Beta Bait is an important game concept first elucidated here at CH. Beta Bait is a psy ops gambit deployed by women to “trap” men into doing or saying something that indicates a beta male mentality (i.e., a scarcity mentality). It’s basically a male status ascertainment algorithm.
Beta Bait is similar to the classic shit test, but with notable distinctions.
Shit tests occur with the most regularity and intensity during early game, and at times when the relationship is on the skids. They are normally loaded up front to help the girl quickly take the measure of your alphaness. Beta bait happens at any time while dating a girl, (or even when not dating a girl, say, while languishing in her orbit as a sex-denied friendzone chump), and are spread out evenly in a relationship as a sort of low level boyfriend diagnosis script.
Shit tests are more obvious than beta bait, and thus easier to pass for men with excellent awareness of female hypergamy tactics. A shit test can be quite bold and shocking to newb ears and thus scare off lesser men, but the inveterate player always operates with the frame that shit tests and other assorted confusing and bitchy female behavior are an opportunity rather than an obstacle to demonstrate his mate value. A girl who is giving you shit is a hell of a lot closer to sex with you than a girl who is indifferent to your existence.
Of the two, beta bait is by far more dangerous than shit tests. If you fail a shit test, you move on to the next girl within your field of view. Your pain is over quickly and time is saved for mining new whore. But beta bait is subtler and more insidious; you may not even recognize you’re being baited until she’s screaming “HALF!” and the kid suddenly doesn’t look like you anymore.
In short, shit tests are what women do when they feel attracted to you and don’t know how to properly deal with their growing feelings of desire. Beta bait is what women do when they are feeling LESS attracted to you (or not attracted at all), and are actively seeking ways to verify that you are indeed the beta male they love to loathe and despise.
It’s a crucial distinction, because beta bait tends to sneak up on a man and slowly erode his self-confidence and his all-important alpha male status, while shit tests are direct and thus, theoretically at least, instantly manageable.
So we come to what I regard as one of the three most invidious, and frequently encountered, beta bait schemes women love to surprise buttsecks on men.
The first two beta bait evil schemes are:
If a girl broaches sexual topics too soon, and with a cocky air of bawdiness, it could be beta bait. A beta male will practically glow with excitement and curiosity when a girl he likes sexually supercharges their conversation. If this is you, DON’T TAKE THE BAIT. A little push-off now goes a long way toward a lot of pull-in later.
Beware girls fishing for flattery. If you give it to them, they will not come.
Which brings us to the topic of this post:
Beta Bait Scheme #3: The “Bad Boyfriend” Ploy.
The BBP is beta bait for the long haul. This is the kind of “smoke out the beta male” game that women will play for months and years, if they feel it necessary.
You’ll know it’s happening when your woman nags you about being a better boyfriend. Often, the form it takes is a woman acting irate about her boyfriend “cheating in his heart”, or not investing enough in the relationship, or just generally failing her outrageous expectations in one or multiple ways.
Here be the rub. She doesn’t actually think you’re a bad boyfriend. She thinks you’re a beta boyfriend. So her BBP dramafest is really a self-gratifying acting class to alleviate her guilt for feeling bored and out of love and wanting to break up. Naturally, most beta boyfriends will take this as a serious charge against their character, and work overtime to appease their nagging girlfriends, which will only make their women despise them more.
The right and proper response to a BBP attack is amused dismissiveness, seasoned with a bit of the ol’ dread game. Remember, if you really are a bad boyfriend (aka an alpha male with unfulfilled options), your girlfriend won’t react to that by nagging you; instead, she’ll react by trying harder HERSELF to please YOU. Plush quislings get nagged. Bad boyfriends get hot sex because their women hope that’ll soften them a little.

[…] The Third Beta Bait Type: The “Bad Boyfriend” Ploy […]
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1) If a girl broaches sexual topics too soon, and with a cocky air of bawdiness, it could be she’s a slut.
2) Give women flattery they are fine for a day, teach them to give out flattery they will be happy for a lifetime.
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OT: Currently running Text Game on a cute, fit 19-year old [7.00-7.50]. It’s like plug-n-play. Hilarious. This shit works. We’re meeting up this weekend.
For older guys picking up much younger women, the key I find is to not bring up the age difference. Young women are naturally drawn to older men who keep fit, are successful, have a certain level of sophistication, and have led an interesting life. If they aren’t, with you, act as if they are.
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Walk down the street and project the qualities you describe. Make strong eye contact and then smile to a much younger girl walking the opposite direction. In more cases than you’d expect, she will look at you intrigued and smile back.
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For IRL initiations, this works – you must believe the age difference is insignificant, as it is if you’ve got what it takes to maintain frame. It works, because if they are among that large group of young women that is fine with older men, they just see you as you are IRL from the start. Your looks and persona are pre-merged.
With text initiations, she may be in for a big shock if she has a significantly younger mental image of you. Have you prepped for this?
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yeah; this is true. Women usually ask the age and the shock is no good. So I do what any guy would and I lie. I ease them into it. By the time they’re coming for the umpteenth time, are they REALLY gonna say no if I tell them I’m 43? I told one 18 year old in the middle of the act that and it turned her on.
The problem I have with the much younger girls is they all fall in love and they are hard to fkin get rid of.
As far as the OP, in women’s defense, I really AM a bad boyfriend. I still treat it like betabait anyway tho lol
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[…] The Third Beta Bait Type: The “Bad Boyfriend” Ploy […]
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I love ‘how to be a Beta’. I have learnt this on here – a great way to get rid of girls you don’t like or are tired of.
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Giving ‘good boyfriend’ advice seems to be the default, from both men and women. I have heard this advice countless times that the way to be a good boyfriend or husband is to, usually, buy more flowers, provide foot rubs, tell her how much she means to you, etc. Generally the advice is to concede more, but apparently receive less. Who the hell came up with this damned advice and why is it so prevalent?
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> “Who the hell came up with this damned advice and why is it so prevalent?”
Well, the dudes who came up with the all-time very worst possible advice ever given to a Good Boyfriend, who was in the process of losing his woman to her Bad Boyfriend, were named Alan Jay LERNER and Frederick LOEWE:
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“If a girl broaches sexual topics too soon, and with a cocky air of bawdiness, it could be beta bait.”
One of the responses that worked for me was “I never saw you as that sexual.” Then I refused to explain, saying “It’s just the vibe I got — never mind.” Definitely takes the wind out of their sails. It also could be disastrous if you really piss her off, but I tend to be funny enough that I can throw in the little zinger now and again without too much damage.
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I totally misread the title, and I actually had to RTFA to figure what the heck was wrong with being a “Bad Boy” Friend [with benefits] – since we’re all reformed Nice Guys who are working overtime to earn that whole vibe of Christopher “Hammer Studios” Lee. [I.e we’re striving to be her “Bad Boyfriend” whom she sees when she’s bored to tears with her “Good Boyfriend”.]
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So when my wife says she doesn’t want to have sex with me because I only approach her physically when I want sex and she wants me to cuddle her more, this is beta bait, designed to help her decide to ultimately scream Half!?
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Just make sure that she has plenty of orgasms when you rape her, and all will be forgiven.
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I ask the question seriously – I know I’m a beta. Just trying to change.
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Step 1. Tease her mercilessly about everything, except things about which she has no confidence. Be playful.
Step 2. Bring a pair of barbells home and use them right before bedtime, in the bedroom.
Step 3. Go on a diet. Doesn’t matter what diet, as long as it’s sane and requires you make some meals separate from her. DO eat supper with her, and breakfast, even if you’re eating different meals.
Step 4. Get a new hobby, or replace a hobby. The new hobby should be DIRT CHEAP – a child could afford it – and requires you spend some time alone working on projects with your hands.
Step 5. Join a men’s groups at a church – any church – but the group must be MEN ONLY and meet early AM. This advice goes double if you’re atheist. Triple if she’s atheist/agnostic/absent. Chicks dig the religious. Dunno why.
Report back for assistance. Several guys here are married. Most of CH’s advice is sound, but will hit like a nuke on a stale marriage.
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Did somebody call my name???
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In some states there are spouse rape laws. While rape is appealing it might land you in jail.
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I’d say that’s more of a shit test.
If you are interested there are lots of ways to deal with this.
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I am definitely interested. Right now, to be honest, I’m doing the cuddling and keeping score to throw it in her face when nothing changes.
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in the meantime your strategy is dishonest and passive aggressive and beta to the core. Literally the opposite of what you should do. Check into No More Mr. Nice Guy in the meantime.
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Hard to argue with that.
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OK may take a day or to but will get back to you. stay tuned.
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I will. Vox says tell her she’s full of crap, stop initiating entirely, go out with male friends 2x / week, and when she wants to cuddle, ask her why. Not sure it will help things – I’ve got 3 kids, don’t necessarily want to nuke my marriage.
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Vox is right. “Ice the bitch”. It is especially important to exit her frame for one of your own making.
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cuddle her but with your hand on her tits or on her cooch…or both.
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There’s an answer to this.
“Honey, after I approach you physically, without wanting to fuck you, the physical contact changes my mind, and then I want to fuck you. You have that effect on me.”
Pause.
“Except when you fart.”
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I love this – unfortunately, I think we’re past the point where playful teasing helps.
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Then it can do no harm. Remember, you have alternatives, so you must act as if you are not afraid to offend her. If she gets offended, double down. When things are bad, you have nowhere to go but better.
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Tell her, “Sure, we can cuddle, but wear this (something made of Saranwrap) and these – (a pair of handcuffs).”
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The first thing to do is figure out if it low arousal or low attraction. How often are you turned down for sex and for How long has this been going on?
Low arousal can be dealt with more easily by stimulating her throughout the day, you k ow some seduction. Tease, charm flirt, Kino… From when you wake up. So you see her in the kitchen in the morning come up behind her and give her ass a squeeze whisper in her ear something like that’s nice and then boom move away get your coffee and be gone. Hit and run. You want to spike her and start her mind to think about sex. A married woman has lots of reasons to NOT think about sex and if you come to bed at 10pm on any given night with a boner and haven’t flirted and teased you have really lowered your chances of success. She needs time to get out of wife mode and into lover mode.
Again on arousal… You can start cuddling and just be chill let your hands wander like you doing light Kino, graze her skin don’t dive right in, get her talking let her blab blab blab and clear her head of the zillion thoughts she has. Don’t problem solve. Just hmmm hmmm and oh really . let her unwind. Increase the Kino. After about 15 minutes of this start removing her clothes. She might be like I thought we were cuddling? Just be like I am cuddling and then something like look at you I can’t handle all this you are too hot. Then firmly move for sex.
If she blows you off at this point don’t be passive aggressive and but hurt. Just shrug be cocky and say something like really you turning down the sexy hunk o man meat? Oh well. Was going to be good tonight, Just below average. With a cocky funny vibe. You are not butt hurt!
Then kiss her on the head and roll over. Start to read or just go to sleep. You are demonstrating outcome independence. Her prissy is not on a pedastle.
She will probably try and bait you I to a conversation “now you’re mad” “we were having a nice time why did you ruin it” “all you want is sex” etc.
Don’t take the bait. Just be pleasant. Hey you said you weren’t in the mood. No big deal. Another time. Goodnight.
This will freak her the fuck out. And slowly things will start to change.
Now that’s low arousal. Low attraction is another story. We Will get back to that.
In the meantime get the Mmsl 2011 primer on Amazon. It will explain clearly and concisely evobiology and psych in a ltr context. Do not let her know or find it!
More to come…
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Good stuff from Sentient. I will just add that by “low attraction” I assume he means that the problem is that your wife isn’t thatmuch into you to begin with – it’s a more fundamental issue than simply not being in the mood – aka low arousal.
Read MMSL, and also the various pointers here about bringing red pill principles into your marriage – that Dave from Hawaii post was genuinely inspiring, but there are other guys here who have done similar stuff.
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Thanks – this I can do, but I think it’s low attraction. When things are good between us, what you wrote is essentially how it plays out, though it ends in sex, because she’s in the mood.
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Got the primer and am reading it. Don’t give up on the beta of the decade!
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Good reading DT. This will probably all hit you like a ton of bricks and you will see yourself page after page. You may get angry, but experience shows in most cases of low attraction don’t blame your wife you dug the hole spoon by spoon.
Also keep in mind as you implement that HER perception of you and any changes you are making (upping alpha, taking care of business, leading more etc.) are likely to LAG your view by 3 to even 6 months. So there will be a lot of changes taking place for a long period and you may not get much of a reaction from it, until that feather finally lands on the camels back and breaks it. Keep heart. Totally reversible situation usually.
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“I’ve been reading Vox, the Chateau, some Rollo and some Athol religiously for a year now, and the things you say make sense. Will and discipline is what I need now.”
What you need now is stop reading, make a short list of a few concrete things you will actually say and do with her, and DO them.
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Appreciate the replies. More details: I’m just over 40, fairly successful and in good shape.
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Congratulations you can be beta of the decade.
Here is the deal the blue pill world sets guys up for a massive covert contract to wit – if I maintain my fitness am a good provider an involved father do my share of household chorus and keep my dick out of other women then I merit sex.
To a wife It’s just like meh… So what did you do for me today? Can you possibly see that in this scenario she gets everything a beta can bring and beta with some industry can bring a fucking lot AND she gets sex ANYTIME she wants it. She gets hormonal during ovulation and you a Freddy at the ready to scratch that itch . she gets it all.
And a women who has everything becomes confused and angry. She needs to be worki g for something. That’s why wives of betas are so I to their bullshit jobs. They do t even need an alpha boss just a beta who gives her assignments and deadlines is enough for her to get her submissive itch scratched. Kids can do this do btw.
So you are stuck in a back seat.
Do you see If your wife was single and your game revolved around jumping through every hoop she sets out and blunting every blow she might face how THAT would end up for you?
The biggest tell is you have fear. “I don’t want to nuke my marriage” that fear permeates your every communication and communication. That fear answers the question who is leading the relatio ship? And it ain’t you starbuck. You’re thirsty dude you have a scarcity mindset. That is terminal game d o a.
But not to worry all this can be fixed with will and discipline. Welcome to the red pill.
More to come.
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I was raised on heavy doses of the blue pill, and I now know it. The “contract” you mention is the one I thought I signed.
Yep, Freddy at the ready, that’s who I’ve been, riding in the back seat.
I’ve been reading Vox, the Chateau, some Rollo and some Athol religiously for a year now, and the things you say make sense. Will and discipline is what I need now.
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DT,
Why are you asking her? You should be expecting it, and taking it. She’s your wife for fucks sake. Nothing come across as weak as saying to her, “please, mother may I?” Take it.
There may be other issues in your relationship that could be causing the problems. I’d consider going to the married man sex life blog (google it), and start at the beginning. read through the whole blog. Athol Kay’s advice really works.
Once you got that done, come here and read through the archives to fine tune your techniques.
A few years ago, I was where you were. Now? Let’s just say that my belly’s full and my balls are empty.
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Cuddling is the reward the husband gives the wife after a good bang … if he feels like it … and isn’t too hot.
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when you wake up beside a hog haha lozlzozzollzoz
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Great clip. Here’s Frost’s actual wife, a pleasant-appearing 5.5 – five whole points higher than the horror he woke to.
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One of the best ways to deal with a female problem you are unsure of is to think “what would a beta do” and do the opposite. Like that Seinfeld episode (Opposite George or something) except it really works. Kind of like the old trick to writing a good letter/story is to first write the worst possible letter/story you can think of and then see how to do the opposite. When the flaws stand out like a sore thumb you can at least see what not to do and what to avoid.
Reverse psychology rape!
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Q for Chateau Older Guys with Young Hotties –
What is your current playlist for “sexy time” – music, in the bedroom
Do you have any artists, mixes, etc you recommend as good
background music
Specifically, – with 18- 24 girls, and more, ahem, aggressive parts of the
interaction (such as getting out the ropes, lol 😉
I’ve personally been using select tracks from below
It’s not bad, but it’s getting annoying hearing another guys voice while
I’m getting a blow job.
Also – some of them start to kill the fast sex vibe. They want to cuddle not fuck
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Kashmir – Led Zep… Best fuck song of all time, but it may date you. Alice in Chains Dirt entire album. Aggressive as fuck, but works on some bitches. Pink Floyd shine on you crazy diamond… Stoner bitches.
Soda stereo or mana – Latinas… Snoop – Vegas whores.
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“since i’ve been lovin’ you” is the best zep fuck song. “dazed and confused” is the best zep pre-club pump song.
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“since i’ve been lovin’ you” is the best zep fuck song
Best damn road trip song too, when you’re alone, one thousand miles from home, the moon is full and it’s after midnight. You light another smoke. Listening to it now, first time in twenty years.
Thanks for reminding me of the song.
Another good pre-fuck song: U2, “Wild Horses” form Achtung Baby album.
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You are correct sir!
Pretty much nothing is going to ever beat Zep.
If she’s more of a slow+drawn-out chick there’s always Bolero, “Whisper Hungarian In My Ear”, or “Prenzlauerberg”
.
Or if she’s the kind of girl who likes to get thrown across the room, “Pigs In Zen” -haha, lulz.
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Ahhh some led zep. Tangerine and that’s the way are also good. Don’t worry about it dating you, part of the fun for young girls is learning new things.
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I was always partial to Boston/Foreplay.
Mind you, that was years ago when I was younger and much more athletic
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thievery corporation is good pre-coital mood music.
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When I hear Bono voice I immediately release the safety on my browning
but this one makes you push gas pedal further and further
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“Cortesar
When I hear Bono voice …gun fantasy” I KNOW!! And the worst part is everyone, or close to everyone in the world will hear his goddam librul crap opinion and become aware of his emotions…for years to come… and no one will hear about you….ever..
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When I am driving I am oblivious to Bono expressing his emotions, and brain dead multitudes of his listeners,could not care less for years to come
Conquering space gives you an illusion on freedom while speed on an unconscious level gives you an illusion of obliterating time itself
Willst du dich von etwas trennen
dann musst du es verbrennen
Willst du es nie wieder sehen
lass es schwimmen in Benzin
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My current play list involves enough white noise to block out the sound of the paddle spanking her ass.
S&M rape!
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Merzbow rape.
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More seriously go for the old “crooner” types for your pre-fuck music—Sinatra, Crosby, Nat King Cole, Dean Martin (Deano for the win, baby!). Throw in a few soft jazzy ladies too–Julie London, Natalie Cole. Get a good mix. Warning: avoid the blues, which are a bit hard for novices to distinguish, but are just black country music—too sad or funny or angry or pumping to set the mood.
Any chick 21+ will think of such music as “sophisticated”, even if they’ve never heard it before; so long as you don’t over play the old-timey crooner vibe, you won’t seem cheesy. Under 21+ don’t seem to go for this and think it’s cheesy, but for some reason once they hit 21+ they all fall into line and start imagining themselves in 1955, at midnight on a warm fall night, smoking a cigarette on a balcony in Manhattan, listening to the music coming out of a new-fangled record player while their boss is coming onto the balcony holding a fresh cocktail or wine for her and highball for him.
I think it’s the age (21)—because alcohol is now legal to them, so sneaking drinks is passe, and now she’s almost out of college, thinking of the future, biological clock starting to tick, etc. This age dividing line is almost uncannily accurate in these situations.
Bottom line: Women enjoy being whores, but every woman wants to think she’s a classy whore.
Mad Men rape!
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This.
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Yep. Create the fantasy and stand out from the crowd.
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I like the pre-fuck music thread. The way I look at it, there are two ways to do it. One, pick the mood music WF discusses, or some other mood music. You can go sophisticated crooner, or modern/international (can yo go wrong with anything in French?).
The other way to go is just play what you want as long as it’s not jarring or distracting. My rawest, hottest fucks in my early twenties were done to U2’s “Zooropa” album. The beauty of this approach is that rather than following a formula (nothing wrong with doing what works), you’re imprinting a girl with your sounds, which she will remember for the rest of her life.
By the way, I cited WF in a matter-of-fact manner. Is this the great truce that prophets spoke of? Bummer. I enjoyed our earlier flamewars.
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Fuck off, ya commie-fag. Piggy needs to be protected at all times by your CPUSA-paid greatness, comrade! The Rosenbergs live! Seig Heil, Mein Obama!
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CPUSA and Julius & Ethel are your relations, not mine, brah! Jeb Bush says you need to get off the net and start fluffing his campaign staff.
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Art Official Age – new Prince album. the whole thing is golden for fucking. if you’re not into digesting whole albums check these selected tracks out:
Breakfast Can Wait
This Could Be Us
Time
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Something’s wrong with this post.
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Unrelated to the post, but I have to be around my ex-girlfriend at some social events. She dumped me a little over a week ago, but I’m interested in reviving the relationship. Should I try to flirt with her, or should I limit my interaction with her? I’m not sure what to do since avoiding her completely isn’t an option.
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Obviously you have to act as if you don’t care about reviving the relationship – but it is hard to tell the difference between not caring and having given up hope, or not caring and being butthurt badly.
Especially if you do care.
See another girl there, ask your ex to be your preselection wingwoman, who is, if all goes well, to disappear at the appropriate moment. Should it go well you will likely get one, possibly both.
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I plan to talk to other girls in front of her, though it seems a little premature to ask for her assistance. My guess is that it would come off as blatantly transparent or it would just seem like a really odd request. Neither helps my cause.
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Do not attend party. Singlebass is right: get the girl out of your head. Hell, tell the next girl you got dumped, and you need a rebound, just so you can get soundly rejected, that way you can get serious about finding the next girl with real effort.
Also, every blue moon there’s another girl waiting for you to get dumped, so keep your eyes open.
Finally, GBFM would be angry if somebody didn’t quote the Bible, so just remember that once a girl leaves you for another man, it’s sin to take her back. Assume that’s the score and act accordingly. If she returns, you’re then fucking a slut, and that’s no good, so there’s no take-backs, baby. I’m sorry to break it to you, pal, but the only manly thing to do is move onward, ’cause even if you bed her again, she’ll never be anything but a harlot. Yeah, it sucks, but that’s how it is.
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> “my ex-girlfriend… dumped me a little over a week ago, but I’m interested in reviving the relationship… Neither helps my cause.”
Dude, unless the whore is carrying your child in her womb, your cause must be YOU. Not some damned whore. To hell with her. YOU ARE THE PRIZE. Not the whore. She has proved her whoreishness for all the world to see. The only question is whether you can earn your Alphatude or whether you’re gonna descend into Gamma hopelessness. Get out there and live your life. To hell with her. LIVE YOUR LIFE.
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Fuck someone else immediately. Don’t see the ex before you do so.
This will reframe your entire outlook on the ex.
She won’t even look the same to you.
Resist the urge to laugh in her face.
Seriously. Fucking someone else is absolutely the best medicine, bro.
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tteclod, I’m perfectly happy to take her back. And judging by this post, our overlord seems to think it’s a reasonable pursuit.
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2007/04/10/how-to-win-back-an-ex-girlfriend/
By the way, it’s a concert that I have to attend. She and I are both performing at the show. I’d skip a party without a second thought.
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This. Benson, get some fresh minge, stat!
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No, you do not have to go to anything.
And always remember , the woman-thing is a about a process, not an individual.
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Rum: “The Woman-Thing” YES! The Woman-Thing is called Womant.
She has many physical manifestations, but they are all the same Womant emitted from the hive.
They all want the same Mansion in France, to marry the King of England, have a Lous Vuitton bag but act like she doesn’t like it if she is smart, and want an iPhone
Every chick in the world wants an iPhone. It has been empirically verified.
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“She dumped me a little over a week ago, but I’m interested in reviving the relationship. Should I try to flirt with her, or should I limit my interaction with her? I’m not sure what to do since avoiding her completely isn’t an option.”
Turning the tables is a bit of a specialty of mine.
It is very important how you react to her rejection/dump. She must see you as being not fazed at all. In fact she must not see you and if she does you must “Be Nice And Get Away”.
Trying to do something in front of her is not wise as she will probably detect your motives in a weakened state.
You need to hole up and stay away from her. This will be hard to do but after a few weeks or even months she will probably not be able to take it any longer and try wiggling her way back.
I can’t tell you how many girls ended up crawling back to me when I held to this strategy. It became so affective that my friends could not believe what these girls would do once their panic set in.
I had one girl who liked me then went cold for no apparent reason. I liked her so it was hard. She started showing up with a new boyfriend which really sucker punched me. I struggled through the pain as I implemented the “Be Nice Get Away” strategy. Eventually her relationship with the other guy blew up and she started wiggling her way back to me. I finally let her into my apartment when she promised to clean the scum from my bathtub. (true story). That was many years ago. She recently tried to contact me after being divorced from her husband who turned out to be gay. She was an Alpha who liked to dominate. She has never gotten over me.
The funny thing is if you do this strategy by the time they come crawling back you seem to lose respect for them.
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That’s been my strategy thus far, so I’ll see how it plays out. I’ve seen her twice since she called it quits and I haven’t let on how frustrated I am. Did you ever attempt to contact your ex-girlfriends after a certain amount of time?
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Is “Benson” a new initiative by Axelrod & Sunstein which is designed to poison the Manosphere with Gamma-tude-inal defeatism and hopelessness and despair?
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“That’s been my strategy thus far, so I’ll see how it plays out. I’ve seen her twice since she called it quits and I haven’t let on how frustrated I am. Did you ever attempt to contact your ex-girlfriends after a certain amount of time?”
Not good that you have seen her twice. You need to disappear from her world completely. This strategy is hard to implement as it takes great emotional fortitude. Contacting her will ruin this strategy.
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“Not good that you have seen her twice. You need to disappear from her world completely.”
That won’t be a problem after this weekend. And of course I won’t reach out to her. I’ll go talk to other girls, too, which will help .
“Is “Benson” a new initiative by Axelrod & Sunstein which is designed to poison the Manosphere with Gamma-tude-inal defeatism and hopelessness and despair?”
Yes. But not if you keep telling everybody.
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Don’t go back. “If someone says ‘Fuck you’ once, they’ll always say it again later, and it will be WORSE, because you’ll know you should have known better.”
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I have to be around my ex-girlfriend at some social events.
What’s this “have to” shit? Is there a chain around your neck? Preserve your dignity. If knocking them dead with your flute recital best accomplishes that – than go with God. If that means abandoning your commitment – than absolutely do not go. You always have options – own them – and ignore her – she doesn’t factor into your plans anymore.
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Skipping it would have made me look bad professionally. I know getting away from her is the ideal strategy, but I asked for suggestions because I couldn’t do that right away.
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“That won’t be a problem after this weekend. And of course I won’t reach out to her. I’ll go talk to other girls, too, which will help.”-
Benson, the disappear act needs to go for her friends also. Talking to her friends is like talking to her and it will just boost her ego. Trust me I know this for a fact. If you can disappear from her “world” and you have not been too much of a beta in the relationship then she will try to wiggle her way back in some form or way.
Would love to hear how it turns out if you decide to use this strategy properly.
Good Luck.
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Yeah, I’ve already had to tell our mutual friends that it’s not worth talking about.
She left me because I didn’t text and call her enough. A little too much push, not enough pull, I suppose. I thought that may give me a leg up once I go silent.
I’ll let you know if I turn the tables.
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“She left me because I didn’t text and call her enough. A little too much push, not enough pull, I suppose. I thought that may give me a leg up once I go silent.”
Yes, would agree.
If I had to guess it would seem like she is/was making a tactical/manipulative move to gain more control in the relationship. I believe that if you play it right she could come back very desperate. Disappearing from her world could really call her bluff.
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So it wasn’t an actual break up, just a ploy to pry more attention out of me?
I’ve been told by a few people that I should call her and explain why my texts and calls were few and far between. Sounds like a bullshit move, but I figured I’d run it past you guys.
My next move at this point, though, is to sit tight and see if that provokes a response from her.
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“I’ve been told by a few people that I should call her and explain why my texts and calls were few and far between. Sounds like a bullshit move, but I figured I’d run it past you guys.”
Yeh, the old just talk it out and she will understand strategy. Be careful, very careful of that. My opinion is wait until she shows some kind of submission then you will be in a better position to “explain”. Remember, she broke up with you. Something doesn’t smell right here. She didn’t give you time to “explain” before she broke it off?
Go MIA. Worst case she never reaches out to you, which is doubtful and you retain respect in her eyes. Once you call(submit) she gains the upper hand. If you really like her then definitely disappear- 1 month!
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“Something doesn’t smell right here. She didn’t give you time to “explain” before she broke it off?”
She called me the day before and told me she was worried that we communicated differently. She said she needed more interaction and that my brief and sporadic texts made her feel like she was being needy and annoying. We talked everyday, though looking back I was probably a bit too aloof.
I got flustered and told her that I didn’t want our convos to get boring so I kept them short, and reassured her that everything was fine. I also said I’d communicate more. She called the next day and ended it; my honesty ploy wasn’t convincing, I guess.
After seven days of no contact, she texted me once. We exchanged a few messages, then I called and left a message later in the day. She responded via text.
I probably showed my hand with the call. Regardless, no contact moving forward.
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Something doesn’t smell right here.-
“After seven days of no contact, she texted me once. We exchanged a few messages, then I called and left a message later in the day. She responded via text.”
Damn, that’s what didn’t smell right. Well there you go. The “Be Nice Get Away” did work. It always does. Wish I could of counseled you before you could respond to her attempt to wiggle back in…
Remember this? “It is very important how you react to her rejection/dump.”
What she did by reaching out was test the waters and you took her bait. That my friend was a big no,no.
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“I got flustered and told her that I didn’t want our convos to get boring so I kept them short, and reassured her that everything was fine. I also said I’d communicate more. She called the next day and ended it”
If I have seen it once I have seen it a thousand times. This strategy I perfected seems easy but it takes tremendous fortitude.
Reading back over some of your actions tells me a lot. Frankly you fell into her trap and went beta. What you should of done was the opposite! Here is the formula for becoming beta bait. Get flustered, make apologetic excuses for your communication, try to reassure her, promise to communicate more=next day she ended it. It is obvious what she was doing here. What you should of said to her was something to the effect of “I have a lot going on and am trying to accomplish some things in my life. Sorry I don’t have time to tend to all your needs so maybe we are meant for each other….or something to that effect.
Well you have some work to do no doubt.
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Yeah, looking back I probably fucked myself. But that was my first major mistake. Now I’m wondering if I can salvage it.
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“Now I’m wondering if I can salvage it.”
There is a 50% chance she will test the waters again. So you better stick to the letter of the script if you want to have any chance. You are going to have to toughen up. What she did is just your ordinary LTR shit test which are different than quick picker-upper tests. She wanted to see if you were a man.
So, still some hope but not a lot.
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So if she reaches out again, I should ignore her text. When would it be appropriate to start interacting with her again?
Thanks for all the helpful input, dude.
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“So if she reaches out again, I should ignore her text. When would it be appropriate to start interacting with her again?”
IF(50%) she reaches out then you should reply back “We are done here”.
This will likely be the table turning move. Her Gerbil will start down the path to panic.
Then you DO NOT respond to any more “reach outs” until she is at your front door/office begging to speak with you.. At that time I will hand over the controls to you.
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That’ll either knock her back into attraction or she’ll walk away knowing that I turned her down. Fucking terrific.
I’ll report back.
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If there is not a reach out within a week from the last time you communicated with her then a different response will be required. Let me know.
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I last saw her on Sunday. I haven’t heard from her this week, so far. What would you suggest as a reply if she reaches out after Sunday, assuming she does try to contact me.
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Was anything said when you saw her last Sunday?
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We were in the same space frequently, again because we were both performing, but always around other people, and I never started a conversation with her except to say hi. I’ve been careful to avoid any post-break up talks and hide my frustration.
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“and I never started a conversation with her except to say hi. I’ve been careful to avoid any post-break up talks and hide my frustration.”
That is good. Lets wait until Sunday and then I will touch base. Stick with the recent plan. Like I said at this point from what I can discern it is a 50% chance of her reaching out.
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Benson, are you still in? I am willing to walk you through this but you have got to tell me if you want in or out. This system is very difficult for beta’s but it has a twofold result. It starts you on the road to being an Alpha and gets you over the women if not getting the women herself.
You have no chance to get this women by reaching out to her. You are in no condition to get this women right now.
I am no expert on picking up and banging women or Alpha rhetoric. But no one on CH and I do mean no one can recover a lost relationship better than I. I am confident of that.
You have to decide what you will do because this system has a high percentage fall out rate for betas. If you get through it though you will be on the road to Alpha.
Remember, she broke up with you.
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Benson – one thing for sure, if she does show back up, and you still want her, you fuck her then and there.
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I’m in, of course. And you’re right, keeping my distance has lessened the sting of rejection and allowed me to clear my head.
If anything, I want to continue just as a social experiment. This is an excellent opportunity to improve, regardless of the outcome.
Like I said, I haven’t had contact with her since Sunday. Some days are harder than others, but I’m committed to seeing it through.
” if she does show back up, and you still want her, you fuck her then and there.”
Naturally.
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“Like I said, I haven’t had contact with her since Sunday. Some days are harder than others, but I’m committed to seeing it through.”
Alright, so you are correct on the pain. The pain is going to eventually subside with some days harder than others. This is all part of the Alpha process. As mentioned before it is not easy but the rewards will be sweet even if she does not contact you.
How physical have you been and how long did you go out with her? You don’t have too detailed.
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We went out for a month. Almost every date we went on ended with sex. We were friends for about six months before I made a move.
By the way, This was only my second attempt at a relationship, which is definitely making the situation harder than it would be otherwise, I’m sure.
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Alright. That helps. Definitely sounds like you went beta and she wanted some Alpha. Still think there is a chance(50%) of a reach out because women like to pull the string to make sure the beta puppet is still theirs. We need to be ready because that will be your only opportunity. The most important thing is to NOT get into any conversation/communication with her whatsoever!!!!! A no response is the best. If you are forced into a situation then be nice and get away. When a puppet does not respond a women keeps pulling the string out of frustration
This is now trench warfare and the reach out could be weeks or even a month or two away. The good news is you will get stronger with time..
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So radio silence until she realizes the error of her ways. I can do that.
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By the way, are we still playing by this rule? “My opinion is wait until she shows some kind of submission then you will be in a better position to ‘explain.'”
If she asks to talk or invites me to get together, is it okay to agree? And how do I tell her I want her back without coming off needy?
I’m thinking ahead, I know, but I want to be prepared.
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“If she asks to talk or invites me to get together, is it okay to agree? And how do I tell her I want her back without coming off needy?”
You are missing the whole point and this is where many fail.
There can be no agreements because you will not be responding to anything. No response literally means no response. I can’t stress enough how important this is. IF she reaches out then her goal is to get a response. You cannot respond. You have to disappear until she shows up at your front door/office in a love stricken panic. This may mean ignoring texts and phone calls for weeks. If you see her in public then be nice and get away.
IF(50%) she tries to contact you then that will set things in motion that you may of never dreamed of. You cannot feel pity or compassion to give in and respond.
Cruel to be kind in the right measure. You let me know as soon as she tries to reach out!
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“Cruel to be kind in the right measure. You let me know as soon as she tries to reach out!”
Fair enough. I’ll let you know.
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I have a date with another girl lined up. Should I let word get back to my ex? Like taking a picture with the new girl and posting it on facebook. I’m not sure how the jealousy ploy works into your strategy.
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“Should I let word get back to my ex? Like taking a picture with the new girl and posting it on facebook. I’m not sure how the jealousy ploy works into your strategy.”
Benson, women have a 6th sense. So it is very important that you do not do anything which gives the appearance of drawing attention or trying to show her. Social media is tricky. With that said it is generally a good thing if she finds out you went out with someone else. If you can do it in a discreet way that will not be seen as an act of desperation then yes. Just be sure it does not come off as such. Women have a way of finding out things anyway. Just be careful and sensible. Time is your ally so try to resist forcing anything with her.
Not to beat a dead horse, I just want to remind you that IF she reaches out make sure to repress any reflex actions. Just let me know.
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“If you can do it in a discreet way that will not be seen as an act of desperation then yes”
Any suggestions? She doesn’t know the new girl, so social media is probably my only option. I could leak the news to one of our mutual friends, but I think that would be obvious.
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“I could leak the news to one of our mutual friends,”-
Being around any mutual friend is like being around her!!! Have you showed anything to any of your mutual friends? Be careful, very careful around “mutual Friends”. In fact you need to treat them the same way as her if possible. Be nice get away.
As for a leak strategy….just be careful. As you stated it would be obvious if you shred it with one of her friends. Wish I could be more helpful on the leak strategy but all I can say is be very careful. Error on the side of caution.
What you want to do is create a secretive situation. Example, She(includes mutual friends) know you did something last night but you tried to hide it versus he said he went on a date. Do you see the difference. One is trying to get an insecure response the other is he doesn’t want to hurt her and he did something, what was it???. The “secretive” causes the hamster to go violent as apposed to the obvious ploy of he went on a date….
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“Being around any mutual friend is like being around her!!! Have you showed anything to any of your mutual friends?”
Showed them what? I haven’t talked about her with anyone she knows. Someone offered to talk to me about the break up and I politely declined. They all know what happened because she’s told some of them and that’s all it takes for word to get around the whole group. Still, I’ve stayed quiet and removed myself from any situation I don’t have to be in.
“What you want to do is create a secretive situation. Example, She(includes mutual friends) know you did something last night but you tried to hide it versus he said he went on a date. Do you see the difference.”
I do. That’s helpful.
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As to the mutual friends even your demeanor will probably be passed onto the old girlfriend.
Something else I need to tell you. If there is a need to tell someone then just say “going out tonight but we are just friends” versus I am/going on a date.
One can be seen as a ploy where as the other is something you are trying to down play/hide……
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who beta this is!!!!
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“Who beta this is!!!!” Priceless
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Had to share this.
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My girlfriend not only never nags and has never beta baited me this way…she just told me she’s embarrassed that she has fantasies that we do anal.
Gentlemen, hold my armor, I’m going in.
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Hold you armour, indeed. No woman has fantasies about doing stuff with her BOYFRIEND, or if she does, she will not talk about it..If a woman tells you she has fansies about you doing XYZ, then that statement *IS* the beta bait.
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Considering I just finished fucking her in the ass for the first time, chap, I’m inclined to disagree with you
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Nice. Post some pics, or even better, a video.
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Justdoit is mistaken. That’s an invitation.
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the girl im seeing said the same thing, and i took her anal virginity. great success
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Y’all have a point. After collecting my thoughts, I’ll say the following: If you are already banging some chick, on a regular basis, and you are on GFT (Good Fucking Terms) with her, then statements that she wants some kinky sex are relatively reliable. However, if a woman is not (yet) on GFT with you, any statements about what she likes or might want to try in bed should be taken with many grains of salt, and is often beta-bait.
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I think there’s a missing litmus test we need for evaluation. Here it is.
If she asks for something demeaning to you, you’re dealing with beta bait. If she asks for something demeaning to her – and I’m pretty sure anal sex still falls within that category from my 43-y/o position – then you’re good to go.
Note: this stuff can go to hell if you’re dealing with a woman for whom many sex acts are been-there, done-that. “Please ass-fuck me, all my other boyfriends do,” is not a good invitation.
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And, as always, for the bazillionth time, if it’s not fun anymore, or just too much work….walk away.
Managing all the tests and traps and baits and bullshit can be fun, I admit.
It’s like solving a puzzle with a blowjob as the reward.
But as soon as it grows tiresome, I walk.
After a while it becomes depressingly predictable, and for me, kind of insulting.
Next next next.
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[…] Source: Heartiste […]
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Incongruent sex talk.
Introverts actually have something of an advantage with this sort of beta bait. My natural paucity of speech would keep me from snapping at the bait in many cases.
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Does hurt the ability to snappily agree / amplify and all that sorta thing though
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another sign of panic over at the landwhale ranch:
https://mrconservative.com/2015/01/55345-creepy-japanese-sex-doll-market-reaches-a-new-level/
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How come I received better responses from 9’s than 6’s or 7’s who seemed to show contempt for me when I tried to talk to them. Hell, I had numerous 9’s practically charge me. I had a 9+ in a New York night club grab my cock on the dance floor.
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Putin – don’t know you or your skill level, but this has been covered in the archives/comments before.
Usually this happens because 6-7s can be insecure if an attractive guy approaches them and think (probably rightly) that he only wants them for sex. So they are actively bitchy to pre-emptively disqualify themselves. So you have to do more work qualifying them. 9s are much more secure in their attractiveness and don’t do this (also, 9s are so intimidating that they don’t actually get as many legit approaches as the 6-7s who most guys think are “achievable”).
PS – Even if you’re an attractive guy I very much doubt “numerous 9s practically charged you” – even if they liked you, it’s unlikely that they initiated. Either they weren’t really 9s or you are a celebrity of some kind.
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“Either they weren’t really 9s or you are a celebrity of some kind.”-
Lol, a celebrity in my own mind.
Definition of charge? I guess I am liberal with the use of the word and it really does not happen that much anymore. With that said the New York Nightclub incident happened as such; Girl is let in free paying no cover and not having to wait in line. Every head in the club turns to stare at her. I am wearing the “Don Johnson look” which back then was popular. Next thing I know she comes up to me asks if I would like to dance. My buddy yells “sure he would” and we go out to the dance floor. She says she is an international flight attendant. I say I found this club in M magazine. We dance a couple songs then she places her hand on my crotch and rubs it. We get off the dance floor and I kind of walk away still in shock at what just happened. Half an hour later I look to see some old man bought her a $100 bottle of champagne. I go home wondering what just happened as I have little experience or game for quick-pick ups. If she wasn’t a 9 then she was a 10.
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@Putin. If you’re a genuinely attractive guy (looks, social proof, whatever) I can believe that happened. I’m not particularly good looking or anything, and I’ve had that sort of thing happen to me literally about 3 times in ten years – a 6,7, and an 8.
So I can believe it. But it’s not “numerous” 9s – it’s just one. I find it hard to believe that “numerous 9s” would do that to you in a club in one night..
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@Putin – sorry just re-read your original post. I thought you said several 9s approached you *the same night*, but you didn’t say that.
If it was numerous 9s over a period of time and you’re an attractive guy with good social proof etc, and you were in an environment with lots of attractive women..that’s believable.
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Culum Struan-
No worries. 9s and 10s are hard to come by. Generally a 9 or 10 will have men stopped in their tracks looking back multiple times and doing crazy things. I am sure most would agree with this assessment and we do not see these kinds of women all the time.
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M magazine. Miami vice. Thanks for the nostalgia of the 80’s. Brings back smiles. My go to move in my most alpha phase was to just post up on the edge of the dance floor, New Order playing and a low slung G and T in hand. Had this same experience a bunch of Times, carrying on a conversation where you from what’s your name etc with a girl holding your cock in her hand. While you sip your drink. Those where the days.
Bitches be crazy in clubs is the only take away.
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Go to the 2:00 minute mark!
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“You’re right, I AM a bad boyfriend. So get me a beer before I pop you one”
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Great post. I get all of these. The “Bad Boyfriend” ploy is a hard one. At first is sounds like a shit-test: “You have tons of girls don’t you?” Me: Yup.
But here’s how it has manifested itself with different girls:
“You’re more caring with other girls”
“You’re so selfish”
“You should be more caring….”
etc
The minute you get defensive, you’re on the back foot. If you deny it, it goes away….for a little while, then suddenly you’re being routinely disrespected out of no where. I learned.
One of the girls I’m banging, the 27 year old…was giving me all sorts of grief about not having curtains in my flat—I live on a top floor with a huge open city view so I’ve never found a need to buy them.
She started into me one day about how without curtains “I can’t keep having sex with you…”
She kept texting: “I don’t understand you” and “Why are you acting like this?” when I pushed back.
I ripped into her. Told her if she ever threatened to withhold, withdraw sex I would be gone for good. Then I made it clear if she wanted to come over, it was on my terms. If she doesn’t like me or my home, she is welcome not to come. There was some more back and forth. Then a pause. Then I did come back with some olive branch. We met up a few days later. She was on time, dressed up and banged my brains out.
The other girl I met is also doing this kind of thing and I’ve just withdrawn—after I did something nice for her.
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Every time my girlfriend tells me I only think about myself, I know I’m doing things right.
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@laikastes context is everything. If she says that in passing yes…if as in my case there’s a wider agenda you need to consider a strategy. I’m still hit and miss with this.
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I see the headline today of Denver woman charged with helping the IS. Might be a post there about how Western women are abandoning their feminine men and are becoming attracted to IS alpha warriors.
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Fishing for compliments is so common. My favorite response to “my hair is a mess today” is looking at her with a scared face, and saying “I know… I wouldn’t go outside the house like this at all, if I were you).
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“I thought it was a wig”.
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