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Chateau Heartiste

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Measures Of Fuckability

July 18, 2013 by CH

Reader “Mr.C” writes,

One measure of Fuckability: How long you are prepared to wait in order to fuck her.

True, but how does one square this with the alpha male imperative to seal the deal in three dates or fewer?

The Three Date Rule isn’t binding. It’s best thought of as a hedge against developing one-itis or getting taken to the Tenth Circle of Blue Ball Hell by a cockteaser, where you drown in a sea of unexpelled sperm.

There are indeed scenarios where an alpha male might wait quite a while (relative to his normal allowance for waiting) to bang a glorious hottie. The crucial difference between an alpha male and a beta male waiting for a girl to put out is that the alpha usually has other irons in the fire and waiting for sex is his prerogative, while the beta has no one else and waiting for sex is his sufferance. And women can sense this differing weight of alpha vs beta male expectation. They sniff it out like dogs picking up wet poop in the air.

Naturally, men will be more inclined to invest their time and energy into a pretty girl than a plain girl. And their investment will rise in accord with reassuring signals of payout. That is, a girl who is making it obvious by her anticipatory behavior that she’s working hard to restrain herself in your company is a girl whose coyness you’d be more willing to accommodate.

So what are some other Measures of Fuckability (MOFs)?

– Amount spent on girl.
– Ratio of eye-to-eye contact to sidelong glances cast at other women walking by.
– Number of hours (or days) before scheduled date that the man thinks about the date.
– Boner triggers. Does smelling her intoxicating ovulatory aroma trigger a boner? High MOF. Does she need to wrap her lips around your schlong to coax a chub? Low MOF.
– Amount of feminist blather man is willing to tolerate.
– Degree of stupidity man is willing to tolerate.
– Rapidity with which man leaves post-coitus. Does he linger past brunch? High MOF. Is he out the door as the last spurt is settling in a flesh nook? Low MOF.
– Inducement to showcase his conquest. Is the man scheming to be seen in public with his lover? High MOF. Is he making excuses to her about having a rare allergy to sunlight *and* moonlight? Low MOF.
– Yes-man to No-man ratio. Being a yes-man = High MOF. Being a no-man = Low MOF. (Game-aware men subvert this tendency.)
– Fap to fuck ratio. If you’re fapping more than fucking your girl, LOW MOF.
– Porn to foreplay ratio. If you’re spending more hours watching porn than engaging in sexy foreplay with your girl, LOW MOF.
– Video gaming to fucking idle thoughts ratio. Extremely low MOF if time spent thinking about vidga gaming is more than time spent thinking about fucking your girl. (Actual time will vary regardless of MOF level, because GUILD WARS.)
– The degree to which an undersexed game hater resents your date for throwing into stark relief the dumpy frumpiness of his wife or girlfriend. More resentment = higher MOF of your date. You lucky dog! Banging a hottie *and* driving an old skooler traddork to histrionics!

Author note: The longest yer humble Chateau proprietor has waited for a bang was five dates, not counting those first tentative steps toward poosy paradise at the tender age of [REDACTED ON ORDER OF CPS] when yer humble pubescent pioneer had nothing but his wits and an untrained, if keen, power of observation to guide him.

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Posted in The Pleasure Principle | 226 Comments

226 Responses

  1. on July 18, 2013 at 12:30 pm morgan

    i have a pretty long meet-to-make-it lag most times, unfortunately. a lot of the time i have bunches of irons in the first and unexpected ones finally respond with some form of winky and i know it’s on.

    how long is the cutoff in you guys’ minds, like if you’re actively pursuing? again, i don’t necessarily do that, just curious.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 10:00 pm Southern Man

      Ditto. At my age and station in life, I don’t date at all. However, I do plant lots of seeds. When a girl I haven’t talked to in six months texts me with “U seeing anyone?” I know that all I have to do is not screw it up. My last two started just that way.

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 7:02 am Southern Man

      Yeah, same here. At my age and station in life I don’t really “date” anymore but I plant lots of seeds and wait for the harvest. When a girl I haven’t spoken to in six months or a year texts me with “U seeing anyone?” I know that all I have to do is not screw it up. My last two started just that way.

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  2. on July 18, 2013 at 12:31 pm moe jones

    Sounds like the author may have a level 80 elementalist or two running around

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 7:49 pm Anonymous

      http://geekologie.com/2008/10/guy-plays-36-world-of-warcraft.php – heartiste?

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  3. on July 18, 2013 at 12:32 pm Socialkenny

    As for Mr. C’s take, I agree in the nuancical difference between the AFC and Alpha. The average Joe has no other pussy to bang while all of his eggs is in 1 proverbial basket. The Alpha can afford to wait since he’s banging others (although he won’t wait).

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  4. on July 18, 2013 at 12:36 pm newlyaloof

    nothing but his wits and an untrained, if keen, power of observation to guide him

    What was your exact training route like through the red pill journey, Heartiste? Were you a beta growing up? I’m assuming we all were at some point except for a lucky few natural alphas.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 12:43 pm morgan

      i always assume that too, i doubt many naturals could really teach or understand a lot of the shocking revelations that take place along the journey. but who knows.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 12:54 pm Tilikum

        “i doubt many naturals could really teach or understand a lot of the shocking revelations that take place along the journey”

        its more about putting words and concepts around what comes naturally. you get really really good.

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  5. on July 18, 2013 at 12:47 pm Joe

    So what do you do if you meet a virgin girl who’s not willing to put out before marriage ?

    [CH: Do her in the ass. “It doesn’t count”]

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 12:49 pm Maya

      You wait until marriage. (If you are truly in love with her, if not – you leave)

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 6:16 pm Zombie Shane

        > “(If you are truly in love with her, if not – you leave)”

        A Darwinian Nihilist like Heartiste ain’t never gonna give you much in the way of an acknowledgment of the existence of an abstraction like “Love”.

        Although it will [or would*] be interesting to see whether his attitude changes once he becomes a father.

        That’s when the rubber hits the road – if he displays the same careless insouciant indifference towards his own progeny that he displays towards his casual partners in fornication, then heaven help those poor kids.

        And their mother.

        *Hopefully he’ll shut his damned mouth and quit blogging once he starts getting really serious about Life.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 12:50 pm cryo

      Only two options here: marry or kill.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 12:56 pm tj

      Fly to Vegas on date 3 so you can fuck her

      How hard was that?

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:03 pm Maya

      Hearts is joking. Anal sex is pretty degrading. I think.

      [CH: You don’t think women love to be degraded by a powerful man?]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:10 pm Maya

        I don’t know. Probably not. Or maybe yes. I really don’t know.

        [CH: Where’s there’s doubt, there’s no doubt. – ronin]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:53 pm Black Poison Soul

        Women absolutely love being degraded. The number of women who have taken it up the ass in our first encounter was one of the most fun things to learn about life – and that was before taking the Red Pill.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:14 pm RappaccinisDaughter

        What about oral? There’s a nice compromise.

        Seriously, starting with anal could be enough to put a person off sex permanently. If that had been my first dive into The Life Erotic, my next step would have been to start searching for a nunnery that would accept an agnostic into its ranks.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:57 pm Canadian Friend

        At least 70 million women think being degraded by a powerful man is absolutely wonderful.

        we know that for sure, because over 70 million women bought and read ” Fifty shades of Grey”

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 8:11 pm hairy ape

        I’ve been wondering for a long time, how SOP is anal sex? I’ve been talking with my dad (a player back in his days) and he’s absolutely appalled by anal. He says wtf with gay sexual practices being used by heteros. “Wtf is wrong with your generation?”

        I’ve never done anal since I’m still a beta schlub, but could it be used as a litmus test to see if a girl is really devoted to me?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 5:01 pm V

        “could it be used as a litmus test to see if a girl is really devoted to me?”

        I suppose it could, but listen to your father and gbfm and dont buthexting

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 8:15 pm hairy ape

        Since when was anal sex standard in measuring devotion? Apparently I didn’t get the memo.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 12:54 am tompaine37

        This is NOT a joke in my experience as a young Christian

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:37 am Johnny Boy

        You know, maybe there is something wrong with me, but I’m a guy who doesn’t get the appeal of anal. First of all it’s gross and unsanitary. I don’t want shit on my junk. And second it’s a matter of principal.. I’m not gay, so why would I want to have sex the same way a gay man would?

        Don’t get me wrong, I have no problem whatsoever degrading women. But that’s what BDSM is for. Tie her down and spank the ever-loving crap out of her before giving her the banging of a lifetime (and if she hasn’t had that done to her before, rest assured it WILL be the banging of a lifetime). In my less experienced days, I seriously underestimated how willing women would be to reciprocate my desires to do that to them. Of course, one need no further proof than the popularity of “50 shades”.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:15 pm cynthia

      What makes hetero anal sex good for either party? I can’t understand why women enjoy it (not like we have prostates), and as for men, doesn’t the average human female already come equipped with a hole made specifically for fucking that self-lubes? Is it tighter?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:20 pm Maya

        Yeah, it’s probably tighter so men enjoy it more. I think it’s painful for women but they like it because the man they love is enjoying so much …

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:32 pm Matthew

        Eroticized transgression, I would think.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:34 pm cynthia

        That does seem the most likely. Physically, it just doesn’t sound fun.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:02 pm RappaccinisDaughter

        It isn’t. It hurts. A lot. I’ve had wisdom tooth extractions go dry socket, I’ve passed a kidney stone, I’ve had compound fractures, I’ve torn a calf muscle, I’ve had major surgery, and I’ve had a cracked tailbone. I’d put anal right in between the calf muscle and the cracked tailbone in terms of the pain scale.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:19 pm Canadian Friend

        As I said above some women like it so much they ask we do it to them.

        again and again

        It is not every woman’s cup of tea, that, I completely understand.

        If it hurts you that much then you should refuse to do it.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 7:10 pm Zombie Shane

        Your man didn’t lube up for you?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:30 pm bigdickeddeadgordon

        As a heterosexual man, you might not think I would have much to add to this discussion, but you would be wrong.

        Last year, while having the flu, I took the strongest over-the-counter medication available. Unbeknownst to me, one of the side effects was constipation (you might be able to see where this is going). During this period, I didn’t particularly care that I was not removing waste from my body regularly and may not have even noticed. I was just wanted the flu to go away. Eventually it did.

        Then on a Sunday, after I had been feeling better for a few days, I decided it was time to sit on the toilet. It became apparent in the early going that this would be no regular trip to the toilet. 30 minutes passed – nothing. An hour passed – nothing. I told myself “Just be a man and force it out”. I tried but was unable to. The idea that I might need a doctor to inspect my ass loomed in my mind.

        After having tried epsom salts and other laxatives, I decided it was time to swallow my pride and visit the emergency room.

        An enema is procedure that lasts about 20 minutes. The nurse (an angel of a woman in my case – extremely gentle and empathetic. A lovely soul) will ask you to hold in the solution for as long as you can, but 20 minutes is an acceptable period. In hindsight I wish I had kept it in longer, because in pushing this rock-hard beast out of my body I thought that (a) my anus would stretch so much that my bowels would fall out, or, (b), at the very least, my anus would tear. Amazingly, neither occured.

        I think that unless a person has taken a dump so demanding that it caused lower back pain, they cannot lay claim to having passed a monster turd. To this day, I am amazed that the toilet was able to flush it away. I can only assume that hospital toilets are built with this problem in mind.

        To add to my embarrassment, I saw the nurse who attended to me, in the car park on the way out (not the aforementioned nurse who performed the enema, but a South African one who visited my room afterward).

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 7:31 am Oloinen

        Ok, I’ll be weird here, but… it doesn’t hurt. Not, if you do it properly warming up first and using lube. I would never ever do it without lube.

        Well, to be honest, I find anal pretty arousing as a sexual fantasy. In real life I’ve been rather nervous about it although I did wanted to try and it worked with my man so we do it occasionally. So it’s not like a woman always has a short end of stick what comes to anal sex.

        However, I personally wouldn’t advice anybody to do in bed anything they don’t feel ok doing. If you don’t want to to anal, don’t.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 2:01 am Subway Masturbator

        One of my “Catholic” girlfriends when subject of anal was breached (har har) :

        “In your DREAMS!”

        Three weeks later, in heat: ” I want it in the butt!”

        Great girl. I should have married her.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:28 pm Revo Luzione

        Penetrating a woman anally shows complete dominance. It is claiming every inch of her body, inside and out, for my use and enjoyment. A woman submitting to anal sex is her offering up her most vulnerable spaces, mentally and physically. I’m claiming her, I’m owning her in every way. A lot of Asian & indigenous cultures believe the soul goes back to the earth via the butthole, and so it has an almost spiritual connotation for me to bang her back door.

        That said, I don’t have to fuck a woman anally more than once or twice early on in the relationship. I do notice a profound shift in a woman’s attitude after she’s been anally fucked. Usually, it doesn’t take more than once. If a chick is really into anal, and I don’t see that post butt-bang submissiveness, I take that as a red flag, a sign of a lack of boundaries and sense of propriety in intimacy.

        There was an article a while back by a ball-busting feminist NYC ballerina, who claimed that her life changed and she started being sweeter, more loving, more feminine, after being anally taken, almost by force and by surprise, by her alpha boyfriend (emphasis mine). That’s what gave me the idea, and it’s worked for me ever since. The idea of butt sex, or the act of a woman submitting to it, is often better than the actual act of it, often, I find. It’s the domination more than the penetration that I find to be highly erotic.

        Personally, I find that the butt to be marginally tighter than the average vagina, but chicks who do kegels often can squeeze both their butts and their snatches with impressive force, so in some there’s not much difference.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 8:23 pm Canadian Friend

        “… A lot of Asian & indigenous cultures believe the soul goes back to the earth via the butthole, …”

        a few months ago I met this woman who insisted I do a few minutes of Qi Gong with her

        and as she was instructing me on what to do, the posture, the moves etc…she told me to hold my anus tight so as to not let energy escape

        I could not believe it

        I thought she was kidding

        she was not…

        First of all my anus is always closed otherwise I’d be defecating in my pants

        and second, this is one of the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard; energy escaping by my anus???

        and people actually pay good money to be taught those retarded medieval primitive beliefs

        this is as stupid as the belief that throwing virgins into volcanoes will appease them

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:33 pm Bastrop

        “Is it tighter?”

        Yes. The lack of lube also increases the friction.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:35 pm cynthia

        *shrugs*

        You’re the one with the dick… but again, friction doesn’t sound pleasant for the woman.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 7:14 pm Zombie Shane

        I can’t fathom penetrating a chick in any hole without her being ready for it.

        Are these guys saying that they ebernankify their bitches without any lube at all?!?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:23 pm Bastrop

        @cynthia Friction = rubbing I’ll bet when you diddle your bean it is the friction that you are enjoying. If your finger slid across like glass, you would feel little sensation.

        @Zombie Shane – who said she wasn’t ready for it? The most eager anal girl I’ve ever been with enjoyed it b/c (what Matthew said above: “eroticized transgression”) it made her feel like a dirty girl, a naughty little whore. We usually lubed up with her natural puss juices and drove the Hershey highway when she started begging for it. For most women, you need to use plenty of lube, but they LIKE it when you don’t seem to care (faked or not) if they ‘ready’ or not. It’s the dominance that turns them on.

        My eager anal girl (EAG) was incredibly sexually responsive, high T, massive shit tests, daddy issues. Lucky for me I wasn’t smitten and my aloofness causes her to classify me to this day as the one who got away. She is unhappily married to a *really* nice beta guy (I’m a beta too, but was very alpha with this girl) and raising an autistic toddler. I’ve known her for almost 30 years now. An early bloomer, she was smoking even at the age of 13. She has fallen from a hard 8 when I was doing her in her early 20’s to a pudgy 4 now at 39. She is a great example of the toll the cock carousel takes on a woman. I’m willing to bet hard money that her husband doesn’t get the wild rides and submissiveness I experienced with her.

        Though definitely a beta for most of my life, I’ve had my alpha periods and alpha relationships. It was when I didn’t give a shit about the outcome that I’ve been the most sexually dominant and had the best bangs of my life. I wish I’d taken the red pill 20 years ago.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 10:10 am Zombie Shane

        > ” It was when I didn’t give a shit about the outcome that I’ve been the most sexually dominant and had the best bangs of my life.”

        I dunno, dude – maybe you can pretend that you don’t give a shit about the outcome – but [properly] making love to a woman is hard, hard, hard work.

        Guiding her through the first three or four preliminary orgasms, and being able to hold yourself back through all of them, and having her start begging you to quit because she “just can’t do it anymore” and then you’re all “oh come on baby, just one more time for daddy” and then she starts coming again and you finally allow yourself to relax and shoot your wad with her – that shit takes a huge, huge toll on you, both mentally and physically.

        And then you throw into the mix some pre-love-making cocktails and a little inebriation, so that you gotta concentrate extra hard just to get the little fella to rise to the occasion?

        There’s a reason that we talk about the “art” of the seduction…

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:54 pm Del

        It’s really annoying these women that never tired anal, or who never had it with someone who knew what they were doing, proudly proclaiming that they “can’t see what all the fuss is about.” I’m proud to say I’ve broken my fair share of them. Even in men, it’s not just the “prostate” that makes anal sex pleasurable. It’s the whole thing. It’s just such an ignorant thing to say, and it doesn’t put you above anyone.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 8:42 am cynthia

        Dude, it’s an honest question.

        I’m not proudly proclaiming anything or saying i’m above it, or anything like that. Not passing judgment on anybody who likes it, not saying I wouldn’t like it myself. From the straight facts, it doesn’t sound pleasurable, but there’s obviously something that people enjoy about it or nobody would do it. So what, we’re not allowed to be curious about experiences we’ve never had?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 8:22 pm Del

        Cynthia, I’ve seen that asked, with that language, too many times to believe it was just an “honest question.” I bet money you’ve already said that before with the addendum “No, thanks,” or “I’ll pass,” or something to that effect. It’s always women who are well aware of the submissive aspect of being the bottom in anal sex and want to showcase that they’d never subject themselves to that. I’ve even seen women who love it say that to their girl friends, so as to maintain some kind of status. The same happens with facials.

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 3:54 am Troubadour

        I’ve even seen women who love it say that to their girl friends, so as to maintain some kind of status.

        That makes me wonder at the fact that my wife likes to brag to her girlfriends about how well she takes it in the ass, and how well she swallows. Hrm. She exaggerates how well she swallows. She gives horrible head.

        My hypothesis is that since she has a fairly realistic self-image, and realizes what a fat unhygienic piece of crap she is, she’s trying to pump up her perceived value. Everybody can see she has no value (no score is even possible on the CH female SMV survey), so by extension anybody seen with her is an obvious loser. She doesn’t get bragging rights from snagging a loser, so she has to make me look like a winner by making herself look like an adventuresome kinky freak in a way that is somehow supposed to offset her lack of physical attractiveness and deplorable hygiene.

        I think she’s hamstering for both of us.

        Incidentally, I think I should be able to file for a “the bitch gets nothing” divorce on the grounds of “see before and after pictures.”

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 5:22 am cynthia

        Ah, apologies if it came across that way, didn’t mean it to (but yeah, the “lack of lube” comment made me think “dry”, so… yeah)

        I’ve never been in a position to have a guy ask me that. I have no idea if I’d go for it or not. And I have no problem with admitting that I find submission to a man erotic. But yeah, some women are really weird about sexual status – maybe because it’s such a confusing issue. There are so many conflicting messages out there about this shit.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:15 pm Canadian Friend

        First of all, some women love it, they ask that you do it to them. It is not something the man imposes, at least not for every woman.

        As you know sex is not only a physical thing, it is in good part “psychological” for lack of a better word.

        a lot of women like to be dominated by a powerful man, but if the man does not have that much power ( he may not be rich or successful etc ), when he is sodomizing the woman he feels powerful and she feels submissive, and that is satisfying for the brain as much as for the sexual organs

        I have discussed this with other men ( hetero sexual males like me) and they agree; it may be tighter than the vagina and feels good but the psychological side of it is very strong, it makes us men feel powerful, strong and manly.

        No we do not think about men’s butt when we do it, no more than we think about men’s tongues when we Frenchkiss our woman.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 2:04 am Subway Masturbator

        Whether someone likes humiliation and/or submission I think is as hard-wired as being gay, however they can discover it late.

        I think that stuff is built in like, maybe over the last 2 billion years or something…I was with a woman who only realized she was a submissive when she was being reamed by her boyfriend, she asked him to stop, he wouldn’t, and THAT got her REALLY excited, and the rest is delightful history.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:45 pm embracingourfemininity

      [CH: Do her in the ass. “It doesn’t count”]

      But if she is saving herself because she is a Christian sodomy is a massive sin.. therefore much worse.

      [CH: You’d think. But Biblical technicalities fall by the wayside when she’s subsumed in the mystical aura of a man she can’t resist.]

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 10:48 am Matthew King

        [CH: … But Biblical technicalities fall by the wayside when she’s subsumed in the mystical aura of a man she can’t resist.]

        A.K.A. Original Sin. Which broke the broken world you think you’re reveling in (when you’re not complaining about it).

        We Christians have a glossary of trade jargon just like the PUAs! If a little older, more tested, and more comprehensive.

        Don’t go at his pronouncements directly, innocent Embracing. You are no match. Rather rely on the Lord and, through the Lord, me.

        Matt

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 7:55 pm Anonymous

      rape!

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 6:03 am itsme

      you wait until she’s married, then bang her.

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  6. on July 18, 2013 at 12:48 pm John

    Is there a direct correlation between length of relationship and lowering MOF?

    [CH: Yes. Familiarity breeds softness.]

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  7. on July 18, 2013 at 12:55 pm tspark156

    This seems ass about face to me, I always got the fuck and then decided wether or not they were worth further investment. I never used dating as a way to get some, I always managed to get minge through flirty interaction and then took it on after the first bedding if it suited me and there was never any shortage of potential targets because of the highly social life I lead in my single days (lead singer/guitarist, military, working in places where there was always lots of available female company). You will notice the past tense and I am prepared to acknowledge that things have changed, but I have only been off the single seen for just over ten years, are things really that different now?.

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 8:31 am tspark156

      If all those comments referencing anal had been there when I posted I would have chosen a different way to begin my reply.

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  8. on July 18, 2013 at 12:55 pm feministx

    I have a hard time assessing interest based on time a guy lurks. So many guys lurk so long and so intensely that it’s hard to make any sense of what they want. One guy lurked for about a year and a half, meaning that he asked me out every few weeks for a year and a half. I finally went out with him a few times and began sleeping with him and he dumped me within about 6 weeks. I was very upset about that and chased after him and tried to repair our relationship. It lasted for like a year and was by far the worst of my relationships.

    So, now I don’t know what to trust. People don’t talk about it, but alpha orbiters exist. They are different than beta orbiters because they are not just friends. You know what they want out of you. But it’s not easy to see how much they want it.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 12:58 pm tj

      How did it feel to be an iron in the fire?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:18 pm feministx

        Sucked so hard. Like not even fair. If he was a terse texter type with disappearing acts ahead of time, it would be one thing, but this guy sent me pictures of him with his family sometimes to get my attention, he offered to take me to Japan with him on a business trip. He was showing so many signs that would seem to suggest serious interest, but then no. That wasn’t what he wanted, and he never started wanting it.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 1:36 pm tj

        You know what also sucks? Being a betaorbiter of an iron in the fire and consoling her afterwards while she cried about losing the Man of Her Dreams and how great the sex was and how could he dare leave her!!11!1

        head:bang:desk – begone bad memories!

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:37 pm A Random Guy

        tj, been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 8:27 pm Third Beta from the Sun

        Congrats. 4th Beta from the Sun.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 7:56 pm Matthew

        He was sending you signs that he thought you were a homewrecker?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 7:57 pm Zombie Shane

        > “He was showing so many signs that would seem to suggest serious interest, but then no. That wasn’t what he wanted, and he never started wanting it.”

        So you’re saying that he was a pathological liar?

        A sociopath/psychopath?

        You should thank your luck stars that he isn’t in your life anymore.

        And then you can say a little prayer for all the girls whose lives he hasn’t ruined yet.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 11:44 am feministx

        I think he was a sociopath now. I am thankful he’s out of my life. After I got rid of him, again he started asking me out from time to time. I was really really mean to him when he did that.

        He said he did consider marrying me and settling down with me, but that I was basically not organized/mature/successful enough for him to really want that with me. At leas that’s what he said. I am like 12 yrs younger than him and I dated him when I was 24.

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  9. on July 18, 2013 at 1:01 pm Maya

    Not that I’m expecting to have sex anytime soon but hypothetically, if I was dating anyone, I can’t imagine having sex after only three or five dates. I think you have to wait much longer, a few months at least. I only remember meeting one man in my life that made me want to sleep with him immediately but I was much younger and reckless at that time. Now I’m older and wiser (and maybe even my libido is lower even though this doesn’t make much sense) I’d wait for a few months with anyone, no matter how alpha he was.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:19 pm cynthia

      There’s a difference between the amount of time that an alpha male who wants the sexual conquest will wait, and the alpha female who wants the commitment conquest has to in order to reach her own goal. I suppose there’s some kind of compromise in there for something to work as an LTR.

      It does bring up an interesting question though, about those guys around here who say they’d only marry a virgin. I often wonder how that works.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 7:57 pm Matthew

        I am taking applications for a junior wife, and one of the requirements is virginity.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 8:04 pm Tiklum

        lzozlzozlzozl http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4x_POwWlZtw lzozlzozlzozlzl ahahahahha lzozlzlzozolzlzozlzl

        Seriously. This is American young women right now. Every single one of them thinks they can be a singer.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 5:10 am cynthia

        Damn, and here I am on the wrong side of 23…

        But seriously – guys want to fuck a girl ASAP, they want to marry a virgin. How does this equation get balanced out?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 5:18 am goodspeed

        For guys who are good with women it works out quite well. Check Krausers blog for an example of this.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 5:53 am Paul@gmail.com

        It doesn’t, people don’t care about the complete equation in any domain, self-interest always comes first. In the end the equation solves like this : alphas fuck fast and get untouched girls (or, more often, less touched), while betas have to wait for highly used ones.

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 12:21 pm Randall Parker (@futurepundit)

        Cynthia, lots of people want benefits at the long term cost to society (or even to themselves). Businesses that want immigrant cheap unskilled labor, smart women who’d rather have a career than smart genes, pretty women who want beta orbiters, slutty women who want alphas who are out of their league for marriage but in their league for a short term relationship. I could go on.

        But if a woman is smart and disciplined enough to hold back letting her boyfriend get sex is raising her market value for marriage. So these guys who get turned down for sex who are serious about marriage get a signal they need to see.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:27 pm corvinus

      Maybe you should try losing 50 pounds and dressing more seductively. You need to start meeting some guys.

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  10. on July 18, 2013 at 1:17 pm jihad

    i feel like you need to post your age and a picture for this paragraph to make sense

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 1:25 pm jihad

      ^^^^ this was in response to Maya’s comment about her libido. i fail at wordpress

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:25 pm Maya

        I don’t think libido is associated in any way with the way people look.

        [CH: There are two covarying libidos in each person: The first is the basal libido, that is, the libido that you were “born with”, and subsequently manifests as a function of your oscillating hormones. Men have, on average, higher basal libidos than do women. This theory is not in dispute, science has provided plenty of evidence for this sex disparity.

        The second libido — the temporal libido — is the one that varies as a function of the desirability of a mate prospect. The hotter the babe, the more libidinous a man will feel. Same goes for women. When presented with the company of an alpha male, a woman can express the equal of a man’s temporal libido. Looks are relevant to the man’s temporal libido, and less so to the woman’s temporal libido.]

        Ugly people can have high libido and pretty people can have low libido.

        [Trivially true. “Can” and “usually is” are two different things. Since looks correlate with general health, it’s probable that pretty people have higher libidos than do ugly people, and this is reinforced by the greater number of available opportunities to prettier people.]

        I’ve read somewhere that it increases with age – for women –

        [Mostly false. Women are at their most sexual and most sexually hungry in their prime fertility years, 15-25. Although studies have shown that there is a brief period in the mid to late 30s when women experience a “second wind” of libidinous desire, theoretically evolved as the gene’s last gasp to get itself copied and transmitted before the wall exacts its terrible toll.]

        but with me, it seems that it’s just the opposite – the wiser I get the less I think about sex.

        [Would you care to add up the number of times you mentioned the word sex in your comments?

        ps A warning, Maya. If you reply to this comment in such a manner that it’s obvious you took neither the time nor the effort to comprehend what was being explained to you — a habit that unfortunately marks most of your offerings here — then Kick a Bitch will be summoned to kick you in the metaphorical cunt, and right off this blog permanently. Heed this warning with the utmost seriousness.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:51 pm Maya

        Whaaat? Hearts, you want to get rid of me?

        [CH: I don’t *want* to get rid of you, but I will if you stink up the joint.]

        OK … I’ll read it very carefully before I say something 😀

        [How about you don’t say anything and take a breather before responding. You get all worked up by my special lessons and then your spergerrific spergitude escapes its cage and flings geometric poop everywhere.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:55 pm Maya

        Sooo, let’s see …

        ”Since looks correlate with general health, it’s probable that pretty people have higher libidos than do ugly people, and this is reinforced by the greater number of available opportunities to prettier people.”

        Your theory makes sense … 🙂 I agree with it! 🙂

        [CH: Kick a Biiiitch… we may need your services here soon.]

        ”Women are at their most sexual and most sexually hungry in their prime fertility years, 15-25. Although studies have shown that there is a brief period in the mid to late 30s when women experience a “second wind” of libidinous desire, theoretically evolved as the gene’s last gasp to get itself copied and transmitted before the wall exacts its terrible toll.”

        Very nice theory, again. I agree!

        [How does the loss of your youthful libido affect your well-being?]

        ”Would you care to add up the number of times you mentioned the word sex in your comments?”

        LOL, why?

        [You forgot to say “Yes, I agree, it was a lot!”]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:12 pm Maya

        ”[How does the loss of your youthful libido affect your well-being?]”

        I’m not *that* old yet. There’s not so much difference between 25 and 28. So I don’t think it’s because of my age, I have lower libido because I’m wiser now.

        [CH: Wisdom has nothing to do with libido function. Age, on the other hand…]

        ”[You forgot to say “Yes, I agree, it was a lot!”]”

        Was it? Apparently I like to theorize about this topic 😀

        [Stick to staring forlornly out your bedroom window and pining for the mighty CH cockatoo.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:32 pm Maya

        ”[CH: Wisdom has nothing to do with libido function. Age, on the other hand…]”

        Yes, it does.

        [CH: No it doesn’t. Stop banging your head against this wall like a dumbfuck troll when it’s obvious to anyone with two brain cells to rub together that “wisdom” — which is a nebulous term you probably couldn’t even adequately explain — has nothing whatsoever to do with the sex drive. Advancing age is the variable that correlates with decreasing libido.]

        I remember we learned in school about some kind of ‘sublimation’ (like this: http://www.blackwellreference.com/public/tocnode?id=g9781405106795_chunk_g978140510679520_ss1-226) and I am convinced that this is what I am experiencing.

        [Posting a link to a dictionary definition of sublimation is not an argument for the assertion that wisdom lowers libido. But you knew that already.]

        ”[Stick to staring forlornly out your bedroom window and pining for the mighty CH cockatoo.]”

        You’re mean with me for no reason.

        [You’re pushing it sperggirl. I’d advise you to shut up for now, and return to discuss another topic when your viscera isn’t quivering with autist indignation. Not kidding. Patience with your antics is wearing thin.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 9:21 pm alexandrahamilton87

        I’m curious whether heartiste thinks that age correlates, not with libido itself, but with ability to control libido. Or do we control ourselves better with age merely because libido goes down? And/or because our options dwindle so there’s less temptation?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:09 pm Anonymous

        Ban her please. She is beyond tiresome.

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  11. on July 18, 2013 at 1:24 pm Scray

    I like ease of lay better than ‘how long you’re willing to wait.’ Like, how long you wait is just one dimension of the ‘ease of lay’ rubric. You’ve got ‘how bitchy is she’ ‘how much of an attention whore is she’ ‘how much does she expect me to listen’ blah blah blah. Ease of lay + fuckability must always equal 1 for the guy to bang. So, as fuckability falls, ease of lay must rise, and vice versa.

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  12. on July 18, 2013 at 1:43 pm BetaBoy

    This three date rule is interesting. I judge myself as a thorough beta but when I was dating I was often in the sack in one to three dates. Is that because women were easier back in the Stone Age pre-AIDS Sexual Revolution days? Or is it possible to be a Beta who can nevertheless be good at winning over the ladies? I was under the impression that a Beta by definition is no good getting the Ladies lubricating just by standing upwind from them and has to win by offering safety and prosperity.

    [CH: I know you’re trolling, but an answer to your puzzle naturally emerges. The girls you as a beta managed to bang in under three dates were less than stellar beauties. Betas can get laid if they go downscale. The further downscale, the easier the close.]

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 8:35 pm BetaBoy

      No, I’m not trolling and the women varied from average to a few who were pretty good looking. I think there was a different vibe at work back in the 70’s and 80’s where the Sexual Revolution had permeated through society, but The Plague hadn’t kicked in yet. By then those of us from the sixties were getting into our 30’s so there may have been some dynamic of their wanting to land the support beta and being more willing to put out because of the sexual revolution making it more acceptable.
      I don’t think you have many readers my age but it would interesting so see how many guys my age had the same experience.

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  13. on July 18, 2013 at 1:52 pm embracingourfemininity

    “Inducement to showcase his conquest. Is the man scheming to be seen in public with his lover? High MOF. Is he making excuses to her about having a rare allergy to sunlight *and* moonlight? Low MOF.”

    If a man is pressuring you to go with him to places where his friends and family are does this mean he really likes you? Even if you prefer to not go so fast?

    What about if it is not measure of f********… what if is measure of relationship material woman? Do you think that players and the like really think they think they can persuade a virgin who is waiting for marriage to lose it with him? And do you think a man would use her and leave her? Just to get her virginity?
    I think it is unfair to go on a date with a man or give him a chance without letting him know you are chaste. I know it’s difficult for a woman to approach such a topic but I think it is better to say so from the beginning, because some men just wouldn’t be willing to wait.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 2:13 pm cynthia

      I’ve had guys laugh in my face for telling them something like that. And not just guys who asked me to coffee – my last OBGYN appointment ended with me in tears because the male doctor thought it was fucking hilarious. Morale of the story, we seem to be stuck in a culture where chastity is a liability in all but the most religious communities.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:27 pm tj

        You can thank the carousel riders for changing expectations

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:39 pm cynthia

        Oh, I do know. Pisses me off to no end. I am aware that women are the ones enabling all of this. Culture is simply saturated with the idea that we all loose our virginity in HS or something.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:45 pm tj

        Catholic school girls – God’s way of showing us how much he loves us

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:01 pm cynthia

        Went to a Catholic school. Most of the girls justified their sluttiness by declaring themselves atheists (this was the most popular option), claiming they were lesbians and burning their “patriarchy instruction manuals” (aka, their school-issued Bible) or just going to confession all the time. It was fun to watch, the boys had no idea what the fuck was going on.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:31 pm tj

        @Cynthia – do you still have your plain skirt????????

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:38 pm cynthia

        School administration wouldn’t let us have a uniform skirt. Said it was sexist and they didn’t want to force it on us. Even though we kept asking. I shit you not.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:42 pm tj

        Prolly too much temptation for the priests

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:57 pm cynthia

        I think we had like… three priests? It was a Carmelite school. The hippies of the Catholic orders. The current dean is an ex-nun who drives a motorcycle to work every day. But otherwise, perhaps you’re right. We had a lot of rich, skinny, blonde, painfully rich hotties there.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 3:10 pm corvinus

        We had a lot of rich, skinny, blonde, painfully rich hotties there.

        I’ve always expected Catholics as a whole to tend toward the poor chubby brunette side. Maybe I’m biased by the existence of Mexicans and Italians.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:40 pm A Random Guy

        I told my daughter once: the biggest disservice to women ever was the sexual revolution.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 2:44 pm Maya

        What did your ob/gyn say when you started to cry?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:06 pm cynthia

        He didn’t know what the hell to say, so he asked me again if I was sure. “Because el-tee, if you really don’t want to have a PAP smear done or you’re religious or something it’s okay, I won’t judge…”

        I made him go get the female nurse, made her sign off the form that said I was exempt from the exam, and took the long way back to work. Did this every year for a decade. Fucking military health care system.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:38 pm Maya

        He was really strange … I’m sorry you had to put up with people like this one …

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:54 pm cynthia

        I’ve had bosses who offered to set me up with their friends, commanders whose first question to an allegation that I was sleeping with a sergeant was “why him and not so-and-so”, supervisors who told me I’d have to cut my wrists before anybody would help me with a scheduling problem, the chaplain’s office tell me I couldn’t talk to the chaplain about a sexual assault,a first sergeant start sexting me when he thought I was sleeping with his friend. Among many, many, many other things. The only thing that surprised me about the OBGYN was how upsetting was. Guys here want to talk shit about women in the military, but the truth is, most of us suffer through far, far more than we complain about.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:59 pm Maya

        I’m sorry 😦 But now you’re not in the military anymore, right?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:16 am cynthia

        Definitely out. (and fuck, I’m really sorry everyone, this turned into more of a screed than I’m intended).

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 7:49 am Oloinen

        But… why didn’t you want to take the test, then?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 8:45 am cynthia

        Still a virgin, still really, really tight down there. Last couple times I’ve tried to put myself through it, I couldn’t stand the pain. Felt like I was ripping apart.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 8:49 am embracingourfemininity

        What test? Pap/Smear?

        Here the OBGYN asks if you are a virgin and if you are he does not use a speculum, I think it is not necessary to do a PAP if you are not sexually active, but you should still go to OBGYN, and also monitor that your ovulating regularly etc. to check everything is fine.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:01 am cynthia

        @embracingourfeminity

        Yeah, the PAP smear. There was always a speculum. And since we’re talking about the military, sexually active or not, there was literally a form they had to fill out in the medical system. When the mandatory stuff doesn’t get in the system, the system kicks out an email to your commander, who then comes down to your cube and tells you to go get your test done. Or it gets briefed to the section heads at the weekly squadron meeting. I’d make the doc put a note in my file about it, but it always seemed to get lost, and so every year, I’d make the trek back down there and beg out of it again.

        (And ovulation tests? That’s a thing? Had no idea. Never seen an OBGYN for anything else.)

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:21 am embracingourfemininity

        Wow, that’s too bad. What exactly is your job in the military? I’ve never met a female in the military before.
        Here they won’t use a speculum as naturally if you are chaste, the speculum is going to cause bleeding.
        Yes, you can check that you are ovulating regularly every month, and also get an ultrasound of your ovaries to check they are healthy, no cysts etc. That’s really important if you plan to conceive. Hormone testing can also check everything’s healthy if you get the tests done on the correct days of the month. I actually was having some pain in my lower abdomen from some food intolerances, but when I mentioned it to my OBGYN he suggested that he check that it wasn’t related to women’s issues before I saw a Gastroenterologist. Thankfully, it wasn’t. I take nutrition and female fertility/Optimum hormonal balance very seriously, as I think the two are very highly correlated. I follow a high fat, moderate carb diet.. as I think that a diet full of processed foods wreaks havoc on female’s hormone levels and fertility, For example I used to have the typical PMS when eating a bad diet… now, I can say I don’t suffer from PMS almost nearly as much, everything runs like clockwork, and I don’t get in a bad mood every month.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:36 am cynthia

        Haha, yeah, the military health care system is really, really bad. I was in the Air Force, but it doesn’t make much difference. It sucks uniformly across the DoD. Dealing with civilian doctors is probably going to be a huge (pleasant) shock.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:05 pm embracingourfemininity

        Well.. when that’s the kind of women men are used to, it’s really no surprise. I can imagine how difficult it is for you there in such an overtly sexual culture.
        And that’s terribly unprofessional of your OBGYN… did you change your doctor? Mine is quite understanding.
        Times have changed ALOT here though also.. I can count the number of women I know in this generation, who have waited on one hand.
        One time a man asked me why I never give a chance to men who I meet.. it’s not that I am stuck up, I am definitely not, it’s just I know the type of the majority of men, a man who is not devout is no way going to wait until marriage. So I replied to this man, I need a man who is devout, and he said “All the devout boys become Priests”. So yeah….
        Of course I don’t expect a man to be chaste, that’s between him and God, I really don’t want to know… I expect him to respect the decisions of others though. In my opinion if a man really wants a woman that bad, and she’s also a good woman.. he should hurry up and marry her instead of pressure her to go against her convictions.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:07 pm Anon

        So she can no-fault divorce him 6 years later when she’s unhaaaaaaappyand take his kids and all of his money *and* his ability to get a new woman to give him adult company?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:23 pm embracingourfemininity

        Yes that’s a sad possibility..
        A man should marry a woman who is 100% against divorce.
        Certain denominations don’t recognize divorce, even in the Orthodox Church a divorce is VERY difficult to obtain.
        Once I marry I never want to divorce, I know it is a big statement to make but I honestly believe..unless I ended up marrying a man who put my children and I in serious danger I would not divorce. I would pray to be forgiving, even if .. I really pray it never happens, even if he was unfaithful. I think even under those circumstances I wouldn’t want to give up. Forgiveness is always an option. Divorce is horrible, it does horrible things to people, and is also very damaging for the children.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:20 pm cynthia

        Haha, that was my military doctor. I haven’t seen the same primary care doc or specialist more than once since I was seventeen, and you don’t get to pick. You also don’t get to pick what immunizations, examinations, tests, or procedures do or don’t get on you. You’d be amazed how bad it is. Best I could do was tell the major who ran Women’s Health what had happened.

        I think there are still guys out there who are religious, but it really depends on the denomination and the individual church. Catholics seem to be better than the younger Protestant or “non-denominational” guys, just in terms of balancing life and religion, but most single people, in general, don’t seem to go to church at all. There’s no point in being with a guy who doesn’t respect your choices and morality, although in today’s culture, you can see why they expect it. (As a aside, my sister-in-law once told me not to worry, that there was a man out there who would respect anything I wanted. Including no sex until marriage. My brother, who’s told me you have to fuck at some point to keep him interested, just gave her the stink-eye)

        I agree with your last statement, completely. Guys like that, though, seem to be few and far between. (IDK, maybe it varies by where you live? I just left Colorado, which was horrible for this stuff.)

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 2:04 pm Original_O

        I would have been willing to wait, but the longer I waited it seemed less likely I would ever find a virgin to marry so I gave up.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 2:16 am Subway Masturbator

        How are we supposed to know if she can even orgasm? I’ve read 10% can’t come (Mayo clinic) . Are chaste women willing to discuss their masturbation habits with someone really into them?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:04 am cynthia

        I’d discuss that with a boyfriend. I would not discuss that with a guy on a first date. Depends on the circumstances, maybe?

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 2:32 pm bob

      “Do you think that players and the like really think they think they can persuade a virgin who is waiting for marriage to lose it with him? And do you think a man would use her and leave her? Just to get her virginity?”

      You should expect the worse, really, because some of these “alphas cads” act like fucking retards.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 2:37 pm Maya

      ”I think it is unfair to go on a date with a man or give him a chance without letting him know you are chaste. I know it’s difficult for a woman to approach such a topic but I think it is better to say so from the beginning, because some men just wouldn’t be willing to wait.”

      No, I don’t think it’s unfair. It’s actually the other way around – it’s unfair from men to expect sex before marriage. You go out with people because you are looking for love, not casual sex. If they only want sex, they can fuck off.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:07 pm embracingourfemininity

        Yes Maya I understand your point but it’s just not the case anymore.. most men don’t expect to have to wait until marriage and it is better to be clear about your intentions not to waste your time and his. If he is worth it, he will understand.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:22 pm Maya

        Actually, I despise men who are not interested in finding their true love and just want easy sex so I totally enjoy(ed) not being ”fair” with them.

        [Ch: I’m sure those men were heartbroken over losing the opportunity to wait ten years for a faint whiff of your pussy.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:35 pm Maya

        I never planned to wait for ten years. As I said above, waiting for a few months or maybe a year is appropriate.

        [CH: Same diff. You’re not going to land a quality man who has options with other women by making him wait for a year. Or even a month. On the other hand, if you were to learn to settle like I have been advising you to do, you might have a shot at stringing along a grateful beta.]

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:54 pm Maya

        OK, maybe one year is too long at my age. But one month is perfect.

        ”On the other hand, if you were to learn to settle like I have been advising you to do, you might have a shot at stringing along a grateful beta.”

        Stringing men along, whatever this means, is disgusting. So is settling. It’s wrong to pretend that you are in love with someone when you are not.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:00 pm cynthia

        @CH: would you ever marry? I don’t mean to be rude, but can you really speak for the “quality guy willing to commit to marriage” demographic? A month seems like an awful short time for a woman’s LTR game.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:11 pm Maya

        It’s funny that CH thinks waiting for sex is some kind of strategy women have. Like, he probably believes we think ”Oh, I have to sleep with this alpha quickly even though I’m not ready because if I don’t do that, he’ll leave” or ”I can string this beta along for a year, I don’t really want to have sex with him but if we get married, at least I’ll finally be married, have kids, get his money …”

        CH, the right time to have sex is when both are ready and in love with each other. I think that when the time is right it happens without thinking much … ❤

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:44 pm Customer Service

        Holy f*ck, this isn’t your personal blog nor do you deserve the amount of effort and attention that is being bestowed onto you by the blog creator. You’re ruining the comment section- for months I’ve been seeing your handle here and all it says to me is just ‘skip over, irrational woman adding nothing to the conversation’. Really, you’re like the worst type of troll. Girl with a pussy spewing asinine information. Heartiste, sit, we need to have a talk, I know you like Maya and all but you need to ban this broad’s IP from this blog – she’s a time, energy and mindsink and we’re all worse off for the experience. Imagine if she was a guy, you wouldn’t put up with this crap. So please end her blog to author relationship.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 9:35 pm Joe Sixpack

        “if you were to learn to settle like I have been advising you to do, you might have a shot at stringing along a grateful beta.”

        Maya,

        There’s another strategy you could follow which won’t feel totally like “settling”.

        There’s a whole subset of men out there who are very hard to define. They look Alpha, maybe even walk Alpha, but when they open their mouth the instantly reveal themselves to be Beta/Omega.

        This kind of guy is actually quite common. Not nearly as much as the stereotypical omega dweeb type, nor the schlubby Beta, nor the jockish Alpha. But it is not a rare species either.

        I know a guy, who’s a personal trainer, in great shape, has alpha mannerisms and looks GQ. He, however, is a complete soft-spoken Beta Nice Guy.

        Maybe the kind of guy who slowly morphed as he got older, picked on when a youth and his self-esteem took a beating. Didn’t notice as he got better looking and women were beginning to check him out. His self-identity still locked into Shy Beta mode and unable to mentally engage with hot women, nor pick up on their subtle IOI.

        This kind of guy is shocked, SHOCKED when you point out that a woman was interested in him. It’s hard to tell if he’s not interested in women when you talk to him about chicks, or that the idea of a woman finding him attractive just stuns him. He’s often interested in intellectual pursuits more than female pursuit and frequently turns to putty around women.

        They don’t have the drive for multiple women because they aren’t used to being with many women. They’re happy in a stable LTR.

        These guys often end up with women well below their “league”. Think Hugh Jackman. Here’s a pic of him and his wife.

        You’d expect him to be with more of a girl like the one in the background. But he’s deep in love with his wife and has a long-lasting marriage and kids with her.

        Also think Rob Lowe, considerably more handsome than his wife is pretty. But he said after dating through Hollywood, “I finally wised up and married my best friend”. Lowe is an Alpha who made the conscious choice to marry into a stable relationship vs. a Hollywood Golddigger Famewhore.

        So there are Alpha looking men with women that otherwise might have to “settle” for Betas. So a woman can have a Beta who at least looks Alpha and then inspire him to Alphaness.

        Any military town is full of this kind of guy (I see it all the time here in San Diego) and in the Midwestern US, an LA/SD/Miami HB6 will be an overnight HB8. Also much of Europe is full of such men.

        The danger, though, is that if a woman changes him, as they are wont to do, his metamorphosis into RedPillMan + his natural good looks will mean she may have created a monster. So, proceed with caution.

        There is also the chance he will begin to flex his newfound Alpha muscles and the relationship falls apart due to jealousy, cheating, etc. However, if he has developed romantic love for you during this time, and your “change” comes from a place a femininity and encouraging him to be masculine, this will go a long way toward solidifying your relationship.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:23 am CH

        The problem with this strategy is that there are far more lonely beta women like Maya than there are weirdly awkward “paper alphas” who would be fine with dating less attractive women than what they really want.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 11:10 am Matthew King

        I know you like Máya and all but you need to ban this broad’s IP from this blog – she’s a time, energy and mindsink and we’re all worse off for the experience. Imagine if she was a guy, you wouldn’t put up with this crap. So please end her blog to author relationship.

        You misunderstand who she is. She is the detritus of the SNL philosophy of Le Château. A used human condom. She is the morning after.

        In other words she was seduced, and years later she still believes something more is bound to follow besides his growing contempt. But “nothing will come of nothing.” I assume CH hangs onto her out of some vestigial remnant of a conscience?

        She is an acolyte, a true believer of the creed, who would have done anything and everything for her promised “five minutes of alpha.” She is a walking advertisement for the hidden damage of submitting to this ultimately life-denying faith.

        I did try to warn her a few years ago. But you know how women are.

        Matt

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:08 pm Maya

        Oh, Matt, I’m fine. As you know, I was never seduced by CH and we don’t know each other in real life.

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      • on July 21, 2013 at 12:25 pm Matthew King

        Not a single post of yours ever offered here gives the slightest indication you are “fine.”

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 6:15 am Paul

        You’re living in the past, nowadays the norm isn’t to wait so long, it is okay not to follow the norm but you should inform the guy that you’re will act different than 99% of women. And you probably already have missed many perfectly suitable men that way so it doesn’t benefit you either.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 6:23 am embracingourfemininity

        I will say that there ARE men who willing to wait for you. I applaud them for this, especially if they are not chaste themselves, but these guys really do exist.. but it will not happen just for a pretty face, a man has to see much more in you to wait. He has to respect your chastity.. He has to love you for this and see you as delicate and something he wants to protect, and see something beautiful in your character that he doesn’t see in other women. You bring out the best in him.. it’s rare, but it’s definitely out there.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 6:33 am embracingourfemininity

        You know.. for all men’s ways that we know of, their innate desire to spread their seed, and that they often can seem less than moral when it comes to women when we observe their behavior, and maybe less likely to “fall in love”.. , despite this, I’m starting to come to the idea that men are often much deeper than women. I may be completely wrong in this assessment. And I was actually thinking of writing a post on my blog about it, but I have hesitated because I think other people might disagree and think I’m talking complete garbage. But I’m starting to notice that when men do love they seem to love so deep, and also have a harder time getting over love where as so many women can seemingly move from one man to the next.

        I think because men are able to combine very well thinking with logic, we often disregard the depths of their emotional feeling. Because they are not so quick to voice their emotions as women, but now it’s starting to appear to me that when men love, they REALLY love, to a depth that many women are not able to appreciate. And men seem to hold onto that pain of heartbreak much longer, maybe it’s because men are not able to share their emotions with other men without being seen as “weak”, where as women sometimes like to shout it to the world. It’s sad.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 7:33 am The Best Single Man Currently Living in the United States

        @embracing ur right about everything except the part that blames men for not sharing their feelings with other men being the reason. Men love. Women seek protection and resources. When it’s over for them, they must move on to be able to find the next protector ASAP. Men never forget the women who dumped them.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:09 am antirationalist

        Trying to respond to EOF @6:33.

        I agree with your sentiment. I’ve said before that people think that women are more romantic than men, because men forget birthdays. What they mean are that women are more EMOTIONAL than men. When a man walks out on a woman, she cries, and finds another. When a woman walks out on a man, he launches 1,000 ships and burns down Troy to get her back. To my mind, “romantic” means more along the lines of moving heaven and hell to get your loved one back than buying flowers because it is your six week anniversary…

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:32 am embracingourfemininity

        Exactly. The problem is modern Romance novels and movie are skewing our idea of what romance really is. Sometimes you have to be willing to look a little deeper to realize the romantic sentiment.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 9:34 am embracingourfemininity

        Yes women are more emotional.. which is why we’re usually not so great at decision making and the like, we need a man’s logic.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:39 pm tj

        Exactly – unless you’re on the same page, why waste each other’s time?

        Plus, don’t make the assumption that men view all women in the same light. There are women to fuck and there are potential “Relationships” – yes, there can be overlap, but not as much as you’d think – especially given the carousel.

        Personally, I’d be grateful to know if there was going to be a long delay.

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  14. on July 18, 2013 at 1:57 pm wargasm

    I think this plays into my theory of being an alpha orbiter. Hang out with hot girls who have boyfriends, coworkers, or girls that are otherwise not disposed to accept your advances currently, and act like the aloof womanizer you are.

    If you often keep the conversation fun, and sexual, she will not look upon you in the same way she looks upon her beta male “friends.”

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  15. on July 18, 2013 at 2:31 pm Harry Morgan

    Somewhat off topic: How do you proceed when a girl has preemptively disqualified an interaction as romantic/date? I haven’t seen a relevant post here or elsewhere on this odd dynamic. Example below.

    I girl I’m interested in works at a local bar. We’ve chatted plenty of times, usually with a flirty undercurrent. She tracked me down on FB and friended me (I never friend girls, but if they do it to me spontaneously I feel kind of stuck).

    I hit her up on FB saying we should have drinks some time and place when she was off the clock. She goes for it. The night of, the following text conversation (rough transcript occurs):

    Her: I’m wondering. Is this a date?

    Me: It’s drinks. But if you’re asking if I’m interested the answer is yes [I’m thinking the second sentence was unnecessary – but I was trying to be direct].

    Her: Im not interesting that way. I don’t want to lead on. I said I would go because I think you are fun and awesome and I like making friends these days.”

    Me: Fair enough. friendly drinks unless you suddenly feel compelled to jump me.

    We went out for drinks, had some good conversation. I treated like any other drink outing with a girl, EXCEPT I felt constrained trying to escalate kino because she had preempted me via the text. It stole my thunder. If not for that, I would have just escalated everything as normal. What do you do with that? (alternatively, was I just screwed from the get go?)

    Relevant facts: she just got out of a 6-month LTR. Also, she works at a bar I like so I didn’t/don’t want to blow the friendly relationship on a mere attempt to get laid (now if it were successful…); also she’s hot and has hot friends so turning her into a female friend / wingwoman who can hook me up with drinks isn’t the worst thing that could happen.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 2:42 pm cryo

      “Me: It’s drinks. But if you’re asking if I’m interested the answer is yes [I’m thinking the second sentence was unnecessary – but I was trying to be direct].”

      Whu? Why the hell did you respond this way?

      Cocky and funny. Learn it.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 3:28 pm Harry Morgan

        C/F is my go to. For some reason this time I thought I’d take the direct approach and telegraph that I was a man expressing my direct sexual interest. I still think there is a time and place for that, even in text gaming, but I think I mis-deployed it.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 3:46 pm tj

      Ummmm – you just got totally LJBFed. Are you prepared to feed her cats and bring her kleenex?

      It’s a bad place you’re at. I’ve been there – eject now.

      The only way you can save this, is to pre-emptively LJBF her. And then constantly accuse her of trying to get into your pants, etc.

      Or you can just enjoy the friendship and realize you’re never going to fuck her

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:45 pm immoralgables

        Comparing your comment to Scrays and it’s obvious which comment adds more value. Lol, like no shit he got LJBF’ed. He’s looking for actionable advice and you’re regurgitating manosphere stuff.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:51 pm Scray

        Tis the age old situ….I bet cavemen awared one another about LJBF lol.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 6:46 am tj

        If he had to ask, he wasn’t aware of the depths of the situation and/or wanted to be told the truth he was feeling.

        Scary’s ideas are good – so are mine.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 3:49 pm Scray

      ‘(alternatively, was I just screwed from the get go?)’

      Prolly. In this situation you’re working without a ton of value (if you had it she’d want to fuck you).

      So first, just (if you’re going to be in her social circle) always have the frame of I am NOT your friend….and you can just catch her later, maybe weeks, maybe months, who knows.

      Her: I’m wondering. Is this a date?
      Me: Well, gotta do something before we get married
      Her: I’m not interesting that way blah blah blah blah….
      Me: Ya me too, I just wanna cuddle and talk about our days wow so great we got that off our chest

      Just set the frame of ‘I’m a rake and I don’t give a shit.’ Flirt mercilessly. Pull out all stops. Cold open other hot girls near her, etc. But don’t escalate or make a move (if you want her in your social circle and access to those hot friends), unless you get the IOI’s.

      In the meantime, build more value. Like, you said your exchanges were full of flirting — but she’s a bartender. Bartenders flirt all the time. That’s just how they are. So, if I were you I’d take her willingness to flirt with a grain of salt….and just start focusing on showing how legit you are. Let her know bits of trivia, talk about the venues where you’re at, make sure she sees you know everyone, be funny (legit funny….you can tell when people are laughing just to be polite versus when they are busting up). So ya, high value + I’m a rake should = pussy. In time. Hopefully, lol.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:35 pm Harry Morgan

        Thanks. As for building value, she’s certainly seen me either bring girls to that bar or leave with ones I’ve met there, so I wasn’t starting from scratch. I suppose I’ll just need to figure out if there’s a greater downstream reward of taking the easy route to friendship (cheap drinks, access to a new a social circle, social proof from her around other girls, etc.) or take the hard route and work for the bang.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:16 pm Scray

        Well, ideally the strat above isn’t hard work. It’s minimal investment. Let us know how it goes if you do end up doing it!

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:31 pm Hhh

        Says the wannabe yareallywho recently got his first date of his life and asked the girl if she wanted to kiss him forcing her to make fun of him. Ur not the teacher yet, boy.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:14 pm Scray

        ‘….and then proceeded to fuck her.’

        ^FTFY, phaggot.
        If you have something to contribute, contribute it. Otherwise, you’re just talking shit that anyone with half an ounce of experience can see right through. You really want to be like this when baby jesus comes down, mang?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:38 pm immoralgables

        Don’t feed the trolls scray, lol.

        You’ve approached more girls in the past 6 months than this guy has done in maybe the past 3 years.

        Sometimes, by responding and arguing, you run the risk of qualifying yourself (guilty of this). So unless it really grinds your gears, just ignore the anonymous kj’s like hhh up above.

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:47 pm Scray

        Ya you’re right….I just don’t see the point of that mentality.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:02 pm anonYmous

      sometimes if you act as if… meaning pretend like your not interested sometimes it can be turned around. just keep a good frame and hope she gets horny. dont become an orbiter just let her initiate always. if she doesnt initiate then she isnt interested and you wont be able to turn it around. i think she doesnt want a relationship but that doesn’t mean no possibility of sex

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  16. on July 18, 2013 at 3:09 pm Scray

    Highlights from the Day 2 —

    It’s a fun little bar where they have a lot of games to play (I crush her at darts and pool). She buys us a round of drinks. She does the formal apology thing. We have a lot of fun times (srs.)

    Good comfort routine I think is talking about how the different primate males get female attention.

    Me: See, we come from primates…so like, a lot of what we do comes from what they do. Like there’s one group who are just bigger than the females and they have harems and they use their physical dominance…they also have like, one inch dicks and sex is real quick for them. Then there’s another group that….just have huge dicks and everyone has sex with everyone else and whoever has the best sperm reproduces. Then, there’s another group that’s just perfectly monogamous forever, and they sing to one another. Then there’s this last group where, pretty much, you have to have a lot of friends. Whoever has the most friends gets the most women, and – –
    Her: You’re like that one, with the friends!
    Me ….whoa, whoa…I mean, think about it. I mean, physical dominance, huge dick, beautiful song, popular. I mean….
    Her: Ya, no you’re the one who’s just talking to everyone and has a lot of friends
    Me: I’m pretty sure I’m like the one with the physical dominance
    Her: ….hahhaha noooooo….what the fuck, do you want like a harem or something?
    Me: ….I’m actually just trying to prepare you for the fact that I have a one inch dick.
    (she loves that, and we’re already sitting close…so then she takes my hand and shows me something — which I’m totally going to steal as another comfort routine)

    Her: Give me your hand….(she grabs it anyway lol)
    Me: This better be good
    Her: See, hold my hand but with your index pointed outward along mine. Now, close your eyes and run your fingers over both your and my index…it’ll feel like one finger.
    Me: All right. I’m trusting you.
    ….(does it)
    Me: What the fuck are you talking about? That doesn’t feel like that at all!
    Her: Really?! Nothing?
    Me: What cad taught you this bullshit?!

    ….
    So it’s going good. Lots of fun stuff, she counted the stars we could see in german….you know, one of those romantic souls. About to think of a way to bounce back to my place when I fuck up a little. We’re sitting in the outside area, close, but we are in a public place. I’m pretty nervous (ya even tho we’re holding hands and cuddling a bit and blah blah)….so, (stammeringly)…

    Me: So….I was, uh….well you had this look in your eye….(Greaaaaaaat)
    Her: hm?
    Me: (must. follow. through)…..ya…I was just wondering….do you wanna kiss me?
    Her: (complete shock and surprise) WHAT. NO! No. No. If I wanted to kiss you I would have done it. That’s how I am, and – –
    Me: (Ugh. Ouch. I just kind of laugh at the humiliation)…okay, okay, relax, calm down. Caaaaaaalm down.
    Her: Yeah, I’m the type of person who will just do it when I want to do it.
    Me: (I just nod and let her spin her wheels a bit…must. plow. through)….
    Her: Blah blah blah what kind of question is that blah blah blah ………..Why, did you want to kiss me?
    Me: (I just give her a mild ‘duh’ look and smirk)….
    Her: Well….I want to, I just….there’s a lot of people around, and…
    Me: (I’m having enough trouble keeping my internals under control to think of something clever to say…I just nod and smile, and then progress to another topic..)

    So I still get the bounce under the pretense of a movie. And then, we’re sitting on my couch….

    Her: Yeah, this is nice. Unlike earlier when you were being LAME. So LAME. That is the lamest thing I’ve ever heard. Do you want to kiss me? I have never had anyone ask me a question like that. You just need to do it or not….so amazingly awkward, I mean, oh my gawd….soooooooo nerdy, I swear (seriously…she’s just going ONNNN AND OOOOONNNNN……)

    I kind of recline a bit and look over at her

    Me:……do you want to kiss me now?

    And that was it.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 4:23 pm YaReally

      lol jeeze, gave me a heart attack. I’m in a rush today so I can’t write much but 1) congrats dude! and 2) told ya. 😉

      Quick notes:

      “We’re sitting in the outside area, close, but we are in a public place.”

      This is why you have a plan for “okay now how do we get from this public place to a more isolated place…even if that’s just the patio area, or a back corner booth, or out on a quiet street, or back to my place, or to the parking lot to move her car, etc.” Because with most girls their ASD won’t let them go too far in public, even if they really really want to.

      “Me: So….I was, uh….well you had this look in your eye….(Greaaaaaaat)
      Her: hm?
      Me: (must. follow. through)…..ya…I was just wondering….do you wanna kiss me?”

      Oh…oh Scray. lol Cringed hard reading this whole part. But on the flip side we’ve all been there, and I’m glad you got to hear right from the horse’s mouth: “So LAME. That is the lamest thing I’ve ever heard. Do you want to kiss me? I have never had anyone ask me a question like that. You just need to do it or not….so amazingly awkward, I mean, oh my gawd”

      ’cause you will *NEVER* forget her saying that to you lol. She’s giving you the blueprint right there…next time you think “should I kiss her?” you’ll remember this chick and be like “goddamn, I’m going to just do it.” and go for it. So in the end it’s good.

      The MM routine of “Do you want to kiss me?” is actually solid, but it’s done from a confident playful “I would be giving you value if I let you kiss me” frame VS a nervous “am I allowed to kiss you?” value-taking frame lol.

      But that’s fine, you got through it. Ultimately while it was shaky there, you DID listen to her “there’s a lot of people around, and…” signal, and you DID change the topic instead of dwelling on it, and you DID handle her objection by then isolating you two to get her alone, and then you DID push forward again once you were alone. So that’s good stuff. Some guys would get stuck trying to logically convince her to kiss them in public. Some guys would just chalk the date up as a write-off thinking “I guess she doesn’t like me”. Some guys wouldn’t figure out how to get her to their place to be isolated.

      So the lesson here is that a lot of seduction is picking up on the girl’s signals and calibrating to them…some of them we know are a given, like that she won’t fuck you on the table in a brightly lit busy restaurant, you need to isolate her to make her ASD chill, and you generally can’t ask her to come up to your apartment to suck your dick, you need a bullshit excuse for her to tell herself so she’s not admitting she wants sex and triggering her ASD…so we can plan for a lot of those things when we design our Day 2.

      But the other half of the battle is picking up on her little signals of what she needs you to handle/disarm/avoid for her to fuck you. That chick WANTED to bang you, she just needed you to provide isolation for it and to take the responsibility off her, so she signaled those things to you and you handled them, so then she’s free to fuck you.

      This is why routine-monkeys get stuck, because they don’t calibrate to what the girl is thinking/feeling and they can’t adapt their game and just stick to the routine…pickup is an art, it’s like water, it flows and adapts as the interaction goes on. It’s not a solid brick you throw at the girl’s head lol

      Anyway, props and congrats dude. Any after-thoughts on the whole thing, looking back?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 4:24 pm YaReally

        (the near heart attack was from the whole “ummm do you umm want to kiss me?” part lol I wasn’t sure if you’d recover or get sucked into logically trying to convince her to go against her ASD)

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 5:22 pm Scray

        Those few seconds were so terrible lol. Like ‘thisismynightmare, thisismynightmare’ over and over and over again. I mean, most of it was just the bitch way it came out of my mouth. It was actually surreal watching and listening to her talk shit about it, because for some reason it reminded me of that Tyler Digest quote: ‘FUCKING DORK SUPER LAME.’

        ‘Any after-thoughts on the whole thing, looking back?’

        Yeah….I think this was the final nail in the coffin of a lot of the misogynistic thoughts I had when I was first taking the red pill. I mean, she got hit on by this tall, bearded guy while we were there. And so when he left, I made a joke

        ‘Geez what kind of guy talks to girls he doesn’t even know?’
        ‘Giants with (with a german accent)Beards!‘

        I was rolling laughing…..So ya, I’ll probably never be like ‘o girls are stupid’ or whatever again (and mean it) because there’s just so many examples I have now — both of girls who do and don’t want to fuck me (lol mostly the latter) — of cool, smart awesome women.

        I also think there’s a lot more value to actually treating yourself like a Pavlovian dog than otherwise lol. What I mean is that, rather than ignore negative thoughts and do ‘woo-woo’ shit to ‘fight’ it, I just rather acknowledge the negative thoughts and change my externals. That works like 100% of the time. If I feel sad, I listen to happy music. Problem solved. I realized this with the ‘do you want to kiss me’ disaster of 2013. I just rode it out and tried to change my externals. It’s a common theme with me, it’s how I can maintain my attitude. I never realized it before.

        So ya, I think that could be a helpful tip for anyone who gets discouraged or whatever. It makes sense — externals happen, your internals follow. So change externals, internals follow again.

        Last, I realized that I just want more. Mooooooar. If I can do this, what else can I do? So…..ya. That’s it.

        ‘This is why routine-monkeys get stuck, because they don’t calibrate to what the girl is thinking/feeling and they can’t adapt their game and just stick to the routine’

        Totally agree. I mean, ya, we deal in general concepts here but they manifest in different ways for different girls. The art part is pretty difficult.

        Welp, I’m getting out there again tonight. Going after only the difficult ones from now on. lol….

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:21 pm Naz

        “the near heart attack was from the whole “ same feeling here, but glad to see you rolling through it Scray. Great job!

        Yareally’s contributions are like the users’ manual for a machine. They might not necessarily be great marketing materials for the machine in question, but they are sure to inform you how to get it working as efficient and effective as you could possible have.

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  17. on July 18, 2013 at 3:26 pm cryo

    Diversity is finally working.

    http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/353835/detroit-declares-bankruptcy-sterling-beard

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:53 pm Canadian Friend

      Diversity destroyed Detroit.

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 7:29 am The Best Single Man Currently Living in the United States

      CH do a post on whether Detroit is the future of the entire country. That’s what happens when whites evacuate, right?

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 7:55 am thwack

        Evacuate to where?

        The Earth is finite, you can only run so far, before you end up right back where you came from.

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  18. on July 18, 2013 at 3:40 pm feministx

    I need real advice on this topic though. How do you tell if a guy is interested in more than just the bang? Some of these signs are not possible for me to see like how much more he thinks of video games than me or how much he thought about the date before it happened. Some others are obvious but by then it’s too late (leaves and doesn’t linger after brunch).

    What are signs that I could see that would help me assess long term interest?

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 3:58 pm Maya

      You should listen to your heart.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:54 pm V

      if you’re boyfriend is married thats usually a bad sign.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:27 pm Matthew

        This comment is an exercise in self control.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 6:00 pm Canadian Friend

      You said a man chased you for over a year and then after you slept with him a few times he left you after only 6 weeks.

      With all due respect, have you considered the possibility you are not all that fun in bed?

      I am not trying to be mean or anything, and of course I only have what you provided as far as “details” of this incident

      but I really think you need to take a hard look; maybe sex was not that good with you and that is why he left you so quickly.

      I doubt it was your personality as he had known you for over a year and talked to you every week or so, it must have been the sex

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 11:41 am feministx

        I would I know anyway. I think he was a sociopath looking back. I hate him so much forever. I sometimes think about beating him with a club.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 8:12 pm Matthew

      Make friends with chaste teenaged girls and study how their awkward suitors act, then go buy ice cream and kleenex, because you’re all used up.

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 2:38 am Subway Masturbator

      Honestly, the fact you’re fucking a married guy (if that’s still the case) shows that YOU can’t be taken seriously as a intact, functioning romantic prospect, so it’s a bit cynical to be wanting guy X to be one. do you realize how anti-social and amoral you are?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 3:13 pm corvinus

        +1

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 3:25 pm feministx

        Is it safe to assume that any guy that tries to get with me now sees me as a purely short term interest?

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      • on July 19, 2013 at 5:57 pm corvinus

        Yes, unless 1) you don’t ever mention the married guy you’re screwing, and 2) after you see a new guy for a few months and stop thinking about being with the married guy, which would only happen if you follow 1) to the letter.

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 2:11 am Subway Masturbator

        Your exterior similarity to an attractive functioning woman has gained you enough flattery that you also erroneously consider yourself worthy of romantic interest as you are.

        You may be wired psychopath style. In which case your life will consist of a tunnel vision mission of calculating what you can get out of people.

        LikeLike


      • on July 20, 2013 at 11:17 am feministx

        To clarify, im not trying to seek someone. Multiple guys keep trying to ask me out repeatedly. Ask out is a bit understating. They seem like they want to steal me. But I suspect they don’t want to keep me around.

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 1:07 pm BuenaVista

        You project a lot. You doubt your own value and therefore assume you have none to others, except for the bang. And by the way, most women overvalue the precious access they provide to their mysterious vaginas.

        I really don’t see what’s so complicated here. If a guy shares your values, interests, and physical type, and he remains interested if you don’t fuck him immediately — seems like Mr. Obvious, to me.

        LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 6:54 am cryo

      It’s up to you to generate long term interest. It seems like you’re just assuming you have enough value for commitment.

      LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 11:24 am ain't nuttin but a gansta partayyy

      ya’ll still be wearin that fuckin elmo suit! WTFFFFF

      LikeLike


  19. on July 18, 2013 at 3:43 pm Measures Of F**kability | Viva La Manosphere!

    […] heartiste.wordpress.com […]

    LikeLike


  20. on July 18, 2013 at 4:03 pm YaReally

    7 hours.

    Back in the early PUA days, we didn’t really look at it as number of dates. We looked at it as about 7 hours of spending time together to get the lay (for a solid attraction-based lay VS a fast fool’s mate lay…basically, her attracted enough to want to keep seeing you, but not overboard to where you’re in a dating frame).

    Like the mindset was completely different…we called it “Speed Seduction”, but that wasn’t just a gimmicky name, it was because we were looking for the most efficient route to the lay.

    So the IDEAL was cold approach a girl, and spend enough time with her to get the lay right then and there…so approach a chick at a bar around 8 or 9 and go through venue changes, partying, hang with her friends, drink, dance, build comfort/rapport, isolate, escalate, venue change for food, back to her place or yours, handle whatever friend-related obstacles are left, disarm some LMR, and have sex by 3 or 4am.

    Or cold approach a girl in the day, say running daygame around 2pm and go on an insta-date, venue change, build comfort/rapport, grab food, go for a walk, grab a drink somewhere as evening rolls in, escalate, venue change, back to her place or yours, disarm some LMR, and have sex by 9pm or just in general that night for sure.

    Now getting a phone number was actually a “failure” in that it was a last resort…if you HAD to, you’d get a number, because for whatever reason the logistics weren’t going to work to stick with her and bang her in the initial interaction (ie – you meet her on her lunch break and she has to go back to work, or you meet her at the bar but her friend is puking and she has to take her home, etc.). This is why we didn’t just collect phone numbers, we Time Bridged (ala Mystery Method), where the purpose of getting a number was to solidify plans to DO something. It wasn’t “give me your #, we should hang out sometime”, it was “give me your # and we’ll go see that thing we talked about on Tuesday.”

    So ending up on a “Day 2” was simply a consequence of not being able to seal the deal on the initial meet…it wasn’t a GOAL to go on a Day 2.

    On top of that, the 7 hour rule doesn’t care how you divide it up. You can stretch the first interaction out for 7 hours and get the lay, or you could go on 7 one hour dates…but because it was SPEED Seduction we were going for the most efficient route, which is as few dates as possible, ideally none.

    So most of the time it would look something like 2-4 hours together in the initial interaction, then a Day 2 that lasts a few hours and boom, that’s the 7 hours down and if your game was tight, she should be ready to bang by then.

    It would be rare for it to take till a Day 3, and we would basically say “dude, your game needs serious work” if a guy was ending up on Day 4s and 5s. Like we could use this as a guage of “it takes me a solid 2 dates to get a lay every time” sticking points where we could say “post some Field Reports and we’ll figure out how to tighten your shit up ’cause it shouldn’t be taking that long”.

    We can bang faster than 7 hours now, as RSD has shown, but I still feel like 7 hours is a good guide for a really solid pickup. Like I can go run a numbers game and find something to stick my dick in in under an hour who won’t remember my name the next morning, and that can even turn into a fuckbuddy/relationship situ now and then. But for the type of game we were running back in the day, the “art” part of “pickup artist”, where the girl felt like she had met her soulmate and like you knew her the way no one else in her life ever knew or understood her, and she would chase you and beg to hang out again etc. etc….7 hours is solid.

    If you’re taking 3 dates to get the lay, you could be more efficient/tighter/creative. If you have tight game you SHOULD be having sex on your Day 2 or initial meet. If your Day 2 ends without sex, it means that you dropped the ball somewhere and your game could be tightened up.

    That’s why I was encouraging Scray yesterday to have sex with his chick he had a date set up with. All the signs were there that she was into it, so if he hadn’t gotten the lay, I’d have said “okay, that’s not an outcome that should have happened…let’s look at where you dropped the ball. What were logistics like? What was your plan for getting back to your place? Did you miss signals she gave you? etc.” and helped him narrow down where he could’ve been more efficient.

    It doesn’t matter if she’s hot. She could be smokin gorgeous and trying to play hard to get, but if her favorite rich handsome tall famous celebrity stud showed up and said “I want to whisk you away for a few hours on a date, blow your emotions through the roof, and then fuck your brains out”, she would fuck him. So if you’re not able to duplicate that, then it’s just a matter of not having high enough value to her, or not having a solid enough Day 2 plan that leads back to one of your bedrooms.

    So ya, 7 hours. For the life of me I legit can’t even remember the last time I went out with a girl on a Day 3 without her having put out already lol.

    I think game this days has evolved, but guys have also lost the cut-throat edge that we had in the early days…it’s a lot more “just have fun and it’ll happen eventually, who cares, you have other girls” VS “take her here, do this, do that, and push for the lay that night”. On the one hand that’s a good thing, because it’s an overall healthier “don’t give a fuck” mindset to build…but on the other hand, well, you can’t argue with results. It’s like going to the gym and randomly lifting weights until you’re “tired” VS going and purposely pushing yourself one rep further than last time and tracking your measurements etc. You’ll get in shape either way, but one way is efficient/fast and the other is less so.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 4:27 pm Tilikum

      “You’ll get in shape either way, but one way is efficient/fast and the other is less so.”

      i think you can chalk that up to natural vs. raw beta learning curve though.
      might be a different personality type finding the sphere.

      LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:35 pm july

      Much respect to YaReally for taking the time to write that up. (read it all)

      Can’t agree with that gym analogy though. There must be some other way you can put that into understanding, because you can measure iron weights, not human interactions. When you squat 225lbs one week, it will still be 225lbs the next week. It won’t suddenly change weight on you because it had a mood swing.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 8:22 pm immoralgables

        July, I see where you’re coming from.

        I’m going to try to answer your question with the caveat that yeah, if you really want to be argumentative about it, we could be going back and forth all weekend.

        In regards to the gym, if you want to take the path of least resistance to getting bigger and more jacked, then your best goal would be to get the nutrition down, get a trainer, go with a workout buddy that pushes you, start a program that focuses on getting jacked (GVT Training for example), you’re taking supplements, eating a lot, measuring calories and hitting the macros, etc etc. Basically, you’re doing it right. In 2 years time no doubt you would have hit your goal to be big and aesthetically pleasing.

        Or

        You could also just go for 4 years and lift heavy ass weights. Compound lifts, body weight exercises, it doesn’t matter. You’re just going consistently and lifting heavy and making sure you leave with sweat stains on your shirt; that’s the basic criteria.

        Both routes will get you to the same goal; that is to be big and jacked. The thing is, one will get you there quicker and also, one will have you looking better than the other. No need to guess which is which but if you’re still not with me, the first alternative will help you achieve your goals quicker and more effectively.

        Same thing with pick-up.

        You can go out for 4 years and just have fun and “hit on girls” and no doubt you will get laid and have enough reference experiences to develop mental synapses and get better at it.

        Or.

        You could go out for 2 years and be systematic about it. RSD Vids on youtube, reading pick-up theory, going to a LoveSystems bootcamp, joining a lair, doing a 30 Day challenge, writing down your field report, measure your progress, break it down into chunks, go to improv classes, invest a couple thousand into revamping your style, getting your physique to an aesthetically please level, etc etc.

        So yeah, tjhe secpond will get you to your goal quicker and you will probably be firing on all cylinders when it comes to your dating life.

        Hopefully that answers your question a bit better.

        LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:43 pm Scray

      Yeah, it was so helpful when you said yesterday to just get in the mindset of ‘just going out to shoot the shit,’ because I think it gets at this. 7 hours is a long time. I mean, we were there for like 2 hours or so before we even were sitting next to one another and kinda cuddling. And then like another hour after that before the incident. And then another hour and a half after that of full recovery lol. When we first met it was like about 30-40 minutes of talking.

      To me 7 hours is a long-assed time lol. But like, if you’re looking to actually DHV and stuff….that shit just takes awhile. All of my sets that have turned into something were longer interactions. Like, when you’re working just off your personality to DHV and shit…..that takes awhile (for me at least lol…I’m sure I can get tighter eventually).

      10-15 minutes —> social hookpoint (like, where they wouldn’t think it was weird if you went with them somewhere else in the venue or where you can lead them)
      ~40 minutes —-> solid A3

      Going back…most of my flakes are from interactions that were like 10-15 minutes long total.

      I do think that when I get tighter, maybe I’ll be able to shave off time to all of this. But, y’know…I’m just a person. I fuck up and have to recover lol. Sometimes I stumble on the opener. Sometimes my ‘imagined as awesome’ DHV routine falls flat, etc. etc. etc. etc.

      So really walking in there with a ‘I don’t expect anything, let’s just shoot the shit mindset’ may take care of a lot of this –> will try it tonight.

      LikeLike


      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:25 pm YaReally

        I’m not a big fan of Alexander from RSD’s style/teaching but he puts it like “being at a bar is like you’re all in detention together. You’re all strangers trapped in the same room for a few hours. So be that guy in detention who makes a boring/awkward situation fun and shoots the shit and becomes the center of attention…they need that and you can provide it.”

        I like that outlook in general.

        Also compare our 7 hours to a normal guy. A normal guy spends weeks getting to know a girl in his social circle. Or maybe he flukes into a cold approach…then he goes on a dinner & movie date (4 hours) and gets a peck on the cheek and $100+ because he pays for both of them. Then a daytime date kayaking or skydiving to impress her, another 4 hours plus maybe a kiss plus $100. Then a couple more dinner dates, another 6 hours total there plus another $100. Then a DVD night to finally make the move, another 2 or 3 movies in a row as he works up the balls to do what she’s dying for him to do…so another 6 hours then finally sex.

        You spent 30 min with a girl, got her #, then spent like 5-7 hours goofing around and got sex. You could’ve even made her pay for her own drinks lol

        Compared to a normal guy, that’s pretty slick.

        I think part of why I grew to like women is that I looked at that 7 hours as fun instead of an obstacle. To me 7hrs was mind-blowingly fast compared to what people think so it was like lol sure lets go on a little adventure and tease eachother and okay show me your family photos when we’re at your place, oh cool so you’re into bla bla…like I know the sex will happen either that night or the next so fuck it, lets smile and have fun and people-watch together and let me drag her into the rain for a kiss and let’s pretend we’re brother & sister then weird people out by kissing and lets collect some funny stories and fuck it lets pop into the strip club and lets hit an arcade so I can kick her ass at a game and then let her win so she can do a victory dance, lets sneak up to the roof to slow-dance to songs on my iPod…

        Like man, it’s all fun. Esp when you’re with a cute girl you know you’ll be banging later.

        For normal guys (specifically the rich good looking ones who thought having $ and a 6-pack and nice car would = instant pussy), it can be frustrating like man I’ve spent $500 and it’s been a month of dates, where’s the return on my investment!! Or for bitter “women are all shit” Manosphere type PUAs the 7 hours is a chore like “ugh now I have to TALK to her…why can’t she just put out?? Women only say stupid shit anyway, fuckin bitches.”

        That’s all silly to me. Far as I’m concerned I’m making out like a bandit even if it takes me 9 hours instead of 7 lol

        LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 7:32 am The Best Single Man Currently Living in the United States

      Bro do you have a job? How the fuck do you write 20 pages of comments here every day?

      LikeLike


      • on July 19, 2013 at 1:28 pm YaReally

        I use my penis as a third finger for typing. Any typos are beaucse it’s so huge it just mashes clumps of keys all at once.

        LikeLike


  21. on July 18, 2013 at 4:44 pm anotheronetakesthepill

    Question to CH and others.

    With younger girls, is it better to play the “You are too young for me” and tell them your minimum age is let’s say 23 (when the girls in question are 19-21) or would you express that you like them young just so that they don’t see you unattainable and feel that they could be a part of the game of seduction?

    LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 9:17 am CH

      There are two common PUA tactics to neutralize a large age difference if the girl is significantly younger and you suspect she will have misgivings about dating an older man. One way is to disqualify her for being too young (“I usually date older women. The younger girls aren’t very sophisticated” or “Don’t you think you’re too young and inexperienced to be talking with me?”) and thereby challenge her to impress you. The other way is to cheekily disqualify her for being too old (“23? Well, you’re older than the last girl I dated. Life is about trying new experiences, right?”).

      For men seeking the easy solution: In the first month of dating, you should just lie about your age. Tell them later, when it won’t matter because she’ll be hooked on you.

      LikeLike


  22. on July 18, 2013 at 5:21 pm Hhh

    In other news, it is currently not safe to be in Detroit.

    .http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/19/us/detroit-files-for-bankruptcy.html?hp&_r=0

    LikeLike


  23. on July 18, 2013 at 5:33 pm Wrecked 'Em

    Slightly off topic, but can anybody here speak to the prevalence of Game in bars on the West Coast, specifically LA?

    An ex-colleague of mine, who was a solid 8 (a certain set of guys might even go with 9) back four years ago when she was 24, moved to LA about a year and a half ago. Today I’d say she’s working her way down through the 7s, but I don’t think that exactly explains the dating scene complaints she has.

    That of which she complains will sound familiar to denizens du Château: Guys “touching her all the time” (kino, poorly implemented), guys “insulting her” (negs, poorly implemented), and guys buying girls a drink suddenly going out of fashion across the board (gentlemen, whomever you are, I salute you!)

    I’d hazard that the CH Virus has mutated to an airborne contagion and is replicating with fury, but can that really be? Maybe it’s just the crowd she hangs with — but HIPSTERS? I mean, her big goal is to work for the UN, and the guys that make up her circle of friends are the sort that think Being Ironic is some kind of Life Skill. Most of these guys wouldn’t know which end of a screwdriver to use, so I’m not sure I’m buying it.

    But, there it is… what’s happening?

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 5:47 pm cryo

      As useful as PUA is, it does tend to attract the riffraff. A majority of guys who try to learn game don’t have the mental faculties to understand concepts like calibration, subtlety, finesse, etc. That’s why I don’t believe Game or Red Pill will ever be truly mainstream.

      LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 6:05 pm FuriousFerret

      “That of which she complains will sound familiar to denizens du Château: Guys “touching her all the time” (kino, poorly implemented), guys “insulting her” (negs, poorly implemented), and guys buying girls a drink suddenly going out of fashion across the board (gentlemen, whomever you are, I salute you!)”

      My thoughts on poorly implemented Game is that it’s a good thing. The more men that don’t place women on the pedestal and don’t inflate her value is always a positive development.

      I know that bad Game has an affect of strengthening women’s bitch shields however it’s a net gain in terms of them not having the same level of beta orbiters who do so much more damage in the long term.

      So basically our society needs more objectifying of women that go out with the purpose of being objectified. If we can achieve a level of having most men that have some level of attractiveness not giving a shit about women’s feelings and preferences and taking back their balls, things will get a lot better. Women will be forced to put in the effort instead of just announcing to the world that they have arrived. When a good amount of betas don’t give attention without sexual reciprocation that’s when you know the tide is turning.

      LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 7:40 pm Rick Derris

      >>>but can anybody here speak to the prevalence of Game in bars on the West Coast, specifically LA?

      At the end of Strauss’ “The Game” he gives an anecdote in which he uses an opener routine on a woman in LA, and she replies with “I heard that one already.”

      A lot more women and men than you’d guess are familiar with the basic concepts from Mystery/Strauss, but as you point out, a lot of guys just do rote repetition of the concepts described in the books by Mystery & Strauss. Same with some of DeAngelo’s concepts. In 2009 I was in a bar and a guy walked in with a crazy hat and guy-liner on – he must’ve just finished watching Mystery’s VH1 show.

      Just trying to repeat something that worked in one instance won’t necessarily work in the future.

      The biggest reason I follow CH’s blog is because it focuses on the background or the theory of “game.” I think it’s much more important to get that down and get into the correct mindset instead of coming up with some other canned opener or routine that will sound contrived or borrowed.

      LikeLike


  24. on July 18, 2013 at 7:15 pm Measures Of Fuckability « PUA Central

    […] Measures Of Fuckability […]

    LikeLike


  25. on July 18, 2013 at 9:35 pm Mr.C

    There is one word that I believe sums up the background theory and bedrock of game for a man.

    VALUE

    Ask yourself this.

    Where is my value coming from and what is giving me my value?

    (p.s. It’s nice to be cited)

    LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 10:07 pm Erik Roar

      Very good statement. I love it when complex things can be broken down to simple ideas, yet still retain it’s depth.

      LikeLike


  26. on July 18, 2013 at 9:56 pm alexandrahamilton87

    Something you guys could answer for me, if you would. I have a friend who’s somewhat of a natural with women. Women just seem to magically flock to him in a bar…. But only 4-6s. And that’s all he bangs. I just don’t understand it. Is he lazy? It seems like he would channel that vibe into banging fewer but prettier women… Why is he slumming it? It’s always confused me…

    LikeLike


    • on July 18, 2013 at 10:17 pm Scray

      ‘Women just seem to magically flock to him in a bar’

      My guess is that your friend is like a 7 in looks and is just coasting on them. He approaches when he gets AI’s from these 4-6’s and it’s all easy. In that case, what you’re seeing is a guy interacting with women when he already has value to them. That’s all he knows.

      When you roll up to girls who are hotter than you (or, tbh, at around your same level of attractiveness even)…that shit doesn’t cut it any more. You can’t walk in and be like ‘gay,’ ‘nah,’ ‘bring da movies’ and expect much before you’ve built the value.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:36 pm alexandrahamilton87

        He’s 5’8″ ish and starting to bald even though he’s only 26. I wouldn’t call him coasting on looks, for sure. He’s not ugly, just a hair on the ugly side of average… But the rest of what you say makes sense. He just seems to shrug and go with it because it’s easy but from what I’ve read on here that seems incongruous with a man trying to get with the hottest thing he can talk into bed. I have no doubt that if he tried a little he could talk much hotter girls into bed but he seems happy taking home 5s.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:52 pm Scray

        The ugly side of average would place him at like a 4.5-5. Therefore, either he’s better looking than you describe, or he already has fairly tight game. If he’s a 4.5 and hooking up with 6’s….that’s pretty good. Like, the amount of effort he would have to put in to bag 7+ chicks would be Herculean.

        Not saying it isn’t doable…it’s just most guys don’t really want to spend 6 mo’s – year in hardcore ‘ya you suck’ Field land.

        There could be other passive variables he has that you aren’t cluing us into either….like….is he real muscular, does he have a real deep voice, is his body language super strong, does he have wicked style, etc etc etc

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:56 pm alexandrahamilton87

        It’s totally possible that he has qualities I don’t notice. That’s how I maintain my all-dude crew. Rule #1 never, ever EVER flirt or hook up with the man friends. Or in their presence. As far as they know, I’m a virgin or a lesbian.

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      • on July 20, 2013 at 10:40 am Subway Masturbator

        “All dude crew.” The Flattery Container ship for Alexandra. Loathsome.

        LikeLike


      • on July 21, 2013 at 4:59 am Scray

        Lol welp, none of these guys can be particularly high value if you never flirt or hook up with them. Therefore, my guess is that your friend already has fairly tight game. He would be taking a shot at the major leagues by “moving up.”

        LikeLike


      • on July 23, 2013 at 9:43 pm alexandrahamilton87

        About the flattery container or whatever…that, or… I’m one of those girls who doesn’t “hook up” in the carnal sense. I’ve had two partners including my current boyfriend, and the first was a 4 year relationship. I was referring to kissing, which even I have from time to time engaged in after a couple glasses of wine, so sue me. And since I regularly chat with cute chicks in bars and invite them into conversation, my dude crew is pretty happy with my presence, I think. Anyway they keep inviting me out and not one of them has gone all foppishly orbiter towards me.

        I’m pretty masculine in personality though, no doubt many dudes aren’t in to that for a girlfriend.

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    • on July 18, 2013 at 10:44 pm Mr.C

      He IS a natural.
      With 4’s – 6’s.

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:47 pm Scray

        lol

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 10:53 pm alexandrahamilton87

        Yes but if you were that successful with the 4-6 girls wouldn’t you move up to attempting the 7’s?

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      • on July 18, 2013 at 11:08 pm Mr.C

        This is what you should be asking him.

        LikeLike


      • on July 19, 2013 at 2:45 am Subway Masturbator

        Why don’t you just come out an admit to him you want to do him? The Subway Masturbator sees all.

        LikeLike


      • on July 23, 2013 at 9:33 pm alexandrahamilton87

        Lol no. I already have a man. And even by this blog’s standards, why would I be attracted to a guy who has already shown me that his value is only enough to get 4-6s?

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    • on July 19, 2013 at 11:22 am Matthew King

      Why is he slumming it?

      Because it’s easier. Ars longa, vita brevis.

      “Life is short, and art long; the opportunity fleeting; experience perilous; and decision difficult.” — Hippocrates

      LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 3:17 pm corvinus

      Laziness.

      I used to have 4-6s flocking to me too, but I said, “meh, could do better,” and now I’m getting more in the 7-9 range, with the 4-6s now ignoring me or even flat-out rejecting me. Haaa. Only problem is, there aren’t nearly as many 7-9s as 4-6s, but quality is better than quantity!

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      • on July 23, 2013 at 9:45 pm alexandrahamilton87

        I don’t think he’s made that leap. Is this the male equivalent of a hot chick who gains 20 lbs because “meh, why not?” Haha.

        LikeLike


  27. on July 18, 2013 at 10:38 pm Libertardian

    http://www.annarbor.com/news/university-of-michigan-governing-board-passes-tuition-equality-for-military-unauthorized-immigrants/

    “Unauthorized immigrants schooled in Michigan and all military and honorably discharged veterans will now receive in-state tuition rates at the University of Michigan.

    The Board of Regents voted 6-2 to approve the change to its residency guidelines during a 3 p.m. public meeting Thursday at the North Campus Research Complex.

    The vote was along party lines, with the board’s Democrats voting in favor of the measure and Republicans voting against it.”

    What Amerikan citizens should all do is leave, renounce their Amerikan citizenships, immigrate illegally, and start raking in the gimmedats instead of paying for them.

    LikeLike


  28. on July 18, 2013 at 11:19 pm Jason

    H’s tweet: “Come on @DouthatNYT , how about a little credit here?”

    I love many of your insights, but such moaning about lack of recognition from MSM fails to recognize something: the comments section of this blog is unmoderated. Purely hateful comments prompting various illegal acts such as murder, assault, etc (mostly in the race war posts) are tacitly approved by your lack of censorship.

    Ross Douthat, like all journalists concerned about their reputation, probably doesn’t want to be associated with *that*, since most people are repulsed by unnecessary brutal violence. These are lessons that newspapers and magazines learned a long, long time ago, and it’s why they have editorial staff to weed through the letters to the editor. You may think this is old-fashioned, but this layer of interpretation actually allows those organs to appeal to a broader readership.

    So unless you take a firmer hand with the atavism, CH will be a footnote in history, at most. Your style deserves more, of course. But as long as you allow truly damaged people equal voice (paging whorefinder) … well, that’s life.

    LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 9:01 am CH

      Concern troll.

      LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 11:33 am Matthew King

      He deserves recognition, but only on his own terms — terms you have a problem acknowledging as legitimate, because you are wedded to the times. “Whoever marries the spirit of this age will find himself a widower in the next.”

      There indeed should be bridges between here and the mainstream, if only to get the word out. But CH’s pseudonymity and lack of censorship are clear indications of one thing: he has prioritized truth above power.

      Or, put another way: he is in it for the long-term ROI. Because eventually “the truth will out.” Over the broadest possible time frame, truth converges with power. Truth becomes power, and fidelity is rewarded. “He’s been saying that for years, and now we know he was right all along.”

      This does not compute to the leftist because he long ago traded the truth for a quick power fix. You have long since ceased believing in the eventual victory of truth. Hell, you have abandoned the very idea of truth itself as a delusional fantasy of the powerless.

      Matt

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  29. on July 19, 2013 at 4:40 am Plumnuts

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jul/19/barbecue-normal-men-sexist

    Beta of a lifetime or expert troll?

    LikeLike


    • on July 19, 2013 at 9:41 am tj

      The comments are hysterical – so much agreement with the author. No wonder England is in such decline

      LikeLike


  30. on July 20, 2013 at 4:32 am Kenny Pua

    Most important thing/tip to always remember when trying to get girl’s phone number. Click the video!

    LikeLike


  31. on July 20, 2013 at 6:23 am Troubadour

    Maybe the kind of guy who slowly morphed as he got older, picked on when a youth and his self-esteem took a beating. Didn’t notice as he got better looking and women were beginning to check him out…
    This kind of guy is shocked, SHOCKED when you point out that a woman was interested in him… They don’t have the drive for multiple women because they aren’t used to being with many women. They’re happy in a stable LTR.

    Maybe some are. I’m safe and comfortable (and materially trapped) in a stable LTR, but not happy. I’ve never been happy, I’ve just always been too retarded around pretty women to get past turning into putty. That’s why I’ve only had sex with two fat chicks, but I play a dozen musical instruments, speak three languages, and have a text wall of other boring intellectual accomplishments. I’m the most fascinating guy who ever bored the shit out of a woman.

    When I started down the red pill rabbit hole, I was basically looking for a new muse. I haven’t done art or music or anything in the longest time; ever since the day a 15 year old whore kissed me, and I got that close to what I mostly did all that other shit to distract myself from not being able to get.

    I might get bored with pussy eventually, and want to go back to writing, but I’m definitely ruined for writing until I get some of that pussy.

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  32. on July 20, 2013 at 12:31 pm Abe O. Padilla

    There is no “conspiracy” to depict White guys as the font of all evil, this was the natural outcome of self-seeking agents hired to run media giants and appealing to second/third generation creators (like Whedon/Abrams) who are deeply socially isolated, contemptous of most ordinary people, and pandering to a mostly female/yuppie audience because it’s easy and comfortable and there’s no emphasis on profits.

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  33. on July 21, 2013 at 10:52 pm el sid

    on the subject of anal sex. Has anyone tried sex with goats and chickens…. yum yum. i don’t know why more people don’t try it.

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  34. on July 23, 2013 at 3:09 pm Silver Price

    In the post on how to be an alpha male (without becoming a stereotype), we broke down the difference between what’s generally thought of as “alpha” and what alpha actually is, and about the character of the nomad — the man who’s neither alpha, nor beta, nor any other role in a social hierarchy, but instead operates outside it entirely.

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