There are essentially two ways available to a man to satisfy a woman’s strong compulsion — call it hypergamy — to relinquish her body and love to a higher status man who is more powerful, in any number of characteristics, than the men in his milieu against whom he competes for the attention of women.
- Raise the perception of his SMV. (SMV = sexual market value)
- Lower the woman’s perception of her own SMV.
Now, a man can raise how his SMV is perceived by women through objective and subjective means (both are effective, although a good argument can be made that the latter is more enticing as a seduction lure). He can, objectively, increase his mate value by, for example, becoming wealthy or fronting a band in a local club brimming with young cuties.
He can also increase his mate value by learning and acquiring the behavioral traits of an objectively HSMV man that signal to women he too is HSMV. This is the province of Game.
That’s the first option. The second option is the dark art of raising his own SMV by making a woman question her belief in her relative SMV. That is, it’s the art of instilling doubt in a woman about her presumption that she’s out of your league.
Which brings us to today’s topic: Wrong Name Game (WNG for short, daringly sharing an acronym with White Nationalist Game).
Wrong Name Game is a dark art, one of the darker arts of pickup, and also one of the more dangerous to execute with the required level of skillfulness. Failure at WNG will likely blow you out of the running completely.* So, proceed to read with caution.
Reader Observasaurus Rex gives us a perfect anecdote of Wrong Name Game in action,
Girl: Hey I’ve got to (Flaking because reasons).
You: Sure Stacy, catch you later.
Girl: My name’s not Stacy, it’s (whatever).
You: You’re the blonde girl in the sundress from (venue) right?
Girl: No I’m (blah blah blah).
You: k
WNG is used here as an anti-flake tactic, which is how it will be most often used. Obviously, the idea is to make it seem as if you’re juggling so many women you occasionally mix up names (HSMV), and that this particular girl whose name you mistook for some other girl’s name (“Stacy”) didn’t leave much of an impression with you.
So, WNG both raises your perceived SMV and lowers the girl’s self-perceived SMV. It’s a two-fer, and that’s why it is nuclear off the nimble tongue of a smooth operator.
Notice what Observasaurus did here that helped the believability of his WNG:
One, he didn’t make a big production out of addressing this girl by a wrong name. He simply passed it off as a credible oversight tail-ended with a friendly “catch you later”.
Two, when she corrected him, he didn’t immediately lunge into beta-ish apologia for his rudeness. He did the opposite, pressing for more information about her looks/style which forced her into qualifying herself to him.
Three, when the ride was over, he cut it off with a perfunctory “k”, leaving the girl to think that he wasn’t much bothered by having thought she was some other girl.
All these conversational feints — so subtle and brief in execution, which is typical when Game concepts are applied in the real world — came together into a synergistic pairing of his higher SMV to her (now) lowered SMV, and the result is a tiny tingle in her hindbrain telling her that maybe this man is worth getting to know.
*It is VERY easy to fuck up WNG. I don’t recommend inexperienced betas try this, until they have gotten some poon notches to build their inner confidence. There is a lot of opportunity for WNG to backfire, in which you would sound like you deliberately mistook her name, and which will then make you seem like you are head over heels for her. The artistry of WNG is paramount; it demands a near-superhuman affectation of casual, unflustered aloofness.

Just did that last week. “Hey, I forgot your name, is it XXX (known wrong name but right ethnic group)”. She liked it.
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lzozozolzolozl
wrong numberzlzoz zgame!!!
3 EZ STEPZ: How 2 Handle FLakesz and Flakey Flakerz in da ERA of da TEXT MESSAGE attention whorez zlzlzozozz
dis is from hearteites blog on FLAKEY FLAKE ERA WE LIVEZ IN where everyone flakes zlzozozoozoz while da gbfm sits at home and waits for da chcix who cflaked flaked on your asssss lzozozzolzolzol:::
how 2 counter da flakey flakesz in THREE EZ STEPZ
1. 9 PM: da gbfm sends out a mass text 2 all my ladies:
“lotsa cocksa 4 u lzozlzlz.”
da gbfm then gets back dozens of messages:
lol
wtf
when?
ok
haha
???
really?
kewl
wat?
2. da gbfm waits and hour while watching some espns and reaidng homer’s iliad and sends out to everyone again:
10 PM: “srry wrng #”
da gbfm then gets back lotsa texts
awwww
lol
too bad
u got my hopes up
damn you
ur loss
really? again?
3. da gbfm then waits ’til midnight and texts to everyone:
12 Midnightz: my place 30 min. bring da movies.
den da gbfm sits back and watches the parade arriving on his door camera monitor while he watches da espn highlights and reads homer’s odyssey. ding-dog ding-dong they ring da gbfm bell one by one hoping to touch da gbfm’s ding-dong zlzozozzozololzollzo but if they are under an 8 da gbfm just ignorez & reads his boookz zlzozoolzz
at 1 am a hot hottie 10 shows up and da gbfm hits the buzzer and lets her up.
da gbfm saves lotsas times and money while the betas liquor her up at the bars and da gbfm gets to hang out with homer instaead of goldidggers and douchetard boobie-men manboobz at all the clubs these days lzlzllzlzl
PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE do nottry this on your own as da GBFM needz you out there buying them drinkz all night and getting them dinnerz as i don’t want no hos eating my puizzaaa and heinekinz beerz!!!! we all have our part in this so please please respect yo!!!!! lzozolzolozzzz
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Ok, Alan, go back to sleep.
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“da gbfm waits and hour while watching some espns and reaidng homer’s iliad and sends out to everyone again:”
They see rollin’ and they hatin’. They hatin’ the rollin’ not the waitin’.
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I use “wrong hair game” myself. As in “later, blondie”…..but oops, she’s brunette or redhead.
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That’s a great one. Better than wrong name IMO. Haven’t tried that but it’s be nearly impossible for her to know whether you’re serious or not or trying to be funny or not.
Her: “I’m flaking because zyz”
Playa: “ok curly”
Lolz…
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Ps, I also address girls with hacked-off sjw hair as “butch”. They really love that
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[…] Wrong Name Game […]
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You can use this over other men to dominate them as well. There was this little cock blocking mop-up man named Adam that used to try to cock block me all the time and bang my leavings after I was done with them.
Whenever he approached me, ESPECIALLY, if I was talking to chicks, I would call him Alan. The effect on our dynamic was a windfall in my direction of who was the pimp and who was the simp
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it’s like in every movie every where amog misnames another guy.
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then a causal blowoff, whatever, “sure thing, Chester” or another wrong name after corrected
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Surely people are more likely to jump on a mistaken name than the opposite, that can be drawn upon to suggest a tilted scenario or that somebody is the enemy, obviously the MO in a film would be to draw on the isolation of one character as opposed to social life on the other, but this obviously isn’t an attempt to get closer to the girl on the other side or is unspecified – it concerns the character who is through this given artificial emphasis, and the ability to stand out at all here – and is perhaps to be taken as illustrative rather than necessarily effective per se, you might have reasons for doing it eg. you dislike a person’s name, or whatever.
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“Hey, Alan!”
“Still haven’t recovered all those brain cells you torched”
BOOM
Neutralized.
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Or roll with it and throw your own,
“Hey Jimmy.”
“Oh hey, Steve. What did your doctor say about the rash?”
Ignore mistake. Torch.
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Alan was capable of nothing. He’s a beta face Obama voter always trying to sweep up my crumbs.
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Try WNG during a doggy style fuck and see how long you can hold on for. Rodeo Game.
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wng + donkey punch = winning
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Extra traction
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tspark156: WNG during a doggy style fuck = Rodeo Game.
Actually lol’d
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When you get a personal best let us know.
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Try the “your sister is a better fuck than you” variation and see if you can finish on an “Angry Pirate”.
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Yee-haw!
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I do “What’s your name” Game–women often remember mine and I don’t remember theirs because I dance with so many women, but they don’t dance with that many men.
Think about it. There’s a lot going on there.
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theasdgamer.
+100 on that observation
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I’ve thought about taking up dancing; this seems golden. Especially since I have to have a really good reason to remember anybody’s name.
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Lead-follow dancing is best for the following reasons: kino & the dominance-submission frame. Some kinds of dances don’t require leading and following and there’s no kino necessary. Examples of lead-follow dances include ballroom dances, salsa, and country.
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Along a similar vein I was wondering about “familiar” game (ben affleck in good will hunting?) i.e. “you keep reminding me of someone i know/ you look really familiar where do i know you from” which ive done inadvertantly before and seems to be an easy way into a conversation.
If done correctly it says a) you know girls at least as attractive as her, b) you are just incidentally noticing her not necessarily trying to hit on her, c) many possible routes to take from there
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“you keep reminding me of someone i know/ you look really familiar where do i know you from”
This is kind of played out IMO, so many girls will here this standard kind of line. I’ve used some similar but a little more non-standard.
“Don’t think I’m staring at you, but you look like someone I know. Turn your head to the side. Yep – my buddy’s sister, you look like her, same profile. Do you come here a lot? I should tell him, he’d flip.”
Head to the side – a little compliance test. You haven’t qualified her looks at all… LOL
You: “Hey!… there you are” Point at her
Her: “what?”
You:”Yeah – you owe me money!”
Her”What?!?… I don’t think so!”
You: “Yeah two weeks ago, you borrowed $10 bucks from me…”
and you’re off….
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[…] By CH […]
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Science proves that thin chicks are best:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3213417/Why-men-thinner-women-attractive-Scientists-say-evolutionary-fitness-makes-slimmer-females-appealing.html
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Also good is calling 20 something women “lady” or even better, “ma’am”.
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This works great for bartenders. I’ve said straight up to girls “I meet dozens of new people every day, you gotta do better if you want me to remember you.” Serious chick crack.
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“You gotta do better”
Just immediately frame the interaction to force her to qualify.
Something similar could be completed with an immediate nickname, like so:
Playa: “What’s your name.”
Her: “Sarah.”
Playa: Smile, quiet for a moment, then, “Yeah, I’m never going to remember that. I’m going to call you ____ instead.”
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CH,
That’s another good game tip…as always.
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Also important but perhaps overlooked aspect to this is that it will totally backfire if you are a good-looking guy hitting on a cute chick (7 to 7.75). It would also have no benefit if the same guy was hitting on a low end hot girl (8 to 8.5). Despite all hamster thoughts to think the opposite, it will lower her value to much in consideration to his…
[CH: the percentage of men that women consider good-looking enough to seem unattainable is FAR SMALLER than the percentage of women that men consider good-looking enough to seem unattainable.
or, women are pickier than men, but women are also attracted to many more traits in men than the number of traits that men find attractive in women.
executive summary: don’t put so much emphasis on male looks, because women don’t put that much emphasis on it.]
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Girls have low social positions frequently anyway, name confusions are relatively playful and unlikely to be too significant; that said, the numbers suggested might be exaggerated for effect, so who knows what we’re talking about here. That might alter its direction. Obviously ‘playful’ runs a lot of pitfalls, such as that some people are actually mild and playful and that is so lame.
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because women don’t put that much emphasis on it.
Then the conundrum is, do women put emphasis on race, with race being a variation of looks?
[CH: race is more essential than intra-race variation in facial substructure. this is why (white) women put more emphasis on race than looks.]
Will the good-looking black guy do better (with the white woman) than the below-average white guy? Or does the best Game win, regardless or race or looks?
[it’s not “looks don’t matter to women”; it’s “looks don’t matter to women as much as they matter to men”.]
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[GBFM: the percentage of men that women consider large-cocked enough to seem unattainable is FAR SMALLER than the percentage of women that men consider good-looking enough to seem unattainable.
or, women are pickier than men, but women are also attracted to many more longer cockas traits in men than the number of long cockasz traits that men find attractive in women.
executive summary: don’t put so much emphasis on male looks, because women don’t put that much emphasis on it, as long as he has a 14 inch personality lzozozoozzololzol.]
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It’s not the size, it’s the throughput. The clitoris only wraps the outer three inches of the vaj. Burritos DO matter–but not length so much. However, banging the butt doggie or spoon style stimulates the clitoral wings. The faster the cyclical rate, the more impulses and the faster the climax. Know your clitoral anatomy.
The Power of sex = the angle of the dangle times the square of the hair plus the heat of the meat times the cube of the tube minus the mass of the @$$
Sex with engineers is always significant.
Take this out clubbing this weekend.
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“hitting on a cute chick (7 to 7.75).”
Inexperienced troll tell.
the occasional .5 in certain contexts is acceptable when it supports the point being made. But a “.75” is outright retarded and reeks of try hard trolldom.
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In cuteness, 0.05 need not entry.
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Ok, you keep telling yourself that…
Selective, yes. Try hard, not so much. In fact why not end all debate and just judge women on divisions of 1.
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You can also use reverse wrong name game, when just as the two of you are about to leave each other’s company for the first time, you can say,
“Okay, so which name did I give you?”
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If you don’t want to go the hardcore way, you can use it as a teasing tool. Saying you forgot her name and coming up with a ridiculous one will have her laughing and punching you on your arm calling you an asshole.
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You feel that the example might have gone a bit too far in flagging that, but quite effective in a way. It might in some ways lower a girl’s perceived social position, or at least posit it relative to another girl’s, it’s a form of manufactured uncaring, but manufactured, so you’d have to be careful with it. The dangers of it as such might be overstated so long as it’s kept to the point, however.
Obviously it might help to choose a girl with a good name.
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It’s easy for me. I turn to her and ask ‘who bitch this is???’
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A lot of stuff like this works solely because it induces shit tests that can you respond to with a dominant frame. If you look at the surface you may think WNG shows off preselection or aloofness, but the real meat is cooked simply by not apologizing and smirking through the shit test that will come next time you talk to her.
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@shartiste good point. Two weeks ago I tried this wrong name game thing in a different way. A smoking hot girl who worked in my office added me on FB. I barely remembered her and from her photos she looked hot. I also remembered she barely spoke at meetings. I asked some colleagues about her, they said she was cool but not cut out for the job. OK. I reached on FB:
Me: Dancer?
Her: hey wala how ru?
Me: at gym. did we meet in xxx when I was djing with yyy?
Her: haha, I’m zzzz we worked together
Me: oh, I thought we danced
bunch of blah blah catch up, then switched it to her dancing and yoga. then more negs and teasing about that. Then hit her up for drinks. She jumped at that. We met. She was fun. She was a bit guarded. I played it cool. We’re meeting up again for drinks.
Point is she was forced to qualify herself and then I could gauge her interest from there. Seemed to be positive.
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I have messed up with girls house. Wwent to drop her off and went diff direction , where the previous chick lived.
Told her sth like “Dont play around, I dropped you at this place last time”
Gina tingles engaged.
Unintentional, but now already part of the game plan.
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ok, brah, Mario’s now my hero. Wrong house game. You bitches all live in the same house rizzight?
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It either works or not. No matter how you feel about it
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don’t get me wrong, I am deeply amused just by the idea of it.
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Wrong house game. Lolz.
A variation of that is “your house game”. I’ve done this so many times and it took me a while to get comfortable with this classic jerk boy move of just going back to your place regardless of what she said or you said etc etc…lol…
Her: “my house was that way”.
Ripp: (turns radio up) “this song is so stupid. But I like it anyway.”
Her: “where we going.”
Ripp: “I’m hungry” (any non sequitur)
lol…I mean it’s blown up in my gave once or twice but thing is if she likes you and is having fun, she’ll dig the excitement of you taking her back to ur pad without a chance to talk about it.
I guess then after I need to try wrong house game and drop her off at some random street…
Lolz…
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I used to do a variant of this: deliberate wrong name game.
Me: Hey Kitty!
Her: my names not Kitty its Karen.
Me: well I like Kitty better so I’m going to call you that anyway.
It usually worked like, well, catnip.
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In ancient times, pre internet, pre texting, we had these phone things and the variation of WNG was when she called in pre caller ID days, was that while she expected you to recognize her voice . . .
Ring, ring.
Hello.
Hi Mark!
Paula?
No this isn’t Paula.
Joan?
Try again and be careful this time.
Mildred?
Oh C’mon.
Ohhhhhh, Terry. Hi . . .
You are such an assh. . .
It was playful and powerful and while the gals laughed if off, EFFECTIVE. I daresay that WNG would be more fun and effective (and less dangerous) in a live voice setting and to update for today I’d utilize ridiculous wrong names like Natasha, Kineesha & Rainbow.
Plus ça change, plus c’est la même chose.
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What’s the authorised CH response to a woman who objects to your illustrating your conversation with ‘fuck’ and its various derivatives?
[CH: “fudge? motherfudger?”]
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Me: What’s your name?
She: Wendy.
Me: No, the name I call you is Punkin.
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I’ve always used a gambit of renaming a chic.
Girl: “Hi I’m sarah.”
Ripp: (pause). “No. Not anymore. I’m going to call you…..Trixie.”
(Reminds me of American psycho when he names the hookers).
It’s a playful gambit and you give her a stripper name or something exotic or off the wall. Old people names work too. Like rename her “blanch” or “thelma” lol…
if you get the arm punch and “erhmagerd that’s mean” you are in.
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[…] Source: Heartiste […]
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Related: I’ve made fun of the name most, if not all, of the chics I’ve ever been with. It probably worked the first time I did it, knowingly or not, and it’s just embarrassingly automatic (to myself, anyway) anymore. Cheers.
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I would like some feedback on this approach. If you want to know more about the interaction, I can put it in another post. Trying to avoid mod.
I picked my brother up from the rental car place today. There was a cute blonde girl working the desk, so I decided to try for a number. She reciprocated my teasing while she filled out some paperwork, even upping the ante a little, I’d say. So after she finished helping my brother, I pulled out my phone and said,
“Put your number in there.”
Her: “Why?”
“So I can text and call you.”
Her:“I have a boyfriend.”
“I won’t tell him.”
Her: “But I will, and he’ll get mad that I’m texting you, and I don’t want him to get mad at you because you’re nice.”
“Call it planning for the future,” I said as I set my phone down in front of her and pointed at the key pad.
She stared at my phone for a second, look up and said, “I can’t, but I appreciate it.”
It’s sound a little dry when I type it out, but the exchange was playful. She also said most guys wouldn’t ask for a number, and it was cool that I tried. But I didn’t hit the right buttons, so tell me what I could have done better.
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Great exchange and if you say the dynamic was playful then even better. With these interactions they help to build confidence and calibrate your game. Next time you try this, it could work out. The approach, the confidence cut through. The problem with this approach is that if the girl does have a bf then there isn’t time to build comfort, you’re only spiking attraction.
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Yeah, it felt good, and you can tell pretty quickly if things aren’t going your way. I think I passed her shit tests, so I’m leaning towards she actually has a bf. Whatever, though.
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One thing I’m doing in fine-tuning my game is milking the tension instead of diffusing it with laughter. One of us has to break the tension, if she laughs, she’s broken it. That’s why smiling and raising an eye brow is a way to non-verbally escalate.
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“milking the tension instead of diffusing it with laughter. One of us has to break the tension, if she laughs, she’s broken it.”
This is the stuff Wala. whoever laughs first signals they don’t have the power…
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This is actually a shit test men do. If she’s already admitted to having a boyfriend, and she puts her number into your phone anyway… she’s a plate candidate only. If she puts her number in, you’ll know she’s not trustworthy in the long run, and you’ll never be her “boyfriend.” Sometimes there is nothing you’ve done wrong, because she has some ethics.
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Good insight. I’ve been burned before trying to turn sluts into girlfriends. Maybe the next one won’t have a boyfriend.
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Not bad. Obviously, delivery beats the context, so it had to be solid.
But all that frame just doesnt click
Her: “Why?”
“So I can text and call you.”
(very average joe response, you had a shot but… and – whats in it for her? sounds like you need her)
Her:“I have a boyfriend.”
“I won’t tell him.”
(you submissively folow her frame and qualify to her, while it should be the opposite)
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Good work putting yourself out there as always. And in day game, you are going to get a lot of rejections… just part of the package.
That said, there is always room for improvement and this here is the key part of the interaction.
“She reciprocated my teasing while she filled out some paperwork, even upping the ante a little, I’d say. ”
What happened here?
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And this “I won’t tell him” feels good saying, I’ve said stuff like this a lot… but in the end is not usually effective (especially in brief encounters) because you are compelling her then to completely acknowledge the illicit nature of further contact and that is the last thing in the world she wants to do. She wants plausible deniability and if something then just happens, well most of us have been on the receiving end of that conversation at one point right?!
So stuff that de-escalates and maybe challenges her a little can work better…
Her: IHAB
You: Whoa…. slow your roll there… I’m not looking for a girlfriend. LOL. But you seem cool anyhow, we should grab a coffee sometime.
Her:IHAB
You: Well good for you. Does he let you have friends?
Her: Yes he does.
You: I always say, you can’t have too many friends, right?
Stuff like that. Basically when you get IHAB and it’s not a token shit test you haven’t demonstrated enough value and not enough attraction, comfort and rapport… Because it’s easy for her to connect with you if she really wants to without ever mentioning the BF upfront, right?
Here is some good stuff from LaRuina on this
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Was out the other night with my WK buddy, so couldn’t game hard (he doesn’t approve) but found myself in AMOG BF destroyer mode anyhow. Was funny.
Mid 20’s couple comes into bar and sits a few stools away. I’m on the corner so facing them. He is turned looking at her and she is turned looking at him and also can see me. I see her keep shooting me a quick look, so I know something is up. I’m negging and teasing the tits on a stick bartender, and my WK buddy is predictably offering apologies for me, even though she is LOLing and loving it, which raises my value more…
So the couple order some beer. he’s a typical hipster guy, beard, sleeve, skinny fat. She is a good 7 hipster girl, short red hair and some tats. He is in full beer nerd mode trying to over educate her on different beers, they order a couple and she is leaving some of them. I see she is just looking for taste so start to interact with then and offer beer choice to her, which she likes.
Anyway this leads to some intermittent group conversation among the 4 of us. She is getting bored though with the guy and a lot of the time he is fully turned to her leaned in and she is on her phone texting. He makes a comment about the phone and she says something to him like “just a minute” and is smiling and looking at her phone and texting. He looks up and we catch eyes. I say “Damn, social media must be blowing up tonight, right?” and he’s says “yeah I know” with an eye roll, and this jerks her head up at me and I say to the guy but looking at her “must be a new cat video or something”. She starts to laugh a bit at this but does put her phone down.
The bartender says something like “don’t let these old guys bother you”, trying to get back into the conversation. So we have a chat on age and the 7 asks we guess her age, so I go with “32” and she gives me a snooty kind of “yeah sure, I’m really 29 right”… So that one hit. LOL
I go into “how do you two know each other” and he BLURTS out loudly “She’s my girlfriend” and I see her tense just a bit at this. I say “wow. That was some statement there. Did you brand her?”, but in a nice way, joking a bit. And she is like “I know right”… So I move into how long you been going together (a few years) and then “so any wedding bells ringing here”… and this perks her up and he starts backtracking about he is finishing school and then will take this job blah blah.
I move into “well if it was me, I wouldn’t let that stand in my way” and he starts about why he needs this degree to get hired and get a good salary, but he is in sales. I tell him if he is so into sales (which he says he was) he should just go full commission. At this my WK buddy says “yeah this guy only works 15 hours a week” he meant it as a slight, but the girls eyes go BING BING at this and she circles back “you only work 15 hours a week!”…
Some more general conversation and then I say to the guy “listen man, I’m going to tell you something. She (point to 7) has more belief in you than you do” and at this she JUMPS up and is like “OMG you are so right. I say this all the time to him…!!!” and she is now beaming at me. Was interesting just watching this whole set of dynamics unfold…
WK buddy now is cranky and goes and gets in the car. I come over to the guy and wish him the best and kinda condescendingly pat him on the shoulder (good luck kid), step past him (he is now behind me) and am straight on with the 7 and she is beaming at me. I put out my hand, she takes it and I ask her her name, nice to meet you (still holding her hand) and then say “damn, for an old lady you have a strong grip!” and she scrunches her face at me. I squeeze her hand and say “take care” and stroll out…
I hope the guy gets his stuff together… Hypergamy is always ON… Be careful.
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Another LaRuina clip – not on topic, but great. Just look at this guy’s frame, posture and delivery during the TV interview… So solid. This is authenticity on display.
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These may go to mod, so we’ll see. She was talking into her cell while asking my bro to fill out a customer service survey. “Nah, why don’t you just pet his pup instead,” he says. “But you should fill it out because blah blah…” She says, trying to convince him.
She still had her phone to her ear as she said that, so I asked, “Wait, are you talking to us? Who’s filling out a survey?” This all threw off her sales routine and got me into the conversation. Nothing stellar, but it shifted her focus.
She hung up finally, and there was a big pile of car seats behind the counter. So I asked, “why are you collecting car seats? That’s kind of weird.” “No, it’s not. Imagine you have a kid. You just rent a car seat instead of bringing your own, put your kid in it and you’re done-zoes!” Then she smiled and posed like she just did a magic trick.
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It would have been straining to keep on that thread, so I let it go. “What’s your puppy’s name?” She asked. I told her and she asked why I gave him that name, because it’s uncommon. I didn’t know where to take the conversation, so I didn’t say anything. “What, am I supposed to be familiar with that name?” She interjected. “Yeah, everybody knows that name” I said.
I felt like I was about to overdo it. I pulled back a little and told her how I came up with his name, and she said, “Huh, that’s kind of weird.” I looked at my pup and said, “Wow, she’s kind of mean, isn’t she?”
She picked up the conversation: “What made you get a dog?” “Is that a serious question?” I asked. She feigned offense again: “Well, I don’t know! People gets dogs for lots of reasons blah blah…like mine just died so I was thinking of getting another one.”
She was smiling and fighting back laughter at this point. “You sound really broken up about it,” I said, “but grieving is a healthy process.” She finished helping my brother and that’s when I went for the number.
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@Benson – you can’t win em all right? Looks like the attraction was a little light though… like it was just getting started and then you “sprung” the number on her…
So with the further background you had a good de-escalation response around your dog
You: I could use some help walking this guy though… Here give me your number.
Her: IHAB
You: Easy misssy… easy… I’m just talking about some dog walking. You probably know some good spots. I’ll call you… (hand phone to her).
But this here
” “What made you get a dog?” “Is that a serious question?” I asked. She feigned offense again: “Well, I don’t know! People gets dogs for lots of reasons blah blah…like mine just died so I was thinking of getting another one.””
Think about this section, instead of joking here it could have been a good chance to connect emotionally and paint a picture of yourself. I mean it’s a great sign of interest from her. Then it would have come up that she just lost a dog – more emotion for her – then you could have gone like, wow that must be tough – here you need a hug – and transition to “I could use some help walking this guy”…
I know a lot of these boards are all A&A that shit and be ALPHA BRO! but if you can connect on an emotional level that is very powerful, especially in a short time window. It leaves a mark.
BTW – Is this the second girl from a rental you after???
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One last point – going emotional is especially good because you ALREADY established your cocky funny vibe, so it’s like another dimension for her to contemplate – you’r enot coming off as a beta pussy – but as a deeper guy which begs the question “WHO IS THIS GUY?”
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I understand the attraction/comfort equation you’re talking about, and that’s why I tried to balance it out by giving her a couple of honest answers. Your idea to use something genuine to transition into the number close is good. I’ll have to remember that for next time.
My Achilles heal is still compressing all of these different elements into five or 10 minutes. I’m getting better, though. She was thinking about giving it to me. I just couldn’t quite swing her my way.
Yes, second rent-a-car chick. I just hit on them where I see them.
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Gambler is good (especially that laser eyes video that YaReally keeps linking) but I just cannot help sniggering at all his videos where he seems to have non-speaking girls standing around just as decoration.
I mean they’re pretty and all but what are they there for..?
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Sounds like she’s about to cash in on BB.
One thing you might try is something to alleviate her ASD–a mutual interest that would allow a meetup, preferably in a group setting.
Bear in mind that her mood at that particular time was happy with her bf, but that could change in the future and she could use some other way to signal you indirectly that she wants your attn. Then you message her your cell no. and everything proceeds ahead. So maybe make a meetup connection or connect on fb.
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What’s that?
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@Benson
BB = beta bux…in the stack…
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Ah, lock down her meal ticket before her looks fade.
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@Benson
this is a GREAT learning opportunity bc this happens quite often in cold approaching. you open her, she makes a reflexive shit test, you respond with a predictable logical beta societally programed answer, her hindbrain confirms low quality genetics and moves on…and you don’t get laid…lol
““Put your number in there.”
Her: “Why?” ”
= reflexive shit test…
and since this WILL come up again if you continue cold approaching (and great job on putting yourself out there btw!…) bc it’s a standard shit test, go here
https://heartiste.wordpress.com/2014/03/13/a-crib-sheet-of-game/
pick a ‘concept’ and work out a goto response that works with your game style (is congruent)…just like it was a predictable customer objection to the product you are selling (=you)…and keep it in your pocket as your new ‘reflexive response’ to this situ…(which will hopefully short circuit the next step (=IHABF))
you: “So I can text and call you.”
= her frame = boring beta ‘logical’ response…which provokes this:
“Her:“I have a boyfriend.””
= reflexive shit test…see how this stuff is auto programing…
“I won’t tell him.”
aaaand, this is where you lost it…and any chance to turn it around…bc it sub communicates that she is a slut…do you see why?…there is a difference between ‘assuming the sale’ and a subcomm insult…
given the brief exchange, there was NO WAY that you could have had enough value built up to justify you’re expectation that she would cheat on her bf…also, the reverse of that idea is it sub communicates that you are a desperate beta ‘loser’ bc you are indicating to her that she doesn’t have to do anything/be anything special to ‘earn’ your attention sexually…except just exist with a pussy…lol… = she can ‘get you’ without proving that she has any other value to you…
so, when you get:
“Her:“I have a boyfriend.””
you: Whoa! I just met you and you’re already thinking about having hundreds of babies with me?…slow down!…you should at least buy me a coffee or something first… [then change subject]
see how that works?…you assume she is chasing you bc at that point she IS (at least her hindbrain is testing the potential…)…bc she put you and the sexual idea of ‘bf’ together in the same thought…and if you can then keep that frame = max seduction…
good luck!
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Here’s a few that I came up with off the top of my head:
“So you can enjoy texting me.”
“How else are we gonna share funny cat pictures?”
“Because I told you to.”
Now that I think about it, I’ve also used, “Because it would be your pleasure to text me” to number close in the past.
They all communicate the same point–“I want to talk to you again”–sans the icky beta language she finds distasteful.
Thanks for the feedback, dude.
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The reverse of the idea… Awesome area to focus on HABD… Great as usual.
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@ HABD, Benson
Her: I have a boyfriend.
Me: We’re all taken. [Implications: I’m HV. I know you’re evaluating me. Having a bf is no big deal. If we cheat, I have something to lose, too. I know how to be discreet. I’m not here to judge.]
This defuses ASD and builds value. It was my natural response and I had to process it to see why I said it. Lots of Game in those three words.
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Last time I said this to a woman, she put her hand on my waist, looking to build comfort. Tingles implied.
Unfortunately, I don’t remember the nonverbals I did. Did I look away impatiently? Maybe. I know I was lasering her a bit and she was doing the same. I probably was amused-mastery-smiling while lasering the broad.
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Something I just thought about. I usually assume that IHABF is utter bullshit, just a shit test to throws betas off course. She often doesn’t have a boyfriend, so I think I could pass with “I won’t tell him if you won’t,” because I’m not giving up at the first road block she throws up.
But I had never considered that it may make her feel slutty, or make me look needy in certain cases.
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@Benson
in the stack…
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Fucking stack…can you give me the reader’s digest version?
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@Benson
only one comment above…the stack just ate this one too…lol…
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Mod still holding up your replies habd?
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@Benson
when this one pops out, my comments will all be out, but i just wanted to expound on this…
“I usually assume that IHABF is utter bullshit, just a shit test to throws betas off course. ”
it IS a shit test…lol…and it catches betas just fine bc it works like it’s suppose to…which is to ‘reconfirm’/dismiss low quality genetics…so, it’s always the result of a failed prior shit test…in your case, your failure of her ‘Why?’ test…
“i won’t tell him if you won’t” will ALWAYS hurt you…and not just sometimes…bc that’s the attitude of a beta = “if the ‘alpha’ knows about me hitting on her, he’ll hurt me/kill me…so, let’s not tell him…”
sooo, don’t say that…lol…
also, did you cringe when she said this and called you a beta = ‘nice’?…
“Her: “But I will, and he’ll get mad that I’m texting you, and I don’t want him to get mad at you because you’re nice.””
and that SHE had to protect YOU from the ‘alpha’ male…lol…
see how this is like ping pong? she throws out a reflexive shit test to some interest you show in her…you give a beta response…she gets triggered by THAT to throw out another reflexive shit test = IHABF…which leads to you give a beta response…which triggers her final reflexive shit test = ‘you’re so NICE!…but thanks for the validation!…’
good luck!
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It hurt me to read HABD’s comment, but it’s good stuff.
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Yeah, me too. lol
It’s very useful information, though. I honestly had no idea that my answers made me look so weak. I’ve been too busy high fiving myself for approaching regularly.
[CH: if you’re approaching regularly you’re 50% of the way there.]
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@Benson
you’re doing fine…lol…cold approaching is the hardest part…props on putting in the hard work and putting yourself out there…its not easy…
sooo, here’s a game plan if you want it… for the next 20 approaches don’t do anything different, just notice your interaction pattern (ping…pong…ping…etc.) just know that you aren’t going to get laid from those approaches but you’ll learn something valuable…and start to make some predictions about how the conversations unfold…and you’ll start to notice that you are giving reflexive responses too…
you need to be able to see that before your next step (well, you don’t really…unless you want to actually understand how this stuff really works…you could just go with canned routines…lol)…bc you need to be able to see ‘where’ you are in a ‘conversation’ at any given moment…bc THAT will tell you how to get out of the beta pattern…if you happen to slip back into it…
THEN, your next step is to SMASH that first reflexive shit test…by being ready for it/predicting it/’drawing’ it with a statement to the girl…and have her hindbrain kick her hamster to wake it up…lol…but you need to see the patterns to understand that they are patterned, socially conditioned reflexive responses…
also, check the current mailbag post…some good responses to IHABF…
@theasdgamer
“we’re all taken” =/= “i won’t tell…” it’s a good comeback…for the reasons you list…
good luck!
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Her: “I have a bf.”
Me: “I have a puppy.” Deflects. BF is equivalent to a puppy. Makes her laugh. Tingles. Cocky.
I still think that “We’re all taken” is quite strong because of the amused mastery vibe, which is more compelling than jerkboy. “We’re all taken” also implies trust because of common grouping; preselection is hinted at.
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Sounds like a plan, though it won’t take me 20 approaches to catch myself slipping, especially after this thread.
There’s some fine tuning to do, but I’ve gone from fat, aspie virgin to fucking girls I was once afraid to talk to. I’m more than halfway.
Thanks for weighing in on my situation, by the way.
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” I’ve been too busy high fiving myself for approaching regularly.”
This is why I recommend doing SNL night game as much as possible. The success and failure is right there, you don’t trick yourself as much. It’s hard, and you will fail A LOT – but you are forced to really push and learn a lot, which helps your over all game development.
Keep having fun…!
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My band is starting to play around town regularly, and being a drummer affords a lot of status. There’s potential there…
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@Benson – check out Irish Asshole’s lay reports [Action Reports section] and posts on Sedfast… he is in a band as well and writes often of the difference between being the guy on stage and then the guy in the crowd. It’s very interesting.
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He’s right. It’s instant status and a great opener. I noticed when we played Saturday; people just want to be around you, especially girls. “Hey, great job on the drums…” No wonder Lars Ulrich is such a prick.
He mentioned in one post to avoid hitting on/fucking the girlfriends of other musicians. That’s the only pitfall to avoid. Band game is a great opportunity otherwise.
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Pink Floyd’s “Comfortably Numb” is one of the greatest artistic achievements of the latter half of the 20th century. And linked here is that song’s best live performance. David Gilmour and the late Rick Wright deliver passionately at the forder Gdansk shipyard in 2006.
The great Zbigniew Preisner conducts the Baltic Symphony Orchestra. Rarely does one see two geniuses perform together.
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“Echoes” is better. Everything they did after “Dark Side” was too Waters-oriented and more like his solo music than classic Floyd.
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Animals is killer.
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Waters’ sneering madman element workef well against Gilmour’s dreamy tendencies.
Too much Waters (such as some of his overindulgence on The Wall or his later solo work) is exhausting, but just the right measure gives their music a transcend energy that Gilmour alone won’t generate.
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Find memories of learning the two guitar solos note for note in my room as a teen.
The smell of a new electric guitar after working manual labor all summer to save up. Getting the notes right and feeling the goosebumps. Epic song.
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It’s the longing feeling and the clarty of the first solo, and then the dionysian chaos of the long outtro (second) solo that makes the song a masterpiece.
Yeah, it’s a thrill to play it. Having picked up the gitar in my late thirties, I’m bound to remain an ‘advanced beginner.’ Nonetheless, I learned the first solo on an acoustic, then finally had a chance to try it on a friend’s electric.
It’s not a difficult solo to learn, with its slow tempo.
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@CH and @yareally
I have a question. Or advice for a situation I’m in.
Have you ever dated or come across a girl who just DOESN’T vibe at all. It’s like there’s nothing exciting about her (but you want to fuck her). Or there’s no click really. Idk.
I’ve gone out with this girl twice. She’s kind of a ‘good’-girl (waited to drink until she was 21 and now she’s 22 or 23 and I’m mid 20s). First night we had a few drinks, I got her to my bed and she wouldn’t even take off her pants…I tried everything and was persistent. Let it go for about 2 weeks (she only initiated contact once in that time which I see as a red flag, but I didn’t initiate at all in that time really). So I hit her up about 2 weeks later AND SHE AGREES TO HANG OUT ONE ON ONE AGAIN. She’s prob a 7.5 and I’m pretty sure that I’m high enough Smv for this girl cause I’ve banged 8s before (just saying this to put it in perspective). So we hang out got food (split the bill) I negged her about her freckles tried various game tactics etc BUT she wouldn’t even go back to my bed, but would make out with me at the venue we were at (which making out before getting to sex location is bad game, but I had no other routes ha).
So my question is how/why am I going backwards? I’ve noticed there are some girls I come across that I just do not vibe with at all for some reason…
It’s becoming too much effort now so I’m checked out… But how would you deal with this. It’s quite frustrating and happens periodically.
It almost feels like the girl wants to be taken out on an official restaurant dinner date or something? I honestly have no idea. And WHY the fuck does she continue to hang out with me one on one if she didn’t want me? Thoughts
[CH: sounds like you’ve got yourself a tepid prospect. girls like this fall into one of three categories:
1. poor histo-complex compatibility. aka she’s just not that into you. but she doesn’t want to say no to you quite yet.
2. relationship whore with ASD. she’s been burned by cads in the past, and is trying extra hard to force you into a beta male frame of extended courtship.
3. she’s a cocktease who gets off on the attention from dating multiple men.
odds are she’s not the “good girl” she acts like, but that’s neither here nor there. (many a girl who has strung along one man on multiple sexless dates has later fucked some jerkboy on the first date.)
your job, when you find yourself in binds with girls like this one, is to stop digging when you’re in a hole. from what you wrote it looks like you’re fully invested in the chaser role. she senses this, so she’s playing a slow hand with you, figuring you won’t go anywhere. which you aren’t. and she’s not turned on enough to lose control of her personal good girl narrative.
i think you need to next her for good. or, if you want to take another shot, try playing the chasee role and flipping the script. next time you’re on a date with her, take the initiative and end it first. or, next time she’s in your bedroom, try a freeze-out. no spitefulness. just do this with a blase attitude, like it’s not out of the ordinary for you.
point is, stop chasing her. you’ve gotta 180 this dynamic pronto or it’ll be blue balls forever.]
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Is this Med School Will?
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CH nailed it. The makeout is a carrot for her. Don’t give it up for nothing. Hint at it very briefly then change tactics immediately to something non-sexual. Tease the little b1tch. Make her understand that makeout is only a prelude to sex. At the same time, you need to make sure that she understands that going to your apt. and sitting on your bed is not guarantee that you will give her your d1ck. Tease her with that, too.
Women want to be desired, admired, and male attention. Disperse them economically, after they have earned them. Withhold showing your desire until a woman has invested enough.
Ideally, you would bring her to your bed and start making out, then get up and go watch a vid in the living room.
Push-pull.
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@will
“So my question is how/why am I going backwards? ”
she’s grooming you as a beta orbiter…she lets you alllmoooost get to the promised land…and now she’s seeing how little sex she has to drip, drip, drip out to you to have you jump to her tune…
“It almost feels like the girl wants to be taken out on an official restaurant dinner date or something?”
do ya think?…lol
” I honestly have no idea.”
sure you do, you just don’t want to face it…
“And WHY the fuck does she continue to hang out with me one on one if she didn’t want me?”
see above…
next her…and don’t chase the new girl…or don’t next her and try to turn it around…for the practice (this is the one i ALWAYS recommend…) but just know that, at this point, you are MOST likely to go down in flames and suffer some major red pill bitterness/disillusionment…so, you have that going for you…lol
good luck!
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@habd I wouldn’t have believed this had I not seen it so many times but yes, girls slot you into either provider or lover very early. And in many cases there isn’t a cross-over.
I wrote about the married girl I banged within hours of meeting her. She flaked on me and I saw her out and she blanked me. Why? because her body and mind are in conflict. Her mind dominates for now. So the solution is to withdraw attention and hang back, get on with things. At some point, the girl comes back.
But if you’re slotted into the provider role it doesn’t work that way. You’re constantly struggling to get physical and the girl withholds. Rollo wrote that whoever cares the least holds the most power in a relationship. From that perspective women have become very good at controlling through sex. Flip the script by withdrawing and you become the guy being chased—if there was attraction in the first place.
But I see this a lot in my interactions, girl is more interested in banging but doesn’t see me as bf material. I have girls now who meet up with me exclusively to bang. It’s no even like we have to pretend. There’s no pretext. If they do claim to be busy or flake I just say “k” or don’t reply at all. They always come back.
But it all requires a perceptual shift and a belief that you can do it and if you don’t see them again no biggie.
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@Will HABD “Grooming you to be a beta orbiter” looked at from your perspective means you keep chasing, giving her attention and she decides the next steps. If you stop for a second as CH suggests and think this through, you’ll realize your over-investment comes from a lack of options or she triggers in your some deep-seeded need for validation. But that’s irrelevant, the advice here is solid. Stop. Game is a set of ideas and structures but they don’t work on girls who don’t want to be gamed. You’re not getting strong IOI’s, she’s not proactively reaching out, you’re getting no positive feedback. So stop. Drop. Roll away.
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@Will I had a similar situation at the start of the year. I met, gamed, number closed a cute 26 year old at a party. We went out and then I brought her home. We made out but she refused to go further because she wanted to know that I am a “Good man”.
She cooked for me, came out to my New Year’s party, helped me clean up, came over, same thing–a make out, nothing more. I just left it.
I ignored her for 6 weeks, just disappeared. I reconnected, she came over, cooked me a gourmet meal..same nonsense.
I didn’t get mad at all. I didn’t react at all. But, I saw her out at a party a few weeks later—and totally blanked her. I spoke and gamed her friend, I blanked her completely. She looked like she was about to cry.
I never ever spoke to her again. That was 6 months ago. She fell off the grid as well and never reached out to me. She figured out the deal and if she wasn’t up for it after the time I put in, hard next. You can’t win them all, but you can learn from each of the situations. Being a dick didn’t come naturally to me—though many people think i’m a hard ass because of my cool, tough exterior. Learn from this. Walk away.
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Wala, that broad might have been a true unicorn. Sounds like Mrs. Gamer. You can qualify unicorns. They were trained by their fathers and corralled by their fathers until their brains were mature enough so that they could corral themselves. Did she have slutty friends? She was definitely your orbiter. Sounds like a keeper.
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Reply in mod. Might be a unicorn.
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What’s wrong with you guys? You are so butthurt wanting to be like an urban Arab harem-keeper, bouncing from woman to woman, none of whom you keep or have babies by. I guess you all white nationalists are still infected by Eskimo thought-vibratos or still figuring it out. On another note, I’m glad roosh got attacked. They attacked a minority! Now they’ve discredited themselves further. But I quite like Persians and lets pray the Iran deal happens. Fuk dem cuckserfs
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President Lyndon Johnson used to do this: Purposely get people’s names wrong or mangle them to throw them off base and give himself the upper hand. At one debate, he gave someone’s name an ethnic pronunciation because he knew that would harm their chances of being elected.
Speaking of chances, it’ll be about 50/50 whether my comment makes it through moderation even though I was one of the first commenters on this blog. Here we go…
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Ole Lyndon was a dark motherfucker indeed. Used to power trip by having his aides take notes while he was taking a shit with the bathroom door open.
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I dun this. Uhhh….wernt game. But it worked!
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Somewhat off-topic I know, but this clip is pretty shocking considering what a concert in 2015 looks like…
Here’s a clip of a 1977 Lynyrd Skynyrd show in Oakland – the crowd is almost uniformly white – and the girls almost uniformly slim, 50% of them quite attractive.
They are long, LOOONNNG gone of course… This being in 1977, those girls were born in 1950 to 1964, with parents who moved to California as the Promised Land after WW2. In 1965 Teddy Kennedy pushed through his immigration reform bill and by the mid-1970’s California was in the midst of a demographic shift to Mexicans and Central Americans. These girls LITERALLY no longer exist in California, the blond hair is gone. What you see on TV and in film is a fake – they have to gather all of the Mexican families off of a movie set site such as the Santa Monica Pier, bus in a bunch of white, upper middle class, kids from OC or Oceanside, and that’s what you see on the screen. Not reality, has not been so for decades. Gone, not to return. Enjoy this video, I was lucky enough to be in High School during this time, and yes the girls in my classes looked just like these girls. Tube tops in school? Riots in 2015, not allowed.
Le sigh…
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I’m probably ten years younger and I can attest it looked this way…and continued to up until around 1987. It really was like those trashy teen movies they used to show on the USA Cable Network’s Up All Night broadcast.
By 2001, I had to cover something at a high school for a newspaper and remember making a crack that when I was in school, we had surfer chicks while the boys today had girls that came to school in their bedsheets. The guy I made this joke to didn’t find it funny at all..which says something right there.
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http://nypost.com/2015/08/28/donald-trump-rips-into-sleazebag-perv-anthony-weiner/
Trump trolling hideous shitlib harpie mrs Anthony wiener.
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With some wrong name game
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Check out the picture of the “activist” – surprised much? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3214567/University-Tennessee-tells-staff-students-stop-using-switch-xe-zir-xyr-instead.html
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Yup http://gothamist.com/2015/08/20/times_square_topless.php
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And another one — white cop gunned down in cold blood by a black last night
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tantamount to a lit candle holding tiptoe on a tightrope through a room chock-full-o dynamite
most men, including some alphas, will not pull this off effectively
text drops the dynamite load; her flake shrinks the traverse distance
even so, this preselection derivative beats ‘so you wont be able to do my laundry’
i’ll stick with my requisite and patented ‘ok, your roomates kinda cute, send her number my way’
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Reblogged this on XWorkx.
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don’t even use a name
‘friend’ ‘girl’ is more subtle
‘sure, girl. catch you later’
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I use “Baby” for Mrs. Gamer all the time. Some clerk did it recently and Mrs. Gamer took offense.
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[…] Wrong Name Game | Chateau Heartiste […]
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YaReally, Sentient, HABD, Wala et al
I was poking around PUAZone a bit and found the most fascinating post here about the different sexual archetypes in women:
http://www.pua-zone.com/showthread.php?13845-Woman-s-3-Fantasy-Archetypes-(Attn-Jimmy-Chonga)
He says all women are a blend of the three, but usually have a primary type and while general Game advice will work on all, tailoring the seduction to each type will produce dramatic sexual results – he’s really good at explaining each type and giving examples from his own lay reports.
It’s a really interesting mental model – the “Overcome with Passion” type, the “Pretty Princess” etc. The other posts of that poster are also worth reading.
I’m going back through some of my recent dates and trying to slot the girls in. For eg, that 19 year old I banged but had bad sex with recently and I posted about – it looks like she’s a classic Overcome with Passion girl..hence all the banter/shit tests..
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Field Report
I was out walking at the mall with Mrs. Gamer. I saw one of my dance partners there and she saw me walking with Mrs. Gamer. I saw my dance partner later and chatted with her. Mrs. Gamer kept walking and didn’t stop to lay ownership to me. Must be looking to keep deniable plausibility going for me, lol. Mrs. Gamer didn’t c0kblock me. Good girl. My dance partner didn’t ask me about Mrs. Gamer either. Good girl. I’m in the zone.
At a club Sat. night I told Mrs. Gamer to ask a certain man we knew to dance and she did. Good girl.
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[…] Their teaching echoes the teaching of Ovid, the medieval master teacher of love. The school of sexually adventurous women that Gilote and Johane founded studied the text and glosses of sexual adventures and engaged in arguments. Eventually women throughout England and Ireland learned women’s love game. Only since the past decade have a significant number of men started to study pick-up techniques and game. […]
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