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Chateau Heartiste

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« Cougars On The Prowl? No.
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The Limits On Hypergamy

August 27, 2010 by CH

Via Randall Parker, here is a study of birds showing that less attractive female birds choose equally unattractive mates.

Less-pretty female house sparrows tend to lower their aim when selecting a mate. Addressing the lack of studies on condition-dependency of female mate choice, researchers writing in the open access journal BMC Evolutionary Biology found that female sparrows of a low quality prefer males of an equally low quality.

Researchers from the Konrad Lorenz Institute for Ethology in Vienna studied sexual selection preferences in the common house sparrow. Though it has always been assumed that females will want to choose the best possible mate, in terms of reproductive and genetic fitness, Matteo Griggio and Herbert Hoi have found that, in fact, unattractive females dare not dream of mating with males who are considered out of their league. […]

“Actually, we found that overall, female sparrows don’t have a preference for badge size in males”, Griggio explains, “but we did find that less attractive females – those with a low weight and poor condition – have a clear preference for less attractive males with smaller or average-sized badges”. Rather than not find a partner, unattractive females will simply settle for an unattractive male.

Griggio continues: “There is some good news for the plainer females though – while they may be forced to settle for less dominant males with small chest badges, these males have been shown to invest more time in parental care than their good-looking counterparts.”

We here at the Chateau write a lot about female hypergamy, as it is a powerful motivating force in shaping the dating market and, ultimately, influencing your own success or failure with the opposite sex. Female hypergamy gets short shrift in studies and in popular culture because it is one of the uglier truths about women’s natures. Since gender is one of the four pillars of protected PC classes holding up the high church of leftist blank slate theology — right behind race but trumping homosexuality and any-religion-that-isn’t-Christianity — it makes sense that our commissars of media agitprop would work hard to avoid having to touch the subject of female hypergamy.

But we touch it here! And grope and fondle it lasciviously. That’s why it’s worth mentioning that even hypergamy must occasionally bow to the restrictions imposed on free market choice by female mate value. Although the above study is of birds, some parallels can be drawn to human behavior; parallels which are corroborated by real life experience. Women may loathe the idea of settling, but many of them do, as you can readily see by walking out your door and noticing all the ugly ass couples canoodling like they really enjoy the prospect of fornicating with each other.

Like the female house sparrow, less attractive women may deliberately avoid dating higher quality men in favor of beta males for a number of reasons:

  1. Less attractive women sacrifice too much to keep an alpha male around. There are plenty of couples where a much better looking man invested absolutely nothing into a skewed relationship and got all the sex he wanted in return. This might be fun for the plain jane for a while, but I’m sure the thrill wears off after a few months, (or years, if she’s truly deluded about her own value).
  2. Less attractive women figure they don’t have a shot, and so don’t bother flirting with alpha males. Call it the Sour Grapes Syndrome; a homely chick insists she prefers niceguys or nerds to the exclusion of those “meathead jocks” or “douchebags”, but in reality she is simply rationalizing her limited options. Sour Grapes Syndrome explains why ugly chicks don’t commit suicide en masse.
  3. Less attractive women have to make a trade off that more attractive women don’t. A hot babe can land *and* keep an alpha male around to help her raise her young, but a homely chick has to decide between a one night stand with a horny alpha who will be embarrassed by his slumming the next morning and a relationship with a beta who will lavish more caring attentiveness on her and any brood she may have with him.
  4. Less attractive women like to feel they are better looking than what their partner normally gets. This is a power law of mating dynamics. We all want to leverage our power in the dating market to the hilt, and a relationship where there is a big imbalance in power sharing is inherently unstable. Homely chicks know, either through experience or instinct, that dating alpha males results in a huge power differential that will almost always result in a breakup with her in tears. So she avoids dating alphas when it’s time to get serious about landing a committed man. Homelier women are smart to do this; studies have shown that the strongest relationships are ones where the woman is better looking than her partner. When a women feels pretty in the context of the man she is with, she will be happier… as long as the man keeps up his end of the bargain by having higher social status and/or game.

Note that none of the above reasons should imply that female hypergamy is rendered null and void for unattractive women. Human females are a little more complicated than house sparrows. In real life what we see are homely girls giving hypergamy the ol’ college try until their options, and their ability to stoically endure continual pump and dumps, are exhausted. This often plays out in practice with the widely observed phenomenon of urbanized 4s, 5s, and 6s suffering a series of humiliating short term flings with men well above their level during their 20s, followed by a grudging acceptance of the utility of settling for the boring beta male in their later 20s and 30s.

Seduction artists who like to dumpster dive (and really, you should probably turn in your PUA card if you prefer taking the easy road to low quality pussy) should continue treating the playing field as if female hypergamy was in full effect all the time, because most homely chicks — even the married ones — can’t resist getting used like a disembodied hole by a superior man.

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Posted in Biomechanics is God, Girls, Self-aggrandizement, The Id Monster, Ugly Truths | 84 Comments

84 Responses

  1. on August 27, 2010 at 4:38 pm Gorbachev

    Sadly, all of this is true.

    LikeLike


  2. on August 27, 2010 at 4:50 pm anplayer

    Why sadly? You might as well feel sad about preferring steak to burgers. We like what we like. Like the bull that produced the steak, the attractive women get eaten up with age in any case, it’s a tragedy for them whether they get selected or rejected. Speaking as a man who actually likes women, the dating market is really a no-win situation as far as they are concerned. Not suprising so many of them go a bit mad.

    PS: given the solipism of the female mind, you might want to point out that although high weight sparrows may be the most desirable, this is not the case for humans.

    LikeLike


  3. on August 27, 2010 at 4:54 pm Marwinsing

    As a kid scout I remember my scoutmaster “Sparks” who was an electrician/radio-ham sorta guy and his wife, Mrs Blignaut (I’m South African).

    He was a pint-sized bespectacled snout-nosed geek and she, a H-U-G-E vetkoek boeremeisie-type (farmer’s daughter) and their house was always in a complete and total utter mess.

    What beautiful days those were!

    I loved them.

    LikeLike


  4. on August 27, 2010 at 4:56 pm Night Prowler

    I love dumpster diving when I’m hammered. It’s more about how fast it can be done and what you can get away with when you play the away game. ATM is a standard I have set for myself.

    LikeLike


  5. on August 27, 2010 at 4:58 pm Ari Hinkelberger

    When you’re like an 8.5 and you’re banging a 10. This is the type of article that scares the shit out of you.

    LikeLike


  6. on August 27, 2010 at 4:58 pm raliv

    Superior man.

    Repeatador those two words over and over and over again in your mind.

    Superior man.

    Superior man.

    Superior man.

    What would a superior man do?

    LikeLike


  7. on August 27, 2010 at 5:03 pm Silver Fox

    Womb renting

    http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/08/27/renting-wombs-in-india/

    LikeLike


  8. on August 27, 2010 at 5:10 pm Vincent Ignatius

    This is all pretty intuitive. A girl takes the best she can get. The fugliest 4 will jump a quality man if he makes his intentions clear, but she knows she won’t be able to keep him.

    LikeLike


  9. on August 27, 2010 at 5:28 pm TLM

    Didn’t Pearl Jam record a song about this in the 90’s? Better Man was the title.

    LikeLike


  10. on August 27, 2010 at 5:36 pm SFG

    “Seduction artists who like to dumpster dive (and really, you should probably turn in your PUA card if you prefer taking the easy road to low quality pussy)”

    I never owned one to begin with. But as a geek, it’s fun being a sort of low-rent player…and it’s more fun being desired by a 3 than chasing submissively after a 6. Non serviam. I get enough of that at work.

    LikeLike


  11. on August 27, 2010 at 5:55 pm omegaman93555

    And yet a low desirability woman may reject a low desirability man, or not-so-low desirability man, only for an ego boost-

    http://gameforomegas.wordpress.com/2009/12/26/fat-women-and-the-omega/

    LikeLike


  12. on August 27, 2010 at 5:58 pm Joe Eoj

    “Seduction artists who like to dumpster dive (and really, you should probably turn in your PUA card if you prefer taking the easy road to low quality pussy)”

    Aren’t such individuals basically traitors, spoiling everything not just for men but also for women? If a (female) 5 gets a (male) 8, however briefly, she’ll never be satisfied with men at her own station again. This screws everything up (a) for her, since she now can’t be satisfied, and (b) for the male 5s she should theoretically be dating who now have to suffer her bitchiness.

    I have a new manifesto to make the world a better place: men, don’t go below your level! Quality, not quantity. In my book, it’s better to bang one ten than ten nines, better to bang one nine than ten eights, better one eight than ten sevens, and so on down the line.

    LikeLike


  13. on August 27, 2010 at 5:58 pm cap'n bob

    Speaking of game- no less than John Derbyshire is now referring to it and its effectiveness:

    http://www.johnderbyshire.com/Reviews/Miscellaneous/twoandahalfmen.html

    Today the Derb (and the Weekly Standard), tomorrow the Atlantic!

    LikeLike


  14. on August 27, 2010 at 6:18 pm Doug1

    Chateau—

    The all important slut factor was left out. It’s pretty much the sluttier 5’s 6’s and 7’s who are willing to date and quickly put out for alphas of some sort at the cost of being pumped and dumped or at best getting only a short term fling. More good girls insist on strong evidence of commitment which they believe may well become love before they’ll have full, which they’re unlikely to get from a male more than one sex rank above them. These girls just don’t exist so much in bars and clubs. They’ll likely have a pattern of several quite long relationships and also periods without sex (other than the self given kind) between relationships.

    It’s the slut factor which creates the desert for betas (male 5s&6s) and at least for casual sex, higher betas (male 7s).

    LikeLike


  15. on August 27, 2010 at 6:21 pm Laura

    I learned early on that to chase men that were out of my league made me look pathetic. However, if someone who was too good for me paid attention to me I very likely wouldn’t have the will power to resist his advances. Most women are weak when it comes to certain men.

    LikeLike


  16. on August 27, 2010 at 6:24 pm Doug1

    Joe Eoj–

    Aren’t such individuals basically traitors, spoiling everything not just for men but also for women? If a (female) 5 gets a (male) 8, however briefly, she’ll never be satisfied with men at her own station again. This screws everything up (a) for her, since she now can’t be satisfied, and (b) for the male 5s she should theoretically be dating who now have to suffer her bitchiness.

    Women have always been the proximate gate keepers of casual sex. Though in previous times and still in some religious areas of our society culture and social pressure put great pressure on them to only have sex with commitment, if at all before the heaviest commitment, marriage.

    Men have always banged willing sluts so long as they were decent looking and often if they really weren’t.

    Turn your shaming and control efforts where in used to be and always belongs (and the only place it’s ever effective for many) – on the girls.

    LikeLike


  17. on August 27, 2010 at 6:25 pm Anonymous

    @Joe Eoj
    Most PUAs are very unlikely to be 8s.

    LikeLike


  18. on August 27, 2010 at 6:25 pm gunslingergregi

    Yea but joe you got to work your way up ladder sometimes plus have something to fuck while you wait on the “good” girls to give it up. Then ya got to have something to make your woman jealous while your with her. Plus all her friends that she brings home are not gonna be as good looking as her.

    LikeLike


  19. on August 27, 2010 at 6:26 pm Anonymous

    Seduction artists aren’t diving in dumpsters, they are in the dumpster.

    LikeLike


  20. on August 27, 2010 at 6:28 pm gunslingergregi

    Now the friends that show up when she isn’t there yea those tend to be better looking he he he

    LikeLike


  21. on August 27, 2010 at 6:50 pm David Collard

    My wife is 49 and I still enjoy fucking her. If a girl is pretty to start with, not too fat and not too thin, if she doesn’t drink or smoke too much, she can look quite good into her forties. Her mother is a good looking woman for her age too, which is proverbially a good sign.

    My wife has aged really well. Still quite pretty (she dyes her hair), great legs still, her tits are not as fantastic as they were, but they are not too bad.

    Stick her in a pair of heels, a blouse and nothing else, and she is a plausible sex object.

    It is a myth that all women age badly.

    LikeLike


  22. on August 27, 2010 at 7:10 pm Marwinsing

    Birds of a feather flock together. Ugh… bloody clichés… nah man I’m an ugly motherf*cker and all I’ve left behind me this last quarter century or so are a string of beauty queens, a couple of femme fatales (one of whom’s late hubby gassed himself) and the most recent, a serious mental case heh. Strange life this. Wonder what’s coming up next? Surprise-surprise!!!

    LikeLike


  23. on August 27, 2010 at 7:11 pm Science

    I’d like to hear your thoughts on the sluttiness of women based on their attractiveness (ie- are the hottest girls -8-10s- actually less likely to cheat than then less attractive girls- 5-7s)… since a 7 can bag a relatively quality male for a one night stand.

    LikeLike


  24. on August 27, 2010 at 7:14 pm Science

    Mediocre females may have a totally different mating strategy than high quality females (date a beta and fuck alphas one weekend a month as opposed to dating an alpha and being faithful).

    LikeLike


  25. on August 27, 2010 at 7:35 pm cap'n bob

    David Collard,

    Some women do age very well. But they’re a small percentage of the total. And given the diet of Western Women, they’re getting less and less.

    The old poem advised women to “Gather ye rosebuds while ye may”. It’s still good advice – find the most suitable husband at the earliest age – but most women reject it.

    LikeLike


  26. on August 27, 2010 at 7:51 pm Bling Bing

    “find the most suitable husband at the earliest age – but most women reject it.”

    Maybe to most women and men it is not just about youth and beauty?

    LikeLike


  27. on August 27, 2010 at 7:55 pm dana

    another strategy for lower SMV women is the “beautiful loser” ie, the best looking possible man whos options have been curtailed by life experience or some non looks related flaw

    LikeLike


  28. on August 27, 2010 at 7:58 pm Grampa

    The interesting point, not emphasized, is that from the sound of it, female sparrows have more common sense than female humans in mate selection.

    I suppose that is the welfare state allowing dysfunctional behavior, but, still, it is interesting.

    LikeLike


  29. on August 27, 2010 at 7:59 pm greatbooksformen GBFM

    i recall dose alpha fucks to beta bucks
    i was benrnake’s fav. hottie back in the day
    losta cocka in my gina and lotsa cocka i sucks
    now it’s juts me and my cats every day.

    lzozozzlozozozzlzl buthex

    LikeLike


  30. on August 27, 2010 at 8:01 pm greatbooksformen GBFM

    “Bling Bing
    “find the most suitable husband at the earliest age – but most women reject it.”

    Maybe to most women and men it is not just about youth and beauty?
    ”

    lozozozozozlzlz

    yah, maybe to womenz its more about lotsa cocka and butthex and sevctive taping of butthes withh is why power womenxz promote and publish and por teh lies of buthexers and secrteiev tapers of butthex iwthout the girtlths ocntentnt.

    when women get empowere not only are we ruled by gina tingles, but anuth tingleths too lzozlzozzozozozozozz

    LikeLike


  31. on August 27, 2010 at 8:07 pm 1987 James Hetfield

    dana,

    what does SMV mean?

    Assuming it means ugly women, do you think even they can ever really feel anything but contempt and pity for the “beautiful loser” types?

    LikeLike


  32. on August 27, 2010 at 8:22 pm gunslingergregi

    Uhhh they don’t always make 4.60 an hour lol

    They can make more than median of doctors.

    LikeLike


  33. on August 27, 2010 at 8:24 pm dana

    smv=Sexual Market Value a la the Danimal not necessarily “ugly” just relatively lower SMV than others

    yes they worship them for their looks and support them and buy them things and suck their dicks because they are much higher quality physically than they can normally achieve. the beautiful loser also often has ltr game from NOT having been bad with women at some point and can drive the lower SMV woman insane

    LikeLike


  34. on August 27, 2010 at 8:55 pm SV Warrior

    Okay. Back to my distant past again. I show up at a dinner party primarily inhabited by what were then oldsters. Men and women in the 30’s, 40’s. I was 24 and just beginning to get game (even though we didn’t call it game back then). At the time I was dating this dynamite 20 year old Nordic blond but when I look back things were starting to come apart. She wanted to get married and I didn’t.

    Anyway, I am at this party and I strike up a conversation with this gal is about 35 and looks a like younger Julie Christie. She had come with friends but when they left she stayed behind to smooze with me and then asked me for a ride home. As I dropped her off she asked me come up for coffee or a glass of wine. I wanted to go up. I knew what was going to happen if I went up there. She was a cougar of sorts before the name cougar was popular.

    But I said “No, I have to head home.”

    I broke up with the blond about a month later. I never went back and asked the older woman if she wanted to hang out.
    Cougar or not, I regretted not doing so to this day. Of course because I was getting game I had plenty of other women to keep me busy.

    But I have always wondered what it would have been like.

    LikeLike


  35. on August 27, 2010 at 9:13 pm Manlyman

    @ David C.

    Post pics. We’ll decide.

    LikeLike


  36. on August 27, 2010 at 9:14 pm The_King

    I think a test of your alphaness is if you get approached by ugly or fat chicks vs. alpha females or hot cunts.

    Anyways, I’ve noticed that you are going on a tear like A-rod on roids, keep em coming captain.

    Always fun to watch women rationalize away.

    If you are alpha, try asking out a semi-ugly or fat girl to prom. She will flip shit, then break it off the day before and take the cheerleader captain instead. Ahhh good times.

    LikeLike


  37. on August 27, 2010 at 10:20 pm Dude Man

    @Joe Eoj

    Physically, any girl becomes a 5 rather quickly, and today most girls always have puppy dog eyes for alpha on the side walk.

    Mentally, or competence, or other things, I haven’t yet met a girl even close to equal.

    So, your principle would yield celibacy for the strongest and most able to suppress their whims and desires for morality.

    And that may be the point of the progressive mindfuck machine.

    The choices are:

    – Animal fuckfest, cock carousel, alpha your mom
    – Free and equal, and don’t worry about the decision of the other free and equal woman
    – Virginal, lifelong marriage, property/semi-property

    LikeLike


  38. on August 27, 2010 at 10:21 pm MichaelC

    @cap’n bob

    The old poem advised women to “Gather ye rosebuds while ye may”. It’s still good advice – find the most suitable husband at the earliest age – but most women reject it.

    The strategy requires good and honest judgment by young women — something in notoriously short supply (speaking as the father of teen girls). The strategy was workable when parents had the primary role of selecting husbands for their daughters. It’s unworkable when young women make their own selection, because so many girls have a grossly inflated sense of their own ability to attract and HOLD ONTO an alpha.

    As many have noted, the current strategy of young women is to spend their prime years chasing the “perfect man”, and then when they lose hope settle for whoever they can get. They would get a better-quality man for marriage if they made their selection closer to the age of 20.

    LikeLike


  39. on August 27, 2010 at 10:50 pm Gotz

    We should held débutante festivals like in some countries did in old times. At the 15 birthday the girl was introduced to society in order to find a husband. There’s no way to set early marriages society wide without cultural support. If I were the king of my country I’d forbid university for ladies, so they lose they carrer aspirations and look for marriage.

    LikeLike


  40. on August 28, 2010 at 12:26 am Black Rebel

    I remember once I was supposed to hook up with this girl who, while cute in a hipster way, was really just an average girl who was pretty cool.

    What happened when I was supposed to hang with her? She flaked, I called up an ex for a booty call.

    Lesson learned. If you’re an attractive male with game, style, options and a reputation, you shouldn’t lay it on so thick all the time.

    Game can help all men, but the amount of men game needed varies from guy to guy. The prematurely balding D&D addict with big glasses who’s 5’6 will need to have his game at like 9/10 to get steady girls. The 6’2 210 captain of the football team will get the same results with his game at 2/10. Much like you need to calibrate your game girl-to-girl, you need to calibrate how much game you yourself will need.

    Calibration…it’s everything. I believe it’s in The Art of War…sometimes when you are strong, it’s best to fool your enemy by appearing weak.

    LikeLike


  41. on August 28, 2010 at 12:33 am smelly monkey

    I dont think there is anything wrong in settling. It just shows that the woman/man in question knows what his reasonable options are and isn’t deluded enough to wait for a alpha man/female.

    LikeLike


  42. on August 28, 2010 at 12:52 am The Rational Male

    Absent the drive to marry and reproduce during their prime years, women today have MUCH higher standards than they should. They mistake the ability to get a high value male to pump them and dump them with the ability to obtain commitment from a high value male.

    Do women settle? Only when they are ready. And most urban women today aren’t ready until they are past their prime. What ends up happening is that they find a provider type to put a roof over their head and a nice car in the garage and maybe an ankle biter or two. This satiates them for a few years until they start to get bored and wonder what they are missing.

    Unless a woman is unattractive (1-4), she likely has a hugely bloated sense of sexual market value. See Gorbachev’s comment from yesterday’s post regarding cougars who are completely oblivious to why a man wouldn’t want them for more than a pump and dump.

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  43. on August 28, 2010 at 12:57 am The Rational Male

    smelly monkey-

    “I dont think there is anything wrong in settling. It just shows that the woman/man in question knows what his reasonable options are and isn’t deluded enough to wait for a alpha man/female.”

    The problem isn’t in “settling”, the problem is having that nagging thought in the back of their heads that they can and should do better.

    Inflated Sense of Value. This is a big part of what has ruined western women.

    LikeLike


  44. on August 28, 2010 at 1:52 am Prophet Jeremiah your Daddy

    Gorbachev is so gay, always: “Sadly, all of this is true.” He wishes it could be more easy, like in the gay world he lives in.

    Once I met Gorbachev for poker and he said, straight-faced: “I wish the power balance in gender relations was restated by the mass conversions of males to gay living standards, in which case they would be gay. I would have more females for myself… and boys in case I wronged in my delivery of game to the 6’s of my liking.”

    Astonished, I made a passing comment that he should try harder and higher, maybe 7’s or 8’s, before gaying it out. He then started talking about a business world ruled by gay CEOs, in which he himself had a prominent part.

    He is all “I am a concerned male” around here, but it is bullshit.

    LikeLike


  45. on August 28, 2010 at 2:18 am Hungry Hungry Hippos

    “one ten than ten nines, better to bang one nine than ten eights, better one eight than ten sevens, and so on down the line.”

    lol are you people high or trying to prove to the internet how high your standards are because you’re a masculine apex with elite game?

    LikeLike


  46. on August 28, 2010 at 2:21 am Kaikou

    @ Prophet- dude wtf?! Crazed

    LikeLike


  47. on August 28, 2010 at 3:43 am xsplat

    xsplat

    Superior man.

    What would a superior man do?

    Huh? Better to just be arrogant and know that you are superior. And if you are not, keep working on it until you genuinely are.

    LikeLike


  48. on August 28, 2010 at 3:47 am xsplat

    Joe

    I have a new manifesto to make the world a better place: men, don’t go below your level! Quality, not quantity. In my book, it’s better to bang one ten than ten nines, better to bang one nine than ten eights, better one eight than ten sevens, and so on down the line.

    If it’s the over-valuation of the value of pussy that you are trying to deflate, chide men who marry.

    Men have economic power, women have pussy power. It’s all out of what lately, because men are paying too much for pussy.

    Don’t marry.

    LikeLike


  49. on August 28, 2010 at 3:54 am xsplat

    Bling

    Maybe to most women and men it is not just about youth and beauty?

    Are you retarded, or just stupid?

    I was chatting a random internet chick last night, and found myself growing irritated. It was her attitude that MEN are not, or should not be, interested in how sexy the woman’s body is.

    Fuck you and your attitude to. Dating is about sex. Sexual chemistry. Heat.

    If I want a friend and someone to wash the dishes I’ll hang out with guys and hire a maid.

    Yes, it’s about youth and beauty. Grow up and get over it and flirt like a woman, not like a virginal a-sexual tomboy.

    LikeLike


  50. on August 28, 2010 at 5:00 am Gorbachev

    @Bling,

    You may want to believe that there’s more to it than youth and beauty.

    There can be. But youth and beauty are huge components. I lived in Korea; women there are considered, well, more-or-less worthless when they hit 30 and are unmarried. 30 there is 28 here (different system).

    Many men value more. But a sexual relationship is distinguished from all other relationships friendships, acquaintances, etc.) by one thing alone: Sex. All other things you can find with friends, close friends, associates.

    So, it being principally about sex (and no matter what a man says, this is what it’s about: Anything else he says is a lie), sexual chemistry is crucial to it all.

    LikeLike


  51. on August 28, 2010 at 7:11 am David Collard

    I agree that women are not normally very intellectually interesting. Their conversation, from a man, would be regarded as quite prosaic. But of course, anything sounds better from a young, pretty woman.

    My wife is not a stupid woman, and has a degree in the humanities, but she is rarely of interest intellectually. She is an intriguing personality, which is something. But a man who marries for intellectual companionship will probably be disappointed.

    As for “hire a maid”, we had a cleaning woman until recently, but she was more trouble than she was worth in some ways. When she turned up, she worked hard, but it means having a strange woman in your house. I found her personality irritating, and after a while women like that start to think they are part of the family. Women of that class tend to be flaky too. This woman had left her husband. I didn’t approve of her.

    It is better if your wife can run the house.

    As for maintaining control in an LTR, the mistake modern men often make is to forget that your wife is not, primarily, your friend or equal or “buddy” or “mate”. She is your wife. You, as a husband, have to maintain some distance from her. The key insight of “game” is that a woman will only find a man sexually interesting if he conveys some superiority to her. A modern husband, in a companionate marriage, has trouble with this. Under the older, hierarchical model, a woman probably felt more “‘gina tingles”. This is the deep truth that most people don’t get now. Why did women stay in traditional marriages, apparently without much demur? Because they were emotionally satisfied to be a wife to a head of house.

    But it is not hard to convey the impression that one is a traditional husband. Today my wife, son and I went to a small party. My son and I were the only males there, so I just decided to sit with my son and watch TV. I left my wife with the ladies in the kitchen. My wife served my son and me lunch from the kitchen. No fuss. Everybody was happy.

    It is a mistake to spend all your time together as husband and wife. It is unnatural. She won’t value your presence if she never feels your absence.

    Also, act like a man with your wife. She was wearing a cardigan today. I didn’t like the way she had it buttoned, so I told her to unbutton it. She complied. It is a myth that women resent being told what to do. It is small thing, but life is made up of small things.

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  52. on August 28, 2010 at 9:52 am Dream Puppy

    @MIchaelC “As many have noted, the current strategy of young women is to spend their prime years chasing the “perfect man”, and then when they lose hope settle for whoever they can get.”

    This makes me feel unbelievably happy, and somewhat smug, to be honest.

    Advice to people with female friends who do this. It is a hurtful subject to breach and usually people who are deluded don’t listen to you anyway….

    Would you guys give advice to a friend who’s sexual value was quickly dropping, yet she was still trying to find alphas (not just alphas, but alphas in a very specific niche). I don’t think one can advice another woman without coming off very mean.

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  53. on August 28, 2010 at 10:07 am Laura

    David,
    I actually like it when my husband tells me what to do. Most of the time, I don’t really want to be in charge.

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  54. on August 28, 2010 at 10:31 am Dream Puppy

    same w/ me laura. i hate being asked “what do you want to do today”

    i usually answer: ” i want to be led”

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  55. on August 28, 2010 at 2:16 pm The Rational Male

    Dream Puppy-

    “Would you guys give advice to a friend who’s sexual value was quickly dropping, yet she was still trying to find alphas (not just alphas, but alphas in a very specific niche). I don’t think one can advice another woman without coming off very mean.”

    I get this overwhelming urge to call out half the women I know (and a few men) on their pathetic delusions, but I hold back. Social conditioning is a tough thing to counter. A person has to want to know the truth to be able to assimilate it.

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  56. on August 28, 2010 at 2:24 pm xsplat

    Rational

    I get this overwhelming urge to call out half the women I know (and a few men) on their pathetic delusions, but I hold back. Social conditioning is a tough thing to counter. A person has to want to know the truth to be able to assimilate it.

    I’m not sure how deluded it is to overestimate your market value. My value is pretty low, and I shoot miles above my league. But I’ll hold out and use the hand when needed rather than settle. Because I can.

    Look, face it – women really simply don’t want to settle. They would rather use the hand. Who can blame them?

    You are not alive unless you are in love lust. Which of us would opt for anything less?

    Not me. I’ll be there again, no matter how many so so girls who are into me I have to pass up, and no matter how long I have to wait. You just don’t go back to daily gruel once you’ve learned to cook up a real life.

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  57. on August 28, 2010 at 3:11 pm Dream Puppy

    @RationalMale

    You’re right. I have stopped giving advice because it just never comes off right. Plus, people will do what they want anyway.

    As Dream Husband says, “The best kind of vice, is advice”

    I still feel like I am failing my friends though….

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  58. on August 28, 2010 at 4:28 pm betadyourmom

    re: “dumpster diving”

    In my experience, if you’re gaming below your league, a less attractive woman will quickly let you know. Lots of challenges about “why do you like me?” etc and resisting sex as to not appear easy. At least for me, a fuggy is much less amenable than a solid 6 or 7.

    And fat chicks, ug. The few times I’ve hung around with girls that were that were chubby, they practically oozed terrible self-esteem. Ugly people, ugly personalities.

    That’s why I kinda wonder about stories about guys “hogging” or “dumpster diving”. Women tend to know exactly where they stand on the totem pole. If anything it’s probably the guys overrating themselves and it’s really a bunch of 5 hooking up with 4s.

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  59. on August 28, 2010 at 4:59 pm ???

    It should also be considered that women have evolved to be attracted to beta males in some sort of way. Beta men provide a safe alternative for women. Offspring of “un”alpha women would have a better chance of survival if they had a beta male caring for them. Now one could say that’s where cockholding comes into play, but eventually monogamous genes would be passed down (beta would eventually knock up the cockholder more and more). The fact that some girls prefer beta over alpha might just be an expression of an uncommon evolutionary trait. Put it this way: not everyone wants a ford mustang, some people don’t give a shit and just want dependable cars= honda civic.

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  60. on August 28, 2010 at 5:42 pm MichaelC

    @Dream Puppy

    @MIchaelC “As many have noted, the current strategy of young women is to spend their prime years chasing the “perfect man”, and then when they lose hope settle for whoever they can get.”

    This makes me feel unbelievably happy, and somewhat smug, to be honest.

    Advice to people with female friends who do this. It is a hurtful subject to breach and usually people who are deluded don’t listen to you anyway….

    Dreamy, you did it exactly right: snatch up a good man before they’re either taken, or bitter over a bad relationship. Your female friends will be extremely envious of you when they hit their thirties. Beware of female “friends” who are critical of your husband, to make you think he does not deserve to be treated as well as you treat him — she may be trying to sabotage your marriage so she can snatch your man for herself.

    Don’t try to convince your friends of this. The quickest way to lose a female friend is to tell her what she does not want to hear. Then again, perhaps there are friends whose loss would create an improvement in your life.

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  61. on August 28, 2010 at 6:59 pm Half Canadian

    Female hypergamy is rendered null IF the woman makes a rational decision that hypergamy is not in her long-term interests. Call it sin, security, or alternative goals, but some women understand that slutting it up has a low, long-term ROI. Those who are planning for their 50’s, 60’s, understand that the cock carousel will not get them lasting satisfaction.
    Its the short-sightedness of women (and of men, let’s be frank) that leads to the all-out orgy that is modern dating.

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  62. on August 28, 2010 at 8:56 pm xsplat

    In my experience, if you’re gaming below your league, a less attractive woman will quickly let you know. Lots of challenges about “why do you like me?”

    Q:Why do you like me?
    A:I’m just doing my job as a man.

    Those who are planning for their 50′s, 60′s, understand that the cock carousel will not get them lasting satisfaction.

    There are girls who plan for their 50s and 60s? Even I don’t plan for them, and they aren’t that far off for me. I think girls plan for babies, and that’s as far as it gets.

    Future orientation isn’t always the best way to live a life anyway. If you were going to die today, and had to piece up your moments in 1000 moments, and re-live the 100 best over and over, which would you choose?

    If you live a life with more of those better moments, that’s a better life.

    What do you want, people with relatively happy older years, or people with a lot of great moments spent in their vibrant youth?

    You can’t even save up these acorns for old age. They spoil. Now is the best time to fuck around – the sex will be the best. The life will be the best. Fuck throwing that away just for some old years spent with some guy you’ve been with forever.

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  63. on August 28, 2010 at 9:04 pm xsplat

    ???

    It should also be considered that women have evolved to be attracted to beta males in some sort of way. Beta men provide a safe alternative for women

    Yes, some women are quite particular about how faithful and responsible the guy is. They can sniff out guys who are not family men and who offer no security, and they will not fuck them.

    But mostly women contain both extremes within them at the same time. Dual mating strategy.

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  64. on August 28, 2010 at 11:47 pm conscious animal

    david collard, you are hilarious. your name is funny too.

    ” I found her personality irritating”

    she’s a fucking maid, not surprising.

    still made me laugh out loud.

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  65. on August 29, 2010 at 12:40 am David Collard

    “David Collard” is a penname. Glad that I amused you, conscious animal.

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  66. on August 29, 2010 at 1:16 am xsplat

    Some people talk about the proof of a life well lived as being that last moment before you kick off, and you have someone devoted there beside you to wipe your ass. Some talk of the proof being the quality of life for your last few decades.

    No way. A life well lived is judged by the number of great in the flow moments you have. Whether you have them in your thirties or in your seventies makes no difference. You can’t hoard happiness – live well today – even if it means risking a lonely tomorrow. Because we all risk a lonely tomorrow anyway – no matter at what age you marry or don’t marry.

    People are too hard on girls who don’t want to settle down. Ya’ll talk as if they are irrational. Because they don’t want to perma-marry your type, they are irrational.

    Most guys don’t want to perma-marry girls below an attractiveness threshold either. Why fault women for what their attractiveness threshold is? They are build that way. Learn what is, and adapt to what is. Because ain’t no amount of shaming going to get a girl to do anything other than follow her own self interested options – and her self interest is about exactly what she is currently following.

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  67. on August 29, 2010 at 1:21 am xsplat

    Many people think that girls are generally over entitled and don’t realistically assess their long term mate value.

    It might be that, or it may be that they do realistically assess, and are taking a risk for a calculated benefit, in full knowledge that the risk may leave them bankrupt.

    Any entrepreneur will tell you that in order to win big, you have to risk losing big.

    Women do that when holding out for the best they can get before settling down, and they do that by settling down later in life rather than sooner. They know the risks – it’s worth it to them. They want what they want, regardless of the risks.

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  68. on August 29, 2010 at 3:11 am xsplat

    Dana linked to danimal recently, at http://myrsky.net/faust3/danimal-archive-part-2 there is this:

    Danimal Archive, part 2.

    The AIDS epidemic continues to worsen steadily. From a public health perspective, a sexbot is like a more effective condom: an artificial device a man sticks his penis into to stop the spread of disease, but unlike a conventional condom, a sexbot would actually feel good. I expect the AIDS industry to promote sexbots once they become good enough to start replacing real sex. AIDS advocates agitate to distribute clean needles to drug addicts. How would sexbots seem worse?

    Every cute girl I know has at least one hideous obese female friend who would be handy for discouraging aspiring Romeos.

    The idea seems to be that you want to deny the fundamental reality that most people can form relationships of comparable quality with any one of millions of other people. Circumstances determine who you end up with, but to imagine there is anything “unique” or “special” about that person denies the simple fact that everybody is replaceable. Besides, the average man has to approach dozens of women to find one who will relate to him. He gets rejected by 24 women, and then he spends the rest of his life trying to convince the 25th woman she is “special.”

    What was John Lennon’s net worth? I’m guessing he had more to imagine there than I do, since I’m probably a lot closer to “no possessions” right now than he was when he wrote this silly song.

    Putting on weight is a slippery slope. Someone who gains and then tolerates 20 pounds of excess fat has the personal habits and mental outlook in place to gain another 20. And so on. If anything, gaining the next 20 is easier. Being fat is depressing, and the depressed fat person turns to tasty foods for enjoyment, which leads to more fat, more depression, and more compensatory recreational eating. It does look absurd when you see the final result, but the process of self-destruction through self-indulgence takes a long time and proceeds in small, easily-rationalizable increments. Specifically, in mouthfuls. Everybody has to eat anyway, so there’s nothing shocking about eating a little more each day.

    Every time you step on the gas pedal, you are shouting “Go Bush!”

    Nobody can do everything they please and still function in society, except for the occasional despot. The process of growing up involves years of having beaten into us an understanding of many things we cannot do lest we offend someone else. Once we get used to stifling ourselves, it gets to be a habit and then we can start to think we are being ourselves at that point. And yet every normal human behaves differently when other people are watching vs. how he or she behaves when nobody is watching.

    I wonder why, in the debate about the existence of extraterrestrial intelligence, those who believe other technological species exist are called “optimists.” Given the huge difficulty most humans have getting along with most members of their own species, only a pessimistic human could imagine there are even weirder and more troubling beings out there somewhere who will challenge even more of our cherished beliefs, perhaps with disturbing new facts. Just as intolerant people plonk individuals, and sometimes even entire races or genders or political parties, I can imagine if space aliens ever do appear, lots of people will want to plonk all of them.

    I don’t know anybody who appears to have any trouble accepting himself or herself. “I am my own worst critic” is always the biggest lie.

    People who can’t even list 5% of what governments do think they know who should be the next President. Amazing.

    There aren’t many sure things in life. But almost any woman in the top 1% of appearance can certainly get a man in the top 20% of income (at least) if she wants.

    Disposability is the basis for evolution. Everybody will be replaced. If you like being a human as opposed to a monkey, then you approve of that process.

    It’s peculiar that professional sports are all about crushing your competitors, on the level of the individual athletes, and allowing talent and hard work to reap all the rewards, but collectively the team owners keep changing their own rules to prevent any one team owner from crushing the rest.

    A person’s sexual orientation contributes more to the content of his/her character than the person’s political views. I know lots of Republicans who don’t make a spectacle of their political views the way a cross-dresser makes a spectacle of his orientation. You could get to know some Republicans very well and never guess how they are going to vote. But you immediately know something is abnormal when you meet a cross-dresser. The cross-dresser not only has some particular orientation, but wants to make everyone aware of it.

    Young people cannot really imagine the horror of growing old. But they can plainly see there are virtually no sexually attractive old people.

    Five decades of work is plenty of time for any non-stupid person to accumulate sufficient wealth to see him through life’s end-game. All the old fart needs are (a) a stable society to prevent younger, stronger people from looting his wealth outright, and (b) the personal discipline to have saved at least 20% of his disposable income each year.

    Note: it is exceedingly rare for large groups of people to consider euthanasia for people they find sexually attractive.

    Why do you think old people constantly reminisce? Because their lives generally suck now by comparison to their much better memories of youth.

    Recall those Puritans who landed at Plymouth Rock with their idealistic hopes of founding a Puritan colony full of dour people doing their Puritan things. Today their young descendents are wearing nipple rings and downloading porn over the Internet.

    If a man is highly attractive to women, it’s likely he’s doing pretty well in some “other” areas, because women look for men with a visible knack for outcompeting and dominating other men. A beautiful woman could be stupid or whatever and feel insecure about that. Or she could market her stupidity like Jessica Simpson. Jessica is (or maybe her handlers are) at least smart enough to know that during her few short years of maximum sexual market value, something that would be a crippling flaw for a normal person simply makes her more intriguing thanks to her good looks.

    Being attractive means having options. People who can afford to vacation anywhere find it difficult to vacation in the same place every year. People who can afford 500 cable channels find it difficult to watch one channel exclusively. People who can eat in many restaurants find it difficult to eat the same food for every meal. That’s a different flavor of “difficult” than being unable to afford even one of those desirable things. Personally, I think having a lasting relationship career is more important than having a lasting relationship. It’s like being employed. Job-hopping is no worse than working one job for 40 years. The paychecks are steady either way. Both are better than chronic unemployment.

    Marketers tap into our essential hubris, our overriding self-absorbed belief that we truly deserve the best of everything. Marketers attempt to hijack our raging self-love by selling us the idea that to buy their products is how we love ourselves. “Because I’m worth it” makes a much better advertising slogan than “Because I’m a piece of shit.”

    It’s true that people who happen to be in the top 1% of looks are rarely in the top 1% of much else. But not much else matters so much, so easily, so automatically, or so universally.

    As long as the Randi Prize goes unclaimed, all the various religions have nothing but empty words, and some gullible followers who believe them.

    The odds are strongly against you and I having completely opposite preference orderings. And there is a good sociobiological reason for that: having preferences that drastically cut against the norm makes your offspring less likely to reproduce. Over time, there must have been selection against really oddball preferences in our ancestral lines.

    In any case, can you post the URLs of some photos of women you consider more attractive than Playboy models? If the Playboy models are not the penultimate in female perfection for you, what women are? I’m genuinely curious.

    I read some survey that said 80% of women fail to reach orgasm regularly with their partners. I guess most men are lazy, and most women are not very assertive. Or maybe most women don’t care if they have orgasms. Of course if you look at 80% of women it’s pretty clear why most men wouldn’t feel like making much effort.

    When I see people wasting time on Usenet, I suspect they are not like the guy in “The Bachelor.”

    If modern science were completely wrong, it probably wouldn’t work as well as it does.

    If you have some method of divination which consistently predicts the future with results better than chance, by all means go pick up your million bucks. It would be criminal for you to deprive the rest of humanity of your breakthrough discovery. That’s one reason why the Randi Prize is a safe challenge. If anybody can win the prize, the exposure alone would revolutionize all of human understanding and yield huge benefits.

    Few people can correctly maintain the distinction between (a) what happened, and (b) their belief about what happened.

    In general, the more people understand nature, the less natural they want to be.

    In any case, if you know so much more about men than Hugh Hefner knows, are you making more money than Hef by selling your alternative magazine featuring photographs of average women?

    For example, if I never read the news in print or watched televised news, I might not know the U.S. is fighting a war in Iraq. There has been no visible impact on my everyday life that I can think of apart from the news reports. My daily routine and the choices available to me seem to be exactly the same as during peacetime, and nobody from my immediate social circle is serving just now. The government has not imposed rationing. Every time I get on my bicycle, the roads are just as choked with gaswasters as they ever were. I see no indication that anyone around me is making any sort of wartime sacrifice. People like to read the news and get all emotionally aroused about politics, but when you turn off the news and go about your daily routines, how often are you personally affected by any concrete manifestations of all that political stuff?

    Faith is an extremely destructive mental habit because it can blind you to real empirical insight—things you can never imagine, but can only observe by learning. A person who is stuck in a blind alley and refuses to back out cannot be a good inventor unless his first guess is extremely lucky.

    The fact that McDonalds fills thousands of job openings does not indicate all those applicants consider burger-flipping to be the ideal job. Instead it probably indicates the applicants lack the skills to obtain jobs with higher pay and higher status. And I would guess a lot of burger-flippers certainly do care that they can’t get better jobs. A better way to estimate the desirability of menial jobs is to count the number of people who turn down high-status jobs in medicine, law, engineering, professional sports, entertainment, etc. to take menial jobs like flipping burgers.

    In my everyday observation of ordinary men and the women they date, it appears almost every straight man selects a woman who is close to being the most conventionally attractive woman he can get. I don’t see patterns like this: a man dating a succession of women who are, say, “6′s” and then finally marrying a woman who is a “2.” Instead he probably marries a “6.” Odds are he would rather have a 7, 8, 9, or a 10. But he can’t attract one strongly enough to get good treatment from her, and his dating track record demonstrates this.

    There is also a wide range of political opinion within the Republican party. There are Republicans who oppose the war in Iraq, Republicans who favor a woman’s right to abort her fetuses if she wants, Republicans who are openly gay, Republicans who are atheists, Republicans who are Muslims, and Republicans who are black. There might even be Republicans who recognize the best possible strategy to make America safer is to increase the gasoline tax, although I have yet to meet one. And yet despite all that variety of opinion within the Republican party you know there is something distinctly different between a vote for Bush and a vote for Kerry.

    More often than not, sex is easy for (young) women to obtain and difficult for (most) men to obtain, starting from square zero. Thus it is staggeringly obvious that regardless of who wants sex “more” in some abstract sense, most men want sex with (young) women way more than most young women want sex with most men. Sure, once a woman finds a man who meets her 300 specific requirements, and she feels comfortable in their relationship, her sex drive might lumber out of dormancy and amount to something, but she reaches that state with so few men that in most of her encounters with men it’s as if she doesn’t have a sex drive at all (that they will ever detect).

    By the time a woman is 70, odds are that hardly any men will want sex with her. If all the women in the world looked that bad, most men would not appear to want sex very much.

    “Yankee guy” subjugated “Dixie guy” and told him to stop owning black people. Of course only the wealthy minority of Dixie guys actually owned slaves. Most of the Johnny Rebs died fighting for something they couldn’t even afford. What tools. It sucks to find yourself on the wrong side of history.

    Of course every religion tries to cook up arguments about why their religion is special, but these arguments don’t work very well when all sides get to have their say. Most religions do best when they can quarantine their marks away from competing religions. Any time there is a sustained religious dialogue, the result is typically war. Because neither religion can prove it is right and the other religion is wrong. But they have to believe that or else there is no religion. A few people have tried in their mush-head way to claim all religions are equally true and valid, but that doesn’t hold water as long as rival religions keep murdering each other’s followers.

    If women wanted sex as much as men do, the AIDS epidemic would be ripping through heterosexuals in the United States as fast as it ripped through gay men in the United States.

    If you want to experience horrendous emotional and psychological damage, try working as a technical support representative for any small software company. At least in the sex industry you are selling a product that works, and satisfying the customer in many cases.

    Easy money tends to have a corrupting influence, and this applies to entire industries, even to countries. For example, cigarette manufacturers have had trouble diversifying to other products because they find they have to work much harder to earn similar profits selling things that are not addictive. And on a national level, what will happen to Saudi Arabia when its petroleum gives out? Unless the Saudis come up with something else to sell, the world economy will spit them out as completely worthless. And I doubt you will shed a tear. The day will come when Saudi Arabia has to work for its keep, just like the rest of us. And that will be a big shock to them, just as it must be for an aging beauty when she wakes up to find she will actually have to start working, at one of those undesirable jobs she avoided while her looks provided a better option.

    I happened to observe a public gathering of lesbians one time. I was amazed by their demographic oddity. Apart from one stunningly hot couple, the vast majority were collectively far less attractive than I would expect for a large group of similarly young women. Normally when I see a large concentration of young women (at a university, or outdoor festival, etc.) I notice quite a lot of eye candy. A woman whose looks put her in the dregs of her gender generally would have to select from the dregs of the opposite gender. For an ugly woman, that could be life-threatening. A man who isn’t attractive to many women may have to settle for a woman who is merely ugly; a woman who isn’t attractive to many men might have to settle for a man who is a violent sociopathic loser. So for a woman hit by the ugly stick, another woman is not a bad option.

    Paycheck size makes a big difference in how a person feels about a particular kind of work. Imagine if you got paid $100,000/year to flip hamburgers. For that kind of money, a simple job would seem like a game. The work itself is not particular degrading; what’s degrading is the normally small paycheck.

    Most people would probably quit their current jobs if they won the lottery jackpot and no longer needed to work, which indicates the need for the paycheck is a big motivator; but even so, few people could do something they truly hate for a modest paycheck. There has to be some other reward in there somewhere.

    Every profession offers its tales of horror. Which is why they must also offer paychecks.

    Women usually aren’t interested in jobs that are really dirty or dangerous. Ask the coal miners if they shed a tear for the poor exploited exotic dancers.

    Political analogy: women are the “swing voters” when it comes to sex. Election campaigns don’t waste their time trying to persuade voters who already have strong opinions about a candidate. You could show John Kerry ads to a hard-core Bush supporter all day, every day, and as you know the ads wouldn’t make a dent. Or, conversely, you could watch George Bush ads for the rest of your life and they would only make you hate him more. All that campaign spending goes to competing for swing voters. Telling men not to have sex with women when they can is like trying to persuade you to vote Republican, or teaching a brick to sing: generally a waste of effort. It’s more productive for moralizers to focus on moralizing to women, who can be persuaded to say no to sex.

    People believe whatever makes them feel good. For most automobile addicts, it feels good to believe they can just keep wasting gas like there’s no tomorrow. And that they can have their easy convenient transportation and world peace simultaneously.

    Thought question for all the so-called thoughtful people out there: suppose the only way you could continue driving your automobile would be to have the U.S. military conduct a thorough ethnic cleansing operation throughout the Middle East. Would you choose to stop driving in protest (or even consider car-pooling), or would you find a way to rationalize the operation? Perhaps by blaming it on the politicians you elect to do your dirty work? At the rate we are going, I suspect we will face a choice something like that within the next decade. Of course it won’t happen all at once.

    Not many attractive young women can earn more money by other means than they can earn by stripping/etc. Getting up to similar wages in “normal” careers usually takes a lot longer. But then those other careers typically last a lot longer as well. It makes sense for an attractive young woman to strip her way through university. Then when her looks begin to fade, she has trained her brain to pick up the load.

    I haven’t seen a convincing creationist explanation for the consistently ungenerous natural world, supposedly created by a generous god. It’s as if god’s goal was to make us all cynical.

    There might be some people who decide who to have sex with based on what magazines tell them. Are you one of those people? And how do you account for the failure of gay people to get the message? Forget about which women men are “supposed” to find attractive, a percentage of men shrug off a lifetime of social indoctrination and don’t find any women attractive.

    Before getting too proud of your renunciation of high-mindedness, consider that proletarians never use the word “proletarian.”

    It’s interesting to read an article on soc.singles—the monument to wasting time—that contains the phrase “but it really is a total waste of time” as if that is a reason not to do something.

    Are you smart enough to grasp the connection between your own driving, and the distant slaughter that makes your driving possible?

    It’s interesting to consider just how wretched the ability of humans to record events was in ancient times. Only a low percentage of adults could read or write. A sheet of papyrus cost the equivalent of $30 today, and the cost of ink and a scribe’s labor was many times higher. A single book had a real cost comparable to an automobile today. There were no reporters or scientists, no coroners, no one trained to evaluate claims of the paranormal. The few educated people had less understanding of basic science than the average high school graduate today. And even today masses of people get swept up in complete nonsense, such as the Roswell UFO story or the Jonestown mass suicide. The ancient world was a very odd place for God to reveal his plan for humans. There was little chance of getting a solid, indisputable record of exactly what went on.

    Man’s only hope is to fail the test of faith by rejecting faith as the wrong way to think. Imagine if people in the year 1300 and ever since had all accepted things just the way they were. We wouldn’t even have names for all those diseases, much less any hope of curing them.

    It’s quite an achievement, really, for the United States, where 82% of adults identify as “Christians,” to be as tolerant of other ideas as we are. A large number of U.S. citizens came here to escape religious persecution, and no particular sect gained an overwhelming market share, so they made the painful but ultimately beneficial decision to deny themselves the freedom to persecute those they disagree with. Then there is also the need to maintain a free flow of ideas to keep the whole science and technology thing going. Christians in the U.S. have made a real deal with the Devil there. They want to enjoy the material fruits of all those clever inventive godless atheists who corrupt the minds of youth in their infidel bastion universities by teaching them to think logically.

    Who knows, maybe in heaven you get to take field trips to hell to check up on your old friends. You can tell them inspiring things like “Today is the first day of the rest of your life.”

    All of us already have billions of years of experience with not existing (so to speak), so it’s hardly a stretch to imagine post-life is likely to be just like pre-life.

    Most farmers have a certain amount of common sense. They understand that to make plants grow they have to till the soil, plant seeds, get some proper weather, and so on. They cannot just believe their crops will grow and expect their belief alone will accomplish anything. There may be some primitive peoples who believed that, but they quickly starved themselves into extinction. The survivors could entertain a lot of nonsense (such as the belief they needed to sacrifice their children to make their crops grow), but only as long as they still did the things they actually needed to do. Arabs say “Trust Allah, but tie your camel.” They’re halfway to being logical.

    Read Darwin (and his modern interpreters Dawkins and Dennett) to understand why all living creatures not only have self-bias, but must have it. You will not learn what you are by reading the Bible, because the primitives who wrote the Bible did not know.

    If a religion becomes tolerant of competing ideas, that’s like a herd of zebra becoming tolerant of lions.

    If you have the good fortune to die of old age, I hope for your sake by then technologists have provided worthwhile artificial companions, so you can avoid the sad fate of living out your final decrepit years alone that awaits 4 out of 5 women. Or worse, living out your final decrepit years with a decrepit old man.

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  69. on August 29, 2010 at 3:24 am xsplat

    Woops – apologies for the above post (currently in mod) I only wanted to quote this:

    “If you have the good fortune to die of old age, I hope for your sake by then technologists have provided worthwhile artificial companions, so you can avoid the sad fate of living out your final decrepit years alone that awaits 4 out of 5 women. Or worse, living out your final decrepit years with a decrepit old man.”

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  70. on August 29, 2010 at 8:36 pm ???

    xsplat

    “Yes, some women are quite particular about how faithful and responsible the guy is. They can sniff out guys who are not family men and who offer no security, and they will not fuck them.

    But mostly women contain both extremes within them at the same time. Dual mating strategy.”

    Yes women have both urges but these urges are not balances, depending on the woman. The opposite ends of the spectrum are called sluts and goodgirls. The problem today is that the MSM glorifies the slut persona as empowering. So many girls could possibly be acting against their own nature. Or roissy could be right and all girls are whores (except our mothers). Never know.

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  71. on August 29, 2010 at 11:35 pm mustang lil

    Put it this way: not everyone wants a ford mustang, some people don’t give a shit and just want dependable cars= honda civic.

    hahahahahahaha LIES!!!!

    LikeLike


  72. on August 30, 2010 at 8:15 am Cyning

    This Roissy post is all stuff I knew subconsciously but this puts it concisely. I would say it’s depressing, but it’s always best to use it constructively if you’re male. At least you can compensate with game. Ugly women cannot so they self-justify.

    It explains my beta-esque predicament of receiving most interest from the ugly <5s. For example I've got an absolute swamp monster girl stalking me over Facebook. She's thick as shit and looks like she has low-level Down's Syndrome (hint to guys: if on Facebook/Myspace they have next to no photos of themselves but pictures of nature or holiday scenery, chances are they're unsightly in real life to the point that no makeup or flattering angles can improve them). I could be getting a lot more sex, but I'd prefer the painful dry spells over a demeaning lowering of standards. At least this way I'll have to up my game if I want some pussy. And be less approachably 'nice-guy' if I want to foist off the hambeasts.

    @betadyourmom: "And fat chicks, ug. The few times I’ve hung around with girls that were that were chubby, they practically oozed terrible self-esteem. Ugly people, ugly personalities."

    True. However, girls who are slightly chubby but not obese can strongly influence their overall rating by their body language and general aura. Roissy is right that women overestimate the value of confidence but there is a degree of comfort-in-one's-own-skin that helps their rating, as long as it doesn't come across as obnoxiously overestimating their value. An amenable nature and certain joie de vivre, men like that. The figurative baggage that a lot of fat girls carry with them can be as much of a turn off as their literal baggage.

    They also tend to rationalise their predicament. An extension of said Sour Grapes Syndrome is constant complaints about shallowness and perceiving as malicious social constructs those things that are in reality part of the Immutable Biological Script. And as such they tend to be leftists, feminists and whatnot.

    [Tangent ahoy] Basically leftism (going right back to Marx) and all it's bastard offspring are largely rationalisations borne out of the inadequacy of its proponents, quelling all manner of cognitive dissonances. This is not a popular image, so left-liberalism cleverly popularised itself through art and the media, and that's how relatively normal people have been ensnared in its tentacles or at least its central tenets. It's no good for one's dating market value to be socially ostracised, and that's one of the few realities that the liberal-left seem to acknowledge. [/tangent]

    An important thing in life is to second-guess yourself and examine your motives. Identify cognitive dissonances, eschew rationalisations and head on a path to self-improvement. There is no humility in blaming other people for your problems by way of social constructivist arguments.

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  73. on August 30, 2010 at 1:33 pm Ingersoll

    I don’t know what country you live in, but EVERY RELIGION gets the PC treatment. Christianity is the BIGGEST recipient of political correctness. Try critically examining it and running for office, or daring to suggest you are irreligious and run for office.

    This is why I don’t get the Chateau’s defense of idiots like Glenn Beck. Try criticizing his Mormonism or implying that the blanket idiocy of believing such tripe automatically calls into question his judgement of issues relating to truth. The victim-mogering is out in full force if you dare criticize ANY religion.

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  74. on August 30, 2010 at 1:34 pm Ingersoll

    Anyone who believe in any revealed religion is already exempt from any discussions about evidence and political correctness. When we talk about liberal “dogma”, why do you think we use the vocabulary of religious belief as an insult?

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  75. on August 30, 2010 at 1:38 pm Ingersoll

    Do you guys really think popuist conservatism of the Beck/Hannit/Limbaugh sort is any better in judging and accepting the merits of Roissy’s bracing realism?

    Race and IQ: Jews and Asians beat whites more than whites beat blacks. Realism doesn’t always mean priviledging ourselves. The research on IQ and testosterone differences in races seems to settle on parasite load – cultures with a high parasite load priviledge high testosterone males since testosterone is something only those with strong immune systems can afford and high parasite loads make it hard for infants to develop their brains

    Gender: Christianity pedestalizes women

    Evolutionary theory: Conservatism and Christianity thinks it is hogwash.

    Any realist conservatives worth their salt must criticize Christianity if they intend to go around criticizing liberal immunity to unpleasant evidence.

    People of Walmart: Conservatism loves them!

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  76. on August 30, 2010 at 2:34 pm K.K.

    Just out of curiosity, what’s “high quality pussy”? Elin Woods? Pam Anderson? Anna Nicole Smith? Britney Spears? Madonna?
    (They were all considered widely considered 9s at one point…raise your hands if you’d do them now.)

    It’s great if a girl’s ‘hot’, but it’s gravy. It doesn’t do much for you, it can give the girls egos or attitudes of entitlement…and it’s still ‘all pink on the inside’. Give me a 6 that’ll dish out steaks and beer over a do-nothing 9 any day.

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  77. on August 31, 2010 at 7:26 am David Collard

    Christianity does not pedestalise women. Read the New Testament. Women are subject to men; morally weaker; and a secondary creation.

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  78. on August 31, 2010 at 2:38 pm Professor Woland

    The real genetic payoff is having high social ranking, physically attractive sons. Who ever can have that sits at the top of the genetic pyramyd because an alpha male will out reproduce an alpha female. Having a low ranking son can mean genetic oblivion.

    All things held constant, an attractive woman will have as many eggs as an unattractive one. There will never be a shortage of suitors to knock either of them thanks to male promiscuity. For women it is not a question of quantity but quality.

    Having female offspring is a much more conservative reproduction strategy per se.

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  79. on August 31, 2010 at 7:24 pm kids club

    A really great looking man who is worth walking across the street to have a closer look at, it just as rare as a female of the same description. Men are just less inclined to think of the long term. Unfortunately many women are no less fussy as to how they spend their precious time.

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  80. on September 1, 2010 at 10:27 am K.K.

    “The real genetic payoff is having high social ranking, physically attractive sons. Who ever can have that sits at the top of the genetic pyramyd because an alpha male will out reproduce an alpha female. Having a low ranking son can mean genetic oblivion.”

    No offense, Professor, but this ‘payoff’ is largely illusory. You can crank out offspring until the sun goes nova, but you’ll still end up dead. Leaving behind a huge gene pool and a long-lasting bloodline is all well and good, but it’s ultimately a construct of the ego. The only reasons marriage was invented in the first place was to consolidate or acquire property and to ensure one’s offspring was in fact their own.

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  81. on September 5, 2010 at 1:49 pm Linkage is Good for You: Still Playing Catch-Up Edition (NSFW)

    […] – “Relationship Game Thoughts“, “Cougars on the Prowl? No.“, “The Limits on Hypergamy“, “Values Compatibility and Sexual Attraction“, “Chicks Dig Jerks: Chimney […]

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  82. on September 5, 2010 at 2:19 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””If you have some method of divination which consistently predicts the future with results better than chance, by all means go pick up your million bucks. It would be criminal for you to deprive the rest of humanity of your breakthrough discovery. That’s one reason why the Randi Prize is a safe challenge. If anybody can win the prize, the exposure alone would revolutionize all of human understanding and yield huge benefits.””””’

    I checked the rand prize and if that is what it takes is predicting the future then give me my prize.

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  83. on September 5, 2010 at 2:29 pm Gunslingergregi

    ””””””’xsplat
    Any entrepreneur will tell you that in order to win big, you have to risk losing big.
    ”””””’

    That is actually not true though.

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  84. on September 22, 2010 at 10:32 am About hypergamy | Deansdale's Blog

    […] Posted on September 22, 2010 by Deansdale There’s a lot of talk about hypergamy in the manosphere lately so I feel compelled to add my two cents […]

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