male influence in his life predicated *any* of his desires to seek revenge on women.
again, this incident attacks the crux of the issue…and that is, this man felt entitled to a woman of his choosing. human history and the history of our primate genetic ancestors has shown that male procreation is a sort of honor. not every male is given the opportunity. because of the development of the idea that human men should be able to have sex with women, a man’s value has become so attached to his ability to woo women, his failures are painted in vivid red strokes.
this man had no male guidance to reconcile his inner demons; demons that we all face in varying degrees. his demons were manifested because of a sort of self-pity that stemmed from his lack of success with women. that lack of success was further underscored because of the high value men place on obtaining women.
in olden days, a man like this would turn to science or the clergy….where do they go now?
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Al
Girls are best taught how to be feminine women by older men. He needs her youth and beauty and raw drive, and she needs his maturity and wisdom.
And young men will do well to date much older women. A young guy has a permanent boner anyway – he hardly needs a hottie to get horny. And he needs experience and wisdom that young girls don’t have. He needs it.
It’s fair, it’s educational, and the sex is good to great.
I don’t know why people in the west focus on dating near their age.
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oh chuck… go on and make me take back all that positive vibe!
so you yourself, being the child of a single mother… where did you get your fatherly feedback? more importantly: if you did not receive that particular male encouragement, could you see yourself personally, ever in one thousand years, going on a suicidal shooting spree? i think that if your answer is no, your prescription would not cure this particular ailment.
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doug1,
Since you two are close, do everyone a favor and tell your dumb cunt sand nigger friend of yours to read a book.
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hahahahahhaha
hi yi yi hey yey hi yo
hi yi yi hey yey hi yo
…. we gettin ay-rab money!
…. we gettin ay-rab money!
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Cannon — I’m always around. But most times when I start writing a post, I take my time, reflect on what I’m saying, and realize that it’s not worthwhile, so I abandon it. Most of the time I just link to other writings which provide what I think is a valuable point of view, and which say it better than I could myself.
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Marcus
Yes, he may have not held normal peoples views of morality – he may not have felt an emotional identification with morality – he may have been a sociopath. One in a hundred of us are.
But he does come across as rational.
Killing innocents gained him publicity. Without that publicity there would be no attention to his cause.
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By the way, one reason some women act like bitches, deliberately trying to get the man’s goad, is to turn him into a cave-man.
If the man was already cave man, she’d not feel the need.
Women need to be mock raped from time to time. They need the drama. If you don’t feed it to them, they’ll ask for it. And if you don’t provide, they’ll lose interest in you.
Women need regular mock-raping. At minimum a firm man-handling.
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after further review:
the post(s) of commenter “Once Touchless” purveyed no pretty lies. again, pardon my enthusiastic revelry in doling out shame.
katto: “The Wire” has been getting fellated around these parts like Cutty’s dick by a b-more street urchin’s cape buffalo mother. keep doin what ya doin, ya playaaa
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Roissy, Whiskey and others are spot on about this. Go read any progressive left wing site about this news. For example Metafilter. Soon as someone mentions that if “he had got laid it might not have happened”, everyone piles on the person with Maoist brainwashed femnazi bullshit like “YES, LET THE WOMEN FOLK SEXUALLY PLEASE THE CRAZY GUY”.
Roissy and others are spot on. The left wing progressive sexual revolution hasn’t created a new age of individualism and freedom. It has reverted back to prehistory, where betas are shunned into subservient roles and alphas take everything.
Best to learn game.
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This shit was off the chain funny though. A dude came on jezebel and was asking what to do about situation. These bitches are talking shit on Roissy even though apparently they sure as shit don’t have any solutions. Roissy doing god’s work to help save womans lives by giving men game. The only response these bitches had was to tell the dude to go kill some bitches in a round about way.
””””””””””””””””””’Vedette mouse,
First and foremost, my condolences go out the the victims of this tragedy.
As a man who has a difficult time meeting and holding the attention of women, I have to say: What are we to do? What can we as a society do to change this? I have always felt that the reason that I am so awkward around girl that I like is because I was never shown what to do in a situation like that (raised by a single mother, my father was never there).
I grew up being subjected to my sister’s idea of what a guy should be; which pretty much means some one out of a romantic movie or a 14 year old’s idea of a dream guy. The thing is, by listening and following that idea at such a young age, it is ingrained in me, and it doesn’t work. I come off a too needy, clingy, desperate which leads to weird and awkward.
Then come a wave of thought that is this “game” theory brought by guys like mystery and the like, promising “hey, we can show you how to meet girls and get them to like you and stuff!” And as a man who is is on the verge of desperation for companionship, how can we say no? And its not that I am only looking for sex (although that would be nice, and who here would not like to have sex, man or woman?) But by reading and following theses ideals makes me a “mediocre neanderthal”, I’m fucked either way.
So I ask you, readers of Jezebel, let us not complain or point fingers, let figure out a way to solve the problem that work for both our sexes. What is a guy to do in a situation like this? Accepting loneliness might work for some, but not all and hating women can lead down a dangerous path.””””””””’
”””””””””””Cwisto Moweina has
VedetteMouse: um, it’s not our problem that some guys, including you, can’t hold the attention of women? And to suggest so in the comments of a post about a man who murdered women for the same reason is kinda, um, psychotically selfish? Reply
lisas promoted this comment Edited by cwisto moweina has got yer goat at 08/05/09 2:52 PM ”””””””’
”””””””””””’Lisas,
@VedetteMouse: First and foremost, you’re a fucking asshole, and everyone here is being far, far too nice to you.
This is a thread about a murderous, misogynist dead piece of shit, and you want to discuss your sad-sack love life? And whine about how you don’t know how to do it right because there was no man around to tell you? YOU’RE AN IDIOT. GTFO. ”””””””””’
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Jezebel saying roissy may have some responsibility if guys just start killing bitches. No it is bitches like jezelbel and her crones that have that responsibility.
Asian woman can save us. I don’t believe american woman have what it takes.
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””””””’omw
I’m pleased to know the Roissy commentariat has endorsed Mr. Sodini’s actions.
The rich man’s in his castle, the poor man’s at his gate!””””””””””””’
What’s up omw how ya been?
I may have even missed you a little.
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Well ok make that if ya just allow them to be woman without the special laws and the backup. Just let them be real actual woman. Then yea could be fine.
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[…] recent mass murder in Pittsburgh. I usually ignore these events, but these posts by Half Sigma and Roissy piqued my interest. Go read them, if you haven’t already. DGL’s annotated version of […]
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Oh your god!
I have never seen a worse collection of insecure, pathetic man-children in one place before.
You are all deluded, and Roissy most of all. I truely though such mysoginy was a thing of the dark ages. I feel tainted knowing that I share a Y-chromosme such monstrous, ignorant and singleminded morons.
No wonder you have to manipulate women into giving you a chance to reproduce. Hopefully you do not succeed, and our species will be saved from you contaminating the genepool even further.
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Go back to ‘Stuff White People Like’ Skyweir … oh, and it is spelled ‘misogyny’, jackass.
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”””””””’on August 6, 2009 at 6:33 am Skyweir
Oh your god!
I have never seen a worse collection of insecure, pathetic man-children in one place before.”””””””””””’
Is that a pic of a man or a woman?
But yea like I was saying if your a woman again another bitch trying to get bitches killed. See the point.
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Skyweir:
Your spelling is “of the dark ages.”
Know this: if I was boxed into a cave on top of a snow-covered mountain with a dog, a chicken, a bag of seed, and you… I would kill you and eat your flesh first. Really, this is not a question of survival but rather of pure self-interest. I might actually enjoy the dog’s company, and the hen could be fed to lay eggs, which I find delicious when scrambled or over-easy. Both trump your value on the face of the earth.
For real though, I had a little stint with World of Warcraft back in the day and I think I saw your S5 mage by the same name with the fully equipped kit pwning n00bs in all that arena gear in the battlegrounds, definitely “Alliance” not “Horde.” How is the Lich King valuepack? – I decided I’d rather go on a suicidal killing spree than cop the expansion. It was affecting my “quality of life.”
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Somebody should make a movie out of this thread, with the words “THIS IS WHAT MRAs ACTUALLY BELIEVE” flashing at the bottom of the screen in primary colours for the entire duration.
I feel so fucking dirty knowing you vile fucks and I share a species.
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ebola cola:
are you the 300 lb redheaded broad from the jezebel board who can’t convince her love interest to overcome her poor looks?
if so, you should know that your condition is not so commonplace as categorical “ebola”
rather, we call it
“ginger-vitis”
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I too agree w/Dreamer-more White guys get w/plus-sized White gals than many White guys here want to admit. But even w/that aside, the bottomline is, that Americans overall are getting bigger. That’s just a fact. And so, if thiness is that big a deal to White guys, pardon the pun, then they’re in big trouble…pardon thepun again.
Because it seems to me aint much any of y’all can do about it. If it were me, I’d be seriously thinking of relocating to a country where there were more Women to my liking, especially if I was single, not a chick nor child. I’d save up my pennies, get a passport, and catch the first thing smokin to East Europe, parts of Asia, Iceland, whereva. I really wouldn’t waste much time complaining, whining, bitching and moaning about something I can’t do a damned thing about.
But again, that’s just me.
The Obsidian
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lol
feministe has linked here as well.
I fucking cracked up at this line where she stated that Roissy needed a “… new Ed Hardy t-shirt.”
Wasn’t ‘hating on people that wear Ed Hardy’ on SWPL a while back?
Progressive urban liberals are almost parodies of themselves.
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And what do you believe ebola?
Listens to the fiz of the cola.
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Ahh yes the feminsist no free speech websites. Another reason for people not to talk and just keep it all in till they kill some bitches. Feminists the most anit-woman people on the planet.
Men actually love woman. Feminists want them to have careers where they can toil for the man. Shit is out of control ludicrus. The irony of it all.
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””””””””on August 6, 2009 at 7:54 am Obsidian
I too agree w/Dreamer-more White guys get w/plus-sized White gals than many White guys here want to admit.”””””””””””””’
Well Obsid with all due respect I did fuck a 400 pounder and yea she still asks about me 14 years later. The thing is I couldn’t do it again. Guys rock man they take mercy on people bitches don’t. What can ya do?
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For all his anger at hot young beeotches, his three victims were aged 37, 46 and 49.
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Golly, that’s specious reasoning, Roissy! Women have to have sex with creepy guys let they get gunned down. Move over Freud!
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Obviously Roissy is advocating men to use game so that woman don’t get gunned down gil. Read for comprehension on the game can save lives. Look at arpagus he wanted to rape woman until he learned game. Anyway society doesn’t give any other out for people who don’t want to be on planet other than take it or maybe offer the pain up to god. All the bleeding hearts against suicide.
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Are you retarded Gil? That’s not what Roissy said, if the guy had some GAME women would’ve fucked him WILLINGLY(he wouldn’t come across as a creep) thus avoiding this sordid situation.
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That’s why war has always been around. Surplus boys get killed and war brides are captured, bringing on a male-to-female ratio that keeps everyone happy.
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The NY Post linked to a YouTube video that purports to show Sodini giving a tour of his house:
If this is real, then I think it’s pretty clear that the guy was an offputting weirdo, possibly in the Asperger Syndrome spectrum.
BTW, Roissy, the video shows a copy of “How to date younger women” on his coffee table
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If the guy knew about game he would have known that one of the biggest components is INNER GAME. Meaning awareness of one’s flaws and deficiencies and the willingness to work on them. If he came across as a creep and was aware of it he would work diligently to change himself! Having said that there is a possibility this guy had a serious personality disorder and was beyond saving. There are millions of men who lead the same life as this guy did yet would never kill innocents.
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What’s best about this whole debacle is that had this guy been some minority (like Asian, or Latino, lower socioeconomic status) that shot the place up, then the left would have used it as a chance to ‘understand’ the victim.
Look at the way progressive blogs acted after various school/college shootings. It was a case of trying to understand the victim’s mindset. He was a ‘victim’, or he was ‘bullied’, or he was ‘misunderstood’.
Now when one of their sworn enemies — women-hating white males — does the same, they get a whiff of blood in the water and get shown for the bloodthirsty hypocrites that they are.
So much for progressive tolerance.
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Oh by the way, apropos of nothing, it just popped into my head:
Old Italian proverb: A man isn’t a man until he’s killed a man, or written a book, or had a son.
So far, Roissy has done none of these things. (Neither have I.) But one of his favorite bloggers has done 2 out of 3.
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The home in the video matches the address in his DNS registration:
244 orchard spring road 15220
http://maps.google.com/maps?q=244+orchard+spring+15220&ie=UTF8&split=0&gl=us&ei=brd5SsXaK5yEtgfnh9SWCQ&ll=40.395473,-80.068445&spn=0.007583,0.01929&t=h&z=16&iwloc=A&layer=c&cbll=40.395391,-80.068402&panoid=kg0ATiKV6gJIn9p1rmlfDw&cbp=12,234.96,,0,1.87
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The Feministing, Feministe and Jezebel website comments just goes to show what I said earlier-that Women as a group, not specific individuals now, but in the aggregate, simply could not care less about Men’s problems in this area-even if you preface your remarks by condemning the violence. So what.
Yet another reason why Women cannot be consulted in these matters, usually. Proper application of The Ten Percent Rule can help, but that takes considerable skill to wield effectively. Until then, youngbucks just starting out should basically ignore whatever “advice” a young Woman offers, and cling instead to the realworld experience of Men who know what it is to his dick wet on the regular.
Amin.
The Obsidian
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One thought that comes up in this thread is knowledge of Game. Had this Pittsburgh guy known game… had Jon Gosselin known Game…
Most guys heve never heard of Game. At least this was the case with my pre-internet era teens/twenties. Unless a boy was lucky enough to have had solid role models (alpha dad, cool older brothers) or natural game uncorrupted by Feminist teachings, he was doomed to repeat his mistakes with every new girl he meets, like those damned souls in Dante’s inferno.
When I think how many times I’ve fcuked up a good thing I had with a girl I won via natural asshole game, only to lose her by “rewarding” her with nice-guy betatude “because quality women want to be respected…”
I broke my awful pattern of beta LTR behavior by coming across Game. But what if I hadn’t? Most young guys never come across this simple set of teachings. Will this change?
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Gunslingergregi:
I actually posted a response to that, but it’s a bit further up the way in the comment thread at Jezebel (I’m anonymous there, too)…
————————————————
08/05/09
There was an interesting comment recently posted to Roissy’s blog:
“Most guys will not cure cancer or invent the light bulb in their lives. Their worth is contained primarily in their ability to find attract and keep 1 good woman, aggregate some assets, and reproduce. Deny him those things unfairly and there will be trouble.”
In my opinion?
1) you are not worth less if you haven’t had sex (in a while, ever, whenever…). Stop placing so much importance on it, or variations of it (hooking up with a girl, going on a date, etc.)
2) Hey! Now that that pressure is off, you can talk to people and be yourself! Don’t even worry about making friends. Just talk. Learn about others. Relate. Have fun. Try to find out one interesting thing about a person in your circle (work, social, or even someone random) a day. Celebrate it. And remember, this exercise isn’t about you, it’s about others, and learning about them. There’s no pressure for you to be anything other than a listener.
3) Think about yourself. What it is that makes you unique and interesting to talk to. Think about what kind of person you would like to be.
4) Guess what? A *lot* of people feel socially awkward. Most people, actually. They all have different defense mechanisms, and they’re not all for you, but you can’t take it personally – their prickliness, or rudeness, or coldness, just like their warmness, humor, and welcoming nature are about them (and their insecurities) – not about you, or any of your possible shortcomings.
Jesus. I would write a 25 page book of dating advice for men, but it just wouldn’t be playing to men’s insecurities enough to outsell Mystery.
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@Katto A man isn’t a man until …
I did two out of three.
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I did two out of three.
Without breaking any laws, to keep things clear.
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Ahh, here’s his youtube channel featuring two of his videos:
http://www.youtube.com/user/MOSB46PGH
I’m still calling Asperger Syndrome.
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Half Sigma just came through with a bunch of new Sodini links:
Here’s Sodini trying to learn “Game” in a seminar by R. Don Steele:
http://www.youtube.com/user/steelballspress
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I am amazing that there are feminist blogs linking to this article, who conform to, and confirm, our worst impressions about them.
Sometimes I wonder if they really are as bad as we think they are. After reading some of the links, I can say without hesitation, THEY ARE.
Despite the unsustainable power advantage that women presently have over men, they still insist that America is a misogynistic society. Most of them have never even heard of the word ‘misandry’. That is how blind they are in their projection.
Frankly, I am surprised that Sodini-type sprees don’t happen more often.
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”””””””””’evemariesaint
Gunslingergregi:
I actually posted a response to that, but it’s a bit further up the way in the comment thread at Jezebel (I’m anonymous there, too)…
————————————————
08/05/09
There was an interesting comment recently posted to Roissy’s blog:
“Most guys will not cure cancer or invent the light bulb in their lives. Their worth is contained primarily in their ability to find attract and keep 1 good woman, aggregate some assets, and reproduce. Deny him those things unfairly and there will be trouble.”
In my opinion?
1) you are not worth less if you haven’t had sex (in a while, ever, whenever…). Stop placing so much importance on it, or variations of it (hooking up with a girl, going on a date, etc.)”””””””””””””’
Well sex is important. When I took my supervisor class. The pyramid of basic needs has sex on the same level as food and shelter. It is important.
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Are you retarded funky k? Just because he can’t get women to take notice of him willingly doesn’t give him the right to gun them down. Someone who’s that deluded probably wouldn’t have listened to ‘game’ advice anyway. Then again the guy was obviously computer literate so he may well have read ‘gaming’ advice. Besides he comes across as a full-on O***a not a hard luck Beta.
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I think that at the last minute, Sodini had a change of heart. He brought 4 guns, but only killed 3 people. His initial plan was to kill more like 30.
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i am on the side of the feminsit harridans (including Bob11, who´s obviously a women posing as men). Getting laid is hard, but getting friends is easy. A guy without friends is a freak, no questions about that. I also had a pleasant moment when the coolest commenter around, Lucifer, defined “friend” as someone who links to your profile in linkdn
omw citation of that article proposing taxation of old bachelors was priceless.
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game can save lives & get you laid. but there are downsides to too much pussy, apparently…
http://current.com/items/90604019_4-angry-women-krazy-glue-boyfriends-penis-in-revenge-attack.htm
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Legalize prostitution. Legalize suicide. Lets help the men out. No reason for people who don’t want to be on planet to be here.
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Hell I don’t want to be here to watch the united states go down shitter. To watch people become slaves.
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I have never seen a worse collection of insecure, pathetic man-children in one place before
pleeeeaaase, I am very secure in my evil ways.
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. He brought 4 guns, but only killed 3 people. His initial plan was to kill more like 30
betas
always letting things half-done
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Cannon’s Canon: “In the spirit of Pupu, great boredom, and triple-hate”
Pupu – the guardian angel of the wave field from the thermal attacks that may blow the field into countless nonsensical bits – has been proudly canonized into the trinity of …!
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FYI. There are 2 youtube videos of Soldini on Youtube.
User name: MOSB46PGH.
Google “How George Pittsburgh Lives”
Kind of weird and awkward, but not a real nut job.
Had dating books and a punching bag, plus the usual geek gadgets. I’m guessing the video was used for online dating.
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Gil you retard, reread my post carefully, where have I condoned his deed? Stop projecting.
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He really isn’t that strange in the video, but one can sense the desperation. He was living a lonely, empty, isolated life, like so many ordinary American men do today. His sparse, sterile home is a perfect reflection of that.
Whiskey is correct in that men will seek to fulfill their psychosexual needs through identifying with some leader who will promise them women (subconsciously, perhaps) and loot. Whoever can harness this desperation and understand what men want should be able to amass great power.
I am really losing faith in this country. The current setup is highly unstable.
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I am really losing faith in this country. The current setup is highly unstable.
I know what you mean. Even 3 years ago, I didn’t feel this way.
But I do think that by 2020, things will be better, not worse, for men.
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[…] ways they are being culturally read. The succinct jewel of wisdom that blew me away: Roissy’s contention that “anything is justified” to help men avoid celibacy is terrifying, but more subtly […]
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you’ll see that there is a sizeable minority of average men who are living lives of de facto celibacy
I don’t think that’s true factually. See Table 10 in this CDC publication:
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/ad/ad362.pdf
Only 2.8 percent of men 25-44 are virgins, another 9.6 percent have had one lifetime partner — that mixes in people married young and faithful (religious?) with probably some de facto celibate types. But over 80 percent of men report three or more lifetime partners.
If you were a serious beta early in life, say 18-24 when it is tough, you might be scarred enough by the experience to think that there is some vast population of sexless men. But most people work it out eventually.
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Cannon’s Canon:
Fair enough. I would probably start with a few homeless people to acclimate myself to the sensations. You know, to maximize performance.
Just going off the cuff like that with no physical preparation? Lunacy!
He spent the better part of a year making preparations. If that’s not cold-blooded and off-kilter, what is it?
The guy committed a heinous crime against people who’d done nothing to him. Go ahead and defend that, if you want, but don’t expect rational people to give you any credence.
You seem to be taking issue with me because I suggested his early family life, as he described it himself, is at least as much to blame for his inability to connect in any meaningful way with the people around him as his later problems with women.
Blaming it solely on the fact that he couldn’t get laid is addressing the symptom, not the cause. WHY couldn’t he get laid? Why didn’t he have any friends? Why such a sense of isolation?
Far from sniping at my theory, you should be supporting it, as it in turn supports what’s often argued here: how important a stable two-parent family is for the development of a child. This is what can happen when a boy doesn’t have a strong, involved father-figure in his life…and does have a bullying brother, and a fault-finding mother….
xsplat:
Yes, he may have not held normal peoples views of morality – he may not have felt an emotional identification with morality – he may have been a sociopath. One in a hundred of us are.
But he does come across as rational.
Killing innocents gained him publicity. Without that publicity there would be no attention to his cause.
How he came across is ultimately immaterial: his action was irrational and unbalanced. If he truly had been rational, he would have behaved rationally, but he didn’t. And if he truly was a sociopath, no amount of game would have helped him.
That’s precisely what I first posted here saying: there’s more to this than simply “women wouldn’t date him”, but most of the posts here are overlooking the other factors and zeroing in on “it’s all the wimmin’s fault!” That doesn’t help anybody.
His cause?! He HAD no “cause”. What he has now is notoriety for pointless murder, not publicity for a cause.
I’m sorry he was so damaged that gunning down people minding their own business looked like a sensible option to him. But he is the one who did that, he and he alone. There is no justification for such an action. He relinquished his claim on my compassion the moment he gunned down people who never did a thing to him.
He had the means to take xsplat’s route and purchase his companionship, if that’s what was important to him. He had internet access, which, if he were searching for dating advice, would have brought him to this very site, or one much like it. He had options that he did not exercise, and lashed out randomly when things didn’t go the way he thought they should go. Indefensible and cowardly.
No amount of game would have solved this guy’s problems.
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if only you
were jewish
you’d be purrfect
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You are aware that many women find sociopaths extremely attractive, aren’t you?
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Fifth, it is a misogynistic society, but feminism does nothing to help matters.
What we’ve ended up with is a misogynistic society in which women who aren’t hot get hated on brutally, men all feel entitled to sex and devotion from women who are hot, the whore/wife division and balance has been totally trashed, women feel entitled to behave like whores and be loved like wives, and wives are encouraged to put a pricetag on their “services”, and any woman who doesn’t want this kind of insanity is called “oppressed”.
Men are now being told that in order to be viewed as a responsible guy (read docile drone) they are obligated to basically throw money at problems they would naturally have thrown punches at. So they’ve been let off the hook and the sad truth is that since there was already a problem of respecting women in the first place, they’re glad to not have to look after women anymore. Feminism has given men enough time to be bored and useless in every way but their wallets.
So you have a gym full of women for whose security the owners are not concerned. No armed security or even unarmed guys checking bags at the door.
There are crazy people everywhere on this planet, but the owners of that gym couldn’t be arsed to put one dude with a flashlight at the damned door. That doesn’t sound like a society that loves women to me. That sounds like a society that hates women so much that nobody cares for women’s safety, or men’s either for that matter.
…which brings me back to the roots of this. Women’s rights cannot be divorced from human rights and work well. Everybody’s wellbeing has to be considered when making any decision that is going to affect the laws and social climate of a nation/society.
The people with money are going to do whatever they can to keep as much as they have, and cut as many corners as they can. This is an obvious case of there being enough of a psychological crack to slip through, that whoever owned that gym didn’t think security was needed. That’s at least two or three people they didn’t have to pay. Folks are dead and shot up now, but they saved some money. Yay.
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”””””””Marcus,
I’m sorry he was so damaged that gunning down people minding their own business looked like a sensible option to him. But he is the one who did that, he and he alone. There is no justification for such an action. He relinquished his claim on my compassion the moment he gunned down people who never did a thing to him.””””
Yea but if he had just gunned down himself he would just be another statistic unable to earn your angst or compassion.
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MQ AKA betaplug:
I don’t think that’s true factually. See Table 10 in this CDC publication:
de facto celibacy does not necessarily mean virgin.
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The Jezebel twats are slipping….took them all day find this arena of pretty-lies-less discussion and bleat their self-serving, head-in-the-sand noise.
Hey harpies – most of us on this site condemn the violence, view the Sodini affair as an atrocity (not simply as a “tragedy” – the way liberals often describe 9/11 and other premeditated attacks on the U.S.), and reject the caricature of Sodini as some kind of “hero” (Arpagus and a few others notwithstanding).
What we are trying to hash out – if you can fend off the vapors for a moment – is what the Sodini case means in a larger context, and what might’ve lead to a different outcome for Sodini (and his victims) had certain much-discussed-on-this-blog cultural factors (the pernicious effects of uber-feminism to both men and women, misandric divorce laws, gina-tingle as the “true north” of modern women’s mate selection compass, in decreasing stake many “regular and/or beta men have in society as currently constituted, etc., etc., etc.) been other than as there currently are.
That exercise, along with Sodini’s unusually lucid (for a mass murderer) account of his own inner state has had the effect of humanizing this killer. Many on this thread have felt empathy with his frustration, even if they simultaneously place the culpability for the murders squarely in his corner. Many men have felt a (much lesser) degree of the pain and frustration that Sodini details. Few resort to Sodini’s extremes…many more will take out their frustrations in much smaller, less evil ways (as Whiskey had detailed admirably.) We are kicking the implications of this case around, within the larger context of (let’s be honest here) the typical themes of this blog. Which is fine.
Is feminism “to blame” for Sodini? On the last analysis, I’d say no, we are all responsible for our own actions to the extent that biomechanical beings like us can be responsible for our actions. Do the insidious and pervasive effects of feminism and the current shitculture help explain Sodini’s murders in some way? I’d say, guardedly, and with much qualification that I could detail if need be, yes.
There’s a difference between explication and justification, and you jezebel-trolls are simply often too intellectually weak to see it or apply it.
Now, back to your fainting couches!
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Come on now, where are we going to find enough men to provide women with armed escorts every time they step outside?
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Marcus Aureliette: agreed. Society is not simply a herd, it is composed of individuals who are held accountable.
Many men here condemn women for their immoral choices in the sexual marketplace, but if you give the beta shooter loser a pass because society’s made things more difficult for him, then indivdual women should be given a free pass for the behavior that “society” encourages.
If men are being fed nice guy bullshit about what women want, women are also being fed Sex and the City/feminazi bullshit about what they should strive for and how to act, and what they deserve.
It’s one thing to say Soldini is reflective of societal trends (arguable). But to in any way defend his actions, reeks of hypocrisy and a lack of personal integrity.
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”””’Ghost of Nicole
The people with money are going to do whatever they can to keep as much as they have, and cut as many corners as they can. This is an obvious case of there being enough of a psychological crack to slip through, that whoever owned that gym didn’t think security was needed. That’s at least two or three people they didn’t have to pay. Folks are dead and shot up now, but they saved some money. Yay.””””’
Again with the you can’t get money. Hating on rich people lol
Getting money is comparatively easy compared to actually working for a living your whole life.
If you are intelligent you can come up with exact ways to succeed the problem with being a fucking genious is that you can see the whole fucking life played out. You can see entire life fucking streams into the future based upon almost any variable.
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“Xsplat said
I’ve lived in the forest, not masturbating, meditating 5-8 hours a day, for weeks and months on end. It’s amazing, and recommended. But in the city, that doesn’t work for me. I need sex, good sex, and lots of sex.”
Xsplat, sounds like an amazing experience, I wish to someday try and “go all out” with the ascetic experience (for a few months, im not strong enough for a lifetime comitment)
Dont you strongly miss the clarity and inspiration you had in that forest?
You and a-bax have a point in that’s it a helluva lot harder to be an abstainer in todays world. But I dont see it as an all or nothing achievement. What I mean to say is that the strife for celibacy in itself is rewarding, rather than the end-goal. In some ways the rewards, such as calmness and inspiration, also acts counter to the goal since these qualities usualy inspire women to pay more attention to me (but of course my vanity gets a little massage from this).
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speak for yourself
I Love sluts
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Man, that is a lot of comments. I couldn’t go through them all but has anyone noted that, in becoming a killer, had he lived he would probably have had a shower of marriage proposals? As per Roissy previous posts. Maybe then it’s some sort of primal-wired bid to jump from Omega to cold-blooded killer Alpha. But without the surviving bit.
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Welmer asks, “Come on now, where are we going to find enough men to provide women with armed escorts every time they step outside?”
You know it doesn’t take that much, and the improvements would benefit people, not just women.
Armed security in places where there are large gatherings of people is a must. The rest is a matter of just having somebody know where all your female and under 12 family members are at a given time.
When I was a teenager, I told my parents where I was going every time I stepped out the door, and usually took my brother with me if it wasn’t with friends or my boyfriend. That was just how things were done in southern Italy. A girl just didn’t go farther than maybe down the street to the bakery without an escort unless she had to.
When this is normal, an interesting thing happens. My boyfriend and other male friends and acquaintances of mine often share escort duties for each other’s sisters, wives, girlfriends, and moms. Moms a little less because they’re older and wiser…wives slightly less if they are very modest and with children. Sisters and other young and/or just single female relatives are just not allowed to roam freely.
Part of this is to protect them from other men, but part of it is so they don’t start hanging around with slutty girls.
One who didn’t know how these things worked would think that these women would have no chance of meeting guys, but this is not the case. They just have no chance of meeting guys their family doesn’t trust. Quite often, one of her brother or dad’s trusted escorts becomes her husband.
Can you imagine how different say, DA’s life would be if being known as a good guy who wouldn’t rape people’s sisters got him called regularly to escort girls who are not allowed to date or marry any other kind of guy? So long as he was butch enough to give any guy who touched her an attitude adjustment, that would be quite edgy enough.
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Nicole,
I don’t agree that this is a misogynistic society.
Women are far more capable of being cruel to a good man, than men are of being cruel to a good woman.
Most men are instinctively driven to *protect* women. That is the only reason feminism and anti-male divorce laws have gotten as far as they have. The well of goodwill that men have towards women runs deep, and feminists have abused this privilege far too much.
The well is finally drying up with a certain section of men. Sodini will become a martyr for this group. That is unfortunate, but certainly not unexpected.
The American male has set foot on the Moon, defeated multiple evil empires, has invented just about every technology of the modern world, and has built great companies. When he finally figures out what this latest threat to him is doing, the American male will act to change the laws. The threat to him will end rather swiftly, then.
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I wish to someday try and “go all out” with the ascetic experience
My record for celibacy is 12 days. Army activities, zero privacy or time. By day 11, I was borderline insane. Found a PortaJohn though.
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Four words: voluntary reversible chemical castration.
In these socioeconomic circumstances it’s inhumane to force omegas to live with their excess male sexual desire. By dropping out of the sexual market, they would increase the prospects for the remaining men, too.
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Nicole
Your socialistic and nanny state BS proves why women shouldn´t have voting rights
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The PortaJohn release… whoo! out of this world. Futuristic-level vision disturance. Like being gutted and electricuted at the same time. I had to slump against the plastic wall as my legs were bucking out from under me.
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[…] George Sodini is an MRA hero as much a reason to learn game. Finally a mass murderer writes a relatively coherent manifesto. Could be better, but at least it is implied that feminism is to blame and he is taking a last stand. I had been waiting for this (almost thinking I had to do it myself) and I am impressed. Kudos. Women are treated much better than men in America. This is merely the blowback from feminism. […]
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Fifth says, “I don’t agree that this is a misogynistic society.
Women are far more capable of being cruel to a good man, than men are of being cruel to a good woman.”
I’m not a man, so I can only give my perspective as a woman on this. I see the cruelty going both ways, with men being more physical and explicit about it, and women being more emotional and subtle about it.
Men and women also have different priorities, and what a man may interpret as kindness (like screwing a woman he feels is ugly/substandard and then dumping her on that basis), a woman would interpret as cruelty.
“Most men are instinctively driven to *protect* women.”
I don’t think this is an instinct. I think it is a social custom. Again, part of it is a matter of perspective. A guy who beats his daughter for talking to a boy he doesn’t approve of believes he is protecting her. The girl doesn’t feel very protected.
“That is the only reason feminism and anti-male divorce laws have gotten as far as they have. The well of goodwill that men have towards women runs deep, and feminists have abused this privilege far too much.”
I agree that things have gone too far legally in the other direction, but this is also a matter of perspective. What women are being told is that they don’t need the man’s presence as much as they need his money. Men are being told that their money is more important than their presence.
This will affect the income of a man, which is important, but with men having a better chance of remarrying, apparently not the end of the world. To women, it sends a far more damaging message that will screw up her and her kids’ lives in a way that money won’t fix ever.
Not very loving towards women to program them into a lifestyle that will leave them more vulnerable and their kids without a consistent male role model.
“The well is finally drying up with a certain section of men. Sodini will become a martyr for this group. That is unfortunate, but certainly not unexpected.”
True…he’s like a suicide bomber for nerds. Some people will understand the insanity of it, but some will consider him a kind of martyr/hero. I don’t really condemn anyone for their opinion on this, just that it has to be clear that this kind of thing should not happen. If there’s something we can do to prevent it in the future without making things worse, it should be done.
“The American male has set foot on the Moon, defeated multiple evil empires, has invented just about every technology of the modern world, and has built great companies. When he finally figures out what this latest threat to him is doing, the American male will act to change the laws. The threat to him will end rather swiftly, then.”
We can hope…
As it is, it seems to me that the laws and social trends are favoring a kind of surface misandry that comes out in rather misogynistic results. I tend to be kind of results oriented, and I don’t see a whole lot that has actually improved because of feminism except for the bits that gave men and women equal citizenship rights.
The rest seems like trying to solve cultural problems with legal actions. That doesn’t make things better, and really seems to have made things worse. I’ve yet to meet one woman who, 20 years down the road said that court enforced alimony or child support truly improved their lives.
I’ve met plenty who have sung the praises of fathers who, when a marriage failed, stayed active in their children’s lives, and paid voluntary arranged child support, or none at all because they had flexible joint custody. Nobody I know who actually made a fight of it ever feels they got enough, and none of them are happy people. All their kids have serious issues.
The current system seems to be wrecking more women’s lives than men’s, from my perspective. This is why I say it’s misogynist. It’s like the statement is misandrist, but the result is misogynist because you can’t hurt men without hurting women. “Shit rolls downhill.”
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Have you guys noticed a trend in fat women? Some of the ones I have spoken to actually believe they can get alpha cock. They don’t want to hook up with beta men either. This is a troubling development.
LOL’ed.
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I don’t see much in this original post that’s so outrageous. Roissy’s basically saying that if this guy had some intimate human connection he might have been less prone to murder. (It’s not simply sexual release because then masturbation alone would have staved off his craziness. Consensual sex with another person is an entirely different experience that’s comforting and self-affirming on a different level—well, hopefully anyway. If all goes well.)
There’s no way to know if Roissy’s hypothesis is true, obviously. But I don’t see where he says that any woman *owed* the killer sex, or that he deserved it just by virtue of being a man. He actually points out that this guy didn’t have the type of personality that would make him appealing to women (or to anyone, really)–desperation is a turn off and the video confirms that he seems desperate and just somehow “off.” He mentions several times that his guy’s soul/personality/etc. was in a pretty toxic state that wasn’t good for him or others.
What’s sad to me is that what actually could have been an interesting discussion got hijacked by unstable men who want to rant about why women should constantly put out and don’t deserve to vote. There are a lot of lonely men (and women) in America right now, and it has infinitely more to do with the misplaced values and selfishness cultivated by rampant capitalism than it does feminism. But congratulations to the select few commenting here who have managed to make such a terrifying and tragic situation a platform to prove how unhinged they personally are. That’s what the internet is for, after all.
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socially awkward men buy a book by a douchebag to become aggressively socially awkward instead of working out their issues with women and social interaction through proper channels; news at 11.
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Charlotte, do you figure that the feminism and rampant capitalism (rampant lack of ethics and rampant thieving is the actual problem, but I’ll concede that perhaps this is part of the nature of capitalism even though it doesn’t define it) are each occuring in a social vacuum?
Granted, it would be nice if more guys here would make the connection between corporate/state control and the racidal feminist agenda, but I wouldn’t go shaming them for getting part of it right. I’d just explain to them how one serves the other.
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I’d ask how you’re defining the radical feminist agenda, what it consists of according to you. (I haven’t read all 700+ comments, so this may have been something you’ve already outlined.)
If you’re referring to the right for women to vote or not be stay-at-home moms or to choose for themselves who they have sex with (if anyone) then, no, I’m not going to ally that with part of the problem.
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also rather than buying a book or whatever, i think you guys should reflect on the fact that you are unable to view or treat women like human beings and how that relates to your inability to get laid or find connections with women. the animosity and disrespect toward women in these comments is chilling; if you think that women should bear the responsibility of fucking socially awkward/angry men as a safeguard against later being murdered by them, you have some kind of mental illness.
if you improve your attitude toward women and stop blaming them for not wanting to fuck you, and play up the positive aspects of your personality, you will probably be able to date and get laid like a normal person. if you instead decide to ape a douchebag and antagonize women and trick women into fucking you, you will never be happy because you are not being yourself and you are not forming any kind of genuine connection with anyone. i’m saying this for your own good, because the only women who fall for this shit have low self-esteem or emotional problems.
also i urge all of you to just commit suicide instead of killing women. your problems are not our fault.
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Nicole said :
I agree that things have gone too far legally in the other direction, but this is also a matter of perspective. What women are being told is that they don’t need the man’s presence as much as they need his money. Men are being told that their money is more important than their presence.
This will affect the income of a man, which is important, but with men having a better chance of remarrying, apparently not the end of the world. To women, it sends a far more damaging message that will screw up her and her kids’ lives in a way that money won’t fix ever.
Agree. Misandry has a blowback that still hurts average women more. As I keep saying :
Feminists are to average women, what
Terrorists are to average Muslims, and
Rev. Wright/Jesse Jackson are to average blacks.
But these groups have to stand up to their extremists, as the average members of their group are the ones being hurt the most, not the ‘enemy’ (whether men, non-Muslims, or whites in the respective cases). Radical Muslims ended up getting more average Muslims killed and displaced than anyone else.
As it is, it seems to me that the laws and social trends are favoring a kind of surface misandry that comes out in rather misogynistic results. I tend to be kind of results oriented, and I don’t see a whole lot that has actually improved because of feminism except for the bits that gave men and women equal citizenship rights.
So no improvements in the last 89 years, effectively.
The current system seems to be wrecking more women’s lives than men’s, from my perspective. This is why I say it’s misogynist. It’s like the statement is misandrist, but the result is misogynist because you can’t hurt men without hurting women. “Shit rolls downhill.”
Agreed. But the intentions are unrestrained misandry, which is the point. The damage to women that results, is never owned up by feminists.
So why do so few women see this? Women who are mothers, sisters, and daughters should see this.
Even you, as a woman, would get quickly banned from any feminist blog comments section, simply for stating what you wrote above. I am sure you have experienced this. What does that ultimately tell us about the state of affairs?
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Charlotte, I’m okay with feminism up the point of equal citizenship rights…but then that’s not feminism as much as it is egalitarianism.
A woman should have the option of doing whatever she’s capable of with her life/career so long as it doesn’t infringe upon the rights of others.
It’s just that this isn’t how things are legally at this point. Men’s rights aren’t being considered because of an outdated stereotype based on averages and not individuals. People are using the state to do what the family should be doing, and radical feminism as opposed to egalitarianism puts more of what should be social issues into legal hands.
Minimizing the role of fathers actually being a part of their kids’ lives, and demonizing masculinity are part of the radical feminist agenda. They’re extremists, and the minority, but they’re a very loud and scary minority, much like radical Christian fundamentalists.
Their loudness and the impact they’re having on men’s daily lives may justifiably distract them from where the money is going in all this. I try to show them how some of their reaction plays into the hands of people who are not looking out for their interests…sometimes to no avail, but I at least understand where it comes from.
It may seem pathetic on the surface, but one has to consider that the fact that someone recognizes that something wrong is happening to them, as a sign that they are not quite a wuss. Wusses would just keep playing along, believe that they are failures, and some of them would go and shoot the wrong people.
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Hansen
It was an interesting time in my life. Times have changed, and I’ve changed, and I’m no longer so connected to that time to even remember what I’d miss.
Lately I’m more into chi-kung, rather than formless meditation. Sex to me is chi-kung. At it’s best it can be the ultimate form of prayer, and the most intense form of body centered meditation.
I’m sure sex was greatly enhanced from living in the woods, and all those years of focus.
I am not of the opinion that celibacy is overall preferred, as a means to clarity. In some circumstances it is.
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Firepower:
I’m a shiksa, through and through, doesn’t that count for anything?
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xsplat:
I’ve heard some philosophers of sex talk about it as a meditative, and potentially transcendental experience, but why do you specifically use Qi’gong? In what way do you specifically employ it?
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I’m a shiksa
You shouldn’t call yourself that. The word in original Yiddish means “smelling of piss.”
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Nicole,
But feminism is the belief that everyone’s equal—or rather deserves equal rights and protection—not that women are special or better than men. (http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=feminisme)
Of course men and women should have the right to do what they will without it infringing on others. I think you and I agree on that (?) So I’m not sure what you see women regularly doing that infringes on the rights of men and I do mean that sincerely, so if you’re patient enough to give me examples…. I know some men here have complained about men having to pay for expensive weddings or buying women drinks, but those are most definitely not legislated and no man has to do them, just like no woman *has* to be in charge of household cooking or needs to give up her job to raise a child. We might feel compelled to play our socially indicated roles, and resent them while we do it, but they’re still things we take on voluntarily.
I’m getting the impression that what you’re thinking of has something to do with how custody battles play out since you mention fatherhood? If a father loves and wants to be with his children, I don’t know any feminists who would argue that he shouldn’t be able to spend time with them—even if he and the mother are living separately, divorced, not married, etc. Maybe we know different feminists.
What I think of as being radical feminism (wanting to outlaw pornography, prostitution, etc.) is utterly repugnant to me, and very scary since they do influence public policy and hold academic positions and that type of thing. Not good, and not good that they’re trying to tout their positions as feminist.
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Fifth Horseman,
A Jezebel commenter posted this quote from Margaret Atwood : “Men are afraid that women will make fun of them. Women are afraid that men will kill them.”
I think that maybe, just maybe, your claim that women have more control over men than vice versa is ignoring oh…. thousands of years of human history, where men (for the most part) controlled every aspect of a woman’s life from her birth to her death. Things are different now – I get to choose, for instance, to have sex without worrying about having children as a result. There are laws against a man forcing me into sex or any type of relationship. I can choose to marry, to date, or remain single. I can, theoretically, choose whatever career path I like. The Atwood quote points to this still existing imbalance: I can still be raped if someone else chooses to break the law. I can still be physically grabbed in the street and made to feel uncomfortable. I can still get paid 75% of what an equivalent male colleague gets paid, just because I’m a woman. I am not listing these things to insinuate that you have it easy – I’m just pointing out everyday facts that I (and broadly speaking, most women) deal with.
I’m not exactly sure what kind of ‘feminism’ or ‘militant feminism’ people here are talking about when they are trying to place blame for a) their social insecurities, b) lack of sex or c) general frustration with life. Would someone care to enlighten me? Because the last time I checked, feminism was the radical notion that women are human beings and deserve to be treated as such. Basic rights such as voting, education, access to health care and the ability to make basic choices in life regarding love and career matters seem like remarkably easy things to support. I’m wondering how, in the minds of apparently many men, it seems to have caused all of this fuss: why is my freedom ruining your life? I’ve never even met most of you…
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Use of the term “chilling” (as in, “having a chilling effect”, or “I find X chilling”) – another red flag that something self-serving and likely false is to follow.
A good chunk of Roxy’s comments above…bingo! We have (1) “trick women into fucking you”, as if women do not enjoy a well-executed seduction by a man who induces gina-tingle…as if successful application of game is a *trick* that our special snowflakes somehow fall prey to. Hey Roxy et al., do your eye make-up, ass-pants, and tit-glitter somehow *trick* men into wanting to fuck you? Or is it merely your understandable and often effective technique of inducing male arousal?
We also have (2) “be yourself”, and Roxy’s warning that we men never be happy unless we follow her advice her and just “be ourselves”. Hey Roxy, et al., Sodini was just “being himself” for the last 20 years. How’d that work out for him? For the aerobics class girls? How’s it working out for DA and Arpagus? Learning game is like learning any other hard-won skill…it’s difficult precisely because it forces you to step out of your comfort zone, it forces you to squarely face counter-intuitive realities (you mean, women lose respect for men who show too much deference to them? But I thought…)
Roxy, honey, most men you are attracted to likely didn’t get the way they are by simply “being themselves”. A few naturals, perhaps, but not most. Most men that woman find attractive learn one way or another – through trial & error, observation of naturals in the field, or quasi-formally – that what attracts women is often the opposite of what one’s conditioning and instincts likely are.
Read my recent (11:21 AM) comment regarding this Sodini business, and you’ll see that it doesn’t bear much resemblance to your 1st paragraph.
Readers: We now have a phrase (“as a women”) and a term (“chilling”) that can but put in the red-flag bin as in indication of self-serving, likely-false utterances to follow. Let’s keep an eye out for more of these tell-tale give aways.
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PA:
I was using the adaptation of shiksa in the modern lexicon. In a non-derogatory way.
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Charlotte wrote :
But feminism is the belief that everyone’s equal—or rather deserves equal rights and protection—not that women are special or better than men
Not anymore. Feminism today stands for the unashamed exploitation and abuse of men. Women, in America today, have many laws that discriminate in their favor and against men.
What I think of as being radical feminism (wanting to outlaw pornography, prostitution, etc.)
No. Radical feminism is using the courts to extract money from men, to subsidize women, and shield women from having to conduct themselves as adults who are responsible for the choices they make.
Anti-male divorce laws, sexual harassment laws, welfare, and left-wing government stimulus (i.e. take taxes paid by men to create non-value-added jobs for women), are all examples of radical feminism. It really is the same thing as the way blacks had second class status under Jim Crow. Men are the new Southern Blacks.
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@charlotte- too long to encapsulate in a comment. stick around and read, setting aside any quibbles you may occasionally have with specifics, to get the gist of the particular male worldview on display here. or read the devlin article roissy cross-linked to yesterday, “sexual utopia in power” (googlable) for an alternative history of the sexual revolution. wouldn’t expect you to agree with everything, coming from a feminist perspective, btu hopefully it wil make you think and understand some things from a male point of view. good luck and welcome.
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Welmer
I think most people haven’t a good notion of what a sociopath is.
Dr. House is the classic sociopath.
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evemariesaint,
Because the last time I checked, feminism was the radical notion that women are human beings and deserve to be treated as such.
Then the last time you checked was 50 years ago. Get with the times, grandma.
Today, feminism is :
Using the courts to extract money from men, to subsidize women, and shield women from having to conduct themselves as adults who are responsible for the choices they make.
Anti-male divorce laws, sexual harassment laws, welfare, and left-wing government stimulus (i.e. take taxes paid by men to create non-value-added jobs for women), are all examples of radical feminism.
The real examples of good feminism are Todd and Sarah Palin. A woman who got both a great career and a big family, with the full support of her husband. That is why lefto-feminazis hate her so much.
Nicole gets it. Read her recent posts. Sadly, there are far too few women with her level of adult maturity.
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I think this is a superb definition of modern misandric feminism that I have stumbled upon. It deserves a repeat :
Radical feminism is : Using the courts to extract money from men, to subsidize women, and shield women from having to conduct themselves as adults who are responsible for the choices they make.
Anti-male, anti-family divorce laws, sexual harassment laws, single-mother welfare, male-bashing TV shows, and left-wing government stimulus (i.e. take taxes paid by men to create non-value-added jobs for women), are all examples of radical feminism.
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radical feminism is: the revenge of ugly women against happier people
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evemariesaint ignorantly wrote :
I can still get paid 75% of what an equivalent male colleague gets paid, just because I’m a woman.
BULL. FUCKING. SHIT.
Women are NOT underpaid in America. Neither are minorities, by the way. No one with a grasp of free-market entrepreneurship would claim this.
Read Myth #2 here for an utter demolition of that low-IQ feminist lie.
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I think most people haven’t a good notion of what a sociopath is.
Dr. House is the classic sociopath.
As is Barack Obama.
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The Fifth Horseman
So you think that divorce law is inherently anti-male? Howso?? Because of alimony rules or child support rules?? I know plenty of women who’ve been in positions where if they were divorced they would have to pay alimony and half of their pensions. I don’t think this is inherently anti-male (unless, of course, the job market/$$ making system is inherently anti-female and thus sets up a paradigm where women de-facto make less money than the men they’re married to).
What kinds of non-value-added government stimulus jobs are you referring to that are only for women? I see lots of men building roads and bridge infrastructure (which I would never call non-value-added – they’re actually very important) – I believe those are related to government stimulus money?
And I would agree that Sarah Palin’s career absolutely would not have been possible 50 years ago, much like Hilary Clinton’s – I just happen to disagree with Palin’s politics and find her extremely pandering and difficult to understand when she speaks – that’s why I don’t like her very much (hate’s a bit much, though).
Oh, and I’m 28. Not even a mom yet, but thanks for checking!
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radical feminism is: the revenge of ugly women against happier people
Good one. I would retool it to :
Feminism is : The harassment of happy people of both sexes by ugly, immature women and gays.
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Maurice,
Thank you for the invitation. Given some of the comments here, I’m not sure I want to know much more about how some of these men think—if they’re really “thinking” at all. But the Devlin article does sound interesting and I’m so glad that some of you (probably most of you) here are able to have respectful conversations with others. Believe it or not, I’ve been a sex worker for years, so I regularly get a pretty heavy dose of the male view. And I like (most) men a lot. Most of the men I’ve met are good people who want to be happy and make others happy—and they don’t spend much time complaining about what a bad rap they’re getting or ranting about how feminism ruined their lives. Maybe that’s just because we have better ways to spend our time together. Or maybe I’m just great at choosing clients.
Fifth Horseman,
Your comment re:Sarah Palin is wrong. There are plenty of successful female politicians who feminists embrace (Clinton, Pelossi, Olympia Snowe, Barbara Mikulski) because of their political views—or don’t. Lots of feminists supported Obama over Clinton because they were unhappy with Clinton’s politics. There are numerous valid complaints of Sarah Palin, like her instance on abstinence-only education, her hostility to science, and her extremely inadequate knowledge of important international and national subjects. I’ve never heard any woman complain about the fact that she’s married.
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Oh, and I’m 28. Not even a mom yet
Any prospects on the horison?
IVFs and IUIs are expensive and negative readings on home pregnancy kits are heartbreaking.
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Evemariesaint,
Let’s start with your biggest bullshit of all :
That women are only paid 75% of men.
To this, I ask you to answer this question :
Why don’t women start their own companies, and hire only women, and thus totally outcompete male sexist companies on cost advantage?
and another question/statement :
Has it occured to you that a female schoolteacher only works 9 months out of the year, vs. a male engineer who works 12? That is where the 75% number comes from, BTW. Per month and per hour, they make the same.
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Chi-kung is merely focusing attention onto kinesthetic awareness, in very specific ways. Just as a piano player builds up neural circuits of well played habits, the chi-kung meditator learns to call up grand kinesthetic visions. Some of the sensations can be very, or even extremely intense.
For instance any good sex forces very strong yelling. Sex without yelling is tepid. And it’s the same for any woman I’m with. If you are able to control your voicebox, you are not being properly fucked.
One good thing about chi-kung is it allows for many facets of personality to be fused with body centered feelings, and moved into sequentially, and eventually in harmonies, and at times all at once. It’s possible to feel sex mostly from the heart, or above the head, or even below the feet. The voice will rise or fall in pitch, depending on where you put your power. The belly of course yields a low grunt.
What sound do you imagine placing attention in the heart would bring? In the forehead?
Below the feet is a tricky maneuver – it means being able to be very grounded, while at the same time very intense. Like your sitting on top of an bottomless volcano, with no fear of it exploding.
And on and on.
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HANSEN
where can you find instruction on proper sexual transmutation on the net? The few sites that talk about it in english are either too esoteric yogic sites or shallow info ad sites. Napoleon Hill spoke about sexual transmutation for men in order to accomplish but he did it in the context of working for your wife and loved ones. He assumed the man was married (its in one of his books I cannot remember which).
thanks
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That actually sounds incredible. I’ve heard a bit about it (sex as meditation), but my traditional perception and practise of meditation involves very intense focus on nothingness, not on intensifying physical experience. Which is usually meditation’s target, no? I’m sure you have the quite the roster of lucky ladies.
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I just saw his YouTube videos. Gee, guys, I must have been wrong. I can see that this dude should have been getting some EVERY NIGHT. Didn’t you see the matching sofa and armchair? How about the speaker endtables? I hear those make panties melt. And not to mention the incoherent ranting! Women love that.
The guy was obviously a psychopath, and so are a frightening number of you morons who’ve turned him into your hero. The guy had no friends for 30 years and no sex for 18 and you idiots identify with him? He was almost 50 and he was chasing women as old as his own child. He shot 13 women. If you sympthatize with this asshole, your life is totally worthless.
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@charlotte- sex worker, eh? i predict you’ll be uncannily popular here if you stick around. however, devlin is an older conservative type, so his style and assumptions about some things may strike you as old fashioned. but bear that out to get a gist of the whole worldview.
you get all types on this site: a small bit of genuine crazy, some anger, some misogyny, to be sure, a fair amount of sex talk (some real, much fake) but also a great deal of really thoughtful smart folks writing about the issues of the day that pertain to the theme. i find it best to ignore the bad stuff and stay for the good.
and i encourage new and reasonable female commenters when they appear, not out of ass-kissing or white-knighting, but because the female views typically (not always) make the board more interesting (“sausage boards suck”).
how did you find this blog, btw?
@evamariesaint: well, there was that time you had sex with Cary Grant on a train, and then he saved you from falling off Mount Rushmore. so you *have* to be at least a little bit drawn to alpha males, hmm…?
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Marcus cuntrag
Do you honestly believe that is what I do?
Or do you just “believe” whatever is convenient to your emotions.
Seems to me your brain is broke.
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“I just saw his YouTube videos. Gee, guys, I must have been wrong. I can see that this dude should have been getting some EVERY NIGHT. Didn’t you see the matching sofa and armchair? How about the speaker endtables? I hear those make panties melt. And not to mention the incoherent ranting! Women love that.
The guy was obviously a psychopath, and so are a frightening number of you morons who’ve turned him into your hero. The guy had no friends for 30 years and no sex for 18 and you idiots identify with him? He was almost 50 and he was chasing women as old as his own child. He shot 13 women. If you sympthatize with this asshole, your life is totally worthless.”
To quote the legendary Whiskey,”women HATE HATE HATE betas.”
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Bob, this is why I find “liberals” grating.
Wouldn’t *lack* of sympathy for someone who went off the deep end make someone more worthless than someone who at least tries to see the guy’s despair?
If a fat chick burst into a school gym and sprayed a bunch of jocks and cheerleaders, what do you suppose the reaction would be?
On women’s boards, it would be remarkably similar to what you see here.
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By the way,what was the title of that Houellbeqc (I know I spelled that wrong) novel about the AFC who popped the white girl with the black boyfriend?
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great. my bubby wants to meet you now. why do i always attract the goyimette stalkers. tramp
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“If a fat chick burst into a school gym and sprayed a bunch of jocks and cheerleaders, what do you suppose the reaction would be?”
What was the (female) reaction to Jamie England?Lorena Bobbit?
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What was the (female) reaction to Jamie England?Lorena Bobbit?
I saw a bumper sticker in 1993 that said “Lorena Bobitt for Surgeon General.”
The Houellebecq novel: “Whatever” (American title)
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Welmer
Being a raving iconoclast (like Pewee I’m a rebel and a loner), I’d never considered that.
But that makes sense. Natural born followers in desparation will follow. Hmmm. How can I exploit that knowledge?
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On women’s boards, it would be remarkably similar to what you see here.
No, the feminist boards would be much worse.
No man here is saying that the victims deserved it.
They are merely saying that feminism is driving men, who otherwise were harmless, into such extreme behavior, AND that many good women will suffer.
The feminists would be indiscriminate in their cheering of the death of any and all men.
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Ovid
By the way,what was the title of that Houellbeqc (I know I spelled that wrong) novel about the AFC who popped the white girl with the black boyfriend?
Extension of the Domain of Struggle or Whatever
In Houellebecq’s first novel, Extension of the Domain of Struggle (1994, translated in America as Whatever), he intimated that sex in contemporary times has become a second system of social differentiation. It resembles wealth but has still more disastrous consequences of stratification.
For Houellebecq, sexual liberation led to an absolute sexual pauperization for the mass of average people-who are neither unusually alluring nor socially adept, and who stay home alone in their misery.
By the same processes, ridiculous sexual prestige, pretension, and license came to an arbitrary few.
Liberation was neoliberal, transferring the market economy into the private sphere, whose humane character previously had been protected by institutions of family that had only been seen as repressive.
“[S]exual liberalism,” he wrote, “is the extension of the domain of struggle, its extension to all stages of life and all classes of society.”
In The Elementary Particles, his second novel, Houellebecq traced the origins of the collusion between liberation and market forces to the hippies and liberals of the 1960s. (He also fantasized, with characteristic extravagance, that genetic engineering could be used to eradicate the two sexes, allowing civilized happiness to blossom once human beings were superseded.)
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S
Ya, it’s not formless meditation. Closer to kundalini or prana based practices. As far as I can tell, there are not exact real energy channels in us, but there are general sensations that are subtle and common, and sensations can be grown. For instance it’s common for people to feel a rush of energy up the spine, to feel love in the chest, to wrinkle their forehead when thinking. And it’s also possible to create sensations of energy going down the front of the body, merely by placing attention in a step wise fashion in certain areas, many times and over years. You create a kinesthetic part of your body, by force of habit and awareness. That’s what neurons do – they hook up and make stuff. So chi-kung has hundreds of different schools, all making slightly different channels. And other energy-sensitive yogas will vary also. Sometimes people throw in colors into their synesthesic meditations.
But as you say, all of that is not about vipassana. But heighten any experience enough and you are going to feel a whole lot of nowness.
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take taxes paid by men to create non-value-added jobs for women
Wait, you mean that as a woman, I don’t have to pay taxes? Cool! Why didn’t anyone ever tell me?
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Firepower, I’m saving up for a Jewish Rosary in the hopes that it will land me a nice Jewish boy.
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http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/fiori3.html
Good essay,except for the closing paragraph.
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And thanks;Willard,PA.
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Maurice,
I found this site through a blog that linked to Jezebel—but I’d like to specify that I’m definitely not one of their regular readers. Way too much girl-on-girl crime there for my tastes, among other problems. Anyway, really, thanks for the welcome.
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It’s clear this guy was making a statement. I doubt anyone here cares, but the way to stop massacres like this: the media should give (prominent?) coverage to suicides. That way the Sodinis of the world can get the attention they need w/o swisscheesing anyone else.
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””””Even you, as a woman, would get quickly banned from any feminist blog comments section, simply for stating what you wrote above. I am sure you have experienced this. What does that ultimately tell us about the state of affairs?”””””””
Boo yaaa!!!
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I have to admit I’m confused about how you guys think feminism is responsible for making women less available for casual sex.
Of course, it doesn’t help that ‘feminism’ is a nonsense term these days which is held by people with completely opposing views. Some people would say Palin is feminist, some people would say she’s anti-feminist. Some feminists think all porn is rape, some think there should be free porn in schools. People mean such different things, it’s not really worth using the word in a discussion.
You could argue that giving women the right to say ‘no’ makes them less interested in sleeping with you, but I don’t think that’s your argument, because you seem to be saying that women are more slutty… and yet having sex with fewer men. I’m confused about how that works. Care to explain?
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”””””Slaa
It’s clear this guy was making a statement. I doubt anyone here cares, but the way to stop massacres like this: the media should give (prominent?) coverage to suicides. That way the Sodinis of the world can get the attention they need w/o swisscheesing anyone else.”””””””””
Hell Yea men and woman should both be encouraged to commit suicide and also be assisted in the act by the government. So that no one is unhappy one the planet and we can actually be a progressive society.
Gonna flunk out of school and just don’t feel like it anymore. Go to your local suicide center.
Think life is boring go to your local suicide center.
Had a bad day go to your local suicide center.
Someone asking you to pay child support you don’t want to pay go to the local suicide center.
This is gonna really help out with keeping people who want to be on planet.
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http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/fiori1.html
http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig/fiori2.html
A couple more.
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Emmy it really doesn’t matter about the woman so much as it matters about divorce laws.
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Oh – I should clarify – I don’t think we create actual nerve channels in the body. More likely most of the connections are in the brain, and include connections to existing nerves in the body. When we dream, we feel our bodies after all. And I’m told most of what we feel when we interpret our sensations is mostly going on upstairs. So if I’m feeling energy below my feet, I have the option to believe in real energy, or to just say “whatever, it’s likely all in my head”. But either way, it’s a huge practical benefit, because that sensation correlates with certain physiological and emotional states, and it’s handy to tune into and control that.
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and all the other laws that give woman superpowers so that when they say they are empowered they think they are empowered but really it is only because of some man backing them up. Really empowered woman are the ones with no laws doing shit for them making them unequal in the extreme from what they opriginally where.
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It was never about the women.
George Sodini was an unimportant man – a “nobody” – who wanted to go out in a blaze of glory to earn the admiration of his peers – ie. men.
Mission accomplished?
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”””””’Emmy
take taxes paid by men to create non-value-added jobs for women
Wait, you mean that as a woman, I don’t have to pay taxes? Cool! Why didn’t anyone ever tell me?””””””””
No emmy what he is saying is the jobs men do. Like I work in iraq and the jobs where people do the work are outside in 130 degree whether. Well there are no females electricians, plumbers, carpenters, hvac technicians, mechanics, or anything else where you have to work in the heat. Now females are doing the jobs where you work inside of air conditioned offices. Now we could just have the work the the men do go automatically to a computer that automatically totals everything and orders parts and such. The thing is we need to have jobs for minorities and woman so yea jobs are created so that minorities can do something. If all the office jobs went away the jobs that needed to get done would still get done.
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@emmy- well, for the second time today, i’ll recommend the devlin article “sexual utopia in power” (.pdf available via google). it’s by an older social conservative, so the style and some of the assumptions will come off as dated. it’s a long read, but one full of good insights, especially into the male point of view, and contains a very clear answer to your question.
welcome to you as well.
@charlotte- i occasionally read “gawker” which contains jezebel in its family of blogs. usually funny, but too much unconstructive snark to be on my regular daily read.
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… What do divorce laws have to do with anything?
You’re making me even more confused.
How does the argument that women having MORE sex means men get LESS sex make any sense?
Unless the women are all turning lesbian. Which I suppose is possible.
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a co-hosting invite for The View
followed by lots and lots of donuts
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In fact the base I am at now has the shitiest conditions I have seen so far. We have no px we are in the middle of a town so if we get attacked people are gonna die. There are no amenities. This may surprize you but my company does not allow females to work at this camp because it is so shitty. This is standard procedure for the shitiest camps. So all that talk about equal pay kind of goes out window doesn’t it.
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Oh yea and equal pay for equal work and where are the qoutas for woman to work out in the heat. Where is the equal work that woman are doing. Working out in hot sun fixing shit and making a difference vs sitting on ass in office playing with numbers or the bosses dick.
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Like I work in iraq and the jobs where people do the work are outside in 130 degree whether. Well there are no females electricians, plumbers, carpenters, hvac technicians, mechanics, or anything else where you have to work in the heat. Now females are doing the jobs where you work inside of air conditioned offices.
It’s probably true that there are no female americans working in the heat in Iraq… I expect they’re all too scared to go over there where they think they’ll get shot!
There are women who do those jobs in other countries, though. And there are men who work in offices. Probably more men working in offices than women who work as hvac technicians, I don’t know.
Taxes (and insurance) are always about taking money away from one person and giving it to another. Very rarely the money you give comes directly back to you. If the system is working well, the money sort of comes back to you indirectly. If the system is working badly, some fat cat at the top steals it all!
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It’s interesting to me, from reading a spattering of comments, how many people here think men bear no culpability for an inability to get sex and maintain relationships. It’s almost ironic, considering what this website is about.
I ran into the creepiest guy I knew in high school a while back, and he introduced me to his fiance. This guy is unattractive; he works at a dead-end job; and he’s still incredibly socially inept and uncomfortably weird. Yet he’s managed to find a woman who loves him, and he’s getting laid on a regular basis. I wonder why that is? I wonder why he was able to find someone, and this guy couldn’t even make a friend in 30 years (that should really have stopped anyone here from exalting him as a hero. Something was wrong with this guy, something that goes way beyond sexual frustration)?
Well, here’s what I think. My Creepy Acquaintance has never really thought poorly of himself. When he tries to do something, he believes there’s a decent likelihood that he’ll accomplish his objective. If he wants to meet or talk to someone, he’ll approach them. If that person ignores him or ultimately stops talking to him, he just goes and finds someone else to talk to.
Sodini, on the other hand? Well, he hated himself. He believed he was destined to failure in all that he did. He wouldn’t approach women he was interested in. He thought everyone was out to get him. And, well, that’s not attractive — to anyone (which goes a long way in explaining why he also didn’t have friends). I definitely don’t like women who have no confidence in themselves and project self-loathing and misery, do you? Hell, I get away from them as quickly as possible, because they’re pretty damn annoying and emotionally draining. I wouldn’t expect them to like a guy who was like that.
The lesson men should take from Sodini is two-fold: first, if you hate yourself and think you’re always gonna fail and that everyone dislikes you, then you’re setting up a pretty rotten self-fulfilling prophecy. You have to at least be able to pretend to like yourself if you want anyone else to like you. Second, if you really ARE disliked by everyone (e.g. you not only never get laid, BUT YOU HAVE NO FRIENDS), then the problem just might be with you, and not with the Big Bad World.
Start by trying to fix yourself, not by blaming everyone else for your problems.
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haha i like the assertion that feminists are the ones who are ugly or angry or bitter- from a community of men who need help getting laid from a book and blame women for their problems, some of whom are trying to blame women for one of MANY instances of men attacking or killing women because of his misplaced anger toward women.
i will tell you for real why you aren’t getting laid- it has nothing to do with this silly “game”- it is because you are living on another fucking planet where “misandry” exists and women have magical powers. i urge all of you to try to seek therapy, and after that, go out and do things you like to do. don’t go to a bar and try to insult a woman into fucking you. go live your life and enjoy your life and introduce yourself to people and become a happy person. i guarantee you 100% that if you actually liked yourself, had a good attitude toward women, and viewed women as equals and partners and friends and not objects to be gotten, women would want to hang out with you and do a bunch of cool stuff to your dick.
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”””””””There are women who do those jobs in other countries, though. And there are men who work in offices. Probably more men working in offices than women who work as hvac technicians, I don’t know.”””””””’
Exactly you don’t know what your talking about and yet your making statements like ””””””””There are women who do those jobs in other countries, though.””””””””””
””””””””’Emmy
You’re making me even more confused.”””””””
I would imagine you are almost always confused having to live a the lie of being empowered.
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”””””roxy,
women have magical powers””””””’
Not magical. State sanctioned power backed up by men with guns and judges. Men only wish this where a magic dream but men going to prison for losing jobs and not paying child support is the reality in america after the year 2000 for gods sake. Really unbelievable but happening anyway.
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Emmy:
You’re making me even more confused.
How does the argument that women having MORE sex means men get LESS sex make any sense?
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well, it looks like there are more than a few jezebelers showing up and commenting today.
@roxy- your tone is a little unbalanced and angry, and your facts are mainly wrong. but even with that, you appear to be attempting to give the men here good advice, as opposed to simply insulting/flaming. (well, there’s quite a bit of insulting in there.) kudos to you for that, in spirit at least.
there’s quite a bit more to game than initially meets the eye, and there’s quite a bit more to this blog than pickup. stick around, read for a bit to get the feel of things, discount or ignore the intemperate stuff, and then see if you think there’s no such thing as “misandry” or if pickup actually is equivalent to “insult(ing) a woman into fucking”.
no welcome for you yet, until you can sort out all that anger. here’s hoping.
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gregi, i read a little of your blog and you sound like a nutcase, so i feel awkward addressing you. please back this up with some evidence. not one article, but actual statistics from a reputable source. men and women who pay child support are subject to the same laws. this is also a sort of shallow straw-man argument to support your claim- women don’t have magical powers. 1 in 6 women will be raped or sexually assaulted in her life, and over 90% of the perpetrators are men. women make (as recently as studies from 2007 show) about 69% as much as men with equivalent experience and education. i could go on and on, but your blog sounds a little sordoni-y and i’m sure you think that all of the reputable research supporting this is a figment of the “liberal media’s” imagination and that you really can’t get laid cause women r so mean n powerful.
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LR wrote :
In all seriousness, though I think a lot of men don’t realize that A LOT of women don’t even necessarily WANT the things that Feminists lobby for.
So stand up to them, and fight back.
You will pay the consequences of the backlash that they are courting. Prevent this.
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Yeah R, it’s totes the hoez and feminazis fault that a CRIMINALLY INSANE MISOGYNIST never got laid and it fucked him up so much he had to shoot a bunch of women to death. If only he had learned ‘game’ women would have been all over him. If only women were sex slaves like the good ol’ days he could have fucked a warm hole whenever and been totally happy, nope, wouldn’t have needed to kill people.
Newsflash: usually women don’t like to date or fuck crazy assholes with a creepy vibe, BECAUSE THEY KILL US. Or treat us like objects rather than people (whether that entails calling us hoes or putting us on a pedestal), or otherwise suck to be in relationships with. Just by existing a man doesn’t have a ‘right’ to sex from attractive young women. Yeah, I know, life is hard. Waaaah.
Also: Do you idiots honestly believe that the feminist movement in America has caused some kind of deficit in hot sex from hot women for the menz? I mean, this is so illogical it’s breathtaking. Women are having casual sex these days like never before! It’s a whole new world of opportunity compared to only 30 years ago! All because of feminism and the sexual revolution! Please, one of you jackasses upthread explain how you have reached this conclusion. Honestly, I am curious. Is it because women think they are people now, instead of understanding their true role as walking vaginas who exist only to fulfill every aspect of every random guy’s sexual desires?
Here are some facts most of you don’t seem to understand:
1.Most women in the world aren’t young or hot.
2.The ones that are tend to get together with young hot men who have natural charm, or other men with a lot to offer, whether that’s personality, money, whatever.
3.If you are older, not conventionally attractive, not rich, socially awkward, boring, or crazy – you have a smaller chance of ‘banging hot chicks’.
4. That’s fucking okay! You can still have great sex, loving relationships, and a great life. Work on yourself first and becoming a fulfilled and kind person, even if that means you aren’t having sex yet. Don’t be fucking shallow and expect every women to look like she stepped out of Maxim, treat women like people, be honest with them, and go to therapy.
5. Don’t listen to R -unless you want an empty and morally bankrupt life and an inability to connect with women on any level deeper than sex with strangers. If you do want that, I consider you a psychopath but to each their own.
[editor: game can strengthen long term relationships just as well as it can help a man have lots of sex with strangers.]
You all are so concerned with what it means to be ‘alpha’ or a real man. Let me tell you – it means accepting responsibility for your own actions and life and not blaming other people for your problems. There’s a way to fucking overcome anything – cocaine addiction, mental illness, a history of abusive relationships (yeah, women cheating on you and fucking with your head is abusive – but you chose those women – why?). It takes dedication, lots of hard work, admitting you need help and getting it (therapy and anti-depressants are a start), and willingness to change and grow. This isn’t the place to help you though.
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Men pay about 80% of all income taxes. This is because taxes are skewed against high-earners, who happen to be men (and not because of sexism, but rather hard work).
Most tax payers are men.
Most tax eaters are lower-income women.
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Emmy said
“How does the argument that women having MORE sex means men get LESS sex make any sense?”
The argument really is that “the average woman having more sex means that the average man gets less sex.” The reason for this is women only want to have sex with the best man they can get, while most men will fuck anything average and up. That means the top 10-20% of men fuck the top 60% of women, and the rest of the men have to pick through the leftovers. Women are blind to this reality because they assume that the world treats men and women the same and it does not and never has.
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maurice, can you understand why women might be angry reading a blog of a bunch of unbalanced men accusing women of being at fault for their own murder because some psycho couldn’t get laid?
i am actually trying to offer advice- i’ve poked around this site and haven’t been able to stop laughing, imagining dudes sitting down with a notepad trying to figure out if they are responding to too many text messages, or feverishly lifting weights to try to suppress genuine feelings they have for women so they don’t seem like a wuss. it is so out there and hilarious, but it also makes me sad because it perpetuates the idea that women are simplistic vaginas waiting for men to treat them wrong in the right way.
you know all the stuff you’re into? movies, writing, music, even sports? there are women who like that stuff too. and you could like… find women who like that stuff, and hang out with them, and be happy being friends with them if nothing romantic develops. and then you can find other women who like the stuff you like, and hang out with them, and value them as people and have a good time and laugh and eat food and stuff, and then eventually you will probably fall in love with someone and have your feelings returned. you are not guaranteed love and sex as a right, and it isn’t something you deserve, so why not enjoy yourself forming human connections with other people instead of making sure you follow some ugly nerd’s “rules” for fucking women while you write angry misogynistic blog posts all day.
it is not true that women want to date assholes, but women also don’t want to date “nice guys”- and by that i don’t mean a guy who is nice, i mean a guy who is obviously being nice to you because he wants to fuck you, which is what most of the “nice guys” who are posting here are actually doing.
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CC:
I’ve already said (twice) that women do this, not explicitly but by referring to what whiskey always says i.e. thugs are loved.
It seems that you’re going one step further and saying that if he did appear dangerous in any way, he would not have had a problem getting laid.
What can’t be denied is that in this instance, it was a mistake.
The smart choices (looking retrospectively rather than evaluating on whatever superficial criteria available at the time of his being alive): — not being involved with him. — staying with him for all time.
Is ‘she should’ve stayed with him’ valid? Maybe she wouldn’t have given him sex in the LTR anyway, and he would’ve exploded and shot everyone up because he has a kid to manage on top of it e.g. those instances of Dads killing both themselves and their children. Do we know? No. Am I interested in a deep psychological analysis of this man and whether he was flawed? No.
His importance lies in the wider issues.
Agree. I’m very human.
Although I do wonder what makes a person human. You and Lucifer can enjoy your position of amoral (superSMRT???) superiority. I’d rather appear emotional than be like yourself.
Still: Practically, hm? Is there hope?
The Fifth Horseman, i think you are living on another planet if you think that high earners “happen” to be men and that sexism doesn’t exist or play a part in it. i really truly think that you’d benefit from opening your mind to the thought that sexism may exist rather than feeling sorry for yourself. awwww, poor men. life is so hard because they can’t get laid by virtue of existing ! women r so meannnnnn.
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The level of self-pity on this blog is astronomical. Isn’t that the definition of a ‘beta’ for you guys – sitting around feeling so sorry for yourselves, how hard life is, and how mean and powerful women are that you’re effectively paralyzed?
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Someone:
“For every nerdy, smelly, fat, or otherwise socially undesirable man out there, there is an equally unattractive woman walking around.”
Bhetti:
“In most systems it makes sense for these people not to reproduce.”
In which systems?
The military has taken me all over the world and everywhere I saw nerdy, smelly, fat and otherwise socially undesirable folk breeding.
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The Fifth Horseman, i think you are living on another planet if you think that high earners “happen” to be men and that sexism doesn’t exist or play a part in it.
I live on Earth. You clearly do not. And I get laid with women who have faaaaar more beauty than anyone you know.
Women do NOT earn less than men. Only someone totally ignorant of Econ 101 would believe such stupidity.
That BS is thoroughly debunked in Myth #2 of this brilliant article.
Three women work for me at the corporation I work for. When I hired them, they were paid exactly what male candidates for the same job were paid. They are good employees (all of them are Asian, which is part of what makes them good employees).
Then again, real world facts are inconvenient for lefto-feminists.
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roxy,
I will pose the same question to you that scared off evamariesaint :
Why don’t women start their own companies, and hire only women, and thus totally outcompete male sexist companies on cost advantage?
So what is your answer?
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roxy, come over and Detoxy my Buttoxy.
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@PA
Thanks for being so concerned for my fertility, but I’m not worried. With a long-term partner at the moment, and when he and I are ready (another couple years… maybe three), we’ll have kids. We just have other stuff we want to do at the moment (career-wise).
@maurice awww, so glad someone recognized the reference! I just look like her, I’m not her. But she was definitely in some damn fine movies (my fav is ‘On the Waterfront’). I’m not sure if I would consider my partner an alpha – to be honest, the terms and how they’re used here really confuse me. I know many men who have elements of both within them. If I had to say what attracted me to my guy the most, though, I’d say it was his thoughtfulness and his passion for what he does. In some ways those are alpha characteristics, but I can definitely see how some here could construe them as beta as well.
@The Fifth Horseman
Oh look! We’re both wrong: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/29/AR2007072900827.html So now it’s more like 77.8%, but when adjusted for same-job-description/same-education variables (so this precludes your school teacher analysis), we’re looking at 11%. Slightly disturbing, perhaps, is the 2007 analysis of women’s earnings in the finance sector:
“The wage gap between women and men cuts across a wide spectrum of occupations. The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that in 2007 female financial advisors earned 53.7% of the median weekly wages of male financial advisors, and women in sales occupations earned just 64.8% of men’s wages in equivalent positions.” (that’s from http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763170.html)
[editor: you are an idiot. the “wage gap” shibboleth is misleading because it does not control for the fact that women are more likely to pursue careers in lower paying “soft” fields like nursing as opposed to cardiology. there will always be a wage gap as long as women by their natures choose these caring professions over more lucrative jobs and strive less ambitiously than men for the top positions in their fields.]
Of course median weekly wage probably doesn’t take into account maternity leave, but I’m not quite sure that would make up for the 46% gap.
At any rate, the gap is closing all around, when compared with the 70s and 80s, which is nice to know.
And just so you know, I am, genuinely, trying to figure out where the hell we’re going from here, because I find these arguments intriguing. The theory I’m examining here isn’t pretty, and it goes something like this:
Corporate and conservative interests (I know, guys, bend your minds around that – not feminist interests…. conservative ones) have, for many many years used women and racial minorities as straw men for white men (in particular, white working class men) to vent their anger at. They use these particular issues to draw attention away from the fact that a very small class of people (definitely more diverse right now than it ever has been, but still mostly rich white men) control the vast majority of resources in this country. They utilize media and political tools to drum up anger/action for particular issues like gun control, abortion, affirmative action, etc., so we can collectively be distracted from issues like our economy, health care, education, infrastructure, etc. They do this because if they can stir up enough attention and response, they divert our attention away from the fact that they’re actually buying and selling our government from under our noses.
I know. It’s a bit big, and a bit conspiracy theorish for me – I don’t always buy it. But lately I’m wondering something inside – if we all, really truly, actually agree more with each other than disagree. And if we take out the anger, disrespect, and hate from the way we speak to one another, we actually might find that a true political voice in a real democracy are all we really need.
I don’t mean to take away from the personal struggle that a lot of self described ‘beta-males’ obviously face. I absolutely believe that the suffering described here is real. I don’t believe that women collectively, or any racial minorities collectively are to blame, though. And I think the best way to get through this would be to assign a certain amount of respect and dignity to all of humanity – not to take it away from groups and scapegoat them. I’ve suffered from loneliness and serious depression through some of my life, but I’ve never ever thought to blame an entire group of people for it – I’ve only searched for ways to personally overcome it. Does anyone else think that this might be the ticket here?
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@bonnie, another evident jezebel flamer: please review my earlier comment to roxy above. there’s more here than meets the eye, and there are some sacred cows that are ritually offed here all the time. if your mind is open to points of view outside feminist orthodoxy, stick around and read for a bit. with better reading comprehension that you have shown thus far. ex.: the majority of commenters *condemned* the actions of sodini in the first thread about him. a few did not, and tried to justify/understand/explain him. it may be unpalatable for you to have any empathy at all for a murderer, for a male outcast, to try to understand how he thought and felt, and to point to some of the social forces at work that shaped him into what he became. i don’t excuse his actions, but i understand the discussion.
game is more than as you described. women don’t always understand or acknowledge their own attraction buttons. if that were the case, then all the average “nice guys” you referred to would be paired up with equally nice girls, but they’re not. it’s perfectly OK for a man to want to improve his chances with women by improving himelf, getting in touch with his own better/”alpha” side, as much as it is for women to do so correspondingly by dolling/tarting themselves up when they go out on the town. don’t mock or judge until you fully understand.
@roxy- first, thanks for the improvement in tone. but you still don’t get the blog. you may never be able to make that mental leap, to understand a certain male point of view with a degree of empathy. if so, fine. feminist blogs ooze hatred of men, and there’s a fair amount of misogyny here as well. part of the territory, unfortunately, if all is fair (or unfair) in love and war, the sexes trying to figure each other out.
most of the regular commenters here are quite different than what you described – losers obsessing about texting or working out. i don’t know even which thread you’d be talking about. the level of comments here (discounting the intemperate stuff) is quite high, and if you stick around you may learn what our worldview is all about, where it comes from and what goes into it, even if you disagree with lots of it.
and you still don’t get game. men want to have sex, not hang out at the movies with platonic female friends. women want sex too, but habitually give men bad advice on what will actually make them interested (ex.: what you wrote). sex is a big part of happiness in life, and it’s perfectly natural for people to seek it out.
as i write, i know i’m on a fool’s errand. i’m not going to get any jezebelers to convert to roissyism, like saul on the road to damascus. i guess i’m just urging you to be reasonable, have an open mind, and consider the possibiliy that some of the consequences of feminism have been bad for men and womn both. we all learn best when we stretch our minds the most.
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“This may surprize you but my company does not allow females to work at this camp because it is so shitty.”
OK…you do realize feminists are trying to change shit like this, right? That they want to be allowed to work anywhere that males can?
Another thing feminists hate, that many MRAs ironically blame them for, is the portrayal of men as dumb oafs in the media. You have people like Seth Rogen and Judd Apatow to thank for that, and if you want it to stop, you need to talk to a feminist and see if she or he has any constructive solutions to this problem.
As for divorce/alimony laws, the idea that men are good for money and women need to stay with the child? Shocker: not invented by feminists! It’s actually a long-held patriarchal idea! I know, crazy, right?
[editor: working women leads to a more polygamous sexual market because they have a smaller pool of higher status men from which to choose mates, and because a man’s provisioning no longer serves as an effective sexual status signaler, thus ensuring that the flashiest (read: PUAs) alpha males horde the quality pussy. please stop spouting your fembot platitudes here. my readership is smarter than you know.]
I am so sick and tired of seeing MRAs blame feminists for things that feminists are actually fighting against.
And the people who claim to identify with the shooter? There are no words for how sick you people are.
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Roxy,Bonnie:
Mulier speciosa templum est aedificatum super cloacam.
Look it up,cunts.
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”””K
OK…you do realize feminists are trying to change shit like this, right? That they want to be allowed to work anywhere that males can? ”””””
Do any of your feminist friends work as carpenters, electricians, mechanics, generator mechanics, or hvac techs and we are not talking about they took a class and worked a year then where moved to another job. Talking worked it for 5 years at least?
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horseman, nothing was actually debunked in that “article”? what you linked is blog post with a dude’s unsubstantiated opinion (one who glibly boasts that abraham lincoln was a republican, completely ignoring significant party realignments that have happened which would render the current republican party near unrecognizable to him and several other complete logical fallacies). do you want to see some studies about the gender gap? you can do a quick google search and find reports from the census bureau, AFL-CIO, US department of commerce, department of labor, several independent research firms, and several major news outlets. simply saying that something is true does not make it true.
as for why women don’t start companies and hire only women- not sure how to address this completely asinine question? women do “start companies” but it is illegal to hire based on gender alone, so that is probably the reason that these hypothetical companies would not hypothetically hire only women. if you are willing to start this conversation ignoring hundreds of years of history i have no idea how we can even actually communicate with each other.
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QUESTION FOR WHISKEY BELOW
Ryder wrote:
<<>>
I’d be interested to hear Whiskey’s reaction to this. Unless I misinterpret him, Whiskey’s message has been that the cohort of “guys-who-are-locked-out-of-sex” is enormous. The majority of adult males, actually.
Ryder, it seems, argues that while his long-term odds of satisfaction are awful, things are not so grim for the man who just wants to get laid every now and then.
Whiskey’s critics tend to accuse him of being too negative. While Ryder doesn’t criticize Whiskey (on the contrary) it does still seem that Ryder thinks things aren’t as bad for the man who just wants some trim as Whiskey makes them out to be.
What say you, Whiskey?
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” And I get laid with women who have faaaaar more beauty than anyone you know. ”
Who are you having sex with? Exclusively Victoria’s Secret models? Otherworldly beings? WTF?
That’s another thing baffles me on this site (which I spend more time perusing than I care to admit) – the notion that the attractiveness of a person has a number value that could ever apply to more than one individual, and that these values are static across cultures or periods of time.
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Whiskey,
Since it got snipped for some strange reason, here’s what Ryder wrote:
Yes, I think it is that easy to get laid – relatively speaking. Over the years, I’ve had the opportunity to ask older guys (guys who came of age prior to the late sixties) about how easy it was to get casual sex. Answer: it wasn’t. A real “stud” (otherwise normal guys, I’m not talking celebrities banging two chicks at a time at the Sands) back then might have been with a FEW women, but nothing like the numbers that guys can routinely put on the board today. Nerdy guys can put up numbers that only studs could have achieved not so long ago.
Having said all of that, there are still a lot of guys out there that are being, in effect, locked out of sex. They *could* probably get laid, most of them, but they are really not suited for the rough and tumble of modern male/female interactions.
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“And the people who claim to identify with the shooter? There are no words for how sick you people are.”
As sick as this?
“I saw a bumper sticker in 1993 that said “Lorena Bobitt for Surgeon General.”
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””’K
OK…you do realize feminists are trying to change shit like this, right? That they want to be allowed to work anywhere that males can? ”””””
That is the lie. They don’t want to work anywhere males can they want to be gaurrenteed jobs anywhere they want to work. They don’t want to learn the job and get it. They want companies to be forced to hire percentages of them with no competition. No females stood up and said I want to go to the shitty camp even though woman are not allowed. No woman made a big stink about it lol
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Bhetti:
The capacity to kill has been, in terms of evolution, a desirable trait since way back when it had a utility. Not all men have it, and women sexually select for it. You and I are both on board here.
Then, when this man summons the capacity to kill others, which so many men cannot do, you declare that sexual selection is at work. Buffoonery.
Please don’t lump me in with Lucifer. He’s just fighting a bout of lucidity today.
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oh sorry. I need to answer another question:
@The Fifth Horseman
w/r/t why women don’t start their own company and only hire women so as to compete with similar male-dominated companies in the same field:
I think the answer is quite simple, really – the amount paid for labor (whether high or low) does not automatically equal the best workforce. Putting aside the trend to just hire people in other, cheaper labor force countries, I think that any smart CEO (female or male) would want to hire the best workforce possible for their firm to compete and succeed – regardless of their sex. The statistics I just posted from the WaPo article insinuate that women doing the *exact* same jobs as men, with the *exact* same qualifications/experience are paid, on average, 11% less. My guess is this has to do with the perceived ‘risk’ of hiring a woman who might have a family, might want to have a family, etc. It also could be related to the higher health insurance costs in the US for women when it relates to privatized health insurance.
Interestingly enough, in France, where the same gap persists, there’s a study that talks about structural factors:
“In general, women are as qualified as men, but have a shorter career and length of service in the companies in which they work: 29% of women, compared with 18% of men, have interrupted their work for more than one year since they started to work. For 50% of women, this is due to family needs. Both occupation and career progress also contribute to the overall average difference. A considerable proportion of women (37%) work in administration, while relatively few reach management positions: only 15% of women attain management level, compared with 23% of men.
Furthermore, fewer women than men work in large companies, where the pay gap is likely to be smaller; instead, women frequently work in sectors that maintain a significant gender pay gap.
Up to 55% of the gap in bonuses can be explained by the gender difference in exposure to risks and arduous working conditions, such as noise and night work, which affect men more.”
But, that only accounts for 1% of the gap –
“This table shows considerable wage discrimination among management staff. Overall, men with university degrees are better paid than women with the same educational level: the pay gap between a graduate and an undergraduate is 23% for men and 15% for women. A similar differentiation can be observed for management staff: men’s salary at this occupational level is 62% higher than that of male administrative employees, while the pay difference between the two occupational levels among women stands at 50%.
Thus, women not only encounter difficulties in accessing management positions but also, when they do reach this level, they face further significant discrimination in terms of pay: structural factors only explain 1% of the gender pay gap at this level, leaving 19% unexplained.”
http://www.eurofound.europa.eu/ewco/2006/08/FR0608049I.htm
BTW – the reason I thought of France is because my guy’s sister just had a baby with her partner there – and I’m totally in awe of the support both parents get when it comes to enforced, paid parental leave. It’s pretty incredible. But I’m not sure that the cost of that leave is really an explanation for why the gap persists there, as men get almost the same amount of paid leave as women after having a child.
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Bonnie & Roxy
You ladies are both naive and brainwashed. You lack a) an understanding of men and b) what should be a self-awareness of your true feminine natures.
The brainwashing is a result of, at bottom, feminism’s denial of the fundamental asymmetry of the sexes. (Note that I did not say or imply political inequality of the sexes, but rather biological asymmetry. I by this I mean much more than simply different plumbing. See above comments.) Feminism’s insistence on equality uber-alles has blinded it’s adherents to real psychological, physiological, sociological, and social difference between the sexes. You both appear to have bought this nonsense hook, line, and sinker. Pity.
Your naiveté is your own business, but if I had to guess I’d say it is likely the result of being shielded from the consequences of your past mistakes (and we all have them), by either a wealthy father, a provider-beta suckup fuck-buddy, or the very state-as-husband-substitute we rail against here.
Try some introspection. Deep instrospection…not the stuff of Cosmo or Sex in the City. Try to put yourselves in a man’s shoes. This will be difficult for you, but you will be stuck with your juvenile, breathless, sputtering nonsense if you don’t try.
Best of luck, from what I can tell, you’ll likely need it.
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i don’t know what “jezebel” or “jezebeler” means (i mean, i know what the actual word means, but i’m not sure what you mean in this context?).
maurice, i read one of the articles linked at the top of the page with the “16 rules”. i understand that men want to get laid, but i’m telling you that if you actually become a cool person, women will think to themselves, “i will fuck this cool guy.”
[editor: that is because “cool guys” instinctually follow the 16 commandments of poon.]
and you can probably make some friends along the way. and being cool and fun is way less work than making sure that you are appropriately emotionally distant and remembering to try to make a woman jealous and making sure you only send her 2 texts for every 3 she sends you.
if you think that i’m lying, it is probably because you have never come across as a cool guy to any woman, and you need to work on it.
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”””””””””””””’Bonnie
The level of self-pity on this blog is astronomical. Isn’t that the definition of a ‘beta’ for you guys – sitting around feeling so sorry for yourselves, how hard life is, and how mean and powerful women are that you’re effectively paralyzed?”””””””””””””””
You fems need to make up your minds. First the shaming for saying the guy had balls and followed through on his plan to protect himself from pain. Like omg I can’t belive you could identify with the shooter.
Then the shaming for feeling sorry for ourselves and how hard life is lol
Well check it if we all manned the fuck up there would be dead woman and politicians and judges everywhere along with some building or that building blowing the fuck up on a daily basis.
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a-bax, you can try all you want to talk about “how it is” but the simple fact remains that you are part of an online community about men who couldn’t figure out how to meet women and fuck them without a book. you lose. you can try to condescend to women and tell them about their “true nature” but… you need a book to get laid. period.
there are definitely differences between genders- why, we even have different genitalia! and most men are taller than me! but you are being truly naive to accept the way you were socialized to behave and accept it as somehow “natural”. none of that changes the fact that people with truly happy relationships and people who can get laid easily and people who are having the best sex are people who have chilled out and learned to enjoy the company of the opposite sex without reducing it to an overly simplistic formula based on the observations of bitter, angry dudes.
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[editor: that is because “cool guys” instinctually follow the 16 commandments of poon.]
hahaha. yeahhhhh, right. i’m sure that the coolest guys i know are guys who don’t think of me as a person and try to make me jealous by flirting with other women, and not guys who actually have fun interests and hobbies and are intelligent and funny.
[editor: the former does not necessarily exclude the latter.]
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@Gunslingergregi
————
Do any of your feminist friends work as carpenters, electricians, mechanics, generator mechanics, or hvac techs and we are not talking about they took a class and worked a year then where moved to another job. Talking worked it for 5 years at least?
———————-
I know a couple of female mechanics. Not sure if they’re still mechanics, but they were working as such a few years back. And I actually primarily work in a field that, in my experience, has been 80-90% men. In one case, a working group of 70 people and only 5 women. So I know that it can be tough. Sometimes there’s a serious sexual harassment factor. Sometimes it’s just more subtle (see: Peggy Olson in Mad Men trying to get invited to important meetings that seem to only occur after office hours in bars and strip clubs). But mostly I’m alright with it – what really sucks is when anyone (but usually women) insinuates that I’ve only gotten my job because I slept with someone for it. That ruffles my feathers.
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“First the shaming for saying the guy had balls and followed through on his plan to protect himself from pain.”
whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat? haha. how was he protecting himself in any way by murdering a bunch of strangers? how? explain it right now. and how were women at any point the cause of his pain rather than his own social awkwardness and mental illness? this man had no friends and his FAMILY didn’t even like him- what about him hints to you that he was a shy underdog who got stepped on by cruel, callous women? and if he had, how would murdering a bunch of strangers be “protection” against that?
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@K- this
could be viewed as fighting words. “good for money”? please expound, if you don’t think that divorce/child support laws aren’t horribly slanted against men.
@evamariesaint- nice post in spirit – thanks for being positive and constructive. even though i don’t agree on the uber-capitalist conspiracy theory. there are several other explanations that do better than grand conspiracy theories. and although the themes of the blog are usually sex, male-female relations, and anti-feminism/misandry, there are threads that veer off into long discussions of economics. DA and DT had one on the first sobini thread overnight.
@bonnie- that’s a kind of shorthand. our host believes that female attractiveness is universal, and i and other believe it; subjective to some degree, and dependent on personal experience. so we call a woman an 8 or 9, and women come up (at least on TV) with unbelieveably goofy names like “mcdreamy” or “mcsteamy”. explain that, if you will.
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roxy – Does it make you feel empowered to talk down to people here? Nevermind that your insults aren’t true – most of the people here do get laid, and they’re trying to improve some aspect of their sex life – but what’s the point? Doesn’t a strong, empowered woman have something better to do?
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”””””””””on August 6, 2009 at 4:17 pm evemariesaint
oh sorry. I need to answer another question:
@The Fifth Horseman
w/r/t why women don’t start their own company and only hire women so as to compete with similar male-dominated companies in the same field:
I think the answer is quite simple, really – the amount paid for labor (whether high or low) does not automatically equal the best workforce. Putting aside the trend to just hire people in other, cheaper labor force countries, I think that any smart CEO (female or male) would want to hire the best workforce possible for their firm to compete and succeed – regardless of their sex. The statistics I just posted from the WaPo article insinuate that women doing the *exact* same jobs as men, with the *exact* same qualifications/experience are paid, on average, 11% less. My guess is this has to do with the perceived ‘risk’ of hiring a woman who might have a family, might want to have a family, etc. It also could be related to the higher health insurance costs in the US for women when it relates to privatized health insurance.”””””””””’
Umm pretty sure for same job title major companies are paying the same. At least at mine. Do you really think they would be paid more than another without getting sued. Plus jobs like I said are created basically just for woman. Shit is across the board now. Except I would like to see 50 percent woman out there sweating in sun I hope they have to pull em kicking and screaming off the street for that one.
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talking down to people doesn’t make me feel empowered, but it does make me feel good about myself that neither i or anyone i know is this unhealthy and has such trouble relating to human beings. sometimes it’s refreshing to find out that blogs like this exist because having the internet as an outlet is probably keeping one or two of these guys from killing or hurting more women, but mostly it’s just depressing that their parents did such a poor job raising them or that people reach adulthood lacking a natural curiosity for their surroundings and lacking social skills. 😥
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Roxy, I comment here and there. While I enjoy this blog, and find many of the commenters bright and interesting, I’m not part of any “community”.
I got laid a bit in HS, plenty in college. I never once read a book. This site had given me insights and helped hone some of my own thinking, and I’ve seen my interactions with women improve as a result of it.
I’m married, happily so, to a women sexier and more feminine than most of the women I dated throughout my 20s. This is largely due to ignoring PC bullshit and feminist prattle that you and Bonnie dish out. This site has helped corroborate some of the insights I gained on my own. It also opened my eyes to things I hadn’t thought of before. Kudos to Roissy and the regulars for that.
As Maurice said, there’s a lot more going on here than simply pick-up, although that is The Big Theme. The tangents and side-discussions are often at a very high level. Higher, I’m sad to say, than what I’ve seen you bring to the table thusfar.
I know it is often difficult for women to work their way out of a fog-storm of emotions, but you should try harder if you want to have anything more than a shallow understanding of this blog and it’s topics.
Are there “angry, bitter dudes” on this site and very thread? Of course. But, are there also “people who can get laid easily and people who are having the best sex are people who have chilled out and learned to enjoy the company of the opposite sex” commenting here? Yes, in droves. Not just men either.
Dial your emotions down a bit, and listen. When you want to angrily chime in, bite your tongue and listen some more.
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[editor: that is because “cool guys” instinctually follow the 16 commandments of poon.]
Errr. I know I might get myself banned for this,
[editor: only human spammers like lady rain get their comment spewage randomly deleted in order to train them to think before commenting.]
but does anyone else find this as the weirdest self-reifying line ever?
“Don’t follow those weird commandments, just be cool!”
“Cool guys instinctively follow these commandments.”
[only to those without the eyes to see. cool guys won’t necessarily follow every one of my poon commandments but they will follow more of them with greater artistry than will the average beta who struggles with women. it’s the trendlines that are important, not the discrete data points. most cool guys do this subconsciously, of course. just as most cute chicks attract men unthinkingly with the bodies they were given by their parents.]
I dunno, but my boyfriend is pretty cool (well, I guess most of my friends said “really fucking cool” “totally awesome” and many other variations of that when meeting him) and he definitely doesn’t follow II, III, V, VII, or XI. I’m not saying that the 16 rules are all wrong – some of them contain some pretty good advice. (Though I would add that anyone in a relationship where someone is manipulating via screaming/yelling/fighting/being obnoxious should just leave… but that’s my personality talking)
But, I guess I’m coming at this from a relationship perspective, too… I don’t really do ‘dating around’ or just sleeping with guys anymore. And I didn’t like it very much when I did. Maybe this is good advice for an insecure guy who just wants to get laid with an insecure girl?
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“Umm pretty sure for same job title major companies are paying the same. At least at mine. Do you really think they would be paid more than another without getting sued. Plus jobs like I said are created basically just for woman. Shit is across the board now. Except I would like to see 50 percent woman out there sweating in sun I hope they have to pull em kicking and screaming off the street for that one.”
1) your anecdotal evidence from your company doesn’t apply across the board
2) there are basically constant lawsuits in regard to this
3) what jobs are created just for women?
4) your hatred of women is seriously chilling and i hope that you don’t own any guns or live near a gym!
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@ roxy
That might explain why you’re reading. Why are you insulting people, pointing and laughing, ‘haha, you can’t get laid without a booooook’.
Does that strike you as juvenile? Do you regret the decision?
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haha i love the hypocrisy of accusing me of being overly emotional and hysterical or something when your response is dripping with condescension and derision. nice try i guess? i am offering you guys genuine advice- if you want to feel good about yourself and actually enjoy sex and hanging out with women, you should listen to me. if you want to blow a load in someone who is as insecure and self-loathing as you are, by all means, keep up your ‘game’.
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””””evemariesaint,
I know a couple of female mechanics. Not sure if they’re still mechanics””””””’
Not sure does not sound convincing. I knew a female mechanic in the army. Well after a year in a half in she came into my squad. I did a tool inventory with her. She could not identify a 3/4 inch socket. I then had her work the rest of the night changing a spindle lock nut washer. Her last sarge had been a pussy. Now I of course did have to go through the harrassment and shit and threats of sexual harrassment. I also had to talk many times to people above me about this chick because god forbid I treated her just like I would treat a man. I made her work. Surprized she didn’t accuse me of rape. I was kind of waiting for that one lol Anyway I think she may have grown from the experience. Possible.
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maybe it’s juvenile, but wimpy dudes crying victim because they aren’t cool enough to get laid are easy targets, and i had fun. i do have to leave work now though and probably won’t be able to find this url tomorrow.
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Strawmen always are easy targets Roxy. That’s why they’re used. Impressed with your honesty at least though. You go girl!
Leaving work at 445? Maybe that’s why you get paid less.
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@maurice
I understand your take on it as conspiracy. I kind of feel that way when I look at it, too… but, the more I think about it, the more I realize that it doesn’t have to be a bunch of people getting together to decide what to do. It just has to be some lobbyists and strategists deciding separately what works for their own attention-getting purposes. The old, “there doesn’t have to be a conspiracy, there just has to be capitalism, rolling down a hill” sort of thing.
I also think that a lack of conspiracy doesn’t negate the idea of scapegoating who sections of a population to avoid addressing the real issues surrounding unhappiness in any individual or community.
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A-Bax,
I absolutely agree that men and women are biologically different and much of the basics of our behavior are innate (I would argue though that gender expression is a spectrum and most of us fall more towards the middle than either extreme). It’s a total dismissal of common sense to think that they aren’t – that’s why this belief is mostly confined to the highly educated.
I also agree that trying to force men and women to act the same, want the same things, even achieve the same things within a society s a)useless and b)can be damaging.
Steven Pinker’s The Blank Slate is one of my favorite books. I’ve read most of the books a commenter listed above, and own several. Recently I read Susan Pinker’s The Sexual Paradox, and would recommend it.
All that aside, I disagree with most of what is said on this site. Different people, same information, different conclusions.
I am a feminist, by which mean the dictionary definition – I think women should have the same basic rights as men, and opportunities to do with their life what they wish even if isn’t what most women would want. I believe in ‘the patriarchy’, but I believe it’s the natural state of the human animal. What comes naturally to us as male and female animals isn’t the right thing or the best thing for most people, though.
My opinions are also influenced mostly by own life, experiences, and the privilege I was born into. So are yours.
I am a white woman, lower-middle-class growing up, lower class now (I make about $20,000 a year and support myself), young, conventionally attractive (skinny/blonde/cute face), have an abiding hatred of games of all kind, but especially mind-games, flirting, and the normal pursuit and power-struggles I see men and women engaging in all the time. It’s just how I am. I admit it’s different than plenty of people. I’ve been in a great relationship with a man (who isn’t wealthy, does not support me, is many years older than me, but good looking and a kind and interesting person) who has been consistently honest with me, for the past 5 years. We’ve always treated each other first like human beings. My dad has been mentally disabled since I was a kid. I didn’t graduate from high school and didn’t go to college. I don’t and never have had straight male friends because I don’t enjoy being friends with people who want to have sex with me.
So, that’s me. I’m one person, and pretty much everything about me doesn’t fulfill the expectations most of you seem to hold about women who look like me. I can only tell you what I would tell any guy who I disagreed with off the internet.
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””””””””Roxy,
4) your hatred of women is seriously chilling and i hope that you don’t own any guns or live near a gym!””””””””
More shaming when I point out the obvious discrepancies in things between men and woman to the womans benefit. Do you know how many equal opportunity classes I have taken? Do you know how many signs I have seen about how sexual assault is bad?
Should have seen the womans face when I was in the army and pointed out that we woman and men whree not equal and don’t get paid equal pay for equal work. She went of course to the commander. Then what was he gonna do. I merely pointed out that she could run a 2 mile course in like 20 minutes while I had to run it in 15 if she ran it in 16 minutes she would have done great and made promotion point to move up in pay. If I ran it in 16 I would have been kicked out of the army. If she had a higher percentage of body fat than me it would be ok. I would get kicked out of army. So that is a pretty big employer right there. That is equal pay and the guys have to work harder than woman to keep there jobs and to get promoted. Also there is a double standard that adversely affects men.
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[only to those without the eyes to see. cool guys won’t necessarily follow every one of my poon commandments but they will follow more of them with greater artistry than will the average beta who struggles with women. it’s the trendlines that are important, not the discrete data points. most cool guys do this subconsciously, of course. just as most cute chicks attract men unthinkingly with the bodies they were given by their parents.]
But I would argue that the discrete data points *are* important, because really… every human is different.
[editor: all apples are different in the details, too, and yet we can make useful generalizations about apples.]
People are different, and every relationship is different.
[ego assuaging boilerplate. all male-female interactions share important commonalities. for instance, men dig youth and beauty. women dig power and status. how men and women behave in relationships and what turns them on are quite predictable to anyone who isn’t blinded by ideology or the psychic distress of their own low sexual market value.]
I agree that a lot of action/interaction is done unconsciously in any relationship (i.e., we get far more information from body language than we do from words), but don’t you think that, if the end goal is for a ‘beta’ (ugh, I hate that word) to have a successful relationship on his own terms, then a lot of self-reflection and thought and deep interaction with different types of people (friends or lovers) can bring him to that better than a boiler-plate instruction manual?
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“You fems need to make up your minds. First the shaming for saying the guy had balls and followed through on his plan to protect himself from pain. Like omg I can’t belive you could identify with the shooter.
Then the shaming for feeling sorry for ourselves and how hard life is lol
Well check it if we all manned the fuck up there would be dead woman and politicians and judges everywhere along with some building or that building blowing the fuck up on a daily basis.”
I think you missed the point. To be clear – I don’t consider getting mad and blowing things up (or shooting people, or punching walls, or any other misdirected expression of anger and frustration) to be ‘manning up’. It’s a common response among men to emotion they can’t control or don’t know how to focus, sure. Fucking babies (and retarded or crazy adults) lash out physically when they are upset about something/someone and don’t know how to handle it.
Shooting some people before offing yourself is not ‘protecting yourself from pain’.
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There are lots of posts here so maybe I missed it, but I didn’t see anyone pointing out that Sodini, who was 48 and quite average in every superficial respect (personal appearance, home, job), seemed to be obsessed with very pretty very young women, high school- and college-aged. He was out of his league, so to speak, and he didn’t even recognize it. On the contrary, he felt entitled.
If the young women rejected him because they prefer a confident Zac Effron- or Robert Pattinson-type guy close to their own age over a run-of-the-mill 48-year old IT dweeb whose behavior probably gave them a serious case of the creeps … then why is anyone criticizing these women? What did they do wrong? Exert their preferences? This isn’t feminism, this is free choice. Both men and women in the U.S. are free to make their own partner choices.
[editor: sodini’s problem wasn’t that he felt entitled to nubile 16 year old hotties, it was that he was so socially backward he remained an involuntary celibate for 20 years and this celibacy destroyed his self-confidence.]
And there is no law demanding that women be “nice” when delivering a rejection. Only our social brainwashing demands it, and it’s time to end the convention. Far too many men thrust themselves upon their unwilling female victims and therefore don’t deserve a polite response. You reap what you sow.
Rejection is part of life. Deal with it. If you are compelled to harm others because you’ve been rejected, the problem is YOU, not society, and you need serious psychological help.
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”””””roxy
maybe it’s juvenile, but wimpy dudes crying victim because they aren’t cool enough to get laid are easy targets, and i had fun. i do have to leave work now though and probably won’t be able to find this url tomorrow.”””””””
Yea I hoped you were able to learn something. Wouldn’t that be great if we can change a feminist a week. Well it still won’t do any good about divorce laws but yea fun. So yea if ya need some dick just email me and I just need to be paid in you being able to cook well and a plane ticket.
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[editor: you are an idiot. the “wage gap” shibboleth is misleading because it does not control for the fact that women are more likely to pursue careers in lower paying “soft” fields like nursing as opposed to cardiology. there will always be a wage gap as long as women by their natures choose these caring professions over more lucrative jobs and strive less ambitiously than men for the top positions in their fields.]
Aw man. I totally missed this. I did, later, post the wage-study proof that *does* take into account for structural differences in pay scale for men and women and there is still a gap.
[editor: what that study purports to show has already been discredited by a host of other studies.]
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”””””’Bonnie,
Shooting some people before offing yourself is not ‘protecting yourself from pain’.”””””””
That guy is no longer in pain. He protected himself. Now the state should offer a way out in a perfect world. It doesn’t suicide is looked at as a bad thing. So yea the dude protected himself.
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One thing I have learned as a young woman is that no matter how kind and gentle, or direct and clear, you are when you reject a guy, you are usually going to get the same reaction in the end: anger, and often some kind of verbal abuse.
The only conclusion I’ve been able to come to is that they all really are surprised I’m not interested in them sexually.
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””””””programmer,
Rejection is part of life. Deal with it. If you are compelled to harm others because you’ve been rejected, the problem is YOU, not society, and you need serious psychological help.””””””””””””
lol serious psychological help. What would they have done?
Given him some pills? Maybe labotomy. They certainly wouldn’t have reccomended suicide or helped him with it.
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Bonnie, I officially take back my lumping of you with grrrlpower Roxy (who has supposedly left the building for happy hour in attempt to ply naive men for drinks.) Sincerest apologies!
Your post was a refreshing read. You seem very straightforward, and I’m inclined to take you at your word. I’m sorry to hear about your Dad. I have an older brother who is mentally disabled, and it can be tough on the whole family (toughest, of course, on the disabled person.) It’s not easy, for sure. Having a mentally disabled relative, especially in your nuclear family, opens your eyes to things that other’s might not see easily, or might not understand until much later in life.
You and I might not agree on everything, but that’s fine. We do agree, though, on Pinker’s magnum opus, which should be required reading in all women’s studies classes, imho. 🙂
I especially like these lines of yours “I believe in ‘the patriarchy’, but I believe it’s the natural state of the human animal. What comes naturally to us as male and female animals isn’t the right thing or the best thing for most people, though.” I might quibble with the second sentence, but that would lead us down the rabbit’s hole of the Naturalistic Fallacy and moral philosophy in general. Another time, maybe.
If I can channel Maurice here, I’d like to say *welcome*. I think you’ll find alot of interesting, if sometimes rough & tumble, discussions here. There’ll be things you may dislike and disagree with. But I get the sense that you won’t be as easily offended or run off as the jezebel flamers are.
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””””’Bonnie,
I am a white woman, lower-middle-class growing up, lower class now (I make about $20,000 a year and support myself), young, conventionally attractive (skinny/blonde/cute face), have an abiding hatred of games of all kind, ””””””””
See bonnie most of us could buy and sell years of your life.
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In fact if you made 20k for the rest of your life I could hire you and pay you to do nothing. Ironic life isn’t it.
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””””””Bonnie
The level of self-pity on this blog is astronomical. Isn’t that the definition of a ‘beta’ for you guys – sitting around feeling so sorry for yourselves, how hard life is, and how mean and powerful women are that you’re effectively paralyzed?”””””””””””””’
lol
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@roxy- what A-Bax and S_A said is exactly right. sorry you thought poking at straw men was the thing to do.
@bonnie- “abiding hatred for games of all kinds” ? including scrabble? 🙂 actually, flirting and game-playing are part of human nature, and can be quite enjoyable, so your alienation from this may be a source of unhappiness or confusion. or then again, maybe not – if you know yourself as well as you appear to. just be aware that what might not be normal for you is normal for other people, game-wise, and in that respect this blog helps people figure things out. and, it’s perfectly reasonable for men to want to have sex with you if you are attractive. that’s the way of the world. don’t hate or disrespect them for it. and i’m glad you are in a happy relationshp. so am i and so are many of the men on this board.
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Gee,
i like women SO much more now that these have shown up.
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Now bonnie imagine making 80,000 dollars and you spending money is that same 20k that you make but your working at a 80k job because you had some kids and your wife decided to get a boyfriend and leave. How would you feel about that?
Or how would you feel about making that same 20k and having 8k of it go away in same situation.
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[editor: what that study purports to show has already been discredited by a host of other studies.]
Gimme links, hot stuff. 🙂
[editor: do your own dirty work. and i didn’t give you permission to flirt with me.]
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Lol faggots and pop evolutionary psychologists who obviously have no idea how biology works, making some psychotic killer into their hero
You have no idea how fucking crazy y’all sound, do you? I feel so sorry for you.
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Gunslingergregi,
I wouldn’t work for you if you were the last employer on earth. 😉
I just think it’s interesting that I am pretty much the kind of person (or as they put it here so charmingly, ‘poon’), in looks at least, that the men at this site seem to be trying to attract. But I don’t play by your rules. I don’t play by a lot of rules in society – I have no interest in making money, or in marrying it. Doesn’t that make you think things between men and women might be a little less black and white than you had assumed?
I am writing you off as ‘stupid’ now. Your posts aren’t worth reading and certainly aren’t me worth responding to. You express yourself less eloquently than my 5-year-old nephew.
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xsplat:
Do you honestly believe that is what I do?
Or do you just “believe” whatever is convenient to your emotions.
Seems to me your brain is broke.
No, in all earnestness, I was not maligning you. Did I get the wrong poster? Who’s the guy who’s always going on about how he pays for professionals rather than getting embroiled in full-fledged relationships?
I’m not putting down that choice; I cited it only to point out that, if sexual release alone was what the shooter needed, he had the means to secure it.
If I’m mistaking you for another poster, I do apologise.
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@lulz- nope, noone’s hero. read more carefully next time. people who read and post here understand quite a bit about evo-psych and biology. if you think something you read is wrong, post exactly what you think it is, and there can be a conversation.
@evamariesaint- see, i *knew* you had a thing for roissy. 😉 i’m sure someone will come up with a link. also, lose the ’50s style hairdo and gain some weight, ferchrissakes!
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@MA – that was lucifer, an annoying troll. xsplat has said he never pays for sex.
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@dana- enjoying the show so far?
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”””””””Bonnie
Gunslingergregi,
I wouldn’t work for you if you were the last employer on earth. ”””””””””’
I didn’t say my wife would employ you. But yea funny shit.
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evemariesaint, in your experience, have you seen any indications of wage inequality? Leaving aside issues like preferential hiring, etc., in your industry or your friends have you seen evidence of this?
I think it use to exist, but I’m been working for awhile now and I haven’t actually seen any evidence among it, my peers, or my friends (and therefore their peers.) I have anectodal evidence to the contrary, though those cases were motivated by gender.
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evemariesaint said:
“I think that maybe, just maybe, your claim that women have more control over men than vice versa is ignoring oh…. thousands of years of human history, where men (for the most part) controlled every aspect of a woman’s life from her birth to her death.”
Sweetie, if that hadn’t happened, 99% probability you wouldn’t be here today to whine about it.
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jokerman:
Oh jeez! Thanks for setting me straight!
xsplat, please accept my apology — I was citing lucifer’s method of operation and assigned your name to it in error.
My bad.
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Bonnie – While I don’t have the time to get into an extended debate, you stated a VERY mistaken assumption I wish to address: Patriarchy is in fact NOT the natural state of the human species.
Patriarchy – i.e. Father fully vested in Parental responsibility, is in fact an artificial construct. It is the weakest relational bond amongst our species, and can only flourish with the implicit and complicit social contract of society as a whole.
In just about every mammalian species on the planet, the Father’s role is mostly confined to the sex act. Only in a few species like elephants, are the role of Father’s supported by the species herd/flock/group.
Before “women’s liberation,” society as a whole largely supported the Patriarchal model as the means of investing men into their families and into society as a whole.
The advent of no-fault divorce, default child custody to the mother, alimony, and the child support industry have all stricken terrible blows to an already biologically weak link of Fatherhood.
The resulting pathologies are becoming more evident to those of us that recognize this reality.
Sodini didn’t kill these women simply because he couldn’t get laid.
He killed these women because he had no father.
No father to show him by example how to be a man.
No father to show him how to channel natural male aggression into positive outlets.
No father to demonstrate how to control your emotions.
No father to teach him how to deal with women.
No…he was raised in the “natural” state. By a single mother…who was domineering and overbearing by his own account. He never learned any of these previous things I mentioned….which is why he was so disaffected, socially inept and incapable of attracting females.
Which lead to the mounting frustration and mental derangement.
Sodini is one of the possible outcomes when the role of the Father is destroyed. Based on the rise in divorce, illegitemacy, the loss of social stigma that was associated with Patriarchy…well, we are going to see more and more instances of men filled with rage lashing out in this exact same way.
This is what you are reading about on this blog in one of it’s many, many different permutations.
Feminism was an outright war on Patriarchy.
Sodini and the three ladies who died are simply just more statistics who are casualties of that war.
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I have heard a lot of gum flapping in the states about how woman and men are equal. I have seen a lot of laws and shit trying to force them to be equal. The first time I have seen a woman who was equal to a man was when I met my wife who is from a foreign country where they have no laws that forces people to be “equal”. She puts feminists to shame. Runs 2 business and still has plenty of time to raise a baby. She is already retired from having to work more than 30 days a year or so.
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i thought the same thing as the blog’s title when i saw the guy’s story on the news and read about the no sex in 20 years bit…..
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“abiding hatred for games of all kinds” ? including scrabble? 🙂 actually, flirting and game-playing are part of human nature, and can be quite enjoyable, so your alienation from this may be a source of unhappiness or confusion. or then again, maybe not – if you know yourself as well as you appear to. just be aware that what might not be normal for you is normal for other people, game-wise, and in that respect this blog helps people figure things out. and, it’s perfectly reasonable for men to want to have sex with you if you are attractive. that’s the way of the world. don’t hate or disrespect them for it. and i’m glad you are in a happy relationship. so am i and so are many of the men on this board.”
Yes, even Scrabble. I even hated things like card games and puzzles as a child.
I agree that I am not a ‘typical’ 24-year-old ‘girl’. But I am not exactly a freak. 🙂 I seem more content and more functional than most people I know.
I said above though, that I can only filter things through my own lens. This site and many commenters make sweeping statements and generalizations about women, that do not apply to me (a woman). It’s not any wonder I disagree and find a lot of your arguments logically inconsistent.
I have no problem with people wanting to have sex with me. I have a problem with people feeling like they have the right to make explicit comments about my body just because I exist, invade my space, touch me, expect that I like this, and then get mad when I don’t want to fuck them. Somehow I only have this problem with straight men, never with lesbians. Might be the way of the world – doesn’t mean I have to like it or take it lying down.
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@bonnie- i said it was the way of the world for them to desire you, and even express that desire, but of course you don’t have to comply if you’re not interested. sorry if that was not clear – i didn’t mean to imply otherwise.
how’d you find this blog, by the way …?
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“Bonnie – While I don’t have the time to get into an extended debate, you stated a VERY mistaken assumption I wish to address: Patriarchy is in fact NOT the natural state of the human species.”
I think you are wrong about this and most of the other points you make in your post above.
I do agree having positive male role models is beneficial for childrens mental health (boys and girls). But I don’t think even an entire nation of responsible, invested fathers would prevent some people from developing abnormally, becoming socially deviant and committing violence.
I have done a lot of reading and thinking on the subject. Like I said before, different people, same information, different opinions.
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You think I’m wrong?
There will always be socially deviant folks that commit violence.
What you fail to even comprehend is that it’s statisitcally undeniable that most mass murderers and violent criminals come from single mother households.
When Patriarchy was the norm, there were far less single mother households…and far less instances of guys like sodini lashing out blindly.
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Marcus Female
Ok, no problem. My hackles were risen (what is a hackle?) because I’m in Indonesia, and many ignorant trolls with weak egos and harsh racist souls assume that any sex here is ALL about cash. Pisses me off, at it insults not only me, but the girls.
Ya, sex is about the cash or the flash or the bling or the status. Partly. That’s fine. Uuuurrrrggghhh – the stereotype of the sexpat is ALWAYS wrong. Always. Because it’s always motivated by the desire to see the man as unattractive and stupid and the girl as a cold calculating bitch who needs milk money. Whereas the gender relations of expats, and even sexpats, is a human affair with endless variations.
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To put it simply…most single mother households do not produce mass murderers…but most mass murderers come from single mother households.
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“You think I’m wrong?”
Yep. Pretty much totally wrong.
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‘celibacy is walking death, and anything is justified in avoiding that miserable fate.’
I can’t believe you said that.
[editor: read for comprehension. men who are unsexed zombies will easily be able to justify any heinous action given the appropriate psychological miswiring.]
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Bonnie, you have no clue just how wrong you are.
I refer you to Dr. Daniel Amneus treatise on the topic, The Garbage Generation.
[blockquote]If we are to deal meaningfully with crime, what we must do is reduce the number of female-headed families; what we must do is prevent the divorce courts from expelling half of society’s fathers from their homes; what we must do is terminate a welfare system which displaces millions of men from the principal male role, that of family-provider. What we must do is make the father the head of the family.
The female role, says Margaret Mead, is a biological fact; the male role is a social creation. This is the primary reality concerning human society. Motherhood has been the dominant feature of mammalian life since its beginning some two hundred million years ago, most conspicuously since the great reptiles became extinct and the Age of Mammals began sixty-five million years ago. Fatherhood in the sense of major male participation in reproduction is only a few million years old. Fatherhood in the sense of male headship of families is only a few thousand years old.
What is happening to our society is that it is discarding patriarchal sexual regulation and reverting to the primeval mammalian pattern of a reproductive unit consisting of the mother and her offspring, the male putting in an appearance to perform his minuscule sexual function and then disappearing or being hauled away to the sausage factory or being reduced to the role of stud who can be discarded when his female tires of him. “Men and women,” rejoices feminist-anthropologist Helen Fisher, “are moving toward the kind of roles they had on the grasslands of Africa millions of years ago….Human society is now discovering its ancient roots….The recent trend toward divorce and remarriage is another example of a throwback to earlier times….[T]he so-called new extended family [read: broken family] may actually have evolved millennia ago….At long last, society is moving in a direction that should be highly compatible with our ancient human spirit….The ‘traditional’ role of women is a recent invention.”
Biologically speaking, it is indeed a recent invention, scarcely older than the civilization which it made possible and which emerged coevally with it and created the wealth which reconciled women to accepting it. But women’s new economic independence is leading them to yearn for a return to the prehistoric mammalian arrangement. “[W]herever women are economically powerful,” says Fisher, “divorce rates are high. You see it in the Kung and you see it in the United States.” Let’s say, wherever women are economically powerful and there are no social guarantees to ensure male headship of families, divorce rates are high–such being the case among the Kung and the Americans. The Kung have no social guarantees to ensure male headship of families because the Kung never emerged from the Stone Age. The Americans have no social guarantees to ensure male headship of families because there exists an elementary confusion in the heads of policy makers, lawmakers and judges, who imagine that the obvious strength of the biological tie between the mother and the infant (the “biological fact” Margaret Mead refers to) means that it requires their assistance. A biological fact does not require the services of the legal system. What does require these services is the weakest biological link in the family, the role of the father. It was the creation of this role–only a few thousand years ago–which made patriarchal civilization possible. Prior to that, mankind had to muddle through the million years of the Stone Age with the female-headed reproductive arrangements of the ghetto, the barnyard and the rain forest. [/blockquote]
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“editor: working women leads to a more polygamous sexual market because they have a smaller pool of higher status men from which to choose mates, and because a man’s provisioning no longer serves as an effective sexual status signaler, thus ensuring that the flashiest (read: PUAs) alpha males horde the quality pussy. please stop spouting your fembot platitudes here. my readership is smarter than you know ”
What the HELL are you talking about? In what way does your note on my comment have anything to do with anything I actually said? And most importantly, why do you think I should evaluate the world based on who gets the “quality pussy?” Is that really the measure of equality for you? Is that all you care about? That is just…sad.
Ovid–“As sick as this?
“I saw a bumper sticker in 1993 that said “Lorena Bobitt for Surgeon General.”
”
Yes, only worse, because Lorena Bobitt was not a mass murderer who killed random people. What she did was still fucked up, as is anyone who supports what she did, even jokingly. But that quote does not represent mainstream feminism, just as the people hailing this sick man as a hero do not represent most MRAs.
Gunslingergregi–“Do any of your feminist friends work as carpenters, electricians, mechanics, generator mechanics, or hvac techs and we are not talking about they took a class and worked a year then where moved to another job. Talking worked it for 5 years at least?”
Yes.
“Now I of course did have to go through the harrassment and shit and threats of sexual harrassment. I also had to talk many times to people above me about this chick because god forbid I treated her just like I would treat a man.”
“Do you know how many equal opportunity classes I have taken? Do you know how many signs I have seen about how sexual assault is bad?”
My, what a grave injustice! Certainly someone like you, who says:
“So yea if ya need some dick just email me and I just need to be paid in you being able to cook well and a plane ticket.”
…would never need anything like sexual harassment training, and any reports against you of such behavior must be totally made up.
maurice–“@K- this
men are good for money and women need to stay with the child
could be viewed as fighting words. “good for money”? please expound, if you don’t think that divorce/child support laws aren’t horribly slanted against men.”
”
Wow, talk about taking something out of context. I didn’t say that was my view, I said it was a long-held patriarchal view that feminists are fighting against. I never said I “don’t think divorce/child support laws aren’t horribly slanted against men.” I think that in some ways, they are. But that is not the fault of feminists.
Bonnie–“I don’t and never have had straight male friends because I don’t enjoy being friends with people who want to have sex with me. ”
Bonnie, I’ve enjoyed and agreed with most of your comments here, but this seems a little unfair. Not all straight men treat women like pieces of ass. I have many female friends, and they have many other straight male friends, and we’ve all managed to keep ourselves under control. None of my straight male friends whine about how our more beautiful female friends won’t give them sex in return for being nice to them–if they did, they wouldn’t be my friends. I’m sure you can find a lot of guys who would be fun to hang out with that wouldn’t ever pressure you into a sexual relationship, even if they do find you attractive. You’re just not likely to run into them on this site, apparently.
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””””””evemariesaint
[editor: what that study purports to show has already been discredited by a host of other studies.]
Gimme links, hot stuff.
[editor: do your own dirty work. and i didn’t give you permission to flirt with me.]””””””””’
That was brutal. Treating a bitch like a man. Equal opportunity hahahaahahha
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xsplat:
Ok, no problem. My hackles were risen (what is a hackle?) because I’m in Indonesia, and many ignorant trolls with weak egos and harsh racist souls assume that any sex here is ALL about cash. Pisses me off, at it insults not only me, but the girls
It’s just my bad luck that I made the mistake with your name, more than any other! I didn’t realise your location, and it’s understandable that you’d be sensitive about it. (Hackles are the erectile hairs on animals’ necks/backs, and by association, any display of anger/hostility in response to a perceived challenge.)
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””””””””””””””Seeking Alpha
Strawmen always are easy targets Roxy. That’s why they’re used. Impressed with your honesty at least though. You go girl!
Leaving work at 445? Maybe that’s why you get paid less.””””””””””””””””’
Ding Ding Ding we have a winner. Guys tend to work more hours. OMG the sky opened and the light shined down.
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Quick test what woman here has worked 36 hours straight to get an important job done and twelve of those hours could not be paid for but you did it anyway out of loyalty to the company.
Anyone?
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“Bonnie, I’ve enjoyed and agreed with most of your comments here, but this seems a little unfair. Not all straight men treat women like pieces of ass. I have many female friends, and they have many other straight male friends, and we’ve all managed to keep ourselves under control. None of my straight male friends whine about how our more beautiful female friends won’t give them sex in return for being nice to them–if they did, they wouldn’t be my friends. I’m sure you can find a lot of guys who would be fun to hang out with that wouldn’t ever pressure you into a sexual relationship, even if they do find you attractive. You’re just not likely to run into them on this site, apparently.”
I know lots of people like you, it’s just not for me. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t like men. I have hung out in the past with men as part of a group of friends, and they have mostly been cool people who aren’t ‘Nice Guys’ and would never pressure anyone, might not even say anything if they did have feelings..
But too many men are just like the ones who hang out here, and I don’t share interests with many that I meet, so I’ve written them off as a group. My boyfriend is great and happens to be a man (I am bi so it’s not like it’s a prerequisite in my partners), but it takes too much time to filter through all the pigs, dumbasses (I have low tolerance for signs of either – one racist comment and I have no interest in communicating with you voluntarily) – then once you get down to the truly good people, some might be interested in me. No matter how politely they might express it, I don’t enjoy rejecting people or awkward vibes. It’s easier to just be friends with women, who I have always gotten along with great. I don’t have a lot of time for friends anyway!
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Woof
Are you having the vapors, Woof? Do you need to take a lie down on the feinting couch?
You think you are making a positive argument, but what you are instead showing is that women DO NOT WANT to have empathy for the male condition. You not only can not, but you do not want to have it.
A man with a moderate to high libido who is not getting laid is living in hell. It’s a lifestyle of mental anguish. Every moment is a reminder to him of his pain.
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What are you doing on this blog Bonnie? You don’t like men, and as you said, you don’t have time for these conversations, then why post here? You will not change anyone’s mind here and apparently you’re not open to debate. Again, what are you doing here? Please do us all a favor and bo back to feministing, and that goes for the rest of the sisterhood.
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“Bonnie, you have no clue just how wrong you are.”
I say the same to you, sir.
For what it’s worth I think Margaret Mead is full of shit. I was sad to see one of my female heroes exposed as profoundly misguided, but all evidence points that way.
In America at least, violent crime rates have been on a downward swing for many years now, as divorce rates and single parenthood climbs. I would argue all have a lot to do with the feminist movement and the sexual revolution.
I don’t have much hope for you (I suspect you think the reduction in violent crime is due to more low-income mothers getting abortions or whatever) but how do you reconcile the less people are violently killing each other than ever before at the moment and we have better quality of life overall, with your belief that our society is disintegrating and our values are going down the tubes (along with sexual opportunity for men with non-hoez, oh noez!), and it’s only going to get worse?
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”””””””””””Gunslingergregi
”””””Kerri,
I recall dating a guy in DC, we were on our 2nd date, and he kept getting calls from an Asian chick he had dropped, she wouldn’t stop calling him on his cell phone…it was nonstop…she also began the circle around the house routine in her car…needless to say, I gave up first. The Asian chicks get deadly, angry, dangerous when they stalk a guy…there was no way I was going to be her target.””””””
Gunslingergregi
Gotta love them they are the best you can get.””””””””””
Spot the fear of the empowered american woman of a little asian woman who is supposed to be docile he he he
Like I said Gotta love asian woman they are the best you can get.
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Bonnie…the reduction in crime coincides precisely with America now becoming the highest incarcerated rate per capita of males in the entire world.
Some trade off, eh?
The statistics are undeniable….playing the “your wrong…no YOUR WRONG.” debate game does not mitigate that in any way.
Sure, abortions have played their role in reducing the number of children born to single mother households…which of course would reduce the number of violent criminals in the long run.
But so does incarcerating vast segments of the population.
All in the name of “freeing” women from the “Patriarchal Oppression.”
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””””””Bonnie,
(I am bi so it’s not like it’s a prerequisite in my partners), ;”””””””””””’
And here we go it is the lesbians that are the ones ruining it for actual woman. Wild shit.
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Gunner
Women may not push themselves as hard as men, but I think they do loyalty, pretty well. Maybe not to a group effort, but if her work is guided by a boss that she admires. Devotion is something women like to do.
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“I know lots of people like you, it’s just not for me. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t like men. I have hung out in the past with men as part of a group of friends, and they have mostly been cool people who aren’t ‘Nice Guys’ and would never pressure anyone, might not even say anything if they did have feelings..
But too many men are just like the ones who hang out here, and I don’t share interests with many that I meet, so I’ve written them off as a group. My boyfriend is great and happens to be a man (I am bi so it’s not like it’s a prerequisite in my partners), but it takes too much time to filter through all the pigs, dumbasses (I have low tolerance for signs of either – one racist comment and I have no interest in communicating with you voluntarily) – then once you get down to the truly good people, some might be interested in me. No matter how politely they might express it, I don’t enjoy rejecting people or awkward vibes. It’s easier to just be friends with women, who I have always gotten along with great. I don’t have a lot of time for friends anyway!”
I see your point, Bonnie, and I won’t try to change your mind on this. At least you’re not saying “all men are evil,” which puts you ahead of most of the commenters here. You’re saying it’s just not for you, which is…understandable, I guess.
xsplat, it’s not about a lack of empathy for the “male condition” (what, is being a male a disease now?) it’s a lack of empathy for men that think their penis is the most important thing in the world. I am a man, and yeah, not having sex for a while can suck. Do you think that it doesn’t suck for women, too? You’re also disregarding people who choose celibacy, for religious or other reasons. But the fact is, no one is entitled to sex, and the more entitled you think you are, the less someone is going to want to give it to you. If this man had thought of women as actual people who were allowed to make a choice, not only would he not have shot anybody, but he may have been able to find a woman who could love him.
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”””””’K,
…would never need anything like sexual harassment training, and any reports against you of such behavior must be totally made up.””””””
Well yea actually I made a pact with myself never to get with an army chick. I even refused blow jobs in basic training. I cuddled some bitches when they were crying but that is all. I was the only one not carrying her bags and allowing her to do whatever the fuck she wanted. I treated her like a god dam soldier.
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“If this man had thought of women as actual people who were allowed to make a choice, not only would he not have shot anybody, but he may have been able to find a woman who could love him.”
Oh Jesus…the self delusion…agh astounding.
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Funky,
I like arguing and telling people I think are stupid, that they are wrong. It’s also gratifying when I sound smarter than everyone I am arguing with.
I have plenty of time for posting on blogs. Where did I say I didn’t? I did say I don’t have a lot of time for friends.. I post to blogs while I am at work.
“A man with a moderate to high libido who is not getting laid is living in hell. It’s a lifestyle of mental anguish. Every moment is a reminder to him of his pain.”
LOL! Okay, aren’t you exaggerating a little?
I work a job where I am the only woman among ‘regular’ blue-collar guys, I love to pump them for info about their opinions on this stuff, and we are ALL laughing right now.
I find this site distinctly lacking in empathy for women – my empathy is reserved for guys who treat women like people. Also, sympathy quickly runs short for big whiny titty-babies.
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“It’s also gratifying when I sound smarter than everyone I am arguing with.”
Pure arrogance but not surprising coming from an american feminist lesbian. Didn’t you say you’re a highschool dropout? You have no idea about the caliber of people posting here, since you’ve been here what, one day? So if you don not wish to leave, please refrain from commenting for a while and read.
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Dave, I can’t take you seriously when you don’t know how to properly utilize apostrophes.
To anyone who is interested: I call myself bi, but I have never touched a woman. Analyze me, please.
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Yes, yes, gunslinger, I’m sure you’re a saint who never said anything to this woman like you’ve said on this board.
Funky K, you wanna elaborate on how I am filled with “self-delusion” for my apparently totally radical belief that murderers usually dehumanize their victims first?
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Could bon bon be begging any more for male attention. She is bon bon the emotional prostitute.
the new femx.
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I don’t buy into your ideas of ‘caliber’. I am judging you all from your comments here.
I mean, gunslingerwhatever communicates like a chimpanzee with a keyboard. Saying you have a genius wife who is a paragon of femininity, make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, and fuck supermodels is ultimately meaningless on the internet where we can all claim anything.
I’ll take your word for it I guess, and I assume you’re taking my word for everything I told you about myself..
(I am mostly being arrogant to get on your nerves, btw.)
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Bonnie, don’t be an obtuse little bitch.
This is a comment section on a blog forum. We debate ideas here, not focus on perfection of grammar in a place where extemporaneous discussion and the rapid pace of contributions from people all over the world does not lend itself to an environment for editing and re-editing and proof reading to make sure some dumb broad like yourself can’t than dismiss an argument on superficial grounds like “correct use of apostrophes.”
Typical weak deflection based on ad hominem reasoning.
You can say I’m wrong based on nothing other than your own assertion, with no backing evidence. You want to disprove me, post your evidence. Cause I assure you, dear, I have the links to the stats that back up everything I claimed.
You won’t find me resorting to weak ass attempts to marginalize a point based on “grammar.”
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”””””””K
Yes, yes, gunslinger, I’m sure you’re a saint who never said anything to this woman like you’ve said on this board. ”””””””””””””’
Wouldn’t have to be a saint. I compartmentalized army chicks as soldiers no biggie.
Except when they cried you could obviously tell they where chics.
I never saw a man cry in the army.
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Oh and yea ok I had to actually not treat them like men. I never knocked out an army chick. I also never threw one on the ground by her neck. I also never choked one the fuck out. So yea chicks in army also miss out on that shit.
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(I am mostly being arrogant to get on your nerves, btw.)
You’re not, however you’re becoming a nuissance. Sigh, I think you might be right Gunny.
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Again it is that I want to be equal but you can’t give me wall to wall counseling. he he he
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Dave, I can’t take you seriously when you don’t know how to properly utilize apostrophes.
I can’t take anyone seriously who splits infinitives.
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Dave, I don’t think it’s worth your time. In a couple days it’ll blow over and the feministing/jezebel crowd will go back into the pit.
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”””””””””Bonnie
I don’t buy into your ideas of ‘caliber’. I am judging you all from your comments here.
I mean, gunslingerwhatever communicates like a chimpanzee with a keyboard. Saying you have a genius wife who is a paragon of femininity, make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year, and fuck supermodels is ultimately meaningless on the internet where we can all claim anything.
I’ll take your word for it I guess, and I assume you’re taking my word for everything I told you about myself..
(I am mostly being arrogant to get on your nerves, btw.)””””””””””
I believe I destroyed femx and she didn’t get on my nerves either. Truth can hurt badly.
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Gunslinger, do you honestly expect me to believe that someone who hates women as much as you do would be able to treat female soldiers equally? That you would be able to compartmentalize your incredible misogyny so well, that the accusations of sexism against you were pure coincidence? Who would be stupid enough to believe that?
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Nicole—
Your perspective is seriously warped. Not to be cruel about it but you’re a middle aged 2. That transparently DOES deeply affect your views and perspective.
This just about totally cuts it with me about you Nicole. You transparently DON’T want American or Israeli (most likely, considering the influence of Jewish feminists on American laws) divorce laws significantly changed. The income of a man, particularly a beta man, has a very real impact on not only his material comfort but what kind of new partner, wife or not, he can attract. That’s particularly true when he’s fishing in over 30s female waters, as most divorced men are/have to be.
More women than men don’t WANT a live together or married relationship after they’ve had kids. Or they don’t when they have a ditched provider ex husband’s money coming in on the regular, mandated by limitless jail time for failure to pay. That’s after she’s the one who 2 to 1 initiated the divorce in America and in about 90% of the cases effectively wanted it (by e.g. leaving or failing to stop a love affair that’s lead her to cease having sex with her husband) according to a number of divorce attorneys including Esquire on this board. It’s OUTRAGEOUS that men should be legally compelled to pay more than welfare level child support to women who would otherwise qualify for it, when they’re the one’s who overwhelmingly brought about the divorce.
I thought you supported this view more or less. Now I know. (Ugly epithets here deleted.)
Then let’s end both because it’s clearly hurting men’s lives. (Save when it has to be assessed to save the taxpayers from the welfare that wouldn’t still be paid at all if not for the women’s vote.)
What utter horse plop. The results may be bad for both sexes but they’re way worse for the average man than for the average woman.
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lol tarl coming out of the booottthhhh.
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Dave,
All I’m saying is that I think you are wrong (and probably what I would consider ‘dumb’). I’m not under any onus to educate you or provide evidence to why I think I’m right. Maybe there is no evidence, maybe I’m just arrogant. Maybe I’m just fucking with you. I still think you’re wrong wrongity wrong, nyah. That’s all.
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Are you feminists able to make men believe that you want equality and that you don’t hate men?
Please convince the men here that feminists just want equality and don’t hate men?
All ears on this one.
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Gunslinger–“Are you feminists able to make men believe that you want equality and that you don’t hate men?
Please convince the men here that feminists just want equality and don’t hate men?
All ears on this one.”
Alright, but first I want you to convince me that you are not a Cylon.
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“I can’t take anyone seriously who splits infinitives.”
Don’t you know how hard it is to be a high-school drop-out? I am in constant mental anguish! Why don’t you understand my pain (and give me your money for free)?!?
There’s still a 50/50 split between the two camps of grammer-nazis. It’s not really like the difference between your and you’re.
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Ahhh. I yield to the superior intellectual argument and it’s irrefutable logic.
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Charlotte–
No. It has to do overwhelmingly with feminism, including the feminist push through AA for women in all it’s various forms and endless media propaganda to subvert the provider importance of most men.
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Dave –
We’re not going to agree because we both have our reasons (backed up by evidence) for thinking what we do, and I doubt a random commenter on this blog would ever change either of our minds no matter what studies we linked to. I’m sure we’ve seen a lot of the same basic information, we’ve just come to different conclusions.
We’re arguing over something that has no definitive proof, after all – it’s not like the law of gravity or the overwhelming evidence for plate tectonics and evolution. If anyone else wants to learn about it they can go look it up and check out some books.
I am here to argue about petty shit, not discuss the deeper meaning of patriarchy, good god.
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“No. It has to do overwhelmingly with feminism, including the feminist push through AA for women in all it’s various forms and endless media propaganda to subvert the provider importance of most men.”
If you can find the right person to be with, it’s not like there aren’t tons of people still who prefer more traditional gender roles/family structure. Everyone should do what makes them happy. ‘Feminine’ and ‘manly’ behavior comes naturally to a lot of people.
I know a ton of SAHPs, only two are dads. I would love to be a SAHP someday and have my husband work full-time to support me. I hate working, I love kids and want to have my own, it all works out. But since it’s not the 1940s, if my husband drops over one day and can never work again like my dad did, I have more opportunities to find work that will keep my kids fed.
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K see I even gave you two serves and answered and you want a third without giving back shit. See your not a woman any man should get with. Obviously yea it is true that feminists seem to hate men. It also seems to be true that most feminists that we have seen say they are bi then later on ya find out they hate men and then it comes out they are really just lesbians looking to use a man because they cannot achieve success on their own account in real life.
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I’m not sure what is more amazing, that you and I used to feel it respectful to ask the wife permissions, or that we never had any clues that reality worked otherwise.
Never…ever…ever.
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K claims to be a man Gunny. Tragic really.
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no way funky.
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Dave the Islander
I’m sure I read somewhere that one function of humor is to recognize status.
Remember in grade 4, when the guy with cooties would tell the same joke as the head boy of the class, but when cootie-kid said it it was stupid?
Being funny is synonymous with being cool. Be cool and you are funnier. Be funny and you are cooler. But you can’t be uncool and funny.
If the boss tells a joke, everyone will chuckle.
So yeah, being funny is social status – it’s also social mastery.
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Whiskey, your knowledge of women is not well rounded enough.
You need to date more money hungry gold diggers.
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Exactly, xsplat.
You can take any women’s “list” of what she wants in a guy…and inevitably it all boils down to the unspoken and often unrecognized desire she REALLY wants…social dominance.
“I want a man that will bring me flowers when I’m sick.”
“I want a man that will cuddle with me and not expect sex.”
“I want a man that will cook special meals for me.”
“I want a man that will be sensitive to my needs, and open up and share with me and be communicative.”
You always see women with these sorts of laundry lists.
The addendum to any and all of these lists is this:
“…as long as he’s not a beta.”
A dominant alpha bringing a lady flowers feels like she’s special because she senses that he could be with any girl he chooses, but he chooses to give his affection to HER. (All women want to feel like they are the special, chosen one by a highly desirable man).
A beta supplicant is bringing flowers in a pathetic attempt to beg her to please oh please let him sleep with her.
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Bonnie
Missed this one
Please provide the overwhelming evidence fo evolution.
Last I checked the scientific method requires observation of repeatable experiments.
Can you please tell me when scientists where able to observe amino acids transform into living organisms?
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Let me fax this list through the inter-time-tube to my 20 year old self. He says he agrees, but no promises about the sex thing. He’s liking all the closeness and connection.
Now let me read it. Blech!
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“K see I even gave you two serves and answered and you want a third without giving back shit.”
I’m sorry, Gunslinger. It was clearly my mistake for assuming you would understand irony.
My point was to show that the burden of proof is on the accuser. You believe feminists hate men–prove it. It is not up to me to disprove such a stupid and inaccurate statement.
“See your not a woman any man should get with.”
Putting aside the fact that I am not a woman, what effect did you intend this remark to have on me? Did you expect to send a woman crying home? Do you honestly think so highly of your misogynistic ass that you believe a woman would care about some random stranger’s assessment of their dateability? What does that have to do with the argument at hand? Are you twelve years old? So many questions…
Here’s another one. How can someone who believes that men are people with self-control and responsibility be accused of hating men, while people who accuse men of being uncontrollable animals who need sex handed to them like candy lest they become murderers called “Men’s Rights Activists?”
Sounds rather backwards to me.
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So, you mean, evidence is not meaningful unless it follows the scientific method, right?
And the evidence of your bible is…
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mandy – I think you are the one who doesn’t get it. There are plenty of countries where the culture is more like the 50s America wet dream you are describing – why aren’t you there?
I am so glad I am subverting your bullshit cultural ideals. This is why we’re called progressives, you know – our ideas keep on going, and gaining strength, and yours are going under. Good riddance.
Of course things aren’t perfect now for men, women, their families, and our relationships with each other. But they never have been. Probably never will be. I hate tons of things about the way things are in our society. All I know is that the way things are better for me than they were for my mom (raised with bullshit 50s ideals, forced to enter the workforce and kept us fed and clothed somehow after my dad’s brain exploded and he could never work again), and way better than for her mother (her evil drunk father raped and beat her mother and brothers with no legal recourse, they nearly starved to death during the 30s due to that fuckwit ‘provider’, with no options).
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Dave–
“Exactly, xsplat.
You can take any women’s “list” of what she wants in a guy…and inevitably it all boils down to the unspoken and often unrecognized desire she REALLY wants…social dominance.
“I want a man that will bring me flowers when I’m sick.”
“I want a man that will cuddle with me and not expect sex.”
“I want a man that will cook special meals for me.”
“I want a man that will be sensitive to my needs, and open up and share with me and be communicative.”
You always see women with these sorts of laundry lists.
The addendum to any and all of these lists is this:
“…as long as he’s not a beta.”
A dominant alpha bringing a lady flowers feels like she’s special because she senses that he could be with any girl he chooses, but he chooses to give his affection to HER. (All women want to feel like they are the special, chosen one by a highly desirable man).
A beta supplicant is bringing flowers in a pathetic attempt to beg her to please oh please let him sleep with her.”
Of course, this is proof that women are totes socially dominant to men, as no man has ever made a mental list of what he views as attractive qualities in a woman.
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mandy, you don’t believe in evolution? AHA. AHAHAHA.
Again, it’s not my responsibility to educate you. I’m not going to change your mind. I will say though, that the theory of evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life.
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Mandy–“Men used to make (sometimes off color) jokes at work to keep it a happy, productive environment. Now women have mucked all that up.”
Yet more misandry disguised as men’s rights. Not all men need institutionalized racism and sexism in order to enjoy a happy, productive environment. If someone needs to resort to those hackneyed, dried up wells of comedy in order to make a joke, than they clearly don’t have a very good sense of humor. And if someone feels the need to oppress others in order to make themselves feel better, than they have no business calling themselves a man.
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K
I couldn’t make heads or tails of what you wrote. And it doesn’t seem you are talking to anything I’ve spoken about.
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What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?
Tokyo, is that you?
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Bonnie
No.
P.S. “LOL” is a sign of being too stupid to know how stupid you are. Use grown up words. Explain yourself. Or do you prefer to use emoticons to express your “self”?
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What I want in a relationship:
*Trust
*Good communication
*Mutual respect
*Shared values
*No manipulation or mindgames, of the alpha or beta variety (it’s all the same shit)
*Good sex on a regular basis (have to admit if BF gained weight or grew a big beard I would probably lose sexual interest)
*Mostly positive interactions – no nagging, negging, screaming fights, flinging accusations. If we argue we address the issue at hand, no ‘you always do this’ and ‘you never do that’
And as a bonus – a shared interest or two. My BF and I, have a huge veg garden we tend together. Other than that we don’t have many common interests. He likes sports and movies, I like books and my dogs. We aren’t friends with each other’s friends.
We’re nice to each other. I rub his back when it hurts. He rubs my feet when they’re sore. He gives orders all the time and I follow them (it amuses him to bark orders, and I know he’s right because I’ve known him for 5 years and he’s smart as hell). If I ask him to do something (I don’t bark) he does it right away. He makes 3x more money than me – but I don’t use it. I cook for him more than he cooks for me – because I like cooking and would do it for myself anyway.
I still fail to see where dominance factors into our relationship. Sure, he’s louder and more physical – he’s a medium-sized man. I have a soft voice and am comparatively weak – I am a hundred-pound woman. We have different personalities and interests that are influenced by our sex. But when it comes down to the core, we’re pretty goddamn equal. Not exactly the same, but we have equal weight in the relationship.
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xsplat –
P.S. LOL means ‘laughing out loud’. Sorry for the confusion.
P.P.S. I still think I’m smarter than you!
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I’m reminded of a Monty Python skit, by John Kleese.
“What do you mean I have no sense of humor! I’m funny! I understand your jokes! Well, no, not really, but I know what humor is!”
Tell us a joke, K.
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Feminist:
”””””””Bonnie
I am so glad I am subverting your bullshit cultural ideals. This is why we’re called progressives, you know – our ideas keep on going, and gaining strength, and yours are going under. Good riddance.”””””””’
Femspeak:
”””””””on August 6, 2009 at 7:10 pm Bonnie
All I’m saying is that I think you are wrong (and probably what I would consider ‘dumb’). I’m not under any onus to educate you or provide evidence to why I think I’m right. ””””””””
Are normal fare here from feminists is below.
”””””Bonnie,
“I know lots of people like you, it’s just not for me. Don’t get me wrong – I don’t like men.”””””””
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Wow, you people are not good at making connections, are you?
xplat, you said: “You think you are making a positive argument, but what you are instead showing is that women DO NOT WANT to have empathy for the male condition. You not only can not, but you do not want to have it.
A man with a moderate to high libido who is not getting laid is living in hell. It’s a lifestyle of mental anguish. Every moment is a reminder to him of his pain.”
My point was that most people will have empathy for a person who doesn’t get to enjoy an active sex life, as long as that person isn’t a complete asshole who values his or her sexual satisfaction above other people’s lives and their right to choose. You, and most of the other commenters on this blog, have failed to meet that basic requirement for empathy. You can’t expect people to feel sorry for you when you lash out at women in such a hateful fashion. You are a whiny privileged asshole who wants something for nothing. If I were the kind of person who used such misogynistic language, I would be forced to call you a pussy. Instead I will settle for drama queen.
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Dave, your argument seemed to be that women who make such lists as the one you posted are interested in social dominance, and their expectations are unfair and wrong. If I understood wrong, please tell me. My counter-point was that men do the exact same thing, yet you only criticize one sex. Why is that?
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Where did you guys find this one? Was this on a Feminist site? I’d like to addend this to be entitled:
“Things that make me want to choke and die on my own vomit because it’s better than the inane boredom of being with a man who does things that are this utterly uncreative and sappy.”
My list is much easier:
1. Stand there, don’t say a word, and just look good.
[editor: so i take it your backup plan will be celibate monasticism when you have aged so badly in a few years that no good looking man will even want to fuck you?]
My demands are simple and easy to understand.
[from simpletons come simple demands.]
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Wow, Gunslingr, you’ve found one feminist who has said she doesn’t like men. Clearly I must rethink this entire movement!
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My counter-point was that men do the exact same thing, yet you only criticize one sex. Why is that?
Men are more honest and self-aware about what they want: young, good looking, with a good personality.
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Of course, Bonnie, the posters on this site will call you a liar for the description of your relationship. Because they can’t imagine an egalitarian relationship existing. Because they hate men.
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“My counter-point was that men do the exact same thing, yet you only criticize one sex. Why is that?
Men are more honest and self-aware about what they want: young, good looking, with a good personality.”
So? How does that make women cruel oppressors of men?
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@ Bonnie –
Yet you proclaim to be smarter than everyone here?
LOL (thanks for translating that for xsplat…)
@ K –
You understood wrong. Women’s lists of what they want in a guy are all over the internet. You can literally find women who make lists of up to 100 of these types of things they say they long for.
But what is never said, is that these are the things she would like from an ALPHA male. The kind of man that she admires, respects, defers and submits to. The kind of man that makes her “‘gina tingle” with lust.
In other words, when a woman says “I want a man that will bring me flowers when I’m sick,”
what do you think her reaction would be to a guy like Sodini bringing her flowers?
“Ewww…creepy stalker thinks he can get into my panties just because he brought me flowers!.”
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xsplat, do you really think it’s impossible to make a joke that isn’t racist or sexist?
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””””””””’K
Wow, Gunslingr, you’ve found one feminist who has said she doesn’t like men. Clearly I must rethink this entire movement!””””””””””
Now you are being dishonest. I am sure you have been to feminist sites and have internalized a lot of it. I only go occasionaly and then read things like a woman talking about a 4 year old boy jacking off. I mean wtf is that.
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Bonnie, because your so smarter than all of us, I’ll reiterate the most relevant parts:
He gives orders all the time and I follow them (it amuses him to bark orders, and I know he’s right because I’ve known him for 5 years and he’s smart as hell). If I ask him to do something (I don’t bark) he does it right away. He makes 3x more money than me – but I don’t use it. I cook for him more than he cooks for me – because I like cooking and would do it for myself anyway.
I still fail to see where dominance factors into our relationship.
He barks.
You ask.
Yet you fail to see how dominance factors in to your relationship?
Here’s another one you might want to translate for xsplat: LMAO.
You don’t even know it, yet you have just confirmed one of the primary themes of this blog.
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K, I find your comments painful to parse. Go on with whatever you’re doing – I just don’t find it entertaining or educational. How old are you anyway? What education? What life history?
Ya, that’s what I thought.
Naive expectation that will lead to dissapointment.
Don’t do too much of that. It can be unwanted.
Don’t do too much of that. That’s called projection, expectation, and putting your mate on a pedestal.
Gag. *cough* social masturbator! *cough*
And no teasing. And no foreplay with teasing. And don’t give me any surprises that you planned to execute in order to tittilate me, against my will. I’ll tell you when I’m ready.
And since you’ve been with 0 to 5 other boys, you’d know what good sex is. It’s when you come, once, right?
You got one right.
Correct again. That’s merely bonus points.
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So K lets do reverse excersise and you can show us where people on this site hate woman?
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xplat
“And the evidence of your bible is…”,/i>
NONE.
I’ve never claimed the Bible is based on science. Faith is a whole other realm.
Evolution on the other hand claims to be based on science.
links to observations and experiments on the creation of life from inanimate object please….
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LOL, you guys are fucking hilarious. Since when is sex a right? Oh man, I love laughing at the pathetic asses of men who will never get laid. 🙂 Have you ever considered that maybe the women aren’t being cruel — maybe you’re just a filthy, disgusting human being that NOBODY wants to go near?
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””””””on August 6, 2009 at 9:34 pm Serena
LOL, you guys are fucking hilarious. Since when is sex a right? Oh man, I love laughing at the pathetic asses of men who will never get laid. Have you ever considered that maybe the women aren’t being cruel — maybe you’re just a filthy, disgusting human being that NOBODY wants to go near?””””””””””””””
Exhibit b for why men will go and kill woman and why suicide should be condoned.
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Clueless K, she’s being perfectly honest about her relationship, and I buy it 100%.
She’s with a man she respects…and he dominates her. It’s plain as day.
There’s nothing “equal” about it.
He BARKS
She ASKS.
He leads, she follows.
She found someone for whom she recognizes is smart and she follows him willingly.
This is why they are so happy…they are fulfilling their gender roles as they were meant to.
This is the very heart of hypergamy.
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***********
K
xsplat, do you really think it’s impossible to make a joke that isn’t racist or sexist?
***********
I got a bad reputation, in town.
It’s something I can’t live down.
They call me a loser, a no good boozer,
and tell me I act like a clown.
But if you don’t like, my face and style,
Don’t waste time, trying to tell me how,
Just show me,
And get your own bad reputation.
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Mandy, I gave up ages ago debating with true believers.
Also, I’ve decided that some untruthful beliefs are useful crutches. For instance, when learning Chi-kung, it’s best to believe that the energies are “real”. Its very motivating that way.
So continue with that.
For a while.
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Good lord, you people are sad, nihilistic human beings. I won’t be talking to you guys anymore. I naively thought that maybe I could say or do something to prevent any more women from being murdered, but clearly you are so insane that you still blame this incident on women, not the man who pulled the trigger. It’s sick and disgusting, and I can’t look at it anymore without vomiting. I hope someone can eventually talk some sense into you sickos before you hurt anyone else, but I really fear that it is a pointless effort. Good luck to Bonnie and the few other good people here.
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One last idea to implant into your nearly exploding head, K.
On your deathbed, will you tittilate yourself with more shock and awe revulsion, like you do now?
I bet you like action and horror movies.
“Oh! My word!”
I’ll bet you my will against yours that my deathbed will be way more cool than yours.
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Oh, I can’t resist,
This preciousness.
This superb picture shows the difference between feminists and normal women.
Feminists need to see this often.
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My mom barks orders and my dad was always soft-spoken. We were always more obedient with my dad – he was the more consistent parent and treated us with respect. Mom makes a lot of noise and slapped us around, but we had less respect for her. My dad seemed scared when she yelled, and when they fought it seemed 50/50. We followed him around the country furthering his career, though.
I don’t think tone of voice determines who is ‘dominant’. Say a woman nags, verbally humiliates, and slaps her husband, and he responds first by shutting down, then by yelling and hitting her. Who’s dominant here? Him, because he can hurt her physically more and might get the last word in cause he’s stronger and louder? Her, because when she angers him first he tries submission, then loses his shit and screams and beats her? I see this pattern in a lot of relationships.
For the record, when BF and I have a real fight I have won every one so far. Major decisions fall to me, I carry heavier stuff (I like excuses to build strength doing everyday stuff and he’s older and his back hurts lately), I write out all our bills with my checks, and I initiate sex 80% of the time. I don’t think his masterful tone of voice in 10% of situations says that much about our relationship. You might disagree I guess.
I will agree with you though, ‘beta’ behavior as you describe it sounds unbearable. I would never date a person (male or female) who put me on a pedestal, had a sense of entitlement and felt victimized, and kissed my ass all day long. Ugh. On the other hand your description of a lot of ‘alpha’ behavior makes me want to vomit as well. Being someone who’s assertive without being douchy is something that might be born, not made..
We’re a lot like dogs, after all. My two male dogs are always loudly fighting with each other for food and attention, but the little old bitch (15 and 50 lbs less than them) rules the roost. She doesn’t even have to bite them to rule them – they look where she looks, they bark when she barks, and they never steal her food. She ignores them most of the time, and because they’re bigger and younger she gets knocked down and pushed aside a lot. Dominance and submission isn’t always clear to see.
Also, for the record – my poor opinion of men in general has been greatly influenced by my BF. ‘Most men are pigs’. ‘Why else would he want to be friends with her, if he didn’t want to fuck her?’ I’m the one that tells him friendship without sexual tension is possible between straight men and women. Technically. He thinks many men are inherently uncouth rapists.. I agree.. I try to be a little more positive than he is.
Maybe I just fall for his good acting when he seems to not be like you guys. Of course, he hates you people and refuses to spend time with you..
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K wrote,
but clearly you are so insane that you still blame this incident on women, not the man who pulled the trigger.
Odd that K also thinks that the 9/11 terrorists were justifiably reacting to what America did to them, and that the blame should not go to the people who actually conducted the terrorism.
Actually, it is not odd. Logic and leftism/feminism don’t mix.
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Bonnie wrote:
Please note, that this is how a typical modern American women defines a relationship that is…
Again, you confirm exactly the kind of themes we discuss here.
Please do keep demonstrating how you are smarter than the rest of us. You’re doing a great job of it so far.
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xsplat
Come on, bringing up my religion is an amateur red herring. So you don’t have any proof do you?
my faith has nothing to do with the fact that no one has observed the creation of life from inanimate objects.
Just admit that you can only believe but can never prove evolution.
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Also for the record – I like that my BF is a man. He acts in many ‘manly’ ways. He doesn’t cry. He loves sports. He’s good with cars and can fix stuff. He raises his voice more than me. He’s bigger, stronger, taller, and hairier than me. He likes to pick me up and can throw me around. It’s great.
I just think you’re taking too black and white a view of the possibilities for relationships between men and woman. I don’t want us to be the same. I like us how we are. I think men and women are different on a deep level. I think the reason he likes to order me around and I will ‘ask’ instead is probably mostly due to our sexes. Just because I am a feminist doesn’t mean I have to deny it.
Things the feminist movement has brought me: we don’t have to get married to have sex or a relationship. We can plan if we want children, and how many. I don’t have to depend on him for money/stuff. I can legally own my possessions and money I make. If something happened to him and we had children, I would have a better chance of survival. If he decided to become a deadbeat dad, I have legal options to force him to offer some support. If he beats me or rapes me, I have more options for escape/help/making sure he doesn’t do that to anyone else.
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“Just admit that you can only believe but can never prove evolution.”
Evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life.
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””K,
Good luck to Bonnie and the few other good people here.
””””””””
See I knew K was a woman because bonnie doesn’t like men.
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The Fifth Horseman,
Do you think ugly women choose feminism cause they can’t get a douche of their own, or that women who embrace feminism become ugly by association?
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K left us wanting didn’t show where we hate woman just kept saying it over and over.
Then the examples of woman coming on here over and over where too much I guess.
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I can legally own my possessions and money I make.
This was true w/o feminism
Typical histrionic ridiculousness of the perpetual victim mentality.
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Bonnie asked :
Do you think ugly women choose feminism cause they can’t get a douche of their own, or that women who embrace feminism become ugly by association?
Do you really want us to answer that honestly?
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Like I said upthread, in the 30s my great-grandmother and her sons really didn’t have the options of escaping my psycho drunken, raping, beating great-grandfather. They tried to get away. He found them. He didn’t bring any money to the family. They went hungry. The police wouldn’t do anything.
Men still do horrific shit to their wives and children (women too, but not as often). But we really do have more options now for stopping them/helping their victims.
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The Fifth Horseman,
yes, I am curious! Maybe if it’s the latter I’ll reconsider my position. Another women saved from the ravages of time and feminism!
I am also curious about what you might have to say about so few women these days identifying as feminists. Women I know (especially those my age and younger) see it as a dirty word or even an insult. Yet it seems like the policies and social trends it engendered are still going strong. It confuses me.
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Men still do horrific shit to their wives and children (women too, but not as often). But we really do have more options now for stopping them/helping their victims.
Women do tons of horrific shit to honorable, dutiful, law-abiding men. Much more than the other way around.
Yet, we have no options now for stopping them/helping their victims.
That is why women have it much better in America than men do. Men are becoming second class citizens. A few heroic women like Dr. Helen Smith and Amy Alkon are working to bring visibility to this misandry.
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@k
Seriously? No one who says such namby pamby Trotsky-ite crap has any business calling themselves a man.
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Bonnie
You need to realize that if it wasn’t for what you consider “rape,” most people wouldn’t be here.
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“Please do keep demonstrating how you are smarter than the rest of us. You’re doing a great job of it so far.”
Aw, shucks.
/sarcasm
Please share your insights about how I reaffirm points made on this site. I am honestly interested.
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Bonnie asked :
I am also curious about what you might have to say about so few women these days identifying as feminists.
Because most ‘feminists’ over the age of 30 are misandric hate-mongers who suck all the joy out of those in their vicinity.
Women I know (especially those my age and younger) see it as a dirty word or even an insult.
Because it is. Modern ‘feminists’ are to sane women what Al-Qaeda beheaders are to average Muslims.
Yet it seems like the policies and social trends it engendered are still going strong.
It is not 1909 anymore Bonnie. It is 2009. There are no such policies or social trends that you imagine.
For example, the absurd myth that women are paid less than men for the same job. No person, man or woman, who actually works in a corporate job in the real world would believe such a thing. It is simply not true.
It is a myth created to dupe feminists and keep them mad, much like the tooth fairy myth was created to force children to be good.
It confuses me.
It always will. You are not a normal person.
What are your views on Tammy Bruce, by the way? She is a feminist (a genuine one, not a misandrist who calls herself a feminist).
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Bonnie is what cannon was talking about with the team of feminists and 30 different lives that don’t intersect anywhere.
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Passes batton to tood.
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High fives mandy
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mandy – I wouldn’tbe here. My grandmother was the product of rape.
Does that make it something that’s good for people? The fact that it’s always happened constantly? Warfare and murder between men has happened constantly in history too – I still think it fucking sucks and the less of it the better.
“Women do tons of horrific shit to honorable, dutiful, law-abiding men.”
Yes, they do. It’s awful. But they don’t seriously injure them, kill them, or rape them very often. ‘Statistics prove’, if they prove anything.
I would consider being murdered by my husband/boyfriend the ultimate horrific act. I don’t think there’s anything I could do that would be as bad, besides kill him. I don’t think there’s anything a person can do to another person that justifies murder – except attempt to kill them or a loved one first.. being a lying, cheating, moneygrubbing evil person doesn’t cut it.
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Bonnie wrote :
am also curious about what you might have to say about so few women these days identifying as feminists. Women I know (especially those my age and younger) see it as a dirty word or even an insult.
If this really is true, then this is the best news I have heard in weeks. Much like when local tribesmen in Al-Anbar province rose up against Al Qaeda amd toppled them.
However, I am beginning to think Bonnie is a dude who is parodying an extreme feminist, in order to make feminists look bad (quite effectively, I might add). I give this a 50% chance at this point – that ‘Bonnie’ is a parody and not for real.
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@Bonnie
Does that make it something that’s good for people?
I’m partial to existence myself
I don’t think there’s anything a person can do to another person that justifies murder
What if their conception is inconvenient for their mother?
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“Yet it seems like the policies and social trends it engendered are still going strong.”
By this I meant all the things the guys here upthread were complaining about. No provider role for men, destruction of nuclear families, serial killers who were raised by single mothers, unfeminine women, etc.
Do you think ‘feminism’ is still alive? Is it winning a battle or a war? Will it go back whence it came and will women retreat from the workplace?
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”””””’Bonnie,
Yes, they do. It’s awful. But they don’t seriously injure them, kill them””””””””
Death is not the worste thing you can do to a man.
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Dam both mandies came out woodwork.
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“Odd that K also thinks that the 9/11 terrorists were justifiably reacting to what America did to them, and that the blame should not go to the people who actually conducted the terrorism.
Actually, it is not odd. Logic and leftism/feminism don’t mix.”
I’ve been reading here for a while, and I admit I haven’t been able to read every single comment, but did K actually say this, or are you making it up?
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@bonnie
Is it winning a battle or a war?
Wait, I thought war was always bad? So actually war is bad unless it is against men ?
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By this I meant all the things the guys here upthread were complaining about. No provider role for men, destruction of nuclear families, serial killers who were raised by single mothers, unfeminine women, etc.
Do you think ‘feminism’ is still alive? Is it winning a battle or a war? Will it go back whence it came and will women retreat from the workplace?
Those social trends are very much alive, and will continue apace — there are two possible endgames: (1) new technologies come along and change the game again the way contraceptive and abortion technologies did a few decades ago or (2) continued civilizational decline as men continue to retreat from being seriously engaged in society, eventually leading to a transition from western civilization to something else.
Either is possible, really, but the genie isn’t going back into the bottle unless she takes the whole civilization down with her.
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“However, I am beginning to think Bonnie is a dude who is parodying an extreme feminist, in order to make feminists look bad (quite effectively, I might add). I give this a 50% chance at this point – that ‘Bonnie’ is a parody and not for real.”
Do I really seem so extreme?
I can’t prove anything. All I can say is that I’m a 24-year-old woman sitting in a office chair.
The word ‘feminist’ is indeed a dirty one to many young women. But like many people, they think a ‘feminist’ hates all men and wants women to run the world or something. Once they check out the dictionary definition, most realize they agree with the concept. Women should have the options to live how they choose. That doesn’t mean all women have to act like men or want the same things men do.
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“However, I am beginning to think Bonnie is a dude who is parodying an extreme feminist, in order to make feminists look bad (quite effectively, I might add). I give this a 50% chance at this point – that ‘Bonnie’ is a parody and not for real.”
Except that Bonnie’s comments are not even close to anything an “extreme” feminist would actually say. Aside from not having male friends, She actually seems pretty right-of-center to most feminists I’ve encountered. That you interpret her comments as radical strikes me as quite hilarious. It shows that you don’t actually know what feminists say and do, which makes all of your criticisms against feminism invalid. and it makes me wonder how you’d react if you actually read a radical feminist blog. Your head would probably explode.
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Thanks for the thoughtful answer, novaseeker.
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@bonnie
You really need to familiarize yourself with the unintended consequences of feminism or you are in for a harsh surprise.
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“Death is not the worste thing you can do to a man.”
No, having to pay child support or alimony, or *gasp* not getting sex are clearly so much worse than rape or murder. Those wimminz have it so easy.
*eyeroll*
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Bonnie wrote :
I can’t prove anything. All I can say is that I’m a 24-year-old woman sitting in a office chair.
Ah. Now we are getting somewhere.
24, eh? Let me give you some advice : Your opinions are likely to change by the time you hit 30, so don’t scream about feminism too loudly. You will have an embarassing time explaining that you no longer believe at 30 what you did at 24. It happens to many of us.
Let me ask you : What career are you currently in?
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Seriously, Chris. It seems like I agree in fundamentals with more of the (not batshit crazy-seeming) people here than I do in a typical feminist community. I think it’s idiotic to assume that men and women are ‘socialized’ to act the way they do.
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Watching your parents get an ugly divorce more dehabilitating than being murdered. After your murdered your just dead. Not your fault if there is god doesn’t judge you. Watching parents divorce fucks up a piece of your soul and you get to live with that.
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novaseeker
I agree but I see one more option. That is a repeat of the 1930s when economic crisis did what no conservative or traditionalist ever could or can now do and that was curtail the excess of the 1920s including budding feminism.
This would put us back in Buckley territory we talked about the other day with a continual push-pull stagnation but probably you’re right. This would lead to some new or non-Western culture.
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Don’t pull the ‘oh, when you’re older and wiser card’. People have been trying that shit on me since I was a little kid and they’ve been wrong so far.
I don’t have a career. I have never been interested in having one. I do what I have to do, here and there, to make money to support myself. Wait tables, work retail, office jobs. I don’t need much money. I prefer to spend my time doing things other than answering to a boss or stressing about work or paying for objects.
My only real ‘goal’ since I was a child myself has been to have kids and spend as much time raising them as possible. That goal has yet to change, despite constant lecturing.
“You really need to familiarize yourself with the unintended consequences of feminism or you are in for a harsh surprise.”
I have a feeling you’re hinting I’m going to get raped. You’re a real nasty one.
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Bonnie: I think it’s idiotic to assume that men and women are ’socialized’ to act the way they do.
Is it really idiotic to recognize that men and women are encouraged from birth to act differently? That men and women are pushed their entire lives towards gender roles to which they would not otherwise gravitate? Do you honestly not think that boys and girls are treated differently as soon as they’re out of the womb?
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Bonnie,
Don’t pull the ‘oh, when you’re older and wiser card’. People have been trying that shit on me since I was a little kid and they’ve been wrong so far.
Are you saying that none of your opinions, at age 24, have changed from what they were at 18, 15, or 12?
If they have changed, why do you think that process has stopped?
Tell you what. Write down your views on feminism, and store them where they will be safe (like your email inbox or whatever). Then look at them again in 6-8 years. You will be shocked with what you believed at age 24.
My only real ‘goal’ since I was a child myself has been to have kids and spend as much time raising them as possible.
A perfectly fine goal. If you do manage to have a husband and kids, however, you will probably end up voting (gasp!) Republican by that time. Marriage and kids cause a 20-point shift rightwards in women’s voting.
I prefer to spend my time doing things other than answering to a boss or stressing about work or paying for objects.
Fine. But until you actually work at a job in a for-profit business, don’t go around saying that ‘women are paid less than men for the same job’. You have no basis for knowing anything about the reality of the subject.
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“Watching your parents get an ugly divorce more dehabilitating than being murdered. After your murdered your just dead. Not your fault if there is god doesn’t judge you. Watching parents divorce fucks up a piece of your soul and you get to live with that.”
I had to finally respond because THIS WAS THE STUPIDEST THING I HAVE EVER HEARD. How about watching your dad kill or beat your mom? If you want to compete in the Oppression Olympics that one has got ‘divorce’ beat. Oh boo hoo, your mommy and daddy don’t want to be a couple anymore. What could be more painful and soul-scarring? (WTF??)
What about watching your dad become severely mentally and physically disabled (burst large brain aneurysm, coma, slow recovery) and your mom, who had been at home with you your whole life, have to now juggle raising three kids, caring for her husband who will never again be a normal adult or make any money, working fulltime and sinking into poverty regardless. That fucks you up too. Happened to me. I don’t believe in god or an afterlife so would rather be fucking alive, thanks, no matter the degree of soul-scarring.
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I neglected to mention yesterday that the award for word of the day went to “hebephrenic”
(we’ll leave that as a quiet hint among us)
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Well why I advocate for suicide being legal and socially accepted so you would have to have that shit right near the front of your mind all the time.
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The Fifth Horseman: If you do manage to have a husband and kids, however, you will probably end up voting (gasp!) Republican by that time. Marriage and kids cause a 20-point shift rightwards in women’s voting.
—
Recall she never actually said marriage or husband, only kids.
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“Watching your parents get an ugly divorce more dehabilitating than being murdered. After your murdered your just dead. Not your fault if there is god doesn’t judge you. Watching parents divorce fucks up a piece of your soul and you get to live with that.”
Gunslingr, while I find the adult-you repulsive beyond comprehension, I do feel sorry for child-you for going through this. I am lucky that my parents never had the intention of getting married, and thus, their not being together seems like the most natural thing in the world to me. I never had to see them grow apart or hate each other, and I can’t imagine what that must be like for a child.
But now that you’re an adult, you need to think things through rather than reacting emotionally. Whether or not divorce or death has worse psychological ramifications–for all parties involved, because we all know that the person who is murdered is not the only victim in the crime–do you really believe that someone who divorces a man is just as bad, or worse, as someone who kills a man?
That’s just not a rational belief. You have made a lot of comments on this thread that have made you sound suicidal, and that saddens me, because I think all human life is valuable and I do think you can turn your life around. But first you have to stop playing the victim and blaming women for your problems. I am also worried because I can see you becoming violent to others, not just yourself, and I really don’t want that to happen. Please, educate yourself and stop drinking the Kool-Aid from sites such as this. The man who shot up the gym full of women thought advice from these people would comfort or help him. He thought wrong. Please don’t make the same mistake.
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””””””””’What about watching your dad become severely mentally and physically disabled (burst large brain aneurysm, coma, slow recovery) and your mom, who had been at home with you your whole life, have to now juggle raising three kids, caring for her husband who will never again be a normal adult or make any money, working fulltime and sinking into poverty regardless. That fucks you up too. Happened to me. I don’t believe in god or an afterlife so would rather be fucking alive, thanks, no matter the degree of soul-scarring.”””””””””””””””””””
That is more possitive as a life experience than divorce though. You saw your mom take care of your dad not use the force of the state to kick him out of his own house.
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“Fine. But until you actually work at a job in a for-profit business, don’t go around saying that ‘women are paid less than men for the same job’. You have no basis for knowing anything about the reality of the subject.”
I never said that or anything like it. I don’t think you read my posts (for that I can’t blame you as they have been plentiful and long).
Sure, my opinions about various things have changed over the years. Never very much. I’ve been on the same basic trajectory my whole life. Saying ‘in 6-8 years you might agree with me more’ communicates your condensation, but means nothing. Even if 75% of self-proclaimed ‘liberal feminists’ turned into conservative anti-feminists when they popped out their first kid, I could still be part of the other 25%.. and I vehemently disagree with your bullshit right now.
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I echo H’s statement to Bonnie: socialization is a huge factor when it comes to gender roles. Evolutionary psychology may explain some of it, but it doesn’t account for everything. I think it’s a mixture of both.
But Bonnie is totally right in that there are millions of things more scarring than divorce. While I still do sympathize with children who go through this, Gunslingr, you have to quit the notion that you have the worst life ever. It will only kill you.
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Chris: Evolutionary psychology may explain some of it, but it doesn’t account for everything.
—
Oh don’t even get me started on evo-psych. Biggest pile of bullshit non-science ever. Notice it always upholds the status quo and male dominance.
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“That is more possitive as a life experience than divorce though. You saw your mom take care of your dad not use the force of the state to kick him out of his own house.”
She kicked him out later (after he could walk and speak normally) and she takes no responsibly for his well being (they are still legally married and she pays for his health insurance). He’s been on his own for 3 years now and is struggling financially and emotionally with no one to help. I am considering taking over his care if I can get him to cooperate (not easy). I’m furious with my mother over this. She thinks it’s just a dandy idea that I would be responsible for him. I have thrown her marriage vows in her face – they are very religious. If I believed in god I think he would hold this against her.
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“That is more possitive as a life experience than divorce though. You saw your mom take care of your dad not use the force of the state to kick him out of his own house.”
OK, my sympathy for you is evaporating quickly. You cannot trivialize other people’s traumatic experiences and then expect pity for your own. For God’s sakes, how fucking selfish can you be?
CHANGE, goddammit. Be better. The way you’ve been doing things clearly is not working for you. You are depressed and suicidal because of your attitude. That means you need to get a new one.
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”””””””Chris,
That’s just not a rational belief. You have made a lot of comments on this thread that have made you sound suicidal, and that saddens me, because I think all human life is valuable and I do think you can turn your life around. But first you have to stop playing the victim and blaming women for your problems. I am also worried because I can see you becoming violent to others, not just yourself, and I really don’t want that to happen. Please, educate yourself and stop drinking the Kool-Aid from sites such as this. The man who shot up the gym full of women thought advice from these people would comfort or help him. He thought wrong. Please don’t make the same mistake.””””””””’
Not sites like this doing it. When I went through two years with a gun to my head. I had only been through the wonderfull land of watching my parents divorce and my dad take the beating from the us government. The only sad part is I couldn’t kill myself. There is no help available for people who want to die except to tell them not to. There needs to be a place to go to get real actual actualized help. If the government is going to enforce laws that are completely ridiculas then they need to provide a way for people to die with dignity and clean up the refuse.
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“How about watching your dad kill or beat your mom? If you want to compete in the Oppression Olympics that one has got ‘divorce’ beat. blah blah blah I’m a harpy”
Compare the frequency with which the two events you’ve used in your analogy, unfairly initiated female divorce and male on female domestic abuse, occur.
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But GUESS WHAT gunslinger. I manage to be a happy person most of the time! I function! I still like women and want to be a mom (even though my mom sucks)! I still want to have kids with my BF even though he could drop dead any second! I’m a little angry, maybe, but I take it all out on the internet.
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To add to the anecdata, my parents never married and as soon as my mother told my father she was pregnant he ran away. He came back after six years but most men fucking don’t.
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Bonnie, clue me in. Are you berating the emo for being emo, or you trying to out emo the emo?
I’m guessing the former.
Next step, schadenfreude.
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Yeah, H, some of it makes sense to me, but so much of it just seems way too convenient to be true. And even if it is totally accurate, that doesn’t mean douchebags get to use it as an excuse to be douchebags. We aren’t animals, and even if it is in our “nature” to be oppressive alpha males who use women as sex objects, that doesn’t make it RIGHT.
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””””””’Chris,
OK, my sympathy for you is evaporating quickly. You cannot trivialize other people’s traumatic experiences and then expect pity for your own. For God’s sakes, how fucking selfish can you be? ”””””””””
Not looking for your sympathy looking to help other people not go through life if they don’t want to.
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HUNGRY HUNGRY HIPPOS YO: Compare the frequency with which the two events you’ve used in your analogy, unfairly initiated female divorce and male on female domestic abuse, occur.
—
Unfairly? So a woman should be forced to remain married to someone she dislikes or even despises?
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”””””””’xsplat
Bonnie, clue me in. Are you berating the emo for being emo, or you trying to out emo the emo?
I’m guessing the former.
Next step, schadenfreude.””””””””’
I wonder what percentage would do it and would it have a ripple effect if it became condoned by the media.
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Chris: And even if it is totally accurate, that doesn’t mean douchebags get to use it as an excuse to be douchebags.
—
Sample evo-psych articles I have actually seen:
Hey men it’s okay to make women do the shopping since they were “gatherers” and you were “hunters”.
Hey people we found that some male chimps played with toy cars and some female chimps played with dolls.
Hey men “forced copulation” happens tons in nature GO WILD.
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”’Bonnie,
I still like women and want to be a mom””””’
lol exactly
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Ya, I broke up with a woman, and got back together for the baby. Stupidest thing I ever did and I will never do it again. As attested by multiple abortions.
Not all women deserve a good man.
And I’m not good for the hell of it – not even good for a kid. I’m good step by step. Good to me, I’m good to you.
No commitment.
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“Are you berating the emo for being emo, or you trying to out emo the emo?”
I’m just trying to provide him with information really.
Lots of things are fucked up in life; your parents divorcing isn’t the worse that can happen; this is what happened to me, I made it through and I’m okay even though the situation is still pretty much awful.
The reason for gunslinger being miserable isn’t that his parents divorced or that women were shitty to him (I’m sure they were! Women are just as shitty as men a lot of the time!). It’s that he’s depressed, suicidal, and has problems dealing with life, and is still in the ‘blame everything else’ stage. I’ve been there, I got out of it by realizing the only thing that was going to change was me and doing things differently (got help, took pills, talked about my problems, got a more positive outlook, made small changes over time, stopped talking to my mom).
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Gunslingr,
You think you are actually helping people by telling them to kill themselves? You are one sick fuck. There are many, many other options available for you. For one, you can stop being a fucking misogynistic douchebag. That would greatly improve your life. And have you even tried seeking help from an actual mental health professional? I admit, it doesn’t always help and some of those people are full of shit, but you have to at least try. “Die with dignity?” You have already surrendered all your dignity. Giving up on life is a surrender of dignity. The only hope for you to get it back is if you take a long hard look at your life and change.
“Compare the frequency with which the two events you’ve used in your analogy, unfairly initiated female divorce and male on female domestic abuse, occur.”
You’d have to define “unfairly initiated female divorce,” first, which is a subjective opinion. I believe that if you don’t want to stay married to someone, for whatever reason, you shouldn’t have to. And I don’t see how anyone who actually believes in freedom can argue against that. There is no comparison between that inalienable right and actual physical abuse.
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”””””””Bonnie
But GUESS WHAT gunslinger. I manage to be a happy person most of the time! I function! I still like women and want to be a mom (even though my mom sucks)! I still want to have kids with my BF even though he could drop dead any second! I’m a little angry, maybe, but I take it all out on the internet.””””””””””””””
Yay me too beating life wow yea its great I love woman yea fantastic. Whats your point.
Just saying people should be allowed to make choices legal choices. Just like woman are allowed to kill there unborn babies so to should adults be able to kill themselves. What is the difference after all. I want people to be able to have control over there bodies. No one should be able to tell them what to do with their bodies. I believe it should be equal men and woman should both be equally able to abort themselves.
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H–
Haha, exactly. It’s so often used to justify rape, and it’s sickening.
I’ve even seen “studies” that provide “evidence” that men naturally like blue while women naturally like pink. I shit you not.
Still waiting on the answer to my earlier question: when did K say that the 9/11 terrorists were justified?
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xsplat: Not all women deserve a good man.
—
But all children deserve to be supported by their parents, and no adult is allowed to run away from parental responsibility. You can’t create a child and then proclaim “no commitment”.
My parents did not “get back together for the baby”. My father simply paid child support like he was legally obliged to do and became a larger part of my life. He is happier for it.
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@bonnie
“I have a feeling you’re hinting I’m going to get raped. You’re a real nasty one.”
No you rape obsessed dimwit!
I mean that the institutions in society will fall apart and the comfort and prosperity you’ve grown accustomed to will evaporate as men have little incentive to keep building and maintaining civilization.
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Gunner
You mean schadenfreude?
I used to think it was an unholy sin against empathy.
Now I just laugh. It really is funny to laugh at other peoples pain. I blame the internet.
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”””””Chris,
The only hope for you to get it back is if you take a long hard look at your life and change.””””””’
I am speaking about the past when I talk about when I was holding gun to head after 2 years I gave up on it.
I would like other people to have that option. The government should take away the stigma of doing it so that people aren’t having to do mass muders to be able to get the guts to off themselves. You want to save lives don’t ya Chris. This would probably save womans lives.
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lol xsplat it is funny. What if I am a billionaire and then off myself what a statement that would make on live tv eh.
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“I would like other people to have that option. The government should take away the stigma of doing it so that people aren’t having to do mass muders to be able to get the guts to off themselves. You want to save lives don’t ya Chris. This would probably save womans lives.”
Your logic does not resemble our earth logic.
You honestly think telling people that their lives don’t matter is going to make them more respectful of the lives of others? Just…really?
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“I mean that the institutions in society will fall apart and the comfort and prosperity you’ve grown accustomed to will evaporate as men have little incentive to keep building and maintaining civilization.”
—
Yes, yes, this argument (society will fucking CRUMBLE!) has been used against every social change. Abolition, suffrage, miscegenation, etc. Old hat.
Your implication that women enjoying the same freedoms and privileges as men will mean that men will just drop everything out of laziness or fear paints dudes with a terrible brush.
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Oh, and Bonnie, I didn’t get an implication of rape at all from that statement. However, there are many, many other comments on this thread where the threat of rape is far more explicit.
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Chris: Oh, and Bonnie, I didn’t get an implication of rape at all from that statement.
—
I could see where she was coming from with that one. Rape is a tool to control and silence women after all.
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H:
Oh don’t even get me started on evo-psych. Biggest pile of bullshit non-science ever. Notice it always upholds the status quo and male dominance.
Truth hurts.
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”””””””’Chris
“I would like other people to have that option. The government should take away the stigma of doing it so that people aren’t having to do mass muders to be able to get the guts to off themselves. You want to save lives don’t ya Chris. This would probably save womans lives.”
Your logic does not resemble our earth logic.
You honestly think telling people that their lives don’t matter is going to make them more respectful of the lives of others? Just…really?”””””””””
Well look how well abortion has turned out that the feminists pushed for. Millions and Millions served. Feminists seem to think it is a good thing. So I am just saying what could make helping people who are in pain or don’t want to be on the planet anymore die be so bad?
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Gunny, I hope I’m hope I’m up to it. But yeah, if I can see it at the time, that’s the god damdest funniest joke.
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“Your implication that women enjoying the same freedoms and privileges as men will mean that men will just drop everything out of laziness or fear paints dudes with a terrible brush.”
It’s just as K said earlier: conservatives, especially MRAs, have exactly the extreme pessimistic view of human beings that they accuse their opposition of having. They can’t imagine people having equal rights, or an equal relationship, because to them people are inherently evil and need traditional, strong, government-enforced morals thrust onto them. They also don’t like to have to analyze their moral system, because if it’s worked this long, surely any change to it would destroy everything? So they just blind themselves to alternative points of view. They are slaves to tradition, because they see people as too weak to come to their own decisions or make positive change.
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H:
Your implication that women enjoying the same freedoms and privileges as men will mean that men will just drop everything out of laziness or fear paints dudes with a terrible brush.
Incentives matter.
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“Well look how well abortion has turned out that the feminists pushed for. Millions and Millions served. Feminists seem to think it is a good thing. So I am just saying what could make helping people who are in pain or don’t want to be on the planet anymore die be so bad?”
Gunslingr, you’re comparing refusing to support another life form with your bodily fluids–something that has always been considered legal and a natural human right–with allowing someone to kill themselves, which has always been illegal except in the case of extreme illness.
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Chris: conservatives, especially MRAs, have exactly the extreme pessimistic view of human beings that they accuse their opposition of having.
—
I’ve always found that MRAs are either outright misogynist and/or want to escape all possible responsibility for all of their actions, or just mean well but place blame on feminists rather than the system that actually creates and enforces the gender role they despise. Feminists call that the patriarchy.
Either way you can’t actually reason with them.
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“Compare the frequency with which the two events you’ve used in your analogy, unfairly initiated female divorce and male on female domestic abuse, occur.”
You’d have to define “unfairly initiated female divorce,” first, which is a subjective opinion. I believe that if you don’t want to stay married to someone, for whatever reason, you shouldn’t have to. And I don’t see how anyone who actually believes in freedom can argue against that. There is no comparison between that inalienable right and actual physical abuse”
Look, people get divorced in a marriage with far greater frequency than one partner suffering abuse. It doesn’t take a genius to figure it out. People will do it for all sorts of retarded reasons, because human sexuality, especially female, is naturally volatile and fickle. Divorce, and the father absence and trauma to children which occurs almost inevitably, is a far more dangerous social pathology than male on female abuse. WHEN YOU HAVE CHILDREN, “whatever reason”, is not good enough for a divorce, because that divorce, and the inevitable father absence and trauma to the children which occurs due to the unjust family law system, has a dramatic impact on the well being of children. I think that women divorcing their husbands IN MARRIAGES WHERE CHILDREN ARE INVOLVED simply because they are no longer attracted to them is a heinous crime which, while not on the level of physical violence in the family, occurs with far greater frequency and badly needs to be addressed. The family law system needs to be structured to put the interests of children first, NOT OF WOMEN as it currently does. This has nothing to do with men’s rights, it has to do with protecting the welfare of children, would just happen to benefit from more stringent divorce laws.
That’s why bonnie’s analogy is silly. Men very very rarely beat or kill their husbands or children. Women very frequently dispose of their husbands on a whim at the expense of both the husband himself and children in the union. Feminists understate this in the interest of preserving lax divorce laws which give financial incentive to divorce, their stated reason being so that females don’t have to suffer abuse from their patriarchal male oppressors They are willfully oblivious to the fact that what they inflict on their children with divorces and the resulting absence of a father is a far more widespread and almost as dangerous of a crime. People, especially women but men as well, need to re prioritize and accept that the welfare of their children is above their dissatisfaction with their partner.
For marriages without children, I can accept your idea of an “inalienable right” to leave a partner, so long as there’s no financial incentive to leave your partner.
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Bonnie,
Let’s back up here.
You said you wanted to be a mom and have a lot of kids. Silly me, I assumed something that I should not have.
Do you want to be married to one man for life (the father of those kids), or do you want to be a single Mom?
If the latter, how will you afford those kids, since you also don’t want a career?
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“Incentives matter.”
And the incentive for men to make money will somehow go away if women have equal rights? How’s that work?
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They are slaves to tradition, because they see people as too weak to come to their own decisions or make positive change.
The vast majority of humanity are domesticated primates.
Not changing anytime soon.
Well, not until the Die-Off anyway.
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Oh dumb H
Abortion = 50 million dead babies since 1972 is not enough mayhem for you?
Suffrage = First thing on the agenda of the first female voters was Prohibition. Then came socialism. Nice legacy that one.
Misegenation = the white race was 35% of the world population in 1900.Now it is 8% predicted to be 2% by 2100 then eventually 0%. This is rather the opposite of much hyped “Diversity is our strength”
“Rape is a tool to control and silence women after all.”
NO it just isn’t. It is about sex.
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And the incentive for men to make money will somehow go away if women have equal rights? How’s that work?
Women have much more than equal rights right now. They have special privileges, and men are second class citizens.
It can scarcely get more lopsided against men than it is now.
If men and women have equal rights, then that would be an improvement for men, relative to the current situation.
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Chris: liberals, especially feminists, have exactly the extreme pessimistic view of human beings that they accuse their opposition of having.
–
I’ve always found that feminists are either outright misandrists and/or want to escape all possible responsibility for all of their actions, or just mean well but place blame on patriachy rather than the system that actually creates and enforces the gender role they despise. MRAs call that the matriarchy.
Either way you can’t actually reason with them.
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“People will do it for all sorts of retarded reasons, because human sexuality, especially female, is naturally volatile and fickle.”
Wait, wait, wait. I thought the evo-psych meme was that men are the ones who need multiple partners, while women will settle for one? So, which is it?
And regardless of whether no-fault divorce is good for children, the law cannot force people to stay married for any reason. It’s unconstitutional and wrong.
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Chris, you said:
…MRAs… extreme…pessimistic…can’t imagine…to them people are inherently evil…They also don’t like…So they just blind themselves…They are slaves
Clear concise thinking, Chris. Not emotionally biased – in fact in you clearly pointed out the faults of emotional bias.
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Oh “Many been here a while”, you can argue against abortion all you want, at least that’s a popular behavior. But claiming that suffrage and misegenation are bad ideas, too? Way to make yourself look like an absolute fool.
And you saying that rape is “about sex” says to me that, to you, sex is about humiliating, hurting, and destroying women. Fantastic.
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I’d give up my right to vote if it meant all other women would, too!
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Chris:
And the incentive for men to make money will somehow go away if women have equal rights? How’s that work?
Equal rights? Excuse me? Surely you’ve been here long enough to know that the feminist shibboleths which are regular gored on this blog have nothing to do with the notion of women being treated equally under the law.
We’re talking about UNfair, UNequal legal advantages and cultural attitudes.
If women are given incentives to indulge their capricious natures (whether through cultural rot or unfair marriage laws), men will no longer aspire to invest in what is basically a castle built on sand. No nuclear family formation, no community involvement. Atomized selfishness.
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It’s amazing that somehow having two people stay together “for the sake of the kids” who hate each other utterly and argue constantly, possibly escalating to minor physical violence on occasion, is better for children than their parents having a divorce.
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who hate each other utterly and argue constantly, possibly escalating to minor physical violence on occasion, is better for children than their parents having a divorce.
Yes. It is.
And if a woman wants to leave, fine. But why should she be entitled to money from the man, without having to prove that the man did anything wrong? What if she is just ‘bored with the man’? Why should she get any of his money, that too in the form of alimony after the divorce?
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Chris:
Wait, wait, wait. I thought the evo-psych meme was that men are the ones who need multiple partners, while women will settle for one? So, which is it?
I know you’ve been here long enough to know better than this. Dumbass.
And regardless of whether no-fault divorce is good for children, the law cannot force people to stay married for any reason. It’s unconstitutional and wrong.
We’re talking about divorce laws that unfairly favor women and make it easier for them to break up families and ruin lives.
INCENTIVES MATTER.
Got it?
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Chris, you have to understand the mentality to understand what they’re really saying when they say “unfairly initiated divorce”.
What I’m about to say is not flattering, but it’s not meant to come off as harsh as it seems.
A person who does not appreciate their own individuality, is not going to appreciate someone else’s.
There are many women who stay in marriages for financial reasons, and sometimes social reasons. Some men who aren’t even sexually attracted to their wives anymore, also stay in marriages for social and financial reasons. It may also be because of a kind of familial love, but it’s not romantic love. Sometimes it’s not really even familial love, but just the base social and financial symbiosis.
On a cultural/national scale, beta males are all of the ones who aren’t in the top leadership positions. Plenty of them may be alpha in their homes or in their “swinging bachelorhood”, but these are relative positions.
Aside of being the bulk of the population, they are its backbone…it’s stability. If they have too much freedom, and nobody telling them what to do with it, they are lost. So what used to be very good reasons to stay in a marriage are currently no longer considered good reasons because of an idea of freedom that really doesn’t benefit people who are better suited for a bit less freedom and more stability.
So although people should have the freedom to get out of a marriage if there is abuse or other unlivable conditions, many are using their freedom to get out of marriages just because the thrill is gone. They don’t understand that the thrill always goes, and what they need, especially if they have kids, is marriage counseling, not a divorce.
There is plenty of freedom for people who are married and realistic. Even for those who like to screw around, there is swinging. For the other kinds of “freaks” there are also communities where someone could indulge their fantasies in a safe and supportive way *without destroying their marriages*.
Divorce should be the last resort. Now it’s the easy solution.
Why it seems unfair to many is because people’s lives are being upturned and sometimes wrecked for a freedom that isn’t really freedom for them. The man or the one in the traditionally masculine position of provider, is still obligated after the woman or the one in the traditionally feminine position, is freed. That’s not equality.
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The Fifth Horseman: And if a woman wants to leave, fine. But why should she be entitled to money from the man, without having to prove that the man did anything wrong?
—
Spousal support is based entirely on income and not granted automatically. Either spouse may request it. Usually men make more than their wives. Perhaps the centuries of disallowing women from entering the workplace has something to do with that.
You didn’t actually explain how it is better for the child to have two parents who hate each other and argue constantly.
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””””””””””””””Chris
“Well look how well abortion has turned out that the feminists pushed for. Millions and Millions served. Feminists seem to think it is a good thing. So I am just saying what could make helping people who are in pain or don’t want to be on the planet anymore die be so bad?”
Gunslingr, you’re comparing refusing to support another life form with your bodily fluids–something that has always been considered legal and a natural human right–with allowing someone to kill themselves, which has always been illegal except in the case of extreme illness.””””””””””””””””””
Your just shutting off your own life form. I bet some of the woman might be slightly upset that they just helped kill a human being with arms and legs and a head and eyes and a nose and ears. Except the baby is innocent that the mother is killing. I am talking about adult human beings being able to leave the planet with some help.
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Mandy been here a few times (God damned Tulkus think they know it all)
Concision. Two points.
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h
Perhaps the centuries of disallowing women from entering the workplace has something to do with that.
Good grief! No one disallowed them, poor women always worked.
It was a privilege to get to stay home and take care of one’s own children and home. The prerogative of the rich only for much of human history.
You didn’t actually explain how it is better for the child to have two parents who hate each other and argue constantly.
This assumes the false dichotomy that it is either divorce or live in a hostile mess. most couples who consider divorce but stick out are happy that they did 5 years later.
Children actually are better with a mother and father full time. Contrary to pop psych kids don’t give a rat’s tutu about adult’s happiness.
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“People will do it for all sorts of retarded reasons, because human sexuality, especially female, is naturally volatile and fickle.”
Wait, wait, wait. I thought the evo-psych meme was that men are the ones who need multiple partners, while women will settle for one? So, which is it?
And regardless of whether no-fault divorce is good for children, the law cannot force people to stay married for any reason. It’s unconstitutional and wrong.”
It’s obvious you aren’t aquainted with evolutionary psychology’s theories of human sexuality, but to sum it up for you, women are hypergamous, males are polygamous. Monogomy was designed to mitigate the ill effects of both gender’s sexuality in the interest of creating lifelong pair bonds because those pair bonds produced the healthiest, physically, mentally, and emotionally, offspring. Further, it insured parental investment from the parents of both genders, which drove society forward. Monogamy was destroyed by feminists, and now we gradually regress to the mating patterns of the baboon pack in which only a small percentage of males mate with a large percentage of females. This creates many displaced men who are uninvested in society and their children, forcibly in the case of family law, even if a divorced father wants to, he often can’t help the upbringing of his child. I suggest you read F. Roger Devlin’s “Sexual Utopia in Power” (http://www.theoccidentalquarterly.com/archives/vol6no2/DevlinTOQV6N2.pdf)
Until then, don’t claim to speak for evolutionary psychologists.
The law can, has, and should provide incentives not to divorce. Before feminism, divorce was financial suicide in all cases, now it can be hitting the lottery in some cases, and almost always financially beneficial in the other. Add to that the ability of women to pursue their hypergamous sexuality after the divorce instead of being with a washed up beta, and we are where we are today with Monogamy destroyed, millions of men displaced, unmarried, exempt from the gene pool, and having little investment in society. We have more men like Sodini. I don’t believe, as many of the commenters have suggested, that Sodini’s rampage was caused solely by sexual deprivation. If he had a wife and kids he was invested in, regardless of how often he was getting his rocks off, there is no way in hell this would have happened.
Which leads us back to family law. There needs to be more stringent laws regarding divorce, especially with children involved, so that there are as few displaced, uninvested, sexless men roaming around building anger toward women and society. With even more primacy than that, the welfare of children will see dramatic improvement with the return of nuclear families. People who support such unjust divorce laws are essentially prioritizing the whims and nature of volatile female sexuality over the welfare of men and children. You’re right, the law can’t force people to stay married, it doesn’t need to. It needs to stop providing incentives to WOMEN filing for divorce, those being financial benefits and almost inevitable custody of children if desired.
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Ghost
Either that, or fresh pussy. To feel alive again. Because that’s a good thing.
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MBHAW says, “Good grief! No one disallowed them, poor women always worked.
It was a privilege to get to stay home and take care of one’s own children and home. The prerogative of the rich only for much of human history.”
Thank you. I’m glad someone said it.
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“Mandy been here for a while”: Good grief! No one disallowed them, poor women always worked.
It was a privilege to get to stay home and take care of one’s own children and home. The prerogative of the rich only for much of human history.
—
I misspoke, I should have said “advancing” instead of “entering”.
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http://www.fatherhood.org/father_factor.asp
to all the people who are somehow trying to argue divorce laws are fair because 2 parents (mother and father) aren’t better than 1 (mother). You are misandrists of the worst kind if you can look at the facts and continue this belief.
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h
I misspoke, I should have said “advancing” instead of “entering”.
Most men were not able to advance either. only the rich and well connected got ahead. Coal miners shoveled coal until they died, soldiers fought until they died, sewer workers breathed in sewage until they died.
Just pawns in someone else’s game. Had nothing to do with gender really.
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I wonder how many of those “fatherless” homes are due to men refusing to take responsibility and simply leaving rather than women refusing to allow the fathers to take part in their child’s life.
I also wonder how much those stats have to do with poverty rather than with being fatherless.
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Chris (a suspiciously androgynous name (wrote) :
Perhaps the centuries of disallowing women from entering the workplace has something to do with that.
And with that, the parasitism of ‘feminists; shows.
Who cares about ‘centuries ago’? Why should people today suffer for that?
You are white. I am colored. Because your ancestors oppressed me, I am entitled to your resources today. So pay up.
Now listen good :
Anyone who thinks a woman is entitled to alimony, in this day and age, is effectively saying that women are inferior to men. If women are equally capable, then there is no case for alimony.
So you think women are inferior. I think they are equal, and thus not entitled to what their ex-spouse earned.
Why on Earth would a spouse be entitled to anything, without any burden of proof of wrongdoing, after choosing to divorce their spouse?
You didn’t actually explain how it is better for the child to have two parents who hate each other and argue constantly.
Yes, it is worse. Anyone who actually has kids, or a kid who has gone through a parents’ divorce, will agree.
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I wonder how many of those “fatherless” homes are due to men refusing to take responsibility and simply leaving rather than women refusing to allow the fathers to take part in their child’s life.
About 99% are the latter. Feminists don’t want to face the consequences of their fickle and selfish choices.
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Xsplat says, “Either that, or fresh pussy. To feel alive again. Because that’s a good thing.”
Hey, if it keeps the couple functioning, folks should consider it. Not everybody is built for strict monogamy. This is something they should discuss before they get married though.
…although one of my friends did get a bushwhacker. He is a natural chick magnet, and she pretended to be bi and poly right up until she got pregnant. Then suddenly everything changed, and he’s having to duck into dark corners.
It really really sucked for their former girlfriend, who was the real deal.
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”””””””””””’Anyone who thinks a woman is entitled to alimony, in this day and age, is effectively saying that women are inferior to men. If women are equally capable, then there is no case for alimony.
So you think women are inferior. I think they are equal, and thus not entitled to what their ex-spouse earned.
””””””””””””””””””””’
Yup equal for sure.
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MBHAW, I have issues with capitalism as well. But to claim that the massive disparity in power and wealth between men and women throughout history had nothing to do with gender? Really?
Remind me why miscegenation is bad, by the way?
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H I hate to make ad hominem attacks, but your willingness to explain the negative effects of fatherlessness on other factors which are often associated with fatherlessness gives me some insight on your feelings on the value of men to society. I have one simple question, if every child had a father, all other environmental factors constant, would children be healthier? Would men be healthier? Women?
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The Fifth Horsemen, ignoring history and assuming a level playing field for all people does not actually mean that everyone is equal.
I do not think women are entitled to alimony. I think spouses are entitled to support where necessary, especially in cases where one is unable to support themselves right away. That is the basis of the law.
“or a kid who has gone through a parents’ divorce, will agree.”
Oh really? Because I have several friends whose parents divorced and they disagree with you rather vehemently.
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I don’t have a problem with capitalism. I love adam smith!
the same power structure exists with feudalism, socialism (see modern Britain or the USA for the favors and treats the politicians get but commoners don’t), communism.
You are never going to level the material state of all people. At least not without a whole lotta bloodshed.
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HHHY: “I have one simple question, if every child had a father, all other environmental factors constant, would children be healthier? Would men be healthier? Women?”
I think all people are valuable to society. I am merely saying that poverty is a major factor when it comes to crime, and even BEING fatherless.
Every child DOES have a father, it’s kind of necessary to reproduction. And yes, in a perfect world where men didn’t beat or rape their wives or abuse their children, and where men didn’t run away from the responsibility of fatherhood or otherwise completely leave child rearing to the mother, childhood would be better and motherhood would be easier.
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MBHAW: “You are never going to level the material state of all people. At least not without a whole lotta bloodshed.”
Or a lot of mind-changing. I am anti-hierarchy. Plus, the USA or Britain can hardly be called socialist as a whole.
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Women often end up with violent husbands because those women prefer violent men
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MBHAW: “Women often end up with violent husbands because those women prefer violent men”
Or maybe because they’ll be stalked and killed if they leave. This doesn’t justify violence against women in any way.
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So women should not be held accountable for their stupid or dangerous decisions?
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MBHAW: “So women should not be held accountable for their stupid or dangerous decisions?”
Is being “held accountable” mean “having no means of escape” or “get murdered by your spouse”? Being too scared to leave your partner because they might hurt you isn’t a stupid or dangerous decision.
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Or a lot of mind-changing. I am anti-hierarchy.
So brainwashing then? Ain’t gonna work, the richest and smartest people are likely a lot smarter than you and aren’t gonna give it for your Utopia. Also hard working people resent supporting the lazy. Men resent paying for whores who won’t sleep with them.
100s of millions have died due to communism and you just won’t be happy till a few 100 million more join them
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“Good lord, you people are sad, nihilistic human beings. I won’t be talking to you guys anymore. I naively thought that maybe I could say or do something to prevent any more women from being murdered, but clearly you are so insane that you still blame this incident on women, not the man who pulled the trigger. It’s sick and disgusting, and I can’t look at it anymore without vomiting. I hope someone can eventually talk some sense into you sickos before you hurt anyone else, but I really fear that it is a pointless effort. Good luck to Bonnie and the few other good people here.”
FUCK YOU. AND FUCK ALL HYPOCRITES LIKE YOU.
The man was nerdy but decent-looking, had a nice job, and though non-social clearly did not have certain psychological needs met. There was nowhere for him to turn to for help. Women ignored him. Or they were too busy getting their loose pussies ravaged by “playas.”
In other times he would have a wife and kids and, though a little nutty or eccentric, would have been invested in their welfare, preventing something like this from happening. He would have been a productive member of society.
By painting the guy as a monster, people like you are REINFORCING what made him do what he did.
Sodini is a martyr. He is a victim of the callousness of society. Some have blamed feminism. I don’t know if that’s the case, but it’s clear that something is awry with the sexual status quo.
This is part of the sexual market “correction” Obsidian has been talking about.
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MBHAW: “Men resent paying for whores who won’t sleep with them. ”
Surely if they aren’t sleeping with them (even if they pay) then they’re not whores?
“Ain’t gonna work, the richest and smartest people are likely a lot smarter than you and aren’t gonna give it for your Utopia. Also hard working people resent supporting the lazy.”
I’m not having a discussion with you about my political beliefs. I never even said I was a communist. Just anti-hierarchy.
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Anti hierarchy + desire complete equality of material condition = communism. A rose by any other name my dear….
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Mandy XD
“I hear most guys lamenting that there is nothing for men to offer women anymore nowadays; at least not in the traditional sense. A man can’t offer to provide for her, what with all these power women (”I don’t need a man!”) providing for themselves.”
Combine this with the Sodini situation and other aspects of the sexual dystopia we endure, and it sounds like a good theme for a novel.
Years ago I read an obscure, way out of print, written in the 70’s novel called Sex and the High Command. It’s about a US Navy sub crew coming back to port after months at sea to discover a new drug on the market that can get women pregnant and give them an orgasm to boot.
The exploration of men’s uselessness to women in the post-modern, socially atomized, diverse welfare state would be a worthy fiction read. Now could it be written honestly and published as is without bending to the pretty lie dictatorship’s dickless diktats? Or has Houellebecq already been and gone?
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HPC: “The man was nerdy but decent-looking, had a nice job, and though non-social clearly did not have certain psychological needs met.”
You didn’t know him. You weren’t his friend. You weren’t any of the women he tried to pick up. Perhaps they had a valid reason for not dating him. Oh, say, because he hated women and ended up shooting a bunch.
This is the case of a man who felt entitled to something and getting angry when that entitlement neither justified nor fulfilled.
Plus he DID have a child. He could have invested in it. Instead he shot a group of women.
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MBHAW: “Anti hierarchy + desire complete equality of material condition = communism. A rose by any other name my dear….”
I never said I desired complete equality of material condition, for one. For two, the few pockets of stateless communism haven’t ever killed anyone.
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When men work and pay taxes which goes to welfare payment for promiscuous women it is as if they are paying the tab for other men’s whore.
Also paying alimony and child support(aka new boyfriend support) is analogous as well
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Right, MBHAW’s amazing grasp of the law is that spur I needed. I’m leaving this vile blog.
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If only Sodini had been aware of this blog… he’d have a chance of being saved. Conversely, the feminists and their lickspittle male followers offer no alternatives or solutions for betas like Sodini.
There will likely be copycats who will avenge years of rejection and being ignored in the current sexual market. Pointing fingers after the damage has been done will not solve anything.
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H is a ridiculous monster.
For each woman who is murdered by a husband, there are how many men who get financially ruined simply because the wife decides to leave on a selfish whim? 10,000? 100,000?
So 100,000 men who suffer dehumanizing financial ruin, for 1 woman who is murdered.
Seems that men are the victims here, by a wide margin.
I think spouses are entitled to support where necessary, especially in cases where one is unable to support themselves right away. That is the basis of the law.
NO. The law provides the woman with alimony for YEARS after she divorced on the flimsiest of grounds. Plus, child support = alimony, in that far more than what is needed for the care of a child is given to the wife, again with no burden of justification.
It is horrendously unfair to the man. Men get screwed over FAR, FAR more than women.
That is why men are avoiding marriage, while women are desperate for marriage and bridezilla consumption.
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Yeah, H is a pussy beta.
He blames Sodini for 20 YEARS of not having a woman.
Yet hot young women are more than happy to bed with guys who beat them and sell crack on the side.
Faggot.
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H cried,
I’m leaving this vile blog.
Translation : H has been exposed as a parasite and immoral oppresor of men, and has been cornered.
It looks like we have beaten down the last of the vampiric Harpies who came here today.
Good work, fellow soldiers.
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Yeah, figures H would be a harpie bitch.
How would she keep her sanity after 20 years without sex?
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How would she keep her sanity after 20 years without sex?
She hasn’t, as we clearly saw today.
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[…] Massive self improvement ( Game might have been able to net him a late 30’s and a 6 on the looks scale women, even if he […]
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Damnit. I go out with family and miss all the fun.
[editor: do your own dirty work. and i didn’t give you permission to flirt with me.]
Oh, that wasn’t flirting – it was just a sad attempt at being ironic because I thought you called me an idiot previously for no good reason.
@maurice Still waiting for my link, but the rest is done. So no worries there.
@al wage inequality in my profession is much harder to get a read on, because the wage disparities between all people of all ages are really great within it, and also because there is automatic stratified treatment of people because of their sex. I have been considered for work because I’m a woman, and been immediately disqualified for consideration because I am. Same with being on the attractive side of things vs. not (which gets even more complicated). Behind the scenes, the women I’ve known are very very few, it’s mostly men, and I don’t know about their wages because while it’s considered cool of me to fraternize with crew, it’s definitely not cool for me to talk $$ with them. On the business angle of things, I see virtually no women in management or upper management positions – the smart industry women I’ve met are super-stratified – either running their own companies, heading them, or in administrative positions only. Mid-range you often seem to pretty much get very attractive girls who entertain their male co-workers and bosses and can hang socially, but don’t actually seem to care much about their jobs. There are definitely exceptions to this, and they seem to be concentrated at a couple of companies. Not sure if their hiring or promoting practices differ, but I’m guessing it’s a combination of both.
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@evemariesaint- OK. i can see why you’d prefer to flirt with cary grant. thanks for your constructive tone, as a first time visitor among the jezebel swarms, and here’s hoping you stick around and learn the ways of the regulars here. welcome.
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DaveinHackensack – Just glancing at your last couple of posts, the economic points you make are spot on.
Thank you.
You might also be interested in checking out this post I wrote a few months ago, taking on a prominent lefty’s ideas for the American economy: “How not to create broad-based prosperity”. I’d be interested in your thoughts on it.
I’ve bookmarked it and will read it this weekend.
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Sounds good, DT. Get ready to have your blood pressure go up a few points when you read the quotes from Matt Miller.
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Interesting thoughts dave I have noticed that budgets are always played with on numbers. Like if it is spun this way it is one trillion over ten years. They just don’t mention time period. Then if spun another way it is 100 billion for a year.
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kind of like with my company they spin 26 billion when it is against them except it was over period of 5 years.
Then the new contract comes out and it is 5 billion per company over a period of a year.
Except yea the numbers are what stands out 26 billion not the 5 years. The three companies times 5 billion 15 billion X 5 =75 billion over 5 years but my company was fucked with for costing too much. Numbers are a mutherfucker. Spin is a bitch.
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then anything that really helps people like healthcare for all children cost 50 billion is a big deal.
then your like billions to fight aids no prob
300 billion for saving spotted owl people don’t blink eye its like only 300 billion.
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Roissy:”But as we know the physical appearance of a man reveals little about the state of his spirit.”
You are incorrect. Ever heard of physiognomy? – http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physiognomy
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“That is why men are avoiding marriage, while women are desperate for marriage and bridezilla consumption.”
Not the men and women around here (I interact mostly with men each day and mostly conservatives or right-leaning Democrats) – men are very taken with the idea of marriage to the point of pressuring their gfs and fiancees about it. I’ve met a lot of conservative guys who have always said they want to marry young. I hear about it a lot. I rarely see the kind of guys so often portrayed in the media as commitment-averse.
Among my friends, mostly women under 40, the idea seems much less appealing. To me as well, of course. Why be legally bound in the eyes of our law? My BF and I can do nearly everything ‘married’ couples do with no paperwork. It’s cheaper, and easier to split up if you want to.
“I don’t know why people in the west focus on dating near their age.”
Me neither. My BF is 17 years older and it’s been great (although I do worry about him dying or having health issues while I am relatively young). He hasn’t taught me to be more feminine, though. More encouraged me to get in touch with my inner righteous anger.
“what do you think her reaction would be to a guy like Sodini bringing her flowers?
“Ewww…creepy stalker thinks he can get into my panties just because he brought me flowers!.””
Only an idiot would randomly bring someone he didn’t know flowers. It turns your vibes creepy even if you were neutral or sexy before.
Start by talking. Then by flirting. If she responds, try dating. After that come the flowers.
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The Fifth Horseman
“Bonnie,
Let’s back up here.
You said you wanted to be a mom and have a lot of kids. Silly me, I assumed something that I should not have.
Do you want to be married to one man for life (the father of those kids), or do you want to be a single Mom?
If the latter, how will you afford those kids, since you also don’t want a career?”
I don’t think I want lots of kids. Maybe two or three.
My BF and I have been together 5 years and are serious – would love to have children with him and we are planning on it in the future. I don’t put much value on legal marriage but it’s not something I’m against if he wanted it. Monogamy feels right to me, I love him, love his family and like the way our relationship has changed over time (become less passionate, more comfortable as is only natural). If we weren’t having sex anymore and that was still as important to me as it is now, I would explore other options before leaving him. Cheating isn’t among those options – wouldn’t lie to the guy just to keep us ‘together’ – so yeah, if there was no sex, we were legally married, and he was against me having sex with other people, I might want a ‘divorce’. Other than that possible situation I picture us growing old together.
I would only have children as a single mother if I was getting old and had no prospects for a partner. While I disagree that a mother and a father are necessary, two parents are always better than one. Or three or four parents – I support polygamy of all kinds, should be legalized.
“Just saying people should be allowed to make choices legal choices. Just like woman are allowed to kill there unborn babies so to should adults be able to kill themselves. What is the difference after all. I want people to be able to have control over there bodies. No one should be able to tell them what to do with their bodies. I believe it should be equal men and woman should both be equally able to abort themselves.”
I agree. I’m a supporter of assisted suicide in all cases. I’ve found a body (hanging), not fun for me, and I felt bad for him. He should have had somewhere nice and clean to go where they could do it without pain and choking and the police handling his dead body and his mom seeing his face all fucked up, etc.
There are options, though, if you have a little money. They have clinics in Switzerland and the Netherlands that will kill almost anyone. Cremate you and send you back to your parents in a package. Places like Germany and Sweden have no penalties for assisted suicide.
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Is it really idiotic to recognize that men and women are encouraged from birth to act differently? That men and women are pushed their entire lives towards gender roles to which they would not otherwise gravitate? Do you honestly not think that boys and girls are treated differently as soon as they’re out of the womb?
Not at all, in fact.
My ex and I were shocked — completely shocked — at how our son, without any prompting or encouragement by us (in fact, we were drinking the kind of bullshit cool-aid you’re spinning here, and so we “exposed” him to various toys and so on) gravitated towards stereotypically boy type toys, activities, TV programming and so on. He was just that way from pretty much the very beginning, without active encouragement from either of us or from others to “conform to a pre-ordained, narrow gender role”.
Good grief! I know almost no-one who actually has children who believes that bullshit, because it’s simply not true. There are outliers (tomboyish girls and femmie boys), but for the most part, most kids gravitate in one direction or the other without prompting. The blank slate is a crock of shit, frankly.
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I think of gender expression like a spectrum. Most people are firmly within the norms for men or women, some people are at either end and are extremely masculine or feminine, and fewer are towards the middle. I think how you end up is mostly biological. I was a tomboy as a kid, a baby dyke as a teen, and while I look feminine now, I am still atypical enough in personality for a woman that people remark on it.
I’m seeing this with my 5-year-old nephew. He’s persistently interested only in ‘girl stuff’ and has been since he was a baby – despite constant pressure and discouragement from his father who wants him to be a man’s man. The kids likes nailpolish, wearing dresses, and playing house – totally disinterested in cars and guns, hates getting dirty or rough play. He’s probably gay. It’s rough on him. He can’t help the way he was made.
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And the incentive for men to make money will somehow go away if women have equal rights? How’s that work?
Men, if they have no reasonable prospect of a stable marriage and family, will simply not invest as much in themselves, and by extension, the greater society. That’s already happening –> look at how men, as a whole, are clearly falling behind women, as a whole, in terms of education, employment and so on. It doesn’t have to do with “fear” or “insecurity”, but rather a lack of motivation. If that situation is simply not attainable for many men, they will underinvest, and underperform, and that will have a negative impact on everyone.
Feminists often miss that, because they suffer from the “apex” fallacy — namely that what happens at the top is all that matters. Yes, there will always be ambitious motivated men at the top. But the rest of the men … not a given, and increasingly today we are already seeing the signs of men losing motivation, and backing away from women and society in general. In short, it’s already happening, and it’s probably irreversible. And the reason for that is largely the feminist social revolution, where most men are heavily disfavored as mates.
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It’s absolutely true in our current system that a percentage of men are not getting the chance to have a stable marriage, produce children and work within society to provide for them.
But what I don’t understand is why you think there hasn’t always been a large percentage of the male population who hasn’t been able to achieve this. You’re so quick to blame the way things are today, but all evidence supports it’s just the way things are, period.
Men aren’t so concerned with status and dominance just because that’s what many women find attractive (although many women do). Women haven’t had much of a say in who they have kids with forever, and still don’t many places. For most of the history of humanity marriages were arranged and women were passed from fathers to husbands, or they were taken as spoils of war or offered up to rulers and warriors. You were competing with each other, not trying to impress us, until very recently. Maybe that’s why you’re so angry that we have some say now?
Young women have historically paired up with men with some degree of social power. In most societies throughout society polygyny has been common leaving even more young (angry) men out in the cold. Women of ideal reproductive age (and especially attractive ones) are what all men from 15-50 are pursuing, and there aren’t enough of us to go around. There never have been. The only solution to all these problems you are complaining about it raising the ratio of women to men.
At least men in America these days have a few more options than in a lot of other times and places. Prostitution is safer than in the past and there are ways to protect yourself from and treat STDS. There may be fewer women wanting to ‘settle down’ but there are more who will engage in a sexual relationship (since a lot of you are saying celibacy is the main problem). Dating and pursuing women is easier than ever before.
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The widespread acceptance of the idea that marriage is about love or personal fulfillment is rather new and unique to the West(barring a few historic examples like the inspiration for the Taj mahal). In much of Asia ‘love’ (ie not arranged) marriage are still viewed as irrational and unstable. The divorce stats of arranged versus chosen marriages do back this view.
@ Mandy Been Here a While:
I don’t want to start an interminable argument, but I thought I should clear up some misconceptions I saw from your corner regarding the nature of science and the status of evolution.
Evolution is a charged subject for many on the religious right because it is seen as undermining the value structure of (most) Abrahamic faiths. Implicit in the Abrahamic faiths is the idea that “man was created in God’s image”. This is the theological source of our separateness from the rest of the animal kingdom, and the basis for out ability to receive grace (and ultimately, redemption.)
Evolution is problematic for those steeped in these faiths because it undermines the notion of a fixed-species. That is, if there was gradual development from one species to another, it gets difficult to say exactly at what point an organism was human (and thus ensouled), instead of merely an animal. Genetic, paleontological, and archeological evidence of other human species (i.e. Neanderthals, homo erectus, homo habilis, homo ergaster, etc.) makes clear that there were other species that can be considered human apart from ourselves, homo sapiens sapiens. So, given a theology that makes an absolute distinction between mankind and other animals, evidence that the distinction is along a spectrum rather than discrete – evidence that the difference is less “qualitative” (in terms of supposed underlying essences) and more “quantitative” (in terms of underlying variety in allele frequencies) – is threatening.
One natural response to that threat is to deny or minimize the veracity of the evidence. This is attempted in a number of ways, but a common strategy is the strawman tactic, used by Pat Buchanan (who I otherwise enjoy) in conflating evolutionary theory with what he calls “Darwinism”. I think it is this vague, non-scientific idea of “Darwinism” that you are reacting to when you say “show me the evidence of life emerging from non-biological processes”. Evolution is not a theory about how life originated, it is rather a theory about how life changes over the millennia. (That there has been significant change over the millions of year of life is indisputable). There have been some materialistic/reductionist thinkers who have attempted to use evolutionary theory to buttress their metaphysics, but these philosophical exercises – whatever their merits or problems – stand apart from evolutionary theory itself.
Another common response, the “show me the proof!” response, betrays a subtle lack of deep understanding of the nature of science itself. In short – scientific theories are never proved one way or the other, with utter finality. They are simply well-supported empirically, or not. They either have roughly-equally-well-supported rivals, or not. They have explanatory power and predictive success, or they do not. So those who demand “proof” that evolution is “true” are making a category mistake.
Evolution is, at the moment, among the most well-supported and well-established scientific theories of all time. Could it be upended in the future? Possibly, but whatever does so will have to also account for all it currently accounts for (the same way relativity theory accounted for all of Newtonian Mechanics as well as the perihelion of Mercury, etc.) For those who deny evolution, the simple rejoinder is “what scientific theory do you subscribe to which explains as well and predicts as much in the domain that evolution ranges over”? There can be no answer, for there is no (current) rival scientific theory. Religious answers might be proffered, but then that is just a slight-of-hand changing-of-the-subject.
Two quick closing points, as I know this is a long post:
1) There was a time when religious thinkers thought that the moral realm depended on the fixity of celestial objects. That is, our ideas of good and evil, right and wrong, were thought to depend on the earth being the center of the universe, and heavenly bodies moving in circular orbits at even speeds. Empirical evidence to the contrary (Kepler, Galileo) were suppressed and considered subversive in that they implicitly challenged the moral order.
Doesn’t that seem silly in retrospect? Isn’t it kind of obvious that our moral concerns and ideas are not dependent on any particular astronomical theory? If so, can’t you see that it’s a bit silly to link our moral concerns and ideas to the fixity-of-species within biology?
2) You wrote earlier that you “love Adam Smith” and think his ideas were top-notch. I agree. Can you not see, though, that the same *invisible hand* concepts within Smith’s work are also at work within the evolutionary account of species-change? Both Smith’s and Darwin’s ideas make use of the same conceptual structures.
I can never for the life of me understand how many on the right accept Smith but deny Darwin, while many on the left accept Darwin but deny Smith.
Sorry for the long post everybody. Peace.
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I’ve always found that MRAs are either outright misogynist and/or want to escape all possible responsibility for all of their actions
The standard bar-slut we bang nowadays is obviously unworthy of commitment. Women love the freedom to ride the dick carrousel but love to define as “misogyny” the opinions men have about girls who do that. It would be akin to men define as “misandry” the female repulsion for betaness.
This why I insist that feminism is either a product of women whose inteligence (femX and any woman pictured as a leftie in Tood´s photo) is far above their sexual market value (the leaders) or women like Bonnie (the follower) who use it to hedge themselves against to dramatic impact of time in the woman´s Sexual market value
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A Bax
Interesting points.
Yes, the astronomy theory does sound silly now.
I’ve never considered the Smith-Darwin connection before.
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@Bonnie –
But what I don’t understand is why you think there hasn’t always been a large percentage of the male population who hasn’t been able to achieve this. You’re so quick to blame the way things are today, but all evidence supports it’s just the way things are, period.
Not really, no. In a system of fixed monogamy, most men find mates. In a system of soft polygamy or serial monogamy, which is what we have today, it becomes de facto polygyny, as Robert Wright (hardly a right winger or an MRA or a misogynist in any way) described in his book “The Moral Animal”.
Wright describes it as follows: assume you have 2,000 men and women, all ranked by mate value 1 to 2,000. In a system of fixed monogamy, most men and women will mate with people around their mate value because they don’t have the option really to “trade up” except in odd circumstances. If you remove fixed monogamy and allow polygamy, what you see happening is that a certain % of women will drift up the food chain. Woman 1250 might decide she prefers to be wife 2 to man 450 rather than wife 1 to man 1250. That leaves man 1250 without a peer mate value woman. If that happens on a large-ish scale, what happens is that the women left in the 1200-1300 range (i.e., those who have not drifted up for “better” hypergamous mates) are highly increased in value relative to their mate value peer men, simply because there are fewer of them than there should be. So not only will many men in the 1200-1300 range not find mates (because their female mate value peers are mating “above” them), but the ones who do will be in fierce competition for the few remaining peer mate value women who have not absconded for higher mate value men.
Wright already observed in 1994 that this was what was happening in the West, and that certainly has not change since then, but only become more solidified. And, no, this is not the way it has always been. Monogamy used to be more fixed, and that prevents the kind of drift upwards women engage in when the rules are looser – at least it prevents it from happening to any significant degree other than outliers. Things are different now, quite different than they have ever been – and that has worked to the advantage of most women, but the disadvantage of most men. Hence the rise of Game.
Men aren’t so concerned with status and dominance just because that’s what many women find attractive (although many women do). Women haven’t had much of a say in who they have kids with forever, and still don’t many places. For most of the history of humanity marriages were arranged and women were passed from fathers to husbands, or they were taken as spoils of war or offered up to rulers and warriors. You were competing with each other, not trying to impress us, until very recently. Maybe that’s why you’re so angry that we have some say now?”\
Not really, no. It’s not that “women have a say”. Women also had a say in 1950. But the world is hugely different between now and then. You’re writing as if we went directly from arranged marriages to today’s serial monogamy. We did not. We had quite some time there where women chose their partners, but there was fixed monogamy. What fixed monogamy does, however, is greatly influence mate selection choices for women – that’s very obvious based on the current observed behaviors.
But in any case arranged marriages do not change the analysis. Because monogamy was fixed, the mates chosen for women were chosen on the basis of hypergamy, in terms of finding the best mate, but not sexual hypergamy. So there was something of a continuity between that “pre-selection” and the later practice of women choosing their own mates, because when women were choosing their own mates in the 40s and 50s, it wasn’t often based on sexual hypergamy, as it often is today.
Young women have historically paired up with men with some degree of social power. In most societies throughout society polygyny has been common leaving even more young (angry) men out in the cold. Women of ideal reproductive age (and especially attractive ones) are what all men from 15-50 are pursuing, and there aren’t enough of us to go around. There never have been. The only solution to all these problems you are complaining about it raising the ratio of women to men.
No. Historically the solution was twofold: first, eliminate a good proportion of the men due to incessant warfare. That cuts down on the competition and keeps the restless men busy, allowing the top men to monopolize the women. The second solution was enforced monogamy. If every man can only have one woman as a wife, the issue you raise doesn’t happen – because the older men who are lusting after the younger women are barred from taking them as wives, and they are reserved for other men to take as wives. The issue you raise only happens in actual polygamy or de facto polygamy like we have now – where some men can snap up almost all the women. In a system of hard monogamy, it doesn’t happen (other than cheating, which of course will happen in any system).
At least men in America these days have a few more options than in a lot of other times and places. Prostitution is safer than in the past and there are ways to protect yourself from and treat STDS. There may be fewer women wanting to ’settle down’ but there are more who will engage in a sexual relationship (since a lot of you are saying celibacy is the main problem). Dating and pursuing women is easier than ever before.
Not at all.
In a sexual free market, most men lose out. Women are hypergamous and gravitate towards the top men, leaving most men out of the running, despite the “appearance” of freedom. Dating and pursuing women is much, much harder than it has been at any time in history for men, because for most men, women are simply dating way up the scale and have no interest in them. This is why you see sites like this one – where men can learn to compete in the sexual free market and get laid. The marketplace is hostile to most men unless the men find a way to practice Game and project alpha-ness.
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Hey gig,
Your post doesn’t make much sense, although you seem like a gaping asshole.
I agree that the changes wrought by the feminist movement benefit women greatly by letting them participate in other markets than the sexual one where we have a small window of value (for most girls it’s half-used-up by the time we are ‘legal’), followed by most of our lives where our only use was to make some more babies for our husbands and then die slowly of boredom once the kids were grown.
I’m deeply thankful to all the feminists before me that it’s not like that any more. I hear here that a woman’s sexual market value is pretty low by the time she is 30 – I’ll be glad to be not-so-valuable in six years, maybe guys won’t approach me so much and I won’t have to hurt their feelings.
It’s nice I guess that I could in theory have pretty much any guy I wanted, and I appreciate that my ‘number’ or whatever landed me my BF who I think is sexy.. but really I just want to be left the fuck alone. I dressed like a boy and kept my hair super-short for this reason until I was 19 and met BF. The only reason I am not trying to make myself look unfeminine intentionally now is because he likes me to look pretty. I probably won’t ‘let myself go’ (I’m pretty sure it would be impossible for me to get fat, but I could look like a lesbian) in the future for this reason as well. But I have always looked forward to aging and becoming more of a person – or even a mother figure- to men rather than a sexual object.
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Please! Men were not sitting around “gee how can I keep my wife from accomplishing anything?” Women enjoy watching their children grow and have families of their own. Their were plenty of charities as well as labor , the fact that it may not have been int he same jobs as men or in the “workforce” is irrelevant.
This alleged time of boredom could have been used for scientific inquiry, writing invention etc. But it clearly wasn’t. There is scant evidence of these women asking to do such things such that the few who did really stand out.
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[editor: so i take it your backup plan will be celibate monasticism when you have aged so badly in a few years that no good looking man will even want to fuck you?]
I’m assuming then, that you could only handle the “stand there” part of my demand.
[editor: try to read for comprehension. answer the question: will you resort to celibacy when you have aged so badly in a few years that the men you find attractive no longer want to fuck you?]
Ladies, in the spirit of truth: You’d have been fine if you’d have hit it…and quit it.
[the vast majority of women are not OK with random pump and dumps. and i suspect, despite your transparently false bravado to the contrary, neither are you.]
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But I don’t love it anymore than I love a good rollercoaster ride or a hour at the shooting range
obviously sex with betas is not the world´s greatest experience
gig´s law number 17:
there is a masturbation threshold below which it is better to masturbate them have sex with (see “cigstache”). for women, the masturbation threshold is satisfied by raising cats or rollercoaster rides
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“eye-raped”
A Rape! Rape here, A rape rape there, everywhere a rape rape
LR reminds me of a friend I had that taught philosophy. He went to some feminist presentation about phallic this and phallic that. And he raised his hand and asked “what about vaginal this and that? If skyscrapers are phallic than the air is vaginal, etc” She couldn’t answer and he got a lecture form the head of the philosophy dept about asking such questions of the women’s studies lecturers.
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LR someone just like you, A woman wants to marry a roller coaster
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/5972632/Woman-getting-married-to-fairground-ride.html
Makes one want to keep the kiddies far far away form amusement parks
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I’m all for anyone trying to improve themselves, even if it’s just by learning ‘game’ and ‘rules of poon’ to try to attract more women. I’m not convinced that websites, books and seminars advertising techniques such as these are effective at all. It’s hard for a woman to ‘up her value’- we’re pretty much born with our bodies, faces, and personalities. Growing out our hair, wearing sexy clothes and makeup, putting water balloons in our boobs, can only do so much good (I think mostly when girls are trying this hard they make themselves look awful, but I like the all-natural look). It’s the same way for men. Most of the people I think are sexy (and charming) just are, without much effort on their part. Charisma is hard to learn.
Are there inspiring success stories on this board? Does learning ‘game’ really transform pathetic, needy ‘betas’ into masterful ‘alphas’? From what I have read above, most of you say you haven’t had trouble attracting women in your life.
Ah, but there are plenty of stories from men on this site and elsewhere about how their access to higher quality women has improved by using game. In that sense, I think men have it somewhat easier than women do, because Game is something that can be learned, and it works. Not so much on websites and through seminars, although that is a part of it. Mostly through trial and error is how it is learned — practice in the field, so to speak. And it *does* work. It doesn’t make every guy land 8-10s — not at all. But a guy who is usually settling for 4-5s will move to reliably landing 6s and the occasional 7. And the guy who is SOL will land 4-5s reliably and so on. it works, within reason, of course.
It’s the same as a woman who does absolutely nothing to look good vs. one who does all she can to look good. Sure there are “naturals” who will be hot no matter what they do but a woman can boost her number a few notches by what she does to make herself look better. It’s the same for men. There are men who are natural alphas, and there are others who need to put in effort. Game is about putting in the effort to project that in a way that women find pleasing, in light of the fact that the current date/mate market is thoroughly unforgiving for most men unless they have Game.
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I don’t go out often, and when I do it’s with my BF. So the only attention I get is staring, hissing, catcalls, and guys trying to pick me up on the sidewalk when I am outside trying to live my life (I only go out to shop and take my dogs places). I can do without that, the sooner the better.
I don’t go out to bars and clubs either, and I sometimes get various catcalls and guys trying to hit on me. When I was younger I was very annoyed at this behavior. But now, despite my social awkwardness and shyness, I try to reciprocate with at least a smile, eye contact, and a response. It’s better to shoot a guy down with kindness than a cold shoulder. Most people are not assholes, and often even the real assholes can still be disarmed by a nice demeanor.
Your youth and attractiveness are a part of your charisma. Think about how very charismatic people make you feel. Chances are, those people generally make you feel good and positive around them. Why not try to give this to others? Why be closed off in your shell for fear of giving a bit of happiness to another human being? Look at it as an opportunity to make someone’s day a little brighter.
I think flirting is something that, if done with the right intention and attitude, can be a good thing. Flirting, at its fundamentals, is just being friendly, a social lubricant. You are not giving in to an obligation, nor are you saying that you are available. You can even start by flirting with your boyfriend. It is just an act of saying to another person, “Hey, you’re alright. I’m glad to be around you.”
Sometimes it’s just saying “Hi!” and “Have a good day!” Sometimes it’s turning to the person next to you who’s silent and reaching out with an observation — “That’s a nice outfit.” It doesn’t matter if they’re male or female, young or old, black white yellow brown. Just for a moment, you might make their day a little better by making a small effort at a connection. Then you will have spread more kindness, positivity and love to the world. 🙂
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I have zero issue with that.
I want the best I can get (as a woman, who wants the have babies) – someone good-looking, intelligent, father-of-my-children material, who loves me back but doesn’t worship me and get angry if I step off the pedestal, who I can respect and trust and who doesn’t piss me off too often (I can’t stand over-emotional people, they remind me of my mother. BF doesn’t cry, yell, punch walls, get road rage, or have physical or loud verbal fights with other guys).
You guys want the best you can get too. Nothing wrong with doing what we have to do to get that. If Roissy’s actual posts and many of the commenter here weren’t so offensive and ignorant (it’s not a coincidence that nearly everyone who has said fucked-up sexist shit has managed to interject some fucked-up racist shit into the discussion) I wouldn’t have anything to complain about.
I was just re-reading the sixteen commandments. I disagree with the first 8 (and quickly reject the people who have tried them on me), the last 8 strike me as reasonable ground rules for a stable relationship.
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Hope, I think that depends on the culture/situation one is in.
In some places, if you smile at a guy, he thinks it’s an invitation to sex. So I have a pretty severe prude shield when I’m walking anywhere alone, like through the market or something.
I’m friendly to women, but men here have to be treated like inanimate objects to avoid bumping into along the road, or else they think you’re a slut.
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See, you’re starting to catch on.
The apparent misogyny you see here mostly results from women becoming de-pedestalized. Game does that — it makes men see that women are just as venal, sexual, and flawed as men are. Some of the guys who are proficient with Game can attest to how easy it is to pry women away from their BFs or husbands for sex, for example — something which makes them (understandably, no?) view women more skeptically as long term partners. But that’s just a natural outgrowth of the knowledge that Game gives men about women.
I think women do not tend to pedestalize men — feminism encourages women to see men as feral animals, in a way (all men are rapists, etc). But many men grew up being fed pedestalized, chivalry-addled views of women, and when those views are dashed, anger results. You see, we want to think more highly of you than Game allows us to, because we were taught to think more highly of you. When it dawns on us that this is a flawed view, a sense of being defrauded by the system ensues, which results in anger and a de-valuing of women.
Most move past that, and simply accept that women are morally neutral as men are, and are as capable of being complete traitors as men are (and probably are better at it). In the long run that shouldn’t make a man angry at a woman for being who she is, but at the same time it makes him look at her more realistically, and hence more skeptically. It probably mirrors the skepticism that many women seem to have for men.
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Hope-
How is having normal pleasant and polite social interactions ‘flirting’? If it is I do it every day. I say good morning and hello to people, smile at them, and engage in small talk. Men, women, children, of all ages. I say ‘thank you’ when someone compliments me. I don’t like it much when an old man tells me I’m beautiful, but I take it in the spirit it is given.
Hisses, whistling, oogling, and guys screaming ‘suck my dick’ or ‘sit on my face’ out their car windows are a different matter. It’s threatening and ugly behavior. I respond in kind.
Random guys trying to pick me up with cheesy lines or telling me I have a nice ass are also not okay with me. I usually try to educate them on why this isn’t an approach that will land them someone with a nice ass, rather than telling them to fuck off, but either way they seem to come to the ultimate conclusion of ‘cold bitch’.
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the only women who look forward to hitting the wall are those who haven’t yet. here’s an idea: you don’t want to be a sex object and have men ogling you and bothering you? gain 75 lbs. you will be INVISIBLE. problem solved
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Dana says, “gain 75 lbs. you will be INVISIBLE. problem solved”
If only things were that simple, my life would be a lot easier.
Rather than becoming invisible, one just looks like an easier target for exploitation and abuse…to herdbeasts anyway.
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@novaseeker,
Whereever did this originate? no sisters? no neighborhood girls? separate gender private schools? mothers preaching? Hollywood fantasy? How can a boy not see the nasty side of girls– from kindergarden onward?
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what is a “herdbeast”
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I don’t see how feminism teaches women to have a low opinion of men. All the dogmatic feminists I know (do you know any? you all seem shocked by me, believe me, I am at odds with most beliefs in the community) believe in the blank slate. If a man’s a pig they think he’s that way because our society and patriarchy has warped him. They think patriarchy is bad for men as well as women, but not in the same ways you all do. They tend to think everyone is capable of near-perfect behavior if we only had a perfect society to mold them. They don’t believe the way men and women tend to act has much or anything to do with biology (I see huge similarities in all cultures I have ever read about). They don’t believe rape could be defined as a ‘natural’ behavior, and they don’t believe it’s easy for your average man to rape in the right situations (despite it being proved over and over again in wartime situations).
I’ve always thought blank slate version of human behavior was nonsensical, and I started reading lots of sociology and anthropology books as a young teenager (starting with EO Wilson’s Sociobiology), before I was aware of the feminist movement. I haven’t gotten along well with men since the 3rd grade when girls suddenly had cooties and all my little boy friends wanted to either kiss me or tell me I was inferior. The feminist movement has been telling me all along to give men more credit and not assume you are genetically programmed to treat me like a peace of meat, but I have seen no evidence.
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@ Novaseeker:
Very well said. Eloquent.
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Game Can Save Lives?
apparently so.
if it weren’t for the steady stream of
plastic surgeon daughter poon
servicing Jon Goselin, that guy
would turn into Jason
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Whereever did this originate? no sisters? no neighborhood girls? separate gender private schools? mothers preaching? Hollywood fantasy? How can a boy not see the nasty side of girls– from kindergarden onward?
We, do, anony, but we are told “most girls are not like that — most girls are different” and so on — also by sisters, mothers, aunts, female friends, Oprah and so on. That meme is out there in spades today as well.
The feminist movement has been telling me all along to give men more credit and not assume you are genetically programmed to treat me like a peace of meat, but I have seen no evidence.
Ah, well I was basing what I wrote on the writings of feminist leaders and academics like McKinnon, Dworkin, Brownmiller, Daly and so on. Certainly this crowd (Dworkin: all heterosexual sex is, in form, rape; McKinnon: in the current social climate it is impossible for women to give valid and meaningful consent to heterosexual sex, even in the context of marriage, so therefore definitions of rape based on consent are meaningless; etc).
Yes, feminism is based on a conspiracy theory called “patriarchy”, but nevertheless the CT of patriarchy sees all men as complicit in a system that oppresses women at all levels. This is a fairly ridiculous reinterpretation of history. History shows that for most of it almost everyone was oppressed by a handful of men and women at the top. Men were “in charge” at every class level, but upper class women oppressed lower class men, too. The main factor of oppression was social class, not gender, and there was certainly no conspiracy of common interest between lower class men and upper class men — it was a relationship characterized by mutual contempt.
So, to be honest, while I agree that feminists are blank slaters, because they also believe in this conspiracy theory of patriarchy, the blank slate is shunted aside with respect to most men — in effect at least — such that men are presumed to behave in a very predictable way due to patriarchal programming. Hence why all men are rapists, because the patriarchy encourages all men to use rape as a tool for sociopolitical domination against all women as a class. That kind of neo-Marxism underlies feminism, and still sees men as the “class enemy” due to patriarchy (which is neo-Marxism’s new “capitalism”).
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Bonnie,
you can’t see that teaching that maleness is a “learned” behavior imprinted on a blank slate and that it has to be changed is anti-male?
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bonnie–
Patriarchy = all human history.
Before the birth of Marxist derrived feminist ideology.
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How is having normal pleasant and polite social interactions ‘flirting’?
I guess it’s another semantics thing that I’m probably messing up. But casual conversation, compliments, smiles and eye contact on the part of a female can all be seen as “flirting,” even though you’re just being friendly. This is why a lot of girls won’t do these things even though it is just being friendly. Since I do not know you too well, I thought that you were as closed off as I was at one time (I didn’t even casual conversation!). Sorry that I projected my own shyness onto you. In any case…
Random guys trying to pick me up with cheesy lines or telling me I have a nice ass are also not okay with me. I usually try to educate them on why this isn’t an approach that will land them someone with a nice ass, rather than telling them to fuck off, but either way they seem to come to the ultimate conclusion of ‘cold bitch’.
The way I respond to ugliness is to avoid it and not give it any feedback. Or, if I must respond, I try to respond without anger. I suppose I have not seen as much examples of this in my own life, because most people I come across are not so rude. The few who are, you cannot do anything about. Trying to “educate” them will not change their mind, because they are stuck in their own world view. They may be doing it to shock you or get some kind of response, and this boosts their own image or their image among their peers. Don’t play by their rules, and don’t pay any mind to what they think of you.
In some places, if you smile at a guy, he thinks it’s an invitation to sex.
Sure, that can happen. A guy can view a girl as an easy target and rape her if she gives him some opening. We have to protect ourselves. The positive individual is not totally foolish and naive. Be prepared for the worst, but do not expect it. Expecting the worst just makes everyone closed off and unhappy.
men here have to be treated like inanimate objects to avoid bumping into along the road, or else they think you’re a slut.
Dehumanization is not a sign of a healthy society. I’m sorry to hear that is the case. You are of course right that different cultures have different rules and norms for personal interactions, but at the base of it everyone yearns to just be acknowledged as a human being, and they just want love. Unfortunately everyone is so closed off and afraid.
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It’s been impossible for me to gain 10 lbs since I was 14. Being fat isn’t a matter of eating a lot. It’s mostly genetic. It’s not in the cards for me. Dressing like a boy works, I’ve tried it before. I’m choosing not to do that, so I’m sure you think I’m ‘asking for it’ (sexual attention).
Anyway, fat women get less positive attention, but they still get constant attention and comments about their body from men.
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Good lord, don’t you people ever sleep? So much to respond to…
mandy–“Most men were not able to advance either. only the rich and well connected got ahead. Coal miners shoveled coal until they died, soldiers fought until they died, sewer workers breathed in sewage until they died.
Just pawns in someone else’s game. Had nothing to do with gender really.”
You can’t honestly believe that, in a world where men are traditionally the providers and women traditionally stay at home, there was and is no difference between the two genders’ ability to advance in the workplace. That is a level of cultural ignorance that is profound even more an MRA.
The Fifth Horseman–“Chris (a suspiciously androgynous name”
“Suspiciously androgynous?” Oh noes, my gender isn’t immediately apparent to you! Whatever will you do?
” (wrote) :
Perhaps the centuries of disallowing women from entering the workplace has something to do with that.”
”
Actually, H wrote that. But I agree with him/her.
“And with that, the parasitism of ‘feminists; shows.
Who cares about ‘centuries ago’? Why should people today suffer for that?”
I think what you actually mean by that last sentence is, “Why should men today suffer for that?”
Because women still are suffering from the mistakes of the past, and you don’t seem to care about that fact.
“You are white. I am colored. Because your ancestors oppressed me, I am entitled to your resources today. So pay up.”
Your analogy is ridiculous. A woman can’t just go up to a random man and demand anything, and people of color can’t do that to white people. And as a person of color, you really should have a better understanding of how historical oppression affects the world today, and what measures are and are not appropriate to help society in this regard.
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“H is a ridiculous monster.
For each woman who is murdered by a husband, there are how many men who get financially ruined simply because the wife decides to leave on a selfish whim? 10,000? 100,000?
So 100,000 men who suffer dehumanizing financial ruin, for 1 woman who is murdered.
Seems that men are the victims here, by a wide margin.”
100,000 financially ruined people is still < one murdered person. End of story.
"NO. The law provides the woman with alimony for YEARS after she divorced on the flimsiest of grounds. Plus, child support = alimony, in that far more than what is needed for the care of a child is given to the wife, again with no burden of justification."
As someone who was a child support recipient, I can tell you that this is a fucking lie.
"That is why men are avoiding marriage, while women are desperate for marriage and bridezilla consumption."
Wait, women are desperate for marriage because they can't wait to get divorced and get alimony? For serious?
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Hoffman–“FUCK YOU. AND FUCK ALL HYPOCRITES LIKE YOU.
The man was nerdy but decent-looking, had a nice job, and though non-social clearly did not have certain psychological needs met. There was nowhere for him to turn to for help. Women ignored him. Or they were too busy getting their loose pussies ravaged by “playas.” ”
Woman-hating rhetoric like this is what causes women to be killed. A retarded three year old could figure that out.
“In other times he would have a wife and kids and, though a little nutty or eccentric, would have been invested in their welfare, preventing something like this from happening. He would have been a productive member of society.”
That’s because in other times, people were a lot more desperate to settle down. Today, people have more choices. That may be bad for some people, but freedom wins out.
“By painting the guy as a monster, people like you are REINFORCING what made him do what he did.
Sodini is a martyr.”
So, calling him a monster may cause other people to do the same thing, but calling him a martyr will…discourage people from doing the same thing?
Are you posting this from Bizarro World?
“He is a victim of the callousness of society. Some have blamed feminism. I don’t know if that’s the case, but it’s clear that something is awry with the sexual status quo.”
You’re damn right something’s awry. What’s awry is that men like these have entitlement complexes the size of apartment complexes. They feel it is their right to possess women, whom they refer to as “pussy.” They don’t care about women as human beings, and then act shocked and betrayed when women won’t sleep with them. That sounds pretty fucking awry to me, and it is what feminism is trying to change.
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“If only Sodini had been aware of this blog… he’d have a chance of being saved. Conversely, the feminists and their lickspittle male followers offer no alternatives or solutions for betas like Sodini.”
Except that, as it turns out, Sodini was an avid follower of R. Don Steele, who offers suggestions similar to those seen on this blog. It is not yet known whether Sodini ever sought help from feminists. So your argument is bullshit.
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A Bax
I keep thinking about your comment and I remembered that at Oz Conservative blog, someone discussed that evolution allow for Progressive Social Engineering. Really a misunderstanding of evolution, I guess.
The idea is that there is a destination(Utopia) humans are approaching if we can only form human nature to that ideal, we can achieve perfection. Human nature of course isn’t that malleable and I don’t believe evolutionists claim that there is some final destination life is progressing towards meaningfully. Survival of the fittest is more like “Survival of the survivors” as opposed to “survival of the best.”
I don’t have a good explanation for the conservative side apart from a widespread belief that America is a meritocracy.
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Chris who is definitely a woman
So, calling him a monster may cause other people to do the same thing, but calling him a martyr will…discourage people from doing the same thing?
Really, he is just a canary in the coal mine. It could have been a lot worse.
Ignore his frustration at society’s peril.
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“Patriarchy = all human history.”
I said that upthread and was vehemently disagreed with.
When I refer to feminism and patriarchy, I am using the word they way the movement does – to refer to the systematic oppression of women. Normally though, when I think patriarchy, I think of men being dominant in society and families.
Patriarchy is the natural state of the human animal. That doesn’t mean it’s morally right or good for the majority. Rape is pretty ‘natural’ IMO (happens in every culture and in the animal world). It’s still wrong. Same for murder, assault, molesting children (most people that do this aren’t ‘pedophiles’), etc.
I don’t see why it’s so hard for people on all sides of an issue to just recognize other people’s right to make choices. Lots of people are happy with traditional gender roles ad family structures. Lots aren’t. I don’t think there’s a war between the sexes, but what men in this thread seem to want (a return to legally enforced gender roles) would mean I as a woman would have a lot less options in life, and I am against that.
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@bonnie
I don’t see why it’s so hard for people on all sides of an issue to just recognize other people’s right to make choices.
Yeah, whence all this fuss about Sordini’s choice?
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“The standard bar-slut we bang nowadays is obviously unworthy of commitment.”
If you’re banging her, you’re no more worthy than she is.
“Women love the freedom to ride the dick carrousel but love to define as “misogyny” the opinions men have about girls who do that.”
Men love the freedom to ride the pussy carrousel but love to define as “whores” the girls who do that.
“This why I insist that feminism is either a product of women whose inteligence (femX and any woman pictured as a leftie in Tood´s photo) is far above their sexual market value (the leaders) ”
Since when is an ideology proven right or wrong based on the physical attractiveness of it’s followers?
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“Curt the Canadian
HANSEN
where can you find instruction on proper sexual transmutation on the net? The few sites that talk about it in english are either too esoteric yogic sites or shallow info ad sites. Napoleon Hill spoke about sexual transmutation for men in order to accomplish but he did it in the context of working for your wife and loved ones. He assumed the man was married (its in one of his books I cannot remember which).
thanks”
Curt I would suggest you start by reading Julian Lee’s book on the subject. You can download it here,
http://www.celibacy.info/BlissOfTheCelibateDownload.html
As far as I sse it transmutation is acheived not when we “keep the lid on the boiler” so to speak but rather when we “avoid heating the water” in the first place. So first one must practice avoiding physical self stimuli, but the goal is to avoid the mental act itself.
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mandy–“Chris who is definitely a woman”
Hehe. I’d confirm or deny this, but I am having way too much fun watching you people obsess over my gender. I thought you guys, unlike those dirty feminazis, were all about equality? Why is my gender at all relevant to this debate?
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I know you’re being fallacious – but it’s because he’s a mass murderer. If he had just offed himself I would feel worse for him, although he’d still be crazy.
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*facetious, not fallacious. Damn spellchecker
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I don’t see why it’s so hard for people on all sides of an issue to just recognize other people’s right to make choices. Lots of people are happy with traditional gender roles ad family structures. Lots aren’t. I don’t think there’s a war between the sexes
There is a war, though. Women have waged relentless war against men as a sex for five decades now. That’s clear from the feminist propaganda.
But in any case, I am no supporter of fixed gender roles. Let couples do what they wish. No skin off my nose.
But I AM a support of hard rules of marital monogamy, if children are present. No pass to leave and fuck other men with your kids in tow while ex-h pays you. Sorry, that is just bullshit nonsense.
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According to google (hah), only about 29% of American women even identify themselves as feminists. 29% of women (who are probably moderate in their views and mostly straight) against the rest of the women and most of the men? How are we winning here? Andrea Dworkin is crazy, hateful, and has no power in America. Most people who say they are feminists have no common views with people like her.
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Well but identifying as a feminist is not needed. Women of your generation have all the benefits of feminism — why would you label yourselves as gender warriors, when you have already reaped the benefits of the gender war your mothers waged against men my age?
It makes perfect sense that young women do not ID as feminist. If you ask them, though, they are quite feminist, because the gains of feminism are the new “givens” of life.
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“In a sexual free market, most men lose out. Women are hypergamous and gravitate towards the top men, leaving most men out of the running, despite the “appearance” of freedom. Dating and pursuing women is much, much harder than it has been at any time in history for men, because for most men, women are simply dating way up the scale and have no interest in them. This is why you see sites like this one – where men can learn to compete in the sexual free market and get laid. The marketplace is hostile to most men unless the men find a way to practice Game and project alpha-ness.”
OK, look. I have never “practiced game” and I am not, by anyone’s standard, an alpha male. (oops, revealing my gender…oh well.) I’m just myself. My geeky, non-sports watching, musical theater-loving straight male self. Yet somehow I managed to find, at 19, the girl of my dreams. She isn’t a super-model, but she is beautiful. She’s also ridiculously intelligent and has the best sense of humor of anyone I know, and the sex is amazing. While I try to do nice things for her as much as possible, she spends more money on me than I do on her, and we usually split the bill at restaurants. This used to bother me, but now I’m OK with it.
I’m not saying this to rub it in anyone’s face, what I’m saying is that if you are a genuinely good guy and treat women as equals, as people, and aren’t beholden to any stupid rules, traditional gender roles, ratings, or “tips of poon,” you can find a great woman. I have never put up a front or tried to project anything other than what I am, and I did it.
I think the problem here is that so many of you are too picky. You criticize women for being selective and say that the whole system is against you…but maybe it’s you that needs to change. My girlfriend was quite overweight when we first started dating. I overlooked this because I was in love with her personality and her beautiful eyes and smile. She has now lost a lot, but I would still be with her if she hadn’t, because that’s what love is. I find it sad that I never even see the word “love” come up here, but that’s really what you guys are ultimately looking for, isn’t it? Maybe you need to lower your own standards before criticizing women’s for being too high. Newsflash, women like young, attractive men just as much as men like young, attractive women. Yeah, some will date or marry old rich guys, but that’s usually for the money. But there will always be those women who will love a beta more than an alpha, as long as said beta is kind and respectful and genuine. If you treat them like prizes to be won in a game, you may get the woman, but she most likely won’t make you happy. Women of real quality can learn to love betas. But the trade-off for that is that they have to be real nice guys, not “Nice Guys” who think they are entitled to pussy. You guys are asking for way more from women than you give to them, and that’s just going to make you miserable.
*climbs off soap-box*
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Patriarchy is the natural state of the human animal.
Wrong. As Dave from Hawaii explained yesterday, for humans and most other mammals, with few exceptions like elephants, matriarchy is the norm.
Matriarchy is a social structure wherein the females provide all or nearly all of the care for their offspring, with males uninvested, mostly off on the side fighting each other for access to females and killing other males’ offspring. Matriarchal societies like the one above also appear in all primitive human societies. Or neo-primitive ones, like welfare slum societies. They are brutal, ugly, violent places.
Patriarchy, on the other hand, is as unnatrual as society itself. Its viability rests on male certainty of paternity, formalized in institutions like law, castes, marriage, courtship customs, etc. This ensures that males (1) have a realistic shot ar reproduction; (2) are ensured of their paternity. And it lets males feel invested in their offspring, thus harnessing their energies and talents into cooperative structures.
Matriarch = barbarism.
Patriarchy = civilization.
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mandy–“This alleged time of boredom could have been used for scientific inquiry, writing invention etc. But it clearly wasn’t. There is scant evidence of these women asking to do such things such that the few who did really stand out.”
Yes, because clearly women were given the same tools and motivation to achieve all the scientific breakthroughs as men did, they just didn’t use them because men are born more science-y.
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry at how stupid you are.
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^^^^You poor deluded Herb……
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“Since when is an ideology proven right or wrong based on the physical attractiveness of it’s followers?”
Many of the people here seem to have an ideology based on their perceived right to ‘bang’ or marry (depends on the guy) hot or ‘quality’ women. How sexy a person is seems to be an obsession and influences everything in their lives. Sexy men are to be feared because women might want them instead, sexy women are desired/resented/exploited – if they don’t want you they’re cunts, if they do they’re whores. It’s all fueled by self-hatred.
I like sexy people and I like to be around them or look at pictures of them, so does my boyfriend, but it’s not a mental illness with us.
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that was meant for Chris…..I don’t think it’s even worth debating you. Your level of delusion is incurable.
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chris, you are aware that on all tests and by every metric men ARE in fact born more “science-y” in that they have higher visuospatial and logic skills, which translates into enginerering, invention and math. how is this “stupid”?
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Bonnie
I skip past your posts, B in the Bonnie Bonnet, but I found found this in a reply to you.
You’ve got it wrong. It’s women who are the head of the household in the “patriarchal” societies you have in mind. Where there is arranged marriage, it’s the mother who does most of the arranging.
India, for instance, is a matriarchal, not patriarchal society. Asia on the whole is dominated by women. All men are mommas boys here.
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“Yes, because clearly women were given the same tools and motivation to achieve”
Why didn’t women create those tools hmmm they had to be GIVEN? By men?
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Chris
I’m a woman who has gotten off my ass and studied math and engineering. If you want to learn or do something, given a small amount of education, you will do it barring physical impediments. That is what men did all along.
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My girlfriend was quite overweight when we first started dating. I overlooked this because I was in love with her personality and her beautiful eyes and smile. She has now lost a lot, but I would still be with her if she hadn’t, because that’s what love is. I find it sad that I never even see the word “love” come up here, but that’s really what you guys are ultimately looking for, isn’t it?
So you found a nice fattie for yourself and lecture the rest of us about our pickiness? Gratz on your fattie whom you “love”.
Newsflash: love is simply a set of neural reactions in your brain which is neither lasting nor important. Commitment is important, but that is a personal decision, not “love”. If you want to commit to a fattie, good for you. But don’t preach to everyone else about how you found happiness settling for a fattie, even if she lost weight later (mostly you can’t rely on people changing for the better after you meet them).
I think you are a typical mangina, to be honest.
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Chris is a fattie who made that story up to make herself feel better that there really might exist a man who could see her inner beauty and lover her “unconditionally”
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Mandy that has to be the case…
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“Well but identifying as a feminist is not needed. Women of your generation have all the benefits of feminism — why would you label yourselves as gender warriors, when you have already reaped the benefits of the gender war your mothers waged against men my age?
It makes perfect sense that young women do not ID as feminist. If you ask them, though, they are quite feminist, because the gains of feminism are the new “givens” of life.”
Feminist does not=gender warrior. Maybe it’s a generational thing – if you were alive in the 60s and 70s, you probably saw the more extreme aspects of the movement up close. By the time I was conscious it was the 90s and it had been normalized.
To me, ‘feminism’ means believing that women should have the same basic human rights as men, and autonomy over their own lives. Most people believe this, so I think the majority of American men and women are feminists even if they don’t know it. All I want is opportunities. I’m sorry if me having more options means some man has less, but I am looking out for myself.
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Christ, don’t you get it?
Women apparently want to be objectified for the most part. It lets them off the hook for deficiencies in their personality and intelligence.
Men apparently like to be suckered. It lets them off the hook for deficiencies in their testicular fortitude.
So you have women who find it easier to sell their pussies, and men who find it easier to buy it, and then try to sell an idea like equality to them…It doesn’t work. Most people take the path of least resistance, and that’s just human nature at work.
The complaints are about the fact that the system doesn’t take human nature into account. The social engineers didn’t consider the truth of the situation when making their master plans.
…or maybe they did. The cosmetic and diet industry is booming, as is porn. So maybe by whipping up this frustration, they’re profitting from it and simply don’t care about the fallout.
So individuals who can see what’s going on have to basically look out for themselves. One just has to be okay with the idea that they are going to be the minority.
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India, for instance, is a matriarchal, not patriarchal society. Asia on the whole is dominated by women. All men are mommas boys here.
Wait, what?
India is a very male-dominated society. Even non-Indians know this.
For example, people greatly favor their sons over their daughters. Some even pre-screen the gender of the fetus and selectively abort girls (a horrible practice, for sure).
Female literacy is 10 points below male literacy, because many parents only have the resources to educate half of their children, and so choose to educate the boy.
In divorces in India, women don’t get any money upon divorce. That is the reason (the SOLE reason) divorce rates are low in India relative to the US.
So what on Earth are you talking about?
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Feminist does not=gender warrior. Maybe it’s a generational thing – if you were alive in the 60s and 70s, you probably saw the more extreme aspects of the movement up close. By the time I was conscious it was the 90s and it had been normalized.
To me, ‘feminism’ means believing that women should have the same basic human rights as men, and autonomy over their own lives. Most people believe this, so I think the majority of American men and women are feminists even if they don’t know it. All I want is opportunities. I’m sorry if me having more options means some man has less, but I am looking out for myself.
I do not think it is generational, really. The only difference between the generations is what they accept as a “given”. Now, people accept feminism and the extreme anti-male tilt in society as a “given” among the younger generations: women are better, men are lesser, and this is the new normal.
And it has never been about opportunities, either. It has always been about *power*. It is very much a zero-sum game, as you point out in your last sentence there. And it’s fine to look out for yourself, but at the same time that simply means you are a gender warrior, whether you like that name or not. At the end of the day, as we look out for ourselves, we are at war with each other. Hobbes had a lot to say about that, but in the current state it’s all about gender as the main basis for conflict.
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Chris —
You don’t get it. Your fattie lost weight because she wants a guy BETTER than you. She’s either fooling around or looking to fool around. That’s reality. That’s if you are a man, which I seriously doubt. Only a woman would speak of “fear of rape.”
Assault is easily avoided. Stay away from Black/Hispanic areas. Don’t get drunk. Avoid strange men. CCW.
——————
Bonnie — Today’s soft polygamy, with a few “hot” men being shared by multiple women, benefits women. No wonder women defend polygamy — it’s their dream. It benefits a few guys at the top.
But most guys lose out. They don’t go nuts and shoot up the place like Cho, or Soldini, or Klebold or Harris, or blow stuff up like McVeigh, or crash airliners into buildings like Atta and Co.
No, most of these guys just make life miserable for their enemies, which are women, and the kids of Alphas, and will sign on to any nutty scheme that promises a total upheaval where THEY get power. Some of them even succeed, and the cycle begins again. Only Western Monogamy was ever successful in breaking the “men on the out stage rebellion/revolt to seize power and women” model that plagued the ancient Egyptians and Babylonians and societies onward. It’s recent. It’s fragile. And it’s pretty much dead at this point.
So expect a lot MORE violence. Not in the Soldini way, but in the casual way of the British Chav and the Black ghetto. Being a violent thug and intimidating people is a short cut into your pants. And those of your much hotter, younger sisters. You might be enamored of some Alpha male political bigshot, but the poorest punk with a gun can make him crawl on his knees. Women find that … hot.
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Mandy Been Here For a While
I remembered that at Oz Conservative blog, someone discussed that evolution allow for Progressive Social Engineering. Really a misunderstanding of evolution, I guess.
Like any exciting new idea that comes out of the sciences and into the mainstream, evolution was often misunderstood by many of its supporters as well as its critics. Many of its supporters often made conclusions outside the scope of the actual theory that were not and are not warranted by the empirical evidence supporting the theory-proper. “Survival of the Fittest” was used as a slogan by some uber-rightwingers in the late 19th century as a justification for what used to be justified through divine-right reasoning. It was also used by leftist eugenicists (Margaret Sanger) to advance their crackpot ideas.
Lesson: The politicization of science is a great danger. (I’m looking at you, Al Gore!)
The idea is that there is a destination(Utopia) humans are approaching if we can only form human nature to that ideal, we can achieve perfection.
Yes…this is an illusion of the Left. Big time. We are seeing it’s latest incarnation in the Health Control bills wending their way through the legislature. The left has not come to grips with the vacuousness of this platitude despite the 20th century history and the serial failures of the many Great Leaps Forward therein.
Human nature of course isn’t that malleable and I don’t believe evolutionists claim that there is some final destination life is progressing towards meaningfully.
Quite right, on both counts. Human nature is not very malleable (though it is not cast in stone either. Cochran and Harpending have an excellent book out, titled “The 10,000 year Explosion” which presents a compelling case that the rise of agriculture 10 millennia ago had a significant impact on humans genetically, and that our “nature” may have altered subtly as a result of that. E.g., humans became more “tame”, or “domesticated” psychologically as we began to live in cities…compared to the more aggressive “wild” hunter gatherers. Fascinating stuff.)
Your second sentence is spot on, almost cannot be stressed enough. Evolution is not goal-directed. It bears repeating: Evolution Is Not Goal-Directed. All small changes must “pay for” themselves in real-time. Religious opponents often charge at windmills when they attack evolution, anthropomorphizing the theory and viewing it as representing some kind of cosmic “will” that is challenging their God. Pat Buchanan is guilty of this.
But…and this is important, new-age lefty types who invoke “evolved” as some sort of accolade are also guilty of misunderstanding and anthropomorphizing the theory. (As in some hippie chick complaining that dudes aren’t “evolved” enough, or championing some European statist/welfare policy as “more evolved”.). Guess what, the horseshoe crab is *highly evolved* in that it is a near perfect match to its environment, has survived countless extinction events that plagued many other species, and hasn’t had to change one whit in millions upon millions of year. Complexity is not necessarily an advantage.
The fundamental lesson is that evolution is not goal-directed, value-laden, or merit/detriment-conferring. It is simply an astounding and ingenious theory that describes/predicts species change over time.
Survival of the fittest is more like “Survival of the survivors” as opposed to “survival of the best.”
Again, quite right. “Best” is value-laden and clearly not supportable in purely scientific terms. In reality, evolution isn’t represented well by a *survival of the [X]* formulation, although such sloganeering is catchy and memorable. If one needed to reduce it to a small sentence, something like “allele frequency changes at the population level between X generations” – clunky and inelegant, yes, but THAT is what evolution studies, at bottom.
I don’t have a good explanation for the conservative side apart from a widespread belief that America is a meritocracy.
The meritocracy is based on the political axiom we’ve adopted in this country, “all men are born equal” (well, politically equal, anyway). That egalitarian stance was born of a christian/deist mindset. Anything that threatens religiosity is a threat to political egalitarianism, from the conservative’s viewpoint. Thus, not only is evolution a false idol (anthropomophizing Patty B), but it will lead to an upending of political equality. At least that’s how I think their thinking goes.
Strange thing is though, that liberals, while superficially accepting evolution, shy away from the (for them) unsettling implications the theory has on group differences (racial, gender), and demonize those who would have the nerve to notice what their lying eyes tell them.
Both sides seem to forget that “all men are born (politically) equal” is an axiom that can simply be asserted legally without outside justification. That may seem like a position of weakness (no support? just an assertion?), but really it’s a position of strength because it doesn’t rest on anything, and thus can’t be undermined by attacks on the thing it would otherwise be resting on. And well, we have to start somewhere and axioms (or something like them) necessarily exist.
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Maybe I read the dictionary too much as a kid, but I’m only basing my opinions on these words by what these words mean according to Merriam-Webster.
Patriarchy:
1. Social organization marked by the supremacy of the father in the clan or family, the dependence of wives and children, and the reckoning of descent and inheritance in the male line; broadly : control by men of a disproportionately large share of power
2. a society or institution organized according to the principles or practices of patriarchy
Matriarchy:
1. a family, group, or state governed by a matriarch
2. a system of social organization in which descent and inheritance are traced through the female line
I have read a lot of anthropology texts, and while there are a handful of societies that mainly trace descent through the female line, men are still in power. Even in the much lauded Mosuo people, who center their families around women, trace family lines and inheritances through mothers, and have creative spouse arrangements – men are still in charge of nearly everything. Women do majority care for children in every society I have ever heard of. If anyone has a detailed example (things along the lines of ‘Margaret Mead said’) I would be interested to see it.
The only way I am going to accept that ‘Asia is dominated by women’ is if women have an equal share in making money and occupying political office.
Feminism:
1. the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes
2. organized activity on behalf of women’s rights and interests
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Bonnie wrote :
To me, ‘feminism’ means believing that women should have the same basic human rights as men, and autonomy over their own lives. Most people believe this, so I think the majority of American men and women are feminists even if they don’t know it.
Bonnie, newsflash, women already have the same, or better, rights than men.
It is not 1909 anymore. It is 2009.
It is the right that stands for equal rights. It is the left that stands for subjugating men into being second class citizens.
Feminism achieved its goals long ago. Today, what is called ‘feminism’ is actually misandry.
That is why so many girls your age and younger are rejecting the term. Rightly so.
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Patriarchy: Social organization marked by the supremacy of the father in the clan or family, [etc.]
In other words, a civilization that rests on male cooperation, which comes from the fact that most males have a shot at marriage & procreation. In such societies, men run things.
Matriarchy: . a family, group, or state governed by a matriarch [etc]
In other words, she-lions with pups, with males dropping by for booty-calls after killing other males and their offspring. Or human welfare-slum societies. In such societies, matriarchs run things.
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1. the theory of the political, economic, and social equality of the sexes
If a man insults me, I punch him in the face. If a woman insults me, I give her a withering look and then ignore her. Inequality.
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dana–
“Bonnie,
you can’t see that teaching that maleness is a “learned” behavior imprinted on a blank slate and that it has to be changed is anti-male?”
If you define “maleness” as treating women as objects, than you are anti-male.
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PA–
“If a man insults me, I punch him in the face. If a woman insults me, I give her a withering look and then ignore her. Inequality.”
Yet another thing caused by the belief that women aren’t as strong as men. What do we call that, class…?
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Mandy been Here for a While:
If you’re interested, I recommend these highly readable and astute set of essays, by Steve Sailer. 1) Darwin’s Enemies on the Right, and 2) Darwin’s Enemies on the Left.
http://www.isteve.com/Darwin-EnemiesonRight.htm
http://www.isteve.com/Darwin-EnemiesonLeft.htm
Great stuff.
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“Yet another thing caused by the belief that women aren’t as strong as men. What do we call that, class…?”
WTF?!?!?!?!
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“So expect a lot MORE violence.”
What reasons do you have to think that we are going to see a rise in violence besides your fear and hatred of feminism?
Lots has changed in our society since the 70s, but crime rates don’t seem to be correlated with what women are doing.
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/cv2.htm
America is really a pretty great place to be for all of us. http://www.il-ireland.com/il/qofl2009/
If you want to move to someplace where women have fewer choices and would be ecstatic to be with you, there are plenty of places to go. Please, go.
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That poster is a plant from feministing.
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Funky K–“that was meant for Chris…..I don’t think it’s even worth debating you. Your level of delusion is incurable.”
So my acknowledgment of the fact that women, historically, have not has as many opportunities to educate themselves in the sciences is a delusion?
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@ Chris
the belief that
Is this a false belief?
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dana–“chris, you are aware that on all tests and by every metric men ARE in fact born more “science-y” in that they have higher visuospatial and logic skills, which translates into enginerering, invention and math. how is this “stupid”?”
Even if this is true, your original assertion was that women who were bored of being housewives could have been spending their time making scientific breakthroughs. That is stupid because they did not have the same opportunity for scientific education as their male peers.
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i think we’ve found the man that got my missing female hormones and brain chemistry
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“you can’t see that teaching that maleness is a “learned” behavior imprinted on a blank slate and that it has to be changed is anti-male?”
But who is teaching that?
Okay, I’ve never taken a Women’s Studies college course, god knows what they teach there. But the vast majority of the population never does either.
I know you won’t believe this, but most women who identify as feminists are straight, like at least a few men and wouldn’t want them to act like women.
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All the panic about a few alphas monopolizing all the women seems ridiculous to me. I’m definitely a greater beta. Overall I’m a 7 on the male attractiveness scale. In the old days, I’d have married a 7 and spent my whole life sleeping with one woman. But in our society, I can stay single and spend the next decade or so sleeping with many 6s, the occasional 7, and (rarely) an 8. Sure, it’s too bad I’m not an alpha or a master PUA, because I likely will never nail one of those super-hot alpha-chasing 9s. But I get plenty of sex with cute girls and my main worry is scheduling all my dates. So I think there are a lot of non-alpha guys out there who do just fine under the current system. You’ll never have your beta underclass revolution while you have a comfortable middle class.
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Lord, you people are having a hard time keeping up, aren’t you?
It doesn’t matter whether the belief that men are stronger than women is true or not. What matters is that your willingness to hit a man and not a woman stems from this belief. Feminists did not originate this belief, in fact they rail against it. So you can not blame them for this particular inequality.
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“You’ll never have your beta underclass revolution while you have a comfortable middle class.”
Dwindling by the minute pal.
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funky K–“Why didn’t women create those tools hmmm they had to be GIVEN? By men?”
Um…because men made the laws? They were the ones who decided who got into the best universities, who got the best jobs, etc.?
You really don’t understand how the world works. At all.
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So you can not blame them for this particular inequality.
PAs point was that ‘perfect’ equality is a myth because – as in this example – men and women will never be treated differently. This isn’t a ‘belief’, it’s a fact. Because men are stronger than women, they will be treated differently.
Specifically, he was pointing out that feminists don’t want equality in all things – just in the good stuff. They want to share the privileges of men without the accompanying responsibilities.
I joined this discussion late and just started reading above. You started dating a fatty and even once she’s thin, she has former-fatty syndrome. This is one of Roissy’s tips for getting higher quality girls. Congratulations!
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Overall I’m a 7 on the male attractiveness scale. In the old days, I’d have married a 7 and spent my whole life sleeping with one woman.
I’m a sub-human male. In the old days, I would have been shunned by society and forced to marry some hideous woman and support her and attempt have sex with her for reproduction. In our modern world, I can stay single, keep my money, and enjoy my hobbies with little in terms of repurcussions from society.
a civilization that rests on male cooperation, which comes from the fact that most males have a shot at marriage & procreation
So let me get this straight. We have civilization just merely based on the idea that men want to squander their precious sexuality on one ugly woman?
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I’m a feminist and I certainly don’t think men should feel equally free to punch women in the face as they would a man. I don’t know many feminists that would take ideals of ‘equality’ that far. I’ll keep that privilege of gender, thanks. A punch in the face could kill me, it would be like punching a 12-year-old child. There are plenty of women who are as big and strong as some men, but an average woman in any population is smaller and a lot weaker than a man. I’m not a big fan of anyone punching each other, but it seems extra-wrong when you’re punching someone who has no chance in a fight with you.
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They want to share the privileges of men without the accompanying responsibilities.
Remember, nobody wants to be the nigger.
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mandy–“Chris
I’m a woman who has gotten off my ass and studied math and engineering. If you want to learn or do something, given a small amount of education, you will do it barring physical impediments. That is what men did all along.”
Mandy, we are discussing women in history who were prohibited by law from studying these fields.
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Um…because men made the laws? They were the ones who decided who got into the best universities, who got the best jobs, etc.?
Of course, and now that women are ~60% of colleges simply indicates what feminists have claimed all along: men are inferior, bestial creatures.
Do you have your collar yet?
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“So let me get this straight. We have civilization just merely based on the idea that men want to squander their precious sexuality on one ugly woman?”
Right? Seems lacking in logic.
Some men are desperate to be married, they’re sure coming out of the woodwork here, but plenty of you are happier single even if you’re not having a lot of sex.
My BF’s brother is smart, attractive, rich, and a cool person and while I don’t know what his casual sex life is like (can’t be that active cause he is home most nights during the week), he hasn’t had a girlfriend in a while and has no interest in getting married, never has. He’s perfectly normal.
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novaseeker–“So you found a nice fattie for yourself and lecture the rest of us about our pickiness? Gratz on your fattie whom you “love”.
Newsflash: love is simply a set of neural reactions in your brain which is neither lasting nor important. Commitment is important, but that is a personal decision, not “love”. If you want to commit to a fattie, good for you. But don’t preach to everyone else about how you found happiness settling for a fattie, even if she lost weight later (mostly you can’t rely on people changing for the better after you meet them).
I think you are a typical mangina, to be honest.”
So hot women should settle for betas, but a man should never settle for a “fattie?”
Yeah, equality my ass.
And I didn’t “settle,” by the way. I’ve never been more attracted to any other person in my life.
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And I didn’t “settle,” by the way. I’ve never been more attracted to any other person in my life.
There have always been bottom feeders. You are one of them. It’s good that you’re happy be one though.
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So let me get this straight. We have civilization just merely based on the idea that men want to squander their precious sexuality on one ugly woman?
That, and the fact that in a patriarchal society David Alexander helps make trains run on time, and in return he gets to mate and have himself a couple of cute DAs, who get to grow up in an orderly system. Or he can just get out of the way of the mating game and be left alone.
While in a matriarchal society David Alexander gets killed, or raped by other males, or if he manages to sneak in a fuck, he gets to watch the cute little DAs get tehir necks snapped by a stronger interloper. And then get killed.
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mandy–“Chris is a fattie who made that story up to make herself feel better that there really might exist a man who could see her inner beauty and lover her “unconditionally””
God, it’s really depressing that you find my story so unbelievable that you have to make up some conspiracy theory to explain it. Just…wow. It’s no wonder you people are so angry and bitter. You really need to change your point of view on the world. I can’t imagine being so miserable.
I see why K and H left. This place is a hive of depressed, horrific people. Places like these produce murderers like Sodini.
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Most feminists are delighted at the prospect of a few men fighting over them, dropping by for as PA says, booty calls, and then fighting each other, killing each other, and so on. They’ll even take the occasional killing of women by violent, dangerous Alpha men in the Ghetto Gangsta sense, not the PUA sense, to get what they want: Testosterone. That’s the goal of feminists and post-feminists: T and as much of it as they can get, like a junkie jonesing for a fix.
As much as men are driven by T&A, women are driven by the desire for Testosterone and aggression in men. They will do whatever they can, as a group, to get it. A few women may vary, here and there, and a have lick of sense for self-preservation, but most women vastly overestimate the ability to control male violence, and encourage it in every turn. Women are of course drama junkies, by and large and feed off turbulent emotions like a surfer on a wave. In moderation and controlled, this is no problem.
In moderation. When controlled.
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” They want to share the privileges of men without the accompanying responsibilities.”
What responsibilities?
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My BF’s brother is smart, attractive, rich, and a cool person and while I don’t know what his casual sex life is like (can’t be that active cause he is home most nights during the week), he hasn’t had a girlfriend in a while and has no interest in getting married, never has. He’s perfectly normal.
Not only normal, but “the new normal”. The new paradigm of the male superhero, in fact. Seriously.
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The responsibility to control emotion. The responsibility to put personal growth, desires, and needs behind that of family and spouse. The responsibility to die for their country, their family, their spouse, their fellows. The responsibility to count their own lives as cheap, compared to the needs to preserve or protect their community. The responsibility to die like flies on the battlefield. The responsibility to put in a lifetime of misery and drudgery to provide for their family. The responsibility to just do, without asking for praise or celebration. The responsibility to be an emotional rock for their families, children and spouses.
These are just a few, and ones that come to mind that women consistently and prominently evade at every turn.
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Who considers him a superhero?
The idea of the perennial eligible bachelor isn’t new, and I don’t know anyone else personally who is like him. Usually the always-single guys I know don’t work much, are socially awkward, or are very unattractive.
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“You really don’t understand how the world works. At all.”
No Deluded Fatty, quite the opposite.
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Who considers him a superhero?
The idea of the perennial eligible bachelor isn’t new, and I don’t know anyone else personally who is like him. Usually the always-single guys I know don’t work much, are socially awkward, or are very unattractive.
Many of us do.
He is a prototype. More will follow. And that will be a great thing. Men need to be as indifferent to women as women are to men, and find fulfillment in other things. That is not a knock on women, but a boost for men to be their own people. Men do not need women. The sooner more realize that, and control their libido, the better off they will be, because then they can engage women more rationally. But yes, he is the new male superhero of the 21st century.
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novaseeker–“women are better, men are lesser, and this is the new normal”
No. Mainstream feminists do not believe this. Yes, there are some radical feminists who still follow the Dworkian “all het sex is rape” nonsense, but they are not the mainstream.
whiskey–“Chris –
You don’t get it. Your fattie lost weight because she wants a guy BETTER than you. She’s either fooling around or looking to fool around. That’s reality.”
FUCK YOU. You don’t know me or my girlfriend, and you do NOT get to decide what my “reality” is.
She lost the weight because she wanted to look better for me. We love each other.
You are a joyless piece of shit whose “everyone sucks” philosophy makes you incapable of ever truly loving anyone, including yourself. So, like Shakespeare’s Iago, you go after anyone else who has a chance at real love and you try to ruin it for them because you’re jealous of their happiness.
Well, it’s not going to fucking work. You are a failure at life, and I will never be like you. I win. You lose.
“That’s if you are a man, which I seriously doubt. Only a woman would speak of “fear of rape.”
”
Or a man who has actually, you know, talked to women.
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@whiskey – That’s a nice list of ideals, but I don’t know any men that live up to even half of this.
Women have this reputation as ’emotional’ but I don’t see it all that often. I have iron control of myself, better than my BF does (he often loses his temper).
I can’t even turn on ESPN without seeing a coach or 6 ft 7 football player publicly blubbering, and men are forever throwing things when they get frustrated, yelling and breaking shit because they can’t deal with traffic, and getting into screaming slapfights underneath my window at night (I live on a street with 3 bars – I have filmed a few of these pathetic losers, I should put the videos on youtube)..
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PA, working hard in exchange for the right for wife and kids seems highly absurd given that one ends up handing over 90% of one’s wages to the wife and kids. The only reason to work hard and desire a stable society is to have money and the ability to spend it. Patriarchy has no room for men like me because it leaves no room for sub-human males like myself or for those of us who aren’t masculine strongmen. This doesn’t mean that some matriarchal state is the magically better solution either.
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As a practical matter, men won’t commit to women if they know they can be cast aside for a better partner at any whim, and still be on the hook for child support. Married or not.
Thus you’ll see fewer and fewer guys willing to commit. Marriage will be for rich people, not say Paul McCartney rich, but “moderately’ rich with say 10-20 million dollars. People staying together for that beach house in the Hamptons.
For everyone else, it will be single moms. The Britney-Federline solution. With the most positive outlook, most guys looking and acting like K-Fed.
That’s your future ladies!
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No. Mainstream feminists do not believe this. Yes, there are some radical feminists who still follow the Dworkian “all het sex is rape” nonsense, but they are not the mainstream.
I can’t keep up with what the fuck they believe, because they (and you, their male defenders) spend so much energy ducking and dodging that noone knows what the fuck you all believe, and for goddsakes cannot trust you when you speak about mainstream whatever. It is an unruly movement, and to be honest I dont give a fuck about what the mainstream says, because its the rads and not the mainstreams that are more involved in interest groups, lobbying, academia and policy setting — shit that has an impact on all of us. So take your mainstream soccer mom feminism bullshit and shove it up your collared mangina ass.
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David, if you read my comment, you’d have noticed that in a patriarchy, things are orderly enough for you to just work for yourself and get out of the “rat race” and be left alone.
In a matriarchy, you are a target at all times.
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“He is a prototype. More will follow. And that will be a great thing. Men need to be as indifferent to women as women are to men, and find fulfillment in other things. That is not a knock on women, but a boost for men to be their own people. Men do not need women. The sooner more realize that, and control their libido, the better off they will be, because then they can engage women more rationally. But yes, he is the new male superhero of the 21st century.”
I think it is a good thing too. This urge to define ourselves by sexual and romantic relationships is damaging to everyone and many people have problem with it, men and women. We should all focus on ourselves first, a romantic relationship is secondary to a fulfilling life.
Although, if many men feel that lack of sex is emotional and physical torture like posters upthread, I don’t see how it’s possible.
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Right. And she won’t climb the walls in a testosterone fueled frenzy of want from long term lack.
So the trick is to get her addicted to your cock, such that she climbs the walls from want if you dare deny her. Do what the betas cant. And don’t do the betas can.
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She lost the weight because she wanted to look better for me. We love each other.
That doesn’t seem likely. She wants to look ‘better’? I thought you said she was already the most beautiful woman you had ever seen. Does her being thinner look more beautiful? Does that mean you think thin girls are prettier than fat girls? I agree.
But no, whiskey is probably right. She will leave you. She’s thinner now and can get a better guy. Every time you fuck she’s thinking ‘would this be better if I was fucking a manlier guy?’ Every time you go out to eat she’s thinking ‘would this be more fun if I was with a more charming guy?’ God forbid you should move in together, every time she looks around the dingy apartment she will think ‘could I live in a better place with a more successful guy?’
Enjoy her while you can. Your time is running out. I’d recommend striking up some friendships with some more fatties so you’re ready to move on when she does.
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Bonnie:
The responsibility to die or kill for your family, nation or society.
That is the ugly little part of the double standard feminists leave out. Women were expected to be chaste then loyal to their husbands(while men were given some leeway sexually), men were expected to sacrifice their lives in battle(and shunned if they wouldn’t .) Who was really oppressed then?
A Bax
Quite right, on both counts. Human nature is not very malleable (though it is not cast in stone either. Cochran and Harpending have an excellent book out, titled “The 10,000 year Explosion” which presents a compelling case that the rise of agriculture 10 millennia ago had a significant impact on humans genetically, and that our “nature” may have altered subtly as a result of that. E.g., humans became more “tame”, or “domesticated” psychologically as we began to live in cities…compared to the more aggressive “wild” hunter gatherers. Fascinating stuff.)
I’ll have to check it out.
I read once that life expectancy took a dive once agriculture came along. It went from around 40 to around 30 years. Seems counter intuitive that tilling the soil would make life shorter than hunting and gathering. I guess this book might address such issues.
One of my professors told us that serial killers did not exist before the rise of cities. That once people could be anonymous, all sort of pathologies popped up. (parallels to the Internet???)
A friend once suggested that humans just aren’t well suited (rather poorly evolved or poorly created) to civilized life. Hence we keep screwing it up (Egypt, Greece,Rome …)
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I think it is a good thing too. This urge to define ourselves by sexual and romantic relationships is damaging to everyone and many people have problem with it, men and women. We should all focus on ourselves first, a romantic relationship is secondary to a fulfilling life.
Although, if many men feel that lack of sex is emotional and physical torture like posters upthread, I don’t see how it’s possible.
This is where training and self discipline are useful.
Men have options. Men can go PUA and Game. Men can withdraw and do what they want and so on. Options. Men need to embrace all of their options, whether they involve women or not. Society *hates* men who are voluntary bachelors, but many of them are happy despite the shunning. And for men who are not made for that: PUA.
My point is options for men. The world is open now. Options. We cannot change the world back to the way it was, but we can also elect to play the game by our own rules, and this site is one of many options for that.
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“I can’t keep up with what the fuck they believe, because they (and you, their male defenders) spend so much energy ducking and dodging that noone knows what the fuck you all believe, and for goddsakes cannot trust you when you speak about mainstream whatever. It is an unruly movement, and to be honest I dont give a fuck about what the mainstream says, because its the rads and not the mainstreams that are more involved in interest groups, lobbying, academia and policy setting — shit that has an impact on all of us. So take your mainstream soccer mom feminism bullshit and shove it up your collared mangina ass.”
And yet you have no problem with the Men’s Rights Movement, which has some legitimate beefs, like alimony, but has now been co-opted by radicals who praise murderers and call people “fatties” and “manginas” instead of making intelligent arguments.
That’s not an “unruly movement?”
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whiskey,
Doesn’t everyone know that now? Yet men continue to charge down the aisle.
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Seeking Alpha–“That doesn’t seem likely. She wants to look ‘better’? I thought you said she was already the most beautiful woman you had ever seen.”
You thought wrong. I said I’d never been more attracted to anyone else. That has to do with more than looks.
“Does her being thinner look more beautiful? Does that mean you think thin girls are prettier than fat girls?”
Yes.
“But no, whiskey is probably right. She will leave you. She’s thinner now and can get a better guy. Every time you fuck she’s thinking ‘would this be better if I was fucking a manlier guy?’ Every time you go out to eat she’s thinking ‘would this be more fun if I was with a more charming guy?’ God forbid you should move in together, every time she looks around the dingy apartment she will think ‘could I live in a better place with a more successful guy?’
Enjoy her while you can. Your time is running out. I’d recommend striking up some friendships with some more fatties so you’re ready to move on when she does.”
As I said to whiskey, fuck you, you miserable piece of shit. Just because you’re lonely and bitter does not mean you get to treat other people like this. God, you people criticize feminists for being hateful and anti-male, but I have never seen any feminist talk this way to anybody. You are the biggest fucking hypocrites I’ve ever seen.
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“That’s not an “unruly movement?”
It’s a movement that attracts mass murderers and adds fuel to their resentment.
And no, I don’t think abortion is murder.
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You don’t know me or my girlfriend, and you do NOT get to decide what my “reality” is.
She lost the weight because she wanted to look better for me. We love each other.
You are a joyless piece of shit whose “everyone sucks” philosophy makes you incapable of ever truly loving anyone, including yourself. So, like Shakespeare’s Iago, you go after anyone else who has a chance at real love and you try to ruin it for them because you’re jealous of their happiness.
Chris, a lot of people are like this. The best thing to do is accept it and rise above it. Don’t let their negativity influence you. That would be the pity. Being here (and other dark places) for a long time, even if you are originally well-intentioned, will start to warp you. Learn the source of their pain, heed their “warnings,” distance yourself from the resentful bitterness, and move on.
It sounds like you and your girlfriend have a great relationship. I am really happy for the two of you. Likewise my boyfriend is a wonderful and honorable man, and we have a lot of love. If people want to cut that down or spit on it, it’s their prerogative. Some people will forever paint a picture of life with a huge black brush and overlook the nuance in the small things, the little bright spots and joys of life.
I see what you are trying to do, and it is fruitless. Many have come here and not changed a single entrenched mind. It is like trying to convert some fundamental religious adherents. Save your positive energy for those who won’t reject it, rather than throwing it into a black hole of despair and “watch the world burn” doom and gloom. You will feel better for it, trust me.
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So what do you propose to do about it Chris? Shaming won’t work. That’s a played out card. Men only care about shaming when it impacts their ability to get sex. Period. If they’re priced out of the market, going their own way, or PUA, shaming has all the impact of a two year old crying for his blankie.
It does not work.
Whiskey’s Maxim #1: The degree to which shaming works is directly proportional to men’s expectations of sex from women.
And yeah, what Seeking Alpha said. A fat girlfriend gets skinny? She’s seeking new cock buddy. I’d get your ass into a PUA group, pronto, or play LTR Game like Dave in Hawaii did. If you ask nicely he could probably save your behind, with game-changing tips, if you really are a guy. And if that’s what you want.
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And yet you have no problem with the Men’s Rights Movement, which has some legitimate beefs, like alimony, but has now been co-opted by radicals who praise murderers and call people “fatties” and “manginas” instead of making intelligent arguments.
That’s not an “unruly movement?”
Difference is that I don’t defend a “movement” or an ideology. Men are by definition very individualist, at least those of us who are not hopelessly feminized like you. So, yeah, MRAs have crazies, too, I agree, but what lesgislative and judicial havoc have the MRA crazies wrought? What pull do they have in the academy? The feminist crazies dominate lobbyists and academia as well — you know this. Stop bullshitting. It is not the same at all.
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*sigh* Thank you, Hope. You are aptly named.
Thanks to you too, Bonnie.
I need to call my girlfriend now and get some positivity.
I don’t know if I will keep posting here. The depressing crap aside, I don’t think I can keep up with a hundred new posts every hour. Seriously, when do you people find the time to get all this ass you’re supposedly getting?
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@Hope,
amen to that sendoff.
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“FUCK YOU. You don’t know me or my girlfriend, and you do NOT get to decide what my “reality” is.
She lost the weight because she wanted to look better for me. We love each other.”
what a man! did he run out of the room crying after he typed this?
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nova for the flame! you go, bro!! 🙂
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Thank you, Hope. You are aptly named.
🙂
By the way I quoted you in a blog post of mine. It was well-stated, so hope you don’t mind!
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Just because you’re lonely and bitter does not mean you get to treat other people like this.
Chris (and I have a hard time believing you are a man; you sound effeminate). SA is engaged to a hot young girl. So the “lonely & bitter” thing is barkng up the wrong tree.
But forget everyone here for a moment, and ask yourself — if you are in fact a man, not a female troll — do you want to be happy?
If the answer is Yes, then it would behoove you to assess where you stand with your girl, if you don’t want to lose her. Let me tell you what my gut tells me about you. When I was single, I was REALLY good at snatching girls who had boyfriends. I had a good nose for what they found lacking in their man, and I’d exploit that. And your tone just screams “guy about to be dumped because he lives in a romantic fairly tale.”
You might be losing your girl real soon. And there is no greater cruelty and coldness than a woman who no longer loves you.
So what shoudl you do? You should go back through the archives of this blog, including commetns, and over time learn what it is that attracts — and keeps — women. Pay particular attention to Dave from Hawaii’s comments on marriage.
You will resist these new insights. You will try to compartmentalize them. This is called “ear wax,” and it’s normal.
But with time, if you keep reading, if you dedicate yourself to seeing the world — and your own life — for what it is and not what you want it to be, you will start learning.
Remember, boy, it’s your happiness at stake.
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Nova
Excellent post. If this were a forum it would deserve a sticky.
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“But no, whiskey is probably right. She will leave you. She’s thinner now and can get a better guy. Every time you fuck she’s thinking ‘would this be better if I was fucking a manlier guy?’ Every time you go out to eat she’s thinking ‘would this be more fun if I was with a more charming guy?’ God forbid you should move in together, every time she looks around the dingy apartment she will think ‘could I live in a better place with a more successful guy?’”
I could get a better looking, richer guy that my boyfriend, but I’m not interested in anyone but him. I think it’s pretty common to have enough love for a person as an individual that you want to be with just them, even when there are prospects out there that are technically better. Of course as love fades we are all more likely to be considering other people. To put it in a way you might understand: haven’t you ever loved a 7 so much that you wouldn’t throw her over for a 10?
You seem bitter, yes, but also naive.
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“Difference is that I don’t defend a “movement” or an ideology. Men are by definition very individualist, at least those of us who are not hopelessly feminized like you. So, yeah, MRAs have crazies, too, I agree, but what lesgislative and judicial havoc have the MRA crazies wrought? What pull do they have in the academy? The feminist crazies dominate lobbyists and academia as well — you know this. Stop bullshitting. It is not the same at all.”
Right, it’s not the same. Feminists use political pull, MRAs shoot people. Clearly the feminists must be stopped.
You’re fucking crazy.
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Chris–
Completely untrue.
There’s a fundamental double standard, as their should be, between sluts and studs.
I fuck a slut is she’s hot. I won’t marry one. Or live with one.
Most men agree with that.
The idiots that don’t will most likely get cuckolded. And end up with a cuckold baby perhaps. As ten percent are now in the feminist Anglosphere. Once a real slut, most likely one again. After a little while anyway.
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lonely and bitter
Engaged and happy Chris. But you’re just so darn predictable, I couldn’t resist. But I do think it’ll happen. When she leaves you, you can come here for tips on how to get a new girl… one who isn’t fat that you can keep.
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“Difference is that I don’t defend a “movement” or an ideology. Men are by definition very individualist.”
Oh, please. You are so full of shit.
Chris, stop letting them get to you. Not only are they all people we will probably never understand, but they are saying personal shit on purpose to try and rile you up.
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Wow, thanks Hope!
PA–“Chris (and I have a hard time believing you are a man; you sound effeminate).”
Because effeminate-sounding men don’t exist?
“SA is engaged to a hot young girl. So the “lonely & bitter” thing is barkng up the wrong tree.”
You can be with a hundred hot girls and still be lonely, as SA reveals himself to be.
“But forget everyone here for a moment, and ask yourself — if you are in fact a man, not a female troll — do you want to be happy?
If the answer is Yes, then it would behoove you to assess where you stand with your girl, if you don’t want to lose her. Let me tell you what my gut tells me about you. When I was single, I was REALLY good at snatching girls who had boyfriends. I had a good nose for what they found lacking in their man, and I’d exploit that. And your tone just screams “guy about to be dumped because he lives in a romantic fairly tale.”
You might be losing your girl real soon. And there is no greater cruelty and coldness than a woman who no longer loves you.”
You don’t know what you’re talking about, and you’re not interested in helping me. You’re interested in perpetuating your woman-hating and man-hating agenda.
My girlfriend just quit her religion for me, asshole. Her dad has practically disowned her. But she did it for me. It’s called love.
“So what shoudl you do? You should go back through the archives of this blog, including commetns, and over time learn what it is that attracts — and keeps — women. Pay particular attention to Dave from Hawaii’s comments on marriage.
You will resist these new insights. You will try to compartmentalize them. This is called “ear wax,” and it’s normal.
But with time, if you keep reading, if you dedicate yourself to seeing the world — and your own life — for what it is and not what you want it to be, you will start learning.
Remember, boy, it’s your happiness at stake.”
Oh, please, tell me how to be just like you!
As I’ve already pointed out, George Sodini took similar advice to the kind seen on this blog. How did that work out for him?
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“The responsibility to put personal growth, desires, and needs behind that of family and spouse. The responsibility to die for their country, their family, their spouse, their fellows. The responsibility to count their own lives as cheap, compared to the needs to preserve or protect their community. The responsibility to die like flies on the battlefield. The responsibility to put in a lifetime of misery and drudgery to provide for their family.”
This is group-think, not individualism.
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Chris – age you saying that you are like George S. sans Game advice?
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Folks, Chris has been lurking here for about a year.
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Chris, I think your favorite soap is coming on in 10 minutes…you better get your ice cream ready.
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Chris–
They don’t generally get much pussy. Except sometimes from fatties that others pass by. Except for the occasional drunk pump and dump from non alphas.
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Anyone who “solves” the Sex and Love mysteries of life by settling for a fattie is not someone to listen to for advice.
It’s what I would call PUA Buddhism: “Desire is the cause of suffering. Eliminate desire. Settle for a fattie.”
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To put it in a way you might understand: haven’t you ever loved a 7 so much that you wouldn’t throw her over for a 10?
Well first of all, men and women are different bonnie. You can’t flip the argument and have it work the same way.
But more to your point, what will allow a boy like Chris to keep his girl is keeping her attracted. The best way to keep her attracted is to know what attracts her.
It’s not saying ‘I love you’ ten times a day and needing to call her for a boost of positivity because you’re so insecure in your body that some mean commenters on a blog can make you upset.
What will attract her can be found here. There’s lots of material on long term relationship game.
And I promise you I’m not bitter. I’ve actually never been happier in my life than I am right now, which is a nice thing to be able to say.
But I think it frustrates people here to see someone like Chris who will likely lose his girlfriend because he has no interest in discovering what attracts her and keeps her.
We’re romantics here. We want to find out what attracts a woman and put it to work. Anyone who tells you to ‘be yourself’ is actually giving quite selfish advice. Don’t improve yourself! You’ll still be loved!
It’s a pretty lie.
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Chris says, “God, it’s really depressing that you find my story so unbelievable that you have to make up some conspiracy theory to explain it. Just…wow. It’s no wonder you people are so angry and bitter. You really need to change your point of view on the world. I can’t imagine being so miserable.”
It was hard for me to take too, when I started venturing into this topic years ago.
…but such is the mentality of people who have never been loved despite their shortcomings. They don’t know how to love others despite their shortcomings.
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Right, it’s not the same. Feminists use political pull, MRAs shoot people. Clearly the feminists must be stopped.
You’re fucking crazy.
Uh .. He wasn’t an MRA, and even if he was one, there is no comparison between three dead people and millions of men being fucked by a feminist legal system. I don’t defend what he did, but if you want to talk about loss of life, feminism has resulted in the murder of millions of babies simply to placate female freedom. And you support this, you sick, murderous, amoral bitch.
And you call me crazy? You support the largest perpetration of mass-murder in human history in the name of female sexual freedom. YOU ARE A PUSSY. Full stop.
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“This is group-think, not individualism.”
No woman, it’s call civilization. Without it you have sub saharan
Africa. We shouldn’t expect a high school drop out to understand though.
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My girlfriend just quit her religion for me, asshole. Her dad has practically disowned her. But she did it for me. It’s called love.
She threw away her loyalty to an important male figure in her life for a new passion?
What happens when you become the male figure she was once loyal to and a new passion comes along?
Doesn’t sound like a stable girl to me.
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Outstanding comment Seeking Alpha [August 7, 2009 at 3:54 pm]
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Tupac says, “Anyone who “solves” the Sex and Love mysteries of life by settling for a fattie is not someone to listen to for advice.”
I would say the same of someone who “solves” the mysteries of love and sex by settling for a whore.
Most of you would rather a shag a size 4 with a history of 500 partners than a size 14 virgin.
I find that incredibly sick.
…but for the sake of having sane discussions with you, I suppress a lot. I’m not really here to help anyone out of pity…just to let the less herd dependent know they’re not totally alone.
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PA–“Chris – age you saying that you are like George S. sans Game advice?”
No, I’m not, and you know that. I’m saying that Game advice is a fucked up system that fucked up George S.
Don’t be deliberately obtuse.
Tupac–“Folks, Chris has been lurking here for about a year.”
Whaa-? I didn’t even know about this place until yesterday. I got here via Alas, a Blog.
http://www.amptoons.com/blog/archives/2009/08/06/mens-rights-activists-anti-feminists-and-other-misogynists-comment-on-george-sodini/#more-8424
And once again, I am not telling anyone to “settle” for a “fattie.” There is a huge middle ground between “settling” and “having completely unrealistic expectations.” You guys fall of the far latter end of that spectrum, and thus you are complete hypocrites for bitching and moaning about how women’s standards are too high. I fall in the middle ground, and that’s how I met the love of my life. If I was busy rating girls and working on “game,” I would be just as miserable as you people are.
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Most of you would rather a shag a size 4 with a history of 500 partners than a size 14 virgin.
I see where you are coming from here, but attraction is not really negotiable. It is or it isn’t, when the horizontal moment of truth comes along.
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I would say the same of someone who “solves” the mysteries of love and sex by settling for a whore.
No one here advocates settling down with a whore.
Most of you would rather a shag a size 4 with a history of 500 partners than a size 14 virgin.
I think we’d prefer the size 4 virgin for a long term relationship. And if it’s just a shag, who cares about the partners?
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Cris
No he didn’t. Attending a seminar by a notoriously ineffective so called PUA who really can’t get hot young quality girls but rather fatties himself apparently, doesn’t mean he took PUA advice to heart. Much less the best PUA advice.
It’s not an easy process and there’s no evidence that he seriously applied himself. Someone like him who have to. Really hard and for a long time. Including trying it out and failing but then continuing to try.
As well as get much higher quality PUA teaching. He went to the dregs
It’s like saying law school doesn’t work because someone who paid some fees and attended a few days of classes and then dropped out from the lowest rank school then fails to pass the bar. And then commits a murder atrocity like this one.
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PA, Seeking Alpha–
Seconded.
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Seeking Alpha, I know what attracts my girlfriend. I do not need anyone’s help in that regard. And I have improved myself a lot since I started our relationship. So has she. There’s a difference between self-improvement and a completely insecure need to rely on some kind of rule system in order to make sure you don’t get abandoned.
As for her leaving the Jehova Witness church, she didn’t “throw away her loyalty.” She made a decision her father disagreed with and he decided to be a little bitch about it. We are both trying to work things out with him. She didn’t choose one man over another. She wants both her father and her boyfriend and she deserves to have both. You can’t use that as evidence that she is going to fall in love with someone else. That’s completely ass-backwards.
And abortion isn’t murder.
And with that, I’m done here. You people will never be able to pull your heads out of your own asses long enough to actually listen to or respect another human being. Thank you Bonnie, Hope, and Ghost of Nicole for injecting some much needed common sense and decency here, but I am afraid it will never pierce the thick skulls of these misogynist douchebags. Let’s just hope none of them shoot anybody.
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But this is the same thing guys here are asking from chicks though:
“Desire is the cause of suffering, the kind of suffering that created George Soldini. Eliminate desire. Settle for a beta or “nice guy” “
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he decided to be a little bitch about it.
Hmmm, maybe she won’t leave you. Women are often attracted to men who are like their fathers.
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if you dedicate yourself to seeing the world — and your own life — for what it is and not what you want it to be, you will start learning.
Ahh, a good quote.
I know you are well-intentioned, PA. You think that game is essential to the happiness of men and women. It sort of reminds me of the lucky charms that people keep to give themselves a boost. Oh, I have no doubt it works. It’s the well-documented placebo effect, which is still hard to explain when it comes right down to it. It gives you that bit of hope that the world works how you want it to work.
I have to say, after some time dedicated to observation, that the world is what it is. It’s a bunch of different confusing and nonsensical things that don’t always conform to logic and patterns. They just don’t.
We’re romantics here. We want to find out what attracts a woman and put it to work. Anyone who tells you to ‘be yourself’ is actually giving quite selfish advice. Don’t improve yourself! You’ll still be loved!
It’s a pretty lie.
The guys here overestimate the influence that game has for “keeping a woman in line.” The thing is, no one is going to keep a woman in line except herself. No amount of inner game or seduction or insanely good sex or confidence or any of that is going to change someone else. You can influence someone long enough to change some of their behavior and to affect some outcome, but in the end, the equilibrium snaps it all back into place.
We all tell pretty lies. You see, game is just another lie. It’s like the snake oil salesmen of old — give a man what he wants to hear, and he’ll go and make magic on his own. We all have a bit of that magic in us. It’s the ability to influence the world through our sheer will. Keep willing and you keep the energetic force going, creating your own reality.
In your reality, game reigns supreme. In another man’s reality, religion reigns supreme. Who’s to say who’s right? I live in a state where most of the people think that Brigham Young is the American Moses. They’ve got men and women marrying when they’re 18 and pop out four children after serving a few years in a missionary somewhere abroad, in Africa or New Zealand or wherever. Everybody’s got lies they tell themselves for comfort. My stuff seem like pretty important truths to me, but to other people they’re likely worthless.
So yeah, game works. It surely does. But it’s another lie.
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“We shouldn’t expect a high school drop out to understand though.”
Yes, because the higher your level of formal education, the higher your IQ, knowledge and wealth. Except, not.
Hardly any men are living the way you think they should. Most men and 99% percent of the women are very far away from that. And yet, somehow, the majority population has great quality of life in general – better quality of life than a few decades ago when more people internalized those values. You have no reasons for the assumptions you make.
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It’s hilarious how the majority of men here are defending the viewpoint that they don’t have the balls to take responsibility for their own actions. Men getting violent over their lack of sex is not the responsibility of women who don’t want to have sex with them, any more than the elementary student most of you seem to want your gender to emulate getting mad because he failed a test is the fault of the teacher who failed him. This waste of life shot innocent people, and that’s his fault. If he wasn’t so crazy, maybe he would’ve been able to get a girlfriend.
I’m still not entitled to sleep with you if I don’t like you because you seem to believe that your poor fragile egos won’t hold up to rejection and will send you on a murder spree, sorry to say. Man up and stop crying about it.
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Heh, that teaches me to type when I’m that pissed off. Substitute “obligated” for “entitled.”
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Yep.
Man up and accept that you are human refuse.
Again, I in no way endorse killing other people, but the idea that some people are human refuse leads to problems.
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Hope
Do you believe that there are some qualities women are innately, biologically attracted to?
If yes…
Do you believe that women will want what they are attracted to?
If yes…
Do you believe that if a woman discovers she cannot have and keep what she wants unless she follows certain healthy behaviors, that she will change to have what she wants?
I think those are all pretty simple, uncontroversial statements. Yet if they are all true, than game has been proven effective.
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Novaseeker says, “I see where you are coming from here, but attraction is not really negotiable. It is or it isn’t, when the horizontal moment of truth comes along.”
Indeed, and men should accept it when that truth is that they don’t want a good woman. They want a whore who fits the specifications they have been programmed to believe are ideal. For many men though, that is not the way their attraction is geared. They’re not settling. They just have different priorities.
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@ Tanz
Men getting violent over their lack of sex is not the responsibility of women who don’t want to have sex with them
Almost nobody here has said that. You’re wrong with a condescending attitude. A poor combination.
What did Roissy advocate in this post? For the MAN to learn what ATTRACTS women, so that women would WANT to be with him. He puts 100% responsibility on the George and highlights GEORGES failure.
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Indeed, and men should accept it when that truth is that they don’t want a good woman. They want a whore who fits the specifications they have been programmed to believe are ideal. For many men though, that is not the way their attraction is geared. They’re not settling. They just have different priorities.
This is true as well. I think many of us want one type for sex and another type for home. Similarly to what many women want, at least after a few years are under the bridge. I see the difference between the sexes here as a timing issue, on the one hand, and a compartmentalization issue, on the other.
On the latter, like doug1, I think that men can have affairs less disruptively than women can, because men tend to look on them as sex, whereas women tend to meld sex and emotion together when they have affairs, making them more total, and more disruptive. It all has to do with whom you want in your life for what purpose.
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Do you believe that there are some qualities women are innately, biologically attracted to?
When I was a kid I was innately, biologically attracted to the gayest looking guys ever. I hear of lots of girls who are attracted to and turned on by effeminate men. I know, I know, small sample size.
Still, the universe is not, was not, nor shall ever be black and white. Tell a group of people that a tan is undesirable by having them read a bunch of fashion magazines stating this, and they’ll really start to believe it. Preferences can change, and sexual attraction itself can change. Game even says this.
Draw a large enough circle and affect enough people’s consciousness towards your own framework and you trigger their attraction buttons. The Greeks idolized the male body and believed maleness to be the epitome of beauty. That’s some powerful “game,” if you will.
Biological, innate, whatever. It may be, or it may not be. I’m just telling you about the inherently unstable nature of the so-called “truth” you preach. You can take it or leave it.
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This guy felt like absolute shit about himself and that’s always a shame. But one thing that all the people I know that hate themselves have in common is an inability to see the what people out side their experience see.
I mostly talk with women. I know a lot that hate themselves (some have mental disorders that influence this, some are just depressed and self-loathing). Mostly they are good people, fairly smart, and good-looking. They can’t understand how anyone would consider them any of those things.
There are very, very few people who are truly monsters (S was just an awkward sexist until he shot a bunch of people). There are very few who truly have nothing to offer another person. But there are a lot of people who internalize everything bad that ever happened to them, retreat into themselves and never come out. They blame other people and the world for their own self-hatred, and it usually destroys them.
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Chris “The depressing crap aside, I don’t think I can keep up with a hundred new posts every hour. Seriously, when do you people find the time to get all this ass you’re supposedly getting?”
I wonder the same thing all the time 🙂 How do people get time to keep up with this site and others? I know a lot of people maybe have the sorts of jobs where they have a lot of moments of downtime, I wonder if that’s how? Or they use their mobile device while waiting in line and commuting or something?
Also, aren’t people bored with this story yet? Or ready to move on to taking action a la “SAVE A BETA” foundation.
By the way, I think that’s what some people are trying to do here – SAVE A BETA SAVE A SOUL – they’re just trying to help you.
Some of the help is coming out in a harsher ways than others. But I hope you at least think about it. Today you and your girl might be great, you know what makes her happy. But we are all constantly changing and evolving beings, maybe later on she may change a bit? Hope are a bit open-minded about the perspectives being shared, because you never know what may happen and it’s better to not be surprised.
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@Seeking Alpha
I was addressing the commenters here who seem to think this guy is some sort of hero who highlights the desperate plight of guys who aren’t getting sex. And there are quite a few of them.
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Novaseeker, you’re right…but as a point of info, I’ve noticed something about men and affairs.
The same kind of women they liked best before they were married is the same kind of women they liked after. A dangerous chaser of hoes before, stays a dangerous chaser of hoes. A guy who liked his women exclusive and nurturing before, likes his women exclusive and nurturing after.
So I look at a guy’s history very carefully…maybe not for quantity, but definitely for quality. I don’t do reformed captain save-a-hoes.
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Some of you are so stupid, it hurts. I’m a woman. And everyone I know also describes me as “nice.” Yet I couldn’t get laid either for 21 years. Most of the friends I’ve had couldn’t get laid. They weren’t the most attractive, but they were average looking at least.
The problem with men is they think they deserve sex. While women internalize it and think it must be something wrong with them. Their lives are run by diets, make-up, and clothes. The funny thing is that is actually a little closer to the truth. If hundreds of people are turning you down, there isn’t a problem with them. It’s you!
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Hope “The guys here overestimate the influence that game has for “keeping a woman in line.” The thing is, no one is going to keep a woman in line except herself. No amount of inner game or seduction or insanely good sex or confidence or any of that is going to change someone else. You can influence someone long enough to change some of their behavior and to affect some outcome, but in the end, the equilibrium snaps it all back into place.”
First, read your stuff for a while back in the day and always enjoyed it. You are so insightful girl!
I think it’s human nature to want to feel like you have control over your destiny. I think this feeling is stronger in men in general. For a while I’ve been thinking that drives what a lot of the guys here post what they do about being able to completely “control” a woman. I don’t think any guy here has claimed Game can conquer all women, but the idea is that it can conquer a vast majority.
Every individual person, woman or man, is unique. Some people are more influenced by certain biological truths than others, hormone levels can vary, the influence of culture can vary as you mentioned, etc.
I think for men many of the principles of Game will work on more women than they will not, but it’s not absolute as you mentioned. It’s not like doing stuff to mice in a lab.
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”””””””””””””’Chris
mandy–”Chris is a fattie who made that story up to make herself feel better that there really might exist a man who could see her inner beauty and lover her “unconditionally””
God, it’s really depressing that you find my story so unbelievable that you have to make up some conspiracy theory to explain it. Just…wow. It’s no wonder you people are so angry and bitter. You really need to change your point of view on the world. I can’t imagine being so miserable.
I see why K and H left. This place is a hive of depressed, horrific people. Places like these produce murderers like Sodini.””””””””””’
No Chris it is that society gives people no way out that creates murderers.
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RE: PA
As I noted earlier, in a patriarchal society, my access to females is limited because I am forced to engage in the context of a full blown relationship in order to get some female attention, and I’d have to become you to do that. Under the status quo, I can maintain a persona and personality that I feel comfortable with, and with women having full earning power, they can opt for platonic friendships with me. I don’t want matriarchy or patriarchy, but a world where both sexes are capable of creating happy and content lives and where my nieces and nephews can achieve and not be hobbled determined gender roles.
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[…] sex for minimally decent behavior on their part. Here, self-styled “pick-up artist” Roissy In DC makes explicit all of the implications that are otherwise […]
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A-bax, this one must have some all purpose use: “I think your favorite soap is coming on in 10 minutes…you better get your ice cream ready.”
Maybe I can troll the womn friendly boards and use it as a sig.
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“I don’t want matriarchy or patriarchy, but a world where both sexes are capable of creating happy and content lives and where my nieces and nephews can achieve and not be hobbled by determined gender roles.”
Me too.
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“No Chris it is that society gives people no way out that creates murderers.”
Society can’t create much unless it starts with a blank slate.
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Yes, Beth, you and your friends are fat.
The problem is with you.
Diet, and get laid.
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Thank you lovelysexybeauty. I agree with you there.
And hey xsplat, soap operas are fun. I learned English from watching them when I was 10. I still remember some of the plotlines.
Perhaps the discussion can prove to be of some value. Is there some social program or something that can be instituted to help such males to cope with the hand that they’ve been dealt..? Just food for thought.
Incidentally, Savage did a column on this on July 30th. There was a long discussion about it even before the murders came to light.
http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/SavageLove?oid=1930394
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“So I look at a guy’s history very carefully…maybe not for quantity, but definitely for quality.”
Definitely. I know one of my BF’s exes and have seen and heard of two others. All are intelligent, classy and naturally beautiful.
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So let me get this straight, xsplat:
If a man won’t sleep with a woman, it’s the woman’s fault.
If a woman won’t sleep with a man, it’s the woman’s fault.
So basically, it is always the woman’s fault.
Is that an accurate assessment of your belief system?
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evamariesainte
I want the wage gap to re-expand back in men’s favor, and to a large extent.
It’s much better for the country when provider males are rewarding for their ability to provide by getting decently attractive women as mates (so long as there aren’t terrible things wrong with the one in question).
Which should have affirmative action for men in the workplace and sweep away all forms of it for women, including efforts to close wage gaps or root out any discrimination against men. It should be allowed instead of the discrimination against guys we have now starting in schools.
Feminism has lead
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Also, the guy who posted about his relationship with his girlfriend was dead-on in his comparison of another poster to Iago. For those unfamiliar, the entire plot of “Othello” hinges on the villain’s accusation that “She has betrayed her father, and may betray thee.” So I guess that poster aspires to be a Shakespearian villain. Of course, that story ends with the faithful wife being murdered by her paranoid, misogynistic husband who listened to the nihilistic, bitter, jealous Iago rather than trusting his faith in the woman he loved. But Chris seems a lot wiser and less easy to manipulate than Othello, thankfully.
Funny how a man who lived 500 years ago had a better grasp on the dangers of patriarchy than the men here do. Seriously, go read the play now.
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Yep. Feminism is good for men, too. Take my job, my wife, my kids and give me a bill. I know it’s for my best. Thanks, ladies for showing me the light. I am now evolved.
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Anyone can get ass if they know what they’re doing – it’s really not that hard.
Keeping it, however – that’s the challenge.
I’d love to hear R in DC’s advice on what it takes to make a longterm relationship work, followed by examples from his personal life.
THAT would be useful.
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“I want the wage gap to re-expand back in men’s favor, and to a large extent”
I’m so glad it’s not going to happen.
[editor: as you are a woman, you would be happier if it did. i’m not kidding.]
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Beth–
You obviously were obese. And then some.
If an obese man can’t get laid the first advice here would be to tell him to hit the gym. There wouldn’t be a lot of sympathy for him until he does.
If Soldini was either real fat or had a loser job at 48 the reaction to him would have been very different.
The fact is that in virtually every other sort of society other than modern Anglosphere feminism this guy would have been paired with a wife.
This guy puts it well:
http://fbardamu.wordpress.com/2009/08/06/george-sodini-and-the-contract-between-the-sexes/#comment-84
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Chris ain’t a man. No man would write that he has to go to his girlfriend for “positive vibes.” That’s a chick thing. A man challenges, fights, and so on. No man uses shaming. That’s a chick thing.
Chris is a chick.
Any guy who’s fat girlfriend gets thin knows what’s up. She’s after new cock. Simple as that. He either gets in the game to keep her, by running Game, or he goes onto the next fattie with emo tears. Yeah Chris is a chick.
Sil — No one here is advocating anything other than Chris (on the perhaps 0.0001% chance he’s a really, REALLY effeminate guy) to do anything other than run GAME on his chick before she bangs half his friends. Which she obviously wants to, hence the tremendous effort to get thin to bang different and more macho cock.
Othello works because … DUH he’s a Muslim. From a “hard” patriarchy where guys have to spend all their time mate guarding. Think Bin Laden. His father had 22 wives and 57 kids. Bin Laden himself has had five now (one died IIRC). Women, btw, love that stuff. You’ll NEVER see feminists disparage Muslims for their polygamy and it’s side-effects: women in burkas, other stuff of mate guarding. Matriarchy, like PA said, is like a Pride of Lions. Males have zilch investment in kids or women, except for killing each other and each other’s offspring. Othello falls because he ain’t a proper Englishmen, with a proper English wife, living a proper English life. He’s a Muslim who just doesn’t fit. Who can’t. It’s his nature.
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“You obviously were obese. And then some.
If an obese man can’t get laid the first advice here would be to tell him to hit the gym. There wouldn’t be a lot of sympathy for him until he does.
If Soldini was either real fat or had a loser job at 48 the reaction to him would have been very different.”
And what of women who are skinny, but ugly? Do you have sympathy for them?
Somehow I doubt it.
“The fact is that in virtually every other sort of society other than modern Anglosphere feminism this guy would have been paired with a wife.”
I’m sorry you don’t like America, or the freedom it allows. Maybe you’d be happier somewhere else.
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Bonnie–
That’s a completely idiotic statement. Breathtakingly stupid in fact.
No one who rejects the blank slate ideology but instead believes that innate sex differences and genetics in general are very important in determining personal attributes, doesn’t also think that culture or society if you prefer is also of great importance.
There are no solely genetic determinists. Only solely enviromental determinists. They’re called blank slaters. Or Maxists and progeny.
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I wonder if all these men would still be supporting the shooting “victim” if the “victim” was a woman who couldn’t get laid.
I read through more responses, and all I can say is FUCK MEN WHO THINK THEY ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO HAVE TROUBLE GETTING LAID. You should be freakin’ shot with a paintball gun right to the knees.
Almost ALL of the women in my life have had a lot of trouble getting laid. I have practically thrown myself at men for YEARS with nothing! The EXACT SAME THING happens to women. You’re nice, but you don’t have huge boobs? Well, don’t even try! Because NO guy will fuck you!
Because men want supermodels. They wonder why they aren’t getting laid. Because they don’t go for 5’s when they are a 5. They go for fucking 10’s all the time! That’s why most guys can’t get laid. Because there are only so many 10’s to go around…
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I can’t take anything you say on this site at face value. You’re just.. silly. Also kinda gross, and dumb, but mostly a clown.
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He was a social misfit with mental issues. He was so socially inept he couldn’t even get MALE friends. Even the biggest nerds can get a nerd clique, so that’s pretty bad. Socially inept men are to women with options what fat chicks are to men with options, so of course he shouldn’t expect female attention. What Beth is describing applies to Soldini too. Perfectly.
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Doug1 is right, and I’ll take it further. The problem is not Soldini. He killed three? Five? people and is now dead. He accomplished nothing, other than misery, which was likely his intention (aimed at his mother and brother). He was a man who obviously knew he was mentally ill, tried to self-medicate, but it was not obvious to anyone that he was mentally ill and save a dragnet screening that would not pass constitutional muster or political possibility (every male over 12 getting psych screened) there’s no way to detect and stop guys like him. EVER.
But he’s not the problem. It’s guys who are in the same general boat (not the psycho boat, no connection to women). NEVER EVER in history EVER has a large group of men unconnected to women been anything but disaster. Look at Britain over-run by Chavs. Look at Black America, once a place where doors were unlocked and kids played in the street without fear — this in Jim Crow America!
All of these guys, are in for any crackpot Huey Long type that promises a total entirely new society, a whole lotta destruction, and the chance for THEM to come out on top. They’re invested in society’s destruction and replacement by ANYTHING else. They can take a marginal, crackpot lunatic with no following into the Big Leagues.
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Sil–
Yes.
But most of those girls can get laid. Just not by alphas.
Personally I’ve made out like a bandit on both the sex and money fronts. Including plenty of casual sex with a large number of lifetime partners, most of whom were hot.
That doesn’t mean that I don’t think there’s something disturbing about guys with good jobs who are simply too shy and introverted (which seems to be the extent of his transgression before he lost it and started planning for his atrocity) can’t get a mate.
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Almost ALL of the women in my life have had a lot of trouble getting laid. I have practically thrown myself at men for YEARS with nothing! The EXACT SAME THING happens to women. You’re nice, but you don’t have huge boobs? Well, don’t even try! Because NO guy will fuck you!
Because men want supermodels. They wonder why they aren’t getting laid. Because they don’t go for 5’s when they are a 5. They go for fucking 10’s all the time! That’s why most guys can’t get laid. Because there are only so many 10’s to go around…
So many men will bang 5s. Your friends and you are either (1) obese, (2) not making the most of your appearance or (3) rejecting the men who make advances or (4) hanging out in places where there are far cuter women.
Women can get laid easily enough. Men can’t. Maybe the men in the 5 range are over shooting, and if they are then they are being silly. But in your range you would get attention from many men if you were cute. Cute 5s often report that they hate being “harassed” by men and so on.
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doug honey,
There’s a difference between a society ‘creating’ something, and culture and society being of great importance.
I believe in both nature and nurture, just like every other informed person.
And there are plenty of people that believe in near-total genetic determinism.
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“Othello falls because he ain’t a proper Englishmen, with a proper English wife, living a proper English life. He’s a Muslim who just doesn’t fit. Who can’t. It’s his nature.”
Wow. So, the play is not a condemnation of sexism, but a perpetuation of racism. Isn’t that convenient for you.
Your understanding of the play is completely backwards. First of all, they’re in Venice, not England. Second of all, race is only mentioned a few times and religion is never explicitly mentioned. Gender roles are referenced at least one hundred times throughout the play, with dozens of monologues dedicated to the division of men and women. Ethnic differences may play some part, but it’s obvious that the main obstacle is the differences between male and female culture. Othello, as a soldier, is steeped in male culture. Up until the murder, he does not act much differently from any of the other males in the play, all of whom are white. And it’s Iago, a white man, that manipulates Othello into action, primarily through misogynistic rhetoric, though he uses one or two race-baiting tactics as well. It’s quite obvious what the real focus of the play was, and the critical consensus is that the play is a warning against confining people to rigid gender roles and the suspicion and chaos that inevitably ensue from that. The assertions that Chris is a female, or that his girlfriend’s only reason to lose weight is because she wants someone else, show an extremely limited and ignorant view of gender, and taken to it’s logical conclusion, that kind of thinking gets people killed.
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Bullshit Beth. I know personally, women who were at best, 6’s, who had to beat the guys off with sticks, because they had “it.” Pure unadulterated sex. In loads. They were not fat, mind you, but if you saw their picture they would not do anything for you. Meanwhile, I know personally, beautiful tall, attractive, slender women who are easily 9.5 or above, that find it difficult to date because they only get approached by d-bags. They told me so themselves.
Heck I’ve sat in bar after bar after bar in New Orleans, LA, Denver, Chicago, DC, NYC, Hong Kong, and SF, and watched some mid-range (6-7) hottie have a freaking parade of men after her, while the uber-hot chick just sits in the corner and frowns. Because only one or two d-bags will make a move. Every other guy too intimidated.
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Beth, you have to forgive Xsplat and some other guys here. They’re desperate for a group of people on whom they can look down to cling to some illusion of higher status in the herd. It’s a bad strategy for a weird person to use, but I guess their school libraries banned Nietzsche and Rand.
Anyway…men are too easy for a woman to not be able to get laid based on her looks unless she has some bad facial deformities. I would bet that the problem is that they were excluding the guys who were actually available to them. Women with low self confidence often go for unavailable men.
Another of those things women don’t want to hear, and neither do men, is that some people just don’t have the looks or the callous to play in the meat market. The meat market is all about looks and some status jockeying between the mediocre. People with real status and money don’t shop in the circles that most people do…well unless they’re slumming.
So, and ugly or otherwise socially devalued woman in that environment has to be willing to be perceived as not even a sex object, but a desperation object. If you’re not hot, you are the last resort of the drunk and desperate. If you’re not built for that, you should not be out trying to “get laid”. You should be looking for a husband.
Having kept your legs closed for some years will make you more valuable to guys whose first run of marriage didn’t go so well, and who are looking for a woman who is around their age but not used up. So the thing to do is not dress or behave as if you’re trying to get laid. Be more feminine.
Don’t wear a lot of makeup and such…that’s counterproductive if you’re trying to look like an obvious prude. Dress very modestly but stylishly, and very feminine. Get in the habit of long skirts and frilly shirts. Don’t show any cleavage, even in the summer.
Also, get some social proof. Travel in groups of women who are like you, and male friends and relatives who feel protective of you.
That’s the basics. If you’re White, look Mormon, and if you’re Black, look Muslim.
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the critical consensus is that the play is a warning against confining people to rigid gender roles and the suspicion and chaos that inevitably ensue from that
Only if they take Shakespeare as being a constitution that can be reinterpreted over time to suit the “critical consensus” and its ideological prerogatives.
Rest assured, Shakespeare had no concept at all of sexism or “cramped” gender roles. That is reading back into his text what is not there. And it is typical of what we see in the academy today: nonsense bullshit fueled by ideological fervor. We had the same problem at my t5 school as an undergrad 20+ years ago: main shakespeare scholar was a flaming faggot (dead now due to AIDS) who was convinced shakespeare was all about fag liberation.
Nice try, though. Go an and reinterpret the western canon as you wish, but the rest of us will call bullshit on you as you do so.
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Disclaimer for all the new readers. Nicole is fat and ugly. Keep that in mind when reading her comments.
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Sil — You’re some chick on the internet. So I’m not interested in getting into your pants — shaming doesn’t do crap for me. Nor anyone else, after Obama and Rev. God Damn America. So cut the crap. This btw is how men will treat you the microsecond after you are no longer considered bangable, so get used to it, it’s your future under Matriarchy. Women guys don’t want to bang have zilch use for men in Matriarchy.
Shakespeare wrote plays for money. His audience was a bunch of drunken, gin-besotted Englishmen who wanted to feel superior to the nasty foreigners, the French, the Moors, the Danes, pretty much everyone. Shakespeare wasn’t a fricking feminist with a time machine — he made money amusing a bunch of drunks, and a smattering of upper class twits who were slumming. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t great. But he’s not your college seminar on “Gender Roles in Elizabethan England.” Most of the ground at the Globe was covered in vomit and piss (a fact conveniently omitted by romantics). Since Shakespeare liked his attached to his neck, most of his plays had a good heaping helping dose of how it’s right and proper to have only a proper English monarch (who is not Catholic) on the throne. The fricking end.
Jeez, these fembots are stupid and annoying.
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Women do NOT, I repeat, DO NOT, get paid less than men for the same job. No one who actually works in a white collar corporate job will corroborate this lie. I personally have 3 women working for me, and all 3 were paid the same as men who interviewed for the same jobs.
All 3 women happen to do their jobs well. All 3 are also Asian, but that is another topic.
To the extent that women are paid less than men in general, it is for the same reason that 22 year olds earn less than 40 year olds. Why is one ‘sexism’ while the other is not ‘age-ism’?
The whole thing is thoroughly exposed to the piercing glare of logic in Myth #2 over here.
Feminists need to believe this fantasy, much like children need to believe in the tooth fairy.
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Funky K says, “Disclaimer for all the new readers. Nicole is fat and ugly. Keep that in mind when reading her comments.”
That is correct. As a fat, ugly woman who could easily get laid if that was all I wanted, but who is in a committed relationship under circumstances that should have made it absolutely impossible according to the Hollywoodian Hivemind, I know of what I speak.
A hot girl’s value is in her beauty. An ugly girl’s value is in her chastity.
An ugly girl opening her legs is like a hot girl getting fat.
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Shakespeare wrote plays for the groundlings, who were drunk out of their minds, most of the time and a few slumming upper class twits. Most of the dirt where the groundlings sat at the Globe theater was covered with urine and vomit. Drunken audiences (the norm) would throw things at the actors if they did not like the play. Shakespeare needed money, and wrote for money. To please drunks, the upper class twits, and keep his head on his neck.
Hence a goodly portion of every play praising Queen Elizabeth directly or indirectly. And no theme was more popular with the drunks and the Queen than pointing out the many, many flaws of the awful foreigners. Considering Catholic Spain was a constant threat.
Why would I care if you think me racist or not? You’re some chick on the internet. You don’t matter to me either way. Besides, after Obama and Wright, racism has no meaning.
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“Yes, Beth, you and your friends are fat.
The problem is with you.
Diet, and get laid.”
Exactly my point. If guys want to get laid, they need to lower their fucking standards to a reasonable level. When the majority of the people were in North America and Canada is obese, then hoping and waiting for a non-obese woman is… well, foolish.
And it’s not my weight. It’s my boobs. I’m flat-chested. I also have an ugly face. Unfortunately, both require surgery, whereas starving myself would be so much cheaper…
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A hot girl’s value is in her beauty. An ugly girl’s value is in her chastity.
An ugly girl opening her legs is like a hot girl getting fat.
Hmm.
I think that lesser attractive women are prized for their (presumed, often wrongly) availability.
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PA is a guy here who prefers small breasts, and has said he would rather deal with open sores than fat.
So if you aren’t fat, or if you lose weight, there is one guy even in this unforgiving community, who would probably do you.
The question is, is that all you really want for yourself?
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“Bullshit Beth. I know personally, women who were at best, 6’s, who had to beat the guys off with sticks, because they had “it.” Pure unadulterated sex. In loads. They were not fat, mind you, but if you saw their picture they would not do anything for you. Meanwhile, I know personally, beautiful tall, attractive, slender women who are easily 9.5 or above, that find it difficult to date because they only get approached by d-bags. They told me so themselves.
Heck I’ve sat in bar after bar after bar in New Orleans, LA, Denver, Chicago, DC, NYC, Hong Kong, and SF, and watched some mid-range (6-7) hottie have a freaking parade of men after her, while the uber-hot chick just sits in the corner and frowns. Because only one or two d-bags will make a move. Every other guy too intimidated.”
Either I’m really, really hot…. Or I’m not very attractive. However, I have flirted with guys in my own range of attractiveness and still NOTHING.
Guys always say it is so hard for them to get laid. But truth is it is like that hilarious Seinfeld episode with the woman with the man hands. Jerry couldn’t stand dating her for a small reason.
Men are just too picky. That’s why women get laid. Most of them (women) have horrible self-esteems. So they will fuck anything that moves. That’s why guys always complain that girls only go for jerks. Truth is that is the first guy she came upon, and she doesn’t think she deserves better.
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Whoever linked to the fbardamu post at wordpress thanks. Great point about the social contract.
His points are outstanding. The “slacker guy” is something that is directly attributable to no women in a guy’s life that he can marry and expect to stay married to.
If a guy just wants to drift he can drift. And without women, many guys will do just that. Leaving all sorts of things going to hell. It’s not like women can do most of the male-dominated jobs.
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Exactly my point. If guys want to get laid, they need to lower their fucking standards to a reasonable level. When the majority of the people were in North America and Canada is obese, then hoping and waiting for a non-obese woman is… well, foolish.
Wrong.
1) There are foreign women, who are often thin and with a more pleasant personality. Go to the INS website to see how many greencards were approved from China, Russia, Ukraine, Colombia, Brazil, VietNam, etc. in 2008 alone.
2) There is Game, which will put a man ahead of the 95% of men who don’t have Game or vast wealth.
3) There are sex technologies under development in Japan and Silicon Valley, that will disrupt the current male/female balance greatly. Any woman who thinks a holographic tactile or robotic sexbot cannot replace a real woman must also consider that the artificial woman will be engineered to look like a 10/10+, while most real women score below 7.
Real 10 > Sexbot 10 >>>>> Real 6.
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“So many men will bang 5s. Your friends and you are either (1) obese, (2) not making the most of your appearance or (3) rejecting the men who make advances or (4) hanging out in places where there are far cuter women.
Women can get laid easily enough. Men can’t. Maybe the men in the 5 range are over shooting, and if they are then they are being silly. But in your range you would get attention from many men if you were cute. Cute 5s often report that they hate being “harassed” by men and so on.”
Unfortunately it is definitely 4. In the city I live in women outnumber men 2 to 1. And there are a lot of hot chicks out there. It’s a college town, too, so they are all at their hottest and most sexy!
So, the idea that only men have troubles getting laid is just not true. Even attractive women have trouble when the competition is just too fierce. I mean, this guy obviously lost to better competition. That’s it really.
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Novaseeker, they’re prized for their presumed exclusivity, not their availability.
I’ve been on the wrong side of this. The guys assumed that I couldn’t get laid, so they thought they were doing me a favor by lying their asses off and then dumping me when they were done. It was apparently worth many months of deception to them, to get that exclusivity.
Because men seldom talk to each other about these things, and they all tell each other that they’d never do certain kinds of girls, each of them at some point in their lives had an epiphany that they thought they and they alone discovered…that maybe if they did an ugly girl, they could have someone they and they alone were interested in, and therefore they and they alone would be screwing.
I made them feel like men. What they didn’t know is that there were many, many other guys beating down my doors for the same thing. It’s not magic or rocket science, and I don’t think I’m so exceptional in personality. Hell, some of you here find me incredibly abraisive and masculine.
So if I can get laid, just about any woman can.
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Where do you live Beth? Maybe moving is the solution?
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“Wrong.
1) There are foreign women, who are often thin and with a more pleasant personality. Go to the INS website to see how many greencards were approved from China, Russia, Ukraine, Colombia, Brazil, VietNam, etc. in 2008 alone.
2) There is Game, which will put a man ahead of the 95% of men who don’t have Game or vast wealth.
3) There are sex technologies under development in Japan and Silicon Valley, that will disrupt the current male/female balance greatly. Any woman who thinks a holographic tactile or robotic sexbot cannot replace a real woman must also consider that the artificial woman will be engineered to look like a 10/10+, while most real women score below 7.
Real 10 > Sexbot 10 >>>>> Real 6.”
Again, exactly my point. It is actually getting harder for WOMEN to get laid. Because men don’t have realistic standards. They have so unrealistic standards they have to make perfect little robots. That is why guys in areas where this technology isn’t available aren’t getting laid. Because men have standards that are too high for any women to attain, so these men stay virgins.
And I live in an area with a large percentage of Asian immigrants. And I can tell you they aren’t really “nicer” than most other girls. Their society just teaches them to be submissive. Which is something that men who go for these kinds of girls (and robots) find more “pleasant.”
While I believe the bitchy white girl thing has gone on far enough. I don’t believe a girl who refuses to argue with you is really what men should be striving for as an ideal. This is very disturbing. I wouldn’t want to be in an relationship with a man where he couldn’t argue with me. I believe that the way society is pushing towards the “woman is always right” is kinda disturbing. Arguing is fun. And people’s opinions (if they are well-thought out) should be listened to.
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“Where do you live Beth? Maybe moving is the solution?”
Besides the lack of men, it’s actually one of the nicest cities in the world. Literally, magazine articles cite it as one of the nicest cities in the WORLD to live in. Which is pretty freakin’ awesome. I don’t know if I would want to move.
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Beth might be a good fit for David Alexander. Perhaps the two should hook up.
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FUCK YOU. You don’t know me or my girlfriend, and you do NOT get to decide what my “reality” is.
She lost the weight because she wanted to look better for me. We love each other.”
what a man! did he run out of the room crying after he typed this?
this was not exactly the manliest answer I have read in this blog
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bonnie
Ok then bonnie honey. Name one.
Name one public intellectual or popular blogger who does. With a link.
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Beth, you could vacation elsewhere…especially places where guys tend to value non sluttiness.
Join an organization that does some travelling, like a Christian choir, band, or performing group. Being on stage gives you more confidence anyway.
In fact, a little fame goes a long way in getting positive attention. If you have a performing talent, get some gigs, and be very picky about who you allow backstage.
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Beth wrote :
Again, exactly my point. It is actually getting harder for WOMEN to get laid. Because men don’t have realistic standards. They have so unrealistic standards they have to make perfect little robots
No, it is called self-respect. Everything is not relative. Many man have levels they just will not go below (contrary to what whiskey says). There is a level below (say 5 or 6) where Internet porn is a better use of their time than dealing with a real woman.
Sex technologies will push that floor up to about 8 or so.
When you wrongly say that ‘men have standards that are too high’, what it really is is that a man that YOU find attractive is not interested in YOU. That is all.
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The concept of the “10” sexbots is both amusing and frightening …
A normal man might try out a sexbot just to see what it feels like. This is amusing.
A sick man will buy one, have a relationship with it, and prefer it over real women. This is frightening. Hopefully it’s a lifelong committment, I hate to think of this sick man taking on a real partner on occasion.
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“No, it is called self-respect. Everything is not relative. Many man have levels they just will not go below (contrary to what whiskey says). There is a level below (say 5 or 6) where Internet porn is a better use of their time than dealing with a real woman.
Sex technologies will push that floor up to about 8 or so.
When you wrongly say that ‘men have standards that are too high’, what it really is is that a man that YOU find attractive is not interested in YOU. That is all.”
No, men have too high of standards. That’s why they have to push the floor up to about 8 or so. Then they complain they can’t get laid. Because MOST WOMEN can’t fulfill their expectations. The reason they are having troubles is because they are not being realistic. If you are fat, go for a fat girlfriend. If you are a loser who argues on the internet all day long, go for another loser that likes arguing on the internet.
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The man who obesseses about being an alpha is actually a zeta. NO self confidence. Even betas have confidence.
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“The concept of the “10″ sexbots is both amusing and frightening …
A normal man might try out a sexbot just to see what it feels like. This is amusing.
A sick man will buy one, have a relationship with it, and prefer it over real women. This is frightening. Hopefully it’s a lifelong committment, I hate to think of this sick man taking on a real partner on occasion.”
They already have sex dolls that look very realistic, and are made of silicon. I think they are called Love Dolls. They are a Japanese thing, I think. Look it up. There is a story on Youtube of a guy with tons of them. He doesn’t have a relationship with a real woman. Because a real woman has flaws. Every person on this planet has both physical and personality flaws. And rather than dealing with someone with “OH NO!” small-breasts, men would rather create sex-dolls…
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Amanda wrote :
A sick man will buy one, have a relationship with it, and prefer it over real women.
‘Sick’ only by the feminist definition of ‘sick’, which is translated to : men have to do what feminists want and expect nothing in return.
What is truly sick is how incredibly anti-male the divorce laws are, and how a man loses everything he ever worked for, simply due to a whim from the woman – no fault has to be proved at all.
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Beth, on a side note, what city is that? That standard of living sounds nice, I’m considering moving these days.
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Beth, you are far too practical for these idiots. 🙂
I think they are actually masochists without realizing it. They actually love being rejected by women who are out of their league. Over and over and over again. But because they haven’t come to terms with their masochistic selves, they get frustrated, claim to be PUAs, and lash out at the women.
Fortunately these genes should be bred out in a few generations. Masturbating to internet porn and developing relationships with their sexbots will help to ensure this.
I am SO SO SO happy that all men are not like this! I have a wonderful husband, and all but one of the boyfriends I had in my single years were great. The one who wasn’t had an addiction problem and had been abused as a kid, he was a mess.
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“‘Sick’ only by the feminist definition of ’sick’, which is translated to : men have to do what feminists want and expect nothing in return.
What is truly sick is how incredibly anti-male the divorce laws are, and how a man loses everything he ever worked for, simply due to a whim from the woman – no fault has to be proved at all.”
Another thing that pisses me off. I hate it when people complain about this subject. Go out and form groups. Protest. Write your senators. Yeah, things can’t be absolutely perfect for you even if you are a white, Christian man. But complaining about it does nothing. Go act.
Also, how would you like it if you spend your whole life as a househusband and you ended up with nothing at the end of it all? You know, you usually have to freakin’ PAY people to take care of kids, clean the house, and make dinner. Your partner is doing it for free, and you want to fuck her over in the end and leave her with nothing? Yeah, she should get what she worked for. If she didn’t work that hard, she gets jack squat. She worked very hard, she gets something to survive off of when it is nearly impossible to join the workforce without work experience….
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Beth — No, the obesity epidemic, and woman’s hypergamy, leaves guys who would have gotten married or had a regular girlfriend in the 1950’s out in the cold. That’s why you partially have the porn explosion, and other substitutions (“bromance” for male-female intimacy). I’m dubious about sexbots.
Asian women don’t discount High IQ nerdy guys who lack bad boy testosterone and social aggression as much as White American girls. Western men have traditionally valued and sought independent and feisty women who they can trust enough around other men not to mate-guard 24/7. That model broke down under contraception, urban anonymity, and rising female income allowing bad-boy chasing by women all the time. Even while married. It is not ever coming back. And Western men will simply pump and dump in a rational response to the changed sexual marketplace.
If you had a twenty one year dry spell, that means you were pretty fat. Any woman who’s not getting constant offers from guys from the age of 16 onwards is fat. You’re also now late thirties to early forties, thereabouts, and so not exactly anything but cougar material to guys your age or younger — your best bet is some guy ten years older. Sucks but there it is. I can think of three Chinese girls, with bad breath, worse teeth, and not great complexion at B-School who had constant booty calls. True, it was with the kinda not very good looking Indian guys, but it was notorious. These girls had more action than the nearly ten girl I knew there. They were slender though. No T&A to speak of either.
If you are in good shape, you can probably have your pick of guys in their fifties. But guys in their forties will want a woman in her mid thirties no later. Though had you been in shape ten years ago those same guys would have been all over you I guarantee.
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“Beth, you are far too practical for these idiots. 🙂
I think they are actually masochists without realizing it. They actually love being rejected by women who are out of their league. Over and over and over again. But because they haven’t come to terms with their masochistic selves, they get frustrated, claim to be PUAs, and lash out at the women.
Fortunately these genes should be bred out in a few generations. Masturbating to internet porn and developing relationships with their sexbots will help to ensure this.
I am SO SO SO happy that all men are not like this! I have a wonderful husband, and all but one of the boyfriends I had in my single years were great. The one who wasn’t had an addiction problem and had been abused as a kid, he was a mess.”
Thanks. I hope those men do find solace in these sexbots. Whatever makes them feel happy. I guess it isn’t a total loss for women trying to get laid, since those guys wouldn’t fuck any decent woman anyway.
I don’t know if I would ever want something like that. It’s just too creepy to never have someone argue back with you or disagree with you. That would be terrible!
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ROFL @ Fifth ……. A guy has “self respect” if he’d rather masturbate to internet porn or have sex with a mannequin (or god knows what else) than sleep with a real woman.
I would call it a “sickness”. Probably schizoid.
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The more I think of it, the more I like the idea of the sexbots. Then all of these ill men can stay at home and develop their relationships with their sexbots. It will get them off the streets and they will no longer by rejection to murder innocent victims (unless they choose a sexbot that isn’t entirely compliant).
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Ohh I see the shaming brigade is here in full force, hilarious. The above comments from some of you women show that you have absolutely ZERO understanding of what makes a man tick. Z E R O! And please don’t bring your HERB husbands and boyfriends as an example of normal well adjusted men. They’re all SWPL Herbs. Neutered American pussies.
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Sil–
The play is neither idiot feminist idiologue.
First of all Othello was a Moor, not a sub Saharan black man. Moors are Berber and Arab (both Caucasians), though sometimes with some black blood it’s true (which was very striking even in highly dilute form to N. Europeans at the time), virtually always a decided minority among the higher up members of those societies, such as the Moorish general in the Venetia army, Othello. Moors in Shakespeare’s day referred to North Africans, especially of Morocco, and those that hand conquored and ruled most of Spain beginning in the 8th century, until the reconquest was finished under Los Reyes Catholicos, Frediand and Isabella at the end of the 15th. (It was mostly over by the 13the century however, by which time the remaining enclave of Grenada was tributory to Spanish monarchs.) Shakespeare was likely basing his impression of the Moors on the Moorish Ambassador to Queen Elizabeth three years or soe before he finished the play.
Second of all the play was never about sexism, despite what some feminist studies departments say. Shakespeare thoroughly accepted large gender differences.
It was about love, jealousy, adultery or the suspicion of it and so on, however. Not sexism.
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“Beth — No, the obesity epidemic, and woman’s hypergamy, leaves guys who would have gotten married or had a regular girlfriend in the 1950’s out in the cold……”
I’m actually 22 years old. It’s seems I was giving out the impression I was older from my poorly-worded posts, and that was not my intention. I never had ANY physical relationships before I was 19. No one even talked to me beforehand.
Hilariously enough, the guys I asked to take my virginity refused on the basis of the fear I would become attached. Unfortunately, I was never like most girls my age. I tried to convince him I certainly wouldn’t get attached, but alas, it actually gets harder and harder as a woman to get laid, the older you are. Because guys don’t want the “pressure” of taking a girl’s virginity.
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Beth, I have some advice that may or may not be useful, and if you find them patronizing, I hope you know that I mean well. First of all, don’t pity yourself. Love yourself. You have worth as a human being first and foremost. Discover that human side of yourself, and cherish it.
When was the last time you really felt happy? Attempt to feel that as much as you can.
What I did after I got divorced and was feeling sorry for myself was this. I made a list of the top ten attributes I sought after in the man of my dreams. I said to myself, if I want a man like this, then I need to embody these traits as well. Only when I have become someone I would want to be with, can I meet someone that I want who will want to be with me.
Out of the millions, you only want one. How do you meet this one? You don’t do it by saying woe is me, men suck, they pick the other girls over me, and I’ll never find anyone. You don’t do it by throwing yourself at guys to try to make them like you. You do it by stepping back and becoming someone who is worthy of your one.
Get off this site. You are becoming as angry as those whom you lambaste. They will only drag you down into a pit of despair and make you think all humans are scum. No, not all. Not even most of them. I’ve met so many great, nice, wonderful and amazing people over the years.
I’ve met not so great people, too. Various people online, men and women, have called me all sorts of names. Screw’em. Stick with people who want to make you stronger rather than tear you down.
According to them, I’m a worthless divorcee, I’m not white, I’m a loser nerd, I’m a cunt, a whore, a lying slut and an emotionless bitch. Meh. Let them talk. In the end, my greatest enemy was not them. It was myself. I allowed them to cause me pain by being weak and an easy target. When I stopped, they stopped mattering.
You mention that men like big breasts and butts. As an Asian girl stereotypically lacking in great curves, I know there are plenty of guys who don’t give a flying rat’s ass about that. Let the guys here call them “betas” and “losers.” Let them be negative and critical. Let them focus on the dark side of life.
If you insist on knowing about anonymous online guys’ opinions of you, go to reddit.com and create an account. Make a post under AskReddit and put your picture up. Explain to them that you can’t get laid and that you believe men are too picky. Ask those guys how you look. I can guarantee you that you will get more than ten kind answers, and a lot of unsolicited advice.
Trust me when I say that someday, you will look back at this stage in your life, and you will smile. Because you will have gained wisdom and perspective. You will have found your own happiness.
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Amanda–
Sexbots will never have mass appeal. Or not until the technology becomes incredibly human like, on programmable to the desired mindset. Which is generations off at least.
What you should be in favor of is legalized voluntary prostitution.
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Beth — men won’t have sex with fatties. Porn there is a better substitution. Fatness equates with age. When you get fat, you age 10-20 years in the opposite sex eyes (applies to women evaluating men).
Men did not sleep with you because you were fat. When you finally lost weight, you were old. “Getting down to” 140 at 5/7 implies you were considerably fatter. If you were say, 210 you can hardly blame men for not wanting to make love to a woman who’s weight puts her biologically in the same bracket as their grandmothers. You looked like their grannies so you got treated like them — sexless. At your age 140 is still pretty hefty. It’s Joy Behar territory. Behar ain’t sexy.
You can’t make guys find grannies or the equivalent, fatties hot. Simple as that. “Shaming” language doesn’t do any good either. In fact it evaporates in Matriarchy. Women in a matriarchy are good for casual sex and that’s that. Men don’t give a damn what they think and smack em around Chris Brown style when they get out of line. Think Ghetto Rappers — all raised by single moms where nary an Adult Male between 25-55 can be found.
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The more I think of it, the more I like the idea of the sexbots. Then all of these ill men can stay at home and develop their relationships with their sexbots.
A bit worried about how you will compete, aren’t you?
I suppose you think 80% of all men are ‘sick’.
Whatever freedom women have today is not due to the feminist movement, but rather an accident of technology. Vacuums, microwaves, dishwashers, etc. reduced the time needed for housework, and freed up time for careers. This is a good thing.
But another accident of technology will greatly diminish the inflated power that women presently enjoy (and have abused). This will happen rather soon, and no women are prepared for it.
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Hey Hope why don’t you heed your own advice to her and take a hike. Lest you want to become like the rest of us dwellers or the darkside(man I can’t refrain from laughing when typing this). Some of you women while claiming to hate this place and it’s participants, somehow, c a n n o t pry your eyes away and leave. Why is that? What do you think is going to happen if you keep on posting your drivel here? Change our minds?
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You said you had a twenty one year dry spell.
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whiskey, I know it makes you feel better to ASSume that I’m a domineering man-eater and my husband is a submissive, but you couldn’t be further from the truth. I only wish we were having an in-person conversation so you could see him, he’s a beauty, and he most definitely “wears the pants” in our relationship. He’s the manly man and I’m the nerd girl, and it works beautifully because he has an inner nerd and I have an inner freak.
But back to you….. You are caught up in a woman-hating fantasy which is no doubt the direct result of your lack of self-esteem. Are you planning to marry a sexbot, too? I hope so!
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Also, how would you like it if you spend your whole life as a househusband and you ended up with nothing at the end of it all? You know, you usually have to freakin’ PAY people to take care of kids, clean the house, and make dinner. Your partner is doing it for free, and you want to fuck her over in the end and leave her with nothing? Yeah, she should get what she worked for. If she didn’t work that hard, she gets jack squat. She worked very hard, she gets something to survive off of when it is nearly impossible to join the workforce without work experience….
More feminist stupidity to justify hugely imbalanced divorce laws.
If the woman chooses to leave, why should she get money from the man? The man didn’t want the divorce. Why is alimony ‘no fault’?
As far as men doing something about it – they are. They are avoiding marriage. They are learning Game. They are inventing sex technologies.
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Yes Beth, post your pic on reddit and boost your ego by a bunch of SWPL virgin nerds. Good advice Hope!
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doug1,
Sexbots will never have mass appeal. Or not until the technology becomes incredibly human like, on programmable to the desired mindset. Which is generations off at least.
I don’t agree. Some lesser Beta men are already deciding that Internet porn is a better bet than, say, bothering with a 4 or 5. I don’t think this happened in the VHS cassette days.
A sexbot does not have to be perfect. It just has to be pretty good, to push this floor up to say a 7 or so.
Imagine if a man had a free lifetime pass to the best strip club in town. He would go daily, and probably decide that any dating to women below a 7 is not worth his time.
The same effect would happen here. Even men who do not buy the sexbots will benefit from the side effects of the power shift.
What you should be in favor of is legalized voluntary prostitution.
Already exists in parts of Nevada, and in many countries (even developed ones like Germany).
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Fifth, you might be surprised that I too find divorce laws and judgments grossly unfair to men.
You do realize that feminists want equality, don’t you? Not superiority, just equality.
This is why the treatment of men during divorce angers me, because there is obvious unequal treatment of men and women. The women are almost invariably favored in every way. If women want the same rights, pay, opportunities, etc., then we should also want the same responsibilities.
I’m also pro pre-nups.
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If you are 21, and “got down” to 140 at 5/7, then what was your weight prior? Was it 210? Higher? Lower? That’s still high for barely out of your teens.
You also said you had no male interest, and now you say you do, but they won’t have sex with you when they find out you are a virgin! That’s frankly unbelievable. If you tell the guy you have herpes, maybe. Virgin? Not believable.
I taught in barrio schools, there fat girls get plenty of action, I know cause a good many of them had to drop out for pregnancy reasons. But then most barrio girls are fat. Slender girls stood out. If you are White or Asian, in either area, it will be different. But guys your age are driven by one thing, and it’s not their head either. Your story changes so much it’s not credible.
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Hey, it just dawned on me if we women had the same kinds of unrealistic expectations of men that some men have of women, there would be a whole lot of celibacy going on. Can you imagine women preferring to sit in front of their computers looking at porn, buying plastic dolls to satisfy them, participating in any of the huge number of PUA fora to share “secrets” of manipulating men for sex ……. what a hoot that would be!
That would leave procreation to the normal people, which is best for society.
I feel like investing in a sexbot company.
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Over and under for Amanda’s divorce from beta-husband? I give it five years, tops.
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Chris:
Tupac–”Folks, Chris has been lurking here for about a year.”
Whaa-? I didn’t even know about this place until yesterday. I got here via Alas, a Blog.
My bad. I thought you were Chris the Asian dude who used to post here.
Nicole:
I find that incredibly sick.
…but for the sake of having sane discussions with you, I suppress a lot.
I can feel………your anger.
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Women do have unrealistic expectations too, but for relationships rather than sex. That’s why they need books like “He’s Not That Into You.”
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“Over and under for Amanda’s divorce from beta-husband? I give it five years, tops.”
According to Michelle Langley it should take about four years 😉
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whiskey, just because you wish it doesn’t make it so.
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The Fifth Horseman–“Amanda wrote :
A sick man will buy one, have a relationship with it, and prefer it over real women.
‘Sick’ only by the feminist definition of ’sick’, which is translated to : men have to do what feminists want and expect nothing in return.”
You honestly think that only feminists find the idea of having a relationship with a robot instead of a human being “sick?”
Do you ever even leave your house?!
As to those who kept calling me “some chick on the internet,” I am male. And it seems like this is the third or so time you people have made that mistake about somebody. I love how you assume that anyone who disagrees with you is a woman. I guess that means that 99% of humanity must be female.
As for Othello, if the play is not designed to point out sexism, why are there several monologues in the play that explicitly point out sexism? Why is the villain the most misogynistic character? Why does the entire plot revolve around irrational suspicion of a woman? Why are the women the most innocent and wise characters in the play? There is far too much explicit commentary on gender for it to be an accident.
And even if it was unintentional, my point that the poster (whose name I can’t remember right now, sorry) was acting exactly like Iago still stands. Whether Iago was intended to be a critique of sexism can be debated–if you’re an idiot, I guess–but surely that he was intended to be an asshole can’t even be challenged by the dumbest of the dumb.
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Joe, you’re right. Thanks for reminding me.
Hey whiskey, ever been married? If so, still married or divorced now?
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Beth
It’s nowhere NEAR as hard for average looking girls to get laid as average attractiveness guys (which is never as much about looks for girls as for guys whatever girls say, look at what they do, and especially isn’t as they get out of their teens). I’m not speaking as a beta.
Frankly it sounds to me like you’re a female 2 or 3 in looks. Especially if a 2 that does make it hard. But you could get laid if you went the slut route. Do you at least dress real sexy when you’re looking? You might have a lot of trouble getting a bf though, at least among younger guys. Some much older divorced ones maybe not.
Also why not get breast implants? There are guys who prefer very small A cup breasts, such as our PA here. But usually that’s only with an especially pretty face. A trim body and big C’s, or D’s depending on your frame would do a lot. They’re also not THAT expensive.
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I agree with Amanda. Divorce laws are unfair to men. But like conservatives with their tea-bagging and birther nonsense, you guys are sabotaging what could be valid points with a whole lot of misdirected anger, resentment, and just plain dumbfuckery. It is impossible to take your points seriously when you are acting like spoiled children throwing a tantrum, when you dismiss people’s opinions on account of them allegedly being “fatties,” and basically behave like racist, sexist, homophobic scum.
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Beth, I have to second Hope in that this is the wrong place to look if you want to convince yourself that there is some hope for the average guy.
One of the reasons I’m here is to salvage the strong and understand what was wrong with basically forcing myself to pursue “nice” guys against my better judgement.
It helps me to understand and sympathize with them so that I don’t have to hate them. When I first stumbled across this blog, some of the worst of them didn’t know that through their vitriol, they actually saved a guy from having both his knees broken by a few pissed off Russian guys.
I came to understand that it wasn’t personal. It’s a kind of sickness spreading through society that makes susceptible men think they’re entitled to hurt people. You couldn’t really blame them for that any more than you could blame a two year old who’d never been hugged for twisting the head off a kitten.
This is what you have here for the most part…men who were raised to be good little boys and not strong men. Who could blame them for being angry that the world, especially in a society that has indeed become sick itself, does not match their expectations?
Not all guys here are that traumatized and messed up, but enough are that when you return here you should be more stable yourself. Hanging around here will confirm your worst fears about men if you don’t take this in the context of therapeutic catharsis.
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Breast implants ARE expensive. And you can’t just consider the one-time cost, they have to be replaced every 5 to 10 years, so a women who is 20 is looking at several subsequent surgeries throughout her lifetime. Each surgery can cause more scar tissue and possible complications. This on top of pure expense, down time, and the typical risk of any surgical procedure (anesthetic, infection, etc.)
If a woman has deformed breasts, surgery makes sense. If she doesn’t, surgery is simply enabling society’s dysfunctional expectation that women are sh*t unless they have certain physical characteristics. She would be far better off spending the $40k or more she’ll likely spend on implants (initial surgery plus replacements) on something else. Like a property, financial investment, education, etc. Or blow it on something that will be good for her mind, like some fabulous travelling.
If women harshly rated men on their penis size and many refused to have sex (or refused to admit that they have sex) with any man who had less than a 12″ penis, do you think most men would get penile implants? This isn’t a loaded question, I just came up with it, I have no idea what I think the answer might be.
Sil, great post, this comment in particular: “I love how you assume that anyone who disagrees with you is a woman. I guess that means that 99% of humanity must be female.”
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“More feminist stupidity to justify hugely imbalanced divorce laws.
If the woman chooses to leave, why should she get money from the man? The man didn’t want the divorce. Why is alimony ‘no fault’?
As far as men doing something about it – they are. They are avoiding marriage. They are learning Game. They are inventing sex technologies.”
Umm…? From all the years of UNPAID work she has done? Reread what I wrote. If she didn’t work, she gets nothing. But if she worked for years UNPAID, then she should get what is coming to her.
That’s not really doing anything about it. It’s only avoiding the issue rather than solving it. Kind of like calling it civil unions and giving gays all the same rights rather than letting gay people just marry.
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Several points.
First off, Beth, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but the truth is, if you’re a Woman who CAN’T get laid, you got serious problems. The simple truth is that most Women can get dick if they want it-true, they may not be able to land the Alpha cock, but still, they can get cock.
Guys on the other hand, barring status/money, gorgeous looks or Game, pretty much are at the mercy of the Fates, and will pretty much take what they can get.
As for the sexbot piece, here’s my question:
Why is it that Women using the turkeybaster to have a kid is OK, but a Man choosing to hav sex w/a robot/blowup doll/etc, *aint alright*? Seems to me, that if anything, the former option is far more problematic on a host of levels than the latter-the Man harms no one. The Woman, on the other hand, is bringing another life into the equation.
I would never use such things myself, nor do I see sexbots being a real viability anytime soon, but if we as a society say there is nothing wrong w/a Woman who, by her very actions prove that she couldn’t find a Man to do the deed, go and get the turkeybaster treatment as cool, then I simply cannot see any problem w/a guy who either can’t get laid or doesn’t want the hassle, getting girlfriend from Blade Runner to do the job.
*shrugs*
Somebody please, explain to me, what is up with that?
O
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Of course it is as hard. Why would I need costly implants if it wasn’t as hard? And to answer your question, I can barely afford the rent and food. By the time I could afford them, I will be too “old” for men.
Also, I have tried the slut route. Didn’t work. The only thing that almost works is bars. But then much like the psychopath that killed all those women, I’m pretty socially inept, too. So…
“It’s nowhere NEAR as hard for average looking girls to get laid as average attractiveness guys (which is never as much about looks for girls as for guys whatever girls say, look at what they do, and especially isn’t as they get out of their teens). I’m not speaking as a beta.”
Frankly it sounds to me like you’re a female 2 or 3 in looks. Especially if a 2 that does make it hard. But you could get laid if you went the slut route. Do you at least dress real sexy when you’re looking? You might have a lot of trouble getting a bf though, at least among younger guys. Some much older divorced ones maybe not.
Also why not get breast implants? There are guys who prefer very small A cup breasts, such as our PA here. But usually that’s only with an especially pretty face. A trim body and big C’s, or D’s depending on your frame would do a lot. They’re also not THAT expensive.”
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Also, recent historical evidence also shows Cleopatra was likely a plain jane too.
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“Why is it that Women using the turkeybaster to have a kid is OK, but a Man choosing to hav sex w/a robot/blowup doll/etc, *aint alright*? Seems to me, that if anything, the former option is far more problematic on a host of levels than the latter-the Man harms no one. The Woman, on the other hand, is bringing another life into the equation.
I would never use such things myself, nor do I see sexbots being a real viability anytime soon, but if we as a society say there is nothing wrong w/a Woman who, by her very actions prove that she couldn’t find a Man to do the deed, go and get the turkeybaster treatment as cool, then I simply cannot see any problem w/a guy who either can’t get laid or doesn’t want the hassle, getting girlfriend from Blade Runner to do the job.
*shrugs*
Somebody please, explain to me, what is up with that?”
That’s very easy to answer. Because they are doing it to get a kid. They are not having a long-term, sexual relationship with an inanimate object. Ever heard of Asian Ball-Jointed Dolls? I’m into that. Basically, that is the number one insult of the community. That they are in relationships with inanimate objects. So, it still goes both ways.
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1434 comments
it is friday night folks. time to comment in PUA blogs is over. . let it for tomorrow
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bust of cleopatra:
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Amanda–
You’re not sounding so bad Amanda. At all.
There are some bitter betas commenters here. But that’s hardly all the betas much less all the regulars.
What pre-nups can’t touch is child support=alimony. Which for most non rich men is the biggest financial burden of divorce. At a time when 70% of divorces are initiated by women, and divorce attorney’s including our Esquire have extimated that fully 90% of divorces (or at least cessation of intimacy leading to it) are wanted in one way or another are wanted by women. (E.g. they move out or refuse to stop an affair that’s lead them to stop sexual relations with their husband.
I say child support=alimony because it now does include a large alimony component, after it was massively boosted by feminist “reform” divorce laws in the early 1990s. That despite the fact that it’s never been easier for a woman to support herself or remarry after divorce if she wants to. For a high earning man in a high tax state child support=alimony can easily exceed half his after tax income. That clearly includes alimony to her. That’s true these feminist even if her refusal to stop her adultery accompanied by her losing all sexual interest in her husband was the reason for the divorce.
It makes marriage potentially indentured servitude for men. And only men. Women are virtually never assessed child support.
Men should voluntarily support their children as their closeness to them and conscience and the circumstances guide them. I.e. myself, if a wife left me with kids 1 and 3 I might well decided not to, but start over. If i left her because I fell in love with a younger hotter model (which despite media propaganda is the case in way less than 5% of divorces when kids are still in the home) when they were 8 and 10 and I’d genuinely bonded with them (as men tend to do with older children but not with infants) then of course I would. Though I’d want most of it to be direct support.
I basically feel that women do not deserve any ongoing support from men for themselves or their children once they stop sexing them and acting as wifely companions to them. If they want those things they should stay married and make the marriage work. Or they can live independently or find a new man. The father can support his children as he will.
If the ex wife would otherwise qualify for welfare, then I think the father should have to save the state from having to paying for it.
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“Why is it that Women using the turkeybaster to have a kid is OK, but a Man choosing to hav sex w/a robot/blowup doll/etc, *aint alright*?”
No one said it wasn’t OK for a man to choose to have sex with something artificial. Nothing wrong with sex toys. What people are disgusted and amused at is The Fifth Horseman’s idea that it is healthy to have an actual “relationship” with something that can’t relate back. The woman in your scenario is presumably not having a relationship with a turkey baster.
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Fifth, I don’t think that 80% of men are sick. I would estimate that the percentage is much much lower, probably under 5%, based on my lifetime of experience. The incidence online might be higher.
Hey Sil, thanks for your comments, it’s nice to see comments from a normal guy who comprehends reality and thinks.
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Lived with a girl. Got out alive. When I found out she was cheating I was happy. So I could bail without the usual drama, tears, accusations, and manipulations. Weirdly, guy was even more beta than I was. I can’t tell you how many married women have hit on me — and I’m nothing special either.
I think Esquires comment in the other thread deserves mention:
“I’ve banged more than a few wives (most without preplanning; they “forgot” to mention hubby, whoops … yes, women are like this) and they rank among the freakest fucks I’ve ever experienced. More than a couple made quite clear that the freaky shit we got down to (anal, good and hard; tough-love BJs, smacking ass very hard, choking, even fisting – ie many things leading to squirting) was stuff they would NEVER contemplate doing with long-suffering hubby, to whom they went home after, dripping and gaping. If he was lucky, he’d a get a quick pop once a week. Some forced hubby to wear a rubber, but of course got barebacked by me. As for remorse for this sick cheating, I never detected any, from any of the women. Their only demonstrable sorrow, of any kind, was when I dumped them like well-spooged-on kleenex.”
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/07/july-2009-beta-of-the-month/#comment-116507
Obsidian — the reason sexbots are not “OK” is because it’s BETA. Women HATE HATE HATE Beta males. Something most betas just never get. If women could push a button and kill magically, every beta male on the planet, including their own fathers, brothers, and sons, they’d mostly do it.
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Beth says, “Umm…? From all the years of UNPAID work she has done? Reread what I wrote. If she didn’t work, she gets nothing. But if she worked for years UNPAID, then she should get what is coming to her. ”
If the provider was doing their job then, if you want to break it down to dollar value, s/he can consider it paid in full.
Domestic workers are generally paid minimum wage or not much more. If the home maker had a roof over her head and a standard of living based on the provider’s income, then there were no years of unpaid labor unless he abandonned her.
What child support is *supposed* to do is allow the home maker to continue to get paid for continued services.
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whiskey–“Obsidian — the reason sexbots are not “OK” is because it’s BETA. Women HATE HATE HATE Beta males. Something most betas just never get. If women could push a button and kill magically, every beta male on the planet, including their own fathers, brothers, and sons, they’d mostly do it.”
Wow. I guess it’s just me, but if I were going to construct an elaborate fantasy world that bore no resemblance to reality in order to hide from my own flaws and insecurities, I would make one that didn’t suck so much.
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Beth
Who are you kidding? Not us.
First of all it’s she that’s leaves him. See my prior post.
Second of all she was paid. Handsomely. She’s lived a rich upper middle class or above lifestyle if with me all that time. She’s lived VASTLY more richly than any maid would. The same is true of middle class men as well if less dramatically so.
Further, given the strong hypergamy instinct of females especially when marrying to go with someone of higher status and income, this is very generally true.
Your tired retread feminist argument falls flat on it’s face.
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Also why not get breast implants?
No. no… no… NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(sob!)
Doug, you do know that the eighth circle of Hell is for givers of false counsel?
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Nicole–
I agree with the first part except what’s the “abandonned her” exception? She was still paid richly for her labors as a homemaker. The truth is the premium she’s getting is as a lover and companion. When a man leaves a woman “without cause” she’s generally failed miserably in those roles, or to follow your idiom, “services”. Otherwise men just want to have affairs and still sex and respect and love their wives. Usually.
But your last graph. If the homemaker is continuing to provide services after leaving her husband, why should the state have to compel the husband to pay her?
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Sil is a chick.
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Beth–
Maybe it’s evolution’s design (I’m using shorthand here, it’s not really teleological) is that some human’s don’t reproduce. More males than females don’t but some of both.
Yes that would include Sodini, despite his looking ok and having no doubt a fair bit above average IQ given his job. He’s a really asocial wuss. What gets people especially betas here about Soldini is that it represents in some ways lots of guys who aren’t nearly as asocial as he is but also have good jobs and well above average IQs and still can’t get laid in feminist America.
Never before in human history has society not weighted upon female gina tingle mating choices. Always there’s been a more socially useful shaping of that choice, though girl preference was not usually entirely ignored either. Veto power or restricted options usually.
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Whiskey-
Duh.
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I have a deal, a humanitarian arrangement in the House of PA, wherein it is not a violation of marital vows of fidelity when I take it upon myself to convince a wavering soul to NOT get platic tits.
My persuasions are most tender. I unbutton her blouse and slip of her little bra, as she trembles with anticipation and shyness. And then I devote a long, very long amount of time to kissing, caressing, sucking, and playing with those sweet little jewels. Until she understands what an enormous treasure she has in those perky little A-cups.
But only if the small-breated creature is hot. My charity has its natural limits.
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Basically, I hate guys like the man who killed those women. I hate and envy them so much.
Man, it must feel so incredible that even in your darkest moments, it is always someone else’s fault. Even when the entire world is fucking you over, it must the rest of humanity.
I wish I could feel that great. Yes, yes, it must be men’s fault that I can’t get laid. All of them must be scum, right? RIGHT?! Unfortunately, no. It’s men’s fault they can’t get laid more often due to their high standards. But me? I’m just really ugly.
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“Who are you kidding? Not us.
First of all it’s she that’s leaves him. See my prior post.
Second of all she was paid. Handsomely. She’s lived a rich upper middle class or above lifestyle if with me all that time. She’s lived VASTLY more richly than any maid would. The same is true of middle class men as well if less dramatically so.
Further, given the strong hypergamy instinct of females especially when marrying to go with someone of higher status and income, this is very generally true.
Your tired retread feminist argument falls flat on it’s face.”
Not all women are paid that handsomely. And a maid gets to work for eight hours in a freakin’ mansion. A housewife never gets time off.
I believe she should get enough to put herself on her feet and not one red cent more.
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Doug, the problem with making policy has to do with the usually and most of the time. Usually and most of the time are not always.
The other problem with policy though is that social problems are seldom solved with legal solutions. If men in a society are lazy faggots then no law will change that.
Example: most of Jim Crow was either barely legal or actually illegal. It took a widespread social movement to do what laws alone could not.
It’ll take that to get family law reformed. The society will have to become one in which people of all genders have a strong hold on personal responsibilty.
Good luck…
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Beth-
Why should she get that if she leaves him or he divorces her after adultery, which younger cohort feminist raised women are committing more often than men?
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whiskey: No, it would be more accurate to say a magic castration button. And not the higher provider type betas.
A-Bax:
“man was created in God’s image”. Not true in Islam as far as I know, which is considered Abrhamic. Sorry, pedantry, really.
Cannon’s Cannon:
Old news but…
This is the interepretation you got from what I said:
“This case of Sodini means that sexual selection is working.’
When I meant:
“For once, a woman rejects a man who should have been rejected. Since it is biological mechanisms that are supposed to be behind this, yay!”
There are points that can be argued with that. I view it as an opinion, rather than a fact, and a minor point not worth obsessing over. I recognise that one can argue he Could Have Been Saved, but my morality scale says that a man who has capability of strategy-poor killing (his actions are akin to suicide in my view in terms of usefulness and have provided grist for the man-hating mill) is one that should be rejected. Often the most unappealing cases I meet are one who’re infected with a poisonous worldview that seeps into all their interactions. Akin to and actual clinical depression if anything.
Quoted for Truth.
Bonnie: Seriously? When I have to reject men, I don’t remember instances of verbal abuse/anger. At best, I got a ‘you’re a really nice girl, you know that?’ At worst, a joking ‘you lead me on! Give me all that time back!’ comment which was valid since I talked to him for hours without extricating myself and he was sending some clear attraction signals I failed to understand at the time.
Well, the real worst is persistence. But even when I’ve hit The Rare Persister with something, I didn’t get anger, just retreat.
Well, that’s unsportsmanlike.
LOL!
If you’re so clever and mature, then you could’ve worded that with a bit more compassion, instead of reacting emotionally when a nerve got hit. I’m not speaking from a position of superiority: I can’t say I haven’t said this sort of thing myself.
It’s a ridiculous tactic in general to say ‘I’ve had it worse!’
Wonderful.
Nice to see how you’ve benefited from all this, personally.
Now look at the negatives: a) women who aren’t comfortable with their sexuality (e.g. finding her own fantasies horrifying and “patriarchy”-induced) b) men who’re demasculinised and the women who emotionally/physically abused by them (e.g. the statistic on how many women hit their husbands first) c) women who’re ignorant that being young, slim is when your prospects are the best and the time that you’re most likely to bond d) women who’re alone at forty because of being careerist and feeling that they must provide for themselves and achieve. e)having children later and all the ensuing infertility issues. f) Fathers deprived of their children. (young children are better off with their mother but too often there’re meaningless bans on seeing him, either directly or by her moving and not taking whether the father can move into account: seen this happen personally at least three times) and financial difficulties for men re: alimony/child support.
All that said, I’m only focusing on you because you seem for the most part to have sense and give the appearance of open-mindedness.
xsplat:
Yeah it did amuse me to see dana of all people accuse someone of a mental disease on the Internet, especially since she’s the one who linked me to Szaz. The list of her differential diagnosis by someone who might want to accuse her of mental illness would be long and may include a different type of schizophrenia. But that’s neither here nor there, they’re both non-mentally ill people leading their lives.
Chris:
Gunny’s happily married and not contemplating suicide, although he can be very at ease with it as an idea.
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Project much?
Unless you have a gross physical deformity, your real problem is your ugly attitude and demeanor.
From the little amount of time you’ve spent posting here (if you are being really honest), you are certainly coming across as a bitter, angry ugly person. Just as a man with the stink of beta turns off women, so too does an ugly personality in a woman turn off men. Doubly so if you do not have the natural physical beauty that would normally make a man oblivious to your character flaws.
Guys will bang ugly girls…if she comes across as a fun, interesting person to be with…and he got his inhibitions loosened up a bit by alcohol…and he’s not going to be exposed to social pressure for being seen with an “ugly” woman.
But if you’re just not good looking, but no major physical defects or obesity as your problem, than your problem is definitely related to the personality and demeanor you project.
You poor, brainwashed little dear. A housewife in a happy marriage gets more than her time off…and a lot of side benefits as well.
Also, a good housewife doesn’t only think of herself and what she does. She recognizes that while she’s at home doing homemaker work, she KNOWS hubby’s out working to put a roof over their heads, food in their mouths and clothes on their backs.
It’s called “symbiosis.” The key to feminism achieving it’s pernicious inroads into cultural consciousness to alter the very fabric of social order was to first trick MIDDLE TO UPPER CLASS HOUSEWIVES that they were ‘being taken advantage of” and to view their labors as a husband being a parasite of her labor.
And too many women have bought this garbage, without a critical thought or consideration.
When I get home from work — I could be tired, exhausted and just wiped out from the days labor — and I walk into the door to the smells of a home cooked meal, a beautiful smile and a cheerful, sincere “Hi honey,” the LAST thing I’m thinking is “Heh…I got the dumb bitch to be cooking me some food…and I don’t even have to pay her!”
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I’m thinking – “It’s worth working hard like this to support a wife who can create a home I look forward to returning to every day.”
And believe me, I show her my appreciation in many different ways. She is not “unpaid.”
Somethings money cannot buy…and one of those is love.
But love is truly an expression of putting the person you ‘love’ – putting their needs above your own. Self-sacrifice.
Question: How many coal miners and ice road truckers and lumberjacks did the kind of work that risked their lives, or the risk of severe, permanent injury, just to bring home the money for his wife and children…start thinking of all the housework and child rearing as “parasitic” off of his labors?
Answer: Only if she’s a bitter, shrieking shrew of a bitch who doesn’t put out.
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whiskey
Lived with a girl. Got out alive. When I found out she was cheating I was happy. So I could bail without the usual drama, tears, accusations, and manipulations. Weirdly, guy was even more beta than I was. I can’t tell you how many married women have hit on me — and I’m nothing special either.
…….. the reason sexbots are not “OK” is because it’s BETA. Women HATE HATE HATE Beta males. Something most betas just never get. If women could push a button and kill magically, every beta male on the planet, including their own fathers, brothers, and sons, they’d mostly do it.
You are as psychotic as ever.
You make absurd categorical generalizations and then you proceed to introduce contradictory evidence without being the least bit aware of the inconsistency.
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Dave says, “When I get home from work — I could be tired, exhausted and just wiped out from the days labor — and I walk into the door to the smells of a home cooked meal, a beautiful smile and a cheerful, sincere “Hi honey,” the LAST thing I’m thinking is “Heh…I got the dumb bitch to be cooking me some food…and I don’t even have to pay her!””
Dave, I don’t know any guys who would think something like that. I’ve heard some hearsay, and suspected this is what some guys who truly mistreat their wives are thinking, but I’ve never seen or heard that in person.
I chalk it up to a very small minority of sociopaths becoming widespread radical feminist mythology.
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Beth-
I fully endorse what Dave from Hawaii said, as I usually do.
I was thinking I needed to address your “8 hours” point, cribbed entirely from standard feminist dogma.
If the woman regards her time with her husband relaxing as work then shame on her for having married him.
Further the idea that housework with kids is a grueling job is absurd. My youngest brother was six years younger than I was and I was a precocious kid, so I got to observe my stay at home mother’s workload versus my father’s. Sell it somewhere else. Yeah infancy may be quite a bit of work for women, which most love doing, but even that less than advertised. What it really is is constantly on call and sleep interrupting. But it also allows a lot of free time. The rest of child rearing/housework with modern appliances and cooking methods and foods isn’t remotely a full time, five days a week job. When maids are hired for that much they do a whole lot of busy work, pretending. As well things like shopping are pleasurable for most women. Basically it’s a lot of feminist noise. That men were far too reluctant to scorn. No longer baby.
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OK, whiskey, credit where credit is do……
whiskey
Sil — You’re some chick on the internet. So I’m not interested in getting into your pants — shaming doesn’t do crap for me. Nor anyone else, after Obama and Rev. God Damn America. So cut the crap. This btw is how men will treat you the microsecond after you are no longer considered bangable, so get used to it, it’s your future under Matriarchy. Women guys don’t want to bang have zilch use for men in Matriarchy.
Shakespeare wrote plays for money. His audience was a bunch of drunken, gin-besotted Englishmen who wanted to feel superior to the nasty foreigners, the French, the Moors, the Danes, pretty much everyone. Shakespeare wasn’t a fricking feminist with a time machine — he made money amusing a bunch of drunks, and a smattering of upper class twits who were slumming. Doesn’t mean he wasn’t great. But he’s not your college seminar on “Gender Roles in Elizabethan England.” Most of the ground at the Globe was covered in vomit and piss (a fact conveniently omitted by romantics). Since Shakespeare liked his attached to his neck, most of his plays had a good heaping helping dose of how it’s right and proper to have only a proper English monarch (who is not Catholic) on the throne. The fricking end.
Jeez, these fembots are stupid and annoying.
Good post. And Conrad was pandering to an English sense of imperial superiority over other Europeans in “Heart of Darkness”.
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Beth wrote :
Umm…? From all the years of UNPAID work she has done? Reread what I wrote. If she didn’t work, she gets nothing. But if she worked for years UNPAID, then she should get what is coming to her.
That is absurd.
When even Amanda and Sil say that divorce laws are unfair to MEN, you need to conduct a self-examination of your extremism.
You clearly believe that even if the WIFE walks out on a whim, SHE deserves to get paid, due to the hard word she allegedly did (such as watching TV and getting fat).
A woman should never have to take responsibility for her actions, and be shielded from consequences that adults have to face. In other words, you think women are inferior. Some feminist you are.
No wonder you are among the 0.01% of women who cannot get laid.
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Sil wrote :
What people are disgusted and amused at is The Fifth Horseman’s idea that it is healthy to have an actual “relationship” with something that can’t relate back.
I never said ‘relationship’ you pathetic liar. When you have to erect a strawman because you can’t debate the actual point, that is a sign that you know you are wrong.
A strawman is probably what you fuck too.
The fact is, Internet porn is more compelling to most men than a woman of your level of looks (a 4 or less). Sex technologies will merely push up the ‘worth the hassle’ floor up to women who are a 7 or 8. Thus, the middle of the bell curve gets disrupted.
YOU will not be affected by sex technologies. But women more attractive than you (those between 5 and 8) will be.
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Beth–
Ok, let me get this straight.
You’re ugly, a radical feminist, and dirt poor.
Do you really think rad feminism on marriage and divorce laws etc. is the way to get the marginal advantage in using what you have to attract guys?
Especially since much older divorced ones are your best hope?
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Still wading through the comments on this thread, but just want to say, at least here this shit is being discussed. This event and the associated manifesto (or whatever-tf it was) is the emblematic essence. In the mainstream we get the predictable cliches, and outside of that, this spin or that. But not here.
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Check the myth at it’s source: Betty Friedan’s Feminazi Mystique (Oh, I meant “Feminine Mystique”) – which was nothing more than a manifesto to indoctrinate middle to upper class white housewives to focus only on their own domestic duties as “unpaid labor” living in their “comfortable concentration camps.”
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Perhaps the fact that Beth cannot get laid (and thus will not reproduce unless she goes to a sperm bank) is probably good for humanity.
The laws of nature are still in effect, apparently.
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Dave from Hawaii wrote :
which was nothing more than a manifesto to indoctrinate middle to upper class white housewives to focus only on their own domestic duties as “unpaid labor” living in their “comfortable concentration camps.”
And people wonder why Muslims are able to outbreed SWPLs, and, soon enough, topple them.
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Chris and Sil are both women pretending to be men (who appear to unintentionally pretending to be women).
So we have two Victor/Victoria feminist shills here.
In fact, this reveals how intellectually lazy feminists (and most women) are, that they can’t even imitate a man well. The basic tenor of a man’s writings are significantly different than that of a woman. Yet these feminist dumbshits don’t even know this, and think their ruse would actually fool someone here.
The men here, on the other hand, could convincingly pretend to be women, through their writings, and not get caught by any other woman on it.
Regarding men, women don’t even know what they don’t know.
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That’s just a function of these types of women who have never before truly interacted with men who have taken the red pill and see the matrix for what it is quite clearly.
They are used to controlling and manipulating blue pill-taking SWPL betas that shrink in the face of laughingly predictable shaming language and the female supremacy attitude they all project.
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“Import ten, twenty million nubile, lithe, young women to America and repeal the prohibition on prostitution and it would go a long way towards eliminating these sort of incidents and the anger brewing inside of millions of men like Sodini, not so much because they could get safe, affordable blow jobs, but it would result in the lowering of the bitch shields of millions of women by orders of magnitude if they had to compete with those millions of nubile, lithe, young women.”
Sure. But womens bitch shields are themselves a response to PUA’s and to distorted male behavior. A less drastic solution than importing ten million young female sex workers would be for people in America to re-learn how to behave towards each other. This problem is a city one, primarily. Get away from New York, DC, and LA and you can still find men and women coexisting happily for the most part.
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Sil squeaked :
The Fifth Horseman’s idea that it is healthy to have an actual “relationship” with something that can’t relate back.
I never said ‘relationship’ you filthy liar. Having to lie about another’s position is proof that you know you are wrong. And you know that you feel threatened.
All I said is that sex technologies are an augmentation of Internet porn, which already push women 4 and below (such as yourself) into a zone where very few men will bother with them. Sex technologies will merely move that floor to about 8 or so.
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Can anybody point me to where to begin to develop Game? – Oh Dear
You might try the mall. Or if you’re a tough guy, the street. Good luck.
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Get away from New York, DC, and LA and you can still find men and women coexisting happily for the most part.
Only the SWPLs and blacks of urban areas.
Even in cities, immigrant communities are moving in and breeding. Some of them are effected by feminism, but most are not.
So SWPL culture is really a transitory footnote in history, particularly considering that they don’t reproduce. Rural America remains solid, and urban America is getting filled with immigrants who still follow traditional gender roles (to the other extreme in some cases, but that is another matter).
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Sure. But womens bitch shields are themselves a response to PUA’s and to distorted male behavior. A less drastic solution than importing ten million young female sex workers would be for people in America to re-learn how to behave towards each other. This problem is a city one, primarily. Get away from New York, DC, and LA and you can still find men and women coexisting happily for the most part.
So what?
Most people live in major metros, so Game is the only option. Most are not moving to flyover country anytime soon — in fact most would prefer to expat than to live in those godforsaken flyover american hellholes.
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The problem with this poor guy is that his beta-tude was ingrained, part of his bio-chem. Apparently this pattern is observable and studied in chimps. At that point, game is wishful thinking. His options were slavish ass-kissing, hoping for a handout, or …
So game is useful to some, but not to everyone.
Another point, that may have been discussed here but don’t recall, is that, in their use of sex appeal, women are exercising their animal power. A man’s animal power is his capacity for violence. These two will balance each other. The more sex appeal on display, the shorter the trigger on the capacity for violence.
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Re my previous post, a criticism that comes to mind: What of traditionalist, say Arabic or Central-Asian societies, that allow for no display of sex appeal from the woman? And such societies have violent tendencies. There is no contradiction there, but explaining the subtleties is beyond me now. The equation has to take into account the tendency to control the animal impulses. If these are controlled, as in the West, the sexual display can ratchet higher before the reaction ensues.
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Novaseeker, “Most people live in major metros, so Game is the only option. Most are not moving to flyover country anytime soon — in fact most would prefer to expat than to live in those godforsaken flyover american hellholes.”
Game won’t turn a hot city girl into a hot country girl.
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“Why should she get that if she leaves him or he divorces her after adultery, which younger cohort feminist raised women are committing more often than men?”
Then she doesn’t get anything.
“Ok, let me get this straight.
You’re ugly, a radical feminist, and dirt poor.
Do you really think rad feminism on marriage and divorce laws etc. is the way to get the marginal advantage in using what you have to attract guys?
Especially since much older divorced ones are your best hope?”
How am I a “radical” feminist? How is thinking that a woman shouldn’t leech off a man, but get enough money to get a job and support herself after spending years as a housewife with no job experience, make me a “radical” feminist?
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The problem with this poor guy is that his beta-tude was ingrained, part of his bio-chem. Apparently this pattern is observable and studied in chimps. At that point, game is wishful thinking. His options were slavish ass-kissing, hoping for a handout, or …
I don’t believe this is true for most men. There are many degrees of variability, of course, but I don’t think that there are large groups of men who can’t benefit from Game even after they know about, and accept, the value of Game.
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Or to explain what might seem a contradiction in my contention that women’s animal power will be balanced by men’s animal power (and vice-versa?), the example of societies where women’s sex appeal in held in check being agressive, simply consider that the West is in retreat.
(I know, bordering on incoherent. Trying to work on some ideas and drink beer at the same time.)
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“Perhaps the fact that Beth cannot get laid (and thus will not reproduce unless she goes to a sperm bank) is probably good for humanity.
The laws of nature are still in effect, apparently.”
I can say the same for you, sexbot boy. 😉
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Fifth Horseman, Game is useful to understand even if not successfully employed. It can shift the fault away from the poor sap, onto larger problems. He’ll still suffer from blue balls (occasionally, even at that age), but be less likely to cause some stranger’s family such grief.
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How is it absurd? Women hate Betas jibes exactly with Roissy’s observations of Marry/Fuck/Kill.
Besides, this guy did not stick with her long. Did me a favor, I guess. I guess his principal attraction was he was around.
Second what Doug1 said about how this is unique (i.e. all society warped around what makes women turned on). It’s not healthy, any more than unrestricted male choice.
However, successful species in avoiding extinction have generally, robust gene pools. Humans are unique in that we mix r vs. k reproduction, i.e. rats vs. blue whales. In the k model, only a few reproduce, and focus on extracting maximum resources, while in the r model many reproduce because you never know what genes will come in handy. A guy like Soldini, might have had a unique mutation that would confer increased resistance to disease. Or not, you can’t tell particularly as diseases evolve. Generally species go extinct because they specialize too much and get into a genetic bottleneck.
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How am I a “radical” feminist? How is thinking that a woman shouldn’t leech off a man, but get enough money to get a job and support herself after spending years as a housewife with no job experience, make me a “radical” feminist?
And how does turning a beta male into a wage slave for a woman make his life better? Oooh, he gets (crappy, inferior monogamous) sex, but he’s working 60 hrs weeks to hand over his money leaving him no time or money to enjoy the fruits of his labour.
Fuck that shit.
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“Unless you have a gross physical deformity, your real problem is your ugly attitude and demeanor…….”
I really can’t take your posts that seriously if you won’t even read what I wrote. What I wrote is entirely different from what you interpreted. That man thought everything in the world was everyone else’s fault. Never his own. I was complaining how nice it would feel to feel that way. Instead of being more logical and realizing it is actually your fault.
Also, I had a mother that was a shrieking bitch. Who was ungrateful and always had to have her way. I think that people should respect their partners. But I always had a problem with being “grateful.” Sure, I appreciate people and what they do for me. But I do nice things for people because I am a nice person. Expecting people to “put out” or give you something in return… Well, no wonder the hypothetical wife hates the husband. You should give because you love. Not because you feel you need to. Of course one would get bitter and resentful with a method like this.
It’s like forced volunteer work. The shit they make you do at schools. You certainly won’t enjoy it or put any effort into it if you feel you can’t get out of it, or didn’t really want to in the first place.
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“And how does turning a beta male into a wage slave for a woman make his life better? Oooh, he gets (crappy, inferior monogamous) sex, but he’s working 60 hrs weeks to hand over his money leaving him no time or money to enjoy the fruits of his labour.
Fuck that shit.”
Then don’t marry? If you don’t want to marry, and you only want sex, then do it. Dump the girl all the time if you don’t want a relationship. She can’t force you to marry her if you dump her ass first.
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Nova — Flyover country is not bad. I’ve spent time in Dallas/FW, Denver, Salt Lake, Atlanta, Chicago, and New Hampshire. Enjoyed them all, including the outlying areas.
The only place I found hell was Topeka KS. They do roll up the sidewalks at night. Right about 9 pm.
Place in and around Salt Lake are great if you like mountain biking, hiking, fishing, and so on. Damn cold in the winter. Stupid liquor laws. But a lot of non-Mormons. Boise is nice too, from what I’ve heard.
Texas is pretty. Out in California the hills are green from Jan-March, if that. From Amarillo through to Dallas, the entire country side is green fields, dotted with peach orchards and small ponds, particularly off the Interstate. In August. Dallas is nice. Lots of Art Deco buildings still there.
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Nicole:
Because men seldom talk to each other about these things, and they all tell each other that they’d never do certain kinds of girls, each of them at some point in their lives had an epiphany that they thought they and they alone discovered…that maybe if they did an ugly girl, they could have someone they and they alone were interested in, and therefore they and they alone would be screwing.
Kinda reminds me of my prediliction for what I call “scatch-n-dents.” Like most men, I’m not to keen on mate-guarding, but I still want the best. So I’m often overcome with joy when I I discover a chick who would be an 8, save for a small flaw like a large nose or weak chin. A woman like that will be largely ignored by super alphas, and the appeal is somewhat niche-like, so I smell blood in the water and circle in.
I come at her like a panther, cuz I know ‘yes’ is her answer.
😉
Beth:
I’m 5′7 and 140lbs. I’m currently losing weight and hope to get back to 120lbs. I’ve had my body fat measured in high school (when I was much chubbier) and was right in the average range. I’m not even overweight at all.
You say you’re a bit chubby but not getting any. My advice: move to a city with a large hispanic population. Or go on vacation to South America. We spics love a woman with a little junk in the trunk. You’ll be in hog heaven, pardon the pun.
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The venerable Whiskey:
Obsidian — the reason sexbots are not “OK” is because it’s BETA. Women HATE HATE HATE Beta males.
Sweet! Time for another shot.
(I play a drinking game where throw back some Bushmills everytime Whiskey unleashes his classic phrase)
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Beth might be a good fit for David Alexander. Perhaps the two should hook up.
She probably doesn’t have nails and only owns flats. She probably never uses makeup. She may be suitable for hugs and conversations though.
Guys are not picky.
And that’s the damned problem.
A 5-6 in the bed beats your right hand dreaming about some 9-10.
Again, that’s because most men are not discerning enough.
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She can’t force you to marry her if you dump her ass first.
It’s the alpha males here who want a system that suppresses beta freedom by depriving women of high incomes which forces them onto men that they don’t love. While they continue to use their alpha powers to score hot women who actually orgasm, they’re merely making life miserable for women by forcing them onto beta males they don’t love and for men by seizing their wages to pay for these women.
We should invest in research on how to develop single-parent families where the kids turn out just as well as a traditional nuclear family. That way, we can save the betas.
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The men (and women) can have sexbots with advanced AI.
The children can have fatherbots.
Declared DA.
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Dadbots, to go for something snappier.
What functions to program?
— Reading bedtime stories
— “Make us dinner, woman! Learn how to cook, daughter!”
— “You’re not going out in that!”
— automatic at age 11 porn to son
Yeah, DA.
No.
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Tupac Chopra
Official diagnosis? Lush 😉
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Oh, I just wanted to say. I don’t really know what all this alpha/beta/game shit is referring to. I just got directed to this site from another site.
Anyway, I can’t help but think about this from a biological standpoint. In the real world, beta males do get females from their species. Not as often as alphas, but females do, in fact, seek out beta males for increased genetic diversity. See elephant seals, fairy wrens, humans, etc.
You see the problem is that it is scientifically proven that males with lower testosterone make better fathers. They tend to feed and look after their children more. (Whereas higher testosterone males have always been associated with being better able to defend their children.) The problem is that higher testosterone males provide better genes. Hence why in animal species, including humans, females tend to cheat more when they are most fertile. And they tend to cheat with higher testosterone males.
One of my favorite species is the Fairy Wren. A cute little bird that would probably make a great example for a human society.
See, the males are all polygamous, like a lot of animal species, and like human males desire to be. But the females are free to do the same. They pick a father that raises their children, but often “cheat” on them with higher testosterone males. A good 80% of chicks are not the genetic offspring of the father-figure. But the father-figure doesn’t mind, since it also gets a lot of sex on the side as well from other females.
See, if our society was more like the Wren society, where the female can also mate with multiple partners, then everybody would be getting laid and everyone would be happy.
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See, if our society was more like the Wren society, where the female can also mate with multiple partners, then everybody would be getting laid and everyone would be happy.
Ummmm dear, this entire blog is about discussing various aspects of PRECISELY HOW our society has become Fairy Wren-like…and how it’s made everyone much less happy.
In many ways, it’s exactly this society that produces guys like Soldini.
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Beth
Wrens will most likely never develop cheap and reliable paternity tests.
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Beth:
See, if our society was more like the Wren society, where the female can also mate with multiple partners, then everybody would be getting laid and everyone would be happy.
OH SNAP
SOMEBODY BOUT TO GET THEIR SHIT RUINED
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Ummmm dear, this entire blog is about discussing various aspects of PRECISELY HOW our society has become Fairy Wren-like…and how it’s made everyone much less happy.
I’d suspect that Beth is implying that beta male and alphas males would have similar or equal levels of sexual activity, as opposed to our current biological regime where women are only capable of attraction to alphas.
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Beth
If no significant investment were required by any given male to successfully raise a kid, your scheme would make sense. If successfully raising kids (or birdletts) required a huge amount of male support, a cuckholding she-wren could expect to be killed outright if caught. For a first offense. If you do not understand this you should not be giving anybody advice. You would be taking on an ominously large responsibility.
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“wexler said
Fifth Horseman, Game is useful to understand even if not successfully employed. It can shift the fault away from the poor sap, onto larger problems. He’ll still suffer from blue balls (occasionally, even at that age), but be less likely to cause some stranger’s family such grief.”
Expressed in a straightforward (and cynical) way but nonetheless I agree.
Regardless if one is looking for sex or would rather raise ones lifeforce in pursuit of spiritual goals I think it’s necessary to remove the illusion’s one have about the female of the species. Women are raised from young years to understand what makes men tick, so they have an advantage of disillusion in their reaction with the oposite sex. It is very important that men also gain this cultural advantage and preserve it during the coming paradigm shifts.
I think the problem with the PUA community is in its tendency to indoctrinate men to seek value from women, men should first find value in their inner core. In this way Game is actually making skewing the balance in favour of women even further.
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1500 comments. Tons of feminists creeped in from the outside, like a swarm of Orcs from Mordor.
Only to be beaten back by the elite strike force of all the regular warriors here.
An epic thread, this was.
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Texas is pretty. Out in California the hills are green from Jan-March, if that. From Amarillo through to Dallas, the entire country side is green fields,
Plus Texas has a fair share of hotties too.
California’s image of beach-frolicking blondes is no more. They have been replaced by barrel-shaped Aztec Mexican women.
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The Fifth Horseman–”I never said ‘relationship’ you pathetic liar.”
You may not have said it, but the person who you replied to did. Amanda wrote:
“A sick man will buy one, have a relationship with it, and prefer it over real women.”
Then, you wrote:
“‘Sick’ only by the feminist definition of ’sick’, which is translated to : men have to do what feminists want and expect nothing in return.”
So yes, what you were essentially saying was that having a relationship with a sexbot and preferring that to a relationship with a woman is only sick by unrealistic feminist standards.
Unless you read Amanda’s post incorrectly, and what you were trying to say was that sex with a robot is not “sick,”
your statement shows you to be an extremely socially isolated person who refuses to expose yourself to opinions outside of what you find comforting, even if those opinions are entirely mainstream. That is the only way to explain your apparent belief that preferring relationships with robots instead of real people could be viewed as normal by most non-feminists.
Another indicator of your sheltered and ignorant mindset is your constant assertion that posters who have claimed to be male are lying, because they don’t sound masculine enough for you. Look, I go to a lot of internet message boards, and people often mistake people’s gender online. Maybe you’re right that men as a group mostly write one way and women another, but that’s not true for every individual. There was even a story the other day on a blog I frequent about a male author who was told he couldn’t write from the male voice convincingly enough, because they thought he was a woman on account of his name, “Bev.” Not all men are the same. Of course, no other blog or message board I frequent has ever been so obsessed with discovering the gender of other posters, because that has shit-all to do with the argument. It’s a diversionary tactic designed to throw people off instead of actually engaging their points. As was, I suspect, your insistence that you didn’t actually say the word relationship–just because you didn’t say it doesn’t mean that’s not what you were referring to, and again, unless you misunderstood the post you were quoting, you knew exactly what you were talking about.
Quit wasting my time on diversionary tactics. I’m trying to have a grown-up discussion, but every comment I read here makes that seem more and more impossible.
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“Fifth, I don’t think that 80% of men are sick. I would estimate that the percentage is much much lower, probably under 5%, based on my lifetime of experience. The incidence online might be higher.
Hey Sil, thanks for your comments, it’s nice to see comments from a normal guy who comprehends reality and thinks.”
Thanks, Amanda. And I agree with your statistic. It’s sad how little faith the regulars here actually have in men. They really do hate themselves.
The Fifth Horseman–“1500 comments. Tons of feminists creeped in from the outside, like a swarm of Orcs from Mordor.”
You really think you’re the good guys in all this?
Sad.
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Silly,
So yes, what you were essentially saying was that having a relationship with a sexbot and preferring that to a relationship with a woman is only sick by unrealistic feminist standards.
Use of sex technologies (whether sexbot or 3-D/VR) is not a ‘relationship’ any more than Internet porn is.
But what already happens today, is that some men decide that Internet porn is a better all-round use of their time than a woman who is a 4. Discuss this with David Alexander, a practitioner of this philosophy.
What you fail to admit is that men rank women based on their looks, and the desirability of a 10 is far, far higher than a 4 or less (again, such as yourself). There is a cutoff below which most men would rather not bother with any relationship at all with the woman in question.
Looks matter to men. You picked the wrong species of creature to become, if you have a problem with that.
Sex technologies will merely raise the floor to about a 7. Even for men who don’t use these technologies, as there will be far too many women competing for far too few men.
Another indicator of your sheltered and ignorant mindset is your constant assertion that posters who have claimed to be male are lying, because they don’t sound masculine enough for you.
We, as a group, are far more astute in detecting such bullshit than you think. None of the experienced male commenters here will buy your scam of claiming to be a (straight) man.
The only other possibility is that you are a flaming gay man. Faggot.
your statement shows you to be an extremely socially isolated person who refuses to expose yourself to opinions outside of what you find comforting,
Projection, projection, projection. We, as a group, always self-examine our views. You clearly do not. You don’t even know enough about men to know how to pretend to be one.
I am an alpha male, and highly skilled in Game. A self-made millionaire and good looking by any measure.
Again, you do such a poor job of impersonating a man, why would you have any skill in reading another commenter?
Quit wasting my time on diversionary tactics. I’m trying to have a grown-up discussion, but every comment I read here makes that seem more and more impossible.
In other words, you are finding it harder to escape logic, since, as a feminist, you don’t have much experience with logic.
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The ironic thing is that if women were aware that Sodini was capable of mass murder they would have flocked to him. And if he had survived and was in prison then crazy broads would write love letters to him and want to marry him.
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“Silly,
Use of sex technologies (whether sexbot or 3-D/VR) is not a ‘relationship’ any more than Internet porn is.”
OK, so you admit that you either read Amanda’s post wrong or phrased your response wrong.
“But what already happens today, is that some men decide that Internet porn is a better all-round use of their time than a woman who is a 4. Discuss this with David Alexander, a practitioner of this philosophy.”
This is a sick belief.
“What you fail to admit is that men rank women based on their looks, and the desirability of a 10 is far, far higher than a 4 or less (again, such as yourself).”
I “fail to admit” nothing of the sort. I never said looks don’t matter to me.
“There is a cutoff below which most men would rather not bother with any relationship at all with the woman in question.”
This is where we part ways. A relationship with an actual human woman–provided that she is stable and has a good personality–is still better than none at all, even if she is a 1.
Of course, I may be speaking from the privilege of having scored a beautiful woman, but I can’t imagine ever just giving up and deciding to spend more time on porn than actual girls if I were unable to do so.
“Looks matter to men.”
Again, I agree.
“We, as a group, are far more astute in detecting such bullshit than you think. None of the experienced male commenters here will buy your scam of claiming to be a (straight) man.”
Whatever, this will not impact my day very much.
“The only other possibility is that you are a flaming gay man. Faggot.”
Wow, very enlightened.
“I am an alpha male, and highly skilled in Game. A self-made millionaire and good looking by any measure.”
Wow. Do all of your friends spend this much time posting on anti-feminist blogs, or just the good-looking millionaires with game?
I think you are the one putting on a front here.
“Again, you do such a poor job of impersonating a man, why would you have any skill in reading another commenter?”
I find it hard to believe that someone of the stature you claim to be would have nothing better to do than this all day.
“In other words, you are finding it harder to escape logic, since, as a feminist, you don’t have much experience with logic.”
So bringing someone’s gender into a debate and pretending you don’t know what they’re referring to when they quote you is “logic” now? Seriously, you’re living on another planet.
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”””””The Fifth Horseman
“I am an alpha male, and highly skilled in Game. A self-made millionaire and good looking by any measure.”””””””””””’
What the fuck is going on with this blog. How many fucking millionaires are one this fucking thing lol
”””””’Chris,
I find it hard to believe that someone of the stature you claim to be would have nothing better to do than this all day.”””””””””””
That is how bad it apparently is chris. Maybe you can understand now. Maybe they are trying to help people which is about the only thing you can do on this planet that makes the shit somewhat meaningful.
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I got some catching up to do with you fuckers he he he
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You people are all crazy.
Game? What is this, some bragging contest about who has the biggest dick?
You people are willing to defend a guy who shot people in a public place?
What next, are you willing to stick up for the Unabomber? The Beltway Sniper? The Midwest Bomber? Terrorists whose sole purpose was to create terror?
We’re living in an age where we need to take personal responsibility and let others who fuck up deal with it themselves. We don’t need to justify a criminal/terrorist/villian’s actions.
A man can keep his dick in his pants. A woman doesn’t need to be thought of as an object. We can all make decisions for ourselves.
We need to start looking towards the futures and cast aside old and flawed ideas.
This concept of sex that keeps a man sane is simply ridiculous.
Also, I’m a dude, and I’m fucking proud to be an American!
To add to this, in the 17-1800s, it was believed a woman was actually the one dependent on the man for sex. If she didn’t receive it, she would go mad because her sex organs would crave it, would not be completed without a man spiritually, physically, chemically, you name it. Women were seen as raw materials, men as giving life.
Of course, this was all crappy science, as is any notion that this man, who is a killer, deserved to be screwed by any woman. He was a bloody egotistical psycho, women don’t automatically owe men anything, and this notion in the modern day that somehow men need women to complete them and it’s women’s responsibility– that’s just bad science REVERSED.
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“But what already happens today, is that some men decide that Internet porn is a better all-round use of their time than a woman who is a 4.”
All the guys I know who have a problem with internet porn can date cute girls (and do sometimes). They’re just addicted to spending their free time jerking off.
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”””mmr,
You people are willing to defend a guy who shot people in a public place?
What next, are you willing to stick up for the Unabomber? The Beltway Sniper? The Midwest Bomber? Terrorists whose sole purpose was to create terror?
We’re living in an age where we need to take personal responsibility and let others who fuck up deal with it themselves. We don’t need to justify a criminal/terrorist/villian’s actions.
A man can keep his dick in his pants. A woman doesn’t need to be thought of as an object. We can all make decisions for ourselves.
We need to start looking towards the futures and cast aside old and flawed ideas.
This concept of sex that keeps a man sane is simply ridiculous.
Also, I’m a dude, and I’m fucking proud to be an American!”””””””””””’
Dude what are you talking about with the you people. You may be proud to be an american but what could this dude have done to seek help so that he didn’t do what he did and get the help he needed. Who is defending him. I am saying he didn’t have any options on what to do. If he could have gone to a place that would have ended his life in a clean way and approved by society he maybe wouldn’t have done what he did. He didn’t fit in to life. No one seems to have a solution to this problem. Just pointing fingers and that is why this shit ain’t gonna get solved the solution is to painfull to point the fingers back at ourselves (everyone else)
”””””’MMR,
We’re living in an age where we need to take personal responsibility and let others who fuck up deal with it themselves. ””””””””””””
Yea he took responsibility for not wanting to be on planet and also ended the lives of other people. I am saying there is a way that you don’t have to let people get to that point.
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“You see the problem is that it is scientifically proven that males with lower testosterone make better fathers…. The problem is that higher testosterone males provide better genes. Hence why in animal species, including humans, females tend to cheat more when they are most fertile. And they tend to cheat with higher testosterone males.”
There’s also pretty definitive proof that the level of testosterone that women are attracted to fluctuates with their cycle. A woman seems to want different things depending on how fertile she is. Which means guys with lots of testosterone have the best chance with a girl when she’s ovulating – but ‘betas’ with lower hormone levels have better chances the other 20 days of the month.
Pretty much all of us ‘settle’ to some degree for short term partners and for long term relationships that produce kids. The guys who are sexiest to a lot of women are not the the guys they always want to settle down with (although they may be the guys they are likely to cheat with).
I think my boyfriend is good-looking, I love him and he has a ton of great qualities that are hard to find, including a natural gift with kids – they only have to see the guy to love him. But when you say ‘hot guy’ he’s hardly what comes to my mind. And he has no social power.
Most hot guys are such ‘alpha’ assholes that it’s a turn-off. I’ve never been interested in one for this reason, not even just for sex.
“Only to be beaten back by the elite strike force of all the regular warriors here.”
Who’s been beaten back? Your tactics are nasty and your arguments decently logical, but most of the other ‘warriors’ here are so stupid you should be embarrassed to be associated with them.
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”””””””Bonnie,
Also: Do you idiots honestly believe that the feminist movement in America has caused some kind of deficit in hot sex from hot women for the menz? I mean, this is so illogical it’s breathtaking. Women are having casual sex these days like never before! It’s a whole new world of opportunity compared to only 30 years ago! All because of feminism and the sexual revolution! Please, one of you jackasses upthread explain how you have reached this conclusion. Honestly, I am curious. Is it because women think they are people now, instead of understanding their true role as walking vaginas who exist only to fulfill every aspect of every random guy’s sexual desires? ””””””””””
””””’Bonnie,
Your tactics are nasty and your arguments decently logical””””””””””’
Feminists pretty much always come on nasty and namecalling and disgusting. It is good to see you calmer now and able to reason somewhat.
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I swear, one more ridiculous assertion that an idiot like sodini was somehow justified in what he chose to do right before he offed himself, and I’m going to vomit all over my designer label high heel shoes.
The fact that it wasn’t until the beginning of the last century for women to get the right to vote, after black men had gotten the privilege (although in some areas, having the right didn’t mean that they were actually allowed to vote.) — unless there’s going to suddenly be a change in the law that prevents us from voting in the future, who the hell cares? There’s no “making up” for the past, and that goes for just about all the groups who complain that they have been unfairly treated …IN THE PAST….
At the risk of starting a riot over having an unpopular opinion; there are things that women should concede to men being better in, and there are also things that men should concede that women are better at. Other than raising kids and keeping house. I don’t feel the need to go and join the military so I can prove that I’m just as good of a soldier as any man. (Some women may feel that need, but many find they are targets for the same behavior that led to the first female cadet dropping out of west point; some turn into cock-crazy she-beasts; still others finish their service and go on to live normal and happy lives. It’s a crapshoot.) When it comes to competition with other women, it’s ridiculous and unnecessary. Feminists are usually all about the sisterhood and being happy with the way they are until someone with breast implants joins the march. Then it’s suddenly a bipartisan debate between the side who is horrified by the thought of a woman allowing herself to succumb to the impossible male ideal female form and the side that’s busy with their appointments to have breast augmentation done.
Sodini spent all of his time masturbating and reinforcing the belief that he was an un-saveable failure, which is exactly what he became. The sad part is that whether you believe women are inherently evil, secretly wishing for a man to come along and “let” them submit, or that women are always right (gag…yeah, and men are always right too…vomit) – he killed human beings that should still be alive right now, when the only person he had the authority over was himself. If I had a dollar for every time I heard “poor me” stories from both genders, I wouldn’t be online right now, I’d be sipping a girly-drink with one of those umbrellas in it, and whatever else I wanted to do on a recently acquired private island that was paid for with a briefcase of cash. If it were up to me, he would have failed to do himself in after his temper tantrum-gone-overboard, and been left in a state that was just enough to qualify him to be charged with murder and to stand trial.
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“Another point, that may have been discussed here but don’t recall, is that, in their use of sex appeal, women are exercising their animal power. A man’s animal power is his capacity for violence. These two will balance each other. The more sex appeal on display, the shorter the trigger on the capacity for violence.”
I don’t know if you mean sex appeal in advertising? Some mysterious value of sex appeal in the regular girl – that you know she will have sex? The teeny percentage of women who in 5″ heels and mini-dresses with bleached-white hair and exploding cleavage?
Putting aside societies where they wear the burka (and have tons of violence, some of it socially sanctioned violence against women for any perceived loss of control over them) – much of Europe is still far behind us in violence, and yet they are more sexually open in some ways. Advertising, topless/nude beaches, and most European women seem to like having sexual relationships with guys they think are sexy.
By having ‘sex appeal’ I am not ‘exercising’ any kind of power. I JUST HAVE IT. I’m young, I have long hair, I have a nice figure, I CAN’T HIDE IT unless I wear a burlap sack (and I prefer to dress normally – no skin, but my clothes fit). I don’t wear makeup, I don’t go anywhere where it could be construed that I am marketing myself sexually (bars, clubs, etc). I am not trying to make a display or tempt anyone, but daily I have men reacting to me as if I am.
I don’t see how you can’t understand that a woman who exists and is attractive, and has male desire focusing obsessively on her nearly constantly for this reason, HAS NO POWER. Actually, we’re walking around scared all the time that a guy isn’t going to take no for an answer this time and is going to take what he wants by force.
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””””””’on August 8, 2009 at 9:28 am msexceptiontotherule
I swear, one more ridiculous assertion that an idiot like sodini was somehow justified in what he chose to do right before he offed himself, and I’m going to vomit all over my designer label high heel shoes”””””””’
You are femspeaking putting words into mouths. Who is saying he was justified? What would be your solution for this guy when he first knew that he was gonna have to kill people in order to kill himself?
What help should he have sought?
What help is available right now that would have helped him not to do this act?
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And ‘self-defense’ is no answer (the average American guy is 90 pounds heavier than me). I suppose a gun or knife might be, with proper training and carried constantly at the ready (especially on dates and around guys you know, since that’s how it mostly happens).
I still say it’s no way to live. But it’s my reality – I live on the outskirts of one of the biggest cities in the US with a very high rate of violent crime. All my female friends have been raped or sexually assaulted at least once.
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I don’t see how you can’t understand that a woman who exists and is attractive, and has male desire focusing obsessively on her nearly constantly for this reason, HAS NO POWER.
That’s nonsense. You have the power of attraction. You choose not to use that power, but you still have it. I see professional women in my workplace deploy their sexual power of attraction regularly — not by handing out sexual favors, but by using their power of attraction to mute criticism, cosy up to male bosses and so on.
It really *is* power, whether you personally choose to use it or not.
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””””Bonnie,
(especially on dates and around guys you know, since that’s how it mostly happens). ”””””’
Is it usually when the woman and guy gets drunk that this rape happens?
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Oh, and “this guy is exactly why I refuse to join a gym! I’d rather take the chance that some random stranger will attack me while I’m out running alone with headphones and my ipod playing at top volume.”
Ooooh, and if there’s going to be a killing spree that targets “bitches and sluts” for their confusing signals and wrongful rejections, what kind of message are you sending to your daughters about their worth?
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Do you have any solutions exception other than bitching and moaning and femspeaking. Get that out of your system that great to get it off your chest. Any solutions with what I proposed above?
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I am saying that if this guy could have had help dieing in a society approved way. I don’t think he would have killed those woman. So yea maybe feminists could work on that one for me.
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Gunslingergregi –
How on earth does killing oneself to end a miserable existence obligate them to first kill others?
He was miserable, but I don’t believe that every one of the women in that class could have felt miserable enough to want to die too. He didn’t know them, he didn’t even leave the lights on when he started shooting because he couldn’t stand to see himself when he began firing.
And as far as help is concerned, I would have suggested he practice with using his toes to fire the shotgun into his mouth. Or instead of sitting there obsessing on how he hadn’t gotten this, and no one wanted to give him that, which was *NOT HELPING*. Did I say I knew how to help him? No. I can’t honestly say that I believe if there was a woman around him in the last year of his life who would/did sleep with him, that it would have stopped his “exit plan”. Christ, even the way he talked about his little plan reeks of too much time watching CSI and Cold Case and not enough getting out of the house.
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I would take exception to having my opinion called femspeak, but it’s a Saturday, and I like to take the weekends off.
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And why can’t you recognize when something is said sarcastically. Really.
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”””””””””””””msexceptiontotherule
Gunslingergregi –
How on earth does killing oneself to end a miserable existence obligate them to first kill others?
He was miserable, but I don’t believe that every one of the women in that class could have felt miserable enough to want to die too. He didn’t know them, he didn’t even leave the lights on when he started shooting because he couldn’t stand to see himself when he began firing. ”””””””””
When you can’t kill yourself and you go for help in doing it society has no help for you at this point. So then you logically move to the next step society must pay for not helping you leave and for forcing you to stay alive.
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””””””””msexceptiontotherule
And why can’t you recognize when something is said sarcastically. Really.””””’
Well it is normal feminist woman who do the namecalling from the very beginning but have no solutions for things. Then it normally comes out they are bi and then it comes out they are looking for a man to finance their life.
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Yea I don’t think it is womans fault it was his fault. At the same time he had no options for leaving planet available. That is the part I am trying to get out. There was no where for this guy to turn.
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bonnie is right that there was never so much sex with hot girls available as today
what she misses, in the most typical female way, is that only a small share of men are benefitting from that.
the sodinis get mad because they don´t get any of the pussy, they know people are getting much more than them, and they face the dark side of opportunity, which is failure
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homicidal o m e g a s will never target alphas because alphas aren´t the ones saying ” LJBF” or “You are a nice guy”
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@msexceptiontotherule
I agree completely!
The idea that “society” was somehow to blame for not helping him kill himself, and therefore he “had” to go kill innocent people, is ridiculous.
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sodini was an uber-loser and deserved to get screwed
what I asked many times, and people refused to answer, is how do you people consider it is right for most of the female workforce to be employed in non-value adding jobs maintained by taxes on men like sodini ?
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@Tarl,
What would be your solution for this guy when he first knew that he was gonna have to kill people in order to kill himself?
What help should he have sought?
What help is available right now that would have helped him not to do this act?
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@ guns
men are supposed to help themselves. this is part of what we call being a man
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Guns,
I am not an expert on mental illness, so I don’t really know what the options are for “help” for the suicidal. Obviously he should have sought professional help of some kind. I find it hard to believe that “go kill other people” was the only choice and no other options are available right now.
The idea that he couldn’t have offed himself without taking others down too is refuted by the clear evidence that many, many people do kill themselves without needing to kill anyone else first. A lot of suicides don’t make it with the first attempt, and they try, try again until they get it right, but they don’t take any innocents with them.
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“what she misses, in the most typical female way, is that only a small share of men are benefitting from that.”
When was there ever a time that sex with hot girls wasn’t solely the province of the devastatingly good-looking man, or the rich king?
The cards have been stacked against non-sexy guys since we were apes.
Maybe 50 years ago more guys would have been married, but average guys would have been married to average girls.
“You have the power of attraction. You choose not to use that power, but you still have it. I see professional women in my workplace deploy their sexual power of attraction regularly — not by handing out sexual favors, but by using their power of attraction to mute criticism, cosy up to male bosses and so on.
It really *is* power, whether you personally choose to use it or no.”
There is definitely a certain power in being a sexually attractive woman, and many women use it to devastating effect (and often for ill).
But ultimately, women are at a strong disadvantage, especially in a one-on-one situation with a man. Our ‘power’ – not the power to flirt and try to make men desire us more to get what we want from them, but the hold any good-looking girl has over men when she’s just walking to work wearing non-‘suggestive’ clothing. We can’t turn off attractiveness or choose who it affects and how. Because we are attractive we are perceived (usually by idiots) as not only desirable but actively, willingly tempting, and when we don’t want the sex they think we’re asking for (just by being young and pretty), they get angry.
I admit I have privilege, just like anyone else. Being white, pretty, young, intelligent probably has a lot to do with where I am in life today (I have never had a moment of trouble finding a job, friends, or getting the kind of guy I want). I don’t think I would give up those advantages if I could. And there’s no way I would want to be ugly. I do embrace the normal aging process and the change it will bring in other people’s reactions towards me.
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””””on August 8, 2009 at 10:58 am gig
@ guns
men are supposed to help themselves. this is part of what we call being a man
”””””””””””
And that is what the dude did he self medicated. He was a man.
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“men are supposed to help themselves. this is part of what we call being a man”
Right? This is a ‘stereotype’ about men I love.
And there’s nothing more unattractive than perceiving yourself as a victim or martyr.
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HANSEN
thank you friend.
————
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I admit I have privilege, just like anyone else. Being white, pretty, young, intelligent probably has a lot to do with where I am in life today (I have never had a moment of trouble finding a job, friends, or getting the kind of guy I want).
You show enough self-awareness in realizing that your youth is fleeting. If you want to have children and a family wiht a husband you respect, this is your small window of opportunity to secure the commitment of a quality man.
Unsolicited advice: marry a man at least 5 years older than you, and avoid liberal (leftie) men.
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My BF of 5 years is 17 years older than me, but he is so liberal he’s practically a communist.
Anyway, we’re probably going to get married and have kids but I am not really in a hurry, I just turned 24.
I think the most reasonable thing for us to do is have kids soon, I can work part-time after they’re in school, and if I want a career I can go to college when they’re grown.
I do think it’s a little misguided that so many women I know who want families are doing college/serious jobs first, not marrying til their 30s and then having fertility problems. Get babies out of the way first while you still have energy and good eggs, you’re going to live til your 80, plenty of time for working.
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This would have been better said yesterday… but oh well.
Light Crude Oil is currently at 70.95 and there will be eight days left on the September Puts and Calls when oil opens on Monday.
If oil were to close at 71 on August 17 the Call and Put sellers(Big Money) would have to pay 844 million dollars to the Call and Put buyers(Little Money) for all Calls and Puts between 50 and 80 dollars. You can use the Open Interest at the Nymex site here:
http://www.nymex.com/lsco_opt_cso.aspx
to calculate this yourself using an Excel spreadsheet.
The cabal in charge of oil also appears to have mental problems and refuse to allow light crude to go above 72.
The ‘minimum payout’ price is currently about 63.60, but this will rise towards 65 as the last-minute compulsive gamblers buy puts and calls.
I would be surprised… shocked… if oil didn’t go below 67 sometime next week.
I believe the oil cabal INTEND TO take oil down violently sometime near the end of August or early September.
The weak El-Nino will probably stop major developments of Hurricanes. Also, oil production in the Gulf is more fictional than real at this point. The very small remaining natural gas production is probably more vital… given that real natural gas production has been declining since 2000. And yes, I am aware the American government is claiming wild lies about stable natural gas production. They are lying. Since the American Public never punish them for even the most outlandish lies, why shouldn’t they?
HOWEVER, there has been no activity AT ALL in the Atlantic…. and that is disturbing. All Hurricanes and Tropical storms tend to cool the water, so none means the water is somewhat hotter than normal.
The SMALL chance of a major hurricane is more of an opportunity than a threat. All evidence suggests that the oil and natural gas cabal ignores Hurricanes till impact…. and then gets at least a hundred billion dollars from the government to ignore a Category 5 like Ike. However, the oil situation is a lot tighter than last year, and the natural gas situation is very, very tight. So a Government Bailout may not work this time. BUT, there is no reason to assume oil or natural gas is going up until you can see the Hurricane rotating on a satellite picture. The market simply will not BE ALLOWED to react until impact is CERTAIN. Completely, totally, certain.
So right now oil is going down until a hurricane HITS.
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@Comment-Whatever:
HAHAHAHA
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I think I’ve come to the conclusion that men who obsess over any sort of superiority categorizations are total losers.
A man who has self-confidence doesn’t worry about where he fits in this fabricated spectrum.
A man who has no self-confidence obsesses about it.
I sense a lot of hatred toward females from some of the male posters here. I’m wondering if these guys are actually homosexual but don’t want to be, so the struggle causes them to lash out at and be unreasonably critical of their proclaimed objects of desire.
But I wouldn’t wish that the gays would have to deal with these guys any more than I would wish that women would have to deal with them, because they are seriously f’d up and need some serious counseling and perhaps liberal doses of psych meds more than they need a plastic doll to hump.
Once again I will say that I’m so happy that most men are not like this. I’ve met lots of really wonderful men in my life and only a few sick ones.
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Keep on shaming amanda. That is the way to go.
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I am glad all woman are not like the filthy mouthed feminists we have seen because then the world would really just be a shitty place.
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Bonnie, I have often thought that my life is probably better as a woman who is superficially “flawed” (I’m probably a 6 appearance-wise) because I don’t have to put up with the crap that the better looking women have to put up with, most importantly the constant unwanted attention from men I would NEVER be interested in. I like my anonymity. I can get appreciative looks but I don’t cause heads to crank around. 🙂 Guys aren’t usually attracted to me until I start speaking to them. I would be forever cranky if I had to put up with the crap that beautiful women have to put up with! Like you said, the assumption that just because you are beautiful you are asking for the attention. I wonder if this is why beautiful women get the reputation as being “bitchy”, because they are constantly barraged with the affections of guys who are clearly out of their league and after being polite so many times they just get worn out and stop being polite. That’s what would happen to me, I’m sure of it.
As for the “power” of beauty, it’s really not true power because it requires that a male with greater power be involved, i.e., an employer who hires you or a manager who promotes you or a wealthy man who takes you on as a romantic partner.
And it’s limited power in that it declines over time. Even the most beautiful 40+ woman has less beauty-power than an average cute 30-year old. Let’s not even discuss what happens to the beautiful woman when she hits 50, suffice it to say that from that point on she becomes the incredible invisible woman. For someone like me it’s not a difficult transition, but for a woman who is used to a great deal of attention, it must be disconcerting.
So you have to be smart about how you use your beauty-power and make sure that it’s not the only power you have. The beauty-power can give you an occasional assist, might as well take advantage of it, but you have to make sure that develop your own successful life and you don’t become dependent on men and on your beauty.
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Gunslingergregi, if you hate women so much, why do you even talk to us? Didn’t your plastic doll arrive yet? Keep us posted on how that relationship works out for you.
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“Ummmm dear, this entire blog is about discussing various aspects of PRECISELY HOW our society has become Fairy Wren-like…and how it’s made everyone much less happy.
In many ways, it’s exactly this society that produces guys like Soldini.”
It is a perfect society since every pair has several mates. But every pair sticks together to raise the chicks. The problem you guys are having is that human females are forced into monogamy. All the good ones are already taken (note the PREGNANT woman Sodini shot). And the older you guys get, the less desirable the mating population is left over from the alphas having already mated with the desirable females.
In many areas and societies around the world, human men try and have multiple females for the male’s benefit. All the while ignoring that it would be advantageous for females to be able to pick a high testosterone male once in a while, too. The fairy wren society works since the betas do father some chicks. Just not all of them. Which is everything any of you would really need anyway. The alphas also help out and raise chicks. Everyone gets sex. You get children, which is the end goal of any individual.
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‘Beth
If no significant investment were required by any given male to successfully raise a kid, your scheme would make sense. If successfully raising kids (or birdletts) required a huge amount of male support, a cuckholding she-wren could expect to be killed outright if caught. For a first offense. If you do not understand this you should not be giving anybody advice. You would be taking on an ominously large responsibility.”
Which is why HUMAN males lived in fucked up societies. In human societies, this would be the case. In animal societies, what happens is the female just receives less support. Less support for the children, less of an home area to browse through than a female that didn’t cheat, and less protection from predators. That’s why both animal genders will actually go through great lengths for their partner not to find out.
And even then, the vast majority of the children are still the children of the resident male. It is just one or two that may or may not have a genetic advantage due to a higher testosterone father.
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””””Amanda
Gunslingergregi, if you hate women so much, why do you even talk to us? Didn’t your plastic doll arrive yet? Keep us posted on how that relationship works out for you.”””””’
I didn’t say I hated woman did I?
Typical feminist that we have seen come here also a liar. Will put words in other peoples mouths and act like it is truth and cannot fathom real truth.
Then after a while they tend to be able to handle the truth a little better.
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The song with the who will save your soul comes to mind on why I talk to you amanda.
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”””””””””Amanda,
Keep us posted on how that relationship works out for you.”””””
On relationships,
Every relationship I am in the other woman friends woman aqauntances comment on how my woman and I have a perfect relationship. I think I will be ok on that one.
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“sodini was an uber-loser and deserved to get screwed
what I asked many times, and people refused to answer, is how do you people consider it is right for most of the female workforce to be employed in non-value adding jobs maintained by taxes on men like sodini ?”
I don’t know if this has been answered yet…. But what do you mean “non-value” adding? How is being a gym teacher when there is a large obesity epidemic in North America, a “non-value” adding venture? Even if you do believe this, what about dolls, stuffed toys, knick-knacks, and other assorted junk no one needs? Do you believe that is entirely female-driven industries? Because the MAN who makes those Bratz dolls would disagree. And I do believe a Bratz doll is more “non-value” adding than a gym teacher. A gym teacher helps you stay fit and teaches you the best moves to not hurt yourself.
Other industries that have primarily female audience are nurses and child care workers. I guess we don’t really need those, right? I mean, it’s not like doctors have better things to do than change some old fart’s bed pan.
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“Typical feminist that we have seen come here also a liar. Will put words in other peoples mouths and act like it is truth and cannot fathom real truth.”
I’m curious. Why do all you guys hate feminists so much? You seem to be classifying feminists as different than most women. Is it the man-hating? Don’t you find something ironic about hating a group of women where a good 90% of them are considered idiots by our society at large? It’s like saying “I hate racists!” Well, congrats. You and about a million other people share the same opinion.
The way I see it, feminism has been brought down by idiots. This is the way with everything. A new anime appears? Most of the fans are idiots. A new music artist appears? Most of the fans are idiots.
When will people stop bitching about “feminism” and realize that most people, in general, are idiots?
Has anyone seen the movie Idiocracy? That’s the problem with society right there. We reward bitchy, shallow women and highly aggressive, idiot guys. But those who are actually intelligent or logical…. They just get shafted.
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”””””””Beth,
I’m curious. Why do all you guys hate feminists so much?”””””””””””””””
I think you may be using the wrong word it is not hate. I actually enjoy setting them on a different path.
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Yea beth the feminists are usually the lesbians not the normal hetro woman. They are the ones trying to ruin life for normal hetro woman. Normal hetro woman more than likely do not go around screaming on a site and swearing and tossing vomit especially I would imagine if they have kids wouldn’t you think.
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Beth wrote:
“Which is why HUMAN males lived in fucked up societies. In human societies, this would be the case. In animal societies, what happens is the female just receives less support. Less support for the children, less of an home area to browse through than a female that didn’t cheat, and less protection from predators. That’s why both animal genders will actually go through great lengths for their partner not to find out.
And even then, the vast majority of the children are still the children of the resident male. It is just one or two that may or may not have a genetic advantage due to a higher testosterone father.”
What you describe in animal societies happens in human societies too, we are still a species of animal after all. The vast majority of men who find out that their wife/girlfriend/baby’s mamma is cheating don’t kill their spouse, they simply drop out, stop giving a shit about her, the relationship, sometimes even the kids. Sure, there is crying, yelling, divorce court first, but the men eventually drop out.
On the other hand, there are men who try to make the kind of open marriage you describe work. Check out the Beta of the Month post on this blog. No man respects a man who lets his wife/girlfriend/baby’s mamma sleep around. The cuckhold gets nothing but pity and disgust. The woman in his life has no respect for him either, which is why she continues to fool around, and sometimes even reveals the details of her affairs to her spouse, just to humiliate and degrade him. “I sucked his dick like I never suck yours.”
Here’s the deal Beth, find one successful culture or civilization anywhere in the world in which the kind of polyandry you describe was widely practiced. Here’s a hint: don’t waste too much time on this. Also, don’t try to wave the fact polyandry has never been widely practiced anywhere by a successful culture on the fact that “history is written by men.”
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”””””””’Beth,
Is it the man-hating? Don’t you find something ironic about hating a group of women where a good 90% of them are considered idiots by our society at large? ””””””
That is why we are here to stop the feminists from turning normal woman into lesbians. They come on here angry and internally not understanding why. We fight them with a little logic and some common sense and the brainwashing starts to fade and they begin to see men as maybe people too.
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“What you describe in animal societies happens in human societies too, we are still a species of animal after all. The vast majority of men who find out that their wife/girlfriend/baby’s mamma is cheating don’t kill their spouse, they simply drop out, stop giving a shit about her, the relationship, sometimes even the kids. Sure, there is crying, yelling, divorce court first, but the men eventually drop out.”
Again, you are letting your resentment of women cloud your judgment. In a society like this, women wouldn’t sit there rubbing their extra-pair mating in the male’s face. Read the part where I said the pair goes to great lengths to AVOID this very situation. They try and hide it. Because less protection is given, blah blah.
Also, if this was widely practiced, there wouldn’t be “Oh, I suck his dick more.” Both would have open, swinger-type relationships and wouldn’t be little pricks like this.
Also, polyandry has been practiced small-scale in human societies, but like you said, it has never been practiced large-scale. And, as much as you hate to hear it, it is precisely because, on average, animal males do not like their females mating with multiple mates. Because of the investment in children that might not even be his. ((This is why I used the Fairy Wren as an example of a species that got around this. As the father-figures just raise the chicks anyway for the benefit of the whole species. The problem with human males (and most other males) is they only think in terms of what benefits themselves. Before people bitch, females do the same. But a society like this would benefit everyone!))
However, there are multiple mating systems set up, and polyandry does occur in animals. Mostly birds. Though, what I was describing isn’t really polyandry anyway, since BOTH genders have multiple mates. Polyandry refers to only the female having multiple partners.
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“You seem to be classifying feminists as different than most women.”
Of course they’re different! They’re the hideous, fat ones!
This is what I am trying to communicate with my posts I guess – I am young, thin, pretty, quiet, don’t care about work or money, want babies with my man and hope to stay home with them-and yet I am a dedicated feminist, don’t care about muscles or money and dislike a lot of ‘alpha’ behaviors (although as described here, ‘beta’ behavior sounds unbearable), control my emotions to a fault (even when I have PMS), value intelligence above all other traits, don’t enjoy using my sexuality except for within my monogamous relationship, and know enough about myself that I don’t spend time with men because I don’t enjoy their company.
Humans behavior can be predictable, but it isn’t black or white and while most people have their set patterns and traits that put them within the norm for their gender, most have at least a few outliers.
All the guys here seem very, very sure that everyone is as predictable as they might be – so I’ve got equal amounts of remarks that I am actually totally submissive to my BF who is an alpha – or that I am actually a strident harpy who dominates him, a pathetic beta, in every way. Etc.
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“That is why we are here to stop the feminists from turning normal woman into lesbians. They come on here angry and internally not understanding why. We fight them with a little logic and some common sense and the brainwashing starts to fade and they begin to see men as maybe people too.”
This site confirms a feminist’s worst fears about the dark, grody souls of men. The fears they have been trying to keep at bay their entire lives, because if they admit the truth to themselves they’d want crawl into a hole and never come out.
Lucky for me, I realized the truth about people – both men and women, most of whom are rotten to the core – before I was ever a feminist, and I’ve been able to screen people like you out and find someone to love and to fuck that I can also respect.
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”””””Beth,
Also, polyandry has been practiced small-scale in human societies, but like you said, it has never been practiced large-scale. And, as much as you hate to hear it, it is precisely because, on average, animal males do not like their females mating with multiple mates. Because of the investment in children that might not even be his. ””””’
Yea saw the video of the stallion killing a colt that wasn’t his after he came on scene. It amazed me.
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Bonnie thinks this is clever:
and
Bonnie whined:
Well here is the thing, Bonnie. Since you are a nasty little bitch, no man with any self-respect will put up with you. Because of that, that all you bring to the table is your pussy, the only men who will give you the time of day are those interested in your pussy. Got that?
I know it would be a wonderful world if men were ‘blank-slates’ that could be ‘adjusted’ to find your nasty behavior ‘funny’ but really, you are just another dime-a-dozen nasty bitch.
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Well if you really believe the majority of people are rotten to the core then you should have no problem with people getting killed.
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”””””””Bonnie,
This site confirms a feminist’s worst fears about the dark, grody souls of men. The fears they have been trying to keep at bay their entire lives, because if they admit the truth to themselves they’d want crawl into a hole and never come out.”””””””’
Well the biggest fear that usually comes out is that they would get raped by those horrible men. What they usually put out as bait anyway. Except you don’t hear about men raping woman on this sight or normally even referencing it. So your pretty much full of shit ain’t ya. Even the dude who didn’t get any sex for 20 years didn’t go out and rape woman. Your fears seem to be unfounded.
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“That is why we are here to stop the feminists from turning normal woman into lesbians. They come on here angry and internally not understanding why. We fight them with a little logic and some common sense and the brainwashing starts to fade and they begin to see men as maybe people too.”
I don’t know. This site becomes a little boring very quickly. It’s one thing to come in and use logic and point out true things like human females tend to cheat more.
But the sheer amount of emotion around these subjects is sad. Instead of using basic biological, evolutionary, or psychological knowledge, it seems everyone rather jump to generalizations. Or they refuse to realize there is a biological reason why females tend to cheat more. As much as a lot of people hate to hear it, we are all just animals in the end.
Human males try to go for polygamous relationships because it benefits them to spread their genes. The reason monogamy is forced on them is because the male more often than not can’t provide as much support for the children of one mate compared to supporting children from multiple mates.
This is why females invented a method of keeping their mates from straying… Guess what method it is? That’s right! Sex. And lots of it. Long before she is ovulating. This occurs in multiple animal and bird species. This is part of the female sexual power. They give lots of sex in exchange for the resident male to stick around. Then, when they are ovulating, sometimes, they cheat. But as I noted before, there are obvious disadvantages to cheating. If your partner finds out, you get less protection, etc. Hence there is always a portion of females who would not cheat despite the genetic advantage in order to attain the physical advantage of the male. Hence……. Big Epic Pause…. Monogamy.
Though, most species are NOT monogamous! If you guys really thought about it, you are actually very lucky. Because in most animal societies guys like Sodini just wouldn’t ever get a mate. Ever. Not once in their whole lifespan. You guys say that in ideal societies, more men would get access to more females. In truth, the ideal animal society has always been a few males get access to all the females.
Sucks, huh? Hence, the Fairy Wren. Betas get to mate. Alphas get to mate. Everyone hides it, even though everyone kinda knows about it. Perfect little society for you guys. But in reality our society is more like I described. A few males getting all the mates.
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””””””Beth,
This site becomes a little boring very quickly.”””””””””
lol
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“Yea saw the video of the stallion killing a colt that wasn’t his after he came on scene. It amazed me.”
Yes, bears and lions do this, too. Notice the reoccurring theme? It benefits only that one male. It does not benefit the species as a whole. Hence when human males do the same thing they are only benefiting themselves at the detriment to society (Fairy Wren!) as a whole. This isn’t a slight against males. Every individual, if you think about it, is only really interested in benefiting themselves. But, in a Fairy Wren-like society, they are still benefiting themselves. But the other one just doesn’t know about it.
Again, this is why “Oh, I suck his dick more” is an unlikely scenario.
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Gunslinger- Just because I think someone is morally bankrupt does not mean I feel they deserve death or pain. Most people are selfish, nasty, and love to use whatever power they have to take advantage of other people – that doesn’t mean they don’t have good moments and qualities and things to offer the world.
If this guy had lived I wouldn’t want him to get the death penalty. Assisted suicide, I do support, because it’s a personal choice and people deserve to die with dignity. Abortion too – a fetus/not-yet-able-to-breathe-baby is surely human but the rights of its mother trump its own.
“Well here is the thing, Bonnie. Since you are a nasty little bitch, no man with any self-respect will put up with you. Because of that, that all you bring to the table is your pussy, the only men who will give you the time of day are those interested in your pussy. Got that?
I know it would be a wonderful world if men were ‘blank-slates’ that could be ‘adjusted’ to find your nasty behavior ‘funny’ but really, you are just another dime-a-dozen nasty bitch.”
This isn’t borne out by how my life has gone so far, which must disappoint you. My life has been easy in many ways – I am smart, and I coast on my good looks.
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Beth wrote:
“Again, you are letting your resentment of women cloud your judgment.”
Woah there, girly. You are letting your knee jerk reaction to this blog and the posts of the more extreme, outspoken members here cloud your judgement. You won’t find any resentment of women in my total of 3 or 4 posts here. If you’re going to speak to me, drop your assumptions. Otherwise I won’t waste my time by trying to engage in an intelligent discussion with you.
“Both would have open, swinger-type relationships and wouldn’t be little pricks like this”
In theory yes, in reality no. Reality is that most men find it much harder to get laid than women. This is a fact. Men will sleep with just about any woman, but women only sleep with the best quality men they can get. So in the vast majority of these open, swinger-type relationships the woman will be the only one doing any swinging.
“Also, polyandry has been practiced small-scale in human societies, but like you said, it has never been practiced large-scale. And, as much as you hate to hear it, it is precisely because, on average, animal males do not like their females mating with multiple mates.”
Yep, it’s all the men’s fault. If only they’d stop acting so stupid and manly and just do exactly what the women want.
“The problem with human males (and most other males) is they only think in terms of what benefits themselves. Before people bitch, females do the same. But a society like this would benefit everyone!”
It doesn’t benefit the male at all. Correction, it benefits a few males at the top and all females. Most males will be slaves working provide resources for children, a few of which will be his. They won’t get more sex with other females, because they will be passed over for sex by women who only want the sperm of the best males, and he won’t even get as much sex from his mate (except the occasional crumbs as reward for his hard work) because she is getting her needs met elsewhere.
Monogamous marriage was never “natural.” It was a compromise set up to benefit both sexes and society as a whole. The average man got a mate and offspring that he could be pretty sure were his. The average woman got a man who would protect and provide for her and her offspring, and could be pretty sure that he wouldn’t just run off and leave her for the next attractive girl that came along.
The alternative is the mating strategy we see in the ghetto. Guy fucks girl. Girl gets pregnant, has baby. Relationship becomes too much work so guy leaves baby’s mamma to go fuck a new girl who is less work and more fun.
Polyandry does occur in a few rare instances in nature, but the fact that it is extremely rare should tell you that it is not a successful mating strategy. Instead of talking about fairy tale societies where “everyone benefits” (really only women benefit) deal with the human animal as it really is.
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“Well if you really believe the majority of people are rotten to the core then you should have no problem with people getting killed.”
What if one of those women were in the minority that don’t suck? And being an idiot isn’t really worth getting a death sentence over. We don’t even execute child rapists. Why would we go to the effort of executing idiots?
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Also, polyandry has been practiced small-scale in human societies, but like you said, it has never been practiced large-scale. And, as much as you hate to hear it, it is precisely because, on average, animal males do not like their females mating with multiple mates. Because of the investment in children that might not even be his. ((This is why I used the Fairy Wren as an example of a species that got around this. As the father-figures just raise the chicks anyway for the benefit of the whole species. The problem with human males (and most other males) is they only think in terms of what benefits themselves. Before people bitch, females do the same. But a society like this would benefit everyone!
You yourself point out why it would never work: human males are not wrens. Our offspring take a substantial amount of parental investment to raise. It’s for that reason that a human male is very reluctant, typically, to raise the offspring of another male by his wife/partner –> it’s a genetic zero for him, and a huge investment for another man’s genes. And so that behavior has become deeply ingrained in the species. It isn’t going away — we’re not going to become like wrens, even if you would like us to be.
More likely, as the nuclear family continues to wither and die on the vine, is that the parental investment of men continues to decline overall. Yes, fathers who are in intact nuclear families invest a lot parentally today, but a huge number of fathers are not in intact nuclear families, and have very low levels of parental investment. In addition, there are increasing numbers of men who never become fathers. That, to me, is what the future looks like: more single motherhood, less male parental investment, more casual sex going on for the most attractive men and women.
Human mating mores are not going to become like those of wrens anytime soon.
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“Monogamous marriage was never ‘natural.'”
Marriage (by which I mean socially recognized male/female pairings for the purpose of producing offspring a man regarded as his own), either one man and one woman, or one man with multiple women, has been the social norm in every society we have any information about since the beginning of history.
Even in the highlands of Papua New Guinea, possibly the most diverse area in the world, where most of the cultures had no exposure to Westerners until the 19th century, that still has some 45 tribes that have had no contact with modern people – every tribe studied so far practices this system. It’s ‘natural’ all right.
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Woa there uncle gabby your not looking at the extremely angry original posts without reading anything. Look at the facts. Not what fems tell you are the facts.
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“Woah there, girly. You are letting your knee jerk reaction to this blog and the posts of the more extreme, outspoken members here cloud your judgement. You won’t find any resentment of women in my total of 3 or 4 posts here. If you’re going to speak to me, drop your assumptions. Otherwise I won’t waste my time by trying to engage in an intelligent discussion with you.”
I’m responding to your dick-sucking comment. I already stated this would be a non-issue in my original post.
“In theory yes, in reality no. Reality is that most men find it much harder to get laid than women. This is a fact. Men will sleep with just about any woman, but women only sleep with the best quality men they can get. So in the vast majority of these open, swinger-type relationships the woman will be the only one doing any swinging.”
Again, I will argue my original, original point. It is also hard for some women to get laid. You see the guy talking about sexbots. Can you imagine when those are put out? It will become even harder for women to get laid.
But, in reality, you would get a higher chance at females if they weren’t in a strict monogamous relationship. You must admit the number of married, uncheating wives do decrease you sex pool.
“Yep, it’s all the men’s fault. If only they’d stop acting so stupid and manly and just do exactly what the women want. ”
Lol. This is why I responded with “aggression” the first time. It isn’t men’s fault. That’s ridiculous. Men are striving for what benefits them the most. All individuals (including females) do the same. Hence cheating.
“It doesn’t benefit the male at all. Correction, it benefits a few males at the top and all females. Most males will be slaves working provide resources for children, a few of which will be his. They won’t get more sex with other females, because they will be passed over for sex by women who only want the sperm of the best males, and he won’t even get as much sex from his mate (except the occasional crumbs as reward for his hard work) because she is getting her needs met elsewhere.”
Except animal societies show that females WILL go out and SEEK out beta males. Even when a female is with an alpha male, she will seek out beta males for increased genetic diversity. It isn’t just a matter of going from one alpha to the next.
“Monogamous marriage was never “natural.” It was a compromise set up to benefit both sexes and society as a whole. The average man got a mate and offspring that he could be pretty sure were his. The average woman got a man who would protect and provide for her and her offspring, and could be pretty sure that he wouldn’t just run off and leave her for the next attractive girl that came along.”
Exactly. But in reality, humans, like animals cheat. And yes, even the male in these monogamous marriages will cheat. For the exact same reasons as the female. Genetic advantages… But they will also try to be fairly monogamous for these exact reasons. More protection and an insurance the child is his.
“The alternative is the mating strategy we see in the ghetto. Guy fucks girl. Girl gets pregnant, has baby. Relationship becomes too much work so guy leaves baby’s mamma to go fuck a new girl who is less work and more fun.
Polyandry does occur in a few rare instances in nature, but the fact that it is extremely rare should tell you that it is not a successful mating strategy. Instead of talking about fairy tale societies where “everyone benefits” (really only women benefit) deal with the human animal as it really is.”
The reason the ghetto relationships break down is because the male doesn’t stick around. The whole relationship is dependent on two partners.
Again, I was not arguing for polyandry because that would only benefit the female. The reason it occurs so infrequently in nature is that in those animal species, they often live in such extreme conditions that multiple males are needed to provide for the young of the female.
These males will stick around for their chances of mating as well.
In fact, in other species of bird, some will forgo mating altogether to help their parents and their half-siblings.
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I think we should forget about birds, they are not relevant to the discussion (human sexuality/behavior).
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Beth and bonnie hard to figure out who is bored and who is not. Raise your hand if your boring.
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“ou yourself point out why it would never work: human males are not wrens. Our offspring take a substantial amount of parental investment to raise. It’s for that reason that a human male is very reluctant, typically, to raise the offspring of another male by his wife/partner –> it’s a genetic zero for him, and a huge investment for another man’s genes. And so that behavior has become deeply ingrained in the species. It isn’t going away — we’re not going to become like wrens, even if you would like us to be.
More likely, as the nuclear family continues to wither and die on the vine, is that the parental investment of men continues to decline overall. Yes, fathers who are in intact nuclear families invest a lot parentally today, but a huge number of fathers are not in intact nuclear families, and have very low levels of parental investment. In addition, there are increasing numbers of men who never become fathers. That, to me, is what the future looks like: more single motherhood, less male parental investment, more casual sex going on for the most attractive men and women.
Human mating mores are not going to become like those of wrens anytime soon.”
I agree that this is the state that society is going towards. Whether any of us like it or not. Many complain this Sodini guy should be able to get laid. But truth is, he is the face of the future.
In some ways, this new society won’t be so bad. With all the single mothers, maybe less children (am I being too idealistic here?) will be born. And the population might start to level off.
The problem is that males have to stick around. Maybe in the Fairy-Wren society and the 1500s, it would really suck to have a child that isn’t yours within your clutch of children. But nowadays there is parental testing. Men can be sure their children are, in fact, their children. So, this massive abandonment of the nuclear family is puzzling to me. Perhaps more women are wanting children before they attain a mate. Perhaps more men are standing up for themselves and refusing the father-figure role for children that aren’t theirs.
Regardless, the one thing that is certain, parents are needed. And whichever society that promotes both parents sticking around (and it doesn’t need to be Fairy Wren-like) is definitely one we should start working towards.
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“I think we should forget about birds, they are not relevant to the discussion (human sexuality/behavior).”
They are very relevant. A lot of men believe that more men should get the chance to mate. In reality, in a lot of other animal species, this is just not the case. They argue that Sodini was stuck and there was nothing for him to do, but murder these women.
In reality, that doesn’t make any logical sense.
On the one hand, the guys here agree that it is hard for all males to find mates. But on the other, they don’t realize there is a very good reason for that. Most males in general don’t get the opportunity to mate often. A lot of males don’t EVER get the opportunity to mate. This is due to mating systems in which alphas are preferred (though for the hundredth time, alphas are preferred, but females will seek out betas even when they are already with an alpha). This is why I offered the Fairy Wren as a possible solution for more males to get mates.
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I don’t really think there is anything more I can say on the subject. I don’t blame men for wanting to spread their genes to multiple partners. Because it makes biological sense for them to try. And I know that females will put out more to keep their resident mate in line. And that some females will tend to cheat for more genetic diversity. While others will not, for more protection.
I don’t really see the problem. It is like people are saying, “I hate being human!” It’s just the way things are. It’s always going to be hard for males to mate as often as they want. Because females can’t afford to mate with every man that walks by. There’s too many STIs and the investment in possible pregnancy is just too high of a risk.
The thing is there is always exceptions to every rule. Females who can’t get laid. Nice guys who get tons of pussy. Women that have tons of children from multiple men.
Instead of complaining about idiots, we should be going out to get laid…
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”””””””””’Beth
A lot of males don’t EVER get the opportunity to mate”””””””””””””
In nature though those that never get to mate are killed by the alpha. In human society they are forced to live.
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Bonnie said:
Bonnie also said:
Oh, I am surprised. With the pull of your VERY YOUNG body I would expect that you could get more quality guys right now….
but I guess Bonnie, that your personality just sucks that bad.
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“It is also hard for some women to get laid. You see the guy talking about sexbots. Can you imagine when those are put out? It will become even harder for women to get laid. But, in reality, you would get a higher chance at females if they weren’t in a strict monogamous relationship. You must admit the number of married, uncheating wives do decrease you sex pool.”
I could fuck married women now, if I wanted to. I am frequently approached by married women, whom I have put absolutely no effort into gaming. I abstain because I was raised by old fashioned parents with old-fashioned values. You can dismiss that as naive, and unnecessary in your magic fairy wren kingdom, but I choose not to help destroy the self-respect of somebody’s unfortunate husband/father.
“Except animal societies show that females WILL go out and SEEK out beta males. ”
Of course they will. The Beta will provide resources for their offspring. But how is does that benefit the beta? He might get to reproduce? Occasionally pity sex for good behavior? This doesn’t sound like much of a benefit for all the hard work he does as a provider and protector of his mate and their offspring.
“But in reality, humans, like animals cheat. And yes, even the male in these monogamous marriages will cheat. For the exact same reasons as the female. ”
Right, but for most of the history of civilization people were punished very harshly for cheating, because it is bad for the children, and de-stabilizing for society as a whole. One extreme punishment was stoning. Less extreme and much more common was public shaming. Monogamy breaks down when it is not rigidly enforced.
Currently their is no enforcement at all, not even shame. In fact, a woman can cheat on her husband, divorce him, get the house, the kids, alimony and child support (that she doesn’t even have to spend on the kids). This is a reward for bad behavior, bad behavior that doesn’t just hurt the husband, but hurts the children and society as a whole.
That is not some horror story that I read about on the internet by the way. I have watched this happen to good men that I know in real life. And I didn’t walk away from this resenting women. They were only acting naturally just like the magic fairy wrens of fairy tale island. I resent society for no longer trying to enforce any standards and letting injustice happen again and again.
“The reason the ghetto relationships break down is because the male doesn’t stick around. The whole relationship is dependent on two partners.”
The male doesn’t stick around because he doesn’t have to. Society does not force him to marry his baby’s mama, as it would have 50 years ago. There is no punishment for leaving because monogamous marriage and the social structures that enforced it have broken down.
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lol comment
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congratulations there are so many annoying broads on this thread it’s become just like trolling the weight watchers forum
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
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“In nature though those that never get to mate are killed by the alpha. In human society they are forced to live.”
Not really. In the Kingfisher society, mating is restricted to how many spots are available to nest. Sometimes beta males will stick with their parents and raise their half-siblings. Other times betas will actually bring fish to some female in the hopes the beta will get to mate with her when it becomes more alpha in the next breeding season. As females will remember who helped them before….
Salmon beta males will actually sneak in just as the female is releasing her eggs to release some of its own sperm. The alpha male will try to drive the betas away, but can’t stop them when the eggs are being released as it needs to release its sperm as well.
The problem with humans is that betas just give up. Whereas the animal betas keep trying until THEY (not other innocent bystanders) die or until they reach alpha status. The problem with human males is they have to stop giving up so quickly. If a hundred women turn you down, go ask out a hundred more.
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Lions beth
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Well beth you should love game then it tells the betas to do just that not give up and ask out a 100 more.
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“Oh, I am surprised. With the pull of your VERY YOUNG body I would expect that you could get more quality guys right now….
but I guess Bonnie, that your personality just sucks that bad”
I’ve been with the same guy since I was 19, I’m 24 now. I’m committed to him, and guys hitting on me, which I do my very best to avoid, are an irritation.
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””””””””””’Beth,
The problem with humans is that betas just give up. Whereas the animal betas keep trying until THEY (not other innocent bystanders) die or until they reach alpha status. The problem with human males is they have to stop giving up so quickly. If a hundred women turn you down, go ask out a hundred more.””””””””’
And your forgetting a major difference it is also alphas who don’t want to be on the planet with humans. Some of them look around and are like wtf is this crap?
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Beth — this is why no one has much respect for the intellectual capacity of women. Men are not kingfishers. The entire history of agricultural and pastoral civilizations is: dominant male(s) assemble big patronage network, get most of the women. Beta men on the outside drift to the bush, jungle, desert, or wilderness. Descendants of dominant male run patronage network into the ground (regression to the mean). Charismatic male on the outskirts or from other newly formed group conquers corrupt, decadent, effete descendants amidst great bloodshed, new patronage network established to grab up most of the women. Cycle repeats.
The other cycle (found in sub-Saharan Africa, pre-Columbian Americas, etc.) is matriarchy, where men compete for women by killing each other. Often this is accomplished by kin networks (see the Old Testament) and stealth, i.e. the big guy gets a spear in his back.
Human males are intelligent tool makers. They tend to use those tools to express themselves (see Soldini). More often than not they simply kill rivals (and their offspring) and take women. Unless you magically make human males unintelligent and not driven for sex/reproduction you get one of these alternatives as seen by the entire history of the human race. Only through enforced monogamy do you break this cycle.
Color this obvious, and the pretty lies women tell about human nature are so pathetic to invite ridicule for the intellect of those promoting them.
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“Of course they will. The Beta will provide resources for their offspring. But how is does that benefit the beta? He might get to reproduce? Occasionally pity sex for good behavior? This doesn’t sound like much of a benefit for all the hard work he does as a provider and protector of his mate and their offspring.”
No, this is actually the best part. The Alpha is the one that continues to provide the resources. The Beta is sought out as a one-night stand to provide a little bit of extra sperm for a little bit more genetic diversity. The Beta may help a little just to ensure that his children survive, but won’t put nearly the amount of effort the alpha puts into it. The Beta very much benefits. Hence why alphas tend to go for mate-guarding strategies.
“Currently their is no enforcement at all, not even shame. In fact, a woman can cheat on her husband, divorce him, get the house, the kids, alimony and child support (that she doesn’t even have to spend on the kids). This is a reward for bad behavior, bad behavior that doesn’t just hurt the husband, but hurts the children and society as a whole.”
I couldn’t agree more with both points. Cheating is no longer considered as bad as it used to be. Women should not get all that shit when they were horrible people. And men who live their mates are also horrible people.
While, I have been arguing for Fairy Wren society, I actually do support a nuclear, monogamous family the most. I was trying to argue for a society that you guys might benefit from. But you guys don’t believe it would benefit you. So, meh.
What society do you think would benefit you guys then?
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The problem is that males have to stick around. Maybe in the Fairy-Wren society and the 1500s, it would really suck to have a child that isn’t yours within your clutch of children. But nowadays there is parental testing. Men can be sure their children are, in fact, their children. So, this massive abandonment of the nuclear family is puzzling to me. Perhaps more women are wanting children before they attain a mate. Perhaps more men are standing up for themselves and refusing the father-figure role for children that aren’t theirs.
The reason is fairly obvious: there is no security for men as fathers. Sure, paternity testing is available –> but all that does, if it turns out false, is create another divorce situation where the father is not investing in either his own children by his wife or the children of her lover. So it protects men (and I think it should be mandated for that reason), but it doesn’t solve the issue. Women are not cheating *less* due to the existence of DNA paternity tests.
The issue is really family law and sexual mores, both. Family law is a disaster for men, but not for women. Women can obtain continued parental investment from their ex-husbands while providing nothing at all in return while they pursue other DNA. That big thumb on the scale makes marriage and the nuclear family pretty untenable because one partner can get much of the benefit of marriage while no longer actually being married, while the other shoulders the burdens of parental investment without the benefits of marriage. Couple that together with sexual mores that encourage women to pursue their own sexual pleasure, and you get the breakdown of the nuclear family. In brief: when women do not need to be married in order to get male parental investment (even just the financial/resources part of it), you will quickly see the family break down, because her incentives to stay are much lower –> she can get much of the benefits of staying married even if she divorces, while getting the additional benefit of pursuing other men for diverse DNA.
So to me it’s no mystery at all as to why the nuclear family is going the way of the dinosaur.
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That was a good question.
The one I picked to live in.
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Guslinger
“Some of them look around and are like wtf is this crap?”
You crack me up 🙂
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What society do you think would benefit you guys then?
Hard monogamy (breakable only for cause — the big “A’s” of adultery, abandonment, abuse, addiction).
By far this is the most beneficial to men.
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“Beth — this is why no one has much respect for the intellectual capacity of women. Men are not kingfishers….”
You entirely missed the point. My point is not that men are kingfishers. But that beta males are not killed off in every animal society. So, saying that human males that never get the chance to mate would be killed off is not necessarily true. In some societies, yes. In others, no.
Again, your points are interesting. But they don’t really address what I am saying.
Females who cheat will a.) go for alphas during their fertility periods b.) mate with betas even when they have an alpha mate c.) if betas never got the chance to mate there wouldn’t be betas. Look at the weasel. Females have selected for highly aggressive males. If human females only ever mated with alphas, human males would be much more aggressive.
My point is that beta males have to work for pussy. And that the idea that some guy like Sodini is some rare case scenario is wrong. Most animal males suffer the same fate. And I already pointed out why females can’t mate with every Sodini that walks by.
Again, all I am hearing is generalizations about women. For one moment, try ignoring your feelings towards women. Especially ones that suck ass. Now, let’s continue…
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“The reason is fairly obvious: there is no security for men as fathers. Sure, paternity testing is available –> but all that does, if it turns out false, is create another divorce situation where the father is not investing in either his own children by his wife or the children of her lover. So it protects men (and I think it should be mandated for that reason), but it doesn’t solve the issue. Women are not cheating *less* due to the existence of DNA paternity tests.
The issue is really family law and sexual mores, both. Family law is a disaster for men, but not for women. Women can obtain continued parental investment from their ex-husbands while providing nothing at all in return while they pursue other DNA. That big thumb on the scale makes marriage and the nuclear family pretty untenable because one partner can get much of the benefit of marriage while no longer actually being married, while the other shoulders the burdens of parental investment without the benefits of marriage. Couple that together with sexual mores that encourage women to pursue their own sexual pleasure, and you get the breakdown of the nuclear family. In brief: when women do not need to be married in order to get male parental investment (even just the financial/resources part of it), you will quickly see the family break down, because her incentives to stay are much lower –> she can get much of the benefits of staying married even if she divorces, while getting the additional benefit of pursuing other men for diverse DNA.
So to me it’s no mystery at all as to why the nuclear family is going the way of the dinosaur.”
Thank you! This is logical, and I agree completely with it. I really don’t agree with taking children away from men. I would never do that to any husband I may or may not attain. From my relationships in the past, I really believe in paying your own way for things. Paying for children should only be an issue when the children are staying at your house. If you chose to have children, you should be ready to pay for them. But you shouldn’t pay for children, you don’t get to see. In animal societies, these females wouldn’t get any resources. As they shouldn’t with humans.
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Whiskey I think we should do some pc and replace the word woman with feminists when talking detrimentaly about a group.
For instance Mandy been here a while make me believe that it might be ok to fall in love with a woman from the states.
Femx makes me believe that it would not be ok to fall in love with a feminist.
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I really don’t agree with taking children away from men. I would never do that to any husband I may or may not attain. From my relationships in the past, I really believe in paying your own way for things. Paying for children should only be an issue when the children are staying at your house. If you chose to have children, you should be ready to pay for them. But you shouldn’t pay for children, you don’t get to see. In animal societies, these females wouldn’t get any resources. As they shouldn’t with humans.
You’ll find a lot of agreement here, I think, with what you just wrote. 🙂
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“What society do you think would benefit you guys then?
Hard monogamy (breakable only for cause — the big “A’s” of adultery, abandonment, abuse, addiction).
By far this is the most beneficial to men.”
Really? That’s interesting.
“That was a good question.
The one I picked to live in.”
And isn’t it sad that it is so hard to live the way you want? If I had my way, I would never work a “career.” I would live on a farm I built myself. I would grow all my own food and make all my own clothing. If the food doesn’t grow, I starve to death. Is it funny that this is my ideal life?
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”””””’And isn’t it sad that it is so hard to live the way you want? If I had my way, I would never work a “career.” I would live on a farm I built myself. I would grow all my own food and make all my own clothing. If the food doesn’t grow, I starve to death. Is it funny that this is my ideal life?”””””””
Yea pretty much where I live now it is like that.
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Except you have this thing called extended family backing you up.
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Bonnie said:
Bonnie said:
Bonnie, I’m okay with people dating outside of their age range… but when you were 19 he was 36 years old. That IS messed up. Just plain messed up. He is also at the time when he should want to settle down…. and he CERTAINLY should want to settle down at 41.
Meanwhile, you’ve blown half of your most fertile years on a man with no intention of committing.
You is owning me girl. You is doing great.
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I’m guessing Bonnie has A LOT of problems with her father.
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the fifth horseman was right I think this may be the thread that ends all threads the 10k comment thread mua mua hahahaah
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Beth really you could go amish they might take you in. Then you can learn to be like that.
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Or you can be like me and save money so you have loot plus quasi live like that he he he
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Lot of money no money walking through farmland is pure.
Look at truly rich people what do they do? They get land.
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Because having a thousand acres of land is = freedom.
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Beth said:
“No, this is actually the best part. The Alpha is the one that continues to provide the resources. The Beta is sought out as a one-night stand to provide a little bit of extra sperm for a little bit more genetic diversity. The Beta may help a little just to ensure that his children survive, but won’t put nearly the amount of effort the alpha puts into it. The Beta very much benefits. Hence why alphas tend to go for mate-guarding strategies.”
Then this model isn’t a good example for human behavior at all. The Alpha male, according to the pick up artist community, is the guy who has sex with the most females. He is the cad. He doesn’t provide resources for his offspring at all as he skips out on being a Dad. The Beta male is the Dad, he doesn’t get as much sex, but he is better at providing the resources for raising children.
In the Fairy Wren species, as you describe it there are no Alphas or Betas, because if an Alpha is behaving like a good mate and helping to raise his own offspring, then he is no longer an Alpha. If the Beta is out fucking an Alpha’s mate behind his back, he is no longer Beta.
You could say “well that’s just PUA bullshit, the animal kingdom doesn’t work like that, blah blah blah…” But this is a PUA blog, so them’s the rules.
“I would live on a farm I built myself. I would grow all my own food and make all my own clothing. If the food doesn’t grow, I starve to death. Is it funny that this is my ideal life?”
That’s pretty much the way my grandparents lived, and I think that is the way of life that is optimal for human dignity, but practically speaking it sucks major ass. That’s why it’s been largely abandoned.
If I could live in my ideal society, I would live in a cabin in the scottish highlands, poach deer, fuck red-headed lasses and take occasional pot shots at the goddamned english, the way my ancestors did. Or wear a horned helmet and carry a big ax and rape and pillage and burn civilization to the ground the way my ancestors did before that.
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””””””If I could live in my ideal society, I would live in a cabin in the scottish highlands, poach deer, fuck red-headed lasses and take occasional pot shots at the goddamned english, the way my ancestors did. Or wear a horned helmet and carry a big ax and rape and pillage and burn civilization to the ground the way my ancestors did before that.”””””””
That was fucking awesome.
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[…] a comment from Whiskey on the original Roissy thread, whose writings on this subject have influenced my own: I find it amusing that women who believe […]
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Just because of the movie not the rape lol
”””””””””””Uncle Gabby,
That’s pretty much the way my grandparents lived, and I think that is the way of life that is optimal for human dignity, but practically speaking it sucks major ass. That’s why it’s been largely abandoned. ”””””””””””
Yea I think so to. I am trying little different tack on it though. I want that side for the humanity of it but also the modern features for well the moderness. he he he
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Like your growing own food but you have a/c.
Your maybe making some mends on clothes but you can still buy your woman some hot dresses.
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You travel from the flatlands where your rice fields are up into the mountains to live on the middle of a lake and monitor your fish farms. You travel to the ocean where your growing a seaweed farm and enjoy the calm of the surf and the wind. You take your sailboat out on the water to do some deep sea fishing and can catch enough ocean fish for 6 months of eating. You hand the boat back to the guy who watches it and takes other people out on it when your not using it and helps him have a livelihood. You can travel by plane to different destinations in the world with your woman and enjoy some different scenery but there is always your base the land the farms to go back to for your tanquility.
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dana
congratulations there are so many annoying broads on this thread it’s become just like trolling the weight watchers forum
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
chill out, don’t hate your own kind so much 🙂
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You have a jakuzi and a movie theatre with surround in your house in the middle of a village. You have all the amenities yet also the benefits. You lay out on the porch and listen to the sound of the kids running around. You can go and help people build there houses for the heck of it. You can make improvements on the school that is down the street. You can initiate the repair of the road leading into the village. Buy a few computers for the school and put up a basketball court so you can teach you son some hoops.
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Life could be interesting I suppose.
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@ comment
if you understand the cabal so well, why do you still manage to lose money? the same way frustrated males hide themselves behind unrealistic high standards, frustrated traders hide themselves behind mithical cabals
@beth
I am talking about NGOs and the Govermnent, where women are massively over-represented. those are not true jobs, all those people still depend on white males, but have the Leviathan to take the money without having to comply with the providers´will
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Beth
Your Wren version of a happy family life is actually, imho, better thought out than 99% of the opinions one hears about the subject.
It is not completely implausible if females sexually desire “betas” from time to time and if descretion is easy to maintain and if the investment needed to raise a kid is broadly shared or not much trouble. There have been socities where this has applied and in fact sexual happiness has been widespread in those cases. I am thinking for example of English/European aristocrats. No kid was going to starve, all the men were rich and ennobled even if relatively beta vs other nobles, and servants did not talk (usually). So, if you were born into that lucky strata, it worked out pretty well.
Thing is, the whole thing required the beta-ization of the rest of society and that tends to be an unstable structure over time.
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@ guns and gabby
your ideal life is pure and simply retirement.
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Beth–
Beth
So what? How dumb and self absorbed can you get? You aren’t of average female attractiveness or even a little below. You are very atypical..
You’re trying to generalize from yourself. You’re apparently an ugly plus shy plus fat outlier that can’t get laid. He and we are talking about the average beta, not the bottom of the heap male omega, i.e. 1-3 in attractiveness. That they can’t get laid doesn’t surprise or all that much bother most of us. You’re apparently a female 1 or 2, and shy.
The argument isn’t about the tiny percentage of young very ugly women, such as yourself apparently, who “can’t” get laid. (I still find it hard to believe you can’t if you’ll accept casual sex from men who’s overall sexual attractiveness is no higher than your own. I.e. wimpy and/or omegas.)
The average looking 5 (ordinary, plain) or 6 (who is cute) girl can get laid very easily. 4’s can as well. 3s do with more difficulty. Even 1’s if they’re young get laid if they lower their standards enough and aren’t hideously unattractive acting as well.
Neither the world nor arguments here revolve around you, or girls both as unattractive and as shy as you.
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lol gig did you notice the business’s in there. But yea retirement exactly hopefully soon.
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Retired at 35 same age as Jesus when he started. That is some cool symbolism right there.
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Although she is talking bout growing all her own food and making clothes by hand little more extreme than retirement.
I will go along with that word though because that is exactly the capability I want to be at. It is all in the plan.
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“Or wear a horned helmet and carry a big ax and rape and pillage and burn civilization to the ground the way my ancestors did before that.”
Nope, no woman-hatred here, folks! Just a guy expressing his natural desire to rape! Why would you have a problem with that, you fat lesbian man-haterz??!
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Jesus was dead at 33
i thought you were in the Army in Iraq. What exactly do you do?
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@ gabby is one step ahede of guns
he not only dreams about retirement. he wants to retire to a video game
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Contractor
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Beth
When people here talk about hating feminism few are wasting their time worrying about the most radical feminists, who e.g. those that feel that intercourse is inherently rape or that prostitution is inherently rape.
We’re talking about what you take for granted. We’re talking what’s now part of the “post feminism” landscape, but we don’t want it to be. We’re talking about the never ending affirmative action for women in all kinds of ways in the workforce and the constant push to see workplace parity for women (or better, never any feminists complaints when women attend and graduate law school 50% more than men) when that’s clearly dysfunctional for family formation and stability since women are hypergamous. They want to marry a man who’s job has more status and makes more money. (This e.g. leads a vastly higher percentage of female executives to be unmarried than men.) Yeah feminist ongoing campaigns for affirmative action for women in one form or another sure make a lot of sense Beth. Not.
We hate the divorce law changes feminists pushed through under their media “dead beat dads” slogan, which vastly raised the level of child support to include mommy support=alimony. Such that a high earning man in a high tax state can easily have to pay over half his after tax income to his wife, regardless of how much she makes or could make, who in all probability left him for no compelling reason in these feminist no fault times, or even if she’s the one who’s been committing adultery.
We hate that those same divorce law changes automatically made marriages a 50-50 economic partnership regardless of how much the man makes or how little the wife contributes, thereby, with the way excessive state mandated levels of child support, vastly decreasing a man’s economic power in a relationship as soon as he gets married and again if he has children.
If a man cheats on a woman she can if she wants punish him by divorcing him and take him to the cleaners financially, in the typical marriage, esp. if the man is a solid middleclass or even more if he’s an upper middle class earner. As we all know. If she cheats in this same marriage he can if he wants punish her by divorcing her – and her taking him to the exact same cleaners.
Furthermore the child support=alimony part of this can’t be changed by a prenup. Some axe he holds over her head, hunh Beth? This was never how it was before the feminists changed the divorce laws in the early 90s. Most of us think that state mandated child support that even a prenup can’t change should be limited to welfare amounts if the mother would otherwise qualify for it, at most, to save the state the expense. (Or he should get custody if that’s where she’d be at economically.*) Other than that it should be completely up to the father and that often he’ll want to pay expenses directly.
*The general proposition is that if women wants support for their children from men they should have to get it voluntarily. American women shouldn’t be able to get it by marrying for awhile and then leaving their husbands to chase a variety of alpha cock, while getting the state to place their husband quite literally in involuntary servitude to pay child support=alimony. Ex husbands with CS obligations aren’t even allowed to get a more fulfilling but lower paying job. He isn’t allowed to take more time off. He can even be required to seek higher paying employment to maximize his earnings regardless if he prefers what he’s been doing. Like I said, indentured servitude.
If she wants child support from a man she should continue to provide him with good wifely services including sexing. That’s why he married her in the first place. Or she can go find another male to help her provide for her children if the bio dad doesn’t want to do it voluntarily post divorce. (In early divorces many wouldn’t want to but rather to start over, naturally enough.) American women being able to extract no money from their husbands after divorcing them would keep a lot more women from divorcing. And change the balance of power in marriage back to something more balance. She still has tons of female pussy and other loving persuasive power.
Are you starting to get an idea Beth?
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yea sil there ya go get that hate out baby
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Yea gig I will of course be playing video games and also stocks. Two passions can’t live without already priced effectivenes of setting up delta force ii on 50 comps that can be used. The numbers looking good. All over lan so speed won’t be issue.
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Yea if I was in army I couldn’t really talk about quitting could I?
Also I couldn’t do 5 years straight of 12 hour days he he he
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Contractor I can quit any time I want. Why sometimes it is a struggle to stay. There is no punishment for me leaving I have some free will in it. Like freely choosing to stay in prison.
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retirement at 35 is for traders who won the lottery, or won BIG money in a single operation. or traders who want a calm middle-class life style.
you are either retiring into the middle-classes with assets that could have grown into upper-class levels of money or you are tthe chief contractor,
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is Afghanistan winnable?
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What income would you classify as middle class?
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If they would use my ideas on war any war is winnable. I may try another company who knows. My ideas have been shunned.
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gig said:
Ah, America and Englands little attack dogs. Have you found them particularly honest?
gig said:
I said the down to 60 was a fake down on this site. Do I have to look up the thread?
Well I was right. While it is true that I didn’t make as much money off that as I should have, lousy execution and excellent understanding is my typical method of operation.
Here is a question, gig. Did you know that the week after Ike, the Category 5 that was called a Category 3/2 hit, AIG went bankrupt? You know, Insurance Losses from the Category 5.
The idea of covering the whole thing up even though satellite feed clearly showed a massive powerful hurricane was truly a scale of wild lying I hadn’t thought of.
My perceptions WEREN’T CYNICAL ENOUGH.
Perhaps gig, you imagine a 10% return as ‘wonderful’. As someone who isn’t rich, working on my own savings, I needed DOUBLINGS every year to get anywhere. And I did. Even for me that involved some risk. I did this for several years. Some loses, but I was increasing pretty good.
In the end, though, I WASN’T CYNICAL ENOUGH. I didn’t think they would nationalize the whole natural gas market, or that the American commoners would give them hundreds of billions of dollars to spend however they want cause “master want”.
I’ll admit I responded….poorly….. after my first massive loss. But I was still making rational decisions. The market simply totally changed as the madmen no longer cared about losses from manipulation. 150 to 30! WHAT THE F’ING F! Natural Gas… with production catastrophically dropping since 2000 goes to 3! The US Government under-wrote it all.
I didn’t believe the market was free, but I believed a market existed in oil and natural gas. That ceased on September 2008. And the European Governments have sacrificed any hope of becoming the world’s reserve currency in return for maintaining the status quo one or two more years. Didn’t expect them to self-castrate, but hey, I don’t like them anyway.
When everything comes unglued no doubt some intrepid moron will right something about ‘when markets failed’.
A more fitting title would be “When Slave Let Master Do Anything He Wants”.
Oil is going down in the short-term.
But expect some shortages with nonsense as an excuse in either Natural Gas or Oil. Or both. Those markets no longer are markets, so one should expect extreme, brutal dislocations. Could be months from now though. A year.
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Sil–
There is a natural male instinct to rape the women of your enemy who you’ve conquered, and aren’t under social protection, yes. It competes with other male instincts to care for women and children, even of the enemy, when they’re defenceless.
It’s not about hate but about lust and spreading the seed in a low cost to the high T alpha man way.
It’s thoroughly natural for men to generally dominate women, as they’ve done through history. It takes a lot of Marxist inspired feminist laws to make male dominance over women as low as it is now. In fact in many ways, particularly in the whole domestic side of life, these laws are turning this into Matriarchy. 40% of births are bastards to single mothers today. That’s an incredible increase since feminism became the point of view of out entertainment media and schools. We added to the number of divorced and not remarried women, WAY over half of American children now have to father figure in their daily lives. Feminist wrought matriarchy.
Oh sure a few alpha men will always tend to be more at the apex than women, but that doesn’t mean the fundamental block of our society, the family, isn’t already matriarchy. That isn’t even counting the countless families where Anglosphere feminism in the media and schools has successfully encouraged women to wear the pants in the family in just about all things, and men to “yes dear” and “I’
m sorry” and “you’re right” them on any point of conflict, because according to current feminist American culture “women are nearly always right” in marriages and men must always placate them, because after all “men are dogs”.
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Was talking with iraqi guys yesterday though and one was suggesting he would like to go to states to live.
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Comment what do you think made you not take some loot and put it into some more secure shit like maybe buying some rental houses to have an income with cash?
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Beth–
We hate the hair trigger and ridiculously overreaching and guilty until proven innocent sexual harassment laws that because of the ease of bringing costly civil lawsuits under them turn many litigation nervous workplaces into places where prissy female sensibilities often rule. They should be eliminated.
We hate the hair trigger and ridiculously overreaching and guilty until proven innocent domestic violence laws which e.g. criminalize a mere no injury slap by a man to a woman and indeed almost any display of physical male dominance (made her afraid of violence), thus neutering as much as feminists can yet another area of natural dominance. And also say threat over female cheating. There have always been laws in this country against really beating your wife up and when it was severe or repeated and regular, the police and courts did intervene. Feminists wanted and got vastly more than that, to try to root out all domestic violence. As it is now a woman can lie about being no injury slapped or even threatened with it, get a no hearing restraining order, and force a man out of his home for 90 days or longer, while still having to pay the bills for it. That’s feminist justice.
We hate that feminists in ed schools and the mostly female and mainstream feminist indoctrinated teachers they turn out, and school administrators, do everything they can now to see that girls excel compared to boys, with little care given when boys accordingly fall behind. Recess is adequately frequent for boys because it’s girls that matter most now under this feminist mindset, leading to ADHD diagnosis for lots of kids, overwhelmingly boys. Boys roughhousing in recess and on school grounds is stopped at hair trigger levels in many upper half white schools and teasing of girls or e.g. pulling their hair etc. or even hitting them BACK is likely to be regarded as sexual harassament and subject to punishment. Everywhere in schools and universities the mainstream feminist object is no male dominance display over females despite the fact that it’s entirely natural.
Universities now regularly have ridiculous radical feminist standards for what constitutes rape and male students are expelled on those bases, oven with uncorroborated and unconvincing stories, but convincing enough in those hyper feminist and rape obsessed climes.
Feminists and even some feminist researchers make a regular practice of lying about levels and severity of many things to get laws passed and an ongoing climate created such as about the prevalence of domestic violence and even severe violence, and the levels of rape and “date rape” which is often next day female regret. NOW simply made up it’s nostrum that Super Bowl Sunday is the “most violent day of the year for women”. Yet the feminist friendly and saturated media published it without fact checking and it was recirculated for years before it was shown to be false and completely without foundation. The famous feminist assertion BEFORE the 1990 divorce law change push that women are much worse of financially after divorce than men** was based upon literally fabricated data by a feminist social scientist. When it was discovered more than a decade after the laws had changed and the feminist work or that ratchet of it anyway was done she claimed it was innocent mistakes. Yeah right.
**As though a divorced woman’s state of financial affluence shouldn’t depend on her own earning ability in this feminist job market for women time, or a man’s obligation post divorce to continue to see that she lives as well as he does. Especially since it’s overwhelmingly women who seek divorce (70%) or otherwise want out of the relationship (divorce lawyer Esquire estimates the combo to be 90%, the later including the wife moving out or refusing to stop her adultery which has lead to her no longer desiring sex from her husband.)
We hate the feminist lionization of women in the American entertainment media of women and the regular belittling of men, especially husbands, particularly but not only in situation comedies. We hate the feminist encouragement of wives to “be strong women” to their men, meaning nagging and bossing around is just fine. We hate the American media message that husbands and LTR boyfriends should always apologize if she’s upset or there’s an argument, even when they did nothing wrong, and that the woman is automatically right in a dispute. Or anyway it’s essential for domestic harmony to pretend so. Close to the exact opposite is the case and close to the exact opposite is how men wishing to play LTR game and act more alpha, or indeed alpha, should act.
That’s a beginning Beth.
Questions?
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”””””””””gig
retirement at 35 is for traders who won the lottery, or won BIG money in a single operation. or traders who want a calm middle-class life style.
you are either retiring into the middle-classes with assets that could have grown into upper-class levels of money or you are tthe chief contractor,””””””””””
Kind of interesting you obviously went to school to understand money and yet cannot envision retirement by 35. Why is my wife could envision retirement and succeed and she doesn’t know how to read. Makes 20 times minimum wage with 30 dollars in bills.
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@ guns
we are not talking about an imaginary America, but the real, feminized, multicultural and over-taxed America of Obama. Can vibrant America win? You could simply BUY the pedophilic rag-heads, for God´s sake!!!!
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Excuses are like assholes gig everyone has one and they all stink.
Seriously though you haven’t thought you could at least get to a first retirement and then work because you want to?
Not that I didn’t do comments same mistake and toss it all on red. Not that I didn’t make the mistake on when I had the money of putting at least half on solid unlosable investments that returned a decent income.
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Although all the money I put into the wife is still there. Irony is nuts
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gunslinger said:
First, I never got above 1xx,xxx. That’s hardly ‘small’ but it isn’t huge. Second, I was young. Third, I would never buy rental properties in the US. Especially since I knew the housing bubble was going to pop.
In a stable country with a government that doesn’t want to steal everything, rental properties can make sense. Not in America. NO.
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Yea gig kind of like what we are doing. The iraqi dude was like yea america good they put new roads and build houses and such. Probably taking there manhood in process but oh well. Future may be better infrastructure hopefully than before.
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@ guns
my boss, 20 years older than me, took an extended weekend in Paris with a international model. He said to his wife that he was going to a conference in Buenos Aires
. so she couldn´t go due to the swine flu
He paid two first class tickets and booked room in the “best hotel ” in Paris.
he won´t have any relationship with the girl. He did this because he can
this is far above the middle class. this is the 99th percentile. this is being rich. He said that in my age, we can still talk those girls into bed, but that in his age, guys need big money.
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Well the nice thing about multiculturalism is that you can buy houses for 25k and still rent 2 sides of a duplex for 350 a piece. The other great part is that a management company only charges 10 percent.
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“yea sil there ya go get that hate out baby”
Oh my GOD, gunslingr. Calling out someone’s desire to rape is “hate,” now, but the person actually expressing the desire to rape is a-OK with you?
I give up on you.
“We hate the feminist lionization of women in the American entertainment media of women and the regular belittling of men, especially husbands, particularly but not only in situation comedies.”
Doug, I can’t speak for the accuracy of most of what you wrote, but this is one area in which feminists are definitely on the same side as you. The portrayal of men, especially husbands, as idiots who need (and get) a woman who is way smarter (and usually hotter, and long-suffering) than them to solve their problems and teach them a lesson is commonly lampooned on feminist blogs such as Shakesville. It isn’t good for men, as it tells us all to act like irresponsible and stupid children for our entire lives, and it isn’t good for women, as it tells them that this is what they must put up with. Your beef is with Judd Apatow and Seth Rogen on this one, not feminists.
“We hate the feminist encouragement of wives to “be strong women” to their men, meaning nagging and bossing around is just fine. We hate the American media message that husbands and LTR boyfriends should always apologize if she’s upset or there’s an argument, even when they did nothing wrong, and that the woman is automatically right in a dispute. Or anyway it’s essential for domestic harmony to pretend so.”
Hm, I’ve honestly never seen this. The straight female feminists I know all respect their husbands as equals and have no problem admitting when they are wrong and he is right.
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truth is, the appocallipse opener won´t work anymore once you are close to 40.
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Ok gig extended “””””””””””””””””””””weekend”””””””””””””””””””””””””
is a big difference than doing it every weekend. Don’t have to be top 1 percent to do that.
For me to be a G 365 days a year would be base cost around 650k
Not really top 1 percent.
That is based on 2 weeks when I balled out on 25k spent on hotels and such.
Around 1780 a day.
Figure one pizza hut on my last base was pulling 5k per day and that is with less then 100k in equipment expenses. Life is a joke.
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opener
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I know it is a slap in the face to your snowflakeness but you can be a janitor and live simply save money work 84 hours a week and become a baller. You can be a convenience store clerk and save money for a few years to buy your own store in nyc and G up bigger than your boss thinks he is G’ing up. I am also talking about the as you say supposes dumb ragheads and that is in america they are becoming g’s working there way from 84 hours a week in a convenience store to owning there own and takeing years off for vacations. Like three of em buy a store together and they take turns going back home for vacation/live like kings.
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Got to say yea international model is cool. What I would do is just get in touch with there agent and have a 10k meeting. Basically a ten k escort or whatever there charge is for an appearance.
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Gunny good point, it just irritates me because it’s the argument (beta providers being nice cuckolds while women screw Alphas and maybe occasionally have a kid with a beta) that I hear constantly by women, all around, including out here in SoCal. Where even nice, kind, generous, sweet women will say that bs.
Beth — you don’t get the whole point. Beta guys mostly lose under your happy Wren system. So being intelligent tool makers, they tend to rig the game so they win. They either don’t invest at all in women and kids, compete via violence (with tools equalizers for physical strength) and end up with mass-violence epidemics (like say, Liberia and Charles Taylor) or they scheme to be Big Men themselves.
Men don’t like sharing women. They generally kill not to share. Western men culturally and genetically don’t like to share and will kill EVERYONE not to share, and they have the means to do it. Remember the Illiad, the Odyssey? That stuff is as old as the oldest books in the Old Testament. It’s how Western Society runs. Odysseus did not return from his twenty year absence and say “OK honey, I’ll share you with other men.” He slaughtered all her suitors. Every one. You see that from Dermot MacMurrough’s kidnapping of the wife of Tiernan O’Ruark and inviting Strongbow into Ireland, to well, the collapse of Tony Villaraigosa’s political ambitions.
If Western Men are forced to share women, they’ll simply treat them and their children as disposable objects, and we see that now. Everything has it’s costs — and this is the cost for women in the female sexual utopia.
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People keep saying that Game would have been the solution for this guy, that Game would have stopped him from killing those women. But after reading literally hundreds of posts here, I still don’t understand how the tactics of Game–which are entirely based on dehumanization, objectification, broad generalizations of entire groups of people, manipulation, and humiliation–are actually supposed to *stop* people from going on murder sprees. You guys do know that these tactics are usually used by those who want to *start* murder sprees, right?
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Just relax chris you could have an anurism take a midol.
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xsplat wrote
Marcus cuntrag
Please reframe from using lurker’s insults.
@hope Being here (and other dark places) for a long time, even if you are originally well-intentioned, will start to warp you. Learn the source of their pain, heed their “warnings,” distance yourself from the resentful bitterness, and move on.
*waves fan in the chruch of hope*
Amen
I’ve gotten so that I can throw an insult as harsh as blog host.
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””””expressing the desire to rape is a-OK with you? ””””
God one thing I do hate is femspeak. Good lord.
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even comment whatever is letting lost tonight. Oh dear why why why did these women come here an upset the nice men.
*thanks the lord they haven’t upset maurice….YET*
Doug, why have you been so angry lately. Once upon a time you were only men when Fem came around. You played the charismatic laid back gentlemanly alpha role very well. don’t become whiskey lite.
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“Just relax chris you could have an anurism take a midol.”
Answer the question, Gunslingr, for once. How can dehumanization, objectification, scape-goating, stereotypes, and humiliation stop someone from being murdered? Are these not the tactics usually used by those inclined to murder, or even commit genocide?
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As long as you don’t say you can beat a man we will be just fine chic he he he
Might want to do some backreading on hope from feb 08 though when she was still in love with her husband.
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Obviously I normally answer questions but I am not in the mood for feminist men or woman right now whichever you might be.
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“God one thing I do hate is femspeak. Good lord.”
Answer. The damn. Question. Or shut the fuck up.
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Or heres a quick question along your same vein why are you a feminine man who want to be a woman but say a man and is a man talking about womans issues as if you where a man posing as a woman who is a man. Why are you a fag and also a manhating thing? I don’t get why your so against men that you want to kill them?
Can you answer that legitimate question?
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The above was directed at feminist mangina formerly known as “chris” and since I labeled him a feminist mangina that of course makes it true. From now on everyone will refer to chris as feminist mangina.
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“Obviously I normally answer questions but I am not in the mood for feminist men or woman right now whichever you might be.”
You and your cohorts haven’t been “in the mood” for the whole three days I’ve been here. (insert your own “That time of the month, anti-feminists?” joke here.) I’ve asked a number of reasonable questions and most have been ignored. Hell, I’m still waiting to hear if the accusation that K said the 9/11 terrorists were justified is true (I’m pretty sure it’s not).
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Chic we are using femspeak now. When you refer to the formerly “woman” who came on here and upset the nice men. They are now referred to as the feminists who came on here and upset the nice men.
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“Or heres a quick question along your same vein why are you a feminine man who want to be a woman but say a man and is a man talking about womans issues as if you where a man posing as a woman who is a man. Why are you a fag and also a manhating thing? I don’t get why your so against men that you want to kill them?
Can you answer that legitimate question?”
Um…if your intention here is to imply that my question was as ridiculous as yours–it’s really hard to tell because you have the writing skills of a seventh grader–it didn’t work. Game DOES use tactics of dehumanization, objectification, and generalizing. You guys have expressed PRIDE in that. You refer to “sexual market value,” you rate attractiveness on a 1-10 scale, you say all men are like this and all women are like this…My question was valid. Yours is based on a whole lotta shit you made up in your sick little head.
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Chris
You did not so much ask a question as make an assertion as to the nature of “game”. Since most people here disagree with your characterization, you are just being self-indulgent.
How about we go back to the basics:Game=Having women want to swallow your cum.
See how that would reduce murder?
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feminist mangina I have posted a question of you above and really it is in poor faith that you do not answer it. I am really shocked that my question out of all the questions will not be heard. Could you please take some time so that I can better understand what it feels like to be a feminist mangina and answer the question?
I’ll even say please.
Come on it is a legitimate question.
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For all those that still believe it’s feminists that hate men:
http://www.thefword.org.uk/blog/2009/07/non-feminist_mo
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Chris
guns “God one thing I do hate is femspeak. Good lord.”
chris Answer. The damn. Question. Or shut the fuck up.
wow guns, she has you backed up against the wall. you’re the freaking type so i’m sure you’re having fun.
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feminist mangina your really being a complete fucked up dickless small dicked asshole and I hope you burn in hell for not answering my fucking god dam question. Your never going to get a woman/man the way your pathetic self acts by not answering simple legitimate question that I have. You have not payed attention to my question. That means you will never get a woman/man in your life. You will always be alone with your thought by yourself because you did not answer my question.
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Chris
So now we all know you are about 19. It is not your fault that you are naive.
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feminist mangina how am I supposed to even debate with you anymore if you won’t answer my question. I can’t belieeeevveee you don’t have the balls to answer my question. This is amazing. You are such a wimpy guy who can’t stand up for anything.
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allright rum I will stop he he he
Chris may grow up to be ok.
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Scary being inside the mind of a feminist man that is some sick way of debating.
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””””Rum
How about we go back to the basics:Game=Having women want to swallow your cum.”””””””””
You nailed that one for sure.
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OK, gunslingr. I will humor you if you will humor me.
I have some feminine traits, and some masculine traits. Why? Fuck if I know. I like being that way and I don’t see anything wrong with it. I do not wish to be a woman–I enjoy my penis very much, thank you, and I would never want to put up with everything women have to (periods, assholes such as you who feel you are entitled to their bodies, etc.). I am not gay, and if I were, it would be none of your damn business. I am not against men, and I don’t want to kill them, and I find it hilarious yet sad that in a thread about an actual man shooting actual random women simply for being women, you are accusing me of hating men for being men and wanting to kill them. The irony is delicious.
Your turn.
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Answer the question, Gunslingr, for once. How can dehumanization, objectification, scape-goating, stereotypes, and humiliation stop someone from being murdered? Are these not the tactics usually used by those inclined to murder, or even commit genocide?
You’re PMSing, honey.
The thing you don’t get about Game: women enjoy being Gamed. If they did not, it would not work.
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doug1’s 7:47 post is great. Worthy of being stored in the archives for ‘best comments’ that I wish we could have here.
At a minimum, it should be a strong candidate for ‘Comment of the Month’ award if that is still running.
Epic thread, this is.
Among all of the super-worthy points, the first blood I always draw in a ‘debate’ with a misandrist is to attack the notion that women are paid less then men. As per the links I linked to earlier, that is the stupidest, most dishonest piece of crap lie going today. Even worse than the lie that minorities are paid less than whites.
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But if you will take exhibit b “assholes such as you who feel you are entitled to their bodies”
That is not good faith. You see how?
I may have the confidence to believe that I can get most woman. If a woman tells me no I move on. So only woman who want my dick get it. Now I am also pretty fucking choosy on which woman get to have my dick. I do not accept every woman who shows interest because I do not need to. I pick the ones out that I want and maybe indicate some interest after they do an indicator of interest to me. Or I follow there personality for a while and like it and they meet my minimum criteria and I indicate interest. Rarely there will be a woman that impresses the fuck out of me.
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Chris
First you say you are a guy and then you say you do not hate guys. Somehow, I am not reassured.
In case you never read Roissys original post, he was merely saying that if Sobini had looked at women more realistically he would be fucking them instead of going postal on them.
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Rum–
“You did not so much ask a question as make an assertion as to the nature of “game”. Since most people here disagree with your characterization, you are just being self-indulgent.”
Fair enough, but I don’t understand which part exactly you disagree with. Do you not believe that putting people on a rating scale and talking about their sexual market value, and in fact making that part of the basic tenants of your life philosophy, is not dehumanizing and objectifying and often humiliating? Do you not believe the assumptions made about men and women by many of the commenters here–some so rigid and unflinching that they can’t believe I am a man–are generalizations?
“How about we go back to the basics:Game=Having women want to swallow your cum.
See how that would reduce murder?”
No. I’m sure there’s lots of murderers who have exactly that.
The only thing that can really reduce murder is people treating other human beings as equal human beings rather than disposable and inherently evil objects.
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You’re also making the wrong assumption that everyone uses game to be a PUA. Another false assumption.
Game = what women find attractive in men. Do all women find PUAs attractive? No. Do all women find being gamed, in a context appropriate way, attractive? Yes. All it is, Chris, is acting in a way that women find sexy and attractive. It’s the equivalent for men of what women do when they apply makeup, wear heels and so on.
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“Chris
First you say you are a guy and then you say you do not hate guys. Somehow, I am not reassured.”
Why? That doesn’t make any sense. Would saying that I do hate guys make you finally believe that I was one?
I’m not following you here.
“In case you never read Roissys original post, he was merely saying that if Sobini had looked at women more realistically he would be fucking them instead of going postal on them.”
But implicit in this and so many of the comments is that this is an either-or situation. That if you’re not fucking them, you’re going to want to kill them. I know that sounds extreme, but that is the logical conclusion of the argument. What is never said is that someone can go their entire life without getting laid, and still not feel entitled enough to take that out by murdering people.
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To phrase that better, you’re completely leaving out the option of Sodini never “fucking” or “going postal on” women.
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””””’Chris,
Fair enough, but I don’t understand which part exactly you disagree with. Do you not believe that putting people on a rating scale and talking about their sexual market value, and in fact making that part of the basic tenants of your life philosophy, is not dehumanizing and objectifying and often humiliating? Do you not believe the assumptions made about men and women by many of the commenters here–some so rigid and unflinching that they can’t believe I am a man–are generalizations? ””””’
Is any field that studies human behavior bad?
Is psychology wrong?
Do you pay car insurance?
Because there are people that study death and how much it costs.
Life insurance a price put on death.
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Pretty much here trying to figure out how to enjoy life and get the most out of life and have fun in life and for our woman to have fun in life.
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””””””””””””Chris
To phrase that better, you’re completely leaving out the option of Sodini never “fucking” or “going postal on” women.””””””””””””””’
You can’t stop that though chris you can’t stop people from doing bad things. Shit happens.
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“You’re also making the wrong assumption that everyone uses game to be a PUA. Another false assumption.
Game = what women find attractive in men. Do all women find PUAs attractive? No. Do all women find being gamed, in a context appropriate way, attractive? Yes. All it is, Chris, is acting in a way that women find sexy and attractive. It’s the equivalent for men of what women do when they apply makeup, wear heels and so on.”
OK novaseeker, I find this perfectly rational. But doesn’t your admission that not everyone finds the same things attractive basically defeat the purpose of a blog like this, which offers specific rules, ratings, theories, and so on? Doesn’t it prove wrong the many posters who have made broad generalizations about what all men and women want and how they behave?
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Chris
The sexual market exists whether or not any of us “put people on it.” Markets of all sorts simply exist and smart people deal with that fact with their eyes open. Silly people cover their eyes and try to pretend otherwise.
Besides, the whole sexual market value thing is just a way to find a common frame of symbolic referrence. You know, like a language. Language is always an imperfect reflection of “reality” but you have to use words to talk to one another.
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chris may burn out on this place. People who start off strong, usually fade out after a few weeks.
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novaseeker wrote :
You’re also making the wrong assumption that everyone uses game to be a PUA. Another false assumption.
Yep. The biggest value of Game is to avoid the cruel traps that men fall into (oneitis, depressions, getting swindled, getting screwed by the anti-male divorce laws) by a culture rigged to trap men this way.
Scoring with pretty girls is only the second most valuable use of Game. A ‘PUA’ is only a subset of this.
What is stupid about the feminists and faggots who are protesting here is that the main article states, correctly, that the victim’s lives could have been saved if Soldini had even some practical knowledge of Game. We WANT for this tragedy to not have happened, and Game would have been the best way.
Yet the idiots are OPPOSING Game, therefore ensuring more such incidents in the future.
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S wrote I’m a shiksa
Pa’s response You shouldn’t call yourself that. The word in original Yiddish means “smelling of piss.”
Alpha’s who jackhammer after a good back hand slap frequently ruin the bladders of their willing victims. I think it’s called a fistula.
A-Bax wrote
The Jezebel twats are slipping….took them all day find this arena of pretty-lies-less discussion and bleat their self-serving, head-in-the-sand noise
Nothing like starving an attention whore.
Katto wrote
THE WIRE
Sailer’s views on “The Wire”
It’s okay to have your own opinions. You don’t always have to follow your messiah.
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“The sexual market exists whether or not any of us “put people on it.” Markets of all sorts simply exist and smart people deal with that fact with their eyes open. Silly people cover their eyes and try to pretend otherwise.
Besides, the whole sexual market value thing is just a way to find a common frame of symbolic referrence. You know, like a language. Language is always an imperfect reflection of “reality” but you have to use words to talk to one another.”
I guess I am starting to understand where you’re coming from on this, but personally I’ve found that people who go through life rating people and obsessing on labels such as “alpha” and “beta” are generally miserable, while those who focus more on love and mutual respect are happier and have better relationships. And most of the comments I’ve read here have reinforced that belief of mine.
But I’m glad we are finally discussing the fundamentals of our differing belief systems rather than hurling insults. It’s letting me understand you much better.
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doug1, have you read Susan Pinker’s book The Sexual Paradox: Men, Women, and the Real Gender Gap?
And don’t worry so much about men not doing as well in secondary school and college, they don’t need college to be successful or even billionaires.
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””””””””Chris,
No. I’m sure there’s lots of murderers who have exactly that.
The only thing that can really reduce murder is people treating other human beings as equal human beings rather than disposable and inherently evil objects.”””””””’
Yea ok this person killed some people which is wrong because he took away there right to choose whether or not they wanted to leave the planet. They may have wanted to continue their existance now we can’t ask them. A lot of shaming language is being used against the person who did the killing but at the same time no real solutions have been presented on what could have stopped it. Would counseling have helped?
Would pills have helped?
This person had to overcome a lot of cultural mores and norms in order to do this deed.
What we could do for people like this (rather than just trying to shame them) is to allow them to go in peace leaving this earthly body. We can make it morally acceptable to leave the body on this planet because you want to. We can compare it to abortion for unwanted pregnancies. Except this is an adults choice to abort themselves. They recieve the same type of help a person would recieve if they wanted to abort their “fetus”/”baby”. In order to do this we will label them “pre-corpse”/”human being”. Should help with keeping only people who want to be on the planet be on the planet. Then no one has to be shamed. Non one has to be in pain that they don’t want to be in.
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The guy had no options in his mind. The above might have helped him make a choice not to murder.
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I don’t believe he killed them because he thought they where disposable objects he killed them becasue he believed they where human beings and it was the ultimate sin.
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Gunslingr–
“Is any field that studies human behavior bad?
Is psychology wrong?
Do you pay car insurance?
Because there are people that study death and how much it costs.
Life insurance a price put on death.”
Good points–for once–but I can’t compare any of those legitimate fields of study to Game. That’s absurd to me. Also, I find that the precepts of Game generally tend to paint an overall negative view of humanity, to the point of dehumanization. I don’t think that the other fields you mention do that to quite such a degree. Well, some subsets of psychology do, but it’s such a broad area of study that it can’t really be compared to this.
“You can’t stop that though chris you can’t stop people from doing bad things. Shit happens.”
But we’re discussing what would be the best way to prevent tragedies like this, no?
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Chris wrote :
OK novaseeker, I find this perfectly rational. But doesn’t your admission that not everyone finds the same things attractive basically defeat the purpose of a blog like this, which offers specific rules, ratings, theories, and so on?
No. A skilled practitioner of Game (not all of which are PUAs) will be able to quickly judge WHICH types of things woman A will find attractive, a different set of things woman B will find attractive, etc. fully within the concept of Game.
Doesn’t it prove wrong the many posters who have made broad generalizations about what all men and women want and how they behave?
Some very broad generalizations are true, such as the fact that the vast majority of men will be more interested in the beautiful woman than the ugly one. Also, a woman of 35 has a very different set of life concerns than a woman of 21, and the Game applied to either should adapt accordingly.
I don’t see that people are making any more specific generalizations than that.
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OK novaseeker, I find this perfectly rational. But doesn’t your admission that not everyone finds the same things attractive basically defeat the purpose of a blog like this, which offers specific rules, ratings, theories, and so on? Doesn’t it prove wrong the many posters who have made broad generalizations about what all men and women want and how they behave?
No, because the basic principles are the same. The specifics are different depending on context, your personality and so on. But the basic idea of what women find attractive (playful dominance) is the same — it is simply effectively expressed differently depending on context.
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Gunslingr, my solution is to stop the widespread belief in our society that women’s primary purpose in life is to sexually service men, and that if they fail in this regard, they are worthless. Sodini clearly held this belief, as do many of the commenters on this blog.
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””””””””’Bonnie
doug1, have you read Susan Pinker’s book The Sexual Paradox: Men, Women, and the Real Gender Gap?
And don’t worry so much about men not doing as well in secondary school and college, they don’t need college to be successful or even billionaires.”””””””’
the sneaky bonnie only 3 million millionair’s but yea get rid of our men no problem there are 2 billion chinese and 1.2 billion indians.
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Chirs your extrapolating way to much out of this shit. You have obviously not read for comprehension. You need to study some more or have a photographic memory.
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Chris
Commenters here are a diverse group. You should not generalize about “us.”
It has been said a lot that for guys learning game is primarily a matter of un-learning the wrong ideas society has force fed boys and men about how women really feel.
Stop and think of the ways this helps guys get to the place of love and understanding with them.
See, women are virtually incapable of telling the truth about this. It is not, at the end of the day, their fault. But you still should still not listen to what they say as if it were meant to help you win them over. It almost never is. They are forever testing guys. They cannot help themselves.
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TFH and novaseeker, you’re actually starting to make som sense, but you’re expressing yourselves faaaar more moderately than you were before. Perhaps the problem isn’t “game” itself, just the ridiculous extremes that many of the posters here have been taking it to. After all, any ideology, when taken to extremes, can be deadly.
But again, I’ve never practiced game and I’m not an “alpha male” at all, and I’m doing fine in my relationship (believe it or not, I really don’t care). If game helps for you, then great–but if you absolutely obsess over it like some here have been doing, I do believe it is going to hurt you.
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And don’t worry so much about men not doing as well in secondary school and college, they don’t need college to be successful or even billionaires.
What ignorant crap is this? Of the tens of millions of men that drop out of college, just because 3 became billionaires, these anecdotes justify a rationalization for mistreating all men in the educational system?
So 0.00001% of college dropouts became billionaires, so that justifies the situation of mistreatment of the other 99.9999% of men.
The divorce laws in the US screw over men 90% of the time and women 10% of the time. That 10% offers feminists plenty of anecdotes to use to keep the absurdly anti-male injustice going (to their own long-term detriment, of course).
Reason #4,540 that feminism repels thinking people : Anecdotes are used ahead of data to justify outlandish agendae.
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Trust me on this Chris feminism’s ideals holds woman back from being truly equal. Understand that and savor it. Then go and visit some places where there is no feminism.
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The fifth horseman It really is the same thing as the way blacks had second class status under Jim Crow. Men are the new Southern Blacks.
Please stop!
You deserve lurker level spam insult comments hours on end for this crap.
Whiskey At your age[5’7] 140 is still pretty hefty
Whiskey she should be on the smaller side for her BMI. I’m 2.5 inches taller and I weight 140.
chris you’re expressing yourselves faaaar more moderately than you were before.
his girlfriend gave him some. don’t you know all men become relaxed after they’ve had a mini death.
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””””””””””on August 8, 2009 at 9:45 pm Chris
Gunslingr, my solution is to stop the widespread belief in our society that women’s primary purpose in life is to sexually service men, and that if they fail in this regard, they are worthless. Sodini clearly held this belief, as do many of the commenters on this blog.””””””””””””””””’
How do you figure that he thought they were worthless unless sexually servicing men?
See your still doing femspeak and you just can’t help yourself lol
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You are still basically trying to perpetuate a war not a peace. Yes another thing that can be outsourced is woman.
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If it is a war of the sexes.
Then it is to easy.
You can replace all the woman in us with woman from china alone and it would not make that much of a dent population wise. I wonder if that is what feminists are working towards. Then feminists in us would not have to worry about servicing the men of their country at all. They could all go lesbian and it would no longer matter that they showed any love for the men.
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Chris
Soldini felt the opposite of “entitled” to womens sexuality. His complaint was that in his mind and according to how he was raised, he had done everything necessary to have some woman want him. In other words, he thought guys needed to earn love, not just show up and claim it.
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“Bonnie, I’m okay with people dating outside of their age range… but when you were 19 he was 36 years old. That IS messed up. Just plain messed up. He is also at the time when he should want to settle down…. and he CERTAINLY should want to settle down at 41.
Meanwhile, you’ve blown half of your most fertile years on a man with no intention of committing.
You is owning me girl. You is doing great.”
I’m curious as to why you think a 17-year age difference is ‘messed up’. If I had been still in high school it would have been a weird vibe, but at the time we met I was working full time, living on my own, supporting myself totally. He thought I was older than I was, and I thought he was younger (people usually assume he is 6-10 years younger than he is).
Marrying a younger woman later in life runs in his family. His father and both grandfathers did the same. Your fearless leader here seems to think there is nothing more natural, I tend to agree. Some of the happiest couples I know have a 10-25 year age gap.
Anyway, like I said, I am in no hurry. I believe in loooong trial periods before committing to marriage or parenthood. And most girls may have been ready to start with babies at 15 years old but back then I weighed about 85 pounds and I’m still trying to pack on some weight – I don’t want the doctor to be telling me I have to gain 40 lbs when preg because I am still underweight.
My parents suck, and that probably has a great deal to do with why I like the stability of an older guy. Dad’s brain exploded when I was a kid and he is permanently disabled, mom was emotionally and physically abusive. It’s a valid reason – wanting someone emotionally mature and fully adult when you didn’t have that as a child.
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“Trust me on this Chris feminism’s ideals holds woman back from being truly equal.”
In what way?
“How do you figure that he thought they were worthless unless sexually servicing men?”
This isn’t rocket science, Gunslingr. He killed them because they weren’t fucking him. Why would he kill them unless he thought their lives were worthless?
And I’ve seen the same basic sentiment a hundred times on this blog. The anger towards women who won’t sleep with “betas.” The insults hurled toward them, as if they are somehow not doing their rightful duty or being at all useful if they aren’t on their knees. I think my evaluation holds up.
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and I’m doing fine in my relationship
No doubt you are, Chris. Let’s see what happens as life goes on, however.
You may not believe this, but many of the posters here once thought the way you did when we were also younger and “doing fine” (so we thought) with women.
One tip: women are not WYSIWYG. Their behaviors are more complex. This is not explained by women to men, because they expect us to understand it without their explaining it to us. But men learn, one way or another, I think.
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Meanwhile, professions that need qualifications e.g. medicine and law are overrun by women.
Of course it’s worrying. Every man can’t be a billionaire. Certainly drop outs, criminals and those on welfare are more the norm in my locality. If there’s success, most likely confined to construction work or the army. It’s all feedback loops: to have civilised and productive men, you need a civilisation where they can thrive. Every profession that’s disproportionately populated with women (when considering the intelligence of men, but the problem is discipline) has suffered in terms of the quality of the work, the discipline and the politics of the profession itself.
In general, discipline and consequences are softer on women. This is observable every day gender politics. Thus standards slip.
In any case, that’s not the point. If men are not allowed an equal chance to thrive (albeit different methods have to be used to provide this): it’s not a sustainable model and certainly contrary to any benefits society might have.
To provide an anecdote: There was this clear dominant, intelligent male. Due to this quality, he challenged every figure of authority (high IQ males combined with high social IQ? Yes, invariably rebellious). Did they know how to handle him? No.
He dropped out repeatedly of his classes. Most likely no discipline in his family. Most likely a single mother. Most likely going to be on benefits. As was the norm in the area I went to school in.
Have you ever seen men of the same social class and background as the women try to make something of themselves — get themselves out of the gutter despite it being easier to be on benefits — and then facing so much difficulty because of an entire faculty that did not know how to direct typical, normal male energy which was easily and intuitively well-controlled in previous models?
That’s the beginnings of complete ruin, right there. The consequences are clear and visible: inability to provide an educational model that provides the structured framework allowing men to achieve and then a system that rewards them for failure or in the case of criminality, inadequately punishes them when they’ve already gone beyond the point of no return.
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No chris he killed them to get the guts to kill himself. He thought they where people. Have you ever been inside the mind of a serial killer?
I have.
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“Chris
Soldini felt the opposite of “entitled” to womens sexuality. His complaint was that in his mind and according to how he was raised, he had done everything necessary to have some woman want him. In other words, he thought guys needed to earn love, not just show up and claim it.”
But if he believed that he had done everything to earn their love, and was angry at them for not returning his affections, that is the very definition of “entitled.” Not entitlement based on the fact that he simply existed, but based on what he had (or believed to have) done to deserve it. If he really still thought he was the problem, not women, then he wouldn’t have shot them.
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Look at his youtube home tour video. He practically says out loud, “Look at how much I have tried to be worthy of a womans love.” That is not feeling like sex is owed or that women are only good for that
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i need you guys to loosed up. you’re too serious tonight, it’s saturday.
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Bonnie wrote :
“And don’t worry so much about men not doing as well in secondary school and college, they don’t need college to be successful or even billionaires.”
What ignorant crap is this? Of the tens of millions of men that drop out of college, just because 3 became billionaires, these anecdotes justify a rationalization for mistreating all men in the educational system?
So 0.00001% of college dropouts became billionaires, so that justifies the situation of mistreatment of the other 99.9999% of men.
The divorce laws in the US screw over men 90% of the time and women 10% of the time. That 10% offers feminists plenty of anecdotes to use to keep the absurdly anti-male injustice going (to their own long-term detriment, of course).
Reason number 4,540 that feminism repels thinking people : Anecdotes are used ahead of data to justify outlandish agendae.
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“No chris he killed them to get the guts to kill himself.”
But if that were true, he could have chosen any random victims. But her was very clearly targeting women as a group because of what he viewed as their slights against him.
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What this guy did was suicide. He was carrying out an exit strategy. Everything else is secondary. If all he wanted was to kill random women he could have done that regularly and gotten away with it for a long time.
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“Look at his youtube home tour video. He practically says out loud, “Look at how much I have tried to be worthy of a womans love.” That is not feeling like sex is owed or that women are only good for that”
Maybe not just sex. I think we’ve all been making a mistake focusing in on just sex and not a deeper need for connection he clearly had. But he certainly felt like he had done so much to get what he wanted, and he finally blamed those who wouldn’t give it to him.
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The thing is, Chris, if you look at some of the women here, they have also commented that there will be more, not less, Soldini’s in the years ahead unless men get better at attracting women. Obviously he sucked at it. Does that mean he should have shot them up? Of course not. But what we are saying is that if he had gotten better at attracting women, his underlying issue would not have been there — maybe. He may also have just been a crazy MoFo who was beyond helping himself, in which case he ought not be used as a posterboy for misogyny either.
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“get rid of our men no problem there are 2 billion chinese and 1.2 billion indians.”
You are such a racist. ‘Our men’, jesus christ.
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Now when you install morals and god into that person then they tend not to follow through.
Look at society coming up today. There is no god for most people. Morals are not getting instilled in the same way. Where do you think it is heading if all the punishment you can give is of this world and there is no punishment in the afterlife.
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You are such a racist. ‘Our men’, jesus christ.
Or maybe nationalist? Why assume he was referring to one race? I didn’t see it there.
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Yea I have already brought that up in the past when managers have said that the indians made great workers and where cheap. I said sure they make great workers they are people too just like us. We could replace every job in america with indians but is that what we really want to do?
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Yea nova the femspeak lies are just expected just rediculas.
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“The thing is, Chris, if you look at some of the women here, they have also commented that there will be more, not less, Soldini’s in the years ahead unless men get better at attracting women. Obviously he sucked at it. Does that mean he should have shot them up? Of course not. But what we are saying is that if he had gotten better at attracting women, his underlying issue would not have been there — maybe. He may also have just been a crazy MoFo who was beyond helping himself, in which case he ought not be used as a posterboy for misogyny either.”
I get what you’re saying, but we clearly disagree on what that underlying issue was. I find misogyny and entitlement to women to be far more dangerous obstacles than simply being bad with women. But we may just have to agree to disagree here–thanks for the good debate, though. It came as quite a surprise after the last few days here.
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””””””Bonnie
“get rid of our men no problem there are 2 billion chinese and 1.2 billion indians.”
You are such a racist. ‘Our men’, jesus christ.””””””””’
You don’t feel like you beling to a country bonnie?
You don’t feel like your on a team in any way?
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“Now when you install morals and god into that person then they tend not to follow through.
Look at society coming up today. There is no god for most people. Morals are not getting instilled in the same way. Where do you think it is heading if all the punishment you can give is of this world and there is no punishment in the afterlife.”
Sodini was a Christian. And true morals are instilled by teaching respect, not fear of punishment.
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get rid of our men no problem there are 2 billion chinese and 1.2 billion indians.”
I’m happy, I love Asian men.
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Chris look at the way the feminists come on it is only after a bunch of grueling beat downs that eventually they can almost talk without the shaming and calling names and femspeak.
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that is great chic have you married one yet?
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“Meanwhile, professions that need qualifications e.g. medicine and law are overrun by women.”
No, colleges providing those qualifications are overrun by women. Although most colleges are trying their best to keep an even gender ratio..
As of 2004, 84.9% of men had graduated from high school, compared to 85.4% of women. And 28.9% had bachelor degrees, compared to 26.5% of women.
Need I explain to you that there is no guarantee that someone who goes to school to obtain a certain degree will practice in that career for any length of time, or at all?
The vast majority who are currently succeeding in the two professions you mentioned are men. Women are still hovering at under 30% of practicing lawyers, and around 20% of doctors in America. And they are far more likely to choose specialties within those careers that make a lot less money.
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Chris,
Given your opinions about Soldini, tell us :
What are your opinions on Al-Qaeda’s terrorist attacks against the US, in London, Madrid, Bali, Bombay, and elsewhere? Which parties should receive the harshest condemnation?
What are your opinions on Palestinian terrorist attacks against Israel?
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Bhetti
Excellent post. A lot of what guys feel about this comes from wanting to be on the winning team. Any kind of affirmative action system tells guys that the authorities want your team to lose. And I do not mean the “male” team, I mean whatever enterprise he is depending on.
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Bonnie wrote :
And they are far more likely to choose specialties within those careers that make a lot less money.
The operative word here is ‘choose’.
Hence, there is no sexism here. Different people make different choices, based on goals, values, age, priorities, and gender
So congrats. Your feminist goal of providing equal opportunity and equal compensation for equal work, for women, has been fully, 100% achieved.
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I find misogyny and entitlement to women to be far more dangerous obstacles than simply being bad with women. But we may just have to agree to disagree here–thanks for the good debate, though. It came as quite a surprise after the last few days here.
Okay.
One last thing I would say, just to think about: I think many of us might say that misogyny and entitlement mentality come from (1) not adequately understanding how to attract women and (2) not working on how to attract women more effectively. A man who understands how female psychology works when it comes to attraction and is able to leverage that to attract women is not going to go shooting them up in a gym, and is likely to be much less misogynist and “entitled” as a result of his knowledge. I don’t think you’ll find anyone here saying that Soldini was right to feel “entitled” — no man who doesn’t work to understand what women find attractive and work to become that has any right to be pissed at women for not finding him attractive — a “being pissed” that leads directly to misogyny and a sense of entitlement.
So perhaps Chris we see things the same way, but have a rather different perspective on what the “cure” is, so that men (who are otherwise sane, which may not have been the case with this guy) do not drift into a sense of entitlement and the resulting misogyny that can build when that sense is not fulfilled. Guys who are running game are the antithesis of entitled — if they felt entitled, they wouldn’t be running game, and wouldn’t have spent the time and effort (and countless rejections) in learning how to run game.
But anyway, food for thought for you.
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Nice Nova,
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“You don’t feel like you beling to a country bonnie?
You don’t feel like your on a team in any way?”
I’m an American, but no, I don’t feel I am on a team (a lot of women don’t get all gay over teams the way most men do).
We’re all immigrants here. If people of Chinese and Indian descent are citizens here, they are Americans. If they become a majority of our population, all that means to me is that there are more people living in my country of Asian descent that European descent. I would not feel ‘taken over’ in any way. I certainly don’t regard white men, or American men, as ‘my men’.
And nova, this is like the 20th racist thing gunslinger has said, so while he didn’t make it as clear this time I felt free to assume.
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Teamwork part of a team where parts can make a whole. Where you can work together.
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gunslinger wrote :
that is great chic have you married one yet?
She loves them because they let her copy their homework in college, enabling Chic Noir to receive passing grades off of the homework alone (offseting the exam flunks).
Her admission to college being based on race + gender = double affirmative action, after all.
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Bonnie you have been assuming everything you talk about.
Your entitlement to your easy carefree life always being able to find a job because your pretty would certainly change up some when there are millions and millions of pretty in shape nice non swearing feminine woman around to compete with.
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””””””’Bonnie,
(a lot of women don’t get all gay over teams the way most men do).””””””
Ahh so the truth comes out. How are you going to have a team in marriage or are you gonna be the boss.
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I mean it is insane to hear feminists speak. No realism to shit.
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TFH–
“Given your opinions about Soldini, tell us :
What are your opinions on Al-Qaeda’s terrorist attacks against the US, in London, Madrid, Bali, Bombay, and elsewhere? Which parties should receive the harshest condemnation?
What are your opinions on Palestinian terrorist attacks against Israel?”
The harshest condemnation should of course go to Al Qaeda, the Palestinian attackers, and anyone else who kills innocent people, of course. I don’t think you will find many feminists who disagree with that, or who wouldn’t kill Osama Bin Laden if they had the chance.
What you will find is people trying to determine the complicated root causes of these situations, such as the U.S.’s initial support of Al Qaeda. That doesn’t mean we believe the U.S. is worse or even just as bad as Al Qaeda–what it means is that we bear some responsibility and our actions were wrong, and we should stop doing things like that to avoid similar events from happening.
I see what you’re trying to do with your analogy–women are to Sodini what the U.S. is to Al Qaeda–but I vehemently disagree with it. For one, rejecting a guy is not the same as supporting a terrorist army. 😉
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I guess what you get when you figure you will never have to deal with any consequence of any decsicion is a bonnie.
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“The operative word here is ‘choose’.
Hence, there is no sexism here. Different people make different choices, based on goals, values, age, priorities, and gender
So congrats. Your feminist goal of providing equal opportunity and equal compensation for equal work, for women, has been fully, 100% achieved.”
Pretty much, yeah. Women have nearly unlimited choice in the workplace – the only thing that is holding us back in a couple fields is our physical size and strength (I would love to work for my friend installing commercial heating units, but I cannot lift my own body weight over my head, so it’s not going to happen), and we have no right to demand special concessions for that.
Most of us want vastly different things than men do. Women choose nursing, teaching, yoga instructing, blah blah other female-dominated professions because that’s what we’re interested in and what is most workable. When we have a high-powered professions, we’re less likely to be workaholics. Comes naturally to most.
Women in the workplace hasn’t been something I have mentioned until my above post. You seem to think all feminists think men are holding us back from getting the jobs we want. I don’t.
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Sil said:
“”Or wear a horned helmet and carry a big ax and rape and pillage and burn civilization to the ground the way my ancestors did before that.”
Nope, no woman-hatred here, folks! Just a guy expressing his natural desire to rape! Why would you have a problem with that, you fat lesbian man-haterz??!”
Nope, no woman-hatred at all. I’ll taller and bigger boned than you and 95% of the men you know. In a system of no laws where the strong ruled by force, I would make out quite well. This is what we came from, and what we will revert to sooner or later.
But I’m glad I was able to give you a straw to grasp on to.
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GNP- I’m not a college student. I have a HS dipolma. i like the way Asian men look as well as their demeanor. The crap you guys post about them being unmanly is a load of bull.
guns that is great chic have you married one yet?
I don’t have the temperment of a good wife. therefore I remain single until I take my last breath.
bhetti chic/LR: Let’s see your empathy. How would you help her?
Can you?
help her how?
Are you going to feed her pretty lies?
What pretty lies do I need to feed her, please explain? Being mean spirited to a woman because she is no great beauty is equal to being mean spirited to a man because he is broke beta with a small peen.
There is no need to mistreat a woman because she is not attractive. She will pick up on it when she sees better looking women attracting male attention.
Tone down the message with very soft language, destroying the impact? [Something women are admittely better at]
So telling a woman you’re fat, old and ugly is better than saying well maybe if you lost a few pounds or grew out your hair, you know that most men prefer younger women blah blah blah?
The female to male version would be, Your peen is too small and you’re a broke loser.
Be a brave woman with betas if you want to but you won’t live to see old age if you go about insulting betas like this^^^.
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”””’on August 8, 2009 at 10:36 pm Gunslingergregi
Bonnie you have been assuming everything you talk about.
Your entitlement to your easy carefree life always being able to find a job because your pretty would certainly change up some when there are millions and millions of pretty in shape nice non swearing feminine woman around to compete with.
”””””””””””
Or how about if they don’t live under same laws as you and they just replace you. See how that works your not living in a vacuum. There are teams out there. There are countries that still have some national pride where people think they are working together for a common goal.
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2k comment post. this will be a new record. pupu give us some stats please.
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“I guess what you get when you figure you will never have to deal with any consequence of any decsicion is a bonnie.”
Your posts are so hard to decipher.
Most of us have privilege to some degree. I try to understand and admit to my own.
If you’re white, you have it. If you come from a background with any spare money, you have it. If your parents helped you with college or getting your career started, that’s a big advantage. Etc.
My life is easier because of some things. But I came from a poor and emotionally wrecked family, I remain poor (my own decision), and no one gives me handouts (I don’t take money from BF). I work full-time and pay my bills and taxes like most people.
I could easily be a parasite on a rich guy, or sell my body in various ways through work. I choose not to.
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“The crap you guys post about them being unmanly is a load of bull. ”
This is such a white American racist POV. Same as considering black men over-sexed animals.
Most men from Asian cultures couldn’t be more ‘alpha’. I know a ton of Korean people and the men who were raised there don’t take no for an answer, and they dominate women and other men relentlessly. A lot of Korean women prefer American (white, or American-born Korean) guys for this reason. My good friend met a good-hearted American soldier stationed in Korea, they married before she spoke more than a few words of English and she’s been here ever since (they had 3 children). She says she knew she had to, otherwise she would have gotten stuck with a bossy Korean guy and spent her life cleaning his socks. She’s a loud ballsy woman, no meek stereotypical Asian doll.
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Someone needs to translate for you gunslinger. Would it kill you to spell things correctly, use punctuation and not sound drunk?
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Would it kill you to be intelligent enough to read bonnie.
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“There are countries that still have some national pride where people think they are working together for a common goal.”
I am not invested in feeling better than other people because I had the good luck to be born in a country where it’s damn good for most of us. I don’t want to keep anyone else out for fear they might replace me – I want as many people as possible in the world to have the same opportunities as I do.
Of course, this isn’t how the world works. Countries are very much ‘teams’ and there are winners and losers. But that doesn’t mean I have to buy into ‘patriotism’ and ‘national pride’. I am paying into a system that gives me services, but I am ashamed to contribute to our political role as World Bully.
I’m sure you’re going to act like I took a shit in Jesus’ mouth now because you looooove the American government and the sunshine, butterflies and true peace it stands for.
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As far as I know: In a sense the UK does have affirmative action, but it’s for lower socioeconomic level (i.e. in relative poverty, the fun term sociologists use to justify socialism most likely as poverty would always exist otherwise) rather than race or gender-based. [Although there actually has been talk of AA for men in the medical profession as I understood it]
The only ones who actually thrive in the system are the maths/science hugely submissive betas or omegas, who will be pushed around and used later. And probably not get laid unless famous. (well, more in U.S., a bit more chance here with a subsection of girls somehow learning to settle, for getting married anyway).
It All Makes Sense Now. All this, unfortunately, is just used from the rad. feminist frame I actually was in that men were inferior and idiots, even the ones who could string together a decent word or two. When the main reason this was happening was that a) men are different b) they aren’t treated as men and have no stable family structure c) therefore they become the worst image of man. The attitude and expectation generates the males.
There are ways and ways of communication, chic.
Yes, if I was talking to an omega who was spewing idiocy: you have no job, you are fat, your penis is small and you hate the world. You really think hating the world is helping any when the only women you might possibly attract is that fat chick you just insulted [i.e. manhating like rad fems]?
The second part is the most important, and the more shocking the set-up the better. I should’ve done that. Should’ve told him to go to the gym or he wouldn’t get any and why should he even expect women to be interested? Should’ve told him why does he expect a woman to fix him or be attracted to that? Real talk.
How much cruelty do we achieve by erring on the side of kindness?
What I’m saying is: he tried, you didn’t. ( The wording maybe could’ve been better, could’ve been horribly worse and cruel [you have been reading how roissy does it, right?]. It could’ve been pointless insults. It wasn’t.) .
Therefore kindness prize goes to…
And yeah I can get away with that kind of talk with the guys who need it, chic.
Bonnie:
I thought you were SMRT Bonnie. Look, someone who doesn’t repeatedly profess to be smart yet understands what I’m saying anyway.
Either you’re a liar about not understanding me or you’re stupid.
Which is it?
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Yep, mostly accurate translation. Gunny, I am in your head today.
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So you see what guys deal with from feminist woman and you are wondering why you can’t still create enough animosity for men to be killing woman on a minute by minute basis. It is because men are too nice. They let feminists get away with murdering men by breaking there souls with their words and laws.
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Reading doesn’t have much to do with intelligence anyway gunslinger.. your wife can’t read, right? And I assume she is a smart lady since she makes lots of money.
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Yes but you claim to be able to read and can’t. Just another lie.
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Gunny: Anyway, you shouldn’t deprive people of clarity of expression. Everybody regardless of their inherent ability to understand txts in dffrnt frms would like the privilige of knowing what you’re saying as well. Without having to strain their taxed brains (no doubt from being at work or being too stressed or in a hurry or something. And a lot of people are really militant about their punctuation, Gunny. It’s sorely stigmatised.). You know I’m a busy grrl so can’t translate for your high-volume output.
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She doesn’t read because she made a sacrifice of it to raise some of her brothers and sisters. So yea in that respect yea a sign of her social intelliegence in sacrificing herself for others or understanding the concept of team. Since she does understand that concept maybe there is a god who allowed me to meet her so she could be rewarded on this earth and so could I.
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Waiting moderation above so will repost translation so that this makes sense:
I thought you were SMRT Bonnie. Look, someone who doesn’t repeatedly profess to be smart yet understands what I’m saying anyway.
Either you’re a liar about not understanding me or you’re stupid.
Which is it?
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Yea bhetti but there are still only 3 million millionaires and I am going to be one of them puncuation or no.
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Chris, don’t you get it yet?
Those who objectify women do so because they themselves are functioning as mere objects. Can you blame a herd animal for desiring to learn the customs of the herd?
In many cases, you’re talking to guys who were even worse off, like caged herd animals. In their safe little cages, they were lied to about the realities of being out in the herd. Now they’re learning the truth as it applies to them.
Like members of any other species who were basically caged, badly programmed, and then released to the “wild”, some of the maladaptive crap they were told to believe will persist despite the reality around them. They won’t have a chance of learning until it causes them suffering, that what they were taught was wrong. Even then, some won’t learn. They will direct the blame for their suffering everywhere but the source.
It’s hard to get out of the “blank slate” mentality, and accept that some people are doomed, but this is a must when trying to relate to people in this and any other social movement. You’re an outsider in many ways, and benefit from this, but many people would not know how to. They literally do not have the courage or even the potential to gain the courage to stand against the tide and accept the risk that doing so could result in their being romantically alone.
They cannot be happy with themselves by themselves. Most people need the approval of others so much that they can forego other needs that you may feel are more important to you.
You can only inform them of the exceptions and give your perspective on the rules. If you’re going to take on the rules then the followers are not with whom your battle truly is. It is with the leaders.
Getting bogged down in the details with the followers (as is evident in their failure to break out of herdspeak and bleating of cliches in the things that count, while professing rebellion on the surface of the issues) is a distraction. It is one that I myself fell into for some time when I was running from truths about myself, trying to be a “good” person. It’s a kind of phase many independent thinkers go through just before we reach a certain age where we just grow out of giving a damn about the petty grievances of the seemingly instinctively self destructive.
If you want to save this corner of the world, become the apex, or at least start goading it into a direction that keeps the herd better fed and docile.
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Ghost you should go back to stabbing men who you thought where trying to rape you in front of 100 other guys eating in a chow hall. That is straight up off the wall psycho shit.
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Nicole
You are pretty drunk, that is obvious. For several reasons I am not inclinded to hate on you for that.
But it is a complete waste of time to fight basic instinct. If you are a guy, don’t be too nice. If you are a girl, don’t be too fat. Nature will be cruel to both.
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Thus Gunny demonstrates how men go ‘this pointless school crap can go to —-!’ and go make a million or die/get arrested/declare bankruptcy trying [mostly the latter if you’re not gunny].
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Gunny, you want some?
No?
Then latch off my tit and fuck off.
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I’m not going to scroll through every comment or get into the back and forths, I just have a couple of things to point out~
A) To the earlier comment detailing the crippling effect of not being able to score in high school, men will need to find new things to base their self-esteem on, because it is not the burden of women (especially teenage girls) to put out, or to put out for the “right” guys, just to protect the male psyche. All teenagers have their own problems, their own insecurities, and not every man who still has his virginity after graduation goes on to be a woman-hating murderer. Plenty of them get the hell over it, as they should.
In a general sense, though that comment set me off, in understanding the actions of this man, I don’t believe the burden or blame should be shifted in any way toward the victims. Perhaps this is no one’s intent, it is merely how things read to me in comments.
B) To the commenter saying feminism is to blame, the only way the movement contributes to violence toward women is that, in a society that still teaches men the lie that they are entitled to women and their bodies, feminism is teaching women the truth, and in these extreme cases, we pay the price for not playing along.
And to the OP, I don’t think game would have saved anyone’s life in this or any other instance of male violence toward women. A man’s ability to attract or outright con a woman into bed with him via playing the/ having ‘game’ is not the problem, and the idea that having such a thing can stop you or any other man from harming women is actually indicative of the real problem, which is the entitlement mentioned above. It is the idea that, if you cannot have the thing (women being regulated to ‘things’) you want, you are allowed to destroy it instead.
While the loneliness apparent in the manifesto is both real and very compelling, again, sympathy toward the shooter because of that loneliness is no excuse to perpetuate the attitude he had toward the women in that gym, to say that it is a man’s sexual needs and not social and psychological attitudes toward women (or at least both) that lead to this kind of tragedy.
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Rum, just because it’s over your head, or really outside of your perception, doesn’t mean I’m intoxicated.
I’m just kind of like a…Morpheus talking in front of people who only took half of the red pill because they’re afraid to go all the way. What I said to Chris is obviously of no concern to you.
Just chew your grass and hope that one day a 10 passes by and pets you.
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Grass is not food. Grass is what food eats.
“Winston, you are drunk!” Said lady. Astor
(Winston Churchill) “Yes madam, I am drunk. In the morning I will be sober but you will still be fat.”
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Rum, just so you know, harping on the fat thing is proving my point.
When you don’t have a real argument, but your prey instincts are alerting you to the presence of a possible predator, you bleat like a startled herdbeast.
In case it hasn’t occured to you yet, I think being fat is less of a sin than being a punk.
…which is what you are, online catfighting with women at a safe distance.
You should really stop working so hard to prove to the other herdbeasts that you are willing to sacrifice your dignity to look cool in front of those you perceive to be your alphas.
It doesn’t make them respect you more.
…kind of like supplicating to women doesn’t make them wet.
If you can’t control yourself, then I’ll be forced to basically treat you just like I do gig…which is to basically skip the posts because you have nothing important to say…and damn sure nothing original.
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Nicole.
A guy would have to be stupid to think that any online forum is a reasonable route towards actual, real life sexual fulfillment. This place is after all just black and white text. No honest, truth-telling flesh and blood squirting orgasms are ever on offer. Because, it is a disembodied thing called the internet.
It has not occurred to your self centered inner-whore that the main point of this blog is to re-educate young guys? To help them be less vulnerable to the cruel lies of the matriarky and fine freedom and joy in ordinary work and ordinary enthusiastic women which will happen to be eveyrwhere.
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Rum, I know what this blog is for.
Maybe you need a reminder.
You say it’s for re-education out of one side of your neck, and then spew lab issue reward pellets out the other.
I wish you would decide whether you want to be viewed by women as a man or as a tool…and if you’re going to keep dick sizing with others to be the most dedicated butt sucker of the very system you claim to hate, I wish you would stop asking me or women like me to give a damn about your self inflicted suffering.
I’m only here for the outliers who like pancakes and blowjobs in the morning, and to know that when they come home in the evening, or even after a months long assignment, all their stuff will still be as they left it.
That used to be normal.
Normal or not, it’s definitely not you. So you can just ignore me, and you won’t miss any good advice on how to get a hoe.
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Manginas like Chris are the problem. “Misogyny and entitlement” like he’s some semi-hot chick using shaming language on some aspiring beta chump trying to pick her up. If Chris is a guy, I have suspicions he’s a chick posing as a man.
Regardless, here it is. Humanity has always had violent lunatic guys, they’ve almost always until the mid Twentieth century attacked famous men in the hope of taking some of that fame for themselves. They never attacked society (women, children) themselves. Even lunatics “belonged.”
Men are largely, uninvested. They don’t give a damn. They react passively to gunmen mowing down female students (Montreal, VT) and don’t bother to volunteer at all. Men DEMAND one thing to invest in society: a decent shot at a wife and family of one’s own. Absent that, they won’t give a damn. And all the feminine shaming won’t work worth spit. What? Women will CONTINUE to not sleep with them? Or be their wife?
Had Soldini lived in say, 1900-1948, he would have still gone nuts … but he would have tried to kill Truman not a bunch of women exercising. That’s how powerful male investment is. Even lunatics belong. Ladies, enjoy your future of male non-investment. Random lunatics shooting at you, and more tellingly, men like Chris (if he is a man) won’t lay down their lives for you. They’ll run away and write a 10,000 word bitter condemnation of the patriarchy and misogyny. While crying, very very much.
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Game would have helped Soldini, with a mentor who knew what he was doing, hook up with some nice, 40-something divorcee with no/grown kids, and invested this guy in society.
He still might have been nuts.
Heck the guy might not have decided to kill people. He was probably a nut most of his life, and coped with infrequent sex, then his cat (who seemed to provide the affection/animal contact he needed). ANY woman who expressed affection and sex for this guy would have probably kept him from killing people, even if he was nuts (which he was). Plenty of nuts can function in society. Most of Hollywood is nuttier than this guy. One of the Wachowski brothers (the Matrix movies) got a sex change operation and hooked up with a dominatrix. Face looks like a melted wax candle. Wears a dress and everything, and “it” functions enough.
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Right, Chris. Nobody ever killed a woman until the ’50s.
You actually stupid enough to believe that or did you just need a crutch? What a shit-weak argument.
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Er scuse me. “Right, Chris. Whiskey, nobody…” etc.
If any of you fuckers actually believed the shit you’re spewing you’d be out living life instead of sitting around wanking on the blog of another pretender. Me? Just another average Joe. Fine with it. Don’t need a fantasy life.
Have fun kids.
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LOL faux if you believed you where just another average joe then you wouldn’t have posted.
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””””””Ghost of Nicole
Gunny, you want some?””””””””””’
Maybe whatcha got?
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”””””’Bhetti
Thus Gunny demonstrates how men go ‘this pointless school crap can go to —-!’ and go make a million or die/get arrested/declare bankruptcy trying [mostly the latter if you’re not gunny].””””””””’
Yea bhetti life sure as shit ain’t about woman. It is about getting rich then after that I mean woman can make life enjoyable and be part of life and add value.
What else would be the point? But yea some also go through multiple bankrupsies and make it but like I had written on my helmet in bosnia.
1,000,000 or bust.
Already had the love of a woman at that time too. It is not enough to be everything and that actually causes woman some pain. When a man requires more from life than just their love.
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nova–
“One last thing I would say, just to think about: I think many of us might say that misogyny and entitlement mentality come from (1) not adequately understanding how to attract women and (2) not working on how to attract women more effectively.”
Personally, I think you have the cause and effect mixed up. But thanks for explaining things to me clearly. I really do see where you’re coming from now.
[editor: no, you’re wrong. nova has it right. see: http://roissy.wordpress.com/2007/07/30/woman-hating-betas/%5D
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Gunny, since you want to break thread crossover courtesy, answer the question:
Does the (mistaken, but we won’t quibble since you have a reading problem) belief that I am a psychobitch who possesses magical superpowers that make me able to successfully grapple with a 6’2″ Black guy who could bench press my body weight (120 lbs.) easily at that time, and that I would stab him out of the blue, for no reason, after having somehow wrestled him down, make you feel:
a. challenged to test your likely inferior (in the imaginary world where I could succeed in hand to hand combat with the big Black guy *without* cunning or weapons) fighting skills against my own?
b. that (in the afore mentioned wonderland of dreams) you should probably avoid me altogether?
See, even with your reading comprehension issues, you’re not being consistent. If I did have magical powers, I’d have used my force shield to repel him on sight.
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1,000,000 or bust
I had always thought that wherever the American army passes, economic activity thrives, but I didn´t have a sense of the extent that this was true.
I always supported American presence in Colombia and dreamed about an invasion of Venezuela, but for ideological reasons. I can see now how the economic justifications for American wars are even stronger.
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Fail.
That is all.
FUCK Misogyny.
[editor: did your microphallus spring to action like a pimple when you typed that?]
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Naa you wheren’t remembering for comprehension you did it with a crowd of people around but still “claimed” he was “trying” to pull you outside to rape you. Now think about that did you really believe he could drag you out and rape you with a 100 guys watching?
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Gig,
funny part was I was making 1400 a month at the time and was 20 but I always knew.
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Like the very post in this long comment chain alludes, this tragedy has woken me up to the importance of style when it comes to dealing with women. Style, or, in other words, game.
For months I’ve been coming to this site for the great writing and humor, and, of course, what I took as important truisms that I might actually, but selectively, apply.
Selectively because, there is after all, this kind of thinking that goes along the lines of despite what Roissy may claim, the real magnet and glue for a woman’s attention is self development. You might never have all the women you want in life, but if you do well in school, land a good paying job, buy a house or have a decent apartment, and, basically, just do the core things like these right, *enough* quality women will be genuinely attracted to you so that getting laid won’t be a big deal. At the very least, there are a lot of re-emerging down-trod woman (think community college campus gals in their late 20s or early 30s) who would gleefully fuck if it meant being able to show off a bona fide working man to their moms and dads. And that would be just for starters.
But this story has changed all that for me. This story has demonstrated how futile a life of self-development can be if that development does not include game development. It proves that doing the core things right like “behaving” or dressing obediently have no real affect on a woman’s draw towards man. It is possible to have a $250,000 year salary and a decent home (which as Roissy observes would not ‘chase women away’ even if weren’t laid out to attract, either), and still earn no interest from women. Thank god I didn’t waste my time making these components a reality for me, believing all the while focusing on style to be a waste of time or merely a humorous luxury. Thank fucking god.
For me, as I am sure it is for many of us here, this is a big WOW moment. An eye opener. A renewed appreciation for this blog, its truths, and, indeed, the very importance of its message and philosophy.
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Gunny says, “Naa you wheren’t remembering for comprehension you did it with a crowd of people around but still “claimed” he was “trying” to pull you outside to rape you. Now think about that did you really believe he could drag you out and rape you with a 100 guys watching?”
I didn’t say that I believed that he was going to rape me. I also didn’t say that there were 100 people in either attack. There were two.
In one, there were maybe 15 people in the lobby. In the other, there were only 2 other people in the dining hall. I was coming off a night shift in the early morning, and the real breakfast time hadn’t started yet.
What he was planning to do was not on my mind at the times. The first time, what was important to me was that he was grabbing and attempting to take me someplace against my will. The second time, the important thing was that he’d just hit me on the back of my head, attempting to knock me down.
What would you tell your daughter to do if a 6’2″ Black guy was attacking them?
Pray?
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That is what I am saying it was in a dining hall?
I think you should fight in that circumstance but how could you think somone would be able to drag you off with a bunch of people watching. You could have screamed and someone would have helped.
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Soldini is another example of someone who does too little living and too much thinking. This kind of life always results in a paranoid and delusional approach to life.
Hmm kind of reminds me of everyone on this blog who follows this extremist roissy. Who by the way has the most vile and charmless personality one could ever imagine. On par with someone like Hitler I’d say.
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Soldini is another example of someone who does too little living and too much thinking. This kind of life always results in a paranoid and delusional approach to life.
Hmm kind of reminds me of everyone on this blog who follows this extremist roissy. Who by the way has the most vile and charmless personality one could ever imagine. On par with someone like Hitler I’d say.
Lol, roissy is Hitler now. Hyperbole much?
But seriously, Game is not about thinking and not living. It’s mostly about application in the field and practice, which again is the antithesis of too much thinking and not enough living. But, in order to get anywhere, a solid framework is needed as well — sort of like the infrastructure for what you take into the field.
I think most here would agree that Soldini needed to get a life. Game would have offered him a way to do that.
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Gunny, life is not a motherfucking movie. It all happened in less than 15 seconds. I dropped my weight, rolled when the punch was coming at me, grabbed a knife, and made a way for myself to escape.
Who has time for screaming for help? How quickly would you know what was going on if you were watching the same thing happen? How would you know the difference between him grabbing me and me dropping my weight, and say, me having a seizure and him trying to help me up?
The guy standing closest to me didn’t even realize what was going on until he heard a fist hit the pool table. Afterwards, he said he didn’t think anyone would be stupid enough to do what that guy did with him standing there.
Hello, knock knock, my ex was a fucking nut. A nut isn’t thinking rationally…and maybe he had some of the bizarre non investment philosophy running through his mind, and didn’t think anyone would intervene.
…and maybe, admittedly, I thought the same thing, and didn’t want to wait to find out the hard way that I might be in a room full of sociopaths like you who’d love to see a woman get the crap beat out of her for saying no to a guy who treated her like she wasn’t important.
Why are we even having this conversation? I didn’t even press charges against the guy because I didn’t want to make things worse. Why are you up in my grill about it?
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Lol, roissy is Hitler now. Hyperbole much?
Ok you got me there. I’m referring to the extreme hostile and cruel undertones to many of his postings.
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God…scream for help…Is this what it has come to?
…that in order to save the poor pathetic egos of heterosexual faggots a woman has to let whatever happen to her, rather than defend herself?
Now I see why there wasn’t security at that gym. It would have been unfeminine for women to not let themselves get killed.
So instead of Soldini being the hero, the gym owner should be the hero for persisting in preserving women’s feminine vulnerability, even at the cost of getting massive lead poisoning.
You know, it’s just so worth it to rely only on men to protect you, even though some of them might kill you instead.
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I think we can stop having this conversation actually. I am good with that.
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New conversation need you to write around 4 paragraphs or so on good qaulities of some men.
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Or you can even use me as an example might make it easier.
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Meagin
There is indeed a lot of anger in Roissys comments. Do you really think that any guy can come to the same overall conclusions as he does about current gender relations and not be angry?
How about you rephrase the concepts that Roissy is trying to convey in a way that comes across as “nice”. Feel free to make use of euphemisms, just do not change the underlying ideas – such that readers would still understand his point of view. I really do not think it can be done.
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I’m talking about his posts where he takes delight in verbally abusing people. He has admitted as much, many many times. Quite frankly, he comes off as creepy.
And see that is the thing about charm and intelligence. If one cares enough to put in the effort there is always a way to make your point in fair terms. I’m not even going to go into that dreadful term nice and all it has come to mean.
Even though I am a woman, I try my hardest to try and see where the other sex is coming from. I see where roissy is coming from and it makes me nausea.
Which is too bad, because he is capable of providing insights that both sexes can appreciate and not turn away from because of his delivery.
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Females seem to have the lock on verbal ugly hate. Shit disgusting. If that is indicative of the state of feminists yea pretty bad shit. Guys need to seriously be going foreign. This is what they will look like when they divorce you except there will be no reasoning with them and they will also have a lawyer egging em on.
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Really to see the way feminists argue is nuts. They say shit that is completely not close to accurate. Just complete dishonest conjecture not from any base in reality. How do you even deal with that in a courtroom with these woman. When they are all emotion and just throwing accusation like it is truth when in fact not even close. How could a man defend himself in a court environment? I mean we see this method of arguing for feminists pretty consistantly.
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meagain:
“Who by the way has the most vile and charmless personality one could ever imagine. On par with someone like Hitler I’d say.”
Hitler was not charmless – on the contrary, he was quite charismatic, which is how he came to power to begin. Ladies especially loved Der Fuhrer:
http://www.amazon.com/Hitlers-Women-Guido-Knopp/dp/0415947308
Whiskey:
“Whoever linked to the fbardamu post at wordpress thanks. Great point about the social contract.
His points are outstanding. The “slacker guy” is something that is directly attributable to no women in a guy’s life that he can marry and expect to stay married to.”
Why thank you very much. For those who want to read my post, it’s right here:
http://fbardamu.wordpress.com/2009/08/06/george-sodini-and-the-contract-between-the-sexes/
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Gunny, I don’t see someone who would be okay with a guy beating up his wife or daughter for saying no, as an example of what’s good about a guy.
You know, back in the day in Japan, home of some of the most truly feminine women in the world, the samurai families used to give a naginata to a woman as a wedding present.
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I guess where a lot of the sexual harrasment claims come from some difference of oppinion with a man and the next thing he knows she is accusing him of sexual harrassment and if someone hears it they have to follow through on investigation. Except that when feminists on here argue pretty much always throw out false accusations. It is their way of argueing.
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Gunny, that ought to tell you something. Ugly verbal hate is a female/pussy defense strategy in an argument.
A man is supposed to be more in control than that. An insult should hit the mark instead of being flung hysterically.
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See that was a test nicole you failed thanks for playing.
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Do you really think that any guy can come to the same overall conclusions as he does about current gender relations and not be angry?
How about you rephrase the concepts that Roissy is trying to convey in a way that comes across as “nice”. Feel free to make use of euphemisms, just do not change the underlying ideas – such that readers would still understand his point of view. I really do not think it can be done.
You probably can, if you channel it as more cynicism than anger.
For example: men and women are primarily animals, and everything beyond that is a conceit. Sophisticated, social animals, but animals all the same. Each of men and women has an animalistic sex and procreative drive that is selfish in nature, and designed to maximize the propagation of their respective genes — in that sense men and women are primarily resources to be exploited by each other for the purpose of replicating their own DNA in generations down the line.
The current legal system has removed the natural consequences of sexuality for women by means of freely available, cheap and effective abortion and contraception, while at the same handing women the lion’s share of power over relationships and children due to the current state of family law. In addition, women’s ascendant economic independence has narrowed what women are actually looking to exploit from any given man from what was previously investment and resources to a much narrower, more animalistic set of sexual attraction and response — something which incents women to bypass the trade-off between stability and excitement, and err on the side of excitement — at least during the years when women are at their most fertile, and hence at their most desirable/high mate value period.
All of those factors (sexual technologies eliminating the consequences of sexuality for women, family law eliminating the strictures of monogamy, divorce law making divorces into windfalls for women, etc.) have dramatically impacted women’s behaviors, making them act in a more primitive, animalistic, and purely sexually-driven way. And men need to adapt to that if they are going to harbor any realistic chances of attracting a woman who is anything other than a woman no other man wants.
I don’t see the need for any anger there. Perhaps wistfulness at what has been lost — or maybe sadness at what has been lost. But you can’t “fault” women for being as animalistic as men are, really — they are, after all, just female human animals, with their own feral, primal sexuality. The main issue is that too many men labor under false premises about women, and as I say above, that leads to misogyny if not cracked. Once you actually understand what makes women tick sexually, it’s highly irrational to be angry with women about that –> they can’t help being like that any more than we can help being attracted to gorgeous women.
So if there’s something worthy of anger, it’s the ideology that set gender relations on its head (because of the mess its leading to on the broader social scale in terms of “fatherlessness” and so on — a result which was socially engineered, and is bad on virtually all levels at the scale we are seeing), rather than women themselves. Yes, too many women blindly support this ideology, but many do not, too. But in any case, it’s pointless to hate on women for being unattracted to betas and attracted to alphas or men with game — that’s like women hating on men for being attracted to what women consider “narrow standards of beauty”. In both cases, it makes no sense, because you are hating on what is perfectly natural, wired behavior in each case. Sure, in a world of enforced, hard monogamy and so on, neither men nor women would be able to follow these attractions to their logical extreme as is being done today, but that’s just the world we live in. It’s darker than the past, and more brutal, less forgiving, and so on — but it’s the only reality we have. It doesn’t have to be an angry reality, though.
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*walks into the salon*
*gives hugs to guns,chris,nicole,rum meagain and bhetti*
@s- I forgot to add j/k to the end of that shiksa joke yesterday. sorry, i will rerun the slap>alpha> jackhammer joke into the ground but that is one of chic’s quirks.
gunslingergergregi Females seem to have the lock on verbal ugly hate
a woman’s strength is in her tongue. A man’s strength is in his fist.
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Yea nicole that directed insult while you where framing it just happened.
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Gunny, shit testing is also a female/pussy strategy.
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””””””””Nicole,
Gunny, I don’t see someone who would be okay with a guy beating up his wife or daughter for saying no, as an example of what’s good about a guy.””””’
And then you give an example of a feminist who says a completely untrue statement as if it where fact.
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Yea chic until you see how they do it then it means nothing. How do you deal with it in say a work environment when a feminist would act like this?
I think it would be much more difficult to deal with as most people do not understand what a feminist deoes when pissed about something anything. Automatic lies about the person they direct their attack on. What would be the logical way a man should act in such a situation?
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I forgot novaseeker
*gives nova a warm hug too*
Whiskey One of the Wachowski brothers (the Matrix movies) got a sex change operation and hooked up with a dominatrix. Face looks like a melted wax candle.
LOLROF 😆
Where is my whiskey and what have you done with him sir??? You were never this funny before
Whiskey He was probably a nut most of his life, and coped with infrequent sex, then his cat (who seemed to provide the affection/animal contact he needed).
Cats are very loving animals. You just need to find one whose personality meshes with your own. In some ways, the’re like women.
Whiskey ANY woman who expressed affection and sex for this guy would have probably kept him from killing people, even if he was nuts (which he was)
There may be some truth to this but he could have also went nuts on her the moment she decided she no longer wanted to be with him anymore.
Sardoni was isolated from both men and women. From what I read, he had no close male friends combine that with no woman in his life as well as indifferent, cold, ball busting parents and his own social ineptitude, you had a recipe for disaster.
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Nova thank you very much. You just made my day.
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Gunny, says, “And then you give an example of a feminist who says a completely untrue statement as if it where fact.”
You’re projecting.
Why dig yourself any deeper?
You’re not really fooling anyone here, and just basically doing the butt sucker dance because you think others will cheer you on or back you up.
…but I assure you that no man here with a pair of testicles would think that getting through a fight and *not* myself making any more out of it than it was, was in any way wrong. They would hope that their female relatives or partner would have the smarts to get out of a situation in which they were obviously physically outmatched.
You are alone in giving me shit about defending myself against a guy who had already put his hands on me with obvious intent to do harm…and then not pressing charges. The second time, it was the witnesses who made a big deal of it and pressed for NJP (non judicial punishment). I could have, but refused to get civillian authorities involved because I didn’t think it was warranted.
I was just going to call my Daddy.
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Chic
I do not know about other guys, but my tongue is strong enough to lift a full grown woman right off the mattress.
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Roissy, your article ignores the fact that there are many, many alpha males–such as yourself and other commenters here, for instance–that are extremely misogynistic and entitled. (O.J. Simpson, anyone?)
“I had always thought that wherever the American army passes, economic activity thrives, but I didn´t have a sense of the extent that this was true.
I always supported American presence in Colombia and dreamed about an invasion of Venezuela, but for ideological reasons. I can see now how the economic justifications for American wars are even stronger.”
This is the kind of thinking that got the Iranian democracy replaced with a theocratic dictatorship in the 1950s, which directly led to 9/11.
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Novaseeker.
Well done.
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Now that I have a better understanding of where both sexes are coming from, I don’t understand men’s bitterness or anger.
How hard can being an exciting a-hole be? I’m naturally an a-hole a couple of days a month myself.
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@ chris,
As someone who was a child support recipient, I can tell you that this is a fucking lie.
— how do you square this with your claim that you’re a guy, who has been with the same gf since age 19 ?
you had some kid at 16 or so, and then had a woman pay c.s. to you?
umm hmm sure.
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Rum to
Chic
I do not know about other guys, but my tongue is strong enough to lift a full grown woman right off the mattress.
Was that a come on 🙂
nothing like a man with a strong tongue.
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By the way chic thnk for hug and I wish you and rum much happiness. he he he
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O.J. Simpson lived every man´s nightmare. He married a slut who divorced him, took his mansion, half of his income, and brought her bad boy lover to occupy his place
people could show even his confession, I would still vote to acquit him if I was in the Jury
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There is a faggot at the New York Times who, discussing the Sodini murder-suicide, naturally concludes that American society is ‘misogynistic’.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/08/opinion/08herbert.html?em
Not even the slightest chance that misandry is actually more, in America. This faggot must think he is some hero for being a Beta lapdog.
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O.J. Simpson lived every man´s nightmare. He married a slut who divorced him, took his mansion, half of his income, and brought her bad boy lover to occupy his place
Hulk Hogan is experiencing exactly the same thing. His wife of 24 years chose to leave. She still gets all his money (on a no-fault basis, of course), and as a new cougar, has a young boyfriend living in Hulk’s house and driving his cars.
He is being brutalized in ‘no fault’ divorce court, in a manner that no beating from Andre the Giant or the Ultimate Warrior can come close to.
A lifetime of hard work, taken away on a whim.
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Yea that dude off the chain. The whole point is if ya give woman same protected status as minorities yea of course gonna cause friction. Then when ya give woman extra powers with capes backed by gov. Then yea absolute power corrupts absolutely. Except you can never have absolute power over another human if that human kills you. Course still out of 300 million people dude could only toss out a couple examples of killings of woman. So yea idiot.
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@ chris
America supported a coup that unleashed a generation of prosperity in Iran. When iranians chose freely, they chose a turbaned whacko like Khomeini. Many countries n Earth need America tutelage to avoid electing mad men (see: Venezuela)
America has never supported a bad coup in Latin America. Until the moronic current president decided to stand against the coup in Honduras
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America has never supported a bad coup in Latin America. Until the moronic current president decided to stand against the coup in Honduras
Is Obama poorly regarded in Latin American now? Or is he still well-regarded?
Course still out of 300 million people dude could only toss out a couple examples of killings of woman. So yea idiot.
10, 20, or 30 million men suffer the ultra-dehumanizing wringer of divorce court, through no fault of their own.
A handful of women get gunned down by a nut.
So what is the ratio? 1 million to one? 2 million to one?
For each woman who gets killed in a misogyny crime, a million men go through the dehumanizing ruin of divorce court. But the media won’t talk about that.
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Novaseeker—
Why would you want to? Why are you trying to dance to the tune of Chic Noir and such “visiting” feminists linked in from feminist sites as Meagain, Beth, Bonnie, Sil, Chris et. al.?
Controlled, rationally based and purposeful anger is generally a much more productive emotion than cynicism. As well the point is to be angery at laws ranging from divorce law to affirmative action in all its forms for women, which negatively affects the female wage gap and the dynamics of hypergamy, and a number of others laws, as well as feminist propaganda and reeducation campaigns in the media and schools seeking to feminize and neuter most natural male dominance, and glorify female kick ass (dominance). As I outlined with some heat up thread here:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/05/game-can-save-lives/#comment-117092
and here:
http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/05/game-can-save-lives/#comment-117112
This I completely agree with. Anger at the ideology and resultant laws, education, and media propaganda. There’s nothing dimmer or less productive than to be angry at the basic evo psych nature of women or the ways in which they are wired and chemically juiced differently than men. Besides I love the differences myself, and anyway women fall on personality spectrums just as men do.
All that the average American 25yo woman is now however is not just about what’s wired but heavily also about what’s been feminist programmed, and legally structured, especially in major urban areas. Traveling to foreign countries outside the heavy feminist sphere or getting to know recent immigrants from such societies makes that readily apparent.
However I see no reason to be tepid about it and every reason to be vigorous. Were leading feminists always mild in their anger at the “patriarchy” or customs and laws which did recognize sex differences and encourage gender role differentiation when they were gathering support to change that? Meanwhile on an individual level unlearning feminism and learning game is the way to go.
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Chris:
“Roissy, your article ignores the fact that there are many, many alpha males–such as yourself and other commenters here, for instance–that are extremely misogynistic and entitled. (O.J. Simpson, anyone?)”
Misogyny (or at least what you perceive as misogyny) and success with women are generally correlated:
http://fbardamu.wordpress.com/2009/08/09/lord-byron-on-women/
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How hard can being an exciting a-hole be? I’m naturally an a-hole a couple of days a month myself.
It’s just that men need to learn to do it, and the entire culture (outside of sites like this) actively discourages men to do it. That’s where the bitterness and (hopefully temporary) anger comes from. Men can certainly learn Game. But they learn it in a samizdat way, in a very counter-cultural way.
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Meagain—
Yes women are encouraged by feminism to be a-holes to men all over the place. To stand up and be assertive and even dominant. To be critical and demanding and nagging.
Our mainstream feminism saturated media and schools do that all the time.
Way too much so. It’ becomes unattractive. But it’s become the field in gen Y esp.
Schools and the American media encourage the opposite in men as Nova just alluded to.
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Also. Men can’t just be assholes around or to girls.
It’s a dance.
They have to be attractive, playful, engaging assholes.
Different styles work and different styles will work with different men. But teasing dominance, leading rather than following her, and taking her on occasional (or depending on the girl frequent and deep) emotional roller coaster rides is something the good ones have in common.
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Yea doug I think it is readily apparent in the woman that some on here throwing insults. If you would slap them though they would be shocked.
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[…] Witness the recent mass murder of women at a gym in Pennsylvania by a man obsessed with his inability to get women to sleep with him. Also witness the media response, most of which has focused on how unhappy the poor man was (you know, when I’m unhappy I cry on a friend’s shoulder, or mope, or have a drink – I have yet to decide that murdering strangers would be an appropriate response to unhappiness). Witness the killer’s blog, which was full of misogynistic ranting about how evil women were for rejecting him, and fantasies about hurting them. Witness in particular the response from some men who seem to consider this guy some sort of hero. […]
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Thomas Jefferson once said that all that is needed for tyranny to take hold is for people of good conscience to remain silent.
That is what is happening here, where genuine misandry is being masked my unsubstantiated claims of misogyny.
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Meagain is just the latest feminst orc from Mordor who fails to understand the main article.
Game can SAVE lives. Save! SAVE!!!!!!
But they don’t get it. They never will. They are intellectually lazy, morally inverted, and don’t even know what they don’t know.
Their projection is so extreme that a parody of them could scarcely do better.
meagain claimed :
Even though I am a woman, I try my hardest to try and see where the other sex is coming from. I see where roissy is coming from and it makes me nausea.
No you don’t. Not even close. If you did, you would be the first to admit that divorce laws, as they currently stand, are grossly unfair to men, particularly hard working, good men who were outstanding citizens all their lives.
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The Fifth Horseman:
“10, 20, or 30 million men suffer the ultra-dehumanizing wringer of divorce court, through no fault of their own.
A handful of women get gunned down by a nut.
So what is the ratio? 1 million to one? 2 million to one?
For each woman who gets killed in a misogyny crime, a million men go through the dehumanizing ruin of divorce court. But the media won’t talk about that.”
I can’t believe I even had to say this the first time, let alone that I have to say it again:
30 million divorced people < 1 murdered person.
That you would try to make the two seem even remotely equivalent truly sickens me.
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1. Doug 1 Why would you want to? Why are you trying to dance to the tune of Chic Noir and such “visiting” feminists linked in from feminist sites as Meagain, Beth, Bonnie, Sil, Chris et. al.?
Oh boy doug1, please explain.
Doug Saving chic noir of course, she’s always about female solidarity and pedestaling, regardless. Yeah most of the female regulars can’t stand LR at least as much as most men here
I’m not about pedestaling of women but I’m for a bit of female solidarity. When I see a falling down drunk woman in the club, I want another female to step up and protect her. When I hear about some female giving bj in the club bathroom, I want my fellow females to join in and ostracize her for doing something so shameful.
Furthermore, I don’t agree with LR’s choice to bring a child into the world with no dad but it’s done. We must work to make sure she doesn’t have another OOWC.
I skip about half of her posts if she is being attacked because that stuff becomes repetitive. Plus I don’t think it’s fun to jump on a person when they’ve been beaten unconscious.
Doug1, you can be a funny guy sometimes. I like how you came out of nowhere to lay it down. It looks like you are warming up to lay into me very soon. well you know I won’t argue with you. I will just go somewhere and dead faint victorian style.
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Fifth, in my opinion, the society is generally misanthropic, with loud representatives of different groups clamoring for who’s the biggest victim and therefore more entitled status.
The responsible male contingent isn’t very loud though, for reasons that Obsidian spelled out very nicely. Nobody seems to care if men are being unfairly put upon, because historically men have always been the providers. To speak up against parasites, you have to be willing to be perceived as a “dead beat” or misogynist.
Men and non parasitic women today should take a lesson from early feminists. Feminist goals didn’t get met just by a few women marching. Some of them took hunger strikes, court battles, and women just being honest with their husbands and their kids about how they were feeling at the time. Not everything that they pushed forward was able to stick. Women’s groups were a good proportion of those behind the disaster known as prohibition, for one. They didn’t get there alone though, and had to get the support of male voters and politicians.
I bet that a lot would change today if guys would just start being honest and not back down in front of their own female family members. I noticed that most guys here dodged that subject when I brought it up.
Yes, if your mama is a hoe you need to tell her. Tell her that while you respect her freedom of choice in how to run her life, it hurts you. It hurts you that the woman who bore you is running around showing her old ass titties to men who don’t give a damn about her. Tell your sisters too. Sisters are horrid about their brothers speaking to them about these things. They think you’re about to out them to parents or something.
Let them know that you’ll keep their less than fatal secrets, but that you don’t like the way they’re conducting themselves. No you do not like how they’re dressed when you escort them and their hoe looking friends to a club. Yes, you like to look at young titty like any other red blooded American male, but other girl’s titties are not your sister’s (or cousin’s, aunt’s, whatever).
Be real at home. Before it even gets to arguing about your silly sister taking too much from her ex for child support, tell that girl to put some clothes on. Baby steps.
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Meagain,
Hitler was LEFT-wing, by the way. LEFT-wing. You may want to believe otherwise, but historical facts are facts.
Go read a real history book.
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“@ chris,
As someone who was a child support recipient, I can tell you that this is a fucking lie.
– how do you square this with your claim that you’re a guy, who has been with the same gf since age 19 ?
you had some kid at 16 or so, and then had a woman pay c.s. to you?
umm hmm sure.”
Funny how when MRAs talk about child support, they completely forget the fact that there is an actual child in the mix. I was the child.
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Chris wrote,
can’t believe I even had to say this the first time, let alone that I have to say it again:
30 million divorced people < 1 murdered person.
That you would try to make the two seem even remotely equivalent truly sickens me.
NO. A large percentage of divorced men commit suicide. The number of these suicides is far larger than the tiny number of men who shoot a few women.
You have no idea how unfair and dehumanizing the divorce laws are towards men. It is just as bad as death for some of them. If you were a man, you would know.
Sickening you is a good metric by which sane people measure their success.
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“O.J. Simpson lived every man´s nightmare. He married a slut who divorced him, took his mansion, half of his income, and brought her bad boy lover to occupy his place
people could show even his confession, I would still vote to acquit him if I was in the Jury”
You are fucking sick. You’re seriously saying that you wouldn’t convict O.J. Simpson of murder even if there was proof that he did commit murder, all because his wife was mean to him. Gee, how could anyone be under the impression that you people hate women and think killing them is OK?
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“Sickening you is a good metric by which sane people measure their success.”
Yet another indicator that you don’t get out much. Ask most people which is worse, 30 million men going through rough divorces or a few women getting killed, and people will find you crazy for even asking the question.
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You are living in a bubble, TFH. You spend so much time on sites like these instead of the real world, you can’t even tell the difference anymore.
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Nicole,
Many good points, as always.
The responsible male contingent isn’t very loud though, for reasons that Obsidian spelled out very nicely. Nobody seems to care if men are being unfairly put upon, because historically men have always been the providers.
Yes. Not the least of which because quite a few men are behind the times, and still think that defending the injustices towards women in the past is the pinnacle of masculine honor. This is not balanced by enough mothers and sisters of ruined men standing up against misandry.
My father is such a Beta provider who refuses to see how corrupt women have become, and I do not respect him as a man.
bet that a lot would change today if guys would just start being honest and not back down in front of their own female family members. I noticed that most guys here dodged that subject when I brought it up.
Very true. Oddly, my mother actually gets it to a greater degree than by ultra-Beta father does.
In general, it is hard to stand up to a group when it will be a six against one contest against you. But men have to ‘man up’ and fight.
Surely you know that YOU, even as a woman, would quickly be banned from any feminist blog for writing what you have written.
But the extremism of misandric feminists has gone too far. They could have sustained their advantage indefinitely if they had merely gone half this far and stayed there. But in their unchecked greed, they are creating a big backlash, that the Four Horsemen of Male Vengeance will deliver in a decade.
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Chris,
More projection, from a morally inverted girlie-man.
I know much more about the real world than you, kiddo. I am a self-made millionaire and long practitioner of Game.
Yet another indicator that you don’t get out much. Ask most people which is worse, 30 million men going through rough divorces or a few women getting killed, and people will find you crazy for even asking the question.
Don’t be so sure. You are guessing, based on no real-world experiences. I see that you dodged, with typical cowardice, the suicide issue.
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@ TFH
he is well regarded, though few people bother thinking about him. people worried more about a “hateful” president like Bush
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“Yes women are encouraged by feminism to be a-holes to men all over the place. To stand up and be assertive and even dominant. To be critical and demanding and nagging.”
So why do men find it so hard to stand up to this? I certainly don’t like to see this kind of behavior (assertiveness yes, aggressiveness no), but I do, often. If feminism is encouraging women to act this way, is it also encouraging men to take it? How can a political movement be so powerful, to subjugate the ‘ true nature’ of men to the point that a majority are submissive or at least, not dominant?
I know a favorite argument of the commenter here that any man that does is a ‘beta, a ‘faggot’, a ‘pussy’, an ‘herb’.
How many alphas are there, really?
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chic noir= woman behind the counter trying to keep the piece.
doug= dude who comes out of nowhere with the reggie bush jersey
two dudes in the white tank top= women who have flooded the site
big guy in white t- blog host
guy in red shirt- nova
I can’t call the rest.
help chic noir out guys.
For Hip Hop News & Entertainment at DimeWars.Com
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go doug1 go 🙂
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@ chris
every single comment addressed to you leaves you “sick”.
you are the living proof of how boys raised without the father become either deadbeats or pussies.
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“Don’t be so sure. You are guessing, based on no real-world experiences. I see that you dodged, with typical cowardice, the suicide issue.”
I didn’t respond to it because I don’t see how it’s relevant. Those men didn’t have to kill themselves. They had a choice. I feel some sympathy for them for having sucky circumstances, but not as much as for people who are murdered. At the same time, I point far more condemnation towards a murderer than a bitch who puts a guy through a rough divorce.
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“I see that you dodged, with typical cowardice, the suicide issue.”
I don’t consider suicide anyone’s responsibility but the person who chooses it.
Do you have any (logical) reason to think that suicide rates are correlated with rate of divorce or divorce laws?
By this chart:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
it surely doesn’t appear related.. most of the countries in the first 15 aren’t exactly bastions of feminism.
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@ bonnie
I get horrified that in the XXI century there still people with your ideas. it leaves me sick of being an American and even a human being knowing that there are people from my species with such reactionary ideas.
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As for women who “like” men who are assholes–personally I don’t buy into most evo-psych bullshit. I don’t think it’s nature, I think it’s what women are taught to want and expect. It’s a result of patriarchy and it’s something that feminists are trying to fight. In other words, feminists are helping get betas laid more often. 😉 Just my theory, though.
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“I don’t consider suicide anyone’s responsibility but the person who chooses it.
Do you have any (logical) reason to think that suicide rates are correlated with rate of divorce or divorce laws?
By this chart:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
it surely doesn’t appear related.. most of the countries in the first 15 aren’t exactly bastions of feminism.”
What’s this? Actual statistics? On this blog? Why, it’s Christmas and my birthday!
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Bonnie asked :
So why do men find it so hard to stand up to this? I certainly don’t like to see this kind of behavior (assertiveness yes, aggressiveness no), but I do, often. If feminism is encouraging women to act this way, is it also encouraging men to take it?
An excellent question, and I am glad you are probing the various facets of the issue. See Nicole’s comment at 7:33 PM today, and doug1’s comment yesterday (Aug 8) at 7:47 PM for detailed answers.
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Chris
If feminists actually did anything postive to help guys get laid Roissys blog would have died for lack of interest, “game” would be unheard of, and young men would fight to get into womens-study courses.
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“Disclaimer for all the new readers. Nicole is fat and ugly. Keep that in mind when reading her comments.”
And may I ask since when have looks become even remotely relevant to internet conversations when all of us participating are from far off places around the globe?
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@rum- I’m still waiting for clarification via tongue lift off the bed comment.
rum If feminists actually did anything postive to help guys get laid
feminists can’t do anything about this because it’s hormonal(nature) and social conditioning(nurture) why most men don’t get laid. women don’t think about sex much in comparrison to men.
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“Humanity has always had violent lunatic guys, they’ve almost always until the mid Twentieth century attacked famous men in the hope of taking some of that fame for themselves. They never attacked society (women, children) themselves. Even lunatics “belonged.”
Your ignorance is overwhelming. What about Jack the Ripper (1880s), Liu Pegli (160 BC), Joseph Vatcher (1870s), H.H. Holmes (1860s), Gilles de Rais (1400s), Lewis Hutchinson (1740s)? All killed exclusively women or children. These are only some examples of well-known serial killers, not all the guys who just killed a bunch of innocent kids or women they didn’t even know.
Crazy fucks have always been around, and many of them attacked ‘society’. There’s a big difference between someone who systematically murders women or children he doesn’t know, and someone who wants to assassinate a president. I’m sure you think it’s all because of feminism, but that’s because you’re a bit slow.
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“Just my theory, though”
You and the rest of the tenured professors who last read about any new scientific discoveries in 1961..
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Rum, let me edit your statement a little:
“If men realized that feminists actually did anything postive to help guys get laid Roissys blog would have died for lack of interest, “game” would be unheard of, and young men would fight to get into womens-study courses.”
😉
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Let me clarify a little:
Feminists don’t have “getting guys laid” as a goal–nor should they–but what they are doing is trying to create a world in which categories such as alpha, beta, etc. don’t exist, or at least are more fluid and largely ignored. This sounds like a good world for a nice beta to live in, because it means women won’t expect men to be dominant, aggressive, and all of the other qualities most betas don’t express that well.
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Of course, my theory only makes sense if you believe these things are socially modifiable. If you believe that they are fully biological, then I can see why you wouldn’t buy it.
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“You and the rest of the tenured professors who last read about any new scientific discoveries in 1961..”
Heh. Your boyfriend is a lucky man, Bonnie.
If it interests you and you have the financial ability, you should reconsider going to college. You certainly have the brain for it.
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I don’t know if this is old news, but Roissy did you see you were linked by Salon?
http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/feature/2009/08/06/hatred/index.html
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Regarding the hysteria about women pushing men out of the labor market in high-prestige, high-paying positions like lawyers and doctors, I’m reposting this, which has some hard facts (circa 2006), for a refreshing change:
“Meanwhile, professions that need qualifications e.g. medicine and law are overrun by women.”
No, colleges providing those qualifications are overrun by women. Although most colleges are trying their best to keep an even gender ratio, which means a sort of affirmative action for male high school graduates.
As of 2004, 84.9% of men had graduated from high school, compared to 85.4% of women. And 28.9% had bachelor degrees, compared to 26.5% of women.
Need I explain to you that there is no guarantee that someone who goes to school to obtain a certain degree will practice in that career for any length of time, or at all?
The vast majority who are currently succeeding in the two professions you mentioned are men. Women are still hovering at under 30% of practicing lawyers, and around 20% of doctors in America. And they are far more likely to choose specialties within those careers that make a lot less money.”
Please, explain to me how this data proves it’s hard for men to succeed?
Being an ADD kid myself, I think it’s clear that the school structure is biased against children like me (and a disproportionate amount of boys), who learn best by doing and with constant activity, and will disengage from the process if forced to sit in a desk and rote-learn with gold stars for rewards. Wrong, should be changed.
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Chris:
Patriarchy?
I lived in a patriarchal society, Chris.
The first criteria for marrying a man “He must be a good man”. That is the exact description of a beta.
The second criteria, less noble “He must be well off”. That can describe many men. Usually hardworking betas. Some golddigging can occur.
More betas get married off in a patriarchy.
Certainly thugs, criminals, open hedonists weren’t acceptable.
So, what, Chris, feminism’s made the patriarchy worse, has it? If it is an ‘archy’ and not genetics that generates these desires, it’s the matriarchy.
Even the most liberated woman can want dominance, Chris.
I call b/s on blaming the patriarchy for what people are sexually attracted to.
Calling it ‘generated by the patriarchy’ is generating unnecessary guilt and creating a political agenda in those who ascribe to this for feeling their own natural desires. Calling it a product of previous abuse is twisting and pathologising their sexual desire, forever labelling it to negative previous events and that only.
And to be frank?
That makes me sick.
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Chris, you are one stupid fuck, aren’t you?
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Chris, I’ve noticed that you consider “collateral damages” for policies implemented to contol the American mainstream herd are less heinous to you than crimes committed by maddened members of the herd. The only difference between one set of people dying and the other is the hand that killed them. Both died as a result of a severe social problem.
In some cases, mass murderers and serial killers’ motivations are completely detached from society. In the case of someone who “goes postal” they are not. They’re killing people because what is aggressively promoted as the standard, is something they feel they cannot and never will achieve.
Divorced and separated men in the west are twice as likely to commit suicide as single or married men. In Australia, they’ve found that separated men are *six times* more likely to commit suicide than married men. It is not the same for women.
Men feel less needed after a divorce. They feel reduced to their dollar value. If such a thing would make a woman feel like meat, why do you figure it wouldn’t make a man feel that way? They’re humans and their human dignity has been stripped from them because they haven’t been taught that they were more use than that…just like women who are forced into arranged marriages.
Quite a few women are pressured and forced by their families into marriages with terrible men who mistreat them, or with close relatives. Some of them commit suicide.
There is a problem when a society or culture reduces *any* gender to legally subhuman status, and takes away their rights to their own children when they haven’t done anything wrong to deserve such a thing. That’s what they’ve done to men…pay up, even if it’s far more than what the kids need, and even if it’s far more than the ex wife and the kids would need in order for her to be a stay at home mom, or the government won’t let you see your kids.
In many cases, guys are paying this even after the woman has married someone else. If she remarries, she has another income in the house and no longer needs to be paid as if she didn’t. That’s why alimony and child support were separate in the past. To get around that, it became okay for judges to award the excess payment as child support.
The cost in lives of this has been far more than the cost in lives of men wigging out and shooting into crowds of women.
…but women commit suicide too because of the same system that reduces them to their sexual market value, which is more connected than many people like to admit, to their social value. Many girls in their teens are convinced that what their peers think about them is more important than the men who, in another time and place, would have married them.
If they’re not “popular” even if they’re prettier, stronger, or otherwise more fit even in superficial ways than the “popular” girls, they go through a social hell that is twisted and unnecessary.
In the former communist countries, women aren’t feminists, but they’re educated if it’s at all possible, because they didn’t need to sacrifice their womanhood to feel this was important. They study, plenty of them with a baby in one hand, and a book in the other. After communism, many who can’t afford university still study informally because that’s just what eastern European folks like to do: learn stuff.
Feminism, when it goes too far, is both misandrist and misogynist. They hate men for being men, and they hate women for their womanhood. Like members of any other lopsided -ism, they just hate on everybody who isn’t like them, and lead the herd down a desolate path that is going to leave them starved and without mates.
People who take up a social engineering cause should consider whether what they’re proposing is really going to improve things or make things worse. Someone would be called irresponsible for introducing feral cats into an ecosystem that evolved without them. It is irresponsible to keep laws on the books that minimize both men’s and women’s natural roles as mothers and fathers. It ends up screwing up the kids.
The cost in lives lost at the hands of, as well as the suicides of people without active parents should be tallied into the “collateral damages” too.
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Chris,
I like you, because I prefer kind people and I understand where you’re coming from. But seriously, reconsider the blank slate thing (Steven Pinker’s The Blank Slate is a good place to start – misogyny-free, I promise). It doesn’t mean you have to be like the people around here.
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bhetti I call b/s on blaming the patriarchy for what people are sexually attracted to.
me too. it’s utter crap that they want to blame random men for liking trashy men.
S&TC didn’t promote going after trashy thug men so people can’t blaime it on SJP.
Certainly thugs, criminals, open hedonists weren’t acceptable.
with good reason.
@rum- stop running from me.
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“I get horrified that in the XXI century there still people with your ideas. it leaves me sick of being an American and even a human being knowing that there are people from my species with such reactionary ideas.”
Feel better soon.
There’s a lot of nausea in this thread. Has anyone thrown up yet?
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“Of course, my theory only makes sense if you believe these things are socially modifiable. If you believe that they are fully biological, then I can see why you wouldn’t buy it.”
Socially modifiable, yes – to a point. Socially created, hell no.
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Chris:
I meant to link this: http://www.blogher.com/policing-our-desires-are-rape-fantasies-acceptable
Bonnie: Have to sleep but will discuss points soon.
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Chic
What are you wearing?
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The whole rape fantasy thing has always baffled me because I have never had even a hint of force or that kind of fantasy. I know some do, but it doesn’t come naturally to me. My fantasies don’t deviate much from my real sex life. While I’ll try anything as long as it feels good – forcing, humiliation, pain, choking, stuff like that – even the thought makes me shudder. It’s why I don’t enjoy most porn.
Thoughts about porn – do you think the increasing humiliation aspect of it is fueled by more frustrated, angry men who might not be able to get women themselves, want to see the women that may have rejected them as dirty animals – or is it just something that’s ‘natural’ in your opinion and is now being fully expressed? There’s always been stuff like that out there, I know, but it seems like more and more mainstream stuff is just really focused on degradation and discomfort. Watching mainstream stuff just from the early 90s is like watching a romantic comedy…
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Rum
Chic
What are you wearing?
knee length blk dress, 3 inch blk stilettos, and flower bomb.
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LOL. I did not make it clear in my above post that I have not tried forcing, humiliation, pain, choking, etc. and the very idea scares me.
Freudian slip much?
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Chic
Do you have a dog?
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I like you, because I prefer kind people
and
While I’ll try anything as long as it feels good – forcing, humiliation, pain, choking, stuff like that
notice that it took her less than 10 minutes to write both statements.. women. how can´t you love them?
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no I have a cat.
do you have any pets rum?
how tall are you?
how old are you?
Will you please clarify your earlier statement?
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I swear it was just a slip of the tongue!
I haven’t tried any of that. So far, even a moment of pain caused by accident has shut down my libido.
But maybe my subconscious is trying to tell me something.
Anyway, there’s no reason a kind person can’t be into S&M. That’s what safe words are for.
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seriously, feminists are right. gender is a social construct. I can´t use the word “man” to describe the SWPL crowd.
those people don´t have balls, they have hiper-developed clitoris below the penis.
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I swear it was just a slip of the tongue
you are sexually harassing me through your tsunami of Freudian slips
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Do Burmese Pythons count as pets?
Dogs need to respect their owners and there are certain things that, if they see you doing, they will respect you forever.
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I meant a slip of the fingers! My keyboard is moist!
oh, damn.
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“Dogs need to respect their owners and there are certain things that, if they see you doing, they will respect you forever.”
Make them work for their food, and don’t let them jump on you, or treat them like they’re 5-month-old human infants. Easy.
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Bonnie,
I see a lot of hypocrisy and contradiction between your stated idelogical position and your actual lifestyle choices:
-You are a feminist and a liberal. Yet you were 19 when you met your boyfriend who was 36 years old at the time, right ? How did you meet him, was he your professor or in a position of power above you? Feminists are usually vehemently opposed to older men “taking advantage” of young women. They believe older men should have “realistic” standards and go for older and less ideal women who are “devalued” by “the patriarchy”.
-You yourself condemned Sodini for wanting a young woman and for not being realistic. Yet your boyfriend (who is supposedly a liberal and a feminist also) did not have such “realistic” standards. He went for the ideal young woman “sex object”, just like any so-caled “patriarchal misogynist pig” would.
-You went for a male who was significantly older than you, who makes much more money than you do, etc – alpha male. You objectified him for his status. You rejected younger beta males. Yet you claim your boyfriend doesn’t have social power ? It’s impossible for an older man who doesn’t have alpha status to get a young, pretty woman. He must have social power – charisma, popularity, job position, something – for him to have had the market value to pull a young woman.
-You say that you like that your boyfriend is masculine, manly, taller than you, etc. You like that he works and has much more money that you do. you claim to not take your boyfriend’s money – but this is irrelevant – because you chose a man with more money for the status it carries, and for the possibility that if you got married you would have access to that money/status. Iow, you wanted someone of superior (and not equal) socio-economic status than yourself. Does this not all run contrary to core feminist ideology, with their rejection of patriarchally “constructed” gender roles, unequal relationships, etc ?
-If your bf could get a pretty young woman, why shouldn’t Sodini be able to get one ? Why shouldn’t all men ? Do you not see the jealousy this would create among men within the mating market, and how it would result in a hierarchy of sexually “wealthy” (like your boyfriend) and sexually “poor” (like Sodini) men? Why is Sodini and other men so inferior to your boyfriend that they are unworthy of the attention of a young pretty woman ? Can you not see how this would create an inequality issue among men ?
-You complain about men hitting on you and harassing you. Shouldn’t other men have equal opportunity to be able to compete for your sexual affection ? After all, your boyfriend had that opportunity. Why should he get to monopolize a scarce and valuable resource (a young woman) without being subject to competition ?
-You and your boyfriend are at the top of the sociosexual hierarchy, while Sodini and beta/omega males like him are at the bottom. It would seem impossible for you to truly be able to fully comprehend or empathize with his situation.
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pushing 2k responses, largest so far or was the black men and white women one longer?
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I’ll cosign Nicole’s 8:50 PM comment. Well said, yet again. I
Feminists, as well as androgyns like Chris, have lost all perspective about how much oppression they are creating and supporting against the bottom 80% of men.
If 20% of men are disenfranchised, they have a problem.
If 80% of men are disenfranchised, everyone has a problem, especially the misandrists who disenfranchised them.
It is a testament to the strenght and self-control of men that Sodini-type shootouts happen as rarely as they do.
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Oh I just saw mention of pets so MUST tell my pet story! I have two Bichon Shih tzu dogs, one male and one female. The male is still a pup (so I thought). I took them to the kennel when I was on my recent holiday and when I picked them up 13 days later the kennel operator informed me she thought my girl doggie was preggers. I booked an appointment with the vet for last Thurs at 3PM for a check up and ultrasound. I never made the appointment. My dog gave birth to eight puppies Thursday morning! I broke membranes (after two minute mark), I cut cords, tied with dental floss and everything. The eigth pup was injured by mom who cut the cord to close, an emergency trip to the vet and he was saved. I’m feeding him every three hours even in the night, day four and he is still living – woot! I’ll cut it out with the pet stories from this point on – but really am on quite a high after it all. I know have 10 dogs! Anyone want a puppy? hee hee
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More betas get married off in a patriarchy.
I fail to see how that’s any better. It’s just a direct transfer of 95% of a man’s wages to a woman and a family in exchange for nothing. Bhetti, the only reason you’re pro-patriarchy is because you’re probably going to mooch off some Muslim guy with money.
Even the most liberated woman can want dominance, Chris.
I learned that from some of the women in my life, and I hate that with a passion.
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Bonnie has finished shit-testing the board.
Gig at least has passed.
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DA, as someone mentioned earlier, only the wives of the rich could afford any “mooching”. Everybody else had to work. Some women worked by tending to the family or communal farm. Some women ran home businesses. Some worked outside the home. Either way, a woman had to pull her weight. Middle class women being able to afford to stay at home and not do anything to bring in income is new, but even then a woman was supposed to at least contribute by managing the resources properly and supporting the breadwinner and the education of the kids.
I chose the working at home and small business option. It was something I decided to do when I was a kid in daycare. I wasn’t going to let my kids experience what I had.
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gig:
@ chris
every single comment addressed to you leaves you “sick”.
you are the living proof of how boys raised without the father become either deadbeats or pussies.
QFT
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The problem, Nicole, is that even if a wife works, it’s still a transfer of income payments from me to her and the kids. Given that the talk around the men here is that such a thing is good for betas, I cannot see how a man working himself to death to support others is good for him when being single and free is a much better option for the utility of one’s earnings.
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Joe:
“I don’t know if this is old news, but Roissy did you see you were linked by Salon?
http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/feature/2009/08/06/hatred/index.html”
Hilarious snippet from a woman in that article:
“And guys over 35: grow up. Date women your own age.”
Why? Because you said so?
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DA:
Given that the talk around the men here is that such a thing is good for betas, I cannot see how a man working himself to death to support others is good for him
The only reason to get married is for children.
Otherwise, you are right.
But if you want to have children, all that monetary investment for YOUR GENETIC PROGENY is ultimately in your selfish interest.
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Agree with Novaseeker re anger and Game, and Ghost of Nicole re feminism.
MTG721 makes an excellent point, unrebutted by Bonnie. Most feminists talk a good game, but their personal lives are filled with A-hole, dominant Alphas who are older and more powerful than they are. A seventeen year difference is basically Harrison Ford and Ally McBeal. That’s the reality of feminists, no different than McBeal or Catherine Zeta-Jones.
Gig: second Tupac Chopra. QFT on men without fathers.
Ferdinand — Did you see the recent spate of “slacker dude wises up when girl comes around” comedies? Knocked Up, Failure to Launch, and so on? Probably this is true even among Hollywood writers, it has to be blindingly obvious for them to see it.
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What does ‘QFT’ stand for?
‘Quit Feeding Troll’?
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I wonder if these gals, with there biological clocks ticking were only dating guys their own age when they were 25?
Gotta love situational shaming.
Has this thread reached 2000 yet?
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QFT is the new, manlier version of “cosign.”
It will remain fashionable until it gets too popular, no homo.
(NOW it’s homo)
so now I just say “flippety floppety floo”
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Ferdinand Bardamu
http://www.salon.com/mwt/broadsheet/feature/2009/08/06/hatred/index.html”
Hilarious snippet from a woman in that article:
“And guys over 35: grow up. Date women your own age.”
Why? Because you said so?
As a good liberal, White woman would she every say – “Black guys: grow up. Date women your own race.”
Or “Gay guys: grow up. Stop dating your own gender.”
Why do liberal SWPL White folks promote interracial or homosexual relationships yet demonize interGENERATIONAL relationships?
Except when it’s old women and young guys.
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Hilarious snippet from a woman in that article:
“And guys over 35: grow up. Date women your own age.”
This is one area where nothing the bitterati do will have any effect.
Hollywood usually pushes every aspect of the feminist agenda, except this one.
Virtually every film has the male lead at least a decade older than the female lead. Sean Connery, Harrison Ford, Sylvester Stallone, etc. all have romantic counterparts much younger in all of their films over the last decade.
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”””””””’30 million divorced people < 1 murdered person.
That you would try to make the two seem even remotely equivalent truly sickens me.
'''''''''''''''''''''''
Only for a person who thinks you can't put a price on a life. Insurance companies and courts do it all the time. So no 30 million divorced pain and suffering not less than 1 murdered person.
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It is pathetic how all these ‘feminsts’ are trying to use Sodini to slander the whole concept of Game.
Roissy’s article says how Game could have SAVED the lives of the victims (and the shooter). Save. SAVE!!!!!
Yet, the misandrists are choosing to say that Game and ‘PUAs’ are about exactly the opposite. It shows how detached from reason and self-examination these losers are.
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Good point Willard.
I think the explanation would be: ” Behind every double standard is an unconfessed single standard”.
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from an evolutionary standpoint, genetic/reproductive sidelining is probably the second most legitimate reason of violence by a male. The first being self defence of his own life or that of people with signifcant relation(mainly offspring or siblings).
in effect lack of sex/reproduction for a man is a fate pretty much as bad being murdered, although the lagging duration of such torture is likely to drive one insane…..
The mistaken belief of our times it seems is that you can regulate male violence and retain their productivity without regulating female sexuality.
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MTG721 makes an excellent point, unrebutted by Bonnie. Most feminists talk a good game, but their personal lives are filled with A-hole, dominant Alphas who are older and more powerful than they are. A seventeen year difference is basically Harrison Ford and Ally McBeal. That’s the reality of feminists, no different than McBeal or Catherine Zeta-Jones.
This is very true.
Someone like Bonnie is bucking feminism big-time, because a core tenet of feminism is that unequal relationships (and if you ask any coven of feminists what they think about a 36 year old man pulling a 19 year old woman, you’ll get a consensus that this is an abuse of male power) in favor of men are patriarchy, oppressive to women, unhealthy, prone to abuse and so on. Yet this is what our feminist here sought out, and what she likes. Sure, Bonnie, you think your relationship is equal, but I can guarantee you that women who are your BFs age are revulsed by it, and do not see it as equal at all. It is hypergamy in action, in fact.
Feminism has done zilch to uproot hypergamy (beyond mouthing against it) because it is, as an ideology, powerless to change female patterns of attraction.
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@A-Bax
Thanks For those links A-Bax.
“Both sides seem to forget that “all men are born (politically) equal” is an axiom that can simply be asserted legally without outside justification.”
Indeed.
Evolution, or really the battle over evolution education, is perhaps the best argument as to why the government should not be involved in education.
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Tood aka The Fifth Horseman, Whiskey and Nova all make excellent points, and I note w/a good mixture of keen interest and deep regret, that none of their points has ever been addressed by our visiting guests, on a thread well over 1,000 comments strong.
And that’s very, very sad.
If ever there was a damning indictment of Feminism in action in our time, this thread is it. I have always said that there is a reason why leading feminist websites operate in the way they do, which includes among other things, heavy moderation, out and out censorship and banning, and finally a marked inability to debate the issues. In fact, one is hardpressed to think of any leading feminist in the past quarter century who has debated a leading Male thinker, let alone beat said thinker in a structured debate.
I think this thread shows us the reasons why.
Roissy’s lead-off post really sums the situation up-had Sodini learned and applied Game, lives could have been saved. It’s really that simple, and one would think that if anyone would get behind the basic notion of Men actually being Men, it would be Women. If this thread is any indication, though, that doesn’t seem to be the case.
I hope Roissy sees fit to let this thread continue, however, because it provides a powerful testimony of the state of Feminism in our time. I can think of no greater “exhibit A”.
The Obsidian
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Whiskey, Obsidian et al. have done some real yeoman’s work on this thread all right.
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Bonnie
Those figures reflect 70 year olds as well as recent college and professional school graduates. They are the overhang of the past which heavy feminist ideology and strong favoring of all that will differentially help girls to succeed is hurtling to hugely change. You and who you’re drawing this info from are doing one of two things 1) relying on the overhang of past graduating law and medical school professionals to make an invalid and misleading current point; or 2) illustrating why elite medical and law school resources are relatively speaking wasted on women, many of whom drop out of the profession full time or at any rate don’t work as hard and effectively to succeed at high levels in them as men – for the simple natural and laudable human reason that their relative priorities are different.
Either way or most likely in combination this should result in at the very least rebalancing these professional school classes to take these factors into consideration. As well in reversing the favoritism towards girls in schools and high schools leading up to this point.
It’s simply bad for society for there to not be a substantial overall, crudely measured, wage and career status gap. (That is ignoring experience and who works the most hours.) The reason: the relative lifetime motivations of the sexes and the role of hypergamy in family formation and stability most of all. Secondarily, the variance among men is greater and the average IQ esp. on math is slightly higher, which means at the elite high performing right side men do have much more brain power several standard deviations out, even if they did have a harder time concentrating and being good diligent little students in their teens and early twenties for biological sex differences reasons.
Men are the inventive and creative engines, overwhelmingly. That still hasn’t changed even though much else has under the HEAVY tilt in favor of women’s progress at all elitish or large organization levels these last four or five decades.
All affirmative action for women in every form include all and so called “glass ceiling” goals should end immediately. If anything men should be favored in schools and the workplace, and everything possible should be done so that the environment is favorable to more of them relatively succeeding, as is the natural order of things, as all human history illustrates, when there isn’t heavy ideological and government intervention pushing hard to the contrary).
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MTG721 (on 08.09.09 at 9:52PM) just gave a monumental takedown to bonnie and any other feminist who adheres to that philosophy. wow.
i completely cosign that post. pwned.
i echo obisidian’s statement that feminists aren’t really interested in debating any of the salient points raised here by MTG721, obsidian, tood and the others. just a bunch of (failed) attempts at shaming and other ad homs.
pathetic.
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Weighing in late (just to help push this to over 2000).
I’m not sure Game would have helped this guy unless a big part of Game is learning to hunt in your own range. There’s evidence he was probably trying with women that were too young and too hot for him. He wasn’t a gargoyle or anything but he didn’t have anything that (much younger) women want that a lot of other guys with better looks and more engaging personalities have too. Absent a lot more money and/or a personality transplant game wasn’t going to be getting 20 year olds into his bed.
On the other hand had he tried with women closer to his own age and looks bracket he probably could have been having sex on a regular basis. As the man said, if you can’t find any partners in your first draft bracket then Lower Your Standards! You probably don’t want to lower them as much as Arpagus does (60 year old two’s? I mean WTF?) but the basic principle is sound.
And as much as I agree with Whiskey that womens’ partner preferences in their raw, unfiltered state (untempered by civilized norms) are fucked up, the fact remains: Women as a class don’t owe sex to any man at the individual level. It’s up to the man to convince individual women to have sex with him.
And I do think we’ll be seeing more of these guys, if not so spectacular then just as destructive in their own way.
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people supporting the murderer and people like OJ (who was only acquitted bc he plays sports which is ridic because sports add no value whatsoever to the world)
No. OJ was acquitted because black women resent white women who take high-achieving black men out of their marriageable pool.
Now I know most men are angry, irrational, and entitled
Most men are rational and hardworking, even if they are angry and reason themselves to conclusions that are sociopathic in their implementation.
Most women, by contrast, are irrational and entitled, and now that they can vote, they have enlisted the State (the most violent thug of them all) in enabling their neuroses.
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“If your bf could get a pretty young woman, why shouldn’t Sodini be able to get one ? Why shouldn’t all men ? Do you not see the jealousy this would create among men within the mating market, and how it would result in a hierarchy of sexually “wealthy” (like your boyfriend) and sexually “poor” (like Sodini) men? Why is Sodini and other men so inferior to your boyfriend that they are unworthy of the attention of a young pretty woman ? Can you not see how this would create an inequality issue among men ?”
All men and women have a right to try, but we cannot force anyone to like/love us. It is up to them to choose or reject. It is up to us to move on if we get rejected and try again.
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Many of your earlier ironic points in that comment lambasting feminist prescriptives for how men and women should act in the dating market are very well taken but this is idiotic.
Let me break it to you. Men aren’t born equal genetically, along a host of dimensions, including ones that affect their attractiveness to women, such as drive, extroversion, charisma or charm, and so on. The aren’t raised equally in their micro family cultures for that or other results.
People aren’t born equal and they’re even less equal by the time they’re 25. They can and usually are strong in some areas and weak in others.
Why do some people born into the middle middle class become rich and even super rich, while others remain middle class and some become poor? Even if we restrict to the same, say white, ethnicity?
I’m not saying that learning game can’t greatly improve the success you could have with women from when you were 25. I’m just saying don’t give me “equal”. We aren’t, never were, and never will be. We’re diverse in myriad ways. Biologically. The “god” of evolution planned things that way. Cause it works well. For the species or rather most of the genes that lie behind the species.
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It’s called human bio diversity.
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See GNXP. Start with the archives beginning in 2002. Read godlesscapitalist and razib only to save time.
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Learning game ain’t never gonna change your genes. Which do matter in picking up women just as the matter in doing well in school and college or getting rich.
Game can change your personal “culture”. It can reprogram you re: dealing with women.
Given what feminism does to make nice and pussify and excessively civilize upper 2/3 white and Asian gen guys in this country in particular, game is a key corrective.
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Learning game ain’t never gonna change your genes. Which do matter in picking up women just as the matter in doing well in school and college or getting rich.
Game can change your personal “culture”. It can reprogram you re: dealing with women.
Given what feminism does to make nice and pussify and excessively civilize upper 2/3 white and Asian gen guys in this country in particular, game is a key corrective.
That is how I view it as well. Your genes will set a “hard cap” on how well you can do with Game, or with women. But regardless of that “hard cap”, you can do better with women if you are running tight Game than if you are not. It’s a relative thing.
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”””””””reactionary,
Most men are rational and hardworking, even if they are angry and reason themselves to conclusions that are sociopathic in their implementation.
Most women, by contrast, are irrational and entitled, and now that they can vote, they have enlisted the State (the most violent thug of them all) in enabling their neuroses.”””””””””””””””””””
This is almost beyond true.
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I want to see this thread hit 2K,so I’m posting.
Can Game,however effective it may or maynot be,be boiled down to an essential statement or fact? If so,might this be it:Women are wanton,treat them as such and they will betray themselves.
Lets push this over two thousand.
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Could do 33
Just love one another. Take care of each other. You see someone reach a pain threshold back off. Getting the last word not quite so important sometimes.
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I don’t agree about the ‘hard cap’. Top PUAs like Mystery had little going for them in terms of looks, wealth, or top-tier education, before learning and perfecting their Game.
Not everyone can, or needs to be, an advanced practitioner of Game, immersed in the life, however.
Moderate competence in Game is easily worth about the same SMV as having a net worth of $2 million. This is a rough estimate. Furthermore, no one can tax your Game, swindle you out of Game, or steal your Game in divorce court (as long as you don’t let this sap your confidence as a human being).
I define moderate competence in Game as the following 5 steps :
***1) Regular, consistent, and somewhat effortless ability to do approaches to women who are 8s or higher. This is the most important point of all, as without approaches, you will not create the opportunities to practice ANY other part of Game. This is also the filter that blocks most novices from ever progressing.
2) Ability to qualify the woman, as well as identify and pass her own tests easily. Be the first to end the phonecall, always be leaving, other time constraints, etc. The ability to use the occasional well-placed neg is valuable too.
3) Ability to run comfort and rapport for the requisite 6-8 hours. Have a lot of interesting stories, games, and other things to run on her.
***4) Ability to bridge from Day 1 to Day 2, and minimize flakes. This is important as flakes are frustrating, demoralizing, and discouraging. A lot of guys are very close to the brass ring, but this derails them in their quest for Game.
5) Ability to run competent seduction Game, after you get her alone. This is where Ross Jeffries NLP can be extremely useful (but not mandatory by any means).
1) and 4) cause the biggest frustration, paralysis, and ‘giving up’, hence the asterisks. But a man who becomes pretty good at these 5 points is ahead of 98% of all men, and is on par with a Beta who has $2 million in net worth (and is ahead of such a Beta if that Beta has no game and is suckered easily by feminine manipulation).
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I am hesitant to make the blanket statement that some are making , that women getting to vote = disaster.
Remember that they got the right to vote in 1920. Only 70 years after that did they start biting the hand that fed them.
Married women with kids still vote over 50% Republican.
It is unmarried women who are the problem, voting 70-29 for Obama. Plus, the number of unmarried women is growing relative to married women, due to the divorce laws and feminist encouragment of destroying their own family.
So the explosive reaction cocktail is from women not being married, rather than from women voting. Married women with kids are not the ones voting left in order to make the government their man.
As the Newton’s Second Law of Motion is my witness, the Four Horsemen of Male Vengeance will punish unmarried urban women (particularly those over 30) the most, while having the least effect on married women with kids, the further they are from the big cities.
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MTG721 pwned Bonnie. She has not posted even once since that post. It is a comprehensive evisceration.
This thread is just like the Battle of the Pelennor Fields in Lord of the Rings, and MTG721’s post was like the moment that Aragorn brought the Army of the Dead into the battle, devastating the Orcs of Mordor (who are the feminists here, of course).
THE turning point of this epic battle.
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Tood/5th horseman
“Remember that they got the right to vote in 1920. Only 70 years after that did they start biting the hand that fed them. ”
What about Prohibition and FDR?
It is unmarried women who are the problem, voting 70-29 for Obama. Plus, the number of unmarried women is growing relative to married women, due to the divorce laws and feminist encouragment of destroying their own family.
As with Roe v Wade, this probably requires a culture shift to precede any legal shift. For example, the Soviet Union had similar divorce laws but the wheels didn’t come off the bus there like it has here.
If it become shameful once again to be a single mother or spinster, then we’ll have less of it an a shift of voting preferences.
You’ll notice mens’ voting patterns are not as easily subject to such whims.
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One other thing this thread provides is insight into the various feminist/mangina bloggers that have posted regarding Roissy’s post…
…and shows just how poor their reading comprehension is.
Several have cited this form Roissy’s original post:
Than used that as their point to level what they think of as damning indictments of Roissy – the PUA community – and all of us “misogynist” participant commenters on this blog, taking the position that Soldini’s actions were justified.
Just to spell it in plain, unmistakable terms for the Salon SWPL liberal idiots and femtards and mangina white knights that have invaded this thread:
…to men on the losing side of the desirability bell curve…
i.e. men who don’t know how female attraction works, and cannot attract a female, endure a long term, enforced celibacy that will lead to derangement…a state in which they can than justify to themselves the rationalizations that allow them to mentally commit to a course of action such as Soldini.
This is clearly what Roissy meant to convey in his post.
But than, what can one expect, since feminism really is the ideology of cultural brainwashing writ large, and the average, brainwashed blue-pill swallower don’t even realize how indoctrinated they are.
I guess it’s too be expected that they would read what Roissy wrote and have what amounts to an emotionally overwrought hissy-fit about how they FELT when they read this post…rather than to rationally contemplate and ruminate and try to decipher what it is Roissy was actually conveying.
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unmistakable terms for the Salon SWPL liberal idiots and femtards and mangina white knights that have invaded this thread:
They (the Orcs of Mordor and the occasional Cave Troll) have invaded, and been slain comprehensively.
I see none of them here anymore (even though 6-7 feminOrc blogs have linked here). We have shown that they are utterly incapable of actually debating any points honestly. We have won.
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celibacy is walking death and anything is justified in avoiding that miserable fate.
Roissy should amend that paragraph to say ‘justfied (in their minds)’. That is because the feminOrcs have really latched onto this single paragraph, and we don’t want to given them any satisfaction of even the slightest strawman that they create.
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Meanwhile, in other news, the Second of the Four Horsemen of Male Vengeance is getting closer.
Touchable hologram becomes reality.
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24 to go till 2000 – now 23 – just doing my part.
As to Bonnie – I think she was interesting. I also think she played a lot of you guys like a fiddle. She very strategically told you her young age, her weight, her prettiness, her partner’s age, her admittance that she responds to his bark in a positive way. Some of you men maybe even got crushes or whatever the male term is for that kind of infatuation. Just sayin… 🙂
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@whiskey: Thank you for saying kind things about post-menopausal women. Young women ignore us at their peril. (‘Course, a lot less would be “gamed,” LOL.)
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black military man said: “All men and women have a right to try, but we cannot force anyone to like/love us.”
doug1 said: “I’m just saying don’t give me “equal”.”
The point is, they are hard left-wingers (Bonnie said her boyfriend is practically a communist) who, if they could, would confiscate everyone’s assets and divide them “equally” right ? Then why should Bonnie’s boyfriend have more/better sexual assets (the services of women, especially young women) than Sodini ?
Also, many of these mass shooters from puberty through their twenties were sexually “locked out” by young women. During this period these young men should’ve easily been able to get at least average young women. The fact that many men of this generation struggle or fail at doing so has more to do with the grossly inflated market value women have under feminism. As a result these omega/beta males never psychosexually matured because they never got to have that urge (for sex with young women) fulfilled when they were young and continue in vain to fulfill it as they get older/weirder, all the while looking on with anger/resentment/jealousy as alphas get all of the sexual attention from young women. Eventually some of these marginalized beta/omega males are pushed to their limit and snap.
I don’t advocate a return to enforced monogamy or patriarchy, but the modern mating market must be made more fair for beta and omega males.
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MTG721, in my opinion, the problem is that the sexual market at the moment is *too* fair to beta and omega males. We’re primates. If everything is let to go natural/primitive, betas and omegas will only mate at the leisure of alphas, or sex will become a kind of social currency in a free-for-all situation in which no males have even a chance of exclusivity. In one system, you don’t get sex unless you endear yourself to or become the alpha male. In the other, you get all the sex you can stand, but you’re expected to do women you don’t find attractive, and even if you do, you have to share her with any and all takers.
So we don’t want fairness. We want more even distribution of exclusive privileges, which being very honest is an unnatural reduction of suffering. We’re asking for “everyman” to have what would naturally be the privilege of the alpha males, with at least one woman each.
It wouldn’t be difficult to achieve except that western men have this idea of “freedom” that they don’t want to give up. They don’t want to be pressured to marry a woman not of their choosing. If there’s going to be even distribution, there can’t be as much choice. Most western men would rather stay single on the remote chance that they might someday bang a 10, than to live in a country where all girls are spoken for by the age of 18.
I know some of you guys don’t like Oprah, but you should watch the episode where she visits the FLDS ranch. Have a look at those women.
Imagine living in a culture basically like that, but without some of the scary religious/racial beliefs. Would you be willing to marry a stray 2? Can you hold yourself back from insulting or being dissatisfied with your wife when she gains a bit of weight despite doing hard physical labor every day? Would you be okay with it if every woman around you always dressed modestly?
Being as I am, I am okay with this kind of world. I’d have been much happier marrying my first fiance. He just wasn’t sure enough though, so I found myself in the pussy mill without a donkey.
If some of you could just avoid dumping the 18 year old girls you were dating when you were that age or a few years older, you’d be fixed for life…but no…she’s never good enough compared to the girls on the television that Hollywood is telling you exist somewhere out there horny and waiting for you.
Heh.
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are you nerdlings seriously gonna stop just before hitting 2,000?
you bastards!
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I’m not sure Game would have helped this guy unless a big part of Game is learning to hunt in your own range.
His range being insane losers who live in crappy little houses outside Pgh? I am skeptical that game can help the insane…
(Really just trying to make it hit 2K.)
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Ghost of Nicole said: MTG721, in my opinion, the problem is that the sexual market at the moment is *too* fair to beta and omega males. We’re primates. If everything is let to go natural/primitive, betas and omegas will only mate at the leisure of alphas, or sex will become a kind of social currency in a free-for-all situation in which no males have even a chance of exclusivity. In one system, you don’t get sex unless you endear yourself to or become the alpha male. In the other, you get all the sex you can stand, but you’re expected to do women you don’t find attractive, and even if you do, you have to share her with any and all takers.
We’re primates, but we’re not chimpanzees. We’re highly technical and socially complex. Betas will never mate at the leisure of alphas or women if that means being relegated to sexual poverty. Betas would simply use technology, violence, social/economic/political pressure, etc to bring about a more fair situation. In a democracy especially, it is more likely that alphas mate at the leisure of betas. This is true even today, as it was a majority after all, that had to agree to the social and political changes which brought us to the current mating market. Since the sexual revolution feminist have fooled betas/omegas into thinking things were more equal. But now betas/omegas are finally waking up to the true distribution of sexual wealth (women, sex) within the mating market (most of it goes to alphas), and I believe this will lead to big changes in the decades ahead.
Women’s market value is artifically inflated because they now have “free” access to male systems (workplace, economic production) and resources (money, protection, cultural chivalry, relationships/love, marriage, alimony, child support, gov’t as husband/father) while men do not have “free” access to female resources (sex, children/reproduction, mother/wife services,etc). Men need to increase mate market value by reducing the “free” male resources women are parasiting from men, and by increasing the “free” female resources men can get from women. Men need to become sexually independent of women, by “outsourcing” women/female services: legalize prostitution, make surrogacy cheaper, import foreign women, better male birth control, legalize male abortion (choice to relinquish paternal obligation), mandatory paternity dna tests, mandatory pre-nups, redefine the marriage contract so it is more fair for men, etc.
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Doing my bit along the road to 2K (warning: I don’t know all the particulars about this guy’s life as I was travelling when it happened and it seems to have faded pretty quickly from the spotlight)
Anyway … I think a big part of his problem may have been not only the lack of sex but of any real meaningful human contact.
There’s a thin line between rouged individual self-sufficiency and soul-crushing unwanted isolation he probably crossed it. Didn’t he have family and/or close friends?
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Comment # 1984:
Imagine a boot, stomping on a cockroach, forever.
Because cockroaches suck.
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We should only have geniune, high-quality comments in order to get is over 2000. Otherwise it is a false victory.
If I can get Obese-dian to spar with me after I make fun of his fat fetish, we can cross the finish line easily.
It is well established that black men want black women to resemble the largest creatures of Africa. This is because these creatures have no natural predators, and survive famines the most. This is revered in Africa, and so black women are required to resemble the giants (elephant, rhino, hippo, cape buffalo) in size, shape, color, and texture. Don’t ignore texture.
Obsidian had a whole thread celebrating his fat fetish. That is what makes him Obese-dian, the ASStrologer.
When Obese-dian says he likes this.
It is really because that resembles THIS.
There are certain creatures, however, that used to roam the Earth, that would fulfil the fetishes of both Obese-dian and Peter.
Here is one such creature.
And here is another.
But alas, Obese-dian and Peter were born a bit too late to have benefited from the specialized pickings available in the Ice Age.
Now if Obese-dian obliges and locks, um, horns here, we can push the total up past 2000.
hehhehhehheh
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“MTG721, in my opinion, the problem is that the sexual market at the moment is *too* fair to beta and omega males. We’re primates. If everything is let to go natural/primitive, betas and omegas will only mate at the leisure of alphas, or sex will become a kind of social currency in a free-for-all situation in which no males have even a chance of exclusivity. In one system, you don’t get sex unless you endear yourself to or become the alpha male. In the other, you get all the sex you can stand, but you’re expected to do women you don’t find attractive, and even if you do, you have to share her with any and all takers.”
We love to exalt the “alpha male” all day long on this blog, I’m probably guilty of it myself. But that large umbrella of alphadom encompasses some people who’s genes are very bad for the human race. Remember, the easiest way to outalpha somebody is to physically injure, steal from, or kill them. Certainly alpha should have some positive connotation, but you can’t make the assertion that alpha=good and beta=bad.
Finally, many betas today are only that way because of the ridiculous things our culture does to them.
lol who cares this has all been said many many times, let’s get to 2k.
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In the manner of Gunslinger (a separate post for each and every little thought that appears)
What’s the failure rate of game? After the course is over, what percentage of guys are still full of woman-repelling characteristics that they can’t get rid of?
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A highly sought-after creature that would fulfill the fetishes of both Peter (fur) and Obese-dian (obesity).
Hyuk! Hyuk! Hyuk!
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How much of the success of game (in the form of courses) is just reframing the normal high failure rate of guys in approaching women?
That is, before they’re in the course they’ve never realized that failure (to make an impression, keep the conversation going, get the number, take her home) was non-shameful and actually pretty normal. If they talk about it with other guys it’s more wallowing in shared misery that leads to more misery.
In the course, they learn to have a sense of humor about getting rejected and view it as a necessary (if not fun) part of the relationship game.
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How many women understand being on the receiving end of rejection at the gut level? My guess is none (or very close to it).
If even the toughest women were exposed to a tiny fraction of the level of rejection that guys on the left tail of the bell curve experience they’d be quivering puddles of misery and locked away in padded cells.
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but duuuuuuude! we only make, like, 2% of what men make! for the same work!
at the same wage!
i’m gonna cry!
your attitude makes women die at the hands of evil guns!
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Four nuns die in a bus accident and ascend to the gates of heaven. They are met by Saint Peter, who commends them for a life of piety.
He says, “Sisters, you have lived your lives by the Word of the Lord since taking your sacred vows. To absolve you of all earthly indiscretion, I refer you to the baptismal font next to me.”
A small pan of water was mounted on a simple wooden altar.
Saint Peter cried out, “Sister One, you have lived your life in purity! If you have ever touched a man’s penis, please cleanse yourself with the Holy Water of the Lord!” Sister One paused, then stepped forward and dipped the tip of her index finger into the water.
“Very well, you may enter!” trumpeted Saint Peter, rolling his eyes. “Sister Two, please cleanse yourself of your sexual impulses and wash away your sin!” Sister Two traipsed forward and plunged both her hands in the bowl, then swathed off her left shoulder and the top of her forehead.
Saint Peter raised a concerned eyebrow, then snapped to his senses. “Very well, you may pass! Sister Three, come forward!” he commanded.
At that, Sister Four cut in front of her peer and plunged her head into the bowl, pulling up after a lengthy breath only to gargle and spit the water back into the bowl like a whale expunging its blow-hole.
“What is the meaning of this?!?” bellowed Saint Peter, equally outraged and confounded by the unforeseen scenario.
“Well,” explained Sister Four, “I had to clean my mouth out before that whore Sister Three sunk her asshole deep into the water!”
///
Sound familiar? This four nuns represent the four quadrants of a complete id, as explained by psychologist and accredited community member Dr. Paul Dobransky. The nuns are examples of King/Queen, Warrior, Magician, and Lover types of personalities. This breakdown is mirrored in the shows ‘Sex and the City’ and ‘Entourage’ as a device to maximize target demographic and gender-neutral sex appeal. Everyone will identify with one of these nuns in particular, and each individual should also target their opposite nun for optimal congruency in long-term relationships.
Wait, what?
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When I see 36 y/o male involved with a 19 y/o female, all I want to ask is “Do you have her watching your old robotech on VHS so you can catch her up before your high school class reunion?”
After a lot of thinking, I’ve concluded that the whole “game” movement would be better off if no one had decided to write a pseudo-manual or touring in every major city to offer seminars 3x a day for the weekend. Guys are usually pretty good at keeping things in confidence….and then others have to get a reality show on VH1 or appear on the Tyra Banks Show (despite the rack and the modeling career, she has this fixation on making others aware of her feminist viewpoint at the strangest times, and usually in between her reaffirming her street cred.)
Feminism should be the perspective that being a woman has its pros and cons, just like men have theirs. It’s not about beating men at every thing they do by doing it better, but about realizing one’s individual strengths whatever they are. Some people are going to want to be teachers and nurses, doctors and lawyers; why is it so important to focus on gender like it’s a dirty word or some sort of crazy plot to ruin the entire world for (men/women)? I think guys who use game are great – they have some funny ass stories from what they did all weekend that are truly entertaining. In a way, they have taught me much about what I perceive about men.
I never once have heard my parents argue in my entire life, but even after 40 years together, they still have sex (as much as the thought makes me cringe, but they have thin walls and the guest room is on the first floor right below their room…oh god, I am so staying in a hotel next time I have to go to Nebraska). My dad has always been fiercely protective of my mother – I will never ever ever call her a bitch again, at least not where they can hear me. His enduring stability, logic, rational and honest nature have always been something to aspire to. My mother has a tendency to be, well, emotional. When I was in high school I had a habit of provoking her to see what she’d do. Yeah, so it was a little twisted to stage a sociological experiment at home, but it was quite educational. But as a couple, my parents were a team with everything that they faced – good, bad, and difficult. They also planned for everything; from their children’s birth to retirement. If I wasn’t their daughter, I couldn’t imagine that I’d have accomplished as much for myself or to have found someone that is confident enough to be truly & honestly happy with my success…as long as I’m happy with it.
But, I digress. Just to make my comment relate to the original topic – if my brother could find someone (more than one, even, since he did get sex before he met his wife) that would not only marry and have sex with him, but bear 3 sons and working on a 4th because she’s hoping for a girl – then Sodini could have gotten laid. I don’t know what happened, but he did not get the best out of the family genetic pool. Of course, my brother never thought of himself as a failure who would never be able to have the kind of relationship he wanted with a woman either. Sodini; he couldn’t game his way out of a cardboard box, with a fat angry woman sitting on it with her hot chick friend. He was a guy who seemed to enjoy reminding himself of how big of a failure he was, despite all of the lame crap he was pointing out on his youtube inventory of his house. Women are not attracted to guys who act like they’re eeyore. If he doesn’t think he’s anything worthwhile, how in the hell would he ever find a woman who would think any better about him? There are tons of guys whose fathers were never there, sometimes in the physical sense and sometimes in the emotional/mental sense. Anyone with older siblings has been bullied and messed with by them. And the mother thing? Act like your testicles have dropped; at 48 or however old he is, he should have been able to assert himself after he moved out of her house and all.
Sodini had the option to fix his problem, many times over, if only someone had pegged him in the back of the head with a softball-sized rock and when he woke up, told him “NO WOMAN WANTS TO DATE YOU BECAUSE THEY KNOW YOU WOULDN”T WANT TO DATE YOU EITHER.” If he needed to work up the courage to kill himself by first killing others, maybe he wasn’t absolutely committed to wanting to end his suffering. I hope I never run into a similar situation, because if I’m gonna get shot & killed, I’m going to return fire before I die.
Miscellaneous fact: generally, women have been found to have better aim when firing a weapon, which is not adversely affected by the situation.
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Cliff:
“How many women understand being on the receiving end of rejection at the gut level? My guess is none (or very close to it).”
I believe that you got this right. (FAAAT) WuMin, or women, will argue inanely that they cannot find their soul-mate, as does any o-mega or hapless, helpless, stick-poked, necessarily-now-over-aged greater beta (my personal estimation of G-So).
What is the fat loser female over-entitled American skank equivalent of attending a PUA seminar?
*** by the way, this crossed my mind tonight – i didn’t dwell on the exact wording of the diary, but is it possible that GS (not goldman sachs) DID INDEED pay for sex, although he had “slept alone for 20 year???” my rational friends concluded that while sex would have HELPED him, it was really the isolation he loathed and the companionship, female or male, that he lacked, that inspired his rampage. if he spelled it out otherwise, fuck you i don’t care.
***
Anyway, the fat loser female equivalent of failing at extroversion for 20+ years, in my estimation, equates to a sodini-level equal of reading a ‘Cosmo’ magazine at age 48. You are now armed with the conceptualization of how to suck a dick, slurp a ball-bag, and finesse the taint with your fingertips, daintily or purposefully. To disclose your intent to capitalize on this wisdom, you dress like a Hunt’s Point hooker at a rural Applebies or equivalent, where no one bothers to find a drunk-driver each night or call a cab. Risk here is cheap!
In these dens of debauchery, fat, over-aged women will meet plenty of middling and lesser younger betas to impart their unpracticed sexual techniques upon. Smaller base supply results in much shorter timeline demand: pay what you owe, ni@@a!, as Riley Freeman would assert.
A female dedicated to sexual availability will not go unserviced; a male surely can, all relevant base levels of value inconsiderable.
*** one more freaky idea: say a decent-looking greater beta has his choice of applebies’ married cougar patrol… the mean and median lifestyle is scaled back in the redneck-themed midwest of course, as they are all assumed to be bible-beaters… well, say feminism hits the grain belt and the cougars seize empowerment over the breadwinners, marginal to the national GDP as they are… i foresee greater disaster on its way! things will get worse in america before they get better – the bible belt will secularize, and we will have another two party system: of liberals and super-socialists! the conservatives will be hiding in galt’s gulch, obviously, or in bin laden’s cave when they figure out he is a proverbial d’anconia.
/// yeah, didn’t like typing that either but WHY NOT???
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what i meant to say: the difference between “full-time” and “unemployed” still decreases in a downward-spiralling economy that has a base lifestyle guaranteed by the federal state. no way that bible-beating girls don’t latch onto this trend soon enough… it WILL happen!
will the beta revolution be televised? if so, by whom?
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are you nerdlings seriously gonna stop just before hitting 2,000?
you bastards!
I bet someone wants DEEPLY to see the comment 2k
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contra the whole forum, I think MTG721´s comment illustrates a male failure more than a female one
he made the quite common mistake of considering what a woman says and condemned her hypocrisy
dude, even if you find a true quality girl and ask her why she got attracted to you, she´ll explain that by giving exactly the description of the guys she rejected in your favor
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@ Cliff Arroyo
I’ve never heard this point before… but it’s obvious and brilliant.
The mere act of doing something — anything — is certainly better than doing nothing, especially for a guy starting out. It isn’t until much later that he becomes decent at Game… but a guy with ‘normal’ success levels at approaches, etc, is a big step up for a typical Community guy.
Most Community guys are very highly successful outside of women and dating (I’ve met everyone from doctors to venture capitalists), and if they would simply put themselves in the game on a consistent basis, they can accelerate quite quickly. They all have cool stories to tell that are interesting to people and are good guys in general. The reframe that you point out is often all they need.
In fact, in one sense, that’s really just what all the evo-psych stuff is — knocking women off their pedestal and telling it like it is. And since women are fallible creatures (even if weird and incomprehensible to a fawning beta) you might as well just go and talk to them. Or make fun of them in a teasing, pull-on-the-pigtails kind of way. As an experiment of course. For the furtherment of science. Obviously.
And oh yeah — Sexbot. Feminist. Buttplug.
2000 here were come! 😉
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What’s the failure rate of game? After the course is over, what percentage of guys are still full of woman-repelling characteristics that they can’t get rid of?
That’s not important. What is important is the much higher failure rate of betadom. Better to get game, try, and fail, than to endure the eternal agony of David Alexanderdom.
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5 more to go.
Cliff, Why doesn’t the Pump and Dump count as painful rejection?
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gonna party like it’s comment 1999
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I’ll be selfish enough not to take #2000 myself.
oops
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How many women understand being on the receiving end of rejection at the gut level? My guess is none (or very close to it).
Being utterly ignored is a different kind of pain than active rejection. But then it’s better to have the option to seek, at risk of constant rejection, than to have to sit passively and be sought.
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I meant “unselfish”. How ironically unintentionally non-ironic of me.
2001.
Congrats roissy.
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We can all stop now. =)
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Mainly because it’s not usually face to face and has time to sink in (and unless the woman in question has an IQ of 50 she should have seen it coming … so to speak). And it takes place after non-rejection has taken place (and can be reframed into him not recognizing how special she was instead of cold rejection). The shit on ice look that many women use to repel unwanted male attention is hard to interpret as anything but really harsh rejection.
Compare that with men looking at you with revulsion or shrinking away from you when you approach (and laughing with each other at your discomfort as you retreat) and that happening a dozen or so times over the course of the night.
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2K or bust.
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above 2000 mua mua hahahahaahahhaha
The most important debate of our time. Men and woman being free from slavery of government interference in their sex lives and personal lives.
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Or the effects on government interference in relationships is dead woman and who the fuck really wants dead woman everywhere and to turn into a terrorist state. I don’t.
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You know, now that it’s actually past 2000 and all I guess that’s supposed to be great but … I’m just not into it anymore.
Look, it’s not the thread it’s me.
No. Don’t call.
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lol cliff now we got to change the goal this is how you beat the system. Now goal is 3k.
Do you feel rejuvenated?
Do you feel invigorated?
Do you still want to be a fucking drooling fucked up vegetable and let the feminists win through attrician of your soul?
Do you intend to quit everything in your life?
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Works like this.
1k then 3k then 8k then 10k then 25k then 50k then 100k then 200k then 500k then 1mil.
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””””””””””’aoefe
24 to go till 2000 – now 23 – just doing my part.
As to Bonnie – I think she was interesting. I also think she played a lot of you guys like a fiddle. She very strategically told you her young age, her weight, her prettiness, her partner’s age, her admittance that she responds to his bark in a positive way. Some of you men maybe even got crushes or whatever the male term is for that kind of infatuation. Just sayin… ”””””””’
Naaa bonnie got played because she changed her entire outlook on life right before our eyes just like most of em do to kiss our asses.
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You want young woman tip a hundred dollars to them at resteraunts with your number on it.
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””””””””””””Cliff Arroyo
In the manner of Gunslinger (a separate post for each and every little thought that appears)
What’s the failure rate of game? After the course is over, what percentage of guys are still full of woman-repelling characteristics that they can’t get rid of?””””””””
lot and that is how we will get to 3k. If I have to bear that cross alone.
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@cliff – “I’m just not into it anymore.
Look, it’s not the thread it’s me.
No. Don’t call.”
I KNOW its not you, it’s the THREAD. Give it one more chance ok? It wants to show you how much it cares. You’ve just started to invest and you haven’t really gotten to know it. Ok it was a little bit bitter at first, but its over that now. It’s ready to go into the future, a bright future, full of pretty coloured rainbows. Don’t call?? That’s like cutting off the legs of the thread –how can you be so heartless??
wahhhhhhh…. it wants ice-cream and then a night out on the town with gf’s. The thread hopes someone else comes along soon. 🙂
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What I haven’t given up on thread and never will.
There are choices that you can make in life and keep them.
Irregardless of other shit going on. Irregardless that you might lose internet connection. I will not fail the 3000 thread. never give up never surrender I will post from work I will post from home I will buy a apple phone whatever it takes the thread will hit 3k.
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The thread needs committment gunny, your response warms the cockles of this semi-hardnened shell of a thread. In fact the thread is feeling so much better it’ll be okay if you decide to send aoefe the i-phone it just wants YOU not the baubles.
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Yea 6 more woman like you aoefe I can own the world mua mua hahahahahaha
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Yea woman with a 100k job the power is transitory. It takes the right man to mold their effort into true power that lasts for generations for them and their children. By taking the effort expent and making it into meaningfull effort and transcending the mundane and the fear to be truly free people.
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”””””””””””””’Martian Bachelor
Two words: chastity belts!
I’ve seen about this exact same debate before and can say some, women in particular, will never get it because they simply lack the evolved module men have which relates to paternity uncertainty concerns, and how crucial it is to a male’s willingness to invest in, and devote his limited time and resources to, a given child.
I see evidence for this all the time in forums on singles sites: lots if not most women can’t fathom why men might have a problem dating women with (other men’s) kids; often they resort to likening it to racism or some other inherently bad/ignorant discriminatory practice or pathological psychological “issue”. You’ll even see women who are currently pregnant (or have a very young infant) seemingly regarding men as merely replaceable relationship objects, the last one just happened to have left her with a baby. A clear majority actually think being a new mother, or a good mother, makes them more attractive to men, that the love they have for their child somehow makes them more valuable to some anonymous man. That’s the level of dysfunction going on out there in women who have been improperly socialized, or, rather, hardly socialized at all. It’s all about them.
Whereas previously a man declared his willingness to support a woman and her children to the best of his ability by marrying her, because he could be sure society supported his right to be almost 100% sure the kids were his, and to be there in the first place for the duration, as well as the importance of this to him, today all it takes in the legal sense is for him to be willing to have sex with her — like that’s some great accomplishment (oh, wait, actually it is now, judging from the number of women who can’t even find a decent date). The whole sex/love/commitment thing has been turned into a big game of “Gotchya!!” perpetrated by women against men. Not inevitably, but in enough instances to be of serious concern to men.
From the standpoint of evolutionary psychology, the rape analogy is entirely appropriate (if unavoidably not precise) because both rape and cuckolding are about subverting the reproductive choice of the other person.
One might naively think that “reproductive choice” is such a hallowed concept that people would easily get this, but as it applies only for women in today’s world it’s easy to see why they don’t. Such a one-sided right translates directly into “Girls can do ANYTHING!” (The Barbie Mantra), which implies what men may or may not want is entirely irrelevant, their designated role is simply to be “supportive” of the woman. Because, after all, she is a mother, or potentially one. This is such a Big Deal because the Feminine Mystique has been replaced by the Motherhood Mystique. All this might be more tenable if there was a corresponding Fatherhood Mystique, but there isn’t, and most certainly not in either the legal or the societal sense.
Adopting the 60s radical’s tactic of fighting absurdity with absurdity seems to me to be the way to go. “Choice For Men” (C4M) attempts to appeal to people’s sense of justice, which is plausibly lacking in 80+% of the population; thus it will never catch on in a big way, which is not the same as saying it’s not right or important. What MRAs should do instead is create what “progressives” like to call a “teachable moment” (whether it’s a “learnable” one or not is another matter) by coming up with a spoof campaign to decriminalize rape based on the following reasoning:
1) The laws derive from A Dark Time when “women were literally men’s property” (Feminist Fairy Tales 101), and are thus embarrassingly archaic and outdated, and obviously only designed to benefit men in the first place by making women out to be weak widdle helpless creatures in need of men’s paternalistic protection.
2) Sex theft doesn’t deprive the woman of any appreciable amount of her supply of sex — unlike the situation with being robbed of your wallet, even continually over years like being cuckolded is. After a little cleanup and being remonstrated to “just suck it up and move on” she can be right back out there at all the finer nightclubs scamming men for free drinks and dinner dates. The penalties for minor forms of theft such as this should be, well, minor (or non-existent), just like they are for minor forms of fraud.
3) Plus, with both Depo-Provera and abortion as backstops, there’s zero cause for any rape to result in a child/burden for the woman. So what’s the Big Deal? It’s not like he’s kidnapping her and keeping her locked up in the basement and having his way with her until she produces his child.
4) The only valid concern left would have to do with STDs, so extra leniency should be shown to rapists who use condoms.
With the current situation as it relates to cuckoldry as an example, this would be a shining example of equality as it relates to subverting the reproductive choice of another person. If women are allowed (some would say encouraged) to treat men callously in so many situations, why isn’t it fair and just for men to treat women equally callously?
“…as women shake off their ancient disabilities they will also shake off some of their ancient immunities, and their doings will come to be regarded with a soberer and more exigent scrutiny than now prevails. The extension of the suffrage, I believe, will encourage this awakening; in wresting it from the reluctant male the women of the western world have planted dragons’ teeth, which will presently leap up and gnaw them. Now that women have the political power to obtain their just rights, they will begin to lose their old power to obtain special privileges by sentimental appeals. Men, facing them squarely, will consider them anew, not as romantic political and social invalids, to be coddled and caressed, but as free competitors in a harsh world. When that reconsideration gets under way there will be a general overhauling of the relations between the sexes”
– H.L. Mencken (1917) ””””””””””””””””””””””””””
on August 11, 2009 at 12:37 pm Gunslingergregi
”””””””””””””“…as women shake off their ancient disabilities they will also shake off some of their ancient immunities, and their doings will come to be regarded with a soberer and more exigent scrutiny than now prevails. The extension of the suffrage, I believe, will encourage this awakening; in wresting it from the reluctant male the women of the western world have planted dragons’ teeth, which will presently leap up and gnaw them. Now that women have the political power to obtain their just rights, they will begin to lose their old power to obtain special privileges by sentimental appeals. Men, facing them squarely, will consider them anew, not as romantic political and social invalids, to be coddled and caressed, but as free competitors in a harsh world. When that reconsideration gets under way there will be a general overhauling of the relations between the sexes”
– H.L. Mencken (1917) ””””””””””””””””””””””
Yea real equality where stupid laws that men deal with begin to apply to womans personal freedoms as well. Better to not infringe opn anyones freedom but pandoras box is open.
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Wow. I was reading the past several days’ worth of posts and I found this gem:
“feminist mangina your really being a complete fucked up dickless small dicked asshole and I hope you burn in hell for not answering my fucking god dam question. Your never going to get a woman/man the way your pathetic self acts by not answering simple legitimate question that I have. You have not payed attention to my question. That means you will never get a woman/man in your life. You will always be alone with your thought by yourself because you did not answer my question.”
And we’re supposed to think that the author of this post is successful with women? Yah, we women just love it when you guys obsess about each other’s genitals and getting f’d up the behind. Sooooo attractive.
I was happy to find some normal discussion in this thread. Too bad it was overrun with useless crap.
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””””””””’Jason
Another example of the child support trap: a man jailed for not making payments to a child that wasn’t his.
http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/08/11/georgia.child.support/index.html”””””””””””””””””””””””””’
””””””””But many, including Cook County Sheriff Johnny Daughtrey, didn’t think Hatley’s incarceration was fair, given that the child was not his. “I knew the gentleman’s plight and didn’t know how to help him,” Daughtrey told CNN last month. When the Southern Center for Human Rights visited the jail earlier this year, Daughtrey told them about Hatley’s case.
Hatley was released from jail last month after Perkins ruled he was indigent and should not be jailed for failing to make the payments.”””””””””””””””””””’
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Yea amanda keep reading that was me doing a satire of the way feminists come on this blog and debate. Which is pretty close to exactly how they talk. They might use more curse words though he he he
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If you read the above article shit is definetly beginning to change. Things like how could this happen possibly in us are being looked at finally.
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“Yah, we women just love it when you guys obsess about each other’s genitals and getting f’d up the behind. ”
Hey, it worked with you! Basically this site is the next best thing to gay porn for getting straight women hot and bothered.
Though I somehow don’t expect to see ‘the next best thing to gay porn’ in the header any time soon.
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Yea cliff I guess to get woman act like poisonous disgusting feminists.
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Oh and thread? Don’t be getting any ideas, I was lonely, you were lonely we started to remember the good times and things got out of hand, but all things considered it was a mistake, mkay?
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Tag teaming this thread
With amanda watching
hahahaah
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Well Cliff thread was wondering if you wanted to get together for old times sake and you know …ahem…bury the hatchet. Remember how THAT used to be sooooo good?
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(Long post warning…)
MTG721 says, “We’re primates, but we’re not chimpanzees. We’re highly technical and socially complex. Betas will never mate at the leisure of alphas or women if that means being relegated to sexual poverty.”
In some ways, that’s how things are now, with a little free-for-all thrown in for the socially adept and outliers. The only non alpha type guys I know who are getting laid with any regularity are either in a couple, or are the social nerds a.k.a. “freaks”.
They look like herbs, hipsters, and dandies, but they’re the kinds of guys who walk into a party and turn it into an orgy. They have a kind of sexy that makes people not only want to shag them, but each other as well. They and their friends get laid, and in interesting ways.
These are the guys who are looking for beauty and suitability, not popularity. Some are in the free-for-all then settle down into more solid older freak communities, but some pluck a flower and whisk it away to their own little MMORPG playing, Ren-faire attending, and occasionally LARPing world.
“Betas would simply use technology, violence, social/economic/political pressure, etc to bring about a more fair situation.”
I’d like to point out the difference between national scale betas and home scale betas. Guys who aren’t politicians or very wealthy or high status/famous are all betas. This doesn’t preclude anyone being alpha at a family level. The family is the basic social unit, and the heads of them are the alphas.
So in the context of dating, someone who knows a little anthropology would view the term “beta” as someone who was incapable of being an alpha at a family level.
Wide scale betas in general could and do easily join the free for all, if they’re capable of being reasonable, and throwing themselves into the experience of sexuality, rather than the status jockeying.
The hang-up with many betas is that they miss out because they’re unwilling to join the social circles of people who don’t go without sex, because those people aren’t “normal”. They’re chasing the top tier of girls who are exclusive to whatever is considered alpha in their social circle.
“In a democracy especially, it is more likely that alphas mate at the leisure of betas. This is true even today, as it was a majority after all, that had to agree to the social and political changes which brought us to the current mating market. Since the sexual revolution feminist have fooled betas/omegas into thinking things were more equal. But now betas/omegas are finally waking up to the true distribution of sexual wealth (women, sex) within the mating market (most of it goes to alphas), and I believe this will lead to big changes in the decades ahead.”
The sexual market was never and never will be “fair” in the way that you mean, in a democracy. Some people would have to be deprived of their freedom in order for every male to have access at will, to the substantially above average women. Those women would have to be imprisoned and whored out to everyone.
“Women’s market value is artifically inflated because they now have “free” access to male systems (workplace, economic production) and resources (money, protection, cultural chivalry, relationships/love, marriage, alimony, child support, gov’t as husband/father) while men do not have “free” access to female resources (sex, children/reproduction, mother/wife services,etc).”
Not every woman’s market value has been increased. Most women’s value has been decreased, because most men no longer see the value in having a woman who is trustworthy above access to women who are pretty and socially convenient.
The individual woman of around average looks now has to compete with the top tier, even when those women are not accessible…just promised by the television and porn.
“Men need to increase mate market value by reducing the “free” male resources women are parasiting from men, and by increasing the “free” female resources men can get from women.”
…but neither available men nor women are an unlimited resource.
“Men need to become sexually independent of women, by “outsourcing” women/female services: legalize prostitution, make surrogacy cheaper, import foreign women, better male birth control, legalize male abortion (choice to relinquish paternal obligation), mandatory paternity dna tests, mandatory pre-nups, redefine the marriage contract so it is more fair for men, etc.”
Men cannot be sexually independent from women without becoming Gay and finding an alternative way of making babies. If you’re using prostitutes and surrogates to get sex and make babies, you are still dependent on women to do those things. Only the context has changed from a trust agreement between people who love each other into a business arrangement between people who feel no love or trust for each other.
I do not see this as better than the current system.
Men would increase their value by not allowing feminists to convince them that their role is expendable…by simply being men. This starts at a family level and extends to the community. Instead of being pussies who let the television and the jocks in school tell you who you’re allowed to screw, get out there and find a woman who suits you and neg her for wearing too much damned makeup and acting like a painted sheep.
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Oh, and this is off topic, but I wanted to announce that feminists have found G4G. I’m homophobic and anti sex now.
Yay!
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Wow.
I’m glad some women jumped in here to alter the mood a bit- up top, this blog was Damn scary!
I was showing the comments to girls at the coffee shop and pretty much terrifying everyone.
But, ever think that all the men who would frequent a blog such as this are of a…particular bent?
I mean, if you don’t have trouble associating with women, or if you’re just laid back enough not to worry about when your next relationship is going to roll around, you won’t be going to this sort of site.
And I had a thought: Sodini was utterly undateable. We all know it wasn’t his looks, his personal hygiene, his work ethic or his intelligence- these things were fine. But he was obviously broken at a very basic level. I don’t know if he was born that way or warped in his early childhood, or some combination thereof, but the result was a man who would make a woman’s belly alarms go off and have her backing out the door as gracefully as she could.
Now, he only went to one lecture that we saw… and we only noticed one book. But how many other books like these were on his shelf? How many other lectures did he attend? Did he go onto PUA websites and ask for advice and get steered to online training? How many Sodini’s are out there- and would there be a SINGLE teacher who would tell this guy: “This system won’t work for you. No system will- you need therapy, my friend!”
I have a sneaking suspicion that these guys who tour and lecture see TRULY hopeless cases every day- but they have no interest in giving the men the truth because it will cost them a customer, and make them admit something they’d rather not: That women cannot be controlled and there are plenty of men who are absolutely not going to find themselves a steady date, let alone a life-partner, no matter what system/tricks they use.
And before you get really angry, please consider: If ANY of you are Dads, or loving Brothers with a sister- would you have allowed your beloved daughter/sister to date such a creature? Seriously- WATCH his videos. Read his blogs. He’s horrible. He doesn’t “lack game”- he’s positively VILE.
(And reading some of the comments above, I see he’s not alone.)
Guys, this is life! Many men, including probably some of the earlier postersm do not deserve- and probably will never get- a healthy female’s companionship. (An equally damaged one, maybe.) Yes, that sucks, but when you start calling a creep like Sodini a “hero”, maybe its time to talk to a professional about one’s anger issues, eh?
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I would even go so far as to say that if Sodini had gone to a place where a woman he was rejected by would be, that it would make some kind of sense for him to go there. The Columbine shootings, and all of the similar ones in schools that followed – the shooters had a grudge against people they knew.
The Texas A&M clock tower incident in the 60’s, the Virginia Tech, The DC sniper(s), Sodini – they were all, simply put, totally crazy. The guys involved in the DC shootings were working their way through killing people along the way to the older man’s ex-wife. The guy in Texas, well, he left his wife and family a brief letter and set out with the knowledge he wouldn’t be back. I already know the virginia tech guy woke up that day and knew how it was going to go – but he’d snapped well before then. Sodini seems like a good candidate for creating a relationship in his head that would be much more involved than the woman would be in reality. Like, after one date, he could probably convince himself pretty quick that she was the one. But the longer he had had to sit and fixate on his situation, the more out-of-touch he got.
“Game is cute…like a basket full of puppies”.
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lol exception you must be in some kind of government work. You say a lot without really sticking to a side.
Sodini’s ex girlfriend apparently was in the gym.
Could you make a little more complicated post though I did enjoy the one on the market value test I think it was.
Of course game is like a basket of puppies sodini might have been ok.
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””””””Circe
Wow.
I’m glad some women jumped in here to alter the mood a bit- up top, this blog was Damn scary!
I was showing the comments to girls at the coffee shop and pretty much terrifying everyone.
But, ever think that all the men who would frequent a blog such as this are of a…particular bent?””””””””
Yea Circe and isn’t it amazing how it was the men who toned down the hysterical woman not the woman toning down the men. Understand if it is up to a woman in a crisis situation they get people killed. They needle a man who says he is all fucked up. They use shaming language on a man at his last straw. Well yea at the end of your rope shame don’t mean shit. Only raw power does.
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A man is like I can’t get woman. The feminist tells him that is because you are lazy and all fucked up and hate woman and you obviously are a seriously fucked up person is you can’t get woman. It is because you are a pussy that can’t get woman.
So the guy is like you might be right and goes and kills some bitches.
You see how feminist ways of argueing is not a help?
Can you see how a shrill bitch ain’t thinking a man is a human being?
Can you see how feminist thinking is leading to anger and probably would lead to dead woman?
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””””’Circe,
Guys, this is life! Many men, including probably some of the earlier postersm do not deserve- and probably will never get- a healthy female’s companionship. (An equally damaged one, maybe.)””””””’
Yea mr shamer it is life. Sites like these are trying to help these men. People like you just tell them this is like. If soldini would go to you for help he would have been told that is life. He would have still killed the chicks.
If he would have went to psychologists he would have been told that is life. He would have killed the chicks.
He went to some type of pua and actually got a means to try to make it better.
If he would have continued and got some actual game help from another man one on one. He may have chosen to live. That is a fact. He may not have killed those woman. If I could have talked to the dude. I could have known exactly where the fucker was coming from. He may not have killed those woman.
Society offers exactly zero help for a man in this situation for any type of help they just offer shaming and that is life bullshit.
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Feminists especially will shame the man who is having problems to accentuate them. Well if what a feminist is saying to shame him would be a man don’t complain. Well he was a man he didn’t complain he didn’t cry he went out in hail of bullets. He should be a feminist hero.
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You know what circe you are the vilest of the vilest pieces of shit with your shaming crap and your forked tongue. Where is your help for people. Where is your soul. What makes you righteous. Trying to put down something that can help men. You fucking piece of shit. Away demon away with your disgusting posturing and morelless degenerate soul.
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””””””””””Holley Thomas: Female Welder Bucking the Trend
The opportunity for Holley Thomas to perfect her welding skills at one of the largest activated carbon (AC) production plants in North America presented itself to her shortly after she graduated from community college.
””””””””””””””’
You can’t make this shit up. They have a spotlight on my companies website where they have every week something about helping woman or some minority enjoy there job or have opportunity and asking the minority if the company has done enough to help them.
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I just can’t get past the part where you said these murders were justifiable. It’s this kind of thinking that trivializes hate crimes against women. Are we all worth so little to you that you honestly believe we are here only to do your bidding and be used for sex? The kinds of things you and your commenters are posting are so utterly dehumanizing to women in general.
Rape, murder, torture, it is never acceptable. Never. I don’t care how many black people beat you up as a child, or how many girls rejected you in high school, or how many east indians cut you off on the freeway, there is no excuse for hate.
And the tables can be turned oh so easily. You think men are the only ones who get rejected? Who go through life alone and unwanted? You make friends with your hand, women make friends with their vibrators. The problem with most of the men with your kind of mindset is you only want a certain type of woman. You never care about who she is, just what she looks like and how great she’ll be in bed. Your idea of beauty is so full of poison.
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Tassia, you either need to read more carefully or give up trying. At no point did our host (sociopathic free rider that he is) say that what this psycho did was justifiable to him.
What he wrote was that the poor psycho’s personal celibate hell devoid of human contact and warmth was so awful that the psycho was able to justify anything in his own twisted mind in order to escape from it (in a way that might draw attention to the millions of other poor bastards in his same position).
If you want people to take you seriously then try to read more carefully. Hell I was skimming and I caught and understood the distinction. And I deeply resent that your poor reading skills made me write something, anything, in Roissy’s defense.
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Yea tasia what cliff said just happened savor it and enjoy the warm glow.
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If you can’t get a woman, then it’s your own fault. Having a job does not make you attractive and not dressing like a hobo does not give you a game.
Just a bunch of weak guys who think they shouldn’t have to do the same mating dance every other creature on this earth has to. Nevermind this killer killed women who already had guys. Guys who actually know how to land a woman.
If you don’t know how, then ask somebody. But sitting around trying the same things that don’t work is just being a loser. And acting like it should be any different is an excuse. It’s YOUR fault you can’t get any poon.
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So whats your point nick?
People here trying to better themselves and you just want to put them down why?
I am not saying your stupid but can you think at all?
I think he did take the blame on himself he ended his own life didn’t he?
He followed your instruction he understood he was a loser because of people like you nick just because before he ended his own life he chose to kill woman.
Sites like this might have helped him recover from that but maybe not there are a lot of people like you nick.
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I think this thread is dead – I was enjoying my three days off from work. But I do want to respond to this. You didn’t read most of my posts, but I will summarize for you.
“-You are a feminist and a liberal. Yet you were 19 when you met your boyfriend who was 36 years old at the time, right ? How did you meet him, was he your professor or in a position of power above you? Feminists are usually vehemently opposed to older men “taking advantage” of young women. They believe older men should have “realistic” standards and go for older and less ideal women who are “devalued” by “the patriarchy”.”
I officially met my boyfriend when I moved into the apartment next door to him (from my parent’s house). He works locally and we had several mutual acquaintances/friends, so I knew who he was. I had dropped out of high school about two years before that, and had been working full time. If we had been different people, it could have been a situation where I got ‘taken advantage of’. While I hate to see people of either gender exploited or hurt in romantic and sexual relationships, I don’t think age is a deciding factor (although I do support age-of-consent laws).
As a feminist who believes many gender differences are innate, I disagree with the idea of ‘devaluation by the patriarchy’. A man desiring beautiful, youthful women is biological and natural. So is a woman desiring sexy men – but sexy means more than youth and beauty to most of us.
“-You yourself condemned Sodini for wanting a young woman and for not being realistic. Yet your boyfriend (who is supposedly a liberal and a feminist also) did not have such “realistic” standards. He went for the ideal young woman “sex object”, just like any so-caled “patriarchal misogynist pig” would.”
My boyfriend’s standards are realistic FOR HIM. He only dates pretty women, who for the last 15 years or so have been younger than him. He has no trouble attracting such women – he’s blessed with good looks and he’s charming, funny, very smart and almost too nice (to the point where people take advantage of him). He doesn’t hit on girls or have casual sex, and lots of women seem to see this as a challenge.
Let’s get this straight here: I am not drop-dead-gorgeous to the average guy. I have a pretty face, look like a young Meg Ryan with much nicer lips. But I am very, very thin, which is hit or miss. My boyfriend has a thing for models so he thinks my body is fantastic, but your average guy, while they think I’m attractive, tells me flat out I need to put on 30 lbs.
‘Realistic standards’ just means understanding your own value in the sexual market. With his post here, roissey is saying that Soldini could have potentially upped his value if he knew more about what to offer women. I assume you would agree (I don’t, in this case – from everything I’ve seen and heard about Soldini, it doesn’t seem he was capable of the social skills and mental flexibility it would have taken him to apply ‘game’ in a productive way. Moreover, if he was crazy enough to do something like this because he thought he had been rejected by ’30 million women’, I don’t know how much female attention/relationships would have helped him).
“-You went for a male who was significantly older than you, who makes much more money than you do, etc – alpha male. You objectified him for his status. You rejected younger beta males. Yet you claim your boyfriend doesn’t have social power ? It’s impossible for an older man who doesn’t have alpha status to get a young, pretty woman. He must have social power – charisma, popularity, job position, something – for him to have had the market value to pull a young woman.”
When I met him, 5 years ago, he was working a lot less and making a lot less money. He lived in the same shitty building I do, delivered pizza for a living, dressed like a college student, and drove a clunker, so I assumed he didn’t make much. Right now, he makes under $60,000 a year (to my $20,000) – by delivering pizza and other non-prestigious methods. He is comfortable enough financially, but he has no career, no social status (people like him, but he doesn’t spend much time with friends). In short, he doesn’t seem like an ‘alpha’ to me. He is cute, and like I said above he is smart, funny, and very kind.
As for me rejecting ‘beta’ guys – I rejected everyone when I was a teenager, and I have always disliked flirty, manipulative men. I have very high standards for all people. I can usually tell when someone is trying to ‘game’ me (in whatever way – men, women, sexually, or not).
“-You say that you like that your boyfriend is masculine, manly, taller than you, etc. You like that he works and has much more money that you do. you claim to not take your boyfriend’s money – but this is irrelevant – because you chose a man with more money for the status it carries, and for the possibility that if you got married you would have access to that money/status. Iow, you wanted someone of superior (and not equal) socio-economic status than yourself. Does this not all run contrary to core feminist ideology, with their rejection of patriarchally “constructed” gender roles, unequal relationships, etc ?”
He looks and acts like a man because he is a man. If I didn’t like it I wouldn’t be with him.
He makes more money than me, but I make very little. His money brings him very little status that I can see. Delivering pizza is not a prestigious job. I fell in love with him waaaay before I knew how much money he made- I was surprised delivering pizza and the other things he does can bring in this much. So it’s a perk that he does okay financially, but wasn’t a consideration in the beginning.
I see nothing wrong with people wanting their partners to make a certain amount of money. And I don’t think gender roles are socially constructed.
“-If your bf could get a pretty young woman, why shouldn’t Sodini be able to get one ? Why shouldn’t all men ? Do you not see the jealousy this would create among men within the mating market, and how it would result in a hierarchy of sexually “wealthy” (like your boyfriend) and sexually “poor” (like Sodini) men? Why is Sodini and other men so inferior to your boyfriend that they are unworthy of the attention of a young pretty woman ? Can you not see how this would create an inequality issue among men ?”
Soldini had severe mental problems. Most men can’t get a pretty young woman – there aren’t enough of us to go around! Life isn’t fair and never had been. My boyfriend came by his advantages naturally, and so did I. It’s no excuse for shooting people.
“-You complain about men hitting on you and harassing you. Shouldn’t other men have equal opportunity to be able to compete for your sexual affection ? After all, your boyfriend had that opportunity. Why should he get to monopolize a scarce and valuable resource (a young woman) without being subject to competition ?”
It’s the way of the world. That doesn’t mean I have to like being harassed and treated not as an individual with dignity, as my boyfriend always has, but as a walking vagina. You wouldn’t like it either, but luckily you’ll never have to experience it.
“-You and your boyfriend are at the top of the sociosexual hierarchy, while Sodini and beta/omega males like him are at the bottom. It would seem impossible for you to truly be able to fully comprehend or empathize with his situation.”
Listen, before he SHOT PEOPLE TO DEATH his story brings tears to my eyes. Really. He was a sad, lonely, pathetic, deluded person. He deserved love like every other person does. But not everyone gets to have love. And most guys, especially slightly deranged or socially retarded ones, are definitely not going to be getting it from cute college girls.
Of course I have no idea what it’s like to be him. All I know is that it is breathtakingly obvious that guys like him have always had a hard time, and will always have a hard time.
As a feminist, I want more choices for women. I want them to have the same opportunities as men, even though most of us are not interested in living our lives the way men do. I do not want women to be forced to act like men, or vice versa – but if a woman wants to live her life like a man, she should be able to. If this reduces options in life for some men, I honestly do feel sympathy for them, but it’s much more important to me that women have autonomy over their own lives and the same rights as human beings that men do. Things surely aren’t perfect in this country for men or women, but I think (and all evidence I’ve ever seen seems to show the same. For all the hysterical claims of the posters here, I haven’t seen them reference one hard fact that might aid their arguments) better right now for all of us than ever before. To me, that’s progress.
As an anti-blank-slater, I believe a lot of gender differences are innate and biological. I don’t think there is anything wrong with the concept of ‘game’ by itself. I certainly don’t like the tone of this site, and I think roissy’s grasp of scientific method is shaky and he is pathetically eager to treat anything that agrees with his experiences as ‘proof’. One or two studies (with a sample size of 413 and performed only on white male American college students) does not prove anything about humanity.
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Tassia, Circe, Jessica Valenti et caterva
make a wish, a sincere wish from the depths of your heart, send a link of this blog to 12 people you know and wait
in more than a week your wish will come true. whenever man kills a woman for mysoginist/patriarchal reasons, he becomes, as punishment, a Pink Fairy dedicated to make every women´s wishes come true
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That was awesome gig and may be true.
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“Just a bunch of weak guys who think they shouldn’t have to do the same mating dance every other creature on this earth has to.”
not every other creature on the earth is the most intelligent species, with advanced economic and technological systems. Those systems aren’t here by accident, they weren’t bound to happen or owed to us and it shouldnt be taken for granted that they’ll be here tomorrow….they were created by humans(men basically) under very specific circumstances. Pretty much all of the success of the modern world is owed to a narrow band of individuals(genetically speaking) who lived in and developed europe and north america over the last 500-1000 years. Any cultural/societal changes in western culture are in fact extremely important and deserve to be debated for the sake of future development and ancestors. Not just for those europeans decendants, but the whole world seeing as even the most successful of asian nations are essentially western copycats, economically and politcally.
most of the guys here by the looks of it do study game and are improving with women..none of them are insane murderers(yet).. they are simply discussing the changes and state of society.
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Gunslingergregi; is it that obvious? And should I pick a side when it’s the debate itself that I find interesting? I like having the ability to be the ultimate neutral. At least, in the general sense. When dealing with people face to face, it’s either choose the side that one identifies with most, or pretend to be on whatever side the person (or people) around you are on. My job requires both.
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”””””””Civil Engineer,
most of the guys here by the looks of it do study game and are improving with women..none of them are insane murderers(yet).. they are simply discussing the changes and state of society.
””””””””””’
A sane person what I am talking about. Excactly People trying to improve themselves so they don’t turn into the killin dude. Doesn’t mean they won’t say f it. But most won’t.
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Gunslingergregi –
I’ll do my best to try and counteract that whole directness thing I do sometimes. Would it help if I threw in some crazy female hysterics? I can prepare some in advance so that whenever necessary I can utilize a few.
“I hate men who are misogynistic jerks, but I want to bang the asshole hitting on me at the bar!”
“Women should be able to do anything they want without any consequences, like men!”
“Men that are dominant have mother issues!”
Did that help? I may need some suggestions, I’m not familiar with how crazy female hysteria is supposed to be worded/presented. I know it may seem strange, but I can’t understand or identify with women who do that crap. It’s irritating, and on more than one occasion, has made me want to throw someone out a window.
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What if the individual has no soul? And how do you know that the gift was passed down from your father? I didn’t know that fathers and sons had that kind of conversation.
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”””””””on August 13, 2009 at 7:26 am msexceptiontotherule
has made me want to throw someone out a window.””””””””””””””’
Just saying you where being direct as opposed to the round the world words with hidden meaning.
And the lasso toss at the end of something totally out there like
“Game is cute…like a basket full of puppies”.
On the dad thing
Well just that he did predict future he didn’t say he could. lol
He was not a fortune teller like I will predict the future.
He just did predict the future.
Nice to see you turn into a multi faceted person though.
he he he
I see you testing waters should be fine.
Everyone has a soul especially the bad people.
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Bonnie:
Point 1:
More women graduate, less practice regularly. That’s, in fact, part of the problem.
Point 2:
doctors: 28% is the more currently if you want to round it up.
Whereas the number of graduates is 47% in 2005. Notice the trends.
DA: I plan to work as part of a team and work out a financial model where any children are given their due attention. I can save up (always a good idea anyway!) for this as well as ‘mooch’. Most realistic prospects in my circles will be ‘progressive’ and ‘supportive of my career’. This is probably the product of a tribal risk-taking culture, where men are easily lost or perhaps spread their resources in polygamy and women can’t depend on them solely.
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Perhaps a Beta Uprising which targets alpha males would have more success in getting them women. Hey don’t shoot your ultimate aim (pussy) shoot the guy who has the access. Oh ya – I’m brilliant! 😉
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lol aoefe divide and conquer eh
The getting pussy is not as big of a problem as paying for the pussy
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Gunny you’re an alpha – you’ll be killed. 😉
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aoefe: That’s called the AJ Travis school of thought, as far as I can tell.
Or he did voice this at some point.
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No doubt this topic is fading a bit, but my fascination with this man’s tragedy has continued since I heard about it.
My third post on your site, but I’ve read articles in comments (lurked) from time to time since last year. I’m re-married, but even a married man can indulge in “continuing education”. I’ve learned though that a filter must be applied and the wheat seperated from the chaffe (and there is PLENTY of chaffe in this art of seduction, pua theory mindset).
I’ve come to the conclusion that this man WAS NOT failed or trod upon by women…and the entire Beta, celibate male population hasn’t either. It is FELLOW MEN who let him, or us as it may be, down. Fellow Betas and Alphas alike failed this man.
The entire disillusionment of men like this can be cured with some simple male bonding and mentoring. And I’M NOT TALKING ABOUT mentoring with “you gotta be an a-hole to succeed” BS advice. What every socially akward man in this world needs is to QUIT PLACING SUCH HIGH VALUE on your sex life or lack thereof. In the same vein, Alphas who brag of their conquests are equally pathetic unless they are balancing their lives with meaning outside the bedroom.
In summation: GET OTHER INTERESTS IN YOUR LIFE AND TRULY INVEST YOUR WORTH IN OTHER THINGS. There is nothing wrong with desiring the benefits of a social life with the opposite sex, and hobbies and interests might be (as a bi-product, not primarily) “designed” to place oneself in social settings, but that should be in order to SHARE the enjoyment of your life with others and GENUINELY ejoy the sharing of their lives as well.
All of this PUA stuff is geared around picking up one-night stand college age girls at clubs, etc, and while there are applications in various other settings, none of these ideas do anything more than superficiously step up someone’s frequency of meaningless encounters…Something that can be accomplished without “put-on” and by simply allowing yourself to be happy. This shines and radiates and is ultimately what true alphaness is.
I learned this lesson. I’m a self-diagnosed Beta if you boil it down to raw Darwinian notions. I’ve had my dry spells, and I’ve sought to improve my opportunities during those times. I’m by no means immune to the need for sexual fulfillment. But I didn’t really get in “the game” until I started investing my energy in things I enjoy, and discovered new things. One example was getting a motorcycle. Many of my male friends and coworkers ride, and I focused myself on deepening those friendships as well as taking risks (ie I never thought of myself as that kind of thrill seeker). I honestly found myself loving my new hobby and redefining myself.
My friends were instrumental in this. They encouraged me to break out of the depression of losing my ex-wife and cut loose. They got my mind off of not having a woman and on having friends and a great hobby. I regained some lost confidence and rediscovered some youth (I’m 36) as well. Even after getting hitched again, I make an effort to not ever lose my sense of self and validate myself more through THESE things than my relationship.
Is my life perfect? Hell no. And sometimes I regret not being single and having options with no moral consequence. Marriage is meaningful, but if we indulge our natural inner male animal instincts we can feel trapped. Society has made the nobleness of family and monogamy antiquated and undervalued in much the same way liberals make excuses for other social ills like same sex etc. Thousands of years of civilized culture is erroding as we revert to, indulge, and excuse our gluttonous and lustfullness. I understand this though, because feminism has had the negative and counter-productive effect of making the mating scene the way it is.
But I’m on a tangent, and I don’t post this to sound prudish or like I’m on a soapbox. Forgive me for that.
Back on topic, if this man had invested his heart and soul into genuine pursuit of HIMSELF, expanded his horizons, his interests, and just learned to love HIMSELF, then a certain measure of satisfaction with women would have naturally followed. He made many, many tragics errors in his thinking. Feeling he deserved a college age hottie at near-50 yrs of age was error number one. He automatically cut his realistic options by 80-90%. And that’s what many celibate men are guilty of, objectifying women to the point of finding no satisfaction with more ordinary women and LITERALLY MISSING all the cues that might have given him multiple opportunties.
And his prosepective “pool” would have certainly been recalibrated to the positive by being a happy, fun person to be around instead of a “bummer”. His misery just oozes from his blog diary, and must have been more so evident in life. Everyone, women included, wish to associate with happy people. It’s very simple really.
Happiness would attract genuine friendships, friendships bring forth social circles and interraction, interraction brings forth a growing network, a growing network increases opportunities for MEANINGFUL relationships and not so many superficial ones.
Now, I’m no pinnacle of success and have inhibitions that stunt me from being a man-around-town “player” type. I’m the first to climb aboard the LTR train and settle into a comfortable seat. I don’t have abundance of energy to allow my social network to grow all that large, and I’m not interested in the short-term “getting to know you” and later forget about you roller coaster of socializing. My life’s list of sex partners is at TEN, LTRs is three, and I succeeded with my current wife at landing a no-baggage (kids) 7 1/2 years my junior hottie (particularly when compared to other women her age) and we started our own little family. I wanted a younger woman, but not a dram-queen college girl, and that’s what I got.
Now having said all of this, and establishing the FACT that finding happiness in general begets sexual success overall, I will adamently admit that to even keep a successful relationship afloat, one MUST allow their masculine nature to thrive and not be hindered by BS feminist rules. A real man is proud of being a man, he focuses his aggressiveness and testosterone on his own prosperity and pleasure while keeping it under control and in check. Pursuing hobbies, particularly ones that stretch you beyond your self-imposed boundaries, will help feed the man in you. This stuff all goes hand in hand, and there is no doubt that introspection is good and one should be willing to break out of their timid shell. Geeky type guys can remain geeky type guys, but its instructive to not PRESENT yourself that way at all times and in all settings. This doesn’t mean defying who and what you are, it just means EXPANDING yourself into being MORE than what you are at the moment.
In other words, I do spend time relearning and reminding myself of what my wife NEEDS and WANTS from me, and not just what I have naturally to give. Everything we do in life does require effort if it is worth doing, and sometimes I have to adapt myself to keep the fire burning in my marriage. But have no doubt, it still all boils down to and is rooted in my own happiness, sense of self, and growth as a human being.
Again, if this man had enjoyed just ONE male friendship, where he had been offered this kind of counsel, he may have not become so disillusioned.
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BTW, I read a comment above that basically said all men DO deserve to get “his dues”… (I’m posting from work so using other words might not be a good idea)
And I agree, and for the same reason. Like the poster said, for every akward, smelly, fat, lazy man, there IS a woman of the same ilk who should be equally satisfied with engaging with these men. But feminism has put women, even grotesque ones, on some artificial pedestal where they hold the cards. Ever looked at networking, dating sites where “B&BW” (big beautiful) women are slutting it up in hopes of scoring above their grade?
Social welfare, allimony, and excessive child support judgements have empowered women beyond their worth. It isn’t even women in the workplace, it is women on taxrolls, or at least having that cushion on which to fall.
There SHOULD be more to our mating rituals than what we have to offer physically, and One Upon A Time a man’s ability to provide was the card we held. It was, and be natures order STILL SHOULD BE, the card that men hold.
That doesn’t mean that women whould be timid, submissive, helpless creatures, it just means that women shouldn’t get what amounts to a free ride from society (and her baby-daddy) just because she got a boob-job and strange men started flirting with her and artificially boosted her self image. This shallowness and our social infrastructure has ANNHILATED the family in this nation.
I’m a victim of the system in that I’m still beholden to my ex (who works and makes nearly what I make) to over $800 a month in child support and insurance for our son, when all logic and reason dictates that she’s banking half that at least, especially being remarried to another equally capable earner (ie home, cars, other expenses are shared). She has also expected (but never got) all the extras, like shared co-payments and league sport fees etc. I’ve refused to do that, other than MAJOR medical expenses, and because I’ve been there for those, she gave up on extorting me for more.
The empowerment of no-fault divorce and the rape of CS laws has removed any incentive for a woman to keep things together and maintain focus on her family rather than her own selfish desires.
I promise, if my wife had been staring at $300/month in CS and **optional** insurance benefits (I mean, since when did that become an entitlement anyway?)…she would (probably) have never cheated, much less left at the drop of a hat. It would have given her much more pause, which she didn’t have to do in reality.
I’m not bitter, btw. I’ve moved on and hopefully won’t repeat the cycle…but even if I do I’ll manage and won’t make the same mistake I assure you.
The reality is that MEN are in many ways guilty of fostering the continued growth of this unnatural socialist system. By placing so much value in women, we set them up on their Queen B pedestals.
I’m sorry but that’s just the way it is.
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WHR–
Oh, you’re a victim??? HA hahaha please explain to us all how you were shackled and dragged to the alter against your will.
If you got fucked in your marriage it’s your own dumb fault for
A. Not reading the fine print
B. Marrying a questionable woman
C. Getting married in the first place
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WHR, I really liked your posts. You seem like a great guy and a person I can identify with.
Unlike Wendy Schwartz I always have sympathy for someone (male or female) who suffers in the breakup of a marriage or other relationship. It’s brutal.
Relationships are fraught with peril. Life is hard. It’s just as biological as mens attraction to slender 20-year-olds.
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I’ve read your posts, several of them, uh “Lady” Raine.
The fact that you used an unladylike word in your comment ABSOLUTELY verifies my conclusions about the world we live in.
And I may have used the word victim for myself, but ultimately it was my 8 year old who was the victim, and forever will be…because my ex was a piece of garbage with a warped sense of right on par with your own.
I myself, as a man, have instinctive desires. But being this little (supposed) evolved creature called a “human being” is supposed to give me the strength and conviction to hold my desires in check. Many people do it, daily. Thousands, no millions, around the world, and are living happy fruitful lives. At least those of us not poisoned by the cultural de-evolution that feminsim has spawned.
A. Not reading fine print: WTF? Marriage contracts don’t have fine print that says its OK to go ho-llistic on your spouse.
B. Marrying a questionable woman: She wasn’t, but became such. Unfortunately feminism has created an enormous, swollen, festered pool of questionable hos and much like presidential elections us menfolk choose the lesser of multiple evils.
C. In some ways, I won’t argue that last point. However, there are some of us antiquated wierdos who still like the idea of raising another human being and sending them off into life with our guiding love. Kind of fulfilling, if you haven’t done it you should try…second thought, we don’t need more like you. Nix that. At any rate, I don’t give a squat your take on it, because I’m sure its quite skewed, but the one man-one woman family unit in the traditional sense is most optimal for bringing forth and nurturing those little tykes. SO, I do not regret, nor shall I ever, giving it the old college try.
BTW, I love after reading an admittedly lengthy yet incomplete expose of my life story you have sized me up enough to judge my decisions. Again, no regrets, really, except for the totally back-assward tail spin that society is in due to trashy hos such as yourself.
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Bonnie, TY.
I apologize if my use of personal anecdote sounded like a “victimization cry” or rant. I do not feel truly victimized, nor do I hate women. I’m remarried and happy (mostly) with my marriage. It DID take a while to readjust my views and not be negative. Thus my advice to men to “get a life”. in the first comment.
Just over the years of marriage, divorce, and remarriage, I have had a lot of time to figure the world out and understand that we have really screwed up a lot of what used to be RIGHT with this country. I KNOW, believe me, that many men, now and historically, misused and didn’t respect the opposite sex. But notice the “now” is still true, despite all the feminist manipulations. Men still harm women, and women still harm men. Social engineering doesn’t change that.
Do I advocate no vote for gals, no right to work or earn equal pay? NOOO! Do I advocate barefoot and prego? Nah, not unless the lady wants it that way.
But I don’t believe in overdoing the social engineering either, and that, unfortunately, always winds up happening and harming society.
Excessive child support, alimony, and other subtle things, automatically viened toward women, realistically, are examples of this, and have liberated and “entitled” women to way too much.
What would be wrong with a child support “account” in which both parents contribute, with debit card access for the domicile parent? (Bounced check responsibility strictly on her shoulders BTW) All the father would be involved in would be getting a statement mailed to him, so that alarming shopping habits could be pointed to as cause for a reduction of support. In this computer driven world, there is no excuse for NOT doing it.
But alas, so many plastic surgeons and BMW dealerships would be out a lot of business from them women “gettin paid”.
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Agreed 100%. Very wise words WHR.
My guy basically did exactly this, despite not having been in a single LTR, and having known some people who were into the pick-up game. He stopped placing any emphasis on sex and relationships, and was just happy with his friends and family. He developed himself, and that is incredibly attractive.
I also think that the whole alpha/beta dichotomy and obsession with sexual success are not for everyone. It depend on one’s values. Some people simply do not value meaningful relationships, family and love. They go for other things. To each his own, I say.
I am glad for you that you have remarried and have not shunned LTRs with women. We all have grievances from our past, and we have all done things we’re not totally proud of. But what we do now and how we intend to learn from the past is what we are and will become.
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WHR, I respect your opinion and for the most part agree with it… But is it really necessary to use derogatory names towards women? There are some women out there who, yes, are terrible human beings and seek only to leech off of whomever they can get their slimy hands on. That doesn’t make it okay to debase and devalue the whole gender as a result.
Also, being gay is not a “social ill” and the liberals/feminists have nothing to do with a naturally occuring sexual preference. People have been gay since the dawn of time.
As for the original article, his standards were unrealistic and he was lonely as a result of it. You can’t expect “hot young 20somethings” to be into an old man, it just doesn’t work like that regardless of what you see on TV. Most women around that age that I know, myself included, are incredibly creeped out by the idea of dating someone old enough to be our fathers. It’s not that they don’t have anything to offer us, it’s just a huge age gap and humans do tend to stick to people who are alike in mind and body. A 48 year old isn’t going to have much in common with a 22 year old.
What he did as a result of his loneliness was abhorrent and unjustifiable, and it also showed his skewed perception of what “attractive young women” really were, since almost none of those he shot were in their 20s.
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””””””’Now having said all of this, and establishing the FACT that finding happiness in general begets sexual success overall, I will adamently admit that to even keep a successful relationship afloat, one MUST allow their masculine nature to thrive and not be hindered by BS feminist rules. A real man is proud of being a man, he focuses his aggressiveness and testosterone on his own prosperity and pleasure while keeping it under control and in check. Pursuing hobbies, particularly ones that stretch you beyond your self-imposed boundaries, will help feed the man in you. This stuff all goes hand in hand, and there is no doubt that introspection is good and one should be willing to break out of their timid shell. Geeky type guys can remain geeky type guys, but its instructive to not PRESENT yourself that way at all times and in all settings. This doesn’t mean defying who and what you are, it just means EXPANDING yourself into being MORE than what you are at the moment.
In other words, I do spend time relearning and reminding myself of what my wife NEEDS and WANTS from me, and not just what I have naturally to give. Everything we do in life does require effort if it is worth doing, and sometimes I have to adapt myself to keep the fire burning in my marriage. But have no doubt, it still all boils down to and is rooted in my own happiness, sense of self, and growth as a human being.”””””””””””””””””””’
That was nice dude. I think yea experience a lot of shit in your life. Impresses the heck out of your woman if you can do anything. She may laugh if you hit a minor obstacle because she is in shock. But yea experience what life has to offer. Why not we are here.
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on August 13, 2009 at 4:49 pm annora
When people are debasing “woman” as a group what they mean are “feminists” Like the militant ones who are batshit crazy not the ones who can be “saved”
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””””’on August 13, 2009 at 4:49 pm annora
A 48 year old isn’t going to have much in common with a 22 year old.”””””””
Just a thought I had earlier in thread but what if he handed you 10k would that have broken down into some commonality.
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””””’aoefe
Gunny you’re an alpha – you’ll be killed. ”””””’
This sounds like there might be some passive agression going on here he he he
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“Just a thought I had earlier in thread but what if he handed you 10k would that have broken down into some commonality.”
That’s insulting. Maybe some women will go for that, but I was raised with the belief that if I couldn’t make it on my own, I wasn’t worth a damn thing. I’ve never really understood the whole “man providing for you” thing, it always seemed incredibly selfish and lazy to me.
And militant feminists are bad, I’ll agree with you there, but not all feminists are militant. There are some people that will always take things to extremes, regardless of what group they belong to. We call those people crazy.
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And no, I didn’t kill him.
(just in case it was tempting anyone to ask)
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Annora,
If it sounded like I’m shooting bad vibes at all women, I do apologize. I don’t feel “all women” deserve ill, I’m married to a great lady after all. I even have neutral and at times positive feelings toward my ex, inasumuch as her parenting of my son is adequate and sometimes exemplary.
If you read between the lines though, I’m not blaming women anway. Men play a part in feminist acceptance, and are culpable to the de-evolution of society as well. I think I hinted as much.
Somewhere along the way, the feminist movement, while rooted in reasonable American ideals, went astray even for the women for which it occured. I truly believe MOST women grow up desiring the stable family “goal”…especially true in the teen years when ideologies havn’t been contaminated by college life and the misery of older women’s stories.
It isn’t until young women go batshit crazy when they get out in “the real world” that they skew and rationalize behavior they were not brought up to condone.
I have a ton to say on this topic, I really should write a blog myself. I met an old HS friend at a bar last night, both of us 36, and we were getting looks from barely-out-of-barbie-doll phase college girls. We both look young for our age and dress well. We were just there because he flew out of state into town. I had no interest in women, but I imagine if we’d hung around the ladies would have been working us for free drinks.
It really is sad.
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””””””””””””annora
“Just a thought I had earlier in thread but what if he handed you 10k would that have broken down into some commonality.”
That’s insulting. Maybe some women will go for that, but I was raised with the belief that if I couldn’t make it on my own, I wasn’t worth a damn thing. I’ve never really understood the whole “man providing for you” thing, it always seemed incredibly selfish and lazy to me.
And militant feminists are bad, I’ll agree with you there, but not all feminists are militant. There are some people that will always take things to extremes, regardless of what group they belong to. We call those people crazy.””””””””””””
Wasn’t meant to be insult but the dude had 250 g’s in the bank. He could have had some fun anyway. I think he was a moral mass murderer.
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Well keep it going anon lol this thread got to hit 3k.
””””””on August 13, 2009 at 5:54 pm msexceptiontotherule
And no, I didn’t kill him.
(just in case it was tempting anyone to ask)
””””””””’
I was kind of wondering what you would do when I ignored the window comment he he he
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gunz – having difficulty posting, but good to know you have a soul along with most of the others here…it’ll be something to burn when in hell – I hear it’s really dark there.
I’m going to go work on a return to cloak and dagger commenting, I can’t have people figuring out my..facets.
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I meant moral as in he didn’t want to be buying sex.
Allright ms catch ya on the other side.
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Exactly. Women who like much older men are one of two things:
1. A Golddigger
2. A woman who is desperately trying to scramble for a man who will give her babies (because he’s old and doesn’t give a fuck anymore).
[editor: or maybe they love him. not that you’d know anything about love.]
That’s why it’s funny when the older men who “like younger women” and keep having probs with them crack me up. Duh, of course you’re going to have probs, you’re with a woman who doesn’t mind that you’re old, shrivel-dicked, and don’t have a young man’s attractiveness. Soooo what did you THINK they were with an old guy for?
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I forgot something…
I would like to present “exhibit X”:
Sugardaddyforme.com
This should be enough evidence of 20ish women willing to be involved in whatever capacity men well over 40 who have money want them to be.
and in case that’s not enough proof
“Megan Wants a Millionaire’ ;
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Dam this thread is gonna take some long term game.
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””””””The Fifth Horseman
1500 comments. Tons of feminists creeped in from the outside, like a swarm of Orcs from Mordor.
Only to be beaten back by the elite strike force of all the regular warriors here.
An epic thread, this was.”””””””””
Shakes The Fifth Horseman’s hand. Man that was an epic thread.
Feminists with claws outstretched and fangs bared with words to posion the soul. Words of logic are stronger still and calm the nerves of the bitches so shrill. Till they see the point of this particular joint is not to kill but to save. To not just put down but to build up. To not just shame but come up with a way for a man to be a man and say he overcame, he used Game.
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Sugardaddyforme.com
“Megan wants a millionaire”
proof that there are plenty of 20ish women seeking older men with money; if she goes on a dating show to compete for the chance at finding “love” with BRET MICHAELS, I wouldn’t want to go anywhere near any of the women from his show, considering the astronomical number of groupies he had back when he was going through his best career years.
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Gunslinger : The man is a poet.
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Well be off the net for a bit. I have come to the end of this phase of my life.
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Gunny: I win.
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@ Wendy Schwartz – can’t you see how limited your views are by what you’ve experienced in your relationships and your life? You come off as obnoxious and deluded to everyone who comments here, even someone who’s basically passing through, like me. Your life choices are fine for you. They aren’t what I want, even though we are both women and identify as feminists.
My BF and I are in love. We’re perfect for each other. We’re also 17 years apart in age. The third thing was never my ideal but it’s not a problem. He’s still hot, and he came equipped with an emotional maturity few men under age 30 have (if ever).
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A person can only be deluded if they are saying things that aren’t true. Thus far I have found all the evidence in the world (yes, in my own experience of course) that most of these stereotypical ideas are wrong and haven’t come about in my life, therefore those ideas are wrong.
If someday those “nasty things” come true….well whatever I’ll deal with it. I doubt that you are silly enough to believe that you are in the MAJORITY on much older man/much younger woman combo in actually being IN LOVE with the guy.
Sure, some women can find older men attractive, I suppose but I hardly think that’s the norm. Wanting money, status, security, and babies is most often the reason.
(Second I never at any point said to anyone that my lifestyle is “better” or “good” for others or tried to impose that opinion so I really don’t know what you’re talking about there. My attitude about MOST of the things discussed here is stuff that people just want to blame on others. It’s clearly evident, and I just don’t have any sympathy for those people because I wouldn’t expect it in return.
Adults are supposed to be responsible enough to be like “you know what? I fucked up and made a bad choice…oh well….let’s move on.”
These people don’t seem to possess the ability to even accept that their life is entirely their fault. Let alone move on from it. The whining and boo hooing I hear here is amusing, yes….but do I feel for any of them? No, certainly not.
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“These people don’t seem to possess the ability to even accept that their life is entirely their fault.”
Agreed.
You are really just here for the entertainment (and, if I may assume, the pleasure of shit-stirring), so I suppose there’s no reason for you to phrase things in a sensitive manner.
You do make an awful lot of proclamations though that seem to be speaking from an ‘as a feminist’ or ‘as a woman’ platform. And often it seems like you are saying you have an opposite opinion just to piss someone off. So I feel like you are inconsistant..
But, it’s not your job to convert anyone. By the time they are hanging out here, most hope is gone.
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Gunslingergregi – don’t make me use all of my work resources to force you to come back. After all, the psychic friends network has been shut down, and I need someone who can provide the occasional literary gem for entertainment.
man, this is when mr.exceptiontotherule is missed the most. damn him for his loyalty to the defense of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness & its fatal end.
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Wow- I can feel the love tonight! I was gone for a couple of days, went on a romantic trip up the coast and we(BF and I) did talk about this site and Sodini and what the Hell is wrong with people like the ones who permanently lurk on sites like this.
I have a theory:
I once went, as a moral support, with a friend to an “Al Anon” meeting. (Sweet mother of pearl- never again.) As far as THOSE people were concerned, because THEY have an alcohol problem, everybody in the world has an alcohol problem. They would gladly see alcohol completely banned, because well, its only a problem for everyone. When I tried to point out that I didn’t have a problem, and in fact, my parents owned a bar and none of us drank to excess- well, I was plainly delusional. See any possible connection? When you have a hammer, the whole world starts looking like a nail, y’know?
You guys NEED to get away from each other. Can’t you see you’re all just reinforcing negative ideas? Yes, I’m sure its very affirming to be with people who have similar problems and to reassure each other that it is the WORLD that is wrong- but it isn’t. Healthy people in healthy relationships, or capable of finding relationships do not find their way here- and I assure you, they are the majority.
Just like alcoholics think the entire world suffers from alcoholism, so people who have difficulty forming relationships see the same thing all around them.
God.
I was wishing I COULD do something for some of the men on here- because it isn’t what you’re doing. Obviously, if all these tricks worked? -You wouldn’t still be here, and you’d be a lot less angry.
And you’d be surprised at what I’d suggest.
*sigh* But you’d never take my advice, I’m sure.
Why would you? I’m a woman and therefore “the enemy.” – And that’s really the crux of the problem.
BTW, don’t get so hung up on the concept of “We’re indispensible!” because I assure you, if your value lies in your being “working drones”- you are absolutely replaceable.
But guys…that’s the thing. You can’t just be working drones! Surely there’s more of value to you than that, right? What woman wants a man who’s nothing but a paycheck? That’s pathetic. And if that’s the kind of woman you keep encountering, you really are looking for the wrong sort of woman. Darn.
Its funny, I saw all the swearing, and it really is sad, because in a way I wish I could help and give suggestions. But I know you’d never hear me. To you I probably seem like evil incarnate, but…
Okay- if there’s ANY MAN HERE reading this who isn’t totally, utterly closed to it, and maybe found that PUA isn’t working for you- Please….just try this: Find a great chick, one that you’re not maybe perfectly compatible with, but a fun gal. A nerdy girl, a smart funny girl- whatever and GET yourself a GAL PAL. I’m not kidding.
If she knows that you’re not trying to get into her pants and, (I would hope) that you don’t hold her in contempt, she will probably give you some valuable insight into how you are being perceived by other women. Plus, its less intimidating to girls if you go someplace already with a woman. It makes you “safe.” Make a friend just to make a friend. There.
Do with it what you will.
I mean, what do I know, right? I’m just a woman in a solid relationship, who’s friends are in solid relationships and who’s currently working on setting up my BF’s only single buddy…right?
(THAT’S a HINT guys.)
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Oh, and GG, I’m so sorry I wasn’t about to respond to your deeeelightful insults.
*laughs*
So, you didn’t respond to the question: would you have allowed Sodini to date your little sister, if you had one? If he rang the doorbell, and was there to pick her up- and you’d read some of his blogs…you KNEW he referred to all women as “hoes” and “sluts” and apparently thought about sex 24/7- you’d think that was okay?
I’m pretty sure an “alpha male” would not allow one of the females who is under his protection (feminism be damned) to date such an undesireable. Both of my older brothers are strong alpha men- and either one would have taken a shotgun to that loser before letting him near ANY female in our clan. (They’re protective, but I love ’em.)
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Bonnie,
MTG721 earlier showed how your actions are almost exactly the opposite of your feminist words. You certainly don’t practice what you preach regarding ‘feminism’.
Circe,
You have no idea what you are talking about, or what ‘Game’ is. Some of the other men here are losers, but some of us are Game experts who do better than 99% of men, as we deeply understand what women find attractive (far more than women themselves could ever articulate).
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I’m considering whether or not I should just go out and find someone to throw off of a ledge. I’d jump, but I have way to many things that I’m obligated to finish at work still. Can’t leave mr. fancypants and mr. alwayssomeexcuse in the lurch because they wanted to go out and fail pathetically with the ladies. If I were like many women, I would have let their wives know where they like to spend their time when they are supposed to be still at work.
But the pay is good, and of course, knowing all of their secrets does mean I have a lot of leverage when I decide to use it.
My game is f’n better than theirs. (Although that’s not saying a whole hell of a lot now that I think about it. Oh well)
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Circe:
Your buffoonery betrays your incomprehension, your “reptilian brain” as it were. As an older brother, I am THRILLED that my sister has married a greater beta provider. His grooming ensures these fundamentals:
1. he will have access to a steady job that provides for their household
2. he will not chase other women
3. he will revere my wisdom and stiff upper lip
Are there any boxes left unchecked, for that matter? I do not necessarily want to trade war stories with him over beers and a football game.
Obviously, you try to bait with your Sodini metaphor, you mental midget. Up until a year or two earlier, he was a terrific dating prospect for a hypothetical sister in his age group. That is to say that she approved with a gina tingle, no cest.
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peace to michael vick, first overall pick! i hope he kills it this year, and i’m from new york, no turtle.
// no entourage
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“MTG721 earlier showed how your actions are almost exactly the opposite of your feminist words. You certainly don’t practice what you preach regarding ‘feminism’.”
How exactly do you think I should ‘practice what I preach’?
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One hates to *thank* Sodini for anything, but if it weren’t for him, I would not have found out about this site. Not sure what linked me to it, but fascinating once found. The folks on the site are more varied and diverse, and have more nuance, than they’re being presented elsewhere (“oh, those crazy PUAs who aren’t condemning such behavior enough!”). There’s actually a coherent world-view here that, even if imperfect, makes sense.
And so much of human relation is about ‘power’ in whatever form…
I’m impressed with folks like whiskey and Obsidian, sometimes novaseeker, and smart women like chic noir and Ghost Of Nicole. I don’t often agree with doug1, gig or Gunslingergregi, but hey, nobody’s perfect. I have some sympathy for Dave Alexander, but don’t “get” him. I have no clue about Wendy Schwartz. But the only *real* annoyances are people like that fellow Chris who was posting earlier, sanctimonious and self-righteous. Nor has he been through a REAL test yet — how will he sound when his slimming-down girlfriend cheats on him and/or leaves?
I’m a modest Beta myself, Sodini’s age (another reason for the fascination) but *much* better off, keeping my head down and nose clean, paying the bills and not in debt, etc. (see the fable of ‘the Grasshopper and the Ant’). Ah, the mellowness of age (and the observing of all those crash-and-burn divorces).
Everyone have a good weekend, and now you guys need to go out and practice Game some more!
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Wow.
So, after watching his “home video” you would let a guy like Sodini date your sister. In fact, you’d be “thrilled” about it. I wonder what your sister would think if she knew your thoughts on the matter?
However, I think your #3 is the most telling.
You’re no alpha.
A REAL man isn’t afraid or intimidated by other strong men- in fact, they enjoy and seek out their company. But a man who is merely posturing and “playing the role” of a dominant male feels safest around men that he knows (believes) he is superior to. So, you really don’t care about your sister’s happiness, (or safety) you just want to ensure that you don’t bring a man into the fold who might be stronger than you. In short, you would subject her to a potential sociopath for your own ego.
That’s just lovely.
Oh! But that’s not game! I don’t know a thing about game!
*laughs*
I guess I’m lucky to have grown up around real men who want strong women. I feel sorry for you guys- my BF is right. There’s no hope for you and I’m only wasting my time.
But I AM spreading the word about “game” and “method” and “negging”- and all that BS. This is good to know.
I will be warning all the single girls at school about this crap so they can be on the lookout for these behaviors.
(Oh, and thanks for calling me stupid- I’m given to understand that your sort regard low IQ in women-folk as a GOOD thing, so I guess that’s the PUA equivalent of a compliment. I’ve also noticed that in the PUA community for a man to behave like an SOB is regarded as being “masculine” and “attractive”, so: “You’re a douche!”- there, now we’re even with the mutual admiration!- don’t tell my BF!)
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Circe,
But I AM spreading the word about “game” and “method” and “negging”- and all that BS. This is good to know.
I will be warning all the single girls at school about this crap so they can be on the lookout for these behaviors.
No effect. They are attracted to these tactics even if they know about them.
I feel sorry for you guys- my BF is right. There’s no hope for you and I’m only wasting my time.
You do not have a boyfriend, or at least one you are attracted to. As far as ‘hope’, you continue to display a shocking lack of comprehension for what Game is (actually, that is why Game works – because women are not logical).
Furthermore, the article is about how Game could SAVE lives. SAVE. SAVE!!!! Do you know what SAVE means? It appears that we wanted those lives to be saved, and you do not.
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Bonnie,
Well, simply read MTG721’s comment. It is self-explanatory.
How exactly do you think I should ‘practice what I preach’?
Better yet, just stop preaching feminism, and admit that you are repelled by feminism (as your actions demonstrate).
Your actions and your words are exactly the opposite. It is as though your subconscious mind has figured out that feminism hurts women more than anyone else. It is just that your conscious mind spouts what is fashionable.
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*gasp!* Oh noes!
I don’t have a boyfriend…or one that isn’t as handsome as YOU! And you forgot to add that I must be very fat.
Right? Surely I’m fat and unattractive. I must be, because I disagree with you and women who have their own opinions are hideous and single. And we only date losers.
Wow. This is some rock I’ve peeked under.
*laughs*
Oh yes, Men are sooo logical.
And that’s why it makes perfect sense to turn out the lights and randomly murder women that one doesn’t even know, women who were married or involved so he couldn’t have possibly dated them.
Very logical- its almost Vulcan!
Let’s be serious for a moment, shall we?
“Game” couldn’t have saved Sodini because he was BEYOND game. He was beyond game for probably a decade- maybe more.
His neighbors knew next to nothing about him and he moved into that house in 1996. He had NO family connection, no friends and he has virtually nothing positive to say about anyone in his life, even people who seemed to try to help him.
You guys really need to stop identifying with a sociopath!
Its pathetic, truly.
I mean, what next? A shrine to Bundy? (Ted, not Al.)
Yeesh.
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“Better yet, just stop preaching feminism, and admit that you are repelled by feminism (as your actions demonstrate).
Your actions and your words are exactly the opposite. It is as though your subconscious mind has figured out that feminism hurts women more than anyone else. It is just that your conscious mind spouts what is fashionable.”
I think your confusion stems from us having very different definitions of the concept of feminism. The word brings Gloria Steinam’s rantings to your mind – to mine, it brings fears of what would have happened to my family when my father (breadwinner) was disabled if my mother hadn’t been able to work (and hadn’t finished that college degree she had never used before). She is doing well now, supporting her remaining children, making a good wage, and still shouldering the burden of my dad’s health care even though they are seperated.
I see no disconnect between wanting women to have choices besides home and family, and not making the choices that would take me away from there myself.
In short: just because something is good for me, and might be good for the majority, doesn’t mean it should be the only option.
Also, just because something is natural, innate or biological doesn’t make it right. It is utterly natural for men to physically and socially dominate women – often to the point of abuse. I am thrilled though to be part of a government system that has shifted much of that power.
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Bonnie,
Well, respond to MTG721’s specific points, if you can.
The consensus here is that he called you on your ‘do as I say, not as I do’ hypocrisy quite spectacularly.
It is utterly natural for men to physically and socially dominate women – often to the point of abuse.
That is not natural at all. Quite the oppositem in fact. Men are protective by nature, while women are manipulative and subjugative.
I am thrilled though to be part of a government system that has shifted much of that power.
It hasn’t shifted it. It merely transferred the hardship over to the next generation of women. As Obsidian and others correctly point out, the biggest losers from feminism are not men, but average women.
So respond to MTG721’s points.
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Circe,
Yep. Game could have saved the lives of those women. That is what WE want, and what YOU oppose. Who is the misogynist now? (you are).
If Sodini had learnt Game, he would not have been subjected to the anti-male bias that permeates US society at all levels. He would have gotten a fair shake in life, relative to his income and appearance level.
No one is ‘identifying’ with Sodini – except you, because you wish you could do to innocent men what he did to innocent women.
America is a society where women have it much better than men. This, of course, is unnatural, which is why America is being overrun by patriarchal immigrants from sustainable cultures.
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*blink* Wow. Are you eating mushrooms? Aren’t you the male and therefore the one who’s supposed to be “logical?” (I’m doing Air Quotes)
Apparently your tactic is: When they have a good point, pretend they don’t and act like the other party is in the wrong.
It is an argument similar to: “But if a duck can’t mow the lawn, then there aren’t any hotdogs left, ARE there??”
And it makes just as much sense.
((Interestingly, I notice none of the apologists argued with any of the countless MALE posters above who suggested this man was autistic, intensely creepy or insane and therefore a bad candidate for “game”. So you are driven to attempt to prove a female wrong, but men are allowed to speculate without question. Hm!))
Since you seem to have trouble following a logical train of thought I’ll reiterate my point:
Sodini was a wreck, a hollow shell of a man and no trick or method would have worked for him. He needed therapy and possibly medication to start liking HIMSELF let alone manage a relationship.
But how would you understand that?
You and your ilk resort to word games, trickery and scorecards to try to land a mate, so I shouldn’t be surprised that you don’t see his sickness.
I mean, half the comments on this blog were spent JUSTIFYING the murder of innocent women that this monster didn’t even know- with nary a peep against them. It is beyond bizarre. There’s been three times when I thought “Nah…these guys are trolling! There’s no way they’re serious!” but the syntax and the wording…
I have to realize that you actually believe what you’re typing.
SO, here, in a nutshell is what this site seems to purport:
a) Though he shouldn’t have done it, overall Sodini had a pretty good reason for shooting up a gym and killing those women.
b. This actually will be a good way to expose the “plight” of the hapless, sexless American marginalized beta and omega males.
c) Within the last two years had he fully committed to ONE of these “systems”, he would have landed a woman and that would have kept him from his murderous spree.
Oh, that an that he’d have made a good candidate for dating in the family.
Nice!
Yeah. I’m done playing with the inmates, warden, let me out now. Its been fun, but I’m done. All in all, its depressing really. How does that saying go?
“Life is a banquet, and most poor suckers are starving to death!”
I might as well be staring at round bellied children in Ethiopia when I am here. I am back to my banquet, and I leave you to your devices. Good luck.
Truly.
I have been snarky, I confess it… But I do feel bad for the denizens of this place.
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When I read Sodini’s journal, I wanted to sit down and have coffee with him. Our society fucked him up. I’m sure his own chemical nature played a part in it but we really do a number on men. We’ve also done a number on women, and probably for much, much longer. I had compassion for him. I wish he had made a different choice in the end.
I’ve read as much of this blog as I can take – I read it for hours. I feel grateful for my wise husband, and hope he lives for a long, long time. I think maybe what we have done together is go through the phases of the Game, except we stayed together. We still love each other. And we are back to loving having sex. It was an enormous amount of work, love and patience. We are better off for it.
I’m sorry that things have turned out the way they have for many of you. I get what you are saying, and I know you really believe that women are to blame for things.
I think we humans are ALL to blame for the problems. You are just riding the pendulum swing way too far over to the extreme. That makes sense. I had to do that for a while after the first 33 years of my life with men.
You will get laid much more using Game, but you won’t get meaning from a relationship. For that, you have to bring your authentic self into it. My wish for you is that you start seeing the entire picture, not just the male point of view. Your point of view is valid. And so is the female point of view. You would do better to embrace both sides.
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MWC,
Game is precisely ABOUT learning the female point of view, and what attracts them to men. Go read the latest thread ‘One Reader’s Journey’.
It is the feminists who want to openly discredit any male point of view, with a shocking lack of intellectual curiousity. They don’t know what they don’t know, only that it must be hated, due to their misandry.
Men with Game know much more about female psychology than women could ever articulate about themselves. Feminists know the least about both male and female psychology.
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Aeofe:
I totally agree and have been thinking this for a long time, though I am also sympathetic to targeting women directly initially. This is why Roissy wrote the ridiculous FYI post about “Deservin’s got nothing to do with it” and is so dismissive of Sodini, as are other alpha males here. It is really funny how they think they can shame the losers into pacifism. You can’t. This is all brute war, nothing to do with entitlement, so that won’t work. There is no battle between the sexes. Women have no real power. The fight is between men for women. Men with access to women will defend women from those who don’t have access in order too keep the women for themselves. Now let us eventually see what men without women can do, particularly with increasingly destructive technology. Sodini is just a humble beginning.
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regarding: strangling a homeless man (as a personal measurement of determination and objectivity, aka for fun)
if you strangle a bum with your bare hands by his neck, presumably his mouth still stays open a bit. do you have a window of time to pour liquor down his gullet to further dissuade cops from investigating, from the self-incriminating odor? as blood-flow ceases, i’d imagine the throat would close off. is this a worthwhile rouse to attempt? (i’d hope that forensic labor isn’t doled out too heavily for dead bums, but you never know)
obviously, i’m not looking to fool the scientists, just hoping to prevent them from getting involved.
any wisdom would be duly noted and appreciated on this subject.
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””””””””””””I think your confusion stems from us having very different definitions of the concept of feminism. The word brings Gloria Steinam’s rantings to your mind – to mine, it brings fears of what would have happened to my family when my father (breadwinner) was disabled if my mother hadn’t been able to work (and hadn’t finished that college degree she had never used before). She is doing well now, supporting her remaining children, making a good wage, and still shouldering the burden of my dad’s health care even though they are seperated.
”””””””””””””””””’
You are thinking about it wrong though. People instead should be taught to work together till they can succeed even though something happens to one of them. Woman need to toughen the fuck up. Feminism makes them Wwwwwwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaakkkkkkk!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And it makes our nation
Richer but at the cost of mens and womans souls.
At some point the piper has to be paid at some point you can no longer work every hour in the day. At some point you have to sleep.
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””””””””msexceptiontotherule
Gunslingergregi – don’t make me use all of my work resources to force you to come back. After all, the psychic friends network has been shut down, and I need someone who can provide the occasional literary gem for entertainment.
man, this is when mr.exceptiontotherule is missed the most. damn him for his loyalty to the defense of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness & its fatal end.””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””’
I think I am done with the protecting life liberty and pursuit of happniness for all just gonna do it for myself 🙂
I did my last act as basically in my company and it felt good to do the right thing. I opened up a can of whoopass and hopefully understood the meaning of Pals. Stood up for the downtrodden and all that feel good shit. Funny in life when you do something and you think it will cause you to die or basically fuck you up. Majority of those times when you man the fuck up and do the right thing irrigardless of consequances it turns out for the best possible.
“Gives the cute little msexcaption to the rule a hug”
“gives blog a hug” he he he
Wish me luck!
“Cowads die many times before their deaths, the valiant taste of death but once”
Truth proven over and over in my own life.
I took the road less travelled and it has made all the difference.
Oh yea been to the cash and got the t shirt. Mua Mua hahahahaha
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p.s. not giving up on thread.
will hit 3000
I’ll be back.
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I think I am done with the protecting life liberty and pursuit of happniness for all just gonna do it for myself
Gunslingergregi – he died to defend what he believed in, and on behalf of his mother, sisters, nieces, and myself so that all of us would be just a little safer. Just because I knew what I was getting myself into doesn’t mean that I let myself believe it would actually be the reality.
& I am *not* cute. Evil, mean, sadistic, “bonkers”, ice queen; now those would be applicable. But not cute. We’ll see how cute ya’ll think I am when I show up with a grenade launcher at the office Christmas party. (Yeah, so I might need a little help carrying it in, considering that I’m closer to 5’0″ than I am to 6’0″ and the weapon I’m talking about is just about the same height – I’m gonna have to take my measuring tape and go measure it now..bbl)
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Yea exception I didn’t die after 5 years not gonna happen.
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Sometimes you have to let the dream of dieing for your country go and move on.
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WHR would be the perfect spokesperson for the Men’s Rights Movement. He put everything perfectly and even some of the fembots agreed with him. The ultimate victims of feminist social engineering are indeed children, men suffer residually and nearly as much.
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Gunslingergregi – I’d say something smartass right now, but I’m trying to order a nuclear bomb from North Korea on Ebay.
But I doubt that any gender or age group has suffered nearly enough. “No tears please, it’s such a waste of good suffering.”
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“You are thinking about it wrong though. People instead should be taught to work together till they can succeed even though something happens to one of them. Woman need to toughen the fuck up. Feminism makes them Wwwwwwwwwwwweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaakkkkkkk!!!!!!!!!!!!!
And it makes our nation
Richer but at the cost of mens and womans souls.
At some point the piper has to be paid at some point you can no longer work every hour in the day. At some point you have to sleep.”
I agree that we as a nation are in trouble. We should work together – and the easiest way to do that is to build bonds by traditional marriage and closer extended families. Children are the most important thing.
I just don’t see ‘feminism’ (which as a concept is creatively defined around here) as a root cause of societal ills. Contributing factor to some things.. yes. But many countries without ‘feminism’ as you define it are falling to the same problems.
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“So respond to MTG721’s points.”
You missed my gigantic response upthread? Reposted, with his ‘points’ excluded:
*I officially met my boyfriend when I moved into the apartment next door to him (from my parent’s house). He works locally and we had several mutual acquaintances/friends, so I knew who he was. I had dropped out of high school about two years before that, and had been working full time. If we had been different people, it could have been a situation where I got ‘taken advantage of’. While I hate to see people of either gender exploited or hurt in romantic and sexual relationships, I don’t think age is a deciding factor (although I do support age-of-consent laws).
As a feminist who believes many gender differences are innate, I disagree with the idea of ‘devaluation by the patriarchy’. A man desiring beautiful, youthful women is biological and natural. So is a woman desiring sexy men.
*My boyfriend’s standards are realistic FOR HIM. He only dates pretty women, who for the last 15 years or so have been younger than him. He has no trouble attracting such women – he’s blessed with good looks and he’s charming, funny, very smart and sometimes too nice (to the point where people take advantage of him). He doesn’t hit on girls or have casual sex, and lots of women seem to see this as a challenge.
Let’s get this straight here: I am not drop-dead-gorgeous to the average guy. I have a pretty face, look like a young Meg Ryan with much nicer lips. But I am very, very thin, which is hit or miss. My boyfriend has a thing for models so he thinks my body is fantastic, but your average guy, while they think I’m attractive, tells me flat out I need to put on 30 lbs.
‘Realistic standards’ just means understanding your own value and who is within your reach. With his post here, roissey is saying that Soldini could have potentially upped his value if he knew more about what to offer women. I assume you would agree (I don’t, in this case – from everything I’ve seen and heard about Soldini, it doesn’t seem he was capable of the social skills and mental flexibility it would have taken him to apply ‘game’ in a productive way. Moreover, if he was crazy enough to do something like this because he thought he had been rejected by ’30 million women’, I don’t know how much female attention/relationships would have helped him).
*When I met him, 5 years ago, he was working a lot less and making a lot less money. He lived in the same shitty building I do, delivered pizza for a living, dressed like a college student, and drove a clunker, so I assumed he didn’t make much. Right now, he makes under $60,000 a year (to my $20,000) – by delivering pizza and other non-prestigious methods. He is comfortable enough financially, but he has no career, no social status (people like him, but he doesn’t spend much time with friends). In short, he doesn’t seem like an ‘alpha’ to me. He is cute, and like I said above he is smart, funny, and very kind.
As for me rejecting ‘beta’ guys – I didn’t date as a teenager, and I have always disliked flirty, manipulative men. I have very high standards for all people. I can usually tell when someone is trying to ‘game’ me (in whatever way – men, women, sexually, or not) and it gets on my nerves.
*He looks and acts like a man because he is a man. If I didn’t like it I wouldn’t be with him.
He makes more money than me, but I make very little. His money brings him very little status that I can see. Delivering pizza is not a prestigious job. I fell in love with him waaaay before I knew how much money he made- I was surprised delivering pizza and the other things he does can bring in this much. So it’s a perk that he does okay financially, but wasn’t a consideration in the beginning.
I see nothing wrong with people wanting their partners to make a certain amount of money. And I don’t think gender roles are socially constructed.
*Soldini had severe mental problems. Most men can’t get a pretty young woman – there aren’t enough of us to go around! Life isn’t fair and never had been. My boyfriend came by his advantages naturally, and so did I. It’s no excuse for shooting people.
*It’s the way of the world. That doesn’t mean I have to like being harassed and treated not as an individual with dignity, as my boyfriend always has, but as a walking vagina. You wouldn’t like it either, but luckily you’ll never have to experience it.
*Listen, before he SHOT PEOPLE TO DEATH Soldini’s story brings tears to my eyes. Really. He was a sad, lonely, pathetic, deluded person. He deserved love like every other person does. But not everyone gets to have love. And most guys, especially slightly deranged or socially retarded ones, are definitely not going to be getting it from cute college girls.
Of course I have no idea what it’s like to be him. All I know is that it is breathtakingly obvious that guys like him have always had a hard time, and will always have a hard time.
As a feminist, I want more choices for women. I want them to have the same opportunities as men, even though most of us are not interested in living our lives the way men do. I do not want women to be forced to act like men, or vice versa – but if a woman wants to live her life like a man, she should be able to. If this reduces options in life for some men, I honestly do feel sympathy for them, but it’s much more important to me that women have autonomy over their own lives and the same rights as human beings that men do. Things surely aren’t perfect in this country for men or women, but I think (and all evidence I’ve ever seen seems to show the same. For all the hysterical claims of the posters here, I haven’t seen them reference one hard fact that might aid their arguments) better right now for all of us than ever before. At the least we are living longer.
As an anti-blank-slater, I believe a lot of gender differences are innate and biological. Men and women are different. I don’t think there is anything wrong with the concept of ‘game’ by itself. I certainly don’t like the tone of this site, but I take it with a grain of salt because roissy is a shit-stirrer. I do think his grasp of scientific method is shaky and he is pathetically eager to treat anything that agrees with his experiences as ‘proof’. A handful of studies (with a sample size of 413 and performed only on white male American college students) do not prove anything about humanity (they don’t even count as theories).
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Being a Vietnamese guy born in England it was pretty hard to attract girls, epsecially that I was short and fat in my teens to mid 20’s. I did get laid though, I just went and paid for it and got a bit obsessed with it for a while.
I didn’t get my first real girl friend until I lost the weight and started to workout, I got fed up of her after a year, and the more confident I managed get a few more girls.
Then I came to the US for work, and having an English accent definately helped meet the ladies and online dating sites started to spring up, so I meet girl through there.
I really don’t have game, and some times if I was between girls, a dry patch might have lasted 6 months, so I’d go back and bang a few hookers. So online dating, hookers and my English accent saved me from being a sexually fustrated nutcase.
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LR, you stupid obnoxious cunt. You are one of those high and almighty feminist cunts who belittle and ridicule “weak men” and you think you are so superior that you are immune from a bullet. Well, I hate to bring you down from your pedestal, but you are a human being, no better or worse than any of the men you reject. Maybe you have never heard the saying from the old west: “Samuel Colt made all men equal”. I hope you learn this lesson the hard way!
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[…] manginas like Ampersand felt so strongly about keeping American men from marrying foreign women. Import ten, twenty million nubile, lithe, young women to America and repeal the prohibition on prostitution and it would go a long way towards […]
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I am not a Beta, I am a Delta. American women are so self-entitled. They like to reject people and still want to be waited on. Frankly, I am tire.
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Men need to ignore women for a while. Men should go for the 5 and below from now on to make society a better place.
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on August 18, 2009 at 6:23 am msexceptiontotherule
Gunslingergregi – I’d say something smartass right now, but I’m trying to order a nuclear bomb from North Korea on Ebay.
Naa you just order the nukes china direct. Don’t use the middle man.
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Game can save lives bitches!!!!!!!!!!!
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I use fives for doorstops whats up now kic some shit. I got my dick sucked 3 times yesterday.
What now
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Gunslingergregi – now you just gotta find your door underneath all of those 5’s you’ve got piled up to the point of blocking your door from properly opening and closing, right?
Mr. Exception – now why didn’t I think of that. Must be the innate need to overcomplicate everything, being a woman and all.
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””””” on August 23, 2009 at 4:55 am msexceptiontotherule””””””””””
In my defense I was on drugs but are you really the temptress and who are you really msexception to the rule. I have my doubts on your individuality.
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gunz- if I told you, it wouldn’t be fun anymore. As for being a temptress – how the hell is anything I’ve said remotely close to an attempt at being enticing? Besides, I’m probably too old for that.
And why question my individuality? Last I checked, I try to consider all sides fairly, with a dash of personal revelation out of my own experiences. I also think it’s silly to launch attacks against the majority where they ‘live’ so to speak that are made by the minority — almost as if they think they’re going to accomplish a mass conversion. When it comes down to it, most of the minority group members are chased off with their tails between their legs. Sad, but not exactly the best tactics to use. They should try reading “The Art of War” or anything that discusses General George Patton’s military campaigns (the latter being more of a morale-booster of sorts than a guide to tactical maneuvers.)
and what kind of drugs were(are?) you on? drugs are bad, but not in the same way as having sex without a condom with a slut kind of bad.
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the art of war is outdated. In new war it is total annilation of your opponent or even of those you think might be the opponent. Hence my drug induced malaise. I don’t care about anything anymore. Must be some good shit. Except I will say my sister is flying in so apparently not all american woman bitches some can be helpfull at least to family.
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””””””””msexceptiontotherule
gunz- if I told you, it wouldn’t be fun anymore. As for being a temptress – how the hell is anything I’ve said remotely close to an attempt at being enticing?
”””””””””””
Your wantingly flauntinly brazenly
harranging my upbringing with the smarting
from your etticate and erudiating you self so my salavitating panting will go on sprinting in mindnumbing fleeting thought while fainting from the lucid picture your painting of the maintaining of my sainting to not be able to henforth go to the hanging.
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Hmmm…I find that Sun Tzu is, albeit in a more higher conscious sort of way, a brilliant tactician. Of course, his teachings are probably better applied to wars of a different type rather than the current “I’m going to blow you up before you can blow me up (hopefully)” military of today. One thing that I think could eliminate a major problem going on abroad – if they can’t agree on some kind of compromise arrangement over Israel; bomb it until it’s pounded into glass. Kind of like “If you can’t share, then NO ONE is going to have it.”
and gunz, you should really try to limit your consumption of illicit drugs and general intake of alcohol. I’m almost positive that you’re in a state that renders you highly likely to be walking into walls trying to find the door. That’s bad for you…very very bad. Like the kind of bad that leads to waking up next to someone and saying “Oh my F-N god what are you and why are you here (before realizing that you’re not at your house, so you get up and leave as fast as possible while getting your pants on ..more or less…)”
I’d hate to hear about that happening, of course. Unless you had a really funny story to share with it, strictly for entertainment purposes.
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I very rarely use drugs like never on my own except for cigerrettes but since this is a james bond type situation they are giving me the lobotamy drugs because I know too much. Sitting in hospital at moment. I may need your connections after all to get me out and vouh to watch me under your care in return I will fuck the shit out of you.
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I also don’t need drugs to come up with my crazy fucking true stories I like to remember the wild shit I do.
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Gunz; as flattering as your gracious offer may be, I am presently celibate by choice. Although I may be persuaded to use my connections under the pretense of a “mission of mercy/act of kindness” if you truly need to get released from a medical/psychiatric facility, that is. I’m not really the sort that excels in nurturing and warm fuzzies.
and wild is not the same thing as a bad decision.
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If I didn’t do what I did it would have been a bad descision. Since I did what I did my soul has some salvagability left. It is not a floating corpse of unlived dreams on a river of denial in giving up the essense that makes us men.
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now all I can think of is “they’re after our male essence!” and “my hand is bad!” from dr. strangelove.
which reminds me, I haven’t watched that movie in a while, but it’s been coming up during conversations everywhere!
Probably means that someone who was in the movie is going to die any minute, if there’s anyone noteworthy in the cast still alive.
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now all I can think of is “they’re after our male essence!” and “my hand is bad!” from dr. strangelove.
which reminds me, I haven’t watched that movie in a while, but it’s been coming up during conversations everywhere!
Probably means that someone who was in the movie is going to die any minute, if there’s anyone noteworthy in the cast still alive.
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Calm down woman your double posting when I come home I got the time and lots of money gonna travel round the world. I got a lot of love to give. he he he
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Well they found out gall stones just as I self diagnosed. So yea got too live 2 months with the fucking things. I hear there painfull.
hahahahaahahahhahahah
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dog pic
misquotes
burbly tude
gunny…i bet this chick
is at least a 7 irl
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Gunslinger wrote:
Well, I guess you aren’t doing that much better. At least you have a time-line now, I guess.
The bile stored in the gall-bladder does help digest fats. It’s best to keep the gall-bladder if possible, and doctors do like removing them. Maybe that’s the best/only choice.
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Not sure yea they want to remove it they say that I could wait. I just don’t want to have the pain again and have to go ahead and do same shit. Might as well get it done unless it is going to fuck me up worse.
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”””””””Firepower
dog pic
misquotes
burbly tude
gunny…i bet this chick
is at least a 7 irl””””””””
Yea Firepower I know and she is in love with me so kind of cool 🙂
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gunz – my dad had his gallbladder removed when I was just a kid…I think about 7 years old at the time…but that was back when they had to make really big incisions to do any surgical removal procedure (I’ll leave it to you to try and figure out how old that really makes me. Try to be nice of course, because it’s a really wide window as far as the number of years go.) I heard that they can use a laser via endoscopic tech, and 2 incisions about an inch for each; that’s only to break the stones up though, not totally sure about removing things. I say take it out, since humans really don’t need them much anymore…although there’s a long list of foods that you’re encouraged to avoid if you don’t want to spend an afternoon in the lavatory.
Of course, if you’d like to live dangerously, *I* can do the surgery…just get me a copy of Gray’s Anatomy and a surgical pack..and probably some anesthesia (which I don’t know how to administer) or chloroform and a lot of painkillers. I used to have chloroform under the kitchen sink – it was there for a few years but once I realized that it had gotten mixed into the wrong box to even be there in the first place and thus had no choice but to promptly return it to the lab it belonged in. Oh wait, can’t do that – wouldn’t want people knowing how to find me. Good luck with your medical stuff!
“I swear to god, if you don’t stop it, people might actually like you!”
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Oh, and it’s a picture of my dog licking the blanket she’s claimed as hers from the day I first brought her home from the shelter – in her sleep. Oddly enough, she does that a lot, but I think it’s kind of cute and she looks like she’s smiling even!
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People might actaully like me lol
wtf obviously I have a good side but sometimes I have to give tough love to feminists. I also have to live my life a certain way. I am honest about the things I do though and also chivalrous to an extent. Yea I was right on the love part. Good Good
It is all going to plan then.
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Hey, I’m sort of a feminist, it’s just that I’ve recognized how much more effective it is to embrace and then implement the strengths and skills – which are far more broadly applicable and varied than most assume women are limited to in these categories.
As opposed to going into an area that has previously been viewed as male territory only to give up when it’s discovered to be very difficult to keep up to the required level, especially when no one is pleased that you’re even there, which means they make life HELL until finally the person quits. And a glass ceiling is only as low as you are willing to allow.
“She’s the kind who smiles when she sits down next to you if you ask her to sit on your lap, because she doesn’t want to be sexually objectified, but respected.”
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I’ve looked around on the internet, and there does seem to be general agreement that it is possible to dissolve gallstones without surgery. Even main-stream medicine agrees that this is possible.
Exactly how to do this, and whether it’s a good idea in your case, I don’t know.
This site seemed interesting:
http://www.liverdoctor.com/index.php?page=liver-problems&subpage=gall-bladder
Anyway, it is certainly possible, in some cases, to avoid surgery, especially with the cholesterol-based stones. What kind of gallstones do you have?
And I don’t think messing up your digestive system for the rest of your life, however ‘little’ it’s messed up by removing the gall-bladder, is a great idea.
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“Perhaps a Beta Uprising which targets alpha males would have more success….”
YES. I Was just thinking this myself. After pondering on Omega rage and pain, I realise it would do the Sodinis of the world good to…to paraphrase Sinead O Connor…. Fight The Real Enemy
Gammas, Omegas, lend me your ear:
Your misogyny is, at worst, understandable, of this I will not argue. but stay your hand at those with the XX chomosone and heed….. Yes women ought stop having such high standards, settle more lower males, appreciate nice guys, give them chance etc….since this is what men have to do. But consider. We can be pretty damn content with a “5”, heck even a “4.5”. But what if there were many “10”‘s not only making themselves available, but AGRESSIVELY SEDUCING us? Would we bother with those 5’s? Is it reasonable to expect us to? So in this alternate reality, if a 5 is deprived the joys of sex, romance, marriage, and motherhood…who should she really blame? The men, or a bunch of bitchy, slutty 10’s who already have plenty of men, but still run around rubbing up against every halfway attractive man…simply because they CAN? Do the “math”. All alphas have to do is pick one or two of the hottest ass they can get and fucking MAKE DO with it…and it will trickle down to some come hither stares in Sodinis direction. But with each just-because-I-can extra lay, they brutally SNATCHED away Sodinis one chance at meager sexual contentment. And many alphas know this! Look at roissy’s blog! They know this and they’re laughing their sick fucking asses off about it!! May I remind you these are the guys who TORMENTED YOU IN SCHOOL?! REMEMBER THAT, OMEGAS?! And when we learn how the mating game is really played we realise they destroyed us far more than we thought they were when we were young. By beating us down, crushing our self-esteem, they were wringing out of us something PRECIOUS… our confidence…something ESSENTIAL to securing a mate, though we did not realise it at the time! Wake up and smell the locker insides and toilet water! Alpha’s, higher Betas….the Real Enemy, have always been our oppressors…their cruelty fueled by nothing other then their vile despising of the weak. Yet so many Gamma-Omegas wanna lash out at the cunts. Why? the reasons are obvious. when your beaten down and SCARED…SO TERRIFIED… of your oppressors, it is expected to direct your bitterness and hurt at softer, easier targets. I walked the path of misogyny too, and I’m not suggesting going back to women-are-angels bullshit. Its just that upon simple thinking, reflection, analysis whatever, I realise that misogyny is the easier path, yet it is ultimately the more cowardly. To any future, budding, wanna-be, halfway, or neo George Sodinis out there: i don’t, ahem, support the sort of bloodshed he was about or anything…but I’m JUST SAYING…. IF YOU HAVE TO SHOOT SOMEBODY, IF YOU HAVE TO KIDNAP AND TORTURE SOMEBODY..think on my words and ask yourself: WHO DESERVES IT MORE?! Ahem…of course in the name of decency and morality and all that good shit…I would have to advocate less psycotic means. Vengeance on alphas will be a lot harder and scarier than cunt-hatred….you may have to disiplne yourself…make yourself combat ready…and ulimately become that which you hate…heck I cant practice what i preach! but if you put down the “Stupid Sluts Take It Up The Ass Like they Deserve” porn and pick up the barbell, it will be potentially more rewarding, for yourself and (I think) society. And Alphas will learn the one downside rule of the alpha life: Watch Your Fucking Back.
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Anonomega:
So what you’re saying is that guys had better bring their own three way mirror?
And while we’re at it, there’s not much reward in vengeance attempted by mere mortals, and even God has stated that we need to leave that to him. You want to go home and ponder your life. You don’t want to advocate anyone going on “death to the alphas roundups “. And you’re a cunt for using the word cunt.
fucker. you don’t know what real combat is.
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”””””Of course, if you’d like to live dangerously, *I* can do the surgery…just get me a copy of Gray’s Anatomy and a surgical pack..and probably some anesthesia (which I don’t know how to administer) or chloroform and a lot of painkillers. I used to have chloroform under the kitchen sink – it was there for a few years but once I realized that it had gotten mixed into the wrong box to even be there in the first place and thus had no choice but to promptly return it to the lab it belonged in. Oh wait, can’t do that – wouldn’t want people knowing how to find me. Good luck with your medical stuff!
“I swear to god, if you don’t stop it, people might actually like you!”
””””””””””””
I am thinking we can have you do it with the spoon.
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“Gunslingergregi: I am thinking we can have you do it with the spoon.”
You do realize that this is surgery we’re talking about, not ice cream, right? And yeah, I do eat ice cream whenever the mood strikes – which can be often, especially when it’s blazing hot, so I guess I should be grateful that my metabolism eliminates concerns about my weight. I’ve been wearing the same size for just about a decade now, so I figure that I’ve got another 15 years or so before I’ll need to worry about my weight according to the current statistical analysis of my genetics.
“Has it ever occurred to you to not ask questions if you really don’t give a fuck what the answers are? Are you even listening to me?”
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lol just trying to keep thread and maybe our thing alive. Jean size sounds good. I start my destiny monday. Wish me luck. Oh wait thats labor day. Lets make it tuesday.
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You guys simply don’t know how good you have it. Feminism freed women from the control of their parents to control their own lives, and coincidentally gave them the freedom to choose who to fuck or not fuck. It’s that ability to choose that allows any of you to bed a women at all, since no parents would be throwing their daughter into a lifelong marriage to a loser.
You think ‘game’ would have got you a wife a hundred years ago?
Seriously, you’ve never had it so good, and all you can do is whine about it.
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Gunslingergregi; awwww…you know, you could have just told me that you wanted to keep things rolling before this, silly!
And what kind of destiny are you planning on starting today? (Since it’s Tuesday still where I am.) Will it have any llamas involved? How about some of those fainting goats – I still go to petting zoos so that if they have any of them, I can chase the kids completely out of the vicinity of the feed dispensing machine so that I can lure the goats repeatedly and scare them into fainting as long as there’s still quarters in my pocket and feed in the machine! The Mr. used to run interference on the petting zoo owners for me in past years, so I haven’t been really up for going to any since he died…It’s a lot easier to do when there’s someone that can do all necessary backup.
@good grief – American men wouldn’t be themselves without at least some whining and lack of gratitude for the things that they get.
“Easy….is that the same thing as calling someone a slut?”
“No, it’s what a slut usually is…easy.”
“Usually?”
“Usually.”
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So here is what happened:
Yea so monday night looking forward to busting the stock market and yea the pain begins. Off to the races. Pain like a solid wave of it. Like a permanant massive cramp that keeps going and going like the energizer bunny in your stomach. This time it would not stop. I am like fuck this. (still no tear) anyway yea I am swearing up a storm though like what the fuck is inside my fucking stomach jesus christ. Yea that sort of thing like maybe I could scare away the pain. Like wtf is wrong with you pain didn’t your momma have any kids that lived. Yea anyway this is funny part. I am like ok lets go get a shot to take care of this. I get to hospital at 0530 in morning and say I already know I have gallstones which is why I am in massive pain. Except by this time I am doing some fightclub type go to your cave shit and doing the compartmentalize shit in the head crap. Anyway they are like asking me all the info my little sister is answering some. This takes like forever then they send me over to another fucking nurse to do vitals. I am like getting slightly irritated and like ok can I just get a shot for the pain? The nurse is like we have to go through the process. I am like I might as well just go home by the time this is done pain will be over. The pain usually has only lasted like 6 or 7 hours. So already like 4 had gone by. So anyway they convince me to stay or whatever and she takes blood pressure and the temp and crap like that. Now I am waiting to see doctor ok waiting, waiting. Yea doc comes in and he is like what is problem I am like I have gallstones I was told so in dubai I am in massive pain and would like you to give me a pain shot. He is like umm we got to do tests bla bla bla. I am like dude I know what I have I want to get it taken out in another place because the hospital near my house is known to be fucked up. I just want a pain shot. He is like ok I’ll give you the shot and then give you a referral for someone to take it out. I am like ok cool fantastic. Then he leaves. I am waiting and waiting and waiting. Anyway I go out to the nurse station and ask what is up with my shot. Oh yea back up. They had me give a urine sample. Forward I am at the nurse station and say where is my shot. She is like we have to wait for the results of the urine sample. I am like are you kidding me. The doctor said he was gonna give me some help for the pain. THe nurse is like we have to follow procedure. I am like thinking you have got to be kidding me. Anyway I go back to room and begin a nice little curse stream going because I am pissed the fuck off and in massive fucking pain. Then 2 security guards come in talking about you can’t be dropping the f bomb. I am like dude the doctor said he was gonna give me a shot and now the nurse said it is gonna be at least 40 minutes to get the urine test back. They are like they have to follow procedure. I am like I go patriotic for this fucking country and go to its fucking war and I come back and I got to wait like this shit. The only reason they have that procedure is because maybe a junkie will ask for pain shot. I am like if a junkie gets a pain shot because he asks for it does that hurt anyone. I said that rule is retarded. They are like yea junkies ruined it for everyone. I am like no having no freedom is ruining it for everyone. They agreed on the lack of freedom to smoke was bullshit. But really letting someone sit in pain for two hours because some junkie might get a free shot big fucking whoop. At 730 I got the shot 2 hours after getting there. Then they hustles me out the door. Anyway the shot didn’t do shit. It made the pain worse. It took away my ability to try and contain the pain in any way with my mind. So now I am fucking there without any mind control just massive fucking pain. My sister calls them and is like what did you give me brother. They said they gave me the strongest thing they got. Anyway by 0830 I am like still in massive pain. (still no tear) I let the anger side of the force flow though. So yea they fucking drove me to a hospital about an hour away where my sister got her gallbladder out and by the time I got there the pain had finnaly started to subside and I was fucking out of it. They take me in emergency I stay there the night so yea destiny predicted just a different path than I thought was gonna happen. Today got the fucking thing out of me and now sitting at home afterwards. Hurts like a small bitch right now. After experiencing real pain though and knowing what that feels like now so bad to deal with lol. The doctor was like I can’t believe you went through what you went through. I guess my gall bladder was all kinds of fucked up and filled with puss. The doctor told me dad I must have been in some serious pain. She told me that anyone going through what I did over last few months would not be mentally sound and that I should see someone to talk about it. I guess I am superman. Fuck.
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Now I’m wondering how often junkies were going in to get shots of painkillers in order for there to have been a policy created that requires emergency room staff complete a drug screen of a patient before giving them anything – even if the person is literally contorting themselves as they writhe in pain.
So did they tell you whether it was an infection caused by the stones being there and doing some damage or just the stones?
Oh yeah, women have a higher pain tolerance than men do, probably some sort of adaptation to the whole having babies coming out of an opening that’s normally the size of a walnut – I bet that most soon-to-be-moms sit and hope that the kid doesn’t have a huge head when they’re born. A friend of mine decided she wanted to give birth with a midwife rather than be admitted to a regular hospital. So long story short, she ended up in labor for more than 72 hours without the option of having something for the pain administered, since by the time she didn’t think she could take any more pain it was too late and wouldn’t be safe for the baby or her. But she didn’t have an episiotomy(sp?) done either, I guess because tearing is better for healing even if it’s more complicated to stitch back up than a straight incision.
If you’re feeling faint, I’ve done my job.
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um…… yeah
the kind of guy who would shoot up a gym
is not really high on any woman’s men I would fuck list….
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“She told me that anyone going through what I did over last few months would not be mentally sound”……………..
OK, now I get it.
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””’SAW: South Asian Woman
“She told me that anyone going through what I did over last few months would not be mentally sound”……………..
OK, now I get it.
”””””””’
Fantastic
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3000 gonna be tough lagging out trying to post now perseverance is a virtue though or something.
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3000 gonna be tough lagging out trying to post now perseverance is a virtue though or something.
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gunslingergregi:
whew, for a minute there, I thought I would have to send out an extraction squad to bring you back in from whatever strip club or promiscuous woman’s residence you’d gotten stuck at.
Don’t make me worry like that again, if you know what’s good for you. 😉
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Hi Gunny! Glad you’re back. This post is to add one more towards your goal. 🙂
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lol msexception I think it is the womans job to worry about the man and the mans job to keep it interesting by putting her in positions to worry a little anyway he he he
If she doesn’t worry she isn’t your woman.
The mans job to kind of make sure his woman doesn’t have to worry about anything else though so she has the ability to focus her thoughts and actions on him.
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Keep up the good work Aoefe.
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Gunz: wait a minute..but I’m worried because if you died, I wouldn’t have you to banter back and forth with here. Which is a lot more entertaining than the situation some people have where they continually have to defend themselves from angry attacks. Comments are supposed to be something you WANT to read, not something you cringe at going through the responses that yours got.
Oh, and they should be thought-provoking as long as the thoughts aren’t telling you how much of a psycho-hose-beast you must be.
And I’d recommend that anything done with the intention of causing your woman to worry stops short of making her a psycho stalker who hides in your back seat when you leave the house, or drugs you so that she can install lojack on you while you’re unconscious. If you start to worry about her doing that, I’d start making sure I didn’t have any new incisions and didn’t hear beeping every time you move around.
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Well yea more like a subconcious intentional intention of making her worry and yea that is cute about the worry if dead what else should the woman worry about “carreer” he he he
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For the record enjoying the Gunny/Ms Exception banter.
Oh and I’m trying to please Gunny by adding yet another comment to his goal number of 3000.
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Gunslingergregi:
Well now that I’m pretty much on cruise control with my career – as long as I don’t do anything to screw it up or stop showing up for weeks at a time – I don’t have to worry about a sudden stall-out while I continue towards another promotion up the ranks. This means I’ll have more time to develop other things like becoming a stalker.
Where do you live again…..?
😉
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aoefe:
how many more do we have left before we hit 3k? I could have sworn that we’d gotten that many by now….*sigh*….gotta figure out how many more posts I need to come up with something cute to say for….
…Which is really going to cut into how much time I have for practicing to be a stalker.
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820 to go piece of cake if that cake was the size of MA.
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since I was gone for a little while I gotta catch up
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whooooooooooohooooooooooooooooo!
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gunz: and I’m more of an ice cream person, which as far as I know, doesn’t come in a MA size…I think that “trough” is as big as it goes…not certain since I keep mine limited to just the half a gallon container when I do buy it.
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Yea where did ya go? did ya find my address yet?
I feel like some cuddle time with you could have some healing qualities. No sex of course right away. he he he
I could probably build some sort of trough that you could use. Harking back to the teamwork thing between men and woman. I don’t think they sell ice cream troughs so gonna have to specialty make it. Which is not a problem just let me know just how many half gallons need to fit in it.
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Ms Exception,
I don’t know where we are comment wise….let me check. 2, 186 including this one.
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I suppose we could type love 800 times or so put that out in the world.
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Isn’t love a little too important to just start handing out to ANYONE that comes along? Not the kind of thing we should be out running around chasing people to give it to based on their ability for having a level of mobility that would assist in spreading all 800 little moments of love to a wider audience and make up for the time spent trying to determine who actually would matter enough to want to give a personal share of 1 out of the 800 we want to achieve… Just so we all know, the Sodinski guy would definitely NOT be one of the ones who would deserve such a recognition.
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I can feel the love already he he he
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And is it that wrong for me to find a story about a mudslide that completely took out everyone at a particular camping site, which they were at, IN THE RAIN, and were using the equivalent of a tin can in the housing aspect despite the numerous times that the park rangers came and told them that they should really consider leaving because there was no way of telling when and how much there would be in damage when the hillside came down – when, not if – as funny?
But in the ironic way or if using Murphy’s law. The mere fact that there were more than ten people who thought that it was impossible to end up badly enough to do any real damage to their rvs and whatever other campers they were using, only to find themselves stuck with all of those things plus an entire 180 degrees of steep hillside that came down from where they had their back to and all the rocks, tree trunks, and other things that came with it…it’s amusing that they could be so retarded for doing, and ended up costing more than just property damages for several people who had family members that were never able to be found in the mess even after things dried out and the conditions were less dangerous. And these people have kids? Who decided to let that happen? Didn’t they put any time into thinking whether this is a person who will not put a baby in this category of risk? Are they the type that will probably be seen when we get to hear on the news about what is on next which is the up-to-the minute report on the local family we will see in the story which will have to be about the death and beheading some poor neglected baby that was left where it turned out as the location ideal in the conditions needed to produce the result of having been killed when its head was taken off by a random wild animal that happened to come at the right moment to behead a defenseless baby that they might have been trying to comfort but because they’re a wild animal they don’t know that biting the head off is not the right way to do with any stray human young that a wild animal might find in their surrounding environment – all of this when this person who you plan to hand this baby to and just let them walk out and take the poor thing wherever they go…this is who turns out on the news to be the one who was supposed to be taking care of the kid when it found itself without a head after left on it’s own for whatever 2 to 60 minutes they weren’t there to see what was happening in any portion of the time…which shouldn’t take long, it is just beheading a baby after all…
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msexceptiontotherule — hey crazy lady —
paragraph breaks will make the reader’s eyes not bleed
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umm yea game could have saved that babies life. Maybe
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paragraph breaks are for sissy schoolgirls anon. The fun of talking in circles has not fallen on deaf ears.
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Man, all this talk about wild animals running amok and getting themselves in trouble for the occasional taste that turns out to behead a baby by total accident, is making me want to blow of everything at work and go find some goats I can make faint for the rest of my day.
And…now that my brother is going through some mid-life crisis which he’s used as an excuse to buy a motorcycle, there are a whole bunch of new possible ways to send him into a new kind of crazy….like how he intends to avoid all the deer that will be waiting for him somewhere on that road, so that he doesn’t have the same type of accident his father in law had while also on a motorcycle that collided with one very solid exemplary specimen of deer it was. And if he’s seen that one movie with Ice Cube riding around on a racing bikes meets the fast and the furious plus gone in 60 seconds type of motorcycle and looked at how ridiculous it was to see him on that cheap bike that resembled a moped in some scenes – and pictured how he is going to look riding the damn thing, especially to work like he’s expecting even after they get the first ice on the roads for the season. As long as it’s known that I am not the one who will be taking care of any of his kids, mostly because they’re already too big for me to lift at their current ages of 5, 3, and 10 months. I don’t know how my sister in law manages to do it, but she’s got three kids and plans for a fourth – all of which are going to have a lot of potential when they can play sports together so they can eventually be drafted for the basic defensive line a team could build on when they hit the wall of what they can try to save the old one before they just throw it all out and start the new one. My brother does only one thing that isn’t likely to benefit his kids at this age, which is how much time and some of the content in video games that are supposed to be for kids who can already read and marketed for kids over the age of 11 and just messing with stuff that is inside a computer they may later not understand as a problem after they remove it from one of the computers that he needs to have working and very expensive to fix, some that can even be caused by graphite powder blown into a computer tower and comes in contact with the point later determined to have been the first domino knocked down and took the rest down till there were none left standing – he played soccer all the way till he finished high school, and two seasons of football, so it’s not like he had nothing in his experience that would make him get his kids involved with being more active and maybe teach them to read before giving them a mini network of partial computers to muck around playing like they see as the same stuff he’s doing when he’s working at something on the computer.
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are we there yet?
how about now?
….
or maybe now then?
or here?
howabout
this one being when?
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and what on Earth would make me decide to do something with a sole purpose of preventing others from bleeding eyeballs….how often am I supposed to believe that actually happens to someone, because I am definitely sure it is not going to be any number that would be considered substantial enough for being studied by medical researchers and doctors who want treatments for all of these patients with bleeding eyes that keep turning up in their office.
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wtf lol
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and gunz…I would totally be worried if I were to run into a baby that had already developed some serious game in less than a year they had living life on the outside…well the outside for the place used for slow-cooking over the entire duration of 9 months that is needed on the recipe cards for incubating the best baby you can find and not be arrested when you try to take it home with you from the hospital that is known in major towns in all 50 states – that haven’t been over-run by a sudden increase in the zombie population and continues to shrink how many choices are left in the group left and will be expected to create a new group that will form the next phase as it continues rebuilding the better choice for this critical time in building the world’s population.
You have no idea how often you’ll end up facing a town full of zombies only for your dog to rescue you, since it’s clear that dogs are not of any interest to zombies because they are free to carry supplies back and forth through a mob of dead people that are trying to figure out how to get close enough to start eating the living people they must be able to smell the stink of life they have on them…Yep, world getting close to a total zombie apocalype by the minute.
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well, one thing is for certain..I’d totally be able to find for someone having to pick me from all of the other strangers that are in the same place…I’ll be the one wearing the skirt and heels you see chasing goats around to make them faint for the next few hours on my schedule for the day. I don’t even think it would matter if I was trying to make goats faint that are not the kind that you can actually get to do that, it’s not like they’re living lives with extremely high levels of stress that could harm them if I were chasing them all over trying to scare them for a couple hours straight with no luck. Besides, they usually eat any buttons that they can find somewhere on my clothing and I always empty those feed dispensers so that the only one that has it would be ME…and not the small group of kids that are having tantrums out in the parking lot.
I’d also be the one not wearing sensible shoes for a time most likely to be when a zombie apocalypse would occur.
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Thats hot.
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right now is a time that paris hilton should wish she read this blog and this post in particular. She could totally sue you for using her trademark/copyrighted phrase, “That’s hot.”
Still, she’s supposed to be good at the things she did on her sex tape from what people say, and she doesn’t make any excuses for the trivial things she chooses to fill her days and nights with doing. The one problem…is that she usually carries a dog that fits in a purse to most events and while socializing/shopping. Someday she might run into someone who wants to put her head on a plaque for the wall behind their desk in what they call an office for a sportsman slash CEO slash political figure slash someone who hates babies and probably goats too.
Alright, this one has to be where I put things on hold, gotta do the rounds to make sure everyone is doing their assigned thing to get done by the pre-meeting for the real meeting in the afternoon all of this work is being done for…Don’t worry, I’ll try to hurry back, x your fingers that I don’t have even one idiot who hasn’t figured shit out about what they’re expected to do if they want to come back to work tommorow instead of getting the option that’s not an option which is where they find they’re going to be leaving this place permanently which will take effect starting at noon today. Time to do what I must for the greater good….yay.
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@ guns
Writing in a blog is not brave, nor risky and not even rewarding.
then what’s the point in bringing it to 3000 comments? will you link your facebook profile to this thread and score some blogging-groupies?
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Cause I said I was gonna gig.
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Gunslingergregi: and it’s very important to actually follow through with something that you say you’re going to do. Regardless of what exactly it is, the ability to say that when you say you’re going to do and lo and behold, what happens? You’re one of the few people who are capable of follow through, without having to have someone nail you down so you actually have to do it. But oh well, some people are just too flaky, with the constant need to have something painful done to prevent them from going on to anything else when they’re supposed to be doing the thing they promised about a month ago goddammit.
and blogging can be pretty risky, depending on whether or not there are people on trying to complain about your lack of spacing between each line of text and how it makes their eyes bleed…good lord, get a pair and make sure they stay away from their un-descended position that drag queens swear by and also say makes them walk more like girls. F’n weirdos, funny sometimes anyway…hehehe
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lol risky blogging because of blog spaces. Risky is only having been back a month and already have been in jail and having another woman who says “I think I am pregnant”. I believe this is going to end up being wishfull thinking on her part just like all the others. She is like I want your baby and I am going to have it. I am like right guys need to have freedom of choice too. May have to pull a sodini if she can’t listen to reason.
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gunz: I’m down with that, just make sure you don’t pull a sodini at MY gym. I’d like to survive my workouts so that the whole point of doing them isn’t lost.
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Well she started her flow so yea I am off the hook for the life sentence. Was a wild week though. She tried to buy me a worlds greatest dad keychain. So yea some freaky shit. I tried to explain to her that I would not be paying child support period. She is like if they make you pay it your gonna. I am like no I can make descisions to do things in this life that cannot be enforced by anyone. She didn’t really get it I don’t think. People fuck themselves up I guess. She took a pregnancy test before that and ran it under water instead of pissing on it. So yea I am dealing with a freak. Give her some credit for worshipping my dick. She is like talking about raping me though lol I was like no we are not going to have sex anymore I am going celibate in the states. She is like what your not gonna give me any more dick. You can’t do that to me. I was just playing on the baby thing. I wouldn’t have your baby if you didn’t want it. I am like riighhtt before it was you are gonna have it then you aren’t gonna have it then your gonna have it then not. Yea maybe she wouldn’t have put me in system but I don’t really want to find out. This the crazy fucking part though. She is like I am gonna get the dick on monday when I come off my period. I am like wtf I said I don’t want to have sex with you no more. Where the fuck is biting beaver on this one chick talking about raping me. he he he Got to say I have never been raped by a woman before although came close on couple. This shit is crazy though. This bitch wants my kid for real for real. Guys need some kind of law to protect against this shit for real. Guys need to be able to give up visitation and responsibility for a kid because woman are looking to have kids with guys for real. This chick is on my dick like an all day sucker. WTF I heard of chicks keeping condom but this is like some wierd shit right here. Like a chick saying I am gonna have your kid. So really woman put themselves in bad situations. You try to warn them and they dont listen. You explain your position in life on a subject and they act like they don’t understand what your saying. This chick would probably act surprized if I fuck her then she gets pregnant and seeks child support on me and I slit her throat while shes talking about you need to take care of your kid meaning money of course. Stupid Shit. Not gonna fuck her though and protet her from herself. We shall see what happens.
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On the rape thing. I mean woman have begged me to fuck them before and I didn’t. This is some different terrain though. This chick talking about riding my dick even though I don’t want her too. Its a brave new world I guess.
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No one cares Guns, no one cares.
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I care Nathan even though there isn’t much to care about. The feminists and society cared about soldini but only after he popped caps if ten percent of population does that yea a lot of people gonna “care” but really what does it matter that people care. There really isn’t enough to this shithole called the world but yea I say go out with a bang. Then society will even “care” about you he he he
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No Guns, I mean no one cares to read your endless stream of unintelligible drivel.
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Look within at your intentions. What have you done? What have you contributed? Your probably one of the ones that thinks you can’t get rich in one lifetime or even ten years. Yea you have less than nothing. A walking corpse who can only try to put down another as his biggest effort at achievment. You are helping reach 3000 though so I guess that is something.
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I’m relatively new to this blog but let me add to what Nathan and I’m sure many others who are too polite to say it are thinking: Guns, shut the fuck up. What you write is nonsense.
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All I’m asking is a little respect for other readers of this blog. We shouldn’t have to scroll 5x the screen length to get to the readable, substantial comments. . Too alpha for full stops, Guns?
You have a blog man, use it! Then we can all not read your thoughts there.
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Look both you pussies are on a old thread talking shit but helping my cause. Keep talking bitches.
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Oh and nathan still couldn’t come up with anything you have done huh tough when you have lived your whole life as a pussy.
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Maybe the two of you can put your coins together and buy a sheep then you can have a threesome.
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Interesting the hate didn’t really come out till I talked about a chick wanting to rape me. Just work the game maybe some bitch will want to rape you too lol
Or maybe its that you can reach the pinnacle and its not enough because their is not enough to have. SOrry to ruin what your working towards but hey lifes a bitch what can ya do.Interesting the hate didn’t really come out till I talked about a chick wanting to rape me. Just work the game maybe some bitch will want to rape you too lol
Or maybe its that you can reach the pinnacle and its not enough because their is not enough to have. SOrry to ruin what your working towards but hey lifes a bitch what can ya do.
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I like when I get to read what others call useless drivel.
But I do have some advice for ya gunz; the best protection from crazy women coming after you wanting your sperm to add to their baby-making plans, is to not sleep with them. There has to be a normal way for a guy to weed out the crazy chicks without having to go into an incredible amount of effort to do so in the process. Since I’m not a guy, I couldn’t actually tell you how that would be done. It’s important not to try to give out information on actions that one is not familiar with in general, to avoid any backlash if a suggestion on the proper course of action fails.
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Sexentotherule
Here is the pitch thrown at you by an ugly chick when you get into a semi-compromise situation, ‘ Dude, if you do not fuck me I will tell them you raped me!” Double your fear if she is underage.
So, what are your options? If you have the minerals for it bury the chopped up bits all over the fields and swamps of your local region or, even better, be good friends with a pig farmer.
The only other option is to simultaneously try to keep on good terms with your stalker while planning an escape. And in that meantime you may as well pump a stream of load into her as not. I mean, no one is likely to get out of this alive anyway.
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Here’s a comment for you Gunny! 🙂
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”””””””””””Rum
Sexentotherule
Here is the pitch thrown at you by an ugly chick when you get into a semi-compromise situation, ‘ Dude, if you do not fuck me I will tell them you raped me!” Double your fear if she is underage.
So, what are your options? If you have the minerals for it bury the chopped up bits all over the fields and swamps of your local region or, even better, be good friends with a pig farmer.
The only other option is to simultaneously try to keep on good terms with your stalker while planning an escape. And in that meantime you may as well pump a stream of load into her as not. I mean, no one is likely to get out of this alive anyway.”””””””””””””””’
Yea shit can get crazy dealing with woman. I had the pregnancy and almost forgot about the strip club chick who ripped her toungue ring out on my dick. That was a wierd ass situation too like was she gonna say I hit her? I was thinking this gonna be some shit. SHe ripped it out all on her own. She wanted a tip I told her to fuck off (I used nicer words). Definetly a dicey situation too. So yea being where I am for a long period of time fucking with woman. Yea shit probably gonna get ugly at some point being in us is just bad for a guys health. Theres no future in it. How many stalker bitches could I accumulate in 2 years especially when they would never be able to measure up to what I have so yea never gonna love em so they gonna love me to death. I guess best course of action is to make them believe you have your own law and are above any worldy laws by nature of your killer instinct. Then buy a kennel. Really best course of action I got to get the fuck out of dodge.
This one probably best for long term protection while here.
”””””’The only other option is to simultaneously try to keep on good terms with your stalker while planning an escape. And in that meantime you may as well pump a stream of load into her as not. I mean, no one is likely to get out of this alive anyway.””
Then only fuck strippers and hookers per lucifer when in us in order to remain free of the chains that bind.
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lol msexception I could maybe make an exception in your case if you promise not to get preggers or do a false rape charge.
Really it is kind of fucked up how many guys are put in these kind of situations every day but ya just don’t here about it. I mean woman don’t stalk or do bad things right?
lol
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Oh and of course I promise not to rape or kill you or stalk you.
Should get leaflets printed up so people can then have relationships he he he
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””’aoefe
Here’s a comment for you Gunny!
””””””
Keep up the good work aoefe. We are gonna need more volume though to meet qouta.
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””””’But I do have some advice for ya gunz; the best protection from crazy women coming after you wanting your sperm to add to their baby-making plans, is to not sleep with them.”””””””
Course this is probably best advice and I am still laughing but it may not be the most exciting or dangerous. The problem with spurning woman and not having sex with them when they want your dick. IS that hell hath no fury like a woman spurned. Kind of flips life on a coin when the woman has a guy who doesn’t want the pussy it is their krytonite. So really to be a “player” is not easy and neither is pimpin lol
I did tell the story of the boss at work who was female. When woman want your dick they turn into something like the terminator. Very vicous yet you know they still can’t beat your ass. So they have learned the art of getting gov other people to fuck you up when they don’t get what they want. The tribulations of being a guy who woman want and betas think the shit is all fun and games until some bitch gets there feelings hurt.
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gunz: I’ll avoid anything that would possibly jeopardize my current place as stalker from afar, can’t have people thinking I’m the sort to compromise on a matter of morals anyway.
And for some reason, I totally want to go see Katt Williams, but I don’t think it’d be a good crowd for me. What does this have to do with your commentary here? I read the words “player” and “pimpin’..” with “ain’t easy” thrown in. If Ron White doesn’t die before he makes it out to the West coast on tour again, I’m going to see him – he reminds me of my mom’s side of the family which has quite a few black sheep characters who liked to drink, run around with women who had bad reputations, smoke, and get into as much trouble as they could find.
Does one always *have* to risk running into a woman who will do the skank version of Kathy Bates’ character from “Misery” by Stephen King though? Seriously. How will I stalk you if you’re dead or incapacitated by some crazy ass bitch?
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That is why I left out stalker I don’t mind that so much he he he
Just promise no preggers unless given permission and no false rape charge. Might want to add no false charge of any kind.
If I happen to fall dead which is almost impossible as I have learned in my various adventures in life. I am pretty fucking hard to kill. But if you would be the superstalker I think you could be I think you could find the grave and dig up the body. Maybe have me stuffed. Could work out fine.
Funny thing is I really don’t drink or do drugs I pretty much just like woman as my vice which is kind of a bad thing in current location it would seem. I do smoke though.
Unless I can do the put them to work on the street thing but not sure I can really pimpslap woman I don’t love.
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But yea a concert sounds allright. Sometimes the people you think would not be the type you would get along with are the ones you do.
Watching crank right now the movie rocks.
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The dude and his girlfriend fuck in the middle of that crowd. Dam that was hot. I do got to try that. Wonder what jail time is for that shit.
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”’Does one always *have* to risk running into a woman who will do the skank version of Kathy Bates’ character from “Misery” by Stephen King though?””””’
Yea umm a lot of woman turn into a version of that. Read some of the stuff from the formerly married guys. As far as in normal life yea shit happens. Why all the extra protection for woman is not needed. Look around at how many guys are gonna fuck up woman personaly. Now look around at how many woman can lie. Yea I think the number are a little scewed to say the least.
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gunz- hahaha, we have to at least be in the same time zone, since I’ve got the end of crank on the tv right now.
But of course I won’t try to rope you in with pregnancy, nor shall I falsely accuse you of anything. Mostly because it’s very difficult to do either when stalking at a safe distance.
And I promise, I will only accuse you of things you actually have done, I would hate to have a situation where I would get myself the reputation for bringing weak cases with flimsy evidence to support them.
Just so you know, sex in public is usually misdemeanor lewd and/or obscene acts in public, but if there are minors present at the time, you’ll end up having to register as a sex offender. So only have sex with your lady in a nightclub, and make sure it’s one that requires 21+ with a legally recognized form of id.
Oh yeah, and the only thing I’d ever have stuffed would be a jackalope; and not just the head mounted and hung up on a wall, I want a whole one from antlers down to the fuzzy tail and sizeable feet. Those are so expensive though, and hard to come by a decent quality taxidermist who does them….
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You don’t sleep either huh,
Good advice on the sex thing although if I do it in nightlcub whose gonna know he he he
But yea the standing on motorcycle and just crashing into stuff. Yea get to experience weightlesness for a while. I have done similar. Riding a “bike” down a hill pretty dam fast I hit one of those cables that come off the telephone poles at an angle. Caused me to fly through the air with the greatest of ease and went over a hill and ended up in a rosebush. Cushened the fall pretty good I guess. Walked away with some scratches. I was going fast enough to the point where the bike continued on by itself and the frame broke in half. So yea I survived that too. Soomehow a half inch cable didn’t fuck me up. So yea don’t worry bout the death thing not really possible. I have been in a car wreck where I destroyed the inside of the car and walked away with no scratch. Shits wierd.
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”””Oh yeah, and the only thing I’d ever have stuffed would be a jackalope; and not just the head mounted and hung up on a wall, I want a whole one from antlers down to the fuzzy tail and sizeable feet. Those are so expensive though, and hard to come by a decent quality taxidermist who does them….””””””””
Saw a video of a lion getting shot then it ran back at the shooters and almost got them. I guess could add that to my list of things to do. Stuff that and put it in house for convo piece. If you go on big game hunt they stuff if for you and take care of the red tape from what I hear. For your jackalope I could prob just get you a stuffed easter bunny. Yea I had to look it up.
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you know what they say gunz….no rest for the wicked.
and if you go to a club that’s 21+ you’d be the safest in the legal sense, you didn’t ask whether or not it would ALSO be the most visible location to complete such an act. It’s a trade-off; don’t want to register as a sex offender, gotta sacrifice the number of people who you’ll have as an audience. Besides, it’s rather unlikely that you’d have enough time to complete the act (depending on how many people, especially soccer moms, that have cell phones in the vicinity who are paying attention to the world around them) before the police would arrive and force you to cease and desist – and they can be pretty taser-happy these days. I wouldn’t be surprised if they forgot all about protocol and rules, just for the opportunity to use their taser on people *period*.
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Maybe just stick with the woods then I guess. Or I guess if do it then make sure it is on the superbowl field to make it worth it. I could just say I tripped just an accident like when whats her names tit fell out.
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But jackalopes must have antlers. In fact, it’s one of the most important characteristics of the jackalope species, which are extremely rare to find in the wild 😉 My dad and I have all kinds of fun teasing my mom about that kind of stuff. Now that she’s started to repeat herself on things she literally just told us minutes before doing it again, she’s an easy target. For weeks she talked about wanting the rabbit who was eating her garden to get itself into the trap-cage, so we did the whole “be vewwy vewwy quiet, we’re wabbit hunting” bit every chance we got. I know, it’s not nice to unmercifully tease one’s family, but it’s so entertaining!
Anyway, I’ve got to go finish the stack of performance evaluations and sign them all so that they can go out when I get into work in the morning. I wish that creative ways of expressing things were acceptable, since there’s a ton of ideas I could use if that were allowed.
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Ya kind of have to start your own business if you want to be majorly creative and even then it is quite restricted in certain areas. Like great white rides probably not going to be allowed in the states.
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gunz: I don’t know if those great white rides would ever be allowed anywhere at all, dangerous and everything as they are. But I thought that they were allowing people to go diving in one of those big metal cages off of hawaii and a couple of other places for the purpose of getting a closer look at sharks.
And I was thinking more along the lines of “creative” = this employee spends way too much time playing tetris on his cell phone and tries to sneak off to hide in the bathroom for the hour or so immediately after lunch. I think he’s having phone sex with some female employee in another division. Oh, and he does an impersonation of the board members that is less than flattering.
I don’t even know why I have to do stupid evaluations other than being the most responsible and having the highest job title – it’s just not normally one that they assign reviews and evals to.
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I will get them one day maybe or at least make some sort of effort. Just a glass open on top tunnel through the resteraunt with the bungee style cord attached to the rider. Make water level about same height as great white. With a quick snatch block type action should the rider be in any danger of being crushed or eaten. Should be some interesting shit. I mean do it because I don’t think it has been done.
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gunz:
What is it with guys and wanting to hang out with *real* sharks? Don’t they get enough of that in the human world? I know I certainly see enough predatory behavior for a few years just in the course of a week.
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It just seems that way or that it is harsh. Shark is life or death. Everyday life just an illusion of life or death.
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Plus conquering fear to get beat to death not that big of deal hung shot whatever. Getting eaten by a shark gonna fucking hurt or be the fight of your life.
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When you take a beatdown you don’t feel anything after getting knocked the fuck out he he he
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Course I will be building and selling an illusion that is more real than everyday life.
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I knew there was a reason why I avoid getting knocked the fuck out. Though I did ‘accidentally’ hit someone with the door they were standing too close to as I was opening it. If they’re going to try and listen from the other side, maybe they shouldn’t breathe so hard. It’s not even like I was saying anything they’d be interested in – though I might have, if they weren’t there trying to hear it.
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“Wonders what it would be like to chill out and not give a shit”
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Saw the add for movie where they stare at goats and make them pass out or die not sure which. Gonna have to go see that one he he he
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they don’t actually kill them, I think…but the ones I like have this genetic condition that they started to breed so there were more who had this particular trait. Initially it was seen as an effective means of keeping predatory animals away from the herd of what was viewed as
higher quality animals by having a number that would fall over and seem like easier meals as a choice. Then they found that it wasn’t necessarily true that predators would take the easier option though by then the goats who had the special condition were being bred for a strange surge in demand for them from people who intended to keep that particular type only, usually for zoos and private small farms. But they don’t seem to have anything else that would be a problem or make them ill-suited for the traditional goat uses, beyond the fainting part that is…though I don’t know if they would be a good idea to have out on hillsides clearing away brush that is difficult for people to get to and do…I can see them all rolling downhill one after the other now…it could be an issue.
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Men who stare at goats be there the movie of the century.
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[…] http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/05/game-can-save-lives/ […]
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I am so going to see that movie when it comes out in theaters on Friday. I don’t care that it costs like $50 for one adult ticket at this point, especially after seeing Ewan MacGregor doing all of the late night whatever shows talking about the goats and that’s pretty much what he said about the movie. Promising. 😉
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I want to know why so many men hate feminists, but at the same time feminism is the reason women can have sex freely with men. So what do you want? Sexually free women, or celibate women? Because celibate women means celibate men. But you hate the people that made us not celibate…I’m confused. Because believe it or not, we are also people (made of real flesh and blood! Surprising, I know.)
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[…] that infamous and widely misconstrued post (2,225 comments), what I actually wrote was: When men kill women, the underlying reason is almost […]
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[…] haven’t had the chance to cover the recent Pittsburgh shootings. Others have already covered it. However there are two things I have noticed that bear […]
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You say “a celibate man with guns is dangerous” then a feminist would say “repeal the second amendment”!
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What this guy did was unexcusable, on every level. I don’t care about his sexual frustration. He took the lives of innocent girls with a gun. Imagine the frustration and pain that their families feel over their loved one whose time card got punched out by this psychotic man. Picture getting the news from the police of your wife, your mom, your sister, your female friend, getting gunned down in an aerobics class by some guy you’d never heard of. I doubt you’d want to understand this guy’s inability to get laid.
This guy didn’t just kill those girls, its like he robbed their close ones of the chance to be normal again. That is fucking unfair and horrific and everyone here knows it.
For the record, I’m a guy whose gotten played left and right by women. Though I hate to admit it, I have not been in a relationship for a really long time. Girls don’t care, why should they? In response, do I get bitter, and sometimes carry hatred toward the female gender?
Absolutely, i do. But I don’t go harrass women, I don’t even approach them. I also don’t rant about my failures in a journal. I got friends, I got hobbies, i have goals in life. And I got enough friends who are awesome with women, so at least I know what’s going on in the dating world just over a beer, a nice dinner, or an intense jog, and sometimes that’s enough for me.
There’s things to worry about in life, like a career, being the best you can be in the gym, trying to maybe not give in to your vices, but how much this guy stressed out about not having anyone was ridiculous. Hell, i would have killed to have this guy’s job! He had so much going for him, and he didn’t even see it.
Sometimes I do think to myself ‘wow women have it so easy, they could just waltz into a bar alone, get 6 guys coming up to them right away. I couldn’t do that when I had money in the bank years ago, had great looks according to female friends, and had a very bright future.’
But I don’t care, I just gotta try to be the best I can be! And not for women, for myself, so I can be proud at the end of the day that I succeeded in life!
Even if I did end up with a lack of in-action this guy had, I wouldn’t get so mad I’d think I’d like to pull out a gun and shoot a bunch of innocent people.
If i did wanna take myself out, I would just probably do it alone. Just so everyone knows though, I wouldn’t even do that because that would be too upsetting to the people in my life who do care about me, and I wouldn’t want them to think THEY failed me, and they’re the reason I offed myself.
I can’t believe some guys here are saying that this is proof that the women’s movement is fucked up or is producing mass shootings. . .that’s a separate discussion altogether, there is never, ever an excuse for going down to gun innocent people, I don’t care what you have or have not been through in life. Boo hoo you’re not getting any? Grow the fuck up, way it goes sometimes.
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johnny doe, you’re an idiot. stop talking about yourself, because no one cares.
Not only is the women’s movement, but this CULTURE is F.U.B.A.R. This whole rotten structure will be sinking into the muck very soon. I can’t wait.
Pull your beta head out of your ass and stop working so hard, because this society doesn’t give two squirts of piss if you live or die and has nothing for you.
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Reggie ray, it’s a forum, I’ll say whatever the fuck I want.
I just think its disgusting to talk about a guy who guns down an innocent girl, and how that relates to sexual frustration, or how hard it is for guys. There’s no connection to the two, the guy was psychotic.
I was trying to show that shortcomings with women, or with people is never a justification to kill someone, using my own shortcomings as an example. That’s it. And just so you know, hard work is not so society recognizes you, it’s for yourself.
I don’t care or pay attention the feminist movement in this country. I’ll leave that to them and their boyfriends/husbands who support them in it, why should I or you care at all?
Even if you’re on some dumbshit like other people here, doesn’t mean some girls, and some guys here don’t think there’s a bit of truth to what I’m saying.
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”gunslingergregi
“Wonders what it would be like to chill out and not give a shit”
”””
It is not bad if you actually don’t have to give a shit lol
You didn’t quite make it to that point though but yea pretty nice.
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Still a ways to go he he he
game really can save your life though no doubt no game when I went home from iraq would have been problem
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Maybe he couldn’t get anywhere with women in addition to whatever problems he already had, because his brother and mother were PROBLEMS.
Lots of women will run for the hills if a guy’s family members are controlling/bullyish/nasty AND they have regular contact with them.
I also wonder if dude had Autistic Spectrum Disorder that may have hampered his ability to interact properly with women. Lots of people with ASD often give off a vibe that some people, rightly or wrongly, label as “creepy”.
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Whiskey wrote: “A bunch of men who are not invested in women will make trouble. For women and kids. That is all.”
Viewing women as nothing more than reproductive chattel, as fuck holes who exist only for men’s sexual pleasure (while it’s to hell with our sexual pleasure, including our right to prevent unintended pregnancy which fucks up our bodies and risks our health and lives — only to end up having to fight for child support); and viewing women as things to own instead of as equal partners of a species is not the way to “invest in women.”
Treating women like the human beings we are whose needs and feelings matter is a damn good start. But I am not seeing that from any of the men posting here.
Instead, I am seeing women being called “cunts”, “bitches”, “cameltoes”, “jezebel twats”, and “dumbasses” along with other pejoratives — all which imply that women somehow deserve to be punished for being children of a lesser god, that we aren’t even human enough in these men’s eyes for any kind of harm to us to matter.
According to the most recent census data, there are 44 million Americans living below the federal poverty level — 84% whom are women. Many are ending up permanently disabled or dying prematurely for lack of access to basic resources and things like medical and dental care.
Jobs considered “women’s work” don’t pay enough to live on, yet women who aren’t “pretty and thin enough” who get left on the shelf have no choice but to work to support themselves, and often a child or two (thanks to mostly beta “pump and dumpers”), and we don’t get to pay less to do all that than a man.
Yet, the majority of men posting here want all the free sex they can get (from only the most perfect-looking babes) while promoting job discrimination, imbalanced power relationships regarding marriage/divorce, and the impoverishment of all women, while us women get nothing in return — not even the benefit of a commitment and equal access to the marital assets, including the checking account, and something “extra” for us once in awhile even though the men are entitled to their young mistresses on the sly, their expensive toys and hobbies while we get nothing. And that is somehow “fair?”
Listen up misogynists and selfish nitwits of all stripes who bitch about not “getting any”: everything isn’t all about you.
On the matter of frustration and getting laid:
There is a lot of prejudice against fat women, against plain-looking women, against older women, against poor people, and against disabled people. There is also a stereotype that assigns such people to the category of “unfucakable”, or at least, “asexual.”
Yet many of us who fall into one or more of those categories end up having fulfilling sex lives and marriages. Is everything a bed of roses? No. But no one has a perfect life. That’s an illusion; just like our “meritocracy” and the American Dream.
George Sodini and these Mens’ Rights Advocates and PUA’s are a large part of the problem, not so much the victims of it. They see women as commodities with which to attain a higher social status in our class-stratified capitalistic society; a “trophy” with which to keep score of their masculinity, not as human beings.
There is a serious disconnect between their hatred of women and their desire for women. But they only desire women as inanimate sex toys that double as “arm candy” to inflate their egos, and then they wonder why they can’t “score” with the women who they claim to hate. By being selfish and inconsiderate, they’ve made themselves “unfuckable.”
No woman wants to go to bed with a man who really doesn’t give a shit about her — not even enough to ensure she enjoys the sex too, and enough to respect her right to not risk unwanted pregnancy which puts her body, wellbeing and life 100% at risk, not the man’s. It does not matter how much or little he makes or how “fit and trim” he looks.
George Sodini had so much more than 80% of those in this country who struggle, suffer in poverty (one paycheck away from homelessness) without access to health and dental care, never mind a decent house and a car. He had more than most in America ever got/will get the chance to have.
How many women in poverty would love to have had the privilege of a nice smile with their natural teeth, like George Sodini, due to equal opportunity for a middle class job with health and dental benefits since many women don’t find a middle class male willing to commit and provide her with that via his good job? Let’s put things into perspective here.
These men are not being sexually ghettoized because of being poor, disabled, or physically repulsive. It’s more likely that they’re not getting laid because they’re misogynists who treat women like meatpuppets they somehow feel “entitled” to “have”; rather than treating women like people. We as a society need to start evolving beyond this patriarchal privilege shit and treat each other with respect, as human beings worthy of love, affection, and sex — not as a “score” or as a special class who is “owed” something that others are somehow not. As for the element out there who consider certain classes of people as “unfuckable”, you don’t have to participate in that.
When your goal is not to meet people to get to know, talk with, hang out with and maybe sleep with, but instead just to meet someone “hot” to masturbate inside of; you’re not trying to meet a person. You’re trying to meet an object, a thing, a sperm receptacle. You’re not looking for a hot girlfriend because you find her interesting and sexually attractive. You’re looking for a disposable fuck trophy. There’s no deeper, more debased commodification than that. It is important to recognize the link between this commodification of every aspect of our lives, and especially of an entire group of people (women) within capitalism’s architecture of aggression and competitiveness which reduces our collective humanity.
Jacqueline S. Homan,
author: Classism For Dimwits
Divine Right: The Truth is a Lie
Nothing You Can Possess
Eyes of a Monster
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[…] One blog comprised of this “community” of males is riddled with over a thousand comments from men who hailed Sodini as a “hero” for teaching women a lesson: namely that not giving men — no matter how socially repulsive and hateful towards women — their “right” to sexual satisfaction, dead women are the “tax” society will have to pay. […]
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